Parks and Recollection - Rob Lowe: Campaign Shake-Up (S4E17)

Episode Date: August 8, 2023

Rob Lowe returns to talk “Campaign Shake-Up!” Rob and our hosts Jim O’Heir and Greg Levine discuss this episode’s appearance from the legendary Carl Reiner, how a magazine cover altered the character of Chris Traeger, the comedic talent of Kathryn Hahn, and much more. This episode was recorded on July 13, 2023.

We're getting together to talk about all the things we used to do The laughs, the passions, the little Sebastian's, the pets we fell into And we're putting it all in a podcast, then we'll send it up into the sky We're calling it Parks and Recollection Come on, little podcast Spread your wings and fly Welcome back, everybody, to Parks and Recollection. I'm one of your hosts, Jim O'Hare. Gary, Larry, Jerry, Terry, Barry from the show, as you know.

And sitting next to me is the... I don't know, what's your name again? Greg, Bob? Yeah, I'm the Greg, Greg, Greg, Greg. Yeah, I'm just, I have one name and you forget it and you have five and I remember all of them. I do. You're special. You're special. And speaking of special, we're, of course, super excited because he's back.

He promised he wouldn't. He is here. So we have Rob Lowe, Chris Traeger. Thanks for keeping my chair warm. It's always so good to be back. He promised he wouldn't. He is here. So we have Rob Lowe, Chris Traeger. Oh, thanks for keeping my chair warm. It's always so good to be back and in one of my favorite places, Parks and Recollection, talking about one of my favorite places, Parks

and Recreation. Oh my God. And we are in studio again together. I know. You know what's so great? We've been so lucky. We have all these great guests. We have people come in, but there's nothing like getting top tier, original core cast together. Totally.

Because you can talk about someone's time on the show in these little bits. You can talk about everyone's time on the show in these little bits and bops and whatever. Yeah. But you guys have this, the gamut of history of being together for this time. And so when we were

together last time, the energy was awesome. I remember thinking about it. I remember dreaming about it. And so this was like a dream come true that we're here together. Yeah. Yeah. What's weird, Jim, is in the dream, you weren't there. Really? Yeah. It was just me and Rob talking. Yeah. Chilling. Yeah. Well, you know what? You go ahead and you see how that plays out for me, Greg. Oh, look at that. You've hurt my feelings and now I'm done.

I'm done for this episode. The edgy Jim O'Hare. I like it. Well, you know, as I always tell people, it's fun when I hurt your feelings, but when you hurt mine, it doesn't seem right.

Yeah. You know, it just seems hurtful. I know people like that. Yeah. Yeah, we just all get along. We're trying here. We're really trying. Greg and I, we bust balls a lot. And know people like that. Yeah. Can't we just all get along? We're trying here. We're really trying. Greg and I, we bust balls a lot.

And I love it. A lot. Oh, God. Well, guys, this is special. And I normally would say, let's talk for 10, 20 minutes about what's going on in life. But this episode, this outline is thick. It's thick. And why?

This episode, this outline is thick. And why? Because you have a very, very, very fun special episode amongst what is also, in my opinion, one of the great arcs on the series, right? This election storyline. This is a pivotal moment with one of our great guest stars. We are talking about Campaign Shake-Up, written by Dan Gore, directed by Dan Gore,

the directorial debut of Dan Gore. I think Dan might still be directing this episode. Yes. Not that Dan was slow, shall we say, but not fast, not breezy, not a breezy director. But I could watch Dan create on set all day long. He kind of would stop and look up and his brain was just spinning.

And then he would come up with exactly what we needed. Yeah. No, he, he's amazing. He's an amazing director. And he is. And I would, I would,

I wish he directed everything I did comedically, but I, I do. I'm having a visceral, visceral remembrance of not only how many takes we would do, but different angles. And we didn't do traditional angles. Oh, we did not.

