All-In with Chamath, Jason, Sacks & Friedberg - E16: Reflecting on the riots at the US Capitol, plus: Georgia runoff elections, vaccine distribution & more

Episode Date: January 8, 2021

Follow the crew: https://twitter.com/chamath https://linktr.ee/calacanis https://twitter.com/DavidSacks https://twitter.com/friedberg Follow the pod: https://twitter.com/theallinpod https://linktr.ee/allinpodcast Intro Music Credit: https://rb.gy/aizgdm Intro Video Credit: https://twitter.com/MikeSylvan Referenced in the show: The Killer D.A. by David Sacks https://rb.gy/k5rz0k Show Notes: 0:00 New intro for the besties - listen here: https://rb.gy/aizgdm 2:14 Sacks' trip to Miami 6:01 Reflecting on the riot at the US Capitol: police response, double standard with BLM protest, big picture, prosecuting Trump & healing the nation post-Trump 29:43 2016 Election interference, reasons for unrest & polarization, Trump's culpability 44:19 Should the 25th Amendment be invoked? 49:51 Democrats win Georgia runoff elections, did Trump's implosion lose Georgia for the GOP? 56:23 How Friedberg would handle vaccine distribution 1:07:45 San Francisco's Killer D.A., recalling Gavin Newsom, Kim Kardashian for Governor of CA

I'm going all in, with your beat, with your beat, with your beat 50s are back, I'm going all in, with your winners ride Rainman David Saunders I'm going all in, and it said, we open-store set to the fans and they've just gone crazy with it I'm going on a beach ride. What? What? What? What? What? What?

What? What? What? What? What? What? What? What?

What? What? What? What? What? What? What? What?

What? What? What? What? What? We should all just get a room and just have one big hug or two because they're all just like this like sexual tension that we just need to release that out. What your, that beat beat. What your, your beat beat. Beat it. What's good for you? We need to get merch. I'm going all in. Alright and we're back. And thank you to young Spielberg with the all in 1.5 extended

edition remix. We're going all in. That was a thank you to the super fans. That was really incredible. Actually, we're back. We're back. We're back. Yeah, shout out young Spielberg with us. The dictatoramaff polyhopatia the rain man himself david sacks is definitely an excellent driver and his dad let's him drive in the driveway and the queen of kinhwa spectacular david freeberg is with us we did an emergency pod we just had all agreed we're taking a nice break Nothing's gonna happen over the new year This is the down period and 2021 is gonna be delightful and simple and

then All hell breaks loose. We could start with the vaccine. We could start with the capital. We could start with Georgia Now we have to start we have to start we have to start with the capital We have to start with the capital all right, so let me just run through the series of events that occur here. There is a certification process, correct, SACS that goes on, where the Electoral College gets counted. And somewhere at 10 a.m. Trump had a rally of thousands of supporters. You were not there, David, correct?

He was in, quote quote unquote Miami. Right. I think he's in the Miami Hilton on Pennsylvania Avenue right now. How do you put up that fake Miami background? But the truth is, let's be honest here. Um, Trump came out at 10 a.m. and had a rally. Jason, can we just take a start back for a second? Okay. Doesn't David Sacks look like Elliott Gould in Ocean's 11 right now? I'm going to do so with Elliott Gould. He is a silver fox. And are you? I mean, you were very public about being in Miami over the new year. You took your town on some Miami. And we see this background. So we can assume that dictators in his pool house poker room. We know that freebergs in a rich callton somewhere based on the furniture. He's in his rich callton

office. And sacks, based on your background, are you in Miami right now? Yeah. I still I'm still I'm still here. Okay, but did you mean I'm sure or not? I haven't, I actually met him. I did meet him. I went to like a tech event the other night and he was there. So were you wearing masks at the tech event or were you wearing a mask mask? They, it was, they were like, no, no, no, no, I'll tell you, there were masks indoors and then there was like COVID testing inside and then you could graduate to the outdoor patio part where people generally weren't

wearing masks. So were you in conversations with people with no masks on? Is that what you're saying? At this event? Yeah, but you know, everyone's been like COVID tested like a zillion times and it was outdoors and you know, I'm willing to meet with people outdoors. You know, I generally don't do it indoors, but I'm,

yeah, I'm, I've said that's my policy starting several months ago. Did we we rewind to April with that photo of SACS? Do we have it where he was in the ski mask and the goggles and the climate and like the biohazard suit and like how things have changed? He's like, I'll go to Miami and have a chat with someone. Yeah, you can you can you you can you you You could definitely do how it started and how it's going. Split photo for it. But look, I have a chance. You're like sharing a banana split with someone, like, you know,

because on eBay and Alibaba buying ventilators for his home triage center. Well, I mean, we had people from the WHO saying in March that the infection fatality rate was like 7%. You know, and the two big things we learned after that were number one that there was a huge distribution by age, right? And so somebody under 50 without comorbidities had a much, much, much lower risk. And then also the thing we learned is that the, there's maybe a 10x difference between

the infection fatality rate and the case for utility rate. I mean, you guys know all this. Yeah. And so once we learned those things, I mean, I think a rational person takes things like that into account, I changed my policy with respect to COVID. And now, especially that we have easy access to tests, which weren't available, you can get tested

before going into a event. I have a question to add onto that. Do you own a furt Chubaka outfit? And were you in Washington, yesterday? With more paint on your nipples? Do you have a podium? Do you have a neck to waist tattoo?

Are you standing behind a podium? Let me hide the Viking horns that I've got. Actually. All right, listen. There was a great title. Can we title yesterday's event, National Lampoon Siege of the Capitol? I mean, it was like animal house, like, you know, There was a title. Can we title the after days of that national lampoon siege of the capital?

It was like animal house like you know, yeah, there was a great there was a great tweet by somebody saying this was This was like the storming of the Bastille as perpetrated by the cast of animal house And there was another there's another great tweet saying The capital now appears to be under the control of a man in a Viking mask. The best one, the best one was I have lost all respect for Nicholas Cage's ability to steal the U.S. Constitution. Apparently, whenever copies went, all right, so let's just go through the chain of events here. And it was it was absolutely surreal because Trump literally went out to a mob of people and said, I want you to march down Pennsylvania Avenue and show the GOP what it takes to have

courage, etc. Mike Pence apparently told Trump that he was not going to go to bat for him in this ceremonial process of counting the votes. And lo and behold, you're watching this, you know, the objections going on to the electoral count. And you see the secret service come rushing in and it becomes a, you know, very serious situation. And when you watch some of the videos, it is truly terrorizing that thousands of people overwhelmed the police. And I guess I want to start with people's opinion on Trump's

copability in inciting what was very dangerous behavior for people are dead. So, you know, while we're joking about the cosplay outfits, a woman who was an art and Trump supporter, who was a vet, who did four tours from what I've read, and I shared the video with you before, literally, you know, as they broke into the building, was trying to breach another area of the building, and she's climbing through a window and gets shot, apparently by the Secret Service or the police, and dies. And so it's all fun and games until four people are dead. And now somebody's lost their wife, daughter,

not with Jason. Jason, I mean, there could have been 400 dead. There could have been 4,000. Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, this could have become a shootout of the okay, Carl, I can't understand why the police showed the restraint they did. I mean, when you see them getting surrounded, I don't know if you saw the one they didn't show restraint, Jason, there was no police.

When you look at the amount of security that's typically there and has been there for other situations, and then you compare it to the amount of security, knowing for a month and a half that this was coming, it just doesn't make any sense to me. So I'm a little dumbfounded that you couldn't have seen this Facebook group called, you know, hashtag Storm the Capital, which had tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of members in there, plotting and scheming, selling merchandise called Storm the Capital.

You know, these guys were wearing printed sweatshirts that they had time to make. And nobody knew about it. And nobody thought to reinforce the security and barricaded and make sure that you couldn't go from the protest site to the Capitol. I mean, I just knew there's some level of complicity that needs to get found out here. But there was a interview I saw with a next DC police guy who said that I think folks were told to tamper down. The police forces were told to tamper down on managing crowds and protests and riots, following the controversy associated with BLM a few months ago.

And spraying folks with pepper spray and water and all the physical techniques that were used were so outraging that there was just more of a systemic concern about being too aggressive with protesters and as a result, they went too far the other way. It's not a number of... Actually, it just happens to be, Friedberg, that when black people protested and brown people, they got the tear gas and beaten with batons. And then when the white people stormed the capital in the same area, they got walked down the steps and X-coated out with a storm warning to not do it again. I mean, this is hypocritical and insane.

