A Geek History of Time - Episode 269 - The First Screwjob in Wrestling Part II

Episode Date: June 21, 2024

See, people when they click on this, they'll see the title, so they'll be like, poor Ed. What does that even fucking mean? However, because it's England, that's largely ignored and unstudied. I really wished for the sake of my sense of moral righteousness that I could get away with saying no. He had a goddamn ancestral home and a noble title until Germany became a republic. You know, none of this highfalutin, you know, critical role stuff. So they chewed through my favorite shit. No, I'm not helping them.

I'm gonna say that you're getting into another kind of, you know, Mediterranean, or psyche archetype kind of thing. Makes sense. Also trade winds are a thing. Ha ha, just serious. Like, no, he really has a mad on him. Yeah, we'll go upon a tangent. As we keep doing. Like, yeah, this is how we fill time. I'm going to go to the bathroom. This is A Geek History of Time.

Where we connect nerdery to the real world. My name is Ed Blaylock. I'm a world history and English teacher here in Northern California. And who are you, sir? I'm Damian Harmony. I am a US history teacher up here in Northern California at the high school level. And tonight we're going to continue to talk about a screw job between Frank Gotch and George Hackenschmidt. In typical Damian fashion, we almost got up to the match that is the match that leads to the screw job last year. So without any further ado, let's

get into that. So as you recall, there was an $87,000 gate in Dexter Park Pavilion in Chicago in April of 1908. Yeah. And this is at a time where you could go to a nice restaurant and buy a full meal for a quarter. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe a buck, you know, at the most. But yeah, this is

boy howdy. So I believe the number was it was worth roughly $2.7 million in today's money. Yeah. Now, Hackenschmidt, George Hackenschmidt, remember, had been ascendant and dominant this whole time. And Gotch on the other hand kept seeming to have troubles. He would dominate someone and then lose to someone that Hackenschmidt had an easy time with. And then it's just kind of this weird cycle where if I was writing it, I might have written it that way. Yeah. And the lines are kind of blurred between work and shoot at this point, because even Hackenschmidt himself

allowed guys to look better against him than they needed to, to draw business for the next time when he would absolutely destroy them. So you have a blending, you have, there are some people who made a reputation of never having wrestled fixed matches, and others who made a reputation for having worked fixed matches before.

Yeah. So Hackenschmidt was reported by American newspapers as disdainful of the American fans, so much so that he kept his workouts private. Now again, jingoism is on full display here. So he's the foreigner. Now according to several sources, Hackenschmidt was actually barred

from the Chicago Athletics Club for refusing to train publicly. And he spent the week leading into the bout going on long walks near the lake instead. Now this is entirely possible because Hackenschmidt was kind of a reclusive fellow, let his work speak for itself, did a lot of writing, certainly was brilliant in many, many languages,

but was not the promo guy that Gotch has been proving to be. not the promo guy that gotch has been proving to be. Yeah. And so that leads to the question. So at this time training publicly was the norm. Yes, it was part of your promo work was to have public workouts because that would get people to come, oh, well, go on my lunch hour and see what he's doing. Wow, that guy's strong. Yeah, you know what?

I think I will buy a ticket. So it's like standard promo stuff You know, it's doing the press. It's showing up to the early a.m. Morning Zoo show nowadays, right? Okay, right Now according to a biographer later on Hackenschmidt was not in good shape for this match His endurance was not kept up by regular workouts Which itself wasn't that big of a problem in most bouts because of how dominant he was so could he have softened because of this sure And the thing is at this point He's gonna need every ounce of cardio that he's got and he doesn't have much because of what's been happening with his workouts. Okay. Now according to reporters the match itself consisted of quote the slow defensive work of gotch which lasted

106 minutes the American took the aggressive and by vicious work out of the rough I'm sorry The American took the aggressive and by vicious work of the roughest kind, which included butting, heeling, and other stunts commonly referred to as dirty, but which are permitted in wrestling bouts. He worried his opponent badly, and Hackenschmidt was up in the air and did not know how to attack his opponent. Hackenschmidt finally tried for a body grip, but could not reach Gotch.

The Russian complained to referee Smith of Gotch's budding. He missed a leg hold next. Half an hour of sparring failed to satisfy the crowd. Okay. Now the evening world had interviews for both men after the mount. First Hackenschmidt, quote, "'I have been credited with one defeat before

"'at the hands of Beck Olson. "'This is untrue. This is my first defeat and I was physically unfit to wrestle. Mind, however, I am not detracting from my conqueror's victory. I simply want to have the truth known. I had a very heavy forfeit up and to annul the match meant thousands of dollars loss. I will say that I did not believe any man could stand before me no matter what my condition was. The doctor forbade me to enter the ring, but I did it. Defeat was my reward. This is my first and only defeat.

Okay, wait. Mm hmm. Like obviously he's going to, you know, well, you know, I wasn't really at my best. I was, you know, da da da da da. So he's, he's, he's, I'm, I'm struck by how much he is playing up how out of shape he was, you know, that, that, you know, the doctor forbade me to go in. I mean, that, that sounds like, you know, you're, you're nursing a wound. Right. Which we have no reason to believe he had going on at this point, you know, because all the stuff

about his knee is two years ago, a year previous? Two years prior, yeah. So, like, what was, was there, was there context for the whole, you know, the doctor forbade me to go in, or was that just like a promo line? No, actually there was something about him being ill. Okay. Yeah. So, and it has to do with the cold Chicago air and all kinds of stuff.

There are a number of- He's from Estonia. Like, come on. Cold Chicago air. What? It's spring in Chicago where it's humid. You're not used to the same kind.

And also, from Estonia doesn't mean he's been in Estonia this whole time. He's been living lavishly in very well-kept up places in England. which itself is not the best of weather, but he would be indoors for a lot of that. Remember in Estonia, he cycled until the winter and then he went outside to lift weights. All right, fine.

