And That's Why We Drink - E241 Time Travel Art and Cubed Wombat Poop

Episode Date: September 19, 2021

Welcome to episode 241, where we’re hiding flasks and iPhones in Nancy Reagan’s memoir! Em is also making plans to shop for purple t-shirts at Target when Christine goes into labor. In terms of stories, we’ve got some intriguing ones for you today. First Em brings us some fun time travel facts and the tale of supposed time traveler Rudolph Fentz. Then Christine covers the gruesome tale of Ivan Milat and the backpack murders. And if we ever go missing, please remember to put our faces on blimps… and that’s why we drink, with a very layered hero, Paul Onions!

oh we almost didn't record video and that would have been very very silly well we've done it before and i'm sure we'll do it again it's not the first time uh people don't seem happy when it happens so yeah try to keep us on the camera. Thank God. Okay, well, hi, Christine. How are you? Hello, Em. I'm doing splendidly.

How are you doing? I'm good. You seem a little sleepy. Are you a little sleepy? I'm kind of always a little sleepy. I changed my antidepressant dosage, so I'm kind of struggling. Interesting. What's the dealio with that and being pregnant?

Are they worried about that at all? It's very controversial. So I try to keep it on the DL. But, you know, here we are. But your doctor said it was okay. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. People have very strong opinions. But everything seems fine for now.

And baby's doing fine. Look, just because you're pregnant doesn't mean depression ended. So you still got to figure it out for yourself. I had a not so great appointment with somebody. I'm not going to mention where I was or whatever, but she told me maybe I should consider praying. Oh, well, I was about to say for God's sake. That's cool. No, thank you. So she was very, it. I was about to say, for God's sake. That's cool. No, thank you. So she was very, it was not a comfortable experience.

So anyway, that's why I'm a little sleepy. But I'm here for you. And also, I wanted to point out before I forget that I was trying to come up with what to call my headband. Oh, yeah. What did you call it? You came up with a new phrase that I wanted to remember. You said, oh, it's your trashy garbage headband. Oh, yeah. I feel really... You came up with a new phrase that I wanted to remember. You said, oh, it's your trashy head...

Trashy garbage head wrap. Or your garbage trash head wrap. So that's even worse. I was trying to remember. I knew it had something we called it like trashy or something. We didn't call it anything. I did. You did. But I don't remember what the name is we laid it on. You called it classy trashy. Classy trashy. Not garbage

trash. Oh my god, you made it Classy trashy. Not garbage trash. Oh my god you made it so much worse today. Well in the in the midst of that sentence I was trying to compliment you and say your hair looks great. It's always in the midst of a compliment. It always is you know. If you ever by the way if you ever meet me in real life and I say something that's just like so off the cuff rude. Know that I was trying to compliment you. Oh my God. Yeah, I was good at that. So anyway, I just wanted to remember that you called it garbage trash today. So that's nice. Well, I feel I have a hunch people are going to hold that.

I'm going to remember now because I'm sure I'll actually, I'll probably forget and say something even meaner in a week, you know, about your dumpster fire head or something. I just want to remember. I just want it to be recorded for posterity's sake, you know. Meanwhile, Christine complimented my hair, which was an accident. And you tried with your hair. And so now I feel bad. Well, I complimented you with no qualms about it.

It was just a straightforward compliment. I think you have less social anxiety than me today because. Today. Maybe today. Well, oops. Sorry about that. Uh, why do you drink or stain besides being garbage besides being a dumpster head? Um, well, um, I guess it is cause I'm changing my, my, I'm trying to lower my dosages of my medications and it's lower. Yes. And itages of my medications. Oh, lower? Yes, and it's a daunting experience. I thought you would be raising it because your weight. Because I'm so depressed.

Well, because your weight, since you have a baby in you, like your weight is changing, and therefore I would think your amount would change. Oh, I don't know if they do it by weight. I don't think they do dosage by weight. I don't know enough about medicine, obviously. But I mean, I've never been told that, but maybe. No, no, I'm I'm just changing things or just tweaking things.

But yeah, all good. Just a little sleepy. But otherwise, you know, clock is ticking. I think when this episode comes out, it'll be really, really, really, really close to my due date. If not, I'll be white knuckling it. I'll be waiting for a text every second. Oh my gosh. You'll be waiting for an aggressive FaceTime. Don't worry. I will say Christine. Yeah. If I don't get notified until after the baby is here, I will scream at your baby. Just so we're clear. You'll scream at my baby. Wow, what a threat. Although I will say, I feel like if I go into labor,

like if I'm not doing the scheduled C-section, I go into labor, then it's unlikely that you won't hear about it because I'll be like in a hospital for two days or whatever before it actually happens. Or I'll be like, not two days, but I'll be like. If you're missing for two days and I don't get a single notification, I'll be like, not two days, but I'll be like, it takes a while. If you're missing for two days and I don't get a single notification,

I'll be like, Eva, she's dead. Let me scream at her, baby. Eva, you've been promoted to co-host. That might happen either way. But yeah, don't worry. You'll hear about it ASAP. But anyway, why don't you drink, Amethy? I don't know.

Today's a little gloomy and I'm feeling the vibes. But I don't know. I feel like I have a lot of work I need to get done, but I am currently in a brain fog where I don't remember what that work is. I feel, so it's a fun feeling of guilt and, uh, and apprehension and nervousness. Cause I'm like, what, what am I supposed to be doing? Well, my fear is that if you have work to do, that means I also have work to do. So I like oh the fear is like I don't know where it's cut I honestly it's probably like me like I see the weather outside and it's gloomy and I just

want to like relax all day and I think my brain is telling me uh-uh before you get really excited is there anything you need to do and now I'm panicking but I can't think of anything you're getting that capitalism guilt yeah you get you get it, you get it. Well, we're working right now, so this is enough for you to, I would say, check it off your list. I did see a pretty interesting t-shirt at Target that I might treat myself to after this.

What is it? An interesting t-shirt. By interesting, it's really nothing that special, but it was purple and I'm interested, so that makes it interesting okay cool uh old navy has this um gender neutral line which i by the way shout out to old navy i should really be promoting them more often because half of my clothing is from there now stop you keep promoting companies and then we don't get paid for it okay okay okay but target if you would like Target, if you would like to be,

if you would like to work with us, they have a few shirts that are looking more and more gender neutral and I think it's intentional. So I wonder if they're going to like say that there's a line coming. Well, Target was the one that switched to kids' toys rather than boys' and girls' toys. They were like one of the first big companies to do that.

So wouldn't be surprising. I wouldn't be surprised. They're always moving and grooving. So anyway, I saw the shirt and I went, ooh, that looks pretty fun. Is it tie dye? No, it's literally just purple, but it's got like black sleeves. I don't know what to tell you. It's really not that special to anyone else.

But if you see me in a purple shirt with black sleeves, you'll know I had a good day today. If I FaceTime you and I'm in the hospital birthing a child and you don't answer, my head is immediately going to go, wow, M's at Target shopping for a purple t-shirt and can't bother to hear about my unborn child coming into the world. Yeah, that might be the case. We'll find out. Okay, so Christine, I actually have a quick story for you today, but it's a very fun story full of potential banter and whimsy so you know everyone is rolling their eyes i can't wait i know well i love a good whimsical tale so here we go this is the story of rudolph fence have you heard of rudolph no fence not like a fat like sitting on the fence fence like e-n-t. Oh, that sounds German. Yeah.

So Rudolph Fence. This is a story about a time traveler. Is he German? The jury's out. I don't know. Okay. We can make him German. Sounds pretty German.

I don't want to make any calls about people's ethnicity and background. He is a man is all I've got. pretty German. I don't want to make any calls about people's ethnicity and background. So he is a man is all I got. Okay, so fun facts about time travel really quick, because I had to throw some in there, obviously. And, and I did not bring up any Back to the Future things, because I thought that might be overdone. So these are other time travel facts. Okay, this is interesting, because I think I've probably heard all the Back to the Future ones already from you. Yeah, I probably wiped the slate clean too, just so you could be prepared to hear them again one day because I never shut up about it. Okay, so in 2015, CBS News did a poll of if you were to travel through time,

what would you bring with you? Do you know what the most common answer was? My iPhone was probably everyone's answer. No, no one brought an iPhone. What? Which is so weird because that would be the first thing I'd do. Yeah, a fully charged iPhone. Okay, what about a camera? I don't know.

God, that's so smart. No. I guess the iPhone would have the camera, but whatever. I'll give you a hint. I'll give you a hint. That doctor who told you to pray would bring this thing a bible?

41% of people said a bible excuse me? why? I don't have that answer for you I hope they mean the bible where it's cut out in the middle and there's actually like a safe there's a flask in it well I always say that because I have a bible

with a flask cut out in it. When you don't even drink and you're not, okay, whatever. You know what? It's a fun surprise for the people snooping through my bookshelf. I have one of those that's a Nancy Reagan memoir, but actually if you open it, it's like a safe. I have that. Did you get it from the DC Spy Museum? Probably.

Because that's where I got that. Did you get it from the DC Spy Museum? Um, probably. Because that's where I got mine. It's from George Vidal or something. And it's like a book on politics. That's probably where I got it. Yeah. It's like one of the most innocuous looking book covers ever. It's just like. Yeah, it's like boring and blends in and all that. White lady on the front. But now that if anybody breaks into my house, they know where my flask is. Find the book with the white lady on it um no so bible apparently 41 that is absurd what is wrong with you people

and then uh 31 said i guess this makes more sense antibiotics yeah okay that that i could get behind that tracks that tracks because like that makes some logical sense. A Bible, like... What are you going to do with that? Also, you could find a Bible literally at any point in time. Like, depending on when you're going. Obviously, if you're going back to the dinosaurs, okay, maybe not. But, like, what are you going to do with a Bible back then?

What, are you going to throw it at a dinosaur? I don't know. I mean, maybe. Or maybe bring one to Jesus and be like, look what they said about you. Like, that I get. If you were, like, very specifically had a plan for a Bible. Can you fact check this real quick? Here's a pen. Can you... Oh, by the way,, look what they said about you. Like that I get. If you were like very specifically. Can you fact check this real quick? Here's a pen.

Can you? Oh, by the way, this is what a pen looks like. They're going to be big. You'll see. Yeah. Were there actually unicorns back then? Or is this a mistranslation? Like I do have a lot of questions, you know.

21% of people. Do you want to take a stab at this or so wait so we got bible antibiotics yeah and by take a stab i mean maybe do you want to take a shot at it the gun yep 21 not surprised so oh my god this is so embarrassing so they want to bring a fucking a bible and a gun and maybe trump with them i don't know i don't understand. I'm just, like, so embarrassed right now. Okay. So. At least a gun serves a purpose, right? A gun serves a purpose, yeah, because, like, if you are going back to dinosaur era, you know. Yeah.

