An Army of Normal Folks - Opponent or Enemy?

Episode Date: October 25, 2024

For our “Shop Talk” series, Coach Bill on the difference between opponents and enemies. Support the show: https://www.normalfolks.us/premiumSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey everybody, it's Bill Courtney with Shop Talk Number 27. Today we're going to talk about something that really bothers me and it's called opponent or enemy. Yeah, that's what we're going to do. And we're going to talk about it a little bit historically too, right after these brief messages from our generous sponsors. I'm Malcolm Gladwell. 25 years ago, I wrote my first book called The Tipping Point, all about the moments when

an idea or trend crosses a certain threshold and spreads like wildfire. I've had a lot of time to think about that book and the way I thought about Tipping Points changed. So now I'm releasing the sequel, Revenge of the Tipping Point, where I return to the subjects of social epidemics and the dark side of contagious phenomena. You can hear a sneak peek of the audiobook on my podcast, Revisionist History. Plus we'll dive into a duo of narrative episodes about my favorite trial in American history and a reevaluation of the broken windows theory I explored in my first book.

Find Revenge of the Tipping Point wherever you get your audio books and listen to Revisionist History on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts. Do you ever wonder where your favorite foods come from? Like what's the history behind bacon wrapped hot dogs? Hi, I'm Eva Longoria.

Hi, I'm Maite Gomez-Rejon. Our podcast Hungry for History is back. Season two, season two. Are we recording? Are we good? Oh, we push record, right? And this season, we're taking in a bigger bite out of the most delicious food and its history. Saying that the most popular cocktail is the Margarita,

followed by the Mojito from Cuba, and the Piñu Colada from Puerto Rico. So all of these things we think Latin culture. There's a mention of blood sausage in Homer's Odyssey that dates back to the ninth century BC. BC? I didn't realize how old the hot dog was. Listen to Hungry for History

as part of the My Kultura podcast network, available on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Buzz Knight, the host of the Take and a Walk podcast, the podcast where I talk with musicians and get the inside scoop on their latest projects. Join me for an upcoming episode with the great progressive rock songwriter and musician, John Anderson, talking about his new music. This friend of mine, John Imex, sent me a video of these guys, the Bang Geeks, playing Heart of the Sunrise.

And it kind of freaked me out how good they were. So I got in touch with Richie and I said, let's go on tour. And he said, is that John Amickson for sure? I said, yes, it is. And we went on tour for 12 gigs and they actually worked on so many great yes, pieces of music we we did the tour and at the end of the tour so let's make an album check out the take a walk podcast starting on September the 17th with John

Anderson formally of yes on the I heart radio app Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. or wherever you get your podcasts. Muhammad Ali, George Foreman, James Brown, BB King, Miriam Makeba. I shook up the world. James Brown said, say it loud. And the kid said, I'm black and I'm proud. Black boxing stars and black music royalty

together in the heart of Zaire, Africa. Three days of music and then the boxing event. What was going on in the world at the time made this fight as important that anything else is going on on the planet. My grandfather laid on the ropes and let George Foreman basically just punch himself out. Welcome to Rumble,

the story of a world in transformation. The 60s and prior to that, you couldn't call a person black. And how we arrived at this peak moment. I don't have to be what you want me to be. We all came from the continent of Africa. Listen to Rumble, Ali, Foreman, and the Soul of 74 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. wherever you get your podcasts. Katie Couric Hey everyone, it's Katie Couric. Well, the election is in the homestretch and I'm exhausted. But turns out the end is near, right in time for a new season of my podcast, Next Question. This podcast is for people like me who need a little perspective and insight. I'm bringing in some FOKs, friends of Katie's, to help me out like Ezra Klein, Van Jones, Jen Psaki, Estelle Herndon. But we're also going to have some fun, even though these days fun and politics seems like an oxymoron. But we'll do that thanks to some of my friends like Samantha B, Roy Wood Jr., and

