Blind Plea - Life On The Outside

Episode Date: July 19, 2023

Episode 11: Getting out of prison isn’t easy. In the two months since her release, Deven’s been busy: getting IDs, applying for jobs and taking care of her daughter. We caught up with her a few weeks after she left Alabama to see how things were going and what she hopes people will take away from her story. Resources: If you or someone you know is experiencing domestic abuse, use a safe computer and contact the National Domestic Violence Hotline at www.thehotline.org or call 1-800-799-7233. You can also search for a local domestic violence shelter at www.domesticshelters.org/. If you have experienced sexual assault and need support, visit the Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network (RAINN) at www.rainn.org or call 1-800-656-HOPE Have questions about consent? Take a look at this guide from RAINN at www.rainn.org/articles/what-is-consent  Learn more about criminalized survival https://survivedandpunished.org/   This series is created with Evoke Media, a woman-founded company devoted to harnessing the power of storytelling to drive social change. https://weareevokemedia.com  This series is presented by Marguerite Casey Foundation. MCF supports leaders who work to shift the balance of power in their communities toward working people and families, and who have the vision and capacity for building a truly representative economy. Learn more at caseygrants.org or visit on social media @caseygrants. Follow host Liz Flock on Twitter @lizflock. For more stories of women and self-defense, check out her book “The Furies” from Harper Books, available for pre-order now. https://www.harpercollins.com/products/the-furies-elizabeth-flock Interested in bonus content and behind the scenes material? Subscribe to Lemonada Premium right now in the Apple Podcasts app by clicking on our podcast logo and the "subscribe” button. Click this link for a list of current sponsors and discount codes for this and all other Lemonada series: lemonadamedia.com/sponsors.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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our podcast logo and then the subscribe button. drive this and guess what? I've got a podcast. It's called Wiser than me and each week I get schooled on life by women who are older and yes, Wiser than me. Older women are this country's biggest untapped natural resource and I want to hear from them. I want to know what they've learned by living 70 or 80 or 85 years. Jane Fonda, Darling Love, Isabella Ande, and many more. Subscribe and get wise. Why's it in me? Listen wherever you get your podcasts. Lemonade. This is Blind Plei. I'm your host, Liz Flock. Devon was released from prison on May 23rd, 2023.

She's back in Baltimore now, living with her family. And so I gave her a call in early June, less than a month after her release to talk about how things were going. She told me how hard she's been working to get her life back on track. The reality is, it's not easy. Readjusting has been exhausting.

There are a million things to get set up after you leave prison, from getting new IDs to trying to find work. Devon's been applying for lots of jobs. She wants to be fully independent as soon as she can. She's also set up a GoFundMe account to help her get back on her feet. Her goal is to secure a job, get an apartment, put a downpayment on a car, and start paying for therapy and her daughter's schooling. Basically rebuild her life. But I'll let Devon tell you more. Here is an edited version of our conversation.

Oh my god, hi. Hi. It's nice to see you. It's nice to see you. How are you feeling? I'm okay. I'm so, I'll show you my bump really quick. I am pregnant. I'm so excited. It does actually doesn't look like that much from there, but it feels like I feel like a house. Yeah, yeah, that's gonna happen, definitely. Yeah, how are you feeling? How has today been?

It was all right, you know? My stepmom brought me to Pennsylvania. We went to the Dutch market and she took me to the Walmart and stuff like that up there because it's nicer. But yeah, I mean, most days I'm just sitting around waiting for the come home. That makes sense.

I was trying to imagine you on your first night home. How was it? Because I remember I talked to you and you got on that fly after they dramatically cut off your ankle monitor. And then how was it being on the plane and then getting off and seeing everyone? Like, what was that? It's kind of weird because like, I kind of just, I didn't let it like shock me.

I kind of just was like, okay, this is what I have to do. Like, I have to get on this plane. I have to take this trip. Then I have to get off and I have to find these, you know, I have to, you know, just get back to life. Like, I still haven't processed anything. I still haven't processed anything because I have to just get back to life.

Like, I just feel like, right now I don't have time to do that, you know, which I know isn't healthy, but I can't really do anything else about it because I have to get, you know, more just to life, more just to my parents. Like I don't really have time for me. And I'm just trying to become independent. That's really like my, that's the only thing.

