An Army of Normal Folks - Welles Crowther: The 24-Year-Old Who Saved 12 Lives (Pt 1)

Episode Date: April 22, 2025

On September 11th, Welles saved 12 of the only 18 survivors who were at or above the floors where the plane struck the World Traded Center’s South Tower. He’s known as “The Man In The Red Bandana”, because that’s what he wore that day and had with him every day since he was a young boy. His mother Alison pays tribute to her late son.Support the show: https://www.normalfolks.us/premiumSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

There was a woman at his office. Wells always carried his red bandana, put it on his office desk. And she said to him one day, Wells, what is it with that red bandana? Why are you carrying that red bandana all the time? And Wells just smiled her and picked it up and held it up and he said, with this red bandana, I'm going to change the world. Unbelievable. And he did. And he did. And he is doing it.

And I say to young people, I say, don't let anybody take your power away from you. Don't do that. Welcome to an Army of Normal Folks. I'm Bill Courtney. I'm a normal guy. I'm a husband. I'm a father, I'm an entrepreneur, and I've been a football coach in inner city Memphis. And the last part, it somehow led to an Oscar

for the film about our team. That movie's called Undefeated. I believe our country's problems just are never gonna be solved by a bunch of fancy people in nice suits using big words that nobody ever uses on CNN and Fox, but rather by an army of normal folks. Guys, that's us. Just you and me deciding, hey, I can help. And that's exactly what the late Wells Crowther did. On September 11th, 2001, this 24-year-old saved 12 of the only 18 survivors

who were at or above the floors where the plane struck the World Trade Center South Tower. And he could have escaped too, but he was helping even more escape on the ground floor when the tower collapsed on him. Wells is known as the man in the red bandana because that's what he wore that day and had with him every day since he was a young boy when his father gave him a red bandana. I cannot wait for you to meet his mom, Allison, who pays tribute to him right after these

brief messages from our generous sponsors. Hey everybody, something really cool about the Wells Crowther interview is we did it in front of a live audience which we're starting to do more and more of. But this particular episode was done at the Stand Together headquarters in Alexandria, right? Arlington, but it's okay. Arlington, well right, basically DC area. All the DC.

Right, the Stand Together headquarters. They've got this really awesome studio and Wells Mother Allison joined us there in front of an audience and it's a well-produced video as well. So in addition to all the other stuff we hope you'll check that out as well and but together if we stand together as an Army of Normal folks we can do some pretty amazing stuff. together if we stand together as an army of normal folks. Just pretty amazing stuff. Hey, Ala, did you like that? Yes. Perfect. All right, I think we got the stamp of approval from Ala, so we're good. We're good. Today, Allison Crowther, I pronounced that correctly?

Yes, you did. Okay. Allison is going to talk about her personal member of the Army, her son. She is from NIAC, New York, Upper NIAC, New York. And Allison, kind of tell us what Upper Nyack, New York is. I picture quintessential town squares and Norman Rockwell paintings, but maybe I'm wrong. Well, thank you so much for inviting me here today. I'm really honored to be here and be able to talk about my son. And Alex knows me from the past and so deeply touched. Upper Nyack, it's maybe not what you think, it's a

really interesting community. It's very diverse. The tiny little place that is the village of Upper Nyack, it's a mile square approximately. There's a mom and a pop shop across the street. It's still called Hartells, but not for long. It's finally being taken over after many, many, many years. And then the Village Hall and Empire Hook and Ladder Fire Company. And that's pretty much it for Upper Nyack.

We're close to the village of Nyack, which is the town that you're sort of envisioning. Lots of restaurants. It's kind of a hot spot. A lot of people think it's like a little Greenwich village. I've heard that before. Really? Yes.