I don't know why you have to go there, particularly. It looked to me like what happened is that the Capitol Hill police simply got completely overwhelmed. You look at these, you know, giant, this is a rally on the mall that turned into a mob. Well, first it's kind of turned into a tailgator, then it turned into a mob, and

then it turned into an insurrection. It kind of stumbled forward into progressive phases of stupidity and disaster. But it looked to me like the Capitol Hill police simply got overwhelmed. They obviously were unprepared. They were surprised, I think, by this. And I saw video of tons of tear gas being used. I saw people getting tear gas like crazy, and I think there was reports this morning on Twitter that the whole area in front of the Capitol there was covered in that light film that remains after tear gasing. So I don't think they were really pulling punches too much. And I also think that is too much. And I also think that there will be prosecutions. I think that these people were captured on video. There's a lot of talk on Twitter. And everybody is in favor of

finding out who they are, applying facial recognition and bringing charges. So I think there will be a lot of charges, unlike, let's say, the BLM protests this summer, I don't remember anybody getting charged based on video of people riding or looting. And then I think, you know, the final difference actually with the BLM protests is that if you've watched Fox News at all in the last 24 hours, the condemnation of the storming of the capital of what happened has been across the board, both right and left, everybody across the political spectrum has condemned it.

Nobody is apologizing for it. Nobody on the right is looking for root causes to explain the reasons why it happened. Everybody is just condemning it and saying that it should never have happened and the people who did it should be prosecuted. And so I don't see any kid gloves here being used, either physically or or. I'll tell you where I see the kid gloves,

SACs is when you see officers being chased up the steps and or taking selfies, which is one instance, I don't wanna just say that's the only indicative thing, but when people are breaking through windows and just kind of being let go, I mean, they were obviously overwhelmed But I'm surprised more people didn't get shot. Tremoff, let's just David tackle this head-on in terms of the race issue.

But I have a question for David before I make my statement. David, do you think that if this were Black and brown people storming the Capitol, would there have been more or less than four deaths? I honestly, I think it would have been the same. I just disagree. I disagree. I really disagree. And I'll tell you why.

I think you have the best of intentions wanting to think that way, but here's the way I see it. I see a president that basically instigated a group of people who are fundamentally disenfranchised. Let's face it, like there are a lot of very, very reasonable Republicans and a lot of very reasonable Democrats. The fringes of both parties are functionally mentally retarded. We know this, okay?

And so what you see are extreme on both sides who are just completely lost and looking for any excuse. And so you have a president in the tail end of his presidency, an inionimous presidency. Basically call them out. Nobody who actually had a job or anything to do could show up, right? So you had all these people show up. It's a Wednesday. It's a Wednesday during the day.

I mean, and what do you think happens? They're there. They're all frothed up. You know, Eric Trump frothing them up, Donald Trump Jr. frothing them up, Trump frothing them up, Giuliani frothing them up, and all of a sudden, as you said, stumbling into degrees of craziness and stupidity to storm the Capitol. And I just think to myself, how could a president instigate this kind of action? Number one, the second thing I think about is when black athletes peacefully protested, something that they had the fundamental constitutional right to protest. In the president's eyes, they were sons of bitches,

white people that stormed the fucking capital. The people's house were called patriots by the president's daughter. And then we're told that they were loved by the president himself. To me, it's just an enormously stark contrast of a double standard. I think that beyond the persecutions of the people,

I actually feel very bad for the people that storm the capital. I feel like these are folks that are on the fringes who just need a vessel and Trump is a vessel, and then he instigates them and runs away. You know what I mean? And they're lost. These are lost people. Then these guys commit the mean? And they're lost. He's lost. They can't get lost.

Then these guys commit the crime and now they're gonna go to jail. I feel like the culpability has to go all the way back to Trump, to Hawley, to Cruz. These guys are those are the real scumbags in all of this. Freeberg, what are your thoughts on this? And then I'll go back to Saxon, let him respond. Yeah, I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that if this was a Black Lives Matter, and

it was Black people involved or brown people involved in the same sorts of activities you saw yesterday that you would not see more shootings. I don't think that's an unreasonable position to take. Obviously, I think there's this other circumstance, which is that event preceding this one, as I mentioned, I saw an interview with a DC police former police director in the police. I forgot what his title was, where he highlighted that folks were kind of instructed to stand down following the BLM controversies. I think that's also a reasonable point of view.

down following the BLM controversies. And so I think that's also kind of a reasonable point of view. And it's probably- What about the president's copability? I mean, I think that's one issue that's gonna have to be addressed post. And I think we have to figure out what life post Trump is gonna be like because this is a level of chaos that nobody to Saks's point, all people condemned.

It's a, yeah, there's a a theory which actually takes its origin from Hitler, where Hitler used this term the big lie. And the theory is that you can create political propaganda by saying something that's so outrageous. It is so improbable that people say there's no way this thing keeps getting said over and over unless it's actually real And this is sort of like the QAnon pedophile ring in the Pizzeria Or the fact that the election was stolen from you. It is such an outrageous statement that that it seems to people that it only has to be true Because it is it is such an insane thing.

And if it is, it's so insane, and I am so incited by this thing. So this is kind of a, you know, acknowledge this being a political propaganda technique that goes back a long time. By the way, Hitler used it as a way to, used it as almost like a double bluff to blame the Jews in Germany, which was an unfortunate

kind of origin of the term, but the term is used a lot now and saying, like, these sorts of events are ridiculous. Now, what's going to happen going forward? I don't think big lies go away. You can try and mute them on Twitter and mute them on Facebook or mute them on Reddit, but whether it's QAnon or whatever is next. This is becoming kind of a standard form now because of the way media has distributed. Anyone can say a big lie and it gets a lot of listens and crump is totally culpable for that. He made some shit up. He made a bunch of claims. I mean, if you guys haven't seen Lindsey Graham speech yesterday, it is absolutely worth watching that he gave late last night.

I saw it. I saw it. And he's like, I asked for the, for the, show me the, the 10, give me 10 people that claim that they voted and they were under 18. He's like, they gave you one. Give me any one that, that was in prison or died and they gave me zero. And he's like, goes on and on for a couple of minutes about how none of what was said, about what happened in the election was true. And it was all false. And he's like, this is all just not true. Um, and so I think's like, this is all just not true. And so I think Trump is culpable for creating a falsehood and having a megaphone and there

are certainly technology. What about the inciting of violence? That is I think where the rubber is going to meet the road. Trump's going to be out of office in two weeks or less one way or the other. Do you, and let me just take it to SACS, SACS I want to give you the time to respond to the issue of the double standard in terms of race and BLM. And then also do you, SACS, if you're on Biden's team coming in, do you advise that you prosecute Trump or investigate Trump for this insurrection? Yes or no?

Okay, so just to tie off on the BLM issue, I just, you know, I just finally don't think that race is the issue here. I'm sure, look, I don't know at the end of the day what the fatalities would have been, if it had been a BLM protest that went awry, but I will stick to what I said before which is I predict that you will see more prosecutions come out of this of the people who are involved. I'm talking about the people who stormed the capital. Then we saw from all the BLM protests over the summer. I mean I don't remember any prosecutions coming out of video tape of people being called recorded, looting and writing and I predict you will see more here.

And again, I think another difference, again, to the extent there's a double standard, I remember a lot of left wing news networks calling the writing, looting the summer peaceful protest, which they clearly were not. You even had a book called In Defense of Looting. And I don't hear anybody defending the storming of the capital, nobody, on the right.

So to look, to the extent there's a double standard, I don't know that it accrues to the BLM side of this, but look, I think that's kind of beside the point and not the real issue here. I mean, Jason, to your question of, is Trump responsible, yes? I mean, clearly. 100 percent. 100 percent. Yes, because he is the one who put forth this theory that the election was stolen and was constantly repeating it for the last two months. Two months ago, right after the election, there was an article published in the spectator called Deplorables Don't Riot. It was actually a pretty good op-end. It was written by a conservative. And the conservative's point was that

all these windows and shops have been boarded up in anticipation of potential writing and looting with the election. And all these concerns are saying, well, who are they afraid of? Not us, not the magma folks. Well, and the theory was, deplorables don't write it. And the right was proud of that two months ago. And now we are seeing that, well, no, the deplorables are writing.

