Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson - ANDY RICHTER — dating app happy endings and being Conan O’Brien’s ‘TV wife’

Episode Date: September 10, 2024

Actor, comedian, and podcast host Andy Richter joins the show. Over lobster rolls and oysters, Andy talks about healing from the dissolution of his nearly 30-year marriage, finding love on the apps, and what it’s like being Conan O’Brien’s “TV wife.” This episode was recorded at Connie & Ted’s in West Hollywood, CA. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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from his podcast, Three Questions with Andy Richter, it's, you guessed it, Andy Richter. I was relied far too much upon as a child, so I never knew that feeling of like, I enjoy freedom, I enjoy servitude. This is Dinners on Me, and I'm your host, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Doing talk shows has never been my favorite thing. It's an honor to be asked, but also the experience can often feel like being shot out of a cannon. I find that being a good guest, and I actually think I am a good guest, is a bit of an art form.

You have a comically short amount of time, usually 4-7 minutes, to come out, tell a few stories, promote whatever you are on the show to promote, make some jokes, maybe play a game or two. For me, a successful appearance means being charming but not cloying, funny but not crass, subversive but not cloying, funny but not crass, subversive but not overly controversial. All this while being true to myself and having good chemistry with the host. I don't know maybe this sounds easy to other people but for me it feels like a challenge on the squid game. While on

Modern Family I think I was a guest on just about every late night show that was running from Leno to Letterman, Kimmel to Fallon, Colbert to Conan. And Conan was always one of my favorite shows to do, not only because it felt comforting to talk to a fellow self-effacing redhead, but also because of the presence of Conan's friendly sidekick, Andy Richter.

Now calling Andy a sidekick feels dismissive to the chemistry he's brought to all three of Conan O'Brien's talk shows. I was always so happy to appear on his shows because it never felt like work, and so much of that great energy was because of Andy Richter. I would just show up and have a good time. I got to spend a little bit more time with Andy recently when I was a guest on his very popular podcast, Three Questions with Andy Richter.

It was just so great getting to know him on a deeper level as a guest on his turf. I knew after our chat, I wanted to dig even deeper with him and have him as a guest on my podcast. It's the circle of hosts. You can approach in three minutes, please. We're just having a conversation. For free food. Oh no, you're paying.

What? Did you bring your wallet? I have Apple Pay. I brought Andy to Connie and Ted's in West Hollywood, which is owned by restaurateur Michael Cimarusti, who Angelenos might also know from his other LA restaurant, the Michelin-starred Providence. Connie and Ted's is inspired by his East Coast upbringing. His grandfather was a fisherman in Rhode Island.

With nautical knickknacks in the modern, sun-drenched space, it serves a sort of upscale clamshack feel. You come to Connie and Ted's for the classics, oysters, clams, crabs, and of course lobster, which is flown in specially from Massachusetts twice a week. The spot is a favorite of Andy's, so I thought, why not bring him someplace where he feels right at home? Okay, let's get to the conversation. How old are your kids?

Well, four, and Coco's four, right? Yes. Yeah, your stepdaughter. Yeah, well she's mine, she's legal now, she's mine. I adopted her, yeah. Oh, that's wonderful, congratulations. Thank you, thank you very much. Yeah, four, and then my younger one is,

he'll be two in November, so what's the math there? 21 months or something? Something like that, yeah. I don't know. Yeah, yeah, that's close together though. But yeah, so I- It's a lot of work. It is a lot of work.

Yeah. How has it been, like But yeah, so I- It's a lot of work. It is a lot of work. Yeah. How has it been like having a four year old, you've already been through it once, twice. Yeah, in some ways it's easy and in some ways, and in some ways it's embarrassing how, not so much now, people are used to it, but when people started to find out that, cause my older kids are 23 and 18,

people would act as if I was some act of heroism on my part. And I'm like, well first of all, it's like, dad has it a lot easier than mom. Like, I fell in love with somebody that has a kid, I like raising kids. And the sort of secret part that I felt like nobody was realizing is that like,

for I haven't like 16 to 18 years of not having to make any decisions. You know, like this child has freed me from my greatest existential fear, which is what should I do with myself right now? Like what do I do now? I've never been good at answering that question. And so now it's like, oh my, on Saturday,

what am I gonna do with my Saturday? I'm gonna take care of this child, you know? It's so interesting, because for some people, for many people, that exact thing is what is terrifying that they don't have that freedom to like do whatever they wanna do. I, luckily I was, I was relied far too much upon as a child, so I never knew that feeling of I enjoy freedom,

I enjoy servitude. I enjoy. That was fine. Get you started on lunch today. Would you care for something to drink? We have sparkling Saratatoga still water. Yeah, actually sparkling water sounds really good for me. Okay.