But then are you, like, trying to poach dinosaurs? Like, what's happening here? Well, I assume if wherever you're going, you at least have a weapon, like, to defend yourself. If people are like, what are these blue jeans you're wearing, you know, then you can defend yourself. I really hope the people who want to bring a gun, though, aren't the people going into the future. Because then it's like something as simple as a phone could scare the shit out of you. And you feel the need to protect yourself. And I don't know. I don't know.

Three percent. I don't know what. I do know what these people have planned. And I don't like it. Three percent are condoms. They would bring condoms before anything else. Oh, for God's sake. So, like, I don't know.

I'm so embarrassed right now. I feel like that comes with an intention. Like, you have a particular interest in a particular person and you think you're going to be the one to blow them away. So, like, if you get captured by the government because obviously you look suspicious in your Levi's and they're like, what are you wearing? You're in the year 1565. So then they capture you and you have a literal Bible and condoms on you. Like, what do you think is going to happen? Which is so embarrassing. Condoms and a Bible that tells you to procreate do not mix my friends. So that's the other thing. Yeah. I don't understand. Um, so 3% condoms. That does freak me out. That makes me worried about the people that you are trying to travel to see because you're definitely going to pull some sort of like I'm from the future shit to impress them and like get them in bed. So I guess at least you don't want to procreate with them, I guess.

I guess. Yeah, that's at least smart. At least they know enough about the butterfly effect. You can't. You don't want to give them a baby. Create a new generation with no side effects. Another 3% are people like me. And they said that they would bring Christopher Lloyd who played Dr. Emmett Brown from Back to the Future. Are you for real? I'm not kidding. But also they would bring a fictional character.

They would, no, they would bring the actor who played a fictional character, which is, which is even dumber because like that man cannot actually, I don't know if they need to hear this, but like he doesn't actually know about time travel. No, I'm bringing Stephen Hawking. Like what are you doing bringing an actor? If you're bringing someone, bring like Carl Sagan. Like what's wrong with you? Precisely. So yeah, a Bible, antibiotics, a gun, condoms, Christopher Lloyd. So there you have it. I think they got mixed up and thought, heard like what's in your purse right now. And they were like, oh, let me check. Because this is like bizarre. Christopher Lloyd is just like a little, you know, taking out my wallet. He's a borrower. Okay, so

this year CBS did a new poll, which wasn't as detailed, but it just said if you could time travel, where would you go past or future? What do you think the percentage of either one is so those are the two options past or future i would say 60 want to go to the past okay and 40 want to go to the future interesting 40 said the past oh okay and which uh i don't know how i feel about that. I guess. I don't either. What would you do? Um, forever ago, I would have said the past because I like to cherry pick the things I would

like to experience from the past. Right. Same. Uh, but I think the future there's a safer, more progress. I fingers crossed it's a more progressive world. So that would be fun to see like where we're heading. And also I could get a sneak peek of technology. and also i think there's a less of a chance that i'd fuck up the butterfly effect oh good point but i guess my fear about the future is like oh my god what if it's a fucking apocalypse is how i imagine the future and then i can prepare better i guess i feel like if you go into the future like no matter what you at least come back with

knowledge yeah but what if the knowledge is like i now have a mental breakdown because i know that everybody's dead and i don't know i have no idea a nuclear war i don't know i feel like the past at least i can be like i'm just gonna go to the 60s and sit on the sidelines and watch uh yeah it would if i were to go to the past nowadays i would have to go back to like a really monumental time and like help protest. But like I also I don't think I could go back the way that I used to think of it of like, oh, I just want to go to the 50s and drink a milkshake at the diner. And it's like that wouldn't work. I know I used to think that way and I hate myself for it.

But now I think I think I'd pick future. I think I'd pick future now. I don't know. And anyway, by the way, it was 40 percent passed and 53% the future, and 7% were unsure. So if you fall into that, you're not alone. I guess I'm the unsure. So I've mentioned this before when I mentioned Project Pegasus, which, by the way, shout out episodes 102 and 103. When you mentioned Project Pegasus, no one liked it a full deep dive.

When I gave a sermon about it, actually. I've said in the past, there are some pictures that are historical pictures that have not been doctored and there's something very fishy about them. I love those photos. It looks like someone from the future is there.

It makes no fucking sense. So cool. So I just wanted to give a shout out to some of those pictures. Again, some of them I talked about during the Project Pegasus episodes. One of them was the little boy who looked like he was like wearing 80s clothing at like the Gettysburg Address or something like there was the there's that really famous one of a guy who looks like he's in a crowd of people dressed in like 1940s clothing, but he's wearing like crazy like steampunk goggles

and a t-shirt, like a band t-shirt. Okay, but like, what are they thinking? Like they, nobody was like, what are you wearing, guy? I have no idea. That's a, I don't know. And they, to this day, haven't really been fully explained, which is so wild to me. There's also a painting from 1860

that actually threw people for a loop because technology has changed. So there's a painting from 1860 called The Expected One. And it looks, it literally looks like a girl from the 1860s is like staring at an iPhone. Wait, can I look at it?

Yeah, it's called The Expected One. 1860. Expected or expectant? The Expected One. The Expected One painting. called the expected one 1860 expected or expectant the expected one the expected one painting oh my god she looks like she's like walking and like texting or something ew ew i just got goose cam it really does yeah so apparently it did get debunked and she's holding a prayer book and like walking to church in the painting prayer book wink uh-huh it's got a flask in it um it's nancy reagan's memoir but so uh it's just it's interesting to even think about

how new conspiracy theories can come out of new technology when looking at old art because you're like oh why does this look like she's how come no one's ever mentioned before that she's a time traveler but like a new perspective you wouldn't have thought about this before an iphone existed so what was the one can i look at sorry now i'm being just derailing but can i look at the pictures that you mentioned earlier it's the guy uh i don't know the name of it but if you type in a 1940s picture guy in sunglasses you'll see it okay i typed in it's pretty famous oh my god okay so i typed in time travel photos 1940 holy crap we could put these on our instagram as well by the way yeah we should he's literally wearing yeah like a t-shirt and like goggles sunglasses yeah and it's he looks

like he's like waiting for a band to start it's like wow but it's just so weird that like how come nobody at the time that picture was taken even thought he looked out of place maybe they did and they just were like well they're like here's a weirdo just hanging out this weirdo right it could be but then also let's let's pretend it's a oh and then there's the little kid and the kids um from the gettysburg i think that was actually act like that's claimed to be Andrew Basiago, the guy who's like the one who's like whistleblowing Project Pegasus. He claims to be the Gettysburg Address kid. Oh, my God.

Yeah. And so I also wonder if that is based on time travel. Let's say they really are time travelers. Why didn't anyone warn those people about like, hey, there's going to be one camera that exists in this decade. Don't stand in front of it. Like it seems like you would, the odds of you getting captured on camera would be really slim. And yet they're finding ways to do it.

Huh? So interesting. Interesting. Anyway, just wanted to give a shout out to some time travel art, if you will. Um, so yeah. So you will. So yeah. So, okay.

So here's the story of Rudolph Fence. So the story is in 1950, in June 1950. And it's in New York City. So at about 1115 at night, an anonymous witness says that they just, they write to the police, they say. They write to the police. It really is the 50s apparently. They write to the police. It really is the 50s, apparently. They snail mail the police. They reported that they saw a man who looked like he was in his early 30s just magically appear

in Times Square. Wow. Just magically appear. And this guy is in old-fashioned clothing. He literally has, like, checkerboard pants. Like, he's got, uh, probably like a bowler hat and like a thick wool jacket. Like he's looks like he's not from the fifties. Okay. Oh, so they think he's earlier than the fifties. Yeah. He looks like he's in, even in 1950, he was reported as having very old fashioned clothing. He had mutton chops and his facial hair apparently matched the time of the 1870s. Whoa.

Which like, by the way, if you think about the 1870s, that was only 80 years before 1950. So in theory, people in 1950 could like match that very clearly of like, oh, that's an 1870s facial hair. Right, because now we would understand what that's about 70 years before us now, the 50s. Yeah, exactly. Oh, that's what the 50s looked like. That's what we wore in the 50s so yeah exactly oh that's what the 50s looked like that's what we wore in the 50s blows my mind because when i think of the 50s i can like very quickly come to an idea but when you say 1870s i'm like what do you who do you think i am a historian yeah facial hair of the 70 1870s yeah so anyway if you were from the 50s, you could very clearly pick out an 1870s facial hair style.

So they said, yeah, old-fashioned clothes, checkered pants, mutton chops, 1870s facial hair. And apparently he just seemed amazed at the sight of New York City. Oh, and he was in Central, where was he not Central Park? He was in the center of Times Square, yeah. Wow. Apparently, he was, quote, gawking at the signs as if he'd never seen an electric sign before. So cool. Which like, OK, pretend this is real for a second, though.

Like I'm like I'm assuming this is not real. Pretend that like there really is a time traveler who can show up to the middle of Times Square. And like you've never seen like a neon light before or like you're pretending. You just threw me more by saying i don't i'm assuming this is not real i'm saying that about their own story is just really it's time travel i'm pretty i'm like gonna take a stab and assume it's not real what i thought you believe it time travel this one doesn't have enough information to back it up for me really yeah but i'm gonna assume to the bitter end that this is true. I'm assuming it's real until proven otherwise.

So we're switching places today. Fun! I love when we roll reverse. So, but imagine you've never... I feel like our listeners need someone to be like, you know, convinced this is real. Team time travel. I know, I know, I know. I'm very out of my element today.

Not me, you. So, but imagine for the... You've never seen neon or an electric sign before i mean i would be i would imagine it was like uh the first time you and i experienced that the vr goggles like right i to this i'm i remember that was the only time i've ever truly jaw dropped i was amazed i felt like my parent my grandparents the first time they saw like a tv show with color I was like yeah it's like what is going on but the crazy thing is that with a like an electric light like you wouldn't even know how to process it well no but you wouldn't even know what to

expect like with vr at least we had an idea of like oh it's sort of like a tv but you feel like you're in it like I feel like we at least had a grasp on it. But with something that hadn't been invented yet, like a neon sign, like how do you even grasp like you're going to see a neon sign? You wouldn't even know how to. Imagine if you were like like a horse and wagon hadn't even been created as a concept yet. And all of a sudden you time travel to a place where there's like motorcycles. Like, can you imagine? I would poop my pants every second of the time I was there.

