Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - 113. Stuart Margolin

Episode Date: July 25, 2016

Gilbert and Frank connect with one of their favorite character actors, the funny and versatile Stuart Margolin, who looks back on his 55-year career in films and television and shares stories about everything from "Love American Style" to "Death Wish" to his pop songwriting career to his decades-long friendship with "Rockford Files" co-star James Garner. Also, Stuart directs Uncle Miltie, casts Marvin Gaye, imitates Maxwell Smart and pens a tune for Johnny Fontane. PLUS: Richard Mulligan! "Evil Roy Slade"! Julie Andrews sheds her image! Stuart boards "The Big Bus"! And the strange tale of "Lanigan's Rabbi"! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Hi, I'm Gilbert Gottfried, and this is Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast. I'm here with my co-host, Frank Santopadre, and we're once again at Nutmeg with our engineer, Frank Ferdarosa. Our guest this week is an actor, director, playwright, and composer who's been working steadily in films and television for five decades, sharing the screen with everyone from Julie Andrews to Charles Bronson to the Olsen twins. wins. Movies include Kelly's Heroes, Death Wish, The Stone Killer, Future World, Class, Days of Heaven, Arbitrage, Blake Edwards' S.O.B. and A Fine Mess. He's appeared in dozens of beloved TV shows such as Gunsmoke, The Fugitive, The Monkees, Bewitched, The Partridge Family, MASH, The Mary Tyler Moore Show, Rhoda, Hill Street Blues, and 30 Rock. And he was a featured player on a favorite show of Frank's and mine, Love American Style. You bet.

Brighter than the red, white, and blue who-who. You bet. summer of George Adams and the Glitter Dome, as well as episodes of the Mary Talamore show, Wonder Woman, The Love Boat, Heart to Heart, Quantum Leap, and Northern Exposure, for which he won a Director's Guild Award for Best Direction. But he's perhaps best known for his Emmy-winning portrayal of Jim Rockford's former jailmate, Angel Martin, on the classic series The Rockford Files, starring longtime friend James Garner. Please welcome to the show a man who appeared in two of this podcast's strange obsessions, the Big Bus and Lanigan's Rabbi, the multi-talented Stuart Margolin.

Hey, that was a walk down memory lane, my guy. I'll bet. Now, if you had done nothing else in your career, Stuart, I would want you on the show just because in Death Wish, one of my favorite movies, you're the guy who gives Paul Kersey the gun that he mows down all the muggers with. Including Jeff Goldblum, right? Yes, and not just Jeff Goldblum, but Denzel Washington. Denzel Washington, yeah. Right. It was interesting.

We made that movie, and then it came out. It was playing some opening in some theater in Westwood, and so I went over to see it. I'm excited about, hey, hey this and I happen to be upstairs and there's a guy on the phone and he's going I want this pulled from every theater in the United States laughter

laughter it was the critic for the LA Times Charles Champlin who was a hell of a good writer but I thought oh my god and a powerful critic, but I thought, oh, my God. And a powerful critic. Yeah, but it didn't, that turned out to be that year, Paramount's number one box office hit, actually.

Beat the Longest Yard. Al Ruddy always used to tell me that. You beat us. I always said, like with Death Wish, unless you were in the movie theater when that movie came out, you didn't see Death Wish. It was an experience

with a crowd. Everyone went nuts. Yeah, it was pretty wild. Even in Westwood, it was pretty wild. And what was Charles Bronson like? He's one of my favorites. Interesting.