Why is that? What changed over the last two months? And what changed is the constant feeding to this group of people, this idea, starting with Trump, but then perpetuated by different right wing media organizations and other politicians who sort of were, you know, trying to curry favor with Trump,

they were constantly pushing forward this idea that the election was stolen. So then these people on the mall, who then ride in storm the Capitol, believe that the election was being stolen from them. So, you know, ultimately that responsibility goes, it's Trump's. So to be clear, and reflecting back to you,

you're saying Trump incited sedation. Is that the right word? Well, sedition. Sedition doesn't seem like the wrong, it doesn't seem like the exact right word to me. I mean, it was, it was, it was certainly a riot. Now, now, did, now look, I mean, you're talking about prosecuting a legal case. You know, if you want to look at the legal standard for incitement, it has to be provoking people to take an imminent lawless act. That's pretty close. I think he, if you want to see that this mob is a gun, I think he loaded the gun. He pointed it in a certain direction, but did he tell them to storm the Capitol? No, not

specifically. I think therefore it would be a very hard case to prosecute, but I think prosecuting him in a court of law is sort of unnecessary and redundant. I mean, I think that in the eyes of the public, politically, he is, I think most people see that he's culpable. Is that the end of his political career? I think he's disqualified himself from being a... i i can't it you know at a national level again i mean if you look again to go back to months ago uh... look at how much has changed two months ago just in the day or two after the election

trump had narrowly lost but there was talk of him starting a new news network to rival fox there was talk about he could even be a candidate again and in twenty twenty four it was not off the table. I think now it's it's clearly off the table and you've seen it's probably because of the Georgia runoffs which we should get to. But again, there are Republican candidates at least one of them had won that election two months ago and now they lost and that has a lot to do with Trump's antics in the meantime of just feeding this constant lie about the stolen election.

I mean, I think there's a really important question about, sorry, but is it worth prosecuting Trump post-fact? Does that do more harm or good for the country as a whole? Certainly, there will be a lot of people that would get great satisfaction of putting Trump in prison. A lot of people are calling for that. But we really do need to question the incredible divide in the nation and what's the best way to heal the divide.

The objective shouldn't be pursuing justice. It should be about moving forward. I'm not suggesting don't prosecute Trump, but I think that it's worthy of noting that there is another way of framing this whole thing, which is what's the best thing to do going forward. On the flip side, you could even make the case that one of the best things Joe Biden could do today or tomorrow is to announce a federal election review commission to actually look into wrong doings at the state level with a bipartisan.

100% of bipartisan days. 100% yeah. It's a slam dunk case anyway. If Biden did that, and he basically embraced the notion that a lot of folks are really angry about and said, I'm listening to you, I'm hearing you, let me show you. And at the same time, they did not prosecute Trump

and let him go off into the distance and do his own thing. Maybe you start to kind of heal the rift a little bit, but right now everyone's kind of inflamed and there is this, like, how do we prosecute him? What do we do? And we're just continuing to kind of escalate the dialogue and increase the rift.

Yeah, so look, I think prosecuting Trump at this point, first of all, legally, that might be a difficult case to prove because of the need to prove that he was trying to provoke an imminent laws action. If he had been at the barricades, pushing people forward, yes. I think legally it would be a tough case. I think it would be, like you said, to be unnecessarily divisive in partisan. I don't know why we need to go there.

At the end of the day, any politician's stock and trade is their credibility and popularity. And Trump has fundamentally damaged the perception of him. I think even among the right. I have a huge issue with this and I'll tell you why. It's because the folks that are now going to go to jail were instigated by this guy. And the folks that were there in many ways were brought, they were cajold, they were instigated to travel from groomed to travel there, to take the time out of their lives, to basically then get fed this rhetoric. And in a moment of just crazy mob like mentality to act out at the behest of the leader of the free world. There has to be a consequence not just to those people because they in many ways are not the person to prosecute.

To the extent that you are going to put some of these people in jail, which we look like, it looks like we're going to. And by the way, let's be honest, there is no inconceivable way that these people get charged with the misdemeanor. That's not going to stand, right? And the worst perpetrators of this when they get put in jail will get put in jail for five to 10 years, minimum. And so what are we going to do when we look at ourselves in the eye and say, these poor Americans at the end of the day, who are instigated by this guy and he yet again gets off scott free while hundreds of Americans who were basically in a peak of craziness fed by this guy does something and goes to jail and you have hundreds of lives and hundreds of families ruined. Even if we don't find a way to basically put Trump and jail for this, I can 100% guarantee you I will bet a million bucks That now the Southern District of New York gloves off

Every single state that can go after this guy gloves off and To the extent that Joe Biden had any incentive to basically like let this go away at the federal level Gloves off in my opinion. I really I really think Let's say that folks do go after Trump. What does that do? If he gets put in jail or he, you know, gets, there's some criminal proceeding brought against him, what does that do to the 50% of the nation that truly support him and truly care about him? I don't, you know, I don't, like, like, like the balance of justice versus unification, you know, I think we're talking actually about 25% of the country. I think I don't even think it's that justice versus unification, you know, how we're talking about 25% of the country.

I think I don't even think of this, right? Or whatever it is, like there's obviously a big voting block and a big block of the potential block. I think I think of the 70 million people that voted for Donald Trump. I think there are half of them who would equally vote for a normal centrist candidate. Mid-Romney.

And. Nikki Halley. Didn't necessarily believe in Donald Trump. Then I think there's the other 35 million. And I do think that there's a spectrum of those 35 and I think that you probably lost 10 or 15 million of them after the events of yesterday where they just threw their hands up in the air and said, hey, really, it was really only inflamed 20 million is what you're saying. Correct.

I agree with Chimaphan. Correct. And those 20 million people are, you know, sad to say concentrated in about 10 states that don't functionally matter economically or otherwise. So about the balance of justice versus unification, certainly it sounds like you're saying way it's heavily towards justice, right? Like more folks will benefit from seeing him come to justice or what perceived justice then. I think what it will allow, I think it will allow the Republican party to resenter itself. I think

that's better for politics. I think it's better for governance. It's better for America. I think it allows a lot of people to basically wake up out of this haze that they've been in in four years and say, wow, wait a minute. In a rush. Right. In a rush. Like, I was on a really bad bender. I did a couple of things.

I really regret. And I need to recenter myself. How do you not find this turning into a tit for tat, Burlusconi, Italy, Brazil, Israel, kind of phenomenon where, you know, three birds are then attacked and challenged and taken the best. The best tweet I saw on this was this woman tweeted out that the following. She said, when the Democrats lost in 2016, they knitted pink hats and donated to Planned Parenthood.

No, they didn't. No, they didn't. They invented a ridiculous Russian conspiracy theory. They did that. That like 10 people went to the Russia hoax. The Russia hoax. No one went to jail. Hokes come on. They David that like 10 people went to jail. The russia hoax. The russia hoax. No one went to jail. No one to what? They were out. The Russians were obviously trying to do like the last person. You're like the last person who still believes in this. Well, listen, I still believe that they tried and I still believe I don't know that they

succeeded. But I think you know, Mueller Mueller spent two years investigating this tens of millions of dollars 25 FBI agents. Yeah, those are all. ten million dollars twenty five fb ian uh... agents g.o.p talking points the fact is matter for went to jl for something completely unrelated you've these are all you must be the last person who still believes that trump one in two thousand sixteen i think that they i think he asked you to pray for help and i think he asked

the russian for help and i think that he would have gladly accepted the help now is it it was it a a conspiracy like in the it, it was a conspiracy like in the prank? No, it wasn't a conspiracy. You can never know if it affected it, but this is the problem with your Russia talking point is that you're trying to just say because he didn't get prosecuted,

which he's probably not gonna get prosecuted for this either. The guy who's a serial offender, okay? And they were trying to get information from Wiki okay, and they were trying to get information from WikiLeaks, and they were trying to get the hacks. And so I don't know why you can so clearly see what he's doing, David, when he incites this violence. And then you don't see that he would, he has no moral backbone or character and that he wouldn't accept foreign aid. He's a treasonous bastard. Here's my view, okay, here's my view, is that when you lose an election as a candidate, you have to look in the mirror and ask what you did wrong.