I'm scared of the future. I'm like, I'm just going to go to the past where I can feel comfortable. I think I would have to go to like the near future. Like I'd like to see what my grandkids are up to. Like, and that's about as far as we can get. Well, because my other fear about the future is very black mirror of like,

what if we have mind reading by then? And people are like, I can read my mind. I don't know. I feel like I just feel too anxious. I'd have to do it in like increments of like, what if we have mind reading by then? And people are like, read my mind. I don't know. I feel like I just feel too. I'd have to do it in like increments of like five years to warm myself up, I think. I don't want to know if I had that option. So okay, so he looks just beyond overwhelmed at Times Square. And all of a sudden, something seems to startle him. We don't know what it is, but something scares him and he just takes off and starts running and he's so overwhelmed by the city doesn't totally know where he's running to and he gets hit by a cab oh no and he dies oh shit oh well he really messed this one up he that talk about

a butterfly effect now there's a whole story and now i'm doing a podcast on it. I mean, Rudolph was not careful. Rudy. Um, so the police show up and a crowd is gathering around him. They're like, who the heck is this guy? Why is he looks about a place? Then again, like it's New York city. I feel like this is not that farfetched so far. Like your grandparents, old bowler hat. And yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know why people were so shocked at this point, but apparently they the thing that got really suspicious was nobody knew who he was. So like you they had to take him to the coroner's office or the morgue and they had to go digging through his pockets to be able to identify him. And they found some really odd shit in his pocket. So you would not be able to guess what these things are, but would you like, and some condoms. I was going to ask,

can you imagine if it was actually all the things that 2015 CBS news predicted? Christopher Lloyd is in his shoe. Christopher Lloyd. Just great Scott. Um, okay. So the first and most important thing is that they found business cards in his pocket, multiple, which made them think it was his name.

Otherwise, he just had, like, one that he could have grabbed from somebody. But he had a bunch at the ready. So, and the name on it was Rudolph Fence. So, they assume that's his name. They also found $70 worth of 19th century banknotes, so 1,800 money. They found other business cards for Rudolph that were actually addressed to Fifth Avenue in New York.

There was a letter that was delivered to the same Fifth Avenue address, and the letter was sent from Philadelphia in 18 in 1876 which was how many years 74 years earlier so there's a letter from 74 years ago to his address weird there's a five cent brass and copper token for beer with the name of an unknown saloon on it. Wow. That when they went to investigate the saloon, nobody had heard of it. There was a receipt from a barn on Lexington Avenue for a horse and carriage washing, which after doing investigation, a barn at that address had not existed.

Wow. And a medal for a three-legged race. Good job. That was just as important as all the other items to him. That one he was clinging on to until his last breath. That was inside the Nancy Reagan memoir safe. It was my special, special item. He was like, nobody needs to touch this as badly as I do.

So they were like, who the fuck is Rudolph Fence at Fifth Ave? And why does he have shit from the 1800s? And also a medal from. Like nothing current, it sounds like. Nothing current. Yeah. Yeah. So it was 1800s money, a business card to an address, the 74-year-old letter, a five-cent

beer token for an unknown saloon, the receipt at an address that didn't exist and the metal. So, um, they found out his name, but the, he didn't live at that address. And so he ended up becoming a missing persons case. Wow. And so at the missing persons bureau department, I don't know what they called it in the 1950s, but the guy who took up this case was Captain Hubert Rim. And Captain Rim really only had that address to go off of and his name. But the man wasn't listed anywhere in prior documents.

His prints weren't on record. So he goes to the Fifth Avenue address and it was not actually a house, but it was a storefront and the owner had never heard of a Rudolph fence. So dead end. It's so creepy. Dead end. So he later decides he's like, you know what? Maybe he actually lived in a different, he lived there at a different time so maybe i just have to go through every individual phone book and just find this fucking guy wow and he ended up finding a rudolph fence jr in a phone book from 1939 so 11 years prior wow and he went to the apartment uh from and the address from that phone book. And the neighbor remembered there being a Rudolph Fence Jr.

So this guy who just showed up in 1950, he's in his early 30s. His son lived there 11 years earlier. So that's already creepy. Yes, it is. You're like, what, our age? And you have an adult son that lives somewhere and so the neighbor says that rudolph fence jr was a few decades ago in his 60s oh and so i never heard how old the current rudolph guy is who died so so the guy whoever

reported him as like what he was wearing and all that said he was in his early 30s. Got it. Okay. Okay. So then they're saying now his potential son was in his 60s a few decades ago? Yeah. Holy shit. Okay.

Wow. And apparently in 1940, which was 10 years earlier to when this is happening, they said like, oh, 10 years ago, Rudolph Fentz Jr. moved to a retirement home. Oh, my God. How creepy is that so captain brim got a hold of the local bank in the neighborhood thinking like oh if he lived here they might have a file on him right and they found a former account at the bank with rudolph fence jr and they said unfortunately we can't contact him for you because Rudolph Fence Jr. died five years ago. But his wife still lives in Florida. Oh, my God.

So Captain Rim finds the wife in Florida. And when he said, like, look, there's this guy named Rudolph Fence. He looks like this. He just showed up in Times Square. basically she was blown away because apparently uh in 1876 the time of the letter and the time of the the that the beer token would have been around and the receipt for the barn apparently in 1876 74 years ago her father-in-law rudolphz Sr., who was 29 at the time, he decided to go for a walk after dinner one night and completely vanished and was never heard from again. No.

And it was all the way down to the exact clothing description, the same age description. The year. The year, 1876. And it was around the same time because I think he showed up at 11 o'clock at night in 1950. Why don't you believe this is real? I'm fully convinced already.

I love this. When he disappeared in 1876, it was 10 o'clock at night. And he showed up an hour later in 1950. That is? Isn't that crazy? So creepy. So it was like, yeah, he's just been missing for 74 years. And he showed up at the exact same age and the exact same clothing and the exact same spot that he would have been walking.

I'm just, that's Goose Cam Central. So a lot of people think maybe it's just a ghost. Maybe they just saw something. But there was also witnesses. This guy is doing a literal investigation on this body. That is in a morgue. Yeah. Like they have all his items like

it's like in hand yeah so you have a cross ghost off the list so uh there was actually after all of this as creepy as it was there was never an official report filed on rudolph fence because apparently time travel was not a good enough explanation for all of this, so it's still an open case. But it's real, right? Like, there's actually a case on this? Yeah, so Captain Hubert Rim, yeah, he was in charge of the investigation, but there's no official report filed with, like, a cause of, like, what happened to this guy.

Okay. So how did a 30-year-old man vanish, or 29-year-old man vanish in 1876 and suddenly appear almost 75 years later at the exact same age and the exact same outfit. So in 1972, this is 22 years after Rudolph fence was seen again. Uh, in 1972, there was a supernatural investigation group, uh, called, and that's why we drank. Just kidding. It's called.

I literally almost said that. And then you said it and I was like, whoa, this is really tripping me out. Oh my God. It's called Borderland Sciences Research Foundation. Sounds way more professional than, and that's why we drank. Absolutely does. And apparently, uh, they, their belief is thatence could have just walked through a time portal by accident. Allegedly, Rudolph might have, quote, slipped through a hole in the fabric of reality between our dimension and the fourth dimension.

Sure, sure, sure, sure, sure. And the article I read on this was a lot more science-y. They gave at least two or three paragraphs trying to describe this concept but just for us to be able to swallow the pill uh our dimension the fourth dimension there can be like thin little pockets and you can fall into the thin pockets and show up somewhere else theoretically at least theoretically yeah so they think that he was just walking in a like a liminal space and kind of fell through and popped out on the other end. Yeah. And that would explain, I mean, if he's going for like an evening night stroll after

dinner and all of a sudden he sees electric neon signs and cars everywhere. No wonder. He's freaking out. Because my thought was, oh, well, if he planned this, he really should have been prepared for like not expect, you know, for being startled. But I guess if you were just casually taking a walk and all of a sudden it was like, buy the new iPhone. Like, oh, my God, you'd be so scared. Look, this is why I don't go for walks.

OK, you don't know what's going to happen. That's exactly why I don't leave my house. Also agreed. Same thing. And so that was kind of the end that we heard of it for a while. But then the Internet came about and this story regained this like surge of popularity because it's like spread across the cybersphere and uh in the year 2000 there was an article in a magazine called masala it's a spanish magazine and i don't know masaya i don't know how to how i would pronounce it but

mas and then a l l a so masaya that's how i would guess it yeah but M-A-S and then A-L-L-A. So Masaya? That's how I would guess it, yeah. Okay. So they did an article in their magazine about Rudolph Fence, and one, like, supernatural researcher named Chris Aubeck, he saw the article and ended up publishing his own two years later after doing his own like investigative recon on where the story must have come from or how why haven't we heard about it in a while where like what's going on okay so he claims that rudolph fence is not a real story he claims that

it's inspired by the 1953 short story called a voice from the gallery by Ralph Holland. Oh, through over time, we ended up finding out that that story, a voice from the gallery by Ralph Holland was inspired by another story called I'm scared by Jack Finney, who later wrote the body snatchers fun fact, which, which would then become the invasion of the body snatchers movie.

So Chris says, this story doesn't exist. It's just been told a million times and originally comes from I'm Scared by Jack Finney. Okay. And I'm Scared was first. I'm Scared was first published in, I never learned how to say it, Collier's Magazine? Collier's Magazine? I think it's Collier's magazine, Collier's magazine. I think it's Collier. Yeah. Collier's. Okay. Um, it was first published in the September 1951 issue, AKA a year after this story was said to have happened. So it could have been that,

and by the way, Collier's was like a well-respected magazine at the time. So it could have been that and by the way colliers was it like a well-respected magazine at the time so it could have been one of those like war of the worlds on the radio things where people were listening to war of the worlds and people freaked the fuck out because they thought it was legit fiction right they could have read this night this story from the 1951 issue of colliers which was people trusted and it says like oh a oh, a year ago, this guy just showed up in New York City, and people all freaked out that a time traveler showed up a year ago. How, like, close to the

story was the magazine article? Christine, it was pretty identical. Like, super duper, holy crap identical. I knew you would do this to me. So, I'm Scared by Jack Finney was apparently a collection of fake stories, which were being written as if they were true. It was a collection of stories of people's experiences, time traveling.

I see. And one of the stories, I think the last story of the collection was actually Rudolph Fence's story. All the way down to Captain Hubert rim being the one that was the detective on the case oh no it also said rudolph yeah fence oh fuck okay damn it so so this was it since the story was based in 1950 and this magazine came out in 1951 it's very easy to be like oh yeah a year ago i'm rudolph fence and I wrote in and a year ago, you know, I time traveled to it's crazy. I don't really, I didn't read I'm scared, but I'm assuming it's something along those lines. And it actually did suggest that people, the reason all these people were able to write in as their experiences with

time travel, the reason people were now time traveling so frequently is because people were trying to escape what was going on in the world so desperately that they were quote disturbing the clock of time and time itself was breaking down. Oh my God. And so they were able to find all these little pockets of time portals. And that was what was causing all these people who wrote in to be able to time travel. So, uh, from i'm scared and colliers this rudolph fence story got mentioned again later uh in 1972 by the borderland sciences research foundation and they were the ones that brought it up again uh in their own journal uh and rumor has it so let's do the timeline here so in 1951

jack fenney writes i'm scared where the story literally comes from then there's discussion that uh ralph holland this other author two years after the Collier's story comes out, he basically rips off the story to nearly a T. Oh, great. In this short story called A Voice from the Gallery, which is what that guy in the year 2000 found and was saying like, oh, I think the story was inspired by this. Gotcha. Gotcha. The same guy who wrote that short story was actually a member of the Borderland Sciences Research Foundation, which would explain why they did their own story about it in the 70s. So it all kind of is jumbled together. But basically, this all its heightened creep factor and people starting to bring it up in the future. And the original article from 1951 from the Collier's magazine, it now actually has a section afterwards that explains the truth behind it.