But I'm calling some proportion of bullshit on that story. There certainly does seem to be a lot of self-protection going on there. Yeah, he beat me, but let's be real. You know, it's that kind of thing. Now then, Gotch, right? And by the way, that's chicken shit heel stuff. That's Ric Flair the next night. That's...

Oh yeah, big time. Now here's what Gotch says, quote, I knew I could win and I have made good. I have been preparing to meet Hackenschmidt ever since he refused to wrestle me three years ago on the grounds that he was satisfied with beating Tom Jenkins, who was then the champion. Hackenschmidt hasn't improved since I saw him last and I have. That is the whole story. I am ready to go on and wrestle any champion that any country in the world produces to face me for my title.

And you can put down, put it down that I have learned enough about the game since Jenkins beat me three years ago to make it hot for any of them. You can take that to the bank brother. Yep. That's, that's 110% says I just whooped your ass like that's yeah, that's that's that's yeah. Wrestling has always been this way. And now and you said that phrase often enough in the last episode that now I'm starting

to hear it like all of this has happened before and all of this will happen again. You know, so say we all Wow Yeah, it's it's So so when when we talk about gosh having defeated him, yes and I'm putting air quotes around that in this match did he actually get a submission or was it just Hackenschmidt wasn't able to pin him down. Well, let's hear what the reporter had to say.

Okay. Quote, the end of the contest was dramatic in the extreme. Hackenschmidt, with his eyes fearfully lacerated, his nostrils torn, his lips and face battered beyond almost beyond recognition, smeared from head to foot with his own blood that streamed from a score of wounds on his head and arms and body, went to the mat at last with Gotch on top. He was half-blinded, dazed, and weary beyond all description. Immediately, Gotch leapt upon him like a savage, driving his knees into Hackenschmidt's body and roughing in the style used when football was legalized

manslaughter. The Russian suddenly quit the struggle and appealed to the referee as he had a score of times before during the bout. For a few minutes, there was great confusion. The roaring shrieking mob that filled Dexter Park Pavilion rushed madly toward the ring and swarmed through the ropes. Then Referee Smith made his announcement. The crowd seized Gotch and carried him back to his dressing room while Hackenschmitt's seconds were busy washing the blood from his face and dressing his wounds. The

crowd then surged to the ring, wrapped Gotch in the American flag, and carried him off. Wow. Yeah. So it was a wrestling bout that was a scrum. Even the reporter is acknowledging that this was not wrestling. And that's as catch as catch can as it gets, right? It was allowed to do those things.

It's just not considered nice. And just because it's allowed to do those things doesn't mean you do all those things the whole time as your move set. Yeah. So, so, Gotch, Gotch won using heel tactics. Heel's gonna heel. Okay. Yep. But and it's an American lapped it up because you've got an American doing the healing makes you the face.

Okay. Yep. All right. I mean Hackenschmidt was aloof and distant the whole time the week previous. So they weren't endeared to him. They were none too pressed to cheer him on in the contest at all, despite the heel tactics of Gotch, which were fully undeniable, and the reporter continues, Although Chicago is a Gotch stronghold, there is much diversity of opinion over this affair. There is little doubt that Gotch wore Hackenschmidt down and

that he was in far better physical condition. But all through the bout he used foul tactics of a sort that would have fully justified the referee in disqualifying him. He jammed his thumbs into Hackenschmidt's eyes. On one occasion when Hackenschmidt had twisted the Americans thumb, Gotch retaliated by smashing him time and again in the face with his fists until the blood spurted out and ran over the Russian's face and body in streams. Time and again, he butted viciously. Okay.

So what strikes me about that is a moment ago when we were talking about the promo language at the end, um, uh, uh, Godge316 says, I kicked your ass. Yeah. Um, that, that is leaping literally a century forward in time. Yep.

To, to Stone Cold Steve Austin and the heel-esque baby face. Absolutely. He, at that point, Steve Austin was turning without changing his tactics at all. Yeah. Like, there's a remarkable anti-hero vibe there, which is not in keeping with with the rest of what we see out of the era. Right. But in but in this case it's as you said before

jingoism. Yes and you do see wrestlers doing oh there's gonna be so much fun. You do see wrestlers doing shit like this, but they don't win typically Because they're heels. Yeah, okay getting a morality play here and at the same time this could have 100% been a shoot because the referee is an American as well and He wants to see a conclusion just as much as anyone else does. Yeah, and Hackenschmidt should be able to beat anybody for any reason. Now, other reporters jumped in. The Evening World continued, quote, Hackenschmidt looked a Hercules beside the taller and more smoothly muscled American. Hackenschmidt weighed 208, Gotch 196. Hack looked a little white and pasty

while Gotch was brown and showed the effects of a long course of preparation, which he indulged in while Hackenschmidt's contract kept him jumping from city to city, giving exhibitions. Much of it seems to give credence to Hackenschmidt's complaints of Gotch having been oiled up. Hmm. Mm-hmm. Quote, Hack tried to seize Gotch about the body for his famous bear grip, literally just a bear hug, but Gotch squirmed out of danger and got clear. Time and again, Hack drove in for a leg hold, but Gotch either sidestepped or jammed his hand into Hack's face and held him off. Every time the Russian missed the crowd, the crowd rose and howled with glee.

As they came together, Gotch suddenly thrust his thumb into Hackenschmidt's eye. Hack tried for a leg hold and Gotch struck him in the face with the heel of his hand. Hackenschmidt complained to the referee but was ignored. They had been wrestling 30 minutes and were both still on their feet. Hack was doing the forcing but seemed unable to hold the slippery Gotch. Hack was trying hard for a head or wrist or leg hold, but it was useless. Gotch seemed able to slip away and keep him on the move. Gotch was dancing around like a boxer letting Hack do the work. Once Hack got behind Gotch, and for a moment it looked like like it looked as if they would go to the mat but gotch jumped away quick as a flash managing to jam his thumb into hacks my eye. Oh, I, just even thinking about it makes me wince.

