Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson - Kathy Griffin

Episode Date: January 23, 2024

Emmy and Grammy Award-winning comedian Kathy Griffin joins the show. Over seafood and charcuterie, Kathy talks about going on tour for the first time in six years, how she finds material perched in a chair of judgement at Hollywood parties, and her iconic Christmas gift for Paris Hilton. This episode was recorded at The Sunset restaurant in Malibu. Want this episode ad-free? Subscribe to Dinner’s on Me PLUS. Just click “Try Free” at the top of the Dinner’s on Me show page on Apple Podcasts to start your free trial today. A Sony Music Entertainment & A Kid Named Beckett production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Well, let me tell you that cancer scared the shit out of me. Of course. Because, like I said, they took out half my left lung, and I'm very bitter about the two lungs community. Yeah. That's right. I can hear you breathing. And I don't appreciate it.

This is Dinners on Me, and I'm your host, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. So I've known Kathy for quite a few years now. I met her for the first time at the front doors of Hollywood, not literally, but she was perched at the entrance of one of the Emmy parties I went to right after Modern Family sort of took off. I was already such a huge fan of Kathy's comedy

and of course her TV show, My Life on the D-List. So I was so excited to meet her. Now, most comedians I've met have an on-stage persona and an off-stage one, and the difference between the two can be somewhat jarring. With Kathy, she's exactly how you know her to be on stage, but the difference is, and there is one, is that she's very invested in getting to know more about you. She loves people watching and making new friends.

I was so thrilled and honored to be invited to one of her famous salon dinner parties a few months back. It was an eclectic group that included Selma Blair, Sia, Lance Bass, Pam Adalon, amongst others. Most of us didn't know each other previously, but now we're all on a text thread with each other. Kathy loves bringing people together, be it through her dinner parties or her own comedy. After six years of not performing, Kathy is about to launch her new tour, My Life on the PTSD list, and this moment for her is a bit of a reintroduction of Kathy to the world.

After her controversial photo of her holding a Trump mask went viral, her life was turned upside down. In addition to basically being blacklisted in the industry, she lost her mom and her sister. She herself was diagnosed with cancer. She nearly lost her ability to speak after a vocal cord injury, and she recently announced her divorce from her longtime partner, Randy.

I say this with all honesty, I don't think I know an individual more resilient than Kathy Griffin. I am so inspired by her every time I am in her presence, and I was extremely thrilled that she agreed to meet me on her side of town for a meal. Hello! Hello! I decided to bring Kathy to the Sunset Restaurant in Malibu, which, like the name suggests, is where you want to be when the sun starts to go down. It steps from the beach. Back in the 70s, it was called the Whale Watch, and it was a favorite amongst everyone from

Frank Sinatra to Jimmy Carson. Kathy is the queen of gossip. If she's at a party, she's going to get the dirt on everyone. It's her job. So I thought bringing her someplace that might be haunted by Jimmy Carson seemed kinda right. Okay, let's get to the conversation. ["Let's Get To The Conversation"]

You've been here, right? Yes. Are you looking at my barber straight since we started? Oh my God. Is this great? You know she's walking distance from here. Let's go. We can go.

Let's scrap this. Yes, let's just go. Now what would our rooms be? Why were there? Yeah, like we can't just knock. We have to say like. We should, I mean like we're literally just in the neighborhood.

But come on, what's in her best interest? Like we're there to buy stuff from the gift shop? I mean I'm literally listening to her book right now. So I can just like say I have some facts I wanna check about the book. Nice, nice. She'll be thrilled you are actually reading it. It's so good.

I love her. I love her. Have you ever met her? Many times. Was it a good experience? Rough, she's rough. She's a little rough. She admits it though in her book.

She said, I don't like people meeting me because I'm worried. About what? About meeting your heroes. Like she doesn't think she's gonna live up and I get it but she's I mean I will say her approach to that is to be tough yeah but luckily I've cracked her a couple of times how every time I see her I go oh please don't sing tonight every Every time I see you, you're over at the piano begging to sing people, I get it, you're talented.

And so that usually kind of cracks her up. She'll go, oh, you know me. Cause she notoriously will not sing unless it's like at Warren Buffett's house and he gives her net jets for life, which I heard she did once. Really? Net jets for life. That's a voice. That's a voice.

That's a voice. Wow. No, but because I feel like I got a really authentic version of her though, because I met her after one of her concerts and she was overwhelmed. She wasn't cold, she wasn't mean to me by any stretch of imagination,

but it wasn't like what I was expecting. And, but I feel like that was a very authentic version of her. Mm-hmm. Did you know that she, and also Frank Sinatra, is sitting at this restaurant? What? Yes. When and why? In the early 70s, they both performed here.

