Small Town Murder - #47 - Anger, Obsession, Revenge in Sun Valley, Nevada

Episode Date: December 6, 2017

This week, we check out the out west town of Sun Valley, Nevada, where a cold blooded, highly calculated & remorseless person lets his desire for revenge take over his life, and ruin the lives of others. Murder is just the tip of the iceberg. Brutal crimes from a terrible person. Along the way, we find out how many feral cats is too many, how long a desire for revenge can possibly last, and how horrible of a person is it actually possible to be!! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman New episodes every Thursday!!Please subscribe, rate, and review!Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, or wherever you listen to podcasts!Head to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things Small Town Murder!For merchandise: crimeinsports.threadless.comCheck out James and Jimmie's other show: Crime in Sports Follow us on social media!Facebook: facebook.com/smalltownpodInstagram: instagram.com/smalltownmurderTwitter: twitter.com/MurderSmall Contact the show: [e-mail] See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You're listening early and ad-free on Wondery Plus. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities? What would you do? This Is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This Is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. This week, we look at the outwest town of Sun Valley, Nevada, where a man's obsession with revenge went to a shocking extreme. Welcome to Small Town Murder.

Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Small Town Murder. Yay! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. You nailed it. Bullseye once again. My name is James Petrigallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman. Thank you guys so, so much for joining us this week. No doubt. We can't thank you enough. We're so excited.

This is going to be—we have a really, really crazy show this week, too. This is one where I'm like, oh, this person is just a bad person. There's not even a curse. He's just a bad person. This is a bad guy. This is an interesting case, and I'm really into it. It's going to be a crazy case. Before that, I just want to remind you guys, coming up very soon.

Next week. I believe, yeah, like 10 days or less than that, a week from when this comes out, actually. Chicago, December 14th, Lincoln Hall, live. Small Town Murder, live. It is almost sold out, so get your tickets very fast. Yeah, if you want to come at the door, it's going to be sold out probably. Actually, probably definitely. Crime and Sports, that was the early show.

Come to Crime and Sports. It's honestly going to be a crazier show, I would think, too. So come to Crime and Sports. It'll be a really good time. Come to Small Town Murder. LH-ST.com for that. Don't forget about Boston, Detroit. Small Town Murder is coming to Detroit February the

16th. It's going to be with Dan Cummins from the Time Suck podcast. And? And. We're going to sprinkle in some aspects of his show into it. He's going to be on stage with us. It's so unique. So different.

Small Town Murder with a Time Suck twist. There you go. It's a mixer. It's a mixed drink. That sounds delicious. It's one of those. It's going to be a tasty, tasty drink. You want to get there for that one.

I'm telling you right now. I'm drinking in Detroit for sure. Get there. It's going to be a great time. Also, we got nominated for some award thing. What the fuck? That's so cool. I don't know about that. Yeah, I don't know anything about that. Look into our social media if you want to vote for us. I don't really care, to be

honest with you. I really don't. I've never won anything. I mean, I've won contests, but those are like, you had to earn it, like in a comedy contest. My award is that every week I look on the charts and we were kicking celebrities' asses who wouldn't give us the fucking time of day and piss on us if we were on fire. So have fun looking up at us, assholes.

That's my reward. As Tribe Called Quest once said, never let a statue tell me how nice I am. Jimmy, that's it right there. Fuck awards. But anyway, beyond that, thank you guys so much for your iTunes reviews this week. We cracked 7,000. What the shit. And we're so excited about that.

And that just helps us out on the business end enormously. I'm telling you, we'll be on like a phone call for something and somebody doesn't believe that the show is what it is. And we'll go, well, we have 7,000 iTunes reviews. And they go, pardon? They don't even know how to say that. So that's you guys. Thank you guys. You guys did it.

Thank you guys. Honestly, man, if you want to help out the show, that is such a great way to do it. Get on iTunes. Give us five stars. It doesn't matter what you say. I don't give a shit. You know, tell us your favorite cereal. I'll take it.

I'll be like, yes, I like Captain Crunch also. Watch the roof of your mouth. Yeah. Careful. Make sure you dunk it in milk. Do that. It doesn't matter, but please do that. It helps us out on the business end enormously, drives us up the charts, and like we said,

it makes people kind of drop their jaws and go, huh? And then take us a little more seriously. So that helps a lot. So thank you guys for that. If you want to do more, oh, you can do more. Yes. You can. We'll take it.

You can go like these list of hero, wonderful producers. What the shit, by the way. It's so long. Fantastic people who helped us out this week. And a change in a couple people's title from producer to EP this week. Yes, some of these people are just. For sure. You support us so much.

We can't. It's overwhelming. It's crazy. Thank you guys so much. If you want to do that, you can get on Patreon.com slash Crime in Sports. What is it? Patreon.com slash Crime in Sports. Okay.

Not Crime Out Sports. No. Crime in Sports. That's our other podcast, which you should also be listening to. It's funny, and I don't know why you wouldn't be listening to it. If you like this, you're going to like that. Same shit. It doesn't matter if you like sports.

I'm telling you right now. Also, if you want to make a one-time donation, that is more than possible over at PayPal using our email address, crimeinsports at gmail.com. Crime in sports. That's the one right there, guys. And before we get to the show here, obviously, we have to do the disclaimer quick. I hate to do it, but we have to do it, guys. It's true.

It is such a bummer, by the way. It is. It bums me out every time. It really does. But you know what? It's fine. Let's do it. Let's get through this.

This is a comedy podcast. So if you tuned in and you think it's a very dead series, if you're looking for investigation discovery, this is not the place for you. Honestly, I'll tell you you what I'll put our research I'll put your research up against theirs for sure that's fine you're going to get all the facts you're going to get everything but it's going to be funny also we're comedians

we're stand up comics so we're going to make jokes we make jokes about small towns bumbling police forces we make fun of murderers one thing we don't do is we go out of our way to not make jokes at the expense of the victims or the victims families we're not trying to do that like we've said a million times we are assholes it's true but we're not scumbags also true so that's that's what we're doing here uh if that sounds great here's the other thing too it's like at this point now you know that so if you if you if you got to turn around and tuck tail

do it now because Otherwise it's like buying a used computer that's got kiddie porn on it and you kept looking at it. Just get the fuck out. There is no kiddie porn in here whatsoever. Throw that computer in the trash. Forget he said kiddie porn also. Just forget that. This is a first date.

You know what? You're a dog person. We're a cat person, whatever, and we're going to go our separate ways. That's fine. That's a little better to handle than kitty porn. Let's do that. Just go the other way. But never mind all that because I know what you're saying right now because we had an extra little thing in the beginning there. Happens all the time.

You're saying, shut up and give me murder. And we are going to oblige. Let's do that. Let's do that. All right. Let us take a trip, Jimmy. Okay. Let's do it.

Let's go. Bags are packed. Yeah. We're in rural South Carolina. Rural North Carolina. Hold on. Hold on. What are you forgetting now? I'm Mack Weldon, too. All right. Let's go. Oh, there you go. Put them on. Put them on. All're in rural South Carolina. Rural North Carolina. Hold on. Hold on. What are you forgetting now?

I'm Mack Weldon, too. All right. Let's go. Oh, there you go. Put them on. Put them on. All right. Here we go.

So we are going on a trip from rural North Carolina. It's kind of muggy. It's in there. There's a lot of dirt. Yeah. Stuff going on here. Agriculture everywhere. The racism was chewy.

Oh, it was chewy as a hate salad was being spooned out by the hate salad being doled out. There you salad being told out. There you know it, baby. We're going out west this week. Out to the west, not like far west or anything like that. We're going to Nevada. Oh. We're going to Southern.

Still a gold rush state, right? Yes, it was, actually. Silver, too, over there. Big on the silver. It's the silver state, as a matter of fact. It's known as it. What was the big city there that everybody went to? Carson City.

That's the one. Bang. There you go. That's the capital, I to? Carson City. That's the one. Bang. There you go. That's the capital, I believe. Carson City. Carson City, Nevada. I know that from having the game of the states as a child. I know that from watching Shanghai Noon because it's a shit movie.

That's where I learn all my history. Also, we're going to get a lot of Reno 911 references in here. Fantastic. Because I love Reno 911, and this takes place right outside of Reno. Really? This is Sun Valley, Nevada. It's between Reno and Sparks. Okay.

If you've watched Reno 911, they're always talking about Sparks is like the next town, which is even redneckier than Reno is the way they portray it. Like, oh, that white trash over there in Sparks. You're Reno. Well, this is right in the middle, so this is going to be worse, we'll say here. But every time I'm reading everything about this, and I just hear it in my point, every time I see the word Reno, it's county police. All I hear is Sheriff's Department in my head every time.

Thomas Lennon's voice, Sheriff's Department. There's little shorts running out. I love it so much. It was something Tingle. Was it Detective Tingle or Deputy Tingle? Jim Dangle. Dangle, not Tingle. Jim Dangle. That's right or Deputy Tingle? Jim Dangle. Dangle, not Tingle. Dangle, that's right.

Jim Dangle. Jim Dangle, right. Yeah, well, those shorts didn't allow for any Dangle whatsoever. Well, I mean, they let him out. Thomas Lennon's hilarious, though. And Sheriff's Department, here we go. Sheriff's Department, this is in the far west part of the state, up all over by California, over there, way over.

Tingle and Dangle both sound very ball-centered. They do, yeah. Anything with a gull in it, I think. It makes me think of testicle. Especially with a guy who's wearing tiny, tiny shorts. That sounded horrific. Makes me think of testicles. I think of testicles all the time.

When I think of a man in short shorts with a gull in his name, I just think of testicles all the time. Testicles all up in my brain. So far west. That's funny, man. So it's, like I said, between Reno and Sparks. Reno's on the west, Sparks on the east. That's in Washoe County, which looks like Washoe.

But for the purpose of watching Reno 911 a ton, I know that it's Washoe County. Otherwise, I would mispronounce it and get tweets and tell people to go fuck themselves for no reason whatsoever. That show, by the way, was so fucking believable if you just saw a clip of it. So believable. For like 10 seconds. Yeah.

You're just like, is this? Oh, okay. I get it. It's a joke. Oh, I see. But it's so believable in that there's a clip of a guy that got pulled over for DUI and then he dances with that big chested broad. That sounded terrible.

Whatever. Well, I'm sure. The blonde, the girl that showcased her boobs every show. Yeah, yeah. I'm sure. Clemmie. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's it.

Nice work. Thank you. I love Reno 911. I've seen it many times. I love the show, too. I watch it a bunch of times, but I can't remember shit from it. It's a great damn show. It's a great damn show.

But it looked so believable in the police footage i feel like and that that clip of the guy dancing it's a fucking sensation on on facebook where people will share it and be like look what this idiot did no you dumb dumb look what you're you're the idiot you just shared it i yeah i feel like that show probably they probably watched a lot of cops because it was like all improv pretty much so i feel like they watched a lot of cops and they took like the situation from cops and they were like, now let's have it spin out of control. Basically, I don't know if that's how they did it or not. But if I was writing that show, that's how I do it. That's the laziest way of writing.

I would watch cops. That's a realistic situation. I just saw. OK, now what if he did this and this and that? What would happen then? This is way off. We haven't even got to the zip code. Let's get to the zip code.

8-9-4-3-3. Area code 775. What would happen then? This is way off the – we haven't even got to the zip code. Let's get to the zip code. Zip code 89433. Area code 775. I'm the one talking about Reno 911 over here. It's a great show. 14.9 square miles, so a decent-sized town. And we'll get from the population, it's a decent-sized place here. Sun Valley is a – we've had these before – a census-designated place. Got it.

As we've got. So not like a real city, technically. It's just for the purposes of counting them. Yeah, kind of thing like that. Because it's just sitting in the middle of these two cities. And it's part of the Reno-Sparks Metropolitan Statistical Area. Okay. Ooh, boy.

There is really no town slogan for this. On their site, it says, this isn't a slogan, but this would be a poor slogan. Quote, we are the fifth largest unincorporated area in the state. Woo-hoo. In the state. Everyone come see us. They're the fifth largest unincorporated.

Get the kids. Load them in the car. Let's go. Fuck the other four. We're it. We're not going to smack your kid. We're not going to Disneyland, Billy. No.

It's the fifth largest unincorporated area in the state, Billy. There's got to be a fucking t-shirt. Sorry. No Mickey Mouse. Hilarious. Your little shit bag. I prefer the name that a 2015 documentary that somebody made, a short documentary, I prefer the name they gave it.

Quote, Sun Valley, the biggest trailer park in the world. Get the fuck out of here. That's what it is. That's amazing. That I like better. To me, you put that. It's a 14.9 square mile trailer park. A trailer park. You just put that in there.

Don't worry about it. You put it in there. The tourists will come. Oh, Jesus. That sounds dangerous. And they got trailers. Come on. Get in the car, Billy.

Fuck Disneyland. Come on. Never mind. History of this place. It was part of the Mexican territory here. It was part of the Spanish Empire before that, and we all know. Then they went to Mexico, and then we stole it from them. It's been stolen over and over again in Nevada, so that's why it's the land of thieves, I would say.

It is. Nevada's a terrible place. That's actually a very fascinating thought. It's true. It's been stolen so many times, you may as stolen so many times. It may just be legal there. People out back in the day, they went there when they were in trouble somewhere else. That's why you went there. It's true.

Look at Deadwood. There's a perfect example. Al Swearengin had a goddamn murder warrant out of Chicago. He couldn't go back to the States, so now he's out in Deadwood, unincorporated Indian territory. You want to come out here and get me just fine. Of course, he has to get the whole warrant squashed. God damn it.

And that's a big thing with Silas ends up stabbing. It's a huge deal. It's a huge deal. But it could have fucked him. But these are the type of people that are out here. That's what I'm getting at. You know, one of these days I'm going to I've had that fucking whole series. I gave him the wire DVD for years ago.

Deadwood. Deadwood. Years ago. Probably two years. Two years ago. Yeah. It was when we first started. When we first started it, you go, I want you to watch this because I'm going to make references. I'm like, yeah, yeah, sure. Yeah. Deadwood. Years ago. Probably two years. Two years ago. Yeah. It was when we first started crime and sports. When we first started it, you go, I want you to watch this because I'm going to make references.

I'm like, yeah, yeah, sure. Yeah, no problem. Sitting there like, you son of a bitch. I'm trying so hard. Oh, my God. That's hilarious. So 1840s, after the United States acquired it, we'll say here, it was trappers and explorers and guys with beards with bugs and birds and shit in them

that went out and got things that, you know, foraged off berries and like trapped beaver and bugs and birds in their beards. They're just sleeping. I'm sure. But birds are nesting in their small birds. Small birds. Right. They got in bugs the size of birds.

Oh, huge. Disgusting things out there. Dangerous things mountains it's probably it's probably bugs that live on birds are inside the fucking beard yeah well i wouldn't i wouldn't doubt that one of the first people to go out there 1843 uh uh mountain man old bill williams led his trappers all the way from the klamath lake all the way the hell out to there. Old Bill. Old Bill Williams. They weren't good with nicknames back then. Not very clever.

They needed a couple Italian guys in there to give nicknames is what they needed. They just said, it's Old Bill there. It's Old Bill and Young Bill. White people are so terrible at giving nicknames. Back then, the nicknames were all. Then again, if you were like an outlaw, though. Right. If the press gave you a nickname, you were on it.

On point. If other mountain men gave you a nickname, you're Old Bill. bill thanks i see why you're a mountain man and not a journalist thank you very much used to be so much better you don't make money with your words do you sir no you don't they were having a big deal in 1849 uh there was a california constitutional convention and they were trying to figure out the boundary yeah for the state of california with with uh nevada over here and a lot of the people wanted it and and some people were like, we don't fucking need that, basically. There's a guy here, a guy in Coloma that argued, an attorney said, quote, a great portion of it can be of no advantage to us.

A vast deal of it is immense unexplored region, a barren wasteland. So that's where we are. It's a barren wasteland. That's a good description of Nevada. So, so far in like 10 minutes, we've called it the largest trailer park in the world and a barren wasteland. This is not terrific here. Not great at all.

Vacation. Vacation. In 1868, a correspondent, a journalist for the San Francisco Times had a little better time with words. Yeah. He described what it was like back then. This is just interesting old West shit. You're telling me a guy from Metropolis, San Francisco is about to talk about San Francisco. He's going to

talk about Nevada. Sun Valley, Nevada. This is just the whole county here. Here's what he says. Quote, its population comprises an immoderate share of sports from the suave and high tone gambler, airily lounging in snow white trousers and coat and spotless delicately plated shirt front with broad brimmed Panama hat and fragrant cigar to the disreputable and hang dog looking sharper beneath whose short and frayed coat tails the muzzle of a revolver protrudes threateningly and whose fierce eyes and bloated face proclaim that he is ready to take a drink or to cut a throat. Holy shit.