Run and gun. Run and gun. And man, there were, at one point I was like, Dan, do you, you know we're not shooting the Normandy invasion sequence

right now from Saving Private Ryan. Right, right, right. It's like it's a Pruder film for him each time. We gotta get every, yeah. Well,

I also, I just want to say on a personal note, you know, I was lucky to have been in the room the entire series and I'm lucky to therefore

have worked with every writer on the series and Dan, definitely my favorite. And I learned so much from him on writing. I got to be with him on set once or twice during this, you know, kind of pop by, but I learned so

much from him as a writer. And something you're talking about, Rob, about perhaps his time he would take is that, and Jim, he never stopped thinking. He was always trying to think of the better version, the funnier version. Let's not be precious. Let's keep pushing it and make it the best thing possible. The way he would generate stories around big set pieces to make sure that you always anchored your acts with great comedy. I just learned a hell of a lot from him.

And so I think it's really cool that today's episode, which is this great episode with Rob, also with us, is this double Dan Gore ep. Yeah, I give Dan Gore credit for, and maybe I'm wrong about this. Maybe you can tell me right now, but I've told this story before. I think Dan is why Jerry stayed on the show, because I believe he's the one who came up with the bit early on when we were doing the pranks on each other. They're trying to find out dirt on each other in the office. Season two, I believe. And it turns out Jerry didn't know that he was adopted.

And that came out. And that's when they realized that's who Jerry's going to be. And that was Dan Gore's bit. So I credit Dan Gore. Because, you know, if they hadn't found a space for Jerry, a place to put him, not just physically, but you know, as a character, then the character goes away. Many shows have done that. They come and they go.

That is the nature of the whole thing. Oh, 1,000%. All right. So a double dose of Dan Gore. This episode originally aired on March 1st, 2012. And Jim, give us a blurb. Tell us what we're talking about. Here we go, people. Bobby Newport hires a new campaign manager, Jennifer Barkley.

Leslie courts the support of a powerful Pawnee senior citizen. Chris informs Ron that if Leslie wins city council, a new deputy director will have to be hired. To prevent this, Ron enlists Ann, shockingly, to take over the department on a water fountain project. A water fountain project. That's the big issue. That's the big thing. I mean, this episode, Carl Reiner. Yes. Carl Reiner.

Carl Reiner. He created, once again, it comes up, the Dick Van Dyke show. He was one of the great stand-ups of all time. I mean, he is truly a legendary, legendary godfather of comedy of the 20th century. And to have him on this show and to just be around him, to say I had know had an interaction

with Carl Reiner is a big big big thing. I had no scenes with him but did I show up on set? Oh yes I did because it was Carl Reiner. The 2000 year old man That's it. Mal Brooks and Carl Reiner I think shaped my understanding of comedy more

than any other people and the 2000 year old-old man bit, I learned the importance of the straight man in comedy and the importance of setup for a great punchline. And their stuff together is unbelievable. Every time they did it, it's incredible. And how lucky we were. Here's what's so great about it.

Carl Reiner is in this episode, and he isn't in all of it. He doesn't, the whole A story doesn't hinge on him. That's how special it was that we're just using you for comedy. We do not need to worry about too much plot with you because you are here to be this weird, funny, self-deprecating, but serious... Ned Jones. What a name, Ned serious. Ned Jones. What a name, Ned Jones.

Ned Jones. Mike Shore has this great tribute he wrote to Carl Reiner, the Hollywood Reporter, talking about this shoot, so we can learn more about it there. And says that he improv'd, I remember this now, he improv'd this line that they sutured the hell out of him. And that's the fun about having someone like Carl Reiner on set. He's going to give you a line

that's probably better than anything you could have written. It's going to make you want to laugh more than you want to laugh. Yeah, that's true. And even at, you know, he's an older guy now. He's still there.

He's still got it. Like he's still got it. It's so great. So let's jump right in. We've talked about it. Big episode. We're going to jump right into our synopsis.

Yes. Leslie is catching up with her opponent. Not like catching up like, hey, how's it going? Catching up in the polls. Yes. Leslie is catching up with her opponent. Not like catching up like, hey, how's it going? Catching up in the polls. In the polls, people. With their opponent, Bobby Newport,

for city council, resulting in a shakeup of Newport's campaign staff. Ben decides that Leslie should pursue the endorsement of Ned Jones, the president of Pawnee Seniors United, played by the brilliant Carl Reiner. I love him. Chris tells Ron that the Parks Department may need to hire a new deputy director if Leslie wins the election,

as she will have to split her time between Parks and City Council. And to prove that his department can function without Leslie, Ron takes up Ann's proposal to create sanitary water fountains across Pawnee. Wow. One of my favorite things is where I'm doing upside-down sit-ups in my office.