Charlamagne the God. We're going to take some viewer questions as well. I mean, isn't that what democracy is all about? Power to the podcast for the people. So whether you're obsessed with the news or just trying to figure out what's going on, this season of Next Question is for you. Check out our new season of Next Question with me, Katie Couric, on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, everybody. It's Bill Courtney with Shop Talk number 27,

opponent or enemy. So when a football game is over, regardless of how difficult the game has been, how close it was, after the game you will always see members of opposing teams who just got through spending three hours beating on each other shake hands. Except the time they brought you guys to the bus with the cops. Well yeah but that was different so yeah but that was because the other team were crazy led by crazy people but 99 percent of the time

that's what you see and the the reason is, is that you can go full contact against an opponent, but it doesn't mean they're your enemy. They're not your sworn enemy. I'm reminded one time when after President Obama was elected, that Mitch McConnell said his number one goal his number one goal was to make sure Obama was a one-term president and I get that politics is a full-contact sport, but I remember thinking to myself Your number one goal Shouldn't your number one goal be to pass laws and legislation that serves our

country? I get that as one of the leaders of the Republican Party, you've got a big goal to make sure that there's more Republicans in Congress and a Republican in the White House rather than Democrats. That's just the way it works. But your number one goal? Does that not transfer from being a competitor to, you know, like a dire enemy? And what stage does that set? It really bothered me when I heard that. And I think we can all now It really bothered me when I heard that. And I think we can all now look at the vitriol that goes on between Democrats and Republicans and wonder what happened to our civility? And is that not a fundamental breakdown of our civics. I'm also reminded that Republicans, people on the right of the aisle, Will Harrold, Ronald Reagan is probably one of the best presidents that ever served, along with Lincoln and others,

of course, but that he was one of the best. And largely, I think that comes from on the hills of a Carter administration that certainly had issues in the Middle East, had issues with the Soviet Union at the time, and had issues domestically with oil embargoes and 19% interest rates. We were kind of in bad shape. And Reagan is largely given credit for whether you agree with trickle-down economics or not, instituting trickle-down economics at the time, which did get us out of a pretty deep economic hole. Within a month in office, the Iran hostage affair that went on for over a year and a half under the Carter

administration was ended. The hostages came home and maybe one of his biggest accomplishments and certainly his largest foreign affairs accomplishments was the destruction of the Soviet Union and the wall separating East and West Germany coming down and Germany once again becoming a united nation. I guess there's all kinds of things Reagan did that his detractors could argue against but I think the things I've outlined Reagan did accomplish and he's heralded for that. But what I think people oftentimes miss is that while all this was going on, there was this guy named Tip O'Neill who was a Democrat and he was a Massachusetts Democrat, meaning

that's a Democrat when you're a Massachusetts Democrat and he was running Congress. And these guys fought it out on policy a lot. But you know what else they did? They built a friendship. After they'd hammered out from eight to five all day long politically, they would go to dinner with their wives. They would have rational civil conversations. People also don't necessarily remember that Ronald Reagan, a Republican president, actually

raised taxes during his eight years, acknowledging to Tip O'Neill that there needed to be a little more revenue. And yes, he did cut fat. And yes, he did do a lot of things that fiscal conservatives really wanted to have happen. But he also raised taxes. He found common ground with Tip O'Neill and Tip O'Neill found common ground with him. But since that relationship, it just feels like there's been a year after year after year degradation of the political process.

