Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Armchair Anonymous: Horrible Boss

Episode Date: October 11, 2024

Dax and Monica talk to Armcherries! In today's episode, Armcherries tell us a story about a horrible boss.Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad free right now. Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts. Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Anonymous. I'm Dan Shepard and I'm joined by Monica Monsoon. Hi. Hi.

Too soon? A little too monsoon. A little too monsoon. A little too monsoon. Today, our prompt is also the title of a franchise. That's right. Ooh, do you think we're gonna get in trouble? We're gonna get sued by New Line, if they're even still a thing.

Horrible boss, tell us about a horrible boss. Yeah. And let me just glance over these stories to see if. People can listen to this. You say that so willy nilly. I don't know if you go through all four stories. Well, I just edited it. I guess you're right.

That's a really strong pushback. You think it's fine. I think it's fine. Now, we do have a tangent that happens in this episode between us, me and you, in between two stories. Oh good, and you kept it in. Really takes, we take a lot of time for the tangent

and I'm, so I apologize, I did leave it in. Oh good. What was the tangent? I did pick it as the social clip. Oh wonderful, oh good, I'll see ya. Okay, please enjoy I'll see you. Okay. Please enjoy Horrible Boss Stories. What's the first step to growing your business?

Getting people to notice you. But how do you do that? Two words, constant contact. Your struggle with expensive, slow, and unmeasurable approaches to marketing your business is over. With constant contact, get email marketing that helps you create and send the perfect email to every customer. Connect with over 2 billion people on social media with an all-in-one tool for posting and sharing, and create, promote, and manage your events with ease, all in one place. Join the millions of small businesses

that trust Constant Contact with their marketing success. So get going and growing with Constant Contact today. Ready set, grow. Go to constantcontact.ca and start your free trial today. Go to constantcontact.ca for your free trial. Constantcontact.ca I'm Afua Hirsch. I'm Peter Francopan. And in our podcast, Legacy, we explore the lives of some of the biggest characters in history.

This season we're talking about the life of US President JFK. He steered the world through moments of terrifying geopolitical crisis. But was he quite the shining hero he seemed? A complex personal life and of course the source of countless conspiracy theories. There's so much to cover, right? What are you most looking forward to talking about? I'm really looking forward to the Cuban missile crisis because it's just one of the most dramatic things

that's ever happened in history. I don't know. There's something about Kennedy. You know, as a growing up, thinking of him as an all-American hero, the good looks, I want to scratch the surface and see what's really underneath. I'm a slightly different generation. I never really understood what the big deal was. I just knew that there was a big deal. Well, I'm a different generation. I feel old, but historians love the dating process. So follow legacy now from wherever you get your podcasts or binge entire seasons early and ad free

on Wondery Plus. All times come and go. Good times, take them slow. My life, I had them both. But one thing you gotta know, I'ma keep on shining. Hi. Hello, so nice to meet you guys. You have a fun kerchief around your neck. I do, yeah, it's my little bandana.

You know, if it gets too hot, it's dual purpose. When it gets hot, you do what? You put your hair back with it? Yeah, yeah, get it all out, you know? Get it off your face. Are you somewhere that's hot? A little bit, not too crazy. I'm in the South, I'm in Nashville.

It's still very much summer here. Ah, future neighbor. Yeah, I love it. Are you from Nashville? I'm originally from Knoxville, so like three hours East. I moved to Nashville in 2017 to pursue music, so I've been here ever since. Nice.

Just before the huge influx of people. Yeah, I at least got in a little early, so that was nice. Rob's asking us to ask you to do something about your mic because it's moving around. It's rubbing on that bandana. It's rubbing on the bandana, he thinks. Gotcha, you know what? Let's get that bandana off.

Well, it served its purpose. So much talk about the bandana and ultimately. It betrayed us. It did. What if you said, this bandana's permanently on, guys? Like that lady whose neck was attached by the red bandana scarf, and then you pulled it and her head fell off.

That's a what, a nursery rhyme? No, that's a real thing that happened. It was on the news. Okay. Well, that's settled. There was no blood. Her head was completely severed. No, it was blood.

That's why it was red. Oh. It was covered in her blood. Oh my God. And it was on the news. You missed that? Well, mine's luckily not red, so we're good. Everyone's great here.

Okay, so you have a horrible boss story. I do. So my horrible boss story actually comes from my first ever job that I got when I was 15 years old. I was working at a fast food restaurant because you know, that's what you do. That's right. So I was usually working the closing shift because you know, I was working at a fast food restaurant, because you know, that's what you do. That's right. So I was usually working the closing shift,

because you know, I was still in school and had to work like after school hours. And on the closing shift, we had like this cool young manager, he was this guy in his early mid 20s, he was all like tatted up and played cool music in the kitchen. So we loved him, we'll call him Jacob,

for the sake of the story. Flash forward to about a month of working this job. I'm getting all settled in. It's going great. Love all my coworkers. It's a fun time. One time I'm working a closing shift with Jacob and a couple others. And there's this very small kind of petite man who comes in the lobby.

We're getting really close to closing. And he's wearing like a black hoodie and black sweatpants and got a scarf over his face. I will say this was not in the winter time. So a little unusual, but we're all right. It is fast food. So we've seen people at their worst, no judgment here. He comes up to the counter and pulls out a gun

and proceeds to rob us. Oh my God. We complied. We gave him the money in the cash register. He pulls us to the back and asked us to open up the safe. And so we give him all the money in the safe. This whole shift is all primarily pretty young people. So we're like, okay, that was insane. Never been through anything like that before. So we call the police, the police come and they get

statements from us. That's pretty much all that happened. I had a closing shift the very next night. So I go into work. And of course, that is all we're talking about. We're like, that's so crazy. Jacob, he's just really shaken up by this. I can tell he's just quiet. He's not being himself, not the usual like fun dude. So we noticed it really got to him, but another week passes. And by this point, it's kind of died down because we never really heard a follow up about, oh, did they catch the guy? The petite robber. Yeah. Yeah. The little robber. So it's about, I want to say like a week and a half later, I'm in the back and I'm washing some dishes and the kitchen door opens and I of course assume it's one of my coworkers

and I look up and this time there's a quite large man in a very similar outfit. Oh my God. He's got a ski mask on though, so he was really the real deal I think. And we get robbed a second time. But as he approaches us, we were kind of like, something doesn't feel right about this because we're in a pretty quiet neighborhood. The police even told us when they came by,

they were like, this restaurant hasn't been robbed in like over a decade. So we were like, this just seems weird. We had a coworker named Alex, who was sort of known for being a bit of a prankster. And Alex had been making a lot of jokes about the robbery. We thought it was Alex messing with us. So we told Alex, you know, get back on the grill, whatever, do your job.