And I say to Ron, the world is my gymnasium. That is like a real a real Chris Traeger vintage, vintage, classic. The world is my gymnasium then that reminds me of um raisins

they're nature's candy oh yes like those like it's something about it I don't know why they are similar to me but they're they're vintage Chris

well it's a great altruism I don't know why a lot of gyms haven't taken on that as their slogan like the world is we are your

your world we are your gymnasium yes yeah they and they should give you know, some equity in that gym when they, when they do it. Are you doing those sit-ups? Are you, are you doing each one of them? Yes. I'm doing those sit-ups. Unbelievable. I, I was super, I try to keep myself fairly fit. I was super fit during the making of Parks because I was going to do the cover of Men's Fitness. I did it. You can Google it.

I was 47. And I was like, I'm 47 years old. Now I seem like a kid when I talk about 47. But I was like, I want to show that I still got it. I was training my ass off for this cover and they kept postponing it and postponing it. Oh, no. And then, like, I think the magazine, the editor left, and then the new editor didn't want to do it.

And so what was going to be, like, a month of getting in shape honestly literally became almost a year. And it's the year of Parks and Recreation, which is one of the reasons why Chris is so fit, which is I happened to be in a zone at the time where I was doing all that crazy, crazy working out. So I have to ask, so you're doing that scene. If that were me, I couldn't have done it. But even anything, if I even tried,

they would have had to have new shirts for every take because I would be sweated, 100% sweated through the whole damn thing. Did you even change shirts during these? No, because I'm a child actor, because I was a child actor, I am trained in a lot of things. I don't touch my hair on camera, which is, by the way, really a missed opportunity because there's some, like, glasses acting. You take your glasses off. Like, I'm really good at that. I was in the West Wing. I know how to glasses act.

I can file act. I can shuffle paper act like the best of them. I'm good on the phone. You get phone acting. Phone acting. But I was, because I was a child actor, they'd be like, did you touch your hair? Oh, interesting.

Right? The makeup and hair department would just berate you as a kid. And so when I go to sleep in my trailer, I sleep like I'm in a coffin. I don't move. My, my wardrobe is immaculate. My hair is immaculate because of my training as a child actor.

But yeah, you don't sweat. I don't sweat either. Oh God. Well, that's just the luck of, that's just, yeah.

Yeah. I have hyperthyrosis for sure. Yeah, it happens. Well, I was happy on set because I I know. Yeah, I have hyperhidrosis for sure. Yeah, it happens. Well, I was happy on set because I sweated, obviously, but so did Pratt. And he was like, he's a flop sweater. And that was great because it took some of the pressure off of me. Yes. Leslie's saying and telling us that senior citizens are basically the only people who voted local elections.

So, if you want to win, you got to get the gray vote. It's so great. I just love that. It's great that Ned Jones and his army of like this octogenarians are the most powerful political machine in Pawnee. It's like a wrinkled Tammany Hall. That is a good analogy. This storyline about Ron needing to hire another person in the office. So there's a lot I want to talk about, but specifically first,

so Ron has to either hire a deputy director, thereby expanding his department, or he has to complete a government project, thereby spending the taxpayers' money, this thing that he's built his whole life in government to stopping. He's like, he doesn't want to do those things. This is the Ron Swanson version of the King Solomon problem, right? True. It's a King Solomon and the baby pickle. A Ron Swanson pickle of the King Solomon and the Baby. And in this, Ron talks about in his talking head that on his sixth birthday, Ron's father made him choose which

of his pet calves he would slaughter. And Ron elected to slaughter both, quote, and they were delicious. And I'm saying all that because the pause that Nick Offerman takes between the first joke, which is all you need sometimes, that his father chose which of his pet calves he would slaughter and he elected

to slaughter both. That's a joke. That's done. You can get out of that talking head. But not many people, but Nick Offerman, guys. Nick Offerman pauses and says, and they were delicious. Oh my God.

