Chart Music: the Top Of The Pops Podcast - #70 (Pt 1): 17.4.86 – The Rishi Sunak Of TOTP

Episode Date: April 14, 2023

Sarah Bee and Neil Kulkarni join Al Needham and prepare for some serious loin-girding as they prepare to tackle an episode of The Pops from the unappealing middle bit of the A...ydeez – a neon wasteland where the Dinosaurs of Pop are running rampant in their Success Coats with sleeves a-rolled. But first, a flick through that week’s NME, and a vital BPT update…   Video Playlist | Subscribe | Facebook | Twitter | The Chart Music Wiki | Patreon Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Starting point is 00:00:58 of sex or violence, which could be quite graphic. It may also contain some very explicit language, which will frequently mean sexual swear words. What do you like to listen to? Um, chart music. Chart music.
Starting point is 00:01:34 Hey up you pop craze youngsters and welcome to the latest episode of Char Music, the podcast that gets its hands right down the back of the settee on a random episode of Top of the Pops. I'm your host, Al Needham, and standing with me today are my dear friend Sarah B. Hello. And Neil Kulkarni. Hello there. Colleagues, the pop things, the interesting things,
Starting point is 00:01:55 what of them? Tell me now. Well, the pop and interesting things are somewhat reduced these days as I've kind of joined the secret club of people who've fallen through the floorboards of society um but i do have a new podcast oh baby show yes thank you for this opportunity um it's called it's called teledrome which is a name i was astonished no one else had
Starting point is 00:02:23 had you know it's always good when that happens when it just comes to you it's like let's call which is a name I was astonished no one else had had. It's always good when that happens, when it just comes to you. It's like, let's call it that. And it's like, and you get, do you remember you used to do Google whacking where you'd Google a thing and there'd be no results. And it's like, ooh, look at this desert of opportunity. So the first two episodes are out now, a skinny little 90 minutes each. I mean, barely there really. We have got nerdy
Starting point is 00:02:46 and ranty about the two massive fantasy shows of recent months, which were House of the Dragon, a Game of Thrones thing, and The Rings of Power, which is a Lord of the Rings thing. One of these we loved to distraction, one of which we thought was absolute bollocks from hell. So, have a
Starting point is 00:03:02 listen. But which one, listeners? I don't. And who's the other bloke sorry it's me and my brilliant friend john tatlock good old john hey up john hey up john um we did a podcast together uh based on a joke idea that i had and he kind of called my bluff on it in the before times uh we did a game of thrones podcast called the night's hate watch which is still i fell off the internet for a bit i think it's back up now which is an exhaustive account of how bad the final season of Game of Thrones is
Starting point is 00:03:30 you can actually track as the will to live leaks from our very souls along the way Presumably finally extinguished by Ed Sheeran I'm guessing Oh god, he really haunts the whole thing, you know.
Starting point is 00:03:47 This is all modern stuff, isn't it? No, we're doing all sorts of stuff. Yeah, just anything. Literally, if you can see it on a screen in your house, you know, it's quite a broad dreamer, really. The next one we're doing, I can exclusively reveal, is we are going to talk about Hellraiser, which, and horror remakes hellraiser from
Starting point is 00:04:05 1987 you remember that one you know they've really jesus wept jesus wept spoilers um and they've remade it and we have opinions about that so um yeah we're doing that by the way that's um that's our own epically late christmas episode which is itself and even even later than that even epically later halloween episode so basically don't feel bad time now means nothing no and we don't have a schedule we do it when we are healthy and not too busy oh and the name of it again sarah the name of the podcast is teledrome and where can you get it anywhere Anywhere you find your podcasts. Yes, that's the correct answer. Neil, come on in. Step into the cyber. I think the last time we spoke, Hal,
Starting point is 00:04:50 it was back in November. In the old times. Our salad days, if you will. Yes, indeed. A very strange end to 2022 and a sort of odd start to 2023. It's been a weird couple of months for me. I mean, you know me.
Starting point is 00:05:02 I essentially just want to be left alone in my bubble and write reviews of records that no one listens to um but a couple of things in recent months has sort of problematized that a little bit since i was last on with simon obviously terry hall passed on yeah and the the quietus asked me about eight in the morning that day to write something and by 8 30 in the morning i had and by the afternoon I was getting calls off like Radio 5 and Channel 4 News to appear and say a few words. Yeah, I mean, I suppose I should feel that
Starting point is 00:05:31 as kind of vindication, you know, this is what a journalist should do, put themselves about a bit. And there's no point in me bearing that grudge that it's always NME fuckers or that incestuous band of mutual mates that passes for London's music media who gets all these gigs. You know know if when i get given this opportunity i don't take them so i did
Starting point is 00:05:50 them both radio five was good um channel four a little bit more revealing i was shunted after 10 seconds in preference for tim burgess or something but but truth be told it all felt a bit distinctly uncomfortable out yeah i was much happier a couple of days later, by which time people on Twitter had got around to calling my piece a moronic, you know, take. And that returned me to my comfort zone. Excellent, yes. Oh, man, you can always rely on cunts, can't you,
Starting point is 00:06:17 to re-send your world again. Indeed, they keep you grounded. But, you know, conversely, I had a lovely moment the other day right that reminded me really that not all response to stuff has to make me feel like some kind of talking head cunt on a bbc4 documentary i was in stratford-upon-avon morrison's right opposite the college there where my daughter goes and i went up to the fag kiosk right um to buy some stamps and i asked the bloke behind the counter like do you sell stamps mate and he just stares at me in like this dumbfounded silence right so i sort of added
Starting point is 00:06:52 you know a book of first class please just to nudge him into action but he's still kind of staring at me and then he says are you a sort of big pause on chart music podcast oh yeah okay now i know it was mental and i'm like yes i am are you a pop crazed youngster and he's like neil kulkarni oh my god he it was so sweet he was so flustered i had to kind of let him serve that the kind of building angry queue of smokers behind me and and then then we sort of stopped for chat it was it was really touching to hear how much chart music podcast meant to him oh so that was absolutely lovely and you know hello to alan from stratford morrison's hi alan i will pop in for a longer chat i mean the way journalism's going i might pop in for a job as well um and and you know maybe a
Starting point is 00:07:44 pot of tea in future but that was that was a really touching thing oh my respect to you alan yeah you gotta watch out though neil it is a double-edged sword being recognized in the street i used to get it a lot about 20 years ago i moved back to nottingham 20 years ago this month right after being in london and doing a lot of late night tele ramble and so consequently I was recognised all the fucking time when I went out in Nottingham. And to the point where I'd go out with a mate who I hadn't seen for years,
Starting point is 00:08:13 and I'd go into a pub and just before I went in, I'd say to her, look, before we go in, I've got to let you know, there's a really good chance that someone neither of us know is going to come up to us and start talking to us because they recognised me off the telly. And she didn't know anything about this. And she just looked at me and went,
Starting point is 00:08:29 fucking hell, you've become a right arrogant bastard, haven't you? And I said, no, no, no, no, seriously. Opened the front door of the pub. I'd only got about three foot in when someone who I didn't know, never met again, just turned around, pointed at me and just shouted, fucking hell, it's you, the legend. And I just looked at my mate and her jaw just hung wide open.
Starting point is 00:08:52 She said, yeah, welcome to my world, baby. But the other edge of that sword, always sharp and cutting. Couple of months after, in the same pub, this girl comes up to me and I can see her coming across to me from the pub immediately knowing what's gonna happen right where she comes up to me said excuse me i'm really sorry to bother you but have you been on the telly and i said yeah i have yeah and she looked at me again and said are you pete doherty's stalker on that documentary the fucking death ray glare i fired at her made her scuckle all the way back to the pub and i just thought thank god you were a woman if you'd have been a bloke i would have oh the fists would
Starting point is 00:09:33 have been brandished oh man it's it's it's tough when you've got a doppelganger on telly because i mean obviously i had years of it with dev allahan from coronation street yes i know the feeling but anyway fuck the randoms and the hoi polloi let's talk about the special people of this world the latest batch of pop craze patreon subscribers and this time in the five dollar section we have pete hibberdeen judy finnegan's Wake Ewan Wallace Circuit 3 Gary McPherson Joe Keating
Starting point is 00:10:09 Mike Daly Adam Harrison John Rafferty Ian Hamilton Mike Atkinson Wayne Codd James Purdy Kit Lynch
Starting point is 00:10:23 DS Dave Caffrey Joe O'Donnell Ian Ron Saunders Graham McPherson Mark Corcoran Lettuce and introducing the Ghostface Scylla! Never could get iller.
