And That's Why We Drink - E397 A Poultrygeist and an En-gay-gement

Episode Date: September 15, 2024

Les Go Girls! Episode 397 is here and between engagement excitement and updates on Christine's haunted house this episode is sure to bring the gasps! This week Em takes us to England for the absolutely wild tale of the Ghost of the Frozen Chicken aka The Highgate Hill Chicken. Then Christine finishes up her two-parter on Steven Stayner and the Sightseer Murders/the Yosemite Park Killer, which are linked in the most unexpected way. And have we survived our first two live shows and kept our sanity? Tune in next week to find out! ...and that's why we drink.Our Fall Tour has officially kicked off! Come see our brand new show (and find out which haunted location Em and Christine mention in this episode that might have followed Christine home...): The Pour Decisions Tour - get your tickets today at andthatswhywedrink.com/live

Let's go girls. I like the les, not the let's. That was a nice touch. It's a big day! We just came back last night at the wee hours. Last night? This morning. This morning from Vegas because we have been in cahoots with Eva's partner Rachel and

we and many of Eva's friends all surprised them because... Clink cl, clink, clink, clink. I've passed the baton and by the baton, I mean the clinky ring. Eva is officially engaged and we didn't even let her on this recording because we wanted to start. So he said, don't worry about joining.

And then I was like, oh, I guess I'm just gonna talk about Eva now that she's not here, but she's engaged and we're so happy they're engaged. And Emma and I both came up with that fun pun separately and then And nobody else ever nobody cared, but we thought it was Absolutely splendid. Yeah, so Eva and Rachel are now engaged and the most fun for me was that Rachel arranged us to all also go see Shania and Wow five-year-old me couldn't have been more excited.

And the fact that it was about something, it was to celebrate something queer was just extra beautiful. I'm trying to figure out the glare, sorry about that. But no, it was very lovely. I had a good time. I hadn't seen Christine in a while. We saw-

Hence, Lesgo Girls. Get it, guys. Get it, get it. Yes. In case it dropped. Shania, are you there? I had a great time. It was very fun to see the dichotomy of people in this group going to Shania because half the people really cared and half the people did not know really any Shania songs. I knew that one. I know. But okay, can we talk about my favorite part was that we were in, literally Eva's not here and we're like, let's talk about all the fun things we did

with Eva this weekend. We were like setting up in the room and we were gonna hide, but then we were in this casino and it takes forever to find the actual rooms we were staying in. So we kept following Eva's dot around on find my friends and we were like, oh no, they're going the wrong way. So finally we're like, okay, it looks like they're here.

Everybody go into your hiding spot. And I had the remote, because I was gonna start playing Shania as soon as she walked in. By the way, I'm one of the, oh, I said that already. I'm one of those people who, it's kind of clueless about Shania, but I did have a great time. But so, they're like, Christine, start the music.

And it's like, bam, bam, and then I hear like, 10 seconds later, all right, start over, cancel the music, everything off. And I'm like, okay, they got on the wrong floor. I'm like, oh,, all right, start over, cancel the music, everything off. And I'm like, okay, they got on the wrong floor. I'm like, oh, they got off on the wrong floor. It's just a bunch of like whispers from different corners. Like I was hiding in a closet, Percy was hiding in the bathroom,

someone was hiding behind the couch, someone behind the curtains. And you could just hear each of us whispering like, she's not here yet, play it again, play it again. And my phone was filming. So I was like, I can't even see my phone. And so I was just sitting there with remote and champagne and I just kept hitting,

brr, brr, and it started over like four times. And then finally they came in and it was so exciting. And I, and put it the best, they were like, oh, and then, and then she'll turn around and Evan and Christine are here. And I was like, yeah, yay, your bosses have arrived to celebrate. It's like, oh, maybe not.

They're like, we're aware, but it was nice to be. It's like, oh, maybe not. They're like, we're aware. But it was nice to be included. It was. I was so honored. It was fun. Oh, I'm wearing my Hot Stuff shirt in honor of the weekend. Yes, well, and also Eva and Rachel had matching chaperone, handmade hats.

It was very lovely. Yeah, their friend Ellen made them. It was just so happy and gay and beautiful and I loved it. And I won 320 bucks at the slot machine in one go. I was like, damn, it was those exploding pigs that I love so much. I had beef Wellington.

That's right. I also watched, I think I watched Em watch and I experienced Em experiencing so many things that was like just secondhand joy for me. Like I watched you experience Shania and it was like I was channeling your joy. It was just delightful. Yeah. So I've always wanted to see Shania. Like it's one of the only, I don't, I'm not a concert goer. Shania is one of the only concerts I've ever wanted to see. And it's one, she's one of the only artists I know every word of every song to. Um, so that was like off of a

bucket list. And then I've always wanted to try beef Wellington and the restaurant we had reservations at had beef Wellington. So I had a great weekend, whether or not Eva said yes, I was going to have a good time. So I was like, Oh, he was like, how did, how did Ray convince you to come? I was like, I needed no convincing. And I was like, I did, but the Shania and the beef Wellington helped. I was like, yeah, we dragged them out. Yeah, even if it didn't all work, I was gonna go to Vegas no matter what. And also, yeah, it was a good time.

I went to Meow Wolf, we did a bunch of fun stuff. So anyway, congratulations to Eva. Right now, we're so happy, and I wish that we had invited her into the recording to clink her glass, but we didn't. So oops. As we were saying this, Eva texted and said, oh, I can hop on now, And I said, no. So we

had different opinions. You went to invite her on. I said, yeah. And I said, no, we're already recording and talking about you. So you can relax. Just know that it's all good vibes. We're talking about you. But I, if case you're wondering I'm drinking today a half half Rhine guys local brewery guys tea. It's like a hard craft tea half and half and I needed something caffeinated today because Hmm. Well, I got on a plane. I miss brunch because I had to get on an early flight Not super early, but you know early enough and then we sat on the tarmac for about an hour and 15 minutes, which sucks when like the flight's delayed but you're on the plane and it's like, you're on track.

And then it's also hot because they're turning off the engine to like. It's super hot. There's babies who are like getting stressed. 100 to like five degrees in Texas and in Fenton. It was 105 degrees in Vegas. And they were like, oh, any minute now, you know. And then of course like you don't want to get up to pee

because it's like, oh, well, what if we're about to go? Because we're kind of moving every now and then. Anyway, point being, I missed my connecting flight from Chicago home and I said, oh, I'm sure there's plenty of flights. And Blaise said, nope, that's the last one. And I landed as it said, taking off. And I went, cool, cool, cool.

They saved the other flights, not mine. So I spent four hours on the plane. I bought the internet so I could just try and find a way home. today was Leon's first day of school and I really wanted to be here. Yeah, now I get that. I like really wanted to be here and I did not want to spend the night in like a hotel in Chicago,

in like some airport by myself feeling sad. And there was no early flight anyway, the flight would have gotten me in this afternoon and I would have missed recording. So I was like, forget it. So I almost rented a car and drove like the five hours. And then I was like, no, then I'll get home at like 3 a.m. My mom, okay, then I found a flight.

I had to buy a flight. It was one seat left. I had to buy the flight from Chicago, from Midway to Columbus. And then that was delayed almost an hour. So then, but anyway, I landed around midnight and my mom had to drive two hours to come get me and then drive me two hours home and then

Go home and then anyway, it was just one of those days where I got in at like 2 33 and I was like And I just started brushing my teeth I was like, I think I just need to force a routine So I just started like brushing my teeth and like went to bed and read a book just associating while your teeth are scrubbed Yes, exactly. Anyway, so then Finally after like five days I show today, Leona got off to school, I needed some caffeine, so I'm drinking this because I really didn't sleep very much.

And oh, also, sorry, you tell me why you drink. Because can I tell you why I drink? Well, that's why I drink. Literally all I do is talk. It's finally your turn. OK, well, one of the reasons I drink is because we're having ghost activity at the house. I'm like, I'm not even, like, I'm not, this is, this is not a,

it's, it's what's the code red. We're not at a, we're not at a fire drill. We're at a fire. Oh, really? It's threat level midnight. Threat level midnight. Weird shit is happening. And this morning, Blaze said to me, yeah, I mean, I finally believe you now. And I went, Oh, that's not good. That's not good. And he didn't even say it like, oh yeah, I mean, I finally believe you now. And I went, oh! Oh, that's not good. That's not good. And he didn't even say it like, oh yeah, because he's always said like, oh, I'm sure like, there's some truth. Mr. Levelhead. Right, like he's always like pragmatic,

like I'm sure there's some truth to it. And like, you're probably right. There's some things we don't, today he was like, something's happening. And I was like, ah, I got him. I hate when they finally agree with us. I hate when they don't agree with us and then when they agree with us,

I go, I actually hate this more. Yeah, it's worse. It's worse. Go back to being the level headed one, please. So what, like, first of all, what's going on? Second of all, what's the thing that like made him? Oh my God. Okay, so when we first moved in,

some weird stuff happened and it was like, stuff that over the years I've written off, but I've started remembering now. And I know I talked about them like years ago when we moved in. It's like trauma. I know, right? I'm like just buried it.

But it's fun cause I'm looking through my old trauma. And then every now and then there's like a ghost story and I'm like, oh, fine. That's a little better than one of these other traumas. I'm digging up. It's like when you find candy in your purse, you're like, oh my God. You're looking for like a tampon and you're like,

ooh, a peppermint, you know, it's like, oh, something more exciting. Yeah, so I, that hits me. Ooh, a peppermint. Like's like, oh, something more exciting. Yeah, so I, that hits me. Ooh, a peppermint. I'm like, wow, how old am I? Yuck. A Werther's Original, yum. Yuck, a butterscotch with hair on it.

Ali, that's perfectly good. Don't waste food. You just peel it off. You just rinse it under the sink, it's fine. Anyway, so when we first moved in, like some weird stuff happened where once we were standing and I'd put up like a little thing in the bathroom shelf upstairs in the guest bathroom that we never use.

And it was like a little guest book. And it says like a guest book to use on the potty. Like if you're visiting- I'm the only one who's ever signed it. You're the only one who signed it. And so it was sitting up there and I like propped it up and I was like, okay. And it sat there for probably weeks, months

and then we're sitting downstairs talking about like I mentioned something about oh I'm so excited for our first guest to come stay and all of a sudden we just heard this crash and I went upstairs and like the the stupid book had been like launched over the toilet and like across across the bathroom and I was like oh no and I turned it over as a guest book And I was like, oh no. And I turned it over and it says like guest book. And I was like, uh-oh. So that happened. Oh my God. And this was years ago.

And then the time I was sitting there and Leona's grandparent, my in-laws were home and they were all like out with her. And I just heard somebody go, daddy, like right in front of me. And I was like, I remember that. And Gio like jumped up. That was freaky.

And at the time I was like, maybe it's just the way the walls are. No, that's nothing like that. I remember, can you hear that voice still in your head? Because I remember claiming it was future Leona in a glitch. I know, sometimes I think about that and I'm like, it just sounded like a little kid. I don't think I know it enough to be, I know.

It could be now, you know? I do wonder that, yeah. I feel like one day maybe I'll be sitting in that exact spot and then maybe she'll say it and Gio will go like this and I'll go, oh my God, it's happening again. It'll hit something right in your, it'll hit something right and you'll know it was the moment.

That could very well be it. Cause it didn't feel threatening. It was just like so alarming cause she couldn't talk yet. She was like two months old. Right, exactly. And then, so recently, so things have kind of, and then Blaze called me that one time saying someone's in the house and the cats were in bed with them.

And so we like just weird footsteps and stuff, but nothing crazy. And then I recently started noticing more like of those weird, like someone's watching me chills where they kind of go up your scalp. And I was like, okay, I keep like turning around and there's no one there. And then you and I, which no spoilers,

but for the show, Em and I go with Eva to some haunted locales. That's how we prep for the live show because we film it, show the footage. So after we went to one of the locales, I feel like something either came back or- Don't you say that. I know, but because it's a totally different energy.

It's like trickster. So I know, and this has never happened to me before since I was little and my retainer went missing and all that other weird shit with Mr. Chatfield. But I have had, and you know that I'm lose shit all the time, right? My social security guards on the floor. It takes a lot for me to be convinced

like I'm not losing stuff, it's disappearing. I have had so many things just vanish like from the most benign spots. Like I have a sleep mask. Where the fuck am I gonna lose that? It's in my house. I don't like take it out of the house with me. Right, under your bed at best.

Under my bed at best. I scoured this place looking for that thing. It just disappeared one day. And I was like, what the fuck? Could not find it. So I was like, you know what? I bought a new one. Cause it was like two months later.

And I said, I give up. I bought a new one. I got home from one of our ghost hunts and Blaze said to me, hey, did you move my hat to like the mantle up here in our room? And I was like, no. And I just, I was like, oh my God, here we go.

