Judge John Hodgman - Battle Royale

Episode Date: April 11, 2012

Leeman and his wife Rachel are American citizens who have immigrated to Toronto for school and work. They've become permanent Canadian residents, but Rachel wants to go whole hog and become citizens. Leeman finds the idea of swearing loyalty to the monarchy ideologically troubling. Should they form a united front and become citizens together?

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. This week, Battle Royale. Lehman and his wife Rachel are Americans who found themselves living in Canada as a matter of circumstance, but they've now embraced the culture and lifestyle of Toronto and plan to make it their home for the foreseeable future. to make it their home for the foreseeable future. They've become permanent residents, but Rachel says they should go whole hog and become citizens so they can vote and run for office. The issue? They'd have to swear their loyalty to the queen.

Lehman finds it ideologically appalling and doesn't want to compromise his principles, but Rachel says it's necessary so the couple can be a united front to their future children and their community. Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom. Oh, Judge John Hodgman is walking into court. This is the Provincial Court of Canada, Judge John Hodgman. Edition Canada. We have to say Edition Canada for the francophones.

Edition Canada. Indeed. Appropriately, you may have already noticed, listeners, that I am wearing my beaver robes of state and my special wig made of recovered hockey side burns. And I would ask respectfully that instead of referring to me as your honor or Judge John Hodgman, refer to me in the lower court provincial style, Mr. Justice. Vous pouvez swear them in. You'll also notice that instead of not paying attention to the proceedings and watching American Pickers,

I will be not paying attention to the proceedings and watching Canadian Pickers. I wish there were. There probably is a Canadian Pickers, right? Yeah, I'm pretty sure there's a Canadian Pickers. Fantastic. How about this? Canadian Antiques Roadshow instead of American Antiques Roadshow. Fair enough.

Please rise and lift your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? So help you the Queen. So help you the Queen of England. I feel I'm unable to make such a swear at this time. Shut your pie hole. Wait, now open your piehole and say yes. Yes, I do.

To God, or whatever. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that he is a citizen of Andorra for tax reasons? I do. Very well, Judge Hodgman. I will admonish the bailiff to

not yell, shut your pie hole at the plaintiff and defendant we are in the provincial court uh specifically the back room of the brooklyn branch of canadian house of pizza and garbage that just opened here in park slope and thus on hallowed Canadian ground. So please do not yell, shut your pie hole at people in the court. Instead, yell, shut your poutine hole. All right.

We had to get a lot of that Canada, those Canada jokes out of our system because we're gonna have a really serious talk about what it means to be the citizen of a nation versus what it means to be a citizen of Canada. Rachel. Yes. Where do you and your husband live now? We live in Toronto.

I've never been. I've been to most of the Canadian provinces. But I've never been to Ontario. What do you think of that? That's just, that's tragic. You know, I've missed Ontario. Very deeply unfortunate. And I've missed Nunavut.

And I don't think I have been to Manitoba. But otherwise, I got you guys covered on all provinces. All of them. Well, the rest of Canada would probably approve of your avoiding Ontario. So, bravo to you. Why? Does it have a bad name? Is it considered to be not real Canada the way New York City is considered to be not real America?

Might be a little of that. And, you know, southern Ontario, I think, tends to see itself as the center of the country. Sure. The universe revolving around Toronto, as it were. Southern Ontario is not so much Canadian as it is Northern Michigan. And therefore cosmopolitan. Indeed. All right.

What do you do there in Ontario? I am a priest. Oh. Of what denomination? Church of Satan? No, the Anglican Church of Canada. Oh, lovely. And as such, you are able to be a married person

and you are married to lehman indeed yes and please tell me last time i checked please tell me that he is a priest of the church of satan not not quite okay i hope i did not offend you uh by no no not at all not at all my friends in the church of satan Lehman, what do you do for a living? Well, I am an actor, and I also work for a bookstore. We'll just say you work at a bookstore. Oh, fair enough. And I pretend to have illnesses for medical students.