Starting point is 00:10:43 And in the $3 section, we phil prothero kevin cope will collinson russell parsons dan metcalf michelle lions marie and pete gibson thank you you lovely lovely people thank you we are the rain you are the sun and now we've made a rainbow i think it's beautiful don't you nail indeed indeed what a beautiful rain i mean you know that's a whole flotilla of new pop craze youngsters that's fantastic a lot of people have left but a lot of people have come on man it's a nice steady churn indeed which is nice i wish them all you know regular barrel movements and a lovely love life
Starting point is 00:11:26 this year and Pete Gibson you jacked it right up didn't you mate right up to the armpit in fact and we're sore
Starting point is 00:11:34 but we're grateful so thank you Pete and as well as keeping chart music alive and getting new episodes in full days before
Starting point is 00:11:44 everyone else we know advert ramble the pop craze patreons get to slip Chart music alive and getting new episodes in full days before everyone else. We know advert ramble. The pop craze patreons get to slip into the back room of the record shop and fiddle about with the chart return book for the brand new chart music top 10. Are we ready, babies? Oh, God, yes. Hit the fucking music. We've said goodbye to the Airbnb 52s,
Starting point is 00:12:07 Dag Vag, the Nagasaki Hellblaster, Rock Expert, David Stubbs, which means one up, three down, two non-movers, three new entries and one re-entry. It's a re-entry at number 10, but Jeff sex. First new entry, straight in at number 9,
Starting point is 00:12:32 the two Ronnies clash. Down one place from number 7 to number 8, here comes Jism. A new entry, straight in at number seven, Sex Under Artex.
Starting point is 00:12:49 Down one place to number six, Bumadon. Into the top five, and it's a one-place jump for the bent cunts who aren't fucking real. Last week's number three, This week's number four. Eric Smallshore of Eccles. The highest new entry smashes into the chart at number three. Noel Edmonds as Wank Fantasy. No change at number two.
Starting point is 00:13:19 The provisional O-R-O-R-A, which means... Britain's number one. Oh, yes. He's still there as the chart music top ten number one. The Birmingham Piss Troll. Oh, my God. What a chart. I suspected that would be the case, to be honest with you.
Starting point is 00:13:43 I mean, you know, much as I suspected Bummer Dog would still be there. The dark side of the moon of the chart music chart. Those new entries, Sex Under Artex, what are they saying to the youth? I don't know, but yeah, that's a bit close to home, actually. Problem with Artex is it fucking funks for ages after you put it up. But once it's up, there's no shift in it. That's it. That's it. That's that thing for life then.
Starting point is 00:14:07 Yes. Yeah. I can see sex under vortex. Sort of early 80s concerned, sort of popping up on Riverside with some performative dance troupe. Indeed. It's the Xs, isn't it?
Starting point is 00:14:18 It's always Xs. That's a definitively, yeah, 80s thing. It is, yeah. It doesn't matter what year it is. There's something futuristic about an X. It just speaks to a sexy future that you'll never get to. The two Ronnies clash. Well, that's either some heavy-duty discipline dub
Starting point is 00:14:36 or Ronnie Barker and Ronnie Corbett doing some thigh-slapping impersonations of Mick Jones and Joe Strummer. Or it could well be two Rononnie's one cup doing a war or a fetus if you know what i mean changing their name to adapt to the new styles i just see lots of blacking up there it's deeply problematic yes and noel edmunds wank fantasy well that's clearly a dance troupe in the style of um sarah brightman and hot gossip they're all dressed up as helicopters and rally cars with legs yeah
Starting point is 00:15:12 the thing is it'd be easy to say that his wank fantasy would be mr blobby or something but clearly noel edmunds is one of those people who wanks in front of a mirror yeah birmingham fish troll sticks he really does i i have got a small update oh yes come on give it on the phenomenon that i mean all the kids are talking about indeed this troll it it's true that you know when i first suggested the phenomena of the birmingham piss troll i was at first sort of confounded by pricey's quite legitimate and forensically scientific interrogation of the narrative you know he was right to observe that my indeterminacy over whether the birmingham piss trolls um sort of
Starting point is 00:15:50 locomotive aspect was one of scuttling or wading and i was floundering to be honest with you at times under his questioning oh yeah floundering in a pool of birmingham piss proper journalism ruins everything doesn't it yeah it's a snopes thing print the legend simon but i mean therefore it was i mean it's both revelatory and sort of really gratifying to read a frankly terrifying testimony from a young brummie um on the internet um who are so it must be true who are who are 1 15 in the morning on a cold October Saturday outside the aforementioned Subway Club in Brum had a BPT experience. Oh, yeah.
Starting point is 00:16:30 This guy had descended the spiral staircase down the canal bridge outside the Subway Club to have a piss in the canal, as so many previous victims have. And after a few seconds, this guy, he sees underneath his tinkle of piss. And this was what blew my mind. A mask.
Starting point is 00:16:48 Fuck. Yeah. I mean, terrifying. Seemingly floating in midair. And not some cheap Halloween mask, but a kind of expensive Dio de las Muertos style skull mask. You know, I mean, serious business. Like a luchador. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:17:03 And the guy thinks, you thinks you know clearly as anyone would oh fuck i'm pissing on someone shouts oh fuck sorry man and immediately diverts his stream of piss away from the man with the mask who's on the receiving end of it i think what happens next is what's truly terrifying in this testimony the masked figure moves to follow the stream of piss and the guy starts screaming even more you know what the fuck are you doing but you know as i've heard before actually the bpt doesn't answer he just he just silently stands there gleefully i mean presumably showering himself in this sort of stream of alco piss and of course the guy is just traumatized he comes away tells his disbelieving mate and swears down that this must never happen again obviously you know the next week the guy like a fool goes
Starting point is 00:17:54 back to subway city and it happens again but this time you know he's yeah he seeks like like any scientist in search of the the nion cryptozoological which is i mean i think we can put bpt in that category i mean who knows what an unknown branch of the hominid family tree bpt might be the last living exemplar of but i mean he gets verification by getting another mate you know to have a piss as well and do the same and in subsequent weeks according to this chap's testimony several of this guy's colleagues verify this this experience and in subsequent weeks according to this chap's testimony several of this guy's colleagues verify this this experience and and they start trying to confront the bpt with questions and then you know perhaps most eerie bit of the testimony in fact is that the birmingham
Starting point is 00:18:38 pistol never answers but he does and this is just shudderingly awful he emits this small groan you know i've never heard that groan but even the imagined sound of it you know makes me twist and shudder in my sheets at night this is like a groan of satisfaction i'm assuming i guess so he lives for the piss he does live for the piss but um finally anyway the guy and his mates they kind of pile down on mass to confront you know this micturant masked men but he gets um apparently the bpt gets spooked and they kind of never see him again but but once again and as ever with the birmingham piss troll you know this leaves more questions than answers. Indeed. I mean, number one, could the Birmingham Pistrol be a woman? That's a possibility.
Starting point is 00:19:28 No. Possibly not. Possibly not. But, you know, let's be fair. I mean, number two, is the mask indeed a mask? Or is it, yes, the grotesquely deformed features of some as yet undiscovered adjunct to mammalian primate development? Birmingham's a, you know, that kind of place. And, you know, is the Birmingham piss troll no more?
Starting point is 00:19:50 Can the Birmingham piss troll communicate? Is the mask perhaps part of some strange initiation ceremony to an actual whole community of piss trolls who have to obscure their faces as they might be recognised as famous members of Birmingham's high society. Oh God, like David Hunter. Indeed. But you know, these could be among the primary top ranking members of Birmingham's powerful line dancing community,
Starting point is 00:20:15 and I think the public have a right to know. Oh, definitely. These are the questions that actually handily form the titles of each episode of my forthcoming History Channel series, Cracking the BPT Code. It's been greenlit by National Geographic. Should be on your screens come autumn. Fantastic. Our TV spent all this money on a fucking thing about Noel Gordon.
Starting point is 00:20:37 Jesus. Have you considered the theory that it could be a curse? The Birmingham Pistol might not want to be the Birmingham Pistol, but he has to serve the Birmingham Piss Troll, but he has to serve the Birmingham Piss Gods. Oh my God. Yeah. And perhaps if you get too close, you know, the mask slips,
Starting point is 00:20:53 in a sense, and you find yourself in the mask, and then you have to take on that role. It's like Ring, you know, you piss on the Birmingham Piss Troll, and seven days later you become the birmingham the series is coming out i mean my people are currently in talks with greg wallace's people so let's see what happens but yeah terrifying verification though i feel vindication
Starting point is 00:21:17 yeah fuck you simon i'm worried now that there's going to be like hordes of people going down there like you know cock in hand ready to lure it out sarah there was a guy on twitter i think who in response to that episode yeah he did go check it out yeah i think the bpt is long gone but um yeah you know let's see well it's gonna be all over tiktok coming up piss talk what's gonna happen to the the you know the the canal is gonna be a delicate ecosystem. If there's more people pissing in there than ever before. Sarah, it's a canal in Birmingham. It's fucked up.
