An Army of Normal Folks - Ellen Yarborough: From Schoolhouse to Firehouse (Pt 2)

Episode Date: February 13, 2024

There are 677,000 volunteer firefighters across America and Ellen Yarborough joined their ranks at 45 years old. The history teacher then accidentally pioneered giving her students academic credit for their service as fire cadets, which they can do as young as 14 years old! Her model called “Schoolhouse to Firehouse” is inspiring the next generation of firefighters and community leaders. Support the show: https://www.normalfolks.us/premiumSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey guys, it's Bill Courtney with an Army of Normal folks and we continue now with part two of our conversation with Ellen Yarborough right after these brief messages from our generous sponsors. One of the best shows of the year according to Apple, Amazon and Time is back for another round. We have more insightful conversations between myself, Paul Muldoon and Paul McCartney about his life and career. We had a big bear of a land, it's called Mal Evans, who's our buddy. And he was coming back on the plane and he said, will you pass the salt and pepper?

And I miss her. I said, what? So I drew that one. This season we're diving deep into some of McCartney's most beloved songs. Yesterday, Band on the Run, Hey Jude. And McCartney's favorite song in his entire catalog, here, there, and everywhere. Listen to season two of McCartney, A Life in Lyrics,

on the iHeart radio app Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 911, what's your emergency? You have to send someone. What's going on? Whatever it is, that's our entire emergency force on the way somewhere. They're saying there's a body in the woods. Excuse me, I don't seem to recognize you. Um, that's because I'm not from here. A small town stuck in the past.

There's only one cell tower and currently it's out of order. With secrets hidden for centuries. We hear things, you know. When they whisper or when they think they're alone. And a curious stranger who may be their only chance for survival. I'm talking about the murder and disappearance in small town New Hampshire.

What do you think? Sorry, have you ever listened to a single true crime podcast? You turn up in Danville just as the town sees its first real crime in decades. This is Consumed, an all new supernatural audio thriller inspired by the novel by Aaron Mankey. I did not wake up this morning preparing to deal with forces

beyond my understanding. Please, I call that breakfast. Listen to Consumed on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, it's you get your podcasts. or couldn't get enough of Sue Sylvester's zingers, we've got you covered. Join us every week as we dive deep into the world of show choirs and teenage drama. We're breaking down every episode from the highs of nationals to the lows of slushie attacks. We have exclusive interviews with some of your favorite glee cast members like Chris Colfer, Amber Riley, Darren Chris, Heather Morris, Alex Newell, and so many more. Plus, we're taking you behind the scenes with the creators, writers, producers and crew members like Ryan Murphy, Ian Brennan and executive music producer

Adam Anders. We're even getting the chance to chat with the music icons whose songs were featured on the show, from the Go-Go's to Jason Maraz to Rick Springfield. Meet us in the choir room while we reveal our greatest memories and untold stories. Listen to and that's what you really miss podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. So have you been on a call with your kid? Oh yeah. So we went on a call to a house in our township but not our local so our other our sister company's local and and my son and I are there and we've been on a few fires

together but this one this was great because we were on a line together we weren't first line in again takes us a while to assemble people you've got to get to the firehouse none of us who are in my fire company actually live very close to the firehouse. So it's going to take a couple minutes to get there and then gear up and then get to scene. So we don't take the first line and we pick up the second line and we go into the house. And so I've got my son, he's on the nozzle and I'm behind him and we're trying to push into the house. And of course all the black smoke is coming out because it's a hoarder situation. And it's just chock full of stuff, including old tires and bikes.

And I had to climb over a door that was on its side in the middle of a room and things like that. But as my son's going in, somebody's upstairs or a window falls out and lands on my son's head, you know, the glass shattering. And he says, what was that? I said, nothing. Just keep going. Keep going. And we go in and he said, you know, of course, it's met with black smoke. And he says, I can't see anything. I go like, just hit whatever's red, whatever's orange, right? Spray the water on the hot park. Yes, spray it on the right, right, look for the glow.

So, and at that point, I mean, really, it's the problem is, is every time you move something, flames are going to pop up. Yeah, because you put air to it, right? Right, absolutely. So you're just reigniting everything. And there was just a lot of overhaul that we were doing. But it was just fun to be with him.

It was really cool. It was hot work. But it was neat. I'm doing that with were doing. But it was just fun to be with him. It was really cool. It was hot work. But it was neat. I'm doing that with my kid. Have fun. We've done a search for someone together before. We had another fire. Well, actually, he and I were in different sides

of the building together. We did a roof rescue together. That was pretty cool. What's a roof rescue? A roofer had a medical emergency. So we had to package him and get him off of the roof and into a window to be taken out by EMS. But it's just neat because I know he's going to listen to me and if I'm in danger, he's

strong as an ox and he'll just reach down, yanking by my collar and pull me out. And I trust him and he can hear my voice. So. So how long is this program? The training program? So we have county fire academies and to get your initial certification, Fire One, which is just basic.

