THE ADAM BUXTON PODCAST - EP.186 - BELLE AND SEBASTIAN

Episode Date: August 17, 2022

Adam talks with Scottish musician and director Stuart Murdoch of Belle and Sebastian and plays two tracks from their new album 'A Bit Of Previous', specially recorded by the whole band for the podcast.This episode was recorded remotely on 1st of April, 2022Thanks to Séamus Murphy-Mitchell for production support.Podcast artwork by Helen GreenRELATED LINKSBELLE AND SEBASTIAN WEBSITE2022 UK AND IRELAND TOUR DATES (TICKETMASTER)BELLE AND SEBASTIAN - IF THEY'RE SHOOTING AT YOU (in support of those affected by the war in Ukraine) - 2022 (YOUTUBE)BELLE AND SEBASTIAN - LAZY LINE PAINTER JANE - 1997 (YOUTUBE)IF YOU'RE FEELING SINISTER (BELLE AND SEBASTIAN PITCHFORK DOCUMENTARY) - 2013 (YOUTUBE)BELLE AND SEBASTIAN - UNNECESSARY DRAMA (OFFICIAL VIDEO) - 2022 (YOUTUBE)STUART MURDOCH'S FAVOURITE ALBUMS by Adrian Lobb - 2013 (THE QUIETUS)THE VELVET UNDERGROUND (Trailer for documentary directed by Todd Haynes) - 2022 (YOUTUBE)MEASLES MUMPS RUBELLA (BAND) - 2001 (FREE MUSIC ARCHIVE) Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

I added one more podcast to the giant podcast bin Now you have plucked that podcast out and started listening I took my microphone and found some human folk Then I recorded all the noises while we spoke My name is Adam Buxton, I'm a man I want you to enjoy this, that's the plan. Hey, how you doing, podcats? It's Adam Buxton here.

It's great to see you, with my mind. Thanks so much for joining me. Thanks so much for joining me. Here we are, walking along a dusty farm track in the east of England as the word, sky-wise. You know, it's sunset, there's some crazy clouds in the sky because we are coming to, well, the end for the time being, at least, of a heat wave here in the UK that has scorched the earth. With any luck we're going to get some rain. Storms are forecast. Certainly the skies around here are looking pregnant with water rage but so far no actual moisture. Anyway that's the weather situation. You're welcome. How are you doing i hope your summer is proceeding as well as can be expected i'm doing fine thank you and so is my good dog friend rosie she's up ahead sniffing but hey look

let me tell you a little bit about my guest for podcast number 186 the the Scottish musician, director, and one of the founding members of much-loved indie pop stalwarts, Belle and Sebastian, Stuart Murdoch. I know the episode is entitled Belle and Sebastian, but it's just Stuart that I'm talking to today. Here's some very brief Belle and Sebastian facts for for you the first stripped down incarnation of bell and sebastian formed in glasgow in 1995 an expanded lineup came together to record the band's first lp tiger milk in 1996 that was the first time they all played together, that original lineup. And as far as that LP is concerned, there was a tunefulness and a sensitivity to the music and the lyrics on Tiger Milk that was, for some, a refreshing change from the laddishness

of the so-called Britpop bands who had dominated the indie scene in the UK for the previous few years. And though just a thousand copies of Tiger Milk were pressed on vinyl, word of mouth and pirate copies quickly spread, and by the end of 1996, Bell and Sebastian had sided with the Jeepster label and recorded a second LP, If You're Feeling Sinister. Another absolute peach. There have been one or two lineup changes since then, but they have kept making records, and their new album, a bit of previous, released in May this year, 2022, is their 11th.

The band worked on the production of the record themselves with help from producer and engineer Brian McNeill. And the NME's Gary Ryan says, all of the well-worn Bell and Sebastian hallmarks are present, but what's truly impressive is how effortless it all sounds this time around. In addition to making music with Belle and Sebastian, Stuart Murdoch wrote and directed a musical feature film, released in 2014, called God Help the Girl, starring Olly Alexander of It's a Sin, Celebrity Gogglebox and the band Years and Years. You know the guy.