Which then lets me overthink it. Was he, was Solomon's choice between, he wasn't sad about killing either one. It was just which one right right so it wasn't like oh i love this one more i love that it was it's hard to even describe what he would what ron would be thinking right right right no it's it's it's that's normally a solemn choice you're

like oh my god i just can't decide between these i love love this person. I love that person. How could I ever make this horrible decision? No. Happy to do it. Yes. Let's take them both out. Yeah, yeah. I don't, I can't, I will not even choose. They both, I'm ready for them.

And they were delicious. Delicious. Okay, guys, let's go. There's so much to do. There's so much to talk about. Synopsis, synopsis, synopsis. Bobby Newport's wealthy father hires Jennifer Barkley, a famous campaign manager of national elections,

to turn Bobby's campaign around. After a courteous meeting with Ben and Leslie, Jennifer trashes Leslie on television. Meanwhile, Ann leads the department in brainstorming a more sanitary water fountain. I mean, first of all, Katherine Hahn, she's one of my favorite people ever. She is A, beautiful, smart, funny, and fearless funny. Like, it's, I think sometimes sexy, good-looking people have a hard time

with the fearless part. We do, Rob. Thanks for saying that. See, we came up with the same thing. There you go. But no, you're absolutely right. And to be willing to go to the place in comedy, like,

I don't know how this is going to turn out. This might be ugly, but I trust my instincts and my scene partner to get there and to have Catherine and Amy and Adam, but Catherine and Amy together. Oh my God. She's a beast.

She's a real animal. Like I rarely saw Amy have to really raise her game up because Amy's just so good. But I remember those two together. I could see Amy going, hmm, I'm going to rear back on this fastball a little bit more maybe. For sure I saw that.

And also, Jennifer, Park and Rec names, as we know, are always great. Yes. I mean, that's one of the great things

about the show, right? Jennifer Barkley is the perfect name because it is so non-Parks and Rec. It's very Grey's Anatomy. That's a great point. Do you know what I mean, it's very Grey's Anatomy. That's a great point. Do you know what I mean? It's very Grey's Anatomy.

Yeah, I never thought about that. Yeah. Because that's who she is. She's coming from another world. Right. She's not of our world. And so she doesn't look like, act like. And so she's got this kind of like,

she's got a television sexy smart girl name. Right, like precocious surgical intern, Jennifer Barkley, right? Yes, that makes sense. She's the biggest scar is the scar from her mother. She's whip smart. Right, right.

My favorite. Yeah, yeah. Wait, there's a prompt I love. Leslie describes a photograph of Jennifer Barkley eating a potato chip salad with Colin Powell as the most impressive thing

I've ever seen. But the fact that it's potato salad, sorry, it's potato salad, not potato chip. But the fact that they're eating potato salad, pretty amazing. Yeah. That's our art department,

our amazing Parks and Rec art department. Amazing. Who photoshopped that. Yeah. I just hate to break it to you out there. We did not send Catherine Hahn to Colin Powell's office. Yeah. To take a picture.

With a prop person. Here's your potato salad. Yeah. We didn't reach out to Colin Powell's guys. Yeah. To take a picture. With a prop person. Here's your potato salad. Yeah. We didn't reach out to Colin Powell's guys. Like, are you available? We're sending Catherine Hahn for a meal. Didn't do it. Okay.

Well, speaking of Colin Powell, we have another great political reference in this episode. We're going to start having a lot more because we have Jen Barkley, who's been there for national elections. Leslie says that Joe Biden is on her celebrity sex list and then quickly corrects herself. He is my celebrity sex list. Oh, that's a bit cringy. Oh, my God.

But it's Leslie. She's chosen her guy. And you know what? She knew before the rest of us, maybe. Maybe not that, you know. Dr. Jill obviously knew. Yes. I also love that Leslie then sweet talks Ben and tells him about his taut, narrow frame, like a sexy elf king. You know, causing him to ask if she wishes he were taller.

He's like, tall, like, oh, I'm just thinking tall. Oh, I don't know, like Joe Biden. Well, all of her references, because she loves Ben so much. And all of her little, like when she calls Anne, you know, her beautiful tropical fish. And she comes up with these crazy, you know, analogies for these people. But she does have a height issue with Ben, whether she wants to admit it. Oh, yeah. You know, to herself is another issue.