It's happening. And he goes, no, I'm serious. Like I'm really waked out right now. I'm really freaked out. Apparently he had had a hat specifically like hanging downstairs on a hook, whatever. And he's, you know, he's himself. He goes, this thing moved to a spot. I would never have put it, it does not go there,

it's never been there, it's too tall for Leona, it's in a very random, very specific spot. And I went, oh, well, maybe you forgot, I don't know. And he goes, no, no, no, something's going on. So then I said out loud, okay, well, if you're gonna return or like move Blaze's hat around, can you bring my eye mask back? Literally the next morning, Blaze goes, Christina, I just found your eye mask. It was like upstairs in your office and I went dude

I like I said where and he said like over in that corner I said well, you know you have to go through your cameras now and see when it appeared I in which camera Oh, you don't have a camera in there shit. I mean not like a security camera. I have this camera That's about maybe now you should get one. I should. And then I was like, I looked there a million fucking times. So then almost like playing along, I was like, okay, all right. So you finally returned my eye mask after I spent money to buy a new one.

Fine. So then I said out loud in front of Blaze again, I was like, all right, well, I've been missing an air pod that I set. I swear to God, this one I know, I set down on like somewhere, I think my bathroom counter. And I went about my day and I thought, okay, maybe like, and it disappeared. And I thought, well, maybe I went right back for it gone.

And I thought it's an air pod, like maybe Moonshine knocked it off. Maybe they vacuumed it up, somebody vacuumed it up. I don't know, I just gave up, I ordered a fucking new one. So I said out loud, okay, fine. If you find my air pod, please let me know. And then I went to Vegas. I got back last night, like 2 a.m. and I put everything down and I'm like brushing my teeth, like I said, kind of like zombie like. And I glanced down and literally sitting right in front of me on the counter where I had left it a million years ago is my AirPod. And I was like, I wiped those counters down,

like looking for that thing. I was like, I cleared the counters. We've had cleaners come in since then. And Blaze didn't put it there. No, and then this morning I said, did you find my AirPod? And he goes, no, I told you, I keep looking, I can't find it.

And I went, it is right where I said I left it, like months ago, months ago. This was when Renee visited in like March. This was like months ago. So anyway, it's just, and we have had cleaners come since then. And then today, as I was writing this down to like tell you, I heard a noise and I was wearing my noise canceling headphones and I like lifted one and I realized my printer was going and I was like, well, that's weird. Hundreds of pages. And

I'm like, oh my God, what is this? It just has all this creepy, like, smiley faces. Yeah. Look at these, I mean, it has like these creepy- Smiley face? Yes! Like little, I mean, you know what house that is, right? Look at them. We can't say it yet, but you know what house that is, right?

No, which one? Uh. Oh my God, you're right. The technology. I mean, but that doesn't feel right either. I know it doesn't. That feels the most similar. I mean, that happened at that location.

But that's also, but we can't talk about it. I know, I know, I know. I know and you know what I'm saying. I do, I do. It seems the most like it would come from that location, but maybe it's something fucking with us because it knows about what happened. It could very well be. Also, it's like different enough from that, that like it could just be some weird, oh wait, no, you're right, the disappearing stuff. Okay, that means, well, now we can't sit and rest. That's not good, that's not good. Uh-oh, okay, well, you better come to the live show

because I feel like we're gonna need to update you. We might be getting haunted by a very prominent ghost. Like perhaps the worst one to be haunted by, maybe. Okay, well. Like, look, this, and then, oh, oh, and then. Can you take a picture of that so we can post it? I did already, yes. Okay.

And I canceled it, because I'm like, whoa, it's printing like hundreds of pages, so I just hit cancel, right? And they're like falling on the ground, like out of a fucking like movie. Did you film that? That's the creepiest thing I've ever seen. No, I didn't even think to, and then I just hit stop, because I was like, it's wasting so much fucking paper. So I hit stop, and it's like job canceled.

So I go back and I sit down and I start like doing my work. I'm like, that's creepy. I took a photo. I was going to like, I was like, Oh, I have to tell them about this. I'm sitting there typing and I like pull my earphone out again. The printer is going again. And I go back and there's just hundreds more. And I'm like, I just canceled that. Like I, it said job canceled. So I had to just unplug the printer. Thank God it didn't do it again. Could you use your printer as a Ouija board and just say like, if there's something you want, like a message you have, can you just put it on the paper?

Well, there's a bunch of random letters in here. Maybe I can try and read it. Maybe not. Like a cipher. Yeah, it's a lot of wingdings, you know what I mean? Oh, by the way, if you're like not sure what I'm talking about, there's just like copy paper, like hundreds of pages. Ooh, it's giving me the chills.

Like look at the side right here, like weird thing. Yeah, it's not even how I'm talking about. There's just like copy paper, like hundreds of pages. Ooh, it's giving me the chills. Like look at the side right here. Like weird things. Yeah, it's not even how printers should be printing. How a border would work on this printer. I've used this printer by the way since I moved in and never had a problem. Could it is like Bluetooth? Could someone be fucking with you

from like a house next door? I guess, but like. That's eerie. For what? I mean. Yeah. Can you imagine if someone next door is just trying to make an escape room at home and just meant to print all that out?

Can you imagine if it's just a five-year-old and they just learned what Wingdings is and they're just trying to print? But like... That's weird. These are all smiley faces. It's hard to see, but these are all smiley faces. It's... You know, I was literally...

I have a printer in my Amazon cart. Now I'm not fucking getting one. There's just no way. Well, I'll tell you the make and printer in my Amazon cart. Now I'm not fucking getting one. There's just no way. Well, I'll tell you the make and model of this one and maybe avoid it. But yeah, I have like covered in chills. I just keep having these weird moments where I'm like, somebody's fucking with me. And so last night when I found the AirPod, I literally laughed out loud and I was like,

well, thank you. I asked for the sleep mask. I asked for the AirPod. They both appeared. Yeah. It seems like they're down to like only prank you until it's not funny anymore. Until I decide that I've had enough.

Yeah. Yeah, that's why it feels trickstery, right? Cause it's like, oh, it like ends up coming back. I mean, I ended up wasting a bunch of money on one extra AirPod, but. Do you think us going on a ghost hunt is what caused this? Or do you think this like something's awoken recently? I mean, we're both really stressed. Could it be that? Yeah, you think this like something's awoken recently?

I mean, we're both really stressed. Could it be that? Yeah, I think it could either be that, it could be, you know, having the child in the house now running around, like maybe that stirred up like some childish trickster energy. I think it also could very well have just been exacerbated by us going and like doing all these, you know,

things with our lives, or it could have been directly correlated to the investigation, I don't know. But it's just like, it's getting like eerie how on point it is. Like I'll say, can I find this sleep mask? Do you think it's listening to you right now? Probably, what should I ask?

Oh, this is the test, okay? I lost ages ago, which I feel so guilty about, the Sekhmet charm from my necklace, cause the cl so guilty about, the Sekhmet charm from my necklace, because the clasp broke, and the Sekhmet charm and the scarab, I cannot find them anywhere. And I thought they were in the pocket of my handbag, like the zip pocket, just gone.

With your hairy Werthers. With my hairy Werthers. So yeah, I guess this is my call out. If you can find it somewhere in the world where I lost it or where it disappeared and bring it back, then... And bring it back in an obvious space. So I put it on the toilet or something. Somebody very clear so that I know.

But yeah, that's a nice test. So we'll see. Man. Anyway, sorry for talking so much, but it's just been a weird couple hours slash days. It's really weird for Blaze to believe you. He this morning and it was this morning when I said the AirPod thing and I was like, I know you're not going to believe me. He's like, no, I think I do believe you now. Like I really do. And I went, oh, oh.

Because usually he'd go, no, I believe you, of course. But like this time he's like, no, I I think I really believe you. Like, I really think something's happening. And I was like, oh, oh, oh. You got to start doing some goodbye rituals when we go to these places. No, I think I really believe you. I really think something's happening. And I was like, uh-oh, uh-oh. You gotta start doing some goodbye rituals when we go to these places. I guess so.

Although I feel like I'm the worst at that. I'm like, well, I don't know. As long as you don't hurt me, you can come along. Yeah, I'm like, I don't care if you're the nicest person in the world, don't fucking come near me. I'm not interested. I'm like, I have new toner for my printer. You wanna come by?

Just see what you can do. Wink, wink, nudge, nudge. Wink, wink. Now you're the guy with the trench coat again, but with toner. With toner and wing ding font. Wow, I don't envy you, and I am scared to be near you because I don't want to rub off on me.

Not in this brand new house. You're coming to visit me very soon. I know, I know. I'd like to think like Sarah Winchester, and I'm like, if I go to your house and then a different location immediately after, maybe it'll get lost there and it won't come home with me. Oh wait, I also did a seance with my friend a few weeks ago.

Oh, shut the fuck up. I forgot about that. Oh, well, what? Was it in your house? Yes, it was. Was it with a Ouija board? Yes, it was. Well, and how'd that go?

Nothing seemed to happen. We got something that said, don't tell, no, oh my God, it was so creepy. It said, who told Tommy? And we were like, who told Tommy what? And then it just never answered us again. Also like, am I supposed to be afraid of Tommy or is Tommy the hero in this story?

Every time I text my friend Izzy now, I'm like, hey, guess what? She's like, you told Tommy? And I'm like, no, I swear I didn't tell Tommy. I've never told Tommy, I never will. I don't even know who he is. You're... Well, I can't wait.

Yeah, I'm very happy to be associated with you. You're kind of like the drama I always want. Where like, I don't want to be exactly involved, but I do want like a front row sideline. What's that TikTok trend of like your type B, type C friend? Or it's like your type A, type B, type C. And it's like, oh, I lost my wallet three weeks ago, but some guy has it and says he'll give it back next week.

My mom's gonna drive me, and just stupid shit like that. Or like, I lost my social security card on the floor of a bar, but it's fine. I don't think anyone is gonna use it. I'm sure it'll turn up. Sometimes I wonder how you're alive. I'm gonna do, trust me. Well, let me know if anything happens. I would definitely get like,

just for truly just to pull a Zach Bagans and do 24 hour paranormal surveillance, I would get a camera for like the three most like haunted rooms, you know? And don't even say anything, just be like, oh, it's for safety. Wait, I just realized where the sleep mask reappeared, where the printer happened

Is also where you saw the vinyl thing spinning That was i'm not kidding that was i've never had And because of course there wasn't a fucking camera in there, but that eva saw it too like That was easily one of the freakiest things that's ever happened because it was spot right there Yeah, okay. I feel really validated because for anyone who's not caught up or doesn't remember this story, even I were sitting at Christine's one time

and we were both sitting in, I'm assuming what Christine has turned into her cricket room because it was just full of like vinyl and cricket stuff. And there's like a lazy Susan essentially that's holding a bunch of the vinyl, right? And we were just sitting, we were not near this thing. We were not near it. You were just like lounging. We were just lying there talking.

I wish I knew what I'd said because I wonder if it was like a nod to something I just said. But the thing, it wasn't like, oh, the air turned on and like it pushed a little bit. Someone, it was like someone took a hand and like wound their hand up and spun it as fast as they could.

The entire thing did multiple full rotations by itself. Forget it. And the way that I Scooby-Doo'd out of there, like I've never had upper body strength, but I almost pulled myself off that bed like a dog. Like my legs never touched the floor. I just pushed myself off that bed and I was out of the never touched the floor. I just pushed myself off that bed and I was out of the room. And like, I remember looking at Eva and being like,

did we just both see that? And so rarely in my life have I ever had like visual evidence. And I'm so glad someone was in there with me to confirm. Well, it never, it didn't even occur to me until now because at the time I was like, nothing ever happens in there. You guys are so like I'm sure no it was it was it moved like a like a like a dreidel it went full spin full spin and so well you had been singing dreidel the dreidel song that must be why I was talking about bubby yes we were reminiscing on Hanukkah's past no it was so I totally the fact that it was in that room I totally believe you okay You got a camera in there click put a recorder in there at least see if you get audio a guest bed

It's a guest room. I don't want to like film people. I Just said put a digital recorder in there. You don't have anyone there now. I Mean not now. Yeah, I guess I just have to remove the camera before people stay over and are like, why are you filming me sleep? Oh, please. Everyone who knows you would understand when you say, oh, ghosts. No, I'm not going to tell them that if they're sleeping in there. Of all the rooms in your house, I'm surprised that's the room

you put people in. I think you want them to get haunted a little bit. I mean, not anymore. Now I'm nervous. Maybe I should move it. OK, well, I will tell you I'll never sleep in that room. The end. We'll we'll see famous last words Well, Christine, I I'm sorry that you're going through all that. That is an excellent reason why you drink. Thank you

Excellent. Excellent reason to attend a theme, you know for once very on theme I got nothing to say I was just gonna talk about the reason why I drink is because I had a great brunch that you missed out on not because you missed out on it, but because... Well, I wasn't thinking that until you said it, but okay. But because I Frankensteined my meal together because it was a French place and they had steak frites. And also, because it's a French restaurant, one of the appetizers was fresh out of the oven French baguettes with like homemade butter. And I combined the two and I sliced that baguette.

I sliced her up real good right down the middle, put my steak and my fries inside, made me a little Sammy. Oh my God, that sounds good. And that's why I drank, because I had a great meal yesterday. That was it. Congratulations.

