The Bechdel Cast - Polite Society with Pireh Moosa

Episode Date: May 2, 2024

This week, Jamie, Caitlin, and special guest Pireh Moosa chat about Polite Society! Check out our tour dates at linktr.ee/bechdelcast   Follow Pireh at @conspirehcies on Instagram, and check out her piece on the movie at https://images.dawn.com/news/1191845 See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th 2017 was assassinated. Crooks Everywhere unearthed the plot to murder a one-woman WikiLeaks. She exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Kay hasn't heard from her sister in seven years. I have a proposal for you. Come up here and document my project. All you need to do is record everything like you always do. What was that?

That was live audio of a woman's nightmare. Can Kay trust her sister or is history repeating itself? There's nothing dangerous about what you're doing. They're just dreams. Dream Sequence is a new horror thriller

from Blumhouse Television, iHeartRadio, and Realm. Listen to Dream Sequence on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Dr. Laurie Santos,

host of the Happiness Lab podcast. As the U.S. elections approach, it can feel like we're angrier and more divided than ever. But in a new, hopeful season of my podcast, I'll share what the science really shows, that we're surprisingly more united than most people think. We all know something is wrong in our culture, in our politics, and that we need to do better and that we can do better. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Hello, Bechtelcast listeners. It's May,

which means the Shrektanic Tour kicks off this month. Starting on May 22nd, we've got two shows in London. Then we are scooting over to Oxford for the Saint Audio Podcast Festival on May 24th. Then we're doing shows in Edinburgh on May 26th, Manchester on May 28th. And finally, on May 29th, we will be in Dublin. And speaking of, I, me, Caitlin, am doing a stand-up show in Dublin on my birthday on May 17th. So you're going to want to come to that as well. And you kind of have to because it's my birthday and it would be rude not to. So all of the ticket links for all of these shows can be found at linktree.com and we will see you there. On the Bechdel cast, the questions asked if movies have women in them. Are all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands or do they have individualism? The patriarchy's effing vast.

Start changing it with the bechdel cast the gods whispered to the podcaster you will not withstand the fury the podcaster whispers back i am the fury and then and then we eat shit live on youtube yeah yes perfect perfect welcome to the bechdel cast i think you know personally Live on YouTube. Yeah, yes. Perfect. Perfect. Welcome to the Bechdelcast. I think, you know, personally, I know it's an audio medium, but Caitlin did just do the full stunt. Sorry, I don't know.

I'm not Eunice. I don't know what stunt words. They did the whole stunt. It was a flying reverse spin kick, and I executed it perfectly. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Absolutely. Hello and welcome to the Bechdel cast. By the way, my name is Caitlin Durante. My name is Jamie Loftus, and this is our podcast where we talk about your favorite movies using an intersectional feminist lens. It's so true, and we use the bechdel test as a jumping off point it's a media metric created

by queer cartoonist allison bechdel often called the bechdel wallace test and one passes this test when two characters sound like yoda one one a test is no i don't know what i'm saying um sorry it's 8 a.m for us listeners today we it will be soon become clear why this is necessary uh but it is eight in the morning and so sometimes the sentences are gonna come out a little crooked it's very true anyway the bechdel test is passed at least our version of it when two characters of a marginalized gender have names they have to speak to each other and their conversation has to be about something other than a man ideally it's a plot relevant juicy little piece of conversation give us yummy give conversation. Gristle. Give us... Yummy. Give us... Oh, Chris.

Okay. I think, honestly, we gotta just get our guest in here because our guest has actually been awake for a whole day and I think we need their support. This week we are covering a movie that I feel like did not get enough, at least wasn't on enough screens in the

U.S. But one I was really excited to watch watch we've gotten some requests for polite society i loved it and i'm so excited to bring in our guest in chat yes she is a writer journalist musician she wrote a piece about this very movie, entitled Unhinged and Unafraid, Polite Society, is a story told by and for brown women. It's Pire Musa. Hello. Hi. Welcome. It's so great to be here. Thank you for joining us.

No, thank you. I'm so psyched. Live from 8 p.m. Yes. How was your day? My day was full, fuller than than yours at least ours it's just well now that we're doing this podcast with you i feel full oh i do i do wow that was really beautiful did we did we just pass the bechdel test we did we did we did it. We did. We did. I guess, so we'd like to start, we really loved your piece. And we usually start the conversation by asking our guests, what's,

I mean, it's a very recent movie, but what's your history with this movie? And also, how did the piece come to be? Because we're going to link it in the description as well. Awesome. Okay, so I came across this movie because I was already such a massive fan of the director Nida Manzoor. I had seen her show We Are Lady Parts a couple years ago for a course called Female Friendships in World Literature. And it blew my mind. And it like like I have so much to say I feel like that's another podcast episode entirely but that show changed my life it showed me so much about South Asian diasporic representation that I had never ever seen before like it showed me how South Asian diasporic women South Asian diasporic Muslim women can be represented in a way that isn't sanitized, is kind of ugly, very honest, hilarious, fun, and so cathartic. And I had never seen anything that felt more like me. So I was like, I need to do a deep dive

into everything this woman has ever done. And I found the trailer for polite society and i was super super excited and when the i mean you might have to edit this part out but like uh the way i watched it was not uh the most legal of ways but that's fine yeah but yeah um because that's the only way that um we got access to the movie like it wasn't officially released in cinemas but I needed to get my hands on it so when I watched the movie I think like it came out in 2020 I watched it in 2023 at least and I think it also released in cinemas then and yeah so like there's been like a lot of talk around action films revolving around women like uh the black widow one came out a few years ago then there's before that captain marvel and then there's also been most recently

madam webb and it's like there was this constant trend of people not giving a crap about women action films like it was like there has to be like you know either we have to sell it with some kind of a narrative like she has to be sexy she has to appeal to a certain tro, there has to be like, you know, either we have to sell it with some kind of a narrative. Like she has to be sexy. She has to appeal to a certain trope. She has to be like the one single badass bitch that like men can enjoy. Or like she has to, like there has to be some kind of marketable selling point. Or we're not going to care about writing it.

And no one's going to care about watching it. And it was really frustrating to see. Because it was like like I was so tired of men coming to me and being like oh did you see Captain America catch Thor's hammer in the 57th Marvel like I don't I don't care I want to see something about women fighting that feels real that feels honest and that feels like I can place myself in that scenario and when this film came that was finally it so it was not just like you know they didn't just put like this one woman in the spotlight to be like a sexy temptress kind of figure like yeah Priya Priya is the actress right um Rhea Khan the main character in this movie.

She feels so authentic. She feels like she's hilarious. She falls over a bunch. We laugh at her. She's embarrassing sometimes. And we see, like, she isn't the most conventionally gorgeous person in the world. And that's refreshing to see especially like especially for someone that looks like me because we we never like there's there's barely a mold that i can talk about when it comes to representation for people that look like me in global media and when there is it's mostly like like when i'm looking for representation for

people that look like me it's like what i've seen is so horrendous it's like you know either we have to paint like a super sanitized picture of like what we are like what south asian culture is like even in uh what's love got to do with it like it's like like there's something so weird about like a white girl coming with a camera to pakistan to explore lahore and it's like yeah I like I I want to see something that that doesn't need to be explaining my culture to to white people like I'm done with trying to explain myself right so there's that and then there's also um like I don't know if you guys have seen this movie like it came out a while ago it's called what will people say it's like a Norwegian Pakistani film and it was like one of the very very few pakistani diasporic films that came out a while

ago in that movie it's just like norwegian pakistani girl is oppressed in norway then she gets sent back to pakistan she's more oppressed in pakistan than she had said and it's like i'm so tired of seeing people get beaten up and oppressed so that like white people can go to a cinema cry about what they did to us and leave like I I want to see something fun yeah like I want to see some action I want to see something that celebrates my existence or the existence of South Asian women but also something that tackles very very real themes and and things that we go through on a day-to-day basis. And I think that this film was really it. Yeah. Yeah.

