Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard - Kathryn Hahn Returns

Episode Date: September 30, 2024

Kathryn Hahn (Agatha All Along, Bad Moms, Glass Onion) is an Emmy-nominated actor. Kathryn returns to the Armchair Expert to discuss the Swedish art of death cleaning, whether limousines are embarrassing or not, and the line between hoarder and collector. Kathryn and Dax talk about losing their fathers, the relationship of their story once they had kids, and why fecal transplants have become so popular. Kathryn explains why menopause should be talked about more, what being married for 30 years is like, and how she has handled having anxiety later in life. Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Wondry Plus subscribers can listen to Armchair Expert early and ad free right now. Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts. Or you can listen for free wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, welcome, welcome to Armchair Expert. This is Donica, no, Danimonica. Oh. There it is.

There it is. Take two. As you'll hear in the episode, this comes up, this welcome, welcome, welcome, and our name's getting all distorted. She gave some good examples and I forgot to write it down. But we were gonna nod to her and honor her because she deserves an honoring and a nodding.

That's right. But we forgot. Maybe another one. Yeah. But anyways, in pursuit of trying to remember what she said, we did just come up with Dana Monica, which sounds close to Santa Monica, and really incorporates both of us.

It's cool. Katherine Hahn, Emmy nominated actor, Bad Moms, Tiny Beautiful Things, WandaVision, Mrs. Fletcher, Glass Onion, and her new series out now on Disney+, Agatha All Along, who you fell in love with on WandaVision. It is a spin-off of her character from WandaVision. Witchy.

Witches. Please enjoy Catherine Hawn, not a witch. Unless she wants to be one. She's a witch. What's up guys, it's your girl Kiki and my podcast is back with a new season and let me tell you, it's too good and I'm diving into the brains

of entertainment's best and brightest, okay? Every episode I bring on a friend. I mean the likes of Amy Poehler, Kel Mitchell, Vivica Fox, the list goes on. So follow, watch, and listen to Baby. This is Kiki Palmer on the Wondery app, or wherever you get your podcasts. He's an up-chance man.

He's an up-chance man. He's an up-chance man. Oh my god, I'm so proud of you. Oh, I'm so proud of you. Oh, before you, oh, way before you, that's nuts. Also, the compound. Oh yeah, probably. I have, there's nothing here. Right, just the shell of the, probably. I have like, there's nothing here. Right, just the shell of the house, probably. Yeah.

Did you already do the math? No, I didn't. Six years. Six years, you guys. Does that feel accurate to you? Time is like the stipend. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And increasingly so, right?

Time? Well, I just went to see Olivia Rodrigo this weekend. Thank you, my dear, and thank you for the tea. My liquid death. There wasn't a bathroom door when you were here last night. I know, I remember. It kind of feels sad that it's there. Ah!

Ew! I kind of missed the curtain. Catherine, I love you. I do. Oh my God, you guys, as soon as I sat back, my jeans popped. Oh, that's fine. I'm just gonna relax. Yeah, get comfortable.

Let the chips fall where they may may you can take them right off. There's a blanket You can fling over your lap I love that you guys I have chosen not to wash the couch because it's kind of Yeah, what is it King Harry Henry I mean I always say King Henry on accident, but it's King Harry. Okay, because it's Prince. Prince Harry. Prince Harry, yes.

I was like, King Harry? I know, it's a mess. He's sweat there. So we can't get rid of that. Letterman peed his pants right where you're sitting. This feels really strange now. It's not really that comfortable, right? I think we just had those restuffed, didn't we?

But I sat in it yesterday, and it felt like it was at an angle. Do you feel like you're at a bad angle? No, I feel really tucked into this corner in a nice way. It feels very cozy. Yeah. It's like a little tuck. I like my little cozy corner.

I have to presume you're going somewhere after this because. Oh, because you look so nice. Do you wanna know my clues? Why, because my hair is soaking wet? No, no. But you live a couple feet away right I hear you what if I had taken a nice car the five steps it would have taken me to walk right so I just walked outside yeah I see an SUV clearly a studio has sent

an SUV for you to get around today and I thought I don't think Catherine would have been like yes yes, send it. I'm going 30 feet. No, it was embarrassing. I was like, you guys, I can walk there. But I'm doing the dodo. Okay, what's the dodo? I guess it's like a pet or an adoption thing

where you have like a date with a rescue animal. Oh, you have a date with a dog or a cat today? Yeah, today, dog and a cat. Okay. So anyway, my dog is gonna meet me there, which is very cute. Oh, cute. What if you also requested stretch limo, like 90s style?

And what if I didn't even walk anymore? Like what if I was like, I just need to be in a little rascal now. A little rascal. From my black car. Or a sedan chair, the way they would carry people on their shoulders. Yes. That would be fun.

Trying to get up the stairs, yelling at everyone. As we sit here and talk, I am trying to think if there's ever been anything that did a 180 as much as the limousine from when you and I were younger. The dream was to be in a fucking Burt Reynolds. Stretch for prom. The longer the better. The longer the better, always.

You want to get in and have to crawl on your hands and knees for like six, seven minutes to get to that front seat. And now when you be deeply humiliated to get out of have to crawl on your hands and knees for like six, seven minutes to get to that front seat. And now, wouldn't you be deeply humiliated to get out of a stretch limousine? I would be. Although now I feel like it would be hilarious if someone were to roll up.

Not even in the movie, but just kind of going. Yeah. Sure, sure, sure. That's a Will Ferrell move. In a stretch white limo. Should we commit to that as like, let's bring back the stretch limo? Is that what we're committing to today?

You know, I often am perusing the classified ads for cars. Yeah. You know me, anything that might pique my interest, I'll take a gander at. Maybe you'd be shocked, maybe you wouldn't. You could get a stretch limousine for $1,000. You can't get rid of them. My dad had four cars. He passed away this spring Oh my gosh, I know but he just had a lot of stuff and that's an understatement But he had four caddies and one Oldsmobile one of the caddies we drove out here to early know had

Transpred what is it called like in a carrier? Oh my god between the three of us, you can't say. I think we had it shipped. I have brain fog. I keep saying that until like the day. Until someone comes and whispers in your ear what word you were looking for.

Just wait patiently. I need that so badly. My kids are just so patient now, they're just like, hmm. It was a 91 El Dorado. So fantastic. You could land a plane on a 91 El Dorado. So fantastic. You could land a plane on the front of this thing. But you know the benches in the front,

they had one seatbelt that went across the whole front. 60-40 split, they called that. Why? Because the driver's seat, actually you could maneuver it, right? Oh, right. And then the other part, the 60%, was for the passenger and the middle rider. We have one of those in the Roadmaster. Me and the girls just drove up to Bob's Big Boys, all in the front. Oh, man.% was for the passenger and a middle rider. We have one of those in the Roadmaster.

Me and the girls just drove up to Bob's Big Boys all in the front. Oh, man. Okay, so are you driving that thing around town now? No, we had it shipped out and then we looked at the under carriage and it is definitely a Midwest loved car. It is rusted.

Swiss cheese under there. Yeah, looks like a prehistoric creature. The rust has rusted into something else. It's like, yeah, there's nothing to do. Then you gotta ship it to a junkyard. And then you're like, oh my God, what a waste of that whole endeavor was. Did you have this, and maybe it's too early

to talk about it for you. I'm 12 years out from my father passing. Your parents, were they together? No. No, right, okay. They got divorced when I was like 30. Oh, wow. I know. Which was interesting. They got divorced when I was like 30. I know, which was interesting. Oh, cool.

I mean... I don't think I was... I don't think that was cool. In the same way that it's original to drive around in a limousine now. Like, no one's getting divorced when the kids are 30. Did it make you feel like a kid? That's exactly what it did. You really revert. Yeah, I had a similar situation.

It didn't end in a divorce, but there was a very tenuous time between my parents and I was out here, totally living on my own, and I was like, no, you can't. Actually, that's not gonna work for me, and I need you two to be in the same house at Christmas. The one time I come home, you must. You have to.

My annual trip. Just get it together. Just get it together. Cut the shit, really, is what you're saying. You've gone get it together just get it together cut the shit really come on you've gone this far i know the fucking shit i know so then this applies and not to get so fucking heavy right out of the gates but my father died and then i go to where he's living and i'm just looking at all this stuff and i go like oh wow we just gather all this stuff and it means so much to us and then at some point someone's gonna just look at this room and it means so much to us. And then at some point, someone's gonna just look

at this room and go like, I don't know, just take it all away, I guess. Isn't that weird? I know, well, my father was a real hoarder. He had a real like disorder. Let's just say that there was a company called in called Masters of Disaster. Oh, okay.

Not Masters of the Universe, Masters of Disaster. It was profound to go walk through my childhood home. You couldn't go up the stairs to the attic. So it was peeling back layers of stuff that meant nothing to us to finding stuff that was ours that had been buried underneath. It was like layers and layers of things we didn't recognize to just like a little box that said, Catherine's here books. It was deep.

And compounded by the hoarderism. You're just struck with the fact that you hang out in these things, you almost define yourself with these things, they make you feel safe, and then they just get sent to the junkyard. Have you heard of the Swedish art of death cleaning? No.

Swedish art of death cleaning. It sounds like a punk band from our youth. I know, it does. Earmark that. We're coming right back to it. I just wanna say, six years ago, my main takeaway, the thing I'll never forget from that interview, is that we liked Fugazi, and you like hung out on a bridge.

Yeah. In Cleveland. And you're like a punk girl, like Fugazi. And I'm like, soul sister. Okay, continue. Yeah, I want to continue. Swedish masters of death. I have a fallback to that question. Okay.

Olivia Rodrigo, guess who opened? Who? The freaking breeders. Oh, really? Yes. It made me love her. And then they played gigantic at the end. All these kids had no idea what was going on, and my hubby and I were like sobbing.

Yeah, I bet. That would make me love her too. I already do. We do love her. No, she's incredible. Okay, but a Swedish death clean. Okay, so Swedish art of death cleaning. And Polar produced a show about it. It's basically like Marie Kondo.

You know, the whole thing of hers is, this is bring me joy. But this is, will this bring joy to the people I love after I die? Oh my God. You have to really like look at death, understand, accept it, and then start to unburden yourself from stuff. So then you can live this chapter of your life unburdened by accumulation. This is so Swedish.

This might be the most Swedish thing I've ever heard. We were just there, I got assaulted in a gas station. How? By an older man who was really mad I wasn't following the rules precisely of where to pay with your credit card. I've never heard of a mean Swedish person. I had to take some responsibility for it when we left.

I was like, I gotta imagine that was very uncharacteristic. And I must've triggered him greatly. and he must have thought like this big bully even though I'm a fighter of bullies I only got big to fight bullies. Which sometimes makes you a bully. I know. It's so weird. These lines are very impermanent. Yeah they are. We're constantly on stand. Who am I? What do I want? Don't you like pretty things? I think I happen to know that we share a designer. Oh! Oh! Did you work with

Nikki Keel? Amy! She's working on my house. My button just fell out of my pants! Just take them off! Catherine, get them off! They don't want to be a part of this interview. Wait! Isn't she incredible? She's perfect. I know, she's perfect. I wanna see pictures.

Perfect. Her book, I would just be like, ah, peace. And she's so cool. I know. She's like chill and low key and seemingly has no ego, even though she's perfect. I wanna be her.

Me too. I know we're getting off of gender stuff. We're moving on as we should and people shouldn't be in boxes, but it's incredible what those images do for you guys. And I don't know any guy, I don't know a single guy that's just like absolutely thunderstruck by interior design. I clearly know some, we just haven't talked about it. But we will look at the history of muscle cars

and we will fucking spray. What is going on? I feel so fascinated. Do you say I'll fucking spray? That's so intense. I know, I know. I'm trying to make it not as scary through my best friend Aaron and I say it a lot and we're trying to kind of deep.

You're trying to like put that in the, de-mystify it? De-intensify it, I don't know. It just comes to mind. Pump, pump, spray, spray, I don't know. Okay, okay. I know what you mean. I feel like there's some incredible male interior designers

who have like insane eyes. But for me and you and a lot of women and also a lot of guys, friends I have, I don't know. Okay, I know what you mean. I feel like there's some incredible male interior designers who have like insane eyes. But for me and you and a lot of women and also a lot of guys friends I have that are like, what? Because when something like clicks into place visually, when you walk into a room, it does give you a feeling of peace. Balance, right?

It's like symmetrical in all of the ways there can be symmetry. When you're like, oh, this is relaxing. And I dig it. I guess we grew up in visual chaos. Yes. So there is something that feels like. Catherine, back to cleaning out our father's place.

Yes. And I feel like I'm almost dishonoring him by reporting this, but any big plastic jug that he had used all the contents in, he saved. Like he was gonna somehow repurpose all these containers. He thought he was gonna make a vase out of them. I don't think a vase would be fair. Often it's a vase.

Like, oh, I'll throw nuts and bolts in that one and I'll throw whatever. How could he not at some point, Ben, like, got enough plastic jugs, not enough washers and bolts and change in the world to fill up all these in a bizarre way I can relate? Like I'll finish a big thing of protein powder in a jug. I'm like, that's a big usable vessel. Cut off the thing and then just like, yeah, totally. It feels crazy to throw this away. So many vultures can. protein powder in a jug, I'm like, that's a big usable vessel. Cut off the thing and then just like, yeah, totally. It feels crazy to throw this away.

So many vultures can. If you were living in the 1300s, this would be like the most prized possession someone could have. Yes. What was the weirdest thing your dad was storing in mass? I can't even, let's just say it took from May till like last week for the house to be finally cleared. Outboard motors on top of outboard motors.

There's a life-size version of the Pei-Taw in the backyard and anchor the size of both of these chairs together in our front yard. He said it was for the F something Fitzgerald, which is like a big freight ship that sank in the Lake Erie back in the 40s. The Edmonds Fitzgerald. Edmonds Fitzgerald.