Oh, you're a professional malingerer? We call it standardized patienting. And I'm sure in Canada it's malingerer Probably There'd be an extra you in there for good measure So you help train medical students by pretending to have certain symptoms? Precisely And they have to figure out what I have Or practice their bedside manner

Or just, you know, make sure I don't die So you are a deadbeat, basically, is what we're talking about. Well, you know, a kept man. Let's put it this way. Your wife is an Anglican priest, and she's making all the money. That is true. Okay. It's a good thing you guys have free health care.

It's true. Which we now qualify for. But neither of you are from canada originally is that correct that is correct where are you from originally rachel i am from south carolina mostly but my dad was in the navy so we moved around quite a bit okay so where else uh most states that fought for the confederacy in the u.s civil war so i've tennessee kentucky which I guess wasn't technically a Confederate state, North Carolina, Georgia, Virginia. Yes. And why do you hate your country so much?

I've just found that Canada is a bit more mellow. Certainly a bit more Anglican. a bit more mellow. Certainly a bit more Anglican. A bit more Anglican. It's true. It's true. So not so much hating of the country as, you know, found a life here. And I've lived in Toronto now longer than I've lived anywhere else in my life. So it's pretty much home. And what is your age? I'm 30. And when did you receive the call to become an Anglican priest? And when did you receive the call to become an Anglican priest? Maybe five years ago. I was also not originally Anglican. Oh, okay.

So you went through a conversion experience? Indeed, yes. Presumably you were originally Church of Satan? Close, Southern Baptist. Oh, okay. I did not say that. No, I understand. No one's going to get you in trouble with the church.

So tell me, I'm just curious about how someone becomes a priest these days, particularly an Anglican priest. I mean, the Anglican denomination we would call Episcopalian in the United States. Indeed, yes. Okay. That is correct. Is there an Anglican church within the United States specifically? Well, the Episcopal Church is the same. Yeah.

Okay. Just, again, very relevant to this conversation, because when the American church decided to rebel against the queen, they did not want to be called the Anglican church. So they're the Episcopal Church. Oh, so it's purely out of queen spite. More or less. The Episcopal Church is known as the Episcopal Church. Pretty much. And obviously in the Episcopal Church and in the Anglican Church, women may become priests. Indeed. And they may be married.

Indeed, yes. To any deadbeat they wish. Any deadbeat they wish, absolutely. Lehman, where are you from? I'm originally from Nigeria. My folks were missionaries there, and so I was born. I thought I protected the accent. Yeah, so I grew up there, and then my folks, when they resigned, moved back to the States and to Tennessee.

And so I spent my adolescence in Tennessee. Where? Eastern or Western, please? Central. Nashville. Oh, all right. Go on. So right in the center. The capital of Tennessee. That's right. And then Rachel and I met in Ohio.

We were doing undergrad. And then she tootled up north to Canada. And I went back down south. May I just please don't say anyone tootled off anywhere. Oh, sorry. Okay. That's sorry. Okay. She trotted to Canada? She trekked.

No, I think all of that. She fled. I'll just say she moved. Basically, basic rules of writing. You don't have to say someone exclaimed. Just say they said. Okay, so you guys met in Ohio where you were doing what? Studying something?

Yes. Undergraduate, yes. Undergraduate, and were you studying acting? I was doing theater, yes. Okay. And you fell in like, and then you decided, then you fell in love, and then you got married? Yeah, we actually got married after I came up to Canada, and we got married that week, and been here ever since. Did you go to Canada knowing you would be married? Yes. Or did your now wife, as an Anglican priest,

just surprise you with it while you were sleeping? She was not a priest at the time, so she wasn't able to ambush me with marriage. So we went with a pretty good plan. We actually had a fairly Baptist marriage. Oh, I see. Because of your background, Rachel? Indeed, yes. Her father is a minister.

My brother is a minister. Right. And your parents were missionaries in what religion, may I ask? With the Baptists. With the Baptists. All right. Yeah. So how do you feel about your wife becoming an Anglican priest?

Oh, I think it's wonderful. Are you both people of faith? Yes. Then you must hate one another, right? Because one of you is wrong. Well, I grew up, even though my parents were Baptists, my mom actually grew up Methodist, and I took a lot of those Methodist trappings, which is, you know, you believe, but not strong enough to get into any sort of fight. Okay.