You know enough to hopefully not do anything colossally stupid level, right? But you go into it thinking like, yeah, this is going to make me a firefighter. But it gives you the cert that helps reduce insurance costs and things like that, and allows you to then start the process of becoming the firefighter that your department or your company needs you to be. But really, the most robust training happens in-house. So in order to get this initial certification at the county level, well, then recognize the state level, and then there's something called the Pro Board. And that's supposed

to transfer state to state, although as is true for most things, the United States, it doesn't always happen that way. You know, everybody has their own, everybody wants to have their own way of doing things. But it's 188 hours. Wow. Yeah. So it's 188 hours. Wow. Yeah. So it's pretty demanding. Our gear is purchased normally through, we have a relief organization and that's, we add funds to that through, as we do for everything, through fundraising, through investments, through

contributions from the township. So we have a general fund, a crew fund, a relief fund, and we get grants. We write a lot of grants and grants will help pay for equipment. For example, right now we have a safer grant. It's a federal grant for about $450,000, $422,000, maybe over the course of the next five years for recruitment and retention. And part of that, for every new recruit who comes in that's going through the training, we get a set of gear for them. So we've gotten other grants that enable us to buy a second set of gear.

So if one set, if we are in a fire or some other hazardous condition that gear needs to be sent off to be cleaned, we have a backup set to wear. So I ask because I also found this which I think is interesting. And I don't know if these numbers are right. You can tell me if this is full of prunes or not, but a helmet's 300 bucks, a coat's 1200, pants are 875, boots are 300, a hood that I think goes under the helmet's 40 bucks, gloves are 95, SCBA, which I assume is a breathing apparatus is 6300, a radio's 3700, a thermal imager a thermal imager is 1200 and training is 7800. I mean, there's $20,000 in crap going on right there to volunteer your time. Right.

Right. And everybody has to have this, right? Everybody who's, well, it depends on your level of training. But to be a full-fledged. Yes, absolutely. If you're going to be an interior firefighter and respond to the most difficult calls, car wrecks, and things like that, and be in a hot zone, then yes, you're going to need all of that equipment.

Every 23 seconds, a fire department responds to a fire somewhere in the country, which means that every 23 seconds, there's two thirds a chance somebody's volunteering their time, their effort, their money, and potentially their well-being and safety to help out people. That's statistics. If you look at those fires, how many of those are going to be wildfires or even structural fires, they're normally going to be in urban areas. So that's going to skew your numbers a little bit too.

I get it. But the point is... There's a lot of people doing a lot of work. Yes. 3800 civilians have lost their lives or has result to fire. 75% of all civilian fire deaths occurred in residences. There were 14,700 civilian fire injuries reported last year. There was an estimated 1.35 million fires. Two thirds of these, according to us, were addressed by people like you, teachers and line workers. addressed by people like you, teachers and line workers. And...

I'd love a line worker to join us. What are the occupations of the people in your house? You got a teacher? Yeah. So if you look traditionally, you're going to see a lot of guys in the trades. And I'm sure in some communities and some of our local communities, we still have that. My fire company, we've got a chemical engineer, lawyer, me as a teacher, finance, number of people in finance, accounting, IT.

That's hilarious. Absolutely. If you really think about that, I mean, that is just people from all walks of life. And the point is, you know, focusing on an army of normal folks. That's some of everybody. Absolutely. And where else are you going to get an attorney and a guy operating a forklift on second shift on a line together. And that's one of the things I really like about it is that we'll joke, like politics,

people will poke, but everybody and you've got some of my friends will say, how can you, some of my friends on one side of the aisle will say, well, how can you work with that person? You know who they voted for. I said, because they will step over that campaign sign in somebody's front yard to go put out that fire, you know, to go to take care of that family. So I'm so glad you said that. One of the things I've said about this podcast is I don't care how you vote. Mm-hmm. How you worship what you look like What you think about Politics who you love. I don't care any of that because

If you're doing something to serve people in your community Regardless of all that other stuff that I may disagree with completely, I can celebrate that one thing about you. And if we can all celebrate one another's service, regardless of who we are, what we look like, what we come from, how we vote, how we love, how we worship, whatever, that kind of starts to create a foundation of respect and mutual appreciation that now we can have those conversations in a civil non-threatening way that aren't so toxic.

And ironically enough, what you're talking about the firehouse is a microcosm of what I'm talking about could happen in our country if we just celebrated one another for the deeds we were doing. Everybody gets a thank you for coming. We're happier here. You know, we needed you. We need you.

We don't care. I don't care who you go home to, how you vote, whatever. You showed up. I needed somebody else on that truck with me. Yeah, if I voted for Trump and my house is burning down and you voted for Biden and you put it out and saved my child's life, I all of a sudden don't really care what your politics are. Absolutely.

And nobody cares that I'm a woman. I mean, the people that do, that's more about them than it is on me once I have my gear on. Most people don't know. So we were on a call and we brought our rescue truck because it's an air bank so we can refill people's cylinders for them. And there was a- What do you mean? You firefighter cylinders. They're oxygen cylinders? Well, you're not carrying oxygen on your back into a fire, that would be a bad thing. It's compressed air. Okay. So, right.

But that's what you're talking about. Those things that the guys breathe through when they're in the... Self-contained breathing apparatus. Which is that scuba thing that's $6,300. SCBA. Yeah, whatever it is. All right. Okay.

Don't leave that on scene. So, we went to a call far away. In fact, we were on a car accident and this call came in and we thought that this has got to be a missed dispatch. This is all the way the other side of the county. Why are they calling us? They wanted our rescue because we have the ability to refill cylinders with air so firefighters can go back in with a fresh tank. Fresh cylinder, don't call it a tank. So we're there and we're parked back out of the way. Folks are operating, there's actually an explosion, this house exploded,

nobody was injured, it was miraculous. So these guys are working and every once in a while somebody will come up with a few cylinders to be refilled. We'll be doing that. So I've got my back turned to the shoulder of the road and this guy goes, you know, and now this is Delco He's like yo buddy. Yo buddy. Yo, and so I turn around he goes, oh, sorry, babe But buddy, yeah, babe, you know, and he says he just wants to know what's going on So I tell him what's going on So it's just kind of funny. So neither of them are offensive. And he's an older guy. He's not being rude. He just wants to know what's going on. He's

apologizing. Yeah, so I don't care. We'll be right back. We'll be right back. One of the best shows of the year, according to Apple, Amazon and Time, is back for another round. We have more insightful conversations between myself, Paul Muldoon and Paul McCartney about his life and career. We had a big bear of a land, it was called Maladins, with our logo, and I was coming back on the plane and he said, will you pass the salt and pepper? And I miss her, and I said what?

