A Problem Squared - 008 = Height Matters and Dish Splatters

Episode Date: June 30, 2020

- Why are kitchen counters one-size-fits-all? - Are the recorded surface areas of countries 3D? - Why don't plastic things dry in the dishwasher? Special thanks to: Gareth and Kiruna (@garethandkiruna on TikTok and PIrate & Parrot TV on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHX3-ZTmi60fYtcnO4VOPSQ) Ed Warner from Motionspot (https://www.motionspot.co.uk/, www.fineandable.co.uk and @themotionspot on social media) Check out www.podcastsincolor.com for an exhaustive and excellent list of podcast recommendations. And for Bec's 5KTS t-shirt, head here: www.bechillcomedian.com/5kts/square

Hello and welcome to A Problem Squared, a podcast where mathematician Matt Parker, that's me, that's him, and not-metician Beckel, that's me, will endeavour to solve your problems such as how do we open this podcast without sounding awkward? Yeah, that's not a ding yet, is it? No, not a ding yet. On this episode, we will be solving problems such as height differences in kitchens and arguing couples. Is the land surface area of a country including the slopes or not? And something about dishwashing

wow plus we've got some updates on photos of big things and beck's t-shirt yeah the five thousand pound charity one not the one that i'm currently wearing not just the t-shirt it's really sweaty right beck so how are you doing? I'm well. I'm really well. I've been exercising more. One of my favorite comedians, who also happens to be one of my friends, Abba Goliath, has been, she went on a little hiatus, but she's come back. She teaches yoga on Instagram three times a week on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays. So we're recording this on a Friday.

So I've actually said that we have to stop by a specific time. You've set a very hard deadline. I have to do my yoga. Because online yoga is happening. Well, fair enough. Yeah, it's keeping me fit. So that's been nice and social because then you see all the other people who log on to Instagram to watch as well and do it at the same time.

So you get like that little chat room. So you kind of feel like, oh oh we're all in this together and she's really funny as well I was always very anti-yoga um I think just because anytime someone is quite evangelical about something it really puts me off due to bad previous experience and I finally was like oh I'll do it just as be a supportive friend. And it's so much fun. And she's great because she's like this sarky New York comedian who lives in Britain. And so she's got this like- Oh, that's exactly what you want.

You don't want a hippie doing your yoga. No. So she's like, she's got that positivity that Americans have where she's very much like, yeah, man, you do you. You be the best you can. But also she'll say things like, and you can try to touch your toes here,

but hey, it's Monday. Who cares, right? She's really, I love it. It makes me, she's very funny and personable. So I look forward to them. So that's been keeping me sane in this situation. How about you? Well, just this week, Lucy, my wife and I,

celebrated our 100th consecutive day at home together as most of us do Matt you're not special well that's why this is what I was wondering I think for a lot of people they're like and but that's a personal best for our relationship in over a decade of living in the same house, I think that's the most consecutive nights we've both been home together. Just through the nature of both our jobs, there's a lot of travel. That's a new, yeah, that's never happened before. So we were amazed. So, of course, you know, I'd calculated when it would be.

I'd put it in the diary and i cooked a 100 consecutive days at home together dinner oh what was in it it was two pizzas well no well you're not far off it was a hundred of everything um that's a problem for the next episode matt if you're gonna cook a hundred a meal where everything was a hundred of something multiple of a hundred what i reckon fried rice but actually that's not much rice no it's somewhere it's it's a lower bound is rice it's it's more than that and an upper bound is like um hamburgers so somewhere in between there's something you can have a hundred of and be sated. No, no, no. I just made a 100. So like a lot of people I've had to do baking at home during the lockdown because getting bread was difficult.

And we've got our own sourdough starter culture now. Oh my gosh. I just tuned out. I just stopped the podcast just then. I named it Trev. Trev, Trev the sourdough culture. So, but actually I had some, I splashed out on some instant yeast, which we have a little bit left off.

And I've been making pizza dough reasonably regularly. So I made two pizzas. But then I also, which I've not done before for the first time, made a stick of garlic bread from scratch. And because then when you put that next to the pizzas, it spells out in digits 100. Or 001. Or 001.

Or 010. There's six different ways. Well, the pizzas are not identical, so there are six different ways you could arrange these things. The way that I would arrange them is rather phallic. Okay, excluding that one. I was just thinking as digits my goodness it was a romantic evening um i took a photo of it all and uh oh fine um anyway yeah so i'm sure everyone for everyone else they're thinking 100 days that's not very special but for us it was

the first time and uh we've we've double checked that we didn't just get on because both of us were off and away traveling we're still genuinely getting on despite both being home together all the time either that or she's hugely unhappy but knew that there was going to be two pizzas and garlic bread coming soon two pieces and garlic bread of it yeah exactly held on for as long as she could i've got to put 200 in the diary now. So if anyone knows something I can bake in the shape of a two, I would love to hear about it. A snake. A cake.