Well, you dismiss the big robber as Alex. That's a funny approach to getting robbed. The guy comes in and points his gun and he's like, give me the fucking money. And you go, Tarek, stop fucking around. I don't have time. And then you look away and then you get busy and then you get out of there. I think it probably did throw him off his game, especially considering Alex ended up turning around the corner. We're like, oh, it's not Alex We're just getting robbed again. Okay, great at this point. We know the drill

We all learned the code to the safe. So we do the whole thing give him the money So, of course after that is just the talk of the restaurant We're all making bets about when we're gonna get robbed the third time Jacob is just so shaken up by this He does not like that. We're making jokes about it. He's like y'all need to take this serious. We just need to be safe about this kind of thing, which is a bit out of character for him. Eventually he ends up talking to one of my co-workers in the back and he was like I gotta talk to you about these robberies. This is really on my mind. He's like sure what's up man? He goes I just

want you to know the robbery that happened a few days ago I had nothing to do with that. My coworker is kind of like, we didn't think you did, man. He said, but the first one, that was actually my wife who robbed y'all. She's really talented at deepening her voice. And so I knew she could pass for a man. And I knew there was a lot of money in that safe and I didn't want to be caught on camera. So I had her come in and me and my wife took the money.

Oh my God. Why on earth is he admitting this A? B, do you know how much money it was? I honestly think he wanted to just get it off his chest. And because he had that reputation of being so cool and fun and we were all for the most part high school or young college students, he thought we'd just be like, yeah, it's cool, man.

Like I got you. We were not, we exposed him for that. As far as how much money was in the safe, I honestly don't know, just because, you know, I was like a low level employee, I was never in charge of counting. I would say it's probably a significant amount if you're willing to take that risk,

or it may not have been. I think that's more where my mind goes, is that it's probably not a life-changing amount. It's probably a couple grand or 1,500. You're taking a life-changing action to get not a life-changing reward. It's sad. Well, it is sad, but it's also because desperation,

that money means a lot in that moment. Yikes. Yeah, so he confesses to the robbery. Unfortunately, I wish I had like an amazing thing to wrap this up. All I know is he got fired. I never found out if he even got arrested or what happened. They tried to keep it real hush hush.

I think because we were understaffed and they didn't want us all quitting. Who was the second robber? His kid or uncle or something? Yeah, did we ever figure out who the second? Jacob was telling the truth. He had nothing to do with that. It was just a random guy.

They did end up catching him because the same night he tried to go rob a gas station up the street. So he was not that far down the road. They were able to get him at least. He was on a crime spree. Yeah. Weird timing. Weird timing.

My first thought was like, it was somehow contagious. It was in the paper and then he got the idea. It very well could have been because it was at the time a bigger story that this restaurant got robbed. So I am wondering if maybe that inspired the second guy. It's also funny if I were wanting to rob this place and I knew that they had been robbed a week before, I would think, well, I've got to wait a really long time

until they drop their guard again. But then you realize there's nothing to do. They're not going to put a cop in the restaurant for the rest of the time it's open. It's like, there's really nothing to be on your guard about. I actually wonder if like, and I'm not saying I'm pro-robbing fast food restaurants, but maybe that guy was smart

because we weren't on guard because we thought, oh, we got that out of the way. Or it's like, it's obviously the first person who robbed. Yeah, that they came back for seconds. The funniest part about this whole story is that the man was a petite man, but it was a woman. Yeah, she was a very small woman, so it makes sense now. What if she had done everything right,

except she was in heels? Oh man, that might have thrown us off even more. Maybe that would have even been less suspicious somehow. Oh, that was a great story, Sam. Yeah, thank you. I'm glad you survived all the robberies. Yeah, I hope your run-ins with pistols ended there. So far, so good.

Okay, good. Well, it's great meeting you. Yeah, thanks for chatting. Great to meet you all too, thank you so much. All right, I hope I bump into you in Nashville. Hopefully one day. All right, take care. Can you knock on wood?

About? Bumping into her? No, I asked you to because we hope she doesn't have any more run-ins. Oh, no more run-ins. Yeah. Hi. How are you?

I'm great, can you hear me okay? Wonderfully. My first question is what is your fantasy fake name? Did you already pick one? I did, I've been watching Sopranos, so I'm gonna go with Carmella. Oh, I love that. Wonderful. Did you watch the doc that they made that just came out?

I'm saving it. It's really good. What season are you in? I watched it before live as a kid, but my fiance's never seen it, so we're only on season two so far. And how's that going? Cause I very much wanna do that

with a few different people in my life who haven't seen it. It's worth a rewatch. It's hard because it's so many seasons, but if you power through them. Yeah, it's still great. And he doesn't feel like it's outdated because I've also never seen it.

It is a little bit, but for the nostalgia factor, it's worth it. Okay, so Carmelo, where are you at? Are you allowed to tell us where you're at? Yes, I am in Albuquerque, New Mexico. Oh, I've spent many a month in Albuquerque. Shooting employee of the month, correct? That's right, at the Costco.

I just watched that movie like two days before I got the email about this. Oh, you did? That's your Costco. I just watched that movie like two days before I got the email about this. Oh, you did. That's your Costco. I know exactly where it is. Too bad your horrible boss was on a Costco boss. That would have been sick. There are no horrible bosses at Costco.

They have the best employees. Okay. So hit us with the year, the context. Okay. So I would like to keep the specific details about this company and what we did. Vague. Great. This takes place 10 years ago.

I am fresh out of college. Three weeks out, I start applying for jobs and I get an interview. I'm so thrilled that so early out, I got an interview. I show up at the office, I meet my future horrible boss. Let's call him Tom. And this is for a job essentially doing contract negotiation and contract writing. So the interview right off the bat is full of red flags, but I am too young and naive to recognize these at the time.