So I drew pepper. This season we're diving deep into some of McCartney's most beloved songs. Yesterday, Band on the Run, Hey Jude, and McCartney's favorite song in his entire catalogue, Here, There, and Everywhere. Listen to season two of McCartney, A Life in Lyrics, on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, it's Jenna Ashquitz. And Kevin McHale. or wherever you get your podcasts. we've got you covered. Join us every week as we dive deep into the world of show choirs and teenage drama. We're breaking down every episode from the highs of nationals to the lows of slushie attacks.

We have exclusive interviews with some of your favorite Glee cast members like Chris Colfer and Mariah Lee, Darren Chris, Heather Morris, Alex Newell and so many more. Plus, we're taking you behind the scenes with the creators, writers, producers and crew members like Ryan Murphy, Ian Brennan and executive music producer Adam Anders. We're even getting behind the scenes with the creators, writers, producers, and crew members, like Ryan Murphy, Ian Brennan, and executive music producer Adam Anders. We're even getting the chance to chat with the music icons whose songs were featured

on the show, from the Go-Go's to Jason Maraz to Rick Springfield. Meet us in the choir room while we reveal our greatest memories and untold stories. Listen to and that's what you really miss podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 911, what's your emergency? You have to send someone. What's going on? Whatever it is, that's our entire emergency force on the way somewhere.

They're saying there's a body in the woods. Excuse me, I don't seem to recognize you. Um, that's because I'm not from here. A small town stuck in the past. There's only one cell tower, and currently, it's out of order. With secrets hidden for centuries. We hear things, you know, when they whisper or when they think they're alone.

And a curious stranger who may be their only chance for survival. I'm talking about the murder and disappearance in small town New Hampshire. What do you think? Sorry, have you ever listened to a single true crime podcast? You turn up in Donville just as the town sees its first real crime in decades? This is Consumed, an all new supernatural audio thriller inspired by the novel by Aaron Mankey.

I did not wake up this morning preparing to deal with forces beyond my understanding. Please, I call that breakfast. Listen to consumed on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I as a teacher and a former student at my high school, you know. Yeah, because you bought the house you grew up in. So, now you're teaching at my high school, you know. Yeah, because you bought the house you grew up in. So now you're teaching at the same school you went to. Correct.

Crazy. So when I was a kid, when I was in high school, every once in a while, there were boys, their pagers would go off and they got to leave school. And I was curious, but not curious enough. I mean, I was busy, I played sports, you know, I had other things going on. In some schools, that's a drug deal.

Right, right. Well, it is a drug in a way high school. In some schools, that's a drug deal. Right. Well, it is a drug in a way. I mean, it's an adrenaline rush. You get addicted to it. Right. Yeah, they certainly get addicted to it. But those boys then at that time got to leave school and go and respond to calls. Now that's not the case because of insurance liability for the school and all of that.

And what I didn't appreciate was their level of service at the time. And those guys that I remember still in, and one of those was the guy that later became our chief. And when my son got involved, now again, he's in eighth grade now, and I see how much time, and he's also an athlete, but I see how much time he's spending at the firehouse and the things that he's doing. And at the time, he was doing things that I would never allow 14 and 15 year olds to do now, nor would the state. But he kind of squeaked in and around some folks, I guess, to have a little more fun

than a boy should have at his age. But I just saw how much time and how much learning was happening and the skills that he was developing and the mentorship, the teaching that these guys were doing, the absolutely responsibility, what he was entrusted with and how he managed that and even like soft skills of confidentiality, the things you see, the homes you go into, mums the word. When you come out and you want to talk about a call, you talk about it with other folks here but you don't go gab about it, you don't take photos of it, none of that happens.

And never even thought about that, but that's got to be absolutely true. Absolutely. That's that element of trust. And I thought it was, and then now he's in high school and he's still doing this and he's recruiting a couple of his buddies. So now we've got this little thing going here and I'm thinking, why don't these kids get credit for this at school? And none of the teachers really seem to know, despite always having had volunteer firefighters in the school, like every school around us and half of the guys who are captains and chiefs and firefighters

in the volunteer service in my entire county started off as juniors and cadets. So they've been doing this forever. But in order to get that kind of credit, you would have to leave half the school day and go to the vocational high school for a Votek program, for an EMS Fire Police class program, which exists, which is tremendous. But then you're leaving out the kids who do all of that stuff on their free time, but don't want to leave school for a tech program because they want to take AP biology, or they want to be on campus so that they can go to wrestling practice right after school. So these were kids that were doing the work that weren't getting credit for it. So I made a proposal, and I wrote a brief course description and justified it based on Pennsylvania State Department of Education standards for career and technical education

that they should get academic credit, elective credit for the work that they provide in the community with a firehouse. And nobody said no. And I think that's been part of my story as nobody ever says no. So we went with it and that was 2018. And what was really cool, and I was invited to do a webinar in Maryland for the Maryland State Farmers Association on recruitment of juniors. And what I showed on one slide was basically how one big gets two, big gets four, you know, this kind of compounded growth, this exponential growth by bringing in a single correct kid and him bringing in the right friends. When I first approached guidance

and teachers, and these are my friends, generally what I heard was, and firefighters are no good at denying this, what I heard was, well, you know, it's kind of like the Marines. These kids, they need something. They need, you know, kind of ship up or shape up or ship out kind of stuff. And then you ask older firefighters and they're like, oh, God, when I was a kid, I was a hellion. And well, would you want a hellion in your fire company now, in your firehouse now? Absolutely not. I don't want those kids. I don't want the version of me when I was a teenager.