Because once I'm independent, once I can completely rely on myself, then I don't need anybody. And that's been like, what I had in my mind, even before I left prison, like, I kept thinking in myself, okay, well, this is what I had in my mind even before I left prison. Like I kept thinking to myself, okay, well this is what I need to do when I leave. This is what I need to do. Like I think that that's what's keeping me from processing is like my drive that I have for myself that I need to do these things in order to have the things that I want into like you know so I can finally be like, okay, well yeah I went through this thing and I did this thing and I had to sit down for a while, but I'm okay. And look at me now, I'm not broken or anything. I just heard a little bit, but I'm not broken.

What do you feel like you would want people to know about like reentry after being in prison or jail? It's more or less like reentry for me personally reentry is all about yourself. And sometimes you have to be a little selfish when it comes to that because especially if you have kids because you have to look at the bigger picture. For me, it's like I have to get right and I have to do things for myself. And I think mental health is a big deal too. I'm getting Medicaid just so I could go see a mental health doctor. Like that's my main focus. Because there's things out here in the world that you don't have to deal with in there.

And so my biggest thing is like you get as much as you put into it. You have to want it and you have to help yourself and you can't have too much pride, or even shame, really. You have to just do what you have to do, find something, make it your motivation, and hold on to it, because that's what you need, you need motivation. Yeah. So you mentioned like Medicaid,

like what are the, all the things, like can you list off like all the things you had to do when you got out like just drivers license, you know, whatever. I was, I, I've been gone for so long. So everything I had to start over with everything. And so I had to file for my social security card, which I did online. I'm waiting on my birth certificate, which Sheila said she found the copy, but I don't know if she's nailed it out yet. That's another thing.

Driver's license and then getting Medicaid, just paperwork, everything's online now, but they just ask you a bunch of questions. And then I filed for food stamps I've been getting paid, just paperwork, everything's online now, but they just ask you a bunch of questions, and then I filed for food stamps because I don't have any income, and I want to help my parents out because they've been spending a lot of money on

her food and stuff like that. And so I want to be able to help them, give back what they've given her, and then just like getting like an ID, like I have to get an ID, you know, I've been waiting on, you know, they, they need your, they need a other identification card. So I have to go soon because my prison one from TutWyler expires soon. And then you need your social security. And then you need to proofs of residency. And that's why I said, you have to find like a motivation,

you have to find like a reason because, and you have to want to do it because a lot of this stuff can be discouraging because it's just, you feel like it's just so much. And I was talking to my friend, Nisha, she, she was at ATF with me. She was at the Annex with me. She was telling me, she's like, even though we've only been out for a couple of weeks,

it feels like we've been out for a year. I'm like, I know. I feel like I've been out for a long time. I feel like I have done nothing. And we were talking about that. So that's an anxiety for, I'm sure not just for the both of us. I'm sure that's an anxiety for, I'm sure not just for the both of us. I'm sure that's an anxiety for a lot of people who want to prove that they can do it. And you just get out and you're like, I haven't done what I've

done. I don't have that. It's been, it's been like almost and they're like, Devon, like, I've had, you know, people tell me like it's only been two weeks. Like my Simone's had to tell me Devon, like, it's only been two weeks. Like my Simone's had to tell me, Devon, like it's only been like two weeks. You've only been out. So you have to like give yourself a break. You need to chill out. And I'm like, but it's not fast enough.

It's not working. It's not, I need a job. I need this. I need that. It's like just chill. Anyone else hoping to squeeze in one last getaway this summer, and does anyone else get worried about leaving their house or apartment unattended for so long? Before you leave, protect your home with simply save home security. 24-7 live guard protection.

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wherever you get your podcasts, new episodes Thursdays. How has it felt to be like a mom after so long? It kind of felt like I was never gone in a way. Like, because she's so, she's my kid, she's my baby, you know. And it was emotional for me because I was like, well now I get to be mommy again. But, um, at the same time, it was like, okay, well, like I never stopped being mommy. I just wasn't there for a little while. Yeah. Was she like excited to see you or was she just like, whoa, this is crazy or what was her reaction?

