Duncan Trussell Family Hour - CHRIS RYAN IN LOVE FEAR AND AEROSOL

Episode Date: June 27, 2014

Chris Ryan (SEX AT DAWN, TANGENTIALLY SPEAKING) joins the DTFH to talk about LOVE, FEAR, AND AEROSOL

When love calls, where will you be? When love calls, where will you be? Will you hear the knock? When love calls your name? When love calls, where will you be? That is the question that Daniel Johnston and Chad Fair are asking all of us on their amazing album, It's Spooky. You can get that on Amazon.com. Where will you be?

When love calls, and will you even hear it? Will you even hear the call of love? When you're wandering through some city briefcase in hand, fresh lines of cocaine oozing down the back of your throat, eyes bulging out of your head as you go rushing in the direction of whatever stock exchange you're planning on trading shares for? Will you hear it when you cross paths with a person that could become the portal through which your progeny go exploding into this universe? Or will you be deafened by the sound of your own inner monologue? Will you be too lost in the cyclone and the hurricane of thoughts that up until that point has completely defined you as a person? Blown around inside your mind like Dorothy in that house, little dog yapping witches flying around?

Will you hear it? Will you hear it when love calls? So many people don't. So many people have filled their ears with the waxy essence of fear. Their ears have a kind of psychic filter shoved into them so that the only thing that they hear are reminders that the world is a pit. That smoke rises up from the cities of the world which are perpetually collapsing into the mouth of the goddess Kali. All things destroyed, chewed up, spit out. The world like a chainsaw dropped by a serial killer on some dusty Texas highway.

An abandoned implement of gruesome death left on the skin of time by some malicious god. A horrific device still clotted with the meaty hairy clumps of whatever sorority house he just saw to pieces before he hitched a ride with some unlucky trucker to San Antonio. Some people think the world is like a cigar cast away by some psychotic multi eyeballed cigar smoking shit god. Some people think the world is a vipers nest, a deadly pit. Your mind thinks that. Why wouldn't it think that? It is dangerous in so many different ways. The world is a dangerous place. You can't deny that fact. The world is a dangerous, dangerous place. All you gotta do is flip on Nancy Grace for 6 minutes or watch one of those autopsy shows on HBO or tune into the Drudge Report or watch videos of ISIS or Al Qaeda videos, September 11th videos.

All you have to do is stand at the edge of some busy street and recognize that if by some accident the wrong neuron fires in your brain and you go stepping in front of a truck, that's it. You will explode like a bloody water balloon, horrifying people for the rest of their lives. You will create post-traumatic stress disorder for all those who watch as you get ground under the wheels of a semi because your brain malfunctioned. Constantly surrounded by the potential of being devoured by time, constantly surrounded by the potential of vanishing instantaneously from this dimension. Being slammed out of our bodies. Being eaten by wild animals. It happens all the time. You could just be jogging and some pack of roving pit bulls could come clambering out of the foliage and chew you to pieces, friends. And if the pit bulls don't get you, then a shooter can get you. Some insane lunatic. All amped up on whatever antidepressant and vapor pen he happens to be inhaling and chomping at the same time as he goes marching through a shopping mall with his AR-15 blazing, blasting giant holes in the backs of the heads of innocent people who wanted nothing more than to buy a Swiffer from Target.

All you have to do is turn on the news and you can see that we exist on a planet where the ice caps are melting, where nature itself seems to be rising up against all humanity as though we were some awful cancer about to get wiped out by the white blood cells of planet Earth, who will soon cover the cities of the Earth in swampy, brackish, malarial water, causing refugee crisis, displace people, wandering the globe, and if it's not the Earth that gets you and if it's not your brain malfunctioning that gets you and if it's not a shooter that gets you, then it's going to be some unknown disease that could be currently growing inside your body at this very moment, some terrible, malicious malignancy that you don't even know about. And if it's not that that gets you, it could just be some unexpected thing, an accident, some rare moment where a brick goes spiraling off the top of a building and spins down and smashes you in the head just as you were about to order a margarita on some beautiful Saturday at the beach. It's true, the world, a billion gnashing fanged teeth if you look at it a certain way, and it was always like this, the world's always been like this. There's always been lions and snakes, there was a time in human history where the snakes were winning the game. We had to stay up in the trees, the moment you came down from a tree if you were some poor monkey, you would get simultaneously attacked by a swarm of deadly adders and rampaging hyena beings. That's what it was like to be a proto-homoted way back in the early dawn of man, a terrifying experience, the world's terrifying, just watch any squirrel, the way a squirrel acts as it's forging around in a yard.

The squirrels generally are not relaxed, they act like they just finished seven tours of Afghanistan and got back to the United States, drank 50 cups of coffee and injected themselves with methamphetamine. Squirrels are freaked the fuck out, birds are freaked out, why wouldn't they be? At any second, a bird can get eaten by a cat, the bird population drops massively in areas where cats live because when cats get into the backyard, one of their favorite things to do is kill birds and squirrels and moles. The entirety of nature is this strange caloric exchange where life gets sucked into some being, shit out, flowers grow, the flowers pollinate and create food for more life which gets eaten by more cats, the whole goddamn thing eating itself up. It's almost as though we've gotten trapped in some kind of atomic grinder and of the unfortunate curse of sentience to make us aware of the fact that at any moment the whole goddamn thing can go exploding on top of us and we end up in the hospital or experiencing some horrible few months as everything inside of us explodes in some kind of chemical cancer fire. So, that element of the universe exists, and the mind being just like a squirrel, scared, lazy, foraging for information, looking out into the world to try to find some safety, constantly spins and runs around, lost in an endless fear cycle. If you're caught up in that goddamn fear cycle, how the hell are you gonna meet eyes with that sweet, beautiful darling who wants nothing more than to rub mayonnaise into your stomach under some Tahitian moon? When love calls, where will you be?

What part, what channel are you gonna tune into in this universe? The frequency of fear, the body of fear, as the Buddhists call it, as Jack Cornfield calls it? The inarguable and inescapable truth that everything you own, everything you are and everyone you know will vanish into oblivion for infinity eventually. Is that what you're gonna tune into? Is that the excuse you're gonna make? Is that what you're going to use to rationalize and justify the fact that for the majority of your life you have been in a boxing match, not with somebody who wants to knock you unconscious, break your jaw so that they could wear some golden belt and prance around a arena filled with cheering morons in Vegas? But a boxing match with the force of love that isn't trying to punch you but give you the ultimate hug that anyone can get. And you're just swinging and punching and sweating, fighting desperately against this strange and beautiful force that exists in the universe and has been the wind in the sails of countless romantics, mystics, saints, and other inspired people who have existed since the beginning of time.

Yes, it's a deadly world out there. I'm scared all the fucking time. And not just because I eat chiba chews every day, which are a very powerful, edible form of medical marijuana. But because there is a huge part of my mind that's fear based, freaking out, screaming, cutting itself with every single possible negative scenario that could happen in any given moment. For example, today, beautiful walk with my dogs, beautiful walk, walking up a sidewalk and I passed this nice elderly couple. And they love the dogs because the little one, a poodle, is just learning to walk and can't seem to understand that he can walk straight ahead. It's like he's always on a diagonal as though he's being sucked into an invisible fan or he's made of metal and there's some magnet pulling him in the wrong direction at all times. But he's learning and it's super cute. He's trying.

But this nice elderly couple sees this idiotic diagonal dog. It's like watching somebody who's drunk at a music festival, stumbling into ported potties. It's cute as they stop and they laugh and the elderly gentleman reaches into his pocket and brings out two little bits of dog biscuit. Do you mind if I feed your dogs? No, go ahead. But in my mind, I'm thinking, wait a minute, wait a minute. I think I saw something like this on Nancy Grace or on one of those autopsy shows and I'm already hearing the news story. Idiot stone hippie allows elderly dog killer to feed his dog massive doses of cyanide and mercury resulting in the painful and death of his dogs, which 10 minutes later popped like two fat, bloody ticks on a summer sidewalk. That's what my mind does. You can put anything in front of my mind and it will figure out a way that that thing can kill it.

Anything, bumblebees, babies, if it's a baby, the feeling is like, oh shit, man, I hope I don't accidentally step on the baby or drop the baby or you name it. My mind is like a trailer park amphetamine addict drunk on Budweiser's and screaming out the window at clouds floating in the sky. It's just a function of the mind. They call it the body of fear and Buddhism. And it's in every religion, the acknowledgement that there is this aspect of the universe that is actively devouring all humanity. This is an incredible, this is a great verse from the Bhagavad Gita that I'm going to read. I may have read it before some podcast ago. I don't remember. Chapter 11, verse 24. This is when Arjuna, the protagonist of the Bhagavad Gita, the symbolic representation of all humanity, the hero part of the self that is inevitably faced with having to fight to have the courage to go plunging into the fray regardless of outcome. And Krishna has revealed to Arjuna his universal form, as it's called. And this is a scary moment during what sounds like some kind of psychedelic DMT trip.

Oh Lord of lords, oh refuge of the worlds, please be gracious to me. I cannot keep my balance seeing thus your blazing death-like faces and awful teeth in all directions I am bewildered. All the sons of Dhritarastra along with their allied kings and Bhisma, Drona and Karna and all our soldiers are rushing into your mouths and their heads smashed by your fearful teeth. I see that some are being crushed between your teeth as well. As the rivers flow into the sea, so all these great warriors enter your blazing mouths and perish. I see all people rushing with full speed into your mouths as moths dash into a blazing fire. Oh Vishnu, I see you devouring all people in your flaming mouths and covering the universe with your immeasurable rays, scorching the worlds. You are manifest. Oh Lord of lords, so fierce a form, please tell me who you are. I offer my obeisances unto you. Please be gracious to me. I do not know what your mission is and I desire to hear of it. The Blessed Lord said, Time I am, destroyer of the worlds, and I have come to engage all people. All the soldiers here on both sides will be slain. Therefore get up and prepare to fight. Everyone is put to death by my arrangement and you can be an instrument in the fight. All the jobs rotting corpse and put them in a laboratory with the rotting corpses of Tesla and Einstein and bring all the great inventors who exist in the world today. Bill Gates throws Stephen Hawking into that stinking half zombie filled laboratory. Elon Musk get him in there and all the other tech geniuses that never get famous and throw them all into this alchemical laboratory and give them all the money and resources that they possibly want and need and tell them that you want them to create some kind of device that will protect you from this inevitable demise that we all face and they could never do it.

Even if they spent an infinite amount of time and figured out a way to transform the atomic structure of your body into some kind of never changing, infinite human form, they can't stop the sun from supernovaing and wiping out the planet. And let's say they could even do that. Eventually all the black holes are going to conchill together and we're all going to get sucked into some kind of impossible to understand singularity. There's no way to stop it. So if you're letting your mind trick you by clanging pots together and drawing your attention away from the more subtle call of love that exists everywhere, it doesn't just have to be sexual love. It doesn't just have to be the secret love you feel for your step sister who you desperately want to finger under the stairs. That's just an extreme version of this force of love that according to some very smart people permeates all things. When love calls, where will you be? Well the fascinating thing is the only place you're going to be is the present moment because until you figure out a way to, you'll never get the methodic that lives inside the trailer park of your brain to stop screaming about the fact that his fillings are actually implants placed there by CIA agents who want to monitor his thoughts. You're never going to tune down the subconscious Nancy Grace that parades through the neighborhoods of your mind muttering about children being strangled to death in the swamps of the world.

