Effectively Wild: A FanGraphs Baseball Podcast - Effectively Wild Episode 1730: The Mike Trout 30th Birthday Draft

Episode Date: August 6, 2021

Ben Lindbergh, Meg Rowley, and Jake Mintz and Jordan Shusterman of Céspedes Family BBQ banter about Jake’s baseball bike trip (and Jordan’s accompanying car ride) from New York to Chicago. Then, in honor of Mike Trout’s 30th birthday, they draft their favorite things about Trout and his incredible career. Audio intro: Jay-Z, "30 Something" Audio outro: Smash […]

30's the new 20, I'm on fire still These young boys is like fire trails False alarms, the next dawn He ain't got it, on to the next one I'm still here, still here Like Mike, gotta stop playing with these children I'm a bully with the bucks Let the patent leather shoes fool you

Youngin' I got the fully in the tux Now what's my past, now I'm so grown up I don't got one gun on me Gotta some army to hire a gun army Get you spun like laundry Hello and welcome to episode 1730 of Effectively Wild, a baseball podcast from Fangraphs presented by our Patreon supporters. I am Ben Lindberg of The Ringer, joined as always by Meg Raleigh of Fangraphs. Hello, Meg. Hello. And we are joined today by two special guests, both halves of Suspitous Family Barbecue.

Jake Mintz. Hello, Jake. Hello. And Jordan Schusterman. Hello, Jake. Hello. And Jordan Schusterman. Hello, Jordan. Hello. We are, of course, coming to you from the same place. I know we've been on this podcast before, sometimes in different countries, different

states, different continents, all kinds of fun stuff. But right now, I'm sitting right next to Jake. I can give him a little pat on the back, and he can feel it. But we're excited to be here. But where in the world are you two? I know you're together, but where? We are at a, no ads, no ads. We are at a Holiday Inn Express somewhere outside Youngstown, Ohio, on our way back from Chicago to the East Coast. Yeah. So we're here to talk about Mike Trout and we will do that in a moment. But Jake,

it's been a few weeks since we had you on episode 1721 to talk about your ride across half the country or so, and you have since completed that ride. So in that time, I have barely left my block. You have biked 1,200 miles. Jordan has driven those same miles, and you completed your journey, which for those of you who were not following along, Jake vowed to travel to Chicago last year because he guaranteed that Tony La Russa would not be hired as the manager of the White Sox and said that if he was, he would walk to Chicago. Of course, La Russa was hired as manager of the White Sox and Jake kind of lived up to his word in that he biked instead of walking,

which is pretty good. And he actually made it. So congratulations on completing the journey. And now you're on the way back east. But Bronx to Chicago, we were just talking before we started recording, and it sounds as if you were not in pain, and it was not as much of a struggle as I suppose it could have been. But what were the highlights? How was the trip? It was great. It was difficult, but it was not as much of a struggle as I suppose it could have been. But what were the highlights? How was the trip?

It was great. It was difficult, but it was not strenuous. It was at no point did I seriously doubt that I would complete it. I had a lot of fun, saw a lot of baseball. The riding itself was easier than I anticipated. The evenings were significantly more difficult than i anticipated like going to the baseball games and trying to like work at them and so that burden then fell upon jordan who had to carry more of the slack at the game yeah which was fine again like the reason why i was happy to to go along is

that you know i've missed being able to go on these road trips with jake and go to games we saw 12 games in 14 days and that was a lot of fun. So yeah, like Jake was a bit of a zombie at most of the games, understandably. That was somewhat by design, but he was there. He did make it, he did watch the games. And I grew into it. As the trip went, I became less and less of a zombie. Yes, yes.

But there were really only like two or three like actual like challenging, you know, adverse days where it was like he had to overcome something. A lot of them were pretty smooth. And a big part of it, we've said this to a lot of people recently, unbelievably lucky weather on many, many fronts. That is really what allowed this trip. I remember, I'll never forget the moment when I came on the podcast before I left and Meg

said, so I see you've built no days off. And I said, I guess you're right. And the weather gods shined down upon us literally. And I spent about 20 minutes total out of 78 hours in the rain, 20 minutes in the rain. That was it. Yes. So it was pretty stunning. And the kicker is we raised almost $30,000 for Lost inc which was very very cool that's fantastic yes and jordan i hope

the drive wasn't too strenuous no no it was the drive was hardly strenuous it was just a lot of very weird timing intervals because even though we were doing it for two weeks i never quite figured out okay how long does it take him to go this far if it's this climbing and this? So sometimes I would get there an hour early. Sometimes I would get there like the same time as him, which felt ridiculous because it was like I have a car. But you know, no complaints.

It was very fun. There was one or two times where like I would get to the hotel before Jordan. And I don't have any of my clothes with me. So I just check into the hotel like in my sneaky bike clothes and then shower and then just like nap and wait for Jordan to show up with my clothes. But it was fine. No, obviously no complaints. It was much easier.

And now we've jetted back and already made it halfway back across in one day. So a little bit easier than on the bike. So there you go. It was very disheartening going back and like seeing the work that I had done to go there. It was like, oh, well, it took me nine hours to get from like, you know, Cleveland to Toledo. But we did it in an hour and a half, you know. Yeah. That's why we invented cars, I guess.

How about it? Wait till you hear about planes. Yeah. Oh, my God. I guess. How about it? Wait till you hear about planes. Yeah, oh my god. What was the best baseball thing you experienced on the way? So it's funny you ask that then because

you know, we love baseball and I think that's kind of our whole thing, but the baseball kind of sucked. The games themselves were mostly bad. We really happened into some very bad, particularly the, here's a good way to put it.

The best major league game we saw was Tigers Orioles. Of the three. The Brewers beat the Pirates, I think 13 to nothing or something. That game was over. It was all early. It was all early. That game was over in like the second inning. And then, you know, our finale in Chicago, the Royals running Lucas Giolito off the field.

It was like, what is going on? But again, there were still some great moments here and there. Seeing Bobby Witt in person. Yeah, we see Bobby Witt Jr. That was really cool. So we definitely saw some cool stuff, but not a lot of memorable, like, oh, man. What a game. I never said what a game.

Yes, not once in 12 games in 14 days did we have an awesome baseball game. But that's fine. That's fine. Well, it seems clear then that the baseball gods and the weather gods struck a bargain. And Jake, I think you probably still got the good end of that bargain. But Jordan, you may have been short shrifted ever so slightly. Oh, good takeaway there, man. Good takeaway.

I was fine with the deal. Well, we're glad you made it. We're glad you saw some baseball, even if it wasn't the best baseball. We're glad you raised some money. And I hope you're already workshopping your next bad prediction so that you can have your road trip for next summer planned. It's funny you say that, Ben, because, you know, I got into this by making a claim. But the journey in itself was fun and in the car on the way back we did begin to cook up something for next summer okay and i'm

not going to reveal anything else about it but say that ben lindbergh you may somehow be involved yes so there you go there's your ominous hint. Okay. Wow. As long as I don't have to bike to Chicago, that is fine. No, no, no. You don't.

Ben, you'll have to bike. It's not like you can drive there. I know. Oh, damn. I have to give him a little bit of a hard time every now and again. That was good. Ben, I got to say, man, cars, though, they're pretty cool.

I just wanted to mention that again. No, I'm fine. I like riding in them. I like being driven. It's I got to say, man, cars, though, they're pretty cool. I just wanted to mention that again. I like riding in them. I like being driven. It's even better than driving, really. Ben, wait until you get your biker's license. I've got a license to ride. All right.

So we have accomplished our banter. We have broken the ice. So let's get down to business here. Mike Trout is about to turn 30. I know it's hard to believe. It makes us feel old. We're all old now. Jake and Jordan are not old, but they're older than they were 10 years ago, as we all are, as is Mike Trout. We all know how time works. He was born on the blessed day of August 7th, 1991. He came into the world and the world was never the same. And this podcast has never

been the same since he showed up right around the time that we started podcasting, which was quite fortuitous because he's given us tons of content and he's going to give us some content today. So it's been more than 10 years since he made his major league debut in July, 2011. And because he is celebrating this birthday, we wanted to celebrate him and venerate him and talk a little bit about all of the joy that he has brought us. And so we thought of Jake and Jordan because way back in 2015, we did a themed episode, episode 762, and we just talked about Barry Bond's fun facts and Barry Bonds stats and Jake and Jordan joined me and Sam for that episode and it was great fun and we wanted to do something similar

here for Trout not as statistically oriented because no one can compare to the fun facts of late career bonds so we will probably share some Trout stats here. But really, we just wanted to do a draft of things we like about Trout. Basically, we didn't get too specific, but our favorite things about Trout, the most memorable things about Trout, we can take it in any direction we want. But that's the general idea. It's just a general Mike Trout appreciation podcast. It's just a general Mike Trout appreciation podcast. And I had hoped that he would be back on the field by the time we did this podcast and that we would be enjoying watching him again. But he apparently has the calf strain from hell that will never heal. I hope it will heal someday, but we will bide our time until he returns by talking about the happy memories that he has given us.