Wait, do you mean like as an act or like they were doing it like? Not together. I don't think together. But I mean like, was it as an employee thing? Or she was singing for a party I don't know I just I just read that they both performed here at this restaurant when it was called the whale watch I think was both interesting whale watch. Yeah, this is the perfect place to bring somebody from out of town Yeah, I've never actually never been here. I'm absolutely

This is the most Malibu place very Malibu. We very Malibu the ocean is right there the Pacific Ocean Yeah, yeah, we're not this is not a sound machine It's not the Atlantic Ocean. No, no, right there every day in and day out. It's here That's why I like it. Also. Did you know that I'm I read about this? Johnny Carson ate here the night before he passed away On my walk that I do almost every day. I walk past his estate Uh-huh and one thing I first of all, I love to imagine who has gone through those gates.

I mean, imagine. Betty Davis, Clark Gable, like the names that must have gone to those parties. It has its own parking lot just next to the house for probably like the help. That parking lot alone could probably go for like empty, like 20 million. Oh, just for the real estate. Yes.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yes. 100%. Because that's like where he lived in Strysan is probably the most expensive part of Malibu. Oh gosh, I think we should go to her house. I think we should too. I have a good feeling about this today. I do too.

Yeah. But I'm throwing you under the bus if it doesn't go our way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is Jess's idea, Mr. Isand. Ha ha ha. I would love, and I've gotta meet her another time after that, after she presented Hamilton with the Tony Award.

I happened to be at the Hamilton after party, and she was really lovely to me, a little warmer that time. She had also that point. What'd she say? Done a cameo on Modern Family, but just her voice, where I talked to her through the call box. And I think she recorded on her like voicemail

app and just sent it to her friend, Jeffrey, who was working on the show. And I got, it was a scene with me. So she asked how it played and everything. I don't think she ever watched it. And you know, I had like a more real conversation with her. I was dying for a photo, but I didn't ask. It's hard with the legends. I know. Because the legends don't always dig it. And she's notoriously with the lighting. And the one time I was on Oprah,

and I actually put the story in one of my specials, when Oprah had Barbara on, it was Barbara's cream phase. And she had, she was only in cream. And by Donna Karen I'm sure. It was all Donna Karen. And she sang one beautiful song, but the slideshow behind her was her dead dog. Sadie?

Yes. Oh wow. And cause she missed Sadie. And as if that wasn't surreal enough, her microphone matched her outfit. Of course it did. So when I got to talk to Oprah in the commercial break, which is also not easy,

but it was like at the height of Oprah time. And I go, I gotta tell you, that Streisand interview was off the chain, amazing. That looked nuts. And she goes, you know she paid my mic white. But Oprah was like pissed. Oh, what? Like she paid my microphone white. But Oprah was like pissed. Like she paid my microphone white.

I said, well, Oprah, it's not Donna Karen told her. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Everything is cream. I thought that was so funny. Oh, I love that so much. I wonder what you go through to get like a selfie with her. Yeah.

Like I wonder if she just doesn't do them ever or if there's a place in her house where she says... There was a couple who did ask for one in Godwin and she was gracious and she did one. And I've been, I was like, oh, do I ask now? And I was like, no, I don't want to do it. Yeah, I'd be afraid. I'd be afraid. I don't want that to be the last interaction.

And also, I have this weird feeling, if she gets mad at you, it's mad for life. I don't want mad for life. I little joke here and there and then that's all the trouble I want. Thanks. I know what. Yeah I'd love a diet coke please. Diet Pups is great yeah. I will do an iced tea. Yeah. And can we have some flat water? Okay thanks. Yeah. I don't flat it great thank you. Have you eaten here Yeah, that'd be cool. A bottle of flat water would be great. Thank you.

Have you eaten here before? Yes. You have. What did you get? I like the crab cakes. Yeah. What are you, what sings to you? What do you like here?

I don't know. I do feel like whenever I can see water, whenever I see the ocean, I'm going to order fish. Good. I'll figure it out. OK. Did you go, did you leave for LA right after high school? I went to, I went

to a junior college for one year, but I knew I wanted to start working right away. So I got an agent in Chicago, and I was an extra in a commercial for the Chicago White Sox to advertise going to the games. Yeah. But I was lucky because they zoomed in on a three shot. So even though I didn't know it until I had lived in LA for two years, working as a non-union extra, which was my full-time job, someone said, oh, you now are eligible to join SAC.

So at least I was able to get my union card. Right, right, right. And that was a big difference. But when you're a non-union extra. 25 bucks a day. Okay, that's what I was gonna ask. $5 for a wardrobe bump if you were your own clothes, right? How long did you do that for I did it for like two years at least how did you?

Survive on I was still living off my parents. Okay, like they let me still live with them in their apartment I went to bedroom apartment on Pico. I was an extra in the Michael Jackson commercial where his hair got stop it Did you see it? Did you see it happen? Yes, but I was an extra in the Michael Jackson commercial where his hair caught fire. Stop it. You were there. My hand got, my hand got. Did you see it? Did you see it happen? Yes, but we didn't know what happened. Yeah, yeah.