I worked hard, but maybe I play a little too hard. So I had to re-characterize, paint a different portrait of who is suitable for a firehouse. And you can't be someone who's failing out of classes. Your priority is school, that's why you're there. So they had to be a student of some sort. They had to be trustworthy. They had to be able to hold confidence. They can't be combative. If an adult says, put your phone away, the phone is away. There's no questions asked. Unlike in the classroom, I fight that battle every day. But in the firehouse, I never fight it. Phones are up, let's go. And the kids want to be there, so they don't do it.

So I kind of painted a new picture of what our ideal candidates would be. And my teachers, my peers have been great at recommending kids to me. I'll have an English teacher with a freshman send me a text, I've got this great kid. He kind of has nothing right now. He's a big kid. He's a nice kid. He's strong, but he's not playing sports. And he's friends with this other boy. He's a firefighter. I'm wondering, hey,

maybe he can convince him to go to the firehouse. Fine. Send him to my office. I'll talk to him fifth block end of the day. So now my teachers are doing some of the recruiting for me, which is amazing. It is amazing because I'll go back to one of the things I read earlier, which is many local volunteer fire departments are struggling to meet staffing needs. Where better to meet staffing needs by training them young, getting them involved and giving them credit for it, make them feel part of something and then all of a sudden you're building literally an army of volunteers.

You hope so. It all depends on where you live too. So the retention issue is big. I mean, recruitment is one thing. So I can convince people to join but how do I keep them around? Because a lot of the kids that I'm going after, these are kids that have any number of opportunities in front of them, including my own two. So both my son and my daughter are firefighters. But I recruited one boy. Actually, I didn't even recruit him. He just approached me and

he said, this was before his, I guess it was spring of junior year, he said, I want to go to the Naval Academy. Do you think being a firefighter, being a junior firefighter will help me in that? I said, sure, come on, I'll take anybody. I actually believe it would. Absolutely, it does. All those skills that you learn? Yep, absolutely it does. And I said, not only that, but if you're responding this much, then it's going to go on your transcripts. So they're going to see there's there's proof positive. You're actually following through with it.

And now you have somebody who's going to speak on your behalf to recruiters. I've had calls from police departments, fire departments, asking me about people who have gone through either with my fire company or one of the other neighborhood ones and the kids know me. They'll ask me, can I use you as a reference? I say, absolutely. And I track those kids. And now you speak at conferences and you instruct at the National Fire Academy and you write for fire service publications and you advise LA based production teams

with how to approach the fire service for television series. I mean, what? Yeah, some of that's luck. You know the saying like I know a guy, I know a guy, I always know a guy or sometimes I'm that guy. No, I think I've made the right connections. So everybody's thinking too often about how can we build a program and how can we pay for this program?

Who's going to staff it? Who's going to do this? Who's going to do XYZ? And my model, I'm trying to just simplify it. Why are we pouring all this money into stuff? Kids have been going to firehouses. Teenagers, whether they accept them at 14 or they accept them at 16, they've been going to firehouses for 100 years, at least.

I mean, I'm saying modern fire service, not, you know, let's say post World War II, modern fire service. They've been showing up, but they've been showing up with their uncle, their grandfather, father, whoever. But now they're showing up one kid at a time or a kid comes in and he brings another kid. We've had to go find the kids rather than the kids coming to us because it runs in the family blood. If that's not happening, then you've got school districts who want to create programs but don't have the funds to fund another program. But they like community partnerships with for their students.

And you've got fire departments who want to get into the schools and they think that there always needs to be a formal class in the school during the school day. And that works for robust school districts that have that fun, those funds. What about the rural ones? What about all these other groups? Even in my community, and again, my model is what about the kids who don't want to give up on certain classes because they're aiming to go to Carnegie Mellon or wherever Or the Naval Academy and they've got to take AP chemistry and AP physics They can't have half their day going somewhere else So why don't we just simplify it and just give them credit for what they do out in the community

All right, so your teacher and your students Know that they're cool teachers kind of a firefighter person too, right? How's that go? So, well, I guess most interestingly, sometimes I recruit right out of my own classroom. And every anniversary of 9-11, I show two videos. If you haven't seen them, I really should. ESPN did an extraordinary one called The Man in the Red Bandana. And it's about a guy, he was a trader, new to the job in one of the towers. I can't remember which.

Hold it. I want to interrupt you and then tell it. We're going to tell this story on this. We're going to do a podcast on this. About Wells Crowther? About The Man with the red bandana. Okay. But you go ahead and tell it because this will be our lead in. In fact, we may use the voiceover one day in a future episode, but this is a great story. Absolutely.

So this is one of my favorite stories and ESPN just does a top notch job on this. So you've got this young guy fresh out of college, Boston College, and he's, I believe he's a trader, some finance guy in the World Trade Center. And he had been a volunteer firefighter. He had been a junior, so he started as a high schooler too, goes off to college, plays ice hockey, plays lacrosse, etc., etc. And he had contacted his father shortly before 9-11 and said, I don't want to do this. This isn't what I want to do.