Well, the legend lives on from the Chippewa down of the big lake they call Gitchagumi The lake it is said never gives up her dead when the skies of November turn gloomy Wait, you never cease to surprise me. That's the Edmonds Fitzgerald by Gordon Lightfoot. With its load of iron ore, 26,000 tons more. I'm seeing how long before Monica screams. Why are you doing this to me?

Benny Edmonds from Sterile Great MD. I gave you so many verses and you're still going. Well it's just such a good song. And it's also 13-14 minutes long. That's the best for karaoke. Just to fucking make everyone nuts. I used to always do Grandma Got Run Over by a Reindeer just because it's so long.

Is it that long? It's not short. Oh wow. Yeah, like this is not the season and also it's like 12 minutes long and there's no real exciting kind of thing. Yeah, it's kind of vaguely funny but not funny. Well it's funny you can say that because my party trick when I was an alcoholic

was to play Edmund Fitzgerald for karaoke but sing the lyrics of Piano Man. He's talking with Davey who's still in the Navy and probably will be for life. Isn't that confusing? I know, my brain just fritzed. Yeah, as did the folks at the bar. Did your pants explode again?

Oh my God. Oh my God. Guys. Wait, I have a question about the hoarding. Was your house that you grew up in when your mom was there also like that? Yes, he had tendencies. So there's always like a trying to push it somewhere.

Like if you opened up the trunks of any of these cars, it was like, whoa. Oh, I see. And my mom was definitely like, this is funny stories. When they were in counseling at some point, the therapist was like, why don't you try taking one hefty bag a week, filling it with stuff, putting it on the tree lawn to throw it away.

And he just didn't do it. And my mom was like, what about the hefty bag? And he was like, oh, it's a metaphor, Karen. He would not do it. It's literal motherfucker. I went to find my dollhouse in there and I opened, it was like silence of the lamp. I took this sheet off and my childhood dollhouse was like hoarded with other dollhouse furniture. That was not my furniture I know.

He just kind of saw it. He's like, well that'll pair nicely. But I think also like, isn't there a thing about it's easier to be with inanimate objects than with people? Yeah. So I had like a sensitivity as he got older. At the beginning, I was like, what is happening? Because he kept saying it was for us,

which was like, again, Swedish art of death clean. And instead of saving anything, he would just accumulate. Once I started having empathy, he would say like, this is an original, da da da, and we were like, clearly not. In his will, he just gave it all to me. To you, you're the steward of all. All of it.

Your brothers are completely liberated from this. Completely liberated. God, it's all me. Wow. So it's been a process, but I've had dear family in Cleveland, and also then it's been a real amazing exercise in truly surrendering, because I'm here, they're there, I get stuff sent to me.

Most of it's broken. That's another chapter of letting go. This is not mine. Do you yourself have any hoarder tendencies? Yes. You do. I have a little bit of fashion hoarding. Yeah, me too.

That's the problem, the line between collector and hoarder is- So that's an interesting thing that I have to look at. Yeah, but you look so cute, and look at your purse. It's like it's working. I mean, your pants don't work, I have to look at. Yeah, but you look so cute and look at your purse. It's like it's working. I mean, your pants don't work, but they do look great. No, I mean, my pants clearly need to be pants. But then I'm also like so unsentimental with stuff. I will throw away things.

When the kids were young, it was a little gaslighting because they'd be like, where's that thing of foil that I had scrunched over in the, I was like, oh. By the way, that's parent 101. You're like, how much of this shit can I throw away? Cause 99% of it, they're not gonna notice. I know. Cause it's just crap. The rocks, they pick them.

But you don't know the one thing that you do is precious. That foil crumple is their baby. Yes. And then you threw away their baby. Delta's never been to a parking lot where she didn't get some souvenir rocks from it. We would have like a gravel pit in the backyard if we weren't getting rid of these rocks at some point.

What's gonna be the one that they really remember? You don't know. I don't know anything about it, despite having watched maybe an episode of Hoarders. Do you know the explanation for what's going on? I wish I knew more. My gut from him, it's an addiction. There's gotta be like a dopamine release

once you have the object. And the idea of it becoming a part of your identity, so the idea of letting it go, feels very vulnerable. And you think you're in control. We would always talk about my dad would be one of those guys on Hoarders that would be all into it at the beginning, would be like, of course! And then he would have a freak out.

As he saw the dumpster, it would panic him. Yeah. I think it becomes a part of who you are. Feels like you're being thrown away. There's a revisionist history about this. I forget which episode, but there is something about the psychology around it. I think it is they associate each item with a memory,

but more than most of us, more than this concert ticket, it's like this rock means something extra. And he also had like a money situation. He always wanted to appear really wealthy. His brothers were really successful, everyone in his family, and he just couldn't quite get it together. He was infamously, we don't want to use the word cheap, but he was very frugal. He would pick up

with a cake at Baskin Robbins that no one wanted that had someone else's name. Happy birthday Charles for my mom. And he thought it was funny. It was funny. Yeah. But he's also being serious. So your mom's still with us. Yes. So I gotta be delicate about this, but of course you're bummed when your parents get divorced when you're 30, but at the same time I imagine your mom was like, I'm gonna get buried under all... That's a lot to live with. Oh, 100%. I love Kristen, but I would not sit in a house and get buried alive because I love her.

Maybe let's stay married and just move next door and go, you're not allowed in here with your objects. I know, or give her a room. That would never work. I know, in a weird way, that gave him an allowance to just explode. There's no speed bumps for his progression. He doesn't have to negotiate at all.

But she like just left. It probably was very, for her- Cleansing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Is her space right now very minimalist? It's not as minimalist as you would think, but it is hers completely. It's beautiful. You know, it's this cute apartment in Cleveland Heights. It's the sweetest.

But our home was very normal-sized, and then there'd be this enormous brass sculpture in the corner that was like, so out of place. Like this grand piano that no one could use. Were you embarrassed growing up or did you not care? No, but this has been such a process of like, mourning this guy, my dad, this guy. Because I think we all just kind of made fun of each other without really taking care.

That was kind of our way of dealing with it. Like we kind of made fun of his stuff. He would like laugh about it. My mom was vicious. We all kind of gave way of dealing with it. Like we kind of made fun of his stuff. He would like laugh about it. My mom was vicious. We all kind of gave it hard, but it was like this weird David Lynch, I don't know what the opening of Blue Velvet was, it's like this beautiful exterior

and you take the rock off and it's just the little like, mangan. We had this secret. Yeah. Okay, great. Okay, great. We went hard on each other too. And I have had to really police myself

to not do that to my kids. Have you had that too? So much. I have like a little shame. Same, same, same. And what's helpful, and I thank my sister for this so much is my sister's around so much

that I'm actually more able to observe her doing it. And when I observe her doing it, I realize, oh, I do it too. So one of the things is, any of the kids do something that's kind of insane. My first reaction is to laugh and it's our way of saying I saw you fuck up but I'm also not saying I saw you fuck up. I'm just laughing and my daughter said like, I hate when you laugh and TT does too and

I'm like, oh yeah we do that. I gotta fucking stop. But that's like my G rated version of how I used to have, but I have a very hard time shaking that. It's difficult. I still, if someone trips on something, I just immediately start laughing. Yeah, me too.

Ethan, my husband's like, Jesus. Kristen too. She's like, it's not funny. She does not like it. She doesn't like it. But it's difficult. I like it though. I know, I know, me too. But also the older one gets,

it starts to feel like, ah, what am I acting out? It's maladaptive. And also you recognize, oh, there's something under this. I'm dealing with this in a weird way. It's not good. Do you feel now that they're getting older, that you are meeting yourself at their age, like all the time? Absolutely. The way I've been framing it is,

I have such a detailed story that explains why I am the way I am. And yet my children are having this completely opposite childhood. And one in particular is so much like me, that I'm actually having to like completely dismantle the story. Like I blame my parents and I blame my environment

for these things. And I'm like, well, no, I'm genetically that way because my little girl's the same. Now she'll create her own story probably. But I'm really aware of that it's a big old story and probably I'm really genetically 80% of who I am. But I've had to realize they're not an extension of me at all. They're completely their own people, which is very difficult to do.

At the beginning, you look at this creature and you're like, I've known you forever and also you're a complete stranger Like it's the weirdest feeling. Yeah, they always existed Isn't that weird and I'm an atheist and I believe in anything, but yes, my kids have always existed But I definitely have felt the older They're getting that the way I communicate with them is somehow how I wished I had been able to communicate and it's not fair on them Because it was a completely unknown approach for you, right? It hadn't been modeled.

Yeah, I didn't know how to do it. I think I overdid it at the beginning. I mean, sobbed when his umbilical cord freaking fell off. I would just like stare at him sleeping. I was like, oh my God, and my daughter too. And so it took a second. Yes, I think the ego really, really gets a workout when you have kids. And I'm not even consciously trying.

I'm trying to give them everything I think I didn't get. And so A, they don't even need that because they're in a completely different environment. Right? So it's like I'm trying to heal some wounds they don't have. They're my wounds and I've got to go heal those and leave them the fuck out of it, which is hard. It's so hard. It's weird.

My son is about to be a senior, my son is about to be a senior and my daughter's gonna be a sophomore and I remember thinking childhood lasted forever. Looking at the eighth grade boys being like, oh, never get it. And now all that's behind them, it's like done. It was five seconds for us. That's the other lesson you learned,

is that this thing, the whole foundation of my personality and all my isms were created in a very tiny amount of time. In the whole rest of my life, I'm dealing with this tiny sliver of time. I know. What a fucking crazy situation. I know. It's the craziest. It was crazy to go to that concert, which was amazing, but to hear music from when I

was their age and hear her and sit next to my daughter. Time was like, whoa, it was so crazy. Don't you find too, the experience of being the parent and becoming middle-aged, for me it scares me. It's like, yeah, no one ever knew what they were doing. The people ahead of me that were adults that were supposed to say, wisdom, I'm them, I barely have myself figured out where I'm functional.

Me too, barely, barely. Yes! Oh yeah. So no one knew. I thought I had it and it started to fall the fuck apart. Guess what? Your grandparents didn't know. It's a miracle this place continues to just self-perpetuate.

Everyone thinks the future is better. You know, we were better than the generation before and we are in so many ways, but I don't know. We're also the same. Yes. Yeah. Is that really historically accurate? What does better mean?

Yeah, what does it even mean? It's interesting to me. What are our values? There are lots of metrics we can look at and there are objective things that are better. No, but all that is in a weird way ignoring what is the human experience and has that changed? Has that gotten better?

Yes, less poverty, higher literacy rates. We watched the late night talk shows from the 80s that we grew up on it and you're listening to these monologues and you're like, oh my God, this was horrendous. And I didn't even know. Calling Monica Lewinsky up. You know, I don't even want to say it out loud. Yeah, bad names.

This shit that you could just say on network TV. So in many ways it's gotten better, but the internal experience of a human on Planet Earth, I don't know. Interesting. I'll tell you one thing that must be better, but the internal experience of a human on Planet Earth, I don't know. Interesting. I'll tell you one thing that must be better. I read a ton of historical stuff.

We haven't had a president in the White House that hadn't lost several children. I mean, that was just fucking standard business, right? I did not see this coming. Lincoln entered with one dead child and one died while he was in office. Yeah, that's weird. If you or I lost a child, that's the last time you'd ever see me. Me too. So that's one way I'll go like, fuck man, life's gotten a hell of a lot better.

It was standard, you'd lose one or two of your five children. I can't comprehend that. Do you think love was different back then? I do. I do. You must not have been able to live like we live now if that was happening every other day.

I guess it's this idea of being better people, that we're better than the last generation. We're not as racist, we're not as sexist, we're not as homophobic. We're inching closer. Yeah, to the great sunrise. Yeah, the self-actualized human. And then the AI will come in.

Oof. Oh, God. Good night. Maybe they'll show us how to do it. Maybe it'll be good. Who knows? Maybe it'll be good. We won't have jobs and we'll just sit in the pool.

Oh, God, that sounds. And that sounds fun. I mean? Maybe it'll be good. We won't have jobs and we'll just sit in the pool. That sounds fun. I mean that does kinda sound awesome. I know. I was like, there's something called retirement. Okay, great topic for us. Cause we're the same age. Yeah, and we look so fucking good.

You both look great. I mean, as I pop my buttons seven times. Really everyone looks great. If I'm at a hotel bar and I'm single and you stroll in, let's chat. Let's see what's going on. Let's have some Chex Mix. Where are you from?

I like your vibe. How did you come to it? Like, oh my God, where'd you get that tattoo? Fugazi, what? Where'd you get that tattoo? It's such a funny. Where'd you find that tattoo? Where'd you get that tattoo?

Not what is that tattoo, but where'd you get it? And I would go, I can't even remember. And you'd be like, ooh, how intriguing. Yeah. Oh my God. He's got a cast. Oh, do you have memory loss too? I put a bit. Do you also have short-term memory loss?

You're from Ohio, I'm from Michigan. I'm sorry, Monica. We vacationed at Cedar Point. Yeah, we did. It comes up so often. I know, I sorry, Monica. We vacationed at Cedar Point. Yeah, we did. It comes up so often. I know, I love it. Nothing comes up more than Cedar Point on this show. We did one back to back days where both people

said the exact same thing for 10 minutes straight. It was so, so funny for me. We didn't go this year. I haven't been, I have a whole fantasy. Can I let you know my fantasy? Please. I won a big time at there once. I never slept in one of those hotels.

The breakers. Did they have a breakers there? The breakers is on Lake Erie with all the porch chairs on the front, the rocking chairs. Didn't even know the name of it. Okay. We only went there a few years ago. I'll tell you something about the breakers. And this was about seven years ago. We had a family reunion. And so we had a house on the Sandusky strip that a lot of cousins were in. And then we stayed at the breakers for aers for a night which was so fancy. Kind of smells a little always like mold from the lake. Like those covers that go right over the bed perfectly.

And they kind of are a little bit stiff but very high end. Very high end. ChiGIF we always go to right there. And everything, appetizer, salad. You mean Friday's the chain restaurant? Yes. Wow. Okay. Yes. Breakers has their own breakfast room. My kids are like, when do we go back to student point? Yeah, yeah, mine haven't been, which is shameful.