A snake. A snake. Oh, no. A swan. A swan is a two. A swan. Looks like a two. There you go.

Deal. Bake a swan. I will bake a garlic swan. Bake a swan. I will bake a garlic swan. We have a problem in from someone named Manic, which is actually a first for us on A Problem Squared. This is episode 008. And for the first time, we've got a repeat problemer.

So Manic gave us a question previously. I'm sure I recognize that name. I think Manic gave us the problem about how much pizza is too much pizza. That's one of our top problems. Yeah. Manic says, I've got a problem. My brother keeps complaining about a situation he and his wife are in. Okay. That's really their problem. Not yours, Manic, but fine. Namely, he's pretty tall and she's definitely short and neither of them like using the kitchen counters because the average height that they are designed for is uncomfortable to reach down to or reach up to respectively how can i get him to stop complaining to me about this problem smiley face or better, what could they do to solve their kitchen height woes?

So, Bec, can we either stop them from complaining or can you fix the root problem? Yeah, well, I offered to problem solve this one because I actually thought it was a really interesting one, especially as my husband is is quite tall and I would like people to know that I am an average height for my age wow and stature but apparently everyone else thinks that I'm small uh I get it a lot I don't know what it is it must be about the way that I walk but a lot of people if i ask them when i'm sitting down to hold their hand up to how high they think i am oh really it is always it's always about at least 10 centimeters lower than what i actually am wow oh now i really want to do that experiment i've had friends who are shorter

than me insist that we're the same height or they're taller. I had a friend who was the same height as me reach up to get something out of the cupboard for me. And I had to point out that we're the same height. That's amazing. Now, Beck, I'm going to say this, and this comes from a place of love and admiration. And I cannot think of a better way to phrase this other than you do occasionally dress a bit like a child. I don't. That sounds worse than I mean it to sound.

It's true, though. I think it's to do with the way that I dress, the fact that I wear a backpack a lot, which is going to make me hunch a bit. And I had this pointed out to me, but I walk with very heavy feet. You walk with very heavy feet. Yeah, I'm a bit of a stomper when I walk.

Wow. And your husband is very tall. Yeah, he's quite tall. So I wanted to tackle this problem because it's something that my husband and I have experienced. However, the easy solution for us, arguably me, is that he does all of the cooking and washing up. Oh, that's an easy fix. And therefore, the height of the cupboards and counters does not affect me whatsoever. So that's been one solution.

I take it that that isn't a solution that Manic's brother and sister-in-law are happy with especially as it sounds like the height of the things it isn't good for both of them whereas in our case the height of everything in our kitchen is is suitable for Gav but not necessarily me so I thought right there's got to be more into this. And I contacted a friend who's a comedian and actor called Gareth Berliner. And he's married to an Australian actress called Corinna. Right. They both have a YouTube channel. During lockdown, they've started doing their own kids show called Pirate and Parrot TV.

If you go on YouTube. Wow. It's so cute. It's very, very fun, very interactive. So it's great if you've got young kids. And Karina also has dwarfism. So there is quite a large height difference between the two of them. Yeah.

And I asked how they deal with that in the kitchen. And Gareth explained to me about rise and fall counters. and Gareth explained to me about rise and fall counters. And those are counterweighted counters where you can have them rise or fall. You can have a sink, you can have a stove. And that means that you can bring them up to your height or bring them down to a lower height. I mean, first of all, you're right to laugh because every counter is technically counterweighted because it has mass.

Secondly, is it like an extreme version of a standing desk? Because a standing desk is just a flat surface. There's no plumbing or anything, but they can go up and down. And so I guess it's just that, but the sink and everything goes with it. Yeah. Yeah. That's amazing. And I was looking it up and some of them are a bit

they look a bit hacked together right so i looked into it further because i wanted to find out what happens if like does that mean if you've got to put up with height differences and height differences can come about for any reasons as well it might not be um to do with your your actual height could be the fact that you're in a wheelchair and therefore you're in a sitting position most of the time. And so I was like, well, does that mean you would have to give up design in order for practicality? You know, it's a weird thing. So I looked into it more and I got in contact with Ed Warner,