It was a two day shoot if I recall. I was there the first day. You're just a crowd seeing, yay. And it was a Pepsi ad, so you're holding up like Pepsi signage. And all I noticed the day was cut short. So there was like murmurs, but we all got sent home. And it wasn't until like the local six o'clock news that they just said like there had been

a pyrotechnic accident. But then nobody was even reporting that his actual head caught fire. So I can't say, I saw that because the pyro was crazy in that act. Right, right. But you were in the room. Yeah.

That is crazy. I know. Wow. But I loved being an extra because it taught me set etiquette. Yeah. You know, I went in the hard way. Like I was so obnoxious I would just walk up to the director and like start asking for jobs.

My God, Kathy. And then I had to be like, that's so not how it's done. I love that you were brave enough to like just go up to video village and talk to the director. So it's done. I love that you were brave enough to like, just go up to video village and talk to the director. So that's amazing. I love that you use brave as a word. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, what was I thinking? Were you doing stand up at that time?

No, I went about it this whole thing, ask backwards. So my dream was to be a sidekick. I wanted to be Rona on Mary Tyler Moore. I wanted to be Ethel. And so I was just on this quest to see how I could do that. And so I got a grant, some bullshit grant, meaning bullshit because I don't know what I put on my paperwork.

And I got to go to Strasburg for two years. So Strasburg, it's a great school. At least Strasburg was still alive. and we would have speakers like Robert De Niro and Al Pacino, and they would come and do like, speak to like a 50-person class. And it was great. But then after two years, I was like, oh, there's this place called The Groundlings. And because I'm from Chicago, Second City is revered there. The improv sketch group.

And I knew that the Groundlings yeah. The improv sketch group. Right. And I knew that the Groundlings were a second city type group. So I went by myself. I thought the show was incredible. I thought all the players were incredible. Were there people that were, that you saw that night that have gone on to Big Thanks? Oh, yes. So after the show, Bold is Brass.

Thank you. I walked backstage right into the dressing room. Once again, not appropriate, and I went up to the guy that I thought was the funniest guy in the whole show, and I said, how can I do this? And he was so nice, he was taking off his makeup, and he was like, well, there's a whole school,

and he introduced me to the head of the school, and he goes, you take classes, and then you try to get into the Sunday company, then the weekend company, and his name was Phil Hartman. Oh my god. And I just loved Phil so much. Do you know what you want to eat? Oh yes, I'm sorry. I'll have your Brussels, no chili oil please, and then I would like your cheese plate. Thanks. Yeah, I can't, yeah. Cheese by the ocean. I know, but I just looked at it and it looked so good. I'm actually gonna have your shrimp cocktail, please.

And I'm gonna have your hamachi sashimi. Yes. Excellent. Great. Thank you. Thanks. Thank you, Noah. Thanks, Noah.

Welcome. So, Phil Hartman. First grounding I met. Incredible. I met. Incredible. Did you take his advice? Did you move up to the ground? Yeah, I started the classes. Our company had everybody

from Will Ferrell and Sherry O'Terry and John Lovitz was my era. I'm trying to think who else was going to ask you. Yes, in fact Lisa is one of the reasons I became a standup because the Grown-Wings used to have this Friday night experimental show and I had a director that actually liked

me which made all the difference because it's a competitive place. And he said, okay, I'll let you open the Friday night late show with one of your stories. And I started doing it and then Lisa said, okay, I'll let you open the Friday Night Late Show with one of your stories. And I started doing it. And then Lisa said, you know, you're good at sketches, but I think you're really best as yourself and your point of view and stuff.

And she was like, honestly, an influence. Really? And I did a couple open mic nights, bombed horribly, like at the improv and the store. And then I got together, I'd become friends with Jeanine Garofalo. So I found a loophole in the Groundlings Constitution, where if there was one night a week

that wasn't being used for a class or a show, and you were a company member in good standing, you could have the theater. So then I started putting on my own standup shows, call it a hot cup of talk, and the style was only comics that tell stories. And I was convinced no industry would come, so we made the show a dollar and we had an egg timer. So I thought industry people always leave early, so four comics for an hour, ding, the bell goes off, you introduce the next person, there's not even a host.

And that's honestly, I finally started getting gigs based on that. Wow. I don't think that way. You came over a few days ago, you surprised me, I had a little procedure done, and you brought over some lunch, very fancy lunch of, Caviar from Mary Trump.

Yes, Mary Trump had given you caviar, and you gifted it to me. I only gifted Mary Trump's Caviar. Put that in your pipe and smoke it. But you sat on my couch and you had just gone to Paris Hilton's Christmas party the night before. And you were just telling me about this party and I was like, I am basically getting a free show.

