Whiskey Ginger with Andrew Santino - Harry Mack

Episode Date: July 8, 2022

Santino sits down with freestyle rapper Harry Mack about his story, his improvisation technique, his influences in hip hop, and much much more! Freestyle Instrumental: 1) 'Flow Dope' Prod. Hiradello Beats - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfHpeHvy7BI Harry Mack's Prom Night in DC | Guerrilla Bars 25 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fShjMXWu6kU&t=101s COME SEE ME ON TOUR!!! https://www.andrewsantino.com ORDER SOME MERCH!!! andrewsantinostore.com Join our Patreon : https://www.patreon.com/whiskeygingerpodcast ======================================================== SUPPORT OUR SPONSORS! SQUARE SPACE Get that site up and running now! 10% off your order https://squarespace.com/whiskey BETTER HELP Get the help you need from a licensed professional 10% off your first month https://betterhelp.com/whiskey SIMPLISAFE Get that house secured 20% off entire system and first month FREE https://simplisafe.com/whiskey Follow Santino on Insta and Twitter: https://www.instagram.com/cheetosantino/ https://twitter.com/CheetoSantino Whiskey Ginger Insta and Twitter: https://www.instagram.com/whiskeygingerpodcast/ & https://twitter.com/whiskeyginger_ Whiskey Ginger Clips: http://www.youtube.com/c/WhiskeyGingerPodcastClips Produced and edited by Joe Faria #harrymack #whiskeyginger #andrewsantino #podcast Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Your fans, welcome back to the show. If it's your first time joining the show, welcome to the show. We got a good one for you today. Like my man, Steve Harvey done say, it's my man, H-Mac, Harry Mac. This dude is incredible. One of the best freestylers I've seen on the interwebs. You need to check out Harry Mac, Harry Mac official, H-Mac. His freestyles are all over YouTube, on TikTok, on Twitter.

I think he's so brilliant, so good at his craft, his skill. And he's super fun to watch, and a very cool dude. Go check him out. He's jumping around the country. He's still doing shows and touring and doing his thing. I'm done touring. I'm not doing any of that, hopefully, until we shoot a special, but I'll keep you posted on all of that jazz. Enough rambling from your boy. Like, subscribe, share this with people. Please leave a comment for the algorithm. As we were. We really appreciate you, man. I really do.

I love doing this show. I love bringing it to you every week. We haven't missed in four years now almost. So thank you so much for watching. Enough rambling from your boy. Let's go to the episode. In here, we pour whisk, whisk, whisk, whisk, whisk. You're that creature in the ginger beard.

Sturdy and ginger. Like vampires, the ginger gene is a curse. Gingers are beautiful. You owe me $5 for the whiskey and $75 for the horse. Gingers are hell no. This whiskey is excellent. Ginger. I like gingers. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to Whiskey and Ginger.

My guest today is one of my favorite people on earth. I say that for all my guests, but I mean it once again. Today, as I crack a blueberry mountain valley, it's Harry Mack. Give it up for Harry Mack at home. Clap at your computer or in your car, wherever you are. Thanks for coming. Hey, thanks for having me, man. So good to be here.

Huge, huge that you came. Look, I've followed you on the interweb, on the internets for a while now. And I have an abundant of, I was like, should I research a lot? No, but I was like, I just want to learn organically about you. Hell yeah. I'm a hip hop kid. Yes. I grew up loving hip hop.

We're a little bit age difference. Right. But we're close enough where I think we have the overlap because you're 30, would you say? 32. Yeah. So, and I'm almost 40. So it's like, I think we still have, we'll still have some touches. Where are you from? We're in the same pocket. I'm from Portland,

Oregon. Okay. PDX. PDX. The PNW, as they say. I was just up there, by the way. Sketchy. Little sketchy. Yeah. Especially right now. Yeah. Especially right now. I think COVID really, you know, hit Portland hard. Yeah. And so there's a lot of homelessness. There's a lot of kind of homeless encampments throughout the city. Needles. Needles. Needles, yeah. A lot of needles. Not space needles.

When you do go to Seattle, check out the space needles. Skip over the needles on the way. We took the train, me and the guy that comes and does stand-up with me. Yeah. We took the train. We were going to get a car to Seattle from Portland. Yeah. And he was like, we should take

a train. I was like, that could be dope. The Amtrak? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I was like, that could be dope. Why not? You know, that's fine. I like, I like that kind of stuff. Bad idea. Cause like getting there was sketchy. It was, it's in a, such a sketch neighborhood. Right. And then there was a little legit, legitimately walked over needles. And I was like, this is. Yeah. You know, me and a friend actually, when I was in college, because I came down here to go to college. That's what brought me down to LA. What are we talking? UCLA? USC. God bless. Smart

kid. Smart kid. Me? Yeah, you must be. Well, I don't know. I was a music major. I was a jazz studies major. Oh, oh, oh. Dumb guy, good school. Yeah, dumb guy, good school. Exactly. Dude, I went to Arizona State. I'm dumb guy, bad school. Oh, there you go. So at least you did one of the two correctly right yeah i was trying you know 50 there yeah uh we romanticized the idea of taking the amtrak up from la to portland we were both from portland me and my

friend and we thought that this was going to be the coolest fucking thing like in our heads it seemed like such a romantic thing to do you know just the not like between me and him romantic but just romantic in the sense of man will be man you do you whatever you and your friends need to do to like get by whatever makes you feel love in your heart it's you and your homie on the train having a nice romantic you know sip of tea overlooking the ocean that's cool too yeah yeah you know i mean it's not it could be a lot worse right um but uh no i mean it was terrible like we were miserable after about eight hours when we realized that we were just going to be blasted with

AC, and the Amtrak is kind of just like a bus. It's a bus. Yeah, it's just a bus. It's a bus on rails. We thought it was going to be like this whole train experience. I don't know. We magnified it in our minds to be this whole other thing. You thought it was going to be like the Midnight Express.

Yes. You know, where Tom Hanks was going to come out and give you hot cocoa, and you were going to end up at the North Pole. Exactly. Nah, you ended up in like Barstow and shit. Yeah, you're on a bus. People are getting on for one or two stops for their morning commute, looking angry. Yeah, it's a bummer. Exactly. Nah, you ended up in like Barstow and shit. Yeah, you're on a bus. People are getting on for one or two stops for their like morning commute looking angry. Yeah, it's a bummer.

Yeah. It's not as nice as you think it's going to be. No. And we were like, oh, there's a bar on there. That's dope. Yeah. But it's not a bar. I pictured like a real bar.

No. It's like a wooden bar. It's like a little mini fridge down there. It's 7-Eleven. Yeah, 7-Eleven. It's a little 7-Eleven on a train. And this like angry guy that's like not happy to help you like take your money. Dude, they're never happy.

No. They're never happy. Yeah. Because I take the train down to San Diego. I refuse to drive from LA because it's, fuck that. It's a nightmare. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because getting, no matter which way you're going, people in LA know, no matter if you're going down to San Diego or coming back, there is zero, and I mean zero time of day where

it's good. It doesn't matter. Something about that gap is so shit. It's shit. So I take the train, and every time that dude, even if you're like hey man how are you he's like what do you want right they don't they fucking hate you they hate that gig they are not happy ever so you took the so you took this train from uh did you ever make it to do the la to portland or no we did the whole thing yeah and it was i mean we were freezing like that's what i remember was just you know

how ac i mean for me anyway ac starts to make you feel weird after a certain amount of time when you're just sort of in an enclosed space with AC for too long. You can't get up and leave. Yeah. And they have little blankets, but they're terrible little tiny blankets. Are you, what, those COVID blankets? No chance. No chance.

The smallpox blankets they have left over? No, no, no. I'm not touching Amtrak blankets. And they're like, we disinfected them. On the plane, I think about that sometimes with the pillows and the blankets. And they're like, did they clean them? You're like, nah, do they though? Do they?

When? When are they cleaning all that stuff? I don't buy that they're cleaning anything. Nah. Where are the laundry machines? They take it outside and do the thing, like do this thing, you know? Right. You shake it out.

The rug, yeah. Shake the rug and put it back. Right. But before we go further, because I'll get on too many tangents, that's what my brain does. Right, me too. You, I found you via the web. I can't, I don't even know how long ago, but I've been keeping up with your stuff for a while because I think,

for people that don't know, you need to check him out right now. And we'll put links in the description so people can see if they don't know you, but I think you're quite known on the interwebs. Your freestyle acumen is, I don't't know i'm trying to find a good adjective it's it's it's remarkably impressive your ability but it's real freestyling right right which is something that we grew up with that i grew up with which was actually off the top yes instead of look everyone has some pre-written stuff everyone knows how their tags come into play same thing in stand-up. That's what we share of this.

That's why I think musicians in stand-ups kind of get along a little bit because they go, I see what they do. Their skill level is something I don't know, but I see how they do certain things. It's almost like watching someone good at chess. You're like, I don't know how he got to that move, but I understand what this means. I understand applying different patterns to different situations and seeing how things can be used and morphed to apply. And you do that pretty heavily. So you, so give me the, from start, did you, were you, have you been making music for years and years? What's it been? Yeah. I've been a musician pretty much my whole life.

You know, like when I was a baby, I was playing rhythms on the high chair tray and stuff like that. I was always musical. Is your dad just giving you a beat and stuff? Yeah, I guess so. Yeah. You know, it's funny. My immediate family members are not actually musicians themselves, but big fans of music. My dad's like a huge jazz head and my mom's really into like folk music and things like that. So I was exposed to a lot of music when I was young. I started playing the violin when I was seven. I started playing the drums when I was 10. Damn. And that's around the time when I first started writing my first rhymes. I started trying to figure out how to how to freestyle Off top or improvise as a rapper around that time 11 12 years old damn So yeah, I've been doing it forever so you're doing in high school. Yep, then you're doing it in college

Yes, sir, and then when you got out of USC Yeah You were like you know What was the impetus to take it to the streets to do those man on the street videos that people should watch if they haven't seen You know what you'll do essentially is go up to a usually a small group of friends right ask them for a word or ask them to throw you words yep you know and you'll continue to freestyle through them kind of coming and going like i've seen videos where people kind of like dip right and then new people come in yeah i think that's kind of i mean that's that's probably the most impressive thing that i saw is i was like

man this motherfucker is just he keeps going going regardless of how the scenario changes, which I think a lot of people would be adverse to because they're like, it's not going to look clean or smooth or cut together. Right. But right. How did, how did this whole thing start? Yeah. Yeah. No, it's funny what you meant. A lot of times you just need a group to kind of start the energy and get the energy flowing. Yes. And then it sort of takes on a life of its own. People passing by will latch on because they see something cool happening and they want to check it out and it sort of evolves and changes. And now for our feature presentation. All right, so let me get like a random word to inspire my freestyle.