And just constantly doing that? I mean, I see now why that phrase exists. Why? Yeah. So let's see. They rushed each other to the ropes fiercely, taking turns in the roughing. Gotch was growing more aggressive, and Hack left openings,

while brushing the blood from his eyes with his hands. Hackenschmidt's face was bleeding badly at the end of the hour, and he looked tired. His nose and mouth were badly battered. Gotch struck blow after blow with the heel of his hand, and even with his fists. Gotch's nails lacerated Hack's right arm and he bled freely. For half an hour more they kept trying fruitlessly for holds, both extremely cautious about leaving openings. The crowd was tiring and yelling for action, but the men in the ring paid no attention. Gotch jammed his hands into Hackenschmidt's face and asked the referee to

interfere, as before without receiving any attention. More fiddling and both weary, stopped in the middle of the ring and stood still for a few seconds. Gotch seemed to think his time had come then, for he suddenly became aggressive and rushed Hack furiously against the ropes, trying for a leghold. More roughing of the Lawned Prize... Oh, more roughing of the Lawned Prize ring variety by Gotch, and Hackenschmidt stopped short and talked to the referee, who said, go on and wrestle, Hackenschmidt, or go on and wrestle. Hackenschmidt, exhausted and covered with blood from head to waist, appealed to the referee, and the crowd swept the police off their feet and rushed into the ring. Hackenschmidt was not thrown. He gave up. Referee Smith

says that when Hackenschmidt appealed to him against Gotch's roughing, Hack wanted to call the bout a draw. Oh, wow. So Okay. The story unfolds a little here. Gotch was straight up punching Hackenschmidt in a wrestling bout.

Yeah. Hackenschmidt appealed to the ref multiple times, but he was simply told, continue to wrestle. And when he pointed out that Gotch was smeared in oil, and even at one point requesting that the match stop so that Gotch could take a hot shower to wash off the oil The referee said that he should have noticed it in advance of the match and to get back to wrestling

What and remember this isn't the screw job and then Shortly after that he quit the match and by many accounts he quit graciously at first quit the match and by many accounts he quit graciously at first, surrendering the fall. Both men retired to their dressing rooms between falls and Hackenschmidt actually sent word that he forfeited the second fall as well. He was quoted as saying, quote, after going nearly two hours with him, my muscles became stale. My feet also gave out. I had trained constantly against the toehold and had strained the muscles of my legs.

When I found myself weakening, I knew there was no use continuing and that I had no chance to win. That was the reason I conceded the championship to him. I have no desire to wrestle him again. A return match would not win back my title." So shortly thereafter, even before leaving Europe though, Haken Schmidt then began complaining publicly of all the things that I just reported on. He also said that such a match should be redone, but in Europe, intimating that no such fair match could be held in the US. Okay. Now according to the Tacoma Daily News, quote, Gotch's rough tactics and continued aggressiveness took the ginger out of the visitor and he lost heart.

aggressiveness took the ginger out of the visitor and he lost heart. Okay. So it, it feels like everybody is acknowledging that gotch had to, if not cheat, play dirty to win. Yeah. And yet that was okay. Now. Yeah. Well, it's, it's it's There's a streak with an American competition culture

The John Madden effect just win baby. Yeah, you know and and and what I thought of was a carol Shelby If you ain't cheating you ain't you ain't trying right? You know And it's like well. yeah, I mean it's dirty, but it's legal. Right, and again, each one of those things is legal because it'd be too easy to just get a guy disqualified. Yeah. But doing all those things at once,

it's like he found the hack. Well, but he found the cheat code, you know, of just like, well if I do all those things at once. It's like he found the hack. Well, but he found the cheat code, you know, of just like, well, if I do all those things, none of them is illegal. Yeah. And what you have here is brawler versus technician. Yeah. And the brawler won.

That makes sense, yeah. Which is, WrestleMania 13, you had Stone Cold Steve Austin, who by the way had to change his style because his neck was broken, um, became a brawler. He had been a technician. Yeah. But you had him against Bret Hart, brawler versus technician, and the technician won because Stone Cold Steve Austin passed out in a pool of his own blood. What? Yeah. I mean, that was K-Fabe, but yeah.

Well, yeah. That's how they did it. Yeah. So from Hackenschmidt, interviewed before he set sail back to England, he said, quote, I believe I have not had a square deal. The referee, when I met Frank Gotch in Chicago,

did not seem to see the way in which Gotch was wrestling. I had no one behind me to look after my interests. You can see for yourself." And at that point, the reporter noted that Hackenschmidt's, quote, left side of his face and I were badly disfigured. So he like turns and shows everybody like, look, my face is hamburger right now. Yeah. Hackenschmidt went on to complain that quote, that comes from scratching and should not be allowed in a wrestling match.

Gotch kept digging his thumb into my eyes. Gotch was washed down with oil before the bout and I could not get a hold of it on him. If everything had been fair, I am sure I would have won. Which, you know, okay, let's assume this whole thing was a shoot and let's assume that hack is being completely on the level here. All of that fits. All of that makes sense? Yeah, I mean it does. It's, it's, yeah, it is entirely reasonable. Yeah. Feasible. And let's, let's say for a second, if you're gotch, you've been losing off and on to different people. This guy is known for his incredible strength and his incredible technique. What possible advantage, what game plan could you bring?

Yeah. And so that all makes sense, right? Yeah. And, I mean, come on, this is professional wrestling. Like, who's gonna let you cut them open or damage your face or... Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, what is this, now? Uh...