What a breath of fresh air this movie is. Yeah. Jamie, what about you? What's your relationship with it? This is my first time actually seeing this movie. I missed it in theaters when it was out here. But we were talking about this before we started recording i loved we are lady parts when it came out on peacock a couple of years ago it fucking rocked uh nina manzoor is she's like close to our age like it's so i don't know i find her so personally inspiring because she's like making her shit I also I remember being so blown away that she like directs and wrote every single episode of We Are Lady Parts it's so distinct it's so funny and it's just so her and I love woman auteurs and especially in comedy

because I feel like oh it's just really. So I was really looking forward to seeing this movie. And I loved it. I was raving about it to my boyfriend at like 6.30 this morning. I was like, no. Because I knew that martial arts was a big part of the movie. That was like half of why I was like, yes. Like it's so. Because like you're saying, Pitta, there's not a lot of action movies led by women. And when there are, they're often like, I don't know, like kind of like even when they exist, they're kind of samey or there's still a lot of like male gaze applied.

And it's I don't know. That said, I thought Madam Web was fun at the movies. Anyways, I connects them all. fun at the movies. Anyways. Her web connects them all. It's as simple as that. Look, it delivered on the tagline. Her web did actually eventually connect them all. And that was all I needed to be happy.

And so I left knowing that her web. So, I mean, I guess my one note for Play Society is like, where was her web and why didn't it connect them all right but outside of that i just i i truly was like there we're gonna spoil the movie because it's a movie podcast but like at the the midpoint in this movie where i just like did not see it coming i like i feel like she subverts what you because i was like oh this is gonna be like a really fun martial arts, like coming of age comedy. And then in the middle it gets fucking weird and like wild. And I'm so excited to talk about it because I was just like,

Whoa, this is so fucking cool. It's such a like strong, weird, wild choice. I'd never, I don't know. I just never seen anything like it and i loved it

and i'm excited to talk about it caitlin with your history with play society i saw trailers for it when it did get its theatrical release in the u.s also i think it premiered at sundance so it like it it's screening origins at least were happening in the u.s i think it didned at Sundance. So it like it's screening origins, at least were happening in the US. I think it didn't come out until sometime in the spring, but I was, I had been seeing trailers for it and I was like, Ooh,

this movie looks so up my alley because I love action movies. I love, obviously I love a romp. I love action comedies specifically. Obviously I love movies where women are the driving force. So this had everything I was looking for. And I also am a big fan of We Are Lady Parts. I had seen it a few months prior. So I was like, really ready for this. And I went to the AMC theater because we come to this place for magic. And I saw the movie and I

loved it. And I bought it as soon as it was available to purchase like digitally. I rarely do that. Because most movies I'm like, it'll end up streaming somewhere, something like that. But I own it now. Thank you so much. hell yeah yeah i'm a huge fan of the movie also very excited to talk about it so uh let's take a quick break and then we'll come back for the recap Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16, 2017, was murdered. There are crooks everywhere you look now. The situation is desperate.

My name is Manuel Delia. I am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhearts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks. Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. And she paid the ultimate price. Listen to Crooks Everywhere on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I've been thinking about you. I want you back in my life. It's too late for that. I have a proposal for you. Come up here and document my project. All you need to do is record everything like you always do. One session.

24 hours. BPM 110. 120. She's terrified. Should we wake her up? Absolutely not. What was that? You didn't figure it out?

I think I need to hear you say it. That was live audio of a woman's nightmare. This machine is approved and everything? You're allowed to be doing this? We passed the review board a year ago. We're not hurting people. There's nothing dangerous about what you're doing. They're just dreams. Dream Sequence is a new horror thriller from Blumhouse Television, iHeartRadio, and Realm. Listen to Dream Sequence on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When you think of Mexican culture, you think of avocado, mariachi, delicious cuisine, and of course, lucha libre. It doesn't get more Mexican than this.

Lucha libre is known globally because it is much more than just a sport and much more than just entertainment. Lucha Libre is a type of storytelling. It's a dance. It's tradition. It's culture. This is Lucha Libre Behind the Mask, a 12-episode podcast in both English and Spanish about the history and cultural richness of Lucha Libre. And I'm your host, Santos Escobar, the emperor of Lucha Libre and a WWE superstar. Join me as we learn more about the history behind this spectacular sport from its inception in the United States to how it became a global symbol of Mexican culture.

We'll learn more about some of the most iconic heroes in the ring. This is Lucha Libre Behind the Mask. Listen to Lucha Libre Behind the Mask as part of My Cultura Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you stream podcasts. And we're back. Okay, we are in London. Ever heard heard of it and we meet two sisters one is ria khan played by priya kansara she is a teenager and her dream is to become a stunt performer in movies there's a famous stunt woman named eunice hotart who she admires who's real who's a real person I didn't realize I love that this movie is like no she's like she was the stunt double for Angelina Jolie Mila Jovovich and Uma Thurman she's a legend yep she was in Titanic Caitlin sorry wait what yeah she's a stuntwoman oh now you care oh now you know i've

cared this whole time she worked on titanic wow i did not know about the titanic thing wow yeah that's wild this feels great this feels great to know i feel so safe knowing that eunice was working on titanic yeah that's very exciting in In any case, she is Rhea's idol. And there's a move of hers, Eunice's signature move, the flying reverse spin kick that Rhea is trying to master, but by Ritu Arya. She is a painter. She was in art school, but she recently dropped out. She seems to be in a bit of a depressive funk. Despite that, though, the sisters have a close supportive relationship where Lina helps Ria train and make stunt videos for her channel. Did you recognize Ritu Arya from Barbie? Yes. Yes, I did.

It took me till halfway through the movie. I was like, journalist Barbie. Got it. Got it. Got it. Because I don't watch the Umbrella Academy. Anyways. That is, I think, what she's best known for, I think, these days.

But yes. So Lena helps Rhea train and make stunt videos. Rhea encourages Lena to keep doing her art. She's very supportive of her sister's artistic pursuits. Then we see Rhea at school and we meet her two best friends Clara and Alba played by Serafina Bay and Ella Bercoleri respectively these characters are the most friend friend characters of all time like they're I like that I mean it's like clearly intentional and I feel like she keeps doubling down on it she's like they've got a secret handshake. They know about screenwriting

structure. They're like, they're finishing each other's sentences. They're like the friendiest friend characters in all of friendship. And I'm not mad about it. No. I like them. It worked. Yeah. Their friendship also felt like an actual, like real friendship

because like Rhea was as weird as they were, and it wasn't like there's, like, one, you know, indie main character that somehow has, like, two entirely wild, strange best friends that are just, like, token characters. Like, it felt like an actual, real friendship, and that they would actually get along. Totally. They're great yeah i like that clara and alba are like constantly ragging on each other and like doing like playful name calling other people might not like that but i was having a fun time with it it felt very like i don't know teenage friendship yeah we're team friends and also there's like an element of like kiss already like you know just team friends it's complicated right okay so we meet them and we meet this bully girl named edith kovacs and ria and kovacs get into a fight in the middle of the school day and Rhea tries the flying reverse spin kick again during

the fight but she fails and she loses the fight Rhea goes home she and Lena live with their mom and dad who don't really get what their daughters want to do with their lives but they try their best to be supportive. Their mom, Fatima, played by Shabu Kapoor, she goes to tea with her friends, one of whom is Rahila Shah, played by Nimra Bucha. She is an intimidating woman, we'll say that. She is trying to set up her son with a nice young woman to marry i also i also want to add i've met nimra bucha in real life and she's the sweetest person yeah i have and it was it was so wild because i was like i've just seen you be like a wicked like scary person and this isn't this isn't computing for me but yeah no she was so sweet and uh i have a picture with her somewhere if you can find it send it to us and we'll put it on our instagram if you're cool with that

