Small Town Murder - #453 - Torture, Torment & Terror - Spearfish, South Dakota

Episode Date: January 4, 2024

This week, in Spearfish, South Dakota, what begins as a fun evening, among friends, turns into an awful, and prolonged session of torture. The brutality is shocking, as the murderers discuss what to do to the victim, right in front of the victim. The killers end up pointing fingers at each other, but it's pretty clear who the ringleader is. Will that matter in court? Along the way, we find out that the money is in supplying gold rushers with equipment, not in the actual gold, that selling your children is never a good idea, and that torturing a person should give you nightmares!!Hosted by James Pietragallo and Jimmie WhismanNew episodes every Thursday!Donate at: patreon.com/crimeinsports or go to paypal.com and use our email: [e-mail] to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder & Crime In Sports!Follow us on...twitter.com/@murdersmallfacebook.com/smalltownpodinstagram.com/smalltownmurderAlso, check out James & Jimmie's other show, Crime In Sports! On Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Wondery, Wondery+, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week in Spearfish, South Dakota, what seemed like a fun evening with friends turns into a night of terror, horror, and torture that leaves a long shadow on the whole area. Welcome to Small Town Murder.

Yay! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman. Thank you, folks, so much for joining us today. We have a crazy show.

Happy New Year, everybody. Hey! If you're listening to this early access, then the New Year is coming up. If you're listening to it regular, it's New Year. So, happy 2024, everybody. Thank you for hanging out with us in 2023. You made it big. Thank you so much. Thank you. We hope to enjoy

the entire 2024 with you as well, if you'll stick around. Thank you so much. Thank you. We hope to enjoy the entire 2024 with you as well. If you'll stick around. So good stuff there. All you definitely want to head over to shut up and give me murder dot com. Tour is all out there. The tour tickets are all on sale and we're telling you something. They're going fast. I know it's there.

We have 12 dates. So there's not that many shows. So even the ones at the end of the year are going very fast. We are going to be in Sacramento, San Francisco, Austin, Phoenix, Kansas City, Oklahoma City, Nashville, Durham, Minneapolis, Milwaukee, Tarrytown, Boston. That's it. That's it. No more shows. We're not adding any more.

That's all we're doing this year. So definitely get your tickets right now. Shut up and give me murder.com. Everything is available. There it is awesome stuff patreon.com slash crime in sports is where you get all of the bonus material there's a ton of bonus material out there anybody five dollars a month or above you're gonna get a huge back catalog you've got a couple hundred episodes of bonus stuff to catch up on immediately and then new ones every other week one crime and sports one small-town murder you get it all and

this week what you're gonna get for crime and sports we're gonna talk about this is a crazy one because never really thought about it but players with disabilities in all different sports from think about Jim Abbott your one-handed pitcher you didn't you wouldn't see that kid with one hand and

go he's gonna be a major league pitcher. He'll throw a no-hitter one day. Isn't that adorable? Good for you, Troy. There are a ton of people with all sorts of things that you would have never imagined someone could play pro sport with. Really? It's wild stuff going all the way back in time. I mean, old-timey stuff to new stuff.

It's pretty wild. And we'll leave Oscar Pistorius out of it, though, because we talked all about him. And then for Small Town Murder, we're going to talk about Gypsy Rose Blanchard. Oh, yes. That whole case. People have been requesting this for so long, and it's time we waited on it because it is just really weird. The interrogations from that are next level wild.

They're all on YouTube. And the video that they made is so gross. It's some crazy stuff. We'll talk all about it. That is patrion.com slash crime in sports. And you should be listening to crime in sports, lots of murder and gross stuff happening lately. And also definitely listen to your stupid opinions. Our new show,

which is cooking right now. Thank you folks for listening to that too everybody seems to really like it so we're jacked about that thank you very much that said disclaimer time hey it's a comedy show here everybody we're comedians but that doesn't mean that the story is not real or we're embellishing it for comedic effect or anything like that the stories are scarily and unfortunately 100 real um we do make jokes about things here's what it is though we know where to make jokes about things there's nothing funny about an actual murder someone getting decapitated we're not like oh my god blood spraying everywhere

that's not funny that's what there's plenty of other stuff to make fun of there's we make fun of small towns because we're all from somewhere that's easy to make fun of we make fun of some bumbling police force that lets a murderer go free to kill more people that's they're worthy of scorn we make fun of murderers because you know what yeah fuck them so there you go that's what we do what we don't do we go out of our way not to make fun of the victims or the victim's family. Why, James? Because we're assholes, but we're not scumbags. That's how that works. So there you go.

That sounds good to you. You're going to hear a wild and crazy story, a really wild and crazy story. If you think true crime and comedy should never, ever, ever go together, I don't know. Maybe you're in the wrong place. Maybe we'll call it a bad first date. We'll go our separate ways. Or you maybe want to give it a chance and it might not be what you think it is either way no bitching later right said i think it's time for everybody here let's all sit back let's all clear the lungs arms to the sky let's all shout shut up and give me murder.

Let's do this, everybody. What do you say, Jimmy? Let's go on a trip, shall we? Yeah, we shall. We are going all the way to South Dakota here. It's been a while since we've been in South Dakota because not a lot of people live in South Dakota, so there's less murders. That's just kind of the way it works with some of these states. Wyoming, South Dakota. This is in Spearfish, South Dakota, so there's less murders. That's just kind of the way it works with some of these states. Wyoming, South Dakota.

This is in Spearfish, South Dakota. Okay. Yeah, Spearfish, which I've only heard of it through Deadwood, when they're like, yeah, the trail to Spearfish, like somebody would get, you know, road agents would like kill a whole family while they were on the, isn't the beginning that the family, that little girl comes from, they were on their way to Spear i think what do they call her they call her something that feels gross right i don't remember i don't remember yeah oh yeah squarehead is what they called her square squarehead yeah squarehead family that meant they're that meant they were german

so oh yeah it was just there so uh this is in western South Dakota. It's only 20 minutes outside Deadwood. So in a car, not that bad. If you're in a dangerous trail in a wagon where people murder you, it's a longer trip. A wagon train might take a few days. Might take a little bit here. Three hours to Pierre, South Dakota, which is the capital. The capital. And then only 20 minutes, though, to Whitewood, which was our last episode.

So same area here, western South Dakota. That was episode 386, Cheers to My Killer, which that's a very interesting episode. Jimmy just remembered that one. That was wild. It's so good to be a drunk. That was crazy. Yeah, someone could be murdering you and you're like, all right. That is weird.

This is in Lawrence County, area code 605. Motto here, it's really a nickname, and other cities share the same nickname. Queen City is what they called it at first. Yeah, there's a lot of those. There's a few of those. Charlotte would obviously have a problem with that. Manchester does it too, for whatever reason. Yep.

This was originally called Queen City, actually. This town. Oh, the town itself. Yeah, it was originally called. They changed it to Spearfish. They changed it to Spearfish. Yeah, big time. And basically before the gold rush of 1876 and the whole, you know, Deadwood thing there,

the area was just, I mean, the Sioux lived here. That's who was here. The Sioux tribes were there. Once the gold rush started, though, Spearfish and Deadwood, all these gold towns popped up. And Spearfish, much like Deadwood, was a big supplier to the mining camps. That's what they did. You would supply food and mining equipment and all that kind of thing. And that's how people made their living.

And booze and girls and you name it, you know? I guess there's a lot of farming and, I guess, gardening. They said market gardening still occurs in the vicinity. Is that farming? Oh, okay. That's probably like vegetables and such on smaller scales. Yeah, small-scale farming. I believe that's called, yeah.

Market gardening sounds a lot like a euphemism for farming yeah it sounds like you've got uh about 30 tomatoes rather than a whole fucking bushel yeah it's like having like a like a horde of cows and being like well you know it's just a i got i got a steed or got a little little What do you call a bunch of them? Is it a herd? It's a herd. It's a herd, yeah. What do I call them, a horde? I think you did.

That's if they're stampeding. If they're angry, they're a horde. A horde of cows are coming. Yeah. I didn't even try to. I wasn't even going for herd. I was thinking like a horde, like I have a shitload of cattle. I'm an idiot. idiot so um the uh in the 20th century spearfish is basically from then on they just made it about

their history of that short time period of mining and everything that was a that's it it's just like deadwood they still deadwood still exists it's a boom town so people can go there and go man people said there was gold here 150 years ago that's why it's there so uh frank lloyd wright was here in 1935 the architect and he called the area unique and unparalleled elsewhere in our country for its beauty he said quote how is it that i've heard so little of this miracle and we toward the atlantic have heard so much of the grand canyon when this is even more miraculous so, he said better that he said Grand Canyon's kind of mid bra. How could he? And that's that's a your stupid opinions reference.

Listen to that show and you'll understand that. But Frank Lloyd Wright said that Frank Lloyd Wright said this is way better than the Grand Canyon. Fascinating man. Reviews of this town. Here we go. Five stars. This is such a quaint little town that is gorgeous to live in, but also fun to explore.

How do you explore a small town? It's one street. You're done. There you go. Just take the day. It's an afternoon. I'm exploring over lunch. It's a small trip, but that's what makes it so amazing. That's what makes it so wonderful. There are several different places

to hike, eat, different breweries and gift shops gift shops great brew that's what i want i want gift shops i want you know plaques with cheap cheap shit garbage i want cheap magnets with spearfish written in like you know bones that's what i want. That sounds great. After I drank an overpriced, far too flowery beer. And it's a beautiful area, and that's why you'll draw people in, because it is gorgeous. The people here are a large part of what makes this place so enjoyable. So the people are good. Four stars. Spearfish is the perfect size if you're looking for somewhere where it's easy to run into people,

but big enough that there are food and shopping options all right so it's like a it's a medium dick he's saying it's the goldilocks period for the for small towns like it's it's just right yeah just right not too big not big enough uh four stars it's a small community with just enough. Okay. Just enough. Listen, yeah. That's what it says. Good size. This person must be like a cowboy or some shit because this is a person of few words. They said this aloud, then turned and walked away as the person tried to ask backup questions. Follow-ups. Follow-ups.

Three stars. Quote, there's the good and there's the bad. That's it. No, I'll believe and there's the bad. That's it. No, that's good news. That's it. Yeah. Whole review. There's the good and there's won't tell you what those are because I'm not a gossip or anything, but I'll just say eyes open.

Take them both. And there you have Spearfish. That's it. Spearfish. The facts of Spearfish. The facts of life. The facts of Spearfish. It's the facts of spearfish.

Two stars. This person's a little wordy. I'm going to cut some of this out of here. Oh, boy. Hiking, biking trails are the pros. Pros. Hiking, biking trails. Some unexpectedly good restaurants.

Very high walkability if you're in town. Yeah. Surprising music scene. Proximity to wonderful things in the Black Hills. Okay, so. Surprising. Yeah, the fact that there's one at all is fucking mad surprising. Super surprising.

Wow, that's weird. Cons, the people. People are fake and judgmental. The few people we've gotten to know all hide their money in success. They're not flaunting it? That's weird. What does that even mean? They don't tell me how much money they have. Okay. Nobody walks around with their bank

statements. It's weird. Borderline annoying. Yeah. I want to know what you're worth, sir. If you drive a nice car, people will gossip and make up things about you. As a culture, the people of this area take pride in a lack of success. We've had things stolen from us and rumors made up about us, and by anyone's standards other than people in Spearfish, we're not even rich. It's also literally impossible to get anyone to show up to do work, whether it's house cleaning, lawn care, surveyors, contractors, etc.

We're not rich but we have we're looking for a maid um yes we're not rich but we hire everything out uh nobody will show up and then they'll complain about a lack of work it's the strangest thing people also have no respect for other safety they speed through town let their dogs run loose and there is zero police around jesus christ well that's why all that shit's happening. Man. And finally, one star. I've lived here my whole life.

It's an excellent place in terms of beauty. Low crime rate. We'll be the judge of that, my friend. It's an ideal place to raise kids. But if you're not in the in crowd or do not have the right last name in this area, people will alienate you. So it's provincial and a lot of places small towns are like that it's like the roadhouse town you know what i mean everybody knows each other some guy runs the town quote unquote and that's what money and the old money people uh feel like they have entitlement too because they've been here for

look man when you got generation after generation of people growing up somewhere they tend to feel like they run the place and sometimes it's just knowing people yeah i got out of trouble in the seventh grade because my grandfather was the barber in fishkill for 40 years and my principal had gone to him and didn't want literally didn't want to get like fucked up with his barber so he let me off didn't want his hair fucked up yeah so he goes in there he let me off for fucking trashing some kids jordan fives that i was stepping on repeatedly because he was an asshole and said fuck you so i should have gotten trouble for that i was being a dick but no your

grandfather could carve an italian swear word in the back of my head i have no idea i have no idea so i'm gonna go ahead and let you go. But, I mean, that could be just as simple as shit like that. Sure. People here are as fake as you can get. They'll do things out of the image of looking decent, but they have no altruistic intentions. If you do not have a certain look of a superficial caliber in Spearfish, South Dakota, no one will give a crap about you. A crap?

A crap. They won't give a crap about you, mister. This person is fascinating. I want to know more. Very angry. They're wordy and verbose. Tell me more. I want more. Yeah. I would like them to talk to the, there's the good and there's the bad. I want to see that conversation because I think that'd be fun to get those two people together. Yeah. People in this town, 12,031. So apparently that's the sweet spot. Okay. Around 10 grand. That's the amount of people we can take.

That's it. More females than males. Median age right around the national average is about 37. Family here, lower marriage rate than normal, about 42%. It's usually 50-50. More people are single with children here. It's usually 50-50. More people are single with children here.

Race of this town, 91.9% white, 0.6% black, 0.8% Asian, and 2.3% Native American, which is actually much more than normal, and 3.2% Hispanic. So it's basically the makeup of the show Deadwood. It really is. It's basically what it is, yeah. 43% of the people here are religious, and it's a pretty good mixture of things. Taking the top spot here is, I believe, Lutheran at 12.9%. Oh. You don't see that as a top very often outside of the Minneapolis area around there. 0.0% Jewish here as well.

0.0% Islam as well. In this county, last election, 32.8% of the people voted for the Democrat and 63.3% Republican and 3.9% Independent, which is much higher than the national average on the independents here. If you live in like western South Dakota, though, it seems like you'd be a more independent sort. You're certainly that way in your personal life. That's what I mean. You've got to do things on your own. Exactly. That's what I'm saying.

So the unemployment rate here is 3%, which is extremely low. I mean, that is dangerously low to where there's not enough people for jobs that people need. Median household income here is lower than the national average. Also, it's $52,258 a year. And the cost of living,

100's regular. Here, it's 94. So, it's not that far off. Housing, though, median home cost here, $384,000. Jesus, that seems high. If you make 50 grand a year, that's a little rough, I would say. So if we've convinced you, damn it, you need to be out here. You're going to find out just who is fake and who is real.

And if anyone can show up to clean your house, we have for you the Spear south dakota real estate report the average two-bedroom rental here goes for 860 which is super cheap yeah and here we have like cheap rentals and then we have manufactured houses like our first one and it goes there's either those or these huge houses like you'd get in like, you know, Aspen and like some of these, that area of Idaho. Giant A-frames. Yeah. It's one of those deals. So here's your average two-bedroom rental. Here's $860, which is cheap, actually, like $400 under the national average.

Here's a three-bedroom, two-bath manufactured home. Okay. A home that they brought in on a truck on the highway. The wide load, that's this house going there. It's brand new, so I mean, it's a brand new. That's nice. They just built it, or made it, and brought it here. They really built it.

They just parked it. They just parked it. Three-bedroom, two-bath. Just put the e-brake on. Yep. 924 parked it. They just parked it. Three bedroom, two bath. 924 square feet. Three bedrooms in less than 1,000 square feet. I don't know how you're doing it. $123,000 for that.

Very, okay. I mean, if you're a young family maybe, you could pull that off. Here is a three bedroom, two bath 1,605 squaresquare-foot house. Not a huge lot, half an acre. It was built in 1918. So the outside looks kind of oldish and cool,

but the inside's very much recently updated and new. So it's all new inside. $445,000 for that, though. How many square feet? 1,600 square feet. It is not. That's crazy. It's not on a big plot of land that backs up to a creek or something.

It's none of that shit. That's insane. Yeah, you're not going to go panning for gold in your creek in this area. It's just not. You're going to wish you could because you've got a mortgage to pay off, a big one. Speaking of mortgages, four-bedroom, four-bath, T-ball for each and every b-hole, everybody. 4,238 square feet. Okay.

3.59 acres. Oh. It's the weirdest looking house you've ever seen. It's so strange. It has like two rows of vertical windows. Huh. It looks like not an office. I can't even place what the fuck it looks like.

It looks maybe like some sort of weird underground government training center or something. Is it two stories with the two rows? Yeah, at least two stories. And it's got these two rows of long vertical windows all connected to each other looking. Oh. And it's still dark in the house somehow. It's really weird. And it's all spray it's still dark in the house somehow it's really weird and it's like all spray painted on the inside yeah these people went nuts with the leather couches like

there's there's like 40 leather couches in this house somehow 2.7 million dollars for this house three million dollars for that yeah it's holy shit look at the house you don't go that's a three million dollar house right there buddy you just don't say that so it's it's a little fucking ponderous uh so things to do here chinook days yeah chinook days are coming yeah uh mountain sports craft beer local food music arts and more it's and more and more the celebration of the spearfish world record of the fastest greatest temperature change on january 22nd 1943 caused by a chinook wind this is the celebration of a temperature change that happened 80 years ago and we still run with it yep it changed a lot so you know Was it just one day it was super cold?