Like... Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, what is this, now? Yeah. So, he also separately claimed that Gotch had doused his hair with chemicals that were burning Hackenschmitt's eyes when they locked up, because he would just rub his hair up in Hack's eyes. Hackenschmitt even threw out there that if he had beaten Gotch, the jingoistic crowd in Dexter Park would have made it very unsafe for him.

You see with that last line, I feel like he's, you know, foreign or healing it up a little bit. Maybe, but at the same time, he could also be seeing America for the first time in a lot of ways. Okay, yeah. Like, this is the Chicago crowd. Okay, I can see that. Now, for his part, Frank Gotch had a response to these claims. Quote, Hackenschmidt was never a better man than I am.

I can beat him anytime, and I'm willing to go right out now and wrestle him again. Okay. Go right out now and wrestle him again Okay The New York Times reporter said quote Americans believe him next to invincible And again this match wasn't the screw job despite it being very clearly fucked up Now Hackenschmidt would go back to England and he would wrestle again on April 20th. So we are talking 16 days from from his loss in Chicago He won easily Against a man named Zabzko

Now after every match gotch was pictured cuddling up to a big bag of purse money I can almost hear him saying, woo. Right? Like, yeah. Wow. Yeah. I mean, gotch has figured it out. He knows what is selling what, um, in the Chicago Tribune, they printed a picture of him doing that with the caption, another winning hold. Now, despite his clear efforts at barnstorming, which is a known work to shoot effort made by conning people through the works until you have to shoot, although if you do it right, you've got everyone who fights you in on the work and you leave town before anyone's the wiser, you in on the work and you leave town before anyone's the wiser like Gotch had done in Alaska. Despite all this, after this match with Hackenschmidt, everyone thought that Gotch was true and legit anyways, always, even though he was obviously barnstorming, even though he's going on tour and working the whole time and he had worked up in Alaska and all that now

because of his defeat of Hackenschmidt, which seems to have been oil-based, seems to have been brutality-based. And now everybody's like, he's an undefeatable wrestler. I love, sorry, you said oil-based. I can think of what you're talking about it like it's paint right But it is on a canvas. Yeah, there you go. You know so I mean after all it must be real who would let you do that to their face You mean exactly like and that's just it

There's the work at it and that makes sense on the other hand. Right. I mean, the reason that Stone Cold Steve Austin passed out in a pool of his own blood is because Bret Hart bladed him. Yeah. It was agreed upon, but it's like, who'd let you do that to his face? The other guy who's looking to make money with you. Yeah. But now everybody thinks that gotch is true and legit. So, so I mean, this begs the question for me. Do we, do we know of any correspondence between managers? Do we know of any communication? To indicate that, you know, this was a planned narrative.

Not this one. Okay. There, again, when they get their return match, that's when the screw job happens, which means that the screw job- It had to be work. Well, that's the thing though. Could it have been a screw job happens, which means that the screw job. It had to be work. Well, that's the thing, though. Could it have been a screw job of a shoot?

OK. Yeah. It's going to get it's going to get weird. So anyway, I found an article the following year in 1909 stating that Gotch had won back the title from a French wrestler named raoul de roen in three state falls i Couldn't find a single record of a prior bout though even though this article is from the standard in Ogden, Utah and was unequivocal and it being a Regaining victory by gotch and it talks about the Frenchman being 50 pounds heavier, in excellent condition, but makes no offensive moves throughout, which that in itself feels a bit like a work.

A little bit, yeah. Now Gotch then goes on to beat Jenkins. He also beats Dr. Ben Roller, a former trainer of Hackenschmidt's, and even Stanislaus Zabisco. And that match also felt very much like a work, because remember, Zbyskow is often tied to work matches a lot more often than others are. Now, just to give you an idea as to who Zbyskow was, Zbyskow was born, is it pronounced Jan or Jan? Jan.

Jan Stanislaw Zgiganiewicz in 1879. So he's a contemporary of both men. He was billed at 5'8", 230 pounds. He's a fire plug. I am still struck by how short all of these guys are. Right? By modern standards, they're practically little people. Oh, yeah. I am still struck by how short all of these guys are. Right. Like by modern standards, they're, they're practically little people. Oh yeah.

Remember Roddy Piper was a little dude in the ring and he was six too. Like, but like you see him and they live and you're like, he's a fucking tree. So now Zabisco's career went from 1901 to 1934 and carny aspect of it all seems to be his foray into wrestling. Zbyszek took that as his wrestling name from a fictional Polish knight protagonist named Zbyszek of Bogdanaisz from a novel written in 1900 by Henry or Henrik Sienkiewicz, and it's called the Knights of the Cross. So he's pulling from classical literature. Zbysko worked with Hackenschmitt's former manager, C.B. Cochran, and it was there that he began to get the stank of throwing matches from time to time, working against guys who

were under his and Cochran's employ, including his employ. So late November of 1909, Zabisco and Gotch meet up in Buffalo, and they battle to a one-hour draw, which of course is going to set them up for a return bout this following summer. And this would come after Zabisco defeated Raul de Roen in December in Kansas City, Missouri, in a match that was noted for Derroin's rough technique wherein he, quote, resorted to almost

every unfair tactic known to the game. He gouged the patient Pollander's eyes, twisted his nose, pinched his body, and slugged him, as reported in the San Francisco call. So in other words he did exactly what Gotch had done to Hackenschmidt. Right. Okay. And he defeated DeRuen prior to losing to Hackenschmidt, or sorry prior to losing to Gotch. Right. So then Zabisco would go on to have a match against Dr. Roller, losing to him because he failed to throw him twice in the match

and that was the stipulation before the end of 1909. I also found a 1910 article in the Minneapolis Tribune that was dedicated to giving the rules for wrestling for the reading public because that's I mean that to me is got my mind agog like there's an actual article that says here are the rules of wrestling this is after the biggest match has ever been done it's it's to catch up the casual fan to let them know, here's what you can expect. This is in Minneapolis, which is a big wrestling town. Quote, opponents may grasp any part of each other's body.