I want to be a firefighter. And I'm sure his dad at the time, and he tells his story, it's really sad. And he's thinking, like, what are you doing? You just went to college and paid all this money. You went to college. You're a trader. You're in the World Trade Center in the Mecca of Wall

Street and everything. You want to give all that up to be a firefighter, but the kid was a volunteer firefighter. Yeah, so it's in his heart. So all hell breaks loose and he's in the position to help. And as his father tells it in the story, he takes off his traitor's hat and puts on his firefighter hat, you know, proverbial, and gets to work helping people out of the building. And that ESPN short recounts that story, including interviews of people that recognized him because

he carried a red bandana, which was a gift from his father when he was a kid. So that's a really cool story. So I share that, the kids some will cry, but now I've got them because to them, 9-11, 2001, they weren't even born. And the other one I show is about the 9-11 boat lift, which is a really cool story and it's narrated by Tom Hanks. And it's that in nine hours, all of these vessels were called into service. And somehow, the Coast Guard manages to wrangle these guys and their ferries and their private fishing boats and all of that and they managed to get 500,000 people off of the south end of Manhattan in nine hours to all points, you know, Staten Island, wherever,

Hoboken, etc., etc. So I love a feel-good story and those are two really important stories. There's a tremendous documentary that's too long to show and hold students' attention these days by these two Frenchmen who came and are just following FDNY around and happened to be there on a gas call when the first plane hits. Whose photos I saw three days ago in the 9-11 museum when I was in Manhattan. They're on the wall, along the whole back wall next to the slurry wall. Those Frenchman's photos are in the 9-11 museum right now.

I saw them three days ago. I was there. I was just up there about a month ago with a friend. She was visiting from Idaho and had never been. I said, fine, I'll take the train up. Let's go. So. I said, fine, I'll take the train up, let's go. When you go in that museum, now being a firefighter yourself, how does it affect you? Well, I think there were a lot of...

One, that department lost an entire generation of leaders, not to mention all the men that followed them in the buildings that day. And I think no matter where you work, the idea that at some point you're not going to be there, it needs to be in your head so that you're actually, you learn something, you turn around and you teach somebody else. So, and I don't know the whole story about how that department rebuilt itself, but fortunately those guys were teachers and now these guys step into their boots and rebuild the department. And I'm sure they shuffled plenty of people around, you know, but that's kind of an extraordinary story of rebirth for that department. But back to showing these two videos. So I've got a kid in my class and she's a senior. Again, it's the first

week of school and she's a nice hockey player. So now she's interested in the story because the ESPN story because of Wells Crowther. And I had said as my lead in that they knew most of the kids know that I'm with the local fire company. I see them on calls. I go into their homes and at the end of class, she says, I want to be a firefighter. I said, fine, show up Monday night. So she shows up Monday night. We were doing a really fun training. Put her in gear, put a pack on her. She went on air for the first time to kind of crawl around. It was simulating, finding your way out, following a hose line out of a building in darkness. So put the mask over her, I'm

sorry, the hood over her face, over her mask so she couldn't see anything and had to feel her way out. And she loved it. And now she went to the Academy in Massachusetts where she goes to college. She's a fire science major. She wants to be a career firefighter. Usually when she's around, we don't get anything, but this summer, she caught a nice brush fire on the highway with my son. So I think of all the people that can be out on a brush fire for four hours, I'm glad it was the two college athletes, right?

And not me and our other gray-haired folks. But they had a great time. So they're just chasing brush wire. All right. So then something happens and you provide testimony to the Pennsylvania legislature. Explain all that. I don't, I'm not really sure how everything started to unfold like that. But it's been...

My trajectory is unusual, I guess. Really? You were in Idaho, then France, and Poland. But even this whole, I mean, it's just kind of truncated into this, this kind of sub career or extra career of doing all of these things where my name is ahead of anything I've done sometimes, you know, like I want to do it first. And the other day, somebody says, Oh, I heard about you, you're famous. I'm like, what did I do? And he's, oh, I just heard you're famous.

So I don't know what that is. Is that a good thing? Is that a bad thing? But it was just it was a guy who had been one of my instructors when I went through Fire One. I just ran in them in the cafeteria at the academy the other day. But there are some good folks in the state.

I've made some really great connections. And I'm going to go ahead and say this for you. Okay. I know you didn't seek it out. I didn't either. Yeah, I get it. All right. And I appreciate the humility and everything else. But a woman who 45 who's been all over the place as a teacher who becomes a volunteer firefighter and then almost becomes the face of volunteer firefighting in that part of the world. That's... I don't know about that. I do. We'll be right back. One of the best shows of the year, according to Apple, Amazon and Time, is back for another round.