yeah yeah that's fine i'll send it if i find Nice. That part must have been so fun to play. I just, like, I understand why not everyone is going to love, like, the choice to go the way they did with her character. But I was like, it's so, she, when the turn takes place, it was, like, reminding me of, like, Glenn Close, Cruella de Vil. Like, she was going for it. It was awesome. Yeah, it was like reminding me of like Glenn Close Cruella de Vil. Like she was going for it. It was awesome. Yeah, it's great. And Rahila invites the Khan family to her Eid soiree at her mansion. And Rhea reluctantly goes with her family to the soiree. There, they meet Rahila's son, Salim Shah, played by Akshay Khanna. He is rich,

and he's a doctor slash geneticist. And he's handsome. And I have the biggest crush on the actor, not the character. Obviously, the character is not a good person. But I'm in love with Akshay Khanna, just so everybody knows. Anyway, and many of the women at the soiree are swooning over Salim, except for Rhea. She thinks he's a prick. She thinks he's suspicious. She notices a creepy dynamic between Salim and his mom. So she goes snooping around the house. And then she finds all these photos of young women, which seem to be like possible candidates for a future his wife. And one of the photos is her sister, Lena. So she's like, what the fuck's going on here? This is gross. And then Rhea sees Lena flirting

with Salim. And then they make plans for a date. And Rhea is super worried because she thinks that Lena getting married will mean that it will like derail her future and her like, prospects as an artist and things like that. But Lena and Salim go out on a date and they have a nice time. And then they keep going out over the next few weeks, much to Rhea's dismay, especially because Lina is no longer doing her art or helping Rhea make her stunt vids for her channel. And then Lena reveals that she and Salim are engaged. And this obviously makes Rhea very upset. So she forms a plan to take down Salim and she enlists the help of her friends, Clara and Alba.

Phase one of the plan to take down Salim is diplomacy. Good for her. Where Rhea tries to talk sense into her parents and into Lina, who reveals that once she gets married to Salim, they're moving to Singapore. Right. So the stakes are even higher. And the diplomacy thing doesn't work. So they move on to phase two which is trying to get dirt on selim this whole sequence and i like looked to the whole sequence is great i

was really interested in what nita mansour's inspirations were because i felt i was like oh this is like a Mean Girls reference and I checked and it was with the chalkboard and the turning to your friends and being like we're gonna fuck his life up I was like this is Mean Girls and she confirmed um there's like I don't know her list of inspiration was really fun she cited a lot of like she's like Jane Austen Tarantino it is every single which I do I feel like you could feel a lot of like kill bill in this she had a lot of bollywood inspiration like she just like i love reading interviews with her because it just seems like she's seen everything and she's not a snob and i just oh

i was like it's mean girls and it was yeah i've also read that she draws inspiration from jackie chan movies as well as coen brother movies edgar wright movies and old hollywood so she's seen it all wow okay so they're trying to get dirt on selim so they stage a heist where they go to the gym where he like works out. They steal his laptop. Rhea is in drag so that she can sneak into the men's locker room. They get the laptop and Clara downloads everything off of his hard drive. There's a point where Rhea takes off her disguise and kind of like interrogates Salim about his intentions with her sister. And then Lena finds out about this interaction at the gym. And she's pissed. She thinks that her sister is meddling in

her life. So they have this big, like action movie fight in the bedroom. Rhea is like, I don't know who you are anymore. The Lena I know would never give up on her art and then lena's like well really because i already did because i'm not good enough and it's implied that oh i know it's like i know how you feel there was okay there i had two instincts there where i was like you are good enough lena and i was and then i was like i had an evil thought room like well we haven't seen her art what if it sucks not really what if she's right there but no feminism she's the world's best artist she's so good but i was just like suspicious that we haven't seen any of this amazing art right we see her painting something but we like don't get a good view of it at the beginning and she also stabs it so you know kind of compromising the integrity of the piece or maybe defining it

maybe maybe she's deconstructing the form what this is me on five cups of coffee at 8 30 a.m yeah yeah it's exactly that meanwhile clara is not able to find any dirt on selim from his laptop so ria moves on to phase three a smear campaign where ria plans to plant dirt on selim by way of breaking into the shah residence and putting quote-unquote used condoms all over selim's bedroom which is really just condoms filled with so much lotion it's a bold move it's a give her credit where credit is due it's a bold move it's just funny that she doesn't seem to know how much cum gets ejaculated. Yeah, I was like, what? No, that was normal.

What creatures were on this bed? Wait, guys, is that it? That's not normal? Jamie, you might want to have your sexual partners get looked at by a doctor. That's not a regular amount of cum. Yeah, that's like a blue whale amount of cum i think and this is this is the point where i ask my mom to not watch this yeah but it's like such a good detail i just oh god i feel like i'm just gonna it's good like the

nita manzor fan hour but like she just has such a good eye for detail she's so awesome that's so funny yeah okay so and then Rhea does all of this alone because she is being an ungrateful jerk to her friends Clara and Alba so they bail while planting this incriminating evidence rhea discovers a wedding photo of salim and another woman so she thinks he's already married and rhea gets caught by rahila she's like what are you doing in my house because of course she gets caught i was like i don't know i think i was just movie pilled where i was like she's gonna going to get away. You're like, no way is she going to get away. She's like 16 and walking around with fake cum. Like she's going to get caught.

Yeah. And she does. And then her whole family comes over and they're like, what the fuck, Rhea? And then Salim explains that that photo of the other woman is his first wife who died of a heart attack during childbirth. And that's why he does the work that he does now. He's focusing on women's symptoms so that something like that won't happen again. Really awesome acting choices by Akshay Khanna here. I thought we're like this was the first time where when he's like,

no, I just care too much about, I promised I would never let a woman feel pain again. And you're like, he's lying. He's lying. He's lying. It's all a bit dramatic. I was too distracted by how hot he was. Of course.

I feel like I've seen too many of the same face here doing the same things that he does, so I'm immune. There's no... There's nothing. That makes sense. Either way, everyone is furious with Rhea, and she is devastated that she's going to be losing her sister, she feels like. Also also Lena isn't talking

to her right now. So things are messy. We then see this weird dreamlike scene where Lena is sort of half conscious and Selim is kind of hovering over her. And we're like, hmm, what's that about? And then we see Rhea going over to Rahila's house to apologize for breaking in and being messy. And Rahila is like, it's okay, come in, I'm having a spa day. But then it immediately gets weird. And Rahila is like, this wedding is going to happen. Stop trying to interfere. And there's this part where a body hair waxing scene is mapped on to a like evil mastermind in an action movie torture scene. And it's very, very funny. And so this twist, though, is like this is like where the movie starts to you're like what something's going on so fucking awesome here where i feel like there's

i was expecting at this point i'm like okay i feel like the younger sibling like all these tropes are on younger siblings they're little stink stinkers. They're projecting. You know, this movie's going to end with Rhea accepting that Lena has to move on with her life and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But they'll always love each other. But then it's like, no, all of her worst fears are true.