An iced tea please. An iced tea it is. Yes. Good to see you again, we haven't seen you in a while. Thank you, I know, I moved to Pasadena, so I. Make a little hike. It's a little bit of a hike, yeah. Well thank you for making it over.

And I also. Good to see you, Jesse. I married somebody with a small child, so I don't do anything anymore. Going out to dinner is. You take a seat And I also, I married somebody with a small child, so I don't do anything anymore. Going out to dinner is, I know, I know. Going out to dinner though is like, and also I married a vegetarian, so that puts a grim. You're throwing a lot at us right now.

Yeah, yeah, well you know. And you're placing blame everywhere but yourself. The reason I haven't been here is not my fault. It's not my fault. We did have a selection of oysters coming out. Nice. So I hope you'll enjoy what Chef Sam is selecting for you guys. I will eat whatever you put out.

And then after that we're going to give you a selection of Connie and Ted's iconic dishes. Great. They'll come after that. So beautiful. I'm so hungry. Give us questions, let us know. Thank you. Thank you so much. I also moved recently.

I'm an Encino now. Oh, okay. You have good food in Pasadena. Because you had a nice, you had a beautiful house. In Los Feliz. Was it too small? I wouldn't say it was too small. It was too many stairs for my growing family.

I see, I see. You know, Rashida Jones was my neighbor in Los Feliz. Yeah. And she brings her son in and immediately she's like, nope, and she just sort of like, she kept picking him up, like no, not over there, not over there. And I was seeing in live time, like how impossible it would be to maybe proof this house.

Yes. It was like beautiful wrought iron work with like these curling like spikes. I was like, oh, that's a place where you can like literally fish hook yourself. Yeah. I was like, oh, I'm a place where you can like, literally fish hook yourself. I was like, oh, I'm seeing this in a whole different light now. That's the thing. When you get a little toddler who runs around

and who like is just a danger machine, constantly picking things up and putting it in their mouth. You go places like, the first time I went to Disneyland with a little kid, with my son, I realized your life is defined by how far you can let your child get away from you without having to freak out. Yeah.

And at Disneyland, you can let them get 50, 75 yards away and you can see them. I dropped them off at the gate and just said, see you at eight. Here you go. It was 20 bucks a piece. Good luck. We did an episode of Modern Family at Disneyland and my storyline with Eric Stone Street was that we were panicked about losing Lily

and we had her on a leash at Disneyland and how all the other parents were judging us. But then we met another set of parents with their kids on the leash as well and we're having a conversation with them but the kids are getting all tangled up like dogs would if you're walking them on the sidewalk. And we're constantly stepping over the leash,

like, taking behind our back, trying to untangle. And it was just this physical comedy that we thought was so funny. But now that I have a kid, I'm like, oh, I get the allure of a leash. I mean, I haven't gotten to that point yet. And I think I'm pretty good about keeping up on these things.

I think that they're still pretty controversial. Yes, they definitely are. And I have a twin brother and sister. They're actually my half brother and sister, but they're nine years younger than me. And I mean, there was no sort of like, mom will take care of them. It was immediately, I was like handed a baby

with a full diaper and like, here change this child. You know? So my brother, my older brother and I definitely were very much involved. And there were times when we would, not all the time, but there were times when we'd be like, we gotta break out the leashes. And we would have them on like, it was like, you know,

when people walk two dogs together. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, but I mean, but at a certain point, it's like, I don't care. and we would have them on. It was like when people walk two dogs together. We gave them a lot of slack. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But at a certain point, it's like, I don't care. Yeah, when you're outnumbered, it truly is. It's like, well, your job is to keep them alive. I was introduced to the, oh shit, my child is gone, at like age 11 or 12.

Yeah, yeah, it's way too young to be dealing with that. Yeah. Where did you meet Jim? We met on Hinge. We met online. Yeah, it was my first real experience doing that. I, you know, I split up with my wife and it took, you know, I mean, it was, it was, you know,

it was the worst thing I've ever been through. You've been very open about how that affected you and sort of gutted you. We'd been together for 27 years and married for 25. So it was just, it was awful. And moving out of the house that I lived at with my kids was just the absolute worst part. And I talked to my sister, my younger sister who'd been divorced, and she said, she's like, well, it'll take really a long time before you feel settled down enough to really kind of even feel like in any way serious about getting back together

with somebody. So, you know, it's a couple of three years. And I was like, what? Yeah. I don't have time for that. I mean, you know? So, but she was right. It did, it took a while.