You're probably never going to be able to stop that part of your mind, that chattering hellraiser cube part of your mind with the meat hooks hanging down from the ceiling and the weird cinnabite demons with the pins in their head telling you how everything is just pain. But the great hope is you can understand that that is just one part of your brain, that's one part of the universe of your mind and theoretically if you can begin the slow process of disengaging from that slayer concert that's been raging in your mind ever since you realize that your parents are going to die. There is a possibility that you will hear from an unexpected place a brand new sound that you forgot even existed. It's the sound that babies hear. It's the sound that lies underneath all the turbulence and horror of the modern world. It's the sound of love friends. Where will you be when love calls? I'll tell you one place you won't be when love calls, you're coffin.

By then it's too late. If you close off, seal down, let the fear mind activate the laser sensors of the vault of your heart and shut those fucking doors down and seal you up and close you off and you walk around the world with your fists clenched, writing angry blogs about shit Ricky Gervais said. Then you're going to miss out. It's as though there was some enormous buffet that exists in this garden of Eden like planet and you decided to stay at the section of the buffet where they only serve diarrhea. You don't have to eat the poop from the buffet of life for your entire existence. You can eat pasta as Jesus said. Hear it. This 4th of July hear it.

It's under the sound of fireworks. It's inside the sound of fireworks. It's inside the sound of birdies. It's even inside the sound of chainsaws ripping sorority sisters apart underneath a Texas moon. It's inside everything just like salts inside all the water of the ocean. At least that's what the super smart people say. Who knows? Maybe I'm just a loony hippie who likes to eat marijuana and ride his bike around.

But I can tell you that every time in my life when I've become convinced that it'll never emerge into my existence again, every time I've become convinced that that's it, I might as well just start eating cat food and shaking my fist at Mexican kids riding their bikes in front of my house. That's when it comes. And whenever it comes, you have to be there to open the door. Because if you don't and you let fear take over and you allow your mind to tell you though you're going to get ripped, this is going to be it, you're going to get your heart broken this time man. So what?

Better to have a broken heart than a heart covered with a meaty fear callus that comes from a coward's life. I'd much rather have a broken heart than a heart that looks like my big toe, which if you've ever seen it is not a pretty sight. There's a thick yellowy callus that from time to time I have to go down and get people to shave off with grinders. They have to put on saw goggles, they have to put on the same thing they wear, the Fukushima nuclear reactors when they saw the calluses of my feet. I'd much rather have a broken heart than a heart covered with a thick yellowy mystery callus, that's for sure. Pick the pain, it doesn't matter, we're all plunging into the void anyway. Take the ride, when love calls. Pick up the goddamn phone you cowards, not that you're all cowards.

Some of you I'm sure are a million times braver than I am, a billion times wouldn't be that hard. For those of you that are cowards like me, this 4th of July, open your ears and just the act of pretending, playing around with the notion that when things seem the most bleak and lonely and impossible, when it truly seems that winter is not just coming but that it came and is going to stay there forever, that's when the little sprigs, the little green sprigs start growing up in unexpected places. Spray some water on those arid fields friend, let the universe shave off that nasty yellowing translucent callus that you've allowed to form around your sweet heart. But be careful, once the flat still briny, malarial water of your subjective consciousness gets filled with effervescent bubbles that come from falling in love, you will no longer be able to function as a cunt in the same way. And that can create a lot of problems if you've based your entire life on being a drooling, fang-toothed life cunt erupting negativity on all those who cross paths with you. You're just going to have to deal with that. You're going to have to deal with the fact that you are going to become a sweet, powdered little baby's cheat that everybody wants to pinch.

And yeah, we know, you're afraid that you're not going to be funny anymore, your business won't be as successful, or some part of your life based on being a goddamn infection is going to fall apart. Who wants that? Let it fall apart. It's already fallen apart, trust me. We're in some kind of flux right now and your distant relatives have already forgotten about you at some point in the future. So forget your stupid career based on being a dickhead. Forget your dumb career based on being cruel to people or whatever life path you've taken that somehow your mind is convinced you is only working out because you're a closed off, shut down human swamp adder. Let that fall apart. You'll be fine. I'm sure it would be better to be in the throes of ecstatic, Sufi level love and living behind a dumpster letting rats piss in your mouth than it would be to have a closed off, shut down heart chakra and be at the top of some diamond encrusted tower getting blow jobs from your sex slaves.

How are you going to enjoy sex slaves if you can't feel it's like going inner tubing in some way that you can enjoy inner tubing couldn't think anything for that one. We go deep into this in this podcast friends Chris Ryan as you know if you've listened to past episodes always hits home runs every time and this is a deep awesome conversation where we go into the idea of love we go into the idea of impermanence. We talk about what it means to be gay we talk about a great many other important things which I can't recall this very second, but it was fun. And I love Chris Ryan. And if you get a chance listen to his great podcast tangentially speaking, we're going to get going with this podcast but first some quick business. This episode of the Dunkin Trussell Family Hour podcast is brought to you by Hulu Plus. For those of you who don't know Hulu Plus allows you to watch TV shows current episodes of TV shows like Community Attack on Titan, Nashville Lost and Doctor Who on your TV. You can binge watch shows that's what it does for those of you who've never binge watched shows it's a great thing to do.

If you follow my advice and allow yourself to experience love and fall in love when you eventually find yourself staring down at the broken fragments of your heart screaming at the sky and wondering if the pain will ever end. One of the first things you should do subscribe to Hulu Plus lay in bed surround yourself with ice cream Doritos booze weed whatever gets you off and binge watch Doctor Who. That is a surefire way to go back into ignoring the pain. And sometimes it's great to ignore the pain. Sometimes if you've got a hangover and you don't want to go and mow the lawn or do whatever it was that you were going to do if you've gotten food poisoning because you skimped on eating at a reputable restaurant and ended up eating a chicken burrito that from the moment you tasted it to the moment you finished it you knew was poisoning your system this just happened to me. And you find yourself a few hours later with explosive diarrhea in your head filling up with the chicken farts. And you realize that for the next three days all you're going to be doing is writhing around shitting and puking. Then why not subscribe to Hulu Plus and spend those days distracting yourself from the fact that your insides are at this very moment filled with rotting flesh that you decided to eat even though you knew it tasted bad.

Just happened to me. Hulu Plus came to the rescue. They've got amazing shows. They've got the entire criterion collection. They've got the fall guy. They've got the A team. They've got Fraggle Rock. Remember Fraggle Rock?

I don't know why someone hasn't written a conspiracy blog about Fraggle Rock but man if anything gave an incredible commentary on human society it was Fraggle Rock man. The Illuminati was using those cute little subterranean dwellers to send some message to us. Maybe not but if you get stoned enough and subscribe to Hulu Plus and watch Fraggle Rock you can convince yourself that you're actually getting beamed top secret Alex Jones level information from what ostensibly was just supposed to be a kid's show. You get all this for $7.99 a month. If you go to HuluPlus.com slash DTFH and sign up you'll get two weeks full access completely free. Then it turns to $8 a month. What is $8 a month? That's three big gulps.

Only it won't kill you. Not that big gulps will kill you depending on what you're doing when you're drinking the big gulp. $8 a month you get access to every TV show. The entire criterion collection. A plethora of movies. And you can watch this on your smart TV, Roku, Apple TV, Xbox, PlayStation or pretty much any streaming device you already own. I can't recommend this enough. I subscribe to Hulu Plus.

$8 a month. They didn't give it to me for free for doing these advertisements. But that's okay. I don't mind paying for it. It's a really cool service. Makes me feel like I'm in the future. When I was a kid, you had to go to the back of your musty old TV and wipe away the tears from your eyes as you listen to your parents downstairs screaming at each other, throwing the cat into the wall, praying to Lucifer. You'd stick the weird metal tongs in the back of the TV and then flip the dial of the TV.

And you were lucky if you just got sound. Sometimes you didn't just get sound. You didn't even have sound when I was a kid. You just pretended that the fuzz that you were seeing on TV was some kind of sci-fi movie where a spaceship was moving through infinite clouds. That's how we got entertainment when I was a boy back in the early 30s. But now you can go to Hulu Plus and instantaneously access nearly every TV show that ever existed. If I went back in time and told my younger self that, then I'd probably put myself in an intentional coma and try to skip my entire childhood, teen years and college years until the moment that Hulu Plus existed. So now you can experience the sweet geyser of entertainment.

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These dates are going to be listed on my website. I'm adding new dates. I just added a date in Vancouver, but there's also dates coming up in San Francisco. There's also dates coming up in other parts of Canada. There's tons of great dates coming up. Please go to dunkitrustle.com and check those dates out. For those of you who have attempted to buy our new t-shirt design, we have new shirts that should be in within the week. We sold out almost instantly because these shirts have within them, as William Burroughs put it, a mythic resonance.

The new DTFH Enneagram shirts were designed by the mystic artist, Ron Regi, and he encoded within them a lot of different occult symbols which are designed to protect you from the evil eye of the haters who might go walking by you and want to roll their eyes at you because they see that you're bubbling with love and joy and have opened yourself to allowing yourself to get heartbroken because you've recognized that you'd rather experience a true connection with the force of love in the universe than walk around completely disconnected and pretending that you're feeling okay. This will shield you from the evil eyes of those cynical, sardonic cunts who want nothing more than to shove you right back into that dusty, dead, airless vault that used to be your life of fear.

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and sometimes they're a little weird and off base and there's some wars that rage there. But man, right now I am so happy about the way the forum at dunkatrustle.com is going. It's a really cool community of people. And I invite you, if you haven't gone there, to sign up for a membership and just say hi to these people. I'm not saying there aren't a few turds floating in the bowl over there, but if they are inside the turd, there's a diamond. That's for sure. Inside every turd, there's a diamond.

One of my favorite songs. And if you also, what am I missing here? Sorry, I lost my trail of thoughts as I was thinking, well, I guess somebody was smuggling diamonds out of a diamond mine and eating them, and that song would be true. Whatever. It can't all be homeruns, friends. I'm not going to delete that.

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but I do respond to emails that come to me. You can contact me by going to dunkatrustle.com. And as always, please go through our Amazon portal. It's located at the comment section of this website. Pop through that portal the next time you're going to buy something on Amazon. Many of you are already doing that, and I am very grateful to you for doing that. It really does help support this podcast, and it's a way for you to donate some money without paying anything extra, just by buying whatever wonderful bit of fascinating plastic

that you have become fixated on, like a brand new camera or an iPad. So go through the portal, won't you? It's located on the comment section of every episode of this podcast. Okay, now, everybody, you know him from his controversial, incredible, incendiary, game-changing book, Sexiton. You know him from his brilliant podcast, where he has some of the top intellectuals of our time as his guests. Tangentially speaking, you know him as one of the sweetest men

that has ever walked upon the surface of this beautiful, paradise planet that we're so lucky to be incarnated into. Everybody, please welcome to the Dunkertrustle Family Hour podcast the great Chris Ryan. Ryan! It's the Dunkertrustle Family Hour. Test, test, test. You're with Chris Ryan. Chris, fucking Ryan.

Chris Ryan, welcome back to the Dunkertrustle Family Hour podcast. To the audience, I apologize. You might hear a background hum. That is the fan that we have running, because it's fucking hot in my podcast studio that I need to figure out a cool-down. Welcome. Thank you, man. Nowhere I'd rather be, even with the heat. Where would you rather be? I said, nowhere I'd rather be. Oh, I thought you said, you know where I'd rather be.

No, no, no. There's nowhere I would rather be. There's a lot of places you'd rather be. Well, not right now. You wouldn't want to be, say, in the harem of some... I'll get there later. But right now, I could... Right now, I want to be here with you. If you could teleport...