What does Mike Trout mean to you guys? Oh boy. Well, we're obviously going to get into it. And I think this is good that this will be a little bit more broad than the Bonds one because I'm especially, you know, as we think, I'm trying to keep it more just like things about him, right? Because there's a million stats that maybe we'll throw some out, but I'm excited to see which direction we all choose to go with this. I think you said we're going to do three rounds. Is that correct? Yeah Maybe we'll throw some out. But I'm excited to see which direction we all choose to go with this.

I think you said we're going to do three rounds. Is that correct? Yeah, we'll aim for that. If we have a bunch more, I guess we can throw out a lightning round or something. But we'll see how that goes. I got a deep board, so we're good. It's good. I'm sure we'll overlap a little here.

But I guess our guests should go first. So I don't know how you guys decide to order. Who had the worst 2020? I don't know. This is a whole other conversation. We already did our banter, so we don't have to do that. But have you done your therapy for the week, Jordan? That's another good question.

That's another good question which we can get into after the recording. But do you want the first pick? I mean, the real question is who's picking 25th, right? That's the real, come on. That's what we're really trying to ask here. You go first, Jordan. Okay, I'll go. I'll let you go first.

I'll go second. All right, I'll just start there. Mike Trout was picked 25th. And you know what? More specifically, I'm going to go with Mike Trout being picked after Randall Gritchick. Not because, you know, obviously there were other players picked ahead of him that never even made the big leagues. More specifically, I'm going to go with Mike Trout being picked after Randall Gritchuk. Not because – obviously there were other players picked ahead of him that never even made the big leagues.

Shouts out to Geo Meyer. Shouts out to Geo Meyer and Bobby Borchering and all kinds of stellar talents. Chad James, I mean really quite baseball luminaries. But I love that it was Randall Gritchuk who has basically become one of the most uninspiringly normal baseball players. Like he made it. He was not a bust. But that he was the guy that was ahead of Mike Trout. And they said, yep, we got to make sure we can lock down Gritchuk first.

It's always funny. And he will be tied with him forever. I think if Randall Gritchuk wasn't the guy picked in front of Trout, what else would we ever say about Randall Gritchick? I honestly don't know. But he's kind of stuck with that forever. And I think it's funny. I mean, there's a lot of Trout draft related ones we can go with, but I'll start there. Yeah. I think if Sam were here, he would point out, because I know he's written about this before, that I don't think it was that the Angels thought that Gritchick was better than Trout. So it is highly amusing though that Gritchick was better than Trout. Right, right. So it is highly amusing, though, that Gritchick was officially selected first. Yeah.

If it was the other way around, no one would ever mention it. And even though you're right, as Sam has pointed out, it's not like they were actually saying he was better. It's still funny. Right. Yes, it is very funny. If you follow, this is part of the issue with baseball's draft, is that it is very complicated. And if you're a casual fan, it does not make intuitive sense to you. And so like for most people to look at a list of the 20, what year?

2009. 2009, sorry. 2009 draft. And it's like, oh, 24th best player, Randall Critchick. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. Yeah.

I just love it. It's very funny. Yeah. there's my first one good first run pick that's a good uh jake do you want to go second go yes all right go ahead i'm gonna take mike trout passing down the number one jersey at his high school every single year oh yeah that's a good one so for those of you who do not know about this mike trout went to millville high school go millville he wore number one when he was there because he was number one there he has since begun a tradition where every year he awards the number one jersey to the captain of the millville high school baseball team and it is not a situation where he like sends an email

or the coaches do it for him. He is in Millville every February before he goes to spring training. And he takes a picture with the senior captain of the team holding up Mike Trout's number one jersey. Some notable number one jersey people include Buddy Kennedy, who was also drafted, believe by the diamondbacks a couple years ago a gentleman named ryan mcisac who played division three baseball at rowan

college nearby and i just love that mike trout cares there are a lot of things about my child like he cares where he came from like geographically and i think that him passing down the number one jersey every year is a beautiful thing, that it means something to him to go back to Millville every year. He can mail it in. He can do it over Zoom. He can send an email. But he is there in person to pass that jersey down every year. And I think there's something incredibly beautiful about that. Yeah, that's a great one. There aren't that many players who are that closely associated with like their hometown like who is more associated with his hometown than mike trout he's yeah well he'll never leave like that's the beauty thing that's a beautiful thing like mr millfield there all the time yeah yeah and i

guess it's because it's not a famous place or or it wasn't before Mike Trout made it famous. I think it's still not a famous place. But I mean that in a good way. I think it's still itself. It has not changed. Yeah, but he hasn't forgotten his roots, right? He hasn't gotten a big head. I mean, he does have a pretty big head, to be honest.

I was going to say. He's got a big neck. Figuratively speaking. All thumb. He's just a thumb. Yeah, but that's a good one. Meg, you want to go? Sure.

So I did go with a statty one because it illustrates a thing to me that I just really love about him. So using the Fangraph splits tool, I looked at Mike Trout's WRC Plus every month since he became a big league regular. So we're setting aside 2011 and the 40-odd play departments since he got that year. Every month since he has become a regular, he has one month where he is below league average by WRC Plus,

and he had a 99 WRC Plus in that month. In August of 2015, he had a 99 WRC Plus. That is the only month since he became a big league regular where he was below league average and to follow it up and this to me is such a mike trout thing his september october wrc plus in in 2015 191 because the guy when he's down he comes back and he figures out how to do stuff better the next year he can't hit the high fastball he figures out

how to hit a high fastball he He feels like his defense is lagging. He sorts that out. I just, I appreciate that a person who is, who was obviously like preternaturally gifted at this specific thing that he happens to have the amalgamation of skills, native skills to do this weird thing that we have constructed super well is also a guy who like is still in school right he's still doing school when he's not getting stuff quite the way he wants and his worst do you know how many big leaguers would love it if their worst big league month was a 99 wrc plus there's some big leaguers who are like that'd be a great month for me so as i recall i think he was hurt, too.

I think he was indeed hurt that month. Yeah, he was playing through an injury. He dove to make a catch, and he hurt his wrist or something, and it was bothering him. It was sore. There's a reason why the one time he was not great. It's not just a slump. It's that he was hurt. Yeah, basically, he never slumps.

He never slumps. He's just the most consistent when he is healthy and when he's on the field. And I don't want to take anyone else's pick, but the thing that occurs to me along these lines is just that he has been so consistent on a seasonal level too, at least when it comes to the war, so that it seems like every year there's a new challenger. And if I'm stealing someone's pick here, just I will stop. But it seems like a number of times. You can just do your pick, Ben.

You're next. Yeah, this would not actually be my pick. But it is something I like about him, which is just that we've had the, is this guy as good as Trout now? Is there a new player who's the best in baseball? And obviously, there's legitimate reason to have that now because he's not playing. But when he was playing, even this year, he was clearly the best player in baseball. And obviously, there's legitimate reason to have that now because he's not playing. But when he was playing, even this year, he was clearly the best player in baseball. And so many other contenders for the crown have come and gone, whether it's Betts or Yelich or Josh Donaldson or whoever. There have been so many guys who maybe matched Trout for a year or two,

but just haven't been able to stay at that level. So it's incredible consistency for someone who has such a high level at all times. Yep. I was just going to add, like, I do hope that we, it basically just ends up being like a LeBron type thing where we're so desperate to give someone else. And then he's going to have like a 1200 OPS in September and we'll be like, what are we, what are we doing? What are we doing people? Come on, let's, let's be realistic. So I think I will take something that is sort of similar to Jordan's. It's in the genre of we underestimated Mike Trout, except it's even closer to his transition into the best player in the world, which is that entering the 2012 season, he was rated as the third best prospect in baseball. Oh, I love this pick.

By Baseball Prospectus, by Baseball America, and by MLB.com. All of them had either Matt Moore first and Bryce Harper second, or Bryce Harper first and Matt Moore second. And this was after Mike Trout had made the majors. This was after he'd been in the minors for a few years. Everyone had gotten a great look at Trout had made the majors. This was after he'd been in the minors for a few years. Everyone had gotten a great look at Trout. He was not an unknown. He was not the kid who was playing high school baseball in New Jersey. Scouts had seen him and everyone liked him. He was super highly rated. The projection systems really liked him and suggested that he might be the Angels best player right away. But no one got anywhere close to how great he was almost immediately. And I say almost just because he was sick in the spring, right? And he lost some weight and he didn't actually get

called up in 2012 until like late April. And basically from day one, he was the best player in baseball and has continued to be ever since. And so the fact that smart prospect people kind of missed like that close to his breakout, like I don't want to denigrate anyone's scouting skills. They're all better than mine and it's easy to miss. But to me, the fact that he was drafted 25th overall, like that's a great one. But there have been a lot of draft misses. And, you know, he was in high school and he was far away and he wasn't facing great competition and everything. It was cold that spring. Yeah, right.

And he was still a few years away from being Superman. So that to me is like more explicable than the fact that on the eve of his immediately becoming the best player in baseball, he was still seen as like a very good prospect, but not the best prospect ever, basically. And that just boggles my mind because we thought he was going to be good. But right up until he was the best, we seriously underestimated him. I think it's still too early. I think it's really important to wait prospects out and there's a chance Matt Moore has another gear. Did you see what he did in Japan last year? I just don't want to lock that in yet.