That was mine. So I'm, I'm, but the end, okay. Well, that's why I drank it. I drink an LD as you heard me crack it open when I fully panicked. When it was too much, yeah. And that's all I've got. Are you, are you ready for a story or do you need to breathe? No, I need one so bad. Just tell me short story. I actually really had to try to make this longer and it's still like not even half of the length of my usual note. So this is just a quickie, but I saw two people mention it in messages to me going, Hey, have you ever covered this?

And I was like, that sounds stupid. I have now. Oh, that's not what I was expecting. No, you'll understand. I was like, that sounds kind of stupid. I don't know. Like, I've never heard of that. Like, is that even a thing? And then I saw a second person say it and I was like, okay, well I have to look into this. And so-

I love that the first person is out there wondering like, did I ever see my DM and go, that sounds stupid? And then close their phone. I think they would understand. Because this is the ghost of the frozen chicken. Oh, okay. All right, you're right. Okay, so they knew.

They were like, oh, I know exactly whose DM this was. It was mine, yeah. More specifically, this is the ghost of the Highgate chicken. I've also heard Highgate hill chicken. So this is April 1626, long time ago. Okay. And it's a cold, cold day in Highgate Pond,

which is in England. And Sir Francis Bacon is the main character of our story. Well, well, well, we're mixing our meat genres here. I literally, I was like, there's gotta be a joke in there. Bacon and chicken, there's gotta be. What's that a, hmm. It's not a surf and turf, it's not really. It's a supreme. A chicken and bacon is usually like a club, right?

Or is that turkey? Turkey and bacon. That's turkey and bacon. Chicken and bacon. Oh, they do a lot of, if there was a ranch situation, I feel like chicken, bacon, ranch is a pretty common thing. That feels like a Burger King situation

waiting to happen. Hmm. Anyway, I can't figure it out. I can't figure it out. I can't figure it out. But Sir Francis Bacon, he was there. And he is hanging out with his friend, the good old Dr. Witherborn. Love him.

And they're riding around in a little horse and carriage together. It's very beautiful. And it's this chilly day by the pond, and they're just riding their little carriage. Oh, how romantic. I know. They were holding hands, they were whispering sweet nothings

into each other's ear. And Sir Francis Bacon, well, actually, do you know who Sir Francis Bacon is? Should I give you a little recap on who he is? I mean, I do, but let's do a recap for... For others, right. Everyone else, not me. Wink.

Okay, so the main thing he's known for is he's the, at least for us, is he's the creator of the scientific method. Do you know what the scientific method is? Yes. And I should explain it for other people. You test it. You have to test the hypothesis. Yeah, you're right. Yeah, there's so I'm not looking at paper here, I'm guessing, but I know there were six steps. Because I remember that being on the test in high school being like, what are the six steps? And I think it was, you have a question, then you research it to the best you can, come up with a hypothesis. Oh my God, you remember this.

I don't remember this much of it. And then I think you test it, gather data, make a conclusion. I think that's it. Oh my God, wow. Yeah, but- Sir Bacon, is that you? Sizzle sizzle. You wanted me to call you that for years. It's about time I finally do.

That's exactly right. Thank you. I'm glad that we're finally here. So anyway, he is the creative scientist. That's the thing that we care the most about, but he was also the first, is it Viscount? Viscant? Viscount?

No, no. Stop trying. It's getting worse. It's Viscount. Viscount, what is it? What? Actually, yeah, it's not. No, it's Vi-Count. This Cont, what is it? Have you never watched? What? Actually, yeah, it's Vi-Count. Have you never watched Bridgerton? Oh my God. Get with the program. No. Is it really Vi-Count?

Yeah. Amazing. Of course I would have never said that. My entire life- It's not. Vice-Count. It's kind of like when I finally learned it was Hermione, but after reading it in all the books, it was hermo-ini-ni or whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel like I've seen this word a million times in my head and now I'll never be able to break away from what it's actually called.

Yeah, Viscount. Amazing. Okay. Thank you for telling me before everyone like lost their minds. Now that would have been fun. He was the first Viscount of St. Albans and he was also the Attorney General and Lord Chancellor. Um, and this is like the most like classic old English thing I've ever heard. But as a child, basically at 12, he studied at Trinity College and then he went into law.

Um, he was an advisor for the Royals and he was knighted by King James. And so our King James the first. So I think this is how him and his little buddy, Dr. Witherborn, I think this is how they know each other because they both have affiliations with King James the first. So Sir Francis Bacon was knighted by King James the first. Um, and Dr. Witherborn was King James the first's doctor. Okay. So maybe they just bumped into each other at the water cooler in the castle and they were like, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that fucking guy.

And then they became their own friends. Yeah, the water cooler. It was like this dirty well. Yeah, it was actually just sludge full of plague. And so Dr. Witherborn, he's hanging out there in their little carriage together and they start talking, and kind of just like how you and I yap on and on, I think they were just yapping and we got to this place.

They start coming up with like new ideas for how to preserve meat besides just salting it. Oh, sure. Because they're like, there's gotta be a better way. And the best guess is because it was so cold outside, they say it was snowy outside. One of the references Bacon used for his argument, he was like, well, you know what,

when we were just outside of the carriage, the carriage wheels, when they pass over the grass, even if the grass is under the snow, when you see the snow kind of go away and the grass shows up, it still looks green and fresh. So like, I wonder if you put things under snow and like keep them cold. Oh my God, he's literally using the scientific method.

That's so adorable. Oh my God, it's like he's- I'm so proud of him. Like invented already. So, so he basically says like, what if we just like tried to keep it cold and that would like preserve its freshness, just like how with the grass that we saw. And cracked.com says, being the 1600s, Dr. Witherborn found the suggestion as asinine

as washing your hands before surgery. And so Dr. Witherborn is like, you're fucking crazy. That can't be the way, like, As he's just like scratching his own, picking his own nose. Scratching his wounds and eating them or something. Yeah. Whoa, okay. Trying to think of something,

the opposite that a doctor would do. Uh-huh. By the way. That sure sounds like it. There was a kid, I'm not gonna say his actual name. Let's call him, oh, give me a name. No, please, I don't wanna know. I don't wanna know what you're about to tell me. Here we go.

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no I had a friend who was gross in kindergarten. The end. That's fucking repulsive, dude. I know. That's why we're not friends anymore. It actually makes me, like, yuck. It makes my stomach really feel ill. I remember being like, as a five-year-old, I think it was the first time I ever thought, you have to be fucking kidding me. That is so fucking foul. I'm sorry. God. Okay. So anyway, did everyone have a good tummy churn?

No. Okay. So they're trying to figure out this meat thing. He's like, there's no way that it's gonna get, that cold is the answer. Like it can't be that fucking easy. He's asinine. So Sir Francis Bacon is like,

horse carriage driver, halt the carriage immediately. And they stop in the middle of Highgate Ponds that they're currently crossing through. And in this area, I guess it was a lot of farmland. So he ran over to the first house he saw that had chickens and he knocks on the door and he says, I need to, yes, it is me, Sir Francis Bacon. It is I. That's like the most old school 1600s Bill Murray story I've ever heard.

It is, it is. He just ran by, took a chicken. Okay, Miriam, whatever you say. You're like, no. Sir Francis Bacon was here. I swear. He. It is, it is. He just ran by, took a chicken. Okay, Miriam, whatever you say. Like, no. So Francis Bacon was here. He bought me chickens, he did. Um. Did he pay for them?

He better have. I think he, it says he bought a chicken. Okay, good, good, good. But he had them totally like prep it. Some other sources said that he like killed it with his bare hands. Wow. I think it's because this is a ghost story.

And then did surgery. Right, yeah. Um, but so, so he buys the chicken somehow it is killed and prepped. And so then how long by the way, was Dr. Weatherborn just sitting in this fucking carriage for him to make a point? You know, he's like, I wasn't trying to challenge you so you could prove it. Like let's just go home.

He looked at the horse carriage driver sitting in the cold snow and went, hang on Jeeves, he has to prep an entire fucking chicken for us to make his point. Yeah, sorry, he's gonna try and make a point. He's not gonna rest until he does. He's got the six step process, it's a whole thing. Yeah, one day people, he says people will know

what it's about, whatever. So he brings back this chicken and he says, ha ha, here's a chicken. And it's also cold out. So I am going to stuff it now with snow from the ground. And we're going to freeze it from the inside out. And then I'm going to put it in this bag for safekeeping and put a bunch of snow in that bag too.

So it's frozen on all sides. OK. And that's his like whole little test. Now, the ironic part of this entire story so far is we never find out the results. I'm guessing the results are that he was right because he's literally freeze chicken. Has he get hurt at Tyson's?

Yeah. Although I will say fun fact, this makes him the inventor of the very first frozen chicken. And frozen chicken has existed then since the 1620s. That is pretty wild, actually. Would have never thought of that. When I think of like an ice box or freezing in general,

I'm like, it couldn't have been the 1600s that existed. So anyway, fun fact, he is the inventor of the frozen chicken. You knew. So and he's also the inventor of preserving meat without salt. You really should have gotten a cow, though, like just to match the name, you know. Oh, not a cow. A pig. I'm a vegetarian. I'm sorry. I get mixed up. Sorry, English and food are not my first language. Food, yes. Meat, not so much.

Basically, he's with his cow, I guess. So he freezes this chicken. And then we don't know what happens because the story ends up taking a sharp left turn. And while he was out there, I guess, waiting outside in the cold for the chicken to be prepped and which I

love that they didn't invite Sir Francis Bacon inside their own home to like prep his chicken for him. They're like, you can fucking wait outside. But he was outside the whole time and then he was like fucking with snow to like pack the chicken.

Basically he ends up getting a cold. And the story kind of ends there because the story, the next part is that this cold is what killed him. He ends up getting pneumonia and dies. Oh my God. And again, this is part of the story. I'm hearing it for the first time. This seems to be a well-known story across people

who know the history of the frozen chicken. But yeah, so usually when you hear Sir Francis Bacon, you hear, oh, he died in 1626. They don't tell you it's because he was inventing frozen chicken. Yeah, he was busy revolutionizing toddler meals forever. Yes, thank you. Like if he, you know, rest in peace, you would have loved chicken nuggets.

Exactly. You would have had dino nuggets? Forget about it. Well, he didn't know what a dinosaur was. That would have really blown his mind. I was going to say, thank God he didn't dig any deeper into that snail because he had enough to learn for one day. Brilliant.

So he ends up gaining ammonia, he dies. And then, and that's kind of where the story ends. But days after he died, people in Highgate Pond start reporting seeing a fucking chicken. Oh no. It's almost as if they say, when he went over to kill this chicken, the chicken retaliated and within

days killed him and is now on his vengeful spree and or is or is celebrating that he finally got him back. God. And so there are now many records of this throat. Not well, I guess he's not totally frozen now because he's running around, but there's this random fucking chicken who is half plucked and some say headless, some sources said headless.

There's a chicken running around just charging you. What the fuck? And then vanishing into thin air. I feel like we don't hear enough about ghost animals. Like I know we've heard of ghost horses and dogs and cats, but you don't usually hear, I mean, imagine a slaughterhouse. Oh my God, just the thought of how many millions, hundreds of millions of animals could become ghosts,

but no, just this one chicken that's getting its vengeance on Sir Francis Bacon. And also chicken retaliating on bacon is interesting. I like that. I know, that's's actually great point too. That feels very Some chick-fil-a coated. I know I was gonna say there's some sort of like meat duel that's happening But anyway before I get into the haunts of this chicken, I want to end the section with a poem that was written about Sir Francis Bacon's experience English people. Okay, go ahead. Against cold meats was he insured

for frozen chickens he procured, brought on the illness he endured and never was this bacon cured. Oh, very good, very good, very good. I love the double entendre at the end of bacon cured. So, okay, he dies, me too. That's beautiful. So, okay, he dies, now everyone's seeing this chicken. Every single website, by the way, makes a joke about the chicken being a poultry geist,

so here I go mentioning it. I cannot believe I didn't say that. Who wrote the poem? It was a man named Pip Wilson. I don't know what it was for. Could have been his eighth Great Slam poetry contest. I don't know. I just felt he deserved credit. But no, I what it was for. Could have been his eighth grade slam poetry contest. I don't know. I just felt he deserved credit.

But no, I thought it was beautiful. So people at Highgate Pond reportedly see a chicken running through the area, sometimes towards you, sometimes in circles, sometimes he is just in all directions, just scatterbrained. He's also seen hanging out in low branches of surrounding trees. And he has been known to just drop on people,

just to get you, I guess, hit you in the head. And he's also known to vanish before your eyes. So one source says that, like I said, the chicken is headless. However, all of the time, he is either half or totally plucked. Oh my God. Which a naked chicken or a hairless chicken, basically,

that is just so much freakier. And also, like, because then if you think it's alive, you're like, oh my God, it must be in so much pain. Yeah, that's terrible. That's like a really haunting experience. And also, it would be such an uncanny valley situation because like, I know people see like stray cats on the side of the road

Imagine seeing a stray hairless cat. You're like, what the fuck are you doing here? Wait, you know, that's not the usual neighborhood cat. Yeah, yeah, especially I mean I am one of those people who is freaked out by hairless cats I'm so like they really heard you talk about rat tails and a possum. Yeah Yeah, if it doesn't have her I really have a problem with it and If I saw a hairless cat charge at me, I would absolutely lose my mind. I would for sure freak out.