And the only way to get out is through martial arts that she learned on YouTube. And you're like, whoa, okay. It's so awesome. I love the twist it's great yeah so good yes so what we're about to find out because ria is freaked out and she runs off and there's another kind of like action movie fight scene where she's fighting off the spa people yeah and then she runs into this room to hide where she discovers a medical lab with all of this like freaky equipment and there are

fetuses and then there's data on her and on lena about like fertility levels and uterus strength. And Lena's numbers are really high, making her a quote unquote ideal host. And Rhea realizes that the Shahs plan to use Lena as some kind of like uterine vessel. Freaky vessel. So Rhea runs home and explains all of this to her mom, who doesn't believe Rhea and tells her to drop it. So then Rhea goes back to her friends, Clara and Alba, to apologize and enlist their help again to rescue Lena at her wedding and get her away from Salim and Rahila before they can abduct her and take her to Singapore. So they hatch a plan, but they need a way to escape. So they ask the bully girl, Kovacs, for help because she has a car. She refuses at first, but then agrees to help. So then we cut to the wedding. Rhea has been asked to perform a dance. And she does it

before she's supposed to, but that's part of the plan to distract Rahila, while Alba and Clara, who are disguised as waiters, sneak into Lena's room to chloroform her and kidnap her. And then Rahila realizes that Lena is gone. And so she and Rhea have this big showdown, during which Rhea finds out the full story of what's going on. Rahila was married off at a young age and had to sacrifice everything she wanted so selim is going to clone her and use lena's womb to host the clone baby so that rahila can start over fresh and reach her full potential and we're like yes yes exactly what wouldn't you exactly i mean i would like to start over sometimes yes i i i think that like again just a really cool reveal of her motive like she's like no i'm i don't want your sister as a baby machine but that doesn't mean i respect her bodily autonomy. And you're like, yes.

So they have this fight and Rhea effectively loses and Rahila gets her hands on Lena again and locks Rhea, Clara and Alba away. But then Kovacs comes to rescue them and freeze them. Then the wedding ceremony starts and Lena is in this daze probably from the chloroform and she doesn't really know what's going on. She's about to marry Selim, but Rhea and her friends come storming in.

Rhea now has a gun that she stole from a security guard. Also, this is a minor character, but ria's established as having a bully who has i don't like the phrase daddy issues so i i'm choosing from here here onward to call it father problems okay sure papa problems yeah she's she's got's exactly. It's just so infantilizing to say daddy issues. But I have them, but they're father problems. So she has father problems and then she returns. I like that it all comes around and now the bully is friend. Love when that happens.

But her like father problems are resolved in the space of two lines of dialogue. Like where Ria is like hey thanks and sorry about all that stuff we said about your dad not loving you and she's like it's all good i don't my my dad's a fucked up person you're like well okay cool and like that resolves in the middle of this huge set piece you're like oh good for that bully she fixed it she realized that her papa does have problems yeah and it's not her fault who's yeah exactly and she goes through all of that in the middle of an act of kidnapping and yes and i celebrate that martialial arts is always the solution. Violin is the answer. It fixes things.

Yes. Okay. So she takes everyone at the wedding hostage with this gun she has. clone of Rahila into her uterus, which triggers some memories for Lena of like these weird and invasive experiments that Selim was doing on her. And so she's like, whoa, my sister's right. And then Rhea and Lena and their family and friends fight back against everyone else at the wedding. So there's like this big fight. And then there's the final showdown between Rhea and Lena and Raheela and Selim, basically the Khans versus the Shahs. And Rhea finally does the flying reverse spin kick to defeat Raheela. Meanwhile,

Lena is kicking the shit out of Selimim and then the sisters drive off and they make amends and then they go get burgers at a diner and then ria gets an email from eunice hoodheart inviting her to brunch and they all live happily ever after so that's the movie let's take another quick break and we'll come back to discuss. Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16th, 2017, was murdered. There are crooks everywhere you look now. The situation is desperate. My name is Manuel Delia. I am one of the hosts of Crooks Everywhere, a podcast that unhearts the plot to murder a one-woman Wikileaks. Daphne exposed the culture of crime and corruption that were turning her beloved country into a mafia state. And she paid the ultimate price. Listen to Crooks everywhere on the iHeartRadio app,

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BPM 110. 120. She's terrified. Should we wake her up? Absolutely not. What was that? You didn't figure it out? I think I need to hear you say it. That was live audio of a woman's nightmare. This machine is approved and everything?

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this spectacular sport from its inception in the United States to how it became a global symbol of Mexican culture. We'll learn more about some of the most iconic heroes in the ring. This is Lucha Libre Behind the Mask. Listen to Lucha Libre Behind the Mask as part of My Cultura Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you stream podcasts. And we are back. Right. so where shall we begin there's lots to talk about so much yeah pita where would you like to start um let's talk about the sisters i mean like yeah there's barely like any content out there on sisters and it's so like like for a movie that passes the Bechdel test like this is like such a goldmine to start with like sister relationships are so like I love that this was

like a like a shadi which means wedding like wedding based movie but like based around women's relationships and sister relationships because there's so much conversation around weddings that revolves around women's relationships and how they're affected and how they're traumatized by it and there's such little representation of that that corner specifically like the sister corner of like what weddings and shawtees result in and it's like like i i love that the the sister dynamic was so turbulent and so chaotic and it wasn't like sanitized and like the fight scene was so like like i was like what is going on it's intense yeah they're like bashing each other's heads against broken glass they destroy their

parents house like it's it's great it's yeah it's it's messed up and like i i love that it's so messed up and nita manzour does this thing where like she doesn't shy away from anything ugly or messed up and like the choices that she makes are so interesting like to have the like this gigantic action scene with like shattering glass and screaming and blood be about like the relationship between two sisters says like so much about their relationship and it isn't like oh you know we love each other we support each other like that relationship has so much to cover and I'm glad that like she she took the initiative to show all the the kind of complex shades in that relationship and like

like I I love so much that in that specific fight as well, like she was just like, oh, he thinks he knows you or something. And he says you're kind, but like, you're arrogant, you're egotistical, and you're an artist. And like, it's, it's so true that like, like, there's this thing with sisters where they just like know each other so well. And I don't know, I don't know that anybody else will be able to especially not like men yeah and i i love that they're so unwaveringly supportive of each other's interests like yeah even when they're being assholes to each other yeah yeah and it's really cool to see because like you know they're they're, they're in the same generation. And so they're like, all right, I get it, you want to be a stunt woman. This is not something that our parents really understand, or are that supportive of. And then the other sister wants to be an artist. Similarly, their parents are like, going to art school isn't serious, and you were brave for dropping out. So there's this, you know, generational gap where their parents don't really understand their interests, but the two sisters

are supportive of each other because they kind of have to be because their parents are not really on board. So that was really cool to see. I feel like that's a very relatable thing. Yeah, I just I love that we see the supportive side of it the loving side of it but also the very messy them bashing each other against walls and stuff but also it's revealed that like it probably didn't happen as violently as it seems to be on screen because then cut to the next scene and Rhea doesn't have any of the blood on her anymore or any of like the cuts so it's like very exaggerated like it's magic yeah yeah I really I mean I thought that it just I mean just I agree with everything you both said I

wanted to also add I don't know I really like the older younger sister dynamic going on because even though I don't I I don't have I mean I have I grew up with all my cousins and I feel like I had a couple different older sister you know figures that I was constantly like admiring but arguing with and you know projecting onto and all this stuff and I think it's like really well built out where it's like and Rhea eventually understands this and vocalizes this. But like she is, first of all, afraid for her sister because she views her sister entering this relationship, which I think is convincingly like this relationship might not suck at the beginning. Those early scenes are very convincing. But I think that it makes total sense that Rhea is like,

well, if this could happen to you, this could happen to me. And I don't want this. And so I will fight against it with everything I've got. And it just felt like such a specific little sister mentality and clearly comes from love and to some extent being naive but then also she ends up being totally correct uh so i don't know like it's it's a little like you can you can see it a lot of ways but i just like yeah their their relationship was cool and i liked that you know even though uh it turns out he was doing evil

experiments on her in the night time uh that lena is very you know like stands her ground and you know i don't know they're both smart and which is why they're always arguing uh right i just yeah i thought like the very particular older younger sister dynamic was like very clear very specific and and i just love where i feel like it's a difficult especially in a comedy for like the characters to be developed through action scenes but that is happening in almost every scene it's great i know i love it, just to like, zoom out a little bit, like this movie, like you said, it focuses so much on women and their relationships with each other. Because not only do we have this sister dynamic, we've got a focus on friendships among women with Rhea and her friends, and then the bully girl becomes their friend. We also have a mother-daughter dynamic where like their father is present in the story, but he gets way less screen time than their mom, Fatima. So I like that that is like given focus. And I mean, just in general, like this is representation we rarely see in Western movies of, you know, brown Muslim women.