That was the second film I'd done with him. I had done a film before called Stonekiller. Same director, Michael Winner. Which I played kind of like a hitman,

a soldier, ex-Vietnam, a little bit like the guy from the massacre whose name fortunately I forgot. But at any rate, so then we do Death Wish and we shot for maybe five days, scenes together, this, that, and the other thing. And I go to the airport to fly home and he walked in and introduced himself. That's the first time we ever met. We'd done about 25 scenes in two movies, and it had never been introduced. The man who started out as, what was it, Charles Buchinski? Oh, yeah. Right, right. And Gilbert and I remember him. We talk about him in House of Wax with Vincent Price. I think he was still Buchinski. He was still Buchinski. Yeah.

with vincent price i think he was still bachinsky he was still bachinsky yeah no no kidding well he went when when he introduced himself i thought this is a little crazy but hi how do you uh he said the second thing he said to me god's truth is he said you know i grew up wearing a dress and uh what he what he was referring to he had grown up in the coal mining country in Pennsylvania and I think they didn't have money to buy all their kids clothes so he wore hand-me-down stuff so I thought that's fascinating so I got on the plane and the publicist had me on the plane and I told him that story and he said he were he said yeah he tells everybody that story yeah I remember reading about that. That's interesting.

That Bronson would sometimes go to school in a dress because that's the only clothes they had for him. Yeah, yeah. Since we're talking about classic movies, Stuart, just to start off, and we told some fans on Facebook that we were going to have you on and some people were excited about it. And they said, please ask him about Little Joe and Kelly's Heroes. Well, it was a terrific part. We were in Yugoslavia for a little over six months. Spent the first three months in Serbia, then moved to the coast, northern Yugoslavia, called Istria, right near the Italian border.

I had done a film, curiously enough, the year before in Yugoslavia with a Yugoslav crew, so I knew a lot of the crew that worked on it, which was great, because I got to know them, and I could order beer. So it was a wild time. All those actors, we were staying in a, when we first started on a place on the Danube called the Veriden Hotel, which had been a castle that had repulsed the Turks back in, I believe, the 12th century. And it was a fascinating history up there. And across the river, which was the Danube from the hotel, was a town called Novi Sad.

And in the middle of the river was a bridge that had been blown up, but they left it there to remind everybody what the Nazis had done. Wow. Yeah. It was a lot of history there. And Kelly's heroes. And can you tell us the cast of Kelly's great cast? Well, obviously, Clint, Don Sutherland, Kelly Savalas, Mr. Rickles. Rickles would sit in the dining room every night and as he walked in he would lay you open

so he was insulting everybody everybody walked into the dining room every night whether it was breakfast or dinner and I remember my wife visited my wife at the dorm and he said oh Stuart whoa, I see what you mean. That's great. He loved teasing Telly all the time.

So basically with Don Rickles there, it was like seeing Don Rickles on stage every night. Every day. Yeah, every day. Another actor in Kelly's Hero is worth mentioning, too, who became famous on TV in the 90s is Len Lesser, who played Uncle Leo. Oh, my God, yes. Also, I'm just going blank. Forgive me. All in the family.

Dead. Oh, Carol O'Connor's in all in the family. Dead. Oh, Carol O'Connor's in it, of course. Right, right. How could we forget him? Tons of people like that that were in the film. And not everybody was there the whole time. It was like we were never going to leave. It was like, keep shooting.

And I think one day Clint said, I'm going home tomorrow. And that was the end of the movie. And what was Clint like? You know, he kept himself quiet, a gentleman, friendly enough, but he was, you know, already a big star. And he had, he kept, he kept quiet. One funny thing is he had, when we moved to the West Coast, I guess you'd go to the West Coast, it was in Istria, which had formerly been Italian territory, but there was a beach.

And there were some, even in, and Tito was still alive in Yugoslavia. And since I had been there the year before, the first assistant director of the film the year before was the Yugoslav production manager for Kelly's Heroes. So he said, when you get to the coast, I've got a great little house for you to stay in. Wonderful. So one day I walk out and there was two houses on the beach, both

obviously, if you were a party member, you got to stay there. And Clint lived in one and I had the other one. And I'm sure he never figured out how the hell did he get that? You know what stays with me from that movie? That wonderful theme song, Burning Bridges. Burning Bridges. Oh, I I this this is a weird thing that happened to me about a few months ago. I was on some radio show and we were talking about old TV and someone said, oh, who's that actor?