So we're both from there. You inherit an architecture, which is everyone that I grew up with had jobs that were really fucking hard on your body. You had to retire. The retirement didn't even have to be good. It was just the absence of this painful, repetitive. And so it made a ton of sense

because you didn't love your job to begin with. You love the folks you work with, but you didn't like assembling transmissions. And so that's the blueprint for me. And I wrestle with it nonstop. It didn't even occur to me as an actor that I could retire. No, you just do it. Until you die on set.

Until they kick you out. Yeah, exactly. Until they send you to pasture. Hopefully you're on a show, you die on set, and you get a little episode dedicated to you, and that's the dream. You're in an in memoriam. Yeah, maybe.

Oh, God. Maybe. Not on wood, I don't like this combo. Yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no. Why did we go so dark? Because we like Fugazi. Correct. And Suzy and the Banshees.

I wanna say the Banshees. But we went to, I was once playing with Kevin Bacon, I love you, we were like on the tiniest plane. And we were like, oh my God, if anything were to happen, it would be like Kevin Bacon and. And others. And others. I know, that's the scary thing about being on someone's thing.

I know, but thank God, everyone's okay. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare. We've all been there, turning to the internet to self-diagnose our inexplicable pains, debilitating body aches, sudden fevers, and strange rashes. Though our minds tend to spiral to worst case scenarios, it's usually nothing, but for an unlucky few, these unsuspecting symptoms can start the clock ticking on a terrifying medical mystery. Like the unexplainable death of a retired firefighter, whose body was found at home by his son, except it looked like he had been cremated. Or the time when an entire town

started jumping from buildings and seeing tigers on their ceilings. Hey listeners, it's Mr. Ballin here, and I'm here to tell you about my podcast. It's called Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries. Each terrifying true story will be sure to keep you up at night. Follow Mr. Ballin's Medical Mysteries wherever you get your podcasts.

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You can binge even the royals ad-free right now on Wondery+. What's up, guys? It's your girl Kiki, wherever you get your podcasts. You can binge even the Royals ad free right now on Wondery Plus. What's up guys, it's your girl Kiki and my podcast is back with a new season and let me tell you it's too good and I'm diving into the brains of entertainment's best and brightest, okay? Every episode I bring on a friend

and have a real conversation. And I don't mean just friends, I mean the likes of Amy Poehler, Kel Mitchell, Vivica Fox, the list goes on. So follow, watch and listen to baby. This is Kiki Palmer on the wonder react or wherever you get your podcasts. I made this joke. Colin Hanks and I were on this 15, 20 foot tall scissor lift as judges on a cooking show.

Why? It was one of these come guest judge. No, but why the scissor lift? Oh, cause you had to sit way up high above all the cooking stations. And look at it happening. And it was so fucking wobbly and we were up there and it was just swaying back and forth like three feet.

And I said, you know when this motherfucker comes down, the headline is gonna say, son of Tom Hanks and husband of Kristen Bell die in sizzling. I love to sit in bed. Monica's like, I don't like this at all. I'm so scared of this conversation. She's like, I don't like it.

Sometimes when you say it out loud, then you can do like. Yeah, that's true. Take away the power. I mainly just make him knock on wood a lot. That works for me. This is almost worn out. Yeah, that area.

This area. I'm like, I have no wood nearby me. I know, we need to fix that, that's on us. Okay, I did have some things written down. I knew I didn't need to because you can feel it. You know, I adore you. I know. You were one of my favorite episodes

the first time we had you. We were babies. A lot's changed. A lot has changed. Monica, your presence is so imperative. Thank you, that's really sweet. It's so awesome to see how that is like morphed. You guys are just the fucking best. It's so imperative. Thank you. That's really sweet. It's so awesome to see how that is like morphed. You guys are just the fucking best.

It's really awesome. And you, Rob, over there, you guys are awesome. You have no idea. If you saw the thing he built downstairs, he's a fucking genius. Oh my, it's insane. It's so pretty. And I'm so excited you're doing that.

Can I even say that out loud? Oh, of course. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We need more people to say it. Experts on experts on video. Check it out. I'm so excited. All the sexy professors and biologists. No, but those are kind of becoming like we were talking about the sociopath narcissism Munchausen that whole like chapter OCD. We got like four things. Those four were really rich. Oh, you heard those?

Yes. Oh wonderful. That was like my summer just driving. I didn't want them to end. I don't either. We're looking for more isms. I love how they talk to each other weirdly. 100%? There's so much overlap. That's so good. You heard the sociopath.

Yes. There's so much follow-up for that, by the way. I came to learn she was in the groundlings, in the Sunday company, and she hadn't told me that during the interview. Weird. Or maybe she just didn't connect. Maybe she was just nervous. Oh yeah, yeah, there's a million options.

She's also a sociopath, literally. I mean, that's what I'm saying. It's so fascinating. I know. Was she in it? She 100% was, because a friend of mine reached out and goes, I was in the Sunday company with Patrick. And I was like, oh my God, I've got to like re-examine.

I've never had an experience that I have played back in my mind more times because the premise is I'm a sociopath, so admittedly, who knows what's coming? Endlessly fascinated by that experience. I was fascinated by her husband. Yeah. Yes. And what he's had to manage and how to have a relationship with her.

A thousand percent. Like what he's not going to get, that he may not even get the love. Well, that was her point. He liked a woman at work and she's like, of course she that he may not even get the love. Well, that was her point. He liked the woman at work, and she's like, of course she do. Oh yeah. She has love in this version you're looking for. So interesting.

Makes me doubt everything. So the only time I've seen you since that interview is we've bumped into each other at Formula One races, which has been a fun thing. Oh my gosh. How many did you go to? I only went to the one. I only went to the one. You only went to the one.

In Miami. And you were a guest of Williams, right? And I wore every piece of paraphernalia they gave me to a degree that was embarrassing. I did this exact same thing as you in Austria as a guest of Williams. I was in like a hat and a shirt and hand, you know, jewelry. I was in wristbands.

I was like a visor. I looked like a walking, like if they had a mascot, I would be like, the walking dog mascot for Williams. Like you worked at Chili's or whatever, like Flair. Embarrassing. Some guy did a double take, he was like, who's that crazy lady walking around with all Williams?

Here's what he thought, he's like, okay great, she loves Williams. She went to the souvenir counter, she bought everything, they were out of bags. So she had to wear everything, so she wouldn't be carrying these individual items. They were so nice. They're the nicest.

Bex, do you remember Bex? Aw, I wanna go back and hang out with them. Yeah, Delta Fell had over heels in love with Bex, was hugging her the entire race. She was so rad. Leonard was speechless. This is your son? Yes.

How old is he at the time? 15, so he was like deep in it. He had the bug. And we had just watched the Senna and the Schumacher documentaries back to back. I was also in. Drive to survive. We hadn't really gotten into Nindenrein.

Just Senna and Schumacher doc. Yeah. Oh, this is interesting. But I do want to go into that show. You haven't watched it. It's so good. That's why I like that one. Okay, I just love the drama and the wealth.

The two together, because one was just go-karts and the other came from such thoroughbred money. So it's like very interesting. And you saw the accident from different points of view. They're mostly all rich though. Yeah. I had a F1 podcast for a year, and we would do zaddies of F1,

so the dads of the drivers. And with very few exception, they're all pretty rich. It's such an intense thing to put your kid into. I wanted very much for Lincoln to go that route because I'm like, of course, back to the healing yourself. I wanted to go kart, I wanted to race, couldn't afford it. I'm like, girl, you got a turnkey, I'll get in the tour bus and we'll go to every single race.

You'll have the fastest go kart, let's do it. Wasn't for her, I had to just move on. She ripped the bandaid off for you at least. But we also went to that driving school, which was so rad in Arizona. I took my son and a couple of friends and I couldn't believe what they just did. You rode passenger with one of the pros, I imagine,

and got like a hot lap. I did that, but then they were able to do like a little thing that was so fast. And I don't think they had their driver's licenses yet. I'm not even sure. Yeah. They had like a trainer, there was whatever, a guy and the thing with them. Kids are racing before they have license.

Before they have license. Yeah. That's true. Yeah. Max Verstappen entered Formula One a week after his 17th birthday. So he'd already been racing. I guess that's how you do it. Before the fear sets in.

That kind of fear. Did you see that documentary called? love a doc us too. Well, first of all chimp crazy, which is out right now No, no chimp crazy chimp vampire people. No the people that did ah King of Tiger King Oh Tiger King. Oh Tigers so it's called chimp crazy. Yes watch the first episode last night It's on HBO and it is pretty good. Oh, I'm excited. Can't wait.

Yeah. Just from the title, I'm guessing. People and chimps. Yeah, people want to own chimps and they're very dangerous. They turn. Especially if they're male. Yes, they're your children, you diaper them. And then they eat your face one day.

Is it mainly women or men? Sorry to gender it. Women. Yeah, women love. They do this with tigers too. It's like the baby of it and the mead. Well, is it that? There's two things I think.

Because I watched fatal attraction stories of women and large cats. This was on a different network. There's all these women who owned like tigers and lions. And of course they all get eaten by them. I think it's attempt to repair having lived with a very crazy dad who was dangerous and threatening. And I think there's some desire to like soothe

and whisper to this clearly wild and lethal animal, like just repeating the trauma. Having control over it. They're very stern mommies. Yeah. Just like, no, no, no, Tonka. Tonka. Very stern, but it's hardcore.

I think it's also connected to yours. I think it's a little bit like if this animal that is meant to hurt people doesn't hurt me, then I'm lovable. Yeah. Yes, that's a great one, Monica. And that's the thing you relate to. Yeah, I do. Yeah, because we have a dog that bites people,

but he doesn't bite Monica. No, he bites me twice. Oh, Frank. Yeah, I like that. Yes, she likes that Frank bites other people. Yeah. Yeah. We have Banjo, who's kind of the similar way.

Like some people freak him out some people don't have people Rosies jumps on your lap with full force pit bull face Oh that he's like a little he's got you all in there. I love him so much That sounds like a very scary combination because if I had to sum up Chihuahuas, I would just go like, oh, they think they're pit bulls. They're so aggressive and they're barking so loud, but thank God they're not pit bulls. But in this case, Andy is a pit bull. Oh, but he's also a lot of bark, no bite. He's such a dingo. Yeah, that's how ours.

Like he's just got such an aggressive butthole. You know what I mean? Like the tail's always up and you're just, ah, get out of my face. Bancho, that's a disarming name. It is. It's a goofy instrument. He's like, oh, he, get out of my face. Banjo is a disarming name. It is. It's a goofy instrument. He's like, oh, he is kind of a banjo. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. Banjo, but he's the kind of dog that would like,

as it's coming out of another dog, he'll just be like, oh, like softy. He didn't shit. Beta, oh, he'll eat the, right, yeah. They don't mind that. Yeah, they really don't. I'm like, you guys, that's pretty sick. In fact, we seem to be the only animal that does mind it.

It's really curious. What do you mean? I watched a video of an elephant. Do you think other animals don't like all the... Oh, they don't care about each other's shit. I saw an elephant. We've all seen this video. That's not because they're missing nutrients.

That's a good question. Well, that's a good explanation. But I saw an elephant put his trunk up another elephant's butt, pull out an enormous clump of dung, and then eat it. That was a video. Maybe he was impacted.ump of dung, and then eat it. That was a video. Maybe he was impacted. But you don't need to then eat it. That's one thing to help a guy out,

but you don't need to eat it then. No, you don't. And then the chimps are chucking it, and they're playing with it, and they're eating it. This is the best conversation I've had. Dogs eat it. Everyone seems really cool. With it.

Every animal, except for us, we're peculiar. Well, aren't we doing fecal implants now? Yes In fact, maybe we're paying the price for not eating each other's but it's a very controversial The fecal implant not if you have C diff you're putting someone else's microbes into your situation You are and hopefully they're the ones that are gonna get rid of C diff match them up. You can't just have self-serve It's nuts, right? You're not supposed to do a fecal transplant

or eat a crap soul from someone who has depression. Well, that's fucking fascinating. I am really interested in that. That would be really interesting if you found someone to talk about that. The connection between gut and brain health. Well, and your stomach's making all the serotonin. We just learned this from a different expert.

So yeah, if your gut's all fucked up and your gut's the one in charge of making serotonin, that's interesting. You're right, we should have a CrapSoul gut biome. That would be great. All right, put it on the list. CrapSoul expert. Do you wanna be here for that?

Do you wanna join us? I would love to be here. Because it sounds like you have a few questions right on the- I have so many questions, I have them right at the tip of my tongue. Yeah, we'll get you in here for that. I would seriously love that. You're invited. Because I really do think it affects your mood and your brain. Yeah, we'll get you in here for that. I would seriously love that. You're invited.

Because I really do think it affects your mood and your brain. Also there's some links between obesity and the gut health. Also neurological disease. Yes. It's very fascinating. Brain fog? We'll ask about that.

We were hot on this trail about five years ago because I'm like, can I get rid of my psoriatic arthritis through this? And we all decided we wanted our friend Amy's poop. In fact, she was the only person in the pod whose poop we thought, doesn't seem to have any of the issues. I mean, I'm upset.

You were hurt. I'm offended by that. But you have depression. Yeah, I would be. Don't you want people to pick your poop? You have epilepsy though, Monica. I know I have two problems. Two strikes.

Yeah, two big strikes. But when did you get diagnosed with epilepsy? In 2020. I've only had two seizures, so it feels like a little bit of a stretch that they diagnosed it as that. Yes. But also, they know what they're doing.

Why not? I'll take it. I'll take it. I'll take it. Yes. So yeah, I've just been on medications. Yeah. Because I've had some depressive really all of a sudden, and I know it has something to

do with hormones. I'm just curious about all of this connection. Yeah. Not to get too personal, we're moving into menopausal zone. Yeah. Oh, for sure. I'm curious about all of it. Have you looked into hormone replacement?

Oh, that's happened. Okay, great. And was it helpful? I'm on hormones, by the way. Yeah, it's like a moving target. I wish, that's another thing that would be interesting. I'm like pitching, having someone talk about menopause would be so awesome.