Yeah. But the Nyacks are along the Hudson River. How far from New York City? Oh, I don't know, 20 miles. Oh, not far. Oh, no, not far at all. Rockland County is at the Western Nyack. The Nyacks are at the western foot of the Tappan Sea Bridge, now known as the

Mario Cuomo Bridge. Oh, boy. But there are people that want to change it back to the Tappan Sea Bridge. And I heard actual rumors at one point there was a judge that wanted to rename it the Wells Crowther Bridge. But of course, there are too many families with 9-11 significant losses that that would ever happen. But the Tappanzee Bridge is what everybody really wants. Anyhow, NIAC is a very diverse community. There are children that grow up in projects in the middle of NIAC and children that grow up

in mansions along the Hudson River. And there's everything in between, different socioeconomic levels, different religious, cultural, racial backgrounds. And the wonderful part about that is that respect for others is taught from a very early age, from kindergarten on and even earlier programs. Professionals, we have a lot of medical professionals,

law professors, attorneys, doctors, lawyers, chiefs of industry, and teachers, and a lot of musicians and artists are also in that area, which gives it a wonderful feel. It's a lot of culture. Yes, it's just a wonderful place to grow up. So you and your husband decided to make a family there, and you have how many children? Well, we have two daughters.

We had three, Wells, of course, and then two daughters. He was the oldest. And then two daughters, Honor was two years younger than Wells and very close. In fact, they were kind of competitive with one another. Honor was a really fine athlete, and actually they all went to Boston College eventually. She ended up playing on the Women's Varsity lacrosse team, and Wells was on the men's lacrosse team. And then our

younger daughter Paige was a trained in classical ballet and very fine dancer. So she trained with Bolshoi Russians and New York City Ballet, code people, dancers. So really fine American ballet theater. It's a shame your children are such low achievers. So let's pick up, your husband's name is? Jefferson. He was named after Thomas Jefferson. His father was actually a southern boy, grew up in Lutherville, Maryland, and then down in-

Maryland is a southern boy? Well, OK, sorry. Oh my gosh, Allison. I beg your pardon. What did I say? You're talking to a guy who went to the University of Mississippi. Oh boy. Well, is North Carolina better?

He was down there too for many years. Yeah, North Carolina's fringy. It's all Southerners. It's North Carolina. Yeah, got it. Yeah, South Carolina's get down home. But his father, Bosley Crowther, was film critic for the New York Times for many, many years, for 40 years, legendary actually, and was credited with bringing modern film, foreign films to this country.

So yeah, so he really was also embraced history and that's why he named his third, Jefferson. I watched a small documentary that ESPN did on Wells and your family. And it didn't go into why. And I'm curious. At a very young age, Wells ran around with a red handkerchief in his back pocket, riding his bike, just had a red handkerchief. It was a thing. And apparently, Jefferson, your husband, gave him a red. I think that's important and germane to what we're going to get into, obviously.

But what's the genesis of the red handkerchief? Well, thank you for asking. It's actually pretty simple. My husband always used to carry bandanas in his back pocket for messy jobs and that sort of thing. And we were getting dressed for church one morning, and Wells was wearing a little suit, and my husband was a banker, so he always had a white handkerchief in his breast pocket and carried bandanas in his back pocket for the

messy jobs. So Wells, little Wells who adored his father, said, Daddy, can I have a bandana? Oh no, can I have a handkerchief like you have in your pocket? So my husband went to get it. He said, yes, Wells, he goes to get one and pulls it out and he said he just thought he'd get him a bandana also so he happened to grab a red one and He put the folded up and put the white one in Wells's chest pocket his breast pocket and said now Wells

This is for show. Don't touch it. Just leave it right there. It's folded nicely leave it. Here's a bandana That's for blow for messy jobs to blow your nose to whatever And keep that in your back pocket. And that's basically how it started. My husband kept the blue ones, Wells typically had red ones, and that's how we told them apart in the laundry. So very simple.

So very simple. And from a young age, it's like neighbors knew that that kid was always gonna have a red bandana. His friends did. He always wore one under his helmet. It just became a, I don't know, maybe a talisman or some such thing. Yeah.