Wow. Women whose gay dresses are not needed to designate their shameful business stroll through the sandy streets with an abandon, which is only to be met with such semi-civilized places. Wow. That's my kind of lady, by the way, sir. He says worse shit about Indians here. He says the Paiute, I think it's Paiute Indians. Is he going to be our Andrew Jackson this week? This is the Andrew Jackson moment.

The Paiute Indians loaf about, accompanied by their heavy and degraded looking squaws who carry their juvenile encumbrances, pack neatly in small parcels and slung upon their broad backs, whence they can form their own opinions of society. Wow. Holy shit. They're squaws, first of society. Wow. Holy shit. They're squaws, first of all. You don't get to call her that. That guy was a dick.

That guy was a real dick. He came in like... That guy's a real dick. He wanted to have like a fucking bad review of something. He was like, I'm going to review this on IMDB and really shred it. He's the original Yelp. Yeah, he is. This guy was a complete asshole he

was trying to mystery science theory the place like a motherfucker like what is going on and what did he call the child the fucking encumbrance juvenile encumbrances that's that's that's aggressive that's the guy that wants to slaughter indians what an asshole incumbrances he's like can and can Andrew Jackson run again? I know he was president like 30 years ago. I want it again. He's like, I got dead relatives that I want to sign up and vote for him. Oh, man. This is horrible.

Modern day Sun Valley founded in about 1945. Hopefully people aren't saying such nasty things about each other. It was for returning war veterans. They were like, we don't know where to put you. Here's a strip of There's nothing here. Here's a strip of land that's probably still radiating from our tests 30 years ago. Oh, we're going to do more. No, they're going to do more all through the 50s.

We'll just give you that. It's like Vegas Vacation where Cousin Eddie was a veteran. He's like, government gave me this land here. And he just throws chicken down and it sizzles from radiation. Yeah, that's what it is. It's the same thing. Every time he turns the microwave on on i piss my pants and forget who i am for an hour that's what we're dealing with here exactly that's what we're dealing with here uh population of this place uh 19,299 okay uh like a lot of these western towns any of the western towns we cover

whenever we do east back east towns it's like a negative since 1990. Population flow. Out west, it's always like over 50%. It's up 64% since 1990. People like the open spaces. They're starting to really enjoy that. From 1990 on, that's when it really, people just said, I am getting the fuck out of here and going out west. And that's, my family, my mother and stepfather

moved out here in 91 to Phoenix from New York. So it happens. We moved out here in 86. It makes sense. It's the migration. A lot of things, it's pretty much your average town, too, in all the statistical ways. Median age is exactly on point at 37. Male-female populations are to the, like, tenth of a percentage are on point. Married population is exactly the same.

It's really, really odd how run of the mill This town is There's nothing that you can look at and go Oh well that's different than other places It just doesn't exist Apart from the trailers Well that's America America is a trailer park Sorry that's a shirt

You're god damn right it is America is a trailer park We apologize there are nice places Most of it's a trailer park We live in Phoenix it. America is a trailer park. We apologize. There are nice places. Most of it's a trailer park. We live in Phoenix. It's a fucking giant trailer park, too. We're dogs out. America is a trailer park behind a strip mall.

That's it. That's it, man. Every corner. That's the new anthem. We're writing a new anthem right now, guys. Land of the trailer park, home of the strip mall. Home of the strip mall. That's beautiful right there.

You know what, Jimmy? That's a T-shirt. I'm going to take my hat off right now because I'm feeling really patriotic right now. I'm going to take a knee for this one. I'm going to look up at the flag in reverence, I think, for that. Jesus Christ. America's a trailer fire. It really is.

That's a better way to put it. It's a trailer fire because you can smell 40-year-old asbestos burning that was hidden deep in the walls. You can smell it in cheap fucking carpeting. And a pack of ramen that somebody forgot was in there. Cheap carpeting and particle board. You can just smell it. Wood paneling.

Jesus Christ. Race of this town. Of course. It's a racial breakdown. It's less white than average. Really? One of the first small towns we've had that's less white than average. Average is about 63% here.

We're 58% white. Interesting. 1.67% black. So I don't think the remaining people are black. Well, what in the shit? Oh, okay. I got you. I'm on board.

3.58% Asian, which is almost the average. We're getting a few Asian people out there. Half a percent Native American. This sounds totally overwhelmingly Jewish. Absolutely. You got it, Jimmy. You nailed it. You nailed it.

It's actually, yeah, it's Jewish and yeah it's it's jewish uh and uh just all all it's funny all chilean everyone there is from chile is very odd no uh hispanic people make up 34.30 which is about twice the normal average it's normally about 17 percent but uh yeah so it's it's in west town it's an out west town you're gonna that's you're gonna get a lot more hispanic it's uh Hispanics, the black people of the West. That's what it is there. That's how that works. Catholics are the Baptists of the North.

Mormons are the Catholics of the Baptists of the West. Hector, the Jamal of the West. The Jamal of the West. Ladies and gentlemen. Jesus. How did I do this? Somehow you made that more racist than i did jesus how did i make that fucking guy from san francisco seem like a fucking yeah unencumbered juvenile encumbrances here seemed like nothing now after that oh christ right. Move forward quickly.

Religion in this town. Yeah. Less religious than normal. That's the only thing. It's about 50-50 as normal. Yeah. You know, consider themselves religious. Here it's 30%, which is out west.

Yeah. We don't need any goddamn God out here. Not near Reno. We have casinos. We don't need God. There's no... My Jesus is Caesar. Legal prostitution in casinos. God does not live here, and we don't want him here.

14.78% Catholic, which would be the percent Catholic, which is going to be the Hispanic population. 4.75% LDS, which you're going to get. 0.16% Jewish. Interesting. They're trying to get... Come on, guys. Come in. Bring it in. I'm impressed by that, though, actually.

Impressed. 0.08% Islam, Muslim people there. So voting-wise, as far as it goes, about 51% Democrat, about 47% Republican you get there, which is about what Nevada kind of flies on if you look at presidential elections. Economy here, actually, unemployment rate's slightly higher than normal, but there seems to be a decent job growth there. There's a lot of out West. Companies move out West and there's decent job growth. Household income, $44,000, which is about $10,000 less than the national

average, which out West is kind of things are usually a little bit cheaper and that sort of thing here. Cost of living is fairly reasonable. Jobs, more construction than normal, about twice the construction jobs are normal. More retail, as you would expect in a place like this. Accommodation, food services like a casino or restaurants are double the normal. Trucker buffet. Trucker buffet, yeah. Whorehouses, that's going to be a thing. Brothels are obviously... Brothels obviously are in the mix in this whole equation.

I think whorehouse sounds so awesome though. It kind of does. Because that sounds beautiful. Like brothel... To me, a whorehouse isn so awesome, though. It kind of does. Because that sounds beautiful. Like brothel. To me, a whorehouse isn't like an insult. No, it's not. To me, this is, again, a Deadwood thing here. And I'm sorry about this, but in Deadwood,

and I know that this is not whatever, and nowadays this isn't right, but in Deadwood, Trixie, if you asked her what she did, she'd be like, I'm a whore. Right. And she was proud of that. Yeah. And that was her.

And she defined yeah she defined it yeah she if it's like richard prior doctorate it's like it's like richard prior with the n-word yeah it was like i'm gonna define it and make it mine and i'm not black i don't know how that works but that's i don't know if that worked for you by every black people out there hopefully that that that spoke to you i don't know maybe but uh this i think is their thing with that it's but like brothel you don't know if you're not if you're not educated enough you don't know what a brothel is or you're not i guess if you're looking for that kind of thing you know what a brothel is yes but as a child i didn't know what a brothel i didn't know what a brothel was until i was like 19 yeah but i knew what the fuck a whorehouse was, and God damn it, I wanted to be in one. Yes. What I'm saying is sex workers of the world, take the whore back.

Take the whore back for yourself. And it doesn't even have to be whore, but pick another word. Pick something that's not sex worker. Even prostitute's fine. Sex worker sounds disgusting. It sounds like you're on an assembly line jerking somebody off, wearing one of those nets over your hair and a plastic glove, which makes it sound clinical and creepy. God damn it, Ethel, put the goggles on.

You got OSHA crawling all up my ass. God damn OSHA. Put your hard hat on. What you doing? Them balls are flopping all over the place. Put on your hard hat. That's terrible. Just take the whore back.

That's what we're saying. Whatever. Pick a word. But sex worker's gross and don't do it. It's terrible. Just take the whore back. That's what we're saying. Whatever. Pick a word. But sex worker's gross and don't do it. It's horrible. I don't want that to be the politically correct term because I can't take it. No, I can't do it. It doesn't work for me or anybody else, I don't think.

Right. So a cost of living in this town. I'm going to get into the money here. Yeah. 100 is par, as we say. That is normal average. Here we got 104 is the cost of living, so a little bit higher. And honestly, the highest cost is housing.

Housing is a $119,000 out of $100,000. Median home cost here is $221,000. That ain't no Winnebago. No, it's $186,000 is the normal in the country. And if we have convinced you, you need to get out here. You just need to get to Sun Valley, Nevada for some reason. We have for you the Sun Valley, Nevada real estate report. Okay.

Goddamn, that's beautiful. I love it. We've got a two-bedroom apartment here on the average. It's about $1,000 a month. Right on par. Right about on the average here. Tons of foreclosures. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Foreclosures everywhere. Oh, my God. That housing boom ruined everything out west. Holy shit. Destroyed it. Nevada was one of the worst states. I think it was the worst state. It was the worst.

It was Nevada and Florida, obviously. And then Arizona, too. Florida's the worst for everything. It's always in there. We'll stick to the normal market. We do enough death. So let's do this. We have a three-bedroom, two-bath, 1,700-square-foot house.

Looks like a complete fucking dump. Multiple window air conditioning units, which is never a good sign in the West. $185,000. So avoid that one. We have a three bedroom, three bath, 2000 square foot. Multiple windows. Multiple. I saw them. Three bedroom, three bath, 2,000 square foot house for $250,000. That looked decent. And then this one actually looks like the nicest house, which it still kind of looks a little dumpy. Four bedroom, two bath, 1,500 square foot house for $279,900. That must be in a nice neighborhood or something. It's 1,500 square feet.

1,500 square feet for that. I thought you said 25. Wow, Jesus. Yeah, for 280 is a little much. That's a bit steep. It's a little steep square feet. 1,500 square feet for that. I thought you said 25. Wow, Jesus. Yeah, for 280 is a little much. That's a bit steep. It's a little steep here. Things to do. Things to do here, they are obviously into the outdoors because there's mountains around here. It says

on the site, the seasons in Sun Valley may change, but one thing never varies. Our mountains come with a to-do list as tall as they are. Sweet Christ. Winter slopes and summer escapes. Adrenaline junkies and solitude seekers, simple pleasures and luxurious indulgences. Good grief. Whatever pulls you to the mountains, we can help you find it here. That's right.

Oh, come to the mountains, people. Jesus. The mountains are calling you. Other things to do here, collect feral cats. Yeah. That's a big deal. People are on the right on the home page of the town site. Get out of here.

It's like this square in the middle. It's the first thing you see. It's like a Photoshop thing with cats and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle outfit. What? And it says, quote, Teenage Mutant Ninja Feral. Wowza. Right on there. No. And it says, hot news.

Cat action team caring for and eliminating reproduction in feral cat colonies. They're super into this. Walshaw is home to more than 26,000 feral cats, most living in colonies. The NHS, which is some sort of cat collection people here, the NHS cat action team, cat for short. That sounds gross. Wow. Yeah, it does. We're going to get some cat action going on out there.

Creates awareness about living harmoniously with feral cats and the benefits of trap-neuter return. What? An effective and humane way of managing feral and outdoor cat populations. Holy shit. That is creepy as fuck. Do not word it like that. Living in harmony with feral cats.

Yeah, they take them and then put them back with their colonies. Yeah, that sounds disgusting. It sounds super. It sounds like- They're crawling colonies. Yeah, that sounds disgusting. It sounds super. It sounds like. They're crawling all over you. It's gross. It's nasty. It sounds like everybody's front yard has just like those little scrape piles where a cat just shit.

It's true. Well, for more information. Scrape piles. You know what I'm talking about when you see the cat. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a little mound. You're like, that doesn't look right. That looks like a cat just shit there.

It's like when someone finds a body in a park and they're like, that looks undisturbed and kind of doesn't look flush to the ground. That's not right there. Somebody did that on purpose. That's a giant cat shit. For more information about the Cat Action Team, you can call 775-856-2000, extension 337. So you want to do that if you live in that area and you want to get on the Cat Action Team. Crime rate here, the thing we care about, property crime, slightly above average. Nothing crazy.

Not too far. It's pretty much in the norm range. Violent crime, murder, rape, robbery, assault, it's about 20% above average. So, yeah, they're going to lose some money and stop at the brothel and then jack you, I think, apparently. And jack you off. Jack you up. Against your will.

Oh, it's going to be ugly. I'll tell you that right now. Let's talk about a gentleman here who is not a nice guy. This is a guy I said. He's just a bad guy. Just a bad dude. Let's talk about Robert Lee McConnell. Okay.

Now, in McConnell, I must tell you, by the way, it's double C, double N, double L. Jesus, man. That is too many double letters. Good fuck. Double fuck you. Get out of here. I don't like this guy at all. I don't like him at all.

Double C, double N, double L. Dude. So it's M, double C, O, double N, E, double L. Fuck you, dude. How terrible is that? Drop any of those. I guess the – first of all, I don't get why there has to be two Cs in Mc-something. One thing.

One is good. Well, especially if your other two are. Are other consonants. It's a spelling word. It's too much. It's too much. His mother, whose name is Kim, she said that he had a rough life to start. Yeah.

Which, I mean, a lot of these guys. How many of these people have we done where it was like everything was great. Things were fantastic. Very good structure in the family home. Something went awry home uh all of a sudden he just fucking sharp left turn the odd thing is the only time we find that is with women killers usually that's the thing like a lot it's not all the time like epping uh epping grew up or from epping uh new hampshire there uh shirley laber laber laber yeah she uh she grew She grew up in horrible circumstances and sexually assaulted and all that sort of thing. But then you get like Jane Lim a couple of weeks ago who grew up.

By all accounts was great. Her mom was like a tiger mom. Right. She was doing piano lessons and calculus and she was 14 and stuff, which I guess made her snap the other direction. But she wasn't neglected and beaten. She had both her parents in the house and a fulfilling upbringing and that sort of thing here. Extracurriculars and shit. Absolutely. But Kim here, Kim

Sahln is her name. She said, quote, I was very young when I had him. We're talking about Robert McConnell. She said about when I had him, 15. So mother had him at 15. So that's always going to be rough. It's not going to be easy. And there are people who pull it off.

People figure it out. People figure it out. But a lot of times we'll say math. I'll go out on a limb and say mathematically a majority of the time shit goes a little awry when you have children at 15. Yeah. My daughter is 16 and she is. If she had a nine month old right now. I wouldn't give her a puppy.

You know what I mean. Like she's a responsible kid. She's all honors class. She know what I mean? She's a responsible kid. She's all honors classes. She's great. Yeah, she's looking to college. She's funny. Yeah, she's smart. She's funny. She's all this stuff. She's a great kid, but I mean, I couldn't imagine saying, here, take care of a human being right now. That's insane.

She won't clean up room for Christ's sake. Right. It's why they give you that flower bag when you're a junior with the fucking diaper on in school and be like, carry this around. Look how shitty this is. Yeah. Don't go anywhere without this. And try that for a week and see if you're just like, fuck it.

No kids for me. No, it comes back. It's on fire. A dog bit it. It's, you know. It's leaking flour all over the floor. It's leaking flour. It's half of it's in there.

There's tape all over it. Fucking mess. You can't tape your child, you know. She says, the mother says about Robert, quote, he always had difficulty with his quick temper. He was very rebellious. He could never get rid of that chip. Yeah. And that's the thing about this guy.

He's always got a chip on his shoulder. He's pissed off at everybody. Everybody's trying to slight him. Sure. He's one of these guys that you're trying to slight him all the time. And he takes everything as a slight. And then he'll let it fester. It's a grudge-holding son of a bitch.