Yesterday it was warm? Yeah, or vice versa. One of the two. Okay. Doesn't matter. All right. Wow. During the week-long festival, there will be a winter celebration that consists of a winter festival, mountain sports, craft beer, local food, music, and arts.

Okay. Well, here's the schedule. This sounds amazing. Starting out January 12th, a January concert. food, music, and arts. Okay. Well, here's the schedule. This sounds amazing. Starting out January 12th, a Jamuary concert. Jam. Jamuary, baby. Yeah.

At the Matthews Opera House. Tickets available in advance are at the door. They don't say who's playing. Maybe the opera. I don't know. Do they say how much they are? Nope. Just available at the door.

Okay. You don't know who's playing or how much it costs, but come on down, everybody. You got it. This is good marketing. Just bring a credit card. We'll figure it out when you get it. Okay, yeah. Just make sure you got some room on your card. That's all.

Pay your minimum and get down here. Winter Carnival at Big Hill is on Saturday. Group Fat Bike Rides. Fat people or bikes? Well, probably both. Take a hike, Slim. Let's go. Nope, not you, Slim.

You're not allowed. Yeah, no, you, Chubby. You're in. Let's go. Yeah. You got to have a favorite kind of nachos to do this. I love to be the judger of that, the guy standing there. Nope, not fat enough.

Nope. Kind of a face, skinny man. Let's go. Yeah, you got to put on a couple of pounds here. We'll weigh in. Come back tomorrow. We'll weigh in. Snowshoe tour or Nordic ski fun races. So these are like cross-country races, it sounds like.

Yeah. Food from Killian's Beer and from Crow Peak Brewing. Liquid lunch? What was that? That's it. That's what it says. Food from Killian's Red. That's a beer, guys.

Yeah. I guess it's a restaurant there, Killian's. Food from Killian's and beer from Crow Peak Brewing Company. Got it. Okay. Donations are encouraged. That makes sense. Sunday is the Killian's Winter Luau.

Winter Hawaiian party. And it says, dress in your best tropical gear. What, under your parka? It's fucking January in South Dakota. It's cold. It's South Dakota. Put on your best Hawaiian shirt under your parka i guess yeah put on your best flowered snowsuit and get down here i'm wearing a leg and what is happening

oh my god prizes for the best uh dress luau food and drink specials and music by a band called Camp Comfort. Camp Comfort. Sounds like they... No, no. Thank fuck, no. Oh, okay. It's Klaus's Camp Comfort Band. No, no. Then there's a pub crawl that day as well. And then Thursday is the film festival.

They got a film festival going on. Then two weeks later, they kick it back up again somehow. Oh. And they have Chinook Day snow sculptures. Wear your best tropical gear. And also a concert to close it out again. It's a January concert at the Matthews Opera House. You've got to have that.

And they will have music and festivities and a fire. So there you go. Very vague. A community bonfire. This is a vague event. I don't know what happens here. I feel like they're going to sell your kids there you go. A community bonfire. This is a vague event. I don't know what happens here. I feel like they're going to sell your kids if you go there. Crime rate

in this town. What we're interested in here. Crime rate. Property crime. A little bit high. Really? Mr. Reviewer person who said it was so wonderful. Free of crime. It's a little bit above the national average. Violent crime though. Murder, rape, robbery, and of course assault. The Mount Rushmore of crime is about half the national average. little above half but in the half range so

that said let's talk about just one of the most awful murders we've ever talked about what do you say this nice fantastic this nice safe beautiful place that's prettier than the grand canyon not gonna be vague about it not vague all. This is a lot of details. Now, let's get into this. Let's talk about some young men here first. These are all a bunch of young men we're going to get into. That didn't sound right. Let's get into these young men.

Let's not get into these young men. Let's talk about these young fellas here. You got yours. I got mine. Let's get into them. Jesus Christ. There's four of them, Jimmy. We'll line them

up this is disgusting now one is chester alan pogue uh p-o-a-g-e and his or it could be poge you don't know but i think it's pogue alan is a-l-l-a-n by the way it's a different spelling kind of normal usually the double a the double L will have the E a lot of times. So interesting there. He's born on the 4th of July, this guy. Is that right? Absolutely. He's a Yankee Doodle Dandy boy.

He is 4th of July, 1980 he's born. So there you go. His parents are Dottie and David. That sounds nice, doesn't it? Dottie and David, little Chester. Yeah. Who names their child chester in 1980 i mean bennington's parents did too but that's it's just a problem and look what happened there yeah look what happened what ended up yeah it's not good that was not good not a good choice

chester well after a only after a arthur is what we named him. Who named him? Big fan. What Chester? Maybe it's a family name. I don't know. I don't know. It's just such a weird name anyway. It's a cartoon name now.

It is, and it also rhymes with molester. So once people figured out Chester the Molester in the 80s, it was over with. That was, you know, it was over. So he's born in Norton County, Kansas. That's where he's from. Grows up on a farm, does little Chester here. Okay. On a farm outside of Norton.

Then in 1994, though, they'll move to South Dakota. We'll talk about that. But they lived on this farm until 1994 when they moved to South Dakota. 14-year-old kid moving up to South Dakota. Yeah, with his parents. I mean, he didn't go by on his own. That's culture shock, right? Oh, yeah.

I guess from Nebraska? Is it Nebraska or Kansas? Kansas. Northwestern Kansas to South Dakota is not that far, though, too. It's right there. But it's a vastly different place. Because I think, yeah, it's not far from there at all, like mileage-wise. No, Northwestern Kansas is right kind of below that.

Maybe it's just higher plains. It's probably about the same. It's just not living on a farm because they were a farm family. So anytime you're a farm family, that's a very specific lifestyle. To go from that to any other lifestyle is a huge culture. I mean, 99.9% of our listeners probably aren't farmers i assume just because there's not a lot of farmers out there so imagine if you all of a sudden tomorrow had we're a farm fucking responsible for a farm life is a lot different right it's the same you gotta wake up mad early

and get this shit going yeah otherwise if you're not on the farm you're waking up at 4 a.m going where the fuck is everybody no one's what's happening why is no one doing they show up at work no one's there you're like okay i'm not even supposed to be here now this is crazy so um now david his father his father here he had severe asthma which was a problem and a problem for farming because farming is a very physically laboring and it's a it's a very dusty a lot of toilet and there's a lot of shit going in your lungs just the shit that comes off of animals even is right top and if you're plowing a field that's rough and uh so because of that they decided farming is no longer for them the severe asthma got in the way so they retired they decided

to move to rapid city which is in the Black Hills up here in South Dakota. Welcome to the small town of Chinook, where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery Plus, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B. Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer,

unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot, and someone is watching Ruth. With an all-star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars' Kelly Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad-free on Wondery+. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts.

I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx and I'm excited to bring you the official Jinx podcast.

We'll be revisiting all six episodes of part one and watching along with part two as it airs on Max starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The Official Jinx Podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts. And it's a better climate for him, too. Apparently, it's less dusty. It's just better for him.

That's the spring in 1994. just better for him yeah that's the spring in 1994 and now david now has to go from being a farmer to trying to figure out how to make a living for his family right because as we'll talk about there's you know there's kids there's a wife and everything like that he tries to sell he makes furniture by hand is what he's trying to do basically because yeah he doesn't know where to go to get a job so he's good at doing things like that. So he makes vanities and desks and other things like that from hand, which is probably amazing furniture. I'd love a fucking hand-built desk.

That sounds awesome. I'd love a hand-built vanity. Vanities are the cheapest built pieces of shit, and they charge a fucking... They're so expensive, yeah. Jesus Christ, they're so proud of them. Made of shit. For nothing.

They last probably. So he tries doing that. That doesn't work out. He can't make a living doing that, apparently. So he drives a truck for a while here in 1994 when they moved to South Dakota, just trying to make ends meet. He's trying to figure out his way in the world. So he's driving his truck for a while, he'll do that until 96 we'll talk about that

and since they move, they start having problems sure Dottie and David do, there's problems in the marriage now as far as Chester goes, Dottie said he's always a quiet boy with brown hair and brown eyes 6 foot 1 when he grows up.

He has a love for woodworking. His father taught him about woodworking. He likes to do that, and he loves baseball. Oh. Never a great player. When you look at him, he's real lanky. He's 6'1. He's probably 140 pounds, I mean, if that.

He's real lanky. He doesn't look like an athlete by any stretch of the imagination. But he still loved to play and loved to watch baseball. He didn't have to be great at it. 94 was a great time for baseball. Well, 94 is the worst time because that was the strike. Right, but there's great players to watch. 93 and 95 was fun.

Yeah, it was great. It was a great fun time for baseball. Just that particular year was one of the worst years ever for baseball. The season shut down and everything. Just a beautiful time for different. God damn it, the athleticism shit was. Prime Griffey, prime Bonds, all these guys. Frank Thomas.

Pre-steroids, some of them, like Bonds and guys like that were pre-roids. Frank Thomas was probably running them. Jose Canseco definitely was. Definitely was. So 1996, David and Dottie file for divorce. Yeah. And two days later, David kills himself. Wow.

Yeah, he commits suicide September 5th, 1996. That is heartbreaking. That's brutal. And September 5th, 1996. That is heartbreaking. That's brutal. And for the kid, too. I mean, he's 16 years old. His dad just killed himself. That's hard enough that your parents are getting a divorce right now. Right.

But he just watched his hero, probably. Give up. In his mind. Right. A farmer just became obsolete and killed himself. I mean, besides that, just his marriage falling apart and the farm and everything else. I mean, he must have. I'm sure David felt like his life was on shifting sands completely.

Certainly. Yeah. So his mother here, Dottie, says about Chester, Chester being a boy had a tough time dealing with that. He had an anger in him, a real hurt because he missed his dad. Yeah. Yeah, of course he missed his dad. Yeah. Yeah, of course that's normal. So Dottie takes her son out of rapid city high school and,

um, they have a, she has a, he has a sister as well. And they move back to Northwestern canvas to our canvas, Kansas to kind of get over it and to huddle up with, they have family there. So they're kind of sure huddling up with family, you know, they don't want to be alonedle up with their family there. So they're kind of huddling up with family.

They don't want to be alone in South Dakota for no reason. So Chester graduates from high school in Norton, Kansas, and decides to enroll in the technical school in Goodland in the fall of 98. So he's going to go to school here. Dottie and her daughter, they move to Spearfish, where they were thinking – her sister's name is Samantha. And they moved to Spearfish, and they were thinking that they were setting the sister up because she wanted to go to Black Hills State University after she graduated. So they were like, oh, we'll move up there.

So she moved up there. So that's how that goes. So he's kind of – he's in in Kansas and they're in South Dakota. Dottie says Chester, always a good kid. Good. A good boy. She always says a very good boy went to church without being forced to. Even even while attending technical school and living kind of away from them, he still went to church every Sunday. Not even like just with the family he visited his grandparents every weekend like while he was in school um he also got in a little bit of trouble

for smoking weed because yeah who fucking cares i mean sometimes you got a vent man it's the late 90s he's a chill kid he's smoking weed who cares it's not like he's you know he's not smoking crack he's smoking weed right what's the's the difference? God, Jesus. It was in every fucking song that you listen to. Yeah. I mean, and it's it's fine. So and he's doing fine in his life. It's not like it's turning him into anything bad.

So he's got five on a big deal. Dottie said about her son as a teenager. I'm not going to say he was perfect, but, you know, he had his time with all that stuff meaning partying and stuff like that weed and when you do that can put you in the wrong group of friends that's what she objected to was the friend group yeah she said though he was such a nice kid quote he wrote me little notes in grade school and middle school in high school even uh you'd expect that of a little boy but not of a 15 year old or a 19-year-old. Whenever he felt the need to thank me for something, he just let me know that he cared.

I'd just find those notes to Mommy telling me he loved me. So that's very nice. Yeah. Yeah, she said they were close. She said Chester loved to go rollerblading and fishing with his mom. Yeah, went to church camp every summer. And just a nice kid, she said. Great kid.

All around good kid that you would want your kid to be. Doesn't cause trouble. She said, I have a coffee table and an intricate wooden puzzle Chester made for me. He made a puzzle? He made a puzzle. That's impressive. Also, I have a bat made from oak and

walnut that he turned on the lathe. Like a baseball bat made a bat on a lathe. That's impressive. Also, I have a bat made from oak and walnut that he turned on the lathe. Like a baseball bat made a bat on a lathe. That's pretty cool. Chester liked doing, he even crocheted because he hung out with his Aunt Becky and she taught him how to crochet. And he learned. And he learned. What a guy. Yeah.

She said, quote, he made me an Afghan. He's just a nice guy. A whole ass blanket. Oh, that's a fucking decent sized blanket. Even if it's just one to put over you while you're sitting, that's a pretty good blanket. It's not bad. Yeah, even if it's just a runner for your lap. Who gives a shit?

That's pretty good. That takes time. They're pretty thick, too. I don't even know what that stitch is called. I don't know. I don't fucking know either. I don't have an Aunt Becky. I don't know what it is.

I have no Aunt Becky. I think it's a loop swoop. Is it bunny ears you do? I'm not's a loop swoop. Is it bunny ears you do? Not sure. Loop swoop and pull are bunny ears. So she said he made me an Afghan. I was so amazed, impressed, and awed that a boy would do something like that. Yeah, what kid is like, I made aunt Becky an Afghan?

How many kids say that? That's a nice kid. His mother said that when he would get into trouble, I would punish him by taking away his car keys. He would still walk more than a mile to church each Sunday. So if he was in trouble and had his keys taken, he would walk over a mile to church for the sermon. Jesus. Now, most of the time you would imagine'd imagine too when a kid gets punished and gets his car taken away yeah they'd give him the car to drive to church usually you know like you

can go to school fucking work in church nowhere else that's it yeah that's even in prison like even if you're on house arrest to let you go to like church work and school and that's all but he's like i'll walk it that's how much I need church. So, man, not bad. So 1999, he came to Spearfish at Christmastime in 99. And he was going to work for a few months. He was taking a semester off of school. He only had one semester to go to finish his degree. And he was taking a semester off and then was going to finish it at the end of the year 2000. So he goes to work for a few months in Spearfish,

and he's going to hang out there. He takes a job that winter working for the Kramer Concrete Construction, all Cs, by the way, setting forms and doing concrete work. Oh. So he's learning more skills. And he's doing that while he's knitting an afghan, which has impressed the entire work crew. Unreal. That'll do.

Yeah. When you bring your supervisor on the construction site an afghan you made for him last night, he's going to appreciate it, obviously. So this is the owner, Randy Kramer. By the way, Kramer is with a K, but the name of his company is with a C. It's because you don't spell concrete with a K. You only spell that with a C, so you've got to run Kramer that way. He wanted CCC, so he changed the spelling of his last

name for his business, which is hilarious, I think. Randy said he was a good kid, a real fast learner. He kept pretty much to himself, but he did his job. He did it well, never called in sick, and wasn't afraid to work. That's as, that's as positive a review as you can possibly get from like construction

site people. Yeah, no, kept to himself. You know, I didn't mind. He minded his own business, did his job,

didn't call in sick and he wasn't afraid to work. That's as good. That means, holy shit. He was a god among men. That's what that means. Kid showed up at start in time. He left at quit in time.

Sounds like a fun to me. Not afraid to get his hands dirty. That's a five-star review from a concrete construction company. That is, man. So 2000 comes around because 99, 99 Christmas and then 2000 rolls in. And he like we said, he's still enrolled, but he's taken the month off or a few months off from from Northwest Kansas Technical School and doing all that. He's hanging out. He's spending time with his mom and his sister, Samantha. And he realized at this point, by the way way when he came to Spearfish he started telling his mother stop calling me Chester I don't want to be Chester anymore. He's had enough. He's had enough. He said that

she said that he wanted to be known by his middle name Alan from now on. Which is a little easier for a kid than Chester I would think. Certainly. When you introduce yourself to a girl it's much easier to say I'm Alan than hi I'm Chester when you're 19. a girl it's much easier to say i'm alan than hi i'm chester when you're 19 just doesn't sound cool um she said quote for 19 years i had called him

chester so it was real hard for me but people made fun of his name he said so he wanted to go by alan oh yeah once you hit puberty you're the molester now, and that's that. Yeah. Period. That's just done and done. There's a blackjack dealer just washing his hands of it. Sorry. Yeah, I'd go by Al before I went by Chester. Oh, yeah. I'd just go by anything. Call me fucking Doug.

I don't care. Just pick a name. It's better than Chester. What's worse than Chester as a first name? You could enlist in the Army, and they'll just call you by your last name. It's better than Chester. What's worse than Chester as a first name? I mean, you can enlist in the Army, and they'll just call you by your last name. That's easier. Perfect. Yeah.

Not Chester. So March 12, 2000 comes around here, and he's been working for a few months doing his thing. Changed his name to Allen. Everybody calls him Allen now. So he made some friends at this point okay and he's gonna go hang out with these friends at about eight o'clock on march 12 2000 he's gonna a pm yeah yeah it's a night hang here and here are his three friends that he's made and he's hung out with and we'll find out where they came from after we introduce them. Here is the first guy here, Briley Wayne Piper.