who has a company called Motion Spot, with Ed Warner, who has a company called Motion Spot, and they specifically make really sleek, beautifully designed interiors that take accessibility into mind. So I posed Manic's question to Ed and got this answer. Accessible kitchen design is almost a science in itself. We're often asked by customers how we can design a really beautiful, flexible and adaptable kitchen to suit the needs of different people. A couple of ways you can do this is designing flexible worktops that can adjust either at the press of a button electronically or be operated on a manual winder. Effectively the counter goes up and down to suit the needs of whoever's using it. Particularly good for someone who's short of stature and may

be living with someone who isn't short of stature but for many of our clients who may be in a wheelchair or just simply have arthritis in hips or knees and need to perch while sitting and performing a task in the kitchen these flexible worktops are really good. Key considerations are to have really clear space underneath the sink and the hob so you can access underneath it in a wheelchair. But another solution that we often design into accessible kitchens are drop-down baskets that are located in overhead cabinets. And effectively, these bring the contents of the cabinet down towards you as you're easily able to pull the basket down and access the contents of the shelf. Again, particularly good for anyone short of stature or struggling to reach above their shoulder.

Hope that helps. Yeah, so that was Ed Warner, the founder of Motion Spot. And I should actually mention that they are launching a new brand called Fine and Able, which by the time we release this episode will be out. So if everyone checks them out, it'll be fineandable.co.uk. And of course, you can find the motion spot on twitter facebook instagram and pinterest so uh yeah check out motion spot if you want to look into that so that feels like a very practical answer for manic's brother if they're struggling

we should make it very clear we're not sponsored by these accessible kitchens or anything they're just people making well-designed kitchens that are accessible kitchens or anything they're just people making well-designed kitchens that are accessible correct yes correct yeah there has been no sponsorship i'm just going to what whatever lengths i can to try and answer manic's question as well we should um i should also thank um gareth and karina for their help as well and they are also on tiktok i should mention um they've got some great stuff on TikTok. So that's at Gareth and Karina. That's spelt Gareth A-N-D and then K-I-R-U-N-A.

Links in the podcast description. But there was another part to Manic's question, which was how do they stop their brother from complaining to them about this problem? Now, I think the clearest answer there is to get your brother to listen to this episode. And not only will they find out what the answer is, but they'll also learn that if they complain to you, then it might end up as fodder for a podcast. So they should be very careful with what they complain about. Yeah, any complaints to Manic are in no way in confidence, it turns out. They will be shared as entertainment fodder on an internationally listened to,

yet to be award-winning, but we're talking that kind of caliber, podcast. And of course, if you know anyone else who has had a similar problem pose there, or indeed if you've had the similar problem and we've just solved it for you, then why not pay it forward by sharing this podcast with everyone you know so that we can help solve their problems as well. What do you reckon, Matt? Did I solve it? Well, I agree that listening to this podcast does solve most problems. So yes, I think I can confidently give that a very firm ding.

Yes, I agree to say ding. Ha-ha! Finally. This next problem comes from Phil Chapman on Patreon, who says, My question is truly global. I'm wondering whether the recorded area of each country, as stated by encyclopedias, etc., assumes that the land is completely flat,

completely smooth, i.e. part of the surface of a sphere, or takes into account topography. For some countries, e.g. the Netherlands, there might be little difference between these figures. But for others, e.g. the Netherlands, there might be little difference between these figures. But for others, e.g. Switzerland or Norway, the many steep mountains could surely make a significant difference. Any idea which country would exhibit the biggest difference and whether it would be enough to change its place in the traditional ranking of countries by land area? Thanks.

I mean, that is a great problem. I was very excited when I saw this one come in. And I guess, you know, in a nutshell, you've, because if you've got a flat surface, any kind of terrain, any up and down in altitude, any non-smooth, like any wrinkles in the surface, increase the amount of surface area. And I had never thought, I mean, it feels like such an obvious question now that Phil's thrown it at us. Who needs that problem? That's what I want to know. Why is that a problem for you specifically, Phil? I feel like that's the sort of problem you have if you have investments in land and you're

trying to look for ways to capitalize further on that investment. Trying to work out what value you're getting by surface. Like, should you buy mountainous terrain because it's better value in terms of surface area? Well, you know what? I can see why Phil has this as a problem because I hadn't thought of this before. But now that I've thought about it,

and in hindsight, it seems like a really obvious question, I've become a little bit obsessed by it. So now I've got to solve it as well. Like, it problem for me i need to know the answer to this oh it's like that film the ring to pass on the curse yeah yeah you gotta you gotta play it to someone else and then they're cursed and you've got to are you got to get someone else obsessed by it within how how many days I forget. So I really, I was like, wow, why have I never thought of that? And so I, first of all, I was like, well, you know what? I'll just look up the surface area of a country and I'll find out who calculates that. And then I'll ask them how they did it. I mean, that's pretty straightforward. So I looked up the surface area of the UK,