Dunkin' T. Russell. Immediately into a room filled with the smartest humans who ever lived, you would rather be here? Yeah. No, a room full of the smartest humans that ever lived in a fucking disaster. They'd all be arguing. There'd be all this ego going on. I'd be the dumb guy in the room.

It's like when I lived in the house, I probably told you about this. I lived in this mansion where everyone who lived there was a fashion model except me. It was like Melrose Place, and I was the ugly guy in the house. I don't need that. I don't need to be in a room full of geniuses.

Transport me into a room full of idiots. There you go. Really ugly idiots. Fucking smart guy. I have fun. And really old. I'll be the young guy. So you want to be in a room full of old, asymmetrical idiots.

Exactly. And then you could be their leader. Start a country. That would be a great insult. You asymmetrical idiot. What's that mean? See? See?

This fucking... This guy is like... This physical form thing, man. It's just such a pain in the ass. It's like... Here we are in this amazing time in human history for better or for worse, but we're still chained down

by the constraints of the physical form. People are... You've got a thing about that. You've got a bug up your ass about the physical form. I've heard... What do you call it? The meat body. Meat bodies and all that stuff.

And yet, I was just saying earlier, you look incredibly fit and healthy. So there's an interesting dichotomy there where your actual meat body is... All right. I'm thinking about this because I told you before we started recording, as soon as I get home in a couple of days,

this marks the big division where, like from now on, I'm working on the book, I'm going to the gym, I'm going to get in shape all this shit, right? So... I've been thinking about our bodies and my relationship with my body and all that.

And the thing is, like, I sympathize with what you're saying about being trapped. William Butler Yates said we're... I think he said we're chained to a dying beast. Yes. Right? So I sympathize with that, especially I'm 52,

the beast is a little more dying than it used to be. You know, hairs are growing out of my ears and shit, you know, all this weird aging stuff. But on the other side, there's no greater source of pleasure in our life than our bodies if we treat them right. Right? Like, taking a good shit

is a wonderful experience. We don't generally talk about it, you know? But it is, it's like a real fucking pleasure to take a proper dump. Yes. No one's going to argue with that if they do that out of their minds. Even a fart, even a good fart,

if you're alone, is wonderful. The excretory function is a great source of pleasure. I mean, most functions are. That's the thing, you know, you're scratching it, you go to sleep at night when you're tired, you wake up in the morning when you slept well, that feels great.

You eat when you're hungry, that feels great. You take a dump later, that feels great. It's like a constant source of pleasure and contentment if you have a good relationship with it. My problem right now is that I don't, I've been ignoring it for years, so I don't, like, get that feeling of, I mean, even not when you're doing something specific,

you were talking earlier about riding your bike a lot, when you're in shape, it just feels good to be alive. Yes, it does. This is like a constant background hum of contentment. You gotta walk the dog. You gotta walk the dog. Exactly. And that's what your body is.

Or it becomes a whiny, gappy bitch. Yeah, that's exactly. You gotta walk the dog, and when I say the meat body thing, I'm not saying reject or renounce the needs of the body temple. I'm just saying that it's a shame, or it's what we, what we, it's a, it's in the same way humans can't fly.

Right. Like, wow, how amazing would that be if humans could fly? It's a, everybody's fantasized about it, that just, if you just sit for a moment and think about how incredible it would be, how much of a burden would be lifted off of all of society,

if suddenly every single human gained the ability to fly. Sure, there'd be problems, but you look at people who are driving like, what the fuck are you doing? Like, why are you in that car when you could soar through the sky, getting to wherever you want,

flying would be incredible. So there's an eternal burden that humans have, or a wall, which is gravity that obstructs us from what appears to be one of the great pleasures available to certain animals on the planet. But there's another obstruction we have, equivalent, which is, if you are asymmetrical,

if you have an asymmetrical form, if you're just born with, for whatever reason, features that aren't considered to be attractive, then you live a very specific type of life. You live a very, whether you like it or not, you want to talk about racism, sure, there's racism,

idiotate black people, idiotate white people, misogyny, sure, idiotate women, idiotate men, but goddamn, there is another form of racism, another form of thing that seems to be built into us,

maybe, genetically, which is that if somebody is not physically attractive, they are rejected by the world. And to me, that's always seemed like a very sad thing, because some of the people who aren't physically attractive, or some of the most incredibly beautiful, amazing humans you'll ever come across, Is that a function of them being unattractive, though?

Would they be that interesting if they were super good looking? Man, you know, you think that, and then you meet someone who's incredibly physically attractive, and they're amazing, and then you realize, like, holy shit, no, it's not, I mean, you might be part of it. Well, there are exceptions, but having lived in that house full of fashion models,

I can tell you that the women tended to not be interesting at all, and they were irritating to be around. But in some ugly people, I know what you mean, though, here's the idea, the idea is, this is an idea to think about. But we compensate, right?

We compensate. So if you don't have it going on in one area, like, I'm not a natural athlete, right? If I were a natural athlete, if I were, like, dominating the other kids on, you know, the football field or whatever, I doubt I would have read as much as I did. So then I wouldn't have developed, you know,

the intellectual capacities I have, which are now, like, what pays the rent, right? So, you know, in a sense, I think, of course, there are many examples. I did meet intelligent, wonderful people who were super good-looking. But in general, being that good-looking, you don't need to work for anything,

so you don't, so it comes easy, and then you get this sense of entitlement, like rich kids, kids who grow up rich, you know? They tend to be dicks. Why? Because they don't know what it's like to not be rich. This is the idea of... I was just, man, I've just recently gotten into this.

God, honestly, I'm gonna say it. I'm gonna say it. I think I'm in love with him. Zizek. I think I'm in love with Zizek. Like, I feel like I just want to be close to the guy. Who the fuck is Zizek? He's this incredible Marxist philosopher.

Oh, I met him. I spoke with him in Australia at the Festival of Dangerous Ideas. God, I would... My hands would be shaking. That guy is... Have you seen his incredible documentary on Netflix called The Pervert's Guide to Ideology? No.

Wow! It's amazing, and it's just a breakdown of the conditioning in a lot of Western movies, and he's just so funny and smart, and I've got butterflies over this guy, but one thing that he says... One thing that he says is he's showing the riots, videos of the riots that happened in the UK,

and all these people rioting and rioting and talking about how the... You know, the people like to say, this is the socioeconomic condition that's causing these people to riot, because blah, blah, blah, and he's like, yeah, but no matter what the socioeconomic condition is or the external condition is,

if you're a human, you know that there's something inside of you that transcends your socioeconomic, physical, gender-based, whatever condition. There's something in you bigger than that. Otherwise, we'd just be robots, moved by the... Not robots, but just kind of like individual droplets of H2O being sort of thrown around

by the tides of society, and there's something bigger in us than that, you know? So it's like, yes, people are lazy, that's for sure, and yes, you meet somebody who's entitled, and sometimes you find that they seem to be unappealing or uninteresting. Here's the big question. How can you be a human being and not be interesting?

How can you be shot out of a pussy under this strange... Shut up. ...automatically be interesting? You're a sentient little piece of the fucking universe, whether or not you're symmetrical, asymmetrical, rich, poor, you're fucking interesting. So maybe that thing we call personalitylessness that we ascribe to some of these people

is, in fact, a kind of massive defense mechanism to keep them from, like, being objectified. So do boring people have interesting dreams, I wonder? God damn, that's a great question. I mean, isn't a dream automatically interesting? Blind people, apparently, who were born at birth, have visuals in their dreams. Oh, wow.

Yeah, not like geometric shapes and stuff like that. That makes sense. Yeah, because the brain produces those. Yeah. But yeah, do boring people have interesting dreams? I mean, a lot of people that we would consider boring, uninteresting, whatever, it's because they're so repressed. That's it.

So that could make them really interesting if you could release some of whatever's under all that weight. But that's dangerous, you know? Yeah, I mean, you've done that too, I'm sure, with women. You meet a woman who's really repressed and you sort of find the key that opens her up a little bit and it's like saving someone's life. You know, like the American Indian thing,

if you save someone's life, then you owe them taking care of them the rest of their lives because now they're alive because of you. Yeah, this is spiritualized, an idea of the guru-disciple connection which is like the guru takes on the karma of the disciple and it's a really heavy duty thing to do because and also the stories of coming in contact with the guru

are always one of weeping, one of this explosion of all this repressed aspects of yourself. Because why are people repressing themselves? Why are they? Why do you think people repress themselves? We generally fear and shame, which is the same thing, really. Yeah. So, when you get around to guru, the idea is

these are people who somehow, whether you're superstitious and believe they have a telepathic connection to your subconscious and witness all the things you've been hiding or they're just really good at making it seem like they're witnessing the things that you're hiding, regardless they're able to project the impression that they have completely seen everything about you and they love you no matter what.

Right. And if you're in a good relationship with somebody that's awesome when you really love, you do feel like that. Yeah. Mark Marin has this great joke about when, you know, he's in love and he's like listening to his, oh, you're not, I'm sorry,

you're not supposed to say comedians jokes on the air after that. Oh, really wonderful. Yeah, because it, I almost did this with Rogan. He's like, that's one of my jokes. I think you were there. Yeah, I was there. I noticed you guys were doing that. Like, careful, don't say that.

I thought it was because he had a special coming up or something. The reason is because if the comedian is performing, it's not what they're saying generally to be new to the people. Yeah, but if they've already done it publicly. Yeah, but it's still, anyway, it's a great, it's a great, the point is it's that idea behind the joke is like, even the like functions of a person that normally would be considered appalling or hidden,

you just love every single piece of them. Yeah, at the beginning. Well, yeah, of course, of course. But in that, what you just did right there, the thing like at the beginning, that's the human mind. That's the mind. The mind does that. Anytime anything wonderful is happening,

the mind, as soon as it really, as soon as you're getting into being in the moment and experiencing this explosion of ecstatic euphoric love, the mind says just what you said. Well, okay, but it's also the brain, which has experienced these things. I mean, when I was in my 20s, I would have said that probably because I was immersed in it.

I was like stewing in, you know, and there's a great line in Tobias Wolf. He's a short story writer. He wrote This Boy's Life. It's a great movie with Leonardo DiCaprio when he was a teenager. Anyway, he has this line where he says, you know, it's the curse of experience

is knowing that everything ends. But it's also the curse of youth thinking it won't. So when you're young, bliss is endless bliss. Pain is endless pain. And as you get older, you realize, well, whatever, this sucks, but it'll pass. This is amazing, but it'll pass. You know, that's who said this too shall pass,

plate over somebody, you know? I think it's just, it is part of the human condition, but it's the fact that we have memory, you know, and we learn and like, oh, I've been in love before, and it's wonderful and enjoy it. Like we're getting back to taking a shit, not that I want to equate being in love with taking a shit, but there's a wisdom in deeply immersing yourself

in every moment of your life, Karpi fucking Diem, because you know it won't last. Have you heard the term zen mind, beginner's mind? Yeah, I read the book. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's like, you could take anything, man, whatever it is, a beer. It's great for now.

It's gonna run the fuck out. It's gonna get warm if we don't drink it. But every moment, it's like, to me, it's like my mind in the past has had the tendency to say it, and especially the tonality that you said it with, too. It's like, did I piss on your love? I didn't mean to do that. You didn't piss on my love.

No, you can't. But the mind, it's the function of the mind to piss on love and to piss on everything else, just like a baby. But see, I don't think so, because you're, I mean, the way you're taking it, and I understand that you're doing that, but the way you're taking it, you're saying you minimize it by recognizing its transitoriness.