Something challenging. Spontaneous. Spontaneous. Lincoln Memorial. Lincoln Memorial, that makes sense. All right, all right. Spontaneous, Lincoln Memorial. Leg work.

Leg work, hell yeah. All right, dope right. Spontaneous, Lincoln Memorial. Leg work. Leg work, hell yeah. All right, dope, y'all ready? Yes, sir. Let's get it. Yeah, okay, uh, yeah, okay, uh, yeah, uh, okay, yeah, yeah, uh, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. Spit up the top till my brain just bust. All of my lyrics spontaneous

I am the one they excited about Do it off top, I don't ride it out Yeah, kill it off top, I'ma own it My flow is spontaneous, I'm in the moment Uh, everyone lovin' my flow I got my man dancin' and yellin' out, whoa Uh, H-Man, I grabbed the mic, let's do this I told my man, I got my own beat

Say you speak and you're gonna have to mute this H-Man, I don't lie with no flaws Uh flaws I'ma kill the game, I'm the cause Tell these other MCs, me gods He was like, hold up, wait a minute, press pause Now I'm down to hit it, hold it with ammo My music hums like a camel My shit is off of the handle Shout out to my girl who be rockin' the camo Man, I've been comin' right through Peace to my fans, I'm supportin' you Had to come through with the ill freestyles in front of the Lincoln Memorial Shout out to my man, yo, what is you thinking?

Fitting so fast that you miss if you blinkin' Every time that I rhyme on the track, I be keeping it honest I'm feeling like Lincoln, yeah Y'all know I rap for the people who be chillin' in the residential But when it come to rhymes off-top, I'm advanced I'm like Lincoln, my flow is presidential This J-Bag coming off the top, getting respect Any mic that he clutches, that's where he racks

Shout out to my man in the white kicks And the black jeans getting respect Any mic that he clutches, that's where he racks Shout out to my man in the white kicks And the black jeans and the V-neck Every time I rhyme, I make your head hurt My man is hittin' up the gym and doing leg work Ayy, Shrek, my lyrics sounding hot They doing leg work, cause when I bust, they gotta squat It's Ayy, Shrek, I'm off the top

Coming through to do my thing Yeah, every single lyric they cling Shout out to my man, cause he's reppin' the kings Hey, Jack, man, you gotta go this time Y'all know they really can't fuck with that My man is his king All on top of your bucket hat But this is the truth

My people be lovin' the sound If this is a hat for a king It's not a bucket hat, this is a crown H-Rack, I'ma break it down for my piece real quick Y'all know I'm blowin' up the head And I know you got the tiger stripes But I never seen a tiger that's red This is a crown I'ma break it down for my face real quick Y'all know I'm blowin' up the head And I know you got the tiger stripes But I never seen a tiger that's red

I'm about to break it down Coming up the top with the bloody hair fuck red Reppin' is trying to diss Mack But honestly it's just more tears in the bucket Way too nice with my gloves This dog it got a pumpkin for a nose Say track man, y'all know that my shit scary. My name is Harry.

So to a bear, they gon' compare me. I kill it when I fill it up to top of the team. Every time I'm rhymin', I be crushin' the scene. H-Mack, shinin' kinda like high beams. Like the color of your sweatpants, I'ma get green. H-Mack, comin' up the top. And y'all know that they couldn't really diss, bro. Let me see what it says on your shirt.

Shout out to man, no official. H-Mack, I'm about to rap for the brand. Crush it everywhere that I stand. I kick the passionate raps. I need the reactions like that. I'ma crush the mic in the craziest way. Shout out to my peeps in DC. Thanks for making my day.

Much love, y'all. I had a rap group all through high school. I had various groups in college. Graduated from college with a jazz studies degree as a drummer and kind of felt like I kind of fell under that whole thing of like well my degree says I'm a jazz drummer so I think I'm supposed to try to figure out how to make this work you know right and I love jazz I still do and and uh loved playing the drums I still love playing when I have the opportunity to play which is less now but I was just you know grinding it out trying to gig and gig and play as a jazz drummer in L.A.

and just scraping by. Are there jazz gigs in L.A.? Yeah, there are gigs. There are gigs. But it's really, really tough for like 99% of the people doing it. I mean, you just have to be so incredibly, undeniably good. What circuit are we talking about? Is it like bars?

Is it? Bars, restaurants, corporate events, weddings, all that kind of stuff. But it's a lot of rough. I mean, for me anyway, it was a lot of like, you know, $50 bar gig where you're crammed in a corner

and you're being told to play quieter all the time. You know, you're disturbing the guests, you know, that kind of thing. And it can be really tough to break out of that. I have friends who are really successful

in the jazz world now and shout out to them because I know it's be really tough to break out of that. I have friends who are really successful in the jazz world now and, and shout out to them. Cause I know it's, it's a really tough grind for a long time. Um, but that's what I was doing. And then meanwhile, you know, I'm obsessed with hip hop and obsessed with freestyling and have been since, like I said, back when I was 10. And so I'm kind of doing the two things parallel. Um, but, uh, I think because of some of my own securities about kind of like stepping out front and being the front person and You know being a rapper. Yeah, it just seemed like man. I don't know I can't necessarily see the path to that it felt too abstract sure and so I was really fortunate

I have a friend who is a great jazz piano player and composer and he kind of tricked me into Starting the whole YouTube thing by asking me to freestyle over his beat for a YouTube video on his channel. Who's this dude? Shout out. His name's Jacob Mann. Shout out to Jacob Mann. Jacob Mann. You started this revolution. Good or bad. It's all your fault. Everything that happens from this moment forward is actually Jacob Mann's responsibility. So I can't take any responsibility for any of it. You say that when you're on the stand and you're like, your honor, Jacob Mann, he started all this bullshit. If it wasn't for him, I'd still be terrified to show my music to anyone. I'd still be trapped in my own bedroom.

He uploaded, and then this whole thing started. Yeah, yeah. We did a little video of me driving his car down Sunset Boulevard. I drove his car because I didn't have an aux cord. And we plugged his beat in. I rapped about all the changing scenery down Sunset Boulevard. Because the whole thing for me is kind of trying to showcase that it's truly improvised. Right.

So I'm drawing in random street signs and things that are happening all around us. And I didn't think anything of it. It was a favor to him. Right. I think he tried to Venmo me like 50 bucks and I said, no, don't do that. That's ridiculous. We got lunch afterwards. I forgot about it. And then I woke up from a nap like about a week later and my roommate at the time said, yo, you're going viral right now. And it turns out that little video was upvoted to number one on Reddit videos and got like 100,000 views overnight or something like that. Wow. And at that time, for me, I mean, I was just like, that's fucking incredible.

That is incredible. It's unbelievable. Yeah. I mean, it was just like, I couldn't fathom it. I remember the night that that was happening, I was like scrolling, refreshing the view count and seeing it go up by like a couple hundred at a time or something like that. But that is amazing amazing that first feeling is wild yeah what were you doing to make money in the meantime uh gigging and

teaching drum lessons so yeah yeah were you doing okay then are you still kind of do I mean I was struggling I had zero overhead you know yeah I was like exactly covering my expenses barely and that's it that's good though at least you didn't have you know I mean you know like a wife and kids that you were like, I'm drowning here. I need to go back to Portland. Yeah. Like I could afford to live that way.

And at the time it didn't seem that crazy. I mean, it wasn't like this horrible experience or anything, you know, it's still like, you know, life was okay with my friends and stuff

and smoking weed and shit. And like, felt like I was having a cool life and I was playing music, you know, I was supporting myself playing music. And, and so I always felt really, really grateful about that part you know um before that i had to

like work a call center job and stuff like that and that's when it's really really tell me about that what's up with the call center job i did that shit you did well i did it i did a i did a sales i did a sales gig where we cold called so it was kind of like the same idea of just like i was a fucking cog in a machine what were you what were you selling i was selling window washing power washing air duct cleaning and i was good god damn i was good dude i could sell you on fuck i could sell you that shit right away i would suck you know i'd use bait bait bait stuff easy bait techniques where they teach you like you know hey mr samuelson you know your neighbor just got air duct cleans i'm not interested it's like oh that's no big deal we just wanted to tell you we're going to be there

and if we're making too much noise, come over and tell us. You know what I mean? We're not trying to work on your house. I just want to let you know. Sometimes it gets loud, because when we clean out these pipes, this thing that happens is, typically we have to fix some of them or undo them, and they kind of clang around, and people have complained. So we don't want to bother you. And immediately,

someone will come over, or one of the workers are there, and it's an easy bit. But all that stuff was... That's amazing. Yeah, it was like skill set stuff that I learned when I was in high school when I did this shit. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was beating out people that were in their 30s selling.

That's amazing, bro. Yeah, I was selling more. And it's so helpful, right? Right. I hate on the call center job so much. Yeah. But my girl makes fun of me because just as much as I'll be like, oh, that was miserable. So many moments in my life now, I'm like, yeah, I learned how to do that from the call center.

Yeah, skills, technique. The people skills you learned or the idea of how to sell things or how to really work and talk to people. Because we weren't scamming anybody. We were selling a real service. Right. But it was like, how do you make them get interested in your service, which is what you are. Right. You're selling you.

100%. So now you're selling you to the world live. So you're like, how can I sell me in a way that's like, I have something to give you that you might want, but I need to get to a place where you go, what is this thing? Exactly. Do you know what I mean?

Because how many people also go like, what's this rap guy doing? What is he doing? Right. All the time. And it's basically the same as cold calling when I'm out there doing the man on the street stuff like you're talking about.

It's tough, right? I'm just walking up to strangers fully exposed to rejection. That was one of the biggest things I learned from the call center is like it's okay to you know so what like people are gonna shit on you sure all right yeah fine strap in that's only gonna get worse yeah i'm sure the more the more success you get the more like fuck this guy this guy sucks and i don't like his rap exactly that's the that's the thing that happens naturally with the growth that that growth ratio of, you know, if you're on a small level of a little bit of fame or success and 1% of them hate you, well, that's a small number.

But when you're, you know, when you're getting 50 million views on YouTube, yeah, it goes up and up and up. Yeah. 1% of the 50 million views. That's a lot of people. It's a lot of people, man. And I'm not good at math, but we know what, you guys know what it is at home. Right. Now, so, so, so I, there's so many good at math, but you guys know what it is at home. Right.