Okay. That's true. Let's see how it plays out then. I mean, you're right. I think Matt Moore could easily accrue 75-4 over the course of this. Well, and Gritchick, too. Oh, that's true. Gritchick's a good point. Yeah. And Jomai. Trump hasn't even turned 30 yet, so I mean, he has a long way ahead of him, let's hope. You're right. And yeah, it's not like

Bryce Harper was a bust or something. It's not like that was a miss. Harper's a Hall of Famer, too, so I'm not saying that him being the number one or two prospect in a typical year, of course he would be more. Okay, maybe that's more of a miss just because pitchers are tough to project and the guys get hurt and all of that. But still, there was no prevailing sense that everything was about to change and that this

guy, Mike Trout, was about to dominate the next decade of baseball. And I think that that's wonderful because it suggests that you never know what's right around the corner. Maybe the next best player in the world is about to debut and we don't even know it yet. And I don't know if anyone's going to like draft his 2012 season. So maybe I'll hold off on that. But he was just the best at basically

every aspect of baseball that year i really would like harper to end up like second in war over the course of their careers just so that we can never abandon this you know they'll like be going into the hall of fame they'll both be first ballot guys and i I'm like, here we are yet again. It's funny, right? Because it was always Harper versus Trout and who you got at least for a little while there just because Harper was so highly touted as a prospect. And Harper has panned out. He basically has lived up to the hype. I mean, maybe not just because he was like the most hyped prospect ever, but you'd be hard pressed to say that he's a disappointment because he's going to be in the Hall of Fame someday too, and he is a superstar. And I guess you never know how their 30s will go, and maybe Harper will make up some ground on the back end.

But that conversation ended very quickly. There's no real rivalry, even though Harper has turned out to be awesome. Like Trout was just so good that that became not a conversation very quickly. And we could do just its own like Mike Trout war segment. But I mean, again, I didn't even bother preparing it. And I just fell into noticing that Bryce Harper literally at half of Mike Trout's career war. Half. And he's also maybe a first ballot hall of famer he's a half so

like that's that that sums up well and i just love like you mentioned right because 2012 is obviously you know such an iconic season but like it was really 65 games that threw everyone off the scent right the 40 yeah bad to average games in the big big leagues and then the fall league in in, when he was just tired and it wasn't good. And those are the only times he's ever struggled basically ever in baseball. So that little stretch. Except for August 2015. Except for August 2015, when he was really an average big leaguer. Yes. Yes. Well said. So for my second pick, I love all those picks. Very good, good transition here. This is kind of going

more of off of what Meg was saying, because I was also thinking about like, right, like when is Trautman bad? And I just got to mention that, but I'm going to go with something a little bit different, which is that I'm going to draft Mike Trout being unbelievable in spring training. Mike Trout, this is maybe not something that people, I was going to take the fact that he's also amazing in all-star games. Cause he's got two all-star game MVPs and he's you know he's always been you know really good in all-star games but that's a smaller sample but if you look at Mike Trout's spring training numbers

going back to this is something I started noticing in like 15 and 16 but I'm now going back and seeing that when in 2010 in seven plate appearances when he was literally straight out of Millville he had four hits two doubles a triple and a homer as a child in big league spring training. And then if you look at 13 through 16, OPS was over 1,000, you know, 1082, 1288, 1362, 1276. Like, this dude is presumably just hanging out, you know, just showing up and getting his swings in, and he can't help it. He's like, sorry, I'm Mike Trout.

Like, I know we're all trying to just kind of get loose, but I'm still going to put up like a 600 on base and slug 900 for these three weeks. Like, it's just what I do. What are you going to do? Like, I'm sorry, you know, and I just love that, you know, I'm sure there are all kinds of great players who absolutely suck every spring. And everyone's like, oh, he's a slow starter, he's a slow starter. Mike Trout's like, sorry, I'm just, I can't help it.

It's like the scene in every superhero movie I was like, oh, he's a slow start. He's a slow start. Mike Trout's like, sorry, I'm just I can't help it. I can't turn it off. It's like the scene in every superhero movie where like this superhero uses their powers in like common society and everyone's like, what are you doing? Dude, chill, relax. I can't turn it off. Like, I'm Mike Trout. Pulled the door off a cab accidentally.

Exactly. That's Mike Trout you know, hitting six home runs in 2014 spring training for no reason When he was already the best player It's like the scene at the end of Incredibles where Dash Like tries to finish second in the race The Angels are his parents being like No come in second

Like sorry nope I'm also the best when we're not trying So I just love Mike Trout He just can't turn it off What about his career spring training stats Can we do those So 493 at bats In spring training That's a full season

Give me the line what do we got 343 435 623 that's 1058 OPS With 27 homers And 26 steals And 8 times caught stealing so i so it's like it's only a little bit better than his normal so it's only a little bit better i guess because it's like

i mean those numbers are eye-popping but so are all of his numbers so yeah but i 1058 ops compared to 1002 ops career in the regular season but like you have to figure he's not trying his hardest. So even though he's facing minor league competition part of the time, it's still pretty impressive. Yeah. And maybe we should. Maybe I should look into this and just be like, how good is the average superstar's line? Yeah. I mean, again, this doesn't tell me anything.

We already know Mike Trout's good. So it doesn't matter. But I just think it's funny because I always notice it every year i'm like oh my god he just can't turn it off so that's my second pick yeah speaking of the fact that he's never had a bad month like he's never had a bad march even right right i guess he he like he missed time in some marches but like his worst spring training ops is 2017 864 which is not bad at all or i guess 824 in in 2020 which was like one of his worst seasons even though it was a really excellent season he was like i'm disappointed in myself after that one he was like he came into

the spring he's like yeah i fixed some things like after last year where he had a 162 OPS plus, like, yeah, he really needed some work. So there you go. Spring, spring trout is my, what do you got Jake? I want to talk about 2014, which is far and away Mike Trout's most dreadful. Full major, in which he had an OPS plus of 169 and won the MVP because Miguel Cabrera decided not to win the Triple Crown that year. It is his lowest season by war, I believe, in a full season. But what I really want to zoom in on are his strikeouts from that year.

He struck out 184 times, which led baseball. Mike Trout, since the wild card era, is one of only three players to lead the league in strikeouts and win the MVP award. As far as I can tell by looking through this on my phone at the Buffalo Wild Wings where we ate dinner about an hour and a half ago. The other two, I believe, are Mo Vaughn in 1996 and Sammy Sosa in 1998.

But I just love that Mike Trout led the lead in league and strikeouts. And I know that we live in the era of strikeouts where everyone swings and misses and it's okay. It's fine. You can still be good. We know this. He led the league in strikeouts. It was like, not a problem, but not, not a problem. And for me, it made me think about like, you never really get your strikeouts completely in check and it reminded me of like when i had acne in high school it was like i can manage this it's never gonna fully go away but i can do my best to keep it under control and that's

what mike trout eventually did with the strikeouts his totals then plummeted from 184 in 2014 and got significantly lower over the next two seasons, both in full seasons. And so I just love that, like, he was striking out more than anybody else in the world and still won the MVP. And then it was like, I can't do that anymore. I'm going to still not good enough. Yeah. That's something I was considering drafting, but we've already alluded to it. Meg, you mentioned it, like just the fact that seemingly every season he targets some quote unquote weakness, which would already be a strength for just about anyone else. But he says, this is what I'm going to be better at this year. And then he is. So he wins an MVP award

and he says, well, that was nice, but I struck out too much. So then he's going to strike out a little less. And he's done this with so many things, whether it's like when he couldn't hit high pitches for a while, right? Because he's a low ball hitter. And then he said, well, I want to be a good high ball hitter too. And then he like turned into the best high ball hitter for a while. Or like when his arm was his worst tool. I don't know if anyone's going to take that. So sorry if I'm stepping on anyone's toes.

But I love the fact that that was like the one thing he didn't really do that well. And he at least got it up to average. You know, he did some shoulder exercises or something. And suddenly he was like pretty good at throwing too. And he's had that like every year. It's like, oh, I'm not getting good enough jumps this year. So now I'm going to get better jumps. And maybe he can't continue to do that forever, but he has continued to do it thus far.