Transitoriness, is that a word? Well, not only do you minimize it, but you have some incredible hubris to say that anything, anything is going to meet your expectations for good or for bad. And the lovely, lovely invitation of so many of these insane mystics is, let's abandon that for a second. Just for fun. Let's, instead of doing the thing that I've certainly always done

whenever I get into a great situation, not just intimate relationship, but anything. Great day. Oh my God, like ecstasy. Take a hit of ecstasy. One hour in, when you're really feeling that incredible euphoric rush, and you start thinking like, this is going to end. You know what I mean?

That's the mind. That's the mind. So you take that part of yourself just for fun as an experiment. And you put it on an altar and you take a dagger and plunge it through its heart and say, before you do it, you say, I'm offering you up to the greater truth. I don't know what the out things are going to turn out. Just for fun, I'm going to pretend that I don't know how things are going to turn out.

Oh, it's fun. But see the thing, you and I are looking at this from two different perspectives because I don't have that tendency to, what I was saying is that for me recognizing that something is transitory doesn't, it doesn't result in my minimizing the experience. In fact, it's the opposite. It results in my paying greater attention to it because I recognize it's going to end. I mean, I remember having this conversation with women, you know, repeatedly over the years.

Like, you know, the woman saying, but, you know, we're on the road. I was traveling all the time, right? So, okay, you're great. I really like being with you. You want to have sex. I kind of want to have sex, but I'm going to be hurt because next week you'll be in Cambodia and I'll be in India and we'll never see each other again. And I remember saying, yeah, but today we'll never be here again.

Tonight we'll never be here again. You know, wherever we are, we'll never be there again. So why not really experience this? Yes. You know, granted I was trying to get laid, but I think there was, there was truth in that. But PS, man, it's, there's a bigger issue here. It's like a lot of people are like projecting their fear of death by like, you know, applying it to like the most special thing that you experience in life. And one of the most special things you experience is the kind of connection with people.

Yeah. And so because it's easier to deal with the idea that, well, this connection, it's easier to do that to be like, well, yeah, I guess what else won't last? Your physical fucking form, motherfucker. Everything won't last. Everything won't last. The entire universe is in a state of complete dissipation. We're all heading towards a massive atomic change just around the corner, just around the corner, blink of an eye. Entropy always wins.

Entropy always wins. We're going to go back into the cosmic swirl, become, become aerosolized by time. Yeah. So from that perspective, it's kind of like, well, aerosolized by time. Duncan, you come out with fucking humdingers, dude. I don't mean to interrupt you. You come out with some shit that like somebody should be following you around with a notebook. Oh, please.

You're aerosolized by time. Aerosolized by time, man. Blast it. That's a great expression. Back into the great void. So from that perspective, since we're not just dealing with the fact that it's just love that has the tendency to fade like a beautiful rose or love as we understand it, we're also dealing with the tendency of all things to do this. Right. To me, it kind of like, it makes it, you just have to like make sure you watch that part of the mind that's doing that to understand what exactly is the purpose of the thought matter.

Sure. A lot of times you're right. A lot of times it's a diminishment and it's out of fear. It's like, yeah, yeah, this is great, but you know, come on, life sucks. You know, it's that tone, right? Which I guess is what you heard in my voice. But it's not what I mean. It's not what I believe at all.

I believe the opposite, which is, yeah, nothing lasts forever. So fucking enjoy it. Open it up, man. When you're taking that dump, enjoy that dump. Yeah. You know, there was that great story. You know, we got it somewhere. Some Zen monk woman.

What's the name for a woman monk? I guess it's just monk, right? Spanish is a different word. But anyway, she was, she was giving talk somewhere, or maybe she was a nun or a Christian figure. Anyway, she was, so she was this sort of like aesthetic, you know, living in silence and all that kind of stuff. And she was having dinner somewhere and they served her a partridge. And she fucking went into this partridge like a wild animal. She had like fat running down her face and she was just like tearing it.

And someone said like, wow, I didn't expect you to enjoy food so much. And she said, when it's time to meditate, meditation. When it's partridge time, partridge. And it's always partridge time, man. And it's, and that's, you know, that's the, we're dealing with this kind of like tendency of the self to, and I feel myself do it all the time, but it's the tendency of the self to contract. It's expansion versus contraction. And it's, and you can contract if you want, and that's fine. You can contract all the way you want, all the way into a little ball.

Like one of those roly-poly bugs that will just if you touch up the stick, it curls up into a little ball. Some people spend their entire life like that. And you could do that. You could definitely do that if you wanted to. That's what the movie Fargo is about, right? Right. That's super like controlled uptight little guy. That's it.

Yeah. And you can tighten down all you want, man. You can tighten down all you want. And I get it. I don't blame you for tightening down like that. If you really consider from the very top of the pyramid, which is that how do you know how fast the earth spins? I don't need it, but we're going that fast right now. So when you consider that crazy idea that we're going is however fast the earth spins, not to mention the spinning of the earth, but it's orbit around the sun.

Then you're adding the spin to whatever the speed that the earth is traveling around the sun. Just that incredible speed that we're experiencing, that amazing speed is enough to terrify a person if you let your mind think about it. Then you add to the fact that you're on top of this speeding fucking ball and you're melting like a wax candle because of the effects of oxygen and gravity on your body, right? Then there's even more reason to shut down. Then you add to that that to really enjoy human relationship. You have to have the courage of allowing yourself to get stretched out and fucking eviscerated, sliced wide open, and you have to do that, man. That's what you do. You get sliced up and eviscerated.

Hey, man, it's what's happening to us anyway. We're all like in the Bhagavad Gita when Arjuna is talking to Krishna and Krishna says, I don't remember the exact verse, but it's like his example is, behold, I've already eaten everyone on this battlefield. And he goes into a great description of it, which is like, look at them in my teeth. He's basically saying, look, it's pieces of your brother in my teeth. I've eaten them all, motherfucker. This is Krishna. This is Krishna.

He doesn't say I've eaten them all, motherfucker, but that's what he meant. His point being, friend, I've already eaten you. You're a lunch. It's a done deal. It's a done deal. We know how this ends. So don't throw down the bow. Don't give up the fight.

Don't become a, don't become dejected, but rather eat that fucking partridge. Right. And enjoy it. Yeah. Oh, no, I definitely agree with that. Now, let me ask you a slight change of topic. But since I've got you here, you know, I am in LA, right? I'm shooting this pilot.

Yes, I do. Okay. For HBO. And I guess I can say that because this won't be out for a couple of days at least. And one of the segments that they want us to do is called unsolicited advice. Yes. So I got 30 seconds to give unsolicited advice to anyone I want. Awesome.

And I'm thinking like, what should I do? Here's my idea. And like, if you have other ideas, throw them out. Awesome. Because yeah, I want to bring it. My idea was to, and I'm not sure who to give the advice to the head of the FDA, the whoever gets chosen to be the head of the veterans administration. The advice is open up, remove all controls on using MDMA to treat PTSD and returning

vets. Great advice. Because you guys are fucking over the vets. You're not giving them the, especially mental health treatment. Great advice. And nothing is more powerful than psychotherapy assisted company by MDMA and remove in helping people with PTSD. Great advice.

What do you think? Love it. Yeah? Love it. You know, Carl Rowe to fuck off and crawl back under a rock because you know, Carl Rowe is just... Is that advice? Well, yeah.

Here's some advice. Fuck off. You know, you could praise it. Because you know, Carl Rowe's father was gay. Oh, no, I didn't have that. Yeah. Carl Rowe's father was gay. He was, that's why his parents got divorced.

And then his mother committed suicide. His father came out and that led to the divorce. And his father was also really into genital piercing. Oh really? And he was like on the cover of genital piercing. So Carl Rowe was just rebelling. Yeah. Against his dad.

And the whole country suffering. Wow. And apparently he had a good relationship with his dad and he accepted his dad being out and like, it was cool. So he subsumed it or what's the word, he repressed it all. And now it's like the entire country is fucked because Carl Rowe is... So sad. And he's such an evil fuck.

So sad. Yeah. I like your advice, man. I like your advice to the Pope, the current Pope, because he's doing such a good job. Like, be cool about weed? Not just be cool about weed. Because he said drugs should not be decriminalized. Smoke marijuana.

Right. Or take some ecstasy. The Pope on ecstasy? I think he'd dig it. I think that's it. I think the idea is like, okay, fine. These drugs are evil, even though marijuana existed during the time of your savior and was not prohibited at all.

Right. It's not an utterance that I know of in the New Testament where Jesus said, don't smoke marijuana. And probably the oil they were using to anoint everyone was fucking hand-coil. It was hash. So, yeah. So the problem is, is like, okay, wait a minute, man. A lot of the stuff you're saying, friend, is pretty beautiful.

The images of you washing the sick people's feet symbolically, that's incredible. You got rid of the Pope Mobile, you're like, look, if you want to shoot me, go ahead and do it. That's incredible. The guys communicated the mafia. Super cool. Pretty cool. But it's like, you're still saying it's okay for farmers to get raped and prison.

And that seems like a pretty shitty fucking thing for a Pope to say. Oh, and farmers. Right. Marijuana farmers. Right, yeah. You know, because if you send somebody to prison for marijuana and they go to the wrong prison, there's some statistical probability that they're going to get assaulted and raped. So, oh, Lord of love, representative of the force of all love on planet Earth, can you

please shut the fuck up about marijuana being illegal? You satanic shill for the devil. Come on, you motherfucker. You motherfucker. Really? You want to send fucking farmers to the dungeon and you say you represent Jesus? You piece of shit. Oh, come on.

Don't go that far. No, go that far. These are our only hope. They took his kids away. They took his family away. They took his life away. Anybody who went to jail for weed, and this son of a bitch is saying, keep it illegal and don't let people make their own decisions, you evil satanic fuck.

Okay, but you're going to lose him if you do that. I mean, I don't want to be, you know, with, what's her name? I don't want to be friends with people who send agrarians to prison. Yeah. Now, I would also like to see the pope sit down with God and ask God why he made marijuana and grew out of the earth. Was that like an accident to make the evil plan? Was it like, I want to see God's skull or the pope's skull, God.

And it grows so fast and so easy. And it cures so many ailments. It's fucking incredible for fabric. And this goddamn weirdo, this weirdo who's in a death cult is prancing around because his PR team is like, let's do this and this and it's going to make the people love the Catholic church and forget the fact that we've been fingering toddlers for the last 40 years and what appears to be an organized, an actual organized and protected thing. The whole world will forget about it.

Listen, it's going to suck. He's the Obama of Catholicism. There you go. Yeah. He's the pretty little thing sent out to calm everybody down. There you go. Let me keep doing their thing. There you go.

There you go. But you know a man by his stance on marijuana. You know a man. You know what a man is. The moment a man says that human should be in prison. Or a woman. Or a woman who says that people should be in prison for freedom of choice to do a substance that causes zero deaths.

Victimless crime. Then you know that's an evil man. Yeah. That's an evil man. That's not a good man. Or at least an ignorant man participating in an evil system. And that's what, I mean, come on, let's face it. When you get an ignorant charismatic, what do you have, man?

You've got the worst kind of thing ever. You don't want that in the fucking chessboard. Yeah. You ever listened to hardcore history? No. I keep wanting to. Yeah, I know. Daniel told me to check it out and I downloaded a few episodes and from, you know, a year

ago I had them on, whatever. And so recently Cassie and I drew, I told you earlier, we did this porn movie in San Francisco. Yes. So we were driving down to San Francisco and I decided to put one on. And it turns out Cassie's mother was a huge fan of Genghis Khan, which is a weird thing. My mother-in-law was a big Genghis Khan fan. Put that in your pipe. That's badass.