Like at first at night, when I that night that I pretty much woke her up, she was kinda like, I think I know you. But the next day, it wasn't really that big of a deal, but as she got more and more used to me now, she's just very, she's like, she's a love bug. She'll sit on my lap and hug me, give me kisses and stuff like that. So I think now that she's recognizing me as mommy, she's way like she's very affectionate towards me. Are you, are you gonna eventually try to gain custody?

Yes. Um, that's like a process, but really all I have to do is show that I'm independent and I can take care of her independently. And I guess that's why I'm pushing myself so hard because I want to have a job and I want to be able to save up some money so that way, and apartment, I mean, cost of living here is kind of high, but you can always find the right place. And so I'm going to look for the right place and get us a two bedroom and try to, you know, be on my own. And do you feel like on top of all that, like, people have expectations of you?

Um, yeah. I mean, I think I'm the hardest on myself because everyone else is like, you know, well, not everyone, but my stepmom, my aunts, my sister, they're like, you know, you're doing, you're doing really well. You're trying really hard, you're applying to these places, you're, you know, you're going home about making a resume, filling out applications, you want to do something.

It's not like you're just sitting around and you're just playing on your phone. And on top of that, I'm still a mom, and I'm still doing all this other, I'm trying to get other things set up for myself. And I really want to ride, and I really, you know, and I'm, but I was like, I don't have time for that. It's like, that's in my head, you know,

I don't have time for that. But as far as pressure, I think that, or expectations, I think that I'm my worst critic. And I think I'm my worst like enemy when it comes to that because I think that, yeah, they expect me to do things, but they also know where I've been. It's different if you like, you know, you just messed up or you're just not doing what you're supposed to be doing

and your parents take you in because you don't have no other place to go. And it's like, well, you have two months or you're getting kicked out. It's like no, take your time because we know where you've just come from. And I don't wanna take my time. I wanna do it. I want everything that my time. I want to do it.

I want everything that I want. I don't want it right now. So I don't want to wait. Where have you applied? Like, what are the jobs? It's like the grocery store giant, all these. There's like a America's best value, the low-motele hotel thing. There's like a, there's a gas station where they need like a clerk and like places like that. Like I've been trying to just just go walking

distance, you know, or if I do have to ask for a ride, it's not but like 10 minutes in the car. Yeah. So ultimately, in terms of jobs, like what do you, because of course right now you're going to get a job that's close and take your time and settle in, but like down the road, are you still feeling like you want to be an advocate or write a book or be a mechanic or like what's on your mind? Yes, that's what I've... Well, I really, really want to be an advocate and I want to be a writer and my stepmom thinks I should be a public speaker.

I don't know about all that. I love to talk about things, but getting out there and actually talking and having people see me like that, that's kind of daunting. But I mean like I would do it. I would just be really nervous the first few times. But I would love that. Like that's one of my, like that's like a goal. Like I know at first, I was all about diesel mechanics, and I really wanted to do that because it's something different and I was so interested in it. But now it's like, I feel like I'm kind of tugged more towards

being an advocate, being the voice for people talking about things that people don't talk about because people just don't talk about it. They just don't, Or they make it seem glamorous and put it in movies that, you know, the woman fights back and she wins and there's no repercussions for fighting back or anything like that. Like it's just like a Jennifer Lopez glamour and a of thing, and it's not like that. It's really not. When you're in actual domestic violent relationship, your boyfriend's not just going to be like,

okay, you took self-defense classes, and now you're going to like, well, follow me, like, no, they're going, they're gonna be way worse than that. So, and I want, I also want the people who are in those relationships or who have been in those relationships to understand that someone is, they're not alone, that, or, and then they shouldn't feel like they're less than, or that they're stupid, because that's what I, I mean, I still kind of kick myself and feel that kind of way, but I just want to make the world more aware of the problem and how it ties into so many things. It's not just black and white at all. It's really not. I know there is a lot of times I could have left or should

have left and looking back on it out like well dang I wish I had of course but I don't know I was just too ashamed to admit that I had messed up and I messed up in a big way, so I kind of let that drive me to stay. Yeah, shame is like such a powerful emotion. Yeah. I was angry my whole life. The spiraling. Like there was no way out on my own. I'm Dr. Monica Band, a trauma therapist and host of this new podcast I need to ask you

something. Each week, also down with a young person, as they ask a parent, friend, or partner that one question they can no longer ignore. Why did you guys wait till I was 18 and your guys' relationship? Why does my mom still love me after everything I've gone through? I need to ask you something premiere September 6 wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, it's me, Sam Beave, and it's no secret I'm pro-choice. Yes, that one, but also others.