And, yeah, he lets it fester and he wants revenge. And he's just one of these people here. So is his dad obviously not around then? Oh, she's not. No idea. He's long gone. She says that he started basically being on his own at an early age. She was a single parent.

Never married to the father. She worked a ton because she's a single parent. And she didn't have – she just wasn't there. It wasn't like she got home at 5.30 and made dinner and they sat and talked about their day and she checked over his homework. She had two jobs and she'd come home at 10 o'clock and be like, did you eat something?

Are you in one piece? That was it. Wash your dick and go to bed because I got my other shift. That's it right there. I got to go back to the Waffle House. Wouldn't it be great if that's all you had to do? That'd be great, but then shit would turn out like this. So maybe that's not so great.

Let's say. You can't. Oh, Jesus. And I know so many people like this growing up, too, that were just... Latchkey children. That were feral, like the cats, basically. They were just feral. They were just let out. And then there was kids where, like, you could just go to their house and do whatever you want.

Yeah. There were those kids. That was the weirdest shit. It was so weird. Why are we playing with knives right now? Where are your parents? And then, oh, my mom's at work. Sometimes they'd be there.

They just didn't care. That was the scariest ones. Yeah. I had a friend whose grandmother would buy us kegs of beer for the weekend. Oh, God. And I remember being like 19, being like, this isn't right. This is weird. And everybody else was like 17 or 18. I was always the older one. And just being in a backyard drinking beer and his grandma would come

out and be like, keep it down, you guys. And then she'd go back in the house. I'm just like, that's fucking bizarre. I had friends where you could do anything you want in their house. I had friends where you could buy weed from the stepdad. I'm serious. This one kid, I remember we'd go. He would try to get people to bet football with him. He was like running a book with us, with teenagers trying to bet football games

and you'd bet money and he'd put up weed which was a fucking... It's good as money. How about 30 bucks and you put up 30 and I'll put up an eighth. But you got the eighth for 15. He would try to like scam teenagers with like gambling and weed sales. It was fucked up, man. He'd lose the bet and then give you and then just fucking rape you on the fucking top of the week.

Yeah, he'd give you like an eighth of shitty weed and it was like short too. It'd be like three grams and you're like, motherfucker, you knew he was doing it too. He was a scumbag. He'd sit there. You know those honey bottles? We'll sidetrack for one one second you know those honey bottles that are bears yeah he'd make a bong out of one of those get out of here no it's serious this white trash he was a roofer well they made those white trash they made those for indoor you know they made those for indoor smoking too just for for like cigarettes that honey bear thing made it safe to smoke in bed where you would sit. Yeah.

How fucking reckless are you that you need a honey bear to smoke? How much are you smoking that you can't determine and discern when you're about to fall asleep?

They make the little plastic ones like that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it was probably just that then he put water in and modified it to smoke weed. No, he fucking put a stem in it, the thing

with the little bowl and he made a fucking legit bong out of it and it was disgusting because he would never change the water it was thick like molasses and if you want to hit

you're like no I don't because the bear is only three inches away from the water so it's splashing on your face is that phlegm or is that water we're way too far to that

but this this poor kid I remember like he would come home and like his parents got into drugs like heavy drugs yeah

like fuck much worse than weed yeah like on a Friday night it, like heavy drugs. Yeah. Like much worse. They were like, yeah. Like on a Friday night, it was like, uh, yeah, we can't go to your house. He'd be like, yeah, they're all smoking crack at my house. So we can't go there. It was fucking crazy. Like he'd go in and be like, oh, somebody took my, my, cause he, he, somebody took my TV and they just like some crackhead stole my crackhead, stole your TV and sold it.

And he'd be like, okay, that's that. I guess I was like, I always felt so bad for him. It he's miserable and I feel like this is kind of the deal with this universe yeah I feel like this is where this guy is living uh the mother said he'd sleep on the couch in the apartment yeah uh he'd sleep on the couch all the time you know just didn't even just didn't care it's a TV couch uh he was always locked out of the apartment you know so he'd forget one key he'd be locked out all night and he'd just have to sit there. He'd eat popcorn for breakfast. Oh, Christ. That sort of shit is what she was saying.

It's like, just not... That's not how you raise a kid. You're not raising a kid. You're just, you've provided a cage, basically, for them, this apartment. And you threw popcorn at it. Survive. Yeah, here's some popcorn. Just survive till I get home from work. Sweet feet. Hopefully this will keep up for about 18 years.

I can keep this charade up. Fingers crossed you don't murder someone before you're eight. Yeah, that's the thing here. Hey, everybody. Just going to take a quick break from the show to tell you a little more about thegreatcoursesplus.com. Oh, my goodness, guys. Now I'm in trouble, basically. from the show to tell you a little more about thegreatcoursesplus.com. Thegreatcoursesplus.com. Oh, my goodness, guys. Now I'm in trouble, basically.

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The new one that I've been listening to this week here at the recommendation of the Great Chorus is People. Actually, too, this is one that I saw, and then they were like, maybe look at that one. I was like, yes, that's the one I want to watch. So perfect. Understanding the Mysteries of Human Behavior. Fantastic. Oh, my God. This is great because what we do here with Small Town Murder is all about trying to figure out what are these people thinking? Why?

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Just so I know, it's thegreatcoursesplus.com slash STM. I think that's the one. All right. And now back to the show. He's just a he steals money out of her wallet, you know, because she has no money to get food during the day and shit like that. Everyone around this is he's growing up in San Francisco area. He's growing up in the Bay Area.

This is where he's from. They neighbors would complain that he was like stealing from them and basically being a general menace to the neighborhood. So they end up, the state ends up finding his mother unfit, and they send him to a group home. The California Youth Authority or whatever sends him to that. He's in a group home for three years, which is crazy. That's rough. That's a lot. It's tough, man.

That's, again, that It's tough, man. That's again, that's a training ground for him. Now he's come up and learned to not give a shit about anything society has to offer and now you're going

to stick him in here. With other future criminals. I don't know what else to do. Group homes are terrible. I've never met a single person that stayed in a group home and came out of it

and was a functioning great member of society. I'm sure there are some. We're going to get a bunch of tweets saying I grew up in a group home and my parents ran a group home. I know there are. There's exceptions to the rule.

Most of the time the people are in the group home because they didn't come from the best circumstances and they don't have a family that will take them. If you don't have like an aunt that'll take you in and you go to like some group home thing or something like that, if it's something like your parents died or some shit like that,

it's one thing, but this is, most of the kids are, they come from a bad circumstance. And also like the feeling of abandonment that now he has as a child that I felt that same abandonment. He didn't even care though. That's fucking crazy.

This guy didn't even care. He just, she said, quote. He's felt abandonment his whole life though, so he's probably used to it and just thinks this is how everybody feels. Well, yeah. And he says too, he doesn't really blame his mom. No. He says, this is Robert talking here.

He says, quote, my mom was a great mom as far as loving, but working two jobs, the supervision was lacking. There was no physical abuse or anything like that. It was more neglect. So that's what it is. She's just young. I mean, Christ, when he's 15 years old, she's only 30. Right. That's so weird.

That's young. You know what I mean? So weird. She's so young. Now, when he's about 10 years old, he went to live with his father in Texas. That's before the group home thing. He lived with his father, and there he found out sometimes it's better when dad just doesn't hang around. So dad is around for just a minute.

It's kind of like on Crime and Sports, our other podcast. We'll have two types of dads with these guys a lot of times. like on crime and sports or other podcasts we'll have we'll have two types of dads with these guys a lot of times it's like we don't know what's better in the end in the long run uh for this person's future if the dad uh just leaves immediately upon him being born or conceived even or if they stick around and beat the living shit out of them every day of their life until they're old enough to leave one or the other and you know what we haven't figured out which has worse results because both of them find fucking horrible results. Absolutely.

This time, I feel like it's the same thing here. He says his dad was very physically abusive, Robert says. Robert says, quote, that was the way he grew up. Corporal punishment. I ran away several times and was successful in 87 when I was 15, which he ran away back to his mother's house. And that's how he ended up in the group home. Got it.

When he gets back before the group home, his mother is dating a guy. She's got a life. She's got a boyfriend, and this guy won't let him run the house. Nothing. Just strict as shit. Basically. Not even, but just not. He's saying you're not going to sleep on the couch. Oh, okay.

So he's just giving him rules. He's just giving him rules of like you have to go to school and things like that. You're part of sleep on the couch. Oh, OK. So he's just giving them rules. He's just giving them rules of like you have to like be a – you have to like go to school and things like that. You're part of this thing now. Yeah. So that didn't work out. So he has his run-ins with the law. California Youth Authority takes him and he doesn't get out until he's 21. That's when they can't hold him anymore and so he has to leave.

Robert says about it that it was the most violent place he's ever seen. The group home. Yeah. Robert says about it that it was the most violent place he's ever seen. The group home. Yeah. And he says that talking about later on saying that, you know, that's even talking about including adult prison. Wow.

He's saying that's the worst ever that he was in was there. It was a juvenile facility. But he said there's where he learned, quote, the power of revenge is what he called it. He said, quote, I had somebody – I had done somebody wrong when i was 17 or so three years later i forgot about this guy and he caught up with me and smashed me beat me down uh he said he asked the guy why he did that why did you why did you crack my skull up and yeah and the guy explained quote that uh this was just his first opportunity to catch me slipping is what he says uh so he said, huh, all right. That was a nugget in his head.

This guy held a grudge for three years. That's calculating. I mean, three years, you're not mad anymore. That's just you have a to-do list of I've got to get revenge on that guy. Here's an ass-kicking I've got to dole out. And that's kind of what separates normal people from people like this, is the ability to go, yeah, fuck that guy, and move on, and not go, three years later, I think I'm going to beat him down.

You see him in a grocery store, and you're like, well, here's the day. Catching him slipping right now. Yeah, that's it. Look at him slipping all over this place. Catch him slipping like Omar with a drug dealer. Let's do this shit. Caught him slipping. Oh, that's right.

You didn't guard your package, motherfucker. Yeah. What's up now? I'mught him slipping. Oh, that's right. You didn't guard your package, motherfucker. Yeah. What's up now? I'm outside with the shotgun smoking the Newport 100. Fucks up. Drop that shit out the window. Don't make me come back here tomorrow. He said, oh, don't make me huff and puff, is what he told one person.

Don't make me huff and puff. Three seconds later, big bag of heroin dropping from the window. Boom. All right. Big bag of heroin for the big bad wolf? Yeah, that's what he said. That's what he walked up with his shotgun. He didn't even have it out.

He just had it down on his side. Don't make me huff and puff. He was just casually smoking a cigarette. And they're like, oh, shit. Straight gangster. When he walks in, the kids go, Omar, Omar. And everybody scatters. That's how it is.

I want that. I want that in neighborhood. That's what I want. Omar, Omar. People run. People bounce. James and Jimmy are here. I want that. I want that in neighborhood. That's what I want. Omar, Omar, people run. People bounce. James and Jimmy are here. Everybody rolls out.

They announce Omar from the rooftops and people run. Pigeons fly away. It's fucking crazy, man. It's awesome. That's the life I want for sure. Let's do that, man. So this guy here, he gets it. He gets it now, the revenge factor.

He says, quote, if somebody cuts you off in traffic, you may say you may say, fuck you and get in a fistfight. But you're not going to track them down two years later to say you're in for it. But see, but see, I would. I'm like that. But see, I would. I'm like that. This guy's an asshole at the way he said that, too. And so serious. Not even a joke. Yeah. And you would think this is the type of guy that just talks a lot yeah that that sounds like a guy who's just like i would do like yeah right dude whatever you're not doing anything you're gonna go home and play video games and jerk off and go to sleep you're not doing shit no no this is the guy who means it one out of ten of those people mean it here's one of them cut you off in traffic and you say i'm gonna go get that guy but you won't

do it yes see i would see me on the other hand, two years, I'll track that motherfucker. Two years, I'll fucking find you. How crazy is that? That's bananas. But me, I'm like that. Like, that's, wow. So he tries to live a life, a normal life here. He's just, you know, trying to find girlfriends and friends and do normal social things.

He sells cars. So you know he's an asshole. Yeah. Now he's a car salesman. Now he's a goddamn car salesman. And if you don't buy a car from him, see, I'll hunt you down. Oh, can you imagine that? Yeah, that guy fucked me on that deal.

He said he would take it if I threw in the rust proofing, and he didn't come back. And I did it, and he fucking left. He didn't come back. He bought it from the Hyundai dealership down the street. That motherfucker. I'm going to wait about two years until he already trades that one in on a new one, and he's completely forgotten about me and then i'm gonna be there right in his face fuck him up

slipping in that elantra that's right he's gonna come in that elantra one morning in his driveway and i'm gonna be in the back seat with a fucking piano wire with an ice pick like goodfellas and nunzio out in boston that's what's going to happen right there. So good. Jesus Christ. He said about this life he was trying to leave, he said, quote, I could handle all that, but I never got the temper in check and still live by those same rules. Normally, by the way, I kind of have a rule about about killers statements.

If it's like confessional things or things to the pool, I normally don't give the killers a chance to spin their own narrative. Yeah. At all. That's what I'm trying to avoid by that. So like, that's kind of on purpose. I'll say like,

you know, I don't care what this asshole has to say. I can judge by evidence and everything else. So I don't really, unless it's like something ridiculous or like, can you believe he said this out now? Why? But this guy,

I feel like you need to, the things he'll say really give you an insight to his character okay you need to know this shit because it all it's he's not lying nothing he said if if i think something isn't true i won't include it or i'll say that's a lie but if he's saying things about himself that are factual fuck it let's roll with. It's one of those deals. So, yeah, he could never live by the rules of normal society. As an adult, he's in his early 20s. He impregnates a woman, a 19-year-old named Cassandra Gunther. I pressured her to keep the baby.

What? Even with the threats of physical violence. My Christ. You will keep this fucking baby or I will knock it out of you, which I don't understand. That's an odd threat. Is that what he said? I don't know if that's what he said. I can imagine that's what he said. Either you keep it or I'll fucking kick it from your belly.

I don't know. Something horrible that he would, two years later when it's grown, I'll come back and smother it or something, you know? Who the fuck knows? But the thing is, he has to keep the cycle going. Yeah. This is the thing. Yeah.

What, it's, what the fuck in, This is the thing. What the fuck? What is it in our human brains that make us, I get that that's people, I know psychologically you repeat the trauma, but why? How does that benefit you? It's comfort or it's a semblance of normalcy somehow that people don't recognize.

I understand. I'm just saying people don't recognize the social strain that they're putting on things. And they can't just correct bad behavior. They know it's bad. It's an old question. They fucking know it. But it's an old question.

Everything else we do benefits us in an evolutionary way. Like, okay, even alcoholism is like if you were – a lot of times – now this is getting scientific, but I've actually looked into a lot of this shit. Now, this is getting scientific, but I've actually looked into a lot of this shit. If you look at Scotland, Scotland, it's not just a stereotype. They have genetically higher rates of alcoholism. They're more genetically prone to be alcoholic. And that is because that's why they were able to fight with sticks and rocks and shit, see Braveheart. They didn't fucking feel it. It was because that's a certain thing that heartier people

have higher rates of alcoholism. It's just the way it is. A lot of times that's the way it works. It makes them crazier and warrior-like and things like that. So that even evolutionarily makes sense. How does repeating trauma help you evolutionarily? I don't know. I don't know the answer.

It's a sociological shit. But it's for sure a don't know the answer. I don't know the answer to sociological shit. But it's for sure a thing because it happens constantly. Why? Everybody. Every fucking trailer park in this country is populated with this same shit. Men do this. They can't fucking figure out how to not be a dickbag. Men do this.

Women get molested by their uncle and then they end up going out. They're 19 and they like a guy who's 15. They can't help it. It's a damage. It's how it works. Men do this. They're 19 and they like a guy who's 50. It's it's they can't help it. It's a damage. It's how it works. Men do this. They keep the cycle going. Well, my childhood was shitty.

So let me make another shitty childhood for somebody else. And then I can be violent like my dad and also neglectful like my mom. And I can really put them together. And then I won't be able to get a good job because I didn't get the education that requires me to do that because I was too busy being a fucking father. And now I need drugs and alcohol to cope with this fucked up life. Yes.

Oh, baby, this guy has it going on. How many Christmases got to be fucked up before somebody just goes, no more. How many turkeys from Thanksgiving have to go flying through a front bay window before this stops? Actually, it's a trailer. There's no bay window. Have to go flying through the particle board and come out the other side.