Oh, okay. There is also like this like random plot twist that in 2007, one researcher at a news archive found the same story of Rudolph Fence before Collier's was even published. And so it was implying that like, Oh, so that like, if I'm scared as the first place to have written about it, but this story actually happened five months earlier than maybe there really was a time traveler.

It became this whole random twist where they really wanted time travel to sound like it could have happened, but really it was probably fake. So anyway, this all stems from a 1951 article in Collier's magazine, but enough people truly believed it was legitimate for a while, especially when the internet came out. Anyway, that's the story of Rudolph. Oh, my God.

I mean, it's a great story. I understand why people got sucked into it. Especially with all the details of, oh, and this was in his pockets, and then these are what he's wearing. It's very creepy. And we found his wife in Florida. I mean yeah come on anyway there you have it i am looking i've just typed him in here you so creepy yeah the first thing of course is a snopes article oh yeah well there you have it i feel like they um there's also

if you look up rudolph fence there's like an actual picture that shows up of a guy so like that implies to be him with like his his mustache which is so funny because if you if you just google the name rudolph fence the first thing that shows up is rudolph fence fictional character i know bummer man yeah oh well it's a great story though it's very creepy very creepy. I thought so. I love it. Well, now that makes sense why. Because I was like, M is saying it might not be real. Yeah, I almost I caught myself in a stumble there. Oh, man, I really wanted it to be real.

Oh, well, unfortunately, I have something real for you today. So I wish I could say this wasn't real. That would be fun. You know, you and me both, Christine. I wish more of my stories were fake and more of yours were real. Remember that time you covered the Grinch? That was a fun day. That was a fun day. And I also didn't even get to appreciate it for half of it because I had to worry about it being real that whole time until I realized later, you know? Yeah, it's a bummer, but I'm glad I kept you in suspense. Um, okay. Well today, um, I have a story for you that I thought I had covered for years. I've just

been like, I had it checked off on my mental list. And then one day I did a little perusing and realized, wow, I literally have never covered this. And I thought I had. This is a story of Ivan Malat and the Backpacker Murders. Yeah, no, that does not sound familiar. I don't know why. I was so thoroughly convinced. I checked like 10 times. But nope, I've never covered it. So today's the day.

Cool. So the story is set in Australia. I watched a show. I guess it was a show. It was like a two-part movie sort of on Amazon Prime called Catching Malat. And it's sort of a fictionalized or I don't know the best way to put it. It's like a dramatized version. Like it's all acted out. It's not like a documentary. A reenactment? Yeah. It's like a reenactment, but it's like a full movie and it's really well done.

And it sticks pretty close to the story from what I could tell. So that's a good movie to watch if you're interested in seeing the story kind of dramatized. So let's just get started. We are in Australia. Two hikers were walking through Australia's Belangelo State Forest at an area called Executioner's Drop. Oh, well, they're OK okay step one is red red flags already there number one when one said to the other come here and look at this kangaroo leg huh is that just what happens in australia there's just like mangled kangaroo parts everywhere

so there was one clip in this movie where one of the guy goes, uh, Oh, where were you? And he's like out shooting. And he's like, Oh, you catch a roo.

And I was like, is this, Oh my God. Like, I like, I'm like not down with it, but the phrasing is something I catch a root. It's great.

Catch a root. Yeah. Okay. Let's see if we can, let's see if we can redo, we can like, uh, come up with a different. Yeah. Okay. Let's see if we can, let's see if we can redo, we can like, uh, come up with a different,

yeah, a different reason to, to say something like that. So it's, so it's fun to say. Yeah, I agree. Um,

so these two hikers are walking through Belanglo state forest at executioner's drop. And one says to the other, come here and look at this kangaroo leg. So it was September 19th, 1992. And police had been called to the site to investigate near the kangaroo leg leg, they also found a patch of skin which had fur on it and quickly realized that's not fur, it's hair. It's human hair.

And it wasn't a kangaroo leg. It was a human elbow. Oh, what? Hang on. I feel like a human elbow and a kangaroo leg look very different. Oh, I understand. Like, not the meaty thigh part of the kangaroo. Like, we're talking, like, the foot and the ankle. Like his leg. Yeah. I know, but when I think of leg, I think of, like, I understand. Like, not the meaty thigh part of the kangaroo. Like, we're talking, like, the foot and the ankle.

Like his leg. Yeah. I know, but when I think of leg, I think of, like, their large, their kickers. Their kicker meat. You know what I mean? Sorry. I know that's fucked up. But, like, where, like, the kangaroo, like, when they jump and then they go, wah!

And they, like, get you with their tushy muscles. Oh, I thought that part was also attached to. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know what kangaroo bones look like. I can't even pretend like I know what they look like. I'm understanding better now when I think of like more of a kangaroo ankle versus a kangaroo leg.

That could be that. That definitely looks like a, like a human elbow. Okay. I'm going to trust you on that. I have no idea what kangaroo bones look like, but I believe you. Okay. So they find this kangaroo leg, quote unquote. Turns out the police show up and they're like, that's not a kangaroo leg.

It is a human elbow. So they rushed to the scene. Other pieces of a young woman's body are found nearby and only 100 feet away from that first corpse. Police find a second body. nearby and only 100 feet away from that first corpse police find a second body so the bodies were soon identified to be 22 year old joanne walters and her friend 21 year old caroline clark and they were british hitchhikers who had gone missing earlier that year joanne was from wales and caroline was from northumberland and they had met in australia while both out backpacking and became friends there so joanne and car Caroline had grown close and ended up sharing a flat together in Sydney's

King's Cross District. And they had been last seen on Easter Saturday, April 18th of 1992, headed toward King's Cross Station carrying sleeping bags and a tent with plans to hitchhike south. So when Joanne's parents, Ray and Jill Waters, didn't hear from their daughter, who would usually call home once a week, they started to get worried. Okay. worried because they hadn't heard from their daughters in so long so they all traveled to australia to uh try and find them hoping maybe they were out in the outback with no access to a phone or they had picked up some side job and hadn't gotten a chance to call home they were just desperate that something sure explained their absence so the uh one of the parents it was caroline's dad i Ian Clark, commented, we never gave up hope.

We dredged around thinking of every conceivable thing the girls could be doing where they couldn't get in touch. Going out as, now this is a phrase I learned, going out as Girl Fridays on a yacht or working on a homestead without a telephone. Do you know what a Girl Friday is? Is it like how Saturdays are for the boys? But like Fridays are for the girls? like fridays are for the girls what is it i was like i was like what is that i couldn't understand that sentence going out as girl fridays it must

maybe it's a british thing but girl friday it's like a girl's night it goes on out gno it's not uh it's a girl friday is a female helper especially a junior office worker or a personal assistant to a business executive oh so it's like a, uh, so he was saying maybe they went out as girl Fridays on a yacht. So like they maybe showed up as like assistants or helpers. Um, not at all. If, if this were a game of who wants to be a millionaire and I had to guess out of four options, what girl Friday means that would have definitely been what I didn't even, even if the fourth one is like humpback whale or something where they always put like the least obvious answer.

Yeah, I would have been like, that's funky enough. It could mean something. Yeah, I was surprised because it must be a phrase because I Googled it and it immediately came up. So I'm sure it's just like something I just didn't recognize. Oh, fun. And probably a lot of people are listening like, yeah, duh, but I'd never heard it before. So fun fact, if you didn't know.

The more you know. It seems slightly derogatory to be a girl Friday, which just means you're like an assistant or a helper, but you know, what do I know? Are there boy Fridays? I assume not. Maybe like girls only get Fridays and like there's like boy Thursdays, you know? Well, I thought Saturdays were for the boys or do they get Thursdays too? Oh God, I don't know.

That sounds like a lot. They get they get everything huh sounds like a patriarchy so obviously they found the bodies september 19th they were not on a yacht somewhere unfortunately they had been found dead and the families obviously were heartbroken so the investigation and an autopsy revealed that the two women had been bound, stabbed, and shot. And that their murderer had sexually assaulted them while chain smoking during the event. Oh my God. Which is like so odd because I guess they just found a bunch of cigarette butts at the site and determined that it was all from the perpetrator. Okay. And also, like, that feels...

It feels personal if it's, like, you're going to get that, like... Like, tie them up like that. But then also to stab them. Well, they're hitchhikers. I guess. I mean, I guess it makes sense that they... And they were foreigners, so I think... Like, multiple stab wounds and shot wounds?

Oh, my God. Like... Yeah, it's very very brutal the story it's disturbing um so unfortunately that was how the two of them were found and tragically the murders of caroline and joanne launched the police into the home stretch of a case that they were trying to figure out which was the murders by someone known as the backpacker killer so these two oh god deaths were the final like final hurrah of you know they put the police in the final stretch of figuring out who this backpacker killer actually was i guess that's good but also yeah i

mean like there's and also that means they weren't the only two people who died from this person like there's a whole series of people you haven't even covered yet. Correctamundo. This was sort of the hook, you know, the entry point into. Well done. Well done on the hook. But geez, I kind of wish there wasn't more people that also deal with this. Don't I as well.

So the public was first made aware of the fact that Joanne and Caroline had been missing during an England versus Australia rugby, rugby match in June of 92. Uh, police had actually interrupted the broadcast to show the girls' faces on screen in the hope that, uh, they would reach like a large number of people. Um, which makes sense. You know, you would want it in a sporting event that a ton of people are watching. If I went missing, I would want my face on like blimps, whatever wherever you could put me i would want if i don't go missing i would also like my face on a blimp if anyone's okay well if anyone's offering i guess that's also jk jk that's part of the gemini flair there is like just at all at all circumstances we don't need a reason but when there is a reason by the way like we really need it but then you better

follow through yeah uh so it was because of this huge amount of attention garnered by a missing person's report of joanna caroline that police began to connect other missing persons reports of foreign tourists in new south wales to these current uh this current case so there were two 19 year olds who had also disappeared at the end of 1989 and three german backpackers who disappeared in 1991 so for reasons unknown it took a while for them to set up like an actual specialist task force and i think one thing at least to me that is always striking is like how gigantic australian wilderness is like i feel like vast vast and and so it's i feel like it's hard to comprehend how like it sounds simple to be like oh well these people went missing and these people went missing

they should have connected them but in my head I don't know part of it's like they're several years apart in such a vast area I don't know maybe I'm just looking at it I know nothing about the Australian wilderness I just assume it's pretty insane i just like it feels feels large i feel like i'm very i feel like i have no idea like even my version of how big i'm thinking it is in my head is actually not as big as it is yeah and i think i listened to that i really like the showcase file which is hosted by it's an australian host so he covers a lot of australian cases and so many of them take place in the outback and you just the way he describes it as like emptiness and so vast that you would never even be able to cover every you know mile of it is just so creepy um so anyway they finally started

connecting like that there were multiple foreign tourists missing from the same area in australia and a year went by still nothing conclusive had turned up. And meanwhile, on the other side of the world, a young man named Paul Onions. Okay, well, sorry. I don't know which joke to make, an Onions joke or the fact that it's so similar to Paul Bunyan. Okay, here's the thing.