It was his connection to his father. That's very cool. Yeah. It helped him. I think he felt like he was getting to be a big man now because he had that white handkerchief and then the bandana in the back. So was your husband, your husband was a banker? Yes.

And your husband was on the volunteer fire force. Yes, he was. And Wells, worshiping his father, the old bandana thing, he grew an affinity for the volunteer fire department in NIAC as a result of his father's involvement. Am I getting that part right? Absolutely, yes. My husband used to take, when Wells was little, seven, eight, nine years old, he was small for his age, and he didn't really grow to his full size until college. So he would, my husband would bring Wells down to the fire house and they'd

have to clean up on the truck and Wells would go into the little places to clean up where the other big men couldn't go. It was just a thing and a lot of the firefighters who had sons would bring them in and they consequently became full members like Wells did. Our daughter, Honor, was the first female member of Empire Hook and Ladder because there wasn't anything that Wells was gonna do that she couldn't do better. Right? So did, so Wells actually became a real live Hook and Ladder fire member.

Yes, he did, yeah. Like at what age? Well, he joined as a junior member at the age of 16 and trained and went to the, you know, the fire training center and did all the training to join the company. And then when he turned 18, he was a full-fledged member. As a mom, were you ever worried your husband, your daughter, your son were, I mean, were you ever worried they were going to get in trouble? No, no, because they, I mean, injury, I guess, is always possible.

But they're very savvy about how and well-trained. And so it was not anything that really occurred to me. But really not. It was more, well, for example, Christmas morning. Had the tree all set up, the breakfast, the brunch made, the presents under the tree ready to go, and the fire alarm went off. Out they go. And it was like, really?

And it was a real big fire that had happened down. So yeah, things like that. But in a town like NAC, if you don't have people like your daughter, your husband in Wells, there's nobody coming to answer the call. That's right. And it's all Rockland County is all volunteer. We actually interviewed about a year ago. I can't remember how long, but she's like a big wig in the volunteer fire world.

She's a captain and she's from the Northeast, but I didn't realize that like 75% of all firehouses in the United States are staffed by volunteers. In urban areas, you're just used to having a firehouse, but all over small town and suburban America are people like Wells and your husband. Yeah. It's a real family. They, you know, they are facing life-threatening situations. And they rely on one another and they trust one another.

And it's really amazing how they come together for other reasons too, not just to fight a fire. And now a few messages from our generous sponsors. But first, I hope you'll consider signing up to join the Army at normalfolks.us. By signing up, you'll receive a weekly email with short episode summaries in case you happen to miss an episode or if you prefer reading about our incredible guest. We'll be right back. It's almost profound that as you hear the story of the benchmark points of Wells' life, there's something as simple as a red bandana, but that was a

benchmark because of his father and then being a junior firefighter and joining and then also being a guy who was always protective of his sisters and all of these things, how these benchmarks culminated in a defining moment for Wells. It's as if his whole life was a training ground. Yeah, I would agree with that. I mean, there are stories, his friends have stories, and we learned a lot of the stories after he was lost. For example, high school, and his friends would always

say, if Wiles was with us, we knew he'd have our backs. High school, there's a fight that broke out in the parking lot, and between a friend of of Wells's and another young man who was basically a troubled bad kid who ended up ultimately going to jail and being killed or something. He was really a troubled person. And there was a knife involved and it was over a girl. And so all these other students were gathered around in the parking lot

watching. And Wells walked up, walked into were gathered around in the parking lot watching. And Wells walked up, walked into that scene, walked up to those two boys and said to his friend, come away with me now. What you decide to do now is going to determine the rest of your life. So, turn around and walk away. Ignore this guy. What maturity? How old was he? He was, well, senior in high school, I think. So, 18. Most kids are jumping around, right?, screaming, fight, fight, fight. And your kid walks in and says, not just, hey, he's got a knife, walk away, but he says,

what you do today will impact the rest of your life. That is serious maturity for an 18-year-old kid. Yeah, I know. And these are stories that, I mean, we knew and loved Wells and knew he was a good guy, but these are stories that surfaced after he was gone. We really, you know, never knew. So, he graduates Boston College and he lands what everybody wants us as a finance job in Manhattan, yeah?