Starting point is 00:21:52 Trust me. It can only help. So if you want in on the never ending thrill ride that is being a Pulp Craze Patreon, you know what to do. You take them sexy fingers of yours, you hide them over to the keyboard, you mash, mash, mash
Starting point is 00:22:09 patreon.com slash chart music, and you step up to that pay window, daddy, and lay your money down right now. Please. This episode, Pop Craze Youngsters, takes us all the way back to april the 17th 1986 reason for this me dears is twofold uh first let a pop craze youngster stop me in a supermarket a
Starting point is 00:22:38 while back and asked me to sort out a mid-80s one so you know it's been a while and fair enough second layer you know i think it's fair to say that we've had some absolute pop trifle of late with the episodes that we've covered and i think it's now time for a bit of bran don't you let me stir a bit of cat shit back into the mix because you know we've done 1986 only twice before, and, oh, God, we've witnessed the bright stars of new pop burning out, the dinosaurs of pop roaring back in the wake of Live Aid, and very little new stuff in the charts to get excited about. Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, this is obviously an age thing for us, Al, I think.
Starting point is 00:23:22 I mean, by 1986, I was a little wanker basically um about pop it kind of confirms all those old horrible opinions but you know it is also a reminder that you know there's a bit more nuance to it but you're right the dinosaurs are well they still walk don't they yes and nothing kind of completely bracingly new has come along in terms of like a scene it's more like individual figures uh kind of still giving us a bit of excitement but it's a thin episode i think this reflecting a bit of a thin time sarah of course you're a bit younger than us so this is kind of more your top of the pops of mine yeah you know like when you've got um some manky toys and you just want to hand them on to your little sister or something they
Starting point is 00:24:05 see yeah that's yours now i've got a better one yeah it is i mean this is obviously before i learned cynicism and disdain for so everything's great for me at this point the pre-beakle 60s 1975 76 the tail end of the 90s most of this unwiped art of a century. Why do fallow periods of chart music happen me dears? Because you know after all there's new bands and artists popping up all the time so surely
Starting point is 00:24:36 there shouldn't ever be a downturn in pop there always should be something pop and interesting and new happening. There's ebb and flow always though like in nature and in music. So why would Top of the Pops be any different? I mean, also, it's like the mids, whenever you get... The kids say mid now, don't they, to mean meh?
Starting point is 00:24:53 Right. It's one of the mids. I know Taylor said before that he considers 1986 a late 80, like the first of the late. I think if you run at the sort of hectic pace that this decade has, you are going to experience a greater degree of wear and or tear by the six mark. I mean, I don't know.
Starting point is 00:25:10 And maybe it's a British thing. Maybe British pop kind of exhausts itself more often than, I don't know, pulling this idea out of my arse. But there is a certain flaggingness about it. So what you're saying is that the 80s has spunked its load all over its jumper and there's no tissues under that's precisely the mental image that i now have i think you can roughly kind of coincide those periods where it feels like there's a bit of a dip with fundamentally a period when the biz feels most in control yes so you know mid 70s mid 80s it's the biz exerting their muscle
Starting point is 00:25:47 and and you know art is kind of feeling you know needy um they've got the begging bowl out they want to get signed obviously i mean this is a thing that happens all the time but there doesn't seem to be anything happening palpably in the background or in the underground if you like um that might feed into an interesting pot chart so you know when you look at the chart it is mainly in 86 it is it is sort of industry sanctioned if you like yeah we've had like you say al that big sort of era defining live aid moment of you know we're in control yeah and you know we're always going to be in control and these old dinosaurs who just refuse to go away.
Starting point is 00:26:26 In fact, the resurrection of a lot of those dinosaurs, thanks to Live Aid. And we're kind of basking in 1986 in that period where the business just got complete and utter control over things. Yeah. I mean, the only new band or artist to get to number one in the LP charts in 1986, Five Star with Silk and Steel for one week. For one week.
Starting point is 00:26:44 Yeah. I mean, you can point towards the bitter aftertaste of Live Aid five star with Silk and Steel for one week for one week yeah I mean you can point towards the bitter aftertaste of Live Aid and combine that with a transition of CD output from classical music to more quote modern stuff meaning that there's a load of yuppie twats out there
Starting point is 00:26:58 who want their copies of Brothers in Arms and Diamond Live to sound as crisp as possible and hoovering up CD copies copies of lps have already got but i feel you also have to blame the pop craze youngsters not the pop craze youngsters listening but the pop craze youngsters in general because things have got so fucking conservative with a small c in 1986 yeah yeah i mean it's not just down to old people buying old dinosaur vans young people are buying the shit as well.
Starting point is 00:27:26 Young people are seeing, you know, Dire Straits as the zenith, as this is as good as music gets in 86. So, yeah, you're entirely right. It's not just a load of old farts who suddenly start buying pop records. It is the pop audience just happen to be buying shite. I guess it's significant that, you know, there's this new way to listen to music at this time called the compact disc um and it is as beautiful as an oil spill in the sun and as
Starting point is 00:27:50 futuristic as a robot that sings whatever song you like as long as it's lady in red by christa berg it's weird to be looking back on this now isn't it but it is it was um you know it did provide a much needed supplementary income for struggling music journalists who yes ended up selling them by the plantain box load to one guy from guildford called bill and it will it was never cool was it i suppose it was cool to the very few prosperous wankers of 1986 who were you know high on deregulation and what have you but it started out as something because it was so expensive it started out as something for only for middle-aged parents and a couple of generations later ended up as something only for middle-aged parents you know yes thing about cds yes you would hear about them all the time but you know me owning a cd player in 1986 is like me owning a
Starting point is 00:28:40 pair of hover boots in 1986 just wasn't gonna fucking happen if you had a cd player in your house it would be on the unit in the living room because it belonged to dad yeah dad had the control again and when dads have control of pop things go bad yeah too right and crucially you know you walk in a record shop the cd section i mean not only is it limited in 1986 but the prices you just look at the prices and you just think fuck that the players are prohibitively expensive as well yeah price of walkmans has just kind of come down in 86 oh yes a lot of us can afford them so yeah it's tapes and records all the way yeah if you're any and it's sort of below the age of 40 basically to my mind
Starting point is 00:29:21 the big story of the year in pop was zigzag sputnik and the general reaction and rejection of them because you know not only did the enemy take against them with their four million pound for this crap cover but even smash hits who up until then were the champions of the pop and interesting thought they were going around thinking there was some so you've got an environment where anything even slightly flamboyant and different needs to be taken down a peg or two because it's not really proper music. Yeah, completely.
Starting point is 00:29:52 I blame Noel Edmonds sneering at Prince in the previous year's Brit Awards for all this. But I mean, you know, for an awful lot of us, Zig Zig Sputnik, who we heard about before we heard, you know, the initial flare of excitement about them was reminiscent for me as a pop fan of kind of oh i remember them going mental like this about frankie now frankie were exciting and thrilling when you finally heard the records they were amazing now much as i dig love missile um you know zigzag weren't in the same league to be honest with you
Starting point is 00:30:21 in terms of that satisfaction and consequently an awful lot of people would have just taken one look at that and the wedge is in then pop's going to be silly and daft you stick with peter gabriel sledgehammer and proper music made by proper people you know they really were not proper people in the best way yes yeah yeah yeah we have often said like you you want your pop stars to seem like they've beamed in from elsewhere or come down in a spaceship and they really they're like who who is more spaceship really than six i saw them actually once um at the borderline all of these things that are now one of the many defunct clubs of london and you know they were great and obviously this is many years after you know but it was fucking great that's the thing i mean i think the kids rejection of zz sputnik wasn't the fact that you know oh they were, you know, but it was fucking great. That's the thing. I mean, I think the kids' rejection of Ziggy Zigg's Sputnik wasn't the fact that, you know, oh, they were too weird or too underground.