That's fair. Then you are, in many ways, a natural Canadian. Well, yes, in certain regards. Okay. Now, Rachel, why do you want to become a Canadian citizen and force your husband to do the same? Well, I feel like, again, this is where we've made a home and a life for ourselves. And I think if we're going to be really involved with, you know, Canadian life, then we should really commit and become citizens. And especially being able to vote is really important. Right. Because I think we feel fairly disenfranchised

now, or at least I do. Let me understand these things. As a non-Canadian citizen, obviously you cannot vote. Right. Right. Are there any restrictions on how long you can live in Canada? No. If we ever live not in Canada for, I think it's five years in any seven-year period, then our permanent residency is considered to have lapsed. So there's a restriction on how long we can be away from Canada and still be considered residents. Okay, okay, very well. Are you allowed to watch American television?

We are, yes, but they do force a lot of Canadian-made television on us as well, which has been a hardship. Do they tape open your eyes and make you watch Trailer Park Boys? No, but we did get a free DVD copy of Trailer Park Boys at some... Oh, yeah. That was a karaoke contest? Oh, right. I think when you crossed the border.

Trailer Park Boys is a hilarious show. I don't know why we're acting like Trailer Park Boys isn't a delightful program. I'm not saying it isn't. I'm just saying it's mandatory viewing in Canada. Now there's dead now Bailiff Jesse is silently telling me to shut my poutine

hole. Sorry. We can get into the Degrassi franchise. Oh, let's not. Please, let's not. So, there is no compelling reason that you would need to become a Canadian citizen in order to stay in Canada. Is that correct? No, no. And we get the free health care as well now that we are permanent residents.

Right. So you already have the. Yeah. I thought that was a given. Okay. I figured you just, you get a health card and trailer park boys DVD the moment you come in. When you cross the border.

Absolutely. So the only compelling reason to do this would be to participate in civic life and to feel rooted. Yeah. Being a priest, I think there is something to be said for really, you know, you're connecting, you're building relationships with your congregation. And if you're not a citizen of the same country, there is some degree where you're not facing the same issues that they are. And it seems, yeah.

You don't want them to think that you might just run away at any moment. Precisely. That you're some kind of two-faced person who was born a Baptist and then became an Anglican. We can't have that. Absolutely not. No, no, no. And why is it important that your husband, do you have to do it as a duo? Is it a two-for-one deal? No, no, not at all. I just, I feel like it's part of the family solidarity. When we eventually have kids, they'll be automatically be Canadian citizens. So I think it'd be kind of weird if he was the only holdout. Oh, yeah. Just to clarify for our listeners, within the Anglican Church, and I believe the Episcopal Church as well, not only are women

allowed to be priests and allowed to be married, they can toodle men and have children. It is true, yes. I just changed the meaning of that euphemism, and now I feel really gross. If you were to have children, you would not want them to be the children of foreigners, of a foreigner. Right, well, or that they will be Canadian citizens, so I think we should be too. Will they be? Yeah, they will. It's like in America, if you're born here, you qualify to be a citizen.

Right, but let's say for sake of argument that they are born in Canada of American citizens. Do they not have any American citizenship at all? Is there any dual citizenship? Oh, there would be. And if we became Canadian citizens, we would be dual citizens as well. You would be dual citizens and would you be able to pass American citizenship onto your children regardless? We haven't actually looked that up. Yeah. That's a good question. Because being an American citizen is the most important thing on earth. Right.

Obviously. That goes without saying. We would remain American citizens regardless. I think it's only if one of us joins the army here that that would go away. Or if we relinquished it for tax purposes. Okay, so Lehman, you obviously have done some research into this. What does it involve to become a Canadian citizen? What are you giving up?