I mean, I've been a fan of your style of comedy and your specials for so long. And what I think I want people to know about you that I've gotten to know is that there is no difference between that version of you on stage and the person who sat on my couch and told me a story about, you know, your night before at Paris Hilton's Christmas party. I was so excited when you were like, that's a new half hour for you. Yeah. Because I was like, it's in.

Yeah. It's in the show. I killed on the couch. It did. It's going in the show. OK, time for a quick break. But don't go away. When we come back, Kathy tells us why she has a soft spot for the Simpsons creator, Matt

Groening. And we get into the fallout from that 2017 photo shoot. OK, be right back. I know. I know we just finished Christmas, but you know what? Valentine's Day is coming right up. So just give into it. Why not give the special people in your life something sweet from Good's Candies to show them that you're thinking about them. Good's Candies is a small batch

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because he threw me a solid, I just think it was kind of a beautiful thing. So I had lung cancer even though I never smoked. Yeah, we're gonna talk about that again. And so it's altered my voice permanently. And at this level, it just kind of sounds like maybe I have a little bit of a cough or something. But when I go to project level, it just kind of sounds like maybe I have a little bit of a cough or something, but when I go to project, the adrenaline just kind of kicks in and it goes

to a higher pitch. And I'm very self-conscious about it. I've had like six surgeries on my vocal cords, but prior to it even sounding like this, it was literally even like this. And during that, Jimmy Kimmel let me go on his show and he, we just explained it to the audience and then took the audience a second and they were very giving. And I got a call from Matt Groening saying, you know, come do like a few lines or whatever.

That's yourself? No, they wrote a character. And you know, I said, look, I gotta be honest, this voice you're hearing, this is like as good as it gets. This is what it is, yeah. Yeah, and he was like, that's okay. And so it was so cool to do that session because it was the first time since my cancer battle where I thought, okay, if I can get over it,

because they're not, they are over it, then that's what I have to work on, but then I'll be okay. How are you feeling about it now? Well, let me tell you, that cancer scared the shit out of me. Because like I said, they took out half my left lung, and I'm very bitter about the two lungs community. Yeah. And I feel like you're flaunting your lungs in my face right now.

Our full breasts of air. Thank you. That's right, I can hear you breathing. And I don't appreciate it. Hi there. Oh, breaths of air. Thank you. That's right, I can hear you breathing. And I don't appreciate it. Hi there. Oh, these look delicious. Thank you. Yeah, I know when you were very open about,

you're very open about everything, let's just be honest. But for someone who obviously uses your voices, that is your identity. And to have that be in danger, cause I think there was a point where at least, I remember an Instagram story that you posted where you weren't sure, there was a chance that you might lose it completely.

I mean, that must have been. The surgeon who took on my left lung, I'm not saying he did it on purpose of course, but he injured me so severely. I have a permanently paralyzed left cord and an aperture over both of them, and they're afraid to close that because it might restrict my airway.

So, you know, that's one of the reasons I work out like a fiend to do like a ton of cardio and all that other stuff. But yeah, it's been a struggle, just mentally getting over the part that like I can't do certain impressions anymore and I you know will ask every single audience to basically you know just accept it right and I'll make jokes about it understanding yeah and then I just hope my earring but I think, you know, I can only imagine that the people who are coming to your shows now are people who have been fans of yours for a very long time and probably understand.

I think they know the whole, like the Trump story and all that stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I don't think any of that. There's a shorthand I think you can have with them. Yeah, thank God. Which is great. And I'm so grateful for that. Were you on any crap? I shouldn't say crappy. Let me just put it this way. Were you a regular on a TV show before ever? Before Modern Family? Yeah. A show called The Class, which was

only on for one season, but it's what brought me to New York. Sorry, it was what brought me to Los Angeles from New York, I was doing theater in New York and that was my first big break. I just, like when I watch Modern Family, I just wonder if you guys appreciated how cool it was to be on an actual Goods It Come when there's so many crappy ones. Like that show just delivered week after week

and you were so fucking amazing in that show. That's very sweet of you to say, thanks for your help. So good. Speaking of sitcoms, I mean, I first became aware of you on Suddenly Susan. With Brooke Shields. With Brooke Shields, which so that's a full circle moment for you because you know, you did get to become the sidekick.

Yeah. It's the thing that you wanted to do, which if I'm doing my math correctly, you had been in LA for almost 16-ish years. Yeah. I mean, I bounced around. Yeah, of course.

Forever. And then all of a sudden, the floodgates opened, and in one year, I got five guest spots, which was huge for me. So it finally put me on the radar of the network folks. What was out like to get that big job? Did you know it was a big deal at the time? Life changing. I mean, didn't have cell phones then,

but like I'm racing home to tell my mom and dad first. And yeah, I mean, that was a great freaking gig. The thing about that show that was so funny is that the behind the scenes was so heavy on that show and it was like the silliest, fluffiest show, but like Judd Nelson would be like doing Whippets at Crafty. Oh no, no, no. Allegedly.