which is where we both live. And first of all, there's no one definitive number. There are two different numbers that get thrown around. There's 243,610 square kilometres and 242,495 square kilometres. Both very specific numbers. Is that because of the tides? Was one just calculated when the tides were out Is that because of the tides? Was one just calculated when the tides were out? No, not

the tides. Great point. And a lot of people, when I was chatting to them about this, were like, what about the tides? You use the mean high water mark. So there's like an agreed bit this is where the land ends. I looked up, because there's

the Ordnance Survey people, the OS maps, there's an agreed boundary. Like the boundary exists. So yes, the tide comes in and out and the actual effective land value changes, but there's an agreed, this is kind of the edge of the land proper. For now, until the ice caps melt. Yeah, that would have to be updated if we uh have that well that would fix part of the problem and the the numbers aren't different because one includes lakes and one doesn't um because the first number does include water but yet if you subtract the water you don't get the second number and i spoke to some like a few like an academic said maybe they were using different resolutions on the map to get those two

different numbers and there's actually a whole separate problem which is it's actually if you're just looking at the length of the boundary of a country if you've got like a coastline it's not even the area famously the length of a coastline changes based on how big a ruler you're using to measure it and apparently i couldn't fact check this but apparently the coastline of cornwall if you use the one to ten thousand scale map from the os maps and then you compare it to the 1 to 10,000 scale map from the OS maps, and then you compare it to the 1 to 50,000 scale map, there's a 100 kilometer difference length in just the coastline of Cornwall. And it's because a smaller ruler, if you're measuring smaller bits at a time,

you can get in and out of more of the little coves and bits that go in and out. Whereas the bigger ruler would just go straight across them and go, ah, it's straight, straight, straight. Yeah, as the crow flies. Yeah. And so, but then if you think, well, hang on, what if there was an even smaller ruler? It would get in and out of more little bits.

I mean, all the way down to like grains of sand or atoms. And there's a famous thing in mathematics where a coastline is fractal, which means there's always more little coves and ins and outs that you could be measuring. And so there's no like there's no limit. There's no agreed. This is how long a coastline is. Because you can always have a tinier ruler. You can always have there's always a small ruler.

And so you've just got to agree, agree on a ruler length. And then that's what you use to measure it. Am I right in thinking that the problem with measuring a country is very similar to the problem we had of calculating the surface area of the T-shirt? Yes. But much harder. Yeah. So it's very bitty. It's difficult because of the shape.

It's not difficult because of this fractal problem. Because even if you've got an infinitely long coastline or you've got this complex fractalness going on with length, you still have a definite area. You don't get the same runaway problem with area with this crazy border. But you do get the t-shirt problem, as we're now calling it, because you get all these weird shapes. However, you can use a computer program to basically split it up, like we did with the t-shirt, into different bits and do all the areas separately, then add them all together.

You can get software which will take the data for where the actual coastline border is and then give you an answer. But there were two things, two problems with this. Number one, I could not find out who is in charge

of calculating the surface area of the UK. I couldn't, both those numbers, I couldn't find any organization or academic outfit or university. No one owns those numbers. I mean, where do these come from? Pirates, surely. Pirates. Yes, pirates. Yeah, nothing. No one. No one would back up these numbers. And so

in a bit of frustration, I then decided to start again with a different country. So I decided to change to Australia, where we're both from. So I've gone from where we live to where we originate from. Australia, a bit bigger, 7,656,127 square kilometers. That's roughly just over 31 UKs. Is that including Tasmania? That is including Tasmania, correct. It's including all islands and I believe all surrounded lakes and water bodies. That's just like the land, that's not the ocean, basically.

And thankfully, I could find out who owns that number. It's Geoscience Australia. So there's an actual official body in Australia who are like, yep, we'll take ownership for that number. Here it is. And so I went on to their website and I found that they took that from the Geodata Coast 100K 2004 dataset. And this is where I slammed into my second problem. I'd got past the first one. I know where this number comes from, but oh my goodness, geo data is the most confusing, bewildering data I've come across in my life. I was like, well, I'll just download that and have a look at it. Oh no, it is not in a nice

format. As in it's not format. It's not format. Yeah, exactly. It was not formatted, as they say in the business. So I dropped them an email and I was like, hey, what's up with this data? And they very kindly replied, and so I can confirm from Geoscience Australia, they do not include the terrain when they're calculating the surface area. So if this is standard practice, and I'm going to have to assume it is because they're the only organization I can get a national answer out of for a country it's the footprint of the country not the actual surface area so when you see land area for a country you're not getting all the ups and downs all the bumps and creases you're just getting the flat this is like the the footprint this is this is the area taken up by the country not the actual surface area if you wanted to, you know, wrap it or something. Yeah, not the shoe.