So, rowdy Briley Piper here, leading the life of Briley. Here it is. He's born March 20, 1980, so same age as Alan here. The name Briley came about in the 80s, huh? 1980, Briley. That is a surely adopter of the boucherie. Chester and Briley are opposite ends of the spectrum. Like in 1980, you could be named both Chester and Briley.

That's how fucked up of a time 1980 is. At least now it's just Briley. And back, you know, before that it was just Chester. Now you can, 1980, it's both. I didn't even know in 1980 jeans with flat pockets and shit all over the back pockets were in fashion. I had no idea. Yeah, Briley certainly wears affliction shirts. His dad does.

His mom wears jeans with pocket covers with buttons and fucking shit danglingling we're talking about a specific person we know by the way leather embroidery all over the pants it's briley that's the guy so briley to make it even stranger grew up in anchorage alaska which i bet you didn't expect that right but you didn't expect briley to be from anchorage did you holy shit so he was born prematurely, a couple of months actually. It was a touch and go there. But apparently everybody in his family said he walked and talked at seven months old, which seems very early for talking.

Right. Like more than a word or two. Talking? Yeah. And walking too is seven months is getting out there pretty early. Yeah, that's pretty man yeah he's really going he grew fast and i guess by the time he started kindergarten he was way bigger than the other kids he was like a briley did briley grew grew big yeah he's also got some

problems briley and this is from a young age because we often think about when the problems start is it born is it you know nature nurture that sort of thing with him it's i mean three is young to start being an asshole yeah and he's an asshole as a as a young child at three he found a lighter which in 1983 by the way every room in every house had five lighters in it. So matches, lighters. And they were so easy to offer. Oh, yeah. Totally. Oh, boy.

Cigarettes sitting on the table. Like, that's just how it was. So it's not like this is like, ooh, they should have hid the lighter. No one hid any lighters back then. No. Every kid had access to lighters. And he set his baron's bedroom on fire. Oh, my God.

He actually started a fire. Operated the lighter at three to a point of creating a blaze. And that was his goal was I'll set the room on fire. He wanted it. Yeah, he wanted it. Then, but they said like he did that, but then he also did another thing. His nine-year-old sister was supposed to do dishes but didn't, so he climbed up. He got a chair and climbed up and did the dishes to try to save her from getting in trouble.

Okay. So they said that was, you know, he was like a nice kid like that. He tried to stick up for his sister. In kindergarten, he got thrown off the school bus. He wasn't allowed to ride the school bus in kindergarten. At five years old. At five. How?

Dude. What do. How? Dude. What do you do? Every kid's bad at five riding the bus. Like, how much worse could he have? Did he set it on fire? Like, what happened? That's got to be child nudity, right? That's the only thing.

That's what I mean. Did he sexually assault the classmate? Like, what do you do at five to be kicked off? Especially in 1985. Yeah. It was hard to do anything to get in that much trouble back then. That's wild shit. I got yelled at a lot on the bus, but I never got thrown off.

Forever? Yeah. Excommunicated from the bus? Jesus Christ. Ostracized from the bus. I remember kids in ninth grade getting thrown off forever because they were smoking weed on the bus and shit like that. Oh, I know kids that got thrown off for throwing shit out the window at cars. At cars.

That's what you've got to do. Kids got thrown off for fucking, things like that, getting blowjobs. Like adult shit. How do you get thrown off at five? That's what I mean. If your dick is out or you're creating fucking road rage, that's how you get thrown off. That's wild. So his mother said, quote out or you're creating fucking road rage, that's how you get thrown off. That's wild. So his mother said, quote, at first I just thought he was active.

That's one way to put it. Yeah. He's an active fire starter. Yeah, that's a lot of active there. Holy shit. But I guess she said he was basically like having a dozen kids, having this kid because he was so hyperactive. His father worked in the oil fields and would be absent for two weeks at a time, sometimes as long as four to six weeks he'd be gone.

Oh, Jesus. Long stretches so that the mom has to deal with this hyperactive kid. Oh, she's going to corral this motherfucker. Yeah. She said he grew so fast it was hard to find and afford clothes for him all the time because he constantly needed new clothes. And she said that also the kids would tease him about being big, which we hear all the time. Remember the Luther Wright crime in sports?

The kids teased him unmercifully because he was so much bigger than them, which is weird. And teachers would – everybody said – his parents said this, but I've seen this in action too. Teachers treated him more harshly because he looked older right it's kind of like the ed kemper thing like right you you you're bigger so you seem older so you're a threat so you we keep you in the basement type of deal so that's that's a weird thing that a kid mentally puts on and it's yeah but yeah and it and it's only because uh the the teacher feels a certain way by looking at them yeah exactly that your treatment is based upon your eyes look your eyes

see a kid that's older and should know better even though they're the same age as that kid but you're bigger you should be it's weird i don't get it yeah strange so when he's 13, now 13, he's arrested, which at 13 to get arrested, you actually have to do something bad to not just be brought back to your parents. So he's arrested for allegedly grabbing a woman sexually. Oh. And also was arrested for assault after robbing a classmate at knife point. Oh, wow. The guy guy knows you you go to school with how old 13 wow 13 he's sexually assaulting people and fucking holding classmates at knife point that is two dead serious ass crimes yeah like arson sort of sort of. This kid is a bad. Wow. Arson, sexual assault, and fucking robbery at knife point.

That is wild, man. That's a lot. So Linda, his mother, Linda Piper, they asked her later, how would she punish her four children? Because it sounds like you had a real handful. She said, well, she had a belt, a switch, and a piece of plastic racetrack. Oh, I just beat him. I just beat the shit out of him. That's exactly what she said.

I know that racetrack and that thing fucking hurts. It's horrifying. She said, quote, the Hot Wheels track worked best. Yeah. Oh, God damn it. I hate that track. You double it up and beat somebody senseless with that thing. Whip him.

Holy shit. Wow. That is disturbing. She said she also has an adopted kids she has four kids three are you know natural and one adopted so yeah she qualified to take another child in well she had hot wheels track so they said well that's nice at least the kids have something to play with how are you going to punish this kid oh i bring a three foot length of it in my purse every day if not i gotta switch i gotta you know a belt i'll take my belt off if i have to oh my god she said all of her natural children had behavior problems and were involved with drugs and alcohol in their early teens so maybe it's because you beat the

fuck out of them yeah well by three doing that i think there's also a bad her and whoever she's making kids with are a bad genetic mixture for kids they come out there may be a the chemical concoction that their juices create sorry yeah i said that it's just vodka and milk that's all it is they're making a bad cocktail or you're like i don't want that that's they're creating something they're they're creating monsters that take Hot Wheel tracks to tame. That's fucking disturbing. She said, though, always, Briley's the youngest of the four kids, by the way. Wow.

And she said that he was the most loving as well, always. She said, he's really the best of any I've got. He's really loving. I mean, the bar is low. He's 13. He fingered a lady and held a fucking rob somebody at knife point he's really the best of any i've got what the fuck the other kids like lit my fucking bedroom on fire holy shit once we stopped the bed from smoldering he really i gave him a hug and we talked it out and really a nice kid

so he had frequent problems and so did she had frequent disagreements with school officials about her conduct um she's yeah she said quote i didn't believe everything they had to say this is the mom saying that didn't believe what this about what the kid was doing he said are you kidding me believe anything they say at this point. You trust the kid? Okay. More than an adult. All right. It's a conspiracy.

They're out to get my kid. They're out to get my kid. They hate him. Now, maybe in kindergarten he got treated worse because he was bigger and all that sort of thing. But by now we're talking about behavior. You know what I mean? And it's a problem. So he was diagnosed with add in junior

high um now he's smart though he was reading at a 10th grade level when he in the seventh grade wow when he got diagnosed with add but his comprehension was very poor yeah he could read and all that but then if you told him what was the story about he's like i don't fucking know yeah yeah my kid was doing that shit he'd blast through a book and i'd be like what was it about and he has no fucking clue no but he could read all the words and everything that were big i got all the words done okay yeah but you didn't understand a fucking word you read oh and his arrest by the way was for grabbing a woman's ass on a anchorage bike path at 13 frightening that is fucking wild um so after the arrest, his first arrest, the first arrest was the grabbing the ass. Then a few months later, he held his classmate at knife point.

The cops wanted to send him and the state wanted to send him to a group home after his first arrest. But his mother fought it. She said, this is what she said. She didn't fight it because she thought it would be too harsh in there for him. He's only 13. She doesn't believe he did it. She said, quote, I don't believe the state would beat him enough to keep him in line. Oh, my God.

Baby, you're not beating him enough. Are you kidding? Obviously, beating him isn't working. No. It's not working. I didn't think they would beat him enough. You know, the state, they're not good at beating children. Usually the state probably wouldn't have.

But the other inmates, the other maybe. Yeah. So ultimately, though, he ended up in a group home for a short amount of time in the end. Also, Linda said his mom said she refused counseling for her son because she didn't agree with the therapist's recommendations so the school liars don't like what they're doing don't agree with the way they want to raise my kid um the therapists don't like what they have to say about them don't like what they think don't like what they want me to do with it yeah she's an asshole this woman she certainly believes that she's doing the

right thing meanwhile all the evidence points to the contrary yeah she's just beating him with a racetrack and hoping that does it like what the fuck is that about wow and she's just making it meaner you know what i mean like yeah it's like beating a horse and then expecting it to not lash out yes Yes, exactly. Well, this is the reason she said, well, I don't think he should get in trouble for pulling the knife on the classmate. Even though he robbed the classmate, he didn't pull the knife out to rob him initially. He just figured while the knife was out, he'd rob him because Briley told his mom that, quote, the kid deserved it because he's made a derogatory comment about briley's mom he said something about you ma that's why i did it so i did that and she was like well you don't belong in a group home

that's right wow that is um that is wild now another a friend of his mother here um her teenager was hanging around with Briley. She called him a bully and a braggart and said he's evil. She said, from the moment I met him, I just knew he was trouble. She said she tried to tell her son and all her son's friends that that kid's no good, but nobody would listen to her. Really? So the life of briley is interesting next up another one of uh alan chester slash alan's fucking guys here is daryl r hodley here h-o-a-d-l-e-y hodley yeah he's born november 5th 1979 so same class so yeah same age range you of them. He's born in Laramie, Wyoming.

Oh. We got an Anchorage guy. We got a Kansas guy. Wyoming. Pretty, yeah. Now, he, again, had trouble in his childhood. Shocking. Oh.

He was abused by his mother and, quote, her male friends. Oh, what did they do? He has a history of abuse and neglect. His mother, Luella Eisenbarth, is her name. He had also an adopted father and also later on another guy and a bunch of boyfriends in between. So an adopted father, a stepfather, boyfriends in between. Revolving door in the house. And that would be when people have to live their life, except that she had some some problems we'll talk about yeah the basically he spent daryl spent most of the first three years of his life with his maternal

grandmother who was really stern and would spank him pretty brutally with a brush why does everybody use a fucking weapon a weapon under three by the way. Wow. They really have a lot of great comprehension under three. Yeah. Do you know, by the way, a four-year-old is about as smart as a dog? Literally. Like a decent intelligence dog, that's a four-year-old. That's about the same amount of comprehension and intelligence like a kid turns four. Under three, we're talking about stupider than a fucking dog.

That's what kids are. And we've all had them. I'm not saying your kids are stupid. Beating that child. You're beating them, going, that'll teach them. Would you beat an animal dumber than a dog because it didn't do what you needed it to do? No. Really, the only time you should be beating anything is because it's attacking you.

Attacking you. And a three-year-old, really, you could probably quell it without beating it. You could probably grab its wrists and put it to its waist, and you'd be all right. Otherwise, I could take, like, I could probably 30, 40 three-year-olds at a time. Otherwise, I mean, there's no way they could mount an attack that could, right? They're not going to form a toddler Voltron. Just to have that fucking joke. time otherwise i mean there's no way they could mount an attack that could yeah i just take one toddler voltron to have that fucking joke i'll just take one by the ankles and swing them around until just clear them all out clear them out let's go guys that's it swing them so i guess

numerous attempts by people in schools and things like that failed to help him because, you know, he would be they would take him out of the home for a while and try to help him. And then they put him back in the home, which was the abusive environment. Nothing worked. He had some problems in high school. In one, a teacher of his feared that Daryl was going to burn another student with a cigarette lighter because he was trying to. Yeah, that's not good. that Daryl was going to burn another student with a cigarette lighter because he was trying to. Yeah. That's not good. Another time, Daryl evaded a teacher who tried to remove him from the building, so he ran away from somebody.

That sounds like kid shit, though. That's pretty funny. That's pretty funny. I had friends that would do shit like that. Yeah. And we used to light each other on fire in high school. If you wore anyone with a sweater, you were going to be a ball of flame in the cafeteria before long. As soon as you outgrew Duck Duck Goose, the next game was you're going to be a fireball.

Yeah, watch this. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts. I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people.

With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great. A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal,

or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California,

Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit, but would never be seen alive again, leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Aaron and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle and theory, walking through the forensic evidence and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened.

And with over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Generation Y ad-free right now by joining Wondery Plus. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, Morbid. We're your hosts.

I'm Alina Urquhart. And I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well-researched. He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people. With a touch of humor. I'd just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called Malevolent Deity, that is pretty great.

A dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother****er lied. Like a liar. Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the Wayback Machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes,

you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. Watch that. That was the next game. Or trying to, like, you light a lighter

and then try to get the hot part on them. Yeah, like they'd make smiley faces in the bus seats when we were kids. Remember all the smiley faces on the back of the bus seats? They don't exist anymore, I'm sure. try and do that to somebody's fucking thigh yeah that was normal and you go ha ha ha that was funny got you when we were growing up that was funny for some reason we sound a hundred now yeah but still so another time he was removed from the school

but refused to leave the parking lot wouldn't leave the property none of these are dangerous things they're just dumb things dicky yeah they're dumb um a there was a discharge report from a that sounds gross here's a report of all my discharge a discharge report from the wyoming boot camp where he was incarcerated after he ran away from home. And this report warned that Daryl should be supervised when he was around, quote, fire-starting materials.

Flammable shit. Jesus. That is... And he's violent, they also said, so be careful. Another report said that he had struck his mother

at some point. Oh. Which, I mean, if they're beating him all the time, maybe that's why. So he is, by the year 2000, he's living in Lead, South Dakota, or Lead, I don't know which one it is.

I think it's Lead, but it's L-E-A-D. No, it's L-E-A-D, but I think they say it Lead, possibly, but it might be Lead. I'm not sure. And he has a daughter, by the way, so that's great that he's bringing another. What?

How old is he? 20. Just turned 20. Let's bring another generation in, Chief. You're going to do great, I'm sure. I'm sure he's got a great career going. Absolutely. And then the third of the three musketeers that old Chester Allen hangs out with is Elijah Page, and he goes by Eli.

His last name is the same as Chester's except without the O. It's P-A-G-E. Chester's is P-O-A-G-E. He's born December 1st, 81, so he's a year younger than the rest of the crew. His parents, biologically, are Michelle Page and

Kenneth Wayne Chapman, who sounds like a serial killer. Does he not? Didn't Kenneth Wayne Chapman leave who sounds like a serial killer. Does he not? Didn't Kenneth Wayne Chapman leave a trail of bodies? You're a bad man, probably. He'd leave a trail of bodies throughout Oklahoma or something at one point, I believe. Kenneth Wayne Chapman. Old farmhouses. If I was going to write a story about a serial killer, I'd call him Kenneth Wayne Chapman.

That's a perfect name for it. It's perfect. It sounds very... If you told me... If you would have just made up a background for. That's a perfect name for it. It's perfect. It sounds very... If you told me... If you would have just made up a background for that guy, we'd all believe it. Everybody would believe it. Kenneth Wayne Chapman. Bad guy.

People would be Googling him. I can't find him. Wow, this is really... This is a deep dive. He did some research for this one. I think Wayne is the most popular name for a serial killer to have. It is. They're all named fucking Wayne.

There's a ton of Wayne. Yeah, Wayne's somewhere in their name. Yeah. I've only known one dude named Wayne in my entire life, and he's a fucking bad name. And they're all born in a certain time period where people named your middle name after John Wayne. So that tells you who your parents were.

Right. There you go. And that's not even his name. Not even his name. Exactly. It's fucking Myron. That's the problem. Marion. Marion. Marion. Fucking Myron. That's the problem. Marion.

Marion. Marion. Yeah. Unbelievable. So his father doesn't really pop into his life until he's about 13. Young Eli. Perfect. That's great.

Maybe for the best, though, when we hear about his dad. Oh. So he's also got a stepfather named Wes Klein, who is also a complete asshole, as we'll talk about. He's born, Eli is, in Titusville, Florida, which is not a great start to begin with. He moves with his family when he's very young to Kansas City, Missouri, though, where we will be on tour, by the way. Get your tickets to Kansas City because we're coming there. Absolutely. He has not a good childhood.

When he is a child, for a while, he lives with his family in abandoned buildings that don't have heater utilities, obviously. That's a party. They're squatting. He's in a squatter family. Starting at the age of two years old, he's allegedly, we don't know for sure, but a lot of people said so, including doctors, allegedly sexually assaulted by his mother, starting from two. What? Two. Everybody here thinks two-year-olds, everyone in this story thinks two-year-olds have way more of a handle on shit than they do.