Allegedly. That's my opinion. And like, you know, it was just, it was just- Wasn't Barbara Berry on that show? Barbara Berry, who I, she was my closest friend on the show. I have this really funny story about Barbara Berry, and that was that she has, she and Jay had a house in Fire Island.

Yeah, oh yeah, I went there, I stayed there. You stayed there, okay. And Brooke Shield, at the time when she was with Andre Agassi, went to stay there for a little while and Barbara Berry was having the housekeepers come through and she wanted them to clean the windows. It was like the one see your thing, they cleaned the windows.

So she left a bottle of Windex saying for the windows or something on the kitchen counter. And Brooke Shields and Andre Agassi come into the kitchen and see the bottle of Windex and thinking that like the one, you know, Barbara Berry is letting the user play. She's thinking, oh, well, she wants us to clean the windows. No big deal. So they were on ladders outside. Oh, my God.

The Fire Island cleaning the windows of their neighbors called Barbara Berry and said, Brooke Shields and Andre Agassi are in danger. Are literally in danger. They're either trying to break into your house or they're cleaning your windows. And I met Brooke a few years ago and I asked her to confirm that story and she said it was absolutely true. So there you go.

That is hilarious. Okay, so the other thing I was gonna say is on suddenly Susan, this was when Brooke was with Andre and that crazy was nuts. Like first of all, first time on a private jet, he would send a jet for her every taping night. And she got him to invite the whole cast to Vegas

because he lives in Vegas. And that alone, like I had never seen like wealth like that. Also, as famous as Brooke is, until Agassi, I did not get the pro athlete fame. Yeah, oh, it's huge. I mean, the executives pants were dropping and they were just so freaked out to be in the presence of Agassi.

Yeah. All right, so get this. So he treated her like crap. And like at one point he tried to get me to not swear around him, you know, I'm fucking 36 this time. Agassi? Yeah, cuz he's a Christian Okay, all right, so this is so wild to me. So they get their divorce, etc. She meets the love of her life Christian

She it's all good but when She was with Agassi she did not know Because he put it in his book. He has a book called Closer. Like, look at me, Closer. He was doing... It's the same guy who wrote the Prince Harry book, by the way. Oh, very good.

Side note. Agassi says in the book, he was doing meth the whole time. Not like some pot, not God forbid, a couple of pills. Meth. Yeah, it's serious, yeah. And that's why he was like that with Brooke. Yeah, yeah. Because he was, and she's such a straight edge

Like I can't why it wouldn't even occur to her that he could be doing something like that. Yeah, but he was I'm not gonna Hi, he was dusty. Yeah, he was dusty. Yeah, I mean He was snippy Well, there's a reason apparently So but brick Schultz doesn't speak to me. I know, you had mentioned that. I feel bad. I've heard you say that, you guys.

Because I told a story in one of my specials that when she saw it live, she didn't mind, but when she saw it in the special, she didn't like it, which is her absolute right. But I will just always love her because she had a hand in making sure I got that part and that changed my life. Yeah. Yeah. And also I just like her. She's really smart. I do too. I like her a lot. She's the life she's had and she would tell the best stories about freaking John Tervolta and George Michael. Michael Jackson. Michael Jackson. JFK Jr. Gondas Jr. 54 like the best. Yeah. She had a lot of life. Yeah. Are there other people that you feel like you were JFK Jr., Goldenness Junior 54, like the best.

Yeah, she's quite a life, yeah. Are there other people that you feel like you've were friends with once and like maybe because of your comedy you've lost that connection? Let me see. No, because those people tend, they avoid me to begin with. Okay.

So like John Mayer. Okay. I run into him a lot. You know, he was really close with Saget and so I saw him at the Saget memorials, et cetera. But it's weird, he's literally never come up to me but in a way that I feel like he's like, I don't need this from her.

So I get that a lot. Like just- Like people who steer away from you? Yeah, and sometimes it's just the thought of a comedian being there at that moment or whatever, but yeah, I get a lot of folks that are just like, ugh. See, the first time I saw you, I remember this, I talked about this when I came over to your house for dinner, but I was like a moth to a flame. I was like, let me get closer to that.

We have these ridiculous parties before the Oscars, before the Emmys, called the Night Before Parties, and they're fundraisers. I'm banned from that party. Are you now? Yes. Do you now? Yes. Do you want to bring you as my date? Like you brought Bristol Palin's Baby Daddy as your date. I'm just going to bring you.

And it was early years of Modern Family and we were walking up and you were perched at the entryway of the party, like on a speaker or a high stool or something, you weren't even going into the party, you just want to watch people arrive at you. And I introduced myself to you and said, oh, I'm such a big fan, and I was like, are you coming in?