You're getting the footprint, not the shoe. But that was not the whole question from Phil. They then wanted to know if you did include the terrain, how much of a difference would it make? And so I put a call out on Twitter to try and find out who owned

the stat of the uk surface area inconclusive i also asked people who could help me processing geo data because i was getting so lost and i just couldn't make head or tail out of it and a few people came to my rescue one of them a, a person called Alistair Ray, had previously thought about the same question and tried to answer it. And they took a section of mountains in Scotland. They took a 25 square kilometre chunk of land from the Cairngorm mountains in Scotland. I'm pronouncing that incorrectly. Someone will correct us afterwards. And they then analyzed how much the area changed if you included the up and down information. And they went and got the data from

the OS maps and you can publicly get certain levels of data, certain levels of resolution. They were able to access, I think, data you've got to pay for, but they were able to get it. I'll put a link to the free version below if anyone else wants to have a look at this data. But they came in to exactly the same problem that you get measuring a coastline. Because all the ins and outs on a coastline it can get longer and longer the more you go in and out we've now got the same problem it does become a problem with area if you've got 3d ups and downs because how small your surface area rule or whatever that is lets you get into more hills so they found if if they yeah if they had data with a 50-meter resolution, the surface area increased by 7.1%.

But if they had a 5-meter resolution data set, it went up by 8%. So the more the resolution, the more area you get. So it's another fractal problem. So technically, it depends. We know coastlines are fractal pretty much, but I don't know about the surface area of a country. I suspect it is as well, in which case there's an infinite amount of surface area,

which is probably not a helpful answer. Although Alistair did then go on to look at some countries. They looked at Switzerland and found if you include the hills in Switzerland, it's got an extra 6.96% surface area compared to its footprint. And they did Lichtenstein. I don't know why they picked Lichtenstein. Well, because it's a small place. Yep.

But it's incredibly mountainous yeah really oh you know i've been there once and this was back in the days before sat nav on a road trip with some friends and we had printed out like the google map directions so it was after google maps was invented but before sat nav and it had us turning right and my memory this is like way back obviously it was we were on a bridge and it was having us turn right onto the road, which was like a long way below us. And so obviously the map data did not include the third dimension. And we're like, we're not going to turn right off the side of this bridge here.

But yeah, you're right. It must be like a super super super up and down country well there you go well it's got an extra 8.72 percent more than switzerland it's more up and downy than switzerland by by almost two percent up and downy so 8.72 percent more surface area compared to the footprint so i at this point i kind of felt like i'd answered the question but i hadn't really got into which countries changed and i wasn't happy because i hadn't analyzed the data myself or we hadn't i hadn't seen like for the uk or somewhere like that and i was like there's some great visualizations here and i i really did feel the same where i was like you know what now i'm really

getting into this i want to get some answers out of it but there were two problems it was taking a long time and there's now a whole bunch of people who are helping me process a whole load of geo data which is very exciting and secondly it got very visual and you can have some very cool visualizations where you show how the terrain of a country or a state or a region is different to its footprint so my plan here is i'm gonna call this semi-dinged because i feel like i've pretty sure i'm convinced that the values you see don't include terrain when you see them stated online although i'm not i've only got one example one example of Australia who have confirmed that for me. But I've not looked at how the rankings change.

I looked at how some countries change. That's something. I'm going to keep working on this. So we record this podcast a week or two normally before it goes out. So we've got time for John to do the edit and everything else. I'm going to keep working on this. I'm going to try and put out a YouTube video on my Stand Up Mass channel when this

podcast goes out on the last day of the month. You reckon you'll have this all together in two weeks? I'm really nervous. I do not like setting myself deadlines. But I'm going to give it a go. When the podcast comes out,

if you check my Stand Up Mask channel and we'll put a link in the show notes for this podcast, I will have the rest of my findings and the visualizations and everything else. And I hope that will be the second half of the ding to comprehensively solve this problem um so there you are can i can i are you prepared to award a half ding i'll give you a dick perfect and you get the later i get when i come through with the goods online so yes stay tuned i mean on you're listening to it now in the future. Go and check it out. See if I succeeded.

Our last problem today comes from Laura, who's another of our Patreons, who says, Problem, colon, why don't plastic things dry in the dishwasher? Why? Why? Okay, it's pressing. Yeah, I don't know. Do you have this problem? Well, so, yeah.

So, the first thing I have to ask, because I don't have a dishwasher. Oh. Insert, you know, joke about how my husband's the one that does everything in the kitchen now. I was about to say, we've established that's not any of your concern. Yeah. I do. His name's Gav. Lol, lol, lol, lol, lol.