That's it, yeah. Tell me about that and where and how it all worked. Well, he actually was given an internship between his sophomore and junior year in college. A friend of ours, her daughter also worked at San Leroneo and was 14 years older than Wells. So, she was already established at the company and sadly she was lost on 9-11, which was horrible. But she ended up, Wells got the internship through her influence. And then when he graduated, that's where he went to work at San Orneal.

You know, I've got four kids. They are now 28, 27, 26, and 25. Wow. Oh, boy. Meaning they were one, two, three, and four. Yeah, I can tell. As a mom, you can, yeah. Yeah, I know. How did a mom, you could, yeah.

Yeah, I know. How did she do that? Oh man. Two of them happen to live here. I'll be having dinner with them after we visit tonight. Nice. And I am so proud of each and every one of them and love them. And I have to believe that this kid that broke up fights, that was a captain on the lacrosse

or the hockey team, played lacrosse, went to play Division I lacrosse, volunteered his time, grew up in this diverse community with respect but care for everybody and now lands a job in Manhattan, in the financial world. You got to be as a parent on Cloud9. You did it. You raised a good one. Yeah. I raised three good ones.

We raised three good ones. And I'll never forget, you know, I always sort of resisted feeling too good about things for some reason. I don't know if it was, you know, just don't curse the good things, you know, just, but I'll never forget the summer of 2001, and I just woke up one morning just so overjoyed that Wells had this great job. My daughter, Honor, had been given, was accepted at St. John's Law School with a $20,000 a year presidential scholarship and Paige was rocking the ballet world potentially. And I just let it all go and I was just so happy.

Why wouldn't you be? Right, I know. But then look what happened, 9-11, pow. It was like, it just... I just don't think, but I don't think the world, God, the universe, any of it penalizes you for happy. For being happy? I do not. I hope not. I hope not. I do not. I think it's quite the opposite. I think the world is broken, and any of those good things that come your way are just a blessing.

Yeah. Oh, I know. They are many blessings. I don't really think it's lucky you're cursed. I think it's we're broken. You're fortunate for the few good things you do get. Yeah. I think it's the reverse of it. OK. Well, thank you for that. Well, I mean, what do I know?

I'm just a fat guy from the South. Stop. Not ever going to ice skate or be a ballerina, trust me. So, things are great. Yeah. And Wells has, I mean, when you're in the financial world in Manhattan, in the center of the financial universe, you have a potential to become a very wealthy person.

And this cat calls y'all up and says, you know, I'm pretty sure this isn't what I wanna do for the rest of my life. Do you remember that conversation? I'd never heard it directly because he wouldn't share it with me. He called dad. Yes, he did.

Dad must've been the soft touch. That's it. Well, you know, yeah. And so, and I remember actually, I, yes, he talked to my husband about that. And my husband's response was, Wells, you know, you have, you take a big cut in salary if you do that, and big cut in earnings if you did that. To do what?

To become a New York City firefighter, because that's what Wells was saying. I think I want to leave my job and join the FDNY. Who does that? I know, my son. Nobody would do that. I'm guessing he had to have had a really nice six-figure-ish or better income with the possibilities of making so much more. And this cat wants to go be a New York City firefighter. Yeah, but you know what he said? Money isn't everything. That's just what he believed.

That's it. Money isn't everything. He said, and I remember him saying, my husband said this, and I learned that when in the ESPN, I think it was in the ESPN documentary where they were interviewing him. He said, if I sit in front of this computer for the rest of my life, I'll go crazy. He was a very active guy. He was physically active. He enjoyed being physically active. And I just think he just felt constrained. So, and also I think he wanted to do courageous things. Did you tell him you make enough money? buy a treadmill? I'm just kidding.