And we have gone from seeing one another from different political viewpoints, seeing one another as opponents to enemies. I'll never forget when Hillary Clinton called half of the country deplorables because they simply didn't agree with her. They're deplorable It's not much worse word to say about somebody else that you're deplorable so, you know from

So it's both sides. You got Hillary on one side. You've got Mitch on the other side and all of this nastiness going on and Is it right that we look at each other as enemies? And my argument would be that it's not. Opponent, sure, just like football players do. When they meet on a football field on a Friday night or a Saturday night or a Sunday,

they literally beat on each other as hard as they can to win. But when it's over, they can respect each other and shake hands. And we got to have that. So I want to read something to you that was in printed on September 25th of 2024. It's an Axios article, and I just want to read the top of it. House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries has promised Speaker Mike Johnson, now we got the leaders of the Democrats versus the leaders of the Republicans in the House of Representatives,

that their relationship will be governed by two rules, no lies and no smack talk. It's an old school pledge that has helped the new leaders build trust in a Congress in which it's in very short supply, especially among Johnson's own leadership team. It's also the kind of code that demands reciprocity. If the tables are turned in the new Congress, and as Jeffries is attempting to lead with the narrow majority, Jeffries has spoken glowingly about his working relationship with Johnson at fundraisers around Washington. Multiple sources who attended the events have told Axios this. That rapport is better than the one Jeffries had with former speaker Kevin McCarthy, the sources said, helping along by partisan

deals when Congress has needed them most. That is so refreshing. So I was actually in DC about three weeks ago, and I can't tell you who, it just wouldn't be appropriate. But I had a meeting with a senior official in the Johnson staff and asked him about that article and I said, is that true? And he said, absolutely. He said, Speaker Johnson really appreciates Hakeem Jeffries. Certainly they disagree on a lot of policy, frankly, probably most policy. But they don't talk crap about each other in the public. They don't try to denigrate each other on

a personal level. They keep all of the arguments on a policy level. And they do not lie to one another. And they show each other civility and respect. They fight it out on policy, but they keep it on a level playing field personally, because they're both Americans. They're not enemies. They can be opponents, searching for the best solutions to serve us all,

but they're not gonna destroy each other personally, because ultimately that's not in the best service of our country. That is heartening, because I don't think we've seen much of that in many, many years. So opponent or enemy? I don't know. Are you an opponent of a policy or an enemy of the person speaking the policy? I think we need to think about it.

I think we need to find our civility to reclaim our civics. I think for once in a long time, we see through Hakeem Jeffries and Mike Johnson, what true servant leadership is supposed to look like. Certainly I have my ideas and you have your ideas and we can hammer it out over the ideas, but at the end of the day, I'm your opponent, I'm not your enemy. I think it's a great example of how things are supposed to work. And for those of us who have been so frustrated with what's gone on in the political process and the narratives that constantly come out of either side of the media that

pittaced against one another. I think there's some glimmer of hope when I read this Axis article that we can reclaim what has made us so strong in the past, which is we're going to fight it out on policy to find the best answers. But at the end of the day, we're all Americans and you're my opponent, but you're not my enemy. So good for them and good for us because if we're actually going to be a true army of normal folks, we're going to have to march side by side, shoulder to shoulder with some people who may not necessarily think or vote or worship just like you, but that does not

make them your enemy. You can still join arm in arm with that army of people to change this country. And it starts with people who approach that, like Speaker Johnson and Keem Jeffries. And to them, I say, good for you. You can be an opponent without not being an enemy, and neither of them make you deplorable. So that's Shop Talk number 27.

But first, I wanna say two things. One, I really appreciate the letters we're getting on Shop Talk. And Alex and I talk about all kinds of different things to talk about on Shop Talk. But there's nothing better than getting a note from you guys to say, hey, you got an idea for Shop Talk? And if you'll do that, I'll answer your email.

And if I think I've got anything to add, we'll have a Shop Talk. And if it's appropriate, we I'll answer your email. And if I think I've got anything to add, we'll have a shop talk. And if it's appropriate, we'll give you a shout out. And if it's kind of one of those things need to be under the radar, well, you'll know who you are when we talk about it. One last thing. Guys, we are hosting our second live interview.