So if I saw a chicken version of that, absolutely I'm freaking out. And also you might not even recognize it without feathers at first. You'd be like, what the fuck is running at me? Yeah, it feels like a butterball turkey. Yeah. Did it?

It's like the sentient turkey for Thanksgiving. It feels like a cartoon. Yeah. Oh my God. So anyway, so it charges at you and then advances. That's kind of its thing. It was most often seen during World War II because that was when at this pond, a bunch of troops were stationed there.

So it was just more people, therefore more eyes, also more mouths to spread this rumor. And one soldier was said to even try to catch the chicken when he saw it because he wanted to make it into dinner. I don't know if that's supposed to be a joke or something, but if I saw a half pre-made chicken, I'd be like, someone's hands have already been all over that. I don't know. Yeah. And it's and it's a guy who did surgery right afterwards. So I don't think we need to eat that chicken. Yeah, so Anyway, the whole the main story of the world war two era is that someone tried to capture it and then never got to

Because it they watched it vanish through a wall Can you imagine coming home and being like I've got stories from war and it's like this fucking chicken walk through a wall I'd be like war and it's like this fucking chicken walked through a wall. I'd be like, tell me the tale again. You have shell shock. I see. Oh dear. You're troubled beyond repair. Yeah. Also like, like, yeah, I can't imagine the just so silly, just so silly. You know how it goes. You know, war time. So silly.

Just just the silliest. Um, so anyway, that chicken has fled the military. So that that's chicken run. Also in 1943, this was probably one of the more notable encounters, but a man heard, uh, he didn't see it, but he heard this phantom old school horse drawn carriage rolling by. Interesting. And sometimes people have heard it flying by as if like, we got to get to a kitchen and cook this chicken. Oh my god, Jeeves, step on it.

At once. So as he never saw the horse drawn carriage, but he heard it flying by him. And then he heard this loud screech and then a silence. In my mind, it's like you were saying, stop, we have to go get this chicken. Just stop the fucking car. Yes, oh, there's a farm right there. So yeah, they hear this carriage, then it screeches,

and then all of a sudden you hear silence. But as soon as you think, well, that was weird, a big half-plucked chicken comes up the hill and runs right past you and then vanishes into the air again. I mean, wow. What happened that this chicken is so traumatized? I mean, of course it was a horrible thing, but this happens to chickens every day.

I wonder why this one stuck around. I know. It's like, I feel like there's, I'm sure that chicken had a cousin who like had it worse. Right? Like, I don't know. I mean, I don't, not to like diminish his trauma or anything, but it's like, wow, I'm surprised that this is the first one I've heard of. The first ghost chicken I've ever heard of.

I wonder if in today's world he'd be a content creator and he heard that, like, he was connected to, like, a bigger story with, like, Sir Francis Bacon. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And he was like, I gotta really push that narrative, yeah. I am the trigger object of the story. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I guess I'm just gonna, I'm the star, you know?

Oh gosh, as he deserves. So other people have also heard this carrot screeching to a halt. They've heard a chicken balking. They've heard the sound of wings flapping. People have seen this thing and it's little naked chicken wings flapping around. In 1969, one driver actually, their car broke down on the side of the road. And while they were trying to fix their car, this white plucked bird just charges at him. Which that feels like goose energy.

It does feel like wild goose energy. It sure does. It sure does. And then again, right when he thought this is it, I'm going to get fucked up by this little chicken, it disappeared in front of him. I wonder if that one had a beak. Because I feel like sometimes it's scarier that it's headless, but sometimes I'm like, but those beaks could really do a number on you, you know?

Yeah, I feel like if it didn't have a beak, I could take it. Right, but also then it's a headless bird and you're like even more traumatized. You know what I mean? Like you're more psychologically scarred rather than physically scarred. Like I'm not pro animal abuse, but if I saw-

Oh, you're not? That's, oh. But if I saw a headless anything charging at me, my thought would be I could fight this fucking thing. Like, yeah, if it's gonna attack you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like I would like you to not have your weapon. So I would rather you stop. Yeah, please.

Um, put down your weapons. Put down your your face. So in 1970, this is the last real sighting that anyone had was in 1970. One couple was having a tryst out by the pond. A very, very X-rated tryst. And out of nowhere under the tree, they were under his tree and on top of them

a half plucked chicken fell out of the tree onto them. And so this chicken has like a vendetta. He's a cock blocker. He's such a cock blocker. He wow. And that was good. Bok blocker, a cock blocker. A cock blocker.

Oh my God. You just cock blocked me. Yeah. That's a double double on pong. That's the one. Um, so yeah, the chicken absolutely ruined their vibe and landed on them and then ran around them in several circles and then poof, vanished into thin air. Well, and imagine like...

the feel of like, you know, when you're... Ugh, like back when I used to make a turkey for Thanksgiving, you have to like, it's all like goose skin, like, pimply and you have to like, it's all like rubbery. I feel like that falling, like you're're having you're like all horned up like these two and it's fucking thing falls on you. I feel like every time I kiss that person, I'd be like, oh, yeah. Imagine if it accidentally created a kink and now they're like kind of into like

I guess maybe that's true. I mean, I'm sorry. I'm talking about myself. I'm talking about myself. Oh, I thought we weren't going to talk about that. Deli meat all just all over the place. I mean, honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if you told me if you confided that in me. I really wouldn't. No offense, but. No, I feel like there I like I would be. Yeah. I would just imagine like, and I like, is it cold? Is it hot?

I don't know what to experience. Is it like body temperature? That's somehow freakier to me. Or is it freezing because it's filled with snow you know oh my god yeah imagine if it was headless and now a headless bird has fallen on you and is it's guts are its guts spilling out like or is it you know it's snow is it melting out is water just dripping all over and i was gonna ask does it ever show up in at in the wind does it like in the spring or is it only winter time that it shows up? So apparently, someone had this question before.

Thank God. The most often people have seen it was in the cold. Oh wow. It's okay. Almost as if it was like residually connected to the history of it or something. Okay, that's very interesting. But yeah, so the residents who live in the area

also report seeing a big white bird just running around as I just had, especially in colder weather, which is what I guess makes it weirder because I guess if this isn't an area that now has a bunch of farmland chickens like it used to, so it's not like it's just like a bird on the loose. It's not like somebody's loose chicken, right, right, right.

Yeah. Anyway, other sources have suggested that the origin of this ghost, this was like two random websites that they said like, you know, they could be the Sir Francis Bacon thing, but other people have said, and the other people were like those two websites, but they say that the origin is that

it could just be a chicken that went missing, but then like somehow survived for 400 years. And some think that this is actually the ghost of a chicken used during a covens ritual. So that's interesting. Oh, whoa. Which in that case, if you're a witch who has ever like used any part of an animal body to as part of your ritual,

are you now connected in some way? Yeah, I don't know. Another theory, oh no, another theory is that it's just a loose chicken, but most people stand by it being the ghost of the first ever frozen chicken. Yeah, I mean, it makes the most sense, I mean, sense is kind of a wild word to use here, but it makes the most sense that it would be

the one connected to like this groundbreaking moment, I guess. Yeah. Like that was an important chicken. It was, I mean, of the chickens, you would want it to be the first at something. Yeah, it feels like it had its glory, you know? Five minutes of fame and it's just kind of extended them. Like the first cow to be a burger.

I'd like to know what that cow is about. Yeah, I mean, I feel sad that they're... It deserves to haunt a hamburger joint. I guess so, yeah. I hope he's having fun, though, like dropping out of the trees onto lovers instead of just, like, sadly, like, trying to find his head or whatever. I mean, if he's haunting, like, you know,

a steakhouse or something, like, the very first steak, I would hope the cow is, like, such a mean girl about it, and he's like, you bitches can't fucking compete. Like, I was the first. Oh, please. You call that a steak friet M inside a baguette? So I will end on this. One of the sources I used was a reporter who writes,

and I think this is a writer for, I kind of think this may be like, she might be the only person who is in charge of this. So she's not a reporter, she might be the creator of Backyard Poultry this. So she's not a reporter, she might be the creator of. Backyard Poultry Magazine. Oh! Which is a website, but apparently it's also

a real magazine, but I think it might be like an online magazine. I'm not totally sure of the situation, but Backyard Poultry Magazine exists. That's all I need to know. The end. Obviously that took me down an online spiral. Of course.

And I just wanted to let everyone know the Backyard Poultry Magazine, if you are someone who is in the world of fowl and poultry and you're farming or something and you need to know things about chickens or turkeys or quails, it's all there. Recent topics, just to give you an idea of what you can find there.

Okay. And they've got a little bit for everyone because even though I am not a farmer or a chicken owner, I can tell you my ADHD would suck me into these topics. Here are some of the more recent articles are a salad recipe for your chicken. Wait, to eat the chicken? No, oh, good question.

A salad recipe to feed your chicken. Oh, I was like, this is kind of fucked up. You're like, oh, how to take care of your chicken. And then if you want to eat them, here you go. Here's a salad recipe to feed your chicken. Oh, I was like, this is kind of fucked up. You're like, oh, how to take care of your chickens. And then if you want to eat them, here you go. Here's a salad recipe for your chicken who you will put in a salad one day. Oh, no. Then the article is, what is custard?

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. There's another one that says understanding egg yolk colors, which I love. Okay, that could be interesting. And then just a little something for the midnight doom scroll. How to spot parasites on ducks. Ah, okay, this is so good

because I feel like if I went to the dentist and they had this instead of In Touch Weekly, I'd be like, forget that. I wanna know about what's custard really. What is it? Tell me more. And also the website has a section called Flock Files, Flock Files, for quick reference sheets

to anything you could need to know about keeping poultry. And they have a rent, a hen program called Hen Pals. Hen Pals! Which pairs chickens with potential owners. Okay, I'm gonna get on this meat cute for chickens. A meat cute, I love that. A meat cute for chickens in a just- A meat cute, I love that. A meat cute for chickens. Backyard Poultry, are you listening?

Cause hen pals could have a meat cute, meet and greet, meet up situation. Yeah, I'm looking at chicken. I don't think they wanna lean into the meat part. Sorry, but I don't think that that's something that they're, even though- Give me a day and I'll ruin your entire business. And I will- What? Oh, oh, I thought you meant me. I was like, don't do that,'ll ruin your entire business. And I will...

What? Oh, oh, I thought you meant me. I was like, don't do that, it's your business too. Why would you do that? No, give me a day over at Backyard Poultry and let me come up with some ideas and I'll ruin the entire vibe by referring to them as yummy meat the whole time.

I need you to be quiet because there's a kids' corner. And in the kids' corner, I would like you to hear the top articles. Twas the Night before Christmas chickens edition Chicken enrichment toys for chickens and then my personal favorite chicken clothes for Halloween and Christmas. I See nothing wrong with any of that. There's only only right only we're oh my god. These chickens have so many clothes So if you have a chicken and you're thinking, that guy is a little too naked for me, now you know where to get the clothes?

Well, I think that chicken that keeps falling out of the trees is a little too naked and he needs a little bomber jacket. He also needs like a mannequin head or something. He needs a little help. Can you imagine if someone tried to just quote, fix the chicken and duct tape a styrofoam mannequin head to a headless running around chicken who's also naked?

Like, no. That's quite an image. chicken who's also naked. I mean, like, no. That's quite an image. That's an acid trip. I love this one. Designer chicken attire. This is a caption for the photo. Designer chicken attire by Julie Baker. Photo by Julie Baker.

There's literally, like, designer clothes for these chickens. I think the person who runs this is doing the Lord's work. I'm going to send these in the group chat where Eva has no idea what's going on. Great. That sounds perfect. Yeah. Excellent. Anyway, that is the Highgate chicken ghost. I feel so illuminated. Thank you. You are welcome. I feel that I was not... Yeah, I was not really... Yeah, take a look at those. Take a look at those. Take a gander? Hey, take a gander at these chicks. Look at those fucking outfits. Hot chicks.

I did see one of the articles or one of their summer issues. It said, how to hang out with some hot chicks like something else. And I was like, that's beautiful. You know, they just have the greatest time. I love this. Backyard poultry is my new jam. Perfect.

And if you had it on your coffee table in Kentucky, no one would question you. No, no, for sure. I've wanted chickens for a long time. I just don't have the space for them. My mom wants chickens too, but she has so many cats. I don't know. Well, now you know how to dress them. Now you know where to get the clothes.

I know. There's like all this stuff about actually like making them the right food. And I'm like, no, let's just buy another leather jacket. That's really what I'm concerned about. There was one article I saw where it was about teaching how to have quail eggs in your school room to teach kids about eggs and warming them and stuff. And then there was another, like a candling chart, because I guess people can warm up eggs with candles and you can see inside the eggshell to see the embryo stage.

And there was a whole thing about that. It was very fascinating. Like this article, cinnamon rolls. What are you talking about? I think same with the custard. I think it's like things you can put eggs in. Yeah, fair point. Okay, fair point.

Okay, yeah, they do talk about raising meat chickens too. So it's not just... That one can be called meat cute. Yeah, that one can be called meat cute. So there's room for all of us. Wow. What a... I was gonna say rabbit hole. Not quite.