Because I'm not just pro-choice, I'm pro-choice-says. Those crazy, life-altering decisions that shift our life path and bring us to where we are today. My next choice, starting this new podcast with Lemonada Media called Choice Words, where I interview people I admire about the biggest decisions they've made in their lives. Choice Words is out now, wherever you get your podcasts.

lives. Choice words is out now wherever you get your podcasts. I want to ask have you listened to the podcast at all? Why or why not? I listened to the trailer and I listened and I heard my voice on the 911 call and I freaked out and I had a whole cup of bar and I just don't know if I'm ready to do it. Honestly like to hear my own voice and to hear my story like that I think it'll make it too real. I really do and right now I just can't. real. I really do. And right now I just can't. I've already like I've disincentized myself so much that if I sit here and I listen to my story and I listen to all the things that I went through and listen to, you know, my parents and my aunts and my sister like I think I'll lose my mind. I really do. And I don't want to do that right now. Just maybe when I'm established

and I can have a breakdown for just a second and not feel like I've completely spiraled out of control, then maybe I will. Yeah, that makes sense. Has anyone else like in your friends or family listen and giving you feedback or? Yeah, I've had one friend who actually was in Shelby County, jailed with me. She said she listened to it and she really

enjoyed it. She said, it's crazy to hear you on there because I just she doesn't know me as like this victim kind of person because I've never been that way. She's just, but she said that it was, she really enjoyed listening to it, you know, as far as like hearing my story because I don't really like break it down for anybody. I'm like, I just, I just tell people I had a really mean boyfriend and I got tired of him being mean. And that's what I tell people. Yeah, are you glad that you participated or how do you feel about it at this point? Oh, yeah. Like, I mean, I think it was helped me, it helped me cope while I was locked up and it gave me something

to do and to strive for and it also opened up opportunities for me to do what I also want to do, which is advocate and like write and I mean, I guess public speak, I don't, I don't know about that. I don't know about that, but I mean, eventually, I would like to do that. I just have to take, take a confidence boost pill or something. There's got to be something, take some classes on self-confidence, I guess. I don't know. But, um, yeah, I'm really glad that I got to meet you. And so, yes, that's like, that's the cherry on top. So, I can't wait to come to Baltimore as soon as I'm allowed to travel again. Yeah. As soon as I push out this damn baby. Ha ha ha ha ha. Okay, one other thing I want to ask you is like

in the podcast we talk about breaking cycles and like the importance of breaking generational cycles of like violence and trauma and like do you feel like you're doing that in any way now? The real problem that I know my dad and me and my sister are problem in my mom, like there was addiction and I think that that had a lot to do with decisions that I made and decisions that people let me make, if that makes sense.

Yeah. And, but again, I think that I'm so far away from that mentality now, like my whole mentality is different, you know, and I, a b**** has a lot to do with that. But I think my mentality is just so much different now because of the things that I've seen and the things that led me to this point.

So I think like I would just breaking that curse. I think that like I've already done that because I just don't even, I don't even have an in me to put a bit through what even a little bit of what I went through when I was her age and get in the older she gets, the more I'm gonna just be like, no,

that's just not how this works. I mean, how do you look back on the person you were before, when maybe alcoholism was present in your life and versus now who you are with a totally different mindset? Well, I just think about the things that I let happen because of alcohol. And I think about all the things that my mom went through, my sister's gone through because of alcohol. It motivates me to be in the opposite direction. Some people take the bad and make it their purpose for good and some people take the bad and make it an excuse

and go ahead and just get into the bad as well. So I think that I'm just on the other side where I'm like, I don't want anything to do with it. I don't. Yeah. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I don't want anything to do with it. I don't. Yeah. Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. I was also thinking about how we've

talked a lot about love and how you love love, which I also identified with. What kind of love do you want going forward in the future? I haven't even thought about that. I just want someone to love me and love f*** for who she is because she's a lot of work. And she's like, if she's not at school, she's full-time. She's full-time job.