You know what I mean? Jesus Christ. This is insanity. So, wow. Then he's got, he's three years younger than his older sister, who is named Desiree. After Desiree, after he's born, soon after that is when she marries Wes Klein. They move to Missouri, and Wes and Michelle have another child named Cassia. So in Kansas City is when they were living in abandoned buildings and all that sort of shit in the winter by the way they were doing this crushing it three kids three small

children five two and fucking you know newborn cold as fuck nice um here is one from a report of there's a bunch of reports because he was in and out of the system a lot as a child right quote people who tried to protect elijah and his siblings found out that his parents and caretakers were drug users and that elijah was sexually abused by his mother beginning at age two god damn it that's rough to see him black and white right um also reports suggest that michelle page sold her children to others in exchange for money and drugs. Meaning sexually sold her children. Her children! Yikes.

I mean, we've heard of fathers doing this and we go, oh my god, rip this guy's balls off. But a fucking mother doing this is even more disturbing to me. It's not the stepfather who came in and just wants to bang the mom and shoot up fucking junk this is mom is saying this is mom and her motherly instincts are to cocaine or whatever the fuck drugs rather than adult yeah do what you will to my daughter because i need

fucking ten dollars right disturbing so wow um they also said quote the children were quote exposed to and witnessed domestic violence and explicit sexual activity in the home. In the home. In the home. This is not good. This is a bad childhood. We'll see what this leads to here. It's not great. So now Desiree, the older sister, said that she pretty much blocked out a lot of those years and doesn't recall a lot of details because it's fucking horrifically traumatizing so she didn't do that on that wasn't her choice her body did that to try to protect her yeah so she can turn into a decent person her her brain shut down because it couldn't handle that shit yeah if you shut that part off

every time you blink you'll never survive no it's no you're gonna be in a lot of trouble for the rest of your life it's gonna be terrible for you and one time she says though that elijah quote when he was real little and there was a guy that went to jail because my mom caught him in the act with elijah trying to get him to do things oh jesus christ he didn't pay ahead of time apparently or something i don't know what the fucking deal was so Also, from the beginning, he's always blamed for everything in the home. And this is everybody says that. The siblings, everybody says that. Yeah.

He grew up, they said, being taught that everything that happened bad to his family was his fault. He did it. He did it. The middle child did it. Okay. When his stepfather would beat him, it was because it's his fault he made him do it when his mother his mother used to do this all the time just pour cans of beer over his head like you're insulting a man at a cowboy bar trying to start a fight like it's necessary

roughness and you're trying to get Scott's back heel to punch him. Because he made a pass at your wife. Yeah. I do love to pour my warm beers out on my kid's head in the pool. In the pool, it's fine because they can dunk it and it's funny. I think it's so funny. In the living room. Yeah, in the living room while he watches fucking Zoobly Zoo.

That's not cool. This is not okay. Oh, man. It's a never-ending story is on it's 1985 holy shit when social workers hounded michelle and her husband or threatened to take away the kids she would blame elijah for it so this is your fault that they're doing this wow uh they said quote eli was raised to take blame. So Michelle and Wes looked good. That's why that's what he'll always do. He'll tell everybody that he did things, they say, because that's what he thinks. He'll take the rap. Yeah. This is a foster parent who had custody of Elijah and all the rest of the other two kids at one point in the mid 90s in Kansas City, probably when they were living in fucking abandoned homes. one point in the mid 90s in Kansas City, probably when they were living in fucking abandoned homes. Quote, the saddest part for Elijah was that Michelle, who I refuse to call their mother, really liked Desiree because Desiree looked like her. She said Wes liked Cassia because she looked like him. But Elijah kind of got ignored when he was a little child desiree would tell her mother that

that he was hungry michelle would just say who's hungry it's like he wasn't even there what the fuck this doesn't exist the yeah it's that's this is disturbing so they said that um they moved near a church and that's how they ended up getting foster care for them they said that they lived in southern kansas city and a lot of the people there went to a non-denominational Metro Christian fellowship church and they would be, they'd hang around and they said that they would see this disheveled family with no money and no means.

And these three little kids and members of the church would provide them with things. Sure. A kerosene heater, clothes, food, shit like that. Um, they said, clothes, food, shit like that. They said, quote, what I heard from others is that this is one of the people.

What I heard from others is that the way that's the way Wes and Michelle operated. They were pitiful people always asking, would you help us with our kids? They did it to get other people to care for them. Yeah. Wow. That is fucking to give them shit. They looked more pitiful for them. Yeah. Wow. That is fucking to give them shit. They looked more pitiful on purpose. Yeah.

Yeah. If they don't have the kids, they can't guilt people into giving them shit. Right, they won't get their shit. Yep. At one point, Michelle just took off and disappeared. This is Desiree says that. She remembered she just took off. She was gone for 18 months.

That's a year and a half. That's a long time to disappear holy shit and then she reappeared and had a boyfriend with her she just rolled up oh this is your new stepdad by the way and let's fucking yeah desiree said she came and got us and we went off to arizona of course they did what that makes a lot of sense. Yep. They ended up, the mother, this new boyfriend, and the three kids lived in a car in the desert. That's what they did. They'd park in the desert and sleep there. Okay.

No, you can't do that. At least there's no snow, and you don't have to worry about freezing to death. It's worse. I'd rather freeze to death than that fucking heat. You got to sleep sitting up, that's for sure. Yeah, at least you can sleep when you're freezing to death but it's worse i'd rather freeze to death than that fucking heat you gotta sleep sitting up that's for sure at least you can sleep when you're freezing to death you can't sleep when it's that hot ever that's fucking horrible holy shit so the new boyfriend jeff watts uh they end up later on this is another boyfriend took the kids to carthage new york uh there yeah the

department of social services reports from Jefferson County, New York, reveal that Michelle and Jeff Watts drank excessively and often fought, pretty much exclusively in front of the kids, by the way. Fantastic. The children reported seeing their mother being beaten on a regular basis. That's nice. And it was

common for Michelle to go out drinking and leave the kids at home to fend for themselves or wander the streets with quote little proper clothing is what the social service report said. So in Carthage, New York, just wandering the streets looking for food because they were hungry and mom's out drinking.

Wow. Yeah. Oh, here's another one. This is the foster mom quote. Desiree told me Michelle wouldn't allow the kids to wear clothes in the house sometimes in the house, in the house. the kids to wear clothes in the house sometimes. In the house?

In the house. You've got to be nude in the house. Like taking your shoes off, but lose your pants. Get them pants off, son. She also said then she'd bring guys home, pour beer over the kids' heads, and tell these men, these are my kids. You can abuse them see oof eventually west klein the stepfather who's now not in the picture he ended up coming to new york and took the

children back to kansas city oh okay now uh neighbors of them they ended up going michelle went back to neighbors said how klein would consume drugs and large amounts of alcohol around them and around everybody and how he would physically abuse the children all the time. God damn it. Person again, the the the foster mother said the kids told me that they would have to sit at the table and listen to Wes read the Bible for hours on end. I'm the I'm the father. He told them you have to respect me. I'm the father, he told them. You have to respect me. It was almost a brainwashing thing.

And after reading the Bible for hours, he'd take them into a room and punish them. Yeah, just hit me with a Hot Wheels track instead. That was their punishment was read the Bible for hours, then I beat the shit out of you. Those are your punishments. What is that about? Desiree recalls being beaten with belts brushes and extension cords oh no fucking bad have you ever seen the kenny versus spenny where spenny whips fucking kenny with an extension cord no he has the most horrific fucking welt afterwards and he's like

jesus christ dude that's too what the hell are you doing that's fucked up so they're hard in the first place awful but the the it's awful it's just a lesson in gravity and physics those things come at you so fast they like cut the skin man those are so bad crazy um now his sister this is what desiree says quote west punished in private so i didn't always see what happened to elijah he take him into a room and do it which makes it scarier for the other kids. But I think he had it a lot worse than I did. Maybe because of the fact that he was a boy.

Probably. Neighbors here, Pete and Susanna are their names. They said how Wes called their house one night in a panic saying someone was beating on his door and demanding repayment of drug money. He called the neighbors.

There's a guy at my door that wants drug money. That's nice, Click. Fuck you. Sounds like you should have paid him. Yeah, there's about four people in my life that could make that phone call for me, and my next door neighbor ain't one of them. You're on the list, Jimmy. congratulations they want james they want the money you can call me for help my kids can call me for help my wife i hope that your answer is brother probably brothers will pay him i would pay him fuck i'd give him their money then probably right give them back the drugs easy answer is fucking pay

them yeah so this pete next door went to investigate why the fuck would you go to investigate i go wow that's terrible man you should probably shouldn't buy fucking you probably shouldn't buy fucking crack on credit maybe that's why i don't know click fuck off yeah there. It feels like there's no collateral in that. Except your ass. Now, he opened the door and what this neighbor found was the man who was at the door with a gun. And on the other side, Wes had the door open holding a shotgun using 10-year-old Elijah as a shield. He held Elijah in front of him and put the shotgun around him.

Like, you're not going to kill this kid. I'll shoot you. Get the fuck out of here. He used his stepson as a human shield. From a drug dealer who wants to collect. From a drug debt. Yeah. Think about that.

Holy shit. Your parental instinct, number one, shouldn't be to get into debt to drug dealers. But if you happen to have had that, your instinct should be, they're here. Hide the kids. Let's protect them. Put them in a bathtub. I bet they won't shoot my son and put him in front of you. That's not the normal thing.

My God. Yeah. Now, the Missouri Family Court judge found that Klein had physically and sexually abused the children and also allowed others to sexually abuse them in exchange for drugs. So he sold them also, which if mom's selling them, stepdad will do it, too. So eventually the neighbors went to Department of Social Services and the person lady, she's the foster mom, she ended up going to training to become foster parents specifically to take the Paige children because she felt horrible for them. Talk about being inspired. Yeah. You saw somebody's situation, you're like, I'm fixing that. I have to fix this.

Whatever certification I need need i'm getting yeah the kids are wandering down the street half clothed again while mom's out drinking and dad is using them as human shields and selling them all tell you what you want to fuck my kid instead we'll call it even like what a disgusting person so she elijah stayed with the person family from spring of 93 until the end of 94 so this is you know that's a year and a half yeah it's a while and she said this is tammy person i think his true nature is very kind and tender he was so happy to be with us i bet he was jesus he's eating he's not being beaten um food and no rape that's amazing that'll really do a lot for your attitude that'll change your life that'll perk you right up let me tell you something wow no rape and food this is amazing tell me there's a bath and i'll come in my own get out

of here you have toys fuck off there's a nintendo here jesus christ wow next you're gonna tell me there's clean sheets get out of here there isn't popsicles in that freezer is there no popsicles and pop tarts son of a bitch strawberry with the frosting man this place is too good to be true and she said and he was really really good with my kids for the first year he was not a problem the only problem we had was he would do his school work but not turn it in and that was because he wouldn't let himself succeed he would not he would actually do he would do his work not sabotaging himself on purpose and the parents would be like why didn't you do your work they go through his stuff and his work was in there and done he did it he just didn't turn it in because he just thought he

couldn't succeed and thought he shouldn't succeed and thought what's it matter huh that's so weird it's uh yeah so desiree says that she saw the tender side of her brother though she said i just i think things just affected him more than me and i think i just stood up for myself more i wasn't an easy target yeah i don't think it's wow that's just crazy so under when they were with the persons though after the first year elijah grew sullen and defiant after that uh he would take off when he was told he wasn't allowed to go anywhere then the person children started to become uncomfortable around him and more nervous in general and so they decided that they had to get him out of the house he was affecting their family too you know negatively which is rough because when you take a kid in like that you'd expect him to be grateful but the thing is like they're gonna see some things yeah

and he's only 12 13 jesus he's gonna he's gonna feel resentment yeah he's gonna feel like he doesn't belong there's so many emotions that kid's going through he's gonna test you to see if you'll if you'll abuse him and if you'll put up with his shit and if you'll be there for him or not too so a lot of this might be kick me out because i'm a piece of shit and i know i'm no good so you should get rid of me and it's a it's a self you know self-perpetuating cycle so i'm not sure but either way it's affecting all of their right their children that they have and they said they had to get rid of him which is that's why it's hard to be a foster parent because it's brutal so that's a tough thing anybody who does it makes it work hats off to you you know so for a time he goes from there to athens texas to move in with his

biological father who he's never known kenneth wayne chapman yeah chapman shocker couldn't care for him couldn't take care of him just couldn't couldn't hack it no big shocker right athens texas i've never even heard of it i know texas needs to stop naming fucking their dumpy little towns after huge great cities of the past athens par, Texas. Get the fuck out of here with that. Dusty shitholes. Please, at least call your big cities those names. At least, you know. Don't call some town of 1,200 people a metropolis.

Yeah, the city of lights, for Christ's sake. So he ends up moving in and out of different foster homes at that point. So now he's being bounced around and God knows what he's experiencing in home to home to home. In Texas? Who knows? Wherever. Yeah. Yeah.

And then from 16 to 18, he gets a job and does pretty well in Kansas City, his sister says. So he and Desiree lived together for a while, actually. Really? Shared an apartment together. Yeah.

So they were like huddling up to escape this horrible shit. That's great. But then after a while, he decided to go move in with a friend of his. And Desiree says he was drinking a lot. He ended up without a place to stay living on the streets. Then one day he told me he was going up to South Dakota with some people he knew from church. And that's how he ended up here now desiree says she never saw him be physically violent with anyone even when his stepfather was beating him or people were making fun of him

he never fought back he just took it she said yeah never never fought back would just take it um just one of those things she said um that you know she says later on, it's very strange, not strange, but she recognizes that they kind of they have these shared horrors of childhood, but they took they have very they handled it very differently. Yeah, they process it and deal with it throughout their lives entirely different. Yep. She said, quote, It took a lot of counseling to not feel that all of this was my fault. This is what Desiree said. Yeah. Everybody ends up differently. They're in a different life, and they make different decisions,

and I decided to deal with that in counseling. And Elijah didn't, is what happened. He didn't do the counseling. So the foster mother said, Desiree wanted out of it. She wanted no part of it. She believed it wasn't her fault, and she wanted to talk to someone about how to deal with that and that's not what he did he took it inward and their lives turned out very different as we'll talk about here and he just copes on his own huh yeah with being angry and

just kind of sullen and and self-sabotaging any situation that he has as well yeah it's fascinating because it doesn't seem like he lashes out it feels like he lashes in like he's he takes it out on himself yeah absolutely because it's all his fault everything you think that's why he even when he's doing something well he doesn't do it because then it's something positive right then kicks his own ass for no reason it's a weird psyche to have that um thing i like to torment myself a little bit like that. So I'm feeling that a little bit. Yeah. I mean, I did that for a very long time. But it's interesting that he's taking out that on himself. Not even.

You know what I mean? He's not even trying to succeed at all. He's doing everything against himself. That's interesting. Everybody shits on me. I'll shit on myself. Fine. Yeah.

Yeah. Weird. I'd rather have my own shit than somebody else's. I don't know. I'll shit on myself first. It's like the comedy thing. i'll make fun of myself so people become comedians i'll make fun of myself before you can make fun of me he's just doing it in an extreme way if he would have just learned to make jokes maybe it would have been he could have had a great laugh yeah imagine the fucking material about his childhood he would have had christ oh my god shit yeah that's what i mean that's what some comics some people do, and sometimes it goes the other way.

So December of 1999 is when he moves to Spearfish. So everybody's kind of new in the area, these three, or trio, or foursome now. Soon after he arrived, he met a girl named Misty Gutler. Hell, yeah. Old Misty Gutler. Come on, Misty Gutler. let's go on and hang out now wow she sounds misty gutler sounds like if you go near her with a heart on she's pregnant period that's it doesn't it any girl named misty is insanely fertile like don't fucking go near them

misty gutler hates it when you pull out. No, absolutely. No. They're like, Misty Guttler's like a mogwai. You have a hard-on after midnight. Just kids start popping out of her corners and shit. You got to pick them up. It's wild. Swallowing chaw spit is called gutting it.

But she guts it the other way it's poor we don't know anything about her but it's hilarious though the name is just funny gutler oh my god so pam gutler is misty gutler's mom yeah and she said about elijah quote he was so polite so considerate he did so many little things to show his true nature. He'd come over to eat supper and do the dishes just to say thank you. Oh. Wow. He said that Elijah, Misty, and Pam, they would all watch TV together and movies together.

Her daughter had gotten into trouble with drugs and was actually on probation, Department of Corrections probation. And they said that Elijah made sure she stayed clean. Is that right? Yeah. She said, quote, he wouldn't allow her to do a thing to screw up. He kept her totally straight and clean. He was good for her. In all reality, I thought he would be my son-in-law.

Hmm. I wonder what drugs she was doing. Who knows? That's, I mean, quote drug quote unquote drugs from whatever pam just thinks drugs are but drugs enough to get her in trouble where she's misty gutler feels like a meth name right yeah it feels misty meth-y it sounds similar doesn't it seems meth-y so misty had to at some point though report to a uh correctional boot camp from the state. The state forces her to do that. So Eli loses his job at McDonald's that he'd had in Spearfish

when he decided to take off of work to go with the gutlers when they dropped off Misty at the boot camp. He had a shift that day, and they fired him. Fuck it. I'm going. Fuck the Hamburglar. That is fucking interesting. Now, another girlfriend of his from before that is a woman named Natasha Paris. Her name is Natasha Paris, Texas. They met in 1998.

She dated him for a couple months. They broke up, but they stayed close friends. close friends. She knew him since she was 13 and actually lived with Eli and the sister in the house for a while.