Starting point is 00:31:09 It was precisely because it felt like a biz game in itself. Yeah. That I'm not going to get played by that, you know. But you were already told that it was an enormous hype. Yeah, that's it. Not only by the band themselves, but, you know, this is around the time that all the tabloid newspapers had actual proper pop columnists every day we were being told how the game was played yeah exactly light was being shone upon
Starting point is 00:31:34 magic and you fuck that yeah we were being shown the workings basically yes exactly i mean let me stress right now as far as 1986 episodes top of the the Pops go, this ain't that bad. If it's a shit sandwich, then at the very least it's an open-faced shit sandwich, isn't it? There is little in the way of cat shit. There's some fucking awful stuff, but, you know, a lot of it's not that bad, is it? No, but in general, the treatment of pop by this episode is it's a bit like what we were just talking about the sort of pop sort of not joked about but but pop denigrated ultimately in the way this episode is presented and as we'll see as we go through this this points towards a
Starting point is 00:32:20 general kind of denigration of top of the pops that lasts for quite a long time towards a general kind of denigration of top of the pops that lasts for quite a long time brace yourself pop craze youngsters we're going in hard in the news this week america drops loads of bombs on AAA from British airbases in retaliation for Libya being behind the bombing of a disco in West Berlin, which causes Islamic Jihad to kill three British hostages and kidnap the journalist John McCarthy in Beirut and keep him there for over five years it also forces brian adams to pull out of donating the track only the strong survive to the soundtrack of an upcoming film called top gun in disgust the shop spill 1986 an attempt by the government to end the ban on sunday shopping is defeated in the House of Parliament and would have to wait until 1994 to come into effect. The government has been coated down by its own MPs for not making the wedding of Nance, Andrew and Fergie a public holiday, describing the move as killjoy and spoilsport.
Starting point is 00:33:40 In other royal news, it's been announced that Prince Charles is letting a very special competitor in next sunday's london marathon nip into buckingham palace to have a shower and a nice cup of tea it's sir james vincent saville obe kgsc but then lucky jim deserves it, writes the Sunday People. It was he, after all, who persuaded the Royals to allow the marathon to run along the Mall. Course organiser John Disley said, This man Savile has the key to so many doors, I just don't know how he does it. Ross Davidson, hunky male nurse Andy O'Brien in EastEnders, is to be axed from the soap following revelations that he and his on-screen wife Shirley Chilton
Starting point is 00:34:32 have been having it off in real life and she's about to walk out on her real-life husband. Rumours of a split hang over the Rolling Stones after Mick Jagger sends telegrams to the other members informing them that he will not be able to tour this year as he'll be working on his second shit solo album but it's definitely splitsville for boy george and alice temple the 18 year old former british bmx champion who were expected to be getting married a month ago according to the tabloids but the big news is that mike reed will be broadcasting his final radio one breakfast show tomorrow with adrian john filling in for a fortnight starting on monday before mike smith takes over for two years but don don't panic, Blue Tulip.
Starting point is 00:35:25 He's set to score a massive hit in the West End with his musical about John Betjeman. According to John Blake in the Daily Mirror, Andrew Lloyd Webber is thinking about backing it and the likes of Midgeor and Steve Harley are fighting to bagsy a role. I'm really excited, says Mike. Lady Betjeman told me that she thought my music breathed new life into his poems sadly the musical ends up only being performed at assorted
Starting point is 00:35:55 charity events but a cd called sound of poetry is released featuring harley cliff richard john featuring Harley, Cliff Richard, John Anderson, Gene Pitner, Donovan, David Essex, Captain Sensible, David Grant, Alvin Stardust, and Mike Reed is released. Christ almighty. He had so much clout, Mike Reed, simply by being the fucking Radio 1 Breakfast DJ. I've read articles about Top of the Pops where there's been guitar playing coming from a dressing room
Starting point is 00:36:28 and someone's gone in, and it's virtually half the acts that were appearing in that night's Top of the Pops sitting around listening to Mike replaying the guitar and singing at them. Fucking hell. I know. On the cover of Melody Maker this week, Suze. On the cover of Smash Hits, The Bangles. On the cover of melody maker this week suze on the cover of smash hits the bangles on the cover
Starting point is 00:36:48 of record mirror the blow monkeys on the cover of number one simon lebon on his yacht which is just pulled into uruguay and at this moment is still upright the number one lp in the country is hits four by various artists brothers in arms by dire straits is at number two because of fucking course it is over in america the number one single is rock me amadeus by falco and the number one lp is whitney houston by whitney houston, me dears, what were we doing in April of 1986? Oh, God, I wasn't doing a lot. I mean, I was, I now a teenager, still at school, horrible little sod, really.
Starting point is 00:37:34 I know I always say that about myself, but, you know, I do want to retroactively reach an arm back and just slap myself. Because I was, yeah, a precocious little sod. A slap and then a hug nil surely perhaps so did you have specs by then or not i did oh god yeah i'd been wearing specs since 1979 so i was well into it by then obviously because you like morrissey yeah of course but yeah i mean you know my sister remembers being being an annoying critic at the age of five
Starting point is 00:38:04 so golden was what was my then you know when my sister remembers being an annoying critic at the age of five. So, Gould knows what was like then. You know, when I started discovering my body, thanks to things like Falcon Crest. So, I was quite literally, in all senses, a little wanker in 1986. That's all I remember, to be honest. I was just about to turn eight the very day after this episode, in fact. Early birthday treat for you then, Sarah. Early birthday treat for me yeah on the massive well there's different types of massive tellies we had that you know that that
Starting point is 00:38:29 type of massive telly um but i was just glad to be still alive at this point because if i think about it i lived in an extremely dangerous house in that classic 80s style it wasn't quite a terrace house there's sort of two in the front and two behind. And incredibly steep stairs, which I learned to shin up and down like a little monkey because it was my house. But whenever any of my little friends came around, they would sort of teeter down and I would hold their hand because it's like, ah, you know, sort of vertiginous steps.
Starting point is 00:38:58 I definitely nearly set myself on fire once by getting too close to the gas fire in the kitchen in my very flammable pink robe made of fibers unknown to man my mum made me a swing because there was like for some reason there was a set of outdoor stairs to the first floor for no reason at all and she hung a swing off it was made out of wood a bit of wood and clothesline and i used to swing on that so that was it was lucky that i didn't just fly off into infinity from that. Oh, man.
Starting point is 00:39:30 If ever a girl needed a ginger Tom that spoke like Kenny Everett, it was you, Sarah. Charlie says, don't sit on the swing your mum made. It's not been checked by health and safety. But steep staircases, I mean, when you're a kid, you appreciate appreciate them but the older you get and the more likely you are to get drunk um they just become a real problem don't they steep staircases are fucking brilliant for getting in a sleeping bag and tobogganing down i don't think i ever did that because it was actually two because they were sort of turn around at the bottom and and oh you know plus party drama is good with a steep staircase i've seen people
Starting point is 00:40:06 fly down a staircase to pin somebody against the wall by their lapels and jab their finger in their face it was it was fantastic and it wouldn't have happened without the steep staircase well i was 17 and still at sixth form finally getting me arsing gear and re-redoing my O-levels after six months of walking out of the house, turning round when it was safe and then going back and bunkering in my bedroom for the day. I was playing truant at a college that I didn't have to play truant from. I could have just left it.
Starting point is 00:40:38 Yeah, yeah. But there was fuck all else to do. I couldn't see myself getting a job. I look back now and I just think, what the fuck were you doing, man? Was I depressed? know i think i probably was i became a proper hermit in any case i couldn't think of anything i wanted to do with my life i mean i had a typewriter and i was doing little bits of writing and stuff like that i'd done an american football fanzine but i think i'd finished that by now right i just had the extended childhood that
Starting point is 00:41:06 a lot of people of my age did and still do yeah yeah you know being an adult didn't seem like any fun whatsoever so fuck it and i feel really guilty about that now because i was still living at my mum and dad's and i was just poncing off them but i blame thatcher it's difficult if things suggest themselves to you but you go well i'm never going to make a living at that If I'd thought more about it When I first got into writing And if I hadn't immediately got scooped up By the benevolent melody maker
Starting point is 00:41:34 Then I would have been in a similar sort of position Just going what the fuck Writing when you don't live in London It just feels like a pie in the sky thing doesn't it The weird thing is now of course 17 yearold kids are kind of being forced, in a sense, to yeah, what are you going to do? What are you going to be?
Starting point is 00:41:50 Yeah. And honestly, I mean, like you, Al, probably, you know, if I'd have been asked at that point, I would have said fucking astronaut or something. I really did not know. Yeah. But, you know, I think we benefited from that. And you might have benefited from these six months of basically doing fuck all. Basically, as a way of making sure that you'd stop doing fuck all, maybe yeah because i hated my sixth form it was just like being at
Starting point is 00:42:09 school again but without football or any of the other things that make going to school tolerable music wise due to a combination of being skint and the charts being shit i'm seriously burrowing into the second hand record shops now and i'm still picking up gold from the 60s and 70s because you know why should i spend what was it 10 pound on a cd when i can pick up the family stone second album for two pound yeah i'm a couple of months away from hearing raising help by run dmc and everything changing but i do remember having my first of many Walkmans round about this time. So yeah, just a period of isolation.
Starting point is 00:42:50 Should have been a Smiths fan, really, but I couldn't fucking stand Morrissey. I just can't see it, man. I just cannot see that at all. So, Pop Craze Youngsters, you know how we go about at this point of the episode. We retreat to the crap room and rip open a box or two and pull out an example of the music press from this very week.