and the band, Years and Years. You know the guy. My conversation with Stuart was recorded remotely back in April of this year, 2022, before the release of a bit of previous. And as you will hear, Stuart, along with the other members of the band, Sarah Martin, Mick Cook, Richard Colburn, Bobby Kildare, Chris Geddes and Stevie Jackson. Hope I'm pronouncing those names correctly. Apologies if I didn't. Recorded versions of a couple of songs from the new album, specially for the podcast, and you will hear them shortly, as well as some great hot waffle between myself and Stuart about some of the music that influenced Stuart over the years,

with particular emphasis on the Velvet Underground, or at least the Todd Haynes documentary. That led us on to the subject of encounters with Lou Reed, record producers in general and what they do, and the effect that living with the condition M.E. has had on the way Stuart writes songs. We also spoke about songwriting in general, and Stuart was kind enough to give me a few tips. However, our conversation began with me commenting on Stuart's excellent look,

which you can see a screen grab of on my website, if you're interested. There's a link in the description. I'll be back at the end but right now with stewart murdoch featuring music from bell and sebastian here we go Concentrate on that. Come on, let's chew the fat. And have a ramble chat. Put on your conversation coat and find your talking hat. La, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la, la you're looking like a um a sort of groovy cartoon character i wish i was my kids would like me more. How old are your children? Five, Nico, and eight, Denny. Oh, man. Hey, that's fun. That's a good age.

They say it's fun. I can think of another word beginning with F. There is fun in there. I mean, when I think of the early early years i don't remember those fondly but by the time they were around five i think i was adjusting to fatherhood a bit more and i could enjoy it you've got girls though i've got a girl she came along last to shine light around and show us the deal yeah yeah i never thought i'd have boys did you not no i always thought i was at three girls like the president in the west wing and they would just grow up and and look after me so when you were imagining yourself as a father if you ever

did such a thing you were thinking of sensitive conversations with young women i think i just thought that they could go off and do something with the mum right okay and leave me in the greenhouse to be grumpy and then you know just come didn't work out like that. Yeah, two boys. It is an absolutely knackering thing to be a parent, especially in the early years. And you have always talked about the fact that you've suffered from chronic fatigue syndrome or ME. And that is presumably an ongoing process of managing your life in all sorts of careful ways. When did the ME take hold and how did it come on? That was kind of late 80s and it came on gradually.

It took me about a year and a half to get to my worst. I was just giving up one thing after the other. worst i was just giving up one thing after the other and then i sort of bottomed out and then i had a nice six or seven years of uh wilderness before the you know before i got the band together six or seven years of wilderness i know yeah what does that look like i mean we're talking about chronic fatigue syndrome myalgic encephalomyelitis, also known as ME, a condition that causes extreme tiredness and a range of other symptoms. So as far as you were aware when it began, when you were in your late teens, what did you think was happening? I didn't really know. I thought I was having a poetic fall like Holden Caulfield in Catching the Rye.

I was reading that book a lot and I thought, wow, what's happening to Holden is happening to me. But it was less fun. It lasted longer. It wasn't just a quick trip to the mental ward. It was, you know, there's a lot of physical stuff as well. It's actually my mum that she said,

I hope you don't have that ME. She was a a nurse she was the first person that sort of paid any attention because the you know doctor didn't really know what was going on and so in fact that's that's what it was how did it manifest itself for you so it was a combination of physical symptoms lack of energy etc i'm presuming and then kind of accompanying mental fog or depression well actually I mean the depression didn't really kick in until year three which seems maybe that seems weird in the scale of things but I was actually okay mentally I mean my life completely changed it's more just like a battery battery getting pulled. I did a lot of athletics and I was working nights, burning candles and just mad on music. Just a bit mad, really, but not looking after myself.

Also conflicted, a bit of confliction. That'll get you in the long run. Conflicted how? Well, just conflicted about what one was meant to do. A lot of pressure. I was kind of brainy when I was at school. It was a lot of pressure to become a scientist and just do science and do university.

I was the first in our family to go to university. So my dad was on my case. You know, this was a big deal back in the day. So yeah, there was pressure. But I realized that, you know, when I got up to Glasgow, the beloved city of Glasgow, it had a lot of attractions that weren't anything to do with science or physics or university. I thought university was rubbish. It really didn't. I was too young, you know, I was 17 when I went there. So I got interested in a lot of other stuff, but confliction, you know.