What was that experience like? Was it hard? It was, well, it was exciting in some ways because it was like just the notion of something new. But yeah, I mean, it was nerve wracking and it was kind of terrifying. And you know, you feel like an old shoe, you know? Like, it's not, like, you don't feel like, hi.

Hi guys, hello. Oysters incoming. Oysters for you. Thank you. Do you have any kind of Tabasco-y, hot saucy kind of- God, the demands just don't stop. Well, it kills the E. coli. You can't yell at people. Well, listen, thank you so much.

Yes, so kindly. Thank you. Thank you. So, yes, so we met on Hinge, and I had been dating, but I just kinda, well, sort of stuck a little bit. And thought, well, and you know what? Was that the first time you signed up for the app? Yeah, well no, that's not entirely true. My friend Nikki Glaser, the comedian.

Yeah, I know Nikki. Shortly after I split up, Nikki said, oh, you gotta get on Raya, you know, the one that's like supposedly celebrity. There's like a waiting list to get on ahead. Yeah, and you have to be okayed to be in on it. She said, I'll recommend you. And I said, okay.

And I, I, she recommended me and I signed up. And I was in no position to self-examine and like write cute little things about myself. Cause I just felt like I'm an old shoe, you know? Like I'm garbage. What kind of music do I like? Garbage music. And it was also, you had to pick a piece of music,

and everything I plugged in was just too old. It was like, I couldn't find anything. Ba-ba-da-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba. No, I mean, just like, but I mean like Aretha Franklin or I don't know. They didn't even have these songs that I was putting in. So I don't even remember what I settled on. God, I'm desperate to know. I think like, I think I settled on an Al Green,

which I felt was much too forward, you know, cause that's like a, come on baby, let's go. Is that like, let's get it on? Yeah, a little bit. Yeah, yeah, but I don't think it was that, but. But, um. So funny. And I put it together, finally, and I'm like, and I pick photos of yourself, which is truly.

Oh, that's the worst. I mean, I hate even submitting a headshot. Oh, it's just, I can't. So I picked the photos and I kind of send it up and then I was kind of browsing through and I realized, oh, I thought I just had made it and was saving it, but it was like, it was out. And in circulating, and it was only about a half an hour

but I was like, yeah, delete, delete. And you weren't ready. Squashed the whole thing. And I just couldn't. It was my first experience. And this held true a little bit to Hinge too, but I felt like if you went by Raya, you would think that in Los Angeles,

at any given time, there were like a hundred women in their 40s leaping in the surf joyously. And I was just like, this is not my crowd. But I really, I mean, Jan and I, it was very short time that I was even on the thing and I met her, because we went out on a couple of dates and then she came over to my house and I cooked her dinner,

which is, you know, I understand the power of that. And you know. It's very powerful. And then I just started hanging out at her house and I met her daughter and I started finding myself driving home feeling very, very happy. And like I say, a way that snuck up on me. And a big deal to me,

that a realization that crept up on me about her too is that she did not need me. Like she had a full, like she has her own business. She has a career that she's been, you know, involved in for years and years, does well, is well respected in her community, decided to have a baby and had a baby on her own, you know? Like I never had to, I never felt any kind of pressure to behave a certain way or be anybody other than myself.

And I never... I didn't have that with other people that I dated, you know? Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, Andy tells me about how his dad came out to him when he was a kid, his relationship with depression, and a therapist he's been with since the early 90s. Sounds like a good therapist. Okay, be right back. When you're hiring, it feels amazing to finally close out a job search.

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So join us every week on The New Yorker Radio Hour, wherever you listen to podcasts. wherever you listen to podcasts. And we're back with more Dinners on Me. I always think about people who have had really long relationships or long marriages and then have decided to end them. And I don't know, I feel like there's still, I don't consider that a failure of marriage. I don't either. I consider, you know, I mean,

you have two beautiful children from this and you spent a quarter of a century, you know, building a life with someone. I think that's really remarkable. Thank you. And that's what I felt when I kind of made a public announcement about it. I considered it a success because it's hard.