When he's an adult, he's a short, stocky dude. Shaves his head. Oh, boy. He's this kind of guy. He's a bald-headed, short, stocky guy, which is, it's always. Apart from the stocky, I can relate. Yeah, well, he just shaves it on purpose just because he likes, I think he likes the look Oh, he's got a great head of hair, but shaves it?

Fuck you, dude. I don't know about he has a- You're an asshole if you do that. I'm not sure what his head of hair is like. I hate those fucking guys. Every picture of him is shaved and he always had a shaved head. Yeah, well, fucking if he's got great hair, I'll kick him in the dick if he's shaving He does not deserve great hair at all, this guy.

April of 2000. Yeah. He meets a young lady. Okay. He meets a young lady named April Robinson. They begin dating. Very nice. I feel bad for this woman.

She doesn't know he's the guy who will wait two years for revenge. They date until about the spring of about 2001, and April breaks up with him, which, as you can imagine, he takes very well, obviously, because he's a very reasonable. Well-adjusted young man. Very balanced, I would say the word to use would be with him. He's very balanced. Shaving his head in his 20s. For sure he's got it going on. Takes everything in stride. Let's roll off his back like water off a duck, man.

For sure. No problems. So April moves on with her life after breaking up with him because she's a normal person and what the hell is she going to do? Right. She begins dating another man. Okay. By all accounts, begins dating another man. Okay. By all accounts, a very nice guy. Yeah.

Everybody likes this guy. Of course they do. His name's Brian Pierce. Yep. He's 25 years old. He graduated from Reed High School in the area. He has what's described as a strong Christian upbringing and supportive family. So he's got a family that loves him.

He goes to church. He's one of these guys that the world is there for him. You know what I mean? He's had a good life. But Robert stays around. McConnell can't just go away. He's got to break their balls. Are you kidding me here?

This Pierce, he's attending college. He's studying graphic design. He's got a nice family. He's got a girlfriend. Things are going great. I mean, that's good for Pierce and what year is this and April 2

this is 2001 okay computer industry is booming that's a great it's a great industry to get into brilliant this guy is right

on the cutting edge good for you here right at the beginning of the dot com shit yeah now after but do you think do you think Robert's just taking this

and going well who's this dot com that's what he's saying yeah C'est well, you know. Who's this dot com? That's what he's saying. C'est la vie. You know what? I'm going to send him a nice card. I'm going to send him a housewarming gift because those two kids are going to make it.

I just got a haircut. I'm going to send him some of my locks to remember. It's going to do it. Yeah, it's going to do it. No, he dates another woman too, Robert. He dates a woman named Lisa Rose. So he's dating. He's moving on with his life. It's not like he's sitting lonely in his trailer

brooding. Tugging constantly thinking about her. He's a salesman. He'll get another woman. You know what I mean? And from what he says, he's a decent salesman. He'll get a goddamn car salesman. I mean, come on. If you're a car salesman, I'm sure you're great. Just come down. No, you're not great.

You're not fucking great. No. You're not great. At all. My wife just went to fucking look for a car. You're not fucking great. No, you're not great at all. My wife just went to fucking look for a car. You're not great. I'll tell you that right now. You're full of shit. And don't call me every week after I stop by to look. Email every day.

Stop trying to act like you're my friend. Stop it. Jesus. Do I have asswipe written on my forehead? Go fuck yourself, dude. Leave me alone. I'll come to you. I'll come up to it like it's a normal

store i'll come to the window if i want to buy something leave me the fuck alone we've all researched every car on the internet you don't have to tell us about the features none of that shit i know what the car has god damn it senior goddamn commercials so this fucking toyota selling scumbag i don't know if he's selling toyotas, but this guy was selling Toyotas, so fuck him. McConnell here, he tells Lisa Rose, his new girlfriend, that he's going to murder Pierce. He says, I'm going to kill that Brian Pierce guy.

He just tells her that. He's like, you know what? It's sticking in my craw. I am going to kill that guy, let me tell you something. She's like, first of all, any new girlfriend would be like, why are you still thinking about your old girlfriend so much? Yeah. He's not just thinking about his old girlfriend so much. He's thinking about her to the point

where he's like, I'm going to kill that guy she's with. Right. I'm just going to take care of that. The new guy is the one that's going to suffer because she doesn't want me. What do you want for dinner tonight? Taco Bell? I'll go get it, but I'm going to kill the guy on the way there. So it'll be an extra, I'll be out a half hour. I'm going to kill him quick. I'll be back. What do you want?

Gorditas? Cheesy gordita crunch? Just nachos and just chips and cheese? That's all you're getting. When you're six? How old are you? Soft tacos. What the fuck? That's what you want?

Not even a Supreme? Get some sour cream on you, pussy. Let's go. So she's concerned, Lisa Rose. She's like, and she knows the guy. She's dating him. So she probably goes, he might be capable of this. I think he's serious.

Yeah, he seems a little out there. So what she does is she twice notifies the secret witness program. Oh, shit. Tells the police, hey, I got a guy here who's saying he wants to kill some dude. Right. Just in case you're interested. Yeah. She also contacts April Robinson.

Oh, boy. And says, just to let you know, quick sidetrack here. How's it going? Well, family good? Yeah. Okay, I'll just let you know your ex-boyfriend. I How's it going? Well? Family good? Okay. I'll just let you know your ex-boyfriend. I know you probably forgot about him. It's been like a year.

Yeah. No, he wants to kill your boyfriend. He's going to kill him. So you want to get on that pretty quick. You know what this strikes me as, though, is like he's now with a new girl. The other girl broke up with him and doesn't want anything to do with him. And she fucked great. You know what I mean?

Maybe. Yeah, yeah. She let him like choke her a little bit or something well i don't think there's a little bit with this guy if they're choking she probably wouldn't be here she wouldn't be here she liked like the back of her hair grabbed or pulled back or something and this new girl that ain't happening there's no you get your hand near my throat and we'll have a we'll have an argument. That's possible. And now he's going, well, my life's, I'm with no chokes. What is this? I got no chokes now. This guy, though, all about control.

Yeah. This is about control. Okay. It's not even, she could have been a virgin. They could have been waiting until marriage, but it's control. Okay. He wants the control and it's revenge. He can't, he gets that thing in his head and everybody has a thing where you're like, fuck that guy.

But it goes away. That's the thing. It goes away. Jesus Christ. It lingers and then disappears. Unless you're like one of my old Italian relatives. It goes away. It does.

For me, too. It goes away so fast. I'm like, oh, look, a quarter. I got to go. And you completely forget. Is that a butterfly? And then everything's gone. Yeah.

If you're an old party, my grandmother still mad at a priest from 1972. I swear to God. True story. If you're an old party, my grandmother still mad at a priest from 1972. I swear to God. True story. If you bring it up, that son of a bitch bastard. Still mad at a priest from 72. Jesus Christ. You're talking about 40 years. She was divorced.

She wanted to get remarried. And the guy told her, you can't get married in the church because basically you're a sex worker now. You're a whore. Yes. That's the word. Thank you, Jimmy. You know, and so my grandmother told the priest to go fuck himself.

Right, in the church. Go fuck yourself. She said, my fine nice man, he take care of my children, he's nice to me. You say I shouldn't be here because you don't like, but you go fuck yourself. And she marched out of the church. That was it.

And the end of religion for grandma right there. Okay. I go to the justice of the peace. She says, I pray at home now. That's what she says. I don't need him. I don't need them. Okay, then.

I'd marry her in a second. She's the best. That's a great woman. That's where I come from. Yeah. That's why if you tweet me and say, you pronounced itino you pronounced it, let's Lino. I'll say go fuck yourself. Because that's how

I grew up. With my grandmother going if that happens, you tell that priest to go fuck himself. I'm like, okay. What do you think? You tweeting is going to be any different? No. Go fuck yourself. That's why I'm a comic. So I can yell at people in the front row and get encouragement for it. I see stars. Holy shit. I'm a comic. So I can yell at people in the front row and get encouragement for it. I see stars.

Holy shit. I'm going to kill Jimmy, guys. Hold on. Let's not kill Jimmy. Jimmy's going to have a fucking stroke. I'm chasing dogs. That's amazing. That's why I'm a comic.

I'm not going to fuck yourself. I'm not going to fuck yourself. Michael, fuck yourself. She stomps out. So good. Just the hand up that's over then. Dismissed. Is she like 5'2 or some shit? She's 4'10.

With the hand up and running out the door. She's about 4'11 and a half in her prime. So cute. Oh my God. Red hair too. Flaming red hair. Yeah, she's a trick, that prime. Oh my God. Red hair too. Flaming red hair. Yeah. She's, she's a,

she's a trick that one. So I don't know how the fuck we got there, but, uh, the, uh, he starts threatening the couple. Robert starts threatening April and Brian.

Uh, just, and he says that there was threats exchanged between them. Something tells like, sounds like he threatened them and they said, please leave us alone. Right. And then he said, there's threats going back and forth here. This is a two-way street, buddy.

Let me tell you something. Can I interest you in a 2012 Sorento? Is that possible? So he says that she kept calling back. She kept calling me back and she says that I didn't want him to, I never called him back. I just wanted him to go away. This fucking guy is annoying me. I broke up with him for a reason.

He's a car salesman. This guy. This is a hell of a car salesman. He'll keep calling. That's where he learned this behavior. I realize you can't buy, but let's talk about a lease. Can we talk about a lease? And when they were training him to sell cars, they probably said, you've got to really be persistent.

He goes, I can do that. You're talking to the right guy. Yeah, me, right here. I'm the guy. Me too. Yeah, it's a me too moment on that one. Me too. Okay.

And by the way, we don't mean hashtag me too. It's me too from another. It's a callback joke from another show that has nothing to do with anything like that. So anyway, this all goes on here. The way Robert puts it, he says that April and Brian Pierce, at this point, too, they got engaged, April and Brian Pierce. So that pisses him off. He says, Robert says they crossed the line at this point and pushed him to the point where revenge was his only option. That's the only thing he could do was revenge.

He said Last Straw came when they got, she took out a temporary restraining order on him in 2001, in early 2001. This made him obviously not be able to come near them. But he continued to violate the whole time he would do that. She'd call the police to report it, that he was driving by her house. He would call. So a judge actually issued an arrest warrant for it. He was served with the warrant on the showroom floor of his job. Wow.

Because they know where he works, so they came to his job to arrest him. Yeah. He says he was pulling in $10,000 a month as a salesman there. I don't know if he's doing that. I don't know how much money car salesmen make, but if he's pulling in $10,000 a month as a car salesman, he is like a primo, top-of-the-line scumbag. And also, too, in a town of 19,000. How many people? 19,000.

How are you moving that many cars in 20,000 people? I don't know what he's doing. You've got to be putting like five, six cars out a week. I don't know. That's crazy. Maybe he works, who the hell knows. In a year, you'd outfit the entire town with a new car. That's everybody.

Good job. I'm done. Good job, Robert. Good job. And they give him like a gold watch and he rides off into the sunset. All right, then. This town's done for. That's all here.

He says, Robert says, quote, the secretary, all these people are looking at me like you're a scumbag who beats on women because it was a temporary restraining order deal, a violation of a temporary restraining order. Right. He tells everybody as he's being dragged out that the woman's claims are bogus, but he still got fired. This is when he said it was time to fight back. He said, God damn it, I want revenge now. He said at that point there was no more threatening.

Oh, sweet pea. So this isn't good. He said, quote, they ruined my livelihood. So he tells them, quote, so you're going to pay. I told them it may not be today, but when you least expect it. Christ. That's this guy. That's what he said to them. It may not be today, but when you least expect it. Christ. That's this guy. That's what he said to them.

It may not be today, but when you least expect it. My Christ. Have a good one. And then he hangs up the damn phone. Yeah, you would. Well, what ends up happening is they think they're okay because he moves. Oh. He leaves town.

Oh, that's great. They're like, fuck, thank God. Late 2001, he takes off. He goes, because he was selling cars in Reno, so maybe that was a little bigger city. He goes to Pennsylvania. Good. Where his father is. So many miles away. And, of course, his father, so maybe that was a little bigger city. He goes to Pennsylvania. Good. Where his father is. So many miles away.

And, of course, his father, he's got such a great relationship with. Oh, that guy's a dickbag. You know, beat the shit out of him and left and all that sort of thing. He goes to help him out with a construction project out there. He's going to go help him, I don't know, build a barn or some shit. He stays away for nine whole months. Okay. Nine whole months.

Yeah. So he's gone. Think about April and Brian. Nine months go by. Oh, Christ. He moved to a—that guy doesn't exist anymore. They're engaged. Yeah. So he's gone. Think about April and Brian. Nine months go by. Oh, Christ. He moved to a... That guy doesn't exist anymore.

They're engaged. Yeah. They're planning their wedding. Fuck, yeah, they are. That guy who... They're picking the chicken cattatoria or whatever the fuck they're having for dinner that night. By late 2001, this guy is a memory. It doesn't even matter here.

Now, late July 2002, this is almost a year goes by. Robert says, I'm going to leave. I got a Pennsylvania. He's not cutting it. I need to go back to Nevada. Before I do that, though, let me do my Steve Martin jerk thing and pick a few items that I need. All I need is this remote control. And also what he needs is a backpack because he's going to have some shit to carry.

He's going to need to carry a 9mm handgun, seven or eight clips, a hundred rounds of ammo total. Holy shit. A ski mask. Yeah. Rope. Yep. Gloves.

Yep. And a knife. Okay. He's going to take all that stuff with him because, you know, that's a nice little care package. So he started a beer league. Yeah. It's like when a kid runs away from home and they have a little bindle on a stick.

That's what they have in it. Usually ski mask, rope, a hundred rounds of ammo. It's usually white bread and peanut butter. You know how it goes. You know how it goes. So he hops on an Amtrak train and heads west. Because he spent all his money on weapons. That's it. Oh Christ, he's got all this shit. He's who knows his dad. $3,000 worth of weapons

and a $40 bus ticket. Or train ticket. He's trading weapons for fare along the way. Jesus Christ. Unbelievable, man. So he gets out there.

He stays and he gets in Nevada. He, of course, has some dealer connections because he knows he was a car dealer for a while. So he ends up getting a car with dealer plates, which doesn't look suspicious. Cars with dealer plates for some reason. It's like, oh, that's a I don't know why. It's like, oh, no one even owns that car. Yeah, that car should be the look suspicious. Cars with dealer plates, for some reason. It's like, oh, that's a, I don't know why. It's like, oh, no one even owns that car. Yeah, that car should be the most suspicious. Like, if you see a dealer plate, like, write that shit down.

Yeah, because you don't even know anybody could be driving that. It's not registered to anybody in particular. To a person, yeah. So he gets that, and he decides to camp out, stake out Brian and April's home in Sun Valley. He clocks their comings and goings with a notepad. I mean everything. They take out Brian and April's home in Sun Valley. He clocks their comings and goings with a notepad. I mean everything.

He stalks them for two days and finds out their whole lay of how they do everything. August 4th, 2002, in the midst of all this, he contacts his old roommate, a guy named Alejandro Monroy. They meet up to hang out or get something to eat or whatever. Sure. Monroy says that McConnell was fixated on April and displayed a lot of aggression toward her and was talking a lot of shit about her. He was just, they're out at lunch or something. Yeah. And he's like just, ah, fucking, you know, they broke up a year and a half ago. Yeah.

Right. He moved away and came back. Right. This guy's like, what the hell is wrong with you, dude? Like, I forgot you went out with that chick. Yeah. What are you talking about? Monroy said he tried to persuade him, Robert, to let his feelings go.

And he told him to grow up, he said. Really? Look, dude, you got to grow up, man. Oh, that's some tough words from a friend, though. It is. And sometimes you need to hear that shit. Sometimes, yeah. You got to grow up and fucking stop.

But when you're a fucking weirdo, those aren't the words. This guy. That's a challenge from a guy like that. You know what I mean? Yeah, that's a good point. You sit there eating a fish taco, and he's like, how's your how's your fish he's like it tastes like april and you're like what the fuck are you talking about man calm down jesus i thought you didn't grow up i thought you guys were waiting to marriage yeah i'll show you grow up i'll show you grow up i'm gonna do something

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So by August 5th, he's back outside the house. Okay. Stalking. Again. Stalking, taking notes. Taking notes. He's got binoculars. This is crazy.

He's like a private investigator, this guy. A lot of these guys, if they just took a different path, would make phenomenal private investigators, these killers, because they are patient, they'll wait, they can sit there, they'll stalk, they blend in. They're nothing to do. Yeah, it's just if you could just stop at right before the killing part. Just take the notes and then hand them in and get paid for that.