So you started listening to a lot of music, right? Yeah. Yeah, that's when I got obsessed with it all. And how did that obsession take hold originally? I got into a band. I got into a band with a bunch of doctors. They were all doctors except me i answered an advert in the student union and um they were called well originally they were called philopi

and the tubes wow that is really reaching yeah yeah that you know but they were all doctors so that was a nice philopi and the. And then they changed their name to the seizures. But it was nice because they used to pass me, you know, they were fun guys and we went to this basement and they gave me the only ones and they gave me orange juice and they gave me Roxy Music

and they said learn these and then I threw in some of my things that I liked I couldn't write a song then but uh so that was a nice little starter did you go out and see a lot of music at the time I mean I know that you were a big fan of orange juice but they were they still around even at the end of the 80s no and that was that was like a big gulf. I got into Orange Juice around 86 or something, but they left Glasgow, I think, around 81, 82, and they'd broken up anyway.

So it seemed like a huge gulf. It felt like I was doing a detective job on the whole postcard scene. That's what got me into the pop group and Young Marble Giants, all that great post-punk stuff. I looked at some of the records that you, some of your favorite albums on a Quietus article, article by Adrian Lobb.

Lots of good stuff on there. Simon and Garfunkel, Bridge Over Troubled Water, Stevie Wonder, Hotter Than July, ACDC, yes. Beatles, Smiths, cocteau twins the fall but i didn't see any um velvet underground and i for some reason i maybe lazily assumed that that they were a big influence on you um i think that article i was um i was trying to do a little chrono i remember that article and i was trying to do a little chronological thing. I mean, the thing is, if you ask a musician what their favorite record or records are,

they have so many. They change all the time. So I could have picked eight different records that day. I don't have them sewn into the lining of my underpants or anything. What? In case I get run over. So I think I was trying telling you a chronological thing that was the you know i remember when stevie wonder was my favorite thing and then acdc was

my favorite thing when i was 12 and then the cocteau twins but the velvets to be honest they didn't really uh it wasn't till the later till the the 90s that i started looking back at the velvets. Have you seen the Todd Haynes documentary? About Velvet Underground? Yeah, I think it came out fairly recently and it proclaimed itself to be a kind of half music documentary, half art film, avant-garde image and sound mash-up. And actually it was fairly straightforward. I don't know, it was okay, but it was like,

actually, it made me like them a bit less after I watched it. Do you ever get that? Yeah, well, that's the danger. I don't always watch too many music things. I don't, you know, Bob and Stevie and Chris and the band, you know, they really soak that stuff up. I tend to, you know, I'd be a little bit careful. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, the music was amazing still. It's very good. It's never suddenly going to sound shit. And Lou Reed's voice is so compelling and cuts through everything. You can kind of, he's a bit like Marky Smith. You could sort of hear him reading out the phone directory and there would be something entertaining about it oh definitely I had to sing in front of

him one time Lou Reed yeah it was random it was like I was in New York I wasn't even I was just on holiday I think with my wife and there was a thing called the kitchen organization and it was something to do with my record label they just phonedoned me up and said, you're in New York. Can you come down and do a couple of numbers? And I didn't have any instruments. And usually I don't like to do anything without the band. So I borrowed somebody's like a squeeze box thing. It's like a thing with pedals, a harmonium. Like I have a couple I used to play

and I played an old Scottish song, Ye Banks and Braes of Bonnie Doon. Then I played one of our own songs, but I thought, well, do you know what? I don't play guitar in this, so I got the fellow from Talking Heads. Gerry Harrison. No, the singer.

David Byrne. Yeah, because I knew he was part of the organization. I said, right, I'll turn up and do this if you could get David Byrne to come play guitar for the song. Oh my God. And he did. Whoa. I don't think he was,

I don't think he was very pleased. Why was he grumpy? I think he was a little bit grumpy. I would be grumpy. I think I had more hubris back, you know, like it was 10 or 15 years ago. I just thought, well, come on, why not? That'd be, that'd be fun.ris back, you know, like it was 10 or 15 years ago.

I just thought, well, come on, why not? That would be fun. But Lou Reed, he was just sitting in front of me, and he didn't look too happy either. He never did, though, did he? Well, the only story I heard about Lou Reed was that it was a friend of a friend went up to him, saw him at an airport, you know, with his dark glasses, and thought, fuck, that's Lou Reed. I mean, you've got to go up and say hello. You've got to say something.