The movie was written and directed by brown Muslim women. Again, it focuses on women. It focuses on women in action where women are are like, doing the action, and that's moving the story forward, which is usually not what we see in action movies. It's women being funny and generating the humor. Again, it shouldn't be a rare thing. But like, comedy movies often don't let women be the funny ones or have jokes. And all of the humor in this movie derives from the women and their antics. And I don't know. There's just so much to love.

Sorry, I just had to like give a list. It rocks. No, that's so like that's so true. I was thinking about the Bechdel test again while you were saying this. Like I think this one like actually wins because it's like there's it's not like that's so true i was thinking about the battle test again while you were saying this like i think this one like actually wins because it's like there's it's it's not like there's like a conversation with two women like there's no man like there's no men doing any like women did all the fighting i think there was maybe like so i wrote this in the article the first time around then the second time around when i watched it like i realized there's maybe like one tiny shot of like a dude kicking someone from the distance and that's it like that's

that's the representation that men fighting get and like it's so cool to like see that like okay the protagonist and like the leader the driver is a woman and then the her rival like the evil wicked nemesis that she has is also a woman and that power just like revolves around women characters and all of the the side characters that have like narratives and storylines alongside all of this also women and it's it's so refreshing to see that we didn't need to see like any men's arcs like Salim didn't like I mean yes like he sucks he's terrible and like well I feel like we need a section on mama's boys but like he didn't do much like there wasn't even an arc like with Raheela I think there's still like an arc like where you got to know her a

little bit like with Salim it's like in the first instance where like Rhea catches him at the Eid party and you see like kind of his dynamic with the mom like you're like okay mama's boy and that's just essentially I mean it grows more horrendous but that's that's what it is and and with Raheela we still get like a little bit of an arc we learn her backstory and I'm glad that like for once it isn't like women that get like a really cheap side narrative that ends up tying the whole story together in the end, just for convenience. And it's like the convenience storylines were the men and the drivers were the women. And that's, I think that's really cool. Salim is just a puppet of Raheela's. She's like, do my bidding, son.

Right. like do my bidding son right i wanted to i i wanted to float this because it's uh i i don't know if it's a if it's a stereotype or a stock character that we've talked about on the show before but just because i saw i mean for the most part the reviews of this movie were glowing incredible and like i don't know i am hard pressed to pressed to criticize it because I feel like it's just like so much shit that I'm like, I don't want there to be any. But I did see a little bit of criticism around the Selim character as falling into stereotypes around South Asian men

as being mama's boys and a few other characters being cited. I don't feel like I'm sort of able to intelligently comment on it but I just wanted to I guess float that I'd seen that and yeah so I like I mean I don't think we have like enough representation of like South Asian people on a global platform for us to for me to even like make a decision about whether this is a stereotype because we don't even get this kind of representation so like this is a celebration for me and i think that it did like so many things right and um like there is an existing stereotype of of mama's boys in south asia that's like in

pakistan it's very very prevalent amongst like like it is an existing stereotype that i have ranted about to my friends like countless times and there have been there's there's been so many examples so i i wouldn't like i i have some qualms with the film but i don't think this would be it because i was like yes this is i've seen like 70 of of saleem like maybe yesterday at the mall that's the thing some tropes are born from reality I felt the same way to some extent about Rahila as yeah the villain and some of the tropes that are employed there because but I but I mixed feelings about it. Because on one hand, kind of on the surface, you could read it as, oh, it's an older woman who is resentful of younger women, and she wants to relive her youth and all of this stuff. It is contextualized, because we learn that she was married off, kind of against

her will, as a young woman. She presumably got pregnant soon after with Salim, and basically just didn't have the opportunity to live the life she wanted to live, and to realize her full potential. And totally fair to resent that, but she does it at the expense of another woman's body and autonomy. But that's why she's the villain and like framed as the villain. The movie is obviously recognizing that that's bad, but I don't know. It's tricky. Maybe I just wish we knew more, a little more about her backstory and a little more about what she did want to do, like what potential she wanted to try to achieve. That could have been an easy place to even connect, like, did she want to be an artist? Like, they would like sort of connect her story to Lena's a little bit.

Yeah, I had the same thought i i get like i i it sucks because i'm like oh but she's so i love how evil she is i like and i and i love like the big action the big boss is very rarely a woman much less like a woman who's like over 40 or 50 or whatever. Who knows how old? But like, you know, like a grown woman villain is awesome. And also I feel like it comes, yeah, like with all of this baggage that you sort of have to untangle. I think it like probably could have been handled

a little better. I like that there was at least an attempt to contextualize it. And like it played on the idea that, you know, she and Salim are really invested in, you know, almost forcing Lena to reproduce. But then the reveal that it's like the evil thing about her

is that she is so like she is so hurt that she didn't get an opportunity to live out her potential that she has no issue with opportunity to live out her potential that she has no issue with taking that from someone else so i felt like that like got around some of the tropiness but it definitely it's like you can't avoid it it's for sure there i just like i just do love it so much so it almost feels like the modern update of the evil queen in snow white kind of thing yeah like it's step like a evil mother-in-law stepmother kind of thing yeah and it's definitely more contextualized than it is in those you know like evil stepmommy fairy tale

movies but i can't every time watch it, it does rub me the wrong way a little bit. But then I listened to an interview with the writer director, Nita Mansoor in NPR, where when asked what she wanted to explore by writing a villain who's a woman. Nita says, it's been the women who've uplifted me the most in my life, but who've also cut me down the hardest. There's something about the pain of a woman critiquing another woman that hurts more than when a man does it. Like you should be on my my team it just cuts deep on a whole other level and so for me i'm most interested in seeing the matriarch who upholds the patriarchy the dark feminine is so beautiful because it's something that we have to quash we've had to deny getting

to show the light and the dark sitting together was really so exciting for me. Unquote. So yeah, that whole interview is like, is so insightful and thoughtful. And like, I don't know. I think with that, I'm like, you know,

let her cook. I don't know. Right. Especially because yes, Rekhila is framed as this, you know, like overbearing mother who has created this, like, mama's boy son and all of that. But we don't see those same tropes applied to Rhea and Lena's

parents. And that's also something that Nita Mansour spoke about in this interview. She said how she deliberately wanted to subvert the trope of the like super strict immigrant parents for Rhea and Lena's parents. She says, quote, it was so important for me to see the parents kind of occupy this very nuanced space of loving and supporting their children, but also being worried for them and nudging them in a certain direction. The film is joyful because our stories can be more than just sad and traumatic. They're full of joy and nuance, unquote. So again, yeah, like the trauma that a lot of us feel based on what our parents are trying to kind of foist us into or the direction parents want their kids lives to take is traumatic in many cases and so the director wanted to avoid that for

at least with Rhea and Lena's parents where again they like they're trying to be supportive they don't really get what their daughters want to do but they're just like we'll let it happen and we can't do much about it so yeah it's like a very common like parent experience where they're like all right get it out of your system and then grow up where yeah yeah my mom was like wait you want to get another degree in film you already have one and I was like trust me mom this is gonna work and look at me now I host the Bechdel cast it's true anyway amazing I love it um what else I guess I just wanted to talk a little bit more about Rhea. I mean, I've got nothing bad to say about Rhea. I love her so much.