There's so many things I want to ask you as I keep jumping in my mind. What were the names of the hip-hop groups that you started? What was it in high school or college? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. You had a crew? What was the crew? Yeah, we had a crew. First crew was in sixth grade, me and my boy Brady. Sixth grade?

Sixth grade, yeah. Wow. We have a record, man, from sixth grade, like a little EP we made. Is it out somewhere? No, no, no. Put that shit up on Spotify. It's, no. Come on, man.

No, no, no. Put it on Spotify. Why are you too scared? It's on Google Drive, you know. It gets shared among friends. Put that thing on the internet. I've leaked a little bit of a track. You did?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was called Brain Vacation, the name of the song. For a sixth grader, that's pretty creative. You know what, man? I listened to it. It's hilarious because it's like prepubescent, you know, me rhyming and stuff. It sounds like Alvin and the Chipmunks, like this super high-pitched voice rapping. And like, what the fuck was I rapping about?

It was like vocab words from class and like intricate sounding shit. I used to rap really, really fast. Topographical. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Teographical. Clouds are fantastical. Yeah, exactly. When you just,s are fantastical. Yeah, exactly. When you're like cumulus when you're learning about shit.

Zero life experience, but trying to make something that sounds like densely lyrical and cool, you know? And I thought that, you know, the faster you rap, the better you were. You know, that to me was just like a linear equation. So I would try to rap really fast. Sure. All that type of stuff. But I listen to it now and it makes me feel, it makes me smile and it makes me feel like,

damn, this is a unique phase of creativity, you know, when you're fucking 11. And it's like, I can't remember how it felt to be 11.

You know, like it's gone. I can't remember how that actually felt. Like I have memories from that age range. Sure. But I don't remember

what it was like to see through those eyes and like experience the world as an 11 year old. But if I listen to that music, it's like a little glimpse back into sort of what that world was. See, that's cool, man. That's like a little time capsule. It is. What was the name of the crew, you and Brady?

State of Mind. State of Mind? And you're 11? Brady came up with it. Yeah, Brady came up with it. He just thought it sounded cool. I went with it. In here, we pour whiskey. Hey guys, I've talked about Squarespace on this show many a times, and what I was trying to do was see if you could create a website with Squarespace

and showcase your work on how you did it on your own. I've told you this before, Squarespace has incredible templates that you can use, but you can also go on your own and go rogue. This time the crew over here picked Jordan Creates. Look at this guy, Jordan Schatzberg. This is the website by JordanCreates.me

He's got his own vibe over there, and look, I appreciate Jordan. If you're creating sites through Look at this guy, Jordan Schatzberg. This is the website by jordancreates.me. He's got his own vibe over there. And look, I appreciate Jordan. If you're creating sites through Squarespace, it means a lot to me because I've got to tell you, they do so much stuff. They have a video studio. You can create videos on there, edit them, put them up. You can do email campaigns to your fans or your followers or your confidants. Squarespace is a place to create your own website,

whether you're selling something, designing something. And again, they have these real-time analytics that are incredible. You can gain powerful insights into who's visiting your site and how they're interacting with your content, how in-depth that website analytics goes as deep as you need it to be.

They got page views, traffic sources, time on site, most read content, audience geography, and much, much much more they got connected all the social media accounts they bring them into one little place they got blogging tools powerful blogging tools to uh share stories photos videos and updates and whatever it is that you may need i really love it because they have award-winning customer support um they got squarespace scheduling where your clients can quickly view your availability book you with reservations they make this so easy whether you're a massage therapist or an artist, a

bodybuilder, you're a comedian, me selling something. That's how we created our site. They've got great SEO tools on there that online store. If you've got one, you're selling something with a suite of integrated features and useful guides that help maximize prominence among search results, making sure that people are looking for you, they can find you easily. Shout out to my boy, Jordan, and go check out his website there. Send in more websites to our email. I'm a Santino fan at gmail.com. Maybe we'll host your website on this show.

And thank you to Squarespace. Squarespace, head over there right now. Squarespace.com slash whiskey. Squarespace.com slash whiskey for a free trial. When you're ready to launch, use offer code whiskey to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain. Hey guys, I've talked about BetterHelp on this show many a times. I am a big proponent of getting help with your mental health. I think it is extremely important to speak with someone about stuff. Otherwise you let it build up and bubble up. And then you have a freak

out in public at a local coffee shop and you throw coffee on somebody and ends you in a local county jail for six weeks, which we're trying to get out of. But let me tell you something. Mental health is very important to take care of. It's just as important as your body's health. And if you're not taking care of that, I'm telling you, it's going to haunt you forever. And how we take care of our minds affects how we operate in our everyday, daily life. I think talking to someone about what's going on in your life is important than just letting it sit for no reason.

BetterHelp, that's online therapy that offers video phone and even live chat therapy sessions. So you don't have to see anyone on camera if you don't want to. These are licensed therapists. You can be matched in under 48 hours, and it's much more affordable than in-person therapy. In-person therapy does not work for me. It works for somebody. I just don't like going to a place. I'd rather sit in the comfort of my home and chat with someone.

I think that's way easier in my bedroom or, like I say, my bathtub. Have I done it before in the bathtub? Yeah, I've done it in the bathtub. That's not that big of a deal. I want to talk to somebody. I'm comfy in the tub tub. But BetterHelp is great. Please use it.

If you need help, try it. You know, what do you got to lose? You know, you don't want to lose your mind, so what do you got to lose? I'm comfy in the tub tub. But BetterHelp is great. Please use it. If you need help, try it. You know, what's, what's, what do you got to lose? You know, you don't want to lose your mind, so what do you got to lose? With BetterHelp, they can help you get to where you need to be or want to be. Our listeners are going to get 10% off their first month at BetterHelp.com slash whiskey. BetterHelp.com slash whiskey. That's BetterHelp.com slash whiskey.'s better h-e-l-p.com slash whiskey ginger i like gingers it's a state of mind man state of mind state of mind for for you're like this is we are promoting exactly who

we are right now we're in a specific state of mind and by the way it couldn't change anymore when you're like 11 within six months you're a completely different person. Yeah, 100%. Your balls drop and you start seeing, you're like, tits? Yeah. Your whole, everything, your psyche changes.

Your state of mind at the time was, that's what it was. It was relatively innocent, you know, and rapidly changing. What was the second crew? So my rap name though at that time

was hilariously corny, MC Wonder. MC Wonder. Spelled? W-U-N-D-U-R. Wonder. Wonder. Wonder. Wonder. Spelled? W-U-N-D-U-R. Wonder. Wonder. Wonder.

Wonder. Like you're Canadian or something. Wonder. Wonder boys up there, eh? Oh, yeah, M.C. Wonder, he's all right. So what was Brady's name? I think he went by Shortcut at the time. Oh, bro, Shortcut's actually a really good name.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Shortcut is dope. I think it's claimed, though. Is he short? Is he a tiny guy? He was good name yeah shortcut is dope i think it's claimed though is he short is he a tiny guy he was short yeah so shortcut's great yeah no it was a good name i think that's smooth better than wonder i gotta be honest it was a horrible name it was a horrible name did you would you were you ever into in your i mean is this maybe past your time but did you got were you guys ever into tagging and shit and did you go tag your shit or no i had some homies that were into it you know you didn't didn't get into it? No, I wasn't.

I was no good. You don't seem like a bad boy. I was a rule follower, man. I was a good fucking kid. Yeah, I could tell you were a good kid. You didn't fuck up almost ever. I mean, occasionally, but I rarely got caught fucking up. My reputation was very clean, you know? Squeaky. Yeah, yeah. What's the worst thing that you did as a kid?

I'm trying to think. Like, did you steal or did you do some dumb shit? Yeah, yeah, yeah. We went through a phase, you know, like fifth grade or whatever. We would, like, bring Sharpies

into the fucking bathroom and write shit on the stall, write shit on the wall, you know. I remember one time in fifth grade there was this, like, competition that was happening

in the class where it was, like, you'd get rewarded for doing good things or whatever. You know, I can't remember. There were all these various challenges,

but you would get rewarded with this currency, like, with this printed money. You know, fake money, I can't remember. There were all these various challenges, but you would get rewarded with this currency, like with this printed money, you know, fake money, like our own little class currency. Sure. And, uh, so first me and my friend Manny, shout out to Manny. We were like, dude, we got to like, you know, photocopy this money. Like we got to make counterfeit bills. Yes, bro. And I had a scanner, which at the time was like kind of crazy. It was like, you know, if you had a CD burner, that was next level. It's huge. And if you had a scanner, same thing.

But it was only one-sided. So I scanned the front of the bill, and I scanned the back of the bill, and then we would glue them together, and we created little counterfeit bills that didn't have the same feel. They were thicker and weird, and the edges were exposed. But it worked. We circulated a couple of them back into the system. And then one day we found the actual bundle of bills, like the bank.

We found the bank. It was just bundled up in a rubber band. You found that bag. Yeah, we found the bag. And we took from it a large amount. Did you feel bad about it? At the time, no. I felt very excited by it.

No, today. Today, yeah. Do you want to apologize to the teacher? Go ahead and look in that camera. Go ahead and apologize. Who was it? No, you know what? If I could talk to the teacher go ahead and look at that camera go ahead and apologize no you know what i think if i could talk to the teacher i think you should have hit it better you know it wasn't that hard to find we're little kids crawling around on the floor and it was under like uh like how you have a bar card here was basically like under something like that right just foolish we found it accidentally what's

the teacher's name do you remember i i don't remember see i don't remember either but people talk to me they're like do you remember i don't remember any of, I don't remember either. When people talk to me, they're like, do you remember? I don't remember any of my teachers. And I mean this. I remember. I'm dead serious. Wow. Fifth grade, I should remember, because my best friend Sean always reminds me,

because I had to stay in for recess every day, because he would make me stay in, because I would do some dumb shit in class. And he'd always be like, Andrew, you're staying in. Wow. Every single time. That's awful. Yeah, oh, no, that was common. That was common. I would say something class. And he would be like, Andrew, you're staying in. Wow. Every single time. That's awful. Yeah, oh, no, that was common.

That was common. I would say something dumb, and he'd be like, that's lunch. And I just knew it was common. I almost got comfortable with it. Did it make you sad, or did you just not care about recess? Didn't give a fuck. Couldn't care less. Nice.