So he walked over and he didn't get within six feet of him and the guy didn't move. He just said, fuck off, kid. That's what you want he's like yay I met the reed the reed told me to fuck off that's perfect isn't it

I mean that really is definitely the guy in this in this Todd Haynes doc there's quite a lot of stuff about his early years and the stuff he used to get up to. I mean, obviously he went through the ringer himself and there were all sorts of issues that he was dealing with and treatments that he may or may not have had imposed on him, like medical treatments. He always claimed that he got ECT to kind of shock the gay out of him that's his phrase and

who knows how that affected him but he was already quite a cranky character as far as i can tell the only worthwhile artistic expression at the time for him so this is early 60s or whatever was just to confront everything that went against society's values and norms so for him it was all kind of gay clubs and fairly violent sex and like taking friends to really rough clubs even though he knew it made them uncomfortable and all this sort of behavior which would be in no way acceptable nowadays you couldn't really talk about it casually in an interview and expect to get away with it you know what i mean but that was his whole mo and if he you know stating the obvious here but if he hadn't been who he was the way he would have written the stuff he

wrote and and performed the way he wrote nobody did yeah um and these performances are priceless yeah i mean i guess speaking of kind of focusing on the cds side of life that's not a million miles away from what you were doing in early bell and sebastian days and marrying a very kind of accessible tuneful melodic pop sound with lyrics that were quite dark or talked about you know strange things that you wouldn't normally have in in in a pop song stuff that you would normally find in a kind of gritty novel maybe yeah i was just i was just writing about what was around and how i was feeling uh there's you know nothing i didn't have anything to lose so i didn't have to pander to

anyone i just i just let it out and you know wrote about the people around me but even the people around me that you might think were kind of deadbeat, they were better than me because they were well. So I could romanticise them. I thought the people that were taking a lot of drugs or messed up and sleeping in a different bed every night, I mean, that was amazing to me that people could do that. But also somebody who could just get up, go to work, come home, have a drink. It was all that

normal and abnormal behavior. Any type of behavior was interesting to me. So I used to write about them. Right. So you're almost like a scientific observer. I was a little bit. But do you still feel disconnected from what's going on around you in the same way? Do you still feel that you're in a separate world because of Emmy? A little bit, yeah. But I think everybody is in a separate world.

I mean, if you want to generalize, I think everybody has their own thing going on. It's got their own movie very much in their mind. So I don't mean to say, wow, I'm unique because I had this experience or I'm having this experience. There's some very good things about the experience I'm having. So I don't want to moan about it or make it out to be so special. Yeah. You mentioned seeing people going out and boozing and taking drugs or whatever

was it clear to you fairly early on that that was not going to be something that you could do and manage the condition oh yeah absolutely i was almost like straight edge even to the point early no shagging i mean you know no what's wrong with shagging that would just knacker you out yeah it's just or well it's getting into the realm when sex would even be uh on the menu i mean i couldn't like i'm talking about those long years especially the early years we were out of the game and i say we because my friend kira and i kira had emmy as well and we used to sit in rooms for long periods talking about the possibility of having boyfriends and girlfriends and just but just talking and dreaming and talking about the past because it was kind of beyond us we were like people moved too fast we couldn't keep up and we had the occasional dalliances.

And then when they realized what the deal was, then, you know, the people quickly sort of moved on. So you had to have a bit of a sense of humor about it. Sure. Now, you have, I understand, very kindly recorded a couple of tracks. Is that right? Or just one track? No, we did. We recorded two songs for you yesterday.

And I wish I could, you know, I wish I've got an injury just now or else I would have just played you a couple of tracks. But I think maybe, hopefully you got quite a good deal out of it because it was nice to involve the group. And so we made this album and then we've come back and this is the first time

we tried to actually play the songs live and then we've come back and this is the first time we try to actually play the songs live and they've come out quite different in the in the way that we played for you oh wow thanks very much i'm honored please pass on my thanks to the rest of the band too what's the name of the first song the first song is called young and stupid and it's the first record it's the first song on the new LP. And it is a little bit of a looking back, being sad in the present moment and looking back to that particular period

of being young and stupid. And we've talked about it already. That was my years before I got sick, the kind of late 80s DJing and messing around being in other bands, yeah. Fallopian tubes he is yeah the Fallopian tubes alright here we go for the Adam Buxton

show I was yelling in my sleep I was crying feeling weak Do we have to feel this way? It wasn't like this yesterday Everything is fine When you're young and stupid Everything's divine When you're young and stupid

There's an easy start to things There's a thrill that beauty brings We're together at the hips. Stuck together at the lips. Nature has the lead. When you're young and stupid. Nature will lead. When you're young and stupid Now we're old with creaking bones

Some with partners, some alone Some with kids and some with dogs Getting through the nightly slog Flashes in the mind You were young and stupid Keeps us warm at night All are young and stupid Makes us feel delight

We were young and stupid Makes you feel regret When you're young and stupid specially recorded for the Adam Buxton podcast. Thank you very much. And that is a track from the new album. What's that called? It's called A Bit of Previous. Hello.