No form of strangling is permitted unless especially agreed to by the principals. Before each match, the announcement is usually made, strangle, hold, barred. Neither contestant is allowed to rub any oil or grease on his body. Seconds must not touch their man during the bout. Neither shall they give him any advice until a resting period is reached. The stakes go with the referee's decision in every event.

Contestants shall be allowed 10 minutes rest between each bout. A fall is scored against a man when both shoulders touch the mat at the same time. A single arm may be pressed against an opponent's throat, but the free arm or hand must not touch any part of the opponent's head or neck. So you can't drive your forearm into my throat and then pull my head up against that, right? Okay, yeah, yeah. The referee shall slap on the back or the shoulders the wrestler securing a fall so that the under man will not be strained by being held too long in a possibly painful

position. When a wrestler refuses to continue a contest at the referee's command, the decision and stakes shall be awarded his antagonist. When wrestlers roll off the mat, under the ropes, or foul the boundary lines in any way, they shall be ordered to the middle of the mat by the referee and ordered to resume the holds that they had obtained when moved. In some bouts, the men are allowed to stand and begin anew in this emergency. Biting and scratching are fouls. The timers shall announce when the limited time bouts are within three minutes of the end

and then shall call off every minute. The timers may divide the last minute into halves or quarters if they so desire. Rolling falls do not count. The referee shall decide all questions that are not covered by these regulations. Now, okay, I mean, that all makes sense. Right. And we saw almost all of that in gotch matches. Yeah. I also found evidence of a women's match in 1910 in March. This also smelled of a work though.

Quote, last night at Harry Williams's academy, Miss Cora Livingston, the champion female wrestler of the world, failed to throw Miss Mae Nelson of Pittsburgh in the specified time of 15 minutes, thereby losing the forfeit money. The match was wrestled catch as catch can with Stranglehold's bard, and was the outcome of Monday night's encounter

when Miss Livingston failed to throw the local woman. The same wrestlers will meet Friday evening in the bout to the finish Charles Reinke will referee. Interesting. So about that gotch match, right? Yeah. So so now back to the gotchZibisco return match of June of 1910. Takes place in Chicago, which is a Gotch mainstay.

He's very popular here. But it's also got a very large Polish population. 41% of the white population in Illinois in 1910 was from German and Russian birth or parentage. And 37% of the whole state of Illinois was in Chicago. in 1910 was from German and Russian birth or parentage. And 37% of the whole state of Illinois was in Chicago, which means that of the 5.6 million people living in Illinois, 1.2 million of them were from Germany or Russia. Okay.

Now, what do we know about Poland back then? it had bounced between the two. And it was not a country at that time. Yeah. In 1910, it wasn't a country. It was a region that both Germany and Russia had claimed to. So when we talk about Polish folk in Chicago in 1910, and we have to look at German and Russian. Yeah. Because there is no Poland at that time.

Right. So Gotch was a fan favorite in Chicago in June of 1910, and I'm not saying that this is a work, but it sure feels like someone took a dive. According to the New York Times, quote, Frank Gotch of Humboldt, Iowa, tonight, successfully defended his title as wrestling champion of the world by easily defeating Stanislaw

Zabisco, the Polish champion in straight falls at the Coliseum. Gotch outclassed his bulkier opponent in every department of the game after winning the first fall in the phenomenal time of six and one quarter seconds. It was only a question of how long the pole could hold out against the brilliant and varied attacks of his more skilled rival. At no time was Gotch in any danger and when the pole would secure any advantage, Gotch would quickly break his hold and jump to his feet. Gotch would forestall his opponent at every turn and it was worse than hopeless for the pole to attempt to assume the aggressive.

Yeah, that definitely sounds like a work. Yeah. And that six and one quarter seconds in the beginning? Yeah. It could be, yeah. That's a swan dive. Yeah. Well, and now here's the thing. It could be that Gotch is just that damn tricky. Because according to other reports, Gotch suckered Stanislav Zabisco in with the normal and customary handshake, which then he turned into an armbar and a half Nelson immediately.

So we've seen this in MMA where they go out and touch knuckles and the guy immediately swings on him. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Zabisco protested, but then he was told by the ref, get to wrestling. There was a report shortly thereafter that Gotch had retired and Zabisco went on to wrestle the Great Gamma in a famed two-hour and 45-minute match that ended in no fall. Jiminy. I went down the rabbit hole in the Great Gamma,

but it didn't really apply here, so I just researched it for funsies. Okay. So I do know that Gotch didn't seem to retire because he wrestled a ton of fucking matches, but there was a time where he hit the road to be in a play called All About About, which appeared on the Vaudeville Circuit.

I found no official retirement notice around this time, but I did notice a lack of his being in the ring. Could be he was nursing an injury, taking time off, or making money in other ways. But in January of 1911, it gets a little weird. I found an article from the New York Times that stated that Gotch did in fact retire the title to another man whom he'd back against Hackenschmidt. And that was announced by Farmer Burns. Quote, Frank Gotch, champion wrestler of the world tonight, declared he resigned the honor in favor of Yusuf Mahmoud and said he would back Mahmoud against Hackenschmidt

for $20,000, part of which was posted tonight. The announcement was made by Farmer Burns from the ring in which Hackenschmidt and Jess Westegard were prepared to wrestle. Burns stated that $1,000 had already been deposited by Goch and that the remainder would be posted any time the challenge was accepted. Mamout and his manager appeared in the ring and the Bulgarian offered to wrestle Hackenschmidt on the spot for nothing or for any amount. Okay. When I say that professional wrestling has always been this way. I mean, it has always been this way.