And that's been a lot of fun. So I'm always looking forward to like, what will he fix this year? Because sometimes it seems like he just doesn't really have anything left to fix. Sometimes it seems like he just doesn't really have anything left to fix. And like his plate discipline, which is like sort of an unsung skill still, I guess, even in this era, you don't really see like highlight reels of, you know, Mike Trout's good takes or something. But like he has basically the best or close to the best plate discipline in baseball, too. And it keeps getting better year after year. He gets more and more selective and just doesn't swing at anything he can't drive and that's another thing that it's like i'm just

gonna be better at that and then he is it's wonderful yeah i mean it's it's phenomenal it's just the best he's just the best i keep trying to like do play discipline reels and no one wants them but i keep wanting them and give them to watch yeah yeah okay so this one's a little follow me we're about to go on a journey so back in 2015 michael claire wrote a thing for cut four about scouting reports for harper and trout uh there had been previously unreleased uh scouting reports from the scouting bureau that he got his hands on for these guys. And I'm actually not going to read from their scouting reports because they're glowing as you might expect them to be. But there's a tidbit in here

that I love, which is that Mike Trout experimented with switch hitting at one point. Oh, yeah. Right. Ben, I think you're familiar with this story. Jake and Jordan, you probably are too. points. Oh, yeah. Right. Ben, I think you're familiar with this story. Jake and Jordan, you probably are too. Right. So he never did it in a game. He would do it for scouts if they asked and he would do it during VP sometimes, but he was not trying to actually implement this into games. Although, and here I'm quoting from this piece, I actually beat my high school team in home run derby left-handed. They made me hit left-handed. They told me I had to hit lefty or I couldn't play. Sadly,

according to the center fielder, it was just something people thought maybe down the road, I'd want to do it, but I don't think there was any potential there except that he won this home run Derby. And I, one of the things that I really appreciate about Mike Trout because he is so good at so many things is that when you watch him and maybe this is a little too close to what we were just talking about, but I don't care because I wanted to tell the left-handed home run derby story. So here we are. I just feel like there is a version of Trout that might be better than the version we got. This is a good question.

He just still feels all these years into his career, 75 or 77 wins, depending on which version of war you're going with. It just feels like there is untapped potential. Like he might still surprise us with a thing. And some of that is going away in the off season and tinkering with the thing and coming back and like being good at the thing. He was bad. And I'm doing air quotes that no one can see before, but I just think there's something very special about a guy whose talent is so well established and so lauded. And we spend so much time talking about it, who still feels like he has the potential to wow you with something. And I think when a guy has

that kind of sustained excellence, it's almost easy to lose sight of just how good he is, which people listening to this podcast will be like, well, why do you talk about him so much then? Because that seems impossible. But I think you get comfortable. You get settled in with the guy. And so it just feels cool that this dude who is so amazing might one day turn around and be like,

what if I did a lefty though? So, yeah. It's pretty great. Yeah, I got my hands on the video of him taking batting practice left handed i forget how or where and i tweeted it i'm pretty sure and i think it's in our facebook group too so you can actually see it happen i'll find it and link to it if anyone is curious but it's not just apocryphal this yeah did actually happen. I don't know about the home run derby, but he definitely took batting practice left-handed and looks like he could have hit that way. So

yeah, that's pretty cool too. I love this answer. I also, when I think about it, right, it's like, okay, but all right, let's say he was a switch hitter. Like what, you know, when you look at his numbers, it's like, well, it's not like he was, he's not like he hasn't been awesome against righties so it's like okay let's give him let's give him the platoon split like what changes maybe it's a cedric mullen maybe maybe a reverse set well maybe it's like maybe like his he's like a career like 330 hitter but like the power is lower and the strikeouts are lower or something like that. Like maybe that's what the result would be. But I don't know. It's again, it's hard to complain with what we got.

Yep. Yeah. The many models of Mike Trout is one of my favorite things about him just because he has kind of morphed a bit as he's aged, but has remained like roughly as excellent in his various incarnations so like he's led the league in a lot of different stats that don't often go together in one player although he still hasn't led the league in homers because jorge soler beat him out a couple seasons ago which i'm still sort of mad at him about but you had the super young trout who was incredibly fast i mean he's still very fast

but like i think as Sam has noted, for at least a while in that season, I think he was leading the majors in base running runs and batting runs and fielding runs. And he ended up coming pretty close to doing that over the full season. So he was just the best at everything

and had all the tools. And then, yeah, later on, he kind of became the high strikeout slugger. And then he cut back on the strikeouts, as Jake was saying, and really ramped up the plate discipline, but like still hit for a lot of power and walked more. And so, you know, he followed the progression that a lot of powers hitters do where they hit more homers, but steal fewer bases as time goes on, which makes sense because he's like hurt himself stealing sometimes and it just, it's not worth it really. But there just been like these multiple versions of Trout and yet all of them are worth like nine or 10 more. So my favorite thing is how many times in this episode, Ben's going to say one of my favorite Trout things is, and then not draft that thing. I'm hugging all of them. Well, you're up again, Ben, so I'm excited to see what you are going to say. Can you imagine a sports team do this?

Be like, ooh, we really like that other guy. Let me tell you all about him. All right. But you can have it. I'm officially taking kind of the quintessential Mike Trout fun fact, which no longer works, but it worked for a really long time, which is best ever through age X in war. One of the great tragedies of 2020. Oh, man. Yeah. Yeah. It's partly the pandemic shortened season. It's partly the fact that he keeps missing time with injuries. So he has fallen off the pace now and he is uh

now i think merely the fifth most valuable player ever through his age 29 season and that's if he doesn't play another day this year so he's behind like i don't know babe ruth and like ty cobb and rogers hornsby or whatever like you know players who play in a completely different. Yeah, basically. And Mickey Mantle, which is like a little less fake, but still somewhat fake. So I think that is just the best stat because it was just the best way to sum it all up really for years. It was like, no, he's just the best. Like no one has ever gotten off to a better start to his career. And here's the leaderboard I can link to that proves it. As long as you believe in war and that war makes sense, here's the definitive evidence that I can just hyperlink to say, best ever. And best ever without even adjusting for era or anything or saying the guys ahead of him you know were playing in in segregated baseball or whatever like you didn't even have to do the disclaimers he was just the best and he was like better than all of the inner circle guys and so you know even though he has fallen

off the number one pace he's still pretty darn close to it and i just got so much joy out of that fun fact for years and like following it and doing the math to see if, okay, if he, is he still going to be on top after this season? Like how many more does he have to have to get back to the top through this age? So I'm sad to see that no longer work, but for a while it was just the the best it was my favorite fun fact going yeah it really is like almost in the same sense that the bonds 400 400 club 500 500 club like that he's in his in his own club for both those like that kind of same kind of thing that was the one that would just like really hit in the same way beyond the as we you know if you listen to 762 it's like well no

he had the most home runs that's the one you should probably lead with but but with trout no you're you're so right and i i think there are a lot of like milestones and beyond trout that we're just gonna we're we don't realize we're missing that that because of 2020 um right and i you know that's that's definitely up near the top of the list for those so i like that one though it had to be taken so i'm glad you did yes uh. For my final pick, I'm going to go with something that you actually just said a few minutes ago, but it's simple. And it's just that Mike Trout is so freaking fast still somehow, even though he is a football player, you know, something that, you know, tragically because he's missed so much time this year, you know, when I pull up his, his baseball

savant page, it is his percentiles don't fill in because he hasn missed so much time this year, when I pull up his baseball savant page, his percentiles don't fill in because he hasn't played enough time, right? But the thing that has filled in enough is the fact that he's still 97th percentile sprint speed. And I know sprint speed is not perfect. I know that it is not necessarily the perfect way to look at it. But I am still... The thing that is most consistently shocking, because he doesn't hit a home run every game but we do very often get to watch mike trout run to first base that happens you know very very frequently during the course of a season and every time it is just a sight to behold how freaking fast this dude can get down the line and the size that he is and i know we

have other big athletic freaks that can move in that way, but none of them are as wide as Mike Trout, right? Like I know Luis Robert is very big and I know even Tatis and, you know, Buxton, like there's some big dudes that they can run, but there's nothing like him getting down the line. And even in the outfield where it isn't necessarily, you know, living up to the best defensive numbers, but it is still the thing that I cannot believe.

Because when you see him when he's younger, he was huge when he was younger too, but now he's gigantic and he's still that fast. And I know he's not running anymore, and that's unfortunate that we're not seeing it manifest in steals, but when he goes, it's still, it is crazy. It is a really, really, really crazy thing. And the only other thing I can really think of

in terms of the aesthetic, and I obviously wasn't around to see it, but it's Bo Jackson. Like when I watched Bo Jackson highlights, I'm like, how is someone that big moving that fast? And Trout is the only one in the modern day baseball that I can think of. And he's also the best at everything else. So that is a simple one, but that's what I'm going with. If that was his only thing, it would also be unbelievable. So yeah, going Trout is still really fast and i

hope i know he's had these injuries and this is i think the first lower body injury serious lower body injury that he's had well he had the foot right oh yeah oh he did the foot briefly and then the other was the was the hand sliding in so that wouldn't matter but yeah i just hope uh and i'm curious i'm honestly really curious to see how many elite sprint speeds he's rocking up down the stretch when he comes back. I saw some clips of him running the other day, and that was like not running at full speed because he didn't want to test the calf completely yet.

And like with anyone else, I would have thought, oh, that's a sprint. Like that looks pretty darn fast to me. And yet that was like apparently problematic and like he he isn't ready to be back yet but like that was faster than i've ever run when my cath was fine so right with jordan and i literally like 40 minutes ago at dinner alex bregman posted a video of himself running in AAA because he's also coming back from a lower body issue and Alex Bregman didn't look great right like he didn't look like he was zooming you know what I mean and Mike Trout even when he's going half speed just and apparently

still hurting it was just looks great yeah yeah so anyway simple one but there's my pick what do you got Jake for your last pick I'm taking the weather thing. I'm sorry. Someone had to do it. Someone had to do it. You're still on the board. I mean, come on. Here's the thing.