What a little poultry hole you've taken. That sounds so bad. Never mind. Scratch that. No, say it again. Say it louder, though. No, no, no. Poultry hole.

Okay, I can't stop. All right. I need you to understand that this is one of the wildest part twos I've ever covered. Oh my God, it's a part two. Yep. Oh my. Okay. Okay. Okay. Hang on. Let my brain do the old school like videotape. Yeah, if you are trying to listen to this backwards, stop it right now because seriously you do need to hear.

You won't get it. You need to hear the first part. Oh, I remember. You'll get it, but it's not as interesting. Like go listen to part one, then come back to this because it's worth the part one to get to the part two. And I'm gonna give a recap for everybody just so we all are on the same part,

are all on the same page. And I also want to add that this is, remember when you said, oh, so you're not covering your crime? And I said, nope, that's not true. This episode, this is Stephen Stainter part two, and the sightseer murders. So we're gonna basically launch Pad off of this story into another true crime story if that makes sense. Oh, I see, okay, damn.

Because I was like, the last you said, which I know you'll do a recap of the last you said was that Stephen Sander is now doing good and he had got a TV rights deal. Yes, exactly. So, and originally I thought that the true crime was gonna be like, oh, he's getting like, ripped off and like robbed financially or something

I know we are going to go over Yeah, the the story there, too But yeah, it does branch off into a separate crime. So okay, okay just to give you a heads up But so here's a brief recap But again go listen to it first Seven-year-old Stephen Stainer was abducted in December 1972 by Kenneth Parnell, who sexually abused him and kept him captive for seven years. When Stephen was 14, Kenneth abducted five-year-old Timmy White, and Stephen escaped with Timmy to freedom. The media hounded Stephen,

and he struggled to process his trauma and recover, but he eventually married his wife Jodie, and they had two children named Ashley and Steven Jr. Steven and his family began to feel as though their lives were returning to normal, and Steven sold the rights to his story. And here we are, May 22nd and 23rd, 1989. NBC airs a two-part special featuring Steven's life story, and it's called, I Know My First Name Is Steven.

Ooh, okay. It's this dramatized version of Steven's story. It follows Steven from his abduction in the second grade all the way to his adulthood and marriage and 40 million people tuned in to watch this miniseries. It was sensational. To gain intimate knowledge of the real life story, the director actually spent weeks interviewing Stephen and his family, listening to all the interrogation tapes, like listening to the tapes with Stephen and describing his ordeal to the police. Like they dove deep into Stephen's life

to get all the information for the story. And while the final docu-series was compelling, it was fictionalized in a lot of ways, right? Like they were gonna make it, it's very lifetime. Like a Hallmark movie? Yes, it's very lifetime. And so Stephen's mother Kay was ultimately unimpressed and Del, his father fucking hated this movie.

The director and writers took some liberties to dramatize the Staner family. Like for example in one scene Kay and Del are like agonizing over having just $45 to fund Christmas for their children. And Kay's like, that's, no, we were never quite that destitute, but okay. It just felt like they kind of exaggerated a lot. And like all the unnecessary parts just to like add more. Yeah, to like drive it home.

Yeah, exactly, drive it home. And I feel like, if you're portraying somebody so one-to-one, like you're saying this is the story of Steven Stainer. It's like a little ickier to fictionalize it. It's not like you're saying, this is like loosely based on his story. You're like, this is him and his mom, and they're all named after the real people.

That's gotta be troubling as the family. But she didn't really mind. Like she's a very easygoing person. She basically just thought to herself, that's Hollywood and she's not wrong. She's also probably like, my fucking son's alive. I'm just gonna call it a day. I know, I know, you're right.

The miracle has happened, you know what, whatever. But Steven, on the other hand, actually seemed to really benefit from the story being adapted, which is great. I mean, I'll tell you why, we'll get to why and how it really benefited him. But just as kind of like a summation of the events that have happened till now, you know, as we said,

the press harassed the Stainer family for months on end. Stephen did not get an opportunity to properly adjust to his life back home. His dad was like really still struggling with the fact that his second grader was now in high school, you know, and had lived this whole life away from him. The siblings were growing resentful because they felt like their parents were more focused on, you know, Stephen than his older brother, Carrie, and then his sisters. And, you know, things were not smooth. It was a rocky road. But on top of that, we haven't even discussed this, which is what happened with Stephen's abductor. Because you said last week, I hope we get to hear.

Well, because last, so the last thing you said was that, I mean, he had, he had just, this was when Stephen was still kidnapped and this little boy, Timmy was kidnapped. And then when Stephen realized that Timmy was about to start the next level of abuse with this man, Stephen grabbed him and ran away. And we never heard anything about the guy coming home and finding out they weren't there or like checking the news and realizing he was like for sure a wanted man and needed to go into hiding now.

We didn't hear any of that. I know. Exactly. So there was never, there was not a focus on that last week. So to give you an update, it's not great. In fact, it's like rather infuriating. So, uh, yeah, let's get into it. So Kenneth Parnell was first tried for the abduction of five year old, Timothy white, and he received, okay, he abducted a five year old. Okay. Let's remember that he received the okay, he abducted a five-year-old. Okay, let's remember that. He received the maximum allowed sentence, which was seven years.

Like you abducted a five-year-old, and that's the maximum possible sentence. It's one of those things where like, well, because he, even if he had the intent to, because he didn't do the worst of the worst, then like, yeah, it's like, it's that stupid, like weird loophole in like police work where it's like, we have to wait for them to commit the crime for them to go to

jail for it. Yeah, it's like this weird gray area where you're like with stalkers. It's like, well, he only stalked you. He didn't, you know, he just wanted to hurry, but he hasn't yet. Like, what are we supposed to do with that? You know, that's a really good point. And so yeah, he received seven years for the abduction of Timmy. Yeah. And then there was a second trial for kind of subduction of Stephen and he also received the maximum which was seven years But he was not charged for any sex related crimes involving his abuse of Stephen or any of the child sexual abuse materials He created just was not Just like was there like statute of limitations or something or he just I do not know

How did he evade that? That's a pretty incredible thing to do. Maybe Stephen just said I don't want to go there. I don't know. Wow He also didn't have to serve his sentences consecutively, oh So he got to be out and free on parole like in between the sun. It's just so awful Like I never understood how that works Anyway, like why wouldn't you just want to get so weird. Like, who's letting that happen? I never understood how that works anyway. Like, why wouldn't you just want to get them all

out of the way at the same time? I don't know. And so he was eligible for parole. So in 1985, 53-year-old Kenneth was released on good behavior after just serving five years in prison. Five years after abducting Steven for seven years? Kate was like, he spent less time in prison than my son did as his captive.

Yeah. He literally spent less time in prison. If you need to be convinced anybody, that's fucked up. He spent less time in prison than Steven did being raped and abused by this man. Yeah, I was gonna say, he sexually assaulted someone longer than- A child. He sexually assaulted a child

and kept them from their parents for longer than he was gone. He was gone. He was on good behavior. I mean, come on. I've never understood how on earth can you have such crimes against you? And like, and I mean, I'm the most ignorant person of this stuff, but like when I hear good behavior,

I'm like, you have to be fucking kidding me that that's even a rule at this point. Like unless you had some sort of like maybe white. I'm like, you have to be fucking kidding me that that's even a rule at this point. Like, unless you had some sort of like, maybe white collar crime, where like, but if you're fucking murdering people, how on earth is good behavior even considered an option? If you're sexually assaulting children and you're like, just because you're a good, like friendly

and follow the rules in jail. Cause you swept the floor the right amount of times, or like you didn't fight somebody. It's like, you didn't you did, because you swept the floor the right, the right amount of times or like you didn't fight somebody. It's like you didn't fight someone because you're in prison, not because you wouldn't fight someone. As a child predator. Yeah. It's just, it's just so infuriating.

Like you're in jail for being violent. How on earth? I mean, and also maybe, I don't know, maybe there's in a, in a perfect world, there would actually be proper rehabilitation programs and like that it would be more realistic to believe that somebody could. I know. And it's hard because I'm like, oh, I don't wanna be like, stay in prison for, like, you know, it's all so fucked up,

but like, also, this guy has raped a child and kept him prisoner for seven years, and we're like, oh, see, he seems fine now. Yeah, I don't. If you're gonna play that game, then like, don't put people in prison for weed, right? Like, it's like, you can't, it doesn't make sense. It just doesn't make sense. It's like, okay, if we're gonna play the fucked up game, then don't put people in prison for weed. It's like, it just doesn't make sense.

It's like, okay, if we're gonna play the fucked up game, then at least play it a little bit more reasonably. I feel like if we're gonna do, if even consecutively or non-consecutively is an option, how is one of the options not, good behavior doesn't count, you're still here. How is that not part of this? Maybe I'm totally ignorant and I'm happy to eat my words

of someone if I said something fucked up. But I currently that's my hot take of like, I don't know how good behavior is something all people can be exempt of jail time for when like not all crimes are equal. Yeah, I agree. And it just it feels really unsettling that he was let out before he even served his full seven years. Yeah, at the very least, how could a judge not say, you should be gone for as long as your victim was gone? Exactly. It's just so unsettling to me.

And of course, Kay believed he was still a danger to children, that he would hurt someone again. And like, I guess that just didn't matter to anybody. They tried Irvin Murphy, his accomplice, in Stephen's abduction, and he only served two years for being anice, in Stephen's Abduction, and he only served two years for being an accomplice in Stephen's Abduction. Taking him, a seven-year-old, in the car and just driving away. Just insane to me.

But anyway, in 1989, when the special aired, Kenneth and Irvin had no more power over 23-year-old Stephen who was now, like we said, happily married, studying law enforcement in school. And actually, fun fact, in the miniseries, he played a police officer in the reunion scene where the actor playing his younger self returned home. Oh! To Merced, California, and he played a police officer kind of like in the fray. I'm glad they included him in that.

Yeah, yeah. And he actually really seemed to, like, thrive after this program aired. Did he get the acting bug? No, he just really felt like he finally kind of got, like, his own control or agency about the story. Like, he was able to talk to the press about his story now as a 23-year-old, not feeling like a child being, like, under the spotlight, but more, you know, he could tell his side of things. And he felt like he was finally in control of his own

life, his own story. People close to him said it was a very healing process, like just to be able to get the story out there the way that he remembered it happening. I'm such a dumbass. Did he get the acting bug? I really thought you were going a completely different direction when you said he like something happened in him during this I don't know. I mean, maybe he did but honestly, I'm very on my toes about what the fuck this new crime is And so I keep thinking it's like entertainment related or something because of the movie, but yeah, whatever. Sorry. It's not Fun fact spoilers. It's not so anyway, the movie was very healing for him. It was called I know my first Name is Steven.

It's very 80s dramatized, like, like slow-mo, you know? It's like, it's very 80s, if you watch clips. A lot of synth piano or something in the background. Yeah, just very moody and like serious and over, yeah. It's very 80s, let's just put it that way. And actually it was so successful, it was nominated for multiple Emmys and a Golden Globe. That's how big this- Holy shit.

It was sensational, like this was a huge deal. But unfortunately, Stephen wouldn't see it win any awards because in September of 1989, about five months after the mini series aired, a car pulled out in front of Stephen while he was on his motorcycle and he was killed in the car. Five months after the mini-series aired. Just freak accident, hit and run, the driver drove away, fled the scene, and later turned

himself in, but he died ahead of jury. This man never, never, and later turned himself in. But he died of a head injury. This man never, never, ever had a fucking break. Okay, well, hold that thought. Because one of the ways that his family has asked that this be portrayed is that he was really happy and was living a very fulfilled and happy life. And so they don't want it to come across as,

oh, he just had like disaster after disaster because his wife, for example, like, I mean, get this, he was only 24 years old at this point. Like that's how young he was. And he had spent a little over a third of that in captivity, you know, and now, you know, now he was killed. And so naturally, and by the way, just side note, the guy who hit him was sentenced to 90 days in jail

after turning himself in. But, you know, I think the fact that the media kind of took over again, because of course, the movies are the mini series is sent, TV movies sensationalized. He's on this press tour, we're all bringing the story back. And then he's killed in a freak accident. Like, of course, this is going gonna be huge on the media, around the news. And, you know, the media tended to depict this, like his life as this one long tragedy, like he could never get a break or anything like that.

That sounds like he's like never catching a break, yeah. Yeah, but his wife Jodie insisted he was very happy. He had finally found peace and happiness after his abduction. She said they lived a normal and comfortable life with their two children, whom Steven adored. Like they just, he made his life something he wanted and he had a really happy, happy life at the end.

So even though his life was cut abruptly short, he at least was able to turn it into something that he was really proud of. And, you know, his wife just said, I want him to be remembered for like this family that he created and how happy he was, you know, to finally feel like agency in life. And then, of course, deeply tragic. He was he was killed. And so that happened just months after the airing of the TV movie.

Now, fast forward to 2004, Kenneth Parnell is arrested again. Hey, I wonder what he was doing. Oh, he was attempting to traffic a child. Wow. What he did fucking. Oh, my God. OK. He didn't learn the way. I mean, here I go thinking like a pedophile. I don't know what like if I ever committed a crime like that, I would be like.