Red flag number one, he tells me not everyone lasts very long around here. Not everyone can take the heat. Not everybody can grind it out and not everyone can handle me as a manager. Cool, Tom. But I'm eager. I want to prove myself in the white collar world. So I'm like, I can handle it. Red flag number two is he says,

since you're straight out of college, you will not be paid very well. However, we do a lot of international business with a lot of other international companies and you will almost more than certainly be living overseas for a short while. While you're there, you will have an apartment, you will have all expenses paid, three meals a day. You'll be going out to find dinners with clients. And I was like, well,

now it sounds like a dream come true. So I accept the job on the spot. The final red flag is he takes me into the bullpen to meet the team. And as I'm greeting everyone, a guy whispers under his breath, you don't want to work here. Oh, oh, oh my God. That's more than a red flag. That's kind of a warning. But I take that as well. Guess this guy can't take the heat. This is what Tom was warning me about. You've already been Stockholm syndrome within like 10 minutes. So I start the job and sure enough within a couple of weeks, I'm on a plane to Berlin. No way. So let me pause here and let me describe his management style to you. one he himself warned me about the entire workday from start to finish screaming and I don't just mean being frustrated or angry I mean bright red face veins popping out of his

head spitting he's screaming so like Alex Jones level yeah over the smallest thing like if he went to the Keurig and there was still like a little K cup in the machine meltdown he'd stalk around the office and try to figure out who was the last person to make coffee. If you did something wrong, you'd have to stand in front of the bullpen in front of everyone else and each coworker would have to explain to you what you did wrong, like a humiliation tactic. Oh my God. Okay, break you down so we can build you up.

And then if you did something right, you were also in trouble because you should have consulted him before you made a decision on your own. So there was no winning. Do you think he had gotten this playbook from somebody or this was a proprietary approach to management? Or do you think he thought he was walking in the steps of giants or whatever they say? I truly don't know.

I've never seen behavior like this before in my life. And to this day, I haven't. I feel like he saw that movie, Boiler Room, or one of those movies where they're screaming and getting the most out of people. Yeah, like Wolf of Wall Street or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. We were on eggshells all day long.

I mean, we were terrified, because we knew one of us is going down today. There was a grown adult woman who would start panicking and crying when she heard his car come through the parking lot. Oh, lord. This is really bad. Part of me thinks that ultimately is so ineffective because you would just grow completely numb to it.

You'd be like, oh yeah, Tom's yelling at me. I don't give a fuck. He yells all day long. It doesn't mean anything. It's like when parents yell at their kids all the time. It's like after 12 of those, that doesn't mean anything. Yeah, I guess it kind of felt more just like you're about to get crept up on at any moment.

Shoved in the back feeling all day long. Yeah, so back to Berlin, upon arrival, we have to give him our passports because he wants to keep them for safekeeping. That's not his right. No. Keep in mind, this is my first professional job. I'm the youngest person there.

Everyone has worked there for years. They're all older than me. I know how dumb it is now, but at the time I was like, here you go. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not saying I wouldn't have complied. He just has no business doing that. Exactly.

So the apartment and the expenses all paid for was true. However, we were working from 6 a.m. through the entire day, through the entire evening, meeting a client for dinner. And as you know, European restaurants, dinner is conservatively three hours long. Yeah. We're finishing out the client meeting at 11 p.m. and then going back to the office

to write the contract until 2 a.m. We're sleeping three the client meeting at 11 p.m. and then going back to the office to write the contract until 2 a.m. We're sleeping three or four hours a night. We are all exhausted. We are all physically sick from not sleeping for like weeks and it's just too bad, just nose to the grindstone. Are you getting hourly or are you salary? Are you even pumped about the hours? It was hourly, but I don't think the client dinners

and like after hours work counted. So we're getting paid eight hours to do like 13 hours of work. So this all comes to a head one night. Tom is coming to my apartment to pick me up to meet a client. He arrives a couple minutes early. So I tell him, let me just finish up my makeup.

You can hang out in my little kitchen living room area. Not 10 seconds into me walking back into the bathroom, do I hear the screaming? And he's going, what the F is this? He comes lurching through the apartment, carrying an empty wine bottle that had been in my trash for probably three days. So it wasn't right on top.

And he says, how effing dare you do this? Don't you know I'm in recovery? Oh my God, stop it. Oh, fucking A, what? Stop it. Oh, don't you know I'm, I'm so sorry. What does that have to do with this? Well, that was the moment where I was like,

I need to stay on my ground. Like if you wanna berate me in the workplace, that's bad enough, but in my home, no. So I just said, you know, Tom, frankly, what I do outside of work hours is none of your business. And I don't think you have the right to go through my personal space. Yeah. Good for you.

Yeah. It didn't work. He said, the company is paying for this apartment. Therefore it is my space and I can go through anything I want. No, Tom. That's not actually legally how it works. that's not actually how it works. But go ahead, Tom. But go ahead, Tom. talking about one of the greatest batsmen in the history of cricket. It's Kevin Peterson.

KP, as he is more commonly known. And there's so much to cover in this story. The highs and lows of the ashes, the dead skunk Hurstheim, his on-again, off-again relationship with his teammates, and of course, Texgate. And I'll be using the phrase Ebb and Flow far more than is reasonable for anyone. You're using it in the trail to say you've used it too many times.

I occasionally try to swap out Ebb and Flow for Warp and Weft, far more than is reasonable for anyone. You're using it in the trail to say you've used it too many times. I occasionally try to swap out Ebonflow for Warp and Weft, but it never really works the same. The Warp and Weft of Test Cricket. Follow everything to play for on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge seasons early and add free right now on Wondery Plus.

Flotsam and Jetson. What's up guys, it's your girl Kiki and my podcast is back with a new season and let me tell you, it's too good Flotsam and Jetsam. The list goes on and now I have my own YouTube channel. So follow, watch, and listen to Baby, This is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch full episodes on YouTube and you can listen to Baby, This is Kiki Palmer early and at free right now by joining Wondery. Undub, where are my headphones? Cause it's time to get into it. Holla at your girl! Hey Armchairs, quick question for you. Have you ever stopped to wonder who came up with that bottle of Sriracha sitting in your fridge or why almost every house in America has a game of Monopoly stashed away somewhere?