And am I right in thinking you're producing that yourselves? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think that word producer, production, is a bit of a mysterious thing, sometimes a bit of an entity. And all our early records were produced by ourselves, although we never said on the sleeve.

You know, we worked with very capable engineers and we are working with one this time. But yeah, we were co-producing with Brian. As you say, it is still a mysterious thing with the producer isn't it because i think i always just assumed the producer comes in he sets up the mics he or she sets up the mics although there aren't many female producers i think that is something that is uh changing gradually we've looked for them i think it's changing yeah yeah um but certainly in the olden days it was uh a world that was dominated almost totally by men and um they would come in and i thought they would set

up all their mics plug in all the guitars make sure everything was recording and balance all the faders and things like that but actually generally it seems to be that that's what an engineer does and the producer just swans in and sits there and goes oh what about a wrap around the middle eight section all right rolls up a massive joint yeah exactly but it can be it's a sliding scale you do get i mean the thing is a good producer will know that if what is needed at precisely that point is just to simply come in and roll up a joint or make tea they will do that they'll be like you know there's some magic happening i can already hear it just let it happen but it could be like the band never showed up and they've got to start making the record and they start okay well let's dig out a drum machine. Let's make it.

So they can be doing everything. They can be doing nothing. We were with one of the most famous producers of them all, Trevor Horn. That was the first time we actually worked with a producer. And it just happened to be Trevor Horn. And sometimes we'd be bogged down. We were trying to get a thing going. We were in his manor house in Oxfordshire.

And he'd say, let's go and put a rocket up. He had these rockets that he got. I don't know whether they were pneumatic. But they went thousands of feet in the air. We went to the middle of the field and all the dogs came with us barking madly. And we were in the four-wheel little tractor things that go fast. And we'd put a rocket up and he said yeah that it raises the spirits and then we go back in and do something else good one that's trevor horn's secret for creative success put a rocket up yeah maybe elon musk should produce a few records. Trevor Horn, that's cool.

Were you a fan of his stuff when you were young? I always remember seeing Video Kill the Radio Star on Top of the Pots and being completely besotted with that. Yeah. Oh, it's classic. It's a fantastic single. But I was a yes guy. I was like a prog rock guy.

Yes, man. So I was a yes man. I had this secret thing. You know, everyone was like, oh, wow rock guy. Yes, man. So I was a yes man. I had this secret thing. You know, everyone was like, oh, wow, Frankie, Grace Jones, ABC. And I was like, Trevor used to be in Yes. I mean, he was in them. I mean, he produced them, but he was in them. That's right.

I forgot about his Yes years because Owner of a Lonely Heart was very good. When that came out, that sounded very futuristic as did so many trevor horn productions what was that like for you though going in with the bell and sebastian record were you sort of what were you hoping to get from working with someone like him yeah we were hoping for owner of a lonely heart but it didn't work out you You know, we were hoping for Arlo Noiser. But he was really, at the time, which was 90, no, it wasn't, it was 2001, 2002 that we were with Trevor. And I think it was his daughter that had heard one of our records

and played it to her dad and said, you should get these guys. And so we did. And he just loved that you know we played as a band um and he he loved that experience of just recording us all yes and that was dear catastrophe waitress that you did with him that was yeah i heard you talking about this was around the time that your film came out in 2014 that you directed god God Help the Girl, and I saw you doing a Q&A, maybe in South by Southwest or somewhere like that. And you were talking about the fact that you sometimes might be just jogging or something like that, and a song will arrive more or less fully formed. You

can hear it all in your head. You can hear the arrangement. You can hear the strings. You can hear it all in your head. You can hear the arrangement. You can hear the strings. You can hear the tune, even the lyrics sometimes. Is that right? I'm very flattered that you kind of remembered me saying that. It's funny that made me write the film, was something that switched on like a radio while I was out running in Sheffield on a dark night along a canal path. But that was, it wasn't me singing. The reason I could hear like a radio was somebody else was singing. It was a female which was which hadn't really happened to me before and that's why I ended up going on that diversion is that something that happens to you a lot though you can I mean I've heard other musicians talk about that kind of thing talking about almost channeling songs feeling as if they haven't really written something but they've just just been, it's almost just arrived fully formed, you know, people like Brian Wilson and musicians like that. I just find that miraculous. And does that still happen to you? Yeah, I would say so. I mean, I'm not saying it's miraculous, but that's the way most of them