I was going to go do some dumb shit after school anyway. Right. So it was really a horrible punishment. It didn't, like, shape you up. It was bad for him. I had to eat lunch with him. But I think he liked eating lunch with me. It was almost like this weird trickery was like, you're staying in. It's like, this is for you. This isn't for me, man. Yeah. You're bored. You don't like,

you hate, you hate being alone at lunch. So you got a little wild weirdo. And then the chores were nothing. It was never like smack the chalk out of the erasers. It was always like I had to do like a writing assignment, but I liked that kind of shit. Yeah. So it was never really punishment. Okay. He's like, you can't be out and playing outside. That was it.

But it was like after school, I'll go fucking play with those kids anyway. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I got from 3 p.m. on to do whatever the fuck I want outside. Yeah, dude. I'm good. I don't remember.

I don't remember almost any teacher's name, which is sad, but that's my brain is just gone from the whiskey is probably where it's from. You're cleaning out the guts right now. No booze for you, huh? No booze for me, yeah. Are you done with it? I don't know. I don't know.

I mean, I stopped drinking when I turned 30. I went out for my 30th birthday. I got smashed, which was very common. I woke up very hungover, like miserably hungover. I puked, And then I said, you know what? I'm going to see what happens if I stop doing this for a while.

And you did. And that was two and a half years ago. And you're done. I don't feel like doing it. That's good. I don't feel like doing it. Now, would you partake in anything that's mind-altering?

I don't know. You like smoking weed or not? I used to smoke weed all the time. Yeah. Every day. And that's kind of my thing. It's just hard for me to sort of put limitations on things like that. Sure just the drinking like i was never the type of person

that drank alcohol every day but i would go out on the weekend and drink and i would end up drinking more than i wanted to and i would black out and i would feel miserable the next day and right i have a lot of anxiety around it so i just wasn't i wasn't chill about it you know and same thing with weed it was hard for me to be chill about it because it's like, well, weed is difficult because it's not that big a deal. I can kind of do most of the stuff I need to do even if I smoke, but then it's like, well, but then I'm smoking at 11 a.m. for no reason.

And it started to affect me a little differently than it used to. It used to be the funnest thing in the world and just make me giggle and shit. And then it started to make me paranoid and feel weird about stuff. Then you're like, I feel my heart in my teeth. Exactly. I don't like this anymore. I don't want to be this mindful of my body's inner working. Right.

No, no thanks, man. At 11 a.m. on a Tuesday. I don't want to be reminded about this meat skeleton that I've got jamming around with all these moving parts. No thanks. Exactly. I all but gave up a little bit of weed. I'll smoke a joint here once in a while at a party or something.

Sure. Yeah, yeah. I used to be a big pothead when I was a kid. Yeah. And then I just kind of slowly waned away. But also that was kind of the mix of my generation was stealing alcohol, smoking weed, and listening to hip hop.

Hip hop was such a cultural, you know, part of that thing was drinking and getting high and listening to hip hop. That was like my whole youth. Okay, so who, okay, wait. What was the name of the group in college? Or high school?

High school, it was still State of Mind. Oh, wow. You guys stayed together. That name stuck. Yeah, yeah. So me and Brady stuck together, and then we added two additional members when we got to high school. And where are those cats?

Are they still doing it or no? They're not still doing music. Oh, look. Brady's still DJs and stuff. Like, casually, I think they dabble, but... It's not their career. It's not their career. They're not doing it professionally.

Right. But we're still in touch. We talk sometimes via text and stuff like that. I see them every once in a while when we're all back in Portland. Do they think you've gotten big for your britches?

Do they talk shit? Do they shit on you? You know how your friends, like you get on a little bit and they're like, oh, big shot, huh? I think she's the man. Yeah, I'm lucky, man.

They're super supportive. I think they're stoked about it. Yeah, they're just happy to see somebody from the hometown getting it like that, I think. Did it change in college? Yeah, in college, I had a different... So in college college it was kind of a different scenario because i was in jazz school and uh i think it's tough like when you have a

group for so long it's such a formative time i was always rapping with my boys you know yeah like and i was always doing music with like my best friends you know and like the you know and we're also like arguing and fucking fighting for no reason and being like best friends, you know, and like, you know, and we're also like arguing and fucking fighting for no reason and being like best friends, you know what I mean? And getting past that and having the fucking times of our lives and drinking for the first time together. And all this type of stuff is wrapped up. And these are the people I'm making music with. And then you get to college and it's like, you don't have any of those people around you anymore. And it's this whole other thing. But, um, I was in music school. And so I was fortunate. I got to connect with a lot of super

talented musicians and writers and people like that. So I had actually like a band, like it was an instrumental band, and then I was the front person rapping. So it was like, you know, like inspired by the roots kind of. We had like a... Great group. Yeah, fantastic group. Yeah. What were you guys called?

We had, again, a really bad name. I always had... So MC Wonder, the band in college was called The Cleanse, which is just evokes like a colon cleanse. Very LA. Very LA. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm on a cleanse. Exactly.

The Cleanse. It was called The Cleanse? Yeah. What was the thought behind that? Like cleanse your palate, change your, what is that? There was zero thought behind it from me. Yeah. I can't remember who came.

You know, it was one of those things where we suggested a few options and went with the one that seemed the best at the moment. Were you still at that point, MC Wunder? No, no, no. I had left MC Wunder a long time ago. Yeah, I went through a series of different names. Did you say goodbye to that alter ego when you left it? MC Wunder, yeah.

Good night, MC Wunder. Like you put down an old jersey. Yes, exactly. God bless, MC Wunder. I must move on. old jersey. Yes, exactly. God bless MC Wonder. I must move on. Yes, my time has come. I must leave you. Then what did you become in college?

I just started going by Harry Mack. Then it was like that was it for you. I went through, which is basically almost my real name. What is your real name? My real name is Harry McKenzie. Same shit. Yeah. Harry Mack is what you probably recalled your whole life.

Everyone called me Harry Mack, H-Mack. H-Mack, yeah. I hear that a lot. Versions of that, yeah. You say H-Mack a lot when you probably recalled your whole life. Everyone called me Harry Mack, H-Mack. H-Mack, yeah, I hear that a lot. You say H-Mack a lot when you freestyle. Oh, yeah. I say every version of my name as often as possible

while I freestyle. Well, but it's good to keep lacing it in because then it becomes synonymous with the guy that does that thing. Yeah. Because nothing is more

detrimental to the internet than when something goes viral and they're like, who did that? Yeah. Oh, it's a little thing. Somebody will go, oh, what's that guy?

He does that thing. It's the thing. Damn. And I do that. I'll watch something that I like and I'll will go, oh, what's that guy? He does that thing. It's the thing. Damn. And I do that. Like, I'll watch something that I like. Yeah. And I'll be like, yo, you got to see this dude that does that shit. And then they'll go, what's his name?

I'm like, fuck, he's tall. Yeah. And I'll remember everything about everything that happened except for who did the shit. It's so difficult to establish your name as a brand in this sort of viral internet world. Sure. to establish your name as a brand in this sort of viral internet world. Sure. Because for so long, man,

I mean, for years, for the first couple years of me sort of building my name on the internet and creating content, if I ever got a big viral repost somewhere, it was like, YouTube rapper does blank. Sure.

Or some version of that. YouTube freestyle rapper or random freestyler on streets of Venice does blank. Or white freestyle, white guy, white rapper. White guy raps well, you know, surprisingly well or something of that nature. And I get it. Like, I don't, there's no reason to drop my name at that point because to most of the population, the name doesn't ring any bells or have any significance. But it will now. But it will now. As time goes on, it's still, by the way, White Guy Raps Well is the name of an album,

for sure, if you want to take that. That's a good album. White Guy Raps Well is so good, man. I might have to run with that. I'd buy that. What are the most influential albums of your youth that you think were the ones that really shaped either the way you have your style

or the thing that you know clicked with you? Because those formative years are kind of when... Look, I know there's great music out right now. I listen to current hip-hop now. A lot of current everything. I listen to everything. But I do know why I like a lot of the things I like. And it's typically because I heard, like you, something we share, a lot of folk, a lot of funk, a lot of jazz.

Not as much jazz, obviously, as you. But that did always kind of come back into play for me so any hip-hop I liked was very much in that vein but I want to hear which ones were big for you yeah uh it's funny because like at the most formative stage when we first started making music when I was 11 12 years old it was like on the one hand we were listening to mainstream rap radio right you know of the early 2000s so it was was a combination of very poppy, like Nelly, Ja Rule, Ashanti, Chingy type artists, and also legends, Jay-Z, Nas, Snoop, Dre, Eminem.

These people were getting a lot of play as well. But it was that sort of mainstream sound. And then 50 Cent, people like that were coming out. And then on the other hand, we started to discover underground hip hop of the time. So our sort of gateway into that was this group called blackalicious um from the bay which is a phenomenal group um i know them well yeah they're great yeah so we we picked up this album blazing arrow by blackalicious and it

immediately became everyone in the crew's favorite record it was like a great record yes it's fantastic great record it's fantastic r.i.I.P. to Gifted Gab, the rapper from the group. I was going to say, yeah, he died a year ago, maybe two years ago now. Yeah, dude. And that shit hit me so fucking hard. Because Blazing Arrow was big for you. Because it was a huge record for me. And a lot of legends in hip hop have passed even after I've become a rapper and sort of been aware of that and and

it's always you know so i was like goddamn but that one in particular was like it had a significance to me yeah that would be sort of hard to even explain you know to somebody else who was like wow this cat is one of the reasons i wanted to rap period was like his like his abcs like that that's that one and that was actually on an earlier record but I just remember the first that first track on Blazing Arrow the rhyme style is so it's the title track Blazing Arrow and the rapping is so insanely dense and intricate and like multi-syllabic he was so thick yeah he was and such a so just such a linguistic kind of like master I'd never heard anybody rhyme like that before right and I remember all of us just kind of looked at each other like, yo, this is some next level shit.

Right. And you know how it is at that age. We just start connecting dots. You know, they had a feature on that album from Charlie Tuna from Jurassic Five. Love J5. So we found out about J5. Right. Loved that.