So you hadn't heard that name before, right? No. Okay, because it's like a running joke on My Favorite Murder. So I knew all about Paul Onions before the thing. So you hadn't heard that name before, right? No. Okay. Cause it's like a running joke on my favorite murder. So like I knew all about Paul onions before the story. Wait, he's been in many stories. No, no. He's like from my favorite murder. Like they covered this and talked about Paul onions. And so it's become like a longstanding joke there.

So maybe that's why I thought I'd covered this before. Cause I was like, Oh, I know all about Paul onions. But there's like a joke on My Fair Murder where like Karen and Paul Onions are like fall in love or something and like go off to get run away together. I don't know. I don't know the full story. But Paul Onions was very striking. I feel like if there was a Paul Mac and Cheese, I would totally fall in love with that person. But yeah, Paul Onions I don't know about.

Paul Onions is the greatest name. He's never left my mindscape after hearing about it. Apparently, he was burnt in. Burnt in. Yeah. So it's just fascinating. But so, yeah, I wanted to see if you'd heard that before. But Paul Ennis is the best name ever.

He lived in Birmingham, UK, and he had heard about the murders of Caroline and Joanne the Hitchhikers. And he was like, huh, this sounds really familiar to something traumatic that happened to me. Oh, shit. What happened to Paul Onions? So Paul Onions had gone backpacking in Australia the driver pulled a gun on him and robbed him. But he was able to escape the man. And they do a really wild reenactment of this in the movie. I don't know how accurate it is to what happened.

But basically, he was able to escape. And according to the movie, he jumped in another family's car and was like, drive. Oh, my God. Paul Onions? So now it's like Fast and furious starring paul yeah he's like i'm mr onions step aside yeah so mr i'm the big o you've been looking for stepped into the vehicle he was able to escape the man and reported to the the experience to the police but they never took any action on it and uh his report apparently even though he had made it to the police was lost

so they didn't even have the original report to connect it until he called and said like hey remember me this happened and they were like we don't have a report and he's like well i filed one but so basically he was like strange same location same kind of mo guy with a gun kind of description and yeah he called in and said, this sounds familiar. So we're going to leave Mr. Onions here. Don't worry. We'll be back.

Leave them on the pantry shelf. Don't leave. Well, yeah. Leave them in a pantry. Yeah. Right. That's where you store onions.

Yeah. That's not a fridge. Not a fridge. No, no, no, no. That's like Paul apples,

Paul peppers, something like that. You don't put an apple in the fridge either. Do you? I don't. Some people do. You know what, you know what RJ puts in, in the fridge? Paul peanut butter. And I'm like, why do you put peanut butter in the fridge? Okay. I started doing that and Blaze was like, can, Blaze literally had a talk with me. Like, can we not put peanut butter in the fridge? Why would you put something that's supposed to be smooth and soft in the fridge to

harden and then you can't use it? Cause when I was little, we would buy probably the reason why I think it's because my mom would always buy the like super intense, like organic, whatever peanut butter. So you'd like stir it? Yeah. And she would always keep it in the fridge, but maybe it was either a German thing. It was either the fact that it was weird, organic peanut butter. I'm not sure. But now it suddenly hit me like, oh, you don't need to put that in the fridge. So now I don't keep it in the fridge, but I did for a while. You know, what blows my mind is that uh maybe you already knew this i'm sure several others do but in the u.s we put like eggs in the fridge you're not supposed to well actually only if they're like fresh eggs from like a farm or an actual because like one of our family friends

has chickens and he gave us a bunch of eggs and And my mom was like, do not put these in the fridge. They're not meant for the fridge. Whoa. But if you buy them at the grocery store, I think you're supposed to refrigerate them. Got it. I mean, I still do. But I'm pretty sure you are if they're like pasteurized. Got it.

Anyways. Yeah. Fun fact. But fun fact. I paused for a moment because I was like, how far of a tangent are we going to go? It's food related. We could be gone for a moment because I was like, how far of a tangent are we going to go? It's food related. We could be gone for a long time. Well, apparently in ASL, there's a, like a, a pun that like only makes sense if you're

speaking in ASL, but pasteurized milk, the way that it's signed is like the sign for like past your eyes. Wait, really? That's fun. I don't know what the actual like hand movements are, but whatever past your eyes is, it's past your eyes milk. Oh, that's so cute. And that's supposed to be pasteurized milk. Okay, anyway, sorry, Paul Inions or whatever we're doing with him.

Pasteurized. Yeah, so Paul Inions is in the pantry. We're going to just gently close the door, leave him there for a little bit. Yeah. So a couple weeks after Caroline and Joanne had been discovered, on October 5th, 1993, Bruce Pryor, a man named Bruce Pryor, was searching for firewood out in the woods when he discovered a human thigh bone and a skull in the forest. Jesus. Yeah. So it would turn out to be a few kilometers away from where the bodies of Caroline and Joanne were found.

So obviously police were called to the scene and they identified the remains as 19- old phyllis everest and james gibson a couple who had gone missing in 1989 so pathologists weren't able to conclusively determine the cause of death but phyllis had been stripped naked uh her bra and underwear were found cut with a knife and it was also evident she had been gagged with her tights oh my god yeah it's really really dark um and what what year was this again so that they had gone missing in 1989 and the bodies were discovered in 1993 so that whole time they've been missing oh yeah yeah so a lot of this has taken place a lot of this is like flashbacks to several years earlier oh my god okay so um pathologists weren't able to they found out that um she had been gagged with her tights james body was lying in fetal position

50 meters away from phyllis's body he had been covered with sticks and branches and had been brutally stabbed like multiple times um pretty dark stuff uh by the time this examination of the bodies had been finished in october of 93 superintendent clive small from the special task force was certain they were dealing with a serial killer because at this point everything matched up a little too closely sure coincidence yeah so 20 detectives were assigned to the team. They had sniffer dogs that got involved. And then an extra 60 police officers were added to focus on the kind of like kilometer area where the bodies were found. But according to the superintendent, the net is really Australia. We have something like 17 million people. We start from there and work in, which I'm like, it doesn't seem like a very productive way to yeah 17 million people inward but you know i guess you have to rule people out i don't know so a couple of weeks into the investigation on november 1st of 93 the remains of 20 year old german hitchhiker simone schmidl were also found and they were found five kilometers away from Phyllis and James. Jesus.

And from the discovery of her body, it was evident she had suffered multiple fatal stab wounds. And she had last been seen on January 20th of 1991 when she was looking to hitchhike from Sydney to Melbourne to reunite with her mother, which is like extra sad. Yeah. Wow. So having found Simone, police knew that there was a high chance they would find the other missing german hitchhikers who had been with her which were 20 year old anya

habschild and 21 year old gabor neugebauer i don't know whoa say that again hang on gabor and then his last name is neugebauer or neugebauer okay got it Got it. I was like, I was impressed, but also afraid I didn't hear it right. Yeah. It's a lot of syllables. Um, so the other two, Anya and Gabor were also, had also gone missing with Simone. So once they found Simone's body, they were like, aha, we have a feeling that other two will be around here as well. Got it. Okay. Jesus. Okay. Yeah. There's a lot of young folks disappearing here. And were they also, cause Simone was like on her way to meet up with her mom, or did we know if they were also meeting up with their families? So that's a good question.

They were all together because the families had, I think they were all, I'm pretty sure they were all together. I don't totally know. That's a really good question. Okay. I don't want to say, I don't want to guess just in case I'm wrong, but. In case there was any even more sad information to have to process. Yeah.

I'm not totally sure, but I do know Anya and Gabor, they were a couple. Oh. Yeah. I don't know why that makes it worse, but it just makes, I don't know why. Yeah. Their parents had already been like, their parent, Gabor's parents had come to Germany, come to Australia to do like tv shows and try to put the word out um my god so the two of them they knew would be together so

unfortunately both of their bodies were found a few days later uh one kilometer away from Simone's body so they're all just cropping up all these bodies. How many is that now? That's one, two, three, four, five, six. So the first two young women. Right. Then Phyllis and James, a couple. And then these three. Then Simone and then, yeah, the two.

Wow. Anya and the couple. Oh, my God. So that's seven now. And that, yeah, uh, so that's seven now. And that, yeah, it's very frightening. Um, so they found the bodies of Anya and Gabor and they found that Gabor had been

gagged and he had been shot six times in the head. Oh my God. And Anya had been decapitated with a sword or machete. Oh my God. I know. Sorry. I know. Like, like what else am I supposed sword or machete. Oh, my God. I know. Sorry. I know.

Like, what else am I supposed to say, though? Like, oh, my God. Yeah. And they actually never found her head. Oh, my God. I know. It's really, really twisted. Ah.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So, Dr. Peter Bradhurst, who is a forensic pathologist on the case, commented, what immediately comes to mind when thinking about Anya's murder is the style of ceremonial execution. So even though, you know, a lot of these people had just been like stabbed and shot, now they had this like really intense beheading as part of the murders. So it's just really so i mean i can't i can't think of anything more fucked up but like so did that at least give them some sort of indication like because that feel that doesn't just feel like a oh i'm i have the urge to kill and i'm going to randomly kill this person that feels like there was a strategy behind it so like did that give them any insight or was this person just like he just he was like hey i haven't beheaded

someone before live in large jesus christ okay yeah it doesn't end up becoming any sort of significant part of my first thought was like throw that into like a profile of like okay so now we're using swords like what does that mean or a ritual or nope nope just ended up being part of part of the the random process um it's very sick so so obviously like this is becoming this is breaking out in the media so they're getting call thousands of calls and tips um and none had been particularly useful until november 5th when a man came to the police with suspicions about his co-worker so his co-worker's name was Robert Ivan Marco Malat and the man reporting him was suspicious of Ivan because he had this really strange obsession with guns and wouldn't stop

talking about them and he just was like something's weird about this guy. Like, he just had a bad feeling. So he reported this guy to the police. So Robert Ivan Marco Malat, also known as Ivan Malat, was born December 27th, 1944. He was the fourth son of 14 kids to Stephen and Margaret Malat. I'm sorry, Stephen and Margaret Duggar, I think is what you meant. Duggar. Sorry. The Australian version of the Dralian version of right right stephen at the time of ivan's birth was uh 44 oh okay margaret was 22 so when margaret was 22

this was her fourth child and then she would have 10 more. So yikes. Girl. Oh, my God. Okay. So Stephen, the dad, was known to be strict but fair. If you came home and you'd been in any sort of trouble, he'd whack you to the ground. Oh.