Well this is Nick and this is Jack and we just launched a brand new podcast called The Best Idea Yet. It's all about the surprising origin stories of the products you're obsessed with and the people who brought them to life. Like Super Mario, the best selling video game character ever. He's only a thing because Nintendo couldn't get the rights to Popeye. Or Jack, how about McDonald's Happy Meal? Believe it or not, the Happy Meal was dreamed up by a mom in Guatemala. Every week on The Best Idea Yet, you'll discover the surprising stories behind the most viral products of all time while picking up real business insights along the way.

We guarantee you'll be that person at your next dinner party dropping knowledge bombs at the table. Follow the best idea yet on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to the best idea yet early and ad free right now by joining Wondery Plus. So have you ever been so startled that in the moment you don't react, but then 10 minutes later, the fear instinct hits you? You got like paralyzed. Yeah, that was me in the car on the way to meet this client. I'm holding back tears. I'm physically like shaking just from being startled so badly.

And he's just going on and on about, so we meet this client make sure you offer them this and tell them we can extend This like as if he didn't just do that two minutes ago So that's the moment where I realized I need to get out of here However, like I said, I'm not being paid well, I cannot afford a plane ticket home Even if I wanted to I don't even have my passport and I could have asked my parents for money But I was too ashamed. They were so proud of me for getting this job right off the bat.

So my plan becomes, I'm just gonna ride it out and as soon as my feet are back on US soil, I'm quitting. Because I was honestly so naive as well that I didn't even know if I was allowed to quit. And I was like, the company's paid so much money to send me here, like, can they sue me if I quit? I literally didn't even know. That's not naive.

He's planted a lot of this in your brain. He's made it a situation where you're scared to make any moves as part of this grooming. Exactly. And everyone else was kind of going along with it. So I was like, am I the crazy one here? Would you guys gossip about him when he wasn't around? Absolutely.

But it was still a mentality of, if you're the one that made a mistake, everyone is against you. You're the one that messed up. Everyone was so afraid to turn against him. Okay, I gotta guess Monica question right now, because we have a long standing debate that never goes my way.

So we would probably agree, right? There's no getting through to Tom. No one's gonna have an argument with Tom and Wynn. Agree, yeah. Now what if one of the male employees stood up in the middle of all this and just fucking knocked Tom right the fuck out? How do we feel about that?

I mean, I don't think it changes anything. So I'm gonna change him, but he's gonna suffer and be humiliated and he deserves it. Yeah, I mean, I guess I don't hate it. Okay, okay, resuming. Sorry you got dragged into that. I literally had dreams about that happening. Of course.

I would have dreams he got hit by a car in front of me and got fucking murdered. Like I would have real bad desires for him. Well, then I have a question for you. Do you think that behavior, you said what was the cause of this behavior? Do you think it's because of the recovery thing or do you think this guy was just like that?

He could have been a dry drunk. I need more deets, but clearly what seems obvious is that whatever the drug of choice was doing for him, he had not found a replacement, right? He was not functioning and he wasn't regulating. And so he clearly had a solution at one point that stopped working and then he didn't figure out the real solution. I mean, because minimally he's fucking miserable, right?

He doesn't feel good. He's not enjoying life. Maybe work is what replaced the using. So I stick to my plan. I suffer through it. I get back to the US and I tell myself tomorrow because God forbid we get one day off after flying 16 hours. We still have to work the next day.

I say tomorrow I'm walking in, I'm quitting. I'm giving him two weeks. And I do. I walk straight in. I don't even get to get the sentence out all the way because he figures out what I'm about to say and rage ensues. How dare you after everything we provided you. You clearly just wanted to go to Europe for free and eat and drink for free and you used me and I'm so disappointed you disrespect

me blah blah blah. He rounds it off with the classic you can't quit you're fired pack up your desk you're done today. So I'm like, fine. Like I really wanted to use this company as a reference, but oh well. So the final little button on this story as I go back to the bullpen, I'm packing up my desk, I'm explaining to my coworkers what happened. And before I finished packing up, this woman just stands up and goes, screw it, walks into the office, quits on the spot. So we both walked out together. Oh, good, good. I wish I could have had a moment where it's like, we all stood up and we all quit,

but it was just one other person, but still. But still. You know, he's such a piece of shit. I have to be honest, I'm a little bit shocked he wasn't also sexually inappropriate. Are you too, Monica? Like when he came into your apartment, I'm prepared now for,

because this is a very entitled motherfucker who thinks he's God somehow over you people. I'm almost shocked he didn't have that part of his arsenal. I got definitely weird vibes, nothing to really speak of on it, but it definitely seems strange. Fortunately, I was dealing with enough mentally, I couldn't have handled anymore.

Oh. Yuck. And we just don't know what happened to Tom. That was 10 years ago, maybe he's still shouting at people or maybe someone finally punched him out or who knows. I'm gonna try and be mature and say, I hope that he's changed.

Right, that's good, that's nice. Oh boy, what a disaster. That was a great story. I'm so sorry you went through that. I know, me too. It was a trial by fire for my first white collar job. Yeah, I wish my solution wasn't to beat this guy up, but it just is.

Well, it was great meeting you, and I hope you found a place where they're nice to you now. I could not be more grateful for my current job. They totally respect work-life balance and your job isn't your whole existence, and my current boss, I could not be more grateful to have him. Okay, great.

We love that. Okay, it has a happy ending. Yes. Can I show you a happy ending. Yes. Can I show you something super quickly? Yes. Look at my tattoo. It is an arm cherry. What?

Oh, we have matching tattoos. Oh my god, cute. Oh, do you have one too? My whole arm is cherries. I probably have nine or 10 that are cascading down my arm. Twinsies. Twinsies. That's very flattering.

Yeah, we love you back. Thank you so much. A long time fan, first time caller. Okay, well be well. Yeah, have a great day. You as well. Okay, bye. That's terrible that man was treating her like that.

I know, power will corrupt. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. We did a good job saying that in unison. We did. I'm proud of us. You are? Congratulations. Hello.

Hi. Monica and I just said something in complete tandem and it worked out really well and now we're very happy about that. Do you wanna know what we said? Yeah. No, you really wanna do this again, it was so perfect. I know we do run the risk, but I believe in us.