Trump failed to do that two months ago instead of just taking the L and he could have blamed it on the fact that the vaccine was one week late. I mean, instead of just accepting the loss, he invented this conspiracy theory that the election was stolen, and he's basically like Freeberg said, been pumping it month after month, and, you know, his enablers, you know, have perpetuated it until we had this, you know, total breakdown and storming of the Capitol. But, again, you know, where was the Democratic reassessment of why they lost in 2016? Who on the Democrat side looked in the mirror and said, you know, where was the Democratic reassessment of why they lost in 2016? Who on the Democrat side looked in the mirror and said, you know, we shouldn't have lost

that election, you know, what did we do wrong? They didn't do that. Instead, they blamed it all on Russian interference or Facebook, you know, all the sudden Facebook went from being a darling to being a scapegoat. And there was Russian ads being put with rubles and tons of link forms confirmed done by the Russians in order to ferment anti-hillary sentiment. I mean, it's actually happened.

It's true. It's true. No, no, no, no. In fact, the election nobody can know that, but it did occur. Yes, we can. Yes, we can, because yeah, it did. Yes we can. Yes we can because yeah it did. It did some.

Okay so now you're admitting there was Russian interference. No I know. So you were before saying there wasn't and now you're saying there was. I'm talking about. I'm talking about why somebody. No, no it's not because here's the, here's where you're being misleading. Is it true that there was some FSB operative somewhere buying ads on Facebook? Yes.

Hundreds of them. Hundreds of them. Out of billions of impressions. It was a microscopic number of total impressions of the election, and the people who actually looked at those ads thought they were absurd. Imagine some operative, hold on, let me finish my point. Imagine some operative in Moscow trying to influence the American election him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor.

I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor.

I'm going to go to the doctor and ask him to do a favor. I'm going to of collusion. Okay. That's what me alert. They take the meeting. Okay. No, that's what Mueller. He spent two years investigating it and found no collusion. Look, so my point is, again, we're getting off on a rabbit hole here, but my point was when you as a candidate lose an election, you have to take responsibility for that. That was not done in 2016. It was not done certainly in 2020 by Trump. It is the problem with both our political parties that they would rather invent conspiracy theories and lies then acknowledge why people are rejecting them Yeah, I'm talking about this. I would say this

But that is not the point David you are right, okay? somewhere along the way we got stuck worrying about the Somewhere along the way, we got stuck worrying about the pronouns that we use and which bathrooms should be or should not be transgendered while the American middle class was completely gutted from pillar to post. That is what's created the boundary conditions for this. Every single time there's been an insurrection or an uprising or a revolution in America, it has never been about ideology. It has always been about economics, always.

And economics is the tip of the spear in this country, whether we like it or not. It started with the Boston Tea Party. You know, it continued through the Civil War. It has always been about that topic. So we all let it happen. We all have a responsibility to fix it. That though is a topic, I think, for another day, because that's the grand arc of what we need to do in our generation and fix this inequality gap. Meanwhile, we do have this tactical

issue, which is you have the leader of the free world in my opinion. And I think in a lot of reasonable minded people's opinion, instigating essentially at a minimum a riot and at the maximum some form of like treason, it idiotic form of the, I don't, I mean, but the problem is it's just, it is just like, it's just, it's incomprehensible. What it is. I've fallen on the side that we need to prosecute him now. I was, I was 50, 50 on this, but I'll tell you what's tipped me over is, you know, if we don't prosecute him, there's this sort of like unfairness to it.

I think that's a very good point. You made Schumach. But I also think that he is going, we need to wake people up from this fog they've been in to freeberg and I don't I think we have to free the the republican party to get back to some more version that is reasonable like you are sacks. I would really see you there are public party has is is is already rejecting Trump so just look at what's happening last last 24 to 48 hours. Even after this storming of the Capitol, okay, you had Republicans who were just hours before objecting to the electors, they basically were saying, no, I've changed my mind. Who was that? Lindsey Graham, but not Ted Cruz, not that other Kelly Loffler. Kelly Loffler did it and there are a few other ones who switched sides. You had ex, you had exon speeches by Lindsey Graham and then romney i agree with that they spoke very

very eloquently and just today a lane chow resigned as secretary of transportation i think that's mostly significant who's a david she's mishin the public party yeah look i think i think after georgia the republican party was were already blame trump for that and now after the stormy of the Capitol, they're ready to be done with him. This idea that you need to prosecute Trump to somehow end his relation with the Republican Party, I think it will just backfire.

I don't think that's what the point is. I think the point is that nobody is above the law. And when you lead, you know, the thing with the people that attended this rally is in any other situation, and Jason, you said it earlier, these are our veterans, these are the people that are like working good jobs. They're trying to just keep America going. They've always believed in American exceptionalism. There was nothing wrong with that.

It was just perverted by this fucking scumbag. He is a complete piece of shit fucking scumbag. He's garbage. And I think that's why you have to prosecute him. I think you have to make an example of him. I know that they with Nixon, they took a different approach, but I just think he's too dangerous to leave un-prossecuted because every time he has some bad behavior, whether it was the Ukraine, whether it's, you know, Russian, we can debate what level they wanted to engage, whether it's, you know, Russia, we can debate what level

they wanted to engage with the Russians, or, you know, in the case of this riotous behavior, you know, I think he's not going to stop. That's the thing that I fear is I don't think he's going to stop. I would rather take every single person arrested and give them zero days in jail and add it all up and give it to Trump. Well, I agree with you to some degree that they were victims of this two-month propaganda campaign to convince the right that this election was stolen. I think a lot of those people who were storming the capital, they were there not to steal an election, but because they were thought they were there to prevent the ceiling of an election. And so, yes, they have been duped by a lot of people, including, you know, leading with

Trump, but including a lot of other people who should have known better. But that being said, they did make the decision to hop the barricade, smash the windows, go into the Capitol. There is some personal responsibility. Absolutely. Yeah, we can't. We can't get rid of this responsibility. Absolutely, yeah. We can't, we can't. That's the tragedy of this woman. Let's talk about this woman for a second.

And I think it's important to look at this specific case. This is a person who's a veteran, and she was inside the halls already, and was trying to breach another area. And she was just shot dead by secret service. They might have been protecting the VP, they might have been protecting Nancy Pelosi or Mitch McConnell, who knows? But they shot her dead.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I saw it on video. I mean, it's on video. It's unbelievable. And it, I mean, coming from a law enforcement family, I can tell you, that's a clean shooting. If she was breaching and they told her, do not come in here, we're going to shoot you.

And the secret service is protecting an asset. They're allowed to shoot you. Like you can't jump that. And she's a military vet. She's from the Air Force. I mean, what is in her mind? How wound up was she by Trump? And by this propaganda that when they told her,

do not breach the second door inside That way you just said the keyword you cannot be spun up in all of this by Giuliani He's a fucking moron You know he can barely like not what his pants. Yeah, you know, you're not gonna get spun up by Sydney Powell The only person that can really catalyze this is the person that has the respect That comes with sitting in the seat that's called the presidency of the United States. And she's the only one.

He's the only one. We all know this because if Giuliani was running this rally and said, let's go storm the Capitol, nobody would have done it. We all know this. Look, yeah. What do you think about this woman, David? Like think about the psychology of this person for a second, the humanity of it. You know, I'll say something.

I think, um, man, politics isn't the problem. It's kind of the manifestation of the problem. If you think about how crazy it is, that I posted a tweet about this the other day, because I've been thinking about it a lot. I think it's so crazy that you can show people a TV ad or a Facebook ad and get them to change their mind on what to vote. People are kind of shown stuff and the bigger problem is this kind of reductionism that's kind of enveloped all of this. If you go back a hundred years, I guarantee you people were having deeper, more civil conversations about differences of opinion and ways to govern and laws to govern us.

And I think like, you know, it's so easy to put a 30 second kind of reductionist ad in front of someone, incite their kind of amygdala to respond and change their mind about something or push them in some direction. And I think that's the bigger issue with what's been going on, is people are kind of being pushed all the way to one side or pushed all the way to the other side through this very kind of simple process.

There is no dialogue to decide what candidate to vote for, dialogue to decide what path to take. It's all in city areas, like lock his ass up, kill them, like everything has become extremely binary And the grayscale is really the reality and unfortunately we've kind of really heard ourselves in this tribalism over objectiveism kind of approach to how we Talk as a society and how we debate and as a result people are pushed over the edge and I think this is a manifestation of that

And as a result, people are pushed over the edge. And I think this is a manifestation of that broader problem, which I think is probably linked to the internet and short attention spans and all this is going on. So why? I think the GOP has just been completely, you know, but it's not just the GOP. Dominance. But what I'm saying, they're all,

we shouldn't use a good segue into Georgia, which is, you could say the same about AOC, and you could say that AOC is doing the same to the Democratic Party and they're they're you know equally frustrated with this extremist point of view or Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders and they're Yeah, none of them got a nomination, right? And none of them got cabinet positions But they could have and they were close and it was like hey look Give every one a million dollars. Okay, great. And tax the rich 90%. Great. It's easy to say.