Oh, yeah. Because there's always a hype thing in there. That's a good point. That's a great point. We're going to jump back into our synopsis. Yes. In front of Pawnee Seniors United, Leslie announces a plan to install numerous ramps

across Pawnee, but it's upstaged by Jennifer, who announces Bobby's plan for electronic lifts. Ned loves it and endorses Bobby Newport, giving Bobby Newport, who is still on vacation in Spain, a commanding lead in the polls and demoralizing Ben. In the office, Anne's water fountain brainstorm descends into an all-out water fight. Leslie confronts Jennifer at the diner, but Jennifer tells Leslie that her job is to beat her before offering to get her some waffles. Leslie is both frustrated with and in awe of Jennifer's abilities.

Yeah, and I just, I know we're talking about all of it, but at the very end, but Leslie's both frustrated and in awe of Jennifer's abilities. That's exactly how it comes across to me as a viewer. Like, damn, that woman's amazing. She knows what's gotta get done. It's not personal.

It's nothing as personal. She would be happy to vacation with Ben and Leslie. Well, maybe not happy, but I mean, she doesn't care. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is her job. Right. She's just doing it. She's doing her job.

They're paying her. She's doing her job. Right, right, right. No, even though she's going to, you know, crap all over Leslie and Ben's plans and she steals their idea. It doesn't matter. It's all good. Yep.

Guys, the water fight. The water fight. Oh, my God. First of all, I keep thinking about the crew that had to clean up that office. The water fight. Jim, you are soaking Rob. You are kamikazes by Andy. Yes.

Oh, my God. That's these by Andy. Yes. Oh, my God. I remember the kamikaze vest. It's one of my favorite moments. It's like a moment I will always remember. It really, first of all, really worked.

You know, because you never know. Remember as a kid, you throw a water balloon. I threw a water balloon at the car and it bounced off the car. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, you never knew. And sometimes they blow up in your hand. Right. You're like, you don a water balloon. I threw a water balloon at the car. It bounced off the car. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, you never knew. And sometimes they blow up in your hand. Right. You're like, you don't know what's going on. I think the quality control in the water balloon industry is not good.

Oh. And to have the kamikaze vest work, you needed, like, yeah, I'm thinking about the force of two bodies slamming together to make sure that these balloons do pop, knowing that they don't always go that way. And they really do, and you get soaked. And I'm not supposed to be helping it pop, because I'm...

You're just this helpless... I'm a helpless bystander, but you're right. If I don't give some oomph to it, then it's not going to do it. That's why we say thank you for the delay, Men's Fitness. That's right. Yes. Your hard abs will pop those damn balloons. It just got going.

No, but Andy, I mean, Chris running in after just this. I think about that fight a lot. I think about the insanity that was from like, oh, we got water shooting at one person too.

Who had water balloons on them to make this? Donna's hosing Jerry down like it's like she's glee. Hosing him down. Like you're a horse. Yes. And he's just standing and they're kind of taking it. That's notosing Jerry down like it's like she's glee-hosing him down. Like you're a horse. And he's just standing there kind of taking it. That's not a water fight anymore.

That's a punishment. That's water boarding at some point. So you're in the writer's room. So how do you go does somebody go, wait, so I just want to keep a little bit of the reality, please. Where are the water balloons?

You don't. No, that's me watching it now thinking it's funny to think about. Did someone run out? Did Andy, of course, maybe always have water balloons on him at the shoeshine stand or in his drawer? That to me is how you would explain it. I'll go with that. You have to sometimes just believe. You just have to sometimes buy into the series events between stuff that, of course, it turned into a water fight that involved water balloons and hoses and all this stuff.

And they're going to hose down their office because they're that gleeful. Yeah. Yeah. Do you remember how many takes did we do? Did they just hit you once? Only once. Because we were, I was soaked. You're soaking.

I mean, she had a hose on my body. Yeah, and I was wet. I was soaked. Because, you know, then it's a big wardrobe change. Right, that's what I'm saying body. Yeah, and I was wet. I was soaked. Because then it's a big wardrobe change. Right, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember only doing it once. That was it.