Meanwhile, Hackenschmidt was wrestling three to one handicap matches. I've been fighting gangs for charity. Now not all at once, mind you, but he would wrestle each man to a throw, 20 minute rounds. Okay. He quote, failed to throw three men in an hour here tonight. Jalmar London, the Swedish wrestler, staying 20 minutes.

Hackenschmidt threw his first opponent, Oroles, the Greek, in four minutes and 13 seconds. He was unable to throw London in 20 minutes allotted. In this bout, the Russian was on the defensive much of the time, and on one occasion was thrown heavily to the mat. The third bout was easy, Alvery going down in five minutes and 50 seconds,

according to the New York Times article in January of 1911. Again, I don't know how much of this is work and how much of it is shoot, but man oh man, when I say that professional wrestling has always been this way, I mean it has always been this way. You've got two men outdoing each other as best they can to get to the champion who appears to have retired and then thrown his support behind a fourth man. On January 25th, 1911, the New York Times was pretty plain in itself congratulations

of the wrestling in the area. With Hackenschmitt in town and Gottsch coming within a week or two, the wrestling game seems on a fair way to its revival in New York. Joe Humphries, who has arranged a lengthy bill for tomorrow night's carnival at Grand Central Palace, says it's only a question of time when either Gotch or Hackenschmidt will be matched with Zabisco. Zabisco may throw Podowsky, the Russian, and Yankee Rogers within a time limit, says Humphries, but he will have his hands full with Americus. The light heavyweight grappler has thrown Dr. Roller in the straight falls, and Hackenschmidt

couldn't do anything with him in an hour. So you see, he ought to keep Zabisco busy. Humphries regards Zabisco as the star of the carnival, but he has other attractions that may prove even better contests than those which the big pole appears. Okay. So the three men that Hackenschmidt threw were a different three men that he'd gone against the week prior and he looks dominant here. Well, George Hackenschmidt, the Russian lion, showed all the fine points of the wrestling game to a crowd of several hundred enthusiasts at Odd Fellows Hall, Hoboken, last evening by winning his handicap match against the three opponents who were more of men than

ordinary ability at the grappling game and each succeeded in making the big fellow work hard for the first few minutes of the match. Then came the quick ending, none of the trio being able to stay as long as 11 minutes. Hackenschmidt agreed to throw each opponent in less than 20 minutes. Hack's first opponent was Jim Galvin, the Irish Giant. Galvin is many pounds lighter than Hackenschmidt, but he is strong and wiry and managed to squirm out of several dangerous holds before he was finally pinned to the mat.

Galvin was on the defensive all the time and quickly tired from the exertion necessary to break the numerous holds which Hackenschmidt secured. The Russian's superior strength tolled after five minutes of wrestling as he pinned Galvin's shoulders to the mat with half Nelson and crotch hold. Okay, wow. So now, yeah, there's also more here.

Ferdinand Sankofsky was the next to face the Russian, and he succeeded in staying longer than either of the others. Ferdinand is a longshoreman who carries about 285 pounds of Avoir du Poivre. Avoir du Poivre? Yeah. I have no idea what that is. Yeah. I'll have to what that is.

Yeah, I'll have to look it up. I don't know. And the muscular Hackenschmidt appeared small in comparison. For five minutes, he did not allow Hack to secure a good hold, breaking one after the other, which Hack attempted, and incidentally, locking Hack's head under his arm at intervals much to this comforture of Hacks cauliflower ear Sen Sankowski showed wonderful strength and gave the Russian a hard fight But Hacks superior knowledge of the game began to manifest itself after eight minutes of hard wrestling and he began to tire Sankowski with Hammerlocks after breaking several of these holds Sankowski found himself in one which could not break, and his shoulders touched the mat together in 10.07. Haken Schmidt's third opponent was Hans Lenner of Hoboken, New Jersey, the New Jersey champion, and he gave Haken Schmidt a better fight than either of his predecessors for eight minutes, making the Russian work harder than before. He broke

hold after hold, but finally when Hack had him tied up with a full Nelson, referee service awarded the Russian the fall. There was some dissatisfaction over the decision and Lanner claimed that he had not been thrown. Hackenschmidt agreed to go on again and with Johnny Dunn as the referee, the match was continued. The Russian made short work of Lanner this time, pinning him so there was no chance to dispute the decision in about one minute of wrestling. Oh wow. Then Zabisco tried the same, succeeded quickly with the first, struggled for nearly the whole remainder of the hour with the second, and failed in the final six minutes to throw Americas, which I only mentioned because of what's gonna happen at the end of this episode to the title. Quote, this left Zabisco with six minutes to throw Americus, his third opponent, who is the light heavyweight champion of America.

Americus started on the defensive and seemed determined to keep Zabisco so busy breaking holds that he would not have had the opportunity to get any himself. He succeeded in this object. The time expiring was Zabisco working madly to secure a real hold. During this evening, Humphreys announced that Hackenschmidt and challenged any man in the world, Gottschbard, to throw him three times in two hours. Zabisco took exception to the tenor of Hackenschmidt's challenge

and offered to accept the defy of the Russian lion as a straight proposition with no advantage to either man in terms of the match. And in Chicago in February, Hackenschmidt started beating men with toehold variants. I notice Gotch Bard. Yes. Anybody but him right Because we're working toward that so what we're seeing here is hack and Schmidt and Zabisco chasing each other around and Trying to outdo each other and now gotch is the title guy you remember that that tournament that I'd mentioned last time Where hack and Schmidt was the prize?

that tournament that I'd mentioned last time, where Hackenschmidt was the prize. Right, right. Now Hackenschmidt is working his way back up and he's going against Gotsch to build interest and to show his legitimacy. The kicker is, not Gotsch, I'm sorry, Zabisco. The kicker is Zabisco is kind of got the stank of fixing matches on him.