The first one was with the Dancing UPS man that went awesome, it was fun. We're doing our second one interview. The first one was with the Dancing UPS man that went awesome, it was fun. We're doing our second one in Memphis on November 7th at Second Presbyterian Church. They've got a nice hall for us to meet in and frankly it was free and they offered to host it so that's where we are. We can't even afford a bell

so you can imagine what it's like to get a meeting space. So Memphis on November 7th we are hosting Todd Comer-Nickey. Todd is the director of one of the best Christmas movies ever made, Elf. More seriously he was the writer of Sully, the movie about the plane that landed in the Hudson to save everybody after it had a bird strike. And now most recently, he's a director of some serious stuff. It's Angel Studios' upcoming film Bonhoeffer, Pastor, Spy, Assassin.

Dietrich Bonhoeffer, who the movie's about, was a German pastor who tried to rally the church in Germany to stop Hitler. He was involved in Operation 7, which was an operation to smuggle Jews into neutral Switzerland to save their life. And ultimately, he joined the famous Valkyrie plot, which is the plot that was to assassinate Hitler. He was caught, that plot was unsuccessful, and Dietrich Bonhoeffer was executed for his involvement in that plot in a concentration camp alongside Jews that he fought to save. He is one of the most epic examples

of an ordinary person who lived an extraordinary life of service all the way to the point of death. And so we're gonna get to explore this story and have the guy who directed this movie, Bonhoeffer, pastor, spy and assassin, that's coming out soon. And you can join us. You can join us live and you can be part of the podcast because we're gonna open up the audience to questions.

So you can get inspired, meet an incredible director and have a cool evening. November 7th in Memphis, Second Presbyterian Church. You can RSVP for free tickets at bonhofferdirector.eventbrite.com. That's B-O-N-H-O-E-F-F-E-R, director.eventbrite.com. So there you go.

Send me ideas for shop talk. Come to the Bonhoeffer thing. Rate, review us. Do all the stuff we constantly ask you to do. Thanks to our producer, Ironlight Labs. I'm Bill Courtney. We'll see you next week. What does the heartbreaking fate of the cheetah tell us about the way we raise our children? Why was Los Angeles the bank robbery capital of the world?

What exactly happened in the Marriott Hotel in downtown Boston in March of 2020? I'm Malcolm Gladwell. In my new audiobook, Revenge of the Tipping Point, I'm looking at these questions and exploring the dark side of contagious phenomenon. You can hear a sneak peek of the audiobook on my podcast, Revisionist History. Listen on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Do you ever wonder where your favorite foods come from? And like what's the history behind bacon wrapped hot dogs? Hi, I'm Eva Longoria.

Hi, I'm Maite Gomez-Rejon. Our podcast, Hungry for History, is back. And this season we're taking a bigger bite out of the most delicious food and its history. Seeing that the most popular cocktail is the Margarita, followed by the Mojito from Cuba, and the Piñuco Lada from Puerto Rico. Listen to Hungry for History on the iHeart radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Muhammad Ali, George Foreman, 1974. George Foreman was champion of the world. Ali was smart and he was handsome. Story behind the Rumble in the Jungle is like a Hollywood movie. But that is only half the story. There's also James Brown, Bill Withers,

B.B. King, Miriam Makeba. All the biggest black artists on the planet. Together in Africa. It was a big deal. Listen to Rumble, Ali, Foreman, and the Soul of 74 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, y'all.

Nimmini here. I'm the host of a brand new history podcast for kids and families called Historical Records. Executive produced by Questlove, the Story Pirates, and John Glickman, Historical Records brings history to life through hip hop. Get the kids in your life excited about history by tuning in to Historical Records.

Listen to Historical Records on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey everyone, it's Katie Couric. Well, the election is in the homestretch, right in time for a new season of my podcast, Next Question. I'm bringing in some FOKs, friends of Katie's, to help me out like Ezra Klein, Jen Psaki, Estet Herndon. But we're also going to have some fun thanks to some of my friends like Samantha Bee and

Charlamagne the God. We're going to have some fun thanks to some of my friends like Samantha Bee and Charlemagne the God. We're going to take some viewer questions as well. I mean, isn't that what democracy is all about? Check out our new season of Next Question with me, Katie Couric, on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.