Starting point is 00:43:10 And this time we've gone for the NME, 19th of April, 1986. Would you care to riffle along with me, me dears? Go on then. On the cover, test department. In the news, the big story this week is that jerry dammers and dale tambo the son of anc leader oliver tambo are poised to launch artists against apartheid with quote one of the most impressive lineups seen since band-aid damas tells the enemy that various big concerts and a benefit record are being planned and in light of the government's failure to do so we hope to encourage individuals
Starting point is 00:43:53 to impose their own sanctions for example stop trading with fascists tambo adds that members of artists against apartheid will not play sun city but they will go and play in a free, non-racial South Africa and be welcomed not only as artists, but also as fellow freedom fighters. Among those fellow freedom fighters who have expressed an interest are Simon Le Bon, The Fall, Hugh Masekela, Billy Ocean, The Pog pogues junior gizcom and harry bella fonte a big shift this year i think politically in terms of people getting into the anti-apartheid movement um you know because obviously in 1985 bob geldof had sorted out world hunger yeah and you know frankie goes to hollywood had sorted out nuclear war so so yeah this this was
Starting point is 00:44:46 definitely the the thing of this year knob smelled off isn't completely edged out of this week's do-gooding news however he's made an appearance for a slap-up lunch at the hard rock cafe in covent garden to give his blessing to the launch of stars by hearing aid 39 of metal's heaviest mothers have taken time off from their normal pursuit of dipping their dorks into the steaming entrails of freshly slaughtered goat in order to make their contribution to the usa for africa foundation reports matt snow as paparazzi flashed and french fries flew saint Bob pronounced benediction upon the project while disclaiming any credit for it. Most of that goes to Mistoffelees lookalike Ronnie James Dio, who initiated the enterprise and penned the song. Many of the project's contributors are there,
Starting point is 00:45:41 including Ted Nugent, Yngingui molstein and members of do judas priest iron maiden quiet riot motley crew twisted sister queens reich wasp and of course spinal tap also in attendance is quote radio, Radio 1 firebrand Simon Bates. Commendable Rock's continued fundraising efforts on the grounds that the Scrooge regimes of the West would be squealing with renewed embarrassment, having hoped the fad would die down. Oh, you see, they are caring, considerate persons, not just thrash metal fans. I've never heard that. it any good new oh it's crap no it's rubbish it's rubbish don't bother i mean even sophia who loves all of those names
Starting point is 00:46:31 that you just mentioned uh yeah don't go for it it's no good the thing is every one of the people involved in that could legitimately do that tonight thank god it's them instead of you lying oh they must have been fighting over it. In gig news, the Beastie Boys have had to drop out of their support act on the big Audio Dynamite tour because they've all caught colds. Pete Shelley is back on the road after a long post-Buzzcocks absence.
Starting point is 00:46:58 Doctor and the Medics kick off their new Messiahs tour to coincide with the release of their new single, a cover of Norman Greenbaum's Spirit in the Sky, and there's new national tours from A-Ha, America's rudest rock act, the Butthole Surfers, Ray Charles, Patti LaBelle, Pauline Murray, In Excess, Sonic Youth, The Go-Betweens, The Mission, and Queen. It's a mere week before the Smiths release their new LP, The Queen Is Dead,
Starting point is 00:47:29 but the big Smiths news this week is that bassist Andy Rourke has fucked off out of it. His replacement is Craig Gannon, one-time member of Aztec Camera and well-known session musician, says the NME, promising that on the 20th of May, the Smiths will play the whistle test live, featuring their new line-up and songs from the new LP. Shame they couldn't have got rid of the frontman, really, but
Starting point is 00:47:56 never mind. Finally, under the headline, wash these scum off the streets, we're informed that a new police training manual issued by California Union City Police Department has punk rock and heavy metal firmly in its sights.
Starting point is 00:48:11 The manual, entitled Punk Rock and Heavy Metal, The Problem One Solution, lists Van Halen, Rush, Husker Du, Ozzy Osbourne and Wasp as deserving of censorship, claiming that suchans are likely to be used as a form of rebellion against the government
Starting point is 00:48:30 the manual which those friendly neighbourhood union city cops recommend should be given to any parent having problems with their rock and rolling offspring also cites publications as cream and hit parader as the mind camp of the new generation likening rock activity to that of adolf hickler's brown shirts no wonder debbie harry had those union city blues quips fred della imagine being in an american heavy metal band and not being
Starting point is 00:49:02 listed in that manual you'd be well oh man the kids only want to rock wasp fucking i've so been trying to play me wasp of late oh really it's not gone well in the interview section well billy bragg has just returned from a tour of east germany organized by the youth section of the local communist party and he's keen to tell danny kelly all about it it turns out the tour was instigated after brag was approached in the toilets at a folk club in edinburgh and asked to play east berlin's 16th political songs festival oh that old fucking chestnut i followed a very western looking gent accompanying five or six singers on the piano he reveals they did this real bouncy flouncy number like bucks fizz or brotherhood of man
Starting point is 00:49:54 and i was thinking i i the commie vision song contest but later i heard their song translated and the verses were entirely composed of the text of mikhail gorbachev speech promising to rid the world of nuclear weapons by the year 2000 fantastic yeah less embarrassing probably than sexuality by billy bragg which is a song i still can't listen to meanwhile paisley park act like sheila re is in town to promote a love bazaar, which results in a sit-down with Gavin Martin. She immediately gets all giggly when asked if the song, about having it off in a limo and on a bed of flowers, is autobiographical, and stresses that she's never had it off with Prince, and they've only been friends. The rest of the interview shuts down quickly, especially when Martin asks her,
Starting point is 00:50:44 The rest of the interview shuts down quickly, especially when Martin asks her, what do you dislike most about America? Sheila gives me an incredulous, quavering look. Dislike about America? That's what I said. Nothing? Oh, come on. No, I like America. There must be something. i like everything people some of them must annoy you says martin no i like everyone blissfully bland in the all-american state of grace is celebrity sheila's e may be for excitement electric and effervescent but look a little further and you'll find E is for empty-headed too,
Starting point is 00:51:25 writes Martin. Oh, a bit harsh. Yeah, a bit harsh. I mean, that really sounds like she's kind of like, there's a lot of things there and she feels like she can't say any of them. Not even, like, if she starts talking about how the hot dogs are bad,
Starting point is 00:51:39 then she'll just end up on a full-on rant about how extraordinarily racist it is. And she's not going to do that to gavin martin of the enemy at this time so you know and her brain just shorts out i don't know i'm just speculating maybe she maybe she did just like everything about america and you know it's like who the fuck are you you limey bastard david quantic has an equally confrontational chat with suzy sue and steve severin in a west end tea room about the new banshees album tinderbox suzy is looking at me very politely severin is looking at a teapot
Starting point is 00:52:14 i've just told them that i think tinderbox is an album whose only distinguishing mark is that it sounds like suzy and the banshees and it has no thrill or excitement to it that kind of argument doesn't really penetrate because it's been said of every album since the scream says suzy before quantic accuses the band of being afraid to take risks severin raises his eyes above teapot level it's just basically an album of really strong songs and that's all we wanted to do as opposed to being the banshees zooming off in one direction or another it was all done to be one complete overall album okay so you've made a nice complete album a nice complete staid unadventurous album that's incredibly same says quantum people say you're
Starting point is 00:53:07 all dried up severing gives me one of the most extraordinary looks i will ever see suze just smiles at me pityingly there's a lot of spikiness isn't there it's very spiky have you ever done an interview where you basically started it by saying well you're shit aren't you? What the fuck? Your latest album's fucking cat shit, mate. As an opening interview gambit, I mean, I don't have the bravery to do that kind of thing. It's kind of revealing in a sense that the story with these bands has gone. They've come up and now they're just other bands, you know,
Starting point is 00:53:38 just bringing albums out just like every other band. And it's kind of, there's nothing to snag. So yeah, a lot of these interviews seem to be getting a bit spiky. I mean, I would just have died. I would have just, like, well, Sarah, go in there. And, I mean, to be fair, no one ever told me to, like, go in there and, you know, say, yeah, what have you got to say for yourself? This album ain't all that, is it, really?