So, we don't have an electric dishwasher machine. And so I'm assuming that this problem suggests that other things do dry in the dishwasher, but plastic things don't. Okay. Because in my head, nothing. It's like, because we have a drip tray that you put everything into once you've washed it and then you let it air dry. So I assumed it was the same with a dishwasher and that you, you know, you have to just let it sit there and dry naturally. But if something's drying and some things aren't, that's a tough point. Yeah, so your modern kind of energy efficient dishwasher uses the heat from the washing process to dry the dishes, I believe. Now, I'm a huge dishwasher fan. Like, ah, if I can automate a tedious chore, I'm there.

So I love the fact that I can just put dishes in the dishwasher, close it, magical cupboard. They come out clean. Ah, incredible. And it's true. When you get your dishes out, most of it will be dry to the touch, but plastics won't. And so this problem actually only came in very recently. And so I got so excited. I was like, we have to talk about this in this only came in very recently. But I got so excited. I was like, we have to talk about this in this episode of Problem Squared. And so I put a whole bunch of different things in my dishwasher this morning, put them through. Sorry, when you say different things, like I'm assuming dishes.

Oh, all kitchen things. No, it wasn't just like a brick a book no yeah um it was things you'd normally put in a dishwasher and i need to disclose my dishwasher and this was life-changing when it finishes washing it opens itself what that sounds like a recipe for danger no no no i would trip over that all the time now okay by open itself it cracks open maybe five centimeters maybe between three and five centimeters if i had to say like it just it just slightly ajar oh so it releases all of its steam yeah it doesn't like wham open like that would be the bulk of my kitchen if it did that no no it just it just pops a jar

and so that way because the issue is yes dishwashers are pretty good at drying but if they're closed obviously it's a bit of a challenge because you want your dishwasher to be nice and watertight you don't want water going everywhere but yet how are the things supposed to drive hey matt why is it easiest to put jam on toast in your house why is it easiest to put jam on toast in my house i don't know because your dishwasher pops a jar good night bye i can't believe i didn't get that See you next episode Beck out Now for the record Most dishwashers don't do this

But when I realised some did It was a deal breaker When we moved in And we needed to get a dishwasher I was like I want one that opens itself It's amazing You put the dishes in You can leave

You can even go on like vacation or a trip And you know You're not going to come back to like, you know, horrible sweaty dishes that have been trapped in a moist dishwasher for weeks. It's going to pop itself open. It will dry. Amazing. So what I did was I waited for it to finish.

It finishes and it pops open slightly. And then I was there. Boom. I opened it. I put everything out to see what would still be wet and what will have correctly dried. And my theory was it comes down to the specific heat capacity of the materials. So some things hold heat better than other things. And there's this weird,

there's a difference between heat and temperature. And things can be at the same temperature, but they can have different amounts of heat energy in them because some things heat up easier than others. No, no, don't like this. No, exactly. I know, I know. This hurts my brain.

It's the most ridiculous bit of physics. So yeah, water takes a lot of energy to heat up. Wood takes a lot of energy to heat up. But some things don't take much energy at all to heat up. I think my feet then are made of wood because my feet are cold all the time. And it takes ages to warm my feet up. I have to put my feet in a bath when they're cold because otherwise they stay cold. I've found a list here, an engineering lookup list of the specific heat capacity of different substances.

I can't see feet on here. But I will believe that your feet have a large... It's exactly that point, right? Some things warm up easier than others. If you name a substance, I'll see if I can look up its specific heat capacity. Chocolate. Chocolate. Okay, here we go. Not on the list. Ah, see, this is the problem. The closest thing I can do for you, charcoal takes 840 joules of energy per one degree Celsius change per kilogram of charcoal and chromium.

That's in a similar part of the list. That takes less energy. That's only 452 joules per degree Celsius per kilogram. Okay. So we're getting to a point where I'm stopping caring. So let's bring it back. Okay. Right.

Okay. Right. Right. Right. So you're right. Okay. Thank you. That's why we're such good friends.

You don't have any issue in telling me that in the middle of a conversation. I've probably got it wrong. I suspect there's a lot of listeners who are like, what? No, tell me about Cramie more. No, no, no, no. You're right. And this is not just a podcast thing. This is just our normal lives.

Bec was like, I'm getting bored now, Matt. I'm like, oh, thanks. Good, good. Good to know. So, here's the thing. It means when the dishwasher opens, while everything may be at the same temperature because temperatures equalize until they're in equilibrium not everything will have the same amount of heat energy stored in it and so some things have more they're holding on to more heat that they can use to evaporate off the water than other things.