Let's leave the Queen issue aside for a second. I just want the basics. So to become a Canadian citizen, from what we've already done, we've already done a huge amount of work to become permanent residents, to immigrate. Became a priest. Although technically we immigrated based on my work as a deadbeat. The federal skilled workers program

paved our way into the Canadian health system. What? Because at that time I was even more of a deadbeat than I was a graduate student. So Lehman's deadbeatness was slightly less deadbeat than my deadbeatness as a graduate student. Wait a minute. Wait one minute. Lehman, you're an actor and a bookstore clerk and a professional malingerer. A cash supervisor, technically. Because I opened the safe and I'm trusted with money. That counts. There was no one in Canada

qualified to be those three things at the same time. Apparently not. You didn't see that session of Parliament about the desperate shortage of people in Canada who could convincingly fake whooping cough? Is this part of the Canadian

hipster immigration initiative? We need more people to work in coffee shops and have tattoos on their chest and do nothing. All joking aside, sir, what possible visa could you have gotten to work professionally in another country based on what you've told me so far? What employer sponsored you to come over? Well, I got the work visa based on being married to Rachel. The Canadian visa system is sort of funny. Because of her student visa, she was allowed to be a student but not work. When I got a work visa for being married to her, I was allowed to work but not be a student.

I see. And so I had a background in theater education, which meant that I got a job at a bookstore and worked my way up to a cash supervisor. And then when we started looking at immigration, I looked at the bare minimum requirements. And sure enough, it said if you work in sales in a retail environment and you count money and a safe, then you qualify as a skilled worker for the Federal Skilled Worker Program. So my bookstore wrote a very nice letter talking about how I was a good employee and would not be a detriment to Canada. And here we are. And just this is a very kind bookstore.

Is it a chain or is it an independent bookstore? Yeah, it's a chain. It's the book equivalent of the Canadian House of Pizza and Garbage. I really, by the way, admire your people's very Canadian-style hesitancy to buzz market any of your jobs

or things that you do. I really like that a lot. It may be that you're more of a Canadian than you realize, Lehman. Oh. Okay, so you're already in resident. And if you were to become a Canadian citizen, would you have to renounce your American citizenship? I would not. I would not at all.

And you say that with a lot of surety. You know that for sure. Yeah. I do. I do know that. Again, there are... We know many dual citizens and people who have become citizens since moving to Canada. I'm pretty sure the only thing I can do, unless I just voluntarily renounce it for tax reasons, which is done, or I'm pretty sure if I join the Canadian military. I think those are the only two real ways, possibly if I commit some act of treason or terrorism. So you and all your friends are up there hanging around, a bunch of expatriates in this twilight world of double or triple citizenship, all drinking mixed up drinks like rosé wine, eating Tim Hortons and Dunkin' Donuts in the same breath. You're people without a country. We are. So let's get down to the brass tacks.

Why do you hate the Queen so much? Well, you know, there's a couple of reasons why I would not feel comfortable swearing an oath to the Queen. I grew up, I was born in full circle and bowing to this queen after that legacy seems like something of a betrayal. And then there's the American side of my heritage. My family is American. We've been in America for a good long while. I don't know if I have any ancestry that fought. But still, there's a certain Republican feel to my family, to my legacy. And

so again, bowing and scraping before a monarch just seems wrong. And then there's just, this queen does not inspire, you know? Like if she, you know, were at the front of an armada, you know, running around causing all sorts of mischief, I might consider it. But I mean, she's just this sort of frumpy Hanoverian. And I don't quite know if I want to, you know, sign on board for that. Okay. Especially, especially given my, my Canadian colleagues and friends have even less regard for her. I mean, I'm not calling for Canada to, to lose the monarchy or become a republic by any sense. I think the monarch, you know, serves a historic purpose. I just personally don't feel comfortable with the idea of me swearing to, you know, an oath to her. Are you having a joke here on Mr. Justice?

I would, no, no, I'm not. I want you to answer me seriously, because it sounds like you're splitting some of my hockey hair hairs. Okay. Is this a real thing that you're feeling or is this something you're trumping up for podcast purposes no no this is this is all completely honest and if you become a canadian citizen what is the status canada is a commonwealth nation is it not yes all right it isn't you would not be a subject of the Queen, would you not? She would be. We do swear to the Queen of Canada. She is our head of state.