I like that she has the, out of everyone, she has like the, you know, most fully built out world. I like that we get to know her friends. We don't get to know her friends super well because they are i feel like that's almost the joke of them is like they know all about movie they they know how movies work because they're characters in a movie uh so you kind of don't find out more about them uh you actually get more context with her bully but i I really like how Rhea it it's like like subtly sort of placing her between two worlds where she is being like teased at school and like teased for wanting to be a stunt woman but there is like prejudice and there's like racism cooked into that because they're like well you should be

a doctor actually and she's like no I'm gonna be a step from it and then like she's also not getting support for that dream at home but for a totally different reason and like she's having it's I mean obviously I cannot speak from experience but it seems like a fairly common like diaspora kid experience where you're kind of taking criticism and shit from all sides and have to be processing it in real time from all sides and have to be processing it in real time while also just like trying to be yourself and do your thing. And Rhea,

like she's just the coolest. I feel like she's just the, the blueprint. And I like that. She's a fucking weirdo and not in a, like, not like other girls kind of weirdo. Like she's a weirdo who hangs out with weirdos

and people treat her like she's weird because she is. And you're like, this is the, but we love her. And like, I don't know. I just, I really, really love that character. Same. And just like big sister obsession. It's like, it's such a, such a thing. And then on Lena's end, I like,

I mean that she's like clearly dealing with some depression maybe because she's a bad artist we don't know uh but also that like the fact that she she's not like well i guess she kind of is quote-unquote punished but like the movie doesn't look down on her for wanting love or relationship and even though obviously selim is not the one the guy for her and perhaps should be locked away from people um i i like that i don't know you're left in like an optimistic place with her and that it, that weirdly like Lena's ending after this, like completely wild sequence that had all these reveals about bodily autonomy and like viewing women's bodies as property and things to be

controlled and blah, blah, blah. And, uh, and then at the end, she's like, I don't know.

I'm just going to like take some time off and figure it out. And you're like, wow, very pragmatic after everything we just saw. It's really nice. Yeah, I love that too. And I also think that it's cool that there's no real like love story or romantic subplot excluding like the Salim of it all which he had me going he had me going I have to say I mean because this is a tricky little thing that happens sometimes where a man will seem like an ally because for example Salim is like, I care about symptoms that affect women.

And he isn't bothered by period blood. I hate that I fell through. I was like, wow, he doesn't think her period is gross. And you're like, what is this bar, Jamie? Come on. The bar is so low. It's actually so sad. It's so sad.

I know. It's depressing. low it's actually so sad it's so i know sad depressing but it makes him seem like an ally which i think is a smart writing choice because it throws the audience off the scent of all this freaky stuff that's happening behind the scenes like as soon as the like with the period thing that happened and like you know at some point like when they're on a dinner date and he goes like oh you know you don't have to you don't have to do what your parents want like you can take your time to figure it out and then like nida manzoor like plants these kind of like oh you can maybe trust this guy but then it's just like like it was an entire like get out-esque flip and like what i what I remembered from these little scenes was like,

can go like in Barbie learning about how like the patriarchy has gotten really smart and like they know how to cover it up. I was like, they really do. This is wild. A lot of men are now weaponizing the facade of being an ally or like feminist language to manipulate people oh my god like this is i cannot like the number of men that are resharing like anti-harassment laws and like the same men that are sending unsolicited images yeah this is a whole world

dude i've been feeling the same way we're like i don't know and i feel like this exists across a lot of different issues where people are learning the like i think mental health is a something that clicks for me a lot of time like people are learning the like therapy language and then weaponizing it to do something fucked up i was it i like wow i was like it maybe it's just early but i was like i was in a relationship like that where it was like a guy knew therapy words but then was using it to gaslight me you know or you're just like wait what is this yeah and i feel like yeah the the language of of feminism i think the issue exists around race as well where it's you're just like wait what is this yeah and i feel like yeah the the language of feminism i think the issue exists around race as well where it's just like people know what to say but their actions it's not squaring and i feel like we're conditioned to expect so little of

people that it's easy to get away with and sad but true i fell for salim's trick i was so disappointed in myself i was like i would have fallen for this in real life if he was like no your period is normal i'd be like really you think so oh bleak yeah it is it's very bleak. Thank you. But aside from that, like, faux romance that doesn't end up actually being a romance between Selim and Lina, there's no other romantic subplot. aren't given any kind of little like love story or anything which is also rare for i mean most genres but action movies the protagonist usually has some kind of love interest but that's not the case for this movie especially if they're like a young like teenage like in high school college i feel like it's almost a given right and we And we're not saying that, you know, romantic subplots are inherently bad or anything like that.

But so many of them just feel wedged in or they feel patronizing because it's like, well, this is a movie starring a bunch of really tough men. How would a woman ever like a movie like this? Well, let's put in a romantic storyline so that women can come and watch it and enjoy it because women love love and men love punching or whatever yeah like a very focused test like we just covered herbie fully loaded the other day where there's a very like shoehorned, well, of course, young woman and young man need to kiss. And it's like, clearly the Lindsay Lohan character wants to have sex with Herbie the car. You're getting in the way of the story by forcing this random relationship.

This is a love story about a beautiful woman and her elderly car. It's so true. Yes. This is a love story about a beautiful woman and her elderly car. It's so true. Yes. Anyways. Anyways. The sixth cup of coffee is really kicking in. I have had no coffee.

So my brain is still soup. Between gray. I like just again, I really uh appreciated nida manzur's uh commentary on the parents i liked i feel like the parents were like it was such a good balance of parents and another like teen comedy trope i feel like is to like turn the parents up to a 15 and make them super kooky and super over the top and like i don't know I always think of I don't know why I'm always like the parents and that's so Raven but like parents that are so or just Disney Channel parents in general where they're so kooky that you're like how does this person function like what do they do at work they're always falling and while there are like slapsticky really like physical comedy

here I like that the parents are fairly grounded. You don't get a lot of dad and I'm not complaining about it. But I like that like during, you know, like Rhea's diplomacy attempt that you get a really clear idea of who her dad is and how he's squaring like generation differences, how he's squaring cultural differences and basically talking about weddings like they're math and you're like yeah that feels very dad coded he's like actually the love portfolio is even when you were you're like all right and then mom gets precedence not only in the like i like that fatima gets that big action moment where she whacks, you know, Cruella on the head with a big heavy chair and that rocks.

But also she gets like little moments. I really liked the moment where, you know, Rhea is getting in trouble right and left because she's planting mayonnaise cum in other people's houses. But you get like a sweet moment with her and her mom where her mom is like i understand why this is happening and like i love you but you've got to make it right which does inadvertently put her daughter into the scary dexter's lab thing but i i don't know i just like this movie is so well balanced where like things could get so off the rails, but there are enough like grounded moments and like really sweet relationships that all of it feels earned. It's nice.

Yeah. You like, you said something earlier about like attention to detail as like a, a directorial trait that Neda Manzoor has. And like, she's, she like this film does feel really well balanced like there were these like small moments with the mom like I really like one that somehow has stuck with me is like when she comes into the kitchen and she's like oh is is the scarf

too much and like that just felt like such a such a regular person anxiety especially for moms and like just like what you were saying about how parents are so kooky and strange in a lot of these comedy films and like this parent actually felt like a real person and i'm so glad that she did because it's also like there are already enough tropes about brown parents and like how they are with their kids and this really like this felt like there was love there like um and we barely get to see that so it's nice yeah also fatima's dealing with something where she's clearly like trying to fit in with the other moms in her community and like she wants to be seen as like, cool and hot and fun. And, you know, she's like, I want to be friends with the popular moms.