show up. Most of the ones that I author myself uh that's kind of the way usually just when i'm waking up or just suddenly you'll get a feeling uh you'll get a feel and brian wilson used to talk about feels they weren't songs they were like a little feel you get the idea for the song it's quite often a rhythm and uh you know rhythm and melody and And then maybe, you know, I'd like the words right along with the melody, because the first blush of words that come along, even though they can be inconsequential, you quite often end up leaving them in. So that's handy to jot those down too. But do you ever write in a more sort of straightforwardly workmanlike way and if so how does that look so less often less often i do that i usually just you know i'm usually the slave to the thing that

we were talking about before but the interesting thing about being in a group is that an opportunity presents itself to write in different ways which is terrific because you've got your own tunes, you've got a handful of those, and then one day you'll come in, Chris is playing a great riff on the Wurlitzer keyboard, and he says, you know, I've got this, I've got a tune that, you know, I've got this feel, and I said, okay, that's great, let's do it. And everybody, you know, everyone starts jamming,

for want of a better word, jamming over the tune, and that's an opportunity to to come up with a different melody to suggest a progression and write some words and those words are will end up being very different from the kind of words that you would write yourself waking up in the middle of the night so we're very we're very lucky i think all those different types of writing are um by being in a band you are presented with different challenges i'm always amazed that you just seem to have this um unending wellspring of tunes like every single bell and sebastian tune that i can think of is interesting it's got hooks it's pretty it's memorable over the top emotional sometimes but there's always a lot going on do you

know what i mean do you ever consciously try and write very different stuff uh or just almost squeeze out all the tunefulness and think all right i'm gonna go for something dour and gray and indie sounding yeah i know it's funny probably not i think life is life seems too short not to kind of give it your best shot it was always my thing from the early days was beauty beauty beauty you know joy try to get the joy in there i can't really sway from that path like i say it just seems like time is tight i mean you know maybe we should set ourselves a project sometimes you do think well maybe we could write a song about this let's write a political song or i give try to give myself a challenge uh let's write a song about chocolate biscuits

you know let's see how that turns out I think there's people in the band that are more enamoured of that idea than I am I tend to fall back on what I'm better at sorry the reason I mentioned chocolate biscuits because yesterday we were going through while we were recording your session we were

going through all the 70s and 80s TV adverts for chocolate biscuits that we could remember uh which was fun what were some of the good ones if you like a lot of chocolate on your biscuit join our club it's a banger and you can't stand it with bandy the trouble is that all the we found that so many of them were kind of vaguely racist you know they were for some reason there was kind of racist overtones in a lot of the yeah yeah yeah it was the glory days of racist advertising yeah so um and there was at the at the cinema there was the key aura ad you remember that yeah yeah it's too orangey for dogs what was it no it's too orangey

for crows crows too orangey for crows it's just for me and my dog and bongo and all that yeah definitely yeah things you simply can and shouldn't be talking about no but very memorable tunes to go with them that was the thing it was insidious yes if i wasn't doing what i am doing whatever I am doing I guess I would probably be a jingle writer in an advertising agency because I don't think that I can really well I'm trying to write some songs at the moment I don't know why exactly I got a record contract off the back of the podcast because I think they just wanted to release some of the jingles that I do and they thought oh well you've done loads now we'll put them out but then I thought well I've got a record contract I should write some songs I should do an album totally and

so I've been trying to write songs that are longer than 30 seconds and it's really fucking hard I can't I mean it's so difficult and also because I've never written anything serious before it's like everything everything just has to be silly. And yeah, you're a funny guy. Thanks very much. But I also have lots of not funny moments and moments that fall way short. And maybe they're mildly amusing at 30 seconds,

but not for over two minutes. You know what I mean? Have you ever thought about getting with some, some guys? And I say particularly guys, because if you've got a problem with 30 seconds, just get with a couple of, you know, a drummer and a couple of guitar players. That 30 seconds will soon become 10 minutes. You know, just get with a couple of guys who are into can or beef heart

and they'll extend your shit. That's a nice image. Yeah yeah that's a good idea get jamming with some some blokes some middle-aged blokes but seriously i mean there's so many ways of of taking your idea and and turning it into a song and and anything can be any little nugget of music can become a different style. Do you mess around with GarageBand? Yeah, man, that's my whole, that was where my music potential was suddenly unlocked. Because I never had any discernible musical talent.