Yeah. So anyway, so Cassie knew all this shit about Genghis Khan, so she was really interested in it. She knew the wrath of the Khans. I think it's a four-part series about the Mongolians. I've heard about it. I've heard it. It's excellent.

It's very good. That's what Danieli recommended. Why am I talking? Oh, he repeatedly made this point because apparently there are revisionist historians who are saying, look, Genghis Khan, okay, he's got a bad rap. But look at all this great stuff he did. He brought order to the world. He created safety and passages and allowed trade and he was religiously tolerant and he

was like, hey, it wasn't that bad a guy. Really, man. And Dan Carlin's point was, okay, but he killed 50 to 60 million people ruthlessly. He would be like, just go in and kill every living thing in cities. And we're saying, well, yeah, okay, there's that. But look at the other. And he was like, okay, you want to make a lot of money? He wrote a book about the good aspects of Hitler, you know, because the only difference between

Hitler and Genghis Khan is... Hitler was lazy. Well, Hitler lost. So he's not writing the history. And B, it was recent. People are still alive and who will rebel against that. But if it's, you know, 500 years ago, you can like say, well, yeah, okay, 50 million people died, but whatever.

I didn't know them. So let's look at the structural positive things that happened. You can't do that with Hitler yet because it was too recent. But it's exactly the same process. Wow. That's so cool. That's so interesting. The tendency of time to wipe away the ethical or moral implications of a person's action.

Just look at the result. It's so Machiavellian, isn't it? Time is the most Machiavellian thing. Let's take a beer break. Can we take a second? Good idea. I'll go get us more beer. Yeah, that's wild that history wipes out, history wipes out the ethics of a thing.

Well, any sort of distance, right? And time is one way to make something distant. But another way to make something distant is to just control information about it. Like today I was reading this thing about how highly controlled the United States food production system is. You can't go to a slaughterhouse. You can't go to a place where these animals are being raised and destroyed because you can't see.

Everyone says you can't. You don't want to see all your sausages, mate. Well, what if you do? You can't. It's illegal. Right. The penalties for these undercover PETA people who go in and film the way animals are treated, they're draconian.

They're worse than terrorism. They're considered domestic terrorists. Why? Because they're bringing to light the truth about where that fucking hot dog came from. It's a game changer, man. It's a game changer. It's a shit-disturber. It messes up the...

It's like there's a play going on. And it's a play. We're in a play. And the set is the United States of America. And you're supposed to believe it's real. Yes. And there's a script. And the script is the idea that you hear.

And you know the script because it's the thing that you'll find people saying. We're defending freedom. We may not be perfect, but it's the best country on earth. That's right. The fucking John Kerry wants to frenchify us. Frenchify me. Please, somebody frenchify me. Have you ever been to France?

It's fucking great. It's great. The women are beautiful. The food's fantastic. It's a fucking great country. Yeah, yeah. Free health care. You have a baby.

You get like six months off if you're the father. Barbarians. Oh, barbarians. Keep me in my trailer part. Fuck those Frenchies. But you know, I'm sure there's some fucking problems there, too. They have a set that they're into. But the way it works is you get the powers who write the script.

Then you get the directors who are the guys who have funny suits on that have guns that will shoot you if you go too far off the script. And the Hollywood executives. The Hollywood, yeah. And then you have backstage. Now backstage is a combination of all the rooms that the people meet in to talk about lobbyists or corporations or paying for the certain laws that are getting passed. Right.

But they're also the prison system. Yeah. So that's backstage. So backstage, what you have is cages filled with people who, in varying ways, are like, I'm not going to fucking imbibe. I don't want to read these lines. Right. Or someone who stands up and says, this isn't real.

This is just a play. Yeah. Yeah. And they're actors. These are actors. You know those. So the more you start talking, now, in prison, clearly there are, in any society, it's a game that you're playing.

And there are certain rules of the game that hopefully correspond to natural law. And then there are certain rules of the game that stop corresponding to natural law and start corresponding to human law. And the human law, and that could be OK, as long as the human law is for truly the benefit of the tribe. The moment the human law that they're applying, whatever it is, is clearly just benefiting one person or two people in the tribe, or the most charismatic or tricky, or have the most, have somehow managed to get people to hold swords to the throats, people aren't

playing the game. That's where you get into the arcies, right? The oligarchy and the various weird societies where it's not the people who are the community running the show. It's the community pretending they're running the show. You ever think you were going to end up in prison? Do you think about that sometimes? Sure, I think about it.

I think that I ended up in prison. Yes, I thought that. I thought I would end up in prison. I thought that. And then I thought, well, I'd rather be in prison, imprisoned eventually, than walk around in a mental prison where I'm doing, modifying my actions in an unreasonable way based on the fear of being, because I know people where you get around them and you start talking about guns, for example, like owning a weapon, and they'll have you put your phone in another

room before they start talking about whether or not they have guns, because they feel like they're being monitored at all times by the NSA, which could very well be true based on everything that's coming out from the Snowden revelations. It could very well be true. But the way I see it is, well, I would rather than NSA hear everything that I'm doing and then arrest me for it as a very, very low level public figure, because at least then my arrest or imprisonment could be used as a political action and maybe could help the world a little bit, a little bit.

I'd rather do that than walk around like, shh, don't talk about it, be quiet. It's better to just talk about it. Let them shoot you or arrest you if they're going to shoot you or arrest you. We're going to get... It was last my time anyway, brother! You got it, like... That's true. Now, the reason I ask, my last podcast was with a guy who robbed 14 banks and he also

escaped from prison. That was an interesting story. And then he became a yoga teacher while he was in prison and was teaching yoga to the other prisoners. And he spent 24 years, I think. Wow. In Lompoc and serious hardcore places. Wow.

Yeah. It was very interesting. He's the second guy I've had on the podcast who did serious 20-plus years in prison. Wow. And interesting to hear. I mean, one thing he said that actually comforted me a little bit. He said, you don't... The Hollywood image of prison, he said orange is the new black, there's some truth to it,

a lot of that. But he said that generally the Hollywood image of prison is inaccurate. He said he only heard of one guy who got raped in 24 years. Wow. And that guy was essentially a prostitute who was like, you know, fucking dudes for heroin. And then he like racked up too much of a heroin thing and then, you know, it was like a punishment. And he also said like, you know, fighting and like you get in there and you go up to the biggest dude and punch him in the face.

No, no, that's not how it works. Like it's actually kind of, there's kindness there and they're like older dudes who look out for the younger dudes and there's a lot of compassion for guys who are new and are freaking out. And yeah, it's a different image than I had of, you know, the popular image. So if we end up in prison, you know, because I always think I'm gonna end up in prison. Yeah. Well, you're gonna end up, I mean, if you're gonna end up anywhere, it's gonna be in some

kind of FEMA camp. It's not gonna be prison and you're probably gonna get executed, but it's not gonna be like a, you know, when the shit shifts and transforms happens real quick. I mean, look at what's happening in Iraq right now. Fuck. Look at that. Holy shit. That's like that.

Everything's fine. And then it's like, wait, what? Monday, everything's fine. What? Thursday, half the country's gone. It goes from like everything's, but there's like a little, you know, what would happen would be like in the United States, what would happen would be like a small scale nuclear weapon goes off in a major metropolitan area, martial laws declared.

Once martial laws declared, everybody's kind of staying inside. Now the NSA is not only like completely accepted. It's like everybody wants it because they're like, now we understand. Now we get an holy shit. We are so wrong. Is this please monitor, monitor, monitor and get rid of these fucking domestic terrorists. Because guess what? They found some goddamn collusion between some ex Afghani Afghani US Marines and Al Qaeda.

Or ISIS and Iraq who actually help them get the weapons in this is the storyline of course. So now it's like we've got to look out for these domestic terrorists because they are somehow colluding with terrorists overseas. And next thing you know, it's like there's a new ministry just like what they did to the jet. Remember when they put the Japanese in internment camps? Well, it's not the Japanese. It's people who believe that guns should be owned by people as a pro drug people.

It's a libertarians. The idea is you're just hanging out in your house and post whatever they're going to call it, whatever date it was on or whenever it happened and the dead nation went off. You're in post that America and you get a knock at your fucking door. Probably a letter actually. You probably get a letter. It's like, hey, show up to the courthouse at this time. We just need to talk to you about some things that we've heard.

And then suddenly you're arrested. And then the next thing you know, everyone's like, what the fuck in it? Have you seen Chris? Yeah. They picked him up. That's what happened in Germany, right? With the Jews. They got a letter.

They like go come down here. You know, you have to sign these things. And then I know we just have to, you're going to be transported to this place. Everything will be fine. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. And then whoops, quick.

It happens quick. And just like you're saying, a hundred years from now, everybody looks back and they think about that time in New America when they had to go through and find all those people who were upsetting the status quo. And that's the Alex Jones paranoid theory of the possibility that things can change. And if you look at history, you will find that these changes happen so fast. Look at fucking Iran. And they're so, they're so, we're so good as a species at coming up with justifications.

Like, you know about manifest destiny? Yeah. I mean, Jesus Christ. Yeah. Sorry. We have to wipe out everyone on this fucking continent. Why? Because it's God's will.

Yeah. And then he obviously intends for us to take over the continent. Yeah. That's hilarious, man. That reminds me of this thing I was thinking today. Eating some weed, thinking about what if instead of religion happening, people like decided that instead of praying to God, things would get better. But if you fucked a pig, things would get better.

You know, like somehow that happened. Like that was the root of all the world religions, which is people like, you know, like there's some, there's a village somewhere and there's a drought or something, like a drought. And someone happened to pick, fuck a pig. He's fucking a pig. Yeah. And everyone's laughing at him. People are watching him.

Oh, and then immediately he starts raining and he's like, see? See? Yeah. See? You fuck the pig and the rain comes. And then they're like, were you doing anything else besides fucking the pig? No. No.

I fucked the pig and the rain came. Because he was focused. I mean, if you're fucking a pig, what else are you going to be doing? You're not checking your emails. Yeah, it's the email. Wow, fucking. I mean, if you've ever tried to fuck a pig, it takes both hands. I'm telling you.

I mean, that's what I've heard anyway. I get in enough trouble for fucking cats. I don't need to be fucking pigs now. And then, so then this village starts fucking a pig. Like the village starts. The same pig? Yeah. You think they'd get other pigs?

I think they'd start off fucking other pigs. Yeah. Ritual, it'd be a kind of like what? It's a polyamorous pig situation. Polyamorous, yeah, fucking pigs. And then I think that like, you know, someone from another village and everyone would come to trade and see like, oh my God, they're all fucking pigs. Why are you guys fucking pigs?

And they'd be like, uh, did you notice the rain last week? Hello. That's because we were fucking these pigs. And then it spreads to that village and that village starts fucking the pigs. Then the next thing you know, you've got like seven villages all fucking pigs, right? Yeah. But the rain doesn't come. The rain doesn't come and they go back to the original pigs.

Exactly. The original pig sucker is like, listen, you didn't do it in the exact right way. I was wearing a cape when I was fucking the pig. Coconut helmet. That's the outfit. Face to the southwest. That's it. And now all of a sudden they start doing that.

Maybe the rain comes, maybe it doesn't, but other villages are like, you guys are disgusting to fuck pigs and it doesn't affect the rain. And they're like, really? Well, we're going to fucking kill you. And then they invade the other villages and they make it, they start enforcing the pig fucking policy. And the next thing you know, you've got an entire new religion based on people fucking pigs. Right.