The weather thing, Mike Trout's love for weather has become bigger than his love for weather. And that it is often besides him being the best baseball player in the world, the first thing about his personality that people list and i think that that is slightly unfair to mike trout who yes look i don't want to get into the whole discussion of face of baseball etc etc but like he is not an electric man that's okay we know this there are other people filled that role in our game but he is definitely not boring there's a huge difference anybody and you two have done this who's talked to professional baseball players know that the bar for boring to be interesting is very low okay and mike

trout is not boring he's not a boring person the weather obsession is not just a bit he loves it okay he is going on the weather channel he watches the weather channel we have apps in this day and age you don't need to watch a show to see what the weather's gonna be where you live you can google it or you can look at it on your phone but he is tuning in to what what the weather's gonna be where you live you can google it or you can look at it on your phone but he is tuning in to what's the guy's name jim jim cantori's best friend his bfffl and he's watching the weather and he owns his own weather balloon he owns a weather balloon he got paid 426 million dollars or whatever and was like what are you gonna do with it first mike oh boy i'm gonna buy a weather balloon like it is just a hobby that i don't know anyone

in my life who loves the weather like that and he's the best player in the world and he just loves can i can i add on the as this has been made pointed out that he loves the best player in the world. And he just loves, loves weather. Can I add on the, as this has been pointed out, that he loves the weather and he lives where there's no weather? That's just, that also kills me. Yeah. I think that's so much why. And he decided to stay there for his entire career. Right, but that has to be part of why he's going back to Millville

and just praying there's a blizzard. He loves it. He's like, come on, give me something interesting. And I think that, like, the Mike Trout interesting and i think that like the mike trout weather thing has been beaten into the ground like when mlb on the broadcast like during the all-star game has him do like the weather reports like he's not in love with being a weatherman right he's in love with the weather he's the way he's the weather guy yeah so he's just thinking about the weather in a way that i don't think about anything.

And I love that. Do you think that his parents anticipated his personality when they made Nelson his middle name? Were they like, that fits. That's a love the weather and your wife and the Eagles kind of guy name. Right? Nelson. That's the name. That's the middle name of a man who has a favorite chair and a weather balloon. Like that's what that name means.

Like it's not Michael John. No, Nelson. Like, hey, the most interesting thing about him is that he likes the weather. And like weather, you know, it's your go-to like conversational small talk. When you have nothing to say, you talk about the weather. And so the fact that he's identified with weather, associated with weather, people think that that makes him boring. But really being that interested in almost anything is interesting, I think. almost anything is interesting, I think. And being that into weather when you're not like a meteorologist and when you're like one of the best athletes in the world is actually interesting. And to the extent that he is bland, like there are some ways in which he's bland. Obviously,

he's not going to give you like super exciting postgame quotes and all of that. But I've come to value that quality too, really. There was a point, I guess, where I probably would have wished that Mike Trout said more interesting attention-getting things. But we don't need that, I don't think, because there is a whole generation of players who just really capture your attention with everything they do and everything they say now. So maybe that was more glaring when Mike Trout was like, clearly the face of baseball or whatever. It's a silly conversation. But like now that you have Tatis and you have Guerrero and you have Acuna and you just have like all of these guys, it's not like there's a void of like personalities in the sport right now. And so i think he's a nice compliment to

that because like he's just superman like superman is not inherently all that interesting a character really at least a lot of the time but like he's a cool iconic memorable character nonetheless and i'm sick of like finding out that people in baseball are bad. Yeah. And like, you never know with anyone. Right. But like from what we know and from what we can tell, like there's no sign that there is some skeleton in Mike Trout's closet. And that is refreshing. And I just like that he's the guy who's just like always working hard and saying he's taking it a day at a time and like signing autographs for kids constantly and like doing charity work and all this stuff.

Like it's, you know, kind of cliched almost, but he's like the good guy superhero. And I think you need someone who fills that role too. And like we probably need more people who are just like seemingly good even if it makes them bland from one point of view so i've come to value that about trout over time he is a metronome in a way for our baseball watching lives right and and that is his personality too i think you know there was a lot said about him facing baseball or whatever. And I think something that Jordan and I eventually kind of agreed upon is like,

Mike Trout is not the guy for like attracting new fans necessarily, but he's outstanding at retention. Like if you're in on baseball, Mike Trout is going to keep you in on baseball once you find out about him. Right? And it seems like other ballplayers really like him. Oh, yeah.

He seems to be very well liked. And when you're the best at something, and we talked about year-to-year variation, blah, blah, whatever. When you're the Mike Trout of your generation, it would be easy for people to dislike you no matter how nice you are. Just because you're the best and it's a competitive field and they're competitive young guys and they want to, you know, take that mantle. But he seems to be very well liked by everyone who comes in contact with him in the game even though you know he does want to tell you about the 10-day forecast but that's useful you know you don't want to be caught unawares even if you have an app in your pocket maybe it's not working or what have you so i don't know it seems like a good indicator that people could have all sorts of reasons to have animus

toward him just because they're jealous and they just don't really seem to. So that's nice. He's wholesome and he seems at least from afar like kind of uncomplicated. Like he just wants to play baseball and be the best at baseball and devote himself to that and take care of his family. And like he knows where he wants to play and he decided that he wanted to stay there and he just did and like he does what he wants to do and remember when there was that back and forth between like rob manfred taking shots at trout for like not promoting himself more and then trout or the angels kind of fired back a bit like he is who he is and like he's he's not apologetic about that and he's not trying to be something he's not and he's not the iconoclast.

He is not like Mr. Let the kids play and overturn all the unwritten rules or anything. He's not like upholding unwritten rules or enforcing them or anything. He's not like Mr. Traditionalist old school guy either. He's just going about his business and like there's nothing not to admire about him. And I would just say like the one thing I would add to this is that it's a small thing, but there are a lot of baseball players we talk about, the bland ones, the ones who are maybe, you know, putting their head down and running. But like Mike Trout is enjoying himself.

Like he smiles a lot, right? He smiles. He's laughing with teammates. And like that goes a long way too too where it doesn't look like – he does still look like he's having a great time. And even though he's not giving us the best quotes, that still comes through on the TV and makes him just as more likable versus other players where they do look like they're literally doing a job.

DJ LeMahieu. Yeah, exactly. So not to name DJ LeMah, but, you know, DJ LeMayhew. So, you know, that's another thing that I would just add on the Trout personality thing. But anyway, Meg, I think you're up. Yeah, well, we covered it a little bit in our discussion here. But I really, despite the fact that I would love to see him play October baseball more often, I really love that he decided to stay with the Angels. And like

he committed like there is a no trade clause in that contract. He is staying in Anaheim. And I think, you know, if you look at the the Fangraphs leaderboard since 2012, it's a lot of dashed out team names, right? It's a lot of guys who have moved around. And there's nothing wrong with moving around. I think that, you know, trades happen and dudes should be able to play where they want to and play where they're paid what they're worth and they need to take care of their families. So I don't begrudge anyone, you know, going to different teams. But I do like when we have guys where a fan base can establish a lifelong connection with someone. And there's something really lovely.

It's quietly the biggest vote of confidence and sort of braggiest thing he's ever done to sign a deal that long with Anaheim with a full no trade. It suggests that he thinks, well, I'm going to get him there. with a full no trade it suggests that he thinks well i'm gonna get him there like we're gonna we're gonna go to the playoffs in the course of this contract and i'm gonna do it it's like quietly very you know braggadocious on his part but the nicer thing is that you just don't get a lot of guys where they're with one team for their entire careers. And I think that when, when we have really great players who are like, that's a thing to celebrate. That's a special thing to get to cultivate that kind of lifelong bond with a player and say like,

that's our guy, you know, and Mike Trout is good enough at baseball that he's all of our guys. And, you know, we spend so much time talking about him that, you know, it's shocking that Ben is only just now watching every

angels game but i know i feel almost disloyal it's like what are the odds he doesn't know a teammate would yeah that's right i could be watching just to get the odd shot of mike trout on the bench in the dugout occasionally that's why i'm watching the angels game this season yeah he doesn't know so so you know like you know, I think when you reach a certain level of talent where even if we think the face of baseball conversation is just sort of inherently silly and the strength of the sport is that there are multiple faces of baseball, if you reach a certain skill level, I think you become bigger than just your affiliation with your team. But that connection is still really magical. And I think that for, you know, to Jake's point about retention, like imagine growing up a baseball fan in Orange County

and you're a kid now, you probably don't remember the Angels ever being in the post-season, but like you've had Trout your whole fandom. It's like being able to root for Felix on steroids. Not Felix on steroids, but like the experience of rooting for Felix amped up on steroids. Anyway, you know what I'm trying to say. So I really like that about him.