We have more insightful conversations between myself, Paul Muldoon and Paul McCartney about his life and career. We had a big bear of a land, it was called Maladins with our logo and it was coming back on the plane. And he said, will you pass the salt and pepper? And I miss her. I said what? So I should buy one. This season we're diving deep into some of McCartney's most beloved songs, Yesterday, Band on the Run, Hey Jude, and McCartney's favorite song in his entire catalogue, Here, There, and Everywhere. Listen to season two of McCartney, A Life in Lyrics, on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Or, wherever you get your podcasts. you covered. Join us every week as we dive deep into the world of show choirs and teenage drama. We're breaking down every episode from the highs of nationals to the lows of slushie attacks. We have exclusive interviews with some

of your favorite Glee cast members like Chris Colfer, Amber Riley, Darren Chris, Heather Morris, Alex Newell and so many more. Plus we're taking you behind the scenes with the creators, writers, producers and crew members like Ryan Murphy, Ian Brennan and executive music producer Adam Anders. We're even getting the chance to chat with the music icons whose songs were featured on the show, from the Go-Go's to Jason Maraz to Rick Springfield. Meet us in the choir room while we reveal our greatest memories and untold stories. Listen to and that's what you really miss podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. 911, what's your emergency? You have to send someone. What's going on? Whatever it is, that's our entire emergency force on the way somewhere. They're saying there's a body in the woods. Excuse me, I don't seem to recognize you. Um, that's because I'm not from here.

A small town stuck in the past. There's only one cell tower and currently it's out of order. With secrets hidden for centuries. We hear things, you know. When they whisper, or when they think they're alone. And a curious stranger who may be their only chance for survival. I'm talking about the murder and disappearance in small town New Hampshire. What do you think?

I'm sorry, have you ever listened to a single true crime podcast? You turn up in Donville just as the town sees its first real crime in decades? This is consumed an all-new supernatural audio thriller inspired by the novel by Aaron Mankey I did not wake up this morning preparing to deal with forces beyond my understanding. Please, I call that breakfast. Listen to consumed on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. So I had mentioned my former principal who hired me back at my school, she moved on and she's superintendent in another county, north of us in another school district. And she's a wonderful person.

I'm going to have dinner with her and a few friends here in a few weeks. And she's been a big supporter of me in all my endeavors, which is nice. So one day I get a call from a guy who knows another guy that knows me. I know a guy. Yeah, I know a guy. And he is a chief at a fire company in this county. And he said, we're really struggling with getting juniors.

I've been hearing about what you're doing down in Delco, in Delaware County. And we're wondering if you could come up and talk to us. And I said, well, what's your school district? And he tells me. And I said, well, you're not going to believe this. I said, but your superintendent is a friend of mine. She's my old boss. I said, don't worry, this is going to happen. And so I went up to meet with them. So we organized a meeting. So it was the school superintendent, my old principal, and then chiefs from these three different fire companies

that all run together. And I brought my daughter with me, who was a high schooler who was really reluctant to join the fire department and eventually get sucked in during the pandemic because there was nothing else to do. And now she wants to be a therapist for first responders, which is extraordinary. Unbelievable. So cool. She's cool. So we sit down at the table, do the introductions, and the superintendent says, so what can I do for you? And I thought the chiefs were about to fall out of their chairs, because here's a school district saying like, no, you don't have to do anything. What can I do for you? Like, what do you need me to do to get you juniors into the firehouse? And they hit the ground running.

They're often running. They did kind of like a meet the firefighter program at the school, hands on, brought a lot of equipment and then started recruiting. And now they're building their junior program. So I've done that locally or regionally, I should say. Lancaster County, they just got theirs totally up and going. I actually brought my juniors out. They were running a summer camp for little kids a few summers ago and I brought my juniors with me to help run their day camp with them for a couple of days. And they were really impressed with my juniors at the time. So now they're off

and going and a couple of our sister companies that I'll see on calls. It's actually helped me in some of my professional relationships with folks who will kind of stare me down. But then they see what I'm trying to do for them too. And I kind of celebrate their junior's achievements. I share that on my social media. Look what this department's doing. And now those relationships have gotten a little bit stronger. So you are now, I think you're the deputy chief, right?

Yeah, process of elimination. You keep downplaying yourself. It's really bad. How many people get nominated? One. But your deputy chief and you're involved now in helping or teaching to train to train. How many of these fire departments? Well, so I've done some webinars for the state of Pennsylvania and I'm on a group, like a

kind of a focus group for the state fire commissioner's office. And I've had calls, a lot of freebies. I've done a lot of free work. But locally, there are, let's say, one, two, three, about 10 or 12 nearby that I've had direct hands on that I actually have something in my pocket from, not that it ever balances out. But I didn't do it for the money. I just felt that it was the right thing to do to share this stuff. And it was a couple friends of mine who were saying, if you're not going to make money off of this, somebody's going to steal your ideas and they're going to take it and they're going to run with it and they're

going to make money. So I'm not a salesperson. I just think this is the right way to do it, to find a population that we'd otherwise ignore. Why don't we recruit the top kids? Why don't we recruit kids that are taking all these classes that are three varsity sport athletes? Why aren't we going for top-notch kids? Why are people waiting for people to walk in their door and we get what we get? But the neat thing is, our juniors are still

across the spectrum. We've got kids who struggle in school that were on them. I look at their grades, the ones that are in my school. I can say, hey, what's happening here? I'll have a math teacher say, hey, so and so is not doing so hot right now. You want to talk to them? And I remind them that school's their job and things like that. But I like that, that we have a diversity of learners because that reflects the fire company too. And some of these kids are top notch. They can tie knots all day long and create rigging systems that are extraordinary, but they're not going to take AP Physics.

It's just not their thing. They're hands on people. They're not textbook people. So 10 municipalities, kids all over the place, all kinds of training. It's not bad for a 45-year-old teacher to decide she's going to hang out with her kid and join the volunteer festival. Yeah, run some costs, eat some pizza. Yeah.