I'm gonna touch your leg. That's cheating. That's cheating, okay. Okay. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Even tighter than the first one, I'm glad we did it. Wow. Yeah. That was impressive.

What a waste of your time, Madison. I know, I'm so sorry. Thank you. Where are you, other than the closet? I am in Montana. Oh, you lucky gal. Oh, is it cold there? You're wearing a nice sweater. It is, it's like 50 degrees today.

Oh, it's brisk. And are you in a city or out in the wilderness? I'm in a city. I'll leave it at that because the story I'm still living in the city. Absolutely. Absolute power, crubs, absolutely. Nope.

Uh. Okay, set the scene for us, give us the year, and tell us about this horrible boss. So this takes place in 2022, about two years ago. I had recently graduated, and this was my first job out of college. It was an office manager position of a cleaning company owned by a married couple. And I'll call them Ted and Lacey. Started off pretty good. About a month into the job,

I come in one day and Ted tells me that he and Lacey are having marriage issues. Lacey has flown home to Indiana and I need to come with him to pick up her car from the airport. Oh no. This is a heavy storyline for month one. I'm immediately like, okay, this is kind of weird. Definitely not in the job description, but as a passive 22 year old, I'm like, sure, let's go. So we go, I drive her car back to the office. We go about the work day,

which was a lot of me listening to him rant about their problems. What were his main complaints? It was a lot of the business that they weren't agreeing on, which I can imagine running a business with your partner is not easy. So work day ends, five o'clock rolls around, I'm getting ready to go.

And he says to me, hey, I really like to get to know my employees on a personal level. And I'm not asking you on a date, but are you free for dinner tonight? Oh my God, ew. I feel like he killed his wife. I'm just gonna, I know you don't like when I guess,

but I feel like he killed his wife. Okay, just gonna, I know you don't like when I guess, but I feel like he killed his wife. Okay, wholly inappropriate. You're 22, how old is he? He's probably mid thirties. I just feel pretty awkward and I'm so new into this job that I don't wanna say no to my new boss. So I was like, sure, just let me know where to meet you. Okay, that's smart meeting.

I go home and shortly after he texts me, hey, I'm actually gonna pick you up. Nope. Be there in 15. That's not how. Oh. Uh-oh, everybody. He comes and picks me up

and he takes me to the nicest restaurant in town. He's ordering wine, appetizers, tells me to get whatever I want. It's on the company. The whole dinner is definitely pretty awkward. He is sweating bullets the entire time. Oh, diarrhea? What if this would turn down to evacuation story?

That'd be great. That would be amazing. But he doesn't do or say anything too inappropriate during the dinner. Can I ask, is he eating or just drinking? He barely ate. Yeah. Cause he was so nervous.

No, cause he's gacked up or something. He drops me back off at home. We go our separate ways. And next morning I go into work, dreading it. At this point, I don't really know if he did just want to get to know his employee better or if I just went on a date with a married man. Oh.

So I go into work and after all the housekeepers leave for the day, he sits down and says, hey, I want to address dinner last night. Thanks for coming out. Obviously, my top priority is you working here, but I think you're a really cool girl and I've never met anyone like you before and I'd like to continue spending time together. Oh, God, is this uncomfortable. Oh, I feel so awkward.

I pretty much just tell him I'm not interested. I'm here to work. You are married. Yeah, please. Let's not bring this up again. Good for you. He kind of brushes it off and says he understands, but his demeanor definitely changed after that. The next few days, he was much more strict,

sending me on pointless errands. My hours were cut. I no longer was like a full-time employee. Okay, I have to pause you because this is such a good example of when people are like, well, that's how people meet. They meet at the workplace. So what's the big deal about a boss dating? This is why, because someone has power. And then if the subordinate does anything in the personal relationship, then in the professional relationship, the person with power can do this.

Exactly. I call my mom one day and I'm like, I don't know how I got myself into this. I do not want to work here anymore. This is horrible. I feel so uncomfortable all day at work with him being by myself. And my mom tells me just quit. She's like,

me and your dad will support you until you can find a new job. You're totally fine. Just get out of there. That night I ultimately decide I do not owe this guy a notice, I do not owe him an explanation. Next morning I go in super early, leave my stuff on his desk and I text him and I say yesterday was my last day. And I thought that is where it would end.

But a couple months go by, I move on with my life, I start a new job, it's going really well. I'm thinking about my future. And one day I just get the idea, Oh, I should probably check my credit. So I log in and my credit score has tanked. And I've always had good credit. I always pay my bills on time. So I'm like, what the heck happened? And I see that there's a new Amex card on my account with a balance of $27,000. What? Oh, fuck.

And at this point, I'm so oblivious. I'm still just very confused. So I call Amex, explain the situation. They tell me this is a personal credit card recently opened in your name and the woman tells me the billing address. I immediately recognize that billing address as my former place of employment with head.

So at this point, everything clicks. I rejected this man, I quit and in retaliation, he has decided to steal my identity and go on a shopping spree in my name. 27,000. Holy shit. The fuck did he buy? I wish I would have asked the AMEX person because from the timeline, I quit to when

I found out was only about three months. So not very long for him to spend close to 30 grand. So luckily, my ex boyfriend is a lawyer, I call him up because I'm like, I don't know if I need to sue this guy. I don't know what to do. He tells me to file an identity theft report with the FTC, sends me a link. I do it all online. I give them his name, phone number, address, and let them have at it. And they took care of everything for me. I didn't have to do a thing. I got notified within a few weeks that my case was resolved.

It was taken off my account. I got all my credit points back. Thank God. And I've never heard from Ted Sessions. You don't know if he was arrested for that? I still have no idea, but I did look into him this week and he's still in business. Oh wow.

Is his wife dead? I did hear they are now divorced. Okay, so she's alive, because I feel like that whole car thing was an alibi situation. Like he murdered her, but then he was like, oh, I gotta pretend she left town, so I'm gonna take her car there. How could he not but then he was like, Oh, I gotta pretend she left town. So I'm going to take her car there.