And my point is, by the way, I think the root of a lot of this is people are programmed to be unhappy. That's how you instigate people to take action. The bottom 10% of Americans make more money and have a better position in life than the top 10% of Kenyans. And it's an incredible statistic if you think about it. go to dollarstreet.org or dollarstreet.com and you can actually play around and see what different people live like around the world.

Yet in the US, we are told at every strata, whether you're wealthy or not wealthy relative to others in the United States, that you should be better off. And it is, you know, happiness is the difference between expectation and outcome. And everyone's been set in expectation beyond what they currently have. And as a result, through programmatic work that is done on people in the United States, we are being told you should be unhappy.

Oh, and by the way, here's the short-term solution to resolve it. And it's driving an incredible amount of of behavioral shift. And it really threatens democracy as we saw this week. And you guys will remember my my big loser for the political loser for 2020 was the American Democratic institution. And I think we saw that this week. Can I agree on the on the heels of that? Can I ask you guys what you think of this? Basically Pelosi has told Pence you have to invoke the 25th Amendment or they're going to take up impeachment.

What do you guys think about that? I think it's the right thing to do. How do you do that? I think there has to be a backstop against such a... Is it possible Trump can't run, could do something crazy? You could... Here's the thing. I tweeted a report about this.

If you are impeached uh... successfully you can't run again uh... so i think that this is a uh... away to put the nail in the coffin of trump even having the ability to run in twenty twenty four which i think is why the democrats are on the right side of history on this one that's my me

me sign a non-prosychee agreement with him if he resigns and that that's kind of the final you know i mean I would like to see. But Jason, why can't you trust voters to make the right decision in 2024? I do trust voters. It's not about trusting the voters. It's more about, do I think there should be ramifications for somebody's behavior? That's my fear is that if he keeps getting away with stuff

He could do something even more violent or dangerous as Shaman said earlier It's a miracle that a hundred people were in shot dead and this wasn't a firefight I mean if somebody takes out a gun at any moment during that and people start shooting we could have hundreds of people Americans dead Not just the four who died and I think Trump is absolutely capable of doing something in the last 14 days. If he did this 15 days out, why wouldn't he do something else? Seven days out or three days out, he's a maniac. I mean, this is insane, deranged, criminal, lunatic behavior.

It's completely possible that he could do something more dangerous in the last 14 days. I know that that sounds crazy, but look at what we saw yesterday. I think there is like a white knuckle element to the next two weeks. I think we're all kind of white knuckling it to, you know, to see what's going to happen. We have 300 hours to go till Biden is sworn in and I've got to admit, like I'm counting down the hours, you know, it's too insane No, everybody's feeling everybody's feeling that That being said I just think that I'm more on on free freebergues point of view on this that we have this insane level of partisan warfare

In the US it's gone to like a whole another level and I just and and and Trump has definitely made it worse in the stormy of the capital is the you know is the zenith of it It's the apex, but look the other side's been doing it too and the question is just how we deescalate this insane person What in the deescalation? Chimath is in Biden like being elected part It's I think it is yeah, I think is. It's like we pick the most boring candidate who has the most milk toast middle of the road approach who who Lindsey Graham likes and who travel the world with. I mean, Lady G loves him. Well, to the extent that Biden has a mandate, this is it. I mean, and he talked about it in his victory speech that night, which was quite good, is about

bringing people together. Now look, I mean, the issue, one of the issues is you can't ignore the fact that Democrats for the last four years have waged this insane partisan war against Trump. I mean, let's not even go into the merits, but you had this two-year Mueller witch hunt, you then had this impeachment crusade, which, look, if there was a lot of validity to the impeachment, why wasn't it used as a campaign issue last year? I just think everybody knows that was hyperpartisan. And my point is that, yeah, look, I think it's a good thing if Biden can de-escalate things. That is, I think, why

he won the election is that he was seen as more of a saying alternative. Let me ask you a question, Sacks. Do you think it would have been, do you think if Trump had been impeached for the Ukraine interference and Pence had taken over, we would not have seen what we was seen yesterday and the country would have been further along to healing?

So, you know, no, I mean, Pence would not have invited and the country would have been further along to healing. Okay. So, you know, no, I mean, Pence would not have invited or asked all his supporters to come to the capital to oppose the counting of the electors. I look, that was a unique Trump thing for, you know, he could not accept the loss and had to keep pushing and pushing and pushing on this idea that he that the election was stolen. So what a good idea to impeach. No, it wouldn't, no, it wouldn't because if you had if you had impeached Trump and it, well, first of all, he wasn't impeached, okay, but if you had voted to convict him, if you had removed him from office, the Senate had voted to convict over a phone call, okay? And look, I'm not defending the phone call. I'm not saying the phone call was perfect. Okay, I know Trump says it was perfect. It was not a perfect phone call. I'm not saying the phone call was perfect. Okay, I know Trump says it was perfect.

It was not a perfect phone call, but you can't remove a sitting president for that. Okay, look, it was unseemly or whatever. I think we all know what he was trying to do in that phone call, but you can't remove a sitting president over that. That was hyperpartisan. And so, no, the country would be much further apart today if you had done that.

And so the question now is, well, how do you bring it back together? And I think, I understand where, where, where Tamauth is coming from. I think that Trump deserves morally, culpably, uh, I think he, he is, some repudiation, some repudiation, but, but I don't believe in locking him up or, or prosecuting him. That's only going to make things much for force. Which crime? for which crime. For this crime. We don't even know what else is out there. I mean, I think there's other issues out there. Let's talk about Georgia. Let's, I think we've nailed the Trump. I mean,

let's anybody really feels like continuing to talk to us. No, that's the situation now. Stacey Abrams is a genius. I mean, my gosh, she should be in charge of everything. Yeah. Can we get her on the vaccine roll out? Well, it's incredible. It's incredible. It's incredible. The SACA is doing an incredible job

in the Democratic side mobilizing turnout. But the reason why the Republicans lost Georgia is, frankly, Trump costs them Georgia. Two months ago, Purdue beat Ossoff in that election. That's right. He won. He won. And he's beaten him him before I think he is

I mean he's not the most wonderful candidate, but I think he is a better candidate and he lost because of these Antics over the last two months culminating in that insane phone call that Trump had with the Georgia sector Talked about that this burger right. I, should you just find me a lot? Sax? Can't you just find me a lot of thousand votes? Look, I just think, you know, I don't think it's more prosecutable. Sending people to the Capitol or asking them and begging them to find him a thousand votes, which one is more prosecutable to you, Sax?

Since you're going to be framing us. Let's, let's, let's move away from the whole Trump goes to jail for a second. I just wanted to, I think it's important to talk about george because i think david you're gonna make a point yeah exactly i mean look i think we're going to hung up too much on the legalities and let's talk about what's right and wrong you know which we is what we can agree on and let you know lawyers and prosecutors figure out the legalities uh...

uh... remesh penuru from national view had a great quote about george he said that Purdue and law flora could survived any two of these three being unimpressive candidates georgia shifting purple and trump being a maniac and unfortunately you had three out of three and that's why they lost if it was a great is a great quote you know be could be either rathlas burger call you know can't you just find the eleven thousand votes the day before the election or two days for the election

that had to push swing voters and undecided to the democrats and the other thing is that per do and lawful are able to make the best argument that they had which is if you vote for us you end up with split you you you prevent the democrats from having all the power in washington so unless you want to give all the power in washington so unless you want to give all the power in washington to a single party you need to vote for us that was the best

argument for voting for them because there's a lot of people in this country who believe in splitting their ticket because they don't trust either party which is kind of where i'm at but they were unable to make that argument effectively because trump was still hanging out to the idea that he was going to be president. No, I think, David, I honestly, I think this comes down to the intelligence of the candidates. Kelly Loftar is a moron. She's an idiot.