So, oh no, she lived with here. I'm sorry. Yeah. Okay. She lived with them there. She said, I was only 17 and I reconciled with my parents, so I moved back home. So she said that they didn't, this is Paige, Piper I was only 17 and I reconciled with my parents, so I moved back home. So she said that they didn't – this is Paige, Piper, and Hoadley basically. They're all going to move in together in Spearfish.

Really? Paige, Piper, and Hoadley, the three guys we just talked about minus our first kid, Chester slash Allen. He's with his mom and his sister. So she said she lived – this is his girl Natasha Paris lived with this crew for a little while. Jesus. And she said, you know, everything was fine when they moved out. When she moved out, she said, well, they were dating. They just hung out and went to church a lot, sometimes several times a week. My God.

Natasha said he was a good kid. There's just nothing else to do, I think. Yeah. kid there's just nothing else to do i think yeah they said that uh paris and piper here um you know the uh briley piper and natasha paris entered this group of friends about 1999 in december when hoadley moved back to spearfish and brought briley piper in to hang out so paris natasha paris she knows chester slash alan she She introduced Allen into this group. To the group, yeah. After Briley showed up, basically.

So then they became all a hangout. So she said they all welcomed Allen in. They all called him Allen, you know, because that's what he has to be called. And they said he was just fine as everybody else. No one was picked on in the group. Everybody hung out. Everything's fine. Yeah, they said it was all good.

So she said that, you know, they had a house that they would hang out at on 3rd Street. They said it was a small house, two bedrooms, living room, kitchen, bathroom. And she said it was definitely a party house. It didn't even have a stereo or a TV, though. It was just people hanging out.

Okay, just loud noises she said a lot of beer a lot of beer drinking a lot of weed smoking that sort of thing she said they were almost all teenagers some people in their early 20s 18 to 22 it's like a you know college age people just four boys that are pissed at the world yeah and they're three boys three yeah the fourth one he doesn't live there alan doesn't live with them he just hangs out he pops in hangs out parties with them because this is the party house i mean yeah this is where you'd go when you're 19 if you're living with your mom and sister and going to church every week you'd be like i need to blow off some steam

just an angry house she said they played cards and talked and um she said everyone was really easy going i don't remember any feuds you know they'd argue like friends but nothing extreme she said nothing like that she said the house was filthy though which it's three teenage boys living there what do you expect gross she said you didn't want to walk around without shoes but no shit what you didn't want to walk around barefoot in there what a that's a gross thing to say out loud. Don't be in my house barefoot. She said that, that you didn't want to.

Yeah, you didn't want to be there. That's how dirty it was. Ew. Yeah. She said that once Briley Piper entered the group, that's when everything kind of changed. Really? She said it was like night and day. He was very manipulative, Briley.

Which Briley, I mean, he's the set my parents' bedroom on fire when I'm three guy. Yeah, cop of feel. Cop of feel and hold a kid at knife point and manipulate his mom and all that kind of shit. So, yeah, she said that Hoadley wouldn't even hang out with her with Piper around when Briley Piper was around. Basically, she said Daryl couldn't even go to the bathroom without Piper. So Daryl Hoadley needs Briley Piper to be around here. So back to March 12, 2000 now when they're all going to hang out. We had to introduce the whole crew here.

They're all going to hang out on March 12, 2000. Big day. Now the three of them, Hoadley, Piper, and Page, not Chester slash Allen, they have been on a two-day spree of LSD, meth, and booze. Two days?

Two days of that, which meth will do that to you for two days. You can go on a spree. Acid is not like that. Acid, you come down. You tend to be not, yeah. You're pretty fucking tired you want to get you're done sleepy sleep at that point yeah you're tired unless you do math and then you do math hey i'm up again so and booze mixed in there just why not now uh briley had told a friend of his, Nathan Wartman, now we'll talk about his mom in a minute here, Nathan Wartman, that Chester, Alan, we'll just call him Alan from now on, Alan would give him, Nathan needed a ride back to the Job Corps facility. Fantastic. Perfect.

And that Alan said he'd give him a ride to Job Corps. Okay. So Alan said, sure, I'll give him a ride to Job Corps. Okay. So Alan said, sure, I'll give him a ride to Job Corps. So he, Briley Piper, Eli Page, Daryl Hoadley, the four of them all pick up Nathan Wartman, drop him off at Job Corps. Okay. There we go. Now, Christine Wartman is his mom, Nathan's mom. She said that Page and Hoadley, Daryl and Eli, were always pleasant and had good manners, but that she did not like Piper, Briley Piper, from the second she met him.

No one likes him. They all get the vibe off him. This guy's a bad motherfucker. So she said the first time she met Piper, he told her that he wanted to kill someone someday just to see what it was like. Yeah. I mean, you've done everything else. Wow. If someone tells you that, don't be around them anymore.

That's a bad person. Certainly jot that down in your notes. Yeah, maybe the time of day he said it. Time, date, all of it. That sort of thing. Holy shit. She said that her son, meaning Nathan, the kid at Job Corps, and Briley had spent some time together earlier in the day at her home on March 12, 2000, during which Piper made a disturbing comment to her.

Briley did this day. He said, quote, I've got to leave. I've got a rat problem. So the mom said that comment made her uncomfortable, but she ignored it and said, I have some mousetraps in the garage. Do you need them? I'll give you some. I have a bunch of them. I brought a whole box of them.

And to that, he said, not that kind of rat. And he left. Okay. So. So he's got a shit. He's got a real shit problem. So now he thinks he's fucking John Gotti over here. I got a rat problem.

We got to take care of it. So then the four of them, this is Nathan's at Job Corps. The rest of them go back to Alan's house after they drop Nathan off at Job Corps. Because the mom, Alan's mom, Dottie, and the sister, Samantha, are both on vacation in Florida right now. So the house is open. Wide open. So they go there and they start playing PlayStation games because it's 2000 and PlayStation one was still real hot shit at that point. Probably Dave Mira or Tony Hawk.

Oh, good stuff. Yeah. Fucking all sorts of good shit there. Just Madden. Maybe who knows what they're running. Yeah. So during they go out and have cigarette breaks sometimes a couple two or three, two of them at a time, basically. And at some point during this, your Paige and Briley and Hoadley, the three musketeers there, we'll call them, they decide to start plotting a robbery at this point now.

Is that right? Yeah. So they're all playing video games. While they're playing video games, Eli Page went through a closet in the house, in Alan's house, and found a revolver, found a gun. Just looking for shit to steal. Just looking for shit to pilfer and steal. So while they're in there now, they're all doing this. They say, well, let's get out of here

let's take off i don't know why you'd want to walk away from you know open house and playstation but they're gonna do it yeah video games and cigarettes that sounds like i do that now that sounds good staying yeah i'm staying until the parents are home if you came to my house and we were like jimmy let's just hang out and play playstation and smoke cigarettes you'd be like fuck yes that sounds great and we do that for hours. We'll do that until we have to make another show. Yeah, absolutely. Because 10 years ago when we first met, we used to do that.

We'd sit and play Madden and smoke cigarettes. That's all we did. So when we weren't doing comedy at the time, we were doing comedy, but when we weren't, we'd be smoking cigarettes and playing Madden. Didn't do that. So they decide to do that. They all leave in Allen's 1997 Chevy Blazer.

So he's the driver. They take off. Okay. They're going to a house in Spearfish, and the reason they say they need to go there is to complete a methamphetamine purchase from someone. Oh, okay. So we're going to go to this dude's house and get some meth is what they said. So they ended up at the house that Piper, Page, and Hoadley had been staying in.

That's where they were going. So I don't know if they said that the guy was coming over with more meth or what the deal was. But once they get there, Eli Page takes out the.22 caliber pistol that he stole from the house, from Allen's house. And he points it at Alan. Okay. Out of nowhere. They've been friends for a while. This is really strange.

And tells Alan to get on the floor. So first Alan's like, thinks he's kidding. Like, what are we doing here? This is funny. And then he's like, no motherfucker, I'm going to shoot you. Get on the floor. So Alan's like, okay. He gets on the floor. While he's laying like what are we doing here this is funny and then he's like no motherfucker i'm gonna shoot you get on the floor so alan's like okay he gets on the floor while he's laying on the floor briley piper comes in and kicks him in the face until he's unconscious why that's just no reason there's no fucking reason um so while he's unconscious they pick him up and they sit him upright in a chair and tie him up with a cord.

What the fuck is happening? Are they going to cut his ear off and pour gasoline on him now? Like, what the fuck is happening? This is insanity. So he regains consciousness in the chair. And I guess Briley Piper laid a tire iron across his feet to prevent him from moving. I don't know how that worked. I guess maybe in front of the chair with his feet behind it so he couldn't.

You know what I mean? One of those. So he's stuck in this chair and he's tied up with a cord and all this type of shit. At that point, Eli Page forces him to drink a concoction that he has made. Oh, boy. This is the three of themcoction that he has made. Oh, boy. This is the three of them, I guess, have made. In this concoction, he has crushed up some pills that he found of some kind, mixed that with beer, and then poured in hydrochloric acid.

What? Yeah. Why would you would what is it and they're trying to make him drink this and they make him drink this oh my god so pills beer and acid they're making this poor kid drink pool acid yeah exactly fucking disgusting so that's the shit that's very anarchist cookbook too there's a lot of crazy shit when i was a kid we used to do bad things with that shit yeah i won't say yeah that stuff is that stuff will explode man exactly yeah very easily it's really yeah disturbing so in a flash of with like yellow smoke you can make some bad shit happen with that stuff oh why we did it is very dangerous yeah we

go into apartment complex pools and steal them because you go into there they'd have they'd have the yeah you just bust those they had tons of it in there yeah yeah bad kid i guess i was so anyway um anyway i was in phoenix during um that they made him do that while they're forcing him to drink it, he's asking the $64,000 question here, the obvious question. Why the fuck are you doing this to me? Why are you doing this? I don't understand it. We were playing PlayStation a minute ago.

I'm giving people rides. We're all hanging out here. Yeah. And in response, Eli Page hit him in the face and told him to shut up. Don't ask questions. Yeah. Shut up. Don't ask questions.

Yeah. So now, while he's tied to a chair and conscious and in pain, they stand there in front of him. This is Piper and Paige, Briley and Eli, stand there in front of him discussing how they're going to kill him. Well, how should we kill him? I don't know. We should do this. Right in front of him, they're discussing this. They're like, well, we should slit his throat. That'd probably be a good way to do it.

What the? So Alan is pleading for his life life he's offering to give them anything they want he's like i have stuff i'll give you whatever you want just let me the fuck go i don't care whatever so at that point eli asks him uh asks alan what's your pin number for your atm card it's not a lot of money, right? No. He's going to fix this. He's a fucking 19-year-old who works at a concrete place. I don't think he has that much cash probably stored up.

So he gives it to him. Alan gives it to him. He's fine to give it to him. Here, take it. I don't fucking care. So then they untie him from the cord, and they don't let him go, though. They then escort him outside to his own vehicle and place him in the backseat.

Okay. Never good to be placed in the backseat of your own car, by the way. Your own car? Yeah. Not good. That's happened a few times in our stories, a lot, and it never ends well. It's never, never, no. Not once.

And they threaten to kill him if he tries to escape from the back seat because he's not tied up at this point because they couldn't walk him outside you know tied with electrical cords that might have drawn a red flag or two from the neighbors push him in the chair yeah out to the car we know there's an old lady staring out the window at some point here it's a nice neighborhood so yeah what's going on over there? So Briley Piper gets in the driver's seat, and he's the one he's going to drive. So they stop at a gas station first.

Then Piper, Briley, drives the group to Higgins Gulch in the Black Hills, which is a fucking gulch, just as you would think it would be. This is a wooded area about seven miles away from the house that they left from there. Okay. They arrive at the gulch, and they force Alan to get out of the car. It's about a foot of snow on the ground. It's 25 degrees outside. It's so cold. Yeah, 25 degrees.

By the way, this is the same time of year. Just about, well, a couple months later that they're going to do that festival where they want you to wear tropical clothes. So that's how silly this is. This is warmer weather than the January. Than the January. Yeah. So they get this guy. They force him out of the car.

Foot of snow and 25 degrees outside at this point. Then Piper and Paige, Briley. You notice I'm not mentioning daryl holdley's name a lot here yeah what's happening he's just a follower he's with this and he's with them he's here he's here he's in the mix yeah oh he's there the whole time i'm not mentioning him because he's not the one doing the things but he's there sitting there hanging out the whole time so they force him out piper and page eli and briley then uh they force him to take off all of his clothes except his undershirt which is like a like a you know wife beater type undershirt you know what i mean um yeah guinea tea whatever you want to do if you're if you're Italian, that'll be what you'd say. But if you're not, please don't say that. So he's wearing that, shoes and socks.

So that's all he's allowed to wear is a fucking undershirt, shoes, and socks for some reason. His dick's out. Yeah, I don't know why. His ass is out. His ass is out. I don't know why they chose to leave him with an undershirt. I don't understand any of this. That's got to be for the humor of it for them right i suppose 25 degrees yeah so they then take his wallet out of

his pants here so at that time they tried to this is their attempt to kill him now they go let's kill him okay they hold him down and try to cover him up with snow. Oh, God, that's just torture. That'll kill him. He'll just freeze to death in there real quick. That's because he has no clothes on. That didn't work, obviously, because that would take a while. So then they said, well, that's not working.

Get him up. They pick him up, and they walk him down to the icy creek below. Okay. This is about 50 feet from the road they had driven on to get here. Now, Paige and Piper kick him numerous times all over him, just beat him up, basically. Kick him in the head, kick him in the ribs, whatever. At one point during this attack, Alan tries to escape. Yeah. He takes off.

But apparently, Briley Piper told Eli, go fucking get him. And Eli chased after him and recaptured him and continued to beat him. God damn it. Okay. Now, at that point, they said, okay, well, he's not dying in the snow, and we couldn't beat him to death. That didn't work. They made him go lie down in the creek, in the icy fucking creek. It's 25 degrees out with snow running.

It's freezing in there. So they made him lay there for a while, by the way, a long time. But he's not dying because that takes a long time. You're going to go into hypothermia. Oh, that would take so long. It takes a long fucking time to die like that. So that't work so they're like god damn it this is shit so um throughout the beatings by the way piper would be laughing and saying things like oh that would suck and oh that's gotta hurt shit like that like just tormenting being a fucking asshole

yeah at one point he said alan asked them can you just let me into the car to warm myself he said i'll i'd rather bleed to death in the warmth of my car than freeze to death out here in the cold basically so he said and he said i'll bleed faster i guess so you know fucking that'd be easy true yeah so they said okay sure but you have to wash the blood off your body in the creek first. Why? I don't know. This is his car we're dealing with.

So after rinsing, so he does, he goes back into the icy water, cleans himself all off. So then he's sitting there dripping with icy water and 25 degree weather. And Briley Piper says, nope, can't go in the car. Change my mind. Piper says, nope, can't go in the car. Change my mind. Instead, they start to, again, beat and taunt him instead, rather than letting him go

in the car. So then they dragged him back to the creek because they went up to the car. They acted like they were going to let him in and then said, never mind, change our minds. We're not letting you in and beat him up instead. Dragged him back down to the creek. This is like, they don't even know what to do with him. This is ridiculous.

This is psychotic behavior. This is psychotic. Like, I don't know how to kill people, so let's just experiment with shit. Like, this is nuts. This is like a kid with a fucking fly or something pulling wings and legs off it. And it's a kid that has a belly full of fucking acid right now, too. Yeah. That's what I mean.

He's on God knows what from the beer and the and the pills and all that kind of thing um at that point the three of them now i think hoadley's involved in this part they all try to drown him in the creek okay um now at things start to diverge in terms of their stories at this point one of them said that briley admitted standing on because he'll say this later briley said he stood on pogue's neck here on alan's neck to help hoadley drown him but then piper stabbed him once or twice uh by the ear and under the chin as well oh my god in the fucking head oh they're just stabbing him and beating him and standing on his neck and all that kind of thing.

He said that earlier he told different people different things. First, he said that he didn't participate in the drowning attempts or the stabbings. He went back to the car and sat there. But then later on, he said, no, he was doing all that. Sure. So after the drowning attempt, now they tried to drown him. They're stabbing him, beating him. Oh, by the way, they're going to start stoning him soon as well.

Holy. He's still moving. Yeah. After all this. So according to Piper, and we don't know how true this is, but somebody might have been Darryl Hoadley, but we're not sure, through the final rock that finally kills poor Alan. Okay. Now, both Eli and Holdley will later admit they jointly dropped

large rocks on his head. Oh, Christ. That's what they think finally killed him. This is, by the way, three hours of beating and torture this took. Oh, Lord. Three hours. Finally, they leave him for dead in the creek what a few scumbags man this is true absolute pieces of shit wow i don't even know what to

say about this is that's i mean this is as as bad as it gets like this is it's one thing to do terrible things and you know we've heard lots of torture and stuff like that. But this is hours of just. Sustained beating of a man that's, he's so young for no reason. And three people, too. Three people. It's one thing for one person to get somebody alone and have their darkest, deepest. This is three fucking people are going along with this.

It is disturbing. So then they drive away in, course alan's car right clearly and they started figuring out how they're going to divvy up his property alan's property here so they went to his house now back to his house because they know nobody's home and they start stealing shit yeah they got back uh then they go to uh hoadley's girlfriend's house and she says later on that she saw the three of them unpack the stolen playstation video games and many other items from alan's house what what the fuck yep you got a playstation out of this you losers that's what you got and what games did you get yeah Yeah, this is ridiculous. For what? The girlfriend also said that Briley Piper at that point confessed to the murders in detail to her.