Oh, okay. So what are the words that you would have to say that are so offensive to you? This is what I would have to say, which is, I swear or affirm that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, Queen of Canada, her heirs and successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfill my duties as a Canadian citizen. Great. You are now a Canadian citizen. Thank you very much, guys. It was great talking with you. You can pay the bail of four loonies at the door. I think I have everything I need to make my decision. I am going to go back to my chambers. Wait a minute. I don't have everything. One last question before I go into chambers. And this is a question for Rachel. We in America

believe in certain freedoms. Indeed. Freedom of self-determination. Also freedom of free health care in emergency rooms, but not free preventive care. Right. Why would you try to compel your husband against his will to become a Canadian? Because that's basically what you're asking me to do here. Pretty much, yeah. So give me the reasons. Why should I compel him against his will to become a citizen of Canada? Well, I'm going to use his own actions against him because this is all about our

family being kind of a united front. And when we got married, he actually took my last name because he thought it was so important for us to be a single family unit instead of having two different last names, which was not my idea. But it's the same sort of thing, right? I think if we're going to commit to this as our home and I'm going to become a citizen, it would be good if our whole family was as well. And as far as the whole swearing an oath to the Queen thing goes, I just don't, I know that he is very politically engaged and he is very politically involved and he actually

keeps up on what's going on in politics far better than I do. And so I think it would be his civic duty to be a Canadian citizen. And while I get why he would have objections to swearing this oath of allegiance to the Queen, I get, like, whether you agree with it or not, she is the head of state, so becoming a citizen... Like, I see it less about swearing an oath to this particular person

and, you know, swearing loyalty to your new country as a new citizen. And it's no less creepy to me than asking citizens of the U.S. to swear allegiance to a flag. So that is my argument. He called the Queen a frumpy Hanoverian. I'm not even sure he will be allowed back in the country if he ever leaves again. It's true. It's true. How would it make you feel if you were to become a citizen of Canada and he were not? I just think it would be kind of weird. I mean, I wouldn't feel betrayed or anything like that, but I certainly think that it would be, it would just be, it would be like this thing that he was holding out on or something.

You would not feel fully committed or full commitment from him. Yeah. Unless he does. I guess my thought is. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Excuse me.

Oh, sorry. I'm sorry, Mr. Justice. Thank you. In that case, why don't you go first, since you're so polite? Oh, thank you. I just don't think there's any really good reason for not being a citizen if we're going to be here indefinitely. And I don't think the queen thing should stop him being a citizen. I kind of think it's what would make him happiest, too.

Lehman, are you fully committed to this marriage? I am. What is your current religion of choice? I'm a geographical Anglican and I still mostly consider myself a Methodist, but I've been attending Anglican churches for years now. Okay. a Methodist, but I've been attending Anglican churches for years now. Okay. Rachel, would he need to convert to Anglicism in order to be fully committed? No,

but it would be weird to me if, say, he wouldn't come to my church and we went to two different churches. I would find that weird. Right. Well, he does come to your church. No, it's true. And he lives in your country. Last time I checked, yes he does come to your church. No. It's true. It's true. And he lives in your country. Last time I checked, yes. And he took your name. Yes. And Lehman, what was your name before you changed? Tarpley.

I'd change my name, too. No, what? Tarpley? Tarpley. Like a tarpoleum. Okay. You keep saying these words, but they don't mean anything to me. Like a tarp. Like a... Oh, okay. T-A-R-P-L-li-um. Okay. You keep saying these words, but they don't mean anything to me. Like a tarp.

Like a... Oh, okay. T-A-R-P-L-E-Y. That's it. You were previously Lehman Tarpley? Amongst other names, yes. What does that supposed to mean? Well, I grew up in West Africa, so I have a lot of names.

Let's hear some more. My full name is Ayobami Abiyadun lehman richardson tarpley kessler my father calls me iobami i say it again please i say iobami that's a-y-o-b-a-m-i rachel will call me io as well i do call him io it's true okay i have everything i need to make my decision i'm going uh into the uh into the break room here at Canadian House of Pizza and Garbage, Park Slope edition. And I will be back in a few moments to render my decision. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Lehman, I'm going to read something to you.

It's a quotation from Matt Groening's Life is Hell. I plead alignment to the flakes of the entitled snakes of a merry cow and to the Republicans for which they scam one nacho underpants with licorice and jugs of wine for owls. Do you recognize what he has tortured into submission? I do. Couldn't you just make funny sounds instead of saying the words? Oh, well, you know what?