That's all you need to do. That's legal stalking is what that is. That is legal stalking. You put your skills to work. What are we good at? Not a lot. Not a lot. I'm an excellent tugger. It's so good.

We're decent at making fun of assholes. We're getting there. So, you know what I mean? I can tug and I can make fun of an asshole. Yeah, while you're doing it. Hopefully not. Let's see. Now. You don't know what I'm doing under the table.

I fucking hope not. Good God. Jesus, that scares me. So now, August 7th. Yeah. it's 4.30 p.m. April Robinson comes home from work like normal. She normally gets home at 4.30. She notices some things that are not normal. Some things out of place.

She notices that the blinds are closed, which they're usually open. There's a golf ball-sized hole in the outside paneling of the house, which is strange. There's a golf ball-sized hole in the outside paneling of the house, which is strange. And there's a blanket in the front door of the inside of the house, like on the floor. Like there's a blanket on the ground there. She's like, that's odd when she walks in. What happened here? And she walked in still.

Well, she just saw the blinds were closed and the golf ball things. She walked in and saw the blanket there and was like, what the hell is going on? And as she opens the door, she notices that Brian, Brian gets home earlier than her. And Brian always comes out to greet her outside to greet her. Sure. She can. He can hear her come in. So she's a great guy. He's a nice fucking guy.

Exactly. And he comes outside to greet her and she didn't. He didn't come out to greet her. So she's so sweet. He's so sweet. Yeah. He's a good retriever. He's sitting on the couch watching the game.

Here's her car pull up and he shuts off the TV and runs to the door. Either that, or he's sitting home just tugging like crazy. He takes it off, slams the laptop shut, runs out there. Hey, baby, how you doing? Hey, how's it going? Oh, yeah, everything's fine. No, I feel like she couldn't have done more of a flip-flop. Yeah.

She had like a psychopath guy with no family and just a mess and a, I want revenge to this nice guy. Like, she's actually someone who went, okay, not going to repeat that pattern. Right. Going on to the next thing. She figured out the fucking glitch in the matrix. And who knows? He's a salesman.

Who knows how Robert presented himself in the beginning? I'm sure he doesn't present himself like a psychopath because that's how predators lure you in. You get yourself a point. Yeah. like a psychopath because that's how predators lure you in. You get yourself a point. Yeah. There's a sweet smell that has to draw you in. Otherwise, what are you doing here? So anyway, after a few seconds, she's standing there and she's like, what's going on?

And I'm sure she's thinking- Where the fuck is he? Where the fuck is he? Should I step outside? Should I keep going? What do I do? But she doesn't have much of a choice because after a few seconds, she sees a man in all dressed in all black holding a knife. Oh, fuck.

Which is not terrific. No one wants that when you come home from work. Takes her a second, but then she notices and realizes that it's Robert. Yeah, sweet Pete. She took her a minute because she hasn't heard from him, seen him in months, almost a year. And I guarantee you that first thought in her head was was just that quote and when you least expect when you least expect it there he is that's what i mean that's yeah you had

to tell his quotes from earlier because you need to know how what kind of person he is because he's honest about what a scumbag he is for the most part now earlier before she got there let's find out how this happened shall we uh in the morning he gets police issue battle dress uniform this is the black gonna go raid a you know a crack house uniform here uh he breaks into the house through a window that was unlocked uh looks around looks through their bills and pictures and sees what they're up to just you know let's get a lay of the land just i think that's just to gas himself up yeah let's look at pictures of them together so I can get pissed off. Let's do all of this.

He leaves. He's like, okay, check that out. Takes off for a while. Gets a sandwich. Does whatever. I don't know if he got a sandwich, but I assume. Because he leaves in the morning and comes back at about 1220. So I feel like he's like, I'm going to take lunch.

I'm going to go. He comes back about 1220. Breaks back into the house and waits. He just waits. He waits because he knows that Brian's coming home soon. He knows from his notes that he gets home at 2.30. So he waits. Brian gets home from work at 2.30.

He opens the door like normal because it's his apartment, whatever. And Robert is pointing a gun at him. Oh, boy. And he says to him, give me your wallet, is what he tells him. Give me your wallet. So Brian throws his wallet toward him, towards Robert, and he reaches for the door. As he reaches for the door, Robert fires his gun ten times. Holy shit.

Ten times. Hits him with nine of them. The last one, though, he walked right up to Pierce because he really wanted to see it up close when he died. Put the gun so close to him that he was burned. His skin was actually

charred pretty good from the gun. That's very close range when it's that. It's not just a little bit. It was that close, basically. That's insane. So he not just a little bit. Yeah. It was that close, basically. So that's insane. So he shoots him. He hits him nine out of ten times at close range in an apartment. That's where the golf ball hole comes from.

That's where I would assume that would come from. Yeah, that's your tenth shot right there. The exit. That's it right there. He then drags Brian's body into a bedroom, drags it in there, and he starts, he takes his knife out and starts digging around in there. What? He starts digging out, because he brought black talon bullets, and he thought that they would be easily traceable or whatever.

So he also wanted to see what one looked like inside of a body. What the fuck? So I wanted to dig in there and see what the bullet looked like lodged in there, kind of see my handiwork. Wow. It's like an artist that took a step back to look at the picture. You know, he's like, oh, look at that. Oh, right. That's a nice brush stroke.

Right in the spleen. Yeah. Good. Excellent. Tore right through the aorta. I love it. Fuck. So this is insane here.

He wanted to see what one looked like inside of a body. So this is a sick, he's stalked. This is a sick fuck here. He then takes the knife and jabs it, jabs it, he stabs it into Brian's torso because he said he was, quote, still mad. Then, he goes, because he wants to, you know, he wants to have a message

here, because he's an asshole, and thinks he's brilliant. He goes out in the living room and gets the video of the movie Fear. Remember Fear with Marky Mark? With fucking Mark Wahlberg, and he'll always be Marky Mark. Is it Alicia Silverstone? I think it was Reese Witherspoon.

It is Reese. I always mix them up, but it's the one where he feared. About a stalker boyfriend. And he fingered her on the roller coaster. Exactly. I know you would remember that. That's spot.

Yeah. That's what everyone about that movie, if you go, Fear, is that the one where they figure the girl on the roller coaster? I always remember it's Alicia Silverstone. It's not her. No,

I think they made like a, she was like the crush or something, or one of those. I don't know. One was Drew Barrymore, one was Alicia Silverstone. It's not her. It's definitely Reese Witherspoon. She was like the crush or something. I don't know. One was Drew Barrymore. It doesn't fucking matter. It doesn't matter. The point is. Girls that I was into when I was 15, 14 years old is what we're talking about now.

Meanwhile, if you finger a girl on a roller coaster, you're going to hurt her. I don't think that's a good place for fingering, guys. No, that's terrible. Guys, let's say fingering for a much nicer place. Not small town murder approved. Not small town. Fingering for a much nicer place not small town murder not small fingering on a roller coaster not small town murder approved guys not small town unless she's really want you to right i guess i don't know he's begging do what she wants be a good husband just listen just listen just be nice okay so uh anyway he places the video fear on there because i assume this is hey, this is what we're doing here.

You want to know about some stalking? This is pretty cool. Yeah, look at this. You like that, don't you? He also takes the credit cards out of Brian's wallet. I'm going to need those here. He says about why he dug the bullets out. He says, quote, yeah, I was doing that to see what they looked like and thought maybe I should take them out for evidence because they're going to know what kind of bullet it was.

Yeah. He leaves the knife just sticking out of Brian's tip. Jesus. He leaves it sticking out of his stomach. He says he considered dismembering the body. He thought about it. Sure. He tells him, but he decided against it, he said, because he thought, quote, if I was going to cut the dude's head off, but I didn't have the time and she was going to come home. So, you know. You know it's just a time crunch.

It's a time thing is what I'm indicating here. I can't do that. It has nothing to do with the fact that I just felt terrible. Yeah. He said the plan at this point was going well, even when she got home. Like, this is the plan. But he said when she got there, a quote kind of went sideways. Okay.

Okay. Because now we're back. Let's go back to when April walks in. Okay. Knife standing there. Yeah. The whole deal. Robert tells April, just shut the fuck up, is his quote to her.

He grabbed her arm. He drags her into the master bedroom. He throws her face down on the bed and handcuffs her. Oh, boy. He then takes her on the couch and starts talking to her. Let's just have a conversation. She doesn't know where Brian is. She has no idea right now.

No clue. Not a goddamn idea where Brian is. They're talking. About 20 minutes later, Robert's had enough conversation. He decides, let me cut your shirt and bra off with this knife here. And then he also takes off her pants, takes off her underwear. He puts her face down on the bed again.

He duct taped her arm to her leg, you know, like a hog tie with duct tape. My uncle was a cop. He used to do that shit to us with his handcuffs. That is the most uncomfortable shit. Take your right hand and put it to your left leg. That is a motherfucker. I hope your uncle didn't do anything other than this.

He's an unbelievable man. He just thought it was funny to watch us try to get out of it. This is less. It was a prank more than it was torture. Yeah. This is not a prank at all. This is horrific. I hope your uncle would frown on this behavior.

He probably would arrest him for it. I would hope so. Jesus, he deserves it. So he, like I said, face down on the bed, duct tapes would arrest him for it. So I would hope so. So Jesus, he deserves it. So he, like I said, face down on the bed, duct tapes her arm to her leg. Then he duct tapes her eyes and mouth. Oh my God. And puts a towel over her head. He had to depersonalize.

Yeah. This is Richard Speck. Yeah. Like if you listen to Mindhunter, the John Douglas, now it's a TV show. It's unbelievable. Now it's a Netflix show. It's really good. It's so good.

But if you look, if you read the Mindhunter book, they go into the details about the spec interview, and he had to depersonalize it. That's all it is. He couldn't. And also, he knows her so much. He had to depersonalize it. He could kill the other guy and point blank wipe him out. Didn't give a shit.

Doesn't matter. But this one, you can't watch it. That wasn't enough, though, because now he's got to assault her. Oh, I knew it. He sexually assaults her in every which way possible uh vaginally anally orally fingers and his his business there everything he's he's just uh rapes her has a fucking uh has a carnival ride on her which is insane uh this poor woman here and she doesn't even know about brian yet still still doesn't know about this she's going through so much torture this is horrible man afterwards uh robert asks her for money she

gives him seven dollars good uh he then she then gets dressed yeah and uh he tells her robert tells april that if she makes any wrong moves he was going to shoot her in front of all of her neighbors we're getting out of here he says i'm gonna shoot you in front of everybody if you make any wrong moves i would make him i would make him. Maybe, yeah. I'd run away screaming and go, shoot me in front of a ton of witnesses. Go ahead, asshole. Better chance to get in the car with this fucking psychopath after what he just did to me. I don't know. So she sees that he had a gun and two magazine clips and she said, you know what? Judging by this guy, he might

do that just on spite. Sure. She also noticed that he had Brian Pierce's wallet and car keys. She asked about Pierce. She said, well, where's Brian? Robert tells her that he was locked up in a U-Haul and being watched by people. So, like, he's kidnapped, basically. That's the deal with him.

He's kidnapped, got him locked up. He's like, I don't know, he's like holding a rich family's child for ransom. I'm going to send you a finger at 2 o'clock if we don't get the money. So she said, Robert tells her that April's going to have to take him to California if she ever wants to see Brian again. You take me to California and I'll let him go. Otherwise, he's never going to get let go and we're going to kill him. All these people that I have over here. All these people that are just on board with this.

People just on board with this plan. We're getting revenge against that girl who did nothing but find another boyfriend and move on with her life. Fuck yeah, I'm on board. All right, all of us. Jesus, let's get that son of a bitch. So they drive to California in her car. He tells her that everything that's happening is all part of the plan. Don't worry about it.

That's when she realized he was telling her a about it. That's when she realized he was telling her a little more. That's when she realized that he'd been stalking her. Everything, where the cars were parked, how many dogs they had, where they sat. He knew everything about them. He had notes about it, everything. It was nuts. As they get to San Francisco, April starts to think that

Brian wasn't a hostage, that he was either dead or just somewhere else yeah and that mcconnell was planning on killing her yeah she's like i gotta get the fuck out of here she's had the thought she should have had coming out of the apartment yeah but i get overcome with fear and the trauma she just went through too i can imagine now it's getting super real too because she's seeing the hours go by right and she's seeing the evidence of the stalking and that this is all a big fucking plan she knows that this isn't going to go well and and reno to san francisco is not a short trip it's no that's a lot of hours to think

uh so they stop at a gas station and she grabs the car and escapes oh really she grabs the car at the gas station and takes off good she's out of there april she drives to a nearby hospital she contacts the police yep she gave the police his backpack my lady had all his shit in it contained uh nine millimeter the gun the bullets uh handcuffs the whole fucking deal all matching up to everything ballistically as you know that uh she uh they take her back to nevada she does not find out that brian is dead until she gets back to nevada fuck doesn't find out never know she's going the whole time. Where's Brian? I got to go find Brian. And they're like, yeah, no.

You're not going to find Brian at all. He's not going to happen at all here. So the next morning, August 8th, 2002. By the way, I'm so happy that April got away, by the way. No kidding. I was so scared. Yeah, I thought for sure April was fucked here when I was researching this. She's not great.

No. Poor girl. No, no. She's going to have to. She's got a tough. She's got years of recovery to go through. I would say so. So the Washoe County Sheriff's Department goes to the house the next morning, obviously, for the kidnapping and all that stuff.

They find Brian with a knife stuck in his torso. Under the knife was the fear video. They found that. They're like, oh, this guy's an asshole. Not Brian, obviously. Autopsy done by Dr like, oh, this guy's an asshole. Yeah. You know, not Brian, obviously. Autopsy done by Dr. Christine Elliott, who's a forensic pathologist, said that Pierce suffered nine gunshot wounds. One wound was behind his ear. That was the close range one.

That close. That close. A quote appeared to be very close range or contact in nature. Also suffered three stab wounds, which two of them were bullets. And then the third one just stuck it in nature. Also suffered three stab wounds, which two of them were bullets, and then the third one just stuck it in there. Two of the stab wounds were, quote, the most superficial with the knife. Those were the ones where he was picking for bullets.

And then the knife was still in the third wound, like I said. And the lack of bleeding says that he was already dead when he stabbed him from there. So he was just playing around with the dead body, which is horrible here. Pierce died from massive blood loss, obviously, from the gunshot wounds. He's still on the lamp. Yeah, he's still running. He ran away. When she took the car, he took off.

So he's in California somewhere at this point. Yeah. He calls his brother, Darren Bacondi, and asks him to send, quote, money and things of that nature. That's pretty vague. Bacondi. Things of that nature. Just stuff. Just shit that's worth stuff? Cans of beans. I of that nature. Just stuff. Just shit that's worth stuff?

Cans of beans. I don't know. What do you want? What do you want? Like hobo gear? Train passes? What are we doing here? Bacondi says that Robert was, quote, kind of rambling during the conversation.

He said that he told him that Robert told his brother that maybe he should just kill himself. He said, or maybe I'll go out in a blaze of glory. Maybe make the cops do it. Suicide by police? Yeah, I could take a couple of them out with him. With me, he says. Hopefully some kind of shootout or something. Hopefully.

So his brother is very aware of the severity and gravity of the situation. Best case scenario, shootout with the cops. They take a few down. This is what he's doing here. Now, a few days later, he's captured in San Francisco because they have a huge manhunt. The FBI is involved in this whole deal. He's taken into custody without incident

at 1.40 p.m. So much for that blaze of glory, fuckface. Yeah, well, they popped up on him on O'Farrell Street there. When he least expected it. When he least expected it. They got him. Hey, the cops can do that, too. Deal with that, fuckface. Take that, dickhead. So this is on O'Farrell Street near Larkin.

And this was after getting a 911 tip that he was in the area. Somebody called and said, oh, there's that guy. He's also wanted in California on active warrants from fraud and reckless driving. Jesus. So he's got shit going on out there. Now, here's when it gets super weird. We're going to take a super weird sidetrack here.

He's also obsessed with Barry Bonds' ex-wife. What? Barry Bonds' ex-wife. He stalked her in Woodside for months before this. He came back and stalked her at some point when he was in California. If you're not aware of who Barry Bonds is. He's the all-time home run leader in baseball. With an asterisk.

With an asterisk. But excessively famous guy. Right. One of the more famous athletes in baseball. With an asterisk. With an asterisk. But excessively famous guy. Right. One of the more famous athletes in America. Everyone knows who he is. Dangly gold cross in his left ear. Yes. And jacking home runs.