Well, again, you know, he didn't share this with me in the beginning. Right. But what happened was his last weekend home, he came to his college photo, portrait arrived, and in that time, putting gel in your hair was a thing. And so that's what he did. And he took me over, his portrait was on our piano. And he said, Mom, he said, what do you think? I said, well, you look very handsome, it's fine.

He said, I think I made a mistake with the gel. I said, no, it's fine, you look wonderful. So I turned around, it was Labor Day weekend, I was taking him back to the train to go back into the city. And he stopped So I turned around, it was Labor Day weekend, I was taking him back to the train to go back into the city, and he stopped and I turned around and he said, you know, Mom, because he'd been very thoughtful, very introspective that whole weekend, and he was spending time going through his albums that he put together, going to the fireman's picnic, going to see his sister in her end of summer performances.

You say this is Labor Day? So we're talking like September 1st, 2nd. Yeah, it was that weekend. And it was his last weekend home. And he stopped and he said to me, I thought maybe he was missing his girlfriend, which wasn't the case, but he said, this ain't broken up. But he said, you know, Mom, he said, I don't know what it is. But I do know this. I know I'm meant to be part of something really, really big. So I think he had premonitions. He had been in Spain the summer

before on working on the borse to learn the stock market over there, spending time in Italy. And he went with friends to a cathedral in Toledo that's very famous apparently. I think it was Toledo. And he was in there and he said, I read this in his diary, but he also said to me, you know, Mom, I had this experience that was really powerful. And it was, I had this sudden understanding, I was like transformed and sudden understanding that my life was meant for others.

And it was, I saw that later on as kind of an epiphany somehow. And well, that was, wow, that was a big aha moment for him. So I think that also contributed to him wanting to be more in the fire department, which is how he ended up on 9-11. We'll be right back. So, ten days later is 9-11. Wells is still working as, I guess he was a trader? Yes. Okay, Wells still working as a trader, but had basically made up his mind to become a

firefighter. I think he was, my guess is he was convincing his mom it was gonna be okay, you know. Working out the script to tell me, right? Yeah, probably, yeah, sure. And let's start with and just go through it, the phone call you get from a friend. I was at work. I was vice president of sales for a company in Pleasantville, which was in Westchester County, across the Tappan Zee Bridge from where we lived in Rockland County. And I was sitting with the owner, the president, we were planning a business meeting and that

was going to happen the next week. And her husband was a stockbroker also, working in Manhattan. And her… In the World Trade Center or elsewhere? Oh, elsewhere. He was not there, fortunately. He was midtown more. So her phone rings, I'm sitting with her in her office,

her phone rings and she said, "'Allison, it's for you. It's your husband's secretary.' I said, oh, well my husband was supposed to go to a golf outing that day. So I thought, gosh, that's strange. Gee, I wonder if Jeff had trouble on the road or something happened.

So I go to pick up the phone in my office and the secretary said, Allison, Wells just called. He wanted you to know he's OK. I said, Wells, why wouldn't he be OK? She said, didn't you hear what happened? I said, what happened? She said, a plane hit the World Trade Center. Oh my god.

I said, but Wells called. He's OK. So that's in my head. And, you know, like the rest of the world, you're thinking that how did that it must have been a small plane that went out of control. That's what everybody thought. Right. Too bad for them. I mean, all of us all around the world, except the terrorists, we're thinking that probably. Anyway, so I kept working within my head and I looked at my cell phone and there was a call that

I'd missed from Wells. It was like about 917 in the morning or 919, probably it was 919 because that 19 was his lucky number. And he's saying… This is Jersey, wasn't it? Yes, yeah. He always, as he could, you know, wore it at Boston College when he was in NYC.

And it was just, it was a message. Actually, thank God from that, because if I'd actually spoken to him, I would have said, get the, you know, H-E double L hockey sticks out of there, which he would never have done. But he left a message, so we were able to capture his voice, and we have that recorded. Thank goodness.