It's really hard, and the notion that you're gonna get together with somebody and it's gonna be forever, that's just, it's kind of a, you know. Well, it's an unfair. It's a bit of a strange concept. Yes, I's an unfair. It's a weird, it's a bit of a strange concept. It's, you know. I think it's stifling a flame before it has chance even.

Like, don't put those expectations on anything. Yeah, yeah. And you know, if it works out, that's great. And if it doesn't, you know, you have to, and I'm sure, you know, I know heartbreak is also a huge part of that. And when you have to let something like that go, it's very devastating as well.

I mean, I know your parents were divorced at a young age. My parents also were divorced. I was older when that happened. And I consider their marriage a success. You know, I have myself and my two siblings to, they have us to show for it. But you know, I also saw them go through a lot of heartbreak too and it's.

Are they okay with each other now? Yeah, yeah, yeah, they are. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, my folks split up because my dad came out, because my dad's gay. And so it's, it was like, it's a different sort of, Right. It's its own special form of divorce. But they, you know, they maintained a friendship for,

you know, I mean, there was a few years where, cause my mom was blindsided by it. You know, my mom was born in 1940. My dad was born in 1937, I think. And it just, it was a different time, but it's also, I have the modern perspective, you know, where it didn't, you know, there were plenty of like, I mean, my dad, and I'm not, that isn't to say that my dad is a big flamboyant swish or anything, but he definitely, you know, it's like. Once you know, you're like, oh.

Yeah. I mean, that was sort of the same with my parents, I think, once, there were major signs. And I think we definitely did talk about this on your podcast. Yeah. But there were major signs, and they just turned a blind eye to it. And then seemingly was very surprised when I did come out.

And I was like, you guys, I mean, all the signs were there. And now, you know, with some space away from it, that's very obvious. You know, they're like, oh, that's what that meant, and that's what that meant. Exactly. When your father came out to you, it was a few years after the divorce,

and you were probably, were you old enough to understand what gay was? What did that mean to you when you were seven or eight? I think, I didn't, it didn't cause me to freak out or anything. I knew enough to know that it wasn't something to go back home to Yorkville, Illinois and spread around like, you know,

when I went, got back to fourth grade or whatever it was. And he kind of wrapped it up with the birds and bees talk too, which he had said he had sent my mom a pop-up book about sex and reproduction that she would not let us have. And that annoyed him. So the next time we were with him, and it was, I think, Christmas time, in Springfield, Illinois, which is at my grandparents,

and he said to my brother, and I said, come on, we're going to the mall, we're going to the mall. And we got in the car, and we drove to a park, and parked in the parking lot of the park, and he went through the whole birds and bees stuff, and then, Virgin Bee stuff and said, but some people are attracted to the same sex and that's me and I'm gay, and we're like, oh, okay. And he got to the end of it, and he starts pulling out and heading back home

and I was like, wait, aren't we going to the mall? And he's like, no, we're not going to the mall. I just said that to, you know, as a cover for Grandma and Grandpa, I was like, oh fuck, I want to go to the mall. I mean, you're gay and whatever, that's fine. Yeah, but yeah, and it was never a big deal. Honestly, I mean, my dad and I are estranged and it's a bigger deal to him, I think, than it is to anybody else. and I are estranged and

it's a bigger deal to him, I think, than it is to anybody else. And it's hard to convince him sometimes that that isn't the case. Right. I mean, I always think about how grateful I am. And I was born in 75 and you know, there was a lot of years in there that it was really not, you know,

that was the AIDS epidemic. Scary. Terrifying. I mean, I was too young to be sexually active at that time, but there was such a stigma around being gay with just that existing. You know, so I really, but I am grateful that it wasn't even earlier that I was having to experience

this because I do think I had it easier than, say, your dad did, for sure. Yeah, yeah. Now, your son's gay. Yeah. And when did he come out to you? He came out when he was about 11. Oh, wow. Yeah, we were walking away.

We had just eaten dinner at a place on La Brea in our old neighborhood, and we were walking down the street and I was holding his hand hand and he said to me, he said, dad, do you know what gay or bi means? And I said, I high-fived him. I said, fuck yeah, boy, do I ever. I said, yes, I do. He said, well, he goes, I think that's what I am.