And somehow or another, we found out about, I think Questlove plays drums on one of the tracks. So we kind of found out about the roots. Right. And then bit by bit, we found out about Def Jux, LP's label, you know, A$AP Rock and Mr. Lift and artists like that. And so we were kind of, to be honest with you, we were like the annoying kind of like snobby kids in middle school

that were like, yeah, that's not the real shit. Oh, Jay-Z, like that's what you listen to? Like we were hitting on Jay-Z. Sure. Now I'm a huge, I love Jay-Z. I came around to be a huge fan, but at that time we were like, yo, if it's not some hyper lyrical underground shit, if it's not

Blackalicious or Aesop Rock or these type of cats, it's not the real shit. Well, our age gap difference is a little bit more because for me, underground or backpack rap as it started to become, now it's called indie rap,

which is a whole different thing because underground kind of lost its meaning. Right. But I grew up in the Midwest in Chicago, so I grew up with, you know,

a lot of the rhymes say are shit. Hell yeah. So for me, Oh, Atmosphere? Atmosphere was, you know, who was going to be on this show and Sean Slug,

we're still waiting for you to come on the show. Let's go Slug! No, we coordinated and he was like, I don't know how to use these microphone Zoom things, because it was COVID. So I said, next time I come to the Midwest, we'll do it then. That's dope.

But those guys were kind of, for me, the, that was, and we weren't, well, you say where you were like, oh, you listen to that shit, fuck you. For us, it was so new to everybody. Yeah. We were nerds about it. Yeah. We were kind of like, you've got to hear this album like yeah yeah yeah you know when asap asap rock you know daylight is like one of those things i remember showing that to like a million people yeah and them still being

like i don't know and sage francis another guy that i wanted to have on this show that we've we've keep trying to is like i told sage when i was in high school for one of my i don't know what class it was. I don't remember. I had a nerdy, weird, cool teacher, and he let me read the lyrics of Makeshift Patriot, which was about 9-11. And I remember reading it to class, and people stayed after the bell rung to hear me finish it.

Yeah. Wow. Because I was like, you got to hear this artist wrote this song that I think is so deep and powerful. It's an amazing song. It's an amazing song. It's a great song. So that, for me, was our little era of like,

back then it was very underground, I guess. And we would go to those shows and they were fucking, you know, 180 people sometimes or sometimes less. Dude, yeah, us too. Yeah, Atmosphere, Sage Frank. I mean, you're naming so many of the people where like, for me, that was middle school and we were obsessed with those groups, man.

Like, did you watch any of the, like, were you obsessed with watching like freestyle competitions and did that kind of fuel this whole thing we did yeah like in the very beginning it was like you know brady had i didn't have cable growing up i had like five channels no shit that was it yeah we never had cable my parents bought cable like as soon as me and my sister left for college i was like oh really uh what was that for did they not want you to be they were like you don't need tv it's bullshit i think it was just like they didn't want to pay for it and yeah well it was a rip-off i mean right yeah we weren't like a huge tv family we watched a decent amount of tv i watched the

simpsons and shit like that but um i don't know it just wasn't a priority really it didn't seem like a priority but you went to kids other kids houses were you like i get to watch yeah exactly and that was the thing so we would go to brady's house every day after school that's where we would freestyle and stuff and and uh we he had cable and we would watch like 106 and Park freestyle Fridays. Sure. And see the battles. And it was like Jin was like killing it week after week. Jin was incredible.

We definitely fell in love with that energy. And just, I think just the fact that there's no like pyrotechnics, there's no band, there's no anything. There's no filler. There's no filler. Right. And it's people blowing people's minds with just the words coming out of their mouth. Idea.

Idea was like another rest in peace. Another guy that went too far. That was a guy when I was a kid, I remember watching him and being like, holy fuck, is this guy good? Yeah. He was shocking to me. And I was studying when I was a kid to try to find out how much of that stuff was, you know, a little pre-written.

Sure. You know, because there's this ideology of when somebody goes, Jay-Z, you know, he freestyles all his lyrics and you're like okay he doesn't write down exactly what he's going to say yeah but he's mapped in his brain how to get there already yeah and you know not like i'm showing the magician's card trick you know everyone's kind of keen to know that like you can kind of tell oh you know when big l put his big l freestyle yeah uh yeah it wasn't it wasn't completely off the top but it was not attached to a record prior exactly it wasn't anything he had done anywhere else yeah uh so that i remember like really getting in deep with that and i was like oh there is a big difference between seeing these two worlds

because the word freestyle kind of gets thrown around and it's incorrect a lot of times it's very confusing yes it's extremely confused i think there needs to be just like all right guys like let's take a moment now to sort of codify the the words we're going to use because the funny thing is the original meaning of freestyle like like in the 80s like if you ask like like according to like big daddy kane and people of that era, it was not an improvised rhyme. Right. It was just a rap about nothing in particular. Correct. And generally like a lyrical

flex, you know, freeform. It's not going to be 16 bars with a chorus. It might be 100 bars continuously with no break, you know. Rapping about being doper than everybody or, you know, all the girls that you're with. My new car, my new girl. All this shit. Which is funny because now that sort of freestyle has come back around to essentially mean that again yeah but there was

a period like in the 90s where this whole thing we're talking about of improvising and freestyling off the top as it's now called became a thing and then and then that became freestyling but it's just hilarious that even now there's still so much confusion around that and like in every video that has freestyle in the title like any funk flex freestyle or whatever right it's freestyle on sway yeah every comment even though 99.9 of those are written or pre-composed or pre-memorized in some capacity right um or some sort of juggling of pre-composed material that's maybe being arranged live right some some level of hybrid. In the comment section, every single time,

there's this massive debate of like, oh, this isn't a real freestyle. Or like, oh, he wrote this. He's like, yeah, no. Yeah, without fail. We know that he wrote it. Like, you know, it is what it is. And the thing is, I'm a huge fan of freestyles like that.

I mean, Lil Dicky, like his freestyle on Sway is like one of the greatest freestyle performances. I wrote that for him. I know you did. Yeah. And he knows it's. I wrote that for him. I know you did. Yeah. I figured. And he knows it. Dave, stop fucking pretending like you come up with any of your own shit.

I write everything he says lyrically. It's mine. I had a suspicion. He writes the TV show. That's fine. Okay. But I write all, everything he spits is all me. All the bars.

It's always been me. That, do you guys have a good deal worked out? Or I mean, in terms of. I get paid nothing. Yeah. Okay. But I just. Yeah, no, it's a really bad deal.

But I mean, we're just going to continue on this relationship because the TV show is fun. So it's worth it. In here, we pour whiskey. Hey, today's episode of Whiskey Ginger is brought to you by Simply Safe Home Security. Here at Whisking, we believe that your home should be the safest place on earth for every family.

That's why I use and I recommend Simply Safe. Simply Safe is advanced home security that puts you and your home and your family every family. That's why I use and I recommend SimpliSafe. SimpliSafe is advanced home security that puts you and your home and your family safety first. That's why I love it. They got these great little tiny little things you can set up by your door to find out who's coming and going. They got 24-7 professional monitoring. SimpliSafe's agents take action the moment a threat is detected, dispatching police or first responders in an emergency, even if you're not there, even you're out on vacay. SimpliSafe uses proprietary video verification technology so that monitoring agents can visually confirm the threat in order to get higher priority for a 9-11 dispatch. That's pretty good. That's pretty good. They decide what's going on over there. They send

them out to your house. Listen, I like SimpliSafe because I like seeing what's going on. I got the cameras all over the outside of the house, so don't try sneaking over. You know, if a FedEx guy throws the package a little bit too hard, I say something. I go voice control, and I say, hey, man, put it down softly, all right? Don't do that ever again. That's my shampoo. I need that put down softly. If you want to have your house safely secured, SimpliSafe is the best way to do it.

I really do think the technology is simple. It's easy to use, which I love. App integrated, which is also wonderful. And it can all connect to one singular source. So you can see different things in different parts of the home, which I truly love. You can customize the perfect system for you on your own. You don't have to take, you know, the one that I do. You can do in just a few minutes at simplysafe.com slash whiskey. Go today, claim a free indoor security camera. That's pretty incredible. A free indoor security camera right now for this interactive monitoring plus 20% off. It's pretty good. Go to simplysafe.com slash whiskey, simplysafe.com slash whiskey. Ginger. I like gingers. No, you're right, though.

The word freestyle does kind of get, it just gets kind of misappropriated, but that's fine. It's going to continue to be that way because rap changes. Exactly. It's changed so much over the years, but I do, you know,

the ones that really stuck out always, some of those lines, Big L especially, too. Yeah. 98 Freestyle. Yeah, 98 Freestyle, you know. Yeah, Beavis. As Beavis, I get nothing but head.

I mean, that was like one of the greatest. I remember that. Showstopper, bro. Especially because I watched Beavis and Butthead at the time. Right. And it was like logged into my brain of how great that was that he did that. But yes, the meaning has shifted so heavily. But you truly, truly, your street videos, are you freestyling legit?

Yeah, I basically always freestyle off the top of the dome. Every time I freestyle, I'm quote-unquote truly improvising, which doesn't mean that there aren't... Like in the jazz world, we call them licks. I have licks, a.k.a. you'll hear me say things again and again and again. How many times have I rhymed full throttle with water bottle? Sure. So much so that we sell a water bottle that says full throttle on my merch shop.

It's like a meme. Go to the merch shop and buy that right now. Buy that full throttle water bottle. Subtle plug. But I mean I'm truly improvising in the sense that i have absolutely no idea what i'm going to say i don't plan it out sure and uh everything i'm rhyming about is you know i'm incorporating the scenery and things that i see around me or random words that are being thrown at me and things well let's talk about the progression now since i've seen you now and we

talked a little bit before the show but so you're you're touring and what i noticed i talked to other comedians and um a guy had said to me a comic friend was like who the who the fuck is this guy? Do you know who this guy is? And I said, I actually do know who that guy is. I said, I don't know him personally, but I really like his shit. Uh, he freestyles. And I showed this comic friend of mine. He was like, holy fuck, because you were touring, uh, at comedy clubs. So my friend noticed you were playing, I don't know. I think it was at the improv, not Pittsburgh, but it was on the East coast somewhere. Yeah. And I was like, oh shit, he's at this improv, that improv and then my buddy was like, is he a stand-up? I said, no, he does this

he does these freestyles, so at live shows what are you giving people at stand-up clubs? Like, what are you doing at those shows? I guess, why stand-up clubs? Yeah, yeah, great question I mean, one of the main reasons that we were touring in stand-up clubs, to be honest, is because we had a plug at the company that owns all the improvs. Right, Levity, yeah, we talked about that, right. At Levity Live, and they were really awesome, and they basically said, you know, I had done a little thing at the Lab here in LA, which is like the smaller side room. An improv, yeah.

At the Hollywood Improv. Yeah. which is like the smaller side room. And improv. The Hollywood improv. Yeah. And just to sort of test it out and see how a show would go. And they said, hey, man, like that was great.