I possibly could, but if I'm going to go with it, I'm going to go with full court. That's the thing. If I didn't care about oaths, if I didn't care about what I said, then sure, I could do like my mother suggests and just sort of give a wink and say the words. But I do believe that words matter and what we say matters, and I want to set a good precedent for my future children to say what you believe. I think that's a very American thing to do and something a polite Canadian would do as well. Stand by what you mean. That would be the easy way. It wouldn't be the Mountie way.

Precisely. Rachel, do you think you've got a shot here? Maybe. I think, I mean, the last question at the end about the fact that Lehman hasn't, like, converted to Anglicanism is a really, and that doesn't seem to bother me was a good food for thought, I'll say. So I'll be interested to see what... Does that mean you're thinking about getting a divorce?

It is. Say yes! That is another one of the things the Anglicans allow as well. It's a grab bag, these people. Lehman, how are you feeling about your chances? I'm feeling decent. But, you know, it's a grab bag, these people. Lehman, how are you feeling about your chances? I'm feeling decent. But, you know, in the end, if I don't respect the authority of the queen, I do respect the authority of Mr. Justice. So the weight of his words will have some impact,

I'm sure. Very well. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman re-enters the courtroom. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman re-enters the courtroom. Hi, Obami. Before I render judgment, I just want to see how good of an actor you are. Would you please feign the symptoms of measles for me? Oh, my measles. Now, seriously, what is a malady that you have been caused to imitate? Let's see.

I've had a lot of appendicitis. Okay. So if you're complaining of appendicitis, let me hear that. Yeah, I have this pain right in my sort of right side of my stomach here. And I, like, started off just as kind of indigestion, but I don't know what it is now. Okay. And now, goiter, please. I got this sort of swelling, itching thing. I don't, I got a date tomorrow night.

Like, what can I do about this? And now, Munchausen syndrome, please. There I was, battling the 18 ninjas from the dire islands of Japan. My sword at my hand, I was ready to take them on. Well, you are a fair liar. You are a fair liar, and you could do, very easily, what even your sainted mother suggested you do, which is cross your fingers while saying

the pledge to the queen. But, as we both know, your mother is a lying Baptist. You're in an Anglican family now. Very true. Upstanding. you're in an Anglican family now very true upstanding no wishy-washy who stand by their principles even if

they are absurdly specific and anti-monarchial such to the point that I think you're trying to split one of the hairs in my hockey hair wig. But I do believe that you are not lying when you say that this is a deal breaker for you becoming a Canadian. And normally, I would probably side with your wife. How would I address you?

The right Reverend Rachel? That would make me a bishop, and I don't think I'm quite ready to go there. So just the Reverend. The Reverend Rachel. Or mother. Mommy. Excellent. I would side with mommy, Mommy Rachel, normally.

But, well, not normally, but, you know, she makes some compelling life in the fullness of the civic society of the country in which you live. And that makes a lot of sense to me. And if I truly believed that you were just joking around about this anti-queen thing, I might feel compelled to compel you. But I don't. I think this is a perfectly reasonable, if somewhat arbitrary thing to have a problem with. And I also learned something else, which is it is really easy to become a Canadian. Really easy, apparently, to become a permanent resident of canada you talked to my friend uh down here john oliver a subject of the crown he had to work very hard just i know i feel the same way doggy it was a sad situation he he faced deportation several times uh as he lived here for a long time and worked in situations that were possibly contrary

to his visa. But over there, it's like, can you stock magazines? Then come to our country. Can you pretend to have appendicitis? Uncle Canada needs you. And I really have to say from a pragmatic point of view that there is no serious downside to his maintaining his full American citizenship to your lives in Canada.

There is no true threat of deportation as far as I can tell. He is obviously going to be able to continue to work, which I'm putting in very distinct quotation marks. And I said he will always be the mother's wife. I'm going to let the dog out. Why don't you let the dog out? Is that one of those Canadian werewolves? Is your is your husband a Canadian werewolf?

Is that what's happening? We know. Oh, OK. As I was saying, it is absurdly's happening? Sadly, no. Oh, okay. As I was saying, it is absurdly easy to become Canadian, apparently. All you need to do is claim the very special skill of looking at money. You have to look at money, and you get to be a Canadian. And it seems unlikely that he'll ever be kicked out of Canada.