Doesn't sound fair to me, but, you know, whatever. I feel like that was their way of trying to make it seem sillier than it is. Like, just whack you to the ground instead of, like, abuse me. Yeah. Well, it's sort of like abuse me yeah well it's sort of like that phrase of like well i was hit as a kid and yeah only when i was bad and i deserved it it's like yeah i only got i got smacked around every now and then it's like i'm fine okay and i'm fine my eyes twitching and i'm fine yeah nothing's wrong with me i promise i'm fine i just want to

hit my kid yeah okay i'm just feeling extra violent violent so he uh when Ivan was four his father pursued a career in market gardening and got the whole family into working on gardening which sometimes involved them all being up until 2 a.m watering the tomatoes um it just seemed like a strange family life I don't know. But they were a big family crammed into a three bedroom house against 14 kids. I'm sorry. Yeah. But to be fair, your childhood house housed like 13 children in three rooms. Yeah. 16 children. Yeah. 16. Oh my God. So you, your house is a, if your house could hear a podcast and heard this exact sentence, it's like smoking a cigarette right now being like, I know that feeling, you know? Well, let me see. One, two, three, four, five. But that house has seven bedrooms. So that was- I thought you said all the kids were upstairs though in those three

rooms. So the boys were, yeah, that's true. The boys were all upstairs in the three bedrooms. Yeah, that's true. And how many boys were in that family of 16 children? 13. So there you have it, 13 kids in three rooms and 14 kids in first. You're totally right. Woo. Um, but that, yeah,

no, you're totally, you're completely right. Um, bananas either way. The fact that there's two examples of this, it's unbelievable. I don't,

I can't picture it. How many bunk beds does it take? Oh my God. They have so many bunk beds. We had to like take them out. They were so heavy. Cause they were like from the fifties. So they were like full wood.

Made of like American solid wood. Yeah. Liter wood yeah literal trees yeah made of sequoia you know it was bananas but yeah so that's a really good point so they all crammed into this three-bedroom uh house in liverpool uh and they oh oh my god i'm literally reading my next bullet says they have triple tier bunk beds they had literal triple tier bunk oh. Oh my God. Really made of like. Made of trees. American trees. Made of American trees. Whatever that fucking reads.

So the mother, Margaret, insisted that it wasn't tough raising all the kids because we worked hard and never had trouble with Ivan or none of them really, which is like, well, good for you. However, one of the brothers, Boris, revealed about Ivan once that, quote, he was going to kill somebody from the age of 10. Holy shit. It was built into him. He had a different psyche. He's a psychopath. And it just manifested itself with I can do anything. Oh, my God.

So they have no sense that kid was like 10 that they had to worry about him. At least this one brother said that. The mom was like, I never had any problems. But the brother was like, no, no no i would trust the sibling i feel like kids usually tell siblings more yeah like you see the darker side i think of your siblings than like yeah if your dad's gonna beat you if you're bad maybe you don't admit that to your parents but right yeah so at age 15 like his older brothers ivan left school to work on various building sites to help earn money for the family. And it was then that Ivan really started to get in trouble with the law.

So at age 17, he was arrested and sent to juvie for six months because of a breaking and entering incident. And then during the 60s, he went to jail four times for breaking and entering, stealing and car theft. And there were only four incidents, only four incidents recorded. But it's believed that there are a lot more that just never got put on paper. Got it. And apparently this is important because the family was so close. There was like an essentially unwritten rule in the family that they would never rat each other out. So it kind of adds a little bit of perspective to the whole case. Uh-huh. Yeah.

bit of perspective to the whole case uh-huh yeah so in 1971 the malotte family uh had a tragedy in the family when ivan's younger sister youngest sister margaret was killed in a car accident with her older brother wally um and she was only 16 and it was a mile away from home so it was like really really hard on everybody and did did wally survive um yes. Okay. So I believe Wally survived and he was driving too, which is like, yikes. Wow. Poor Wally. I can't even imagine the guilt. Extra, extra bad. So a month after his sister's death, he was charged with raping a woman he had picked up hitchhiking near Liverpool.

Oh, holy shit. Okay. Yeah. And around this time of the 1971 crimes, other backpackers had begun to go missing. He was also faced with two, and these weren't connected to him yet, obviously. Like, these were just incidents that were occurring while he was also getting in trouble for other things with the law. And that year he was also faced with two armed robbery charges, one of which was an actual bank that he had robbed. Oh.

So he's not fucking around here. Yeah, that's not small potatoes. No. And he got bail, fled to New Zealand for two years, was arrested upon his return. And apparently, according to crime and investigation, he was acquitted of the robbery charges and in a one-day trial, beat the rape charge after one of the victims changed her story. And there was evidence that malat age 26 had tied up both women and threatened them with a knife but incredibly the police task

force investigating the backpacker murders never learned about the chilling similarities of those crimes until much later so he's like it's just so frustrating because it's like he's like he like was so close to getting caught a couple of times. Yes. It reminds me of who's that guy with the shoes that I hated. The guy that kept getting. Oh, my God. The story you kept telling. It was a two parter.

And every time he like almost got caught. Night Stalker. Richard Ramirez. Yeah. Oh, maybe. That one was infuriating. That one was pretty infuriating. But this definitely has tones of undertones of that of like, oh, so we were so close so many times and so many lives could have been saved.

Yeah. And the connection wasn't made because like they didn't get they didn't realize the similarities until much later that like, wait, this guy's been in trouble for this almost exact same crime 20 years ago. Jeez. I think that would be like the hardest part for me for being a detective is like if I found out if you later. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I couldn't live with the guilt. I mean, and the thing is, like, he had been totally acquitted of those charges. So, like, it wasn't even like he had served time for them or anything. Right. It wasn't like obvious.

So in 1975, it was thought that he had kind of changed his life around because he met his future wife, Karen, who was 17 at the time and pregnant. Get this. With Ivan's cousin, Mark's baby. Hold on. Hang on. I know. With Ivan's cousin's baby. Yes.

Okay. I'm there. So his cousin's baby mama was now his future wife. So his cousin and him were sleeping with the same one so he married karen and they got a caravan together ivan raised karen's son aka his cousin's son jason like his own and they got married a couple years in but when ivan started working for the department of main roads and had to leave for multiple days sometimes weeks to work the marriage collapsed and ivan began having an affair with his okay here we go write this down on your tree uh hang on hang on okay so before we get there you're the best at this like so if anyone can

figure it out it's you i love a good i love drama i love a good family tree i was complex relationships i was born ready for this with a good you know a small town fredericksburg drama i can figure it out okay let's go so ivan began an affair with his brother walter's first wife maureen oh that's it yeah so so he's raising his sister-in-law yeah so his sister-in-law he's raising his cousin's baby with his new wife as his own baby. But then he has an affair with his sister-in-law. Sounds right. Yeah.

And Maureen. And it would later be revealed that his affair with Maureen would often be really violent. And Maureen called him gun crazy. Oh, Maureen, get out of there. Oh my God.

Watch out. Gun crazy. Not good.ureen, get out of there. Oh, my God. Watch out. Gun crazy, not good. So Valentine's Day in 1987, Karen, the wife, packed up her belongings and officially left with the kid. And in 1989, Ivan quit his regular job and began working under fake names to evade taxes and to stop Karen from demanding child support um and this is not a coincidence but around the same time as his divorce went through in 1991 hitchhikers deborah everest and james gibson disappeared so it seems like anytime he's having like a big crisis that tracks though right like yeah that i think we've seen tracks and that like oh when things are getting hard and you have like a bunch of but they they have like anger or energy they need to get out it leads to another crime yeah exactly or like a control thing

of like you're losing control in your personal life so you go out and play god with other people's lives bingo bango oh so back to the investigation of 1993 when they're finding all these bodies um at this point the only facts police were sure of was that whoever the killer was, they drove a car, had knowledge of the forest. Remember, Ivan also worked for the road department, like built the roads. Oh, yeah.

That was another thing that ended up being kind of a... He understood the roads and the forest. And lived in or around the southwestern region of sydney so there was also a pattern that they discovered in that the crimes would happen around the holidays usually christmas and easter which is odd see i wonder if that's i'm sure you're about to give me the answer but just like throwing my my ignorant two cents well you know how like at least for you and me the holidays uh with family easy and happy and nothing ever goes wrong and nobody else yeah there have been a few times when i'm with my own family during christmas where

i'm like i could kill someone right now but like yeah i mean i don't but others yeah it's like you know you get it's like high tension like and if he's already if anything is already like so quick to like make him have to like express his energy in violence like chances are the holidays is a great time to do that 13 siblings so like imagine the in two bedrooms can you imagine oh my god in the gatherings can't even imagine so either christmas or easter which is just yeah interesting pattern and because the were either shot or stabbed, police also thought the killer was a hunter or interested in hunting. AKA maybe gun crazy. Just saying. So needing more leads on November 5th of 1993, the New South Wales government offered the highest reward for information they had ever offered.

for information they had ever offered and i think there was and it was five hundred thousand dollars in australian currency which uh in u.s dollars is 370k about 369 so like a lot of money that's answers a lot of guacamole a lot of guacamole a lot of australian guac uh being offered and i think part of it was that a lot of other countries, these are all foreign tourists, not all of them, but several foreign tourists going missing or foreign hikers, young folks going missing. So a lot of countries were warning people to stop tourism to Australia, saying like, it's dangerous down there. Don't send your kids there. People are getting attacked, especially tourists. So please don't go. People, right. And so I think there was kind of a fear

in australia of like oh my god we're being pitched as this like really dangerous horrible place for tourists to go we need to fix our image yada yada so they put this huge reward out for any information um and information hotlines unsurprisingly went through the roof within the first day they got 5100 calls leading to 2,000 leads. I'm sorry, 10,000 leads, 2,000 suspects. Still. Or not suspects, but people of interest, I guess. But yeah, 10,000 leads.

So as all of this information was coming out across the pond in the UK, remember Mr. Onions? He's been in the dark pantry. Oh, Mr. Onions, who could forget? Yeah, he's just just that man is nothing but layers i'm ready what's he doing so mr onions he's now 27 years old and he saw this information on on tv and got kind of triggered in this way of like this sounds really familiar to some trauma basically i'm still processing from when i was in australia right so he called the police and said uh he wanted to see if his experience could help with putting this serial killer mystery to bed once and for all.