Starting point is 00:53:58 What do you think you're doing? Are you pop stars or what? And I could not have done that. I would have just gone, I'm going to lie here on the floor quietly and die next to the bin. I just could i could not have done that i would just go and lie here on the floor quietly and die next to the bin i just i couldn't i couldn't have done it i think there's there's a way to do that and to to get a response but i don't know what response dave quantic would have expected here really i can't tell whether it's balls or just arrogance i mean i just would not be able to do that at all and i've been given advice by other journalists you know that if if somebody say dries up during an interview or they're not really giving you much you know get spiky get confrontational
Starting point is 00:54:29 start calling them shit but honestly if an interview is going badly for me that's it i'll just call it a day i'll lie and i'll say yeah i've got enough cheers would you even have been able to do that by the time you bowled along in the 90s oh i think i would have and i think there were people who did um when i when i started but i could never do that i mean because interviews just always terrified me anyway i always just wanted them to be a conversation that went okay so so this idea of starting an interview you know sitting down with a band and then your album saying your album's shit i mean i just don't have the cojones to do that i don't believe that know, you have to go in and kiss everyone's ass.
Starting point is 00:55:06 I ended up, one of the best features I ever did ended up being with the Cardigans because they were just knackered and just like, you know, and they've been going for long enough that they were just kind of tired in that very particular way, which I sort of encapsulate a bit, just like the ennui of the long-term band, I suppose,
Starting point is 00:55:21 which is an experience that is really common. Just like, yeah, what are we... They're tired of talking about themselves. That was the reason why I didn't like doing interviews a lot of the time is because I was poking people to go, go on, be enthusiastic. Trying to get people to be enthusiastic when they're just really tired.
Starting point is 00:55:37 And they've said all this stuff before. And it's like, oh. So it can be so joyless. I mean, I don't want to be ungrateful. I met some great people, but not under the best circumstances you know and for fuck's sake they put a new album up they haven't fucking shut down libraries or something they're not politicians the confrontational interview is
Starting point is 00:55:56 i don't know it kind of sometimes it works if he's stephen wells then it's fucking great but yeah other people it's just like oh don, don't goad them, mate. Just, I don't know, take them to Legoland or something. Oh, fucking hell. Don't fucking say that out. But no, I mean, the thing is with confrontational interviews like this, I agree completely. Swells was amazing at them.
Starting point is 00:56:19 But with things like this, bands are just going to go into that default mode of defending themselves. And they're going to say the same stuff, really. Whereas perhaps suggesting in an interview in a kind of vaguely positive question that, oh, you know, you're running out of ideas. I mean, there's ways of doing it without, you know, pointing fingers, if you like. And I think you can let bands hang themselves a little bit more than you having to sort of swing the noose. When I used to advise people about giving interviews and stuff i'd always say well yeah it's all right to say well what's the point of this why would anyone be interested in this
Starting point is 00:56:50 and they'd say you can't say that it'll offend them and say no no no you're giving them a full toss that they can just whack out of the fucking cricket ground it's just a good way of getting people to say this is what i believe in and this is what I've done. But sometimes it doesn't work. Susie's not going to respond to that, is she? No. I mean, ultimately, you're absolutely right. The most important question, really,
Starting point is 00:57:15 to ask anyone that you're interviewing is, why are you doing this? There's ways of getting to that. I mean, starting off an interview with your new album, Shite, yeah, that's not really going to go anywhere. No, it's not. Simon Witter links up with george clinton about his new lp r&b skeletons in the closet and how committed he is to remaining a creative nuisance while revealing that he's been working with sly stone prince and vanessa williams and ensuring that the covers of new P-Funk releases will give you bathroom reading
Starting point is 00:57:46 for the next month. But I may have to draw something new. What with all this Reagan Gaddafi bullshit. In a tedious Bieber cop feature, cover stars test department tell Neil's current editor that their new Ministry
Starting point is 00:58:02 of Power show slash happening is an attack on the complete mediocrity we see around us maybe 50 years from now people will look back on this time and all they'll see is an endless repetition of the same program the same bleach musicians playing the same instruments and following the same patterns or nearly 35 years and he's kind of right isn't he yeah yeah it's odd that test department are on the cover to be honest with you this isn't for the enemy this is the sort of thing that melody maker would absolutely start doing in about 87 just putting weird bands on the cover but it's odd for enemy to do this and in the
Starting point is 00:58:41 thrill section there's a small interview with jack Brown, who feels the need to tell the enemy about his current political inclinations. Brown tells John McCready that his appetite for endless introspection has diminished somewhat and snarls. Fuck it. US policy in Central America is fundamentally dishonorable. Reagan is making it all up. The CIA are tapping my phone, and they're the richest terrorist organisation in the world. Blimey, who'd have thunk it?
Starting point is 00:59:14 Singles reviews. Well, in the chair this week is reggae correspondent Penny Real. So naturally, she commences by sifting through the slew of Jamaican releases that are cashing in on supercats pioneering boops cuts which uses the highly popular techniques rhythm not getting into it sarah you win what hang on am i i was i thought about this the other day and it's like because i know i'm gonna pronounce it but like, am I any whiter than you really? No.
Starting point is 00:59:49 If you're going to rank the chart music crew in order of whiteness. These include Sugar Minots as John Boops, Michael Proffitts, no call me John Boops, Anthony Red Rosa's me no want noops king kong's don't touch my boops and junie ranks as cry for me boops the term boops apparently refers to the kind of man sweet on the ladies she helpfully points out sadly they missed out on boops upside your head these boops were made for walking. And boops, I did it again.
Starting point is 01:00:30 There's a cluster of singles released by women this week. So Real naturally lumps them all together under the heading, Let's talk it over in the ladies room. Another Day Comes by Kiki D is dismissed as an ugly, monotonous and cliche-ridden dirge with a nod in the direction of Eurythmics, performed with what Kiki D probably likes to think of as passion or a prolonged screech to you and me. Live to Tell by Madonna gets equally short shrift. The lure of diminishing return sets in as the singer's thin, sulky
Starting point is 01:01:08 voice fails to rescue a ponderous ballad from Ignamonet. And bangles commit the cardinal error when the song goes on too long with if she knew what she wants. I fucking hate Live to Tell. Do you? Yeah. You hate Madonna?
Starting point is 01:01:24 When I was bunking up in my bedroom, I used to listen to Laser 558, and Live To Tell was on all the fucking time, and it's... It's very glum. Yes. It's a glum song. Squeezer's still knocking about,
Starting point is 01:01:35 and Real observes that their new single, King George Street, is like arriving in Greenwich on the number 54 bus on a rainy Saturday evening, having spent the previous couple of hours huddled along 3,000 other diehards inside Charlton Athletics' capacious stadium at the Valais. A somewhat specific reference, lad.
Starting point is 01:01:56 Billy Graham's going to heaven. The debut single by proto-House Martins The Larks is Canterbury speed rap notable for the line bring your money to QPR and the flip side Maggie Maggie Maggie which borrows a Led Zeppelin chorus to preach the wholly admirable sentiment Maggie Maggie
Starting point is 01:02:16 Maggie art art art your wildest dreams by the Moody Blues is vapid and silly Tongue Tied by Kenny Charles similarly embraces vapidity sometime before it ends. It's Just a Matter of Time by Glen Campbell lets cornball strings and production intrude to turn the whole thing into a piece of indigestible smoltz. Lost Some Blues by La Tentat is more of a whimper of distress than an actual song an apocalyptic
Starting point is 01:02:48 by twinks is sing along a metal that might find some adherence at a biker cafe on the a127 but real doubts even this yeah twinks is a heavy metal band name that's not aged well has it but i mean it's't, has it? But, I mean, it's telling, isn't it? Think about all these singles that Penny's writing about. If you looked at that singles page and somebody asked you, you know, what's going on in 86 then? I mean, this page is kind of like, yeah, what the fuck is going on?
Starting point is 01:03:20 It's just a load of sort of stuff with no centre to it, really. There doesn't feel like there's any sort of prevailing thing happening. Yeah, and there's a lot of avoiding of more chart friendly releases this week. I'll be bound. Yeah, probably. Yeah. I mean,
Starting point is 01:03:33 Penny had a real sort of reggae focus. I mean, I used to do the same when I did the singles. I just used to fill it full of hip hop. It was your one chance to have a say in an editorial direction in a sense. Spray your musk. Indeed, indeed. In the LP review section the
Starting point is 01:03:46 main review this week is given over to tinderbox by suzy and the banshees and kath carol is distinctly underwhelmed the band themselves apart from judging it brilliant see it as a coming together for the new look banshees as they break in new guitarist John Valentine Carruthers. This explains the overall impression of a group suspended in aspic. The tone of the album would suggest a group forging on in search of an inspirational oasis while surviving on unsatisfactory resources. When they get to the bottom, will they go back to the top let's hope so
Starting point is 01:04:27 the art of noise have put out their second lp invisible silence and is rewarded with a zany conceptual slagging from nick coleman sean of paul morley's wiggly words the Art of Noise are a slightly different proposition, writes Coleman. You see, I have made this amazing discovery. The Art of Noise's new LP only answers to the name Kevin. Call him Geraldine or Leopold or Glenn Hoddle or Mr. Art of Noise LP and all you'll get is a sullen round silence. But call him Kevin and he is yours forever. He's pretty undemanding, Kevin. Take him to see Absolute Beginners and he sits there quite unmoved in his nice jacket.