The fact that I only got five years is out of this world. I am so lucky. Qu. Like, I really somehow evaded a lot more trouble than I deserve. I better stop. I don't know what this person's diagnosis is, if Kenneth Parnell, if there is one, but what I do know is after reading many, many books about psychopathy and sociopathy,

if that is the case with him, which I'm very clearly saying I do not know, but a lot of people in this situation may be considered that way, I'm not really sure. But a lot of his crimes point to at least having a lack of empathy. And so if it were the case that he is sociopathic or psychopathic, there's not that fear. They don't have that fear of getting caught.

Beyond me. I haven't even done anything wrong and I'm scared. I know, because you have that kind of, it's a totally different, it's like turned off in their brains. Like it just, there's a lack of remorse, obviously, we know that, but there's also this lack of fear of getting caught because you just kind of assume

things will work out for you. You're like, I don't care. I'm just... Other people's problem. It's like the narcissism element of like, we'll all get away with it. It just like, man. I know. And that's why when they let them out for good behavior, I'm like, you know the story. You know how this goes, right? No one's shown them a statistics chart of like like maybe I'm wrong. Maybe there's a chart that actually proves that like the good behavior thing is worth it.

But like I would imagine quite a lot of people can just good behavior their way out of jail. Call me crazy. But yeah, it's not surprising to me that he was able to be smarmy and get his way out. Back at it, yeah. So he's arrested for trying to traffic a child. He's sentenced this time, thank God,

to 25 years to life in prison. I'm assuming the laws have advanced since the 80s. And he died in prison in 2008. So back to Stephen, he would be remembered as a very kind child, a heroic teenager who saved Timmy, and as a loving husband and doting father who touched many lives. And Timothy White was actually a pallbearer at his funeral. Oh, wow, that's actually very precious.

So they like, they stayed in touch? Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. That's nice. In February 1999, 42-year-old Carol Sund took, this is where we go in a complete plot twist. So buckle up and also... I know you're in a new home but the gargoyles at least mentally get them prepared.

Okay, I have pieces of wax from my cheese. I'll use that. Yeah, same difference. Okay, how many do I need? Let me break them off. Is that a baby bell? This is a little baby bell. I love a baby bell. Okay, so, let's see, let's see. We're in February, 1999, okay? And remember that he had passed,

Stephen had been killed in a motorcycle accident in 89. Right, it was 10 years later. 10 years later. Yosemite National Park. February, 1999, 42-year-old Carol Sund took her daughter, 15-year-old Juliana, who was known as Julie, took her daughter and her daughter's friend, her name is Silvina Peloso, to Yosemite National Park

on like a little girls trip, her daughter and her friend. The friend from Argentina, 16 year old Silvina Peloso, this is where it gets a little convoluted because they're like family friends, and I just wanna give you the backstory of how they know each other. So Carol, the mom had grown up the middle child of five siblings and was very, very, very family oriented,

had four children of her own. She was an extremely organized person. She was like the very type A, like organized birthday parties for all of her friends, was at every school sport, taught a parenting class, served on a safety committee for school children, was like deeply involved in the lives of her children. And Carol and her husband, Jens, were foster and adoptive parents and she co-founded the Humboldt Del Norte, how do you say that Del Norte? I don't know. The Humboldt Del Norte County Branch of

CASA, C-A-S-A, an organization of volunteer legal advocates for children who experience abuse. So she's just like this activist. She sounds like a power woman. Yeah, power woman, badass mom. And she also worked with a local nonprofit that provided housing for adults with developmental disabilities and rallied support for a local methadone clinic that opened in her town. And this is in like the 90s.

This is like a while ago. It was not very well-br while ago, like where it was not very easy to brush it under the rug. Yeah, exactly. And so, you know, she was just a powerhouse of a person. Like her mother, Carol, Julie, little Julie, 15 years old, was an outgoing and passionate person. She was like head first 110% involved in everything she did, loved to compete in sports, was a cheerleader. Her best friend described her as always smiling, was very thoughtful and attentive, just like her mom.

She once wrote a personal note for every single one of her friends, just about why she loved them and put them in their lockers. Like, just like one of those kids where you're like, wow, you have a very pure heart, you know? And so now I want to tell you how they knew Silvina. So Carol, the mom, had been a teenager and living in Argentina as an exchange student from the US.

And that's where she met her best friend, Raquel Peloso. And they became BFFs. And when Carol moved back to the US, they stayed really close, like just writing letters, calling, they just stayed long distance best friends. They both got married and they both had Julie and Silvina just a year apart. So now they had daughters the same age. And so in 1985, Carol and her husband took Julie to Argentina to meet Silvina. And so Carol was

like reunited with her best friend and then brought her daughter to meet her bestina. And so Carol was like reunited with her best friend and then brought her daughter to meet her best friend's daughter. And they like immediately bonded and became BFFs. And like almost- So two generations of BFF. Yes, like took over the friendship. Like they were just clicked,

just like their parents did, their moms did, which I thought was just such a cool story. And I love the way Saoirse wrote here, Julie and Silvina inherited their mother's friendship. I was like, that's beautiful. I love that. That's beautiful. So in 1998, Silvina now, and it's like such a full circle, Silvina arrived in California as an exchange student

to live with Julie. Oh, that's so weird. Isn't that crazy? And like decades before, Carol had gone down to Argentina as an exchange student. And anyway, so. That's so weird. Isn't that crazy? And like decades before, you know, Carol had gone down to Argentina as an exchange student and anyway, so. That's very cool. Yeah. So she was staying with the Sund family.

She took honors, math and science courses at Julie's high school, started playing basketball with a local league. Back home in Argentina, she had loved roller skating. And when she got to California, she fell in love with ice skating and snowboarding. And Sylvina and Julie were very close, but Sylvina was more serious and like just a more kind of intense person, but also extremely kind. She struggled to make friends at first because English

was hard for her, but she and Julie bonded immediately, just like their mothers had. And so Julie and Sylvina decided they'd go with Julie's mom, Carol, on a trip to Yosemite. So February 14th, Carol, Julie, and Sylvina checked into the Cedar Lodge at Yosemite National Park. And this was like a short trip. The trio was supposed to return a rental car at the end and meet Carol's husband at the San Francisco airport to kind of like round out their trip.

February 17th, three days later, Carol's husband reported all three of them missing when they failed to show up at the San Francisco airport at their like agreed upon meeting place. And because it was winter in Yosemite, there were these hazardous driving conditions. Authorities suspected perhaps Carol drove off a snowy road and maybe they were stuck in a snowbank somewhere. Been there, done that. And perhaps Carol drove off a snowy road and maybe they were stuck in a snowbank somewhere, been there, done that. And so they thought like, oh, maybe they've just had car troubles, it's entirely possible, things like that happen all the time. And so authorities weren't too worried. They said worst case scenario, something terrible has happened, an accident, maybe they went over a cliff or into a river. But they were pretty optimistic that they would find them alive and well, like maybe just car trouble, maybe in a snowbank somewhere. So they launched this enormous search effort and even the Navy assisted by flying airplanes overhead, but there was no sign anywhere

of Carol, Sylvina or Julie. Carol's father took it upon himself to scour the park by himself. He brought a gun, a rope, first aid kit. He was like ready for whatever he was able to find. He was checking rivers for signs of a crash. He actually had a gut feeling that this could have been an abduction or like a violent crime. And so he was searching garbage cans at the lodge

where they had been staying, wondering if he would find either their bodies or his daughter and wife and their close family friend. And he's looking in the garbage cans at the lodge for maybe bloody sheets, bloody clothing, like any sort of clue he can find. I can't imagine the mindset of like almost hoping you find something.

And it's like, even though your wife's bloody whatever, like just for an answer. It could affirm your worst fears, but it gives you some clue. He spoke to everyone he could, but nobody had seemingly seen the trio anywhere. There were not many people coming and going this winter. It was very isolated, very quiet. One of the few people that was out pretty much every day that month was 26-year-old Joey Armstrong. She worked in the park as a naturalist and lived with a roommate in a remote cabin. And the cabin had been provided to her as housing

for park employees. And she was the type of person who, you know, was very, very into the outdoors, but also very determined to kind of make a very specific path in life for herself. So she was able to overcome any fears that maybe stood in her way. She was able to basically launch herself into this very, very competitive position, living and working in one of the most popular parks in the world. Um, and she was able to, to get this gig, which was like a dream come true.

Her mother Leslie said she was exquisitely happy working at Yosemite, even though it was just like very remote, off-the-grid living. But because of these recent disappearances, people were feeling kind of on edge and anxious as the days went by and there was no sign of these three women, well, women and young women. So March 15th, which was roughly a month later, Silvani's, Julie's and Carol's rental car was discovered several miles from where they were last seen at the Cedar Lodge. And the car had been completely

eviscerated by a fire so intense that it scorched the branches on nearby trees 25 feet in the air. Holy shit. Okay. So like beyond intentional, whatever happened. The FBI discovered the skeletal remains of two people in the trunk. And these bodies were identified as Sylvina and Carol, but Julie was nowhere to be found. And so her dad held onto this hope that maybe they could find her. Oh my God.

But they had no leads and the room where they had stayed at the Cedar Lodge was virtually void of evidence. Like nothing even seemed out of the ordinary, no signs of a struggle. Nobody had witnessed anything unusual. And basically when all seemed hopeless, a letter arrived at the FBI headquarters and the letter contained a hand drawn map of the Don Pedro reservoir. Ew! Okay, so now this person just wants to play a fun little game.

The map pointed at the location where they would find Julie and wrote, we had fun with this one. Whoa, oh my God. Is that not the most fucked up thing you've ever heard? Oh my god. Like that fucked me up. I, that really.

No, that's, that's, that's very. That's like a gut punch. Cause that also confirms like even if you find her like she's gone through it. What if she's, she is without incredible therapy work she is, we have traumatized her. She's alive. She's not. They found Julie's remains on March 25th, more than a month after her abduction. Her remains were badly decomposed, but it was determined she had died when her throat

had been cut. The FBI arrested three people who were on parole for drug-related convictions, one of whom allegedly made these kind of incriminating statements about being involved in what would become known as the sightseer murders. And so with suspects in custody, everyone kind of like breathed a sigh of relief at Yosemite thinking like, oh, they put these three people away, you know, the bad guys are gone. We don't have to be looking over our shoulders all the time.

And so, Joey Armstrong, the naturalist who worked in the park, called her mom and said, oh, I feel safe again. Finally, living out here, it was like kind of scary for a few months while, or for a month while we figured, while everyone was on their, on edge trying to figure out what happened to these people. But now that these murderers were in jail and they're building a case against them, she told her mom, okay, I feel safe again. But four months later, in July of 1999, Joey was reported missing by her friends when she failed to show up for plans she had made. Oh, God. Okay.

On July 22nd, Rangers in Yosemite drove to Joey's cabin where they found her truck parked in its usual spot, but it looked like she had been in the middle of loading it for a trip. Oh my god. And soon afterward, her remains were discovered in a creek near her home and she had been decapitated. Whoa. Okay. Wow.

So someone's like... And sorry, you probably already said this but so Joey is now a separate story This happened to also be she happened to be in Yosemite she worked in Yosemite as a naturalist and She had been following this story very closely because she worked there And so she called her mom when they put those three men in jail and said, oh, phew, I finally feel safe.

And then- I was gonna say, like, I can't imagine just no way that someone's out in the woods where you work and you're by yourself. Exactly. And so she had, like, everyone kind of had this false sense of security because they had put these people in prison.

Turns out, maybe not because- Or maybe not all of them or something, yeah. Exactly. So the authorities informed Leslie, Joey's mom, that remains had been discovered, but they hadn't confirmed yet that they belonged to Joey. And so they didn't share the details of how they found her body. And instead Leslie found out that her daughter was dead when she saw a newspaper headline, which read Yosemite naturalist beheaded. Oh my God. Oh my God. Oh my God.

And she hadn't even known that aspect. And she hadn't even been, it hadn't even been confirmed to her that it was her daughter's remains. I, I, I'm, I can't even imagine how many times she had to reread that until it processed that it was. And just like that, just you can't unsee that, you know? Yeah. I mean, horrible.

So now people of course are questioning like, well, shit, could that have been the sightseer killer back? Like, did they arrest the wrong people? It's like kind of crazy to think that this is unrelated, this gruesome murders unrelated to the one that happened a couple months ago. Like, clearly they're connected somehow. And if the wrong people were in custody for the first case, that means investigators were basically back to square one

with no evidence and no leads. And if the wrong people were in custody for the first case, that means investigators were basically back to square one with no evidence and no leads. And with now several months away from evidence because now it's all been contaminated. Exactly, exactly. So it's been months and they've been eyeing the wrong people. And so it's like, oh shit, now they got to start over.

And they're, like you said, like this person has an advantage. However, not for long, because he had not been so careful this time. A witness had actually spotted a vehicle near her remote property at the time of her attack and they were able to identify the owner of the vehicle, investigators were. And to their surprise, he worked in maintenance and also lived at the Cedar Lodge where Carol, Sylvina, and Julie were last seen. So they're like, okay, this is a great connection.