And I hope that his very well-earned self-confidence proves to come to fruition, even if it's not this year. I really am the embodiment of the distracted boyfriend meme when it comes to Trout and Otani like I just I hope they can both be healthy at the same time so that I can gaze at them both at once and I won't have to turn my head but yeah it's obviously not one of my favorite

things about Trout's career that he is one for 12 in his one playoff appearance although the one was a homer we must point out but I wish that he is one for 12 in his one playoff appearance although the one was a homer we must point out but i i wish that he had had more october moments i think the silver lining though is that like it does teach you something about baseball yeah oh yeah he has not made the playoffs more than that and i'm not saying it's worth it or that I'm glad that he has suffered and missed the playoffs many times to give us an object lesson in how baseball works. But like, really, I think it does tell you something that a team can have the best player of his generation or possibly any generation.

And that's just not enough. And in any other sport or a lot of other sports, at least in basketball, that would be enough, you know, maybe not to win a title, but at least to get you to the playoffs. And in baseball, it's just not. And that's something I actually kind of like about baseball. I don't like that it has cost Mike Trout many playoff appearances, but I do like that roster construction, that team building is more complex than just going and getting one guy. So in a way, it's a bug, but in a way, it's a feature and it is at least a learning opportunity, I guess. Just if you don't understand how baseball works, then look at Mike Trout's career and the Angels' lack of success. And I guess people might discount his own contributions and falsely assume that he can't actually be that valuable if he hasn't single-handedly propelled the team to the playoffs. But those of us in the know who would never interpret it that way would just conclude that, no, this is baseball.

It actually takes a strong supporting cast. And unfortunately, he hasn't had one. No, I think Mike Trout is a losing player yeah for sure technically true technically true i don't think he has what it really takes how bad does he want it i mean honestly like really a lot of smiling and laughing mike trot you seem to lose every year no okay i'm kidding all right would he have stayed would he have signed that contract if he really wanted to win? Exactly. I mean, people will say that with a straight face. So careful now.

Mike Trout signed a contract with the perpetual 79 and 83 Los Angeles Angels. Yeah. But I agree with – and I would also add that I have – we both carry a lot of disdain for the Angels org because, right, we all – whatever. We don't have to explain why we all wanted to be in the postseason. I'm with you but as someone who has spent many hours on Mike Trott's baseball reference page and plan to continue to do so in the future for the next 5 10 20 30 50 000 years you know we know it's way prettier if there's no other team right if it says yeah if there's one team there right I mean I'm thinking way far ahead here but like that page could really live on in special beauty

if he does stay with the same team all the time. We don't need that last year to say Milwaukee. No. Yes. We really, really, really don't. Or Philly at age 46. The last Philly. Well, I'm pro that.

I'd give him Philly. Captain Harper. That'd be fun. That would be the exception. I'd give him Philly. That'd be fun. Oh, with Harper at the end of his contract? Yeah, that's funny.

Yeah. Yeah. So anyway. Then he could go to Eagles games so easily. That'd be nice for him, with Harper at the end of his contract? Yeah, that's funny. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway. Then he could go to Eagles games so easily. That'd be nice for him. But there you go. I'm more concerned about his BRF page than his playoffs. So there you go.

Okay, Ben, what is Mr. Irrelevant of this mic shot draft? This is Ben Lindbergh's 12th call card. He lost a lot of free agents. This is your comedy. Five more that I'm going to try to slide in under the fire. That's fine. I'll throw in some rapid fire ones at the end too, but go ahead. For the last official one.

It's like when the Rays had 18 picks in 2012. 2011, yes. Good times. Okay, this is sort of a silly one, but I guess I will take the fact that he was the only player on stage when MLB televised the first round of the draft for the first time ever. Like, what a wonderful thing that he happened to be there. And I guess he was there because it was in New Jersey, probably, right? Like, I assume that was in Secaucus. I don't really recall, but usually it is.

Yeah. And it's New Jersey. He's always in New Jersey when he can be, seemingly. So why would he not show up? And like, he wasn't obviously the headliner right like he was not gonna be the number one pick or anything so I haven't gone back and watched that footage for a while like you know I he was like obviously on camera because he was like literally the only guy there who showed up for that event, which is wonderful. And maybe he wouldn't have shown up

if he had been a bigger, more highly touted prospect. Maybe the fact that he considered it worth his while to be there is an indication of the fact that no one knew that he was going to be Mike Trout someday. But I think it's lucky for all of us that he was there so that we can go back and watch that moment in time where Mike Trout was selected with the 25th pick. And no one knew that that was going to turn out to be the first round pick, the first pick off the board in a Mike Trout turns 30 draft years

down the road. So just the serendipity that he happened to be there. Maybe it says something about his personality. Maybe it's a complete coincidence, but I think that's kind of cool. And I'll also say Jordan and I had the pleasure to, I think, three years. Three years when we were working at MLB, we spent the day with the draft kids who went to New Jersey. And any year, there was, I think, between four and six of them. And they were all nice and, you know, fine and wide eyed. And I'll never forget Trevor Rogers seeing Times Square for the first time. But all of them, like, there was something about it that felt like it was cool for them. But it like it wasn't, it doesn't carry the same gravitas as like

the other drafts, like it just doesn't have the same show. And there was always something a little bit rinky-dink to the whole Secaucus draft. And for Mike Trout to be the only kid at the dance. At the first dance. At the first dance. Yeah. Is just beautiful. It wasn't about him looking cool.

He didn't care, he was like i'll go like okay like we'll drive two hours north like whatever it almost feels like if it was in manhattan he would have gone he wouldn't have gone oh great take but he's like ah it's just something you know in jersey yeah just yeah yeah we'll make it happen um yeah no it is it is a great image and i would love to go back and watch like i can like picture it and of course he was like he's you know extra young for his class, so he's just this weird 17-year-old in this awkward studio. It almost feels like that made it all worth MLB Network being in Secaucus, New Jersey.

I mean, they've held on to that forever, and they will never leave. I still have stuff there. Yes, yes, you do. Sorry for another day. But yes, that is a great pick. There's so many draft-related ones we could pick. Can I do a draft-related one that I find just delightful? Sure.

And here I'm going by Baseball Reference War because they have a nice draft rule about this. So, you know, I love, we've talked about how he was picked 25th overall. If you sort the first round war board from that year you sort all the first round guys by their career war by base role reference war mike trout has 75.9 wins you have to add the war of steven strasburg aj pollock and zach wheeler and you are still a win shy of mike trout steven strasburg who like was no like, oh, the Nationals made a bad choice

at number one. He was, like, the guy. They were like, yeah, he was incredible at San Diego State. You should draft Steven Strasburg. Incredible college pitcher, right? No one was like, oh, you've made a horrible mistake. Those three guys combined. You have to combine them.

And even then, you come up short. I love it. It's great yeah i mean again we could do it so the war ones are yeah we go all night i had this on my list that mike trout is war and war is mike trout in my mind i had that too yeah we're like you know i always compare war to getting on an airplane like i don't know how this works but i trust that someone smarter than me has made the calculations necessary for this to operate correctly also the vaccine uh this is kind of sort of like that and so for war it's like i don't know how this is calculated but like

mike drought's the best at it and so I watch him and he's the best. So it's fine with me. Right. And he was doing it good. He was good enough, long enough to where everyone was like, damn, I guess war is legit. I guess war is right. He convinced everyone single-handedly. Yeah.

There's such a synergy. There's a symbiotic relationship between war and trout because they like they kind of both blossomed at the same time in the national consciousness and they just fed off each other where like you needed war to fully appreciate how good trout was and you needed trout to appreciate how useful war was and they just like ascended at the same time and and that was another like teaching opportunity i think just to go back to the cabrera triple crown and those mvp debates and everything and man like now with chow turning 30 and cabrera about to hit his 500th homer like life comes at you fast but things have changed a lot and that conversation and that debate would probably be a lot different

today who knows maybe we'll find out if we have otani with the war lead another angel and flad And that conversation and that debate would probably be a lot different today. Who knows? Maybe we'll find out if we have Otani with the war lead, another angel, and Vlad ends up challenging for the Triple Crown. I guess we'll see how it plays out this time. But that was a case where the war gap between Trout and Cabrera, and yeah, it kind of became like an old school versus new school, silly online play more for a little while there. But like, I think a lot of people learned from that. Just, you know, the fact that you had Cabrera with the old school box score overlapping back of the baseball card stats, and then you had Trout who was just better overall, but you needed War to tell why he was so much better overall.

And so, yeah, I totally agree. Ready for a steamy hot take? I don't mind that Cabrera won. I know I'm the young guy. I know Trout deserved it. Cabrera, like, that one does not bug me as much as the 2015 one. Oh, yeah. The one Donaldson won. Like, Cabrera won the Triple Crown. It's pretty cool. not bug me as much as the 2015 one yeah oh yeah we did one donaldson one like it could wear with

the triple crown it's pretty cool like he wasn't the best player and like we all know that now and like we look back and it's fine yeah i mean it's to this to some degree it's just like damn i wish barry bonds had 10 mvps instead of seven but it's like it's fine like he's still gonna have plenty and it's it's okay but but you're right like cared. Like that was a thing that people freaking deal, man. Oh my goodness. People really cared about. And you know, you look back on it now and it's like, there are more important things going on in the world.

I don't need to get this mad about this. No, I would rather. No, it's still real to me. Damn it. Yeah. Come on. Sorry, Ben. Oh, I did it.