So Hackenschmidt has to do extra to show that in defeating Zbysko, he's also ready for Gotch because now the narrative is that he has to work his way back up. Right, right, okay. Now Gotch appears to have stepped back out of retirement to take on and easily defeat a man named Paul Schmidt in Buffalo, who had lost to Zabisco only two days prior and married in Connecticut. And by April, it seems as though Hackenschmidt has gone back to Europe again.

Now, meanwhile, Gotch, having come back from retirement, is dominating a bunch of no names for small houses. In San Francisco, he drew a $500 house according to the San Francisco call, quote, perhaps he might have ended the match in half the time if he had tried. And here's the damning part. No one seemed, quote, no one seemed to take the affair seriously. Those who did pay their money to gain admittance to the Dreamland went because they wanted to see what manner of man this mighty Gotch is. One peek at him and the crowd was satisfied. His opponent did not figure for nine-tenths of those present were firm in their

belief that he is simply in the employ of the champion and that he goes around the country and does what Gottsch tells him to do. They may be wrong, but it's hard to convince them at that. Gottsch assumed the aggressive from the moment the bell sounded till his shoulders of the Norwegian were pinned to the floor for the second and last time. If the men had an understanding before they went into the ring, they surely carried things out to a tee, for the game worked like clockwork. It was so smooth, and even as to eliminate any possible chance for excitement." So.

So it was boring. Not only was it boring, but everybody's starting to question now that Gotch has come out of retirement, now that Zbysko and Hackenschmidt are orbiting each other to see who can take on Gotch. Gotch is trying to prove that he's still the guy, but he's proving himself with a bunch of no-name jobbers. And everybody's starting to think, oh, these guys are jobbing on purpose. This is fixed. And then in May, Americus, also known as Gus Scheinlein, or Scheinlein, Scheinlein, Scheinlein, defeated Stanislaus Zabisco in New York. Quote, by the terms of the match, Zabisco was to throw Americus once within an hour,

and he failed not only to do this, but failed to secure a hold, which threatened to result in a fall. Americus was so proficient in the defensive tactics that Zabisco never had a chance to appear dangerous. So now Zabisco is no longer a legitimate contender. He just lost to Americus in a very decided fashion. This clears the field for only one challenger. Okay, yeah.

Yeah, but also for a man to maybe be the next in line after that. Because now, Americus has kind of a claim because he beat the other guy that Hackenschmidt was set to beat. Right. So America had just incited the only other possible European threat to gotch. And so the Americans were ascendant. Right. But for the legend of the Russian lion,

which means that you probably are gonna need America's to take on Hackenschmidt at some point. Yeah, okay. Right. So, the Fargo and Forum, the Fargo Forum and Daily Republican reported on July 10th, 1911 that Frank Gotch was beginning his training for a return match against George Hackenschmidt on Labor Day. So, of 1911, Labor Day of 1911. At present, the champion is doing hardly anything but roadwork to keep his muscles in shape so he will not become sore and stiff when the heavy work begins. The plan now is for the champion to start in every afternoon at about 2.30 for a wrestling match with his helpers, which will last on the start about 25 minutes.

The public will be free to see the whole performance, and as the days advance, the time will be gradually lengthened until at the end of the August, Gotch will be wrestling with all the speed and strength he has in him for a stretch of two to two and a half hours. He expects another terrific struggle of endurance with the lion, and so will spare himself no pains in hardening his muscles for a long drawn out struggle. Gotch will have some of the best wrestlers in the country to help him. They will come in pairs to stay a definite length of time,

and will be succeeded by others who are capable of assisting him in special stages of the game. Big Rogers, who weighs 290 pounds, will give him the heavy tugging work, while such as Beal and Orderman will develop his speed and skill. Farmer Burns will be on hand most of the time and is to act in the role of Professor Burns, as he will incidentally conduct a wrestling school that will attract able wrestlers who wish to get in touch with the game from all over the United States. Kid Cutler, Jesse Reimer, Emile Klank, and a number of other notables will be on hand.

Klank, Gotch's manager, having Gotch, will train in Humboldt until probably August 27, when he will leave for Chicago, as he is under contract to spend the last week of training in that city. Okay. So this tells us that we have a match on Labor Day of 1911. Right. Now the New York Times ran an article the day before the bout comparing the tale of the tape. Both men were in their early to mid 30s. Gotch was by far the smaller of the two, both in weight but also in reach, height, measurements, various muscles, et cetera. Although I found Gotch to be 5'11 by most accounts and Hackenschmidt to be 5'9. But they were set to meet in

Comiskey Park, Chicago. Quote, Gotch won their former match in Chicago April 3rd, 1908, but he did not pin the shoulders of the Russian lion to the mat. For that reason, he has never received universal credit for his victory. But tomorrow, both contestants insist that the match will not end until one man has obtained two falls. It may be necessary to finish the contest under the glare of arc lights. Regardless of this, the wrestlers are determined to settle their dispute beyond all possible doubt before they leave the park. All right, so we're really, we're really All right. So we're really, we're really, uh, playing up the, uh, this, this is, this is the grudge match. This is the, nobody's walking away from this until we have a winner.

Yeah. This, this is the blow off. Yes. This is it. This is the rubber match. This is all doubts will be laid to rest here. Yeah. You know, gotch is going to prove once and for all that that was not a fluke. Hackenschmidt is going to prove once and for all that it was a fluke. That Hackenschmidt was right. That Gotch had to cheat to win. And Gotch is going to prove that there was no cheating needed because look how good he is this time.

Yeah. I've always been the better man. Right. Yeah. Anytime, anywhere, let's do it. And keep in mind, you had, for the next, for the previous year, you had Hackenschmidt and Zabisco going against each other until somebody took out Zabisco, and now it's just Hackenschmidt.

Right, right. And the guy who took out Zabisco is the it's just Hackenschmidt. Right, right. And the guy who took out Zabisco is the guy who'll be waiting in the wings for whoever wins this match. Okay. And actually, this is where I'm going to stop it because we're about to get to the screw drop-up. The actual, yeah, yeah.