So he called London's Australian High Commission and he was pretty directly or pretty immediately in direct contact with the task force, told them everything he knew. And then they were like, OK, hang tight. We'll keep you on the record. And then just like left him alone for five months, which is like I know they had a ton of calls, but it's so frustrating. Five months is a long time. Five months is a long time. So he's going back in the pantry. So just wait. Also, yeah. Is he in Australia or is he in London? No, he's in the UK. The UK. Okay. So I was going to make some joke about him being Paul Bloomin' Onion from like Outback. But whatever.

I guess he's not over there. So it doesn't matter. Also, I'm aware before the Australians get mad, I know y'all don't have Bloomin' Onion over there. Oh, I really want to just drive that home. Like, I just want to make them mad and say, no, I'm not going to do it. But please don't be mad at me. Outback Steakhouse. Look, all I know about australia is what outback

steakhouse has to offer and i love outback steakhouse therefore i think i love australia that's the most american thinking i've ever thought in my life it's pretty sad uh i don't know too much about australia except that we always wanted to go on tour and now we can barely like make our way to indiana so i don So the best we've got is out back. Are you kidding me? That's the closest we can get. Anyway, so he is in the pantry for a minute again, but we'll get back to him. So on November 16th, police completed their six week search of the area and held a minute silence for the victims.

And in January of 1994, when senior constable gordon was going through records of travelers who had been attacked he came across an acquittal for a man named ivan malott who had raped two hitchhikers and this record had not been around yet so he's finally discovering this and going oh that's weird this sounds a lot like the case we have now um so even though he was acquitted of it he's like well the fact that he was charged at all is suspicious. Right. So as more information came in, Ivan Malat was turning into the number one suspect, but they didn't have enough evidence yet. So the police launched a surveillance task force to keep an eye on Malat's movements and whereabouts. And creepily, at one point, they spotted Ivan in his front

window, staring back at police through binoculars as they watched his house. Okay, so something's a little fishy. So back to Paul Onions, he's back. Oh, thank God. He obviously had some info that was going to help break the case. In April of 1994, he spoke to Australian police and revealed everything that was going to help break the case in april of 1994 he spoke to australian police and revealed everything that had happened to him back in january of 1990 so what he said was he had gotten a ride from this guy his attacker drove a white four-wheel drive

called himself bill and had a mustache like australian cricketer merv hughes okay i don't know who that is but apparently it's apparently it's a very noticeable mustache. He also said this guy was from a Yugoslav background, was divorced, and worked on the roads in town. So they're like, well, that's Ivan. He is from a Yugoslav family. He has a big mustache. He drives that exact car. And he worked on the road so

pretty fitting sure so onions was flown out to australia on may 2nd to go through videos and photos of various people who could have been his attacker and out of a handful of images he identified ivan malott saying i remember the mustache oh it was that big old mustache that yeah like what mustache what is this is it like neon or something what's happening with this mustache let me show you if i can show you let's see if i can show you my mustache because like it's got to be pretty memorable for people to be like oh yeah that mustache it's quite a stash it is what i'll tell you right now is it like the pringles man or something is that like what kind of mustache we're working with here

here it's like a um let me see if you can see that oh that's a big boy mustache yeah it's an intense mustache i call that a motorcycle mustache yeah yeah like the kind of yeah those mutton chops what are mutton chops i don't know mutton chops are the are the sideburns that like become like that go all the way they're like very large and in charge sideburns yeah so he has just like the big old like. Yeah. The biker, the biker stash. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

So he's like, I remember the mustache. And that's how he was like, that's definitely the guy. So it is a very it's not to like keep like honing on this, but it is like a really it's a statement piece on your face. Like if you want to get away with shit, like shouldn't you try to blend in? You know, you'd think so but um he is kind of he's been getting away with it for a long time so all right you know fair enough who knows um but yeah no i agree it's definitely memorable um so on may 21st three detectives interviewed ivan's brother alex and a Alex's wife Joan, who, according to Murderpedia, handed police a backpack that apparently Ivan had given to her, saying it belonged to a friend who had returned to New Zealand and didn't need it anymore. Oh, that's fishy. Fishy as hell. So subsequent tests showed it had once belonged to missing German backpacker Simone Schmidler.

German backpacker Simone Schmidler. So police were also alerted when Joan apparently made some unsolicited comments about serial killers keeping trophies from their victims. So basically after Paul Onions pointed him out in the lineup of photos and then Joan was like, he gave me this backpack. And then DNA was like, that's definitely Simone's backpack. They were like, well, this has got to be Ivan. So at 636 on a.m. on Sunday, May 22nd, police arrived at Ivan's home and called him, ordering him to come outside with his hands in the air. But Ivan thought it was a prank call.

Oh, my God. Are you serious? Yeah. So he didn't come out. And they were like, it's um, buddy, your refrigerator isn't running. Like we, like we got to come outside immediately. So awkward. Cause it's like, buddy, you know, you murdered a bunch of people. And like, you think this is a prank call. It's pretty ballsy. Yeah. Like also I was going to say, if I've already done something like that,

maybe we're different people, but I would have such unimaginable guilt that like, no way. And I'd go, you're right. I put have such unimaginable guilt that like, no way. And I'd go, you're right. Put my hands up. You know, like I would be like, yep,

they got me. You got me. You got me. That's a piece of gum and be like, okay, you're right. The police are onto me. I mean,

I know. And so those guys, I go, it's a prank call. So he doesn't come out. So they had to call him three times before he finally left the house. And what they say the third time, like my guy,

this is not a prank. You're never going to guess who this is. Apparently we thought you'd guess by now, but it doesn't seem like you're going to figure it out. We didn't think you were bright, but we thought you were brighter than this. So they finally called him a third time and he exited the house with his then girlfriend,

Charlinda Hughes. And after hours of interrogation, he was officially charged with the murders of seven backpackers and the attempted abduction of Paul Onions. How dare you? On May 31st. So he denied all of the charges, even though police literally found 3822 cartridges in a tin, electrical tape similar to that at the murder scenes, a Bowie knife, a 32 Browning pistol and a map of the balangalo state forest literally in his house what a dummy like i mean also like for him to just be like nah it's not me like i know what you think it is but it's not yeah yeah it's it's it's very ballsy to be like very ballsy no got the wrong guy yeah you you are on another planet my friends with your puzzle creations i

just love guns that's all right yeah um and it was only a matter of time until police discovered simone's water bottle and tent at his house uh including and also deborah everest sleeping bag carolyn clark's olympus camera foreign coins that belong to the backpackers and a picture of ivan's girlfriend wearing a green and white benetton top that had belonged to Caroline Clark. That'll do it. Yikes. All in his house. That'll do it.

So his girlfriend's literally wearing a shirt that he took off of one of these women that he murdered, which is like... Oh my God. To find that out later, it must be horrifying. Oh, yeah, truly. As a girlfriend. I didn't even think about what she would be going through. Oh, so where'd this clothing come from again? A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. A dead body. Right, truly. I didn't even think about what she would be going through. Like, oh, so where did this clothing come from again?

Yeah, it's my favorite top. Right, exactly. Oh, my God. So haunted. Yikes. So to top this all off, they also found a pillowcase containing Caroline Clark's DNA in his garage. I mean, it's like just so obvious. He has literal trophies from every single one of them in his house with their DNA on it. Like, there's no question here. Right. This is like, this is a, a, the nail in the coffin, the nail in the coffin,

you'd think. So more evidence was found in weirdly enough, the, his siblings houses. So he had plenty of siblings to, to hide shit at. Right. He had literally a baker's dozen of siblings.

A literal baker's dozen. It's like, you have this, you have's like you have this you have this you have this but also like if you know that someone like you have to hide it like maybe you just shouldn't fucking have it yeah you'd think so right but i guess maybe that's the psyche the whole psychological thing of trophies like i guess part of the risk and reward i don't know whatever it seems like a bigger hassle than it should be i would agree with you if i have to live in fear that also like 13 people in one way that sounds like a perk

for the murderer of like oh 13 places to house this trophy but also that's 13 people you got to keep track of and like what they're doing with your stuff well and that's why i mentioned earlier too like that um they're really loyal really tight-knit family and so it kind of gets shady because it's confusing like was anybody else involved did anybody else know about this but yeah so he it's it seems like a handful let's put it that way a baker's dozen handful of people to keep track of but so at richard's house ivan had hidden caroline clark's tent and bedroll at walter's house he had hidden the rifle that he had used to murder anya and uh anya hobsheet at alex's house he had hidden simone's backpack and at their mom's house police had found one of simone's t-shirt and a t-shirt

that had belonged to paul onions like oh god hidden in her home so you're right like this must just this must just be a trophy thing because why else would you keep paul onions t-shirt like and i know we say it every single time but like it's just further proof that he like could not be cockier of like i could just spread all of this evidence as far as i fucking want and no one's gonna find out and i can watch my girlfriend put on this t-shirt knowing that i murdered the person who wore it. Also, that's extra insane. Like, it makes me wonder if, because the shirt belonged to Simone. This shirt belonged to Caroline. It makes me wonder, like, was Caroline his favorite person? Well, I don't know.

He kept T-shirts of all of them. Maybe this is just the one that he. Well, like, the one that he gave his girlfriend, I imagine. He knows that he wants to see that most often. Maybe. Instead of, like like hiding it in his like brother's shed or something like i don't know that one feels gross like he's almost having on display play or something it feels it's like when you hear about murderers giving like their

significant other jewelry or something that they've taken off bodies and it's like it's on display it makes it so much sicker okay they can like see their trophies in action yeah it's on display. It makes it so much sicker. Okay. They can, like, see their trophies in action. Yeah, it's really gross. So, although it's pretty fucking obvious, at least to us, that this guy is the one. They had no hard evidence that placed him in the forest at the time of the deaths, which is, like, okay, but, like, he has a t-shirt. I feel like that's not needed now. Yeah, I feel like at this point we can skip that step. You can just like check that one off anyway.