And I said, okay, well, thank you for telling me. And then as I like to say, we never spoke of it again, you know, but I mean, not because of me, but because like we didn't need to like, okay. But isn't it kind of refreshing that you didn't have to speak of it again? It's fantastic. Like with my family, from like all that's all they wanted

to talk about. I was like, you guys, it's not that big of a deal. Like we can move on from this. This is not that interesting. It was, and I, because I also felt like, it's his business now. Like I didn't want my, I don't, my parents knowing about my sexuality,

like any, the particulars of it in any way. Like, mom, here's what kind of woman I'm looking for. Ooh, yuck, no. It's not, it doesn't matter. Any of that sort of open-mindedness comes from just the fact that your dad was gay or is gay and came out to you at such a young age. Possibly, but-

And it was not a big deal to you? Yeah, but I also, but I mean, but then that, you know, that's also compounded by my mother and my mother and my mother's reaction to him, which once she got beyond the heartbreak of it, she didn't care. And she was very open about it.

And my mother, I have to really give my mother credit too, because she was very much about mental health. And when, I started seeing what she would call a family counselor when I was maybe 12 or 13 because she had remarried and there was all kinds of adjustment and she very much believed in the talking cure, as they call it. Which is kind of at that time pretty incredible

because I think people live in great stigma around therapy. There still is. People, you know, I mean, I've talked about mental health on things, and I'll have people come up and say, I, after, you know, 30 years of being miserable, went to a therapist, because I heard you want a podcast, which I just, in one sense, I'm touched by it, and I feel great about that, but then in another sense,

I'm like, what? Really, that's what it, oh Jesus, you know? I don't understand, I've never understood why mental health is treated any different than any other health. It's like, you know, when people would say, like when I started going in antidepressants, I had friends that were like, well, yeah, isn't it gonna stifle you creatively?

Isn't it gonna change your personality? I mean, are you gonna eventually get off them? And I was just like, I was walking around with a bone sticking out of my leg. You'd go to the emergency room, get that fixed. And it's like, I don't understand what the, I think people just think that your brain is who you are and you can't fuck with it, which is just like, yes you can, yes you can.

Life is too short, you know? I think with the success of Modern Family, something happened in me that I just, being a very private person, being a person who doesn't always like to share a ton about myself, I'm much better about it now, but like having that experience of being under a microscope really did something to me and I came out of that experience

a bit changed and would experience panic attacks more. And you know, sometimes crowds. It is weird. I used to love meeting strangers on the train in New York. Just chatting with them. Just chatting with people. And then I was nervous to meet people because I was like, what are their motives here?

Are they gonna want something from me? I was noticing these changes in myself and a lot of it was mental. And I was very stressed out about things that normally do not stress me out. And so I explored not only talk therapy but medication as well. And I'm still figuring out how to use those tools to their best ability.

But it has been something that I've embraced and I'm glad that I'm in that place where I'm sort of on the journey of figuring out what works for me and what doesn't. Yeah. Yeah. I've heard you say this before, but you've been with the same therapist for a very long time.

Long, long time. Yeah, since the early 90s. In fact, I just had a session, my normal session is Thursdays, Thursday mornings. And it's been mostly by the phone. No, no. All right. I talked about me.

Oh, I just luxuriated at me. No, and I mean, it's, I don't plan on ever being fixed. Right. It's a process and it'll be an ongoing process. What did depression look like for you when you were younger? Oh, inertia, inertia, sadness, just sadness and inertia, you know? And suicidal ideation has been something

that has been with me for a long, long time. And I mean, and periodically throughout my life, I have experienced never like, you know, I'm gonna go to the hardware store and buy a rope. But certainly sort of like, you know, I could go up on the roof of this building, that kind of thing, just in a very sort of casual kind of way.

And it's a process that lots of people go through. And a lot of people that I know and love have gone through it. And I think they just think that if they tell anybody, you know, somebody's gonna check them into the hospital or something, but it's like, no. I mean, it's- Well, I mean, there's certainly days I remember thinking,

especially when I was younger, like, you know, I was bullied as a kid and I was younger, like, you know, I was bullied as a kid, and I was like, well, this is not that much fun to be living this life every day. I never got to the point where I was like, I'm gonna take myself out of the situation, but I do remember thinking like, this isn't the most fun I've had on a Wednesday.

Yes, yes. Being stapled to this. Oh, we can laugh about it now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No. Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, Andy tells me about his 30-year friendship with Conan O'Brien, going on air every night while going through a divorce,

and the gratitude he has for the show. Okay, be right back. I'm Rob Norman. I'm Andrew Norton. And on Personal Best, we help you tackle the stuff you'd be too embarrassed to ask an attractive, successful life coach about. That's right, we have a slightly different approach

to self-improvement. Which is, we don't know what we're doing. Definitely somebody following me. Okay, she's holding a sword. This is so nuts. But in the end, it always works. Okay, it sometimes works. You have no idea how happy this makes me.