Starting point is 01:05:15 Ask him to show you his nipples and all you get is a round black stare. Kevin is the beast, the apocalypse, the collective unconsciousness He is not a rock star Although he would never admit it, his favourite TV programme is Tomorrow's World And he delights in the notion that in the 21st century, scientists say All music will be constructed in this way
Starting point is 01:05:41 Really, Kevin is a boring, pretentious little little git but and i'll tell you this for nothing he does make my stereo sound bloody expensive cool how we've moved on since this is a toe tapper that will get the brain working there are no new kevins being made you know there's no new kevin no lots of new joshes but no new kevin are we post kevin we're fully in the post kevin era no definitely talking of bland non-pop star names danny kelly has got hold of slang tang by wayne smith which is finally out over here on green sleeves among his contemporaries and rivals he must have been well to the rear of the queue for names. By comparison with Tenor Saw, Nitty Gritty and Coco T, Wayne Smith sounds like a cackle-browed Division 3 centre-forward.
Starting point is 01:06:37 Pleasant enough, but too familiar to shock you a shock, too homogenous to sting you a sting, Slang Tang is very much a case of too little too late what danny kelly didn't know then but probably knows now because he's well into his reggae that wayne isn't even his real name it's his real name his real name is ian smith which no reggae artist is going to use even in 1986 1986. No, no. He might as well have called himself Eugene Terrablanche. He is, hasn't he? Vic Goddard's debut solo LP, T-R-O-U-B-L-E, which he recorded two years ago with the jazz band Working Week,
Starting point is 01:07:17 has finally been picked up and put out by rough trade, and the legend has trouble of his own in understanding why it has about as much to do with the noisy guitars immaculate out of tune vocals and harsh pop tones of subway sect as the new style council single has to do within the city matt snow while apparently singing the praises of Stop Pretending by L.A. girl band The Pandoras, still manages to call them These Broads. Says the record, farts and chews gum at one and the same time, and signs off with the line, Suck on that, Ziggy Ziggy Freudnik.
Starting point is 01:07:59 Circuses and bread by Durati Collum might be potentially damaging to the mental stability of tear 4 O and A level students who listen to this sort of stuff during their stress-filled study breaks, according to Donald McRae. And new Liverpool band High Five have a debut LP called Down In The No Go, but Mick Sinclair doesn't reckon it, or them. I doubt that the High Five really lack a sense of purpose, but there is no evidence of it here. They seem to take half an hour to say very little, and make recording an LP sound like a dull chore, rather than an adventure or a challenge,
Starting point is 01:08:39 veiling virtually everything in lukewarm rhythm guitar dabs, and generally uninspired playing oh straight to the record shop we go pop craze youngsters indeed indeed nice to see the legend in there my future editor yeah and uh teaching colleague as it goes really yeah it's jerry isn't it it's jerry thackery everett trip trip legend that's where he started is this self-declared subplique oh yeah i mean he bought that single on creation didn't he under that name of the legend he occasionally cycles back to it amongst these many personas yeah he was just up the road for me on sunday playing the songs of the fall on the piano at the walthamstow trades hall and i hear it went well yeah my friend went the gig guide, well, David could have seen fine young cannibals at the Town and Country Club,
Starting point is 01:09:29 Depeche Mode at Wembley Arena, James Brown at Wembley Arena, the Godfathers at the Marquee, Gino Washington and the Ram Jam Band at Brentford Red Lion, or then Jericho at the 100 Club. That ain't right. Then Jericho at the 100 Club. That ain't right. Then Jericho at the 100 Club. Fuck that.
Starting point is 01:09:47 What do you mean? Fuck that because the 100 Club's too small? No, because the 100 Club, you just think, oh, punk and all that kind of stuff. Then Jericho, not allowed to go there. I'm just imagining David's face watching then Jericho. Jen-ther-ico. Jen-ther-ico. There's the tribute band, isn't there?
Starting point is 01:10:05 Taylor could have treated himself to Jennifer Rush at Birmingham Odeon, Spaceman 3 at the Birmingham Mermaid, Big Audio Dynamite at Birmingham Portland, or trekked out to the lair of the Wolfroonians to see horrendous shirts at Wolverhampton Cleveland Arms. Neil could have seen Salem Foundations at Coventry Red House, FM at the General Wolf,
Starting point is 01:10:31 the Go-Betweens at Cof Polle, and fuck all else. City of culture. Sarah could have seen Big Country at Sheffield Town Hall or Pulp at Leeds Adelphia, but would probably be best off checking out Bingo Reg
Starting point is 01:10:45 and the Screaming Genies, backed by stuttering Jack and the Heart Attack down at Chesterfield top rank. My faves. Al could also have seen Big Country at Nottingham Concert Hall, the Redskins at Chivago's, Twisted Sister at Nottingham Concert Hall, the Blown Monkeys at Rock City and
Starting point is 01:11:06 Wound Up The Week with Big Audio Dynamite also at Rock City I can't remember seeing the Redskins at Zhivago's Yeah Zhivago's was the right fucking Gary and Sharon place Certainly not the place that the Redskins would have been at. Used to be a venue
Starting point is 01:11:22 Little Richard played there in 1972 Blimey Yeah it's now a Taco Bell the Redskins would have been at. Used to be a venue. Little Richard played there in 1972. Blimey. Yeah, it's now a Taco Bell. And Simon could have seen the temptations at Cardiff St. David's Hall, Attila the stockbroker at Keffen Coed Rugby Club in Merthyr Tydfil, and wound up a thrilling week of pop intensity
Starting point is 01:11:40 watching Shirley Bass's two-night residence air at Cardiff St. David's Hall. In the letters page, well, Stephen Wells has drawn the short straw this week, and the main topic of conversation is the piece about the Redskins having a lovely time in Moscow in a recent issue. But Ernst Vestergaard of Exeter is not impressed. It's blasé and flippant for the Redskins to say that they are aware and conscious of their philosophical weakness, but they seem to ignore this and blunder on. Exactly what form of corrupted Marxism are they peddling? I use the term corrupted Marxism as I believe that this is what the Redskins represent.
Starting point is 01:12:27 Surely the reason the Redskins have to play gigs in the middle of nowhere is because they have become another band to be manipulated and exploited by the music industry. They have become the cliches that they so obviously despise. Apparently the Redskins have been on the verge of packing it in, yet they haven't. Why not? Because they still enjoy preaching to the converted despite their awareness of their political confusion and negation. Is that why?
Starting point is 01:12:58 Where were you in 1917, Christine? Yeah, where was David Stubbs when the rainforests were burning as well? That still needs to be answered. DMP from Manchester joins the pile-on when he writes, Can we take them seriously? I suspect not. From where this punter stands,
Starting point is 01:13:22 behind the short hair and Diana Ross sing-song, lies nothing but regurgitated cliches and cast-off Weller and Bragg lyrics. Do music and politics mix? Yes, when done with a bit of imagination. Something the Redskins probably don't seem to think matters these days. But to your average punter, take it from me, it does. Oh, poor Redskins man you can you can sort of hear the the immense rustling of a lot of black cardigans in this letter's page the other thing in the previous issue that got on readers tits a feature on the federation of conservative students is commented on by Pete Ellis of Glasgow under
Starting point is 01:14:06 the headline Hooray Hitlers. Pleasant reading the piece on young Tories. What a joy to read the absolute shite coming from these posers. Nice to know that while the NUS and Labour clubs are trying to fight racism these wankers are fighting other students. Any attempt that's made to restrict the working class should be fought every inch of the way, beginning with organisations like the FCS, whose views and racist ideas should be stomped out. Fred Titmuss would be appalled. After reading Annie Mahota's FCS article
Starting point is 01:14:43 in the April 5th issue of of nme i pondered this question why are there not so many musicians who are outwardly right wing and or racist says cj cunningham from manchester i can tell you why because the roots of 90 of pop music originated from foreign styles not only boe he's not racist but screwdrivers oi music and derivative forms of r&b stuff the fcs and their pseudo anarchist crap because this is useless and only keeps the money and power in the hands who have always had it just waiting for noel gallagher yes speaking of oi in 1980 fucking six tim from red action under fives kilburn nips in to correct some prejudices about the genre every time i pick up a music paper which isn't very often i find little of interest to read what i find more
Starting point is 01:15:42 upsetting is the middle class snobbery towards different types of music i personally like and have been into oi since the days of sham menace and the ruts before all the oi the bank balance stuff does that make me a nazi fuck no sure there are nf elements on the oi scene but to pay them attention and ignore the rest of it is an insult to all the committed socialists on the scene. And by that I mean raving commies and not national socialists, end air quotes. It's been left-wing punk skins and herberts who have stood up to the front at gigs. Where are all you trendy lefties then? So what if the so-called godfather of OI is a scab bastard? That's no reason to slug off OI as a whole. There was OI before Bushel,
Starting point is 01:16:33 and there will be OI after him. During the Miners' strike, Red Action organised a victory to the Miners' tour, and it was predominantly punk and skin bands that played also me and my mates have been involved with things like anti-fascist action you don't have to be a student to be a socialist to smear all oysters as nazis is an insult and just shows you up for the narrow-minded bastards you are the way that starts you know that that every time I pick up some music paper, which isn't very often. Yes. That's such a, I mean,
Starting point is 01:17:08 that's a Twitter thing almost, isn't it? You know, here's how unoffended I am by this thing that you've written. Yeah, TLDR. One of the recent topics of conversation in Gasbag, King Kurt and their alleged onstage animal abuse raises its ugly head once again. I would like to reply to the two concerned King Kurt groupies from Essex.
Starting point is 01:17:32 You state Kurt do not and have never thrown live or dead animals about on stage. Well, frankly, that's bollocks, writes one of the Cheeman Sutton ex-Kurt crew. I myself saw Kurt at least a dozen times at the 100 Club when they were still a support band and it was not uncommon for the odd rabbit corpse to suddenly appear in mid-air. Ask the band about their early performances. Ask Rory about the dead cat he kept in his freezer.
Starting point is 01:18:01 And where did the pig's head come from? And finally, in more you-can't that anymore news john crowley of south arrow is furious with the enemy for printing something he doesn't agree with last week you printed a letter from an ulster unionist exclamation mark i know that you're trying to be anti-trender and printing a letter from an orange man is anti-trender because the IRA have always been a very fashionable organisation to support. But printing correspondence from one of those reactionary swines is just ridiculous as well as boring. Publications such as yours should be pro-IRA. Yours, with Margaret Thatcher and the Queen's death very much in mind,
Starting point is 01:18:51 John Crowley of South Harrow. Blimey. 52 pages, 45p. I never knew there was so little decent fucking music in it. God, what a time to be a music journo, 1986. Poor bastards. Thin pickings, isn't it? The NME are firmly into their ignore the charts at all times policy,
Starting point is 01:19:13 and it's not working, is it? It's not working, because they're just going to end up with Suzy on the cover every three months, The Cure on the cover every three months, and they're just going to be completely beholden beholden to the the cycle of the music industry um yeah you know um but it says a lot about 86 in fact that this issue is so thin although that letter about king kurt did remind me of hans moretti the freaky magician on the paul daniel show used to chuck alligators about so that was a nice memory live ones yeah yeah Yeah, yeah. He got massive complaints about them.
Starting point is 01:19:45 What, juggle them? Yeah, no, he hypnotised them. Right. And then he'd start sort of swinging them around and there were massive complaints on Points of View the following week. I can imagine. Because it was animal cruelty.
Starting point is 01:19:55 He was a really disturbing magician, Hans Moretti. He used to do things that were just frankly not suitable for Paul Daniels' slot. I remember he did a thing where he, me and my sister were watching it and um he came on and he got a knife out and just started stabbing himself in his arm and all his blood came flying out me and my sister were like what the fuck um this was like 7 30 on a saturday you know and i think he got complaints about that but he kept on and getting invited
Starting point is 01:20:20 back maybe he hypnotized them well exactly yeah and started swinging them around probably kept being invited back to paul daniels's sex dungeon as well yeah he was part magician kind of part at least a crowley type figure he was a bit disturbing lovely but yeah 52 pages enemy i mean it's thin as fuck isn't it and there's not much in it so what was on telly today well bbc one kicks off at six in the morning with a 50-minute CFAX data blast, and then Frank Boff nips out of his sex dungeon to join Debbie Greenwood for breakfast time. At 20 past nine, it's another CFAX data blast,
Starting point is 01:20:57 then play school, then a 40-minute CFAX data blast, the afternoon news, and regional news in your area. Pebble Mill at One offers sewing advice, a musical tribute to Brighton and celebrates the last ever episode of Pop Black. Then it's Hokey Cokey with Carol Chell and Don Spencer, then Racing from Cheltenham and they close down for 12 minutes before roaring back with regional news in your area. Then Floella Benjamin climbs out of her dustbin and travels back in time to the era of knights and damsels in distress in Leon V, followed by Laurel and Hardy getting involved with the American Civil War with Southern Hospitality.
Starting point is 01:21:41 Johnny Briggs attempts to win the school rabbit for the holidays hopefully not give it to king kurt ulysses 31's annoying kids accidentally traveled 5 000 years back in time then it's john craven's news round and simon groom manages to get his 1965 jaguar done up into a racing car at silverstone on our licence fee in Blue Peter. Robbie Vincent and Angharad Meir force some nans to do some aerobics in the Keep Fit show Go For It, followed by the news at six, and they've just finished regional news in your area. BBC Two commences at five to seven with some throbbing open university action and then closes down for an hour and 40 minutes
Starting point is 01:22:26 before coming back with a five-hour CFAX mega blast. At 2pm, it's the British premiere of Le Fin du Jour, the 1939 French film about a retirement home for actors that's fallen into disrepair. Then it's Show Business, the 1944 Eddie Cantor musical about the Ziegfeld Follies, followed by A New Summer Air, then a repeat of the 40 Minutes documentary Johnny Oddball,
Starting point is 01:22:55 the follow-up to the 1975 documentary Minnair about an 11-year-old serial arsonist who was incarcerated in an assessment centre. Then it's Young Musician of the Year and they're currently showing Discovering Birds with Tony Soper. ITV opens up at a quarter past six with Good Morning Britain with Claire Rayner having a good snuffle around the subject of underage sex. Then it's regional news in your area, followed by the abominable Snowman, the 1957 Peter Cushing film about the titular Yeti.
Starting point is 01:23:30 Then some cartoons. After a repeat of Fireball XL5, it's about Britain, ragged dolls, Puddle Lane and the Sullivans, followed by News at One and regional news in your area. After the drama series Hotel, Shaking Crossroads, it's Home Cookery Club, Daytime, University Challenge,
Starting point is 01:23:53 even more regional news in your area, and Sons and Daughters, the show where some Australians realise that love is very strange, as it can come and go. It can also happen when you're young or old, don't you know? So I hear. After a repeat of this morning's Raggy Dolls, it's James the Cat, Basil's
Starting point is 01:24:14 Joke Machine, starring the vulpine BBC refugee with the felt teeth, then Bellamy's Bugle, a repeat of Supergran and Connections, the quiz show they used to bung on whenever blockbusters were on there with Sue Robbie. After the news at 5.45 and even more regional news in your area,
Starting point is 01:24:34 Cath Fellows disgraces herself at the Hathaways in Crossroads and they've just started Emmerdale Farm, where Joe Sugden and Tubby Turner fight like rats in a bag for the top job at North Yorkshire Estates. Channel 4 has its usual doss in bed until 2.15 when they bring us the thrills and excitement from the House of Lords yesterday in their Lordship's house.
Starting point is 01:25:01 Then it's two hours of racing from Newmarket, then Countdown, then it's This hours of racing from new market then countdown then it's this england the 1941 propaganda film about an american tourist who visits the village of cleveland and discovers how many times its residents told foreign invaders to fuck off after that it's the documentary's autobiography of a jeep and to the shores of iwo jima and they've just started channel 4 news anything jumping out there me days well mostly i'm thinking of you stuck at home bunking off yeah and this is what you've got man no wonder you were fucking depressed i know fucking ramble into it nothing really jumping out but i do now have the theme from sons and
Starting point is 01:25:42 daughters in my head probably for the rest of the day, so thanks for that. Well, me dears, I do believe that a table has been laid for the feast of of fucking, yeah. Yeah. You hate 86 so much you can't even talk about it.
Starting point is 01:26:00 And we're going to attack it tomorrow in the second part of this thrilling odyssey into an April 1986 episode of Top of the Pops. So we're going to leave it there. We'll come back tomorrow. Thank you, Neil Kulkarni. No worries. God bless you, Sarah B.
Starting point is 01:26:17 God bless you, Al. My name's Al Needham, and I really need you to stay pop crazed. Chart music. This is the first radio ad you can smell. The new Cinnabon pull-apart only at Wendy's. It's ooey gooey and just five bucks with a small coffee all day long. Taxes extra at participating Wendy's until May 5 ooey, gooey, and just five bucks with a small coffee all day long.
Starting point is 01:26:45 Taxes extra at participating Wendy's until May 5th. Terms and conditions apply.

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