Yeah, you'd think so. So strangely, according to Murderpedia, Alex Malott, one of his brothers, told police as the second group of bodies was being discovered that in Easter of 1992. Now, this is just weird and I can't fully wrap my head around this. that in Easter of 1992, now this is just weird and I can't fully wrap my head around this. He says in Easter of 1992, he was driving past the Belangelo State Forest on a dirt road. He had seen two cars and in the back seats of these cars, he saw two girls tied up and gagged in the back seats. And police were like incredulous at this because he's giving detailed descriptions of what the men looked like, what the girls looked like, the the guns they had although he was saying he just passed them on the road and first part they're like this is really specific information for like just driving past for a quick glance for a quick

glance and second of all if you saw two girls back gagged in the back seat of why the hell didn't you call the police or like stop and help or something yeah and so and so that was just really odd and uh the friend that he was with in the car could only partly verify the story the guy he was with was like well yeah i saw two cars but i didn't like see anybody in them i didn't see that detailed of a murder and in the moment and the other guy didn't say anything. So it's like just a really weird tip. So nobody knows if he's just trying to get a reward, but also like it just doesn't really make sense, especially because it's Ivan's brother. So it's like, does he know something? Is he making up a story? Like, I don't totally get it. but investigators discovered later that so he had these license plate numbers from memory and they matched part of the registration of Ivan's car one of Ivan's cars so okay he was like oh I saw one of the license plates it said like acl blah blah blah and it turns out that was like one of his brother's old cars so okay either he's either he actually saw something and like just never said anything

never noticed it was his brother's car or he like knew something and was trying to like give them an backhanded tip like give them a give them a nudge without breaking loyalty yes exactly that's my guess i don't know but that it's just weird but um nobody knows if he was like maybe trying to confuse police and like send them in the other direction or right yeah if it was like a kind of roundabout tip-off to this day he maintains he told the complete truth about what he saw and he has no other information so nobody really knows but i just thought that was so strange i was like it's not a coincidence that your brother would be reporting this to the police. Right. And it ended up being your brother.

I just found that so odd. So I don't really know what that means, except that it, again, goes back to, like, the siblings were so close and they had this bond to not rat each other out. So I don't know if those are related. Interesting. Interesting note. So during this time, it was also revealed that in 1974, when Ivan was awaiting his rape trial, he had confessed to a fellow prisoner named Noel Manning that in April of 1971, he picked up two 18 year old girls who wanted to get to Melbourne from Liverpool. They had fallen asleep in the car and then they had woken up with the sight of Malat pointing knives at them, telling them he was going to have sex with them. And then followed by, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to kill you. Oh my God. Oh my God.

I don't know how to, I don't, okay. I don't know what, I don't know. I don't, I would not, I would freeze, obviously. I'm freezing now at the thought of it. It's beyond comprehension. He raped one of the young women and then both of them, thank Christ, were able to escape when he pulled into a gas station. But so with this knowledge, police dug into even more unsolved rape cases because clearly, even though he had murdered seven people, like there were people who had gotten away, paul onions and this these two girls two young women so they tried to go through unresolved rape cases to see if maybe the attacker fit ivan's description and they could tack more cases to him and it turns out

that in 1984 two young women hitchhiking down the hume highway were picked up and taken to belanglo forest and a man they later identified as Ivan Malat had said to them, okay girls, which one of you wants to go first? I know, it's chilling. Oh my god. Yeah, it's sick. And thankfully these young women managed to escape as well and they hid in the forest and the reenactment of this in that movie is so terrifying where they're like in the woods hiding. I mean terrifying. I don't know know maybe i'm going soft but like holy shit i was freaking out um so they were able to escape and hide in the forest while ivan tried to hunt them down and uh rather on brand for him police discovered that the date of this attack or potential attack coincided with one of Ivan's breakups with Karen.

So clearly he's going through some personal shit, taking it out on other people. So we're almost to the end here. Ivan's trial at Campbelltown local court in Sydney began in October of 94 in what would be a particularly harrowing and gruesome trial because the evidence was just like so insane. Yeah. And like just stacking up on itself. Ivan's ex-wife, Karen and Paul Onions were amongst those to take the stand and give evidence against Ivan. But when Ivan took the stand, he claimed he had never been to the Belanglo State Forest and had no clue how any of the victim's belongings ended up in his and his family members' homes.

Okay, well, I don't really care for anything he says at this point. I don't care for it either. This is what the judge said, which like cracks me up. The judge replied, you asked the jury to accept that someone broke into your locked house despite the burglar alarm, planted a Ruger rifle bolt in the ceiling of of your garage dropped the weapons receiver in one of your boots in the hall cupboard making sure both gun parts were painted in the same camouflage colors you use on your firearms then left a single fired cartridge linked to the murder of miss caroline clark in a plastic bag on the bed in a spare room to which ivan responded they must have oh my god okay well so he really is just sticking

to his guns for lack of a better word just like blind faith that something will get him off yeah like just blind confidence that this is going to work um so the prosecution's main line of argument was that while there can be absolutely no doubt that whoever committed all eight offenses must be within Ivan's family the Malat family or very very closely associated with if there was any doubt that Ivan was the guilty party he should be given the benefit of the doubt so his own defense was like yes yes it's very obvious someone in the Malat family is involved but we can't be 100% sure it's Ivan which I guess is the safest way to go about this because like obviously one of them has to be 100 you can be 99.99 sure like you know not in a court not if you if you

have any room for innocence you know yeah this is why i don't work in the legal world this is why this is why this is the only the only reason? This is the only one, yeah. Because I'd be like, horse shit. We both know what's going on over here. He did it! Yeah. So, however, on January, I'm sorry, July 27th, 1996, after a four-month

trial and 20 hours of deliberation, the foreman read out guilty verdicts to all charges. They found Ivan guilty of all charges. Good. And there are some theories, actually, that Ivan did not act alone, which is why I wonder about that one brother kind of saying that weird story to police about seeing all those people. I don't know. But some people do think that he had somebody helping him. For example, Gabor's dad remains convinced that Malat was not alone,

saying Gabor was 6 foot 1 inches tall or 1.86 meters and very strong. When we sometimes went to the forest to cut firewood, he would cut huge logs and carry whole stumps. It would have taken two men to kill him. So some people are like fully convinced that he didn't act alone or that at least maybe his siblings knew more than they let on. I mean, if he was being violent to strangers, I'm sure he was threatening his siblings or could have, you know.

He could have. Or if one of his brothers knew from age 10 that his brother was a psychopath. Yeah. They clearly knew more than you'd think, than you'd hope. So Ivan was moved into a cell in Maitland Bay, north of Sydney, where he was classified as an A2 maximum security inmate. He is known as one of Australia's most terrifying serial killers. And two years ago at 4.07 a.m. on October 27th, 2019, the 74-year-old succumbed to esophageal cancer and passed away.

And that is the story of Ivan Malat, the backpacker murderer. Whoa. Oof. So I decided that the way we should end this is because our only frame of reference for Australia is Outback Steakhouse, that we should educate ourselves on Australia a little bit. Okay, great. Just to get the bad taste of a murderer out of our mouth. I still remember the first thing we talked about australia in like a very early episode about goon do you remember that yeah

okay so i'll skip that one do you remember that i remember you being very excited about it very excited about it okay so here are just some random little things to you know cleanse our palate after that kind of story here are fun facts about australia if you visit one new beach in australia every day it would take you 27 years to see oh my god oh my god here's another one something i hate and a reason why i actually don't like australia each year brisbane brisbane brisbane each year brisbane hosts the world championships of cockroach racing what the fuck it's a fun fact that is not very fun our favorite kind of fun fact our favorite kind australia has three times more sheep than people oh my god but that's what i'm saying they're just like a massive and they have 17 million people so like it's a lot of sheep uh let's see uh australia is

the second country in the world to give women the right to vote in 1902 thank you australia i did remember that from uh they did this on uh my dad wrote a porno they did an australia episode where they and they were trying to figure out what goon was and i was like cracking up because they couldn't like figure it out and i was like and I was, like, cracking up because I couldn't, like, figure it out. And I was like, I'll tell you. Well, this one you'll like, Christine. There are 60 designated wine regions in Australia. Oh, I like that. Producing approximately 1.35 trillion bottles of wine each year.

Holy mother of God, that's a lot of wine. There's also, Australia is the home to the longest fence in the the world which was meant to keep dingoes away from fertile land and the fence is over 5600 kilometers long wowza uh and then also i found some animal ones also some animal uh facts which i think anyway that was that was from makemytrip.com okay and these are experienceoz.com.au, the animal facts. All right. Let's see. Wombat poop is shaped like a cube. What?

Tasmanian devils have the strongest bite per body size of any mammal. Oh, my God. This is, I tell you, Australia's a scary place. Oh, here's a fun one. Australia has a larger population of camels than egypt really interesting fact the record jump recorded by a kangaroo is nine meters aka 30 feet in a single leap goodbye crap that thing would kick my ass i told you they got those the tushy muscles that push them that's what i I'm saying. It was a bone, though, not a muscle.

You know? It's just a bone. The poop one freaks me out, too. That wombat poop is shaped like a cube. I don't understand that. What does your butthole look like to be able to push that out? Physiologically, I can't grasp what that would mean. The Australian emu

can run almost 30 miles an hour, which is 45 kilometers an hour. Dear God. See ya. Look, and also 17 of the world's most poisonous snakes are in Australia. It's home to 1,500 types of spiders. I mean, are you fucking kidding me? And then all these serial killers.

Like, oh, my God. It's a scary place. Yes. Platypus. They are highly poisonous and have enough poison to kill a dog or make a human seriously ill. Actually, you know what? I'm back to not wanting to go back to Australia. I love you, Australia.

Here's another. The one I'll end on is one that you and I can both relate to right now. Koalas sleep about 20 hours per day. That I can get behind. That I'm down with. I'm feeling the koala lifestyle. Anyway, I hope that that cleansed the pad a little bit about things we do like about australia also carry stds koalas maybe i also know that they're like not actually as cuddly

and sweet as you think yeah i think you're supposed to be more careful around them there's a picture like if you look up like what an angry koala bear looks like it is oh god it is they Yeah, they carry chlamydia. Oh, Lydia chlamydia. Angry koala. Oh, yeah. I mean, just Google angry koala. Let me send you my favorite picture of an angry koala. And then you will put this on our Instagram also. After all the time travel photos, just an angry koala. So if you haven't listened to the end of the episode you just won't get the joke here christine you tell me what you think about

snuggling this little baby holy why would you send me that that looks like a fucking horror movie oh is that real it's real why is it all wet i'd be angry too well okay maybe that's why it's mad but someone dumps something him. Anyway, there's all that. Well, can I tell you, since we only have a couple weeks left of this game, what size my baby is this week? Yeah. What was the last thing I told you? Was it Buzz Lightyear?

Buzz Lightyear. Did I tell you Winnie the Pooh's Jar of Honey yet? Yes. Okay, so then this week it's Princess Buttercup's Crown in The Princess Bride. So that's fun. That is fun. That's fun uh also a speak and spell oh i do love a good speak and spell yeah you know i always they always freak me out because they sounded like demons the speak and spell yeah they're scary i mean it's kind of like a teddy ruxpin like things shouldn't be talking it was like the original um microsoft sam yes

robotic voice hello your baby has teeth hello fresh your baby is the size of princess buttercups brown also another pointy object so another pointy object your kid's gonna i think that's uh it's hinting that your child's gonna have an affinity for sharp objects so look out well anyway thank you everyone for listening and uh i guess that's is that it are we good dreams we'll see you next week and that's why we drink with paul onions oh i miss him