Personal best, season three. Available now wherever you get your podcasts. I'm No Meat Fry. I'm Vincent Cunningham. I'm Alex Schwartz and we are Critics at Large, a podcast from The New Yorker. Guys, what do we do on the show every week? We look into the startling maw of our culture and try to figure something out.

That's right. We take something that's going on in the culture now, maybe it's a movie, maybe it's a book, maybe it's just kind of a trend, and we expand it across culture as kind of a pattern or a template. Join us on Critics at Large from The New Yorker. New episodes drop every Thursday. Follow wherever you get your podcasts. ["Dinner on Me"]

And we're back with more Dinners on Me. I find it a little bit fascinating when you were going through your divorce that you were also actively on television at that time too. I remember having a fight with Justin, a pretty bad fight early on in our relationship. Like I wasn't even.

Did your relationship predate the show? We met a year into it. Oh, okay. But he's kind of been with me through the entire run. I remember it was an episode, it was the first episode with Nathan Lane, who is an idol of mine and someone I kind of knew a little bit in New York,

but he was guesting on that episode and meanwhile at home, I was having a terrible fight with Justin. And again, it was early in our relationship and so we weren't, we were sort of learning the tools of how to fight, but it felt very big at the time. And I remember just being devastated and having to like do the scene work

with one of my acting idols and like feeling very un-present. But I remember acting with Nathan and thank God I've had many scenes with him after that. But like, I always remember the first day he was on set. I was like, oh, that was such a bad day for me. I mean, it really took over my whole being. And I'm thinking about you going through this

pretty emotional thing and having to go out and sit with Conan and be part of these conversations and be funny. And I mean, was it a helpful thing to be able to focus on or was it? Well, it's certainly, I mean, it's certainly in a career where you don't always have steady work. I mean, having that as a steady job

is always, was always a blessing of a kind. I had had some experience with it in like, in the first run of the Conan Show and during the late night years, having a lot of struggles with depression. And those sort of spilled over into kind of how I felt about the show.

And in many ways, the dissatisfaction that I had with myself falling over into the show was one of the reasons why I kinda left in the first part. It really, it all boiled down to, I wanted to try something else. But it also was all mixed up in depression and bad behavior patterns that I was stuck in

and that I was learning to get out of. So yeah, I had some experience in compartmentalizing and being like, I don't like this, I'm gonna experience in compartmentalizing and being like, I don't like this, I'm gonna shove it over here. But there's plenty, oh, we got, Oh, lobster roll. I got myself a lobster roll. That is your cold lobster roll.

Yes, thank you. Mayonnaise, Rhode Island beer. Nice. Luchine, gem lettuce. Thank you. Jonah Crabby. And. Blue cheese gem lettuce. Thank you. And then, Jonah Crabbe. And I got a double salad. And I'm gonna bring you a soup spoon

just in case you wanna have a little taste. I do wanna try that. I gotta try that. I made a meal out of apps. I'm crazy that way. Mm. This is just basically New England chowder without the flour.

Yeah, and the cream. I love it. That's really good. I mean, the thing that also strikes me, just as people who, you know, I mean, obviously you're in the public eye, and you know, it's hard enough to go through heartbreak and divorce, but then, you know,

you have to sort of make a statement on Twitter, and then, you know, you don't have to, but it's gonna to come out anyway. So you might as well like take control of the narrative. But then, you know, it's a story on People Magazine. And it's like, it can't really be private. It's weird. It's very weird. It's weird. It's weird.

Cause I still just kind of feel like, why would anyone care to put that in print? And I, like I say, intellectually I understand, but I still am weirded out by it. Yeah, yeah. Do you remember specifics about the first time you met Conan? Yeah.