And eat some pizza. Yeah. I tried to give it up twice. So, every November is, in the volunteer world, they call it silly season because that's when all the politics come out and people choose, they kind of jockey for position to be an officer. But our company is so small, there's, I don't know, maybe 12 of us who keep it moving forward, right? And so nobody else wants it. It's kind of a hot potato. So I tried to give it up, but there's nobody who is able to do it. And as our president said to me one day when I said, look, I just,

I don't have the time. There are other things I want to do now. I'm an empty nester now. I want to do other things. And he said, you're still going to do the work anyway. You might as well wear the hat. And then I said, okay, fine, but I'm not going to come to all these calls. Maybe I won't even make 20 percent. And he says, nobody will care. Just do what you can do, which is all we ask of anybody. Just give what you can give. We don't kick people out of unless we don't see them for a year. We're not kicking people out because maybe they'll come back around.

I think your story is a beautiful answer to a question an army of normal folks gets all the time, which is I'm so inspired. You know, what can I do? What difference can I make? I'm too young. I'm too old. And. You and your kids just to spell the notion one's 14, one's 45,

doing the same thing, serving their community on a volunteer basis. And the answer is, you don't have to be part of some NGO. You don't have to start some massive 501c3. You see an area need in your community and you feel it. And every day is an opportunity to do something. Alex reminded me of a guy who does a speech talking about Go Today. You're not too old. You're not too young. And I can't remember the guy's name.

Matthew Kelly? Yeah. Matthew Kelly. And I'm going to give him credit here so I don't get sued. But he says in one of his speech, do not say you're too old, do not say you're too young. Pablo Picasso, 55 years old when he painted Guernica and began a revolution in the arts. Dom Perignon was 60 years old when he produced the first glass of champagne.

Oscar Hammerstein, 64 years old when he wrote the sound of music. Winston Churchill, old when he wrote the Sound of Music, Winston Churchill, 65 when he became Britain's Prime Minister and stood up to Hitler. Nelson Mandela was 71 years old and was released from prison for more than 20 years in prison and four years later at the age of 75 he became the President of South Africa. Michael Angelo was 72 when he designed the Dome of St. Peter's in Rome. Benjamin Franklin, 79 years old, we named him Viden Vafocals. Frank Lloyd Wright was 91 when he finished his work on the Guggenheim.

Dmitri, I don't know his whole name, but this guy was 98 years old when he ran a marathon. And he was 98 years old when he ran the Athens marathon. And a guy named Uriah was 100 years old when he climbed Mount Fuji. So you're never too old and you're never too young because Anne Frank was 13 years old when she began her diary. Waldo Emerson 14 years old. We enrolled at Harvard, Paul McCartney, 15 years old when John Leonard invited to join this little band. Bill Gates was 19 when he co-founded Microsoft and Joe DiMaggio was 26 when

he hit safely for 56 consecutive games. You're never too old, you're never too young. And when people listen to an army of normal folks and they become inspired and they doubt themselves, these people that we just talked about from that speech, about from that speech in you and your son. Show us and your daughter. Show us and now your students. Absolutely. Show us you're never too young, you're never too old and when you match a passion with a discipline and a place of opportunity, you can serve and you can not only change lives but in your case save them. How rewarding is that when you don't know all shucks humility on this one when you

just sit back for a second and think of the last 10 years your life when you're 45 years old and took your kid at 13 to fill out that cadet form and then eventually volunteered to to the meaningful work you're now doing that ultimately does save lives and it fills a huge area need because as we know two thirds of our departments all volunteer without those volunteers your house is burning down and nobody's coming to get you out of the wreck car. Have you taken just a second to think, wow, look how rewarding this is? Oh, absolutely. I think, again, it's been huge for me as a

mother, raising two kids who are that aware of the needs of others. My daughter called me flying home or after flying back to school. She said, well, I had to take care of somebody on a flight. I said, well, what happened? Are you kidding me? No, she said, poor kid. She said, the flight attendant comes over the announcements and said, do we have any medical personnel on board? And it's crickets, crickets. And she's saying, well, that's not me. And they again, again, please, are there any people of any medical training on board?

We have a passenger who needs some help. And she's thinking like, oh, they are not talking about me. So the flight attendant's walking past her and my daughter who has just gone through the very basic she has yet to have a fire. I think she had a mulch fire one day. How old is she? She's 20. And she doesn't want to be a firefighter. She wanted to get certified to be a firefighter. You said EMT? To get her EMT because she wants to be able to be a therapist for people. The PTSD is extraordinary. I think we're doing a much better job

of taking care of our people in that preventative medicine kind of stuff, normalizing talking. That's new for this generation. But folks have been in 40, 50 years. How many people could we save from alcoholism, from divorce, from suicide? Because they know that they had somebody who they could talk to that would listen and that would understand.

So for her to have those certs on the wall, to have her helmet up there, couple pictures of herself, whatever, that gives it some gravitas, right? It gives her some legitimacy in talking to these people. But here she is and she hasn't even tested yet for her EMT. So she just went through the class and she hasn't even tested yet for her EMT, so she just went through the class and she says to the flight attendant, because this woman's kind of panicking, or at least uncomfortable, she said, well, I have my EMT, but I'm just a student. She's great, come with me.

She's thinking what? And she says she's going to the back of the plane and she's saying to herself as she's going back, please don't be erectal bleed. Please don't be erectal bleed. Oh, absolutely not. And gets back there and it was somebody who had a seizure. So she knew what to do.

She knew how to handle it. I've had a couple seizures in my life. So she was comfortable with that. So that was in her scope of practice for sure, to be able to take care of this person, to say to somebody else, nope, we're not giving her anything to drink right now, and basically be there and help this person from continuing to injure themselves and convulsions until as they were taxiing, coming back and having that person taken away by more trained medical folks. But that's still...