So it was just in my head he was okay. And so I kept trying to work, and I went out to hear, you know, because we didn't have a television or radio in the – it was a shop with offices in the back. And I walked out and my coworkers were looking at me like blanched white. And they said, the second tower has been hit and the towers collapsed. And I just knew then that Wells was gone.

I just knew. So I called my husband crying. Well, you know, Wells is gone. And my husband said, don't say that. He had plenty of time to get out, which he did, turns out. He could have left. He had plenty of time to get out. And I couldn't imagine how you get down from 104 floors to ground.

But that was the start. And then we heard nothing for a long time. So during that day, between when you think it's a small plane and then you hear the second plane hits and the tower collapses and you have this frankly mother's intuition that your son is gone. Did you recall the premonition you had only a couple of days before? Not at that moment. Can you tell us what that was? Okay, I'm happy to.

September 10th. Oh, it was the day before? Yeah. September, well, it started the day before. September 10th, I was in my office and went home and I'm in my kitchen trying to work on getting dinner going. My little, my Paige, who was a senior in high school at the time, and my husband in the kitchen, and suddenly I just, like, started to kind of shake, and it's like, there's something so, and I never used the F word, but I was throwing around that night, there's something so effing wrong, I don't know what it is, but I just feel like, I felt like I was flying apart in a thousand pieces. Pete Really?

Julie Yes. Yeah. I said, I don't know what it is, but I feel like there's something really wrong. So I went down… Physically, mentally? Everything. It was all one thing. It's hard to describe, but I just was really just shaking. So I went downstairs to… For no apparent reason?

No. None. So I went downstairs to work no apparent reason no not none so I go downstairs to work on my laptop and I start to reach for the keyboard and suddenly the whole thing just fries like And I thought alright, well, I'm gonna go to bed I'm shaking I feel like the world's falling apart and now my computer crashes. I'm going to sleep. We'll start tomorrow. Right. The hell with the day. I don't blame you.

I know. What else are you going to do? Either that or drink heavily. Well, and yes. So I wanted to try to avoid that. Okay, perfect. I do like scotch. Neat. Neat. Perfect. Anyway. The only thing neat about the day was your scotch.

Oh, God. Anyway, so I go to bed. I didn't sleep all night. I belonged to a fitness club over in Westchester near where my office was. So I got up and I got dressed and I said, I'm going to go work out. That'll help. So I'm on the Tappanzee Bridge. It was, I don't know, around seven o'clock in the morning of September 11th, and I'm still like white-knuckle driving. Like I'm just like so tense. I couldn't figure out what it was. Do you think you're having like a little bit of an anxiety attack over work stuff, or it's just just you just can't explain what's going on? Well, it wasn't I knew it wasn't work because I didn't get ever, you know, about that. It was

fun and I enjoyed it. So I couldn't figure it out what it was. But anyway, so I'm driving across the bridge like this and suddenly into my head come these words. I know what this means, I'm going to die today. And the minute those words came into my head, I felt like my chest opened up and a brilliant mist and light shot out of me and now I'm this little bean-shaped thing above my hair still driving along, but I was at complete serene and utter peace, just filled with peace. And suddenly, oh, well, I'm going to die today, but it's meant to happen, it's supposed to happen.

Oh, well, I wonder how it's going to happen. I was like so objective about this message. And then I started thinking, where did that come from? It felt like it came from outside of me, but it was inside at the same time. It was just, I'd never experienced anything like that before. Do you realize people hearing that are like, oh, come on.

Yeah, I am, but it's what it is. It's what happened. So I- I want you to know, to be clear, I absolutely believe everything you're saying. Good. After interviewing people as long as I have. There are simply things that happen in our brains and our lives and our spheres that we cannot

understand. But I don't want people to think you're kooky. I want people to hear you say, I get people might not even understand this, but I don't care because this is my experience. That's right. That's basically what it is. And it's okay. A lot of people will believe me. Other people don't.