A lot of people want us to do that, we are. Because there's a couple of women that are starting to talk about it, but it used to be so, not only like career ending, in a weird fucking way, which is so dumb, but also just one size fits all hormones. My mom told me the hormone replacement she had was from pregnant horse piss.

What? Oh, wow. And that's when all those strokes happened. Oh my God. Isn't that ridiculous? Yeah. That's not good. Now at least there's like natural stuff. Mine's grown from a yam.

I used to do the wild yam cream. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yam. Yeah, yeah, yeah, purple yams. Listen. Those are very healthy. They're very healthy. I've seen the blue zone. Yep, blue zone chart full of purple yams.

Purple yams. Wow. Purple yams. Purple yams! Wow. Purple yams! Purple yams! Have you read that Miranda July book? Yes! I was just about to ask her that. Crazy, right? I loved it. I have passed it to a bunch of friends. Same! I love reading something that feels somewhat radical that is also like the truth. I know. that is also like the truth. I know. It just feels like. I know.

I kind of love that material-wise. I feel like women haven't been able to show those feelings or those urges or desires that are like kind of off the. They feel taboo. Yes. And also I love the feeling that it was never satisfied. It was like desire, desire, desire, desire, but like she never got that final chord.

It's moving to me. So moving as a coming of age story, becoming a middle-aged story. Well, they say that as second adolescence is like going through this change. And it's weird to be going through this at the same time as my daughter is going through hers. So it is hormone hotbox in our house.

The boys are just like, anyway. We're gonna go to a baseball game for two days. For two days. No one talks about it. I would love it because also I think it is sexy and interesting and dangerous because it happens. Yeah, and there's like a freedom to it. Yes, it's not something like a shy away from.

Yeah, think about how many heroes in film and television we've had that are male who are having affairs and they're still our hero like Tony Soprano, Mad Men, name them. I can't off the top of my head think of the female protagonist who's our hero who's also having lots of affairs. It's really kind of under, it's like ignored. It is.

That's a bad woman who does that. I kind of did that in this show called I Love Dick with Kevin Spacey. It's like ignored. It is. That's a bad woman who does that. I kind of did that in this show called I Love Dick with Kevin Spacey. Oh, Kevin Spacey. You're not canceled. Oh my God, you got. No, you're canceled.

Bye, bye bye. Wait, don't see my brain fog. I'm glad we had you. It's brain fog. My brain fog. I shouldn't talk to anybody with a microphone. I mean, one's name. I know, I mean, produced by, no.

Yeah, you really need crapsoles, I think, to clear up this fall. You guys. Do you know there was a diving team? No, was it a diving team? No, it was just two. Oh, Stanford. In the Olympics, there was two competitors in the lineup,

and one's last name was Harvey, and the last name was Weinstein. So, um. Like in the lanes when it showed. Wait, seriously? Yeah, it was Harvey Weinstein. Oh my God, that's incredible. Okay, sorry, back the RV wine steam. Oh my God, that's incredible. Okay, sorry, back to menopause.

Steamy topic, menopause. It is. But it is. But it's good for men to hear because men go through it too. Isn't that like crisis? Oh God, yes. I've been in it for a decade,

but I think I was hinting around this the last time I interviewed you, but of course I am both thrilled for you and Ethan, your husband, what a victory story. You guys have been together what? 30 years. 30 years. That is the dream and it's awesome. And also I'm like, I am extra sympathetic to dudes I know

who are really young and get sober. Cause like when they hit 40 and they got sober at 20, how much are you just going like, well fuck I was also just 20, I was crazy, period. I don't know if that was my personality. You know, and in a similar way, it just feels compounded to have been with someone for 30 years, it's great,

and I'd imagine as you're reading this book, I don't know. I feel like that's the way to do it, is you have to have that at least mental imagination open door at all times, because it doesn't happen that you're acting on anything, but it just keeps that awake and alive. Right, which I think is vital. You know, I know he does too.

It's just imperative. It's not to say we haven't been married and divorced like nine times within our 30 years. There's been long chunks of time where we were like, oh, I don't know. That's helpful that you said that. Oh yeah. Don't you think there's this really fascinating thing on the other side of it, which is at the beginning,

you're in love, there's great hormones, you're building, building, building, then you've built all the stuff, then there's all this stuff, then you have the lows, then you have the oh, what are we doing, now we have kids, blah, blah, blah. The weird new kink is almost like going, oh wow, and we're still together.

I know. That becomes its own momentum and intriguing aspect, right? Oh my God, I've known this body for this long? That beginning period, of course, it's like pheromone hot. You guys wrestled with 20? Like 18, 19, and you kind of also in that phase are hidden. You're showing off a different side of yourself. Then there's that next phase in which it takes a while,

but when you actually are who you really are and you're changing, can I still look at you and see the person you are now? Or am I constantly, is that another story? Am I like looking at you and telling the same story, projecting who I think you are? Right. I mean, honestly, I think you are. Right.

I mean, honestly, I like going out of town, but we like a little MDMA. Sure, sure, sure, sure, sure, sure. But like two or three times a year. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just to be like, whose lips are these? Yeah, I remember Lusitne after you. This is fun.

Apparently that's like a couple's therapy, you know. Prescription. I mean, it wasn't like prescribed. No, I know. Michael Pollan has said that. Yeah, we had Michael Poll Paul and has said that yeah We had Michael Paul and we said like what would be your dream drug schedule or like what is your drug schedule? And he said well first of all I'm not saying I do drugs because it's still legal

But I would do shrooms on my birthday every year to reflect on my year and where I'm going and then I would do MDMA once a year with my wife to rekindle our intimacy Yes, and I would do toad medicine when I was in my 70s. What's toad medicine? Is that where you lick the Amazonian frog? No, you take it, it's supposed to be as 15 minutes straight shot. Mike Tyson talks about it.

Michael Pollan did not love it. Okay. But he tried it. But he tried everything. Yeah, wow. I would love to do something like that when I was a little lady. You'd be driving your little rascal in circles.

Do you think they should leave you in your little rascal or take you out? Probably take you out. You could drive it out. I would hope that I would be under enough medical supervision that someone would have me laying in my little nest. Yeah, you'll be comfy.

You're pram. My pram! You'd be in a pram. I would love to be in a pram. Yeah, who wouldn't? So elevated in English. You're kinda in one right now. I feel like I am.

Last question before we talk about Agatha all along. And this is just, I want you to gossip about this person. Oh! Cause I find him very intriguing. Daniel Craig. Oh, I love him. He is so fricking funny. He is one of my favorite humans on the planet.

I love him. And have you stayed in touch with him? Is he that kind of guy? Yes. We have a big text chain from Glass Onion, which we would continuously troll him and Ryan about this new cast. I feel like, how's that going? They're doing a third, I guess. Yeah, they're just wrapped.

I love those movies. I know I do, too. And their new cast is awesome. But he's just the best. I'm still want to get dinner with him and Rachel. I think you would love him. Like, he's a good egg. He surrounds himself with good peeps and he's not bond, right? He's very far from bond like a knock-around guy like a blue collar real dude Yes, and his eyeballs are the Mediterranean Sea if the Mediterranean had all the secrets of the universe

Yeah, I'm very intrigued by him He was staying at the same hotel as us when Kristen was working in England, and a friend of ours bumped into him in the gym a couple times. I almost want to spend the entire day at the gym hoping I would bump into him. I want to just watch him work out. I love his body. Him come out of the water in those blue shorts.

I'll never forget it for that Bond trailer. I put a guy. Everyone in the cast I loved. Dave Bautista, one of my also. He's a sweetheart, right? All time, yeah. Big, softy. Counterintuitive, a vegan, right?

Is he a vegan? Or do you see him taking down? I don't know. Okay. Why would you care? That's something I would care about and not you next messages true Yeah, it is right. He has a lot of dogs. We done. Yeah, he's a real animal lover those two pieces of information I feel like I could put together a whole story about him It's good to just put stories together without any knowledge. Using pieces of information from various sources and then say, nailed it. That's why I'd make a terrible detective. Once I decided who was guilty, nothing could convince me otherwise. I think both of you would make good detectives.

Ding ding ding, detective. But like, why does a boy get so big? Right away you gotta ask a question. Any one of us who put in way too much time getting big, why? I know for me why. I think that he was maybe born with that, you know. Not that big though, there's a lot of effort. Well he was in the Vince Vaughn stuff.

Not Vince Vaughn, oh my god you guys. Vince Vaughn, oh my god, I shouldn't do any more podcasts. Vince McMahon. He was a WWE. I was like WME, Liam Orr's Endeavor! Wrestling organization. He was with them. This is his own story.

But he was in that for a while. Oh, of course. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But any boy that ended up in the WWE, they were in that gym, and they were in that gym a lot. That's interesting. That's a lot of effort. It's very interesting.

Did you ever see that Andre the Giant documentary? One of my favorites of all. Oh my. I love it so much. Do you have a favorite moment? Cause I do. Oh, when the fart. Thank you. When they talk about the fart.

The fart, but it's the way, it's the way. He took a fart. When Andre would take a fart, it was Mean Gene, the announcer. He said, take a fart. Meaning like when you take a dump. He had to take a fart. We watched that. He had to take a fart. That's how big it was. We watched that.

He had to take a fart. 400 times. Wait, did you ever hear that weird story that he grew up in the same French town as Samuel Beckett was staying in and Samuel Beckett would take him to school? No. Yes!

Come on. That's a fact check though. It could be wrong. That's a fact and check it. As soon as it came out of my mouth, I was like, could've bit of bazillion different things. We'll revisit that. Okay, now in my research of you today,

I didn't realize this at all happened because I've just known you the whole ride and of course, no, I'm gonna say one more thing before we get to it. Oh. Do you realize every single thing you do is based on a book? This just popped out at me.

And I'm like, is that intentional? I love Dick, based on a book. Mrs. Flet do is based on a book? This just popped out at me. And I'm like, is that intentional? I love Dick, based on a book. Mrs. Fletcher, based on a book. I know this much is true, based on a book. Tiny beautiful things, based on a book. And of course the thing we worked on together, this is where I leave you, based on a book. Is this intentional or is this just happening to you?

No, it's definitely not intentional. And have you noticed that? I've noticed I've had a lot of long titles in my career. Okay, that's what you noticed. Maybe because there is an inherent juicy arc that's already baked into it somehow that when I read it, there's a confidence in it already. So is it chicken or the egg though? This is another way it could be.

It could be that you're attracted to that. I'm almost curious. What is it about something based in literature where the producers and the directors think of you, I think you might actually really innately read literary character. Does that make sense, Monica? Yes, I have a take. I think it's because when you have a book,

a character's fleshed out so, so well. Oh my God. It's so detailed. You're a very real person with depth and complexity and I think that's a good pairing. I totally agree. You seem very dense with real personality aside from show business. I think that's your appeal.

Oh my God. You don't know how to comment on that. I also think that a lot of stuff had been directed by women in that particular chapter who were interested in exploring these women that I just happened to be at the age of, we just happened to match up at this weird moment. I think there's a depth to you

that is very much a literary character more than, what do we know about Bond? He can kill people and fuck good, and he's got cool cars. There's that like- How dare you? That's not to imply Daniel Craig doesn't have a depth to him.

Also, aren't those books? They are interesting When you say literary I imagine myself No, but I hear you I don't know there is something It is suspicious. I have an interview somewhere their last seven projects for based. I know that is interesting Mm-hmm. You work a lot. So part of it could also just be that you work all the time They're gonna be a higher. No, but no because it's literally the last But not mr. Mrs. Smith What do you know, but I'm not Angela de Jolie. You're not no, I'm so sorry. Are you in the new mr. Mrs. No, okay

I got confused. That's okay. That's okay. Yeah Listen I know this I know this really well. I do this sometimes when I'm interviewing people too. And I am humiliated. I'm always confused, and flatteringly so, with Anna Gasteyer. We always are confused with each other. That's 100%.

Is it who it is? 100%. Oh my god, amazing. I can't believe I did that. She will send me pictures of Starbucks cups that say bad moms. Oh nice. Like I love bad moms. But I know you, so this is a bummer. No, it's not don't worry about it. Life is weird

I guess we have to keep it in because you have to keep it in Do you want to go in the bathroom so flagellate for a second cry cry smack yourself in the mirror? Yeah, I do. The chair is too comfy. Do it in my face. I want to see you atone. Wow, it's definitely her. her yeah everyone asked me if I was in SNL Because you're funny. I'm very flattered. We both went to Northwestern Wow okay This feels like a sim thing a little bit of 100% blitz all right well that was embarrassing No wonder you think she works so much because you're saying everything Also everything you see on a gas guy.

You're also like, wow, she's in this too. So she thinks you're in like 13 projects a year. I do. No, between the two of us, we have a pretty healthy body of work. Yeah. People ask me how I have time for the T-Mobile commercials. They're like, Zach Shepard is in. Why haven't you ever said, I'm Death Leopard joined by Santa Monica?

Ah. Oh, I can do that. I'm always in joined by Santa Monica. I'm always in the car mixing it up for myself. You're the only person that likes it. I'm always like, feels like home. Santa Monica, you've never done that one. You should add that in. Okay, I'll do it. And deaf leopard.

I'll do all of them. Deaf leopard, yeah. Deaf shepherd. Okay, but what I was going to say before I got into these literary things, which again, is very suspicious and interesting. We'll both mull that over. I am mulled wine. Hopefully I gave you a kernel of something to obsess about later. It's good. I need more to ruminate over.

Yeah, good. I can relate. As I was up all night last night. Me too. My brain was just on fire. We had a long-term amazing assistant who just left on Friday with a day notice because she got a great job as the writer's assistant. I love her, I'm so excited for her, but it was definitely like fuck Monday And this sounds like a crazy problem to have as I'm saying it. I'm just like oh Cuz I'm leaving all of a sudden all this press stuff is happening, but it's all good. I'm excited for her I have the same thing I think where we're from it's we're from. It's weird, because would you feel better

about lying about what your life is? Which is like, you're in 55 things, you film all across the country. Yeah, someone's gotta pick up some of the big holes. It's hilarious that I still have a file of facts and I still schedule everything myself because I'm kind of a control freak. Not a control freak, but I...