You guys hit it off pretty quickly. I mean- We did. Yeah, as we're talking about relationships, I mean, that's sort of been one of your- Oh, I say I'm his TV wife. Yeah. You know, it's only like 60% a joke because it is very much like being the spouse

of a famous person. Yeah. Because we're sort of together in an adventure and, you know, we sort of were thought of as a duo, but I also, being places, standing next to him, and like I say, it doesn't really, like it doesn't sting, I don't really get mad. But I mean, I am human and there were a number of times

where someone would come up and say, I love the show, it'd be him and me together, another person maybe, but I specifically remember one in Chicago, we were doing shows in Chicago and it was me and him and Sona were going to get something to eat and somebody stopped him, ran on and on and on about how much they loved the show, crazy about the show,

and could I get a picture? And he said, sure, and the person just handed me the phone and got a picture with him and never did any kind of like, oh it's you too kind of thing, which I just, which made me feel like, you don't really, like. That literally happened to me and Julie Bowen in the airport though where someone handed her the camera

to take a photo of the two of us. I was like, there's no way, they just must not have recognized you. It's just, it's strange. It's like, are you lying and like buttering him up for some reason? Right, right. Where you don't really know the show that well or?

Right, right, right. You know, or is it this fake beard I'm wearing? Is it the wig? But I know, as I say, I never went like, oh, how dare they not recognize me because I mean, why in the fuck should anybody recognize me? You know. No, it's, you know, I don't.

It is, it's a very silly life. It's a very silly life. And I often, I am struck so many times watching people in, and it doesn't even have to be something that's like not that good. It can be something that's like kind of good, but just acting is one of the most embarrassing,

embarrassing things a human being can do. It's so funny that you say that because Ty Burrell and I would get the giggles so bad when we were shooting Modern Family because we would catch each other acting. And we'd be like, what are you doing? Why are you such a, you're a grown man, stop. What are you doing with your face?

And we would just get the giggles so bad. And so it got to the point where like, he could just see in the glint in my eye if I'm thinking that. And we would just start laughing and then no one else in the scene would know why we're laughing. Because nothing had happened other than he caught my eye

and Steve and Chris, our creators, are coming over like, what's so funny? I was like, we're just, this job's so stupid. We're just laughing how stupid this job is. Stupid, what? Yeah, exactly. No, I totally get it. Yeah, on the movie El Yeah, yeah. No, I totally get it. Yeah, on the movie Elf, James Conn,

sometimes Jon Favreau would get, the director would get like a little serious, and I would just hear James Conn going, it's called Elf, Jon. Yeah. The movie's called Elf. Yeah. Right, right, yeah, it is, isn't it?

God, I love that movie so much. You know, I, I've thought about this, you know, when I was just looking at the history of your career, I mean, you've done so many incredible things between like, you know, I love the, what is it, quintuplets or quadruplets on? Quintuplets. Quintuplets, that's five.

Yeah. On Arrested Development. You know, so much great voiceover work, and then you also have this consistent beating drum of like 30 years with Conan on all three iterations of his show. I mean, do you ever look back and be like, wow, how did I, that's pretty great.

Like how did I get here? I definitely, I did not always appreciate how lucky I was. And, but there again, like too, I, you know, I was unhappy a lot of the time. And so it's hard to kind of take a good, healthy inventory of your situation when you're not happy. And I don't, you know, that's just like,

I'm not blaming that on anybody or anything. It just was a fact of life. Like it's, like I said Like I said the other day online, it's like the thing they don't tell you about being alive is that it takes 40 or 50 years to get the hang of it. You know? It's such a great analogy. And it does.

And I am also convinced that like, you can't be as, and wise seems like too much. You can't be just as sort of settled and sure of yourself and just kind of have a handle on things when you're young because it's like, to be young and good looking and smart, it's too powerful. It's too much power centered in one area. Believe me.

Yeah, yeah. But the kind of winding down of the TBS version of the Conan show, I had so many people that I had worked with for literally decades come up and say the most beautiful Meaningful things to me about what I had done for them or what I meant to them or how thankful they were It was just it was Impossible to not be transformed by it in a way that I still am carrying with me. And, you know, there's times I feel like show business has shut down now. It's like I don't even understand, like, what's going on.

So at times it's very easy to feel dissatisfied with the current moment and I work really hard to remember that I have done stuff and with a group of people that I love and that it means things to people, especially to young people. How's it been for you, you know, with these, with, you know, your podcast is so great. It's been going on for quite some time, right?

Five years now? Yeah, it's a while. Yeah. I mean, I got to be a guest on it. I've, you know, you've had so many incredible guests on, so many incredible conversations, but you know, you're really front and center on that. Thank you.

It's your show, and you know, that's somewhat of a new role for you as someone who has been, I don't wanna call it a sidekick, but you were. I know, that's what I was. That's the job title. Yeah, side piece. Can you call you a side piece, please?