You're like, no, I'm sitting here to watch people come in and judge them. I was like, that's exactly what I needed to hear. I was in my seat of judgment. Whether it's a box or a top of the speaker, I can make a seat of judgment. A couple of times, I think I might be, I don't know if I'm still going to make the list,

but I've been lucky enough to go to the Kardashian Christmas party. Oh, wow. So I am, well, I'm happy to admit I love them. Yes, I know. I know that they... I love them too. People think they've heard feminism and center-etc But they're also billionaire boss ladies and so it's kind of like

Doesn't make me feel like a good feminist and not like root for them at least in the business here Yeah, okay blah blah blah, so now Chris gives me a chair of judgment And because when I'm at a party, I'm working. I'm mining material. It's like a spirit is attending, but my soul is judging. Well, you know, I find it fascinating because the Kardashians have been a part of your comedy

for a very long time. And yet they are very close to you. Well, we have a pact. I have a pact with Kim, I'm very proud of. We used to live next door to each other. We used to use with Kanye. each other when she was with Kanye. That alone was heaven. And I've done like two specials, frankly, just about that.

But she's always had a sense of humor, even when I was going for her in the aughts. And people have to understand, the 90s and the 2000s, the kind of comedy that was almost mandated was vicious roast style. And so, yeah, I'd called them every name in the book and every time I would somehow run into them

at a charity gig or whatever, they were so nice. Yeah, they are very lovely. Thank you. Look at table side Ponzu. Oh, presentation. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Thank you, Noah. But, you know, that's your style of comedy.

And I think that's what your fan base certainly loves and appreciates. And I love that they have such a sense of humor about, you know, what you've said about them. And that's why I went to... I mean, it's hilarious to me. I get it. I went to Paris Hilton's Christmas party I probably called her a dirty whore and three specials. I told stories about her where she doesn't look like a genius and The whole time she just was like laughing all the way to the bank

And now I feel like I'm one of her aunties. Yeah, I just have such a Affection for her because I just fucking appreciate the ones that laugh about it. Okay, time for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, Kathy tells us one of her favorite Paris Hilton stories from back of the day. Okay, be right back. If you're like me, you're not looking to work forever.

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Was she always someone who appreciated you? Or was there a moment where you like were confronted with her and you're like, okay, this could go to one of two ways and it happened to go well? Yeah, when she agreed to be on My Life on the D-List. Oh, that's right, I forgot she was on that. It was amazing, I spent the day with her. And remember, this is the height of the stalkeratze

and these poor girls couldn't take a shit without being photographed. And she was so game, we went to Kitsyn, which is a store in Robertson, and it was very famous back in the day. And the way the paparazzi stalked us was terrifying. And they're all males, almost all males. And I remember saying, she was still doing the baby voice

and she goes, hungry tigers. I call them hungry tigers and she's smiling the whole time and now We learned the truth that she went to the school in Utah where they physically and sexually abused her and She's an amazing business woman She's like a DJ in huge demand overseas and she does gigs in Dubai and she is her own boss. And so I'm but I gotta make fun of the party. Sure of course. All they served were corn dogs. He told me about this. And one guy who made a crepe. I'm sorry. Corn dogs. He just said the food was lacking. I mean, who was like, okay, the flowers check,

theme music check, food check and check. I'm just saying. I love it. I do want to talk about an infamous photo that was taken. It's not the one you think. 2011, out photo, out 100, you and I were paired together for a photo. And kind of what I remember, you can back me up on these facts, in sort of like a last

minute decision, you decided to do a one-off shot and do a quick photo where you recreated the famous Janet Jackson album cover. Right, where those hands behind her are holding her boobs. Supporting her boobs, yeah. And you wanted my hands to be the hands behind you holding the boobs. And I, of course, agree, because I'm not going to say no to this. I fucking love that picture.

I love that picture so much. I love that picture. But I feel like that was definitely, because I hadn't met you before, but that's where our relationship definitely took a turn. Next level. Next level, yeah. You were taking your bra off in front of me,

telling me to grab your breasts. Touch them now. Touch them now, and I'll post the photo on my Instagram when this interview comes out. I think we also took a look at your pop and your head up. Oh yeah, yeah, I think that's the one that we ended up using. I began putting it in the magazine. It was black and white.

It was black and white, yes. Yeah, I mean, another infamous photo, of course, is the one that most people are, I mean, you wrote a whole special about that time of your life, which I was lucky enough to go to the live taping of. Oh. And I think it's such an important thing

for people to watch. Kathy Griffin, a hell of a story. A hell of a story, and it really is, it truly was a hell of a story. Yeah, also I got to do the best tour of my career. I got the best reviews of my career. I got to play everywhere from the Sydney Opera House to Singapore, all over Europe, you know, Carnegie Hall.

I sold out Carnegie Hall in 12 hours. Amazing. So, you know, I also got a lot of understanding from real life people, but the industry decided I was toxic. And you know, I, it was seismic the way it was handled because it wasn't really a cancellation. It was an investigation by the Department of Justice. Two agencies, the U.S. Attorney's Office and the Secret Service. And I actually just got a FOIA back, Freedom of Information Act recently, expressing how serious they were about trying to charge me with the crime of conspiracy to assassinate the president of the United States. Which is absolutely ridiculous.