You wanna know what's going on. The shame. I spent my whole Sunday mopping my garage and... I know, what's wrong with us. Doing all this weird stuff. I was putting molding on my Roadmaster. But you like it. Feels grounded.

What I like is how I feel after I do it. It's not like I enjoy doing it, but afterwards. But again, this is my story. Even just making you feel grounded sounds like a douchey thing to say. No, it doesn't. You can't win. I am a horrible person.

I know, we're so hard on ourselves. Why are we so hard on ourselves? But yeah, I finished the whole thing and I have a blister on my thing. I pulled my nail away from the bed yesterday. I was bleeding on my thumb. I blistered all over my fingers and I go, okay, you kind of earned all this great luck you have today. And I still don't feel like I really did. I know. Right? I almost think I'm atoning so it doesn't get taken. So last night it spiraled from that to my dad's stuff, to like all this stuff at once. It's very hard for me to compartmentalize and show up clear.

That's why meditation I'm really trying, which is probably the opposite of why one meditates is to try. Try your hardest. I'm going to fucking meditate. And then time feels very precious. Like a year left with my son at home just feels like ooh. I'm very scared of that. But anyway, I'm not a lot of sleep last night either.

I would not describe myself as someone who has anxiety. That's not really my thing. I have other things. Funny enough, just during the day I don't. But at night, I have tremendous anxiety while I sleep. I think it's because I'm afraid to be vulnerable, to like shut myself down. What could happen while I'm not paying attention? My anxiety has gotten worse.

Thank God for people you trust to talk to and also therapists, a therapist. Yeah, it's not douchey if you have an assistant, but if you have many therapists, that might be it. No, I know, that's what I'm saying. When I said therapists, I choose which, no, yeah, exactly. I think a lot of accumulation of being away for a lot of my kids kids life is starting to build up

So I don't want to put that on them. So I'm trying to like move through it all Yeah, see it observe it love one experience it. You're a good girl Miami with your kid you put a lot of effort in that you went to a driving school, you're a provider. Breakers. Oh my God. The breakers. That is the key somewhere. I'm not sure if I'm right on this, but the most vulnerable thing is to love oneself. To believe, yeah, you're worthy of loving yourself.

It's really hard. Yeah. Ugh. Stay tuned for more Armchair expert if you dare Anyway, tell me if you figure it out Probably to that is the baseline and I'm just figuring it out. No, that is like the thing I think most people struggle with that. It's hard. Speaking of therapists, you did play a therapist in Mr. and Mrs. Smith, just letting you know. Oh!

Yeah, that was your role. Amazing! Yeah. And I learned a lot. Yeah, you did. These characters teach us so much. They do. Some people say that may mean it.

Okay, 25 minutes ago. I probably said that before, because I didn't know what else to say. No, also, it's gonna be true. Well, that's another thing, right? Sometimes I'm like, bleh! Because I'm like, I don't want to reveal too much. No, but also, Dash, that's you being against being earnest

and it's also okay to be earnest sometimes. If that's your truth, if you learn something, we learn stuff from our job all the time. Yeah, but we have pros come in. I learn stuff about myself based on our dynamic. Life is like that. Are you allergic to earnestness? I was, although I always had it growing up

in that kind of like- It's too vulnerable. But because there was a rage virus for a second, which was really counter to everything that I had been putting out there. And you're right, when I see earnestness in my children, it might be the most beautiful thing I witnessed. The most beautiful thing.

You're so right, Monica. And then I go like, oh yeah, you can't let yourself do that. When I look my new chimp in the eyes. A tonka? A tonka. There's nothing. Yeah.

The purity. The purity. See there I am making a joke. No, but that was funny. Yeah it was. Okay, 60 minutes ago, I said in my research of you today, I realized something I missed,

which was Wandavision. What if you started talking about the books? I did. The literary books. Oh my God, I realized something I missed, which was WandaVision. What if you started talking about the books? I did. The literary books. Oh yeah, and I was on a loop. I would have totally understand to have empathy and compassion. We'll revisit the books after this point

they've been trying to make forever. I didn't know that WandaVision was so enormous. I didn't either, it was a pandemic. And then this rash of interviews I read post-WandaVision have a similar theme, which is like, you're a big star now, but you've always been, people are enamored with you and you're having a moment, which is crazy to me,

because you were like a lead of Bad Moms, which had sequels. I mean, you were outstanding in that movie. So the notion that you were having a moment from WandaVision struck me as interesting. And I just wonder if it struck you as interesting. Well, it was interesting because it was like one of those jobs that I didn't know. We were not going to be the first out of the gate.

It was supposed to be Falcon and the Winter Soldier, I think. It felt like this weird little step-sister. And it was met with such excitement that there was something different. And also, I think it was just perfect timing. It was so unique. And also, it was made so well. It was a pandemic when it came out.

And I'm not on social media. Congrats. Well, it started out with laziness, and I'm kind of like, I just can't do it. I was going to say congrats too, but she has just as many anxiety and sleep issues as me. And then I thought, well, fuck it. Maybe it's not the...

No. I just think it's like being around. Yeah. Just being human. And I really love that part. It just felt like something clicked. It just felt easy. I love those characters in the Marvel movies. And so it was just easy. I knew nothing about Agatha, this centuries old witch. So it was just a blast. And then seeing it together,

I was like, ah, it's a very cool show. I mean, I did the finale all ADR that last episode was in my garage. Oh, wow. Because COVID like I had to put up sound deafening. No, I did the finale all ADR. That last episode was in my garage. Oh, wow. Because of COVID, like I had to put up. Sound deafening. No, I wish it was like moving tarps. Oh, sure, sure. Oh, yeah, sure. Ferny pads. Ferny pads, like screaming, holding for lawnmowers, like right outside.

Yeah, leaf blower. That was fun though. So it was enormous. Is that the biggest tidal wave you've been on? I guess in terms of visibility and online chatter, that has been the thing. But I've got a teenager who tells me how it just blows over in two seconds, so it's like, you know,

you can't hold on to anything. Yeah, yeah. Because I'm constantly like, it's very demure. She's already like, that's done, mom. I know. I'm like, what? No. Just heard about it. It's all I got.

As soon as I learned too, it's over. It's over. It's sad. Like, got to go, guys. I don't know that one. Oh, got to. I guess it's over. It's over. Like, yeah, gotta go guys. I don't know that one. Oh yeah. I guess it's like, yeah, damn. But it's like, yeah.

And that's from TikTok? I think so. Probably. How soon into that experience were they talking spin-off and Agatha having her own? Jack Schaefer, who wrote it was like, we're not done yet. And I was like, oh my God, yes. And then it wasn't until it was a year, I was actually shooting Glass Onion

when I got the phone call, I freaked out. It took a while to sink in because I was like, oh my God. And you're home for it too, right? Is that here? No, it was Atlanta. Oh, it looks so much like the Disney lot. Oh, we did shoot a little bit at Warner Brothers before they tore it down.

My house was, I guess I can say that, was the Bewitched House. Oh, that's so cool. Isn't that awesome? I love that. You should say that, was the Bewitched House. Oh, that's so cool. Isn't that awesome? You should say that, that's really cool. That's cool, yeah, it was a trip. Okay, so now Agatha Harkness has her own show, which is Agatha All Along,

but there was a moment, it was called Coven of Chaos. I don't know why we ditched that title, that's great. I know. I kinda like The Lion Witch with the great wardrobe. Oh! Oh! That was one that was out there for a second. And I also feel like there should be one

that's just called Witch Please. Oh, that's great. That's great. Or one that's called Britney Witch. It's Britney Witch. Oh my God. I wouldn't be surprised. So I watched three of them last night.

Stop it. Yeah, yeah, of course. What I was really excited about is Allie's in it. Do you know Allie? She is partnered up with William Jackson Harper. I love Allie. She's so rad. Did you meet her on this project

or did you already know her? No, I met her on this project. We got to spend a little time in Atlanta with Will. He's a peach. They're both so freaking talented. And they're so authentic and real. I know. They're real actors.

I really root for them as a couple. Me too. And then Kristen was flipping out that Patti LuPone was on it. That means the world to her. To all of us. Everyone on set was like, oh, Patti.

Yeah. She's incredible. LuPone. LuPone,one the wolf talk about of nature icon I wasn't in the theater, but there's a handful of people that Kristen there's a deity on screen She was like exploding with no I know sorry she was spraying all over the screen The whole cast in this which is not very many people is incredible, but it's all bad bitches

Yes, yeah, cuz Aubrey's awesome. I love very many people, is incredible. But it's all bad bitches. Yes. Yeah, because Aubrey's awesome. I love Aubrey. She's incredible. It's funny, I loved her on White Lotus, and it's criminal to me that you haven't been on White Lotus. Again, back to the literary thing,

you seem like the perfect White Lotus lead. Putting that out there. Oh, put it out there. Would you love to do a season of that? I think it would be amazing. Yeah, okay, great. We just got you that job. Thanks, you guys. Or we got, yeah, Scott. We just got you that job. Thanks, you guys.

Yeah, Scott. I'll give you 2.5%. I'll give you a free set visit. Oh yeah. To whatever fancy locale. Okay, so set it up for us. We meet you, mind you, I was unaware of the WandaVision spin-off of it all,

so I'm really putting together what's happening. Yes. But we meet you and you're a detective, and you're a very detective-y detective. Deadly serious. Yes, very true detective. And then meet you and you're a detective and you're a very detective-y detective. Deadly serious. Yes, very true detective. And then we find out you're under a spell. I have been under a spell for a long time.

And so you're living in a kind of fantasy world. Yes. And I've been stripped of my powers. We don't like that. No. The beginning of it, there's almost like a rattle in this universe, this bubble of this town that something has happened.

She becomes kind of a detective to try to figure out what is happening in this world. She's like the ultimate performer. She kind of morphs into whatever's needed, but she still doesn't know who she is at all. Yeah, it's kind of a memento, kind of Jason Bourne. Yes, certain people start to puncture that. Yes.

Ooh, fun. Then it gets classic. She's got to round up some other witches, and she thinks these are bozo witches. It's all outcasts. You come together, low expectations. Island of broken toys. In your adversary, the antagonist is Plaza.

Yeah, we have a very intense past. I can't wait to find out what it is. Because in that first scene, I was like, are they lovers? Who knows? But we definitely have a long past. Okay. And that's on Disney Plus. That comes out September 18th.

Yeah, I can't wait for people to see it. Yeah, it's radical. I'm really, really proud. It was one of the toughest and most meaningful things I've ever done in my life. What was the emotional connection that was happening or why did it feel special? Going down the road, like the only way out is through.

It's almost a weird metaphor for menopause. 100%, like what is a witch? What is at the end of the road like the only way out is through. It's almost a weird metaphor for menopause. 100%. Like what is a witch? What is at the end of the road? What can you be proud of? What are your powers? It felt very powerful. Also like that a witch contains all ages of being a woman. Witches implicitly feminist. They were powerful women that men were afraid of. And other women were threatened by. Yeah. They were persecuted.

Yeah, it's a good metaphor. But I used to meet with a witch during the making of it who is Yeah. Yeah. They were persecuted. Yeah, it's a good metaphor. But I used to meet with a witch during the making of it, who is amazing. We had like a Zoom. How do you authenticate that? She's a member of Wicca. That's how she defines herself.

She was into tarot, tarot, tarot, tarot, tarot chips. No, she's into tarot and the moon, astrology. It was incredible to keep grounded in that and not the kind of Disney six inch nose, containing the good and bad, like are you a good witch or bad witch? So this felt very like digging into the, it was fun. I'm excited. Yeah. I'm a witch. You so are a witch. I love witchiness. I did too. She also sees a witch for her skincare needs. Yeah. Oh. I haven't seen her in a minute.

Wait I want to hear about your skincare witch. I think she's a witch for her skincare needs. Yeah. Oh! I haven't seen her in a minute. Oh. Wait, I wanna hear about your skincare witch. I think she's a witch. She would not appreciate that verbiage that I gave her because she's quite religious. So I think she probably wouldn't like it. But she put the spell on Monica's face. Yeah, I think so.

I mean, it looks incredible. She'll be doing her thing and she'll just touch it here and then I look in the mirror and I'm like, the whole face is different. So she's pretending like she's doing stuff but really she's doing spells. And potions. That's what I think.

And potions. And elixirs. Nothing like an eye of a newt. The dark arts. Yeah, exactly. The dark farts. The dark farts. Did you say that a lot on set?

Ugh. Yeah, of course. Obviously. You're a good person. Catherine, I adore you. Oh my God, you guys, always. I don't know about six years between visits. No, can we not?

It seems stupid. Especially because you've had 65 projects since then. I know. You could have come on to people. I think that there was a one time near miss. An almost near miss. Now do you just have repeat people that come on and just say how excited they are for you?

I'm thrilled, I'm thrilled. That makes me happy. Oh my God. Because again, back to the Michigan thing, my first thought is people hate success. The whole That makes me happy. Oh my God. Cause again, back to the Michigan thing, my first thought is people hate success. The whole thing makes me nervous. I'm very scared to even be told congratulations. I know.

Isn't that fucking weird? Well, because you've got to think it's around the corner. The shoe is gonna drop. And then it'll actually be on top of it all going away. It'll be humiliating. Cause I accepted those compliments. I know it's public, but also it's life. I know.

Who cares? I know. I wanna escape that. Like yeah, if you can't enjoy any of the things because you're so afraid it'll be taken away and you'll look like a fool to have been enjoying it. All of a sudden you're gonna have to sell it all and move to home.

Also, I don't wanna do this, but you are anxious. No, do it. You're deputized to call me out. This is anxiety. This is what it is. I know in your head you think of it differently and you think you have nighttime anxiety, but I've seen what you just said.