Right. And was one of the greatest players ever before the steroids. He's fucking amazing. Police found materials linked to Bonds and his ex-wife. Her name is Sun Bonds. No. Yes. In a backpack in the car there.

This is crazy Bonds. No. Yes. In a backpack in the car there. This is crazy, man. They found out about the Bonds connection afterwards because they put it together because a couple days before they caught him, he was found stalking her outside, stalking her house in a tree. Get the fuck out of here. They questioned and released him, and they didn't know who he was. Yeah. And so that's what ends up happening here. And this is all in San Francisco. This is in San Francisco where he's from.

They found a they found a letter related to son Bonds in the car. It's nuts here. They also he used to live in Redwood City and he apparently worked at a Redwood City bagel shop that was owned by Barry Bonds. Wow. A few years before this. That's that's the fucking connection. That's where he

fucking saw her and wanted her yeah the uh the police said quote we had concerns with his infatuation with son bonds no doubt uh yeah they said quote this guy was very dangerous he was obsessed with a lot of different people we related our concerns as far as son bonds to the san mateo county sheriff's department my god yeah they found her uh they found him perched in a tree near Son Bonds' home in Woodside about two months ago. Like a feral cat. Like a feral cat. Look for those. They said it was close enough to the house that it was possible he was stalking her,

and he had no reasonable cause to be there. And then later on, now we find out all these documentations, and he used to work for them. That's exactly what he was, was fucking stalking her. That's so weird. Yeah, they said they took it very seriously. They had officers there around the house, around the clock to the Bonds house and all that sort of thing. They found all personal shit from her and they said that he'd apparently been dumpster diving for Bonds memorabilia. Crazy, right?

For trash. For trash. He's jumping in the trash for trash. He's jumping in the trash for trash. He's jumping in the trash for trash, diving around. Yeah, so this is nuts here. Just anything that she touched is so creepy. So he was...

It's unreal, man. By the way, when they caught him, they still had... He still had a 10-inch butcher knife on him. So he kept that on him. So they were like, ooh, look at that. He's extradited back to Nevada. While in custody, this shit gets crazier and crazier. While in custody, he made a number of drawings, had some telephone recorded conversations,

one of which was with his dad where he talked about, yeah, I thought about cutting his head off. I thought about this member in the body. This is recorded in prison. They have that. Number of letters that he wrote. This guy is just – I don't know if he doesn't think that they – like anything he does is admissible. I don't know what the body. This is recorded in prison. They have that. Number of letters that he wrote. This guy is just, I don't know if he doesn't think that anything he does is admissible. I don't know what the fuck. He's just an idiot. He just can't help it.

One of these letters was a letter he wrote to Robinson. There was a preliminary hearing that she testified at, and he wrote her a letter with the cover sheet that says quote, rest in peace 1977 to 2002, which was Brian Pierce's birth and death written on it.

And the letter said, quote, I hope this letter finds you before you kill yourself. Wow. Apparently she had a bit of a suicide scare. That's fucked up. Before the hearing. That is so fucked up. She had a little wrist cutting incident, which good God, her fucking life. I don't. It's got to feel so shit she blames herself for brian's death for sure 100 this guy yeah she her whole life had i not dated robert brian's alive exactly it wasn't for me he's alive

and the trauma that happened to her being assaulted and kidnapped and dragged away now she has to live with that knowing that that yeah that she picked a guy and that. And it's not her fault. It's not her fault. But she's going to feel it because that's just human nature. Psychologically, yeah. And she's probably got a little bit of depression issues, too. I would think by now.

If she's normal, I would hope so. I mean, if she didn't before, she for sure does now. Definitely. He says, quote, I hope this letter finds you before you kill yourself. Just think, now you can be with your mom and Brian forever. That was some performance last Thursday at the hearing. You almost had me feeling sorry for you. You should thank me, you know.

I could get into your house any time I wanted. Just think, Brian would still be alive if you had locked that window. How does that really make you feel, April, late at night alone when you cry yourself to sleep? Yes, it is a nightmare, and it won't end until you finish the job on your arm. He's a cunt. Wow. I want him dead. What a complete... Okay, now, everybody, like we gave our death penalty explanation

last week, don't you want to personally come kill this guy? I want him dead so bad. Don't you? If some guy said, give me 20 bucks and I'll cut his throat, you'd be like, all right, fine. You know you would. We all fucking would. What a complete piece of shit.

Somebody else is going to suffer at his hands in two years anyway whenever they fucking make him upset. But here's the thing is that what I'm picturing is my – Anybody. Anybody fucking gets angry at this. I swear to Christ. I'll get so mad. gets angry at this. I swear to Christ. I'll get so mad. I picture my own daughter and I just think like if a man did this to my

daughter, I'm going to find you. I will find you. I will find you and it will be very, very terrible. I mean, how much of a piece of shit can you be? I'm so mad. And this letter, she never got it because I think the prison officials intercepted this.

But then she had to fucking hear about it in court. I've pictured her reading this and the shit she'd have to go through. Other things. He had drawings hanging in his cell. Photographs of the drawings were admitted into evidence later on, obviously. The drawings, some of them, were a picture of a man who was pierced in his drawing with his face crossed out. And the phrase phrase fucking coward and quote, see you in hell, faggot written on it.

Wow. That's what he did. What the fuck? What the fuck? Another drawing had a quote, black talon bullet entering his head. And it said like black talon on it. Wow. Pierce's head.

He tried to get those uh he objected to those being admitted into evidence of course no sorry you're making drawings of the death you caused no fuck you uh so uh also too they they get two audio tape recordings uh one was him saying i was going to cut pierce's head off he said quote i got him 10 times before he could even hit the ground about shooting him and he he said, quote, I'll just kill people from here on out. There's another one. He said he was boasting on the phone about how satisfied he was that he did it. And he intends to really control the legal process, too.

He thinks he's going to control everything. He also said he also, again, tried to get those not admitted to. But that's why they record phone calls in prison. The whole. So if you admit to shit, they record phone calls in prison. That's the whole point. So if you admit to shit, they can then use that against you. What else would they use it for? That's why there's signs up and they say on the phone, this is being recorded. Yeah.

If you watch The Wire, you know that because they're constantly – never mind. Fuck it. I give up. So he writes another letter to – he writes a letter to an inmate in prison that's admitted into evidence. They had April on the stand and they asked her, does this sound like the guy you know basically? And this was a letter to another inmate where he said, quote, so don't patronize me or try to coerce, bribe or threaten to testify against me. You want to get out. I don't.

I could care less about anything else that I'm charged with. I enjoy my victim's pain and suffering. It makes my job worth it and much more. And the prosecutor said, is that more of the guy you know? And she said, yes, it is. So obviously. I mean, as much as I like the technique. It's still like, what does she know?

That's a stupid. They just wanted to read that letter in court because it sounds terrible. I play a game where I take this douchey guy on Facebook and then I take something my dad posted on Facebook and I say, is it this guy or is it my dad? And they're interchangeable. They are the same fucking person. A 36-year-old guy that is from Florida and then my dad, who's a 50-something-year-old man from Florida. I mean, as much as I like the technique because it shows a character, but people can be similar. They wanted to read that letter and have everyone see April's face while they did it.

That's what I feel like they wanted to do. This is the fear he causes. It's a cheesy technique, but whatever. The prosecutor, the district attorney, Tom Barb, said, quote, he's a guy who can't let go of anything. Everything's a game to him. His macho side keeps him from ever being able to lose. He just wants to be in control of everything that he touches. And if he's not, he's a nasty, nasty person.

Well, yeah, he'll fucking kill people here. What does he do? This is how smart he thinks he is. He wants to control the trial so much. What is so much of an ego he has on himself that he dismisses his lawyers and he tells the judge, I'm representing myself because I'm smart. I've literally never heard of that word. It's ever.

You never heard of what? It working. No, it's the stupidest fucking thing you can do in your life. These people have legal training. You know what you've been doing? Sitting in prison because you killed a guy. That's not law school. You sell cars, dickhead.

You fucking sell cars. You don't know how to write legal briefs, you dummy. You don't even write the contract for the car. No, you don't give it to the finance guy. You come back and fucking give it to me. Jesus Christ. So they do that. They're going to seek the death penalty for him.

He's allowed to represent himself. They let him do that. They go, sure, dickhead, you want to represent yourself, go ahead. On a capital trial. Best of luck. Yeah, he tries to get his confession tossed even though he signed waivers. This is the confession. The only thing he has on it is they told him

they have the recording and they have the transcript and basically he said, I don't want to talk about that. And they were like, well, can we just talk about what you did? And he was like, I don't really want to talk about it. I can talk about what I've been doing the last few days, but I'm not talking about before that. And they're like, look, man, we really need you to clear this stuff up. We really need to talk about it.

So that way we don't have to bother everybody about it. Because otherwise we have to talk to your family. We have to talk to all these people. So why don't you just clear it up now? And he said, OK, fine. I'll tell you what happened. That was the extent of it. Then he signed his paper and he fucking told them.

I object. And here he's saying they threatened me and they did all this. They literally were like, well, I mean, we're going to have to talk to your family. They say way worse shit than that. They'll tell you ever seen like the first 48. They're the things they'll fucking tell people. You'll tell you anything for that. So May 30th, 2003, there's a few hearings after all this paperwork. He might have decided maybe this is a little too much for me and I'll just plead guilty. Really? Fuck it.

Pleads guilty. Yeah. You know that's what it was too. You know that he couldn't admit that he was too dumb to write the legal brief. Or couldn't pronounce affidavit. Any of that. Fuck it. If – fuck it. I'm guilty.

But he couldn't admit that he was too dumb, so he would rather give up and say that this was a strategy of him rather than admit that he's wrong. That's the kind of psycho. So it worked out in our favor on this one, you dickhead. So during the penalty phase, they have Brian's sister, Christine, testify that she loved him. She looked to him for guidance. She describes him as a brave person and a real man. His mother, Pam, spoke tons of pride, said he never spoke hurtful words. He was loyal.

He was loving. Everybody, his stepmother was there, described him as a great kid who held Bible study class with other kids while growing up. It's ridiculous, man. I want my boy to grow up to be this kid. He was like, it's ridiculous. I want my boy to grow up. He's the nicest kid. This guy. Also, Mrs. Pierce, the stepmother, Cheryl Pierce, describes something very disturbing,

which are two telephone calls she received a few days after the murder. The first call, McConnell said his name on her answering machine. She said, this is Robert McConnell, blah, blah, blah, who was already arrested. Right. And so she hung up the phone. So he calls back a minute later and says on her answering machine, on her fucking answering machine, quote, your son died like a coward. What are you fucking doing?

She said that she was absolutely horrified. She couldn't imagine why anyone would be so cruel and mean to call someone who he doesn't even know just to cause pain. Wow. That's the kind of fucking guy this is. We don't need this fucking guy at all. I swear to Christ. Your son died like a coward. Why?

How do you even have the balls to say that to somebody's mom? That's horrible. No one would fucking do that. That's what I mean. None of this shit. We're talking about jokingly we bring up Deadwood and The Wire. These are horrible criminals. All of them on Deadwood. Everyone's slitting each other's throats. No one would do that.

Nobody would. Even Al Swearingen wouldn't do that. No, but they wouldn't have sent a telegram. Morse code over there to tell you your fucking son died like a coward. So, yeah, they have prosecution has just mountains of evidence in the penalty phase. All about his stalking, his premeditation. They have April go up. I mean, imagine you're a jury in a penalty phase.

And you got to hear about how she was raped by that man. How she was raped, kidnapped, tortured. That's all admissible, right? Oh, fuck yeah. He's charged with rape, murder, kidnapping. They gave him the whole deal. Fuck, I can't imagine. They're talking to her.

Imagine how horrifying that is. I mean, you know jurors are probably crying, as they probably should be. Also, too, what she's gone through since then. Brian being dead. the whole deal here. The defense, he calls three witnesses. Really? He's got three people. Who's he got?

Scumbags, all of them here. He calls his longtime best friend, Luis Vasquez, who is the manager of a Reno car dealership. You're bringing in a Reno used car salesman as your character witness? Get the fuck out of here. Not just a salesman. Did you say the manager? The manager.

The manager. The scumbag of the scumbags. The worst fuckface at the place. I've had a lot of liars and scumbags working for me, but this fucking guy is the biggest liar and the biggest scumbag you're going to find. I'll tell you right now. He gets scumbag in a month, this guy.

This is what he describes him as because i don't know if they were friends or whatever he said that mcconnell was one of the best car salesmen he ever had that was his testimony positive uh yeah he said that they took their family vacations with him they trusted him to babysit their children uh they said uh vasquez said he had told mcconnell before all this happened to walk away from Robinson and not stalk her anymore and all that. He described Robert as being, quote, very, very depressed and saying that at times he was crying and he thought he was suicidal at times. Also, Misty Tackman is a receptionist at the car dealership. She testified that April once cursed at her and threatened to kill her with a knife.

April's also got a little bit of a record, too, we'll talk about from before. But that's irrelevant. It doesn't matter. She never killed anybody. Right. She didn't do it. So they're trying to bring that up. That's the only reason I said that was why they would say that.

Also, Cassandra Gunther, the mother of his daughter that she forced with threats of violence to have a child at 19 years old, she testifies about that. She said that she ended the relationship because the child was born. She married another man. McConnell wanted nothing to do with her or the daughter. Would have stalked her, I'm sure, but not with the kid around. Force you to have that kid, then I don't want anything to do with it, but you fucking have it.

Yeah, you're going to have that goddamn kid. He really tried, Robert really tried to have April's police records brought into court. Like that matters. Well, yeah, she did get arrested three years ago, so I guess that means it's okay to shoot her boyfriend nine times and rape and kidnap her. That makes sense, right? What logic.

Unbelievable. Trying to discredit her, but she's on the stand sobbing about being raped and having her fiance murdered. Guess what? Jury isn't going to give a shit if she had a fucking award for an outstanding parking ticket three years ago. Don't care if she liked guest jeans so much she didn't want to pay for them. Doesn't matter.

Doesn't fucking matter here. Robert testifies on his own behalf. Of course, because he thinks he can manipulate everybody. He declined to give specific details about his childhood, but he did state that he and his mother did not get along. No shit, judging by your actions uh he said that he didn't want to make excuses for his behavior but uh because he said many people have had bad experiences growing up uh he said quote everything i'm saying now is for the benefit of the robinson and pierce family

uh he said that uh initially his relationship with april was great but after he caught her cheating things went downhill. She started spending time with Brian, and he started to get jealous and perceive Brian as a threat. And he talks about the threats that went back and forth. He said, but Pierce wouldn't fight. He wouldn't fight me, so I had to shoot him ten times after having nine months of cooling off period. He said, quote, I attempted to leave town, get away, because there was an instant where I was. I'm going to do something right now. I'm going to kill these people right now. He says this on the stand. He said, I should have gotten the counseling maybe to deal with some of these

issues, but I never did. As you know, at some point, I don't I don't want to say to snap. It wasn't instantaneous. You know, I came back with a plan to murder i did when i crossed the country i came back uh this is about revenge i'm going to get these people brian and april and and in my mind the war is on the words have been said the threats are on both sides so i am justified in whatever i do because you know they shouldn't have messed with me they shouldn't have talked shit to me he says uh and then he goes on to say and but then there was this other side you know what the hell are you doing and i would go back and forth ladies and gentlemen the defense rest holy shit yeah and he said at some point on august 7th i did all the all the things they say

you know i was just kind of aimless wandering around but all of a sudden i became focused and i and i did i just made the decision i going to do this. I'm going to retaliate against the people that ruined my life. Yes. And this is at the penalty phase. This is the penalty phase. This is please don't kill me. This is mercy on my soul here. He goes on.

There's more. There's more. His fucking statements are crazy. He says, why is it? Why do all these guys that do horrible shit to people why is it always she cheated on me yes that makes it okay she fucked another guy i can do whatever i want justified no that's not how you're talking about he says quote i can't believe that i killed a christian and now he cares about that a christian uh i can't believe how could i i can't believe i

care i killed a 49ers fan. What difference does the religion or anything else make? And to find out that I took the life of a person that goes to church and all this stuff that I find out now, it hurts me now. It hurts him. At the time, yeah, very lack of remorse. I was pissed off. I admit to making those phone calls, the drawings on the wall. That was done absolutely on purpose.

But in respect to this murder, I'm the coward. I ambushed Brian. He had no chance. Because of perceived threats or whatever, whatever I told myself for justification, I took his life. You know there's no excuse for that, and I have to answer to everybody.