And also the other people who haven't been conquered will start fucking pigs because they'll say like, wow, that society is like kicking ass. What are they doing? Oh, well they've got this special thing where they fuck pigs and the God smile upon them. And no God. So we better fuck pigs too. There's no God. It's just the energy of fucking that pig.

Oh, there's no God? In my mind, there's no God. This is an atheist religion yet somehow from the fucking pig is the magic act that creates positive change in a person's life. Then you get like, then you get to watch the evolution of it, you know? So it's like you've got like the version of it that would pig fucking it would be Judaism, you know, which is a kind of like we only fuck the pig on Sunday. Right.

Well fuck it, but we won't eat it. We only, or we only fuck the pig. Which reminds me of your joke, which I don't know. What you said, if you find some intruder in your house, you can kill him. Don't give it away. But, but, but you said why? But it's like a temple. Judaism would be we only fuck the pig on Sundays in the temple.

We do it. But then Christianity would be like someone coming around being like, no, you can fuck the pig in your own house. We fuck sheep. We have a personal relationship with the pig. Hinduism would be we can fuck any animal you want because they have all these different gods. So they're like, yeah, you guys are nuts.

We can, we fuck. It's just, it's up to you pick the animal that's the best thing to fuck. Buddhism would be like, you can, I get, I mean, like you can, you can fuck the pig, but you're still going to be miserable. And then. You could fuck the pig or not. It doesn't really. It doesn't matter because what, because you know, you can't fuck the pig forever.

Maybe that's what they say. Like you're going to. I'm so glad I got a PhD so I could do this. Have these conversations with esteemed intellectuals. And then like the animus, the hunter gatherers would be, you'd have to fuck wild animals. You have to catch like fuck a bear or something. You know, yeah. That's hardcore.

And then like is. Bears give each other below jobs. Didn't know that. Oh yeah. Just in the news last week. Male bears. I mean, in captivity. So who knows?

Maybe they're, you know, sell, sellmates, but they were, they gave each other. They weren't talking about Harry gay guys. They were. I don't know. They did the research at a bear bar. Isn't that like where bears catch salmon? Like a sandbar. Did I ever tell you I went to a bear bar with Dan Savage and Andrew Sullivan.

Bears are awesome. It was wonderful. They're really friendly guys. Yeah. Yeah. And I was standing. I was actually, we all went to the bathroom together and we were standing there pissing. I'm pissing between Andrew Sullivan and Dan Savage at urinals.

The two, probably the two most famous gay men in America. Yeah. And I said, man, you know, what a lost opportunity. Here I am standing between you two guys. We've all got our dicks in our hands and I'm fucking heterosexual. What a waste. I never stopped anybody. From doing what?

From what? What are you talking about? Giving him a hand job or something? No, no, just like, you know, how many gay guys would like, oh my God. I was like, you know, in the bathroom between Dan Savage and Andrew Sullivan. You can enjoy a cock and be straight. Come on. Where are we existing these days?

Really? You don't think so? Well, enjoy it in what sense? In whatever way you want to. If you're enjoying something, you're enjoying it. Really? So you could like, you know, be asked by a dude and not be gay. I mean, I know you could, but could you want to?

You know, I think that it's what Isaac Asimov. I think it's Isaac Asimov. What a segue. It's not a segue. Isaac Asimov was talking about in the future, there's no more gender based sexual proclivities. There's just fetishes. And I think that's a much more evolved way of looking at it, which is that, you know, look, let's face it, man.

There's a pretty large portion of the population that has discovered a truth that a lot of people don't like for some reason. And that truth is, it feels good to have things shoved into your asshole. I don't think that's a, I don't think you can even argue about that anymore. No, I don't know about shoved, maybe slid gently. Look, you're a romantic. But the point is, the point. After and fine dinner. Yeah, you're a romantic.

You're a romantic lass. But the point is, like, the prostate is a sexually charged organ, and it feels good to have things put inside of it, which is why. I think Louis CK has this excellent joke, and he's done it on his specials. So we can say it. But he has this excellent joke where he's talking to the audience about giving a blow job and pointing out that more than half the audience enjoys giving blow jobs, or gives blow jobs sexually. And, you know, he's the men or the small percentage of people who don't do that. So there must be something great behind it.

That's a really smart way, and that's a very heterosexual human pointing out these obvious truths. It's like, come on, man, it probably feels good. I've often thought that. I mean, you know, I've often thought that if I were gay or bi or whatever, I would give amazing blow jobs. Sure. And, I mean, I honestly, this will sound like bullshit, but I honestly wish I were gay or bi, because I imagine men give really good blow jobs, because they know how. This is what I see the future. I see two generations from now, dinner table conversation.

If I have kids and those kids have kids, I see myself as an old man, probably around 120 years old, based on what's happening. Life extension technology. Yeah, maybe not. But also, maybe just from riding my bike, I'm healthy. I was to be 120. I pictured myself sitting at the table. My grandchild was just turned 14, and he looks across at me and he's like, granddaddy, did you ever give a blow job doing man? And I go, no, I'm straight.

And he goes, I didn't know granddaddy was a bigot. In the same way that when you're around a really old, old man who was around during racial times, they're racist still. Can I tell you a story? Yeah, please. I think that's already here. You're already a granddaddy. Yes. Seriously, check this out.

I told you I did this porn movie, right? I had three scenes with India Summer where I played myself. The story is, it's a really interesting film. It's sort of like bridging mainstream cinema and erotic cinema. That's what he's trying to do with it. So she's in a relationship. She's having issues. She's a documentary filmmaker, so she decides to interview some people who've written books or thought about relationships and where it's going,

and what's changing, and all that. So she does these interviews with people like me and Cassie and Reed Mehalco and Carol Queen and other people who have some sort of public prominence in this area. And I play myself, but I'm being interviewed for a documentary by this woman. And anyway, very interesting. One of the scenes when the director sent me the screenplay, he's a friend of mine and he asked me for comments, there's a scene where there's a three-way going on, two guys and a woman, and I think they're in a shower or something, and the dudes start touching each other and it ends up being like they're both fucking her, but then they fuck each other as well, right? And I said to him, dude, I don't know about that.

I mean, that's, you know, like people are into seeing women with women and men with women, but men with men, that's gay porn. That's a different genre, you know, that I think you'll lose a lot of audience with that. And, you know, like I personally, it would make me uncomfortable, whatever, and I don't know if you're... And he said, Chris, listen, man, young people, they're not making those distinctions like you and me. Yeah, okay, that's the thing, but guys in their 20s, situational homosexuality is completely accepted. You know, no, obviously not by everybody, but far more than when you and I were in our 20s. Yeah, because we're burdened by this massive conditioning that makes it so it's like, you have to react, you've been taught to react to homosexuality. If you were, I don't know, if you were born before 90s, I don't know when things started loosening up on gay people.

Hey, largely due to Dan Savage, I have to say. I'm sure. People give him a shit, but I think that dude is a historical figure. Yeah, he's like, he like, people like him probably also like, think about like Harvey Fierstein, like people like that, people who like... Billy Crystal's character on, what was it called, that family? Do you remember that? Maybe this is even before your time. Billy Crystal's first character on a major TV series. He was really young. He played a gay guy. What was the name of that politician you got shot in San Francisco?

Harvey Milk. Harvey Milk, too. Yeah, it was about the same time. Yeah, those people, you know, these are people who are like Gandhi, but won't get recognized as Gandhi for another, you know, probably another generation, but like same level of heroism. I think so. And alleviating a kind of like hellish existence for a group of people who just want to be, what's the same thing as a smoking weed or whatever it is, man. It's like, you get to do what you want to do with your body and the whole shit, but we still have built into us this thing where it's like, you know, I don't want... Like, you know, remember when Brokeback Mountain came out?

Yeah. And it's like, that came out and everybody's like, oh, the horror, that ain't gonna matter, I guess. The horror, that these two men were... It was like horrifying to like, you had to say that if you're a gay, or if you're a guy. You're a guy, not a gay. You're gay, you said the opposite. Yeah. But if you're a guy, you couldn't be like, I don't know, it didn't really bother me, man.

I don't know. You couldn't even say that. You had to have... You were expected to have at least some... You were hanging out with, like, much of dudes. I was praying and I was like, you know, who knows. But the point is, people are still petrified and terrified of it. Yeah.

And depending on what generation you come from, it's like the conditioning is really intense. So what your friend is saying makes absolute sense, which is that the conditioning is loosening to the point where in another generation, it won't exist at all. Maybe. Among many people. I mean, of course, these things take so much time to start. Bigots will be more ostracized. Because they are now, right?

In college, in American campuses, if you think gay people are creepy and weird, you're the weird dude. Yeah. You are a weird dude. Mainstream is like, yeah, they're gay. You're a bigot. Yeah. Like, you're the worst kind of person.

Right. Like, you are the worst kind of person. Romney. Any more men who believes that gay marriage is wrong. Anyone who believes that it's wrong for gay guys or gay gals to get married. Gay gals. Gay gals. I know you're not speaking.

I like to say gals. I love it. I think it's great. But that's, you ever, like, that is a, that is a, that, the human who, like, says those things, that human, they're, it's like, look at it this way. It's a million times creepier to me to believe that you're the servant of an invisible homophobic god and to repress humans on this planet who have this minimal amount of time to enjoy their bodies before they vanish into oblivion.

And love. Yeah. Their bodies just like, to have, like, the right to visit your partner in the hospital. That's why we disagree. I don't think gay people feel love. Just kidding. Love for the cock. It's just cock love.

Yeah. No, if they felt love, that would be different. Yeah. I think a pig feels love. Yeah. Yeah. When you're fucking it for the rain. Exactly.

This is for the rain, you fucking pig. No, I think it makes, I think, I might, I'd much rather be around a guy who fucks pigs and make it rain than a guy who worships an invisible homophobic god and represses humans on this planet who keeps them from loving them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They do many things themselves, they even get raise arms and I'm like, oh, man.

Their life sucks. Like, yeah, I were watching it for a month, but, you know, I don't think even that scene became the same. Yeah. This was really awesome. I was almost driving there and it was at about six years or so, about eight years old. Like, that's the idea. That's, and-

Carl Rowe. That's what I'm saying about Carl Rowe. I think that's a very- What do you deal with your issue, though? I like to pretend that the reason these bigots are bigots is because there's a, because it gives you this idea that they have this, like, kind of, like, chance for sexual redemption. You get this glorious idea in your mind that all Carl Rowe, people like Carl Rowe are like one positive gay experience away from transforming into these beautiful people.

Yeah, you get to believe that, but it's like, I don't think that, I don't know if that's true, man. I don't think it's as simple as the fact that somebody is a repressed homosexual and is like, I'm just gonna stay in the closet because I, and while I'm in here, I'm gonna, it's like Sol Tarsus, stoning Christians. But you know about that gay escort who was, got the White House pass and spent nights in the White House and nobody's ever explained what he was doing there? You know what I'm talking about?

Yeah, but maybe it's like just, here's a real fun idea. Maybe people just like to feel good and they're part of their brains understand that the gender of lips that happened to land on your penis in an ethical, subjective, moral, gender vacuum are irrelevant. Well, I just interviewed Stanley, who I hope you meet someday, he's 81, so, you know, get on the stick. I just interviewed him last week and we talked about his sexuality and he was married to a woman for 50 years or something, but now like he's, all his lovers are men and a lot

of his lovers over the years have been men and I said to him, like, did you ever come out of the closet? Were you ever in a closet? And he said, no, I just never thought of it in those terms. Like I'm attracted to some people, I'm not attracted to other people and you know, a lot of them have been men because men are easier to deal with than women. Right. Women are so complicated, but he really doesn't give a damn.