And to be clear, they went to pick him up. So this FBI agent, Jeff Rienach, was tasked with picking up this maintenance man to bring him in for questioning, but he was considered a witness because he's not a suspect yet. Somebody just saw his car in the area. We're just here to ask a couple of questions,

just a couple of cues. Exactly. So they pick him up as a potential witness, not a suspect. And Jeff located the man, fun fact, at the Laguna del Sol nudist colony. Just a couple of cues. Exactly. So they pick him up as a potential witness, not a suspect. And Jeff located the man, fun fact, at the Laguna del Sol nudist colony and basically said, hey, come with me to the FBI office. We have a few questions. And he's like, I mean, okay, sure.

So he gets into the car with the FBI officer, FBI agent, and they're just chatting. And Jeff, the agent later said, we were two guys that didn't know each other, that were stuck doing something that we didn't really wanna be doing. And so we were making the best of it. We were just talking amongst us. And this young man starts opening up to Jeff and began speaking about his life.

And he said, you know, I have this, my younger brother died a few years ago. He had been abducted. I don't know if you've heard of him. His name was Stephen Stainer. Are you kidding me? And it turns out the potential witness to Joey's death was Kerry Stainer, uh, the oldest, the eldest of the Stainer siblings.

What? Stephen's older brother. I've literally only, only, I... I almost asked five different times so far. I was like, what does this have to do with Stephen St different times so far I was like what does this have to do with Stephen Stainter but I was like wait for it wait for it wait for it wow really okay that I see the okay okay okay wow so Carrie witness it was the witness that they're bringing in the potential witness and so

they're bringing him in and he's like kind of opening up and he's like yeah you know my I don't know if like, yeah, you know, I don't know if you heard of him, you know, Steven Stainer, that actually was my brother. I'm Kerry Stainer and Jeff, the FBI agent said like, he said, I genuinely care about people and like people just grow comfortable talking to me. Like he's just one of those people where he's like,

I'm just not judgmental. And so he just felt comfortable, I guess, to just start chatting. And he asked Kerry about Stephen's abduction and Kerry told Jeff how little time Kenneth Pardnell had served and how unfair that was. And they were just kind of talking back and forth. Jeff really listened to Kerry

and even offered to help him find counseling to process his trauma and his grief. And finally they reached the FBI office and Kerry met with a couple other FBI investigators and then he asked to speak with Jeff privately. And so Jeff was like, sure, let's go chat. So they sit down and Carrie says, I'm the one who abducted and murdered Carol, Sylvina, Julie, and Joey. Whoa. Just, just like that. That's a little too easy.

Just like that. That feels a little too easy. Okay. When asked how Jeff got Carrie to confess, he said, quote, "'It would be a disservice for me to cause people to believe that I did that intentionally. I didn't know what he did. I don't judge people, so when they talk to me, they feel comfortable.'"

So he basically was like, listen, no pressure whatsoever. And he just said, I got to get this off my chest. I'm the one who did it. He's just got that gentle spirit that just lures you in. Wow, okay, what a superpower. But the fact that Carrie, the older brother, just admitted to four murders. Yeah, yeah.

Like brutal, violent, premeditated murders. I mean, especially, I mean, I guess the only thing we really heard about him when he was when he was younger and dealing with the Steven stuff, the only thing we really heard was that like, he felt kind of he grew up feeling a level of unloved or like he didn't get enough. The time he got with his parents was usurped by the grief. And so he never really got a full the full bond he thought he deserved with his parents was usurped by the grief. And so he never really got a full,

the full bond he thought he deserved with his family. So exactly. I could see like the the psychology kind of working there of like needing control of something. There's a little, yeah, there's a little bit of resentment there on the part of all the siblings. And so, yeah, you can definitely see kind of a through line there. And I will tell you, his defense team for sure brought that up a lot. Yeah. Sure. I mean, what I'm thinking more is like, those fucking parents, I feel so, like they already went through trauma, trauma, trauma, and then boom, the one kid who like wasn't

causing too much trouble as far as we know. I don't know what he was up to as a kid, but now you got another kid that's like all of a sudden like breaking news. Like remember when the police came to their house and knocked on the door and they said, what happened to Carrie? Because he was off at college and they thought like maybe something had happened. They said, no, we found Steven.

Like then this guy would grow up to be a serial killer. I mean, it's just what the fuck is going on? The poor parent, they have to, when they first found out, I have to, again, I don't, like, maybe there was like more to his childhood that we never really talked about yet, but I feel like that mother and father had to look at each other and go,

this can't be happening more to us. Please don't make this happen more to us. No, it's like we've, how much more can there be? But like, I just, I can't imagine what's going on in their heads. Just reeling, just constant reeling. And the other siblings, like the younger siblings, like both of our older brothers, you know,

I mean, it's just horrible. And so, yeah, basically he just confessed to Jeff. Like I think he just wanted to get it off his chest. And Steven's children, so this would be Carrie's, Stainer's niece and nephew, Ashley and Stephen Jr., they barely knew their uncle because after their father died, they didn't really have much contact

with his side of the family growing up. I guess maybe they were just closer to their mother's side of the family. You know, their father- Or could they have sensed to like stay away from Uncle Carrie? Like, was there like a thing there? I mean, they were kids.

I think it's just that they just weren't in contact with the paternal family. Okay. And so Ashley had been following, that's Stephen's daughter, had been following the Yosemite murders on the news for months. And then her family sat her down and said,

that's your uncle who did that. And she was just flabbergasted. How would you even expect something like that to drop in your lap? No, there's no, I don't know. I don't know. And so the media immediately linked Kerry's crimes, of course, to Stephen's stories. The media is just like, this is our best year ever. They're getting to story after story on this case. And so stories covering the murders would begin by calling back to Steven's abduction

before then revealing what Carrie had done. Which I guess is sort of like how I'm telling the story, right? Like this is just the wild sequence of events. One headline, for example, read, "'One brother saved a boy, one brother killed four women.'" So, you know, this is just being like all over, blasted all over the place.

Yeah, I'm sure. I mean, it is certainly newsworthy. It's very sensational, like, in and of itself. It doesn't even need to be exaggerated. It's already just out of control bananas. Yeah. And Ashley, Steven's daughter, had grown up learning about her late father

from other people and even the miniseries. Like, she used to watch the miniseries, and she always pictured her dad as the actor because she didn't, I know, because she didn't know, she couldn't remember really seeing him. She knew the actor version of him better than the real version.

And he was a hero, of course, and Ashley knew that, but she said in an interview that media coverage of Carrie's crimes made her feel like her dad's story was kind of tainted somehow. like it got wrapped up in, you know, this bigger, worse, horrible thing. And Steven Jr., unfortunately, had to avoid school for weeks because he started getting harassed at school. It's like this, like, ongoing cycle.

And there is a, um, I mean, there are different, different contexts, but it is interesting how there is now two generations of Stevens who can't even go to school without being harassed because of some sort of sensational true crime. I mean, for real, it's such a weird cycle. Like, it's so unheard of, I feel like, that this first is just for a different thing, too.

And the other sad thing, too, is like, I would, if I were in that position, if I were Steven Jr. my first thought would be the only person who would know what this is like as my dad and he's not here. Oh, that's so true. It's like, you're following in his footsteps, but you don't even get to bond with him over it or like seek his guidance or advice or wisdom. Yeah, that's really heartbreaking.

I hadn't thought about it that way. And so yeah, it's almost like the cycle repeats itself. He's back at, you know, he's avoiding school because his classmates are harassing him about his uncle's crimes. Ashley stopped talking about their father completely, almost just like didn't want to even go there with anybody. Sure. And as the case against Kerry progressed to trial, the defense team worked to make Kerry as sympathetic as possible to avoid the death penalty. According to friends, Kerry struggled with anxiety from a young age, even before Steven was ever abducted.

He would apparently pull out his hair and would wear hats to school to cover the bald patches that he, you know, pulled his hair out. Of course. Once Steven disappeared, friends and family said the other Stainer children were kind of left to process their emotions alone without like the guidance from their parents. And there were more problems at home than Stephen's abduction. For example, Kerry accused one of his uncles of sexually abusing him when he was young. Accusations were raised against his father, Dell, who allegedly sexually abused the sisters, Kerry's and Stephen's sisters. Oh, wow.

But this is, I don't have any verification of any of this. This is just what's coming out during the defense. I'm sure they tried to like bastardize the whole family to be like, well, it's not, you know, well, look what happened to him maybe over here. I know. And they really lean into that to say kind of like he was a, and it's to be fair, like, sure, it's probably true. They argued that he was a victim of multi-generational abuse in the Stainer family and that his

trauma was compounded by Stephen's abduction. I certainly don't doubt that, but the prosecution also highlighted Kerry's violent ideations, which he described even having as a child. So this has been something kind of percolating in his mind since childhood. He had often fantasized about torturing and murdering women since childhood. And the defense argued that Kerry needed intervention as a child to be diverted from his violent ideations, but he was failed by his family who was too busy focusing on Steven. But then the judge and the jury were like, I don't know that like you can blame them

for not knowing how to intervene in that for him, blame them for him growing up to kill people. Yeah, it just seemed like that's a little bit maybe of a stretch. I don't think that the lack of childhood intervention necessarily made him a killer, you know? I mean, because I feel like that argument could be used for any other family dynamic where like one kid needs more attention than the other. And it's like, well, you're the reason I'm a serial killer. What? Yeah. And it's like intervention is such a're the reason I'm a serial killer. What? No?

And it's like intervention is such a broad term. It was the 80s. What do you mean? Like intervention, I mean, I'm assuming with a psychologist. Remember Dell also was very anti-psychiatry. Yeah, and even if he was, it was not as common as it is today or accepted as it is today.

Very good point too. I don't think they would have even known what to do. Think of like, if you've got a sibling with additional needs, it's like the siblings of kids with additional needs don't become serial killers. Like that's not a good argument. Just because of that. Like, yeah, it's not like there's not a correlation there, you know what I mean?

Or causation, I guess. There's not like, or a correlation. And was this with the court, was this the court's defense or does he truly, has he like said this himself that that's the reason how he turned out this way? That's just what his defense was saying on his behalf. So I assume that was the argument he went with, you know? But forensic psychologist Lewis Schlesinger said of the case that there are many people in the world who do entertain violent fantasies internally, but do not go out and harm people.

Do not go out and act on them. Yeah, there's a lot of people who don't get attention and aren't killers. Exactly, and there are a lot of people who maybe think about it, which is a scary thought, and don't act on it, because they know it's not good. It's a bad thing to do. That makes me even wonder too,

because so if his argument is that this was always in him, and whether or not his brother had his own sensational case, this was just destiny for him. That he was just gonna be a killer. No, he did not argue that. He did not argue that. He argued, they argued that, oh, he just had, oh, well, I guess sort of, yeah, I guess sort of.

He argued that it was all the stress and neglect and abuse that sort of pushed him into this, if that makes sense. Gotcha. I feel like... Because it was the prosecution that brought up he had violent thoughts. That was not the defense. The defense did not go there.

Okay. The prosecution was like, oh, he's had violent thoughts forever. This is not new. I wonder if... I mean, we'll never know if it's true or not, if he had violent thoughts, but if he did while his brother was missing, I wonder if there was something, this is like my whatever crumbs I have left of my psychology degree kicking in, but I wonder if because it happened when he was a certain age, if this fascination, like a morbid fascination came with like what could be happening to my brother right now and like

Yeah, because it's it's a it's a intense trauma and like to think like oh my brother was like sexually assaulted by this man I mean, yeah, yeah, you're right. Like you're sure at a young age. You're forced to think about violence Yeah, exactly. You shouldn't have to think about that. That's yeah, that's why I wonder if there was something there but also I mean, I wonder if he was thinking like, like, let's say, this didn't trigger him having violent thoughts, because he was forced to think about like, what's happening to his brother, if he already was more inclined to have violent thoughts, I wonder what he was thinking when he found out years later that his brother was alive being like, Oh, so you didn't do that, or, oh, you didn't hurt him enough.

Like, I wonder if he was, like, comparing, like, notes in his head of, like, what he would have done. I don't know. I... I mean, I think he fantasized about hurting women, not men, so I don't know that he would have been thinking, like, well, I mean, I don't know what he was thinking, but... I just wish I had his direct answer, but he would never admit, obviously,

admit to something like that. But I, um... Yeah, I imagine it I had his direct answer, but he would never admit, obviously admit to something like that. But I, um, yeah, I, I imagine it had to be some somehow connected to the fact that he was just engulfed in that world from a young age. Like that's not anyone's fault. He just got sucked into this. Yeah. But so were his sisters, you know, and it's like, Oh, that's a great point. Yeah.

Yeah. And like Stephen was more so than anyone and he had two kids and just was living a normal average happy life, and that's all he wanted. It's like there clearly is something, and I think you're right, like it probably was, I don't think it's an easy like nature versus nurture. I think it's just that casual combo of both that nobody can quite nail down the formula, you know, of, well, it's probably if he had, if he really had had violent fantasies since like before Steven

was abducted, then yeah, maybe that was compounded by this stress and trauma and just spiraled out of control, right? It seems like it must have been a combination or multifaceted in some way. Wow. Yeah, definitely a plot twist. Totally makes sense now why you paired these stories together. Isn't that wild? I mean, it feels like, too, it feels like stranger than fiction, you know?