Nocturnal anxiety. I think it's a clinical term, Monica. Nocturnal anxiety. But what you just described is daytime anxiety and lifetime anxiety, so you do have it. So you think I have anxiety about how people think about me and oh yeah, yeah, and that the shoe will draw.

Yeah, that's all. Yeah, that's all. That's literally anxiety. It's future thinking. Future surfing they say in AA. Oh, I love it. It's good. I love that one.

That is anxiety, which you got to make friends with a little bit. I loved Inside Out too for that very reason. That's where I went on my birthday. Oh, fun. Yeah, I'm so happy for Polar. Oh my God, I'm so happy for Polar. Did you hear her on here? Yes, of course I did.

She's so good. She's so good. I love Babers. I love hearing her all of a sudden be the therapist for you guys. Be honest, I would imagine you love, she can shut me the fuck up and give it to me. Yes.

I think people like that. Don't you love it too? And I accept it from her and I enjoy it. But I do think that's very fun for people to hear. I know, she's an incredible listener. Mm-hmm. That was fun. She's digressing a lot, she's fun.

That was crackly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was scared. I know. Scared. I know. She's the frickin' best. All right, Catherine Hawn, I love you.

I love you guys, this is so awesome. Agatha all along, September 18th, Disney Plus, watch the shit out of it, and then we'll get this awesome crew of actors back together to do more. Be well, enjoy your dog date. Oh yeah. Thank you, I'm very excited. You should be.

My daughter's like, we're coming home with one, and I was like, never not. Oh boy. Oh boy. But I'm very excited to find this little cutie home, I hope. All right, adore you, be well. Okay, adore you. He is an armchair expert, but he makes mistakes all the time.

Thank God Monica's here. She's gonna let him have the facts. I'm gonna go Jake Gyllenhaal for this until I read. Or, um... Yeah, his is like halfway. Oh, his is all the way down here? No, it's like one more button. One more button.

That's how he did it? And he does it? Yeah. Do you think that's how he did it or he does it? Do you think it's a one- button. That's how he did it, and he does it? Yeah. Do you think that's how he did it or he does it? Do you think it was a one-off? It's how he did it. I think it's a one-off, because he was playing a character.

Right, and he was presumed innocent. Or someone was in that story. We won't spoil. Okay, I have a really important thing to talk about. Oh, okay. I'm in the middle of a mug issue. A mug? Yeah.

Boy, I got real scared for a second. Yeah. But it was a misdirect. Yeah. No, this is a mug issue. Okay. So this weekend, I went to a new restaurant, so delicious. It's called Budenoki.

Okay. I love Budenoki. Oh, I was gonna text you because I figured you... Of all people. ...it was up your alley. Yes. Isn't it so good? Yeah. We've gone half a dozen times already.

So Rob, have you had any of the drinks in the mugs? No. Okay. So they're doing a special mug drink? Yeah. They have some drinks. Maybe it's just one drink. I don't know.

It comes in a very fun animal mug. Oh. And they have different ones. And so I got this seal. A seal? Uh-huh. Okay, that's not the drink, that's the mug shape. That's the mug. And Jess got a penguin.

Oh, okay. And the girl next to us had an octopus. I didn't really like the octopus. Okay, was the penguin a promotional tie-in for the HBO show? It wasn't cross-promotional, like when Burger King does a Godzilla Cup. No. Okay.

It is a ceramic, like nice mug. Ooh. And it says on there, fee for stealing the mug $150. Oh. It says that on the menu. Which is interesting, cause how? How do they charge if you've fled? Yes. And if one on the menu. Which is interesting, because how?

How do they charge if you've fled? Yes. And if one of your, you know, like, okay, so presumably, oh, we're missing a mug, which by the way, it could be missing for multiple reasons. One might be that you stole it. Yeah. Second, they go, good, we have a credit card on file

because they paid, but there were more than two people at the thing. So someone's getting screwed for their Jermone friend. Well, yeah, but that's, you are who you're friends with. That's on you? Yeah. I decided when I saw that that I needed the mug. Yeah.

We asked the guy, the server, we asked our server, so if we want this mug, can we take it and pay $150 for it? Yeah, that would be my thought, just take it. But it will tell you now and you can go ahead and charge us. Yeah, it's like an ethical thief. Yes, he was like, well, no, I can just give you the Instagram of the woman who makes them, she's really cool.

And you can buy them on her website. And it's a little cheaper. And I was like, oh, great. But then as we're sitting there, I was like, no, I want it now. Okay. I really want it now. You got impatient. Yeah.

Uh-huh. So we asked somebody else, and he said, oh no, we'll give you the Instagram. Like he kind of reiterated the Instagram was the way to go. Can I just add? They must deal with this all meal, every meal. It's probably like our releases now.

What do you mean? Like I'm sure every table's like, so can we just steal this and then we pay? Do you think every table is as absurd as me and is willing to pay $150 for a cute but. How big is the mug? How many ounces? It kind of looks like this shape.

Like a 12 ounce mug or 18 to 20. Like whatever this is. Okay, that's probably 16. Okay, well, I guess, yeah, whatever. is. Okay, that's probably 16. Okay, well, I get it. Yeah, whatever. It was like- It's not a Stein.

It's not like a huge ceremonial mug. No. Okay. I would guarantee most people are not doing what I did. Sure. And they're right to not do that. That's silly, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But it is a town of entitled, impatient people. That's what we are. What's owned who we are is Hollywoodians. Overpaid, impatient, entitled. I think that's a good character description of us. It's not a cheap restaurant either. It's not a cheap restaurant. I just, look, I mean, I'm giving most people

the benefit of the doubt that they're not as crazy as me. Yeah. And are not seeing something. And I'm trying to compliment you. I think you're baseline crazy for LA, and me too. Yeah, you're complimenting, you've been doing some weird compliments lately. They're not landing, certainly, in the way I'm intending them to.

No, because you are always saying something mean in there. Well, you're saying you're worse than the average person. That's what your statement is. And I'm saying you are not any worse than any other people. But you're saying what I am is impatient, entitled, and overpaid. You said that. You said that.

I didn't say I was. I said LA as a character type is impatient, entitled, and overpaid. And I'm including myself in that. Yeah, I know, I know. We're also creative and imaginative and hardworking. Like, I think it's okay that we're, that our characters define, you know,

that the people that are attracted to this place have some characteristics in common. Some of them are very good and some of them are bad. Yeah, I don't know that we can say that everyone in LA is impatient. Well, I think the nature of LA makes you... Or overpaid. In fact, many people are very underpaid. Yep. I think the nature of all the traffic, the nature of the congestion,

the nature of being at restaurants where there's a wait list, I think the context makes us all impatient. It's hard to get everywhere. It's hard to sit down and eat. It's challenging. It's not like the town I grew up in. Or I know how long it takes to get to town. It's two miles down Commerce Road and that's gonna take me three minutes, you know? And then I'll eat at the restaurant I want to

because of course I can when I walk in, you know? So I think the context of this city does bring out, a context of New York is like people are blind to someone on fire. Well, I don't think that's their fault. I don't think bad people live in New York. I think they're overwhelmed with the stimuli. But don't you think in fact,

it kind of makes you more patient? Like the fact that I have to, it takes me an hour and a half to get home. It actually makes me more patient because there's nothing I can do. I've just resigned to wasting a lot of time, knowing your life is gonna take a lot of time to achieve any success.

Like a lot, there's a lot of built in, you must have patience to live here. Force, yeah. Yeah. I think for sure there's force, and I agree. If someone from the Midwest came here and they're like, I gotta go to this place eight miles away, and they were on minute 75 of getting there.

They'd be losing their mind because they have no- Patience. Yeah, they have no, they haven't been beat down by it. But that's my assessment. I think that people here are entitled and impatient and honk their horn and cut people off and try to cut the line. You honk your horn and cut people off.

I don't. I don't. You don't. You're much better than me in a car. Many, many people in LA are honking all day. When I drive down the street, I'm hearing honking nonstop. When I take a walk down Los Filos Boulevard, I'm hearing honking nonstop.

So I don't hear honking in Hood River, Oregon when I go there. Sure, that's fair. And you think that's part of the entitled piece. I think that's the entitled piece. That's not an impatient piece. Well, everyone that comes here, and let's be clear, there's millions of people that A, didn't come here.

Yeah, exactly. B, aren't in show business. I'm talking about people who moved out of their town because they thought they were special. So special they should move to this other city that rewards specialness. So I think all of us who came here in search of this elevated status

and elevated specialness is a little entitled in a way that is useful, because it inflates you in a way to believe you should have that or you could achieve that. And then the bad side of the sword is like you think you're special. Oh God, special, special is such an interesting word. Some people just like the job and this is where the job is. Just like people who go to Silicon Valley because that's where

tech is, because they're in tech or like tech. I don't know that they think they're special. I think they think like, well, that's where I have to go to even try to get this. It's DC, like people who want to be in politics. That's where they have to go in order to have a job they like. Yes, but the conversion rate of our pursuit is infinitely lower than it is in DC, in tech, in any of these.

There's 4,000 rungs of the ladder in tech you could find employment in. You wouldn't go, yeah, I love, granted, people love the craft. No question, I grant that. It's a pure pursuit. But unless you're completely irrational, you also assess, oh, there's four million people

that have moved there to do that, and there's 1,000 employed actors per season. Now, I love riding dirt bikes, but when I see someone do a backflip, I go, I can't do that. I won't be the 1% who can pull off a backflip. But for whatever reason, I had the arrogance and the entitlement and the I feel special enough to think,

I knew those odds, you know those odds, everyone knows the odds and you go, still going. Yeah, still trying. Which is kind of wild because you're talking about one in a 10,000 chance you'll get to do the thing you wanna do and you still go for it. That to me really illuminates some baseline level of, yeah, I'm special enough to be one of those one in 10,000.

Yeah, that's an interesting way of looking at it. God, this was fun and it all started with a mug. We're not even close to the end of the story. I know, that's my favorite kind of story. So, okay, so you talk to the second person. Yes. They turn you to Instagram. He said, Instagram, great.

So by the end of this, it's clear we need to go to Instagram, okay? Uh-uh. And what we did on our way out, when we looked at the shelf of their mugs. Okay. And we decided the best ones were a black bear, and mainly the black bear.

I also really did like Jess's penguin and they had a bunch of cute, they're all so cute. And then I went in the car, I started Googling. First thing I see limited edition section, amazing. Oh, you found the right Instagram page. Yeah. Okay. And those were Halloween. So she has some Halloween ones.

I decided I didn't need to put my money there. But then I went to the others and where all the animals were. And the black bear is sold out. You have a good eye. I know, but now I'm in a huge pickle. Okay, so the black bear is sold out. Also, there was a badger that I wanted that was so cute. Sold out. A good gift for Daniel Ricardo. I mixed Danny and so cute. Sold out. No penguin. Good gift for Daniel Ricardo.

Yeah. I mixed Danny and Daniel just now. Daniel, Daniel. Daniel. Daniel Ricardo. And no penguin. Okay. Auto print.

Exactly. It discontinued. So, how does this filter, oh, I just spit, I'm cutting that. How does this- Did you just leave it in? oh, I just spit, I'm cutting that. How does this, no. She's just leaving it. I hate that. Ew, gross.

Nothing came out. I know how to fake spit. You do? I definitely saw some spit come out. Yes, I did see some spittle. I mean the amount you have when you're talking. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Try again.

You gotta fake clear your throat too. This isn't a real throat clear. You'd know when I cleared my throat. You'd fucking throw up your pretty little lunch, Diane. Or I think you should leave. We just showed the kids that. Delta can do the whole thing now. Oh my god. Anywho.

Okay, so it's a fake throat clear. Oh. Wow, that was good. I didn't see any spittle that. Oh wow. No, that's the last one. That's good. Did you have to do that in a movie?

No, as a kid you do that. Oh my God. At least in Axford Acres where I grew up. Not in entitled Los Angeles. No, this was before I became entitled. This is back when I was blue collar and a man of the people. So this is circling back because you're gonna have thoughts on what I did entitled. This is back when I was blue collar and a man of the people. So this is circling back

because you're gonna have thoughts on what I did next. And you're gonna say it's probably because I'm entitled or I feel special. Okay. But it's not. It's because I go after what I want. You're go get her. Yes. Yeah.

And so I DMed her. Okay, great. And I said, hi, I was looking at your website. I love your mugs. I'm wondering if you're ever gonna, if you're gonna bring back some of the sold out mugs. Because I'm really interested in a couple of them. Yeah.

And she responded. Okay, you're gonna read it? Okay, great, because it's so well written, you don't wanna. I don't wanna mess it up. Oh, that would be a good? Okay, great, because it's so well written, you don't wanna. I don't wanna mess it up. Oh, that would be a good one. I burp and then I spit. That's so gross.

Yeah, I don't like that. It's like what, something came up when he burped? No, gross, gross, gross. Actually... I have to say, well, there are grosser things, I have to say, well there are grosser things, but one, I guess maybe it's a pet peeve. I really don't like when people spit on the street. You don't?

At all. Okay, all right. But one of my friends does it a lot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've done a good job of not saying it, but I think it's so foul. Sure, let me ask. And it is entitled.

A mild distinction. Does it anger you when he sits on the sidewalk or in the street where the cars go? I didn't say the gender of this person, but. Okay, but not a lot of women are fucking hacking loogies. Sorry to genderize this, but I'm not seeing too many broads clear their throats and hack out. If it was that, I would,

I think I would feel less grossed out. You'd think it was punk rock. Well, I would just be like, God, they really have a situation. They're not just like. For their amusement or a tic, spitting. Exactly, exactly. Okay, now what did you ask me about this non-gendered person?

Okay, did this dude spit in the street or on the sidewalk? Would that have a different outcome of outrage for you? Because I do, I have a lot of, well documented, I have a lot of issues. And sometimes I have to spit, but I spit in the street because no one's walking in the street. Like I get it, you spit on the sidewalk,

A, someone would step on it, gross, B, you see it, that's fucking gross. I acknowledge it's gross. That's why I want it out of my mouth. Because it's fucking gross. You think you don't want it on the sidewalk, I don't want it in my mouth. It's yours.