You know, if you want to perform at any and all of the clubs, you know, let us know and we'll make it happen. And I really wanted to go on tour. You know, the world was opening back up after COVID. And this was just a great opportunity for us to be able to book a string of shows all in a row and get inside clubs and do what I do. But let's say this. Yeah. Is there, and I'm obviously projecting, are you not doing music clubs because you feel like

maybe you don't want that vibe yet that you're like, I'd rather just stick in this kind of alternative world a little bit? It's interesting. We did a mix. So we had five or six like traditional music clubs on the run as well. And then the rest were comedy clubs. Both were amazing, but the music clubs turned up a little bit more. I got to be honest. Because they were standing clubs, I think. Sure. Comedy clubs are all seated.

Comedy clubs are seated, which is great for comedy. It's fantastic. And it honestly worked well for what I do too, because it's a fully improvised show. It's a freestyle show. So it's not like I'm pulling out the hits and everyone's, you know, singing along. Uh, it's, it's fully improvised and it's very, uh, you know, I'm engaging with the audience throughout the whole thing. I'm getting words and suggestions and concepts from the audience that I'm then turning into songs and things of that nature. And so, you know,

it's nice for people to be able to sit and enjoy a meal and stuff while they watch the show. But, um, it's not as engaged as much as it is when they're standing. Yeah, because when you're standing, you kind of have to move and sway. You don't have a choice, so you look weird as shit. Exactly. And there's just something about the density with which you can pack people in when they're all standing, and you kind of look out there and see the sea of people. So for our next tour, I think we are going to lean more music venues.

But I enjoyed rocking the comedy clubs, man, and it was a great... We might continue doing that, too, to whatever degree it makes clubs man and it was a great uh we might continue doing that too to whatever degree it makes sense and it was great to get in those rooms sure but i'll be honest man it makes me nervous it made me nervous as fuck especially in the beginning because i would be in these legendary comedy rooms with all the great comedians like plastered all over the walls and i'm like i don't do that you know what i mean and like suddenly i felt this sort of like weird responsibility where it's like, oh, am I supposed to like do stand-up tonight?

Yeah, no. You know? No, those people are all pieces of shit, man. Fuck all those people. You don't got to feel weird about it. Fuck all those comics, man. I mean, I feel this. Dude, I play music venues.

I mean, I play a lot of music venues. So it's like I do stand-up at a lot of theaters or venues that are alternative. I feel the same way. I mean, dude, I fucking, I play the Chicago Theater and then you, you know, you read like Paul McCartney's name on the wall. Right. And you're like, what the fuck am I doing here?

Exactly. But once you get over that bullshit that you're like, this is just an empty room that people need to come see me do my thing at, regardless of your thing. Yes. It doesn't matter. You know, but I think the assumption was, the reason I said that is because I thought maybe the assumption was like, oh man, are these comedians going to think, fuck this dude? Right. You know? But obviously, no.

To tell you that, no, of course not. Right, right, right. But I think people do, instinctively, comics are so territorial, because they're losers, and they're insecure, fucking egomaniacal pieces of shit, that they're like, is this dude fucking trying to do our thing? Right. It's like, no, dude, he does his own fucking relax. Right. And especially

when I showed my buddy, he was like, was like oh shit that's fucking not our reaction is always like what are you doing at this dump why don't you get out of here dude we're telling fart jokes man go do that magic somewhere where it's where it's deserved right right right are you doing an hour or how long yeah an hour yeah do you bring someone with you uh yeah my dj comes out with me sir jazz he's incredible sir jazz yes shout out to sir jazz shout out to sir jazz uh he's phenomenal and so Yeah, an hour, yeah. Do you bring someone with you? Yeah, my DJ comes out with me, Sir Jazz. He's incredible. Sir Jazz? Yes, Sir Jazz. Shout out to Sir Jazz. Shout out to Sir Jazz.

He's phenomenal. And so he'll warm the crowd up for the first half hour, and then I'll go out for an hour and do my thing. And you're taking suggestions almost the whole time, or are you kind of spinning off into your own little thing every time? Yeah, it's a mixture of both, you know. But we have various ways of sort of engaging the audience and getting words from people.

We actually came up with this way where we're able to do like a digital word submission thing. So there's a QR code during the DJ set. People are pulling out phones. Whose idea was that? It was my idea actually. Okay, good.

That's proprietary, man. You better fucking patent that shit. Yes. Oh yeah. That's actually very smart in the process. Yeah. No.

Um, yeah, it was cool. It was, and that's the whole thing about a freestyle show, right? A fully improvised show is one of the challenges is how are we going to scale it? You know, because freestyling generally is, I mean, traditionally it's happening on a, on a, on a street corner with, you know, eight to 15 people.

Right. And that's sort of the best, uh, like the ideal scenario for a freestyle because everybody can hear even with no amplification and everybody can see what's being referenced. Right. They're right in front of your face. Everyone's on the same fucking page. Right. It's very clear what's happening. But as soon as you put, and it's a cipher and it's kind of like all encompassing, it's this 360 degree kind of thing.

As soon as you put me up on a stage, it's like here's the performer and then here's this audience. There's immediately sort of that level of disconnect. And then if I'm doing a bar about your t-shirt in the front row,

you know, who the fuck cares in the back? They can't see that. It means nothing. It's true. So we had to come up with ways to, that was kind of the biggest challenge to going on tour

was for me to kind of brainstorm and figure out ways to sort of show it. So we have all these different things we can do now where there's like a live sort of camera feed that's going to the screen behind, to the projector behind me

and things like that if I'm walking to the audience. Chris Rock is doing that now. Really? Yeah, Chris Rock is doing a reverse camera on the audience because he's got got there's a great comic that's opening for him this guy Rick Ingram who's a right comedy store guy and Rick does a ton of crowd work yeah and he's extremely astute I mean he's you right as a comedian yes he's extremely quick and very astute

and his jokes are very sharp and he's so good at like kind of mapping out the way he does it with crowd work I've never seen anybody else do it the way he does it. He's phenomenal. But they have a camera that shows who they're on so people can see. That's fire. Because for us, it is tough. It is tough as a comic when some bozo says some dumb shit

and the other side of the room is like, what did they say? Exactly. And then they're saying, what did they say? And the other's like, and they're telling them and you're like, ah, fuck. You're losing. It gets lost.

Yeah, exactly. It gets lost. lost well what's interesting to me is um you know you playing in these in these comedy club worlds in our world you know when we're on our come up and you're not selling exclusively tickets to fans right they do this thing called what they call papering a room do you know what that is that's where they kind of give away discounted tickets sometimes free tickets because they want to fill a room because you're a younger person. You couldn't sell out on your own. Yeah, yeah. So in their paper room rooms, a lot of times you're getting people that aren't your fans.

Yeah. So they're showing up. That's usually when you get a lot of disruption, when you get a lot of fucking awkward moments, what we call bombing. Right. Have you bombed at some of these? Have you bombed at all or no? Not on tour, but I've bombed in my life.

Yeah, of course. Yeah, yeah. But on tour is good because it's all your fans yeah yeah but are you bombing are you ever bombing in public and you and you have it on tape of you eating shit you know what man not really that we have on tape good uh and that's not any kind of weird that's a good thing yeah yeah yeah um i've i've been like you know rejected plenty of times or had people not really give a fuck yeah i guess i've bombed there was one time i was doing a freestyle in public for the Gorilla Bar, my Gorilla Bar series, which is the man on the street content you were mentioning. And it was funny because I

just approached a couple, a guy and a girl. And I asked, and you can kind of tell right away when the energy's not, I'm like, I shouldn't have asked. But at that point, I'm not going to be like, you know what? Nevermind. You guys don't seem into it. You got to go for it. You got to go for it. You're committed. But i could tell it was gonna be a little weird and like a few bars in she just pulls out her phone and starts like doing stuff on her phone you know i'm just standing in front of two people you know there's nowhere to hide oh you're on your phone again yeah and of course i do a bar about the phone yeah but it's um so it's funny in that way but you're putting yourself out there which is great i mean i think that's like the way you do it kudos because i think that's it's brave you're kind of swimming in that open water which

obviously is going to get you better content on the other side of it you're going to make create good shit do you have moving forward is that do you want to make like do you want to make an album now too yeah like of all written shit or are you going to incorporate other stuff yeah uh i'm working on like recording music and stuff right now um i don't i don't really write it it's more of like a freestyle process where i'm sort of like freestyling a lot of material we know the best you're jay-z we know yeah no pens allowed no pens dog no you know he said that because he only used sharpie that's what it was no pens no pens. Right, not what we would traditionally define as a pen. But he loves charcoal pencils. That's Jay-Z's clutch.

Only, yes. So you're making the album White Boy Raps Well. White Boy Raps Well. Yes, it's coming soon. I can't reveal anything at this moment. All independent or record label?

All independent. Good for you. I mean, it's a whole new kind of challenge for me. It's a whole new space for me. I'm so known for freestyling and improvising and creating this video content. I'm not so known on the traditional recorded music side of things. So it's exciting.

That gets there. Yeah. That gets there. You're using that audience to do that other thing. Exactly. And they're super supportive. I've done little projects, little EPs where it's kind of like me freestyling off top about subjects and things like that and with more song structure and hooks and things like that. And my fan base loves them and supports them.

That's great. What's the end game goal in your mind? Whether or not it's solidified yet, but what do you think this future – what would you like to see have happen with all of this? Man, that's a great question. I mean, I would love to be able to continue to tour and, you know, do bigger venues and connect with more people on the road, see more of the world, travel through doing music. I want to keep making video content because I love doing it. You know, keep doing the YouTube stuff. I want to keep recording and put out more music.

I kind of want to do all of it, man. And I'm really fortunate. Like, I feel like I have really sort of seen firsthand the truth behind this concept that, you know, you don't need to be like a global sensation to have a successful career. No, you know, you don't need to be Cardi B, you know, or Elvis. What am I, my dad? Hopefully I won't be compared with Elvis too much. Yeah, yeah. Troubled man. Yeah, yeah. Troubled man. But no, it's like you don't have to be that like top tier mainstream level of celebrity or whatever it is to have a

really successful and rewarding career. And I think I'm lucky in that I have a really, really supportive fan base and people who are genuinely interested in what I'm doing and want to buy tickets when I'm doing a show and want to buy merch when we release it and want to support the videos and watch them and share them and all that stuff. So I just want to keep building, man. You seem like a good dude. You seem like you had a good solid upbringing. What was mom and dad? What were mom and dad? Were they like

good old fashioned? He's in sales. She's a... What did mom and dad do? Shout out to mom and dad. My dad was in the flower business for his whole life. A flower man. Yeah, so he – a flower man. A flower man.