I mean the notion that anyone thought I was serious, but it was my own stupidity thinking people were ready to realize the level of dangerous that he is. And, you know, I was doing sort of a play on when he didn't like the way I hate to stick up for her, but Megyn Kelly did the debates, moderated the debates. He said, there is, looks like there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her wherever. And I thought, let's do a picture of him

and blood coming out of his wherever. And I thought, let's do a picture of him and blood coming out of his wherever. And we got a Halloween mask, and I put like a wig head behind it to keep it, it kept folding. And we had done three other like really goofy photos that day when I was spoofing Kim Kardashian. What thought was a champagne on your butt? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And I swear, I thought these pictures will be on Instagram for two days, or maybe a gay blog. I had no idea. Well, I mean, it sort of like harkens back to like when we were together in photo streams, like I have this great idea, let's just do it, but you know, you took a huge hit for it. Oh yeah.

I mean, right then and there, I got fired from CNN on the ticker. Nobody even called me. Anderson Cooper issued a statement. No phone call. You know, so the psychological hit was toughest because I really got it incoming from left, right, and center, it wasn't just Maca people,

but they were scary. But it was also folks I respected saying, you know, ISIS is gonna use this as a recruiting video. And Americans are gonna be beheaded because of you. You've got the blood of American soldiers on your hands. Like the campaign was intense. And the DOJ was calling my attorneys every single day asking me to go to the downtown LA precincts because they wanted

video of like a perp walk and even though they just supposedly had questions it cost me a lot of money and a lot of negotiation to just get them back off about that. But I was interrogated under oath. It was very serious, it went on about two hours. And then it was finally over and I still have an email from the DOJ saying, you're exonerated of conspiracy to assassinate the president. It's just still so crazy when I think about it.

I know, I know, I know. But also to lose, I guess, you know, the support of the industry must have just been incredible. I mean, I think, you know, everybody. Everybody, I mean, I think there's a lot of people. Hold on, not Jimmy Kimmel. No, I know. He would have gone.

You had people who stood up for you. I mean, I think that moment had to have shifted you in ways that you didn't expect it to. Trust issues for sure. I mean, for think that moment had to have shifted you in ways that you didn't expect it to. Trust issues for sure. For sure, trust issues. Obviously, you know, for a while you were not able to do the thing that you loved doing, which was make people laugh, use your voice.

Five years I couldn't tour. For the phone not to ring, for five years, just messes with your head. Yeah, I can also only imagine that. You're holding your chest. I know, my heart is hurting for you right now. I'm covering Barbara's eyes. She's gonna be a see this.

Shelter her goodness. But also, that had to have like affected the way you felt as safe as a person. Just leaving your house. I mean, that had to affect you in very deep ways that, you know, I don't know if you were able to speak freely about. I mean, I know you had Randy. Because nobody had sympathy. My husband, Randy, was incredible. But nobody had sympathy for me.

Even, you know, fellow snowflake libtards like me thought it was too far, etc. You know, I went on the Colbert show and I'm such a fan of his and I used to watch Colbert report every single night. And, you know, he wanted to kind of relitigate the photo. And I thought he was kind of tough on me because I said, Stephen, the First Amendment is both of our commodities.

And he wanted to take issue with that. And I just thought, oh, I'm just promoting my tour, man. And I walked into the wings and I burst into tears. And luckily, it was one of those two show days. And the producer goes, I'll give you a beautiful edit. And I said, what happened? And he goes, he just couldn't get beyond the picture. And it's just like, oh, but I think he's so great.

Like, really, a picture? After decades of work? Like, I do think it's one of those things that with time and space, people are going to realize a lot of people are overreacting. And I think we're already kind of at that place. Well, I think the tour, the fact that I think we're already kind of at that place. Yeah, well I think the tour,

the fact that I'm going on tour is revelatory to me. Yeah, yeah. I definitely want to talk about the, oh I just put my hand on my Ponzu sauce. Oh for God's sake. For fuck's sake. As you're putting together your new show,

and I know you told me you don't talk about Trump at all in your new show, which I love. He just doesn't really come up. It's not conscious. But do you think, when you're writing jokes now, or you're thinking about stories you want to tell, does it, is there a voice in the back of your head now like saying, okay, maybe that might be too far,

or has it impeded the way you like to create and like the way you use your voice? I don't think so because this new show really is about my PTSD and making fun of it and finding the commonality when I make jokes about getting cancer and what that's like. I make jokes about having a prescription pill addiction and trying to take my life and what that was like. You know, there's one story I have about going on vacation with Sia in Mexico and just everything went

wrong to the point where it was just Lucy and Ethel and so I sprinkled the new show with the the notion that I have PTSD is just bizarre to me because I thought it was only for you know combat veterans or something but like when you are mentioning being conscious of my own physical safety right after the Trump thing I had many people confront me and I was scared a lot. Not just you, I mean I know you've talked about this, but you know your sister was not well.