Sure, sure. Well, I mean, co-host, people will wanna be nice and call me a co-host, but I wasn't the co-host. I was the sidekick. It's the side piece. Let's say what it is, it's a side piece. I did, I was interview adjacent for a million years,

and they are different kinds of interviews. Like the Conan interviews, or at least on the TV, they're so short and concentrated and punchy and get a laugh and we'll be right back. When I started doing my podcast, I wanted to do an interview one, I wanted to do it with basically therapeutic angle.

Talk about your history, talk about how it made you who you are. And I was not good at it in the beginning, but it just, most everything I've gotten good at, I've done, I've gotten good at the, you know, Malcolm Gladwell, thousands of hours kind of thing. And now, now it's really a pleasure to do the show, and it's really fun.

I go into their studios, I feel like a big grown-up radio man, you know? But I don't, but it's like, I'm still waiting for a TV show. You know what I mean? I'm still waiting to, I don't know, be Uncle Bob on something, you know? Would you always like to do that?

Oh yeah, yeah. That's my number one choices. I mean, you know, the Conan show was great and I always loved it, but I always missed acting. And that's what I set out to be. I set out to be a comedic character actor, basically. Do you ever find that because you're so well known as yourself for 30 years, do you ever find that

it's harder to break through to those opportunities? Well, first of all, I think that the casting process is just dumb. It's like, it's- What is it now even? I don't even know what the casting process is. I don't even know what it is. And yeah, you record yourself, which I absolutely hate,

because then you have to find somebody else. That's, talk about embarrassing. It's like, ask my son to read lines so I can audition for, you know. Nothing's worse. I fired Justin can audition for, you know. Nothing's worse. I fired Justin as my like line reader. Oh, I fired my wife too.

Cause she reads the description copy too. She'll like, she'll read, yeah, she'll be like, she'll read her line and then I can tell she's reading, he gets up and crosses to the window. He looks out and looks back and I'm like, just say the fucking lines, please. Oh, oh, I'm sorry, you know. But yeah, I hate that part.

And casting, you know, it's frustrating because I get this years ago, when my Andy Richter Controls the Universe, the first show that I did after I left Conan, the first table read for all the big wigs, the head of Paramount Studios at the time, came up to me afterwards and said, wow, you really can act.

I was like, yeah, I'm number one on the call sheet of this show that you're paying, okay. And I'm getting now too, I think because I was over doing the Conan show for all those years, I'm getting a lot of, wow, he's a good actor, kind of like, or he can act kind of feedback on auditions that just feels a little like,

it's just exhausting. I don't get offended or anything. I'm not a spiritual person, but I do believe in the concept of yin and yang and like the better things are, like we get to enjoy so much fantastic aspects of what we do for a living that the downside is like going to be possibly as shitty.

Yeah. You know? Yeah. Like, okay, all right, that's the price of admission. What comes with it, yeah. That was something Dan Savage said when he was on my show. And he's like, you cannot complain about the price of things.

When you largely knew the price going in and you made the choice to do it. Interesting. And he's like, it's just, it's no fun to hear somebody complain about something that they said, I want this. And it's very true. It's very true.

Look at that. No, no, that doesn't keep me from bitching. Doesn't keep me from bitching about things. You gotta, fish has gotta swim, you know. Birds gotta fly. Yeah, yeah. Oh, you know? Bird's got to fly. Yeah, yeah. Oh my god, this has been a joy. Thanks, Bernadette, for doing it.

Yeah. Thank you for doing it. How did you like your reunion with Connie and Ted's? It's fantastic. This place is so good. This episode of Dinners on Me was recorded at Connie and Ted's in West Hollywood, California. Next week on Dinners on Me, you know him as the youngest dumpy sibling Luke on Modern Family, it's Nolan Gould. We'll get into what child stardom was like, our favorite on-set memories, and making life

out of the spotlight. And if you don't want to wait until next week to listen, you can download that episode right now by subscribing to Dinners on Me Plus. As a subscriber, not only do you get access to new episodes one week early, you'll also be able to listen completely ad-free. Just click Try Free at the top of the Dinners on Me show page

on Apple Podcasts to search your free trial today. Dinners On Me is a production of Sony Music Entertainment and a kid named Beckett Productions. It's hosted by me, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay. Our associate producer is Angela Vang. Sam Baer engineered this episode. Hans-Dale Shee composed our theme music. Our head of production is Sammy Allison. Special thanks to Tamika Balanz-Kalasny and Justin Makita. I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Join me next week.