How could he not have thought he was going to get caught? I think he was on speed, some kind of speed. He was sweating bullets, didn't eat much, acting irrational. Yeah. He did used to get high just like in the middle of the work day. So that could be part of the story. It turned into a total blessing in disguise because I'm still at the job that I landed after that horrible situation

and it's a very healthy workplace and I actually get to work with podcasters. I work for a business management firm and I do taxes for podcasters and musicians. Oh wow. That's cool. Well, God, I'm proud of you for getting out of there so quickly and also saying,

no, I don't wanna be going on dates with you. Good for you. Yeah, thanks for telling us that horrible story. Yeah, yeah, it was terrible. You're clearly a sweet person. Yeah, you don't deserve that. Not fair. Well, so nice meeting you.

Thank you guys so much. Have a good rest of your day. Okay, you too. Bye-bye. Bye-bye. Bye. In a quiet suburb, a community is shattered by the death of a beloved wife and mother. But this tragic loss of life quickly turns into something even darker. Her husband had tried to hire a hitman on the dark web to kill her. And she wasn't the only target. Because buried in the depths of the internet is The Kill List, a cache of chilling documents

containing names, photos, addresses and specific instructions for people's murders. This podcast is the true story of how I ended up in a race against time to warn those who lives were in danger. And it turns out, convincing a total stranger someone wants them dead is not easy. Follow Kill List on the Wondry app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to Kill List and more Exhibit C Truecrime shows like Morbid early and ad free right now by joining Wondry+. Check out Exhibit C in the Wry app for all your true chrome listening.

This guy's off the rails. I mean, he's opening up credit cards and his employees' names. Yeah, definitely. Also, the notion that he wanted to go on a second date based on her assessment of how terrible the date was is so delusional. What if we have a dinner and we commit to the fact

that we're only allowed to say, absolute power corrupts absolutely? Or is it every time a word gets said, we have to say that? Because that sounds more fun. In unison every time? Yeah. Okay.

But what'd be fun is if the server came and we were holding the menu, we would point to what we want and we would go, absolute power corrupt. Absolutely. That means I want that sure No, but the way you said it sound like a question mark it sounds like you asked is this good Oh, I was saying can I have this? Oh, see you got to work and then tell me what I'm doing now I'll go absolute power corrupts. Absolutely check. Well, that's right. You did a gesture. Of course Well, you're allowed to do gestures too.

But I also think my audible delivery sounded like too. Don't do gestures, but do a different thing. Okay, I wanna do gestures. Every time I think of something, I'm gonna, like I was gonna rub my tummy. No, that's so obvious. Well, let me do that one to see if you get this one though. Absolute power crups, absolutely.

No, Dex, that's. What do you think that is? I don't even know if you got it. Oh, it's so good. No, I didn't do it wrong. Oh, I'm so full. I couldn't possibly have dessert. Oh, I'm so full.

Oh no, okay. Okay, so there could be some confusion. Okay, yeah. Even with gestures. What about like, what about this? Absolute power crups, absolutely. You got the wrong dish. Yes!

Yeah, yeah, really good. Wow. All right, how about this? Your waiter would hate you. They would be a part of a prompt on another show. Tell us what the worst customers you've ever had. I'm gonna try this one, okay? Okay, okay.

Absolute Power Corrupts, absolutely. Do it one more time. I'll see if I can get it. Absolute Power Corrupts, absolutely. How was it? It was great. That's right. It was great. That's right. It was great.

See, it can be done. Oh my God, we needed it. We need a break. We need to take a nap. Oh, how about this? I got one too after you. Can I say um? No.

Okay. Absolute, oh fuck, it's really hard to without um. Okay, hold on. Absolute power corrupts absolutely? Oh really hard to without, okay hold on. Absolute Power Creps absolutely? Oh I did it. You're pointing a lot. I think it was can I get this without cheese? Oh no, let me try again.

Okay. Absolute Power Creps absolutely? Oh, have you guys always been open on Tuesdays? No, it was where's the bathroom? Oh, okay well let me try that. Okay. No, it was, where's the bathroom? Oh, okay, well let me try that. Okay.

Okay, you ready? Yeah. Absolute power crux, absolute, oh, Lee. Wait a minute, wait a minute. If I'm not allowed to say um, you're not allowed to do all those things you did. That was all within the words. No, oh, you went, oh, oh, oh. Okay, so what was I asking for?

About to poop my pants. Yeah, where's the bathroom? I know, but that's because, no. It's pretty good. You have to do it without any additions. You're so hypocritical. All right, how about this? Okay.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Do you have anything gluten free? Yeah. No. It was, can I get this gluten free? Yeah. No. It was, can I get this lettuce wrapped? Oh. So yeah.

You looked really like, you don't normally ask it like that. I go, give it to me lettuce wrap, bitch. Or if it's a guy, I go, give it to me lettuce wrap, fucking dick. You know your white tries when you kind of swallow fucking, did you hear how I just said that? I don't want you to see me, I'm gonna go. Fuckin' dick.

Do you hear how it's like? That's how it's done. No, it's not. Yes, in Milford, Michigan. That sounds so tried. No, no, in Milford, Michigan, that was like, he says fuck so often that he's got his own version of it. What?

What? Who? Where am I? What? Is this a restaurant? How about this? Oh no. It's a gesture.

I know. I have to first practice it with the gesture. Okay, I got one down too. Okay, go. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. But you wouldn't say that in a restaurant, like that there's a bad smell. You're onto it.

Do you think this fish is spoiled? Yeah. Oh, spoiled? Yeah, do you think this fish is bad? Would you say that? Yeah. I'm sorry, do you think this fish might be bad? I'm inviting them to smell it. And then they bend down to smell it.

And then I go, got ya. Absolute power grubs, absolutely. I hope you keep all this. Hi. Hello, how are you? I'm good, how are you? Good, do you have a preferred fake name? Yes, I'm gonna go by Andy.

Andy. I like that name. Yep. Gender neutral, I like it. Wait, I know why. My guess is because Andy from How to that name. Yep. Gender neutral, I like it. Wait, I know why. My guess is because Andy from How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days.

Great guess, but a similar situation. So I'm gonna call my boss Miranda. Oh, Devil Wears Prada. Oh. One of my very favorites. You got the context clues. Yeah, it is. I would have been able to see on that one.