I don't want it. Well, I don't want it either, but I swallow it all day long. Oh my God. Don't give the beat off people something to play over and over again. I will find a bush, because if you're running around in a bush on the sidewalk

and you run into my spit, that's on you. So I'll try to find some foliage. Also, I think they appreciate it. It's probably nutritional and medicinal. No, that is so, talk about entitled, my God. No, that's arrogance. I think my spit is so healthy for plants. I'll spit, first I'll try to find a foliage,

like dirt around a tree planter. And by the way, I'm a sharpshooter. I'm not like first day like, you know, like where'd it go? I could hit, as you know, I won the cherry seed spitting contest up in Traverse City. So I can put it exactly where I want. I make sure no one's looking. I got moves, I do like, I just really get it out quick

and get rid of it. And then I'll do it second to that in the street. And I'll even step out in the street and act like I'm going around. So I'll go off the side of my, so no one sees it. And never on the side. Everyone sees it. This is what, this is what.

You're learning about this behavior of mine just now. No, I know you. You've seen it. Yeah, I have. Okay. Okay, am I your friend in this story? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha I your friend in this story? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha. You're not. I have this fringe, whatever they are, very short,

ample breasts. They do the most annoying thing. Ha ha ha ha ha. Don't be mean because I wasn't talking about you. That was a joke. Oh, you're so mean to me these days. No, I wasn't talking about you. That was a joke. Oh, you're so mean to me these days. No, I'm so nice to you.

My God. Okay, so. Okay, so anyway, this person also mainly spits in the foliage, the greenery, like anything green, or they don't spit in the street, I mean in the sidewalk. Okay, that's pretty nice. Yeah, that's, I think that's pretty nice. Yeah, but it's still. It's too gross.

It's so gross. Yeah, it is gross. Spud em, spud em. It's full of bacteria too. Yeah, it's gross, that's why you wanna out of your mouth. No, your own bacteria is fine to swallow. Okay. Okay, I'm not, I don't need,

I shouldn't be exposed to anyone else's bacterias. Okay. Okay. Stay tuned for more Armchair Expert, if you dare. Back to the mug. Yeah, you're about to read her response. I'm gonna go with the Grant us this blessing. It's not God who does it. Father. Father, what is it? Father, uh. Father time, I guess. Father God, Father God. Oh my God.

Father God, it's 11 11, Father God. Can you tell I'm coming out of my bad mood? Why are we in a bad mood? I was just grumpy for a couple days. I was really exhausted and I don't know why. I think it was from the previous week and shooting the commercial and all the other stuff. But it kind of hit me like I couldn't work out.

You saw me yesterday. I was asleep on a chaise lounge. Yeah, that was weird. One of you ever saw me yesterday. I was asleep on a chaise lounge. Yeah, that was weird. When have you ever stumbled upon me and I was asleep outside? Well, it just looked like you were getting some sun. Some sun? Yeah.

I was getting some Z's. Oh, you didn't seem grumpy. The dinner made me, I was recognizing this morning while I was journaling, like how much of an extrovert I am. Like the power, the fuel source that is for me. Because I was very exhausted. I slept on a chaise lounge.

I was grumpy, I didn't want to go. Of course I was nice to you because you're my friend. But I didn't want to go. And then we got there and I started chatting with new people and I had a really good time. And then I was like, it clicked me out of my bad mood. And I'm like, God, I am such an extrovert. Mm, that's so interesting.

If you believe the paradigm where you're given energy by those as opposed to drained of energy. Yeah. Yeah, okay, what'd she say? I said, hi, I have a question. Are any of the sold out mugs returning? She said, love to answer any questions. Which ones are you looking at?

I said, I was looking at the black bear and the badger. I was looking at the black bear and the badger. I was looking at the black bear and the badger! It's exclamation point. Oh, oh. And I said, and you don't have a pig by chance, do you? And she said, unfortunately, all those designs have been discontinued. It seems you love the forest animals.

Is that what you're drawn to? Oh my God, so this is kind of like a spiritual experience. And I said, oh, that's so sad. Not necessarily drawn to forest animals specifically. Those were just extremely cute. Then she said, so glad you liked them. We're announcing an addition to our forest friends lineup this week.

We really hope you're drawn to it. Desert devils. Sidewinder snake. I should check right now. Scorpion. See if it's been updated. Oh wow, since your interaction. Oh, there's a new one. It's a fox, it's cute.

Ah, and we've assigned you fox in the past. Shit, should I get it? Of course, go crazy. You should get the fox, bring it to that restaurant, put a sign on it that says, if I leave this behind, you owe me $150. If I forget this here, you owe me $150. That's a far.

Wow, that would really work. Do you think I should get two and then leave one at the restaurant and take the black bear? No, it's discontinued. They don't know that. Well, it's like they knew the most about this. No they don't. In your learning.

No I think this is maybe a good hack. Cause I'm giving them one. Uh huh, maybe we should give them two and take the bear. So order three, keep one, give them two and take one. Okay, I'm adding Dakar. Adding Dakar. I also want a unicorn. There's a unicorn that's really cute.

Okay. I don't like a unicorn. Really? Yeah. Why? I was gonna give an explanation that was way deeper than is real. Well, what was it?

I'm curious. I don't like fake. I don't like deception. I don't like the Easter bunny. I don't like fake, I don't like deception, I don't like the Easter bunny, I don't like fake. I like real stuff, I don't like to be fooled. I want someone to think I think there's really a unicorn. There's no such thing.

Do you know that? Can I say something? Yeah. You use the phrase unicorn more than most people I've ever met. I do like describing humans as unicorns. Yeah. But I guess you're right, I'm saying they're fake.

If I'm standing by what I just said, so I do have to rescind everything I just said. Okay. All right, get a unicorn one, that sounds fun. Add it to my- Playful. Okay. I just don't think, let me say this. Okay.

And I think she's onto something with her spiritual talk. When you get the bear or the whatever, right? It's like woodsy. Yeah. It's like, I'm gonna have a mead or I'm gonna have this woods beverage. And it adds something to it. A unicorn mug is like, what's inside?

Confetti, cotton candy, bubble gum flavor. Not for a warm, you know, I guess maybe if you only drank hot cocoa out of it with rainbow marshmallows, then that's fine, get it? Yeah, but that's just for hot cocoa with rainbow marshmallows. So you're drawn to forest friends. Okay, so out of these-

Yeah, I would get the bear and I'd pour chili in it. We all want the bear, okay? It's discontinued. I'd fill it with bison chili and drink my chili out of it because it's hearty and woodsy. Do you want River Otter? Oh, that's really cute. I kinda want that for Delta.

That makes me think of Delta. Well, she's also a unicorn. She is the ultimate unicorn. I know, see? And I'm taking my little unicorn on a bike vacation. That's so fun! I'm so glad you guys are doing that. I'm very excited.

That'll be so cute. Okay, now tell me what you're drawn to, okay, of these headings. Forest friends, underwater friends, mythical friends. No way, pass. What, Merlin? Who, the wizard?

Lord of the Rings. Stop, you're insulting so many people. You don't like this dragon. I guess I should, because did we find out I'm the, no, I'm the tiger. Oh yeah. Give me a jungle cat. And who are, who was I?

You're the rabbit still, I think. Oh. Okay, there's a Sasquatch and a Yeti too. I think that's so fun. Conspiracy theories. You're just flagging yourself as a dope. Oh my God. Okay, so.

I'm trying to, today's goal is to alienate every single person. Including me. Underwater friends, forest friends, mythical friends, farm friends. Oh, I'd like farm friends. Safari friends. So you have to pick one.

The forest creatures. Real, over- Followed by safari. Then third. Farm. Farm. Then underwater, then mythical Then third. Farm. Farm. Then underwater, then mythical. Yep.

Wow. Yeah. Huh. What's your order? On face value? Without seeing. Thin slice. Okay, without seeing, if I just hear the headings,

it's mythical first. What is, why? That's so fun. Like I love mermaids and stuff. Oh, cause you played a mermaid? Yeah, basically. No, mermaids are cool. They're sirens and they.

What could be worse than neither being a fish or a human? So you can't walk, which is the whole goal of being a human. You love the water. I know, but I'd want wanna be a full on dolphin. I wouldn't wanna be a human fucking top and a dolphin bottom. Why? You love talking. So much.

You have a really strong counter. That was a really good point because I could swim super fast in the- Exactly. And I could go, look at me, I'm in title, I'm special. That's why I moved to the ocean. Honk, honk, hon's why I moved to the ocean. Honk, honk, honk, get out of my way, I should be there quicker than everyone.

All right, so anyway, all to say. You got them all. I'm gonna get them. How big is your cabinet at your new house? Because you're, the things you collect. Mainly mugs. Mainly mugs. Yeah, I love mugs.

You have all the Starbys mugs. Mainly mugs. Yeah, I love mugs. You have all the Starbys mugs. You need a considerable amount of linear square footage or linear footage. Will you put any of your mugs behind your little head there with your mouse and your sorting hat? I guess I could if there's overflow. I'd like to spray it with some kind of sound dampening thing, but if you're cool with that. What if Starbucks made us our own mug? It said armchair is the city.

The city is the attic. Oh. But really, I still have to figure out a way to get the black bear. I gotta applaud this woman's integrity. Okay, so that's really what I wanna talk about because. Yeah. It's weird to me to discontinue,

although that's crazy for us to say because we have several sweat sweaters that have been discontinued. So we're not on a firm footing here to be critical. But it seems crazy to me that she has one that everyone loved and she's like done making it. I know, I agree. But our sweatshirts are different.

The sweatshirts are more like a concert t-shirt. Like it's a year. It's of the moment. It's of the moment and it's a time stamp. Yes, exactly. Do you think somewhere in the bear mug is embedded 2024? Oh. Cause that would be, she'd be very legitimate. I'd really, really want it then.

Yeah. Oh my God. Yeah, but I mean, I have to say, I also applaud her integrity and I did think for maybe a minute. You could sway her. She'd make me one. Of course, the part of.

My specialness. My entitlement. Yeah. No, it's going after what I want. Great. And she did not budge or sway. Yeah. And I've had to make peace.

Yeah, she has boundaries, and I appreciate that. And I have had to make peace, Yeah, she has boundaries and I appreciate that. I have had to make peace and I'm gonna get the fox. I'd like to try to understand. This is sincerely. We gotta do some comps. Like you're craving for this mug. Yeah. Out of 10.

I don't even wanna do it out of 10. What I wanna do is I'm gonna ask you to compare it to when you have craved for a romantic somebody. Like when you have longed for another human, a male human. How did those two longings compare? Because I don't relate to this, you know, in a fun way. I mean, I might have it a little bit with cars, but luckily the barrier of entry to cars is so ginormous

that I can talk myself out of it very easily. And so I'm trying to, I wanna anchor it into a similar longing. Is it the most longing you feel in life is for these little things? Okay. No, it's not. But it is connected, I think.

Romantic connection is not available at my fingertips. Right. And I can't have it easily. Yeah. And so when there are things in life I want that I can have easily, I- Feel satiated. Yeah, there are so many things in life I can't have.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That if there's something I can, I'll get it. This is such a ding, ding, ding. I can't have that if there's something I can, I'll get it. This is such a ding ding ding. I can't believe we did this. Oh my God. This is for Catherine Hahn and we talk about hoarders. Oh yes.

And there's something here about that as well. Except also I did find the transcript of the episode, Malcolm's episode, Malcolm Gladwell's episode of Revisionist History. It's called Dragon Psychology 101. It was in 2020. It's such a good episode. He talks about like art.

It's a lot about art, but then they talk about hoarders. And okay, well now I scroll to the top. It's gonna have to find it again. Okay. While you're looking for that, I'm gonna express this thought I had. So I was journaling this morning, I was recognizing I was in a better mood, and then I was kind of taking an inventory

of when I'm in a bad mood. I guess I project it. I start ruminating on other people's character defects when I'm grumpy and grouchy and tired. And I start obsessing about, okay, this person is in this continual pattern and they're not gonna do anything to adjust this pattern. I realize that my own discomfort

really makes me start getting critical of other people around me. That's a good thing to know about yourself. To the point where I'm like, I'm gonna bring this up to this person. And I guess, cause I'm getting older, I did have the willpower to resist, but it took a lot of my willpower. And I kind of was going like, let's just wait a while.

This is in A.A. a pause when agitated, right? But it was so concrete and real for the last few days. And then this morning I was in a good mood and I was like, oh yeah, I don't care that that person has that pattern and I accept that they are that way. And it's all me. But it's so misleading.

I guess I say all this to say I had this enormous blast of gratitude that in general, I'm not living in great discomfort. I don't have chronic long lasting depression. I don't have a lot of things that a lot of people deal with and they're grumpy and they're assholes. And I just experienced it, it's like, yeah, you almost can't be any other way.

If you're grumpy and agitated, then everything around you is agitating, and the people in your life are, and you become misanthropic, but it's not really all your fault. It's just like you're trapped in this discomfort. But it's knowing that that's what's happening. Knowing that it's you actually is very helpful

to pull you out. But all it can do with the awareness is hold my tongue, which is advisable. It is the right thing to do. But you can't change how you feel. Like A, you can't change, you can't go, well now I feel like I'm in a good mood because I decided.

And if you're in a cranky, terrible mood, all you can really do is just keep your mouth shut. You can't change that opinion you have of the people you're assessing and judging. I can't, I can't turn that off. That's just how I feel, that's how the world looks to me. And all I can do is shut up, but I was thinking, I'm so lucky in that I've got to weather that

for like three days. Interesting. And some people are weathering that half the year, the whole year, year on year, year over year. And yeah, it's gotta be rough. And you can only be so benevolent when you're in great discomfort. But also it's on you to learn how to feel good.

Yeah, but I'm acknowledging, like, I do have a program that will result in me feeling good. And it involves, you know involves a reasonable amount of work and the right amount of sleep and the right amount of exercise and diet. And then for some people, probably many, many people, they could have that recipe I have and it wouldn't result in the right amount of serotonin.