David produced a good old boy. He's an idiot. They're just stupid. This actually speaks to a bigger problem, which is the Republicans could do so much better if they could actually find younger, more vibrant, intelligent people. And instead they find these fucking morons. I don't know where they find them. But, you know, they pulled Kelly Laughler out of some like backstage Dallas beauty page and just kind of like fluffed her up and tried to get her to run. She's a moron.

Law Flore was a mistake. Law Flore was a mistake. A fake fucking idiot. Did you read the story about her with the WNBA? Well, I mean, Georgia is unbelievable. They basically... Georgia is full of so many incredible politicians and they found that idiot. That was a huge mistake. If they just voted, or yeah, the governor made a huge mistake,

they appointed her to the last two months. So I agree that she's a particularly weak candidate, but there are probably only needed one of these two elections. And Purdue had beaten Ossoff before. I agree with you, he's not necessarily the greatest candidate of all time, but he has proved better than Ossoff in the past, including November.

And the reason why he lost two months later is because what's transpired in the last two months. Biden has acted presidential, and Trump has done what he's done. And that made all the difference. And that, by the way, is why you're seeing the republicans breaking from trump they were ready on the way to breaking with them and then you had this david no other capital what are the implications for josh holly and ted

crews i i think i think this was a blow to them because i think that what they were doing in terms of uh... you know opposing terms of opposing the electors, everybody knew it was sort of cynical and... Theater. It was theater. It was performative theater.

It was designed to curry favor with Trump so that he might endorse them in 2024 for the nomination. And it was it was optimistic. And the problem is it backfired horribly and you know people now see it for what it was it was it was optionistic and the problem is it backfired horribly and You know people now see it for what it was and so yeah, I think it's gonna hurt ultimately They try to do something optionistic that they thought would help them politically and I think it's gonna hurt them But wait, I have to ask you guys do you guys know the backstory of law flur and the Atlantic dream the WNBA team? It's tears honestly Jason I'm gonna get so angry because she is just a complete piece of shit.

Please don't lie. You can bring it up. I think she's just a complete free burger aware of this, but I think she's a complete piece of shit. She basically, it's basically she was anti BLM and she was writing letters to the NBA, WNBA, to not allow the players to be vocal about Black Lives Matter after the killing of the murder of George Floyd. And so what the team did, if you look at that story, is they backed Warnock. They got on the call with him. They refused to say her name,

and they rallied the support of Warnock who ultimately beat her and they refused to say her name. I just ever again If you the players on her own team courage if you want to see courage the women that play in the WMVA are some of the most Incredible people yes in the world. Yeah, these are these are women's that have basically stopped their athletic career, stopped fame, you know, stopped all of the attention. In some cases stopped fortunes to work on behalf of criminal justice reform to basically overturn, you know, unjust convictions. These women are incredible. And then to be suppressed, to be able to say what was on their mind, Kelly Lothler is a piece of shit. And they basically wore these, vote, war knock t-shirts every day at every game.

I mean, imagine. And then now they're, I think, going to be forced out of those women. Yeah, I give them a suburb, I think, is the, was the leader of the whole movement of the order. Yeah, bravo to her. All right, moving on from politics, I think we have to talk Friedberg about the deployment of the vaccine. I did a quick poll on Twitter and Twitter and the American people have asked that Friedberg,

the Queen of Canwap, be responsible for the vaccine distribution going forward. Really? I'm in. Let's do it. I would let to share that. I would get that vaccine into everyone's arms in 75 days. I mean, it would be- You would be such a stone-

That would be amazing. So, free bird, what would you do? I would love to do that. And maybe you could describe, you know, we were supposed to be at a million a day. We're at 350 trending towards 400. We did 1.5 million in 72 hours, according to Fauci at 1.00 right after the new year. So we're kind of like halfway where we need to be. What would you do differently? Because the rollout seems we had more than 50% are on the shelves still. It should not. It is a wartime scenario. When war is happening,

you don't go home at 5 p.m. and wake up at 9 a.m. and clock out for an hour for lunch. And, you know, you don't, oh, well, don't run too fast. You know, you might trip. You don't do any of that. We've created incredible disincentives in the system. By, in fact, Cuomo put out a million dollar fine if you get your vaccine out of line. I mean, think about the disincentive that creates. Now, people are more scared about giving the vaccine to the wrong person than they are incentivized to give the vaccine to the right person.

And the reality is, this is a group game. This isn't an individual game. It's not about who gets vaccinated first and you'll live and you'll die. We all need to get vaccinated as a group game. This isn't an individual game. It's not about who gets vaccinated first and you'll live and you'll die. We all need to get vaccinated as a group so that we all have immunity so that this virus stops spreading. It doesn't matter if you're individually vaccinated. It matters if we're all vaccinated because that's the only way we're all going to get out of the economic slump that is truly damaging this country right now. And so the first step is create a military style operation.

Figure out how many feet on the ground, it's all a rate-based system, right? How many are you running per day? And then how do you achieve that objective? And over time, you have your target rate per day. You would scale it up over 75 days, or whatever your rollout timeframe needs to be. And you would say, this is how we're gonna get there.

We need this number of people giving shots this many minutes apart. And then you go figure out where you're going to give the shots and who's going to give them. Get the vaccines to where they need to get to, take over all the gymnasiums and all the stadiums and all the open sports facilities around the country. People can drive up, stand in line, get a friggin shot. And 65-year-olds get priority for the first 30 days. And then after 30 days, your 65 and over crowd loses their priority and it's open season for who wants to get a shot. You stand in line, you get a shot. Walk in, you got 3.8 million nurses in the United States, you go contract 500,000 of them, you give them a huge friggin' one time bonus to come and run

this program, you run 24 hour shifts in the gymnasiums around the country, people come in, they get shots, they get out, takes three minutes. If you're feeling weird, if you have risk of allergies, you go sit in the other room, you wait for two hours, and there's a bunch of roaming nurses keeping on hanging out. And you get this thing done. That's it. This is not that complicated. And we can leverage the National Guard to create the infrastructure to support these lines and get these things done. We can go recruit, there are plenty of nurses associations. You can go, people can work overnight shifts and get paid triple over time, get extra bonuses for doing this.

There's a great way to kind of create an economic stimulus around this. We can get at this entire country, vaccinated in 90 days, and the way that Israel's doing it is a great model, you know, when they run out of clothes. So at the end of the day, if, you know, when you open, when you take these things out of deep freeze, you're at risk of them spoiling at that point, because the mRNA is very, you know, when you open, when you take these things out of deep freeze, you're at risk of them spoiling at that point, because the mRNA is very, you know, can break and so it needs to be really cold and then you got to give the vaccine very quickly. Otherwise, the mRNA can degrade and it's not effective. And you have to defrost it in order to give it.

Yes, you defrost it, then it's sitting there and now you got to give it within a couple hours. And if you got extra doses, it's just sitting at the end of the day. What they're doing in Israel is they're looking outside. They grab the pizza guy that's on the bicycle, on the bicycle cruising by. They're like, do you want a shot? Come on in, they they're looking outside, they grab the pizza guy that's on the bicycle, on the bicycle cruising by. They're like, do you want a shot? Come on in, they give him a shot. They grab the next guy.

You do not need to track everyone that gets a shot. You do not need everyone to show their ID to get a shot. You do not need to X, Y and Z, all the disincentives that create friction in the system of rolling out the vaccine need to be completely eliminated. There's no qualifying criteria, except maybe being 65 and over for the first 30 days. And we prioritize politics over health and safety.

We have made it the case that the teachers should get the shot first, because the teachers, unions created an uproar in California, and said they're not gonna go to work unless they, so now the teachers are gonna get it, and the essential workers are gonna get it, which are people that are working in stores and warehouses and other stuff.

And meanwhile, the people that can actually die from this, 15% likelihood of death if you're over 85, are not getting it because they're not technically essential workers. The prioritization where we've tried to create these artificial, politically motivated systems for defining who gets the vaccine and who doesn't, is absolutely killing us and literally killing us. 4,000 people died yesterday in the United States. The system is fucked up, the incentives, and don't bleep that out because that's

exactly what it is. The disincentives we've created are destroying the rollout. The governor is getting involved in creating models of prioritization that are politically motivated or killing us. And we should centrally plan this thing, war production act, make a shit ton of the stuff, grab it all, get 100 million doses distributed into gymnasiums around the country, get the nurses in there, get the national guard, or whatever. We should have been fattener.