And it's just where they are. I don't care because it's what happened. So anyway, I keep driving now thinking, well, this is better. I'm going to die today, but it's better than what I've been going through. And then I thought, wait a second, I'm planning a business meeting? Why should death be better? Planning a business meeting? I'd better go see a doctor.

Okay, that was my big takeaway. And then I'm driving. I took a shortcut through reservoirs behind a town called Tarrytown. It's usually very peaceful, but that morning there were thousands of up-spiraling mists on either side of me when I drove through. And I remember thinking, and they were all the same height, thousands. And I remember looking at that and thinking, well, I don't know what this is, and I don't know how I'm going to die, but I do know this much, today is a very evil day. That was the

message to me. And I actually had another friend saying to me, who was in NIAC and lived on a home overlooking the water, she said, Did you see what the water looked like today? It was so strange looking. So, I don't know what she saw, but that's what I saw. Anyway, so I kept driving. Now, if anybody wants to question, I've had premonitions since I was 16 years old. Started with simple things, like, you know, a boyfriend breaking up with me that was a complete surprise and out of the blue.

And I ended up bursting into tears one night with no idea why. And then the next day, this fellow broke up with me, one night with no idea why. And then the next day this fellow broke up with me, just as well, turns out. Anyway. Wasted tears. Yeah, I didn't know.

It was misguided youth. Anyway. That's so, and then, you know, then it was, oh, I know my friend's gonna have her baby, you know, like really, you know, things like that that are just, could be coincidental. But as time went on, they became more organic and real. So another time, Wells and Honor were, Page wasn't born yet.

So Wells was maybe five, Honor was about three. My in-laws had a country, a summer home up on Martha's Vineyard Island. And it was in, you know, end of June, I think, where we would stay there for the month of July. And I, for like three weeks before we were going on this, taking them up, I kept having these pounding recurrent visions of driving off a bridge. Boom! Driving off a bridge. And I thought, this is really ridiculous. Like, what is going on here? So I finally, I didn't want to trouble my husband,

but I finally said, you know, Jeff, I'm beginning to think maybe I shouldn't drive the kids up to the vineyard, because I keep having these visions of driving off a bridge. And he said, well, you know, just do whatever you think is right. Okay. So I thought, all right, this is ridiculous. I'm not going to be controlled by some weird crazy thinking we're going. So I packed up, got the kids in the car. The two bridges I was worried

about was the Tappansea Bridge and the Essex River Bridge up in Connecticut, which is a big long bridge over the Essex River. So I drove over the Tappansea Bridge, it was fine. Drive along, drive along through Greenwich, through Connecticut, get over the Essex Bridge, and everything was fine. We get on the ferry, we get to the vineyard, safe as can be. And I called my husband about 7 o'clock and said, Hi, we're here. Everything's fine. I'm so sorry that I worried you. This was really ridiculous. We go to bed. The next morning my phone rings. At about 6.30 in the morning, 7, my husband calling.

He said, Did you hear what happened last night? I said, No. What? He said, did you hear what happened last night? I said, no, what? He said the Myanus River Bridge collapsed. We went over that bridge probably, I don't know, six, seven, eight hours before it collapsed. So I get these things and I have learned to embrace them as it is, I can't explain why or how I get these things, but I do. So maybe that will help. Please tell me you're not thinking about a fat redheaded guy

get hit by a bus in the next two days. I want to be okay. Well first of all you're not fat and you're very handsome and you'll be fine. And I'm not redheaded anymore. No I'm too old. Yeah used to be. I'm too old. Yeah, you used to be. And that concludes part one of my conversation with Allison Crowther. And guys, you don't want to miss part two that's now available to listen to. Isla, Alex's youngest daughter and I,

really want you to go to part two, don't you? Yeah, so tell them, go to part two. Go to part two. Ring the bell. Perfect. Ila and I will see you guys in part two.