And I guess, like, if they love her and they love me and they accept her and they accept me, then that's good enough for me. For real. Now that I'm out, my mind's so different that it's kind of like I'm just like whatever. I don't know. I still love love and I think love is the greatest thing that there ever was, but at the same time like I don't know. I just haven't put time into love. I haven't put time into that part of it. So I just want to be Independent and be a good person and then I'll worry about love That's so cool to hear you say because I think yeah like a lot of us just get caught up in that and then that comes first and then everything else second and

then it causes chaos in your life. So yeah because that's that's exactly what I did the first time and I don't want to do that again. They, you know, my family calls it hormones, but it was not hormones, it was love, okay? I was in love with him. So, yeah, yeah. They just don't, they just don't understand love like I do. Ha-ha-ha. Nobody does except for you if you're in it, you know?

Yeah. Yeah. Devon has a totally different idea about romantic love after all she's been through. She's focused on making up the years she's lost, and ready to be the mom she has wanted to be for the five years she's been away. So, yes. So, um, that's it. I can't believe like, our podcast is over,

but now I guess I get to talk to you like a normal person. Yeah, absolutely. So that's exciting. And I'll be asking you for mom advice. Oh yeah, yeah, I'm excited. I'll be like, how do I change a diaper though? Like, what do I do? One more thing before I go.

As we were finishing production on this podcast, we found out about several other cases of women who were arrested in Alabama for killing their alleged abusers. One woman was charged with murder and her case is ongoing. Two other women took plea deals for manslaughter. The injustice doesn't end with Devon, and it's a reminder that when we hear stories like this, the reality is often more complicated. It's a reminder to pay attention to anyone who might be struggling with domestic abuse. The more we can keep an eye out for people in our own lives and unhealthy relationships,

the more we can prevent tragedies like this from happening. Domestic abuse thrives in the dark, and I believe sunlight is the best disinfectant. If you or someone you know is experiencing domestic abuse, use a safe computer and contact the National Domestic Violence Hotline at thehotline.org or call 1-800-799-7233. There is more blind plea with Lemonada Premium. Subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content like Tate from one of my phone calls with John Stad Henry. Subscribe now in Apple Podcasts.

Blind Plei is a production of Lemonada Media. I'm your host, Liz Flock. This episode was produced by Tony Williams. Hannah Boomer-Shine and Rachel Pilgrim are also our producers. Kristen LePore is our senior producer. Story editing by Martina Abraham's Allunga. Mix, music, and sound design by Andy Kristen's daughter with additional mixing and engineering from Ivan Kuraiv.

Naomi Barr is our fact checker. Jaitla Everett is our production intern. Jackie Danziger is our vice president of narrative content. Executive producers are Stephanie Whittles-Wax, Jessica Cordova-Kramer, evoke media and Sabrina Mirage-Nayin, and myself Liz Flak. This series was co-created with evoke media and presented by Marguerite Casey Foundation. Help others find our show by leaving us a rating and writing a review. Follow me at Liz Fluck and for more stories of women and self-defense,

check out my book The Furies from Harper Books, available for pre-order now. Find Lamanada at Lamanada Media across all social platforms and follow Blind Plea wherever you get your podcasts, or listen ad-free on Amazon Music with your prime membership. Thanks so much for listening. What's up, everyone? I'm Delaney Fisher, comedian and serial entrepreneur.

And I'm Kelsey Cook, comedian, and I swear this is real, a world champion foosball player. On our podcast, Self Help List, we dig into everything from heartbreak, to career burn-out, to the wild stories from our 20s, and the many anxieties we've experienced along the way. We're often joined by guests who range from celebrities to renowned health experts, and together we'll unpack big topics like deciding whether or not we want kids, building your dream career, strengthening self-trust, and much much more. So join us every Monday for an unfiltered, entertaining, and honest conversation with friends where you don't even have to leave your house.

If you're not wearing pants, we will never know. That's right! So listen to Self Helpless wherever you get your podcasts. This message is brought to you by Makersmark. Hey everyone, I'm Sam B. You might know me from the Daily Show, from Full Frontal with Samantha B, or maybe from my new podcast Choice Words, which is another Lemonada Media Show as well. Each week on Choice Words, I interview people I admire about the biggest decisions they've made in their lives and what they've learned from those experiences. That's why I'm so excited to partner with Maker's Mark

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