And Pratt's reaction when he hits you and it explodes, and then he has a mix at first of excitement, and then, uh-oh, am I in trouble? Like typical great Pratt reactions. Guys, more to talk about. Here comes some more synopsis. Anne and the office present Chris and Ron with a spoutless water fountain,

which receives Chris's approval. Leslie confronts Jennifer on PIRD, aka PERM, happily show accusing Jennifer of stealing her ramp plan. Ben tells Leslie to bring up Bobby's vacation, but Jennifer retorts that Bobby is in Spain trying to court European businesses

to open factories in Pony. Jennifer privately admits this was a lie, but Leslie and Ben feel defeated. Anne reveals that the spoutless water fountain was April's idea and suggests that April be the person to fill in for Leslie. Ron asks April to take on a bigger role in the department, and she reluctantly agrees. Anne has her presentation.

It goes very well. Ron's saved from filling the Leslie void. Donna comments that Ben is filling the Leslie void. Oh, my God. To which Anne gives her a sly high five. And I love that Chris says I'll give it up for that. I don't remember that

and I was reading the script and it's there but it's just in the script. I'll give it up for that. He just wants to be on board with it. He's having fun.

He's proud of this group of people. He's proud of these people. Listen, we've established that Chris I think he's happy for his Ben at this point, too. Listen, we've established that Chris, I think he might be keeping track of Ben's proclivities. I think that's one of the great untold stories

of Parks and Recreation is Chris Traeger's sort of really taking notes about Ben's sex life. Right. And we've talked, I think, before, Chris, I think, is a great wingman. I think Chris would be, he's a positive person,

he wants to build up anybody around him, even strangers at the bulge the first time we meet him in that episode. That's right. He'd be a great wingman. Of course,

he and Ben came to Pawnee together. It makes sense that he would care for his friend's happiness. It's also a very, very rare double-enton

sexual innuendo joke. We do not do those on the show. Just don't. It's not in the sensibility of Mike Schur at all. Well, that leads me to this last bit about it. In episode one of this season, there's another moment just like this when Chris, or Ben

says, Leslie, can you do Pert happily? And Donna's like, oh, she could do Pert Happily. Right? And they have this joke. That's another Dan Gore episode. And I'm not saying that this is a Dan Gore style of joke. But it's a Dan Gore style. But maybe it was. I don't know if it was him. I don't want to

be fair, but we can save that for another day. But it's really funny that there are two moments like this from Donna about Leslie and having... Oh, Donna was all about that. I think that's this from Donna about Leslie. Oh, Donna. Donna was all about that. I think that's all she really cared about. I am a fan of the double entendre. I have to say. I am a fan.

Yes. You know, I love Pert Happily. Pert Happily is one of my, I mean, again, it's so hard. When you think about the populace of Pawnee, it's very, very hard. Just when you think you have your, we were talking about Ethel Beavers in a previous one, and think about, what about Pert Happily?

And then you have Joe Sewage. Oh, yeah. And Joan Kalamata. I mean, it's just, it's a deep bench. It's such a deep bench. Yeah. I defy anybody

to come up with a show that has more characters on the peripheral that are murderers than this show. Come in, do their job. Really, name one. Seinfeld?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Get soup Nazi. Yeah. One guy. Yeah, well, yeah. Yelled about soup. Okay, Jerry. Congratulations.

They don't often come back to the extent. That show will never work out. They don't often come back to the extent. And Pert came back and you, as a huge Pert Apley fan,

he came back so much that he kept having new shows. He had a morning talk show. He had this hard-hitting politics show, right? He had this show with, he did all these other things, and we're like, yeah, let's give Pert another show. And now Pert is perm in this one, right? That's amazing. Because of Jennifer Barkley.

You know, his name is Jay Jackson. He's a jazz singer and was a newscaster. In real life, people. Real life. When she calls him perm, it's too good. Super small moment, but I loved it from Adam. It's perfect. When Leslie asks him what they should do, right?

When they're before the Pert Happily interview and she's building him up like, you're a great campaign man. And he's like, you're a great campaign man. And he's like, I don't know. Such a letdown. He has this little smile. She's like, you know, she's saying, there's no one else I'd rather go into battle with than you. Tell me, campaign manager, what should I do?

I don't know. I don't know. And he smiles a little bit. I just, we've talked about this before. You rarely see Leslie, and now Wesley with Ben, not figure it out. Not figure out the win to make the win happen. And for Ben and Adam, I don't know. And even from a writing standpoint, I'm not a writer, so I'm just giving my little thought here.