Yeah, the reason I chose those is because my twin sister has always said that I should write a book called The Devil Wears Patagonia about this experience. Ooh, okay. And if I can give a quick little sidebar about my twin sister, you recently mentioned on the Jack Black episode that you'd never met a triplet because his wife's a triplet

and now you sort of have because I'm part of a set of triplets. Wow. Oh wow, so when you say you're twin sister, we have no clue who you're talking about. There's identicals and the third's a boy. Oh, that's helpful. That's so cool.

Holy shit, so it's an identical twin sister and a fraternal brother. Yes. Wow, so there was two eggs, one of them split. What a shit show in your mother's womb. I mean, every option that could happen was happening. She's so cool. Yep.

And she'd also had a tubal pregnancy prior, so she only had one tube, so she double ovulated on one side and it was all natural. Whoa. Oh my God, miracles can happen. I wonder if one side and it was all natural. Whoa. Oh my God. A gangster. Miracles can happen. I wonder if she felt like it was a miracle

to have three babies at once, man. Well, I'm just saying. God bless anyone who can get through this. You often think you won't be able to and then you have three. Oh right, if you have a. That's incredible. If you're missing a tube.

Yeah, and my dad already had three girls and didn't want any more. Uh-oh. It was a bit of a, the just one turned into three more. Oh, fine. Oh, that's great. Just a quick disclaimer before I get into this, I just wanna say that this story is about one person

and not representative of the company. I'm not gonna name the company. And also that this happened a long time ago. How long ago? Almost 15 years ago. So my dream growing up was to make wildlife documentaries and decided to go to school for the science side instead of the film side.

So I studied wildlife biology and animal behavior, which will sort of become relevant in this story. And after I finished graduate school, I floundered around for a while. I'm from Southern California originally, so I was in Southern California trying to get into film and then eventually managed to get an internship at kind of the dream company on the East Coast.

So I was a very old unpaid intern and I was in my late twenties by this point. From there, I managed to get an entry-level job and eventually I was able to get the dream job, which was working on a series about wildlife around the world. Oh, fun. Yeah, seemed exciting. But I knew going in that Miranda,

the executive producer of the show, had a reputation for being difficult. I think when you want something bad enough, you convince yourself, I'm tougher than these other people that came before me, I can get through it. A couple of little fun facts, Miranda outwardly expressed that she hated working with women. I'm tougher than these other people that came before me. I can get through it. A couple of little fun facts.

Miranda outwardly expressed that she hated working with women. So, so rough start. I was, for most of the time I worked on the show, the only other woman working on the team. And she would do things like steal prescription medications out of our desks. She had a fun habit of ending statements with it. And if you tell HR, I'll murder you.

And she would send texts saying that. Putting that in writing is so dumb. It was a different time, I feel like, back then. And so she clearly didn't like me. She didn't want to pay me as much as the men and all of that. But just sort of a favorite quote of hers was one time she came into my office at the end of the day and kind of crouched down next to me and said,

if you quit, I'll hunt you down like the runaway bunny and make your life hell. And that has always stuck with me as she hated me, but she didn't want me to leave. Can I tell you the creepiest part of that is what's this fucking allegory she thinks everyone knows? That's weirdly the creepiest part of that. Yeah, because no one has ever heard of that.

No. I think it's a kid's book. But it's not like Velveteen Rabbit. It's too specific. It's very creepy. Don't be the runaway bunny. We all know what happened to her. Ew.

I should take this time to apologize because earlier I said all the stories were men and this is a woman. Oh, good. I'm glad we could provide some gender balance here. That's right. Women can be evil as well. All humans can be terrible pieces of shit.

Yeah, but it is three to one. I am gonna say that. Well, that's also reflective of how many men versus women are in boss positions. Well, that's also reflective of how many men versus women are in boss positions. Well, which I think is a problem. For this to be a one to one apples, there'd have to be 50% of all bosses were men

and 50% were men. Let's try it. Yeah, okay. Yeah, yeah, I'm for it, I'm for it. So I'm trying to condense two years of trauma into one story, but I'm gonna tell you about the first shoot I went on for her, which was only the second shoot I'd ever gone on. And it was a big one. It was to film

wolves in Mongolia. Whoa. Yeah. Logistically challenging. No accommodations, I'm imagining. Hard to find outside of Ulaanbaatar. And I had selfishly pitched this as one of the habitats we covered, the Asian step, because I always wanted to go to Mongolia. As the shoot got closer and I think she got more stressed, she started setting what my sister,

who's a writer, told me is like this trope in fairy tales, the idea of the impossible task is maybe remember from the Devil Wears Prada, it's like when Miranda asks Andy to get the unpublished Harry Potter book for her twins. So she sort of started setting those sorts of tasks for me. And so she decides a week before the trip that I need to find a trained wolf in addition to the wild wolves that we're supposed to be filming so that we can film close-ups. And if I don't do

that, then she's canceling the whole trip, we've now spent months with I'm like in a panic I'm working with our local fixer every day I get an update like I found a wolf and then the next morning I get another update the wolf was killed and This happens like three times. Oh boy two wolves were killed and the third one had pups and then couldn't travel So, you know, it's getting more and more stressful one had pups and then couldn't travel. So, you know, it's getting more and more stressful. Somehow we find a wolf and we get on the plane. Wait, so is the wolf a local hire

or are you bringing the wolf with you guys? A local hire. Okay, okay, great. So that's helpful. Fortunately, not traveling all the way to Mongolia. So we get there, we have the adult trained, trained quote unquote wolf, and then five orphaned wolf pups

that someone handed over to the owner of the adult wolf. It's clear pretty quickly that the adult wolf is not actually trained, it's just a wolf that's in captivity. Oh no. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Has a collar and a leash. Isn't like attacking humans, but also is not trained.

So the second you take the leash off, it has disappeared into the hills. Of course. Well, it's a prisoner. Yes. The whole week, there's updates of like, well, the wolf's disappeared again, and then the trainer is wandering the hills for a few hours trying to get it back.

The first task I'm given is to take a fox skin cap that Miranda has bought at the gift shop of our hotel and fashion a cover for the denim collar that this wolf is wearing. So try and make it blend in with its fur so that when you film it, you can't see the collar. Oh my gosh. This is almost like the room or one of these famous,

what are they doing? You can't, this is insane. It's gonna have a collar on it, but then we're gonna cover it with this. It sounds sounding like a satire. the room or one of these famous, what do they do? You can't, this is insane. It's gonna have a collar on it, but then we're gonna cover it with this. It sounds sounding like a satire, like a Christopher Guest animal show. Yeah, yeah.