She said Piper laughed about the killings as he told her about it, quote, and thought it was just a really cool, neat thing. That's what she said, unquote. Another friend, Jeff Dew, Dew, I guess. It's a D-E-U-X do oh yeah jeff do all right that's junior right that's french junior that's french do do yeah really he said that piper confessed to him as well and also said yeah he did have a nonchalant attitude saying that Piper acted, quote, a bit cocky while telling the story. OK, now Eli's got his version here. Eli Page is going to he's going to spill it and he's the guy to spill it because he just blames himself for everything.

So if you're going to get a guy to crack, this is the guy that's going to fucking do it. And that's what happens. Let's hear what he said. This is in his words of what they did to this poor kid. OK, at the at the time when he ran, he was able to run OK. Let's hear what he said. This is in his words of what they did to this poor kid. Okay. At the, at the time when he ran,

he was able to run. Okay. Talking about Alan. I mean, there was nothing in a, uh, enabling him from running, which is, he fucked up his words.

Disabling man. Exactly. Wow. Um, he said, Jesus Christ. He said, Briley reminded the two of them about pending charges for drugs and said, if Alan was allowed to live, he could just get up and go to the nearest house and tell on us and we'd be caught before we even got out of town.

So we can't let him live. So Eli said, so me and Daryl refused at first. We sat there and argued for a little while, 30, 45 minutes. We argued about it. But he said, finally, you know, he said, finally, me and Daryl gave in. And we were like, well, how are we going to do it? And Piper or Daryl always had one or two little knives on him, keychain knives. And Piper asked Daryl if he had them on him and if so, to get them out. Hoadley took out one of his keychain knives and Briley told Hoadley and Eli to, quote, go slit his throat.

Go slit his throat with a pocket knife. With pocket knives? With pocket knives, which is awful. Eli says they refused. They said no. Eli said we told him to go do it. You go do it if you want to slit his throat. Fucking enjoy. Well, I'm not fucking doing it. He said he kept telling me to do it

over and over again. So finally, I just grabbed the knife and went down there and quickly stabbed the back of his neck. And then went back up and handed them the knife and told them it was done. I did my part and now they can do the rest. That's what he said.

There, did it. He's the first one to plunge a knife into him, though. That's what he said. Yeah, he admits to that. He said Daryl Hoadley then went from the vehicle where the conversations among them had been taking place to the wooded creek area where he was lying naked in the creek. Alan was.

Examining the wound made by Eli on the neck. He told the other two, he went down there, they said, go check and see if he's dead. Yeah. Holy went and looked at the thing and he said, he came back and said,

Hey, that's not going to kill him. What happened down here? I just scratched him. Yeah. And, and Eli said, quote,

I told him I'd never done it before. If they want to do it, do it themselves. Like, I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. I'm not the guy to hire to slit throats. It's not my thing. I'm not a hitman.

Yeah, this is not my thing. He said now, this is what Eli said, Chester was crying and asking us to stop and let him go after the initial knife attack. So Piper then said, according to Eli, quote, I'm tired of hearing him whine. And he told him to shut up when Alan continued to cry Piper then this is Piper grabbed the knife and went and stabbed Chester in the side of the head three or four times maybe more I'm not completely sure how many times exactly then he said I told you to shut up huh um Piper then Briley then walks over to hand the knife to Daryl Holdley, who was standing near Allen, and telling Holdley that him and Eli Page had, quote, done their part.

Or no, that me, Briley, and Eli Page, we did some stabbing. Now it's up to Daryl to complete the murder, and we'll go back to the blazer while you do that. Okay. Okay. Eli said, while we're sitting back to the blazer while you do that. Okay. Okay. Eli said, while we're sitting up there, 15, 20 minutes went by. Daryl called us back down to where they were, and we went down there. Nothing happened. Nothing happened, he said, of what he and Piper found.

Chester was still laying in the creek, and Daryl was kneeling beside him. So he didn't do anything. He said this is what Alan was holding his neck and crying and still was kneeling beside him. So he didn't do anything. He said he was, this is what Alan was holding his neck and crying and still begging us to let him go. He continued to cry and say, let me go. I won't say nothing. Won't say nothing, he kept saying.

So Briley told Daryl not to listen to Alan and to quote, just go ahead and get it done. So then Paige and, you know, they go back up. They leave Daryl down there and they go back up to the blazer. They said a few more. Eli said a few more minutes passed and Daryl called us back down.

Okay. So they walked back down again, this time to find Chester holding the front of his throat and blood was coming out. Hoadley said, you know, he's not dead. I cut his throat and he's still just sitting there that's what he he tells them yeah jesus fucking christ no if you're gonna kill people know how to do it and do it efficiently please for the love of god what are you pilfered a fucking gun for christ's sake you're just torturing this young man i guess if you shoot him if you know if you've ever seen a

law and order by 2000 i would think you would you'd know if you shoot him you can't hock the gun then or whatever because they're you know connected or can't sell it to anybody so according to page here according to eli briley it then uh told alan that he could quote if you could quote clean all the blood off of him you could come up to the blazer and warm up. So Eli says, and me and Daryl were telling him just to leave him alone, leave him there, and let's just get out of here. But he said then they had an argument with Briley, and he said he's been stabbed in the neck and the throat, and he's been sitting in the creek for well over an hour now. He's not going to be able to make it.

Like, just leave him here. He'll die. Yeah. Briley disagreed and said and basically he had the keys to the vehicle and no one was, you know, no one was leaving. He just said, I have the keys and we're not going anywhere. Yeah. So Briley told Alan again to wash up and you can come and warm up in your car, he said. And then Chester jumped up and started washing himself off. in your car he said and then chester jumped up and started washing himself off so they said as they walked back to the blazer um he asked piper if he he asked briley if he really wanted us to page asked briley do you really want to let us go up to the you know take him to the vehicle

and warm up is that for real and piper said, just keep him to the creek. So just to keep him in the creek, he said, just keep him down there. Don't let him up. So he washed him up and he washes around his neck, starts to get out of the creek, and then they start pushing him back into the creek. And Eli said, and that's when we started kicking him. Finally, they kicked him repeatedly. Each time he tried to leave the creek, they said, finally, he just laid down in the creek. repeatedly each time he tried to leave the creek. They said finally he just laid down in the creek. Eli went back to the blazer, told Briley, said, hey, let's just leave.

He's laying there in the creek. And Piper said no and said that he would take off with the vehicle and take everything and basically that we weren't going anywhere. Like I'll take off and leave you guys here with him if you don't do what I tell you. He told us to go back down there and finish what we were doing. So Eli said that they arrived and stood over Alan. And he said that he and Hoadley again discussed what they were going to do. How are we going to do this? And he said,

I don't recall who picked up the first stone I could have, but I don't remember. A rock was picked up and thrown at his head and Chester fell over, and we thought that was it. So they started to walk back to the blazer, and they said Alan suddenly got up, or sat up, like the Undertaker, basically. Grabbed his head and started screaming. He regained consciousness and said, holy shit. But if he was out for another five minutes, he would have been fine. They would have left.

They would have left. five minutes, he would have been fine. He wouldn't have been. They would have left. They would have left. Then they came back and they threw more stones at his head, but they said he continued to survive the attack. So then they go back up and confer with Briley again.

Yeah. They've gone back and forth 20 fucking times now. They go up and they talk to him and they said, you know, he's been stabbed in the neck. He's been laying in the creek for a few hours. He's been kicked and rocks have been thrown at his head. There's no way he can make it anywhere. Let's just leave.

And he said, Piper said no and told them, get down there and finish it. God damn it. Good Lord. This is horrifying. So then Daryl and Eli, they walk back down to Alan and hit him with more rocks in the head, ones that they had to pick up together and drop, huge ones. And they said, finally, he remained still. So they returned to the blazer and told Briley that Alan's dead, and then they all left in his blazer. What a story.

He said that just like Tommy Wiseau in The Room. You said that when he tells him, I know a girl who's going out with with a dozen guys and one of them beat her up and ended up in a hospital on the Chigarero Street. What a story, Mark. You just said it like that. If you said it laughing, it would have been the same way. They stopped to buy cigarettes. Then they went over to his house to steal more of his shit. Jesus Christ, man.

Yep. Eli said a couple of stereos, a PlayStation, PlayStation games, some CDs, music CDs, a camcorder, a Dremel set was taken. That's what this was about. That's the pilfering. That's it. $400 worth of crap. And we're going to get away with this. Absolutely.

Totally. Wow. So then the three of these idiots decide to let's stick together. And after they, they see that one's girlfriend and all that, they drive to Hannibal, Missouri together. Okay.

What's if I would have given you 10 guesses, I don't think you'd have come up with that. Why are they going there? Um, they took off there. They departed from Allen's house between 4 and 6 a.m. on March 14th, so the next day. They leave in his blazer, by the way, a dead man's car with blood all over it. That's smart. And they traveled to Wyoming, then to Missouri, where they try to stay with Briley's sister and her husband.

They visit the sister, but upon her refusal to let them stay for a while, they didn't know what to do, so they went back to South Dakota. Zero planning forethought or really preparation. Just all of this is so bad. Two-day meth binge. They're playing PlayStation. They're like, let's kill that guy and take all his shit. Okay.

And then they just do it. Wow. This is where you're bad at things when you're on meth. You think you're good at things, but you can't even kill a 19-year-old or formulate a plan or do anything properly. The pawn ticket for all the shit that they stole is going to get them one day of meth. You're going to get nothing for this. Gas money back from fucking, you know, Milwaukee. Kansas City?

Missouri, yeah. So the sister's husband there, Briley's sister's husband, removed the stereo system from the Chevy Blazer, promising to mail Piper Briley the money after it had been sold, and Eli pawned one of the stereos taken from the home for a radar detector so they wouldn't get pulled over going down. Didn't he? Not even meth.

They got a radar detector out of it. He got a cobra out of this. Wow. You can't just do the speed limit? Nope. I mean, gotta have a radar detector so we can speed. I don't understand that at all. We but we got a speed we got we'd like to i got the need for speed and a blazer i don't want my insurance rates to go up here you know what i mean that's the thing here that's the main problem

holy shit so they go to south dakota and um i guess eli and daryl and Piper stayed in Rapid City and Eli left with the blazer to go back to Kansas City where his mother and sister live. So Eli took the took the car and left there. So, by the way, in South Dakota, they use the ATM card for cash and they pawned a bunch of shit throughout the trip. And records from the bank show that atm card was used six times in various locations in south dakota and nebraska and some of alan's property is later found at pawn shops in both wyoming and missouri my god so uh briley ends up in alaska the three of them then go their

own separate ways briley goes to al Traversing the whole fucking country. The whole continent, basically. And then Eli takes off. Eli, after three days, heads to Texas to see his dad, which I think that's a dry well, homie. I think Kenneth Wayne Chapman.

But actually, Kenneth Wayne Chapman really lives up to his name here, as we'll talk about. Page calls his father from Fort Smith, Arkansas, but actually Kenneth Wayne Chapman really lives up to his name here as we'll talk about. Yeah. Page calls his father from Fort Smith, Arkansas, where he's out of money and gas. So Eli calls his dad,

Hey, I'm stuck in Fort Smith, Arkansas. He said, can you meet me or can you wire me some money? And so I can keep going. And his father said, well,

how about I'll meet you in Fort Smith. I'll come up and get you. Oh, so Eli said that he told his father eventually, well, how about I'll meet you in Fort Smith? I'll come up and get you. Oh. So Eli said that he told his father eventually after they'd been together that he had murdered someone. And that this blazer that I have here that I have no gas for belongs to the murdered guy. So we probably need to do all of that. He still has the car. Yeah.

He drove it down there. Holy shit. There's no cell phones here so it's not like oh he hasn't texted in a while mom and sister are in florida out of sight you know so it hasn't been reported of anything so he goes to see kenneth wayne chapman what do you think kenneth wayne chapman tells him when he says i murdered a guy and i have the dead man's fucking i have the i have the uh the the the victim's vehicle no it's gonna say i have the spoils of this murder right here in this vehicle what do you

think his father would say i got the booty uh does his father say let's sell it his father says first of all clean up all the damn fingerprints off that thing oh my god as a true kenneth wayne chapman would said yeah would say and said get and then get fucking rid of it what are you doing with that thing wipe it down let's sell it what yes oh eli then stays with his dad for a month with the car down there with the no they got rid of it they just ditched it somewhere he's then eventually questioned by uh texas in texas by lawrence county senior investigators and uh they talked to him about it because um there's a bunch of shit going on now now march 18th six days after the whole thing uh piper briley piper was visiting umartman again, the Job Corps kid, but at his house where his mom is there. And his mom hates Briley, as we know.

Sure, yeah. Wartman's mom said that Briley had noticeable scratches on his arms. When she asked about the scratches, he said, I must have done it in my sleep. Really clawed myself to shit in my sleep. Really clawed myself to shit in my sleep. Yeah, I am vicious in my sleep. Well, I always wear a Freddy Krueger claw to bed. That's the thing. I put lotion on my hands and then put Freddy Krueger claws on, so I make sure to keep it dangerous.

I get this recurring dream that I'm covered in mosquitoes. Yeah, it keeps happening. Jesus. So not long after, that's when the three of them disappeared because it was about a week later. Yeah, so the mother said Nathan would come home, the Job Corps kid, for the weekend and wonder where they were. He tried calling them or stopping over at their house. And then a few weeks later, she said she smelled something strange in her car. And she said, I thought the kids left food in there or something.

But she searched it. And under the driver's seat, she found a T-shirt and a towel with a black substance on them. That used to be red. She said, I never suspected it could have been blood. I threw it in the wash with Clorox. They stuffed that shit in the friend's mother's car. Oh, my God. His clothes?

His clothes, yeah. But she didn't know what that was at first. She had no idea. Later, she found out and was like, oh, fuck. She said, I just took it inside and washed it with bleach because it's a white towel and a white T-shirt. She said, quote, she said later on, she called the police and turned the shirt and towel over to them. But she said, I had thrown it in the mosh with some Clorox, so I didn't know. It's already been bleached.

And this is what the deal was. She said, quote, I still think Briley was trying to frame Nathan. I was trying to say, oh, yeah, that's what happened. Yep. Adding that Piper knew how to open the garage door at the home. And she believes Piper gained access to her garage and placed a bloody shirt and towel in her car. And then he fled to fucking Alaska.

It was like, wow, must have been that kid. Weird. I don't know. I live in Alaska, so I couldn't have done it. Yeah. So for a month, he's just gone. More than a month, he's just gone. I mean, Alan's gone. Then a woman who owned land near Higgins gulch ended up going to the land to look at it and spotted something in the creek that she didn't like and it turns out this is a month in the correct way dear god well the good news is it's cold as fuck it's probably

preserved pretty well but it's still not good that's where they used to put bodies before funerals in deadwood back in the day. Right. To preserve them, yeah. Yeah, that was a big deal because it was cold. So his body was found clad in a sleeveless T-shirt, socks, and shoes, and that's it. So the forensic pathologist here from Rapid City performs the autopsy. He discovered numerous head injuries and stab wounds. Some examples of the head injuries inflicted included stab wound

to the jugular vein, another stab wound through the skull, a complex spider web shaped skull fracture that measured five inches, you know, if someone dropped a giant rock, and they determined cause of death

stab wounds and blunt force injury to the head. Two skull fractures, a knife wound in the brain, one that punctured his skull, a knife wound cutting the jugular. And he said any of those injuries could have separately caused death. All of them. So after the body was discovered, Piper, Briley's immediately a suspect because he's a known psychopath that was in the area and knows the kid. So they go, they track him down in Alaska and they go and question him. Everyone in Alaska is running from something. He was running from this.

Unless you're born there, you're running from something. That's where you go. And even if you're in the military up there, you're probably running from something. Yeah. You're probably running from some shit. Yeah. You want out. Yeah.

So they question him and they arrest him for first degree murder. Yeah. He gives a detailed statement describing the murder and his participation in it to law enforcement. And he's extradited to South Dakota. His details are a lot of I didn't do anything. I'll bet. A lot of self-serving shit. his are i did a bunch of stuff then i went back to the truck and the other two did everything and i

didn't know what was going on meanwhile the other two are like we kept going back and and he kept telling us what to do he wouldn't he wouldn't take us home if we didn't yeah and uh on may 2nd, 2000, they arrest, late April, I think it's April 27th, 2000, they arrest Eli Page in Texas for the murder. Okay. So May 2nd, they make a tape where they take him back to the fucking scene of the murder and say, show us what happened here. Because now here's the geography of it. Briley or Eli? Eli. They take Eli? Eli. They take Eli back there.

On the tape, he waives his rights and does all that, and writes to remain silent and attorney. He walks three investigators step by step through a reenactment of the killing. Yikes. They said that he used his right hand and feet to demonstrate how he and his accomplices taunted, kicked, stripped,

stabbed and stoned him and then left him for dead in the stream. The detective Brian Bean said, quote, Elijah was candid to the point of disbelief. It was almost more than a person could stand to this day. It sticks with me in violent colors. He's kind of a piece of shit. And I wish I had heard anything. I wouldn't have known about all of that, as I'm sure some of you are thinking right now.

I can't believe. This is like that one in the trailer. In Rulo. Rulo. Yeah, it's just. No, no. It's torturous. More recent.

Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes. Where they beat up the boy in the trailer for no reason. Like, this is so fucked up. The only thing that makes this short of Rulo is that nobody stuck a broom up his ass that's the difference here otherwise it would be like the same thing the reason is just to take stuff for playstation games haunting it it's not like they knew we had oh my god he has got back there like a closet full of gold bullion and we're gonna steal it it's fucking four hundred dollars in garbage are you you're not gonna believe this stuff his mom already gave him his inheritance and there's three hundred thousand dollars in his closet it's just sitting in there stacked up nice like holy shit so so

fucked during the interview here uh they said that alan was confused when he was forced out of the blazer into the gulch they said he was standing there asking us what we were going to do and why we were doing it. That's what he said on the tape. Basically, we were telling him we were jacking him for everything he had. He said that Alan looked scared but was trying to act calm, trying to be cool about it. Yeah. You know, maybe it would stop.

So they said it was Briley's idea to strip him of his clothes. They cut his hands free so they could remove his shirt and coat. Then they removed his pants and underwear, too, leaving him in only shoes, socks and a sleeveless shirt. They said, why did you let him wear his shoes, by the way? Because that just seems like an odd detail. And he said, I have no idea. Eli said, no idea. He said, when we got there, we weren't set on killing him.

No. They marched him down to the embankment and um they said at the bottom that's when briley told alan to lie down in the deep snow he said piper was like hey let's bury him with snow and maybe he'll freeze and we're just like okay none of us knew shit none of us know shit none of us also knew that if you bury him in snow it's actually warmer than if you left him on top of the snow. You're actually helping him. So that's the other thing I don't fucking realize. Insulating him from the elements. Exactly.

It's exactly what you're doing. It's into wind and all that. So then they said they started kicking snow onto him, but he jumped up and took off running across the stream and up the steep bank on the other side. He was fucking naked, this poor kid. I feel terrible for him. They said he didn't get far before he fell because it's fucking slippery and everything else. They said then, you know, Eli said he was angry,

so he forced him back across the creek. He was like, I'm not going to run. I'm not going to run. That's what he was saying, Alan was saying. They pushed him into the creek. They pushed him in. We know what happened. He's screaming.

He said at this point, we really weren't trying to kill him. We were just trying to get him to stop screaming. Once he stopped screaming, we were like, okay, now what do we do? He said, Piper said, well, slit his throat. And he was looking at me. And I was like, why don't you slit his throat? Fuck you looking at me for? Yeah, this is not my thing.

Not my farm. Yeah, this is not my thing, not my farm. Yeah, he said. But at that point, Eli had the knife first and he went over to Alan. He said, I held his head for a minute and I was like, OK. And they're like, well, do it. Come on, hurry up. So I just quickly stabbed him in the throat and turned around and was like, OK, there. They argued because he hadn't done it right. Then Hoadley stabbed him. And we know the story from there. They argued because he hadn't done it right.

Then Hoadley stabbed him, and we know the story from there. He said when Piper had the knife, he said Briley stabbed him with a, quote, full backswing and plunged it down so hard that was the one that pierced his skull and penetrated his brain. Good Lord. Eli said, I looked down and went, damn, that must have hurt. They said, did that get a laugh? The cop said, did that get a laugh? And he said, we really didn't laugh, but we let out little chuckles. That's a laugh at that point.

In that environment, that's a big laugh. Chuckling at all is a pretty good laugh. Yeah, it's a huge laugh. He killed right there, literally and figuratively. So they said Alan was still crying, begging for his life. He said that Briley's blow made him cry even harder because he broke his skull. He said that, quote, he kept on saying, Al, please let me go. He was crying. He asked us if we could take him to his house and let him die in his house.

We told him no. Then Briley promised Alan he could warm up in the blazer if he washed himself he said that he did his best to that he could and then he started to crawl up the the bank of the thing with a broken skull right but they said then obviously they changed their mind um he said um jesus christ alan said bri Riley promised me. Piper promised me. And Paige told him, Eli said, quote, well, Piper's a liar. I'm a liar, too. And I'm sure Daryl's a liar.

And Daryl was like, yeah, I'm a liar, too. Oh, good Lord. So Paige said he used his foot to push Alan back into the water. He said, quote, he's just basically lying there crying, holding his throat and still holding his head head but they said then they were getting frustrated and angry all of them and eli said just because alan was making too much noise he said we were like just shut the fuck up you're being too loud he kept on screaming and i kicked him again weird broken skull stab wounds yeah he's in pain man naked in a freezing creek weird that he'd be screaming at that point oh he said you guys are really bad at this like in as painful as as a death as it is it's pain it's more painful to hear how fucking no it's not yeah but it's really just difficult to listen to

this because like yeah the amount of fucking failure in these three boys. They're fucking bad at everything. Teenagers are bad at a lot of things. These boys were going to fail at everything for so long. Everything. Forever. Forever. They said they kicked him so hard they kicked his ears off.

Oh, for fuck's sake. off oh for fuck's sake huh they said at one point alan stood halfway up to get out of the creek and eli kicked him back down uh to the opposite side of the creek he said he just laid back for one or two seconds and then just screamed out ow he said uh also alan was just saying just let me die just let me die but he said that um that kicking wasn't working eli, I looked at Daryl and I was like, my foot hurts, man. I can't kick him anymore. He said, me and Daryl just sat there thinking, what are we going to do? He said, by then, Briley was in the blazer. He said, then he went to the stream and picked up a rock a little smaller than a basketball.

It's so heavy. He said, I just brought it up to my chin or my chest and I just hurled it at him. And he demonstrated it for them on the tape. He said that Alan said, ow, and remained conscious. Then Hoadley hit him with a rock and same result. Then Eli put his foot on his head, on Alan's head to try to drown him.

He said, I almost fell. So I stepped back and I said, hey, that's not going to work. So then the two of them picked up a much larger rock. He said, it took both of us to pick it up, and we just threw it at him. It landed on his head. He was in the water, and he was like, ow. So this is all,

he's trying to give this as a plea, right? But this is the most callous fucking words i've ever heard spoken yeah it's fucking horrible he says it real casual like he got hamburgers and came home and then something was on tv he said me and daryl were like hey man he's not dying because they went back up to the blazer he said we just hit him over the head with a whole bunch of rocks and he's still moaning and groaning and stuff and stuff and stuff he said piper said well i don't care finish it make sure he's dead he said and that's when they went down and they threw stuff on him three two three more rocks at his head until he stopped crying and he said that uh daryl knelt down close to make sure he wasn't breathing

and then he and um you know he and page the two of them climb back up the bank to go to Piper they said they asked if he was dead and he said quote we're like yeah he goes are you guys sure well yeah you guys are positive yeah okay you better be and then that's when Briley noticed the blood on his own pants and boots

and he said we just got in the blazer turned up the music and left Higgins Gulch what's your post murder getaway music everybody what the fuck and he said, we just got in the blazer, turned up the music, and left Higgins Gulch. What's your post-murder getaway music, everybody? What the fuck is that about? Holy shit. I'm leaving quietly, I think.

They turned it up, man. With some reflection. They were like, yeah, my name is who? My name is what? 2000. I don't know what the fuck they're listening to. That's exactly what it was. These idiots, these three idiots were absolutely listening to the first eminem album i guarantee it a lot of people were including probably me so um anyway um they are all arrested and um

the prosecutors say briley was the ringleader of the group and was manipulating to everybody acquaintances say briley is the ringleader as well. Chester's girlfriend here said that Briley bragged about his role as well. Oh, I'm sorry, not his girlfriend, Hoadley's girlfriend said that, this is a girl named Kayla Richards. I don't know whose girlfriend she is. She's one of their girlfriends she said that Briley appeared as excited as he told about it um on different occasions by the way of hold on oh yeah telling just whoever whenever she didn't hear more she heard more than once and did not call nope after the first one nope hey wow she might have called I don't know maybe but I if

she didn't call the first time because he was around to fucking tell more. Right. She said that she heard stories of kicking him, kicking Alan unconscious at Eli's house on 3rd Street, which was where the whole thing began. They said that, wow. She also said that in one or two phone calls Briley made to her. Oh, it's Briley's girlfriend. Well, he was in jail in Alaska awaiting extradition. He asked her why.

Oh, no. Hold these are girl. Why is he calling his friend's girlfriend? This is so weird. He asked her why her boyfriend, Daryl Holdley, had told authorities that Briley had stabbed Pogue in the head. And that Richard said her reply to Piper was probably because you did is what she said. He said it because you did it, man. His reply was?

Yeah. Yeah, but he didn't have to say anything. This is being recorded, you fucking idiot. Fucking idiots. This is the dumbest three human beings ever. The three dipshit musketeers here. Unbelievable. Wow.

Unbelievable. So they said that two other acquaintances of them all identified piper as being the ringleader from the way piper told it he said they all said while in jail by the way now they're all in jail while in jail briley piper there's a state prison inmate who's in jail with piiper after his arrest. Piper is trying to actively recruit inmates to help him kill multiple guards and escape. That's how manipulative Piper is. He's out of his mind. Out of his fucking mind. Kenneth Tingley Jr., who shared a cell with him, asked to be moved to another part of the jail.

He said, quote, I figured he'd already taken one life. What would stop him from taking another? Yeah. I don't want to be in the room with this guy this kid thinks he's like bane or something yeah oh he does he's gonna kill his way out of here and then i'll kill my way out yeah i that's what i mean at least get like a tango and cash escape plan get a root with a big fan blade you have to stop and crawl through what's he talking about crawl through the sewer. This is crazy. Just kill a bunch of people and we'll do that.

So this Tingley said that he had conversations with them while they were on the same cell block. They weren't cellmates, he said, but he testified they spent a lot of time together and that Piper confessed in taking part in the murder. He also said that he plotted an escape from jail with Piper and another inmate. He said that he, this is Tingley, said he was the one, he was going to have to kill one of the guards. Givens was going to kill another and then grab the keys. Wow.

Grab the keys. Then Piper was going to grab, go get Hoadley out too because that's his boy. And they were going to escape out a back door where they would meet the girlfriend. Oh, yeah. And, quote, run for it. And then what? And then what? Then we're just going to get jobs.

Just settle down. Live for the next 60, 70 years in peace. Get myself a Nissan Altima and just go. That's it, man. Just get a nice job. Maybe the HR department. Maybe civil service. myself a nissan altima and just go that's it man just get a nice job fucking maybe the hr department something that's gonna maybe civil service you know something steady he said also this tingly guy also claimed piper offered him ten thousand dollars to help out with the escape the fuck is

he getting ten thousand dollars he doesn't have he murdered for 400 wow so that's insane and then another person testified that piper confessed to murdering this is one of the girls here murdering alan and gave a detailed description um they also said this is part of his escape plan he wanted to escape from jail by going to the library taking two women woman guards hostage then killing them either by breaking their necks. Imagine him trying to break their necks. As if. He saw two action movies from the 80s and was like, you just put one hand on one side, one hand on the other, and you go pop, and then they just snap and fall right to the ground.

Grab the chin and pull. You just go, boom, and they just go, huh, and they fall right to the ground dead. That's what he really expected. Or sticking pencils in their necks. Okay. Didn't he learn the first time that it's really difficult to kill someone if you don't have a plan or a weapon or anything? Also, pencils?

You had a knife and couldn't do it. That's what I mean. Pencils, he said. He also said that Piper wanted to escape from jail by going to the library and doing all that. That's insane. Wow. The one guy, the other guy's role in this was to, in the escape

was to go after one of the mail guards and this guy said that Piper offered to pay him for his help as well and said they would have to get Hoadley out also. They said that Piper wanted to get Eli out of jail and kill him for being a narc. So we like to get him out, make him think we're escaping with him, but then we'll kill him because he told on us.

They also said Briley said he had found a paper clip, which he planned to use to take off his shackles and handcuffs while in the recreation yard. He thinks he's James fucking Bond snapping necks with his hands and picking off his handcuffs with fucking paper clips. Is he out of his fucking mind? And I've seen that in movies, but the way a lock on those works, I don't think it's possible with a paperclip. No, it's not. It's not at all possible. Maybe if you're some kind of fucking expert,

but not if you're a 19-year-old jerk-off you can't kill a guy in a fucking creek i don't even think a paper clip can be used to do anything except for coach you on a on an app you could pick you know the lock you could pick on like a 12 year old girl's diary you could probably pick one of those locks with it you know what i mean like one of those like little kid you probably pick that just get a little thing move it over it'll It'll pop eventually. I don't know. They have like the key has grooves in it. So you have to bend. It's very complicated.

You have to bend it in the same shape as the key. Yeah, it's insane. Unless every key that opens it is the same, it's never going to work. Oh, man, that's amazing. So this guy that he was talking to about the escape here was eventually released from jail after a plea agreement with the state on his case. And Briley gave him his clothes and $68 upon his release, which I don't know why he did that. Yeah. So he said that it was supposed to be in exchange for this guy clipping the wires on the fence surrounding the jail once he'd been released.

So he's like, yo, here's some clothes, $68. You get out. for this guy clipping the wires on the fence surrounding the jail once he'd been released so he's like yo here's some clothes 68 you get out come back to the jail and clip the wire even though you're free and clear now yeah you come back and clip the wires for us open for me do that the wires on the alarm so that oh that so the alarm window very. I mean, it's an Ocean's 11 thing here. Holy shit. So instead, he, the Curtis guy, the other guy that he was telling about all this, reported these escape plans to law enforcement because he didn't want this to happen. So, yeah, that's how it goes. Wow. That's amazing.

So January 2001, here comes the court stuff here. Elijah Page is going to plead guilty. Oh, really? Yeah. He decides he's fucked. He said everything they did. There's no way to get not guilty. So the death penalty is on the table for all three.

Even in the guilty plea? Even in the guilty plea. But he's figuring if I give a guilty plea and I say everything and I throw myself on the mercy of the court, I got a better chance than if I go to trial and try to deny it. So he pleads guilty to first degree murder, aggravated first degree kidnapping, first degree robbery, first degree burglary and grand theft. Yeah. And the most callous thing that anybody's ever heard. Like this is. Yeah. This is fucking shocking. Bad casual torture is what it is

this is casual um so um he details the murder as well um tells a bent court about how he was told to finish him off and all that sort of thing so briley piper what's he gonna do rowdy briley piper here he's gonna plead guilty as well. Really? Good idea. What? His attorney says, dude, you're fucked. Both of your co-defendants are saying this is what happened. You said that's what happened to the cops. You're fucked.

He's a chicken shit coward for this. Yeah. Oh, yeah. He told everybody about it. They go, you're fucked, bro. First degree murder, aggravated. The same exact charge list as the other guy there so uh pleads guilty to everything and also both of them waive their right to have a

jury determine their sentence as well oh they waive the right to have the jury do and they suggest that the judge sentence us because they're trying to throw themselves on the mercy of this judge to the point where he goes fine life without parole balls that's what they want january 19th 2001 briley piper sentencing here okay um this is fucking funny they get his mom on the line there his mom who enabled him his whole life she gets on the stand during the sentencing and she's accused by the prosecution of enabling her son's conduct. She says, maybe I'm the reason. Yeah.

So this is how he describes it. This is how Briley describes it. He says that Briley and Eli said they would steal the belongings from the home in Spearfish. They said, let's use the ruse of we're getting more meth and we'll go to the house and do that. So they said they beat him severely. They said they kicked him, punched him, did all of that, tied him to

a chair. When the questioning, after he was tied to a chair, they questioned him about where stuff was. When it was finished, they took the car. He tells the whole story basically, but he said I was at the truck and they were doing all this stuff down there that's it he said he walked back to the vehicle but he said he heard

sounds of large rocks striking that's as much as he's willing to give I heard sounds and he said then they took off so the judge with all this information he pled guilty he said what he did he said his version of the crime

yeah but he's all that ringleader oh yeah so what's the ringleader gonna get here yeah he says you sir yeah may fuck off death penalty they we're gonna kill you too don't matter if you admitted to it and pled guilty and saved the state a bunch of money. Go fuck yourself. Good death penalty. Okay. So February 16, 2001 is Elijah Page's sentencing. Here's Eli. Dottie and Samantha, his mom and sister, or not his mom and sister, Alan's mom and sister here, they testify at the sentencing hearing.

And that must have been, Jesus Christ, they testify. Yeah. Dottie said that she described described she said she was away from home and she said that it was, you know, horrible. Everything was terrible. She said this is not something that's going to go away after the trials are over. No, no. I don't think anything can be worse than learning someone you gave birth to has been murdered. The only thing that worse would be in the way that he was murdered, which was horrible.

Really bad. She described a phone call Alan did that she received from a relative while she drove her son's blazer back from Texas where it had been abandoned. She had to go down there and pick it up. Stopping to call the relative, she said, she was told to call lawrence county to speak to the red sheriff's deputies who told her the body of her son had been found face down in the creek in higgins gulch she said that was devastating there were days full of tears and sleepless nights she said she was under the care of a psychologist taking medication for depression and she said uh her life now has all color joy joy, and everything drained from it.

She's in great pain. I mean, everything that you'd expect from a mother who lost her son who she loved. In a specific, horrible way. Yep. She said, before I was a very open person, I was able to walk up. Oh, this is Samantha, the sister. She said she had to stop going to high school. She said, yeah, she couldn't do it, Basically, she says she's been homeschooled.

She said before I was a very open person. I was able to walk up to strangers and talk to them. I don't care to meet new people now. I don't know how they were raised. Oh, my God. They might kill me. Basically, she said nightmares are part of her everyday life, dealing with the torture of her brother.