And then he finally said, I'm sorry for what I did now. I really am. Well, that's terrific there, buddy. Hell of a statement at a penalty phase. Yes, and that was direct examination yeah that was the part he could control right that was the statement he wanted to give that's the information he wanted the jury to have is that right here's the thing you guys all 12 of you listen up because i'm going to give you all the all of that is supposed to sway them to fucking give a shit to go go, we should take mercy on this guy. Under cross-examination, he said that they talk about the stalking a lot under cross,

and he said, yes, he'd been watching them with binoculars for two days. He details everything that he did on the stand, the stalking, the murder, the thoughts while he was murdering them, the whole deal. He says that his actions were the result of emotional duress. Emotional duress, Jimmy. I go out and kill people and shoot them ten times and kidnap people all the time when I'm under duress. We call it Monday. Fuck, man. I gotta

stop. It's like, you know, it's a New Year's resolution. This year I'm gonna do it. He said even after he was in custody, his boasting of the murderers and taking pleasure in making the Pierce's family suffer, that was all because of emotional duress. Yeah.

He said that he's since had a change of heart, but violence is still in his nature. He does admit that. Yeah. He said that he would give him the death penalty. He did. He said, I believe in the death penalty, and I would give me the death penalty. I could sure use that right now. I am pretty much who they wrote that for.

I'm the guy. When I'm like, I'm not remorseful, fuck them, I the fed that's me very lack of remorse lack of i'm the guy they're talking about verdict shockingly jury finds all the aggravating circumstances and determines that any mitigating circumstances were way way insufficient to outweigh all of his fuckery that's official jury terminology not mine and uh returned a verdict. The jury form in etiquette 101. Yes, you must use the word fuckery. His aggravating fuckery is how they use it. That's right at the end.

Only right before they're going to give the verdict. They're allowed to do that. They return a verdict of death. Oh, boy. So they want to kill this son of a bitch. Yeah. Now, as if you thought he hasn't let his feelings out enough, he gives a huge interview in June of 2005.

Really? He is scheduled to die pretty soon after that. And he says that he is not going to challenge it. Yeah. He's going to. No appeals. Let's do this. He says now after this, this is after court, he said he feels bad.

Now he doesn't feel bad anymore. He says if given the opportunity, he would have finished the task. He said April wouldn't have been spared. He said, quote, I wouldn't play around and have feelings like I did the last time. He said I wouldn't let her get away. She would be tortured and killed and her dad. And her dad now, too. I'll go get him, too, goddammit.

What the fuck? I don't know where he got into the whole thing here, but he's a real, he's just a real asshole. He says he loves the internet. He says it's the best invention ever. He likes to, he's a fucking sociopath lunatic. Yeah. He's just a real asshole. He says he loves the internet. He says it's the best invention ever. He's a fucking sociopath lunatic. He talks about the execution like no problem. Talks in the interview about looking into Brian's eyes when he was shooting him and wishing that he had killed April more.

He says that it was April's fault that Brian was killed. It's all her. He said, quote, she played both sides against the middle. The truth is, this guy got taken by her, too. He was a cool guy. I will always maintain the apology I gave to Pierce's mother. I'm sorry I took your son. I don't think he deserved that.

The honest truth is, if I could take it back, I would kill her. Yes, I should have killed her and left him alone. Not if I could take it back, I wouldn't kill anyone. If I could take it back, I'd trade him for her. I really want her dead still. That's not going to change. But him, he was all right. If she could die, that would be great.

Oh, my God. He says it's all stacked up to the point where he had to fight back. And he said, you know, I'm not going to go for a nickel and dime. I'm going to kill these people and get rid of the witnesses. What the fuck am I thinking? He said he wanted to kill her that day. He said, I allowed my personal feelings from the past to come into play with Brian. It was this is his quote with Brian. It was business.

As bad as that sounds at the time, everything went according to plan. I looked in his eyes. I checked his pulse pulse. I stabbed him after it was brutal. It was heinous with her. It was like, I hate this person. I hate this person. But 30 minutes into it, it's weird.

I was like, I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this. So very fucking strange. Because you fucked her. Well, yeah. That's why he had to depersonalize her to rape her and all that. Yeah, he's a weird thing he's got there. And now he's got sex going on, and now he cares about her again, doesn't want to kill her. And then he said at the end, he was like, I guess I'm going to prison because I'm leaving a living witness.

I'm not going to be able to kill her. Now he says he opposes capital punishment, too. Yeah. He says now he calls it state sanctioned murder. But he said, I gave my word and I'm going to go ahead with this execution and I plan to follow through. That's it. He says, no matter what I do, I'm going to upset people on either side. Right. He says, you know, he says, if I don't go through with it, I'll upset his if i do my mother loses a son but at the same time that's what i've said from the beginning so i don't know what to do here that's the car salesman and i told him i'd give him it for this price i told him and then he said he's gonna lose two grand but look i promised he said he needed the tents on there he said we're not gonna do it after market we'll give you a 200 credit for the place

down the street but we're not just gonna put it on so he's going to be an aftermarket. We'll give you a $200 credit for the place down the street, but we're not just going to put it on. So he's going to be executed here. June 9, 2005 is execution day. He says this four days before execution. Robert's mother says that she doesn't want to make excuses, but how can she forget the past? He's always going to be my son. Now two mothers lose their sons. That's great, but you didn't really have him to begin with, so we don't really care here.

Right. There's great, but you didn't really have them to begin with, so we don't really care here. Right. There's the answer. Yeah, two mothers are going to lose sons, but you lost yours a long time ago, let's be honest. Yeah, that's exactly what it is. He says that he's against the death penalty. He was brought up Catholic, so he's opposed to it. But I said he gave his word. He's going to go through with it. He said, quote, my attorney said it best. She said, I understand life in prison is going to be tough. But I told her I don't want to be buried in a room for the rest of my life. He says that the most basic instinct is self-preservation. But regardless of how bad it is, you have to understand that you put yourself there.

And there's a certain amount of punishment that you have to accept. That's terrific. Yeah. Yeah. McConnell fucking. That's the one. That's the one begotten son let's go fucking fire it up he says I'm feeling pressure on all sides to follow through but I'm also receiving pressure from other people to not do it and to not take another life uh so execution

day June 9th 2005 set to die at 9 p.m my goodness 9 p.m it's a nice hour it's a nice hour they don't do midnight because they know this isn't Nevada. Everyone's got shit to do later on. Brothels. The brothels will be empty if they do the executions at midnight. You do them early. Everyone can get to the brothel later. He has a Catholic priest administer last rites.

He eats his last meal, Jimmy. His last meal is pepperoni pizza. That's it? That's the meal. Pepperoni pizza. What is it, seven? What the fuck is this this i just want pepperoni pepperoni pizza i hope it was cafeteria pizza we're like the just chips of pepperoni not the

circle ones you know what i mean i hope they gave him like shit papa john's or something with that awful sweet sauce little caesars yeah you got fucking little caesars you know the best one is that hungry howie's that's the best pizza of all time it's so good so families are in place media witnesses are present. I hope it didn't get hungry hours. I hope it's garbage. I want it to be a tombstone. Just something frozen.

It's like Western Nevada, too. I can't imagine it's going to be great pizza. I hope they cooked it on a rock. Like Cousin Eddie. 40 minutes left before his execution. And? He says, you know what? Maybe I will seek that stay of execution.

Are you shitting me maybe i changed my mind what a chicken pepperoni pizza is getting good motherfucker uh at 8 26 he decided that he was going to do it the stay is accepted by a judge over the phone and uh everybody files out and they're like shit i guess we're not doing this right now bastard uh yeah they're the the uh corrections department director said that the pier Pierce family was silent when given the news. They were like, good, he's going to die in a half hour, and they were just sitting there. And nope, his family was there to witness it. They drove all this way for what?

For what now? Not happening. He then gets a public defender to help him with the stay thing, Michael Paschetta. He's returned to death row again because he's going to go wait for it now. They go through the whole legal mumbo jumbo. He signed the documents to do the deal. They say basically it's within his rights. He can do whatever

he wants. He has a lot of appeals left. He has stays. He has all the shit that he can do later on. Post-conviction relief, even after all of that. He had hinted, he had said that he wouldn't go through with it if he didn't get a hug from his mother. Yeah. Because he wasn't allowed contact visits before that.

But then a judge actually allowed his mother and stepfather to have a contact visit with him. And he got to hug his mother goodbye and all that. And he still wouldn't. And he still wouldn't do it. What a pussy. Last time this happened was in 1990. It was a guy named Jim Neuschafer, and he was scheduled to be executed in December 1990, and he backed out six hours beforehand.

He didn't even get his last meal. This guy fucking was like last minute. This sucker, yeah. 40 minutes, and he couldn't do it. Couldn't do it. Neuschafer died of natural causes in prison in 1998. Wow. So he beat the execution.

They asked him why he appealed. Like, what the fuck is the deal here? He gave a quick 15-minute interview. He said that it's state-sanctioned murder, and it doesn't think it makes what he did any more right or any more wrong or any more right. He says nobody has the right to take a life. Well, Jesus, you killed. You did. You did.

Didn't seem to mind that. He said his – Jesus Christ. You did, and then you drew pictures and made phone calls. What if the governor calls your mom and says your son died like a coward? What about that? Yeah, no, it's completely ridiculous. What an idiot. The state says that they think he's manipulating the process.

In his appeal here, he questions the constitutionality of Nevada's use of the lethal injection, which does every, that's a standard. Right. He also, he objects to the admission of character evidence against him during the penalty phase. Like what? Are you out of your fucking mind? He says that the court improperly admitted several pieces of, quote, bad act evidence against him in the penalty hearing. He called the evidence irrelevant, inflammatory, and more prejudicial than probative.

No. How about no? It told a pretty good goddamn story, sir. Yeah. They said no. He also said that the other evidence that they gave, the drawings and all that stuff, that he was objecting to them not keeping that stuff out. Right.

And they were like, yeah, no, that's all as relevant as possible. Sure. And you did it in prison, which, as you know, is a public place, basically. You have no expectation of privacy in prison. Zero. Zero. With anything you have. And they also said that the drawings and recordings

and letter all concerned McConnell's attitude toward his victims, which is kind of the lack of remorse and the cruel and violence, the cruelty and all that sort of thing. That's how people decide whether this person should be still here or not, I guess. And you literally said on the stand

in the penalty phase, zero lack of remorse. And I wish I would have killed her. My only remorse is that more people didn't die. I really wish she would have died. Instead of just being brutally raped and kidnapped. And I could kill her dad too. I got a hankering to kill her fucking dad

if I'm being honest here. I would like two things, pepperoni pizza and to kill her fucking dad. Those two things. Those are the things I'm in the mood for. He also claims prosecutorial misconduct. He says that he was denied a fair penalty hearing because the state made several improper remarks to the jury that exacerbated the prejudicial nature of the evidence against him. Like what?

They just said, the appeals court said, we find no merit in this claim. Ridiculous. They say that's because he moved to, this is, he's talking about the drawings and phone calls. This is all wrapped up into them. And he said that it was overly prejudicial and was just going to, quote, piss off the jury. And what they basically said is if it pisses off the jury, that's kind of what it's there for. It's a penalty hearing. One side is trying to say how horrible you are. That's kind of what it's there for. It's a penalty hearing. One side is trying to say

how horrible you are. That's their job. That'd be like the other side going, they're saying he's a nice guy. That's not fair. No, that's their job is to say he's fine, not to get up. Instead, they put him on the stand and he goes, I should have killed her. The raping's fine, but I should have killed her too. That's the thing. You know, there's a lack of remorse I got and stuff. Oh my God, man. Yeah, the proper scope, he also argues, the proper scope of the testimony of the sexual assault victim and victim impacts testimony regarding special occasions. He tried to say that April shouldn't have testified about the sexual assault. He tried to say her testimony was inflammatory.

Okay. Well, you know what? She's your victim. So, yeah. That's the charge. When you leave a living victim, they're going to be inflammatory toward you. That's the point. That's why they're there. They said, regardless, in the state's pretrial presentations, Robert did not object to the testimony

and therefore waived his issue on appellate review. He didn't even object to her testifying about any of this beforehand. Basing an aggravating circumstance on the predicate felony in a capital prosecution on a felony murder. This is confusing as fuck and we're not going to do it. I'm just not going to do it. I could this literally we could talk for 25 minutes about a law they made in 2004 that the the predicate felony for the capital thing. You can't prosecute it. You can't prosecute from A to B. You have to prosecute from B to B to A.

It's fucking it's so it would take forever to explain. If you're a law student you know exactly what I'm talking about. And I read it enough to know I know what I'm talking about. But if I tried to explain it my head would melt and you guys would be so fucking bored it wouldn't matter so let's move on here so he is just fighting and fighting all of this uh he fights the sufficiency of evidence of mutilation he says they didn't really say mutilates a strong term is what he says he says mutilate means to cut off or permanently destroy a limb or essential part of the body or to cut off or alter radically so it makes it imperfect. The fucked up part is this is the third time we've had that definition.

We have to define mutilate. Somebody read that. How many other podcasts define mutilate on a weekly basis? We define mutilate on a weekly basis. Small town murder. So they found, yeah, they have to. There must be mutilation of the victim beyond the act of killing. And he says they weren't.

And they said, well, you kind of dug around in his body with a knife. Right. That went beyond the act of killing. Superficial doesn't make it not mutilation, by the way. I don't care what a pathologist says about what a wound is, the classification of it. It's still a fucking wound that was inflicted post-mortem. You're mutilating a fucking body.

Absolutely. And desecration is also in there. That's a tough one. Desecration is also apparent. They call it his callous, disrespectful treatment of the body. So yeah, they said that we conclude the evidence was sufficient to find that as an aggravating circumstance. So everything is rejected there for those appeals.

July 26th, 2009, state Supreme Court rejects his appeals, too. Yeah, he goes in front of that. He's trying to fight the three-drug system, as we know, of lethal injection, among other things here. They basically told him to fucking pound sand. No thank you. Rejected that. That's the state court, state Supreme

Court, January 7th, 2010. His execution date is set for February 1st, 2010. January of 2010, later in the month, he files for habeas relief in federal court. He will be representing himself also to get this stay for the appeal. To get these stays, I don't know how, I think you could just get them. I'm not sure here. It sounds like it's a postcard that's already ready. You just fill out your name. Yeah, that's what you are in there. January 18th, 2010. He's granted granted the stay. It's ordered that he has one month to file appropriate petitions as well as have a legal council council appointed to assist him in that task because you don't know how to do paperwork.

And this is all fucking paperwork. 2012, another federal stay. So, I mean, these fucking stays, man. Another federal stay. He's still going. He is still alive. He's still sitting in Nevada. He has stay after stay. Habeas relief. He's still sitting there. Right now. Right now. And now also

as we know, the lethal injection drugs, it's not easy to execute someone with lethal injection because we don't have the fucking drugs. So guess what, motherfuckers? You're out of luck. Figure out another way or figure out another system or whatever. This is a guy where however you want to do it, I don't care if it's state sanctioned. Just do it.

Just turn around for a minute and let Ryan's brothers rip this guy out of his fucking chair and maul him to death. I don't give a shit. This guy's a complete piece of shit. Imagine if you let him out on the street. Not that that's ever on the table. It's life. But imagine anything. Even in jail, this guy would be a complete—

Your daughters aren't safe. No. Even in jail, he would be a complete piece of shit that would be stirring the pot and doing things and fucking with people. He's just a complete asshole, this guy. He's the guy—this is like if there's a desert island where we just drop assholes off on. That'd be great. Asshole island. This guy would be president of asshole island.

Wouldn't it be nice to just drop him in, like, the lion exhibit at the zoo? That'd be fantastic. Let's make it entertaining. That's what I mean. I have ideas. Wouldn't it be great? Guys, I have ideas. I have a truck idea.

I had a flagpole thing a while back. I have a lot of ideas that we could work on. I'm not saying it has to be- I mean, save money on fucking feeding these animals. Yeah. There's so much. No, no. It doesn't have to be state sanctioned because we said we're not a-

But this guy's an asshole. For sure. And if you don't want to personally strangle him, I don't know what's wrong with you because this guy's a dick and I hate him. So if you enjoyed that story- Wow. I don't know what the fuck is wrong with you but uh thank you for being so disturbed just like us and uh you you could do to to uh tell us about that as

you can get on itunes you can give us five stars helps us tremendously on the business end i'm telling you guys right now yeah uh also uh patreon.com uh slash crime and sports that's the one please guys uh that you guys have been amazing on there. We have a great list of all of our producers here. Every dime is so, so appreciated. You guys have helped us out so much. You've gotten us through this entire year. Without you guys, this podcast is...