And so I never did any music lessons. I just assumed, well, that's something that musicians do. That's something that talented people do. They learn how to play guitar and piano and they understand all that stuff. So I never, ever did it and was always jealous of people in bands. And then I got a computer and it had GarageBand on it. I was like, holy shit, I can just whack together these loops and it sounds almost like a song. And it wonderful like this week I tried to record a song playing guitar and bass just de-eyed into Logic and um it was really good fun but you know just the physical limit I just can't move my fingers fast enough So I'm only on three chords and it just sounds so horrible. Like if you if you squint, then it sounds maybe like a kind of very indie lo-fi thing from the early 80s or late 70s or something. In fact, like a go-betweens demo or something that sounds great i mean that's that sounds great to me i'm kind of

i'm thinking wow there's a you know because things sound very clean these days and uh when something comes on from that era it has a thing yeah that i'm into well it's definitely organic but then the problem is well what do i sing over this stuff and you know my tendency is to be silly but i feel like i've got to battle it to say something sincere every now and again and then my sincere sentiments are so mortifyingly rubbish I could see why it's tricky it's difficult to move from one thing to other when you have and it's not even other people's perceptions the perception you have of yourself it's but you know you're battling a few things but that you maybe just need a little trick or a little something to allow you to to find a new thing and maybe we'd be getting in

into a room with a couple of people i mean for years when we got into a new album project the word on top of my page was collaborate exclamation mark just remember how good stuff comes from collaboration yeah i think you're right but all these things are easier to do when you're in your late teens early 20s you don't have a family you don't live out in the middle of nowhere you're not 52 and all this you don't have all the other shit that comes along with being a bit older like again again you know just uh it might not be quite the same thing but maybe bouncing a an idea over to to somebody and having it bounce back or else you could just have a long debilitating illness okay and then you know just get some you know get the mumps

for a while you don't hear about the mumps so much anymore you don't hear about the mumps proust proust had mumps didn't he he had a you know and then he wrote remembrance of things past i didn't know that he had mumps well i'm not sure if he did really have mumps but he had some what is mumps i don't know is it sort of a glandular thing it's one of the three m you know mmr isn really have mumps but he had some what is mumps i don't know is it sort of a glandular thing it's one of the three m you know mmr isn't it mumps measles and rubella and rubella that's right but it's the one with the most fun name that sounded like a kid's tv show yeah you definitely you swell up somewhere yeah there's a bit of swelling involved but once you're over the swelling you'll be able to write to your heart's content i mean measles mumps and rubella does sound like a sort of bell and sebastian type indie band

i don't know why that concept album hasn't been written hello fact-checking santa here mumps is a glandular infection that causes painful swellings on the sides of your face. It's easily prevented by the MMR vaccine. Also, there was a New York dance punk band from the early 2000s called Measles Mubs Rubella. There's a link in the description to their music, which sounds quite good to me. OK, time for more music, I think. What is the name of the next specially recorded Bell and Sebastian track, please, Stuart? It's called Unnecessary Drama.

Tell us a little bit about this one, if you could, please, Stuart. So Bob wrote this. He's a riffy man. And he brought this in complete, as he always does, in a military style and tells everybody what to play. But it's good. He always gets good ones. He commissioned me to write some words, but he told me it had to be called unnecessary drama.

So we're going to hear that now. But it's so nice to talk to you, Stuart, and meet you after all these years. And I mean, I say that because, you know, I was a fan back in the day and it was an exciting time to be a music fan when bell and sebastian started putting out music and tiger milk came out and it was this rare item that only the very coolest people were passing around and it's like look i've got the original artwork and hey this is just a photocopy of that you've just got this off some other guy. And it's like, nah, this is an original copy. And it was really cool. And, you know, that was around that time

at the end of the 90s is when I met my beautiful wife. And many of your songs soundtracked those early years of us being together and Lazy Line. Painter Jane is the one that reminds me so much of the intense emotions I was feeling in those days. Epic, stirring song.

Sorry, I'm just sort of gushing at you, but I'm really grateful to you for coming on and talking to me and to the rest of the band for recording these songs. Thank you, Adam. It's been an honor. It's been lovely. I read your letter from before You've been having so much fun And is it possible You're just telling me to draw me in There's an array of douchebags

lining up to play their stupid parts And did you ever pause before you gave your love away? This is my life This is my soul called life This is my life And this is my soul called life. This is my life.