And she's like trying to get into that group. And it's like the same stuff we were doing as teenagers. And I feel like it does kind of keep happening throughout our lives so wait do you guys do you guys know about like kitty party culture in south asia like i don't know if you know about what kitty parties are no not really no so there's like so they really got this like kind of accurate where like i mean it happens here as well but in the diaspora there's like this i i mean like now it's it's prevalent everywhere but like there's a super south asian thing called kiddie parties and it's where like moms kind of gather and they do their little like teas and brunches and whatever and they come and get

together and they just they're when i when i go out to lunch and there's a kiddie party going on it'll be like super loud and everybody will be complaining about their husbands or talking about their kids or doing something and it's like sometimes it's like it's really fun and wholesome to see but a lot of the time it's also like there's a lot of judgment and there's a lot of like interesting polite society-esque dynamics that happen in these kiddie parties. So I'm glad that like she took that concept and put it in a movie because it's a real thing where like moms are also trying to fit in in these specific situations and are recreating those teenage childhood dynamics because there's like an incompleteness that they're also trying to fulfill with like everything that's going on with their husbands at home with

their children and it's just yeah a space to air it out but also a space where they need to police themselves and right kind of exhibit who can be the the most polite or the most like put together the best trophy wife or you know those kinds of things yeah that's that's really fast yeah i i i didn't know about that it's it sounds like in in the way that that like manifests in the story, it is very, it feels like just so many upper class stories like across the board of just like very nicely criticizing your daughter's body. Like really like, they're like, no, this is actually normal. And this is what people in our like class and stature do of course we're policing women's bodies which i mean you know salim's mom is doing at the highest possible level but like a little bit of like internalized misogyny which i guess you know nita manzoor was

like uh sorry i keep saying her name right nitaita Manzoor was saying in the interview as well about like how it really hurts when it comes from a maternal figure who theoretically has very likely experienced that same thing. I like that their mom doesn't fit in because like why would, like she's, look how weird her daughters are.

Of course, she's like a little weird like i like i like it yeah and and on that note of gently judging someone's body uh there's a moment in the movie where fatima is body shaming a friend's daughter and i like that you see her daughters challenge that and say, whoa, mom, not cool. Like don't body shame. I feel like that is undercut by an earlier moment where Rhea makes a fat, shamey comment about someone. I can't remember exactly who she's talking about, but there's some body shaming comment. But at the very least, I like that you see representation on screen of body shaming and fat shaming being challenged. And I appreciated that. Does anyone have anything else they'd like to talk about?

How do you guys feel about about the dance scene that Rhea did at the wedding? I loved it. I thought it was beautiful and fun and exciting. And oh, something that you mentioned in your piece, and I also appreciated a lot, was the fact that a lot of the action is happening while they're wearing these beautiful, ornate dresses. That's something you never see. Because even when in the rare example where a woman is allowed to do action in an action movie, she's often characterized as having kind of like masculine features or wearing masculine coated clothing or something that kind of like makes her one of the guys. Yes. Or worse, like one of the guys from a very male gaze-y perspective of like,

I mean, we've talked about this in a lot of early episodes where it's like combat clothes that are like wildly unsafe and like favoring the male gaze where you're like, oh, she would be gone. She's a goner if this is the real world. Yeah. And to be clear, I'm, of course, not criticizing women who dress in a masculine way or anything like that. Obviously, people of all genders can present any way they want. I'm just commenting on the tropes of how women tend to be portrayed in action movies and the usually rigid

and gendered implications those tropes have. That's just what I meant by that. And then again, as far as action movies go, you rarely see any example of like femininity being attached to an action moment. And so when she's like flipping around and the dress is flowing and it's so beautiful, I just loved it. Yeah. That's so, that's so true. Like I, I'm seeing that connection so clearly now. And there's also like bride tropes around this and in our culture where it's like, you know, a lot of the time brides are told to kind of like walk very slowly, look down, not smile.

And then they're covered in these really, really heavy dresses where they're barely even able to move. And it's like, I mean, that can be be a bit dramatic that doesn't happen all the time but this is like a real trope that happens like significantly and it's like so it was so it was so nice to see like women dressed in these shadi outfits be so mobile and so free and so like you know like not restricted in their movement and making their own choices and and looking fierce and even like drawing blood and like it was it was so cool to see all of that packed into this like one image of the bride which is supposed to be just like pretty and quiet and immobile and like it was just it was so nice to see that like completely shattered totally and also gives us another iconic the bride combat sequence it's oh like in kill bill kill bill three baby i love a fighting bride

and that like i liked that because i i was wondering because it is like thoroughly established like lena also is a great fighter and we see it in like you're saying caitlin like or like you said earlier like kind of this heightened sequence where you're like did it actually happen but then at the wedding it's like she'd better get to fucking fight and she does and it's great because she helps ria train so yeah she's like picked up some fighting skills along the way she's got the juice yeah that like just the whole like act three climax battle sequence was just it's beautiful and then they have burgers at the end they're chowing down again something as little as like seeing women eat on screen shouldn't be this like monumental thing but they're like again chowing

down on some hefty burgers i that like i mean i i love obviously seeing women eat i have no problem with uh i feel like i've like made fun of i don't think the thing i've made fun of applies to this because it was like that is just also a funny joke of like oh yeah they're they were supposed to be at a wedding like of course they're fucking starved and also they just like kicked a million people's asses um i was thinking more of i do you remember uh like how the menu ends and how anya taylor joy is pensively eating a cheeseburger she's like hot girl eating cheeseburger thinking about all she's learned i'm like rolling my eyes but those are usually written by men almost without fail yeah this was great and i just love that the movie ends with them together it's really nice i know yeah like after after you mentioned

the hamburger thing i so the movie ends with them eating but it also kind of starts I mean it starts with Rhea in the karate room the rotisserie chicken yes oh my god I love that we see Lina stab her art and then just go eat a rotisserie chicken on the floor

it's really beautiful bending over and it's like really like she's hit rock bottom and like i'm glad that it's on screen because i've been there yeah and then a couple moms see her and recognize her and she like cowers away in a little corner but then she keeps eating that's great oh it's so funny this movie is so funny it is it like i i i love how like there's so many like wild hilarious moments where like i feel like her her quick cuts are so funny like where where the mom's at a party and then someone asks like oh how are your daughters and it just cuts to them like jamming out to some song. To like the Chemical Brothers.

Great. Yeah. Or like when Rhea is like, there is no chance in hell. I'm going to go to some hoity-toity Eid soiree and then smash cut to them at the Eid soiree. It's good. It's good filmmaking. I love it. It is.

And it most definitely, I mean, I feel like it's, you've listened to the episode at this point, listeners, you know, it passes the Bechdel test. It passes the Bechdel test. Basically, every exchange that isn't about Salim and Rhea's suspicions around Salim passes the Bechdel test. I don't even think it's necessary to like rattle off which matches it's basically between every pair of women in the movie it passes the Bechdel test at some point and even when they are talking about men it's like stay away from that man he's scary yeah which

I feel like it doesn't pass the Bechdel test but i feel like there's some exceptions that you could make where it's like it's okay to talk about men if you're criticizing their bad behavior and or advising that you stay away from them yeah yeah i mean it's like it's the whole movie like spiritually and actually definitely passes the Bechdel test with flying colors. Yes. But. But our nipple scale.

What about the most important media metric of all time, the Bechdel cast nipple scale? Our scale where we rate the movie zero to five nipples based on examining it through an intersectional feminist lens. This is a high one. This gets high marks. I think I'm going to go four and a half. I'm going to take off a little bit of nipplage for that leaning into the trope of like the evil older woman who resents the younger generation. Yes, it is contextualized, but because it's rooted in so much, I don't know, just kind of nasty tropey lore. Again, it always kind of rubs me the wrong way. But as Nidamansur points out, like, there are women who uphold patriarchal standards,

and there are women who cut other women down. And just because we're living in a slightly more enlightened time in 2024 doesn't mean that there aren't women who are very much upholders of the patriarchy. And Rahila is a woman who will gladly sacrifice another woman's freedom and autonomy so that she can try to have her own. So I don't know. Maybe I'll bump it up to 4.75. There's so much else that this movie is doing as far as representation and inclusion.