My problem is an aesthetic problem. It's like guys seem so fucking bristly and like greasy and like just generally like, I don't know, it's like women are so beautiful, they're so soft and they're so, there's something about them that just seem like, it's like. So what about a trans, transsexual? Have you been to Thailand? Never been. Man, there are some, Cassie and I, last time we were in Thailand, we sat outside of this

area of it's like a famous place with Nana Plaza, it's called, and we're sitting in a bar there just watching people go by and you see all these couples with like an older white European or American guy with a, you know, young hot Thai woman. And a lot of times those Thai women are dudes, physically dudes. Oh really? Lady boys, yeah or whatever. I'm sorry, I said the word lady boy and I got a bunch of shit in your heart. You don't mean, it's not coming from a poisonous pit in your heart?

No, I, I, I totally respect it. It doesn't matter what you fucking say you're not like, you're not a bigot, so you're not a, I mean whatever, I mean whatever the fuck I want. Fuck you. Fucking language. Motherfucker, motherfucker in tits. Yeah. Yeah.

So anyway, so I mean, they're beautiful, they're so beautiful and Cassie was like, eventually Cassie said, look, the only way I can tell the difference is that they're too beautiful to be women. Well, I mean, look at like, look at, see, this is the symbol of the new Aeon, which is like, this is the symbol of the new Baphomet, this is the symbol of the hermaphrodite, which is a, a man and a woman who represents the mystical connection between the final balancing out of these two, like it's almost like the universe is like, it created men, it created women, we emerge to represent these two energetic forms, and then it's almost like that, the

physical merging of these two forms somehow represents like ultimate peace or ultimate balance, not just a society that worships the goddess, not just a society that worships the male dominator God, but somehow merging these two together into a society where both sides are balanced. Is it possible? Probably not. If you need to go to Thailand and make love to a beautiful hermaphrodite, I don't know what the word is, it is not offensive to some, they're probably, the funny thing is, there's

no way to refer to that being without offending somebody. There's no language, right language for it, someone's going to be like, that's rocked. Did you hear what happened to Dan Savage a couple of weeks ago? So is it University of Chicago doing this thing? And it's a private thing where like a public figure comes and speaks to, you know, 50 people and it's closed, no media, you're, everybody agrees not to talk about it publicly, right? So there's a student there, Dan's talking about the word tranny and how he stopped using the word tranny in his column and his podcast because people were offended by it, but he

said, look, you know, I remember when tranny was what, you know, people who were transvestites or transsexuals called themselves, you know, they're trannies and it was a word that was not derogatory in any way. And then, you know, it became this political football and now people are saying you can't use it and okay, I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but you know, it's weird the way words like move from fine to not fine and then back sometimes and all this stuff. Faggot is another example and when he started writing his column, every letter started, hey, faggot, you know, it was a joke and, and gay people would call each other faggot and

it was like no problems, like black people calling each other nigger, no problem. And so the, so he was making this point and a student stood up and said, you know, I am a transsexual and I prefer to be referred to as it, not he or she. And I think that this word is offensive and I, I am offended that you're using it here today and you shouldn't be doing it. And it turned into this big thing and the student ended up like leaving crying and then started a petition to like censor Dan Savage and it turned into this big fucking deal. It's so funny that you can't even refer to it.

As you said, there's no word to refer to the thing you're, and this guy wants to, or this person wants to be referred to as it. It's weird that it understood that it's a monster because like all monsters get referred to as it. And I don't mean a monster because of whatever its gender happens to be, but a monster because it wants to apply the same rules of oppression to language that had been applied to somebody who wants to express themselves through their gender. So you end up in the exact same boat.

It's like, all right, now you're a different type of bigot because you're a language bigot. You're not a gender bigot, but it's the same fucking thing. Back off, Jack. Dan Savage, and I'll tell you this, you can take a homophobe and an evil person who wants to control people's sexuality and make people feel guilty for what is more than likely a genetically based proclivity towards a certain gender, and if it's not genetically based, who cares? The point is, you can take a person who's against that and you can tell them whatever

the most up-to-date politically correct words are to use in reference to these people and when it comes out of their mouths, it's going to sound like venom because it is what's behind it. It's intention. And anyone who can attack Dan Savage, it's like someone attacking Gandhi for not being Indian enough. Like, well, you lived in South Africa, you're not one of us. Fuck you, man.

As our Lord Jesus Christ said, young out with a lot of guys, a house divided upon itself cannot stand. And in that way, it's like, figure out what the fuck is going on here, man. We're all people. So what's the problem with fucking people on the left? People on the left, and I consider myself one, if we're going to use that left-right dichotomy, progressive, whatever, open mind, blah, blah, blah, they're the scolds. Why are we scolding?

Hey, every time somebody sends me a fucking email, I'm so disappointed that the words disappointed and inappropriate just make me want to fucking blow up. Here's what it is, man. They haven't come to the bigger truth. And the bigger truth is, or the way I see it is, one consciousness expressing itself through multiple beings of various genders and sexual proclivities. One consciousness, man. Understand that.

Go back to that. And then understand the ultimate connective tissue is love. It's the force of love. That's what we're all going for here, man. We want to figure out a way to make it so that people can love each other freely. That's it. It's a very simple, very, very Christian. It should be the essence of all religions.

Well, and probably Jesus would agree with you, right? Let me, can I read something to you? Do you mind if I read something? Are we going to have another beer? Yeah, we're going to have another beer. I'm going to cut. We have actually, well, we'll cut. So with all this sex talk, gender talk, I want to read this thing out of Ron Regi's

book, who's this amazing artist who is on my podcast. This is from the Cartoon Utopia, and it's called Affection Alchemy. And what he does is he takes Western esotericism, Western mystics, and he like sort of, he like writes out what they say, and then he draws these incredible images of around it. So, because you know, regardless of the gender of the person that you're having sex with, that's not what matters. There's a much deeper thing going on, and it transforms society, and this is an incredible summation of that.

This is by PB Randolph in Ron Regi's awesome graphic novel. Okay. What are you thinking about during intimacy, and how does it affect you? Both partners must have an equal and balanced mindset and involvement in the act of bringing the source of love into the body through mutual concentrated intention on love. The power of creation is broken out of your body and brought into your conscious awareness. Our principal life is the life of imagination, and through love we can realize all there is.

The hermetic marriage, the goal of alchemy is to bring the two sides together again, soul and spirit, heart and mind, beauty and strength, intuition and reason, the sun and the moon, yin and yang, we all have both sides within us. The mysterious conjunction, the reunification and abolition of the opposites, the higher nature is brought down to the body, the lower nature is brought up to the head, as above so below. Every relationship outside ourselves recreates it. The creation myth, the primeval soul that contains all souls is split into two polarities.

Love is the recognition of identical harmonic states, the electromagnetic forces of your heart and mind and even the vibrations of the atoms within you enter into an exchange. Complete the circuit, combine the positive and negative, a measurable electromagnetic force lies behind all observable phenomena. The creative power of the entire universe is present during sexual union, yet it can only be accessed through love. An enormous power of attraction is generated through this creative moment. The consequence of accessing this power without love can be seen everywhere in the problems

of the world today. Human history is full of abuse of this power of attraction for personal gain. A union without love is mutually exhausting, it drains all power and creates nothing. Without balance and mutual cooperation, without love, the obtaining of this power is a terrible delusion. It will bring ruin to all who practice it as a means of obtaining power. Whatever you imagine with persist, it will bring ruin to all who practice it as a means of obtaining power.

And then look at this awesome drawing you did of people fucking you don't love each other, that kind of anger fuck, it's a really great panel. Look at that right there. I've been that guy so many times where you just don't feel it and you're just like doing this weird sweaty workout thing. Yeah, yeah, you know, I don't know. I mean, I think casual sex, now the key for me there is he said it will bring ruin to people who do this as a way of seeking power.

Yes. But if you're doing it not as a way of seeking power, then I don't think there's any problem. Absolutely, no, no, no. Two friends fucking and they're just friends and they just feel like fucking like I'm a four. But you love your friends. Well, even if it's a stranger, what if it's a one night stand? And what you're saying you can't love strangers, it's that moment.

Yeah, you can't love someone you don't know. Sure you can. It's that moment when you're objectifying a person, using them, tricking them. Oh, yeah, if it's ugly, it's ugly. There's no doubt about that. That's what he's talking about. He's saying that here is this incredible thing that transcends gender and in the conversation about it's and hers and he's and hers with hers or he's with these or he's with it's

or hers with it's or hers and hers with an it or it and her or the he whatever it is, you lose the actual thing that's going on and all this chatter about these pairings of various genitals with each other, you're missing to me what's the bigger picture, which is that in the state of sexual union, there is a point of access that can happen if you have the slightest intention of love behind it. You can come in contact with some of the most powerful forces in the universe that can transform your life for the positive and make you a much happier, healthier person. You know, I was watching the World Cup today.

I don't know when you're going to release this, but the World Cup's going on as we record this and somebody scored a goal and it was the typical thing, you know, the guy scores the goal, he runs, he falls on the ground, all his teammates come and they pile on him like a bunch of puppies and they're all like squeezing and hugging and you know, and I thought I've never felt that love in my whole life. I've never felt that love and how many of us have how many have you ever had like, you know, 10 guys who you know really well and who you've like shared all the struggle with and you know, all these training and working out and wins and losses and you score a goal

for them, you know, for the team, for those guys and they all hug you and love you and it's a feeling so few of us have ever had and I related that to an interview I heard recently with the guy who wrote The Perfect Storm, Sebastian Junger. He was actually, it was a TED Talk, I think, Google TED Talk, Sebastian Junger, Y-U-N-G-E-R and you'll see it, he's talking about how he was embedded, he wrote war too, he wrote war and he did a documentary called Corungal, you know, yeah, no, no, his friend died, Tim something died in Libya, yeah, right, and he did a piece about that, but anyway, he was talking about, you know, these guys who were in this horrible situation, they're in firefights

every day, they're getting shot at from every direction, it's just this horrible fucking situation and they stick it out, they're out there for like six months or a year or whatever and, you know, he said, and then they come back to America, the ones who survive and they're fucked because the thing that's missing is love, right, here it's like you got your car, you got your house, you go to the store, you come home, you know, nobody, there's nobody, like maybe your wife loves you, maybe your kids love you, but they don't really know you, they haven't been through that shit. And this is the famine of the West, man, and this is the famine that we're, that is raging in the world, in our world right now, it's a famine of love. Yeah,

it's a huge famine, I often feel like we live in a society that has told us that every natural source of vitamin C is a sin, right, citrus fruits are, they'll rot your soul, they'll make your, the hair grow out of your palms, you know, and all this stuff, you can't do it, and then they sell you these, these shitty little vitamin C pills that just barely keep you alive, and we're all on the edge of scurvy. So when we go to, you know, we get a massage and someone's touching us with care, what happens? You want to like touch them back, you want to, you know, and there are all these stories of like dudes get a massage, you start groping them, masseuse, and you know, or like a lot of hookers, prostitutes will say, half the guys who come,

they're not even into the sex, they just want to be able to lie in bed and be touched and not have to lie about who they are. That's so, man, this is, that's where we are. Come on, you gotta lighten up guys, stop fucking, this is what I'm saying, you know, you curl up like a little goddamn roly-poly, the next thing you know, you're treating everybody around you like they're a stick trying to hurt you, just open up for a second, if you can, it's, it's like you want to do something revolutionary. But it's so hard, dude, it's like, it's like what we're talking about, you know, cultural and training, right? I mean, I've got a little sympathy for that. I'm heterosexual, I have no doubt that that's cultural training. Yeah, right? I, as my loved gay guy, I have had