She dreams about it every night. And she said that she fears that the same thing will happen to her now. So she just stays in the house, basically. part of her everyday life dealing with the torture of her brother she dreams about it every night and she said that um she fears that the same thing will happen to her now so she just stays in the house basically doesn't go out um she said she's full of distrust and everything else um wow friends also uh of eli talked about his previous activities and burglaries and of all that sort of thing they said one burglary was just days prior to the killing. A former cellmate also told of Eli recounting the whole thing time and time again.

They said he recounted it in a rote manner with no emotion. He keeps doing it. He keeps telling people. Wow. Wow. Now, he says it's just a three day drug and alcohol binge. This is what happened. It's all it was, man. So go easy on me. What? Go easy on me.

Yeah. Defense attorney focused on separate parts of his interview where he indicated Briley's the instigator. That's the thing you need to concentrate on. Briley's the instigator. He gave it all up. He told everything that happened. His story matches up with Hoadley's about whoigator he gave it all up he told everything that happened his story matches up with hoadley's about who did what by who or whatever so um you know there's a lot there he said uh they have the the on the tape that they show in court of him you know saying what he did down there by the gulch the judge sees him say that uh when asked to describe the killings eli said that he quote didn't feel nothing no anger or sadness at the time of the murder they said well how'd you feel this is going on he said i didn't feel nothing oh you that's terrifying don't say that

out loud no he said that at the at the murder scene yeah to the cops right he didn't know that was going to be played in front of a judge right he has your life in his hands and the judge says you sir may fuck off death penalty for you too holy yikes um yeah his sister desiree who obviously has been through a lot also elijah's sister said elijah could never talk about it it's family secrets you just can't tell his family secrets were so intense he couldn't deal with the emotions dealt to him because of how much rage he had to have inside of him i don't think it would have been out of the question that he participated in this for sure she said judging by what we went through this is not weird um but for for him to lash out at somebody for not for

nothing for nothing nothing there's a nice guy. That is so frightening. Pam Gutler says, My feelings are I still love this kid to no end. I think it was the combination of drugs and alcohol that led him into this situation. He's a follower. He was raised that way. He got into this, and once it got out of hand,

he didn't know how to get out of it. Oh, man. And that was his girlfriend's mom. Yep. And then Christine Wartman, the mother of the Job Corps kid. Right. He said, yes, Hoadley and Eli played a role in the murder, but she knows that Piper was the ringleader.

Sure. She says, what makes me sad is that when Eli dies, he will be another victim of Briley Piper. Oh. And all their friends say that, by the way. Daryl Hoadley is going to go to trial and plead not guilty. Really?

Absolutely. Abso-fucking-lutely. His girlfriend testifies for him. She was trying to stick up for him. She was described as agitated, emotional, and finally sobbing as she finally described what she knew from Hoadley about the murder.

He's probably the least culpable, but least culpable actual fucking murderer. In a murder, least culpable doesn't mean very much. Right. That's like fucking, come on, man. He's the least culpable absolute piece of shit worthless human being there's no there's even an analogy to that it's just horrible i was going to give it every i thought of five analogies and all of them paled in comparison and fell way short to what's going on here so um anyway he is going to be found guilty yeah of the exact same fucking charges the other two pleaded guilty to during

his sentence a psychiatrist testifies for him and said he has a history of being passed from person to person while growing up and um he said he has reactive detachment disorder and this would lead to an inability to relate to people and the appearance of being unattached he said that the psychiatrist believes that he was mentally ill at the time of the murder. He said that Darrell went along with the slaying out of fear for his own life. The psychiatrist said he felt like he couldn't get away, couldn't do anything. He said it freaked him out. It fucking better.

Jesus Christ. What are we talking about? They also said a sense of power from a guy named Briley Piper would have also, he would have gone along with something like that. He would have been very, you know, very, very. Malleable, influenceable. Malleable, influenceable. They said the psychiatrist also said Darrell told him he struck Allen with a six-inch rock and a large flat rock to put him out of his misery, he said. That's all it was.

He felt terrible. six-inch rock and a large flat rock to put him out of his misery, he said. That's all it was. He felt terrible. Now, he pleaded innocent by reason of insanity to charges of murder, kidnapping, robbery, burglary, grand theft. But if they convict him on the aggravated kidnapping and all of this, they have to decide whether it will be death or life without. An investigator for the Lawrence County Public Defender testified that Hoadley is meek and sorry about the slaying.

Um, they said the told him, he said that Daryl told him what happened and that he showed Hoadley photos of Allen's body still lying in the stream where he was killed. He said he sat there and looked at them and cried. Yeah. So, but that's his lawyer's investigator. So, I mean, who knows? So the jury finds him guilty as balls of murder, obviously guilty of all the things that he was.

But now it's what happens. He is going to let the jury decide his fate on this. Really? And the jury comes back deadlocked eight to four. Murder or life in favor of life in prison. Wow. Eight to four at murder or life in favor of life in prison wow eight to four so he is he is sentenced to use uh may fuck off life without parole interesting so yeah um that's fucking wild so 2004 comes around briley and eli's lawyers are saying hey it's not fair that we got death sentences and he didn't well you guys he fought it and he had some shit that he convinced a jury.

That's the system. You played the game and you lost. You played it. You fucking got tackled in bounds. Fourth down, bitch. Let's go. What are we talking about here? Turnover on downs, boys.

Jesus Christ. Yeah. Your partner fucking going for it. So they Piper ends up appealing and appealing, and there's a weird thing. So Piper's going to get a resentencing hearing, and they're going to find him fucking death penalty again, asshole. So that's two. 2006, Alan's mom said, I haven't heard anybody say I'm deeply sorry. Yeah, Great point.

Wow, what a point. Yep. She said she likes to go up to Higgins Gulf to pick up Higgins Gulch, where her son was killed, to pick up the trash. And she says plant some new flowers. She said she likes to linger. She says this is where I feel closest to him. I can go up there and find peace.

I've never heard of that before. Never either. Going to the site of the murder, that's not usually what usually what happens but she said i'm going to support the death penalty it's not necessary to me to know that he has died but simply to support the death penalty yeah she um she's talking about how she definitely supports the death penalty and she her life is fucked basically this poor lady i know your kid went through that, it's horrible. August 2006, Eli says to his attorney, stop. Stop fucking fighting.

I'm done. Really? I want to be killed. Yep, he said, fucking execute me. So he was initially scheduled to be executed on August 29, 2006, but the governor, Mike Rounds, delayed it until 2007 over a technicality involving the execution drugs. So they say that Eli says while he's in jail, he's you know, he said the murder haunts him. He's 23 hours a day and in fucking lockdown.

He said he must confront the memories of holding a gun to Alan's head and making him strip behind an icy creek. His Pam Gutler. That's the memory? That's the memory. Misty's mom said all that time in his cell has affected him. He has too much time to remember what he's done and what he's been through. He's been through a lot, but what he's done, Jesus Christ.

They said now he's depressed. He has depression now. Yeah, you're about to be executed. You're a piece of shit who's about to be murdered for it. You should feel bad. He's depressed? Really? Yeah, absolutely. Desiree, his sister, says he believes he deserves to die.

I know he is remorseful. This is the way he can say, I understand what I did was horribly wrong. Of course, I've tried to talk him out of it. He's my brother. I don't want him to die, but I can't be mad or angry at him. I don't know what I'd do if I had to see that person, that boy's face in my head all the time. The prosecutor said

this was as bad a murder as has ever taken place in this state. He was mutilated while he was still alive. All murders are horrible, but this one is really troubling. Yep. So July 11, 2007, execution day. mutilated while he was still alive. All murders are horrible, but this one is really troubling. Yeah. Yep. So July 11, 2007, execution day.

Hey. Oh, yes. By the way, he will be the first person executed in South Dakota since 1947. Elijah? Elijah will. And he is the first person executed since the reinstatement of capital punishment there. will and he is the first person executed since the reinstatement of capital punishment there also the youngest person to be executed in south dakota in quote the modern era how old is he 25 holy shit that's very young it's only seven seven years after this happened so he fucked up so bad

that they're gonna kill him at 25 25 last meal oh man they're going to kill him at 25. 25. Last meal. Oh, man. They're really going to do it. They're really going to do it. Steak with a side of A1 sauce. Okay.

Well, yeah, he deserves it. Yeah. Onion rings. Uh-huh. Jalapeno poppers. Okay. Salad with ham chunks. Cherry tomatoes, bacon bits, shredded cheese, ranch dressing ranch dressing and blue cheese that was just a fat mom

TGI Fridays yeah man coffee iced tea and ice cream the warden asked him if he had any final words before they started the execution and he said no and they said diarrhea I think I'm gonna shit myself

they said do you understand what we're asking this is your last chance to talk and he said yes i understand no final words nothing nothing you oh man and he was pronounced dead executed with the three drug cocktail now the life of briley okay um he remains on death row he's currently the only person on death row in south dakota just lonely sitting there with his thumb up his ass how does he stick around so long and the other one we got he's fighting he's appealing he said stop he appeals he keeps appealing he's 2023 he's still going yeah really absolutely uh his attorneys argued on his behalf that the initial court court appointed attorney did not do his due diligence in having assessments conducted for Piper, including fetal alcohol syndrome and why he was born early and all that kind of shit.

Fetal alcohol syndrome did this to me? Yeah. They said he's got ADHD, conduct disorder, use of drugs. Yeah, they said he had a high IQ. The attorney general said he had a high IQ and that the fetal alcohol syndrome didn't exist or simply wasn't a factor for him. He didn't have it. So fuck off. He is a chicken shit pussy.

He's a total pussy. That's why he had them kill him in the creek and he sat in the fucking blazer. He sat in the blazer like a pussy. Think about that. What a fucking coward. So he sits by himself on death row. Good. Hilarious.

Good. And Chester is buried in Spearfish. Or no, he's buried in Norton County, Kansas, where he was born there. So very Alan. Sorry. He wants to be called Alan. So might as well, in his death, respect his wishes. That, everybody, is Spearfish, South Dakota.

That's a fucked up story, right? Jesus Christ. That's one of the worst murders I've ever heard. That's so horrible. Absolutely. If you think it's horrible, but we did a good job with it, please get on whatever app you're listening on. Give us a review.

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mispronounce your name here um also follow us on social media at small town murder on instagram you'll fucking find us jimmy hit me with the list of the most fantastic goddamn people who i'm so excited to ring in the new year with hit me with them now this week's executive producers are colin kerfoot brandy huntley yodem yodem yodem aviv i think uh carol braun matthew reed larry butterfest happy birthday larry happy birthday shannon exley thank you uh so much what a what a sweet gift you're and you're incredible and also liz and david p thank you all so much and travis White. Look at that. Another one. Jesus Christ.

They're fucking falling out of trees. Other producers this week. Amanda Pfister, N.M. Brown at Chilling Tales for Dark Nights, Peyton Meadows, Thomas Smith, Janice Hill, Ivana Jackoff. All right. You're the best. Ivana Jackoff. Helen Laperoo.

Slapperoo. Slappy Rousey. Hannah Adcox. There's so many. What is that? Yeah, I don't know how to pronounce that. That's never going to happen. Helen, you're terrific.

Thank you. Brianna Bray Harris. Sydney Hero. Stacey Kate. Marin Contreras. Helldog 67. R. Ricard. Amanda Landry.

Taylor Hammer. Ashley Valencia. Tristan Williamson. Eric Lee, Jamie Palsberg, Teresa Schmidt, Terry Bishop, Amy with no last name, Sandra Davis, Ashley Yount. Oh, like, yeah, like Robin. Dr. H. Mike DeZaino. DeZaino? DeZaino. It's not DeZaino, right? It's DeZaino?

Hey, DeZaino. DeZaino. All right. Sky Amilano. Amilino. You's not Dezino, right? It's Dezino? Hey, Dezino. All right. Sky Emiliano. Emiliano. You're on a roll today. You're on a roll. Ryan Silvani. Sandra with no last name.

Montana. Howard. Jordan. Mitchell. Katie with no last name. Paul Noonan. Heidi McKay. Dana Starks.

Brittany Jones. Angel with no last name. Kim Corzum. Corzime. Corzum. All right. Claire with no last name, Kim Corzum, Corzine Corzum. All right. Claire with no last name, Chantel Taylor, Tony P, Debbie Kalasok, Kalasok, Kalasok. Kalasok. All right.

Ruby with no last name, Amber Weekly, Blair Hill, Kate Goderstad, Amy W. Rogers, Joe Sway, Yo Sway Martinez, Nicole Rowland, Amy with no last name, Elizabeth Morris, Britt Jennings, Tamara R. Haley with no last name, Chris Moody, Rebecca Dunbar, just Becca Dunbar, Robin Creswell, Todd Wagoner, Shauna Rosalele, Rosalele, Rosie L.,

Stormy Ray, Danielle Macon, Macon, Machon, Corinne DeCiampa, Danielle Robin, Aviation 100248, Megan Spangler, Rachel Johnson, John Pinto, Travis Royce, Melanie Orr, Stuart Barnes, Britt would know less. Name, Twall Good, Kate Gilbert, Lee Clemente, Nellie Miranda, Emmy Emma, Emma Bailey, Lisa Barnes, Angie would know less. Name, Deborah Wales, Audra Veazey, Brian Not-a-Whore. Okay. Erin Eaton, Grace Lethbridge, C. Harrelson. Oh, that's, okay.

Julie B., Miso, like the soup, Neri Lozano, Kyle Green, Stephanie Hanigisland, Shelby Corman, Kay Millie, Tara Finnegan, Chris C., Kathleen, a.k.a. Lee Nee, Tara Finnegan, Chris C., Kathleen, a.k.a. Lee Nee. Rebecca with no last name. Lindsay Bradbury, Scott Moores, Danielle Ridley, Warren Douglas, Olivia Gifford Edmondson, Edmondston, Czar Liu with no last name. Christy B., Jennifer Stovall, Nikan with no last name. Taylor Beams, Alexis Etheridge, Ray Williams, Sharon Erk, Jeff Banner, Marissa, oh, it's Miss Damian Kaner. Colton Robbins.

Yeah, Robbins, not Robinson. Okay. Rena Lane. Raina? Raina. Kenneth Hemshort. Hemshot? Hemshrot.

Krista Doherty. Amber Humphrey. Philip Clark. Richard McDaniel. Josh with no last name, Danny Palico, Palaco Steve with no last name, Coy Orixin, Mike Alexander, Al and Allie, Nick Wood, Hunter Campbell, Tammy with no last name, Danny McDonald, Jasmine Irwin, Loretta Bendotti, D Bingham, Jasmine Irwin, Loretta Bendotti, Dee Bingham, Ryan Fremanski, Anne, Amber, Amber Cachal, Allie Waldner, Bob with no last name, Lynn Rushlow, Dax and Sarah Lim, Daisy Guila, Jay Millen, Jay Millen, Jay Millen, Brian Kelty? Bradley Barbrae?

Laura Edward? Jared? Jared. Jared. Pamela and Jared. Jared, I hope you're having a terrific day. Donna with no last name. Natalie with no last name. Sav Singleton?

Maybe save? Jared. That's a terrific rap name for a white guy named Jared. Ja Red. Ja Red. I love it. Hannah Miller, Nicole Frayer. Fair.

Brenda with no last name. Fatima K. David Zeza. Melissa M. Worst. What? That's got to be a fucking autocorrect. I'm so sorry. Ardent Purity.

Christina Boges. Boges. Bogus. Bogus. Nick. Dick. Dick Gordon. Esther.

I can read that one. Esther. Esther Vrijahoff. Vrijahoff. Rebecca Lee. Susan V. Samantha with no last name. Eric Guthier.

Guthier maybe? Bernadette Gillespie. Lauren Sanavaro. Cannazaro. Cannazaro. Courtney Milan. Naomi Collins. Renfro with no last name.

Ben Calloway. Calloway. Simone Armstrong. Peyton Lee. Highstand. Susie Fuller. Laura with no last name. Lore.

Laurie. Laurie. Kevin Tarwar, Dylan White, Janice with no last name, Ben Cameron, Ciaran, Ciaran, Ciaran, Michelle, I'm reading it the same as that way. Michelle Orlison, Oursler, Laurie Sue Dunn. Allie Tripp. Alexander Family. Oh, the Alexander Family. Jennifer Bird. Troy O'Leary.

Stacey Peace. No, Narelle. Narelle O'Connor. Nicole Kosmeyer. Madison Gavin. Lindsay Metz. Jessica with no last name. Leslie Dvorak.

Don Leatherman. Marcello. Marcello with no last name. Katerina. Katerina Cook. Brandi Zaspell, Christine Crystal Crick, Taylor Brenda, Taylor Brenda's, Natalie Luby, Lube, Lube, maybe Lube. Lube. Thank you. uh pierce pearson hey hey thaler hey thaler nyla webb and all of our patrons you guys are fucking incredible thank you thank you so much everybody you wonderful fantastic sons of bitches we appreciate all that you do for us thank you so much hope you had a great holiday and great

holidays and wonderful new year and all that shit look forward to hanging with you in the new year you want to get a hold of us anytime in the new year or whenever whenever, whatever year you can do that very easily. Shut up and give me murder dot com drop down menu lists everything. Do that. Come see us. Hang out. Come to a live show. Listen to your stupid opinions and crime and sports and keep coming and coming. And

until next week, everybody, it's been our pleasure. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad-free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey.