Crime in Sports - #405 - Many Beatings & One Gunshot - Joe Pepitone - Part 1

Episode Date: April 23, 2024

This week, we start a wild tale, featuring one of the biggest characters in baseball history! In this part, we hear more stories of fighting, and violence, than in any other 10 episodes, put together, with most of it directed at Joe. Whether it's his Dad, fighting whole neighborhoods, or Joe, being in gang fights, or getting shot at school... it's all crazy, all the time! Also, what could make a teenage girl, stay naked, on a fire escape, during a rain storm? Find out!!Get beat up, for getting beat up, get shot in high school, after shop class, and get away from it all by signing with the New York Yankees with Joe Pepitone!!Check us out, every Tuesday!We will continue to bring you the biggest idiots in sports history!! Hosted by James Pietragallo & Jimmie Whisman Donate at... patreon.com/crimeinsports or with paypal.com using our email: [e-mail] Get all the CIS & STM merch at crimeinsports.threadless.com Go to shutupandgivememurder.com for all things CIS & STM!!  Contact us on... twitter.com/crimeinsports [e-mail] facebook.com/Crimeinsports instagram.com/smalltownmurderSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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you when you start your free trial at audible.ca. What if you married the love of your life and then stood by them as they developed 21 new identities. What would you do? This is Actually Happening is a weekly podcast that features extraordinary true stories of life-changing events, told by the people who lived them. Listen to the newest season of This is Actually Happening on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello everybody and welcome back to Crime in Sports! Yay! Oh yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. Hello everybody and welcome back to Crime in Sports.

Yay! Oh, yay indeed, Jimmy. Yay indeed. My name is James Petragallo. I'm here with my co-host. I'm Jimmy Wissman. Thank you folks so much for joining us today. We're jacked today.

We are. We're in a good mood. We're ready to roll and we have some serious fun here today. This is just, in a man's own words for the most part, so much debauchery and violence and craziness. It's so much fun. We'll get to all that. First of all, shut up and give me murder.com.

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they get? You get it all. You get it all. Here we go for this week for crime and sports. We're going to talk about the whole Otani gambling debacle. Oh, shit! They just said, oh yeah, no, it's the interpreter, don't worry about it, yeah, oh, there he goes, yeah, he's playing real well now. They, that is the quickest sweep. I need to know so much more, yeah. Oh, he's saving the league on a global basis, so don't bother with that.

It wasn't like Pete Rose was in the league for 20 years already and we were about to shuffle him out anyway. This is a totally different story and other gambling incidents that are not Pete Rose also. We're gonna talk about some fun stuff from the 60s with some mafia stuff and some stuff like that. And then for small town murder this is gonna be fun. We're gonna talk about, we're gonna dive down some conspiracy holes here and we are gonna talk about A, was Charles Manson a CIA

asset? Was this all done on purpose? Okay, that's number one. And then we're gonna talk about also other CIA related murder things that you wouldn't think of. So it's gonna be fun stuff. Yeah, total conspiracy craziness we'll talk about there. Can't wait. Patreon.com slash crime in sports is where you get all of that.

And you get a shout out at the end of the regular show, this show as well. And Jamil mispronounced your name. That said, let's get to it with our guy of the week here Do it let's do it. It's a pies on this week. Oh, yeah It's a below It's if you're a Yankee fan, especially if you're like a New York Yankee fan And especially especially if you're like an Italian New York Yankee fan, you love Joe Pepitone. You just love him

You know exactly what I'm talking about now, right? Yeah I love him. You know exactly what I'm talking about now, right? Before the show I said I gotta stop myself from doing a J.B. Smoove impression every 12 seconds during this episode. Jimmy said, what do you mean? And I go, you'll know as soon as I say his name. You'll want to say Joe Pepitone up with this motherfucker because Larry David wore, it was a whole episode about this Joe Pepitone jersey that he had.

The number 25 Yankees jersey. It's fucking hilarious. So god damn it. JB Smoove is the luckiest man alive too. I love him fucking hilarious. He's so great. He's not just he's not lucky. He's funny.

No, no. I mean, he's lucky that he landed the perfect spot. Yes. He gets Larry David on his show. His perfect being himself. It's so great. No, those two are the best odd couple of all time TV like I when you talk about an odd couple. They're the oddest couple their conversations are great. It's very funny So I've always ever since his first episode

I was like, oh this is magic with these two these two and it's so funny So funny a genius that Larry recognized how great it is that he would have somebody like JB as his fucking odd I'm gonna play off of him. It's beautiful. It's perfect. It's beautiful. It's fucking gorgeous. So that whole first season he was on there with his family, the whole, it was great.

Larry and the blacks with the fucking cards. He just sticks around. It's great. So Joseph Anthony Pepitone we're talking about here. Joe Pepitone, he's a classic all-time Yankee because when there's an Italian Yankee, it's a whole other level of love from the Italian fans. They go crazy.

It's like, it's hard to explain exactly how much they would prop somebody up of that community on a Yankee, or even the Mets, but Yankees especially. So Joe is born October 9th 1940. Born and raised Brooklyn guy we'll talk about. He's from parks. Grew up in Park Slope. Yeah that's his book is amazing because it's just talking about growing up in the 40s and 50s in Brooklyn and it's fucking amazing.

It's just great. Wonderful stuff here. We'll talk all about him. A lot of this will come from the book called Joe, You Could Have Made Us Proud. That's the call. Joe, you could have made us proud. And that's his book that he wrote. Joe, you could have made us proud. And that's from an actual line from the book that somebody said to him. Really? Oh yeah, yeah. Oh that's so heartbreaking. He pulls no punches in this book. That's the

thing. Joe is one of these guys that will do anything for a laugh and he always did that his whole life and he's beloved by other players because he's, you could break his balls and he doesn't care and he, you could play pranks on him. He cracks up laughing and he plays pranks on you. He's just a fun, nice guy. You know, that's clubhouse guy, great clubhouse guy. And he's also, he's used to abuse too. So he doesn't really care as we'll talk about. His father's a psychopath. It's yeah, his father is Ignacio, Ignacio Pepitone. He goes by Willie though father is Ignacio, Ignacio Pepitone.

He goes by Willie though, William. Ignacio William. Yeah, Willie he goes by. Now Willie is a tough son of a bitch that we'll talk about. He was a gold gloves boxer when he was a teenager. And we're talking like he's born in 1917, Brooklyn his whole life. So this is like one of these old timey tough guys that talks like this See, you know what I mean? Like and he's just gonna always punching people. He's like a Looney Tunes character

He did a bunch of stuff. We'll talk about here. His mother is Angelina Teresa Pepitone, which is Yeah, my mom's Angela there's Angelina perfect. It's It's so perfect so I'm gonna read some stuff right from his book because it's in his own words and it's just the easiest way to do this because he's the only one who could really set this up. He says, quote, my father was a God in my eyes when I was growing up. His name was William Pepitone and he was called Willie Pep after the fighter.

But my father was bigger and a hell of a lot tougher than the former featherweight champion of the world. My father was six foot one inches tall, he weighed about 190 pounds and his muscular shoulders and chest sloped down to a 30 inch waist from working construction all his life. Unbelievable. He's just this specimen. He's just one of these guys that yeah, he lifts heavy things and he's got iron hands and he just beats the shit out of people all the time, including Joe. 30 inch waist, that's a skinny man at the waist, broad shoulders, he's got that V shit

hat. 6'1", one-ninth, yeah, he's a strong guy and a tough guy and we're talking, you know, Joe was born in 1940, so his dad was 23 at that time and then his dad's like in his prime as Joe's growing up really all through his life because his dad was 23 at that time. And then he, you know, his dad's like in his prime as Joe's growing up, really, all through his life, because his dad dies young too. So he never really gets out of his prime. Yeah. He said that he had been a Golden Gloves fighter, not a boxer as a kid.

He was a puncher who kept coming. And he did that all his life to the Rocky Marciano style. Yeah. Take two shots to give one. He was the toughest guy in my neighborhood. I saw him fight in the street at least 50 times. Imagine everybody out there seeing your dad be in 50 street fights. Imagine that. Just think about that. 50. One out of every 20 kids has a story about that time his dad got in a fight someone, not 50 times in the street.

That's crazy. That's your dad's a problem, right? Kind of. He said he never lost, never. And this was in a very tough neighborhood, Park Slope section of Brooklyn, a semi-slum that was populated almost entirely by Italian and Irish hard noses. He had a furious temper and when he wasn't spoiling the shit out of me, he was beating the shit out of me.

If we weren't smiling, we were screaming. We were screaming. No in between. There is an introduction to Willie, because we're gonna hear so many Willie stories, and it's wild, man. Joe talks about growing up in this time around here, too. He says, when you were born

and raised in the slums, you don't know any different until you get away from them and live other places for a while. I remember my early years away from Brooklyn, looking back on the conditions there from the vantage point of a nice plush residence and saying to myself, how the hell did I ever live there as a kid and grow up in such a place? Is that right? Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of people that think that. Yeah. In retrospect, when you see the shit or in hindsight, I don't know, but when you're walking through it and you see how bad it is, A, it could be worse now or B, it could

be better now and still even if it's better now and you still think how the fuck did we live here when it was worse than this. He said, how did I ever manage to get through it? How did I ever get out of there? I think back on three friends who has kids wanted to be priests who instead got into the racket business mob Which was this was the this is the breeding ground for the for the mafia, too This is I mean These are all Italian kids who are growing up where there's mafia stuff and those are the only people around that really have money You guys driving big Cadillacs and wearing expensive clothes are the fucking racket guys quote unquote and guys running numbers and all that kind of shit and that's what the kids look up to in the neighborhood.

Yeah because I don't want to eat like this, I don't want to live like this. You live like that how do you live like that? That looks awesome. Yeah you see them with like you know pretty ladies getting into nice cars when you're 12 and you see that you go yeah fuck my dad comes home filthy and tired every night. Yeah and then he fights in the street. And then he beats the shit out of everybody, including me and my mom. Within arm's reach. He said, into the racket business and ultimately into prison.

It could have happened to any of us and I realize in retrospect we all had to work out our escapes in our own ways. This is the 50s Brooklyn version of you got to either slinging crack rocker. You got a wicked jump shot It's the one of those things, you know, sure. That's what it is. So He said that he's got two younger brothers One is they call him Jimmy, but his name is Vincent because that's an Italian thing by the way, is it? Yes My stepmother's father is named Vincent and he Vincent and everybody called him Jim his whole life. What is that?

Yeah, like he was the mayor and on his beacon and on his placard things, whatever, campaign signs it said, Vincent Jim Frederick. That wasn't even his last name, he was Italian. They changed his last name to sound Irish. So there you go. Anyway, he lived, Jimmy lived a block and a half away with his aunt, which is weird. I don't understand that. Jimmy didn't grow up in the house even though it's his, even though he's the parents kid. And then he's also got a little brother named Billy. I guess the chant, the aunt was childless and wanted kids and they just were

like, we'll just give you Jimmy You could just have him and raise him. It's a block and a half away. He's in and out, you know But he it's weird because he ends up talking about how Jimmy ends up being much different than him and his other brother He says and he thinks not spending his formative years around Willie as much made him a different guy Yeah beneficial for him. Sure. Yeah, his brother ended up being a very square guy, an NYPD detective, very responsible family man.

He said he always had, you know, his lawn was cut perfect and his money was saved and he was like one of those kind of guys. He wasn't like a neighborhood knock around kind of a guy at all. He said, quote, if my father was hard on people who crossed him he was even harder on me it often seemed. I have two brothers, Jimmy who is a year and a half younger than I am and Billy who was six years younger than I am. So they just gave away the middle child. That's so weird. My father would tell me that I was responsible for them and that I had to

look out for them all the time. Quote, they come home hurt. He'd tell me you're going to get a beating. Understand? So you at you should have fixed this. Wow. Anybody fucks with his brothers out in the street. Joe's either got to, you know, make it right or his father's going to beat the shit out of him. Right. Right. He said, so Jimmy would get into a fight and come home with a bloody nose and my father would be waiting for me. I told you to look out for your brother, he'd yell, and without another word, no explanation, nothing, he'd beat the hell out of me with his fists, bloody my nose, leave bruises all over my face. Punched him in the face.

Oh, this wasn't like a smack on the ass. Oh my God. He just beat his kid senseless. That's... this was a different era, you know. And Jimmy... what's that saying? Willi's a fighter. He boxed us for Christ's sake. That's what I mean. A lot of these old Italian guys, you go, they seem kind of dumb when we had like, you know, the... what's it? Joe the Animal Barbosa and guys like that. But no, they've just had brain damage probably from getting the shit beaten out of them growing up. This is how you're growing up here.

He said, little Billy would fall off his bike and come home with a scraped up knee, and my father would just wail the shit out of me. He said, he's quote, but it wasn't my fault. I wasn't even there. And he'd say, you should have been. That's your problem. And he'd beat the shit out of him.

You just pointed out the issue. Yeah, he said, one time Billy hit a fire hydrant on his bike, flipped over the handlebars, smacked his head. I was there, Dad, I was right there. I just couldn't catch him. You should have caught him. Bang, crack. That's what he said.

Why didn't you? He's got to walk, have his arms out over him, helicoptering the whole time, making sure he doesn't get hurt to save his own ass. He's got to dive under these kids that just seem to be incredibly accident-prone. Bicycles are no good for those boys. No, every kid falls off. Every boy can think of like, or girl, I don't know if fucking no, can think of like three good spills you've had as a kid on a bike or a skateboard or something.

At least three good ones. One of them I was 16, James. Yeah, there you go That's how is damn near an adult for Christ's sake you should have been having car accidents at that age. That was it Well, thank God. I was here. I probably would have died for fuck's sake Jesus You're supposed to be running into people and doing dumb shit She did he also said according to my mother That's what my father wanted to do most as a kid, be a baseball player.

All he wanted to do was play baseball. He wasn't allowed. He said, but my grandfather or my father's father was from Sicily and he said baseball was a sissies game and if Willie played that, he'd beat the shit out of him good. So that's that. He said, you know, baseball, why you want to kiss guys? That's baseball's for girls. I'll beat the shit out of you if you play that game.

So that's where Willie came from. Baseball was considered too, you know, not even masculine enough. So what's the rest of the team doing while that one guy's at bat making out in the dugout? Is that what it is? They're in each other's assholes in the dugout. That's what they're doing. Those bats ain't dick shaped for no reason. Pat, let me tell you something.

It's all shielded from the crowd. So we can't see what you guys are doing in there. We know. They walk down that little tunnel. We know what happens. Guys are blowing each other in that tunnel. That's all it is. Use a bums.

Why is the manager on the phone calling for somebody else to get a blowjob because that was happening? Willie, quit getting a blowjob out there and come in here and pitch. So Willie is, in Willie's mind, he's like progressive as a dad. You know, like he's like a next generation type of dad. You know what I mean? Like at least I'm not calling you gay slurs.

For playing baseball, which all the other kids are doing. Here's a beating story for you. There's going to be a ton of beatings,, stories of his father beating the shit out of him, which are hilarious. Italians, one thing I'll give our whole genre here of people, we have a knack for telling stories of us getting beaten or having horrible things happen to us. Tragedy, we know how to make that funny for some reason.

We're very good at that. Making light of child abuse. It's so terrible funny stories about child abuse. The first stand up comedy I ever saw live was Italian Grandma and we would beg, tell us a beating story, Grandma, tell us a beating story and she would sit down and tell us a terrible story about horrible child abuse that someone would have inflicted upon her back in Italy of getting and we would roll on the floor laughing. My cousin Jesse and I on the floor,

oh my God, Jesus, my pow, boom, I fall down, she kicked me in the, and we're like, ha ha ha, because it was fucking hilarious, I don't know. Um, where do you get it? Why do you have a dark sense of humor? I don't know, that was my grandmother when I was six was telling me that shit and I was laughing, so you know that's where it comes from and you were crying right? I was crying yeah, that's funny Yeah, it's hilarious. Oh my god

What were you nine and your brothers were beating you with their fists because you didn't have the pasta ready at on time Holy shit, that's a real story Yeah, her father would just tell a couple of her brothers to take her outside and beat the shit out of her. Like it was some, take her outside, knock her around. And you know, that was it. They take her outside, beat the shit out of her. She come back in.

That was normal back then. The emotion that I feel when I see somebody getting hurt that doesn't deserve it. Oh, it's terrible. I don't like it at all. No, it's bad. But for some, if it happens to you don't like it at all. No hit my stomach. I don't like it It's bad. But for so if it happens to you, yeah, you can tell the story in a funny way It's just how like tell you I guess it's a bad shit the only time that pits not there is when I see a fight like a boxing match or a some sort of

Whatever battle whether it's UFC or whatever But when I when I see somebody that I believe shouldn't be fighting in this like oh, yeah, it's clearly overmatched you I don't like that either. I don't that doesn't hurt me. I enjoy that Oh that side over there knowing that I knew you shouldn't have been there and you didn't know how you deserve this beating I love a lot of times I blame because we talk about whenever we talk about fighters They have you know the tomato can guys and it's like I blame, because we talk about, whenever we talk about fighters, they have the tomato can guys and it's like. That guy is so bad for them.

That's what I mean. Like the promoter knew they couldn't win. Did they go to them and go, you're going to go in there and get the shit kicked out of you, right? Probably not. But it's 30 grand, so come on. That's what I mean. Yeah, the beating stories though can be so fucking funny.

They're really good. They're goddamn hilarious. He says, I remember one Sunday when I was eight years old going to my grandfather's with Willie. My mother had gone over earlier with my younger brothers and my dog. My grandfather kept telling me every time I'd go over there that he was going to kill the dog because it peed on his tomato plants out back and damaged them. What?

That's the other thing. These, they grew up in a different time. Human life has very little value You think animal life has value to these people as a chance everything you're getting it. I'll eat that fucking thing What are you doing? And that's exactly that's how they are honestly like it's my grandmother was the same way It was it's not she my aunt had a cat and she was like well kill that son of a bitch I'll eat it and blah blah blah. I really don't eat the cat. What are you talking? Dogs pee on things that's what they do wild so they can find that funny. He said um wow um

One day I kill that dog Joe. That's what he says Italian accent you can yeah for there I cook him which is exactly what I was here too. That's a playbook. I think from the old country He will be yeah, he said this day my dog wasn't there when I arrived. I got scared and went right to the oven. I opened the door and staring at me was a head with two shining eyes and a tongue hanging out like a dog cooking. My dog I screamed bursting into tears. Look what grandpa did to my dog.

He started freaking out. I grabbed the head and yanked it out of the, but it burned my hands and I dropped it on the floor He tried to save the dog You're gonna mouth the mouth it that he said my grandfather came running from the living room That's my copa Zell on the floor. He yelled I stand I started punching and kicking him. You killed my dog He said that's my cup of zeal. Sheep head. It's a sheep head.

It's not a dog head. The dog's in the bedroom. My father rushed in, saw me kicking my grandfather and knocked me to the floor, yanked me up and knocked me down again. Oh my God. It was a sheep's head. One of my grandfather's favorite meals. Eyes and all.

That's the other thing. They eat crazy shit these people from over there. My grandmother, whenever she'd have like a brother or sister over there, there'd be a pile of chicken feet on the table and they'd just eat them. Just feet. We're in America now. You don't have to do that. You're not hiding in a hole from the SS. Like, you don't need... There's a lot of... Yeah. There's plenty of the better part of the chicken. There's a grocery store. All of it. You can get any part you want. Please let me get you a different part to that chicken, Grandma.

I swear to God, I'll go to the store, I'll buy it. There's a much better part for you to be eating. That's not even on the shelf. You have to ask the guy for that and they're like, oh, we're going to throw them out. But I guess if you want them, that's crazy. We weren't even going to grind those into sausages. We were literally throwing them away. I guess if you crazy immigrants want it, here you go.

So yeah, he said, just then my mother Angelina, who was called Anne, came in with my dog on a leash. She'd been walking it. He was doing some exercise. Yeah, sorry. Willie, that's enough. She yelled at my father, who was still beating me. But she didn't step in to stop him.

She was as afraid of Willie as anyone else, fearing he'd turn his terrible temper on her. He never pulled his punches, left me black and blue and bloody, particularly as I got older. My mother, who never raised a hand to me, could do nothing about it. Some of the blood that was spilled out of me by Willie was her fault. She was always a very nervous person and she had a hysterectomy when I was 10, had to live on tranquilizers after that. Man, if I was two minutes late getting home at night she would put a pillow on the window sill and lean out looking for me. Oh my god. Joey! Joe! Where are you? Where are, Joe, have you seen Joey?

Where's my Joey? Screaming down four stories. God, fucking nightmare. It's so, anything could happen on the streets in the neighborhood, in that neighborhood. If you stepped out of your area into another neighborhood, you'd get beaten up. So she had reason to worry, but the more she worried,

the angrier my father got. I'd come home five minutes late and Willie would punch the shit out of me. Good Lord. Mom's all nervous. When I look back, I don't know how my mother was able to get through it with my father and me. All the crap we brought down on her. My father was such a jealous person that my mother could never really relax and be comfortable and enjoy herself in any kind of social setting. That's terrible.

He talks about even like her sister's husband, like she would, Willie would come over, why are you talking to him for? You know what I mean? Stuff like that. Yeah, he's real, real jealous. Here's a story about a man who beat up Joe's uncle. And Joe's uncle owned the apartment building they lived in. So he was all bloody and Joe's uncle came to Willie for help

and said, look what happened to me. So he ends up going to where this guy was that did this to him, Willie does. And this is from Joe's book here, quote, the guy turned to a bin behind the counter and handed him a length of pipe. How's this? Meaning Willie gave it to Willie. Willie hefted it in his hand, staring at it, to a bin behind the counter and handed him a length of pipe. How's this? Meaning Willy.

Gave it to Willy. Willy hefted it in his hand staring at it then closed his fingers around it. Yeah, he said, that's just right. Then bing, then bing, he hit the guy in the jaw. As the guy went down, Willy yelled. He made the guy give him his own weapon to beat him with. That's like dig your own grave type of shit. Get me a pipe. Pow. Here you go. He said, Willie yelled, you beat up my brother-in-law? Get up, you bastard. Stupidly

the guy got up. Willie hit him again, busted his nose. He was lying on the floor bleeding, half conscious when Willie tossed the piece of pipe on his chest. You're not worth the shit but your pipe does the job. Nice pipe. Nice pipe. He said he came outside and said, let's go, Louie. If that guy ever messes with you again, it'll be the last. And then he noticed me and said,

what the hell are you doing here? Yeah. This is like Tony Soprano walking in on his dad, cutting the guy's finger off. Yeah, it's the same fucking thing. He came out, I was just walking by looking for a stick ball game, dad. That's what he said.

You little wise ass, he raised his hand to me, then he lowered it with a smile. Come on, we're all going home. I already beat. He's eating some ice cream. I just beat the shit out of somebody, nevermind. I'm feeling nice. Pretty tired, yeah.

Pretty tired. While Willie took on everyone, even racket guys who could and did lay very heavy beatings or worse on people who gave them trouble. So he's even like, he didn't even care. He's fighting mob guys. It wasn't long after the hardware store problem had been corrected that my father heard this guy call Volani, this guy called Volani was bad mouthing someone in our family all over the neighborhood.

So a random, random rumor of quote bad mouthing of a relative around the neighborhood. Not even a specific said this to this person about that. Where's the son of a bitch is at? Just point him to me. Wow. Valani owned a clothing store, but he was also large in the rackets. Willie went to see him at the store and got there just as the guy was rolling up his awning, closing for the day.

Quote, what's this shit I hear you're saying about my family? Get lost, the guy said, pulling down the awning rod. Willie hit him on the point of the chin and Velani lifted off his feet and did a back dive right through his plate glass window. Wow. Don't ever badmouth my family again you bastard. Willy says. Just words and he blasts them through a window.

My family. No, maybe they had beef. I don't know. What business of it of Willy's. He left the guy lying among the broken glass in the window trying to shake some light back into his head. Within hours, bad guys all over Brooklyn were out looking for my father. Luckily the word got to Jimmy the Bug right away. Well, once Jimmy the Bug gets the word, then everything's

over. Who's Jimmy the Bug? Jimmy the Bug's a neighborhood guy. Jimmy the Bug lived in our building and was a good friend of our family. He was in the numbers business. Yeah, see? He was in a racket, see? So as soon as he heard what happened, he came right in to see my father. Look, Willie, he said. Stay in this apartment. Don't go out until I talk to some people. I'll straighten this whole thing out. He did. It only took him a month of steady negotiations to keep Willie alive.

Willie had to stay home for a month? Yeah, he had to stay home until I fix it, basically. Jesus Christ. In May of 1980, near Anaheim, California, Dorothy Jane Scott noticed her friend had an inflamed red wound on his arm and seemed unwell. She insisted on driving him to the local hospital to get treatment. While he waited for his prescription, Dorothy went to grab her car to pick him up at the exit but would never be seen alive again, leaving us to wonder, decades later, what really happened

to Dorothy Jane Scott? From Wondery, Generation Y is a podcast that covers notable true crime cases like this one and many more. Every week, hosts Erin and Justin sit down to discuss a new case, covering every angle in theory, walking through the forensic evidence and interviewing those close to the case to try to discover what happened. With over 450 episodes, there's a case for every true crime listener. Follow the Generation Y podcast on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.

You can listen to Generation Y ad free right now by joining Wondery Plus. Welcome to the small town of Chinook where faith runs deep and secrets run deeper. In this new thriller, available exclusively on Wondery+, religion and crime collide when a gruesome murder rocks the isolated Montana community. Everyone is quick to point their fingers at a drug-addicted teenager, but local deputy Ruth Vogel isn't convinced. She suspects connections to a powerful religious group. Enter federal agent V.B.

Loro, who has been investigating a local church for possible criminal activity. The pair form an unlikely partnership to catch the killer, unearthing secrets that leave Ruth torn between her duty to the law, her religious convictions, and her very own family. But something more sinister than murder is afoot and someone is watching Ruth. With an all star cast led by Emmy nominee Sanaa Lathan and Star Wars, Kelly

Marie Tran, Chinook is available exclusively and ad free on Wondry Plus. Join Wondry Plus in the Wondry app or on Apple podcasts. Here's a story from what happens when you come in three minutes late from being. Oh, yeah. I rode off down the block on my new bike, met the guys, and they all went on what, they all, and we all went what they called ape shit. I let them have a couple of rides each,

I had a couple, I got a brand new bike, and he went and they were like, oh shit, Joey's got a new fucking ride. Let me thank him for his spin. Look at Joey with this fucking. Joey! Oh, look at his fucking bike on. Look at Joey with his fucking Schwinn. Joey! Oh, look at his fucking bike gun Joey over here.

Joey Peppa Schwinn. Hey, Joey Schwinny boy, it's a ride. Joey Schwinneroni, come over here for a minute. He said, let them have a couple of rides each. I had a couple, then I pedaled home. My father was waiting on the front stoop. He was looking at his watch. It was three minutes after six.

He was supposed to be home at six. 603. 603. Get off that god damn bike you little bastard! He yelled. That bastard feels like his go to. Oh I love it. He then jumped down the steps, grabbed my shiny new bike, raised it over his head and

smashed it down the steps to the basement. The headlight flew off and all kinds of other pieces but it wasn't enough. He leaped down the basement steps, kicked in the spokes, lifted the bike again and smashed it against a wall. Just kept smashing it and smashing it against the concrete wall until there was nothing left in his hands except twisted metal. He just destroyed his bike. Three minutes. Wow.

He said, I ran up to my room crying thinking, three minutes late, three minutes. Yeah, those his thoughts too. 180 seconds for Christ's sake. Oh, I was lying on the bed crying when he came in and beat me. It's not enough. He beat him. Lucky, he didn't beat him with the bike. Wow. He said, but you didn't beat him with the bike.

Wow, he said, but I didn't feel that beating. All I could think of was that mutilated bike. I'll never forget. The next day he bought me a new bike. He bought him another bike? That's the thing. He says all the time, and this is what he says, usually right after he'd beaten me, my father would cool down and apologize to me, saying he was sorry and he didn't mean to hit me so hard. His father had a fucking crazy temper. He couldn't control.

He was a psychopath. He said almost every time he beat me, he'd come back in later and apologize. Finally, I told him, Dad, don't apologize to me. Just stop beating me. Or he said, at least make sure I deserve deserve it make it something that I really did something on you know what I mean Wow so that's so far that's just to give you a setup of what he's growing up in this is Joe's life is Joey P have a short temperature temperature temper temper I like you saying that it kind of does but the word that I can't stop saying? Not like this. No?

No. Most of his stuff, if somebody does something, his first reaction is to laugh at shit. He's one of these guys that everything's funny. He'll make a joke. He'll go, I have my big stupid nose. You know what I mean? He'd rather not deal with the fight. But later on, he'll have some fights.

But it's usually almost in a jokey way. Like everything with him is a joke. He's one of those rat-packy kind of guys where it's like everything's a giggle and an elbow and a little, you know, one of those. He's not like so serious like these other guys. The old generation was a whole different thing. And his dad may have grown up, fuck, he was born in 40, so his dad grew up through the fucking depression. He knows what it's like. His dad was born in 1917. Yeah, he was born in 40, so his dad grew up through the fucking depression.

He knows what it's like. His dad was born in 1917. Yeah, he's seen shit. And his father thought it was a sissy thing to play baseball, that was sissy. So I mean, it's a different life. So let's finally talk about a little bit of baseball. There's plenty of baseball, but there's more like pranks

and dumb shit and sexual stuff we'll talk about. What? Yeah. So he said a maternal uncle that was named Red, he got Joe into baseball, but he said his lessons could be brutal. He said he started catching with me when I was seven or eight. As I got older, nine or 10, he'd throw harder and get angry when I missed one.

Hey, you fucking bum, what are you doing, you little bastard, you missing the fucking ball over here. Idiot. I'm taking time out of my day to play fucking ball with this bum. The kid's a bum. I'm not even gonna, I'm not gonna sugar coat it, he's a bum.

You know what I make per hour? This is ridiculous. How many hours did I throw away? Multiply that by the dollars, that's how much money this cost me. You owe me now the clocks running on the VIG so it's two and a half points and I'll be here every Friday you better have my fucking money huh I'm seven what? Throw the ball. He said if I missed easy ones he'd smack me and then Willie would smack him so he'd smack the kid and then

Willie go don't hit my kid and smack him. We don't hit. That's amazing. Yeah. God, I love it so much. He talks about growing up in this neighborhood, which was not, you know, it's a rough neighborhood. He said, the biggest problem for me growing up in this neighborhood was that you had to act like a tough guy to get by. Right. Every all the kids were tough. You know what I mean? He said I had a very hard time getting that act together. He's a goofball, Joe, that's not his style, you know? He said I was anything but tough. I was always very tall for my age and stickball bat skinny. I had short wire curly hair that gripped my head like a stocking mask and emphasized my beak-like nose and turn signal ears. No. He said I looked a great deal like a baby robin.

So, yeah. Oh, that's terrible. He's like, people fuck with him. He'd rather make a joke, but he can't because he's got to fight now and act like a tough guy. He's a bad-looking man. Oh, yeah. He looks like a fucking little guinea.

I mean, he looks like a little guinea kid that's going to grow up to have a big nose and look like a fucking good. That's all. I mean. he looks like a little guinea kid that's gonna grow up to have a big nose and look like a fucking good. That's all I mean. He's a scarecrow. Yeah, that's what he got. He just happened to be skinny which doesn't help. Real skinny isn't helpful with that look. That's the worst. At least if you got a couple pounds on you can you know get some balance on that nose and ears but he said I was always scared as a kid. I was always being challenged physically because that's the way it was for everyone until you proved yourself. I didn't like to fight. I didn't like to fight simply

because I was always getting my ass beat. I didn't like to do something where I got beat up every time. It's just something about it. Yeah. Well, if you get beat up at home, you're losing every fight at home. That's just a guarantee. You're not going to beat Willie. Yeah. Grown men in the street can't beat Willie. Then if you get in a fight and you know an option is losing and you know what losing

feels like, you're not going to fight. You just don't want to. You're not going to be like, oh god, I'm going to get beat up again. But he could take a good beating anyway, so that's good. Yeah, yeah, you can take it. He said, I was always getting my ass beat. I mean consistently without ever any change in the outcome. Yeah.

I just always lost. He's not a good fighter. He said I was quick on my feet and I'd dance around very skillfully for a while, but I always ended up on the ground with someone pounding me. Then I'd go home with bumps and bruises and my father would enlarge them because I hadn't done better. Would you get beat up? Get over here you pussy and then he'd beat him up too.

Rather than teaching him how to fight maybe, hey Joe, let me show you how to fight. No, no, no, you want to plant your foot and really get pushed off on your hip on that one. He said, get over here, I'm going to fucking blacken your other eye. It doesn't feel good to lose a fight and then be challenged or told to go fight again and then lose that too. I've been there. It's no good.

It's not fun. But to go home and get beat up also by someone even tougher, it's like, I just lost to a child. This is not even a challenge for you. And you're going to feel it swollen. It hurts so bad. It's no good. He said, I think this is why I became such a fast runner.

Because in baseball, he was always known as a pretty quick guy. He said, quote, you want to fight, Pepitone, you skinny son of a bitch? Nope. Zoom. Sprint away. Quote, you want to fight Pepitone, you skinny son of a bitch? Nope.

Zoom. Sprint away. He said, if Lemon, who's a guy a friend of his, who was shorter and wider and two years older, was around and the challenger wasn't too big, he'd look out for me. You know, if he thought he could take him, he'd help you. But otherwise, you're on your own. He was outmatched and outgunned. Then I, then I got to run.

Yeah. He was tough and he also preferred taking a rap from a tougher guy to getting one from my father. Oh, he'd get beat up, but where were you? Yeah, his father would say, who was with you? Lemon, okay, now I'm looking for lemon. And he'd literally go down the street, find lemon, a child, and kick the shit out of him

for not helping Joey along. Yeah. Child is using someone else's kid. Oh, back then that was very normal. kick the shit out of him for not helping Joey along. Yeah. He said but when... Child abusing someone else's kid. Oh back then that was very normal. Very normal. Why you hit my kid? He didn't defend my kid.

Proceed. Okay. All right good, then you'd hit him too. Back in the other... Thank you, my arm's sore. There's a scene on Mad Men when there's a birthday party, a kid's birthday party and some kid knocks over a drink and one of the neighbors grabs him and goes,

hey, you knocked that over and smacks him in the face. And the kid's father comes over and goes, what happened? And he goes, he knocked this drink over and he's running around. And the father goes, you want some more? And the kid goes, no. He goes, you better apologize to Mr. So-and-so and clean that up.

And he was like, I'm sorry to the stranger who just smacked him in the face Do I was do I want some more? What? Yeah, I hope that's And those people were no the answer they weren't even Italian that's a whole lot This is a whole separate people. Yeah, this is a whole separate fucking thing going on here So he said I've heard that so many times as a child. Do you want some more? Like what kind of thing is that to say to a kid?

You know what the answer is as an adult. Why would you ask that? Because it's that's to show how ridiculous it is that you're complaining. The option is getting hit more or shutting the fuck up. Those are your two options. So which would you rather have? That's what it is. What do you want more? No, and you sniffle. Yeah That means shut up. Are you gonna get hit more? I got I got some left in the tank I'd say a little bit. He said but lemon wasn't around it was strictly feet do your thing

He said I ran home and my mother saw I was bruised and bleeding. Mom, I said, I tried to hit him, but he had a stick ball bat. Quote, get a baseball bat and go get him. My mother said, Jesus Christ, I got a baseball bat out of the closet, went back to the schoolyard and ran right up to that Irish kid. He yanked the baseball bat out of my hands and beat the shit out of me with that. I brought you something. Joe's not a fighter. He's just not a fighter. Joey B.

I feel like this is not for you. You son of a bitch. Uh oh. What do you do with that? That wasn't a good enough beating. I brought this for you. Here, hold on. I'd rather be beat with this.

I don't want you to hurt your fists. You look like it hurt a little kicking me last time. I don't want you to mess your toes up Why don't you go ahead and beat me with this? He said he said I went home and told my mother mom Don't tell me to get a gun cuz he'll take that away from me and shoot me Jesus Christ is enough already He said that was the nuff enough of that fighting shit for me. I lost that one twice Maybe the next fight would be even worse five in a row wasn't bad after all why push it?

That's this is this is All you got is a stick ball bat you pussy I So want a sitcom like an HBO sitcom about Joe Pepitone's childhood. I want it so fucking bad. It's getting bad every day. But it's funny also somehow, because that's the tone of it. That's, you know, Sopranos thing, you know,

and Goodfellas, and there's a certain tone of violence can be funny. And I think somehow this child abuse show is gonna fly in 2024 as very funny. I want this show. I would watch this show every week. I would this show. I would watch this show every week. I would watch it. I would watch it all the time.

I'd binge it. I wanna see him and his mom just like, if you give a mouse a cookie style with each different weapon, then eventually he's just like, I'm not taking the gun, mom. Oh, yeah, so you mean, don't tell me to get a gun. We already escalated from fist to a bat.

That's enough. You're giving my ass an ass kicking every time you keep mousa-cooking this kid. This is a guy who had a long, a long all-star baseball career. And the only baseball we've talked about is that his father wasn't allowed to play it because it's a sissy sport. And when his uncle would play catch with him and he'd drop one, he'd get the shit beaten out of him for it. That's the only baseball we've talked about. His uncle threw him a ball, he dropped it and got smacked,

and then his uncle got smacked by his father. And then a kid beat him with a bat. And he got beat by a bat. Which happened at a baseball field. So I guess it's technically baseball related. Baseball related. Good lord. His mom, if give him a mouse a cookie his ass kicking that's incredible. That's awesome. So from there what do you do if you're

young Joe you gotta run the streets you gotta be out with the other kids you're always getting beat up you got to join a gang that's what you have to do. Is that what Joe does? That's what all the kids did back then and they still do because it's a tough neighborhood you're gonna be fucking prey if you're not part of a group that'll stick up for you. Sure. Sure. You know, if you're in a tough spot, he said in my neighborhood, you had to belong to a gang or you'd get your ass whipped every day. You couldn't go to prospect park to a church dance, to the roller rink, even to school. If you weren't in a gang, even a school, they're looking for kids. Oh, there's a fucking sucker. I'm going to beat the shit out of him. That's what they did. What are you here to learn about James Madison? We're going to be a gang. They're looking for kids. Oh, there's a fucking sucker.

I'm going to beat the shit out of him. That's what they did. What are you here to learn about James Madison? We're going to beat the shit out of him. Yeah, you pussy. Get over here. You're not here to learn the rackets? What's wrong with you, kid?

He said, I didn't much like gangs, but I did like protection, and I needed protection. I did like not getting the shit beaten out of me. He said, we had a gang of 20 to 25 guys for years, the Washington Avenue boys. All of a sudden one day, Joe Fortunato, the leader, came over to me with a bunch of the other guys and said, Joe, we're gonna have to initiate you into the gang. Oh God, this is the worst.

He said, what the hell do you mean, initiate into the gang? I've been with you guys all my life. He's like, I've been fucking here the whole time. Initiate me into what? Right. What we did yesterday, we've been doing this every day He said the guy said no, this is a new thing. We're starting Joe make it official the older guys have to initiate the younger guys Starting with me

Joe it's you fuck me Joey just fucking getting the shit beaten out of them all the time. Why is it always me? Here we go again. And so he said, who initiated you guys? Like let's chicken or the egg here. Let's find out what we're talking about. How'd you get in here? I like these guys ask questions his way out of this.

He's you got to be semi smart if you're not going to be tough here. You know what I mean? He said, we initiated each other said Fortunato, who was a couple of years older than me and looked like Mugs McGinnis of the East Side Kids. He wore an old fedora hat pushed up in the front just like Mugs in the movies. Joe, it won't be bad. It's just a little test for putting all the young guys through. You won't have any problem. What do I have to do? He says, he says, we're just going to tie you to a tree and prospect a park tonight for about four hours and then we'll come back and set you free. Tie me to a tree. Who's to say a transient doesn't go oh look. Yeah or anybody else or a dog's gonna pee on you or who the hell knows what's gonna happen.

Just some random pervert just loves tied up children. He's going to climb up and be halfway up the tree. Halfway up the tree, start fucking poor Joe's little face now. Oh, look at this poor helpless child. Come here. Oh, God. So he said, four hours? Me tied to a tree in Prospect Park for four hours at night? No way.

I'm not doing it. Yeah, I'm not a part of this. Fortunato and the other guys huddled for a minute, and then he said, okay, Joe, if you don't wanna do that, there's another test you can do to be initiated. All you have to do is swim halfway across Park Lake. How big is that? Is this a swimming gang? Will there be much aquatic combat

we're gonna be committing? Why do I need to, this isn't the Navy SEALs, why do I have to swim? What are we talking about? And who's to say, where's the fucking line? What if I get all the way out there swim back and then you guys go that way keep going Well, he said fucking halfway. Then what do I do when I'm out in the middle? How do I get back? You guys are nuts. I'm not doing any of this shit. He says

He said so they huddled up again and said Joe, you wanna be in the gang or don't you here? He goes, yeah, I wanna be in the fucking gang. They said, all right, we'll come up with something else. So they came up with all the guys, all hot loogies into a glass. And made him drink it through a straw. Ah, Jesus. That he did.

I can't, I'm not going to read it word for word, because it's really gross. He's like, you guys are going to make me, he's talking about like, I took a sip, and you guys are making me eat lungers. You guys are disgusting. But he did it, and he got into the gang. Ugh, I'd rather, no!

I'd rather be tied to the tree. I'll cut my asshole out before I do this. No, I'll swim. I'll swim. I'll swim. It's nice out. What is it, June? I'll swim to a tree that you guys tie me to for four hours before I do that. That's crazy.

If someone said swim out to the middle of Lake and back or you'll have to drink a glass of Lugies, I will swim so far. I'll beat Michael Phelps to the end and back. I swear to God. I will beat his fucking ass. I'm not drinking that. I love Joe. You want to be in the gang or not? I love that. What are we doing here? That means somebody huddled and then goes, excuse me, you want to be in the gang?

Somebody's like, yeah, I don't think he does either. Yeah, I don't think so. You guys don't think he wants to be in? I'll get clarification. Joey, you want to be in this or not? You want to be in this or not? What's going on? So let's talk about sexual experiences growing up in the neighborhood here. And there's several, a lot of them are with older ladies, some of them are with younger.

Yeah, there's one lady named Lucy that we'll talk about later that he had a, well, there's this lady named Lucy, and him and his friend saw Lucy coming out of a bar with a guy who wasn't her husband. Oh. So leverage. His friend had an idea of maybe we

can get her to jerk us off if we fucking tell her that. If we don't tell her husband. If we threaten to tell her husband. She got laid. Now she's going to have to jerk off some children. Two 12-year-olds now at the same time. All right, you guys almost done. So they go over. they knock on her door.

They go, hey Lucy, yeah, we saw you with this guy. And she said, yeah, what do you wanna make of it? She's a tough Brooklyn lady. And they said, well, you know, you wouldn't want your husband to find out. And she said, well, what do you want to keep quiet? And his friend, you know, chickened out and said, give us a kiss, come on, how about a kiss?

And his friend maybe thought he could take it further. So his friend ended up, or she ended up giving his friend a kiss and grabbing his cock real quick and then shoving them out the door. Right? Yeah. So anyway, word got around that something happened here and that they knew of something and they were trying to blackmail her. So the guy's husband, the lady Lucy's husband got mad and came and smacked Joe around as a kid said you guys doing blah blah blah make him want my wife to do this then Willie found out that this guy smacked Joe around so Willie went and beat the guy half to death for beating up Joe

right so that's what ended up that's how one let's try to get a kiss ended up with one guy in a pile of fucking of pile on the ground and Joey fucking Lucy every day and Joey trying to fuck Lucy well here's another girl named Pat here we go I'll read this when I was about 12 I had finally started to dribble a bit when I jerked off oh Jesus Christ he talked about his friend lemon trying to teach him how to jerk off and he was like, how come I can't get nothing to come out? And he's like, I don't know, wait a while. Maybe it'll come out eventually. Keep trying. So a few months later, a few months later it started working. And yeah, he was like, come on, you got to break it in. That's why, you know, there's a break in

period. You got to give it a couple dozen jerks before anything comes out. You gotta prime it. Imagine living in a city like that. Like New York in the 40s and 50s. We're like, everybody's so close together. You gotta talk about your business together. You know what I mean? The kids talk about things. And imagine, do you ever have that conversation

with a friend ever? Yeah, no. Well, there's barely any TV. The magazines are like behind a thing somewhere. You can't get to those. There's no way to know anything. There's no way to get any sexual information except for the kid that's two years older

than you in the neighborhood, who barely knows more than you do, but says they know a lot. I never had anybody say, I learned something cool. The vacation thing? Yeah, yeah. Nobody ever said that to me.

I remember kids bragging about like quote unquote bragging about their like their masturbation as a kid being like 12, 13. But not like have you ever, like nobody ever asked. I was jerking off the other night and like I figured out if I do this and that, oh it's much better. Yeah, I remember that like giving tips. I remember jerk off tips from friends and I'm like, that's terrific. Thank you Never got a jerk off tip from a buddy I Jerk off tips but not but that was because we were old enough. They knew we everybody was jerk. Yeah

We weren't like, you know jerking off at the time, but they're just like Playing baseball or something playing catch and they're like, you know, jerking off at the time, but they were just like, you know, playing baseball or something, playing catch, and they're like, let me tell you about a good stroke I learned. Wasn't just like a bunch of dudes standing around tugging going, try this, look at this. Wasn't a circle jerk. You watching what I'm doing here? You watching my technique or what?

Now you try it. Let me see. Yeah, that's how you do it. That's it right there. I don't know, your form's a little off. Isn't that great? Put your pinky out, make it classy. All right's a little off. Isn't that great? Put your pinky out, make it classy. All right, better, good. Isn't that great? Yeah.

No, but I jerked off without like, thanks, fuck, man. That is so creepy. A kid saying, how come mine doesn't work? Yeah, come on, it's not working. You told me stuff's supposed to come out, he said. He goes, well, maybe you're not ready to yet, I don't know. He know you said wait a while. Maybe look come out. I don't know what to tell you I'm gonna doctor. What am I fucking doctor over here?

He said lemon had what we had what we called the hots for a girl named Pat with great big breasts and a saucy mouth Okay, he likes her. He likes her. Lemon was always fooling around with her. I'm going to get you. Yeah. She'd say it might be fun. One day he and I were coming out of the itch, which was a terrible name for anything. It better not be a singles bar. If this is their 12, I mean, I think it's a store and he spotted Pat leaving in front of us. Hey, he said to me

My mom's not home. I'm gonna ask Pat to come over to my house. I bet we get a handjob So these friends said that's that's lemon Yeah, we were always talking about getting a girl to give us a handjob back then We just we didn't know how to fuck so it was you know, so he said like we could do Pat Said sure she'd go along with us to Lemon's apartment. Lemon's eyes got all watery as if he couldn't wait. We went into the hall in his building and Lemon couldn't wait. He reached over and put one of Pat's hands on his dick and the other on mine.

She smiled and started rubbing and squeezing. She's skiing. She's rubbing both of them? She's into this. She's going to jerk off two kids. What horrible childhood did she have? She's fucking. She's rubbing both of them. Yeah, she's into this. She's gonna jerk off two kids. What horrible childhood did she have? She's fucking 14 or something. Hey Lemon, don't you think we better go upstairs, I said?

Someone might see us. Yeah. We hadn't even closed the door to his apartment when Lemon was unbuttoning the back of Pat's blouse. She finished undressing herself and sat back on the sofa, smiling at our expressions, which were naturally bug-eyed gape What tits exclamation point he said He was like 40 when he wrote this what tits on this broad let me tell you that He said I looked down at her thing the first I had seen with hair and I thought wow is that ugly

He just saw a big moth and he was like oh what the fuck's going on down there wow is that ugly no part of me is going near that I get a disease or something lemon was anything but put off and moved toward the sofa then we heard clomp clomp clomp on the stairs. Oh Christ, he said, my mother's coming. Oh Jesus. He ran over and locked the door and scooped up Pat's clothes and threw them under the sofa, grabbed Pat's arm and said, come on, quick, out on the fire escape. Why aren't you naked? She's pushing a nude child onto the fire escape.

Hold on, stay out here naked, your clothes clothes run to the sofa Thank you. I'm not wild squirrel. You got out of this bucket Jesus Christ He said she said are you crazy? I can't go out there like this lemon Why the hell have you locked this door his mother yelled knocking very hard be right there ma Shoving pat toward the window shoving Pat toward the window. Get out! Get out! Get me in the bubble!

This is ridiculous. I took her other arm and helped her up on the sill. What a gentleman. Yeah. Courtly of you. Madam. Oh my god, that's amazing. Lemon, what the hell are you doing?

His mother kicked the door. Open this door! Hurry, get out there! Lemon whispered. People will see me, Pat whispered as we pushed her out on the fire escape. It's better than getting killed by my mom, you and me, Lemon said as he slammed the window. You want to die today or you want to get your ass seen by strangers? Yeah, you want people to see your giant bush or you're going to fucking die today?

Which one? Don't worry, you got great tips. Yeah, everyone's going to be very impressed. Don't you worry, sweetheart. He said... It's something for my ugly thing right there. Oh, Lemon opened this goddamn door right now. That's the mother. Lemon raced to the door and unsnapped the bolt.

His mother barged in, a large bag of groceries in her arms and almost knocked over Lemon. She screamed at him for five minutes and then went into the kitchen. We looked out the window. One of Pat's eyes was peering in around the frame. And water was streaming down her face. It was pouring outside, a cloud burst. They put her out and it started raining immediately. It was like, they're like, I guess it could be worse. It could be raining.

And then, you know, it's the old cartoon joke. Yeah. She was out there for over 45 minutes naked in the rain. Lemon and I sitting there whistling, talking about nothing before his mother said she was going upstairs to a neighbor's for a minute. And don't you lock this door, you two. We opened the window and Pat poured in. Her hair plastered to her head,

the water puddling off her on the floor. Lemon went for a towel, but Pat was half dressed when he got back. Shove that, she said, the towel. Right up your ass. Putting on the rest of the clothes and rushing out the door. Next time, she yelled as she left,

you guys can go fuck yourselves. Go fuck each other. Go fuck each other. So there is a, uh, like one of Joe's first sexual experiences. He's scared of a vagina and some poor wet teenage girl had to sit out on a fire escape for 45 minutes. That's horrible. Yeah. Probably has lived through enough sexual trauma. Just got more. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No girl who probably has lived through enough sexual trauma just got more. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, if a girl is 14, she's like, I'm going to jerk two guys off. She's been through some stuff already without a doubt. Especially back then.

It's not like she came upon porn on the internet and was like, this is artistic. I want to do that. Somebody gave her ideas here. So in a bad way, probably. So he's hanging out with his friends here, doing his thing. He talks about how they would fight another gang. Okay? And this is what my friends and I used to do

for fun for some reason. We'd break off into two teams and get as much fireworks as we could and shoot them at each other. Yeah. And yeah, so you'd throw packs of firecrackers and bottle rockets were good. And the Roman.

Snap the stick off those motherfuckers. Roman candles equalizer. Yeah. That was like, oh shit, everybody die. That's someone breaking out the cannon. He's got nine shots, you guys. Yeah, and the M80 sticks were outlawed. You couldn't have the Roman candles that exploded

because people would die. Really? Yeah, we outlawed those as far as in the battles. You couldn't do that at all. Jesus fires an M 80. Yeah, it's a Roman candle. And when it hits something or, you know, gets up to its whatever bow, it's got an M 80 and it explodes.

Yeah, it's very, very dangerous. Jesus, it's a good one to a good explosion. He said, we scraped together $50 or over $50 and one of the guys got his uncle and a couple of other adults to drive him to the fireworks store. Then we challenged the guys who'd ripped us off to come into our neighborhood. Jesus, we caught a couple of them alone, kicked their asses and dared them to come back with all their guys. They did and we were ready. We had guys on the roofs with cherry bombs that you lit and torpedoes that exploded on

impact. They fucking ambushed them. Fire them down at the road and they would just explode down there. They'd explode all on them, yeah. He said we also had filled garbage cans with the loose gravel that covered the tar on the roofs. We had guys in the alleys on the street with roman candles and we posted one guy on the roof of the building where our territory began two blocks away who as soon as he saw them

coming fired a roman candle signal to us. It was like war. He said when they marched down the street we were waiting We threw down cherry bombs, torpedoes and gravel. Our guys in the alleys jumped out and fired Roman candles at them from 20 yards away. They hit a couple of the guys right in the chest and their shirts caught on fire. That's what will happen. Especially back then there was you could make me could make it out of napalm for Christ's sake. Back then the shirt and they was fine to do it when you know the 50s

There was no outlawing chemicals or anything like that He said shoes were blown off pieces of fingers. You never saw anything like that Pieces of fingers were pieces. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah He said it scared the shit out of me and repelled me when I saw those guys running with their shirts on fire Well, that's good. That's a good thought. But I had to be a part of it and had to act tough like I didn't give a shit. If you didn't throw your bombs or fire your Roman candles at the enemy, another guy in

your gang would see you and tell everybody and you'd be ostracized. It was a wild, crazy scene. I heard that one guy was blinded in one eye. I know we destroyed them. They dared us to come into their neighborhood for a rematch and we told them to fuck off. We said, you guys want to get even, come on back. And those stupid bastards did. And it was just as bad the second time. It's all a lighthearted nightmare on our podcast, morbid. We're your hosts. I'm

Alina Urquhart and I'm Ash Kelly. And our show is part true crime, part spooky, and part comedy. The stories we cover are well researched, He claimed and confessed to officially killing up to 28 people, with a touch of humor, I just like to go ahead and say that if there's no band called malevolent deity, that is pretty great. a dash of sarcasm and just garnished a bit with a little bit of cursing. This mother f***er lied.

Like a liar. Like a liar. And if you're a weirdo like us and love to cozy up to a creepy tale of the paranormal, or you love to hop in the way back machine and dissect the details of some of history's most notorious crimes, you should tune in to our podcast, Morbid. Follow Morbid on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to episodes early and ad free by joining Wondery Plus and the Wondery app or on Apple podcasts.

Okay. So, that's what he's talking about. Here's a story about getting into a rumble with the boys and Willie showing up because he heard that Joe was fighting around in the streets here. Oh. He said- He knows that Joe doesn't fight back, so I don't need my kid losing out there and ruining my reputation.

Well, just, and also he was pissed that people were going to be punching Joe other than him. I punched Joe, not you. You don't get to hit my kid. I hit my kid. No. So they were in a restaurant and this happened, and there's a scuffle around the bathroom here. And he said that all of a sudden the door opened

and boom, it was Willie. And he said, quote, Jesus Christ, it was my father who told me how to stay out of gang fights or he'd kill me. I don't know where he is, my friend Oakey said. I heard a scuffling sound and found out later that Willie had grabbed my friend by the front of his shirt. If you don't tell me where Joe is,

I'm gonna punch you right in the goddamn face, you little bastard," my father said. He's in the bathroom, my friend yelled. In the bathroom. I'm not taking a Willie ass kicking for you, Joe. You said bastard. I know that's the key word before somebody gets their fucking face caved in. Oh, bastard. He's got a fist made. He's about to punch you. Ready to go. He's so Joe is hiding in the bathroom from his father now. He said, I turned and put the little hook thing through the eye on the door. In other words, he locked it with the little door lock.

That'll keep him away. This is the anti-Willy right here. He's not gonna kick that off the fucking hinges. That's amazing. He said, and stop sucking in air and stop breathing entirely. He just like. I'm ready to die in here He's like I don't want him to hear me. Maybe he maybe he'll listen not hear me and go away

He said I wrap my hands around the knob and braced my feet on the floor leaning backwards. He's holding The next thing I knew I was flying out of the bathroom sailing past my father who had yanked the door so hard He'd ripped the hook out of the door and onto the floor. He just tore the whole thing off the hinges. He grabbed me by the back of my t-shirt and twisted as he lifted me up. The neckband was cutting into my neck, choking me. He's just hanging him by his shirt. My father pushed me toward the front door like that, where he stopped by my friend Oakey

and stuck a fist in his face. And you're tomorrow, you son of a bitch Irish bastard, he said. You're tomorrow. I'll be back for you. This is your friend and you're supposed to watch out for your friends. You blew it. He pointed at my nose, which was bleeding again, the blood trickling down my cheek. You're dead when I catch you tomorrow, Willie told him.

Wow. He shoved me outside where my Uncle Tony was sitting in a car with the door open at the curb. My father spun me around and hit me a shot in the jaw that knocked me right into the car. Uncle Tony drove us around to our building and the instant we got there my father threw me out onto the curb. I scrambled to my feet and headed up the stairs as fast as I could.

My father was right behind me, wrapping me all the curb. I scrambled to my feet and headed up the stairs as fast as I could. My father was right behind me, wrapping me all the way. We had an old Bendix washing machine with a little window in the front sitting at the top of the stairs. I stumbled on the last step. When I got up, my father punched me in the back of the head as hard as he could. That's nice. He's a child. Why did you bring the washing machine into it? You'll see. I was half conscious when my head smashed through the Bendex window, shattering it, but somehow not cutting me. His father put his head through a window.

On the washing machine? That shit's thick. That's thick. Oh yeah, it's thick glass. That's not just a pain like a front window. That was the end of my gang fights. I swore that night as I cried myself to sleep that I'd never get into another gang war. Never. And I didn't. When the next one came

up I told the guys what had happened to me in the last one and said, no thanks, it wasn't worth it. Look, we won that battle, but I lost the war. I lost the war. Yeah, he said I'd gotten destroyed in a gang fight in Prospect Park, then gotten double destroyed at home. My father taught me some hard lessons, but this one paid off for me. Hell, I'd been birthed with a big enough nose. So, there you go.

That's so far, and we're not ending it there, but that's so far what he's doing. Now let's talk a little bit about baseball, of how he got into playing some baseball. Yeah, how the fuck? And we haven't talked about that, because chronologically it hasn't happened yet in his life. This is all the stuff that happened leading up some baseball. Yeah, how the fuck? And we haven't talked about that because chronologically it hasn't happened yet in his life. This is all the stuff that happened leading up to baseball.

Just a lot of abuse and bad sexual experience. A lot of abuse. But the thing you would think though back then is this is a way out. I get out of here. Baseball, you play somewhere else. I'm not playing for Park Slope, so I'm gonna be out of here somewhere.

Right. He said when my brother Jimmy was about 12 and a half, he started playing baseball with a team in the neighborhood. And he came home after the first practice with a nice uniform. I'd never played baseball. He played stickball all the time, but never played baseball. And I asked Jimmy if I could try out. He said he'd see.

The next day he told me the team could only have one 14 year old player on it and they'd have to vote me in or out. So you got to go try out. A lot of them knew how I could hit a Spalding which is the bouncy fucking stickball ball. I started the next game at the Madison High School field and there happened to be a bird dog for the Yankee scout in the stands, a guy called John King. These are people who would scout literally, you know, eighth grade kids looking for kids

who, you know, could pick it up. There's no video back then that you could send. People couldn't just put up a YouTube channel with their kid hitting 400 foot homers. It didn't work really back then. There's a guy wandering around looking at children for prospects. Yeah. Yeah. He said a bird dog tips off a scout on a prospect and John King was at the field to watch the second game that afternoon between 16 and 17 year olds. But he got there early and saw me hit three home runs out of the ballpark.

Yeah. Joe's got good pop. He always did. After the game, he came down to talk to the tall skinny skinny left-handed hitter who'd driven three balls over the fence. He started showing up at just about every game I played after that, a rumpled man in a cap sitting there watching me. And he said, John King, the bird dog for the Yankee scout, became like a second father to me. He looked after me, helped me tremendously in a nice, patient way.

He gave me all kinds of advice that improved me as a ballplayer every year. That first season he taught me how to run better, stay up on my toes, and how on throws from the outfield to keep the ball low by releasing it with a downward snap. He went a line drive throw from the outfield. A big rainbow throw takes too long. He was always working with me. John King also became very close to my mother and father. Well, his father didn't beat the shit out of him. It's the first person in the story his father hasn't beaten.

That's wild. Yeah, he said we all respected and trusted him. Too much as it turned out. When I was 15 in my second season of playing baseball, he had me sign an agreement which gave him exclusive rights to represent me and act as my agent. Uh-oh. He didn't know, or Joe didn Joe didn't know I mean he would receive something like 15% of everything I earned until I was about 44 years old

It was just a career long Yeah, 18 year fucking contract shit 20 year 30 year contract. He's only 15. Oh, right Wow, what my mother and father? Yeah. Yeah, he's only 15 at the time. Not knowing any better, not realizing the ramifications of this contract, signed it too. It seemed like a fine arrangement then. After all, John King was going to help me become a major league ballplayer eventually. Yeah. He said, I batted about 600 in high school ball in 1957 and and a dozen other scouts started coming to see me play.

Then I tried out for one of the best semi-pro teams in Brooklyn, Nathan's Famous Hot Dogs, and made it. Really? Really? There's a ton of lots of semi-pro and minor league teams out there. Just people love to go out and watch baseball. Oh yeah, yeah, there was tons of teams.

It was like, yeah. Nathan's played in five different leagues, about 100 games a season. That's a lot. Yes That's not like a half of a season. Yeah, that's a lot more than that The Nathan's players ranged in age from 20 to 25 and all of them had some minor league experience and received a little pay for playing I couldn't take any money because I wanted to play another year of high school ball But I didn't care about the money, all I cared about was playing." He said, I batted 390 with Nathan's. Wow. I was proud as hell. My friends were proud of me. Skinny Joe Pep was a baseball star. He knocked the shit out of that ball. John King said I was going to earn myself a nice bonus and that with 13 bird dogs or

scouts constantly in the stands at my games, there would be terrific competition among them to sign me, which would push the numbers up. Somebody said I'd get $25,000, which back then is like... That's crazy money. That's more than $250,000 now. That's so much money. And another said $35,000 and another said $45,000. I couldn't believe $25,000. I couldn't imagine just how much money and another said 35,000 and another said 45,000. I couldn't believe 25,000. I

couldn't imagine just how much money that was. I knew my father breaking his ass on construction brought home in a good year working a bunch of Sundays and a lot of overtime about $7,000 a year. And they can live in the city. So Willie though, one thing Willie is very supportive about or with Joe with is baseball. Willie is all about Joe. He goes to every game he fucking can. He's at all the games. He's constantly fighting with people in the stands. Oh, he's that dad?

Oh, he's just that guy. He's going to even if his kid wasn't playing, he'd be fighting people in the stands. Put his kid in the fucking game. Forget about it. So one time when he actually fought an entire baseball team, as we'll talk about. Quote, I remember we played an all black team called the Vikings at their field on Myrtle Avenue one day. I was playing first and there was a very close play. I stretched as far as I could with my foot on the inside edge of the bag, just my cleats and the sole of my shoe touching.

This big black guy came down the line and purposely jumped on my foot, which was done a lot back then. That was just what people did. The spike went through my shoe and almost chopped off my toe. Those are the real spikes. They were just like a fucking piece of steel that came out of your foot. And yeah, they were very, very big. So he said, I screamed and fell back on the ground

holding my foot. The blood was running out of the gash in my shoe. Holy. Hey you, I heard someone yell. Uh oh. Jesus, he knows who that is. We know that voice. Is the word bastard far behind?

No, it's not. I don't think it is. I heard someone yell. I looked up and saw Willie running onto the field. Oh, no He met the guy who'd spiked me as he trotted across the infield toward his dugout Willie didn't say another word He just hit that guy and knocked him out with one punch He's also a young man who didn't know he was in a fight also. Jesus. The Vikings leaped out of their dugout. Yes, some fan just came out of the field and started punching players. Willie set his feet and motioned them on. He said, come on. Wave to them. Let's go. Let's go with the baseball team. said his feet motion them on unfortunately for the first three guys

They came one behind the other my father flattened each of them with a single punch bang bang bang. They went down like ten pins If you if you see You're a dugout and what if your team member just gets blindsided and three of your teammates go get flattened Are you even following? No chance. I'm going to say I'm going to go get that really big bat I keep back in the clubhouse. I'll be back later. I'm going to go. How did the first three that came out not grab one? They're leaning right there.

I think it's a matter of honor. I think he doesn't have a bat, so we're going to go out and fight him head up, I think. We're a whole team. I think he doesn't have a bat So we're gonna go out and fight him like you had up. I think the whole team we can be was this one fucking? Guinea coming out of the stands we can beat this guy, right? He just flattened that guy that guy had a reason to be scared too. He knew what he did. Yeah Oh, yeah, I mean he knew somebody was pissed at him, but this is this is I'm not following it. How many more came? So far easy's for no just in the field right now He said none of them got up

I just lay there watching as half the men in the stands poured onto the field. Now it's a riot My teammates the Vikings and the Vikings and scores of fans ran around slugging one another He's blea- god, he's bleeding. Yeah, he said, I finally got up and limped toward the stands. He's not even involved in it. He's the whole thing. He's not even involved in the brawl. He didn't throw a punch.

No, he said, I saw the scouts all leaving and I thought, I wonder what they think of this shit. This can't be good. Is my father driving them away from me? The game was suspended. Because, you know, they had to, everybody had to nurse their wounds. Here's a time when Willie heard a guy in the stands call Joe overrated.

Uh oh. Didn't say he's an asshole, a son of a bitch. He's overrated that player. Okay. He said that this had happened earlier in the game on a play where he struck out on an at bat. So this really pissed him off here and this guy yelled at him call him overrated.

So the next time he got up, he hit a home run and he said it was a hell of a shot. Good home run. As I trotted home, I saw my father who'd been sitting up behind this guy walk down in front of him. Quote, he's overrated, huh? Big mouth. My father shouted into the guy's face. Quote, he's overrated, huh, big mouth? My father shouted into the guy's face, that ball went over 350 feet, you asshole. The guy stood up and my father knocked him down.

He stood up again and my father knocked him out. It reached the point where all the bird dogs and scouts were saying, Joe Pepitone's old man is going to ruin that kid. Yeah, no kidding. Word got around, like, Jesus Christ, you can't bring the guy to a game. John King kept hearing this, and he knew they had a point, knew it was getting harder and harder for me with my father at the games. Now, there's an incident that finally stopped us,

because his father's still beating the shit out of him at this point. And finally, finally, they get in this big argument. Basically, a scout told told Willie that, you know, you're your your your your fucking up. Yeah. Yeah. So he got mad. I guess he ended up getting enough. So Joe got in a fight with his father and he told him he hated his father. He said, I hate you. You're fucking this all up for me. Willie picked up a big thick glass ashtray. You know, those big ones that everyone old people had in their living rooms.

I've got one that holds my fucking keys because I know it's so sturdy. It's sturdy. You could drop it. It won't break. It's very sturdy. Well, he picked this thing up. What Willie and threw it across the room at Joe. Missed Joe with it, but it hit a closet door and he said it, quote, it smashed into a hundred pieces and a dozen shards ricocheted into my eyes and face. The door or the ashtray? Because those things will splinter a door.

Glass all over his face. Oh boy. Exploded in his face. He said I had searing pains in my eyes and I couldn't open them. I thought I was blind and I could feel the blood running down my face and dripping off my clothes. Willie came over and said, fucking oh my God, and helped him try to wash the glass out and everything like that. He said that completely shocked Willie because he didn't want to kill his son.

So he said after that he never beat him up again. That was the last time he had any physical abuse from his father. He said if he got angry't want to kill his son. So he said after that he never beat him up again. That was the last time he had any physical abuse from his father. He said if he got angry he put his hand through a wall, a window, whatever was there when he blew up. Something got punched. Holy Jesus Christ. So yeah there's a newspaper article where they say Joe Pepitone loved his father and

his father loved him back. Willie Pepitone was more than a fighter. The way Joe saw him Willie was the toughest guy in South Brooklyn No question. The problem was Willie had a temper. He was always beating the hell out of Joe really banging him around He'd always apologize But then he'd go and do it again until one time Willie told him you're not playing ball anymore Joe said I hate you Willie picked up an ashtray and fired it at him and that's what they talk about The news is all in the newspaper. Wow. So there was that. Um, he said that, um, quote, this is what Joe said. He couldn't stop yelling at me any more than he could

stop beating me all those years. I knew he didn't mean it, that all he wanted was for me to do well. But the yelling really got to me because it stuck with me longer than a punch. The words crouching in my head and repeating themselves, the things he called me. Yikes. So, and to high school, he's playing, so he's playing high school ball and he's playing for the Nathan's hot dog people.

As a child, they're all players in their 20s, a lot of them are minor leaguers and he's a junior in high school. Then in his senior year, this is, you'd never see this coming and neither did Joe. March 1958 here he's in the hallway at school by his locker. Senior year. He's a big big prospect, dozen scouts at every game, all this type of thing. He gets shot in school. Like with a gun? With a a gun He gets shot in school

The newspaper says a 17 year old high school junior was accidentally shot and seriously wounded today at manual training high school classroom The wounded youth Joseph Pepitone was taken to Methodist Hospital with a bullet wound in his groin. Oh my god Yeah, Joe was the captain of the Brooklyn school's basketball team and an outstanding baseball player. So he's a good athlete. Police said Pepitone was shot accidentally by a classmate, George O'Dell, 16. How much do you think that fucking father was like, you Irish bastard, I'm going to kill you. It was not learned immediately why O'Dell was carrying the gun.

The shooting marred an otherwise quiet day at these Turbulent City schools where the recent flare-up of teenage violence resulted in the opening of two special emergency schools for troublemakers. Oh my god. Yeah, High School Nine Captain shot in class accidents, another one here. They said that this, he shot with a.38 by the way. The kid's bringing a a 38 to school a 38 of shot in the lower left chest and came out his back they said after that George O'Dell here ran from the third floor classroom to the street after the shooting then hysterical and overcome

He returned to the school and told authorities about the shooting He said he found the gun in a lot a couple of months ago and he's just been carrying it around. Kid, you don't take, you do not pick up a gun that's on the ground in public. Especially in Brooklyn. Don't put your fingerprints on that. Are you out of your mind? I was going to say, do you know how many people that's probably murdered? Yeah, that is certainly an instrument of disappearance, I promise you.

Yeah, a lot of people would drop the gun after they shot somebody. That was how they would do it. Don't touch that, for Christ's sake. You're going to prison. Holy shit. They said as he's being carried out of the school on a stretcher to the ambulance, Pepitone

said to the cops, quote, don't be hard on George. He didn't mean to do anything. It's cool. You've been shot, kid. I've been beaten worse by my father. It's really OK. This isn't so bad. They said the two boys were in a business machines class

with 16 other kids at the time of the shooting. Here is a picture, by the way. Oh boy. Peppatone on the stretcher with a cop over him. Looking up at him, going, don't worry about it. Looks just like Don Knotts, that cop, by the way. He does. He's got a, looks like he's got a black eye.

You run across Willie. I think maybe he, he didn't like the way he picked Joe up on the stretcher, Willie came over, beat the shit out of him. Just shoot my kid. You shooting my kid now, pal? No, I'm trying to save his life. Somebody else did this.

Oh man. Now this is two days after his father had a heart attack and was in the hospital. Oh boy, this is gonna give him another. So that's the problem. He said two days later, I was in another hospital on the critical list. There was a lot of trouble at the high school. He goes into that. He said two days later, I was in another hospital on the critical list. There was a lot of trouble at the high school.

He goes into that. He said, on this day, when school ended, I went to my locker to get my jacket and go home. A guy I knew named Odell was standing by the lockers with a group of people. All of a sudden, he came over to me and said, in a put on gangster voice, stick him up. I mean, hey, stick him up, see?

Pulled the trigger. He said, I looked down and there was a gun in his hand. A.38. It's muzzle inches from my belly. Hey, I said staring into the cylinder and seeing bullets in them. That thing's loaded. What the fuck? What are you doing?

Bang. It went off. The sound echoing through the corridor. I didn't even know I was shot. I didn't feel a thing. I just stood there looking down and saw the hole in my shirt near the lower edge of my rib cage I picked up my shirt and there was a hole in my skin circled by what looked like a bruise but there was no blood I reached my hand behind me and felt my back sliding over the flesh in search of a hole then I felt it my fingers meeting the slippery wetness

all around the aperture I looked at my hand and it was smeared with blood. I fell to my knees, still not feeling pain, only a queasiness in my stomach like I was going to throw up. Just then a woman teacher ran up behind me and tugged the back of my collar. Alright you, she said sternly, give me those firecrackers. He's bleeding to death. I'm shot, ma'am. Oh man. Odell had run off crying, but one of the other guys said, he's been shot. Oh, my god, the woman said, seeing the hole in my shirt.

Lie down. You better lie down. Well, this is going to get worse. Oh, man. I was on my knees in shock, but I didn't think lying down in this corridor was going to do a whole lot of good for a gunshot wound. Then the teacher said, no, we've got to get you to the nurse.

Can you walk? The nurse. The nurse. With help, I made it down to the nurse. Can you walk the nurse the nurse with help? I made it down to the nurses office She took one look at me help me lie on the table with the long sheet of white paper covering it and called for an ambulance That should have been done a while ago probably yeah Can you fix this no no obviously does he have a headache does he have a stomach? I know I can't I have aspirin here

Aspirin and Pepto-Bismol. I have some gauze, not even a lot, like a little bit. Like if a kid cuts their finger in shop class, as long as it's not too deep, I can maybe get it back. A kid just left with the last day's bandage. We're fucked. That's it. We're fucked.

We got nothing. Jesus Christ. She placed her hand on my forehead and asked, how do you feel? I told her, I don't feel any pain. And the minute I said it, I remembered something I'd heard one of my aunts say when a member of the family was very sick. If you don't feel no pain, that's when it's bad. I tell you, that's when it's very bad.

And that's when I got very scared. A few minutes later, there was a priest at my side with a purple stole draped around his neck. He had come to administer last r Last rights at school. Oh my god. Are you sorry for all your sins of your past life my son? It's what he said. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I said panicking and beginning my confession Quote father. I didn't go to the store for my mother like I told her I would father. I played with myself. Then I broke it off Wondering out loud. What if I don't get it all out in time father tell you everything right now father I left a naked girl on a fire escape father I thought a bush would give me diseases she's soaking wet

and the kids mother I lied to this. I shot fireworks at another kid. This is awesome. What if I don't get it all out, Father? Yeah, set people on fire. The priest reassured me and finished giving me last rites. Now I was really afraid and I lay there thinking all kinds of weird things. I remember having heard my mother and another woman in my family say, all Italians,

as all Italians seem to then, that just before you die, you see the face of Christ. I put my hand over my eyes. He didn't wanna see Christ. I don't wanna see Christ, I'm not dying. Get outta here, Jesus, go. I'm not ready yet. You can't get me.

Can't get me, ha ha. Got my fingers over my eyes. The ambulance took me to Methodist Hospital and they operated to close up everything and the bullet, everything the bullet had torn inside of me. I was in surgery for nine hours. Wow. Wow. I'd been lucky, the doctor told me afterward.

The bullet had struck a rib and careened out my lower back. Fantastic. Missed everything. Yeah. He said missing three vital organs by inches. I was on the critical list for six days and in the hospital for 12. Shit. That's fucking wild.

He said it was so stupid because he said this kid had just, he found this rusty gun down by the docks and he'd just been carrying it around with him because he thought it was cool. And it was loaded, man. Yeah, it was loaded. That's crazy. So he said that after a few days, this was a few days after the heart attack, by the way,

then on Good Friday, a few days later, his father dies. Oh, no way. Yeah, Willie's dead. He said his father had never been sick a day, but he fell down with a heart attack. Give him three days, he might come right back. Who knows, he might beat the shit out of the doctor. How dare you try to stitch up my heart?

Yeah, he said at one point he said he was so sad because he said I'd wished he'd die. I really wished he'd die. And then he actually did die and he felt bad because he said he would never forgive himself and he'd be sick with guilt. He said, you know, this is terrible. So that's how he's done it. The guy was so high strung. Yes.

He's beating the shit out of everybody. He doesn't know how to deal with stress or anger. Of course he's going to explode. Just rage. Everything is rage. I don't know how your heart could stand that after a while. Right, at all. No.

So right after this too, there's an article seven arraigned in school shooting. So George O'Dell, who accidentally shot Joseph Pepitone, told police he found the revolver in a lot, but on subsequent questioning, he revealed that the weapon was lent to him by Owen Cunningham, another Brooklyn kid, another student at the high school here. After further investigation, the cops brought in other people here. They bring in Michael Levens, who's 22 and a semi-pro baseball player, Vincent Leone of eight, who's 18 years old, Joey Palladino, 19, here, John Morris, 19, Alfonso Guadino, 17, and Henry Paulus, 16. And they said that Levin said he bought the cult in Albany, Georgia

last year and sold it to Leon for $25 in December. So he didn't find it, he didn't borrow it, he bought it from a guy last December. Leon said that he lent the gun to the others at one time or another while being questioned he flared up and punched and kicked Detective Leo RousTow resulting in an additional charge of felonious assault. This is the best neighborhood ever. What do you say? You say it's not allowed?

I'll punch you, you son of a bitch. This is a child that did this. Leon is 18 years old for Christ's sake. He's punching a detective while being questioned because a kid got shot. Odell was held in $10,000 each on felonious assault and gun charges. Bon was fixed for Levens and the five others on the weapons count.

Holy shit, that's amazing. Pepitone shot in the chest was described in fair condition. And yeah. So that is fucking amazing and goddamn hilarious, I would say here. There's, by the way, an article right below this that's pretty crazy. The headline is, Boy 11 tells how he lured two children to river and drowned them. Well, I'm glad they got him.

Jesus Christ, what? George Jones. This is crazy. Because of petty grudges, an 11 year old fifth grader twice lured smaller children a girl for and a boy seven onto West Side Piers and then pushed them to their deaths in the Hudson River. He's a fucking serial killer and 11 years old. 11 year old George Jones then goes on to play some of the greatest culture music of all time.

And then he does well that's what he gets because he goes to jail at such a young age. Yeah. You know it's a lot of life experience. He had a lot to sing about. He said that he confessed. Nonchalantly he explained his grudges. The girl had told tales about him to his mother. And the boy had failed to pay him a promised dime. A dime? He killed two of them?

He killed a seven year old over a dime. Wow. Wow. The confessed double killer, George Jones, a stocky swaggering little character who enjoyed reenacting one of the death scenes was booked for juvenile delinquency homicide in children's court and was remanded to youth house in the Bronx spending pending further hearing that. Wow. Imagine I want to know how long he stayed and what he did after that. No shit, man. What a bad kid. I assumed killed more people.

He was like, yeah, then I killed this child. Let me show you how I did it. It was awesome. If he did it over a dime, yeah, he'd do way worse. He didn't even feel bad. No. He was just nonchalant. So he talks about Joe in his book.

We'll get back to baseball here. He said, the bullet wound caused 10 of the scouts to drop off. Only the Phillies, Dodgers and Yankees were still interested in me. When the bidding got up to 25,000, the Phillies withdrew. And although I'd grown up only a little over a mile away from Ebbets Field and had gone to a lot of Dodger games before they moved to the West Coast, I'd always been a Yankee fan. That's just kind of normal. My father had been a Yankee fan and my uncle Louie, who started me playing ball, was a Yankee fan as that's just kind of normal. My father had been a Yankee fan and my uncle Louie who started me playing ball was a Yankee fan.

If I hadn't picked them, Louie would have given me a shot in the head. So even his career ramifications are subjective, a punch in the head from a family member. Which one you like, you know it's gonna happen. Oh God, the Yankees put me through a physical examination. I was judged fit and on August 3rd 1958 I signed with them for a $25,000 bonus which was about like 250 grand now

Which back then was a huge money I mean the the top players in the game then like your Mickey Mantle or your Willie Mays made a hundred thousand dollars a year Back then and that was he's getting to about a million now, which still isn't a lot for a ballplayer. He's getting a quarter of that as a bonus. It's a big, it's just huge money. That's his dad, that's fucking almost four years of his dad working. That's a lot. So he said, I'm sure that in the years since then,

the Yankees have wished they'd examined my head and been able to see the terrifying guilt, the compulsive rebellion against authority and the need to be loved that led me down so many bizarre and painful tracks. Jesus Christ. At least he gets it. So he said, When I signed with the Yankees, I was told I wouldn't play until after the 1958 season at the Florida Instructional School.

I was disappointed. But about 10 days later, I got a call from the front office saying the Yankees Class D farm team in Auburn, New York needed an outfielder for the last few weeks of the season. Would I like to be that outfielder? It was like asking a dog with weak kidneys if he'd like a tree. He said I went right out and bought myself a brand new Thunderbird in my mother's name of course because I wouldn't be 18 until October and didn't even have a driver's license. A 58 Thunderbird?

Yep brand new, no driver's license. Hell yeah. Oh it's fucking beautiful. This is awesome. He said I talked her into it and she went along with me after all I'd been through. Like come on Mike, I get punched in the head all the time and finally something decent happens to me. She was probably tired of rubbing my back to help me get to sleep. I also bought several $250 silk suits.

Sleek, very tightly cut like the younger sharper racket guys wore then. That's expensive for a suit back then. That's like a $3,000 suit now. I never gave a thought to the fact that I'd spent some $5,000 in one day. That's a lot. That's a good day. He said, hell, as far as I could tell, I was rich. Not yet, Joe. He said, I rubbed Neats foot oil on my gloves, packed my bags, and the next day I was off

to join the Auburn club of the New York Pennsylvania league. Joe Pepitone, age 17 from the Park Slope section of Brooklyn, property of the New York Yankees, perennial world champions, sitting tall behind the wheel of a sparkling new T-es, perennial world champions, sitting tall behind the wheel of a sparkling new T-bird, was on his way. He's doing fucking great. So August 13th, 1958, Pepitone agreed to play for the, he's going there for Auburn. There he sees 16 games and bats 321. Hell yeah.

Not bad. By the way, the 225 grand in 1958 is equal to $229,290.49. Unreal. And back then that was even more than that is now. After the Auburn season I went home until the instructional school began. Then I drove off to St. Petersburg. On the way I kept passing these boat dealers. Oh no. You can't pull a boat with a fucking thunderbird. I began slowing down when I saw one coming up so I

could look at the neat looking speed boats. I started imagining myself behind the wheel of one. He's 17. He needs speed boats and fucking thunderbirds. This is fucking amazing. I started imagining myself skiing behind one. You can't pull one with a thunderbird. Well, I stopped at the next dealer and bought one. And then what? He said, hell, I was on my way to Florida, which has water around most of it. Yeah, that's true. All of it, except for the, yeah.

The dealer attached a trailer hitch to my T-bird and I told him to just stow the water skis life preserver and the rest of the gear I bought just in the boat. Just throw it on in there. It won't blow out or anything. This is awesome. Needless to say, when I pulled up to the Yankees headquarters, management didn't waste a great deal of time informing me that they've never had a ball player, much less a rookie with all of 16 games experience, report to them towing a boat

He said he had a German Shepherd standing on the bow when he pulled into like he had his dog there He put the dog in the boat. Yeah, come on. He's got skis He said they gave me 24 hours to sell my virgin craft But I didn't understand why they had to get so excited about it. They didn't even like it. You got to sell. I'm sure he lost a shitload of money on the boat, too.

He had to sell it then. He can't just bring it back. Oh man. The New York Daily News was praising him as an outstanding Brooklyn baseball prospect. He's getting all sorts of stuff. His manager up in Auburn said,'m delighted with young pepitone He came here with no pro experience. We signed him right out of Brooklyn's manual high school But the boy loves to play ball and has shown surprising power

Yeah, he said about this a coal thing quote. I never thought about anything I was a stickball player and my brother's team needed an outfielder I went there and hit three home runs in one game on a high school field and I was 14 years old." He talked about the scout. He said, I was just having fun. Baseball allowed me to get away from my strict father. My friends partied their asses off and I couldn't do anything. And when my father died at 39 years old, I was free. My mother couldn't hold me back. Nobody could. I got a $25,000 bonus when I signed with the Yankees and I almost spent the whole bonus on my way down to spring training. Buying a car and a boat, bought

a dog and put it in the boat and he was barking all the way down to spring training. You just got the dog. He bought it and was like, there you go, stay in that boat. And he's just collecting things and putting them in the boat. Water skis and stuff, got that, throw that in the boat. Turning it like a motor home. Pick up a chick, throw her in the boat. You're going to have to ride in the boat. I'm sorry. Everything goes in the boat. Water skis and stuff, got that, throw that in the boat. Turning it like a motor home. Pick up a chick, throw her in the boat. You're going to have to ride in the boat. I'm sorry. Everything goes in the boat. I'm going to Florida and I need a wife. Get in. Jesus Christ. So Joe DiMaggio was working down there for the Yankees that year.

That's a legend, especially if you're Italian. He's fucking like Italian God like you don't have any idea like oh I can't even tell it like bigger than Frank Sinatra bigger than any of them. It's fucking Joe They had songs about him and at 58 he wasn't playing with it. He wasn't he retired in 53 already done, huh? He's already done. Yeah. Well Christy started his rookie year was what 37 I think Wow, and he was in he went to World War two for three years also in between there So he was about done. Joe was also yeah, he wasn't gonna look bad That was his thing if he couldn't play center field and look graceful anymore. He wasn't playing anymore. What was he banging Monroe? After that after that after he retired he started fucking her and got married to her

So DiMaggio says about Pepitone quote Joe DiMaggio swear to God he asked. Oh, this is what DiMaggio askedaggio says about Pepitone, quote, Joe DiMaggio, swear to God, he asked, oh, this is what DiMaggio asked Pepitone, quote, Joe DiMaggio, I swear to God, he asked me, are you here to play ball or for a vacation? A little of both, I told him. He got a boat. Next day, everything was gone. They took everything back. And that's the way it was, even when I made it to the majors. It was fun. and my father wasn't around to knock the shit out of me. So I did what I wanted to.

It was all in front of me, man. Okay, let's go round this out with a couple of lady stories here. There's a lady apparently, this lady named Carmen, that it's weird. She would like dance with guys. You get, you buy tickets and then you dance with this broad. What? Yeah, I don't know if she was like a prostitute or what her deal was, but I'm not sure. But he said I just sat there watching Carmen rub against that old guy on the dance floor.

They danced for almost an hour. I kept looking at the clock waiting. Finally she went and sat at a table But the guy sat with her shit I thought staring at them waiting for him to leave then I just stood up and walked over to her Carmen you want to dance I got more tickets. I held them out to her semi pleading I I guess later She said I can't stay too late. I said well. I'll see you later She said not even looking up at me. When are you gonna? Take me? I got to be home before 12 He says she says go back to your table what is this he said hey what's the matter you don't like me anymore yeah she said go back to your

table so he said you said you were gonna take me home and and teach and he starts trailing off she's the guy then jumped up and said, look, kid, get your ass away from here. But she said, and he said, the guy stood up and pushed me. I said, get the hell out of here. Two bouncers hustled over, and one of them grabbed my arm. The next thing I knew, my seven friends came running over and pushed the bouncers off me. What a fight.

Chairs over, tables over, people yelling, girls girls screaming They wrapped us around a little bit and we ran toward the door ran toward the door there So apparently after all of this He ended up back in the club They didn't like kick everybody out. Okay. Yeah, is this like a strip club? What is I don't know what the deal is He's getting baseball tickets and paying with baseball tickets to all these girls so he said He got some more tickets, but then when?

But Carmen was then dancing with somebody else. Oh, anyway, so the fall fight happens He says when we got to the door, they didn't even bother to chase us I turned around and yelled to Carmen, you fucking cunt! You lied! He said that was one of the biggest things you could do then, tell a girl she was a fucking cunt. It still is Joe! That's one of the biggest things you could do. That's one of the biggest things you could do. All the way home on the subway I was bragging

to my friends, you hear me call her a fucking cunt? Right to her face! I called her, did you see it? I was bragging to my friends. You hear me call her a fucking cunt right to her face Yeah, Joe you really told her off they said He said growing up in Brooklyn was a lot like an East Side comedy all the guys were crazy came on like big shots I remember when the oldest guy in our gang got a car All we did for weeks was drive around and yell at girls when we'd see a girl walking along The big thing was to pull up next to her stop and say, Hey, you get over here. Then, then if they paused and came toward you, can I get into your pants or what? Classy. That was the big thing to do. It's the big thing to do. And then he called them a fucking cunt. If they don't, if they say,

no, you just say, what are you a cunt? What are you? What are you a cunt? What are you a nice girl? You a cunt you pull at your Volta line Saturday night fever he said of course 98.2 percent of the girls would just walk away or say get away from me you fucking pigs But I'll never forget this one chick there were six of us in the car Can I get into your pants or what the chick put her hand on her hip and said okay? How many of you do I have to take on? Jesus. Jesus Christ. The guy who was driving through the car in gear and shot away. Jesus Christ. He said there must be something wrong with her. She knew how to get rid of them. That's what it was. She figured it out. Yeah. It's either

run away from us or you just stand there and go, let's all fuck. And then every one of them are going to be like, not that one, Jesus. Let's go, dick's out everybody, they're all gonna drive away. Pull them out boys. Get them out, whip them out. Here is, we'll end on this here, a prank that he pulled with some of his teammates here.

So, he said that a friend of his there had a hopped up Chevy that he liked to keep finely tuned and we hung around a local speed shop for a while. We got to know the owner real well and liked to kid around with him. Then Rich came up with this brilliant idea one day. He got two masks. See where this is going? Oh my God. Two toy pistols that look like the real thing and decided we would pull a fake hold up of the speed shop just for laughs. The owner would get a kick out of it. What is? Why are you doing this?

I don't understand. Don't do this. Let's pretend to go armed robbery. Yeah, armed robbery is the gag. Isn't that fun? Put him up, all right, well. Jesus, he got shot like that like a year and a half ago. You'd think he'd be like,

I don't know, that'll make people uncomfortable. I didn't like having a gun pointed at me. Just kidding, it is not a gag No, he said we walked in masks on guns out and said this is a hold-up turn around and lean against the wall Mm-hmm the trouble started yeah when they got guns, too No, no when a passerby looked in the window Oh shit And ran in the street and flagged down a police car that happened

to be driving by. Two cops ran in with drawn guns followed within seconds by the occupants of two other squad cars. They snapped handcuffs on us, pushed us up against the wall. We yanked off our masks and said, wait a minute, we can explain. This is all a joke. It's not real. Not real.

That's not cops don't want to hear that shit. I didn't mean it is not. No. That's not an excuse. Well, he said the cops didn't think so. Even after the shop owner identified us, they went, well, you still can't pretend to arm Rob. You're going to jail.

He said we had to call Steve Sochuk, who was forced to come down and verify that we were players in the Yankee organization. Otherwise we would have gone to jail which is so for other Yankees and they'd let him go back then yeah isn't that amazing unbelievable show show shock just shook his head and said I'll shook his head like he didn't know what to do with us I guess it was a good thing that we had shown some ability on the ball field and he did with the Fargo-Moorhead twins in the Class C Northern League in 1959. He had 123 games, 283 batting average, 35 doubles, 12

triples, 14 homers, 87 ribbies. It's a very good year. And that jumped him up to Class A ball the next year, which is the top one. This is before single, double, triple A here. And the Binghamton Triplets of the Eastern League. So he ends up, well, we should leave off there because there's a whole bunch of weird sex stuff coming up. And mob guys offering to kill Muskaorin to get him a starting job. So there's a lot going on in the next edition here. Joe Pepitone, as you can tell,

this'll be a multi-part, or probably get, there'll probably be three parts, I would imagine this will be. Because there's, how do you skip over any of that stuff that we just talked about? Do you think, how do I go through a book and go, Willie came down and beat up a baseball team and caused a riot in the stands?

Well, I'll skip over that, that's not related to baseball. He called it, I guess, a stripper. Maybe she was just one of those piano ladies. Called her a cunt right to her face. Yeah, for not dancing with him. Did you hear me? Call her a cunt right to her face. He's proud of it. There's some real weird stuff coming up, including some very illegal things as well coming up in the future here. So we'll talk about all that and more on the next episode here, starting out with working out with the Yankees.

So next episode, we'll start out with actually Casey Stengel and Mickey Mantle and those guys. Yeah, it's going to be some fun stuff, and the pranks and everything get even crazier from there. So we'll check all that out and more next week. But while you're listening, you should definitely give us a review on whatever app you're listening on. It doesn't matter what app it is.

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I swear here. Anybody $5 a month or above, you get hundreds of back episodes immediately that you've never heard before, bonus stuff that's never been public. And then after that, you're going to get new episodes, two new episodes every other week, one crime and sports, one small town murder. This week is no different. This week, which you're going to get for crime and sports, we're going to talk about the whole Otani gambling disaster here. This debacle. I've never seen an investigation just be like, oh, ball concluded, all that guy's fault, moving on so fast. We got to get it wrapped up before opening day. Oh, we got it. All the facts. Wow. Isn that, what a lucky coincidence. I think that might be some bullshit.

And then other gambling incidents too that aren't Pete Rose. We'll talk about Alex Karras in the, Alex Karras is the guy who, Mongo. Oh. That's Mongo and the guy that adopted Webster. He was wrestling, or he was gambling? Yeah, yeah, he was a football player

and he had some, yeah, he got banned from the league for a year. Yeah, he's Webster's dad. Yep, and Paul Horning to same thing happened to him in the same year We'll talk about that then for small town murder. We're gonna talk about some serious conspiracy theory rabbit Oh shit. Let's talk about some real Far-fetched shit that people have brought whole books about okay was Charles Manson in the CIA Or at least a CIA asset that was working to de-whatever, the hippie movement, was that it? Was that what it was?

And also other CIA related murder things we'll talk about there. We'll go way down the rabbit hole and have lots of fun with that. So, patreon.com slash crime and sports is where you get all of that. And you get a shout out. When does that shout out happen? Oh, right now. Right fucking now, Jimmy. Hit me with him like I've just pissed Willie off

and he's seeking revenge like I've pissed his son off. Hit me with him right now. This week's executive producers are Jordan Bennett, Haley Walls, Thomas Smith. Happy birthday, Thomas. Happy birthday. Sherry Blythe and Kyle Norwig got himself a mortgage. Good for you.

Hey, good for you. And Denali York. thank you all so much for everything you do for us. You are terrific. Other producers this week are Sophie Content. Content, content, content, content. Be careful, Jimmy, careful with that one. She said it's cuntent.

This is one of our patrons, Jimmy. Let's not, let's keep it light. Janice Hill, Rhea Sparks Tuesday Mize Jason Munch Nick Jamison Mitch Keller be calorie Kate Clark Blake layman Laura Rhodes Terry with no last name Helena K Joe divine Denise Brice ford Michaela Holtz claw Genesaurus XO Ray honor Shannon Shannon Hall Megan O'Neil, Maxine with no last name, Adam Angeloff,

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They may be sick, they have charities. Jonathan Emerson, John Britton, Sarah Noah, Sarah Noah, Tony the Guitar Geek, Art Vandeley, Bro Mahaj, what? Missy, Missy Grenolds, Grenolds? Is that a real last name? Is it, is it, is it Reynolds and I fucked that up? It's possible.

The G is right. Have you ever heard Petra Gallo before? Could be, could be a name, you don't know. Andy Tees, Kathy with no last name, Mackenzie with no last name, Stacey Arguello, Deke or Dyke or Dick, I'm not sure. One of the three. Let's go Deke.

Probably. Marcy Barger, Aaron Adkins, Stephanie Kite, Puccino, Bellini, Ailey, Ailey would know last name, Allie, it's probably Allie, Wu Beat, Prinnie, Prinnie Miller, Markeith, no it's Markeith, that's a cool name. Markeith I've heard. Yeah, I think there's a murderer named Markeith.

There's an offensive lineman named Markeith too. Yeah, there's a Markeith, there's a investigation,ith, there's an investigation, discovery, interrogation, where his fucking eyes hangin' out of his face, because they tackled him. Yes, yes, yes. That guy's name's Markeith. Yes, yes, yes.

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All right, that might be two first names, I'm not sure. Kevin Carroll, Billy Sale, could be, maybe her last name's Ellen even. Laura Barton, Kim Casto, Morgan W. Con-Clexity Crops. Con-Clexity, all right, Con-Clexity. Oh. Morgan with no last name, Jamie LaFoya, like the lady from ESPN, is it?

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You wonderful, wonderful, crazy bastards. We appreciate it. Bastards. Bastards. And then we come and punch you. Thanks you bastard pow. Yeah People the only people who might be bastards is if anybody complains that there was no actual arrests this on this episode because You have you've also heard of more crime than any five episodes put together so far

Yeah, we had the most crime ever just because it went under the police radar who gives a shit We found out about all of it So and there's plenty of dumb shit coming up and arrests and just funny stuff when you hear him when talking about losing his hair. It's hilarious. He's a fucking mess and so are we. So thank you for joining us. Thank you so much for hanging out with us and we will be back next week with part two. Make sure to listen to small town murder and your stupid opinions of course because it's fucking hilarious. Keep doing that, keep coming back, follow us on social media. The links are on the website there. Have

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