Yeah, dying of cancer. Your mother was not well and these people are also getting threats. They found them both and called them and that was terrifying because I felt like I couldn't protect them obviously but I also was discouraged kind of in human nature because the number of people That believed it and for example now the number of Americans Who are queuing on or queuing on leaning and believe that I actually Harvest baby parts with Hillary Clinton,

isn't like a few fringe people in one cult. It's like a third of America. But yeah, I'm skittish now. Naturally, I'm skittish for you. So like the quote treatment that I get for it, I find funny. Like I do this thing where I get on all fours and I arch my back.

And I say meow. Cat cow, yeah. And then, yes. I did acting class as a kid. Like, this is all, this is what we do in acting class. I thought I was the only person that, I feel like a fool. With my stardom.

I did cat cow, the lobby of circle in the square, no, no, no. Am I with my stardom? I don't force me out. I did cat-cow in a lobby of circle in the square. No, no, no, no. No. Okay, I'm sorry. Then maybe it's me. I don't think any of it works. I don't think the cupping does anything. Do you feel better?

I don't think the acupuncture works, but I do it all because I stop barfing. See now, the acupuncture thing is the most controversial thing you said to me all day. Talk to me. I think it works. Okay, I hope so because I get it once a week. I love acfing. See now, the acupuncture thing is the most controversial thing you said to me all day. Talk to me. I think it works. Okay, I hope so, because I get it once a week.

Honestly, it's like a free nap. In my ears. It's not a free nap, it's a nap I pay for. Ouch, it hurts. Yeah, yeah, it does. It does. No napping. But Kathy, I mean, there is so much that happened

in such a consolidated amount of time. I mean, I really admire you so much for rising out of that, like a Phoenix, truly. I mean, between being canceled or even erased, as you might say, to not having worked, to your mom suffering and going through final stages of dementia, and then losing your sister and then, you know, being addicted to painkiller medicine and like what you know, you famously told me, you don't drink at all.

I mean, you seem so straight edge. So the fact that that was a thing that you were struggling with to, you know, attempted suicide, it's just, it's a lot. And when you look at the time that that all happened, it is not that long, all that was compacted. It is, it did kind of start with the Trump photo and that was 16 and a half years ago.

And it's crazy how angry people still are. I took a picture with, I can't remember, might have been our good friend Selma Blair. And all the comments to her were so vicious. Like, how could you be photographed with her? She came after the greatest president in our history. She's a terrorist. And I was just like, okay, take down the picture.

It's not worth it. It's not worth it. But it's crazy. After 69 years, people are still lying about a picture. What do you think that's about? I Think it's about something that neither one of us can understand I think once you have that target painted on your back They've made their decision about you and they've made their opinions about you and that's just not gonna change

Yeah, and unfortunately, you know the internet it's a portal for all that negativity. Yeah, we placed anywhere I don't think that will ever change. I will be always very happy to post a photo with you and I will always consider you a very close friend. Oh my gosh, I love this so much. I know me too. Thank you for doing this. Absolutely. Thank you so much for also doing the drive-by. Oh, that was fun. It really gave me a lot of joy. Like I said, I wouldn't abuse it, but it was the timing. It worked out that day. Why did you have my Mary Trump's Caviar again? Because it had just been my birthday,

and she sent it to me for my birthday, and I was like, this would be a great gift. Oh, I gotta tell you what, I got Paris Hilton for her Christmas party. I'm so proud of this. But I asked the husband if she saw it, and she said it was funny, and he didn't get back to me, I gave her a bag of money.

Isn't that great? Because I was like, I was like 500 bucks. No, I gave her like some 20s and a couple of hundies and a bunch of 10s and fives. Like crumpled up? Like crumpled, yeah. And I was just like, what do you get for the girl? What is everything?

That is so funny, because also I just imagined her. But she didn't call me to say that she got it. I hope she did. I hope she got the $500. I hope she didn't throw it away. Can you imagine? Yes, I can imagine. That's all I can imagine.

I'm imagining it right now. That's very funny. You give good gifts. Thanks. Yeah. Thanks for joining me. Next week on Dinners On Me, you know him from hits like White and Nerdy and MyBelona. It's the icon himself, WeirdAl Yankovic.

We'll get into his early days as a parody singer, the lengths he's gone to to get an artist's permission, and the throwback way he got to know his wife. Spoiler, it involves a landline. Dinners On Me is a production of Sony Music Entertainment and a kid named Beckett Productions. It's hosted by me, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay.

Sam Baer engineered this episode. Hans Dilschie composed our theme music. Our head of production is Sammy Allison. Special thanks to Tamika Balans-Kolasini and Justin Makita. I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Join me next week.