And again, it's an example of a movie about brown Muslim women written and directed by a brown Muslim woman drawing from her own perspective and experience and representing these characters on her terms, which is why the representation is so thoughtful and authentic. And again, it's a story about women and their relationships, and women looking out for each other, minus Rahila. And, and it's so funny. And it lets women be funny. It lets women do action. And I think it's awesome. 4.75 nipples.

And I will split them between Nida Mansour, Ritu Arya, Priya Kansara. Ooh, who else? Oh, I love her friends too. Oh, and I have to give a little tiny nipple to my crush akshay khanna so i know that didn't make any sense math wise but the live uh i'm gonna i'm gonna go 4.5 for this i'll dock it for for the same reason it's sort of un-get-aroundable but also i'm just like, I simply don't have the energy to be that mad about it because this movie is doing so much else. I really appreciated the context

that Nita Manzoor gave for making that choice. And it's just like such an amazing performance that I don't know, it's hard to be mad at it. I feel like this is like entering, definitely entering like one of my favorite comedies I've ever seen. I think like, I can't wait to this just feels like such a, like future comfort movie for me.

It's great. Yeah. I mean, I feel like we've sort of covered it, but yeah, I think just like developing a very funny, very genuine sister relationship via kicking each other's asses and the asses of others is a beautiful thing. And I'm never mad to see it.

I am just like such a big Nita Manzoor fan. And I can't wait to see what she does next. I know. Four and a half nipples. I'm giving them all to Nita. I think that she deserves it. And I hope we get a season two of Lady Parts or just she gets to make whatever she wants.

Like, whatever. She's great. She's so great. Pire, how about you? So I'm torn between like a 4.5 and a 4.75. I'm gonna like list my reasons and then ultimately pick one. But like, this is such

a like a fun movie. It made me like get up and go to the gym after three weeks of skipping the gym. And I was like, I'm intellectually above all the men in this room who are probably all mama's boys. And it was it felt so so powerful to have seen this movie and then to be moving around my room and doing things. Like I felt like I had like a force with me. And I think she like Nida Manzoor does like an excellent job of giving women that power because it's just so refreshing. There's so much to collect that power from, like from all the relationships that we see grow throughout the movie from all the relations like from all the characters that we see driving the narrative and fighting and kicking each other and like even from all the the ugly representations of women that we see that we

that we don't get to see usually like there was nothing on that screen that was satisfying an old dude alone in his room like this was this was for us and it felt yeah so cathartic and amazing and like there were also so many like little interesting subversions that she did like when the girls were fighting they were insulting each other's dads and i was thinking about how when men fight they try to insult each other's moms and like there's so much she did to like pick out the ridiculousness of like gender tropes that we have and she does such a good job with it and also the the comedy was so amazing like the when ria's in drag and she has the mustache on and she's doing a walk it's yes and how like and just like the zooms and the and the pans and the like bird

sound effects like it felt like i was reading a comic and it was it was so much fun and i i barely ever get to see things like this and um i i will say i wanted like although like rahila may some like you know we didn't get enough of her character for it to feel completely like complex and non-tropey but like i i will say that i i like that like there was this completely evil witch figure that could also embody like kind of like how evil the patriarchy can be when like you know women get control of it and it's like like we we don't we don't often get to see like the control that women have and often it's like patriarchy is an oppressive tool towards

all genders but it's like i like that there was a side of women that we got to see where like she was smart enough to kind of manipulate that system to get what she wanted out of it and there was an entire evil character built around that and it's like the men were just lazy and dumb and privileged and the women were the people that really knew this system well enough because it screwed them over but it also like there was enough room for them to resist and we don't get to see that often so i like that she she took up an entirely evil role because like in keeping with the the comic book type feel of the movie like it felt like we really needed a full villain and like a full protagonist and like we got like a her versus her story that felt really like like something I'd never seen before so I like I liked

it for that reason I think I I'm like I'm lowering half a nipple for maybe like like I wanted to see a little bit more authenticity with like maybe the the parents and children dynamic I felt like so something that like I I'm such a huge fan of Nidam and Zuhur's content but I feel like sometimes like these relationships feel a little bit like like I I love that there's love there we barely get to see that but there's also like like you know how are these kids swearing in front of their parents as like brown teenagers i want to know where are these cheat codes i want them like there's this never happens this is not a thing and it's like especially like with the kinds of parents that like you know they had where they of parents that like you know they had

where they're kind of like you know they are a little bit traditional even if they're they have love and they want good things for their children like I wanted a little bit of that authenticity there because like um I think that was like the one thing that was kind of missing but it was also so much fun that I don't I'm fine with it and then I wanted to like kind of forgive that again and give it a 4.75 because um so I don't know if you guys know or have if you've heard the song or if you had heard the song in the dance scene before this movie but it's like a really really iconic Bollywood song it's called um Mar Dala and it's about like so originally it was in this iconic bollywood movie that like everyone has seen in their childhood when probably when they're when

they weren't supposed to have seen it but like it's called devdas and um the the song mar dala like in devdas there's a woman who does this dance to mar dala and she's like she's supposed to be the other woman and she's actually like a sex worker and she does this iconic dance um the actress madhuri diksit is this like incredible icon in bollywood especially for dance and she plays this this sex worker in the scene where she dances to mar dala and it it's like like there's i mean that film is iconic in its own right but it also has like a lot of like that's a an entirely different discussion but what was so compelling was that everybody remembered this one song and this one dance that this sex worker was doing and it's like

i find it so amazing that nida manzoor was like this is the song that I'm going to honor from all of Bollywood and I'm gonna get Rhea to die because it's like Rhea is a little bit like the other woman figure in this movie like not in the sense that she's competing for Salim but in the sense that she's the the rival to the to the main uh relationship she is trying to interfere with the romance. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So I like I find it so cool that she found a way to honor like that. Wow. Iconic performance that that's been so timeless and that like we still dance at the weddings. And yeah, I didn't even I didn't know that there were that many layers to that choice.

That's so cool. Thank you for telling us. Her web does connect them all it's true it's nitamanzor's web it connects us all yeah um sorry are you landing on 4.75 nipples i think so i think so i'm gonna end with 4.75 amazing oh i love it when a movie scores very highly on the nipple scale because it almost never happens. Yay! A new classic in the Bechtelcast pantheon. So true. And thank you for joining us on this discussion. Where can people follow you and check out your work, your writing, anything like that? I'm notoriously horrible at advertising everything I do. But I have one Instagram page where, so it's called conspiracies. It has my name in it. Like,

it's a pun for conspiracies. And that's where I put out most of my music. And in my bio, there's a link tree. I barely use social media, but like, please go, go follow that for occasional yearly posting. Amazing. And we'll link your piece that you wrote about this movie in the description of this episode. And yeah, thank you again for joining us. Come back anytime.

This was so much fun. I had so much fun. Yay. I just love this I love this movie you can find us in all the regular places you can find us on Instagram and Twitter

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and with that uh let's get cheeseburgers and get an email from our hero oh my god i'd love to all right brunch brunch with eunice let's go yes amazing bye the bechdel cast is a production of i heart mediaMedia, hosted by Caitlin Durante and Jamie Loftus, produced by Sophie Lichterman, edited by Mo Laborde. Our theme song was composed by Mike Kaplan with vocals by Catherine Voskrosensky. Our logo and merch is designed by Jamie Loftus, and a special thanks to Aristotle Acevedo. For more information about the podcast, please visit linktree.com. Daphne Caruana Galizia was a Maltese investigative journalist who on October 16, 2017, was assassinated.

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