And this is my only life. And when you came to me that summer, you were just a shell. And you were holding close to mother. She was dashing with the strength. And there was miles to go, yeah, miles to build that sister-loving bond. And then I figured that the music set your soul ablaze. And it's probably not surprising that you're burning through the day. And if I had a second encore, I would probably do the same. Thank you. This is my only love Strange days Poison characters

My particular haze Please Enjoy the fervor of your love life Cause it doesn't last And with a suddenness that is cruel Everything can go to hell But then you find a new path Leave the old path

Leave the gains behind And on a morning climb You see the grind and feel amazed i know you felt you gave your best but it was never going to do there's always gonna be a young hungry idol coming through i know it wasn't really just like living. You and me could talk like kissing. Every conversation was divine. This is my life. This is my soul.

This is my life. This is my soul come back. This is my life. This is my only life. This is my life. This is my only life. This is my life. This is my only life. This is my life. This is my only life This is my life This is my soul, come on This is my life

This is my only life This is my life This is my soul, come on This is my life This is my song of all time. This is my love. This is my only love. This is an advert for Squarespace. Every time I visit your website, I see success.

Yes, success. The way that you look at the world makes the world want to say yes. It looks very professional. I love browsing your videos and pics, and I don't want to stop. And I'd like to access your members area and spend in your shop. These are the kinds of comments people will say about your website if you build it with Squarespace. Just visit squarespace.com slash Buxton for a free trial. And when you're ready to launch, because you will want to launch,

use the offer code BUXTON to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. So put the smile of success on your face with Squarespace Yes Eight Belle, oh ma si belle Tu t'en allais sans m'écouter Continue continue hey welcome back podcats that was bell and sebastian playing a song specially recorded

for the podcast did i mention that before before? I can't remember. It was specially recorded for the podcast. I'm very grateful indeed to Stuart and to the rest of the band. I have linked to some Bell and Sebastian related bits and pieces in the description of today's podcast. What have we got? You've got your tour dates. They are touring throughout the UK and ireland and further afield later this year you've got a video for a song they recorded earlier this year in support of people affected by the war in ukraine if they're shooting at you it's called link to that on youtube

link to lazy lion painter jane just in case you're not familiar with it good video as well there is a documentary put together by pitchfork called If You're Feeling Sinister. Ironic, because I think Pitchfork absolutely slated If You're Feeling Sinister, the album that is, when it came out in 1998. And they have, they said it was, I'm trying to remember, I think I read this on Wikipedia. But they said it was a parody of the band's earlier work. It's a parody, three albums in, it's a parody of their earlier work.

It's a great album. Anyway, they have since withdrawn the review. The review's been cancelled. And a more positive review was written in 2018. What else have I got here? Oh yeah, the trailer for Todd Haynes' Velvet Underground film that we talked about. Which is good. I mean, it's's worth seeing especially if you're a fan but um yeah i don't know maybe i was in a weird mood when i saw it

oh i can feel a couple of spots of moisture and i'm not talking about my pants sorry pants. Sorry. Here comes the rain. Thank you, weather Jesus. Okay, I should wrap up. Thank you very much once again to Stuart Murdoch, Bell and Sebastian, and Noam Klar from the label for helping arrange everything for this podcast. Much appreciated. Thanks to Seamus Murphy Mitchell for his always invaluable production support and hard work. Thank you, Seamus. Thanks to Helen Green. She does the artwork for this podcast, and I love it. Thanks to ACAST.

They are always helpful and work hard to keep this show on the road. Much appreciated. But thanks most of all to you, because I know, what do they say on airplanes? You have a choice, and we're grateful that you made this one. I hope you don't regret it, and that you come back another time. I hope that things go well for you,

and all your dreams come true. And I was wondering if we could have a hug. Is that okay? Come here. Let's have a sensitive Belle and Sebastian hug. Okay. So, none of that. Oh, one last thing.

I love you. Bye! Please like and subscribe. Give me a smile and a thumbs up. Nice, take a pat with me, thumbs up. Give me a smile and a thumbs up. Nice, take a pat with me, thumbs up. Like and subscribe. Like and subscribe. Like and subscribe.

Please like and subscribe. Give me a smile and a thumbs up. Nice, take a pat with me, thumbs up. Give me a smile and a thumbs up. Nice, take a bite, give me a thumbs up. Give me a smile and a thumbs up. Nice, take a bite, give me a thumbs up. Like and subscribe. Like and subscribe. Like and subscribe.

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