friends who are gay, who I literally loved more than any other friend I've had, and, and they definitely wanted to, you know, have a physical thing with me, I couldn't do it, I just, I couldn't do it. Yeah. I mean, eating dogs, right? Why? Why not eat dogs? I've been there, man, but, and that's not something I'm necessarily proud of, that's just something I see as a kind of like, well, I guess in this incarnation, that's the force field I'm up against, and it's not something I really want to like, I'm not going to spend a lot of time like, trying to overcome. You're talking about eating dogs or what? Yeah, I've been with like 500 guys, but I just can't eat a dog. By the way, I'm going to tell you something, man, there's some, it's a way more fucked up in my mind,

eat a dog, but it is to have sex with somebody of the same gender, but, but. No, of course. Now, you see my point, though, it's about cultural indoctrination. Yes, and, and, and, and, and I think we're both hitting on the, on the same sad, tragic aspect of modern society, which is here we have this technology that is so connected, that is bringing us together in such an incredible way, but one thing that we haven't been able to overcome yet is the personal firewall that exists in each of our hearts that keeps us from opening the love and just letting love exist in our lives without shutting down. And so many people in the same way when people are afraid of death, they, instead of talking about their fear of death, they talk about their fear of heights, they talk about

their fear of. Negroes. Yeah, yes, gay people riding a bike. I don't know how many people, when I've been saying I'm addicted to riding bikes, so I would, it's so dangerous to ride a bike. It's like you're afraid of death. The number one thing that's killing people is not bikes, it's heart disease, it's couches, that's the real deadly mother fucker. So it's like the, the, the, in the same way that people are attached to their fear of death to smaller things and the same way people have attached their fear of love to the activity of objectifying people they're having sex with. Oh man, I fucked this hot bitch last night. It was so fucking hot. They have these kind of like prophylactic experiences with people that instead of a condom, even though they're

probably wearing a condom, they're wearing this thick rubbery sheath that they call their ego and personality, you know? Wow, that's an interesting heart condom. You got a bear back with your heart. And then, and in the same way like when people are wearing a condom and they're afraid of AIDS, people are wearing this ego because they're afraid of heartbreak and it's like, or HIV rather, but the point is it's like pull off the fucking sheath, man. Feel it. Yes, feel it. That's intense, man. I never thought of that, a heart condom. That's a hell of a condom. It's a heart condom and like how many times have you been having sex with someone and you're so terrified and you're so, and you've, you know, I've thought back like I feel so lucky to have run into these

Rondos people and like Jack Hornfield and gotten to interact with them because they push me out of a really dark place. But I can think of times having sex with people when I was younger and I'm not there at all. I'm just a fucking mannequin. I'm not there and not only am I not there but I'm pretending that the person I'm with isn't a person. It's an object, you know? I'm having sex with somebody. I like them but like I'm not acknowledging the fact that this is a being just like me who's experienced so much pain in their life just like me, is lonely just like me, wants to be loved just like me and because of that we're, and they're doing probably the same thing to me in some way and now we're pretending. Now we're just pretending and it's sad because in that moment of connectivity

and intimacy when you have become literally it's as close as you can get to a person, as close as you can get. You're not there at all. Come on, it's sad. It's like being in fucking Hawaii and when the sunset's happening you put on blindfolds. You get this wonderful sunset, you're in Hawaii, look it in the fucking face, feel it. Yeah and people say no, I don't want to see it because it's gonna end and I won't be here forever. Yeah well you know love, I mean I think about this sometimes. I'm a coward on certain levels like one of the reasons I never had kids was I was afraid of being that vulnerable. Yeah you know of like well what if the kid is born fucked up? What if the kid's an asshole? What if the kid gets hurt? What if the kid dies? What if the

kid you know like there's I mean there are other reasons, there are more practical reasons and honestly kids didn't fit into the sort of life I wanted to live but you know there was also an essential cowardice of like no, I want to be able to die. I want to be able to have shit hit the fan without worrying about anyone else. You know if I have a motorcycle accident I want to be able to have a fucking motorcycle accident without like oh I'm going to leave kids with no father or I'm going to leave you know. And even in my marriage or you know partnership with women I've also felt like and I think this is partly because when I was a kid I moved a lot so I and my family moved like every two or three years. Okay so I think you develop a fear of connecting because

like the more I connect the more it's going to hurt when we move again. Ah genius and not only that but don't forget about you also get the glory of being new to a school like when you're in a new place you also get this extra attention and there's like some weird positive side effect ever too. You get both so yeah you're right man it's uh it's all it's like it's just like all an issue all of us are fighting desperately against love. We think it's the opposite you know but we think that the thing we're fighting against is darkness or suffering or evil but really what we're fighting against most of us is love. But it's because of the suffering right it's because love doesn't come without suffering. Well yeah and it's also because of the the the dissolution of

the ego that comes once you've like become gone from being a one two or two and gone from being a two to a three. A I to a we yeah. Yeah the moment that happens you've dissolved into a bigger hole right you know and this is the thing I remember watching this amazing documentary oh god I wish I could remember the name of this documentary. They showed it at my liberal arts college it was the difference between the way indigenous people raise children. Oh the continuum concept probably. Is that what it's called? Well there's the great book which was a classic and I wouldn't be surprised if there was a documentary made about it called the continuum concept. It's by a woman who through happenstance ended up living with this stony tribe in Venezuela and it was all about how they

raised their children and their constant physical contact with the kids. Well it was like that and it was showing like here yeah that must be it man because it's showing like here's how we do it in the west. Put them in a room let them scream don't touch it. Right. And then it was showing this tribe I don't know what tribe the baby is born they stand around the baby the entire tribe stands around the baby and they chant to the baby and what they're saying to the baby is something along the lines of you are with us now you are with us now you've come from a they say something like you've come from whatever now you are with us. We're your people. Yes and then the other thing they did which I thought was really cool is they sit with a baby in a hut for 24 hours to let the

baby die if the baby wants to go back into the nothingness it's like a weird accident. I just thought to me though the beautiful thing about it was it's a we and it's not a we like the family it's a we like all of us welcome to the club. Well that's what I was saying about the football about about you know there's a sense of like you are us we are together and that and the only place we get that is sports and war right we're also we're going to get that. Oh it's so sad. It is. God damn it. It is it's terrible we're we're we're yearning for I mean you and I are good friends yeah but you know we haven't been through anything together near deaf experience unless it's like you know worrying that Joe might get pissed off and kill us but there's no like I mean

you know what I mean there's nothing in our in our lives there's there's nothing that deep but the fires don't have to be grow that hot for it's just like really what it is is that people are selfish they don't want to give up themselves they want to be shielded from the world they don't want to merge into the whole they don't want to be part of a real community. Okay but you're blaming it on people I blame it on structural issues you know in Spanish the word insulation to insulate is the same word to isolate wow wow right and that's sort of the key of this book I'm working on now it's like yeah we try to insulate ourselves from dangers and fears and yeah you know all these things and what do we end up doing we end up being isolated that there's no meaning we're we're empty

and lonely and lost of course we are because we've cut ourselves off from everything that could potentially mean something to us because it's dangerous like love right like what you're saying about love you know love hunting I mean all these things brother sister the community doing community activities getting into the into the challenges having a baby having a family giving up your identity letting yourself merge into the whole throwing yourself into the void with the intention of like dissolving someone it's like those guys who buy surf like Peter Gabriel jumps off the stage and the people yeah there's this faith there you know or baby eagles are in a nest way the fuck up in some cliff and at some point they're like okay I'm going and they jump but you gotta

believe you know you gotta believe or it never happens you just die in your nest and so many people die in their nests have you ever seen that documentary about I'm not gonna end I don't want to end but I'm not actually but it's stupid I was just about to end it I'm like talking about the most more rushed documentary I know well there's a documentary you reminded me of called babies have you seen that yeah oh that's a great one that that's a recent it I'm sure it's not the one you're referring to um I think it won an Oscar actually it's there's no words there's no narrative there's no nothing right it's four babies there's one American born to like a progressive couple in San Francisco there's one Japanese I think yeah there's one in like Mongolia and one is gay no and

one's like uh in some hunter gatherer tribe in Africa and it's just these four babies and their experiences and they cut between they're back and you see the the African babies like rolling around in the dirt he's licking the the tongue of a dog he's like in it he's happy he's fat he's funny and all these adults you're referring to all these different adults like pick him up and talk to him he's got like 20 parents you know and then you look at this American baby in this little like high tech carriage thing yeah you know protected from too much UV radiation and the the thing protected from mosquitoes and oh don't touch that oh and it's so protected and fucking screaming and miserable and sickly looking and man there we go right there there you go man that's it some

of the hunter gatherer babies die right they die the weak ones die as you're saying there's a ritual in fact a lot of hunter gatherer people don't believe that babies are people until they can talk wow so this first couple of years when a lot of them die they weren't people anyway so that mitigates the pain it's a great defense mechanism against the harsh environment that many of those people are existing in but well harsh environment yeah there's different kinds of harsh well that's what you're saying man it's like do you want to live an entire lifetime without feeling love or would you like to have a few years existing completely embraced by this family with the risk that you might die yeah you're gonna die anyway you pick yeah what do you want you want to be in a fucking

spacesuit and a planet that you don't need a spacesuit for right it's like one of the saddest things ever it's like we've got these fucking side of space you did it again a space suit on a planet you don't need a space suit for fuck that's such a great image and so many people do that man because we're terrified of love but god damn it let the snake bite you motherfuckers let it bite you i just saw this documentary on these two sigmes twins these poor guys they were connected by this one have you heard of them these two asian sigmes twins connected by this flap of skin and they couldn't get it surgically removed because at the time the doctors didn't have x-ray equipment they're like it could kill you if we do it so only married two women two twins yeah yeah

and at the end of their their lives one of them dies and the other one dies within four hours they do an autopsy and they sever the skin it's just scar tissue with one vein they could have cut themselves free at any time during their entire lives but they were so afraid of dying that rather than die they live their entire lives connected to another being who for a big portion of their lives they weren't very happy with they were afraid to cut that fucking flap well in the same way so many people are afraid to fucking slice this one little protective sheath they got what do you call it the hymen that when you're about to have sex it with a virgin it like that gets separated and it's like painful and causes some sort of membrane yeah it's a membrane that must

that has to get separated that's the same so many people have fucked literally thousands of times but they're still virgins because they haven't experienced that incredible intimate connection that happens when you're with someone you're like god damn it i love you i love you like i i don't even know what it is some energy is radiating from both of us at the same time it's way bigger than anything i was aware that even existed that's sex if you ask me i mean i i don't know what to say to that other than Duncan's got a beautiful woman standing in the living room listening to that i'm in love anyway Chris Ryan thank you so much for being on this podcast god bless you where can people find you

i'm gonna say i'm chris ryan phd.com chris ryan phd.com and of course your incredible podcast tangentially speaking which you were supposed to be a guest on today but i'll get you another okay another day let's go get a beer instead all right great to see you thanks for coming back thanks for listening everybody that was chris ryan please check out his podcast tangentially speaking all the links you need to hook into the psychic genius of chris ryan will be located at dunkatrustle.com and a big thanks to hulu plus for sponsoring this podcast please go to hulu plus forward slash d t f h and sign up for a trial membership try it out for two weeks if you don't like it cancel it it's only seven ninety nine a month do it sign up for them they've got

everything you need to vanish from the universe for wonderful stretches of time thanks for listening everybody i love you please give us a nice rating on itunes and god damn it go out there and let your heart get broken