It's true. Unfortunately, I just can't see, Rachel, any reason to compel this person to pledge allegiance to a frumpy Henoverian against his will. It is not only un-American. I believe it is un-Canadian to do so. And so I encourage you to go ahead and become a Canadian citizen and join your congregation as a full Canuck. And just remember that your husband is a man of many, many worlds, of many, many names. And there is something to be said for a person of such diverse background and obvious acting skills. So, no. I find in the favor of, say your name again, sir?

Iobami. The full, give me the whole thing. Oh, Iobami Abiodun Lehman Richardson Tarpley Kessler. I find in his favor, this is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules, that is all. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Rachel, your family has been torn apart by this contentious issue. How do you feel?

Well, I'm a little disappointed, but I can respect Judge Hodgman's decisions, and I respect that this is a point of principle for Lehman, so I concede. I concede it's a dumb principle, you understand. But I am satisfied that it is a principle. Fair enough. a principle. Fair enough. If I had more than five Canadian friends who liked the Queen, that might consider it, but no one likes her, aside from these five people.

If anyone else had to take this oath, they wouldn't. Well, Lehman, Rachel, thank you for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you. Thank you. Pull up a plastic bucket of

Canadian house of pizza and garbage pizza dough and rest your feet on an ottoman of garbage. We do have a case on the docket here that needs clearing out. It's another one of these husband and wife disputes. Boy, ever since we brought the husbands and wives back, it has been full on mid-career woody allen over here here's the conflict uh it comes to us from brad my wife who is a personal trainer says that eating ice cream for breakfast is unhealthy and that i should not have it in the morning. I contend that since I'm in good physical

shape, 5 foot 11, 160 pounds, sounds pretty hot, and should have and have an active lifestyle, it doesn't really matter what I eat for breakfast. Should I be, should I be allowed to eat ice cream or whatever I would like to at the mornings? Or should I not eat ice cream for breakfast based on the theory that it is, quote, unhealthy? Unquote. Well, 5'11", 160 pounds, loves ice cream in the morning, one of the greatest

OKCupid profiles of all time. I am a believer in moderation in the morning. One of the greatest OKCupid profiles of all time. I am a believer in moderation in all things. I do not believe that you should rule anything out of your diet if you are enjoying it moderately or consciously. Of course, that's very easy for me to say on a podcast. Anyone who has ever seen me knows that if there is three pounds of cheese on a table, I will eat it as quickly as possible.

That said, you should be able to have ice cream for breakfast sometimes. Sometimes. If I hear that you're eating ice cream for breakfast every morning,

that is weird and compulsive. So, please tell your, thank you very much for looking out for me, but I'm going to have ice cream once a week. If it is more than once a week, that is juvenile and weird, and you shouldn't do it. Can I ask for a judgment on whether he's allowed to put unhealthy in quotation marks when he's referring to ice cream? Well, I will talk to you about that. Sure. Is ice cream unhealthy?

It's very high in saturated fat. It's high in empty sugars. And it's a lot of empty calories. It is a treat. It is not a food. Look, I love ice cream. That does not mean that it is per se unhealthy. Most Americans get enough calories in their diets.

I think most people in the first world are not hurting for calories. I agree. And that is the... And so adding super calorie dense foods is by definition unhealthy. Are you saying that you disagree with my ruling? No, I'm not. I agree with your ruling. I just think that him taking it so far as to disagree with his wife's claim that ice cream is unhealthy is a little bit much.

I'm just mad at this dude because he's 5'11 and weighs 160 pounds and obviously can eat whatever the heck he wants. I bet you he goes to bed every night eating a jar of peanut butter with a spoon. And he still has a 28-inch waist. So, you know that ruling where I said he could have ice cream once a week? I take it back. You're right, Jesse. No ice cream for you ever again. Why don't you suffer?

Brad, I think you're eating ice cream in the morning to freak your wife out. Try to keep it under control. You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast always brought to you by you, the members of MaximumFun.org. Thanks to everybody who's gone to MaximumFun.org slash join, and you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by our pals over at Made In. Jesse, you've heard of Tom Colicchio, the famous chef, right?

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No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh and you're on the go. We'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman Podcast.

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