That is such not an answer for a normal writer. Because there's always like an improv, it's yes and. Right. Well, yes, and we're going to do this. And well, and then we're going to veer off and do this. No, he doesn't know. Yeah, yeah. I got nothing.

I don't know. I love that. I love that we were allowed to do that. I know. I got nothing. I don't know. I love that. I love that we were allowed to do that.

I know. I think it's because also we knew that this was the beginning of what was perhaps the last arc of this storyline, of this campaign. And so there's more to come. Yes, there is. Well, speaking of more to come, there's more to come now with April in the department, right? Because Ron has asked her to step up and she says yes. And this relationship that Ron and April have, it's touching, right? I love it.

And here's my question. Does April truly, we know on the outside, no, no, no. Is her heart like a little bit of like a flutter? I don't know if that's the right word. Like, wow. Because it's a promotion. He's telling her how good she thinks she is. Anne has recommended her because she said she didn't come up with the idea. She said Anne did.

Right. No, you did. Right. You did. I think she does react to that. I think, I mean, we've seen this from April sometimes. She does. She does react.

We see hers. Sometimes through the camera. She'll give it like a little look to the camera. I stupid love you, Leslie. Or she'll say stuff like that. But she will admit. And I think that we've seen her, I don't know, be buoyed a bit from being mirrored back from other people

that she's got something that this outer self she has isn't always necessary. And I think it makes sense, knowing where her character is going to go for the rest of the series, that Ron, Leslie are probably the two most important, and Andy are the three now most important people to help, you know, etch away some of that rough exterior.

Guys, an episode unlike any other. We love it. There's some, I mean, we could do several more hours about it. So what are your final thoughts on the episode? To me, it's all about Jennifer Barkley. Yeah. It's all about Jennifer Barkley. Yeah. It's all about Jennifer Barkley. I think that if this were,

if Parks and Rec were a coffee table book with chapters, this would be one of the big chapters because she's such a force. I mean, she's starring in her own stuff now and we were lucky to get her and we always attracted, you know, such amazing people on the show. We got her before she

kind of blew up. That's right. She's everywhere. Everywhere now. And this was like, she was always, you know, and that's funny. You, you see with actors and, and particularly actors, I think in comedy, it's like people know before people know. You know what I mean? Like we, everybody, we knew, we were like, oh man, Catherine Hahn. Hell yeah. Oh, right. But like the world didn't know.

So it's super fun to watch her right before, you know, it really happens. Right. That's also the sound of a great casting director, which is like, these are the great people. You'll be lucky to get them now. Put them in your thing, front loaded with talented people, because in two years, you're going to want these people as your leads in your show. I always wondered, was someone like Catherine an offer, or did she audition for us, or were we just thrilled to get her? No, I think she's an offer.

Yeah, I mean, she was in the family. People knew her. She's a comedy person. No, I think that she was able to come on in. So, yeah, you're right. Catherine Hahn and Carol Reiner in the same episode. I know, how do you choose between the two of them as MVPs? They're co-MVPs.

Co-MVPs. You're not legally allowed to. Even though Jennifer Barkley, Katherine Hahn sticks around for more episodes, you're not legally allowed to call out her if you don't call. It's call fucking Reiner. Yeah. I could not agree more. Yeah, co-MVPs.

All right. Well, thank you, Jim. And of course, thank you, Rob Lowe, for being with us earlier. And thank you all for listening. You know, text this episode to your group chat. Give us five-star reviews wherever you're listening. Give us 10-star reviews on your chalkboard at home.

Do you have chalkboards at home? Do people have chalkboards at home? I don't know. I don't think they do. I don't think they do, but I will take a 10-star review. You'll take a 10-star review wherever you can get it. Anywhere you can put it. Anywhere you can get it. Give me 10 wherever you can give it to me.

Wow. Sir. Okay, but that's another topic. Okay, well, let's thank other people. Thanks, as always, to Joe and Sean for keeping us going. And you know what? Dear listener, if you got a question for the Pawnee Town Hall, you should send us an email with that question to

parksandrecollectiontownhall at gmail.com. And from all of us here at parks and recollection. Goodbye. Goodbye. Bye. See ya. This has been a team Coco production.