And so my theory is plastic is just not got a high enough specific heat capacity to store enough energy to be able to then dry itself, whereas ceramics are going to hold more energy and so they will dry. Which is why when you take them out, a dish might be really hot still. Yeah. But a plastic Tupperware container might be quite cold. Exactly. Yeah. And there's some other issues with how things conduct to give you the energy, but you're

absolutely right. You'll pick up a dish and go, oh, that's still hot because it's still got lots of energy and it can transfer that to you. But plastic, less so. So I tried putting in a very thick plastic chopping board and a very thin plastic Tupperware storage container to see if the thicker plastic would have enough heat stored in it to be able to dry. And my initial results were that it worked so the chopping board was dry but the Tupperware container was wet now while I was taking photos of everything

in the dishwasher to document the amount of surface water Lucy had some follow-on questions and when I explained the idea she's like well it doesn't it come down to the um is it to do with the actual surface of it like dishes are smooth yeah yeah and plastic has little dents in it and so it's going to hold on to the liquid more than the smooth stuff exactly and Lucy mentioned surfactants that's my theory well she was, she was like, hey, check out the Rinse-Aid. And so I found the Rinse-Aid that we put in the dishwasher and it lists that it contains non-ionic or something, non-charged surfactants. And they're used to cause the water to spread out and not bead. So I think you're right. I think how the water interacts with the materials in terms of maybe does it drain off versus does it bead and stay put?

I'm going to add a third one in as well. Oh, no. Yep. I've got a third thing, which is most plastic things are containers, I'm going to imagine, like tumblers and various brands of stuff. Yep. Can't argue with that. Yeah. Which means that most of it is concave.

Yep. Which means that if it's upside down, which is generally the way I imagine you put them into a dishwasher. Yes, indeed. Then the steam will rise and then more likely sit on the surface of it on the inside. Whereas plates and things, it'll have less to grip onto and just dissipate above it. Roll off.

That's interesting. Or steam off the top and then have no ceiling to hit. That's interesting because I did put in a bunch of bowls, but they were kind of in the rack. They're on a bit of an angle. Huh. Interesting. If you put a ceramic bowl upside down, will the inside still be wet

when your dishes are dry? The problem is the ceramic bowl, they're concave, but they're curved. And so I think the water can run down. Whereas I think the Tupperware is like a flat surface. Oh, but I mean underneath, Matt. Underneath the bowl, not on top. Oh, no, yeah, yeah, yeah, because you put things in upside down, facing down,

but a bowl is a continuous arc, so any water will run down the sides. But if you've got a flat surface, there's no slope for it to run down, so the beads of water will sit on it. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The other thing is I've got a pot, which is metal, and it's always still wet on the inside.

And maybe it's because it's a flat surface. Oh, that's now I'm, yeah, now I don't know. As a throwaway, quick, funny problem to end this episode with and has quite possibly become the hardest problem that we've ever had to deal with yeah no yeah you're right you've had more luck explaining the differences in land surface area than you have explaining the wetness of plastic i have to do more experiments i feel like this might be one that our listeners can help with as well. Yeah, I think we're going to need some suggestions. So what was the wording from Laura's question?

What do we want people to look into for us? So the wording was, why don't plastic things dry in the dishwasher? And more specifically than in capitals, why? Why? Okay. I thought my specific heat had it, but then Lucy mentioned surfactants, and now you've come through with the actual surface and the shape and the orientation. Oh, my goodness. Okay, everyone. If you can try some things in your dishwasher, don't do anything special. Just whenever you're finished washing your dishes in a dishwasher, see what's dry, what's not.

We'll crack what they have in common. Oh, and if anyone is actually just an expert on this, just tell us as well. Oh, if you actually know, yes. Yeah, that would be even better. That's also fine. I can't keep making limited edition watercolors for people who do stuff in their kitchen.

Give it a go. I don't have the time. It's time for some updates. So last time we talked about big things and we tried to work out what the biggest big thing was by scale. And we put out a plea for someone to visit the big macadamia nut in Queensland. And someone has gotten very close, but not quite. So Colin, Colin Jermine. Sorry if I mispronounce your surname there, Colin, or your first name for all I know.

They've sent in a highlights reel of a previous trip they did around Queensland. They went and they saw the big banana. That is a big banana. They went and saw the big lawn bowl. And what I love about Colin, Colin poses to match the thing. Love it. So for the big lawn bowl, Colin's

arranged himself like he's bowling the big lawn bowl. Great. Kind of cowering. He's under the big axe. Yep. Brilliant. Nowhere to be seen near the big headphones. Just standing under the big axe. Yep, brilliant. Nowhere to be seen near the big headphones. There's a pointing there. Just standing under the big shrimp and definitely the big banana.