Yeah, so there might be a medication that needs to be put in place. It's on you to fix your life. I mean, I really believe that. It just made me really sympathetic to people who are really stuck in depression and stuck in misfortune and unemployment. And yeah, it's really hard to be generous and loving. Yeah, it's very hard. It's almost impossible. I'm really sympathetic to it.

I just think the best you can do is like not cause wreckage in those periods. I think that's a really lovely thing and like way of looking at it. I'm thinking of someone very specific that cannot find the light. This person can not do it. And for a long time, I had a lot of sympathy.

And I run out. This person has a million options to get out of this, but it's on them. And I've had depression. I've had big chunks of time where I am in the mud and it feels like I'll never be able to get out or I can't. But I'm open to people's advice and people, you know, telling me maybe you should try this or maybe this.

And then I do and it helps. Like you have to avail yourself. Yeah, the way I always phrase that is I have a lot of patience for anyone engaged in the fight. Yeah, totally. But if you're not engaged in the fight, I can't be with you and I can't be your friend. I remember that was one of the very early conflicts

Kristin and I had really early into dating and there was a certain period, and she has depression, admittedly, and there was a period of in bed and all this stuff and at some point I had to say to her, I will be with you forever if you're engaged in the fight, but I won't sit by your side while you do nothing and hope that you get better.

I can't do that with you. But even that's a little bit of a probably privileged point of view. Like there's, I probably have not been at the depths where being engaged in the fight was not even possible. There is a level of mental illness that cannot be rationed with. Self-governed.

Exactly, yes. But that's not really who I think we're talking about. No, we're talking about people who have to really make a decision. And it's just self-awareness. It's knowing like, God, I've been angry at people for a year. Every day, all I think about is how mad I am

at this person or this person or this person or how bad things are for me. And- Every time I talk about someone else that's in a negative light. Like that should be like, everyone should do some kind of inventory. Reflection.

And go like, when I'm talking about people, is it generally to point out something shitty I heard about somebody? Right. That's not a great signal. Yeah, or just assessing how you feel throughout the day. Like, when's the last time I felt happy or good? If it's been a really long time,

then it just requires active thinking and reflection and like, okay, I think I might need to do something. I need to get in therapy. And it just requires active thinking and reflection and like, okay, I think I might need to do something. I need to get in therapy. I need to get on a medication probably. I need to X, Y, and Z. And that is where privilege, because all those things cost money. So I do that.

And they even maybe imply a friendship circle with some awareness and some, you know. Yeah, there's a lot to it. I've never been, I've only had one suicidal thought in my life I've talked about. It was when I was towards the end of drinking and stuff and I was in Santa Monica, whatever. I had one moment where I wanted to jump in front of a bus.

But other than that, and this is not a suicidal thought, but when I have the feeling of like, I wanna take a nap, and I don't wanna wake up for like a year. I don't wanna die, but I really wanna take a nap that lasts about a year, and I wanna wake up feeling fucking equilibrium. You know?

Yeah, I have that. That to me is like a, that's a huge red flag. The desire to just sleep through maybe the next few days or months or years. I just wanna be in this bed. I wanna feel cozy for a few months. Yeah, one time, I think when we had Conan on, he said this and I relate and I come in and out

of this feeling of, I just wanna like, sometimes I just wanna like get injured enough or sick enough that I have to go to the hospital and like live at the hospital for a couple months. This was the great joke in Bad Moms. I don't remember that. That was Kristen's total fantasy is that she would get in a car accident

and be in the hospital bed and watch TV and the kids would just come in and say hi to her and then they would leave. Oh, that's funny. Yeah, like sometimes I'm just like, life is too much right now and I wish I could just like go to the hospital and yeah, I don't wanna die, but I wanna remove myself. Well, I think there's even more

to the specific hospital fantasy because I can relate to that one greatly. And I think that's also symptomatic of, you need a valid enough excuse to hit pause and take some time for yourself, but you're just so weighted by this drive to accomplish and be productive. And the only thing that would justify a break

from productivity would be a hospitalization. Something that took me to the hospital, yes, exactly. That's exactly right. Because just laying in bed is not the thing. No, you'd hate yourself. Yeah. You're like, well, I gotta be here. It has to be like, there's literally nothing else

I can do but be here. I bet a lot of people in this Western productivity fucking entitled. Anyway, we got really off. I like it. Okay, now back to hoarding. Yeah, hoarding. There is an element that's like, I might need it.

Like these items, right? One element is I might need it someday and then the other is emotional. And that's the emotional connection with another person, event, or something. It says the second of those ideas, the emotional one, describes as the Proust effect, remembrance of things past. He's eating this cookie and all of a sudden it brings him back to his childhood when his aunt used to make these cookies for

him and he remembers the way it felt a little bit like other phenomena is, it's like hearing a song from your childhood. What started to dawn on me was that with people with this problem, these objects form that kind of experience in a much more intense way than everybody else. So somehow these objects are keys to these visceral memories that get produced. So finding something, anything, some token, some memento,

anything that from your past triggers a much more vivid recollection than in the rest of us. What's interesting is that ties into the expert we had yesterday, which was gonna talk about tribalism. Yeah, exactly. And that one of the three main components is this compulsion to know and honor the past. Yeah.

Which is fascinating, because that's related. Yeah, it is, it's all connected. Well, okay, and then they talk about this one woman who couldn't throw away a Disney blanket that her daughter loved as a child because she felt like if she threw it away, she'd be throwing away all the memories associated and she'd lose that piece of history

and her personal history. So it's more like it's so connected to human emotion. Like these objects are so connected to memory. Even though like all the, you know, things are connected to human emotion. These objects are so connected to memory. Even though all these, things are connected to memory, but for non-whorters, we can also still have the memory without the object, and they can too, but they're too fearful of that. Well, I was gonna say, to me,

that feels like some underlying, it's almost like OCD, the real one we discovered, where you're not a molester, but you're obsessed with the notion that you might be. And to me, this reeks of like, you're for no reason, you're convinced you will forget your daughter and the love you feel towards her

if this object doesn't exist. And that's not true, but the obsession that that could happen is very real and true. Yeah, but also I think it's true, oh, we don't know. I think it's true that people feel things at different intensities. So I do think with hoarders that the level of intensity

when they see something is different. It is, but I'd argue because it's the abatement of the deep fear. In that moment- It's hard to know chicken or the egg. Right, but to me it's like when you look at addiction, when I became incredibly compassionate to addiction, which I never really was even though I had it,

and I was open about it, I didn't get compassionate to it until which I never really was, even though I had it, and I was open about it. I didn't get compassionate to it until Erin got sober, four and a half years ago. Oh, really? Yes. Wow. There's a very specific moment where it all clicked for me, and I've talked about it, which is,

I realized Erin was huffing gas in eighth grade. Yeah. And it's terrible. It's a terrible high fault by a headache. It's so bad. And I realized, God, that was an improvement for Erin. And that's really what addicts are, they're just looking for some fucking relief. So yeah, it's a heightened feeling for the hoarder

to hold the blanket, but it's not cause they, I don't think they genetically have a more response to tactile, it's that the fear is so uncomfortable and destructive that when it goes away for the minute you're holding the blanket, it feels great. So yes, their feeling is stronger than ours, but it's not because, I don't think they physiologically

have something more going on. It's that their fear is so big that the relief of the fear is almost euphoric. You don't think addicts have something a little bit different physiologically going on, I do. You think even beyond that, there's something in the reward circuit. Yes, I do.

Yeah, I think that's going on too. Because I think obviously there's this super asymmetric history of trauma and ACE scores. Yeah. And I do think those rewire your arousal system. Yeah. So yeah, I think, but again, that just goes back to my opinion.

That's why the status quo is so uncomfortable that the relief is necessary. Well, I know, but I think, but that's where, you know, that's the whole genetic force. Is it nature or nurture? Genetic force, the gun and trauma pulls the relief is necessary. I know, but I think that's where, that's the whole genetics. Is it nature or nurture? Genetics loads the gun and trauma pulls the trigger. And I have a ton of compassion for addicts. And at this point, that's all I have towards them.

I really don't think there's a choice at all. Right, right, right. And again, then there's responsibility after. Are you engaged in the fight? Exactly. Ding, ding, ding. But no like I think there is something physiologically happening that is not happening in my brain. Right.

And so that's nothing for me to judge. Like I can't. It's like when we talk about pedophilia. Yeah. Pedophiles. Well that's. I'm not fighting an urge. Why are you that way?

I know, thank God. Yeah. I know, that is how I feel. I'm just like, thank God. Thank God I didn't fighting urge. Why are it that way? I know, thank God. Yeah, I have. I know, that is how I feel. I'm just like, thank God. Thank God I didn't get that. Yes. So, you know, whatever. Okay, we have like four minutes.

Okay. Dave Battista is not vegan, but he added that someday he plans to go, or he says he plans to go vegan. Are you sure? I typically do an almond butter and banana or a vegan gluten-free grilled cheese is my favorite go-to. But it says someday he plans,

he says he plans to go vegan. Oh. He lost 75 pounds. Yeah, 75 pounds. He is not saying that he. Is vegan. Is vegan. I mean, it seems like he's eating more vegan stuff,

but he says, I eat fish, eggs. Oh, yeah, that's not vegan. No. We don't really have time to go through most popular karaoke songs. Okay. But number one, actually it's not even most popular. Is it Let's Go Girls?

It's not even most popular, which is annoying. It's 100 Greatest. Oh, that's, yeah, that's someone's opinion. Yeah, it's an opinion. They're all opinions. It's not a metric. But I mean, number one on this list, this is Billboard, is...

Let's go, girls. De. Ba ba ba ba ba. I'll buy you a fox mug for that. Oh, I want a bear. Fuck, now you gotta get two bears? My God. Number two, I want it that way, Backstreet Boys. Yeah, that sounds right. Then I will survive number three, yep.

Okay, cool, we won't keep going. Okay, Toad Medicine, Toad Venom. Toad Venom. It's a traditional Chinese medicine that has shown therapeutic efficacies in clinical, mainly in China, and has been widely used for the treatment of cancer, cardiovascular diseases, pain and inflammation slash inflammatory disease.

Okay, yeah. So Samuel, when Andre the Giant was 12, and he had acromegaly so he couldn't take the school bus, I know. Well, especially when you take a fart on the school bus. Oh, God. Can you imagine? All the kids would be so mean.

How fucking weird that when he was in like fourth grade, he would come in the classroom and he was bigger than his teacher. I know. He couldn't even ride the school bus. Oh my God. That's so sad. But Samuel Beckett, the playwright,

did drive him to school. What? Yeah. I don't know this part. Yeah, she said it. And then I'm checking it that it's correct, and it is. He played cards with his dad. So weird.

In France? And he said they mostly talked about cricket. Oh, okay. Yeah, he's like, he's- I just saw a graph on Instagram yesterday and it was most money per capita by country. This is kind of fun. What do you think number one is?

Wait, most money. Per capita. Number one is France? Switzerland. Oh, huh. Yeah, number two is the USA. Really? It's a powerful graph to look at

because I think our number was virtually, roughly like $586,000 of wealth per person in America. And we have a lot of fucking people. Switzerland's got a very few people. 15% of Switzerland's population is millionaires. Whoa. 15%. That's crazy. You go down the list and I was expecting the UK

to be in the top five. Yeah. UK was in the teens, below France and 300, like almost half of what Americans have. Well, I think that's more indicative of wealth disparity than it is. That's definitely a part of it. Yeah.

It's definitely part of it, but I was a little shocked that France had more than England. It was just kind of, there was some counterintuitive stuff in there and there wasn't like, I would have expected maybe Saudi Arabia to be number one, it wasn't. Yeah, again, cause I think they have some very rich people and then a lot of very poor people, like same with India.

There's billionaires and then there's a ton of poor people and then a lot of very poor people. Like same with India, there's billionaires and then there's a ton of poor people. And same with fear. The only thing is there's so few people, like in Qatar, there's so few people. Anyways, it was a fascinating list to look at. So I just looked up countries, most billionaires. Most billionaires.

Yeah. The United States is number one. We have 813 billionaires. But that's gross, I do wonder per capita. No, this is per capita. Oh, 813 billionaires. But that's gross. I do wonder per capita. No, this is per capita. Oh, it's per capita. Oh, wait, no, no, no.

You're right, you're right. We're 11 per capita. 11th. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. We just have so many people. Who's number one per capita? Number one per capita is... I kinda wanna guess.

Okay, guess. Billionaires. Probably Saudi Arabia. Monaco. Oh, duh. Of course, tax free. They have three. They've only got like 20 people.

Exactly. They have three. We have 813. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So we have the most. China has 406, but their per capita is 53. India has 200, and their per capita is 58. Who's number two?

Okay, number two is per capita. I would think Singapore would be up there. No. Oh my God. Lichtenstein. Oh sure, banking. They have one. Okay.

In a population of 60 people. Yeah, and then number three is St. Kitts and Nevis. Yeah, these are all like offshore. And Lichtenstein's a bank haven. They also have one. Yeah, okay. But the fact that we're 11 per capita, which is pretty high.

Yeah, considering again. And we have a big population. Yeah, we have like the fifth biggest population. And we have numerically the most, it is pretty high. And we have a big population. We have like the fifth biggest population. And we have numerically the most, it's very interesting. Anyway, okay, well, we have to go. We do, we have to do armchair anonymous. We don't have to, we're lucky enough to do armchair anonymous.

Yesterday I would've said we have to, today I feel like we're lucky too. Wow, all right, well. I love Kathryn Hahn. Oh my God. Fuck do I love her. Love her. Yeah, what a catch.

She's the best. Also, we were supposed to talk about Chimp Crazy. We had been really, we'd been pushing him until this episode. Because she introduced us. Introduced us, and yet we are out of time. That's okay. And we also have the fun dinner we went to.

So we have lots of fodder, a lot of content coming. And I'll let everybody know about the monks. Okay, yeah, yeah. Keep everyone posted. Love you. Love you. Okay, love you. Okay. Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondry app, Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to every episode of Armchair Expert early and ad free right now by joining

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