Damn it. He doesn't do that very often. Whoa. Whoa. Boy. It's a wrestling meme. But, but yeah yeah i've never like gotten that into like award debates really because it doesn't change like how the player actually

performed but for a while there like when you just had like the old school cranky columnists who were like triple crown and the story and i guess you also had like the sabermetricians being like more end of story, but it does feel like we've come a long way. It feels like we've come a long way. Yeah, yeah, definitely. So anyone else have anything else they want to get off their chest? A little lightning round here? I have like two and a half more quick ones. I'm just going to go quick.

Do you have any more, Jake? Plain tweets. Oh, yes. That was on. That was definitely on my mind. The plain emoji tweets are on my mind and the the extra space before the punctuation that we talked about on many effectively wow you guys talking about that honestly one of my favorite conversations ever the fact that it was committed to east carolina i think it's hilarious i love that i would well okay I forgot to bring this up. The jersey, number one jersey thing is from East Carolina.

East Carolina apparently used to do that with the number 15 jersey. So he's a pirate through and through. Oh, my goodness. And they told Mike Trout about it, and then he then started it at Millville. So why didn't he turn down the Angels and go down to Greenville? I think you know the answer to that. Talk about alternate timelines. Oh, my goodness.

Mike Trout dominates the American conference. Mike Trout. Because remember, we were just talking about him being the best player in baseball when he was 20. That would have been his sophomore year, I guess, or junior year. He's just taking it to UNC Greensboro. That's not the right time. Yes. So that's a good one.

And then I was just going take the jj hardy catch oh yeah that like that is one of the best defensive plays of the last 10 years easily and he happened to do that too right you know it's just one of those things it's like he has he does have that that moment uh that defensive moment so i adding to the that like he jumped in front of the plane ad on the fence like he oh he did it right in front of the southwest like he flew which by the way that that reminds me the whole you know he's a subway guy in front of jersey mike ads oh yeah such a missed opportunity yeah and they have jersey mike ads in the angel i feel so you know that's a bad thing yeah that's that's tough but those are those are the the only other ones besides the million other war-related ones

that I could have come up with. I'm glad we took an individual play because none of us really had done that and that's not the way we consume Mike Trout's career mostly. It's the steady accumulation of value

maybe more so than just the single play. And partly that's just because he hasn't been in the playoffs. And so a lot of the plays blend together. But that's the one. That's the signature one. Like they're obviously like, you know, he'll hit a ball that's like at his ankles 430 feet or something. And that's really impressive.

Or he'll beat out a ball that he seemingly has no business beating out. And like he's made a lot of home run robberies. And there are a lot of cool ones. impressive or he'll beat out a ball that he seemingly has no business beating out and like he's made a lot of home run robberies and there are a lot of cool ones but that one because that was like the the young trout who could do everything better than everyone that was right because that was 2012 right yeah that was 2012 and that's when he right has the and again he could have just just been at east carolina so another one Another one I wanted to take, and this is a little too personal maybe, but Jordan and I know someone

who got Mike Trout out in high school. We actually know someone. That's not a joke. We've talked to them about it, and they're like, yeah, it was a line out. He hit it 1,000 miles an hour. That's real.

We know someone who got Mike Trout out in high school, and I just love that. That's a thing. line out like he hit him a thousand miles an hour you know like we know that's real like we know someone who got mike trout out in high school and i just love that that's a thing and i wonder what he would have hit in college because his dad was a great college hitter and i i wrote about that once but like i wonder like would he have been as good but just in college or would he not have been would have been slowed down quickly yeah right this is like the optimistic version of or would he not have developed this quickly? Yeah, right. This is like the optimistic version of the would the Mariners have been able to screw up Mike Pratt if they had drafted him.

Yeah. Just to put this in, you know, Jordan and I talk about this all the time because like we love small school, like Division 3 baseball and New Jersey small school college baseball is like as good as it gets. And the kid who we were talking about earlier, who wore number one at Millville was like one of probably like a,

one of the best hitters in the country. This kid, Ryan McIsaac, he hit four Oh five this year. In D three. In D three. And we always joke about like, Ooh,

what if Mike Trout had just like stayed nearby at home and like played division three baseball at Rowan college? Like how would that have gone? Would the number have started with a six or seven? I think he would have. I do. I do believe it. Maybe he would have started hitting left-handed,

but just to like give a shot. I mean, he would have pitched a hundred, but that's the other thing. He absolutely would have been pitching. That probably would have been true at ECU also, but yeah, a lot of alternate timelines on this podcast.

Oh my goodness. We've really gone a lot of different directions. Yeah. How much better could the other timelines be than the one we actually got? This one's pretty darn good. Yeah. So I got to just a couple more here. I'll say,

I don't know if this is a good thing or a bad thing, but I think he kind of spoiled us when it comes to prospect promotions and i know that he he did struggle briefly in 2011 and he got a little unlucky and i wrote about that once he had like a low babbitt and everything but like because he just took the whole baseball world by storm immediately in 2012 when he was still so young like it wasn't just him it was also har Harper and Strasburg and later Juan Soto and like, you know, a bunch of other guys who came up and were good right away, Jason Hayward. But like, I feel like now we're just so spoiled

that when Jared Kelnick comes up and struggles in his first taste of the majors or Wander Franco is like good, but not incredible right away. It's like, what are they waiting for what's taken so long and so it's like we need to recalibrate to like our pre-trout understanding of like what the aging curve is like and I know the aging curve has kind of changed but like he just he blew our minds so much early in his career that I think it gave me unrealistic expectations for like every subsequent prospect so that might be a bad thing but it is part of his legacy at least

in my mind and I also want to take the fact that he has been and still is the face of super pretzels oh my goodness oh why didn't I have this on my board that's a huge oversight it's just the best like i know he has bigger endorsement deals too but this is such a good one the fact that he still reps super pretzels after all this and like maybe he signed like a 14 year deal with super pretzels too i don don't know. And they bought low on traffic. No, it was an extension. I think they actually re-upped. He stayed with them.

He could have gone and run with a bigger pretzel brand, but he decided to stay with Super Pretzels. He has been with Super Pretzels for maybe his whole career. And you would think that he would have priced himself out of Super Pretzels by this point. So he must have given them a sweetheart deal like he he must have had a chance to opt out or whatever like he can't have signed like a career contract like a lifetime deal with super pretzel is that what happened i don't know but like i just went to superpretzel.com and like every time i check i do check periodically to make sure that he is still the sponsor of Super Pretzels, the spokesman for Super Pretzel. And he still is. And like you go and it says, Mike Trout, the supernatural loves Super Pretzel and we love him.

The major league center fielder grew up snacking on Super Pretzel soft pretzels and he's not afraid to let the world know. And he really is not. He is not at all. Here's keep going keep going i have so much more but i just i love that like the the kind of like low budget like local ad quality of it where it's like the the generic jersey that just says mike trout baseball superstar and then his hat says Super Pretzel. And it's just the best. And I wanted to write about this once, like a couple of years ago. And I actually corresponded with a PR person from Super Pretzel. And there just wasn't really enough there to do a piece about it. But I was just looking at the email exchange because I wanted to know like the origin story of how Mike Trout

became the face of Super Pretzel. And the PR person told me that like the CEO and president of Super Pretzel is like a big sports fan and they've had some other sports spokespeople before. And so they kind of like Mike Trout was on their radar. And so they reached out to Trout, and all parties felt like they had known each other for years. I'm quoting now. Okay, okay. A natural, effortless fit. Mike was aware of Super Pretzel previously. Okay, yes, yes.

And he was also aware of Icy, you know, the iced. Yeah. That's also like a J&J snack food. It's like they have multiple brands, and Superzel is one and Icy is another. But unfortunately, he could not become the face of Icy because there was another conflict with another contract he had. So he couldn't represent Icy. So there is another alternate timeline where Mike Trout is not only the face of Super Pretzel, but also the face of Icy. What would that have changed in his career? I don't know. But I asked, like, can you give me any details about this arrangement? And they told me, while Trout has always been a phenomenal partner toward us, each year of his involvement seems to be better than the last.

He is always more than willing to partake in photo shoots. See that? Take that, Rob Manfred. Yeah, come on. He's doing his job. He is definitely the face of Super Pretzel. He will attend Q&A cocktail events, approve his likeness on our packaging, and so much more. What else I want to know?

What makes this partnership truly noteworthy Is the authenticity behind it Trout has been a long standing Super pretzel fan since he was a little boy The partnership never feels Forced or involuntary And you know what that is true I believe he loves super pretzels Because why else would he still be the face of super pretzels

I think that this shows that like Like look if you're friends with Mike Trout And he tells you I'm going to help you move Next weekend I think he this shows that like, like look, if you're friends with Mike Trout and he tells you, I'm going to help you move next weekend. I think he helps you move. Like the angels, the Eagles, super pretzel,

like this guy. Jim Cantore. Yeah. Yeah. Like loyal. I bet that the body armor super drink, a sports drink that he has endorsed since 2012 was was the conflict with icy i bet that that was the problem the body armor super drink i think i think that the right like body armor i was going

to bring up body armor because body armor is definitely just giving him the bag like which good good for mike trout you know get that but i this is my takeaway here is that he absolutely loves super pretzel and absolutely has since he was three years old or whatever. Because that is the only explanation. Doing a little research here. We're going deep right now. I'm glad you kept vamping, Ben, because we're going deep into the Super Pretzel archives here. The Bob Woodward of Super Pretzels.