Yes, a flower man. A very established flower man. No, he worked on a farm basically. He worked on a bulb farm that grew lily bulbs, harvested lily bulbs as well as hostas and fresh cut peonies. You know your flowers, bro. Yeah, he sold – I know my flowers. And so he sold those products like you know wholesale sure um so like if you went to uh you know like a kroger store it you

might see some of the products that were grown on his farm okay um so that was my dad and then my mom was a teacher she taught i was gonna say teacher i swear to god i was gonna be like sales teacher yes teacher what did she teach third grade third grade yeah you had a wholesome wholesome upbringing man yeah yeah it was good no i really I really, I was lucky, man. I had super supportive parents. Like, they really supported my music. That's great. Which was dope. Begged them for the drum set, you know, and they eventually went for it and things like that. And, you know, it was cool. And even when I said I wanted to study music in school and try to make that my career, you know, I think that's like a horrible thing for a lot of parents

to hear from their kid. Entertainment? Why? Right. What are you going to get out of it? Yeah. But it wasn't like that at all for me, man. It was like, yeah, you know what?

Go ahead. That's what makes you happy, and we think you could probably do it. And you did. And here we are. Are they stoked about it? They see what you're doing? They're unbelievably stoked, slightly confused. Sure.

Look at me. Are you kidding me? You think I know how to explain this to my family this is nuts like you talk to people on camera yeah i'm like yeah and that's it's a part of a comedy world where we create and promote and it this is insane to my family i mean like the whole concept of a podcast is like relatively new right i mean i mean it is you know it's been around been around, but it's like, it's just, we really stole what radio was without limits. It was just radio without borders. Yes.

You know, terrestrial radio as fucking Howard Stern loves to say. It was, you know, like the king of conversation. You know, you develop this world, but I don't have to, we don't have to worry about the FCC or whatever

getting mad at me for saying fuck. Right. You know, I don't have to blank that out. Which is so much better. Yeah, it is. Well, YouTube will do, You know, I don't have to blank that out. Which is so much better. Yeah, it is. Well, YouTube will do, you know,

they'll put their hands all over it. Sure. As soon as Google bought them, man, they got weird. And now I'm talking about it, now I'll be in prison. They'll be in YouTube prison. Yeah. But the corporate entities of that

are less controlling than, you know, than when you do a... They're not too weird about, like, swearing and stuff like that, right? No, but I do see what's going on. Yeah. I see what you're doing, YouTube. I see what's going on. I see what you're doing, YouTube. I see what's going on.

I mean, look, it's all about advertising dollars for them because Google has inherited this massive library. And for them to make more money, any show that is successful, they're obviously going to give it priority if it's easier to sell. It's no mystery. Right. I see through all the smoke. If it's brand safe.

Yeah, dude. right yeah i see through all the smoke if it's brand safe and yeah dude they want it they want yeah they want uh they want to be able to promote whatever chemical is killing your kids safely without me saying fuck right right that's really what it's the priorities yeah priorities well have you seen all these things it's like all these companies are owned by like everyone's owned by like three people right you know it's like amazon disney png yeah they're fucking it's you know so but god bless you know right but but God bless, you know. As we say this, a YouTube ad will pop up right now for P&G or whatever.

It's like, do you need baby wipes? Like, right away, it'll pop the fuck up. For us, it's the copyright music thing. Instrumentals, like sourcing music to use in the videos. I was gonna say that too, because I was like I wonder, are you making that music that you're freestyling over?

I used to, and then it was just too much for me to be pumping out that many beats. That's a lot. Yeah, it's a lot. I like producing, but I would just have to turn into a machine. What about your DJ? Yeah, shout out to Jazz.

He's a great producer. He's a super dope producer. And we're starting to do more stuff together. But for me, it's just crazy the volume of instrumentals that would be required because we're constantly going out and doing content or doing like two-hour live streams and trying to keep the music fresh. But for me, what's been really cool is there's a big community of producers on YouTube that make beats and then post them on YouTube. And then the business model is basically like you can lease those beats non-exclusively so like artists who don't can't afford exclusive production can pay 20 to like use the beat as an mp3 and things like that that's nice yeah is that a new thing i don't know anything about that uh in the last i guess like five years or something like that it's a whole so you'll use a beat that's

made by someone else you give them credit for it yes and then you pay a couple of bucks and then yeah you pay there's various tiers for like how many streams it's going to get. You know, they'll cap. Like if this is streamed more than 10,000 times, you have to upgrade to this least level and things like that. So it's just a way for artists who don't have like label budgets to get production and also a way for producers to just get their music out and get it on songs. That's true.

And then they're going to click and be like, yo, who made that? Exactly. Well, have you had one of those songs? Have you had something that's gone so big that you and the producer now are like working together more where you're like? I have relationships with a lot of the producers that we've used like in my Amigo Bars videos and things like that. They have a lot of views and we always credit everybody and link back to their YouTube and things like that and shout them out. But my thing's kind of I'm kind of in this unique gray area where I'll kind of use people's beats and credit them or reach out and say like, yeah, is it cool if I use your beats in my videos?

They're not really becoming songs. They're not going out to Spotify and becoming like bangers and hit songs that go to radio. They're just sort of being used for YouTube content. And that's been really dope. There's a lot of great producers on YouTube that I've been able to collaborate with. That's great. I want to see that if there is a transferable world from not just you making a record, but it is tough going from that freestyle thing to them being like, hey, it's like what we call, you know, like in our world, like scripted and non-scripted. It's like reality doing scripted television is always kind of a thing people are, there's a hiccup.

Yeah. People are like, hmm, what is this, you know? Right. And, you know, can it be successful, which is the challenge for you, and I wish you the most luck when you're doing a written album because I know it's tough because people like you in this light. Yes.

So when you're like, I'm good at this too, and they're like, nah, I don't know, man. Go back to doing the thing I like. Yeah, 100%. That is what's hard. Yeah, I mean I look at you know Cannabis is probably my favorite example of somebody who I thought was so good on other people's records Yeah, these features were fucking incredible Yeah, and then he puts out his own record and I think he got a lot of like flack for it So to speak it was just like I don't know if it was ever as successful as he was when he did other people's shit

Right, which is tough because people just liked him in that light. Didn't mean that he wasn't good on his own record. No, right, right, right. It's just so, I think that does a thing to people that tricks them. It's the same with people love the podcast, they love the shows, and then if they come see stand-up, it's comedy, it's a different vein, but they're like, do the podcast stuff. Right. And you're like, no, no, no, this is a different thing.

Oh, yeah. It's so real. People just get used to seeing things in a certain context and that's, and they fall in love with that. And then they want that sort of rewarding feeling of seeing that again and again. And I get it. And you know, I feel fortunate that I have so many fans of my freestyling. Sure. I also feel fortunate that I love freestyling. You know, it's my favorite part of what I do. I love improvising and I've always been an improviser. So it's dope. I feel like I'm alive in an era where it's possible to, because we're in this whole social media era where you can, you know, anything you're doing, if it's interesting, you can show it to people.

Yes. And if it's good. Even if it's not good. Even if it's not good. It might be huge. Yeah. It probably will be bigger if it's not good. i think the revolution of tiktok has shown the more shit it is yeah the more it will go right right like i'll get stuck on these videos where i'll see them i'm like why do i like this so much it's fucking terrible i know it's it's wild like

there's an old fat man that spits off to the side and he's like i'm still here giving it to your mama boy and people have looped it and duetted it and i it's so dumb and so funny yes like the best one i saw a girl opened up her jeans and turned the other way and he spits off camera it hits her you know she acts like it hits her and she she like you know faints i'm like it's such a stupid fucking video right but it's perfect because the the time oh yeah the timing of it is exactly what you want something like quick and gross and dumb yes and then get the fuck out Are you putting your shit on TikTok or no? Yeah. We post on TikTok daily. Every day?

Every day, yeah. God damn. What's the guy's name who does the model that... Gary V. Yeah, Gary V. Yeah, exactly. We basically do that for freestyling. Dude, you gotta put your fucking shit on fucking TikTok. I've shit on him so many times. Out of love.

It's all love i i just think it's so funny this guy that he's like he's a motivational speaker that says fuck every three words right you know a little like 13 year old kids yeah so you just want to like get in the shoe sales he's like then fucking sell the shoes off your fucking feet you little fucking idiot it's so you got a good impersonation dude he's i just met gary you did yeah we just did a thing we did a uh a did a talk on stage At a cannabis event It was wild

First time I'd ever done it Like sitting like me and you are But it's me and Gary Dean And chatting And he was like You fucking smoke weed dude I have to clown on him Because it makes me laugh

Every time I see his motivation It's just like There's a group of guys like that They're like the liver king There's guys on kale is bullshit There's guys on the internet who live by this like this is the way to do everything. And that's great that they have passion. It just makes me laugh that I'm like, all right, dude.

Other people have other things going on too. You know, and it's just like you have to do it this way. You're like, I don't know, dude. Do you? Do you have to do it that way? There's multiple ways to get there, right? Well, yeah. Look't know, dude. Right. Do you? Right. Do you have to do it that way? There's multiple ways to get there, right? Well, yeah. Look at you, dude.

You're a different, you're taking such a different route to get to wherever it is you're going to end up going that it is wild to walk. That is why I was a fan that I hit you guys up because I was like,

I want to talk to you and find out, you know, how this whole thing started with you. Yeah. But also, have you had any hangups yet or you're not there yet? Have you had anything

where you're tired of the fucking grind? You're like, I'm getting tired of making these fucking videos. I'm tired of doing these live shows. Have you hit the wall a little bit yet? Not really. It's coming. No, I'm kidding. There's been times where I've had to sort of rebalance the portfolio, so to speak.

Doing too much of one type of thing and then I want to mix it up and I have to dial it back. We do this series called Amigo Bars, which is be connected with strangers on a video chat on the internet and blowing their minds. I've seen that, right. You use, yeah, what's the platform? I call it Omegle. I think it's called Omegle. Omegle?

Yeah, but I just messed it up the first time I said it. Yeah, because when you said it, I was like, do I say it wrong? No, you're right. I think you're right. Omegle? Omegle is correct. Either way. Let's say Omegle.

I like it better. Oh, thank you. I think it's Omegle. That's support right there. Yeah, fuck that other way. Well, it's like GIF or JIF. You're like, come onle? Omegle is correct. Either way. Let's say Omegle. I like it better. Oh, thank you. I think it's Omegle. That's support right there. Yeah. Fuck that other way. Yeah. Well, it's like GIF or JIF.