And so an investigator on the case, going off of what I just mentioned about the forensic psychologist saying like, yeah, well, a lot of people have violent thoughts and don't act on them. Right, right, right. And one investigator on the case also said he believes that what makes Carrie and serial killers different is that they choose to act knowing they're crossing a line. Like, they know they're crossing a line. They're not...

He's not pleading insanity. He's not saying, I had no idea what was reality or... He knew. He knew he was crossing a line idea what was reality or, you know, he knew he knew he was crossing a line. What was the thing he said? Um, when he admitted he was like, well, I didn't, I didn't mean to hurt them, but what was the sentence he said? He said something like it wasn't intentional.

Did he say something or was that not him? I don't think so. Okay. Maybe I'm just misremembering what happened. Anyway, sorry. Keep going. I keep interrupting you. No, you're fine. I'm looking back to see. Oh happened. Anyway, sorry, keep going. I keep interrupting you. No, you're fine.

I'm looking back to see. Oh, no, no, no, sorry. The intentional thing was when the FBI agent said it would be a disservice for me to cause people to believe that I got him to confess intentionally. Oh, oh, oh, oh, okay. Because he didn't want it to come off like he was like manipulating and tricking him.

He was just saying, I'm just a guy that people open up to. I was not trying to push him into confessing. And he said like, it would be a disservice to pretend like I did that on purpose, but I didn't. It was just, he wanted to get it off his chest, I guess. And so the night he killed Sylvina, Carol, and Julie, this guy, he had originally planned to actually kill his girlfriend and her two daughters. That was his original plan. Dang. And then it was like too real for him. So you had to do something more removed. Nope.

No? Oh, wow. I was thinking he just found exactly the same kind of ages and all that. Well, he did. But the reason he didn't kill his girlfriend and her two daughters is because there was another man present and he missed his window of opportunity but the reason he didn't kill his girlfriend and her two daughters is because there was another man present and he missed his window of opportunity, and so he wasn't able to pull it off. So instead, he returned home to Cedar Lodge, where he began looking through the cracks of the hotel room curtains until he spotted Carol

alone with two teenage girls. And that's when he was like, -"Oh, perfect, a good little replacement." -"That matches the storyline." Yeah. Oh, God. Oh, no, and like, so that's... That also is extra creepy as like, I guess it's not really Israel Keys territory at random, but it's still like...

It feels wrong place, wrong time, you know? It feels. It's like the only reason you were attacked is because you happen to be... You matched a certain... ...a woman and two girls. And you happen to stay at this particular cabin where this particular maintenance man

wanted to attack a woman and two girls I mean, it's just it's just which like and he'd never killed before you think he would just want to try with one person first because like Three is an ordeal compared to one and you don't know what you're doing yet No, I'm not trying to like make light of it. But like I'm trying to think like wouldn't you want to practice with? less I mean I'm trying to think like, wouldn't you want to practice with less? I mean, so I don't know. I'm, I'm trying to like rationalize something that's irrational.

I don't think there's the same thought processes going on in somebody with this kind of a mindset, you know? And so he spotted Carol alone with two teenage girls. So he knocked on their door, told them he needed to do some maintenance because he was the maintenance man at the lodge. So he just- And conforming to authority is a very, unfortunately, natural social thing we all do. So if anyone had a ladder, they'd go, okay, well, you can come on in. I mean, you just have to wear your uniform or your outfit.

I mean, maybe they've even seen him before if they've been staying here a couple of days. Who knows? And so he knocks on their door, he tells them he needs to do some maintenance in the room, so they let him in. Once inside, he strangled Sylvina and Carol, the mom, to death, then took Julie, abducted her, and murdered her elsewhere. He later spotted Joey by chance

and decided to murder her on a whim. Just like saw her, parked his car, was like- He was on a high from his spree. I guess. I mean, that was months later. Yeah, but I feel like if, I mean, again, I don't think this way, but I would... It's like a fix. I have to imagine, yeah, like once you've done it,

it's like you have to keep the high going or something. Yeah, like I did it once and, you know, so he sees her packing her car for that trip with her friends and he just... I mean, out of the woods, like, I mean, that's just horrifying. And so he murdered her just on a whim and he later said he would have continued killing until he was caught or decided to take his own life. So he just said outright at this was what I was just going to be doing this for the rest of my life. Well, I guess snaps for honesty. What?

Like, like, OK, it's weird that he just admits that he's just ruthless and has there. I mean, that's the ultimate thing you could say about no remorse being put on death row. So I don't think that he has much love, you know, that's still like I. Yeah. Wow. And he later spot, and I think a lot of these people, when they talk about these kinds of things, they're like, yeah, something's wrong with me. I just love to murder people. You know what I mean? Like they almost recognize from like a third party perspective, like weird. Like, it seems that no one else is doing this, which makes

me think that there's something going on. They're all really mad at me for this, you know, and it's like no he knew he was doing it He knew he was doing something terrible. So it's like he knows he's not supposed to be doing that and norm quote normal people Don't do that. So who knows maybe he's just like Intellectually like kind of like Ed Kemper saying, you know, it's the weirdest thing Just say never would have stopped to say like oh, I would have just kept doing it. It's just like the ultimate confirmation of like, I have no remorse or empathy. It's like, because I don't know how you could do that to somebody and not at least like an ounce of you go, I really shouldn't have done that.

Well, but don't you think like why else would he have confessed so quickly? I just I wonder like something must have pushed him to confess. I think he wanted to stop. Like that's what I mean is when he says like, I would have kept going until someone stopped me or I die or I ended my own life. Like it seems like he just was like, I was either addicted to this or I just couldn't stop myself. It just seems like there's a lack of self control.

I don't know. Because, like, he clearly confessed pretty damn quick. Yeah. Maybe he was, like... I don't know. I mean... I don't know. I don't either. I don't either. So, ultimately, Carey was sentenced to prison for life for the murder of Joey Armstrong,

and he was then sentenced to death for the murders of Carol and Julie Sund and Silvina Peloso. He remains on death row to this very day. This is as of September 3rd, 2024. The Yosemite National Institute launched a new program called, not new now, but new at the time, program called the Armstrong Scholars, named after Joey Armstrong, which seeks to connect women ages 15 to 18 to nature through a 12-day backpacking trip in Yosemite's high sierra. And the program states, individuals from different cultural, ethnic, racial, religious, LGBTQIA-plus, and socioeconomic communities come together for an expedition of discovery, leadership,

and personal challenge. There are many ways to identify as a woman, and all of those ways are welcome on this program. Oh, okay. Which is really cool. And so, you know, Joey at least got that in her honor and Leslie's very proud that her daughter is still touching lives, you know, years after she died. And in the wake of this tragedy, the sons expected last we heard about 3,000 people at the memorial service for Carol and Julie. And Silvina's parents came up from Argentina. Her older sister had to stay back because she couldn't miss school. But the Pelosos, Silvina's family, when they came to visit for the memorial, they befriended Carol's parents and they all kind of leaned on each other because now Carol's parents had lost their daughter and granddaughter, and the Pelosos had lost their daughter.

And so, you know, Raquel having been friends with Carol, now befriended her parents. Yeah, and her mom. So it's very generational, you know? It's very, I mean, I also, I can't imagine being that woman and getting a call thinking like, oh, my daughter's just checking in from the States. And it's like, actually, everyone you love is dead.

Like, that's just shocking. It's shocking. It's breathtaking. In the most brutal and horrific, not an accident, not a freak accident, you know. And so, yeah, the Polosus became very close with Carol's parents, and they leaned on each other for support as, you know, having gone through similar traumas. And they brought Sylvina's remains home to Argentina and they were all able to bury their daughters.

And that is the case of the Stainer, Stephen Stainer, Kerry Stainer, the sightseer murders. And to think like Stephen Stainer was killed, so his life was so abruptly cut short. And then his brother lived on and just have this has this terrible legacy, you know, it's just, it's just so mind boggling to me. It's good. I can't imagine the conversations that their parents have had about just like, what does it all mean? And like, man, oh my God.

Well, I mean, talk about plot twist after plot twist after plot twist. Seriously. Also I'm gonna send you the Kerry Stainer mugshot. It's like one of the scariest mugshots ever. He's really, okay. Yeah, he's very frightening. He's also known as the Yosemite Park Killer,

which like, imagine you have one kid who's abducted and becomes this international superstar, like on all the talk shows. And then your other son becomes a literal named serial, the Yosemite killer with his own Wikipedia page. Yeah, but I can also see like the narcissism situation again, because it's just like, oh, so my brother got all the attention.

So like now I need these attention. I don't care how I get it or whatever. Ugh. Like. Here, he said, I wish I could take it back, but I can't. I wish I could tell you why I don't care how I get it or whatever. Ugh. Like... Here, he said, I wish I could take it back, but I can't. I wish I could tell you why I did such a thing, but I don't even know myself. That's where I kind of got into that weird, like, intellectualizing it,

like Ed Kemper does. Like, I think I have mommy issues. It's like, oh, yeah. It's like, yeah, you do. Interesting. He said, I wish I could tell you why I did such a thing, but I don't even know myself. I'm so sorry. I wish there was a reason, but there isn't.

It's senseless. Wow, at least he knows it. And Joey's mother believed that his apology was genuine. She believed what he said. Good for Joey's mom. That's, I mean, I guess at that point, all you have left is like, do you want to sit with us for the rest of your life or not?

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I guess the only silver lining is like, do you wanna sit with us for the rest of your life or not? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I guess the only silver lining is like, at least Steven wasn't alive to see this happen. I know, I thought the same thing. But he could have probably helped his kids through it, like you said, which is just so tragic that he wasn't there. I would be fascinated to hear what he would have to say about this if he found out his own brother

was also someone to be scared of. And just to even see, like here, I'm sending a picture of them hugging, like when they got reunited. It's just so trippy to be like, oh, these are the two. And then how things just went so wrong, you know? Wow. And when they made that TV movie

and they like focused on Carrie's struggles in the house. And of course they wouldn't know for decades what he would become or what he would do. It's just so chilling. Imagine having played Carrie in the show, you know? And then like learning what the guy did that you were trying to embody that whole time. I mean, I'm absolutely reading into this,

but this picture of the two brothers hugging, I'm totally reading into this, but it does look like he's not giving that intense of a hug for someone whose brother went missing for a very long time, and we all thought was dead. So in my head, now that I know the story, I'm like, oh, maybe it was always in him,

but I'm totally making that up. I do not trust the media on that. If there's a, after the whole, what's her name? Amanda Knox, where the photos got taken totally out of context and she was basically put in Italian jail. I mean, I don't trust. Yeah, exactly. That's why I'm like, I'm very aware

that I'm putting my own thoughts onto the picture. However, the mug shot, knowing what he has done with those scene and done with those eyes. The mug shot's pretty wild. Ugh. Man, you really know how to tell a story, Christine. Oh, well thank you so much.

Yeah, it's a doozy, huh? Sure is. What you want to do in the, what's it called? Yappy hour? Yappy hour. I don't know. I can... I can find

something, I'm sure. I'll figure it out. Maybe we tell secrets. Oh, I love to tell secrets. If you'd like to hear our secrets, you can come over to Yappy Hour. You'll need something to recover from that two-parter. Oh my gosh, that was very, I mean,

obviously a terrible story, but also very juicy in like the whatever way I can mean it. Keeps you on your toes, you know? I love how when I compliment you telling a story, every time, it keeps you on your toes. Is that what I said? You say it pretty often, yeah. Oh really?

Yeah, well this one for sure did. I'm certainly on my toes, so you're not wrong. Wow, well, and this comes out later this week, huh? I have no idea. Or is it next week? At some point, this is, it's either this week coming up or the week after. Oh, two weeks. This comes out after our first two shows.

Our first shows. And I'm going to throw up. We can't do Yavi. I have to prepare. I'm so stressed. Okay. It's like, we're actually, I actually am, I just started yesterday taking, I started microdosing Xanax, so.

Oh, that's so weird, because I started macro dosing. No, we are at threat level midnight folks. So we will, by the time you've heard this, it will have been figured out, which is very comforting to me. I hope so, it better be, but I may have lost more of my sanity

and skin from scratching my hives. No, by this time, by the time you hear this, currently our voices, our voices that are in the past when you hear this are very scared. But the reality of when this airs, imagine the relief we're gonna have. It's gonna be fine. I can't even fathom that we'll get it.

I mean, I know we'll get it done. We will, we will. I can't even fathom that we'll get it. I mean, I know we'll get it done. We will, we will. I'm very confident we will. As everyone says, including me, we always do. We always do. It just somehow seems so insurmountable, you know? I totally understand. Yeah, I'm sure if anybody does it's you.

I'm right here with you. But no, it will be figured out. That's the best part. So anyway, if you'd like to see us over at Yappi hour crying, you can. Oh, and go say congrats to Eva on social needs on wherever Instagram she posted cutest pictures ever. She's the bride clink clink clink. Even though we didn't invite her to this recording. That's why we drink.