I mean, that's the key. They should have been fattener. The money for the effort. Central planning is sometimes needed to get shit done. We did it with the war production board during World War II. We did it with the Manhattan Project. There have been countless examples where we've had to centralize planning for a massive short term event.

And this is one of those events. And this needs to be prioritized and organized centrally. And it needs to have the right-minded people on this, not kind of people that are political operatives and not people that are working nine to five. Well, the good news is this is a war and we need to go win the fucking war. I mean, the good news is Trump has time. He's at Camp David this weekend, so I think he can put some attention to it. Sacks. Can I ask a question, Fieber? Yeah.

So, you know, what do you think about just using markets to distribute the vaccine? It's a great idea. I think, you know, you have to get the incentive such that kind-day systems are the incentive, right? Because the objective here is to get as many people vaccinated as quickly as possible. So take that being your objective and then figure out, look, you guys are going to get a thousand dollars per person vaccinated in the first 15 days and then you're going to get 500 dollars and then you know whatever the transition is and then anyone can sign up to buy doses at a cost so they have skin in the game, right? That's an alternative. So let Walgreens and CVS buy

50 million doses. And then they're incentivized to get them rolled out as quickly as possible. Let them do the work. Sure. And frankly, for a few people have anaphylactic reactions across the country, that's just the reality. In war, you have some casualties. This can't be perfect. It has to be good enough to win the war. Well, by the way, when somebody goes into anaphylactic shock, just to clarify that, all you have to do Yeah, you get an epi shot. It's not fatal if you have an epi pen. That's right. And so, when you get a vaccine, if you get one of these vaccines, 40% to 60% of people are going to have some sort of reaction. You're going to have a fever

because these produce a ton of proteins in your body relative to what you would normally, you know, kind of experience with a dead vaccine. There's a lot of vaccines in your body, there's a lot of protein in your body. Your body reacts to get rid of that protein. You produce all these antibodies very quickly. So you end up having a fever, you end up having some allergic response or headaches or flushing or whatever. So everyone's going to have, a lot of people are going to have some sort of thing. So one of the concerns is they want to have nurses available and they want to have this feel like a controlled medical

environment. But again, the reality is we have to sack it up. We have to accept the fact that people are going to be uncomfortable. It is not going to be an easy, simple vaccine like you get the flu vaccine at Walgreens. It's going to be a little bit uncomfortable. You may not have five or six nurses surrounding you and getting all the TLC that Americans have become used to getting every time we, you know, brush our fricking teeth.

We're going to have some people go into anaphylactic shock and they're going to get FBPen shots. We shouldn't be charging $1,500 for FBPen shots. It's another important point. But I think the market-based model could work as well. As an Israel done this right, Israel, they moved the old people to the front of the line, but anybody can get in line. If they've got extra doses that day, they just keep sticking people. They keep jabbing people

until they run out. All they want, until they run out. That's right. And so they're probably at 20% of the population by now. Yeah, so I'm sure we all agree with everything you're saying. It speaks to an enormous amount of political incompetence. I mean, it's really, really just unbelievable why we just don't have smarter people in charge of these things. But, Sacks, I just wanna ask you because there is the conservative argument on this, which is the federal government shouldn't be doing

everything and states need to kind of manage their populace and manage what goes on locally. What is the conservative, I'm not asking you this, and I'm not attacking you, I'm just asking like, what is the conservative argument for not doing central planning and central organization around vaccine distribution and delegating it to states? And are there, do you think that there's a case against

for that that's pretty strong within the Republican party and within kind of conservative room I I think if there's a conservative point of view on this it would just be that let let markets Distribute the vaccine. They'll do a much better job I don't you know, I think whether it's federal or state the question is who's more incompetent and I'm not really sure I mean I think the problem right now is that when you make vaccine distribution fundamentally

political, then the debate becomes about exactly what is your position going to be exactly in line as opposed to just running the most number of people through the process as quickly as possible. We're getting ourselves so twisted up in knots over making sure that the exact right person is in line that we're having, you know, vaccine go to waste. And just to put that in context, 21 million plus doses have been distributed in the United States. 5.9 have made their way into people's arms.

In other words, there are 15 million, over 75% of doses have not gone in people's arms. And in California, we have distributed 5.85% of the populations vaccines, but we've only put 1.3 in people's arms. So we are literally a 4x where we should be. We're at 25% of where we should be. It is absolutely unbelievable that this is happening. And meanwhile, if the government, if the government stopped trying to do anything except, you know,

look, it did Operation Warp Speed, that actually did help get vaccines done faster. But if you just, that was just money to your point, SACs. All they did was create a market where they basically pre-bought all the vaccines, whether or not they were gonna work, and then funded the market to go and produce them early.

That's all that it was. So to your point, that operation warp speed for everyone thinking it's a massive, centrally controlled effort, it was a market-based incentive. They put up a couple of- It wasn't the Manhattan Project, is what you're saying. They put up a couple billion-

Yeah, check. They put up a couple billion dollars and said to all these pharma companies, go produce the vaccine, and if it works, we'll buy them. If it doesn't work, throw them away, but let's get production going. And that was it. Can I use this as a segue?

What we're seeing is we have a bunch of elected officials. We give them an enormous amount of responsibility. They also get this implied power. And then you see sometimes in these acute moments, they're totally derelict. Then I just want to move off of vaccines for a second. Then you get an elected official who is not acutely incompetent, but it seems broadly grossly and consistently incompetent. And I want to talk about Chesa Boudin. And I want to use Sax's article, which to be very honest, David, was probably one of the most incredibly well-written things.

Well done. You have ever created. I don't know, Jason, do we have show notes? Can we put it in? We'll put it in the show notes, yeah. We'll put a link in the show notes. It is so fucking good what you wrote. If everybody folks who are listening have a chance to read David's killer DA the killer DA

But it basically you know starts with a profile of this young woman seem like an incredible woman that was killed by this drunk driver, but anyways David you want to talk about it? Yeah, I mean so for the last with it's if you last couple of months. I've been following the San Francisco A couple of San Francisco police department accounts on twitter and i was noticing these extraordinary tweets which are getting retweet a lot about how they keep kept uh... who are resting and then having to let go of all of all these criminals who are committing

burglaries and other crimes and you could see the frustration of the police department boiling off these tweets and you know bit basically they are substituting this new district attorney that we've had, Chase Abudeen, who has elected, he's been in office about a year. He's elected the end of 2019. And so I started doing a little bit of research.

And then we had this horrible New Year's Eve killing of this wonderful young woman, Hannah Abe, who came to America from Japan for college and stayed here for work. She was just 27 years old. She gets killed by a criminal. Someone who was released, who was paroled by Chesa booting back in April, he had been in jail for armed robbery. Chesa released him as part of a plea bargain.

And then he was arrested five more times for stealing cars and other crimes most recently two weeks ago and the DA refused to press charges and that that's the reason he was out on New Year's Eve he stole a car and then there was this hit and run where he killed Hannah and another woman. And so you know I had already been noticing this issue and so I started doing some research and I have a research assistant helping me with this. It's the only way I could put something like this together.

And we went pretty deep and we realized that the death of Hannah wasn't just an accident or an act of negligence by this DA. It was part of an overall philosophy of decarceration that he has. But his background is very interesting. He was a child of parents who were in the weather underground who, when he was just a baby, committed arm robbery and were part of the murder which was- David, yeah.

David say the words, they were domestic terrorists. Yeah, they were, that's right, they were domestic terrorists terrorists They participated in an armed robbery against the Brink's truck Which was a domestic terrorist that were competent when compared to what we saw yesterday in the capital like these are highly capable domestic terrorists to be clear. I don't know. I don't know how capable They were there there are robbery results in the death of two police officers and a brinks guard. And they were put in prison. His mother spent 20 years in prison.