So in the next exciting installment, that will be it. That it'll this will probably go to three episodes. But we're going to get into their training camps because that's that's where shit starts to come off. OK. Yeah. So what have you gleaned? So, yeah. So what have you gleaned? That what have I gleaned? It's just, again, it strikes me how oddly national this is at this point, that, you know, television didn't exist. Radio didn't even exist. So

the only way you would know about what happened in a match would be by reading about it in the paper. And everybody was, this was a big media event. You know, we're still 60 years out from from the Super Bowl, you know, existing. Yep. And it's it's interesting, the central kind of roles that this seems to be playing in American and worldwide sports consciousness. You know, I mean, we're focusing on it, obviously. So it, you know, looks even bigger than it was. But I feel like this is a much bigger deal Then you might think if you weren't paying attention to this part of the history of that of that time period. Absolutely. You know. Yeah, and and the and way in which gotch is heel esque You know all higher lease like You know

He's he's not he's not trying to be the good guy he's trying to be the winner Yeah, you know and he's trying to sell tickets. It feels like to well. Well. Yeah, yeah, I And he's trying to sell tickets it feels like too well. Well. Yeah, yeah, I I almost feel like that's that's at this point just a given like I don't care what time period we are in in Wrestling history like I've learned enough from you now that like you well. Yeah, I mean it's all cynical It's all about the almighty dollar like are we how we're gonna get the rubes in here to you know spend more money again Like are we how are we gonna get the rubes in here to you know, spend more money again? And what I'm trying to figure out because I know I know That I have heard

Kind of in passing, you know back in episodes 5 through 9 or whatever it was About how this match goes But I don't remember and I'm trying to figure out which narrative it is That's being set up that winds up getting you know undone Mm-hmm, and I know that either way I'm going to walk away going, Oh, fuck man. Um, yeah. And I'm, I'm, I like, I'm going to have a very hard time waiting to hear the rest of this story because you know, there's been all this buildup and like, I mean, how much of it is conscious artifice and how much of it is just each of these guys trying to set themselves up to make money?

Right. And the narrative being built from like unintentional collaboration or unconscious collaboration, you know? Yeah. Like, oh, well, you know, you're going to set yourself up as this, you know, kind of anti-heroic kind of shitheal, you know, you're gonna set yourself up as this, you know kind of anti-heroic kind of shitheal You know guy well, you know, I'm gonna be over here just being you know, the natural talent, you know like

You know cuz that cuz that's that's how the tropes work And that's and that's how it makes sense to do it. And so like you don't have to be talking to each other about All right, so You know this this is gonna be how we do the blow-off you know but it feels it did I mean this clearly everybody who handles promotion mm-hmm modernly went to school as it were learning this oh and I haven't even gotten to the promoter of this particular bout either oh shit oh yeah yeah uh jack curly oh my god like okay i'm looking forward to it even more now yeah oh yeah you know you thought it was grimy with just the two of these guys. No There's it gets it gets so much dirty. Uh-huh. Okay

Yeah, like like it's amazing that anybody competed fairly ever for any of it at any point It's amazing that there were any shoots. Oh Wow, like yeah, it's it's something. Yeah Oh, wow. Yeah, it's it's something. Yeah. So, yeah, that's kind of my takeaway. Cool. Anything you want to recommend to folks? Well, yeah, I have had the opportunity to pick up. I mean, it's totally unrelated to what we're talking about here, but it's a history of the naval war against Napoleon, entitled The War for All the Oceans by Roy Adkins and Leslie Adkins. And it is a very kind of specialized history, but it is written in a very accessible, very entertaining way. Lots of stories of daring do. There's a lot of,

if you're, if anybody listening to us is a fan of the Aubrey Maturin novels, this is the actual history that those are based on. And some of it is way crazier than the books or the movie Master and Commander ever get. So very highly recommended. War for all the oceans. How about you? I'm going to recommend a couple books. The first one I'm going to recommend is The Way to Live in Health and Physical Fitness by George Hackenschmidt. And the other one I'm going to recommend is, oh darn it, I lost it. It is a book by Frank Gotch himself. Let me see if I can find the title real quick. Oh darn it, oh yes, there it is.

Wrestling and How to Train by Frank Gotch. Okay. Actually there's another one also, Wrestling by Frank Gotch, World's Champion. And that's the one that had the pictures that I sent you. Okay, yeah. Yeah. So there's three books there by the two guys that are involved.

And you know what, I'll toss in a fourth so you got equal billing. The Complete Science of Wrestling by George Hackenschmidt. So you have both of them writing memoirs, both of them telling you how to wrestle. All right. So you get to really pick your way. And I'm sure in both cases, there's an interesting mirror to be found. Oh, yeah Of one of them to the other. Yeah Yep, so

Cool. Well, where can where can they find us? We collectively can be found on our website at wubba wubba wubba wubba dot geek history time.com We can be found on stitcher and the Amazon, not Stitcher, Spotify, sorry, on Spotify and on the Amazon podcast app and on the Apple podcast app. Wherever it is that you have found us, since you're listening to us right now, take a moment to give us the five-star review that you know we deserve and please hit the subscribe button. And I remain as ever lately a shadow in the warp. But what about you, sir?

Well, let's see, June 7, July 5, August 2, all of those you can find me at Comedy Spot in Sacramento, 9pm, first Friday of every month, Capital Punishment doing our pun tournament, which is by this point gone on for eight years now. So. Holy cow. That's something. Yeah. So anyway, come check that out. Bring your money. Come buy some merch and spin that wheel. So. Cool. Nice. Yeah. Well, cool. Nice. Well, for a Geek History of Time, I am Damian Harmony.

And I'm Ed Blalock, and until next time, keep rolling 20s.