Super cool. Was so proud of her. How cool is that? Yeah, it's cool. Yeah. It's a long way from the south of France. Absolutely. It's an amazing story.

I gotta believe I'm hoping people listening to us, there's gonna be some people say, Hey, I wanna be a volunteer at Fry. That sounds cool. That's something I can do and I'm not too old. I'm not too young. It's something I can do if a divorced 45 year old mother or two who's a social studies a psychology teacher can do it and do all that you've done. I can do it. If somebody wants to hear more and reach out to you and get a little mentoring on it. How do they reach you? Oh, absolutely. Well, I have, for my consulting, I have this Ellen at schoolhouse-to-firehouse.com.

And certainly that's how I communicate with folks who are just starting the journey of these partnerships with school districts. But I could certainly take some emails from folks that way. And if we have teachers that say or school administrators say, hey, that's something we need. They reach out to Ellen, do it again. Ellen at schoolhousetofirehouse.com. You're going to leave here and go hang out on a Memphis fire truck somewhere. Give us a shout. What house? Station 2. First Battalion. Is that downtown? That's downtown. Are you going to the one right across from the hotel? Correct. So she's saying we booked her in a Rye hotel and she's literally going

across the street. It's awesome. I hope nobody gets hurt and I hope there's no, nobody loses anything, but I hope you at least get to go out on the truck with them. Oh, absolutely. I'll be doing that. I mean, it's, I'll be traveling with the chief. The behind chief. It's Memphis. Something's going to happen.

Something's going to happen. Yeah. Trust me, there's always something going on around here. And it's just different. Be careful and have fun. And Ellen, thanks so much for flying down and joining us. Tell us your story. It is really a cool story and hopefully a reminder and an inspiration to the people that we hope join the proverbial army of normal folks that you're never too old, you're

never too young and there's always something we can do to serve. Yes, ma'am. So, for somebody to want to join a volunteer fire company or fire department, when we say you're never too old for it, we have people, the vast majority of the people are in support roles, just like moving an army along. You have so many more people that provide the support that do for, at least for, volunteer fire departments, the fundraising, the advertising, the recruiting, all of that kind of stuff,

building maintenance, truck maintenance. There really is a job for everybody. So there are going to be plenty of people, including somebody like me who said, well, I'll take some pictures on calls, who will come in and say, well, here's my limit. And then they find that there are other ways that they can get involved. So they might put their foot in the door and say, how about if I just come and cook for you guys one night a month? And we've had folks do that. That's a foot in the door. And once we get them in the station, then it's limitless the kinds of things that they can do. And people find that it's a really nice place to be. The kitchen table is the heart of any fire department, of any fire station. I hope to be

sitting around a kitchen table tonight because that's where you really get to know people and know why they do what they do and what they need and maybe how you can fill in the blanks for them because invariably in any given fire department volunteer, there's going to be some blanks that need to be filled. And even if you're serving the ones who are providing the service, it's still serving. It's still filling an area need. Absolutely. It's still being a part of an army of normal folks, seeing a place of need and filling it. And what you're saying is you don't have to be on the end of a hose. There's a plethora of other opportunities inside a volunteer fire department serve.

Your community. Absolutely. And you want to make sure there's somebody that answers that call. So it's an opportunity for everybody. Ellen, awesome story. Thank you so much for sharing it with us. Thanks so much for the inspiration. Thanks so much for reminding us of the fact that you're never too old, you're never too young, and there's never not, there's never a meaningless job in the entire network of all of it. And and what you've done to help kids to find

an outlet and another thing to do. The whole story is just phenomenal. And again, be careful tonight. Thank you. Thanks for joining us. And thank you for joining us this week and to our friends at the National Volunteer Fire Council for recommending Ellen's story.

If Ellen or another guest has inspired you in general or better yet, inspired you in general or better yet inspired you to take action by bringing schoolhouse to firehouse to your community by becoming a firefighter or something else entirely please let me know. I really do want to hear about it. You can write me anytime at bill at normal folks dot us and I will respond. And if you enjoyed this episode, please share it with friends and on social. Subscribe to the podcast, rate and review it. Become a premium member at normal folks dot us. Do all these things that will help us grow an

army of normal folks. The more people, the more impact. I'm Bill Courtney. I'll see you next week. Music One of the best shows of the year according to Apple, Amazon and Time is back for another round. We had a big bear of a man who was called Mal Evans, who was on roadie and he was coming back on the plane and he said, will you pass the salt and pepper? And I miss her then.

I said what? Sergeant Pepper. Listen to season two of McCartney, A Life in Lyrics on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. A small town with secrets hidden for centuries. You turn up in Danville just as the town sees its first real crime in decades. And a curious stranger who may be their only chance for survival. I'm talking about the murder and disappearance

in small town New Hampshire. What do you think? This is Consumed, an all new supernatural audio thriller inspired by the novel by Aaron Mankey. I did not wake up this morning preparing to deal with forces beyond my understanding. Please, I call that breakfast. Listen to Consumed on the iHeart radio app,

Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, it's Jenna Ashquitz. And Kevin MacKale. Hosts of, and that's what you really miss, podcasts. We're reliving the magic of McKinley High by watching all six seasons of Glee. We have exclusive interviews with some of your favorite Glee cast members

like Chris Colfer and Raleigh, Darren Chris, Heather Morris, Alex Newell, and so many more. Meet us in the choir room while we reveal our greatest memories and untold stories. Listen to and that's what you really miss podcast on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.