She's now released. His father is still in prison for almost 40 years. And he's described in interviews how his earliest memories are visiting his parents in prison, and how this shaped his entire political outlook. And he became a public defender, which I think was a pretty good place for him. I think if I were an indigent criminal defendant, I would want someone like Chase the Beauty on my side. But the problem is he ran for district attorney, and he simply doesn't believe in prosecuting huge numbers of crimes, certainly property crimes, burgl burglarie shoplifting vandalism

and those crimes have absolutely spiked in the city you know uh... forty five percent increase in uh... burglaries in one year thirty five percent increase in stolen cars thirty percent increase in homicides crimes are through the roof because he simply doesn't believe in putting people in jail well you know i I just said this. Can I, sorry, let me just point out, there's a little bit of a history to this notion

that DAs should change the criminal justice system. There's a TED talk by a guy named Adam Faw, SACs, I don't know if you've seen it or if any of you guys have watched it. I was at the TED conference the year that he spoke, but this guy basically thought, you know, he made the case that it is the TED conference the year that he spoke, but this guy basically thought, he made the case that it is the role in the opportunity for the district attorney for the prosecutor

to change the criminal justice system from the prosecutorial side, that you can kind of demotivate jail and other kind of mechanisms of punishment and push for a rehabilitation program as an alternative, and that the district attorneys can take this roll-on of changing the criminal justice system. It created a little bit of a mini-movement, and there was a lot of attention and follow-up after he gave his TED Talk.

I think San Francisco, in large part, picked up on the momentum coming out of this and other similar sort of stories about the DA can really change the criminal justice system and Chesapeakean really kind of capitalized on it. In principle, a lot of people are motivated from a good place when they elected him, which is it is unfortunate a lot of people get trapped in a life of crime and the fact that they're in and out of prison is a result of the fact that they're put into the criminal justice system in the first place and parole is really harsh on people and all these other reasons why people's lives are ruined for simple mistakes and if they get an opportunity in life, they can fix themselves and they can come out in a better place.

So there is a bit of an origin story. It's not just like San Francisco said, let's get an anarchist to be our DA and destroy the world and kill us all. Like I think it came from a good and true place where this all kind of originated, but obviously the experiment has gone severely around San Francisco and his particular methods and his particular actions have certainly caused far more harm than anyone has seen any good.

That's actually really what it is. I think the danger. I think the danger for him too. Well, I think the danger is not that you have an enlightened political philosophy. I think that's actually quite great than that we can experiment. I think the danger is both on the left and on the right

where people cathartically deal with childhood trauma through their job. And I don't know what Chesa Budin has gone through and I feel very bad that he had an incredibly hard life or complicated or maybe not. I don't even know. But I wouldn't even know. But I wouldn't want to know that he's trying to deal

with his own experiences through his job because that's not his job. Meaning, you don't want an activist DA. I think you want a DA that's enforcing the laws and what you do want is you want to elect politicians who change the laws to reflect our values. Yeah, that would be a better through line, I think. Really, if you look at what's happening in San Francisco, I think we've conflated income inequality, which people in San Francisco are very tuned into with, essentially junkies,

people who are addicted to incredibly hardcore drugs that are very hard to get off of, and we've had more deaths from overdoses of fentanyl than we've had from COVID by a magnitude of four or five. I mean, it is bedlam on the streets of San Francisco. And if you don't enforce a basic rule of law, what happens is the price of drugs gets cheaper, more available, more people try them, more people get addicted, and then more people come from other places because they know you have the lowest price on drugs, and the price of drugs is inversely correlated with prosecution of drug crimes.

So, on prosecution of crime. So, this is why San Francisco was viral. And most drugs are purchased from criminal funds. So, you know, criminal activity goes up to fund the drug purchasing. So that's the vicious cycle that's driving San Francisco. And there's a recall going on, and then in related news, Gavin Newsom is now up to a million signatures in his recall, which I think is two there's other way there.

Yeah. They have until mid or late February, they're going to get the votes. And I think the question, you know, Friedberg and I talked about this just on a phone call. He and I caught up a couple days ago. I think it is time, guys, for us to find an incredibly centrist, thoughtful candidate, and put them into the recall race against Newsom. Freeberg had the best idea, which was Kim Kardashian, which I think is incredible because

she is very smart, she's very likable, she's got enormous distribution, she's like, she's about to become a lawyer. You know, that'll be the main, not the best platform for Kardashian to run for president. Look, it's pretty clear recognition, influence, fame, is what gets people elected, not the best policy and not the greatest experience. From Jesse Ventura to Arnold Schwarzenegger to Donald Trump. Ronald Reagan.

Ronald Reagan, I mean, these are celebrities who I would argue in the case of Jesse Ventura, Arnold Schwarzenegger and maybe even Donald Trump as well. Their celebrity was kind of, it had hit its media-driven apex, and this was a second act, and perhaps someone like that is a great fit here. Kim Kardashian really fits the bill, but that's just a shot in the dark,

but I do think someone like that needs to go up, because if you put politician up again, it's another one of these eye-rolling events, and for the populist to really find appeal, it has to be a recognized person, broadly recognized and liked person. Yeah. Um, I guess it could be you. Governor Jason Dachon.

I'm not ready to run for political office. I'm 50. And when I'm 60, I would consider it actually, but not right now. I want to work. I want to work at a hop too. I think we all got a hop. But I was going to say one thing, which is the beginning of today's podcast

was probably the punchiest it's ever been. And I think it just speaks to the fact that there was so, the bar was so high for Trump to have done something that would have actually gotten us to actually argue and interrupt each other. You know, because we've been so incredibly loving and protective of each other for four years on this topic, but it literally took an armed insurrection. For us to finally...

Even the besties. Well, I think it's good for people to see Sacks, maybe an eye or chameau and sacks. Or whoever disagree on some of these cases or freeberg, you know, doesn't believe in prosecuting Trump. I think we actually had a split ticket there where sacks and freeberg felt like we shouldn't prosecute Trump and chameau and I were in the prosecute Trump one. But I think we're all struggling with these issues. All Americans are struggling with these issues of how do you deal with a black swan event? I think that's what's so unique about Trump is, and I think

David, you can speak to this is, I don't think the system was designed for his level of crazy. Right? Like our system is based on norms and traditions and trust. Just like venture investing is, and we see this in venture investing, some founder goes off the jumps of fence and all of a sudden, you know. Yeah, I mean, well, we still, I would say our system performed pretty well in terms of being stress tested, and well, look, we still got two more weeks,

I think we're all kind of, we're all kind of white knuckling it right now. Yeah, hoping nothing else happens, but look, if Trump's goal was a coup you know I think it's a strong word but if it like it totally failed I mean he didn't come close to no uh... to succeeding in a coup um... you know the opposite in fact the the opposite he he he again we talked about how I think his he destroyed his popularity over the last two months he he impacted his earnings by negative $2 billion.

Yeah, so but you know, but to this point about us agreeing or disagreeing, you know, I saw a whole bunch of fans of the pod like at mentioning me saying, I wonder what sax is going to say about this. I don't know what like, yeah, and I'm kind of like like, what do they think I'm going to say? Like they think I'm going gonna be supportive of that. So, I mean, you know, like, I think somehow you, Jason, you've programmed the viewers

and I'm somehow like, the Trump guy, you know, because you're always trolling me as the Trump supporter. I mean, I would believe that Russia was a hoax and that, no, I said, people would have been treated the same climbing up those steps. We all know that's not true. Some of these are self-inflicted wounds of your own. Good to take some ownership there.

Boys, boys. I need a hop. I love you very much. Happy new year. Happy new year, Beth. We'll say one thing before we meet next time, I guarantee you some highly unexpected and highly impactful thing will occur. Please, no.

Can we get back to talking about SPACs or the bachelor? I can. Oh my god, we didn't even talk about my SPAC today. Oh yeah, yeah. Anyway, give it a plug. Go ahead. No, I mean, just explain to people what you do. He doesn't need a plug.

Double today. It's insane. All right, we'll explain what I've got. IPOE is merging with SoFi. It's an incredible company led by we'll explain why I'm here. I-P-O-E, I-P-O-E is merging with SoFi. It's an incredible company led by an incredible CEO, Anthony Noto. You can read a little one page on my website, but anyways, guys, more importantly, to all the listeners out there,

happy new year to all of you guys. Let's make 2021 kick ass. Yep. I love you guys. I miss you. I miss you guys soon. Play poker show. Oh, look, there's somebody.

Yeah, I gotta interrupt it. I gotta go go I will see you all next time take us out young spill bird take us out young spill bird We'll let your winners ride. Rainman David Sack We open source it to the fans and they've just gone crazy with it. I'm going to the US, I'm going to the US. What, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, Besties are gone. Go for it. That is my dog. Take it away. It's your drive away. Sit down. Sit down. Oh man.

My ham is the actual meat. We should all just get a room and just have one big hug. George, because they're all good. It's like this like sexual tension that we just need to release that out. What? B. What? Your feet.

B. What? We need to get a few. We need to get merch. I'm going on, leave it.