So the Twitter account is only, at least we follow, or Follow by Trout and the New York Mets. I'm going to hit that with follow. We're going to give them a follow, Super Pretzel. But I think it seems that Super Pretzel is owned by a company that is basically based in South Jersey. So there's probably, so he has some definitely some regional loyalty there. Some local ties. And the last, I mean, again, we could talk about Super Pretzel all night. Shout out.

I can't wait to go for this. This is not SpunCon. We are not sponsored by Super Pretzel. I think the funniest thing that I just found when I Googled Mike Trout Super Pretzel is a box on eBay of Mike Trout Angel's Super Pretzel box for $3. Why wouldn't you just go to the store and actually buy Super Pretzels? I don't understand. This isn't signed or anything. I can just go to the grocery store tomorrow and

probably find a Super Pretzel box with Mike's face on it. I just texted this to Meg, but they're a pair of custom Super Pretzels. These are incredible. These are Dunks. SB Dunks. Custom Super pretzel colorway that they made for Mike Trout.

I am just going to go out here and vow right now in this podcast that if we ever get the chance, this is not a bet. I'm sorry. I will flock to Chicago. But if we ever get a chance to talk to Mike Trout, this is number one. We will ask him about Super Pretzel before anything else. Because, again, it's not like there's that much. And we know he's going to be excited to talk about it. Both because they're paying him, whatever they're paying him.

And because he freaking loves Super Pretzel. There's no way he doesn't. There's no way he doesn't. So I think it will be an instant connection. And I can't wait to talk to him about Super Press. I have long had the theory, and this could go fast in a good or terrible direction, but I have long been of the mind

that your best chance for a good Trout interview is at an Eagles game. Yeah. Go to an Eagles game with him and just see where it goes. Now, he's very serious about the Eagles, Like go to an Eagles game with him and just see where it goes. Now, he's very serious about the Eagles. So you three who are not big football fans would need to do some prep because I bet he would want to talk about the game. And that might be taxing for you.

But you have Super Pretzel as a backup. So I think it'd be fine, actually. Yeah. I found the press release. They signed him in October 2012 2012 so early no but that's still after the best season ever i mean right but yeah no i mean it would be more impressive if it were pre-season and it's like everyone else was like matt moore is the best prospect in baseball and super pretzel was like no no super pretzel was choosing between matt moore and mike chubb and can get a Super Pretzel watch on Etsy for $20.

It says it was a multi-year agreement. It doesn't say how many years, but it says, we believe the combination of Mike representing our Super Pretzels, soft pretzels, churros, and other related products is a rare combination of the best of the best. People don't know this, but Rolled Gold had Matt Moore all locked up. I think Snyder's might have had Harper

in the pretzel race. And Auntie Anne's had Randall Gritchick. All right, I'm done. Sorry. The other thing I asked the Super Pretzel PR person is, does Mike Trout get unlimited Super Pretzels? Is that the perk perk is that why he is so loyal to the brand and they said there's no set quantity of super pretzels that he gets but

and i'm quoting he he knows he is welcome to all the super pretzels soft pretzels that he wants you didn't write this story i'm sorry i'm glad i'm getting this out somehow we are always happy to send soft pretzels and other goodies to mike his family and his teammates and i want to know like are his teammates taking him up on this like does he have a room in his house that is where he stores super pretzels? Does he just have like a monthly delivery? Is there a specific person he calls at super pretzels? Yeah. Oh, he's going straight to the top.

Come on, I'm out. Yeah. Right. He's going straight to the top. Come on. Let's be real. Because on one hand, giving a guy a lifetime supply of pretzels is wild but like what are you gonna say no if my child calls you and he's like can i have a pretzel

yeah this just this just happened when when yannis won the championship and went to chick-fil-a and was like can i get lifetime supply chick-fil-a they're like ah sorry we can't do that it's like what like at least live and live in the moment i mean go with the flow even at least say the right thing but no super pretzel there's no way he doesn't have just back up the truck and the truck is full of super pretzels and exactly the last thing i asked was like has it worked like has trout enhanced super pretzel sales and they said we see a direct spike in social media interactions and advertising recall and awareness when using mike's image and likeness this is a true partnership mike has become a member of our team and our j and j snack foods family we look forward

to many more years to come and like so do i it's a partnership. Like he's benefiting his global platform. He's getting as many Super Pretzels as he wants. It's like LeBron and Nike or something, right? Man, if it wasn't for Super Pretzel, no one would know about Mike Trout. Yeah, the Q rating is skyrocketing because of the super pretzels sponsorship that that's the thing it's like it's not what you would think of as like an athlete endorsement like it's not gatorade or body armor or whatever or even like subway which like wants you to think it's like healthy food at least like super pretzel is it's a pretzel it's not like a performance enhancing substance it is a super

pretzel frozen they are frozen i've had that box in my freezer for years i was gonna say i have definitely experienced a spike in super pretzel oh yeah mike trout you know and and honestly i'm not i just searched you know mike trout super pretzel on. And I have a tweet from us, September 2013, I had bought a Mike Trout Super Pretzel box because I said, just when I thought I couldn't love Mike Trout anymore, he shows up on the Super Pretzel box, most valuable pretzel. So there you go. The sponsorship is paying off right now on this podcast. We've been talking about Super Pretzels for 20 minutes. If you're listening to this and you aren't about to go at least look for a Minecraft Super Pretzel box, you are lying.

You are absolutely lying. I would like someone who listens to this pod, someone out there, just tally the total amount of times that the word Super Pretzel is said on this pod. Over, under, I'll set it at 75 uses of the word super pretzel. Do you think he brings super pretzels to all of the angels' gatherings? If they have a clubhouse potluck, are they like, Mike, enough with the super pretzels already. Is Otani hooked on super pretzels now?

Anyway, after we publish this podcast, there's definitely going to be a direct spike in social media interactions. They're better. Advertising recall and awareness we need to look trout's been out for whatever two three months now like they don't have like highlights to quote tweet so we got to give a little boost before he comes back yeah all right i think that's all my super pretzel material i can't anyone else save that no we're not topping that yeah that should have been the first overall pick, really. No, this was better.

This was better this way. If you stuck around for the good stuff, God bless. All right. Well, I will just thank Mike Trout for the memories. We hope there will be many more. He's a Hall of Famer if he were to retire today. If this were somehow a career-ending calf strain, he would be a first ballot Hall of Famer. He already has the war of a Hall of Famer. And hopefully, he's only halfway-ish through his

career. And who knows how the second half will be. I would not be at all surprised if he ages gracefully and we'll just hope for the best. But he's already given us so much, both as baseball watchers and as podcasters, because the Mike Trout hypotheticals are sort of the signature of Effectively Wild. There have been dozens of them. They're all collected on the Effectively Wild wiki, which I will link to. Thanks to that page, I know that we have actually talked about what if Mike Trout had to switch hit on episode 364, and then what if he had to hit lefty on episode 999, and more on switch hitting on episode 1002, and what if Mike Trout had gone to college in episode 434. We've done it all. And I never tire of considering new ones, and we'll probably get some super pretzel-related Mike Trout hypotheticals after we post this podcast. Oh boy, I cannot wait.

All right. Jake, Jordan, thank you for joining us from the Holiday Inn Express and we will reconvene here. I hope in 10 years we'll all be here and healthy and happy and so will Mike Trout and we will celebrate his 40th at that time. And until then

you can find Jake and Jordan on Twitter at Cespedes Barbecue or BBQ. You can find them also on the Ringer MLB pod every week, where I also appear on separate podcasts. But the real highlight is Jake and Jordan every week. And of course, you can read them and hear them and watch them on Fox as well. They're everywhere, just like Mike Trout on Super Pretzel Boxes. So guys, thank you so much for joining us. Thanks, you both. It's been a pleasure.

I'm going to go sleep. I'm going to go do that. These pretzels are making me thirsty. Yes, they are. Okay, that will do it for today and for this week. Thanks as always for listening. You can support Effectively Wild on Patreon by going to patreon.com slash effectivelywild. The following five listeners have already signed up and pledged some small monthly amount to help keep the podcast going and get themselves access to some perks.

CJ Labasi, Jacqueline, Gretchen Ehrenkofer, Chris Paskoff, and Finn McHattie-Strailey. Thanks to all of you You can join our Facebook group at facebook.com slash group slash effectively wild You can rate, review, and subscribe to Effectively Wild on iTunes and Spotify and other podcast platforms Keep your questions and comments for me and Meg coming via email at podcast.fangraphs.com

or via the Patreon messaging system if you are a supporter Thanks to Dylan Higgins for his editing assistance. We hope you have a wonderful weekend, and we will be back to talk to you early next week. And I typed in Mike Trout super. And then obviously since it's just cards, it's Mike Trout super fractor. I'm like, no, I's Mike Trout super fractor I'm like no I need Mike Trout super pretzel so let's let's just let's be clear what we're trying to do here