Yes, yes. I'm focusing on some of the lighter-hearted stories, but there was a lot going on kind of all the time on the strip. Then we're a couple days in and the cameramen report back that the wolf pups have escaped into a cave because they're trying to film them in front of some rocks and they crawl into this rocky outcropping and they won't come out. So by this point in the trip I realized that really my job is to be Miranda's

like handler and the men get to stay out in the yard near the filming location but I have to be her chaperone back to Ulaanbaatar several hours away every night to make sure she's safe and not be uncomfortable. Does she have any substance abuse issues? The prescription that she was fond of stealing was ambient. So she didn't really sleep. And she's also very much a chain smoker,

struggled with traveling without smoking, but that's all I know about. I'm not sure what else was going on there. Okay. It's around this time that she decides she's got to get the wolf pups out of this cave the next day. And her way of solving this problem logically is to get an aerosol product like hairspray to try and like smoke the pups out of the cave. I am like panicking. So my suggestion is to find like a squirt gun instead

and maybe use some water, at least that we're not harming the wolf pups. And miraculously we go into a supermarket and they have a bunch of like super soakers there. Even in Mongolia. Yeah. Miranda decides that this is the moment that she knew I had crossed over and that I would make it as a producer because I had finally solved a problem logically and that was my

turning point in her eyes. The rest of the trip Miranda told everyone how much I'd grown on the trip including the size of my ass. Oh. Okay. She was tracking that. Yeah, so that was my first trip with her and I got through it and proceeded to spend the next year working for her, traveling around the world. I finally got to go back to Mongolia a year later without her. And as soon as I got back, quit that job and moved on.

And did she feel deeply betrayed? Like I finally let one woman in. Oh yeah, she didn't hunt me down, but she did screw me over on my credit and things like that. She tried to stop me from getting this other job. Is she still at it? She's not at that company. I'm pretty sure she is,

but she's moved around a bit since then. You continue to do this work? I do, yep. Do you have a favorite one you've watched recently? Cause I have one. Is it Chimp Crazy? Well, I wouldn't put that under the category. I did love Chimp Crazy,

but there's an orangutan one on Netflix that's pretty new. Oh, I haven't seen it. Oh, it's incredible. What's your favorite? There's a very old one that I really like called Queen of Trees that's about fig trees and the relationship between the fig tree and these tiny wasps that pollinate the figs.

It's a good one in the kind of nature space. What a cool job. Truly. Thanks. It's a tough one, but I've gotten to see some pretty cool things. I bet it's gratifying. Have you been attacked by any animals?

Great question. No, just my dog who has a lot in common with whiskey. Oh. Okay, it's kind of useless. Kind of snappy, but I've been in situations where I'm like, this is probably a pretty dumb situation to be in and I could be attacked by an animal, but fortunately nothing's happened.

Well, how about this? Did you watch Chimp Empire? No, I haven't watched it yet. I've heard you talk about it a ton, obviously. Since you've done this, you have to watch it to imagine how they were capturing this footage. Yeah, a lot of the work I do now is actually more people-centered, like people and nature,

and I find it actually easier in a lot of ways to tell a more authentic story with humans involved. Is it safe to say a lot of what we're seeing is staged? I feel like that's what I learned from this. That's what I learned working on that film. This boss in particular leaned heavily on setting things up, but also even just in the edit, you're making the story. So you're making it maybe look like this owl's in the tree

and the mouse is on the ground and it's scared, but that's all in the editing. So it's not necessarily happening. Yeah, that part I can kind of figure out. I feel like when I'm watching them and they build it so perfectly where you think the mouse saw the owl, they really do a good job.

And I'm like, yeah, no one saw each other. Yeah, so there's definitely a lot of that, which is why I think when you have the human-based stories, you can hear things from the people's perspective and not have to force some of that as much. Well, Annie, lovely meeting you. Andy. What'd I say?

Annie. Well, it's a fake. I don't feel too bad if I get a fake name. Well, it is Anne Hathaway. We're in the ballpark, yeah. All right, well, tell your twin sister and your triplet brother we say hi. I will, my twin sister is actually the one

who initially turned me onto the podcast a few years ago and she wishes she was the one getting to talk to you guys right now. And if she wasn't overseas, she'd be popping in to say hi. Well, she'll write in for another prompt. We'll get her. She's tried a couple of times and hasn't yet,

so she was pretty mad. They got it on the first try. Sounds familiar. Oh, siblings. All right, well, be well. Thanks for telling us that story. It was great meeting you. Thank, siblings. All right, well be well. Thanks for telling us that story. It was great meeting you. Thank you guys.

Bye. All right, take care. Do you wish you had a twin sister, identical twin sister? Oh, it'd be fun. I love twins. I love Mary Kay and Ashley. Yeah, twins are fun. They're so close. They are.

Most siblings can't run a business together. Like the fact that they have that business, and there's no problem. Well, we run a business together. But the fact that they have that business and there's no problem. Well, we run a business together. But we're not siblings. Yeah, we are. Well, okay. You never saw it on the 23andMe?

No, it would be done close case about the Sim. If we found out we were. It's like relative, living relative. And it said Monica Padman from Duluth, Georgia. I would go, okay, that's it. I don't know what to do with that info though. Knowing full confirmation the sim's real. Do you start being a daredevil?

Like, well, I probably can't die in this sim. No, knock on wood, knock on wood. This is the most insane knock on wood I think you've had yet. No, because you're saying you can't die. If you got confirmation, it was the sim. I just don't wanna say you can't die. If you got confirmation, it was the sim. I just don't wanna say you can't die. Okay, all right.

I love you. Love you, brother. Hey, love you, sis. Bye. Do you wanna sing a tune or something? We know a theme song. Oh, okay, great. We don't have a theme song for this new show,

so here I go, go, go. We're gonna ask some random questions and with the help of Armchairs we'll get some suggestions. On the fly a rhyme dish, on the fly a rhyme dish, enjoy. Bye.