It couldn't happen. It's available now. Because I dove in and when we decided to make a second podcast here, there's no outside. I didn't have time to do any more outside shit. No. This is it. This was my.

This is James's life. This is all I have. Yeah. I mean, there's stand-up comedy, too. But as an opener stand-up comic, that's not money. There's no money there. You're going to make $1,400 a year doing that. What that does is takes James away from this podcast.

That's all it does. And that's the thing, too, is I've turned down gigs because I'm like, no, you know what? I've got research to do. And I'm not going to fucking go do that for whatever. So that's the thing, too, is I've turned down gigs because I'm like, no, you know what? I got a research to do and I'm not going to fucking go do that for whatever. So that's where we're at. You guys have made it so we can concentrate on this goddamn podcast. I can put every hour I have into it and we can make it as good as possible. And come into the city near you.

Oh, we're coming towards you. We're coming towards you. And that is why, you know, that's why we can do this. It's all you guys. So thank you. And that's why we want to thank you guys. Each and every one of you. From the bottom of our hearts.

Patreon.com slash Crime and Sports is where you can go. Or you can go over to PayPal. You can make a one-time donation, which we're blown away by those. It's bananas. We're so appreciative of those. We can't even tell you. You can do that using our email address, CrimeandSports at gmail.com. That's right.

Crime and Sports is our other podcast that I don't know why you're not listening to. If you're not. Also, if you want to get a hold of us, you can do that on Twitter at Murdermail.com. That's right. Crime and Sports is our other podcast that I don't know why you're not listening to if you're not. Also, if you want to get a hold of us, you can do that on Twitter at Murder Small. Facebook, you can do that Small Town Pod.

And we have a list of some of the most fantastic, not some of, the most goddamn fantastic people in the world. Jimmy, hit us with that list.

It's glorious. This week, it was real. So first, let me correct that Susan Oldis is not a truck driver, you guys. Oh, good. I'm a piece of shit. list it's glorious this week we it was it was real so first let me let me correct that susan old just uh is not a truck driver you guys i'm a piece of shit and i forgot i knew piece of shit she was an emt and i completely forgot the one that does the did the yoohoo fudgical thing so

uh and i wanted to correct that she she uh pointed it out to me by the way i'm not a trucker and i was like i know that because i've seen that i that because I've seen that you're an EMT. And so that's the point. She's a fucking EMT. She's not a trucker. She's saving lives out there. She's terrific. Jess Landgren, Chrissy Ann Costaldi, I've decided are now executive producers.

So thank you both very, very much for consistently helping us get through this and being fucking lights. You're both amazing. Thank you. Yes. Elizabeth Margaret Reese. That's it. She sent TyBot, which is fucking incredible.

Yes. To see TyBot being exchanged over the internet to get us American currency. That's amazing. Thank you. We love getting so much, Liz. Currency from other countries. That's cool. It's fucking incredible.

The fact that you would send us a dime of any currency, we're blown away. So thank you. Ashley Cunningham sent an e-check, which was really cool to see. We're getting all kinds of support. And to see an e-check with a little note that told us to have a Merry Christmas or something, it was so sweet. So thank you, Ashley. I appreciate it.

Andrew Wigand. Sarah Gilbo. It's Gilbo. It's got to be. It may be Gilbo. Either way, she sent two donations just of cash. That's amazing. And she's just fantastic. So thank you so much. Thank you so much, Sarah.

You're fantastic. And then I think she may have gotten on to... No, never mind. It's fine. Whatever. Sarah Guilbeau sent two donations. Thank you, Sarah. Mary Fouse, Margie Kunze, by the way. I meant to correct her

pronunciation a couple weeks ago. She's very supportive of us. Thank you. We love you. Thank you, Margie. Hannah Et by the way, I meant to correct her pronunciation a couple weeks ago. She's cool. She's very supportive of us. Thank you. She's amazing. Thank you, Margie. Thank you, Margie. Hannah Ettinger over in the UK sent a couple of donations.

Thank you. Thank you so much, Hannah. We really appreciate it. For real. Also, too, thank you for the ticket donation. She bought tickets because she was going to come from London, but her health won't allow her to come, so she donated them to another listener, which is so cool. Someone who couldn't afford to get there.

No doubt. We appreciate that. Thank you. Richard Paul, Megan Hodge,. Someone who couldn't afford to get there. So we appreciate that. Thank you. Richard Paul, Megan Hodge, Deidre Kohler had a snafu. She sent money on PayPal to somebody on accident and then got it revoked and then sent to us. She sent it to the wrong location. So some poor guy got money. I was like, cool.

Shit. Shit. Damn it. Son of a bitch. Never mind. Thought I had cash. Ross Olson, Molly Parker, Danny, holy son of a what? That's quite the last name.

Holy son of a what? That's even easier than Wierzynski. No, Wierzynski? Wierzynski. Let me say that. That's it. What is it? Let me look.

I'm trying to get my- Danny Wierzynski is right in the middle so long with the W. I bet it's just Wierzynski. You think it's just Wierzynski? Usually when it looks like all of that, it's just whatever is the basic sound and Zynski. So you want to get rid of that Y? It's Wierzynski. You know what, dude?

You're not getting your Y. Cut that shit out. You're Wierzynski from now on. Wierzynski. That sounds too close to Wazowski from fucking Monsters, Inc. Is it Wazowski or Wabowski? I don't even know. There was a

three-year-old in that movie, Ruin Everything. That kid fucked everything up. God damn it. Sherry Howard or Holland? What? Sherry Holland. Nathan Lossner. Shut your mouth. Kasten Johnson sent some more money. Thank you, Kacen.

Thank you, Kacen. James Cook. Carla Kamstieg. Crystal Colibo. Rachel Taylor. Sarah Lindsay Pet... Oh, Sarah Lindsay Pet Care. Find them.

Google Sarah Lindsay Pet Care. Yes. And if she's near you, have her take care of your pet. She'll cook that pet up. She'll wash it, I'm sure. Mariah Minhear. She's over... She's terrific. Yeah. I think she's I'm sure. Mariah Min here, she's terrific. I think she's the Dutch one.

I think that's what she is. She was the one that corrected my stupidity when I said, what did I say, Llewellyn. And it for sure was not Llewellyn. She had a better Dutch pronunciation. Tatiana White or Tata Janna. I think it's Tatiana, right? The J makes a wise up. We'll go with that, yeah.

Dana Grayson said, Hey, thanks, Dana. And Dick is going through some shit, man. He's got some family stuff going on, and I'm really pulling for his family. Thanks for listening, Dana. Good luck, Dana. Thanks for your support,

and I hope your family comes through it. Hope we can help get you through. Yeah. With dick jokes and whatever. Make fun of assholes. We got those. Either way. Thanks, Dana.

Vincent Peluso, Rachel Edwards, Kajsa, K-A-J-S-A, Kaj Vincent Peluso. Rachel Edwards. Kajsa. K-A-J-S-A. Kajsa. Yes. Kajsa Logan Mueller.

Or Mueller? Mueller. The first name fucks me every time. Christopher Carr sent some money. Thank you, Christopher. Graham Stevenson. I think it's Graham. G-R-A-E-M-E.

That's Graham, man. That's Graham. Or it's Graham. Grandma. It could be Grandma. You don't know. You don't know Graham. Yes, Grandma is in that thing. He calls it by Grandma. Right. Stephen Mace. My sister

Melissa Rachu sent some dough, so thanks, Mel. Yeah, thanks, Melissa. It's actually Rake you. I always say Rachu. Yeah, she actually put the pronunciation of your sister put the pronunciation of her name on a Facebook post saying, don't mispronounce my name. Don't mispronounce your sister's name.

How to fucking say your own sister's name. That's my sister. That sounds right. Nicholas Alexander. Katie Heisel, who makes all the maps for Small Town River. Oh, yeah. Thank you, Katie. Oh, we love the map.

Thank you, Katie. Those maps are cool as shit. I look at those where I'm like, what state am I doing? I'll pop the map up and be like, yeah, I need over here. That helps me. Thank you. So you're doing the Lord's work, Katie. Yes.

Thank you. You're helping me. Aaliyah Steinem or Steinman. Steinman. Taraboosey Creek, which that doesn't. That's like a wine. Yeah, it does. It does.

It does sound like a wine. They're all red, too. Come to Taraboosey Creek. They don't even make a white one. There's no white ones. Taraboosey Creek. All red. And there's a couple with a picnic, you know, blanket laid out, sipping glasses of wine

next to like a slowly moving, babbling brook. Barely trickling over the rocks. Kim Blevins sent two donations and then logged into Patreon and donated through Patreon. Jesus, thank you. Kim, you're amazing. That's incredible. God, thank you. This one is going to fuck me.

I know it. The name. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know this one's going to fuck me good. Teresa Schuchinflug? What? That doesn't make any sense. That's a, what?

How do you do that? Schuchinflug. What is that? Is that Swedish? She sent so many donations. Thank you. I know. I've seen the name too.

There was like 11 of them. I know. That's so nice and I feel bad we're destroying her name. I know. I'm trying. And I'm. There was like 11 of them. I know. They came across. That's so nice, and I feel bad we're destroying her name. I know. I'm trying. And I'm trying to process it, and it doesn't make sense. So there's a P in there somewhere. Shit.

I hope it's silent. I don't know. I look at it and go, no. That doesn't. No. Fuck. It's Dutch or something, probably. Well, tweet us your pronunciation, and we will not fuck it up next time.

Or we will, but we'll try to get it right. Ainsley Duncan. Christopher Brown. Christine Leischel. Dahlia K. Daver, Mahmoud Rahman. Rahmoud? Mahmoud Abdul Arouf. Yes, Mahmoud Rahman. Thank you, Mahmoud.

I appreciate you, brother. Yes, thank you, man, really. David Smart, Nanu. I saw these two names together, between Mahmoud and Nanu, and I was like, I'm going to crush those and look like the biggest fucking smarty pants ever. And then I'm going to, no. Nope. Sempio. Nanu Sempio.

That's it. Sylve and Brian Von Deck. I love names that start with Von. They're always cool. Katie Earl Mahoney. Right. No doubt. Thank you, Katie.

Katie Earl Mahoney. Mark Jackson, who I hope is the coach of the Knicks. He's not anymore. Is it the Clippers now? I don't know where he's at now. He was amazing. I love that the coach of the Knicks. He's not anymore. Is it Clippers now? I don't know where he's at now. He was amazing. I love that guy. Iosif DeReebus.

That's it. Iosif DeReebus. It's an I or a lowercase L. It's either Iosif or Iosif. I'm going with Iosif. Abigail Milner-Sweetster. Don. No last name, but thank you, Don.

Thanks, Don. Chris Coles. Lisa Warren. Megan, no last name, Megan. Stephanie Edlin-Bollinger, Kathleen Thill or Till? I think it's Thill, right? That's T-H. I'm not sure. Brandy Ferry, Autumn Long, and then Autumn Lord, which was they were right next to each other. Wow.

One right after the other, which was bizarre. The whole phone book is coming at us. I hope so. right after the other, which was bizarre. The whole phone book is coming at us. I hope so. Alondra Call and Jason Malz, Tracy Stratford, Kyle Lecher, Marcus Rippentrop, or Trope, Rippentrope.

That sounds better. Jesper Vernerson, which sounds like a mayor. That's fucking great. Jesper Vernerson here. He does. For fucking- Running for Senate of a small- Running for Congress in a small district in Mississippi. Jesper Vernerson.

We're going to get, sounds terrible. I'm just going to ruin it and make it awfully racist. I don't like the blacks. Jesper Vernerson, I'm going to get you a clean water fountain. That means no blacks. Or foreigners. How's that? Or, or.

Jesper Vernerson for whites only. I'll go one step further because my opponent says he's going to do the same thing. Not only black, people from the north also not allowed to drink there. Jesper Farnerson, locals only. Sorry, if you're born above North Carolina, I'm sorry, I cannot count it. Sorry, Jesper. You're probably fucking amazing because you're on board. He's a nice person, obviously. Lindsay Fabella, Laura Crosby, Cat O'Neill, Elizabeth McAllister, Heidi Lake, Laika Riddle, Mike Kennedy, William Hickson III, by the way, Chris Dreger, Meat Pie Pochek, Rachel Timmons, Dirk Haley, Caitlin Carmichael, Josh Doon, Lisa Mim, M-I-H-M.

Mim? I guess, yeah. It's like Chris Mim. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're right. You're right. Center for North Carolina. Melissa Pomeroy, Lexi Skelton, Dina McGuire, Maddie Johnson, Emily Hua.

Hua. H-U-A. That's the sound you make when you're a kid and you're fighting. Hua. That's what Al Pacino makes all the time. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He does, too. Robin Bevan.

Is that a V? Damn it. I think it's Bevan. If it's not, tweet me and call me an asshole. Jacqueline Conte. Just tweet him and call him an asshole anyway. Do it anyway. Jacqueline Conte.

I like that name because that was my third grade teacher's name. And I pray to Christ it's her. It's probably not. You knew your third grade teacher's first name? I know. Isn't that bizarre? And I remembered it when I was 36 years old when I read that name. I didn't know a teacher's first name until like high school.

I was like, oh, yeah, first name. Oh, my God. Your name's Ellen? That's so weird. Yeah. I knew one of my friends, one of my little league coaches was a friend of yours mom. Yeah. She was a teacher.

And I was like, oh, my God. How did I fucking finish your story? I don't know. I was like, friend of mine's dad, mom? What are we talking about here? I got lost in this. Jesus. So Jacqueline Conte, thank you.

Amanda Windsor, Alison Keller, Vicky Frederick, and Callie French. You guys, this week was fucking bananas between the... I've been able to keep up with Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, all of that stuff every week for the past 40 weeks. It's getting out of hand now. And this week kicked my ass. In a great way. Yeah. And I love every second of it.

So thank you guys so much. And where can they follow a guy like you if they want to get a hold of you? Oh, you can find me and tell me how much I just butchered your fucking name and that I appreciate you but not spelling or English. At WismanSucks, W-H-I-S-M-A-N sucks. Twitter, Instagram, and Snapchat. I appreciate you guys being here. It's been truly fucking amazing. And I am at JimmyPIsFunny.

And please follow me. Do all that. You can hit me up. Like yesterday, I was just explaining to Jimmy, like, I've been doing nothing but researching for, like, two days, so you get me, like, I have had no time in the last two days, so now

I'm like, oh my god, I have two days of this built up, and I gotta say, and I love the interaction, thank you, but please don't feel like I'm not getting back to you because I don't care if it takes me a couple of days to like it or to respond to it or whatever, because I'm just fucking buried in murder. So it's for your benefit, I promise you.

And ours. But for yours, too. You can get a hold of me at Jimmy P is funny or try to spell my last name. Good luck. Or just copy and paste it from the show description. Like a smart person. There you go. And take a peek in that show description and find the links for our show tickets.

And come see us in either Boston, Chicago, or Detroit pretty soon. And there's going to be one in Phoenix coming up and then other places around the country. We're negotiating and finding places as we speak. You got it. We are going to be everywhere, all these places. Can you come here? Can you come here? Yes, we can.

If it's a place of decent population that has enough of our listeners, then we'll be there. Then we will be there. Those are very specific. But we're looking at you, Seattle. We're looking at you, Portland. We're looking at you, Atlanta. We're looking right at you.

God damn it. We're staring you right in your filthy, piss-smelling streets. We see you, Philly. D.C., Baltimore. Probably can't do both, but we'll do one and you guys can come for the other. It's closer for you to come there than it is for us to go there. Somewhere in Florida, I'm sure, Dallas, we're looking at you. So we're going to be there.

But never mind all of that because we will be here each and every week. And until next week, guys, it's been our pleasure. Bye. Hey, Prime members, you can listen to Small Town Murder early and ad-free on Amazon Music. Download the Amazon Music app today. Or you can listen early and ad free with Wondery Plus and Apple Podcasts. Before you go, tell us about yourself by completing a short survey at wondery.com slash survey. I understand that anybody who's paid attention to the media would have to come to the conclusion that I killed my wife. Hi, my name is Zach Stewart-Pontier. I'm one of the filmmakers behind The Jinx,

and I'm excited to bring you The Official Jinx Podcast. We'll be revisiting all six episodes of Part 1 and watching along with Part 2 as it airs on Max, starting April 21st. Bye-bye. The Official Jinx Podcast. Listen on Max or wherever you get your podcasts.