I mean, what more can you do when you're a big banana? I think he just looks excited. He's not doing anything more creative than that. Oh, okay. Not that excited um so yeah so colin is currently sent in the most photos of themselves with big things great stuff we've also had some good ones come in on twitter so i'll be retweeting some of those uh we may also have someone visiting the big macadamia nut between now and when this is released.

So do keep an eye out on our Twitter and Instagram for any updates on that. It's at a problem squared. We also need another recap on your 5,000 pound t-shirt. Yeah. So two things to say. First of all, we're on the other side of it. We're on the back of the t-shirt now. Over halfway.

Over halfway, which means that we've raised over two and a half grand for water aid amazing and well on the way to hitting our target in fact the only thing holding us back is how long it takes for me to do i really underestimated the amount of effort involved for doing 500 tiny pieces of art. Yeah. The other update I have is some people have been very generous and lovely and as well as buying squares, popping me a little bit of drink money on my Ko-fi account. And that means I was able to go and buy a proper set of fabric markers that have two thicknesses. So a big one, but a thinner one as well,

which means I can do slightly more detailed things and a lot more colors. Still not all the colors, but a lot more colors. So people buying squares now will get a higher quality or at least better resolution. Yeah. Oh. A better resolution and prettier stuff. still bear in mind that it is

three and a half centimeters by three and a half centimeters on fabric per square so it's still not as detailed as i'd like but i will say that the quality of pictures on the back of the shirt will probably arguably be better than the ones on the front hmm so if someone had bought a bunch of squares on the front to get you to draw a scale recreation of the rest of the t-shirt on the t-shirt yes then now like like exactly like i did then i'm now i've got the low resolution version of that on the front has anyone bought squares on the back to make a a scale copy of the back of the T-shirt on the back of the T-shirt? Not to my knowledge. I say that knowing that there will be a slight delay between this being recorded and going out.

But people can check with us at a problem squared on Twitter or indeed. Don't check. All check all right people you know what to do what oh my gosh if everyone takes up if if the whole back of it is scale versions of the back of it then all of the t-shirts on the back will have to have multiple pictures of the t-shirts yep oh that hurts my brain i'm prepared to to step up and do this again but other people come on we need one or more people buying smaller versions of the t-shirt space to go on the back of the t-shirt oh that's gonna be so good you did eight eight squares didn't you four i did eight that that's the bar and i'll do it again but i'm sure someone can do

better than me if people want to go buy squares squares with the money going to WaterAid, that is bechillcomedian.com forward slash shop. We'll chuck a link in the show notes. Before we finish up, I realized something listening back to the last episode, because yes, I do listen to our podcast. It's a good podcast. Great podcast. Yeah. And I realized that the last episode was numbered 007. Yep.

And at no point did we mention James Bond. Oh. And we'd talked about this in a previous episode because I made fun of you for not using O as shorthand for zero. For correctly not using O as shorthand for zero. For correctly not using O. 007. And someone on Twitter, I think, replied after that episode aired and said that it is actually two O's.

O. Not two zeros. So apparently in the books they do use the letter O, but it is referring to the number zero whoa whoa what hang on so when you read it it is an o o seven but the but it means it's typeset as an o yeah but it's meant to be a zero i reckon it's i reckon they did it that's's outrageous. This is my theory. Fleming did it because they specifically wanted us to pronounce it 007, but knew that if they use zeros, people like you would complain. They don't get to just decide what symbol we use.

Zeros. Oh, my. It's a license to kill. It's not a license to mess with numbering systems. I'm genuinely quite upset. Like that's probably not the only thing in those books that's aged badly, to be fair. on and rewrite all the books to be not just politically correct, but also numerically correct. Numerically correct. Yeah. Finally, we just wanted to mention that we are living through phenomenal times and we've

both been amazed at all the positive things coming out of the Black Lives Matter campaign, everything that's going on. And we realized that if you're listening to this podcast by default, you do enjoy listening to podcasts. Yeah. And if anything, if you're like me and wanting to educate yourself more, I can thoroughly recommend Into America hosted by Tremaine Lee.

Also, in fact, recent episodes on other human interest podcasts, such as This American Life. There's a great one on Science Versus about protesting in a pandemic. The most recent Reply All episode is really fascinating as well. There's just been some really good stuff out there. So thoroughly recommend that as well as checking out the website podcastincolor.com. that's color spelt the american way c-o-l-o-r podcastsincolor.com and there you can check out any type of podcast on any category that you like depending on what

you're in the mood for just broaden your range and make your subscription just a little bit more interesting by hearing some from some more diverse voices.