You're like, come on, man. It doesn't matter. GIF is fine. It's a G. Yeah. It's a G. But I've seen that. That was kind of like the new age version of-

Yeah, of the gorilla stuff. It was my quarantine solution. Yeah, right. To not be able to go out in public and say, hey, can I spit for you? Right. But have you had a lot of times where this is kind of like just ending up nowhere because people are not paying attention or the stream is bad and all that

shit? Oh, yeah, yeah. All types of weird shit happens on it. Well, I mean, sites like Omegle are notorious, you know, obviously for just like dudes jerking off. Yeah. Are you catching guys jerking off whenever you pop up? Not whenever I pop up, but I've seen a decent number of dicks on there. You got a lot of dicks. I've seen we're on uh episode 68 and i think i've seen like 15 to 20 i hope you see so

many dicks on episode 69 yeah the whole thing is dick the whole thing is dick youtube will love that well yeah but but the but the that's the gross thing is guys will just jerk off and wait till someone pops up that they're gonna jerk off to right that's like yeah that's like the thrill what was the old thing called chat chat chat roulette chat roulette chatterbait yeah chatterbait I think is like an actual porn version of that to say yeah the idea was stolen from chat roulette yeah exactly sit and jerk off until somebody shows up right yeah what I kind of want is a guy to pop up you you start freestyle and he starts jerking off but then you got a flow

about him jerking off right right yeah yeah like would I commit at that is the ultimate improvisers test test, you know? Would you do it? What do you do, man? I mean, you don't have to air it, but let's see. Shout out to my man with his dick in his hand. Yeah, I don't know. I think I would have to find a way to navigate.

Sack is whack, Jack. I think you freestyling about a guy's dick in his hand is very, that's Patreon. You got to put that on a paywall site. Yes, Patreon exclusive. Yeah. Do you guys do Patreon too? We do got to put that on a paywall site. Patreon exclusive. Yes. Do you guys do Patreon too? We do Patreon.

Put that on the paywall. If you get a guy jerking off, put up a jerk-off, a whole jerk-off freestyle episode. I'd watch that. Yeah. Not for the jerk-off,

but I just want to see you flow about some naked, weird, obscure dude. It would be hilarious. Why would a guy that gets on there thinks that's going to be... Also, does that really get someone off, just jerking off to people talking?

Someone's jerking off right now to the podcast, by the way. Someone just came right as I said that. Someone's like, yes! Yes! Oh, no. Of course. I think it's the exhibitionist-like thing of it, right? It's like the thrill of some stranger that didn't plan on seeing my dick is going to see it now.

That's weird. I don't know. I can't really get there. No, nor can I. I understand people fucking in public because they think that's hot, like hiding it, you know? Like if you were with your girl or something, you guys are like hooking up in public. Public hookups, I understand the mentality

because it's like, we're being bad. What if we get caught together? Because it's like both of you are sharing that kind of, you know, that anxiety. Yeah. But solo is so sad. It's very sad. Yeah, like a guy's like jerking off outside of a grocery store and you're like, you know, that anxiety. Yeah. But solo is so sad. It's very sad. Yeah.

I mean, it's tragically sad. Like a guy's like jerking off outside of a grocery store and you're like, buddy. It's just gross, man. It's so sad. It's just not. So all those guys out there

who jerk off on Omegle, please cut it out. Please stop. Please stop. Cut it out. I would greatly appreciate it if you stopped. Yeah, because you get it

probably the most because you're on there for hours and hours. There's got to be. Yeah, but it's amazing because it used to just be just guys jerking off. That's why I never wanted to do it. There have been content creators who make things on Omegle for years before me

because it's just a good way to sort of source strangers. Sure. But it used to just be so much of that, and now there's pretty good filters. And you type in interest tags, so you can say music or YouTube or whatever, TikTok. And so it does an incredibly good job of censoring most of the dicks. Most of the dicks.

Some of them will get in there. That's my next album, censored most of the dicks. Censoring most of the dicks. Which one's better for you to pick up people off the street, Venice or New York? When you do Venice, when you're out here on the beach, is it the beach or New York? What has better source material for you? That's a great question, man.

I think, honestly, New York is more exciting because it's New York. But Venice is a great place to make man on the street content. There's a lot of wild shit over there. It's already so lawless and crazy and wild. It feels like a different country over there. It feels like Portland. Yes. It is.

Like Portland on the beach. It feels like Portland, if you will. Yeah. Lawless and insane. Yeah. Yeah. There's no cops over there. People can do whatever the fuck they want.

Yeah. I remember going to Venice for the first time when I moved here. I was like, this is just like a free fucking landscape for homeless people to just live this wild, fun life. Yeah. And then it kind of got restrictive and now it's there's no rules no i mean i don't know if i'd go there now if i was you it's a little nuts it's different now it's different now yeah um i remember being so excited

by venice when i came down here to go to college and as a freshman we took it we just like you know took a ride out there to check it out yeah and just the fact that like it smelled like weed everywhere yeah and there were weed dispensaries and like at that time and that was like my first time like being like oh shit like i could walk they got a weed doctor here like i could try to like we say i have back pain and then maybe i could like legally buy some weed you know from from a guy in cargo shorts and tiva sandals you're a doctor yeah he's like's like, am I, dude? Who knows? Who cares?

Oh, dude, yeah. When I finally did get the weed card or whatever for the first time. I got that thing. It looked like the guy, because that was back in the day. Now it's recreational and it's fucking everywhere. And everyone's buying it. But back in the day, it was like you had to see the doctor. Yeah.

But the guy, it looked like a Halloween costume. It was bullshit. It was the funniest thing. It was total bullshit. It just looked with the stethoscope and shit and like a yoga ball in the corner like he's all about fitness how's your core?

you're like just give me the weed dude just give me the fucking weed man and it was check boxes by various conditions that would warrant you getting the weed so you just pick one I can't sleep that well but I don't like weed nowadays as much because it's insane I smoke weed today I can't sleep that well. But I don't like weed nowadays as much because it's insane. Right.

It's like when I smoke weed today and I'm just like, this was never what it was. Too strong. This is very old man bullshit. But like, oh, you know, oh, yeah, complain. But truly, you could smoke a joint with some friends and be fine. And like now, if I take more than two or three hits, I'm like, I'm so high.

Yeah. Way too high to function yeah me and dave when we were like the third or fourth time that me and little dicky had dinner together before when we were talking about the show yeah we went out to a restaurant near his place and we got stoned yeah and dinner was tough right because we were talking we were having a good time but there was moments at dinner where you're like fuck i'm so high right like i'm so fucking high yeah and we were both in that same state where we're like man we should have smoked that whole joint right we could have shared a small amount but we both were sitting on the patio talking yeah at his house so we just were having a

good time because we got along so we kept sharing and forgetting the idea that like it's not what it was no and like the fact that like a single joint is enough to just like destroy two like adults adult men yeah it's kind of who had smoked I had smoked for 20 years at one point. Right. You know, I started smoking weed when I was like 15 or 16. I'm not, not saying you should kids, but also I, that's when I started when I was in high school. Yeah.

Same here. And I had smoked forever. And so like now it's like, oh, I can get my talents back. It's no chance. Yeah. I think that's part of what happened to me and part of what contributed to me just being like, yo, fuck this. I can't hang anymore.

Did you have one of those nights where it was like, am I going to die? Yeah, I had several bad trips along. Usually from edibles, you know. Oh, my God, dude. Never again. Oh, dude, edibles are fucking scary. Hashtag never again with these fucking things. Because you can get such a high concentration of THC in there way more than it would ever be feasible for one human to smoke.

You don't sit there and face 100 blunts in a row in an hour to get the equivalent level. So you just end up in the fetal position like in your bed with the lights off just like, when does it end? Pacing. I usually walk.

I go for like a long fucking walk. I'm like, get out of my system. Get out of my... But what I'm actually doing is moving it faster through my blood. So it's making me even higher. You're hyping it up. Which is fucking insane.

Oh, Jesus. So are you on tour right now? What's going me even higher. You're hyping it up. Which is fucking insane. Oh, Jesus. So are you on tour right now? What's going on? No, we're back home from tour. Okay, good. We have some one-off shows coming up. We're doing a festival called Same Same But Different. Same Same But Different.

Where is that? Is that in LA? It's in SoCal. It's about an hour outside of LA. I'm forgetting the exact name of the place where it is. Same Same. Same Same But Different is the festival that he's going to be at. When are you going to be there?

Also a great question. Let me see. Same, same. I'm going to look it up. Same, same, but different. Look at this. I've never heard of this in my life. It's dope.

There's a lot of funk bands that are going to be playing. And they call it SSBD. 77 Days. 77 Days. September 9th through 11th. There it is. That's when it is. Man, you're going to do it on September 11th

Jesus I think I think I actually am never forget the date 9-11 that's right he's gonna be doing it on 9-11

the same same but different go out and check that out yes there's yoga and mindfulness there's educational workshops live painting arts and crafts late night beach parties

swimming waterside camping what does this say how did there's there's lessons on how to decapitate a body no uh that's right how to bury a full-size adult male you never know what skills will be

applicable in the future but this looks cool and then chrome chromeo is going to be there that's wild this is very cool so go check out same same but different but also um plug your website which are the websites so people can come see you. Yes, yes, harrymackofficial.com. harrymackofficial.com. And go watch any and all of the videos that you can find of the HMAC on the YouTubes. We'll put them in the description. You can click on some of our favorites here at the Wist Ginge family.

I appreciate you being here, dude. This was wonderful. I wanted to learn more about you. I got to know. I want to come see you do your thing live. I appreciate you being here, dude. This was wonderful. I wanted to learn more about you. I got to know. I want to come see you do your thing live. I would love that, man. Yeah. Maybe I'll come out to Same Same But Different and go learn how to bury a body and do yoga. Please. I would love that. I would love to have that experience with you. It's not that far away, so maybe I'll get out there. We end the show the same way. Look at that camera right there and you say one word or one phrase to end the episode. I used to do one word. Some people freak out.

They're like, I don't know a word. So you could do a word or a phrase. But remember, this is cemented in time forever. There's going to be a vault of these last word or phrases. Oh, my God. And this will be H-Max. So when you're ready. Escalator.

In here, we pour whisk, whisk, whisk, whisk, whisk. You're that creature in the ginger beard. Sturdy and ginger. Like vampires, the ginger gene is a curse. Gingers are beautiful. You owe me $5 for the whiskey and $75 for the horse. Gingers are hell no. This whiskey is excellent.

Ginger. I like gingers.