I can't think of his name. He was he was always good at leering. And I immediately I immediately screamed out, oh, Stuart Margolin. Immediately screamed out, oh, Stuart Margolin! Because on shows like Love American Style, you had that dirty leer. You didn't have to say a word. Yeah, I'd worked on that a long time. Well, it's old, I think.

Well, let's talk just a little bit. We're going all over the place, Stuart, so forgive us. We don't have much of a chronology here. We just kind of go as things pop into our head. But Love American Style, I was telling Gilbert, was created by your brother. Absolutely. Arnold Margolin and his partner, Jim Parker, created Love American Style over at Paramount for ABC. I was getting ready to go to do Kelly's Heroes. And I had done one little part. It's so weird.

I did one little part of a guy drunk in jail that bumped his head against some bars. I mean, it lasted like 10 seconds. So then I got ready to go and got a call and said, look, we're doing this show, but we're going to do these little jokes in between. They're going to call them like blackouts. It was like vaudeville or burlesque or something. Silent movies, too, yeah. Well, it was crazy.

Fortunately, I was young enough. We'd go to the beach and shoot 22 a day. Wow. And then they would show them for half a year. Then you go for another week and do 22 a day and i would and some of those things run dead run as fast as i from the beach to the trailer put it do new hair new costumes run back to the beach and kind of they were written but you'd improvise whatever worked you know uh it was it was i i guess it was like burlesque is what it seemed like i never did burlesque but it seemed like constantly so the leer was part of that

it's probably been a lot of trouble today yeah Yeah, it was like the filthiest leer where you didn't have to say a word. Well, they were bawdy. You were always playing like somebody tying a girl to a railroad track. No, no. I met a lot of people saying, no, my parents wouldn't let me watch that show. Interesting. And go ahead, Gil. No, they would always have like, it was one of those shows, too, that would have so many guest stars.

Right. Well, they had the regular segments that would last anywhere from eight to 12 minutes. Maybe one would be that long. They probably show three of them. And then in between those shows, they do these little gags. They may do two in a row even sometimes. But that's what they were called. And so right before I went over to Yugoslavia, I did like a week's worth. And when I came back, it was kind of a hit. So I continued to do those, the gags, the blackouts.

I think the first time I saw you was in, was in those blackouts. And I remember James Hampton who played Dobbs on F Troop. Yeah. Yeah. Was in them with you and an actress, Phyllis Davis. Very, yes. Beautiful girl. Beautiful. Your brother created it. I want to talk just a little bit about Arnold for a second. Cause Gilbert and I, you know,

we do deep research on the show and the things that we uncover. And Gilbert and I are a little obsessed with a superhero show from the 60s called Mr. Terrific. It was on opposite Captain Nice. Captain Nice. Yeah. They were Batman knockoffs when Batman was such a big hit in 66. But your brother wrote a handful of those. I had no idea.

I'm learning from you. I had no idea. I'm learning from you. I had no idea. And Frank tells me your brother wrote the theme song of Love American Style? Yes, right. He had a partner whose name escapes you right now. I think it's Charles Fox. Yes, good show. Stuart, can you sing any of Love American Style?

Not well. I don't care. He's a composer. He's a musician. Yeah. I just want to hear it if you can sing some. Maybe the title itself. Love American Style.

I'm off beat. I couldn't even do that. Brighter than the red, white, and blue. Hoo hoo! Love American style for me and you. We will return to

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If you or someone you know has concerns about gambling, visit connectsontario.ca. Listen closely. As a master painter carefully brushes benjamin more regal select down the seam of the wall it's like poetry in motion benjamin moore see the love and now back to the show i believe charles fox if i'm not getting this wrong, also wrote the Love Boat theme. I didn't know that. Wow. And you directed a bunch of those. I did about, yeah, I forget.

I think three or four of them, anyway, for sure. Did you direct? I think I acted in one, too. I think you did. Did you direct Uncle Miltie? Do I have this right? Yes, I did, actually. And Steve Allen was in the same show, in the same segment.

I think it was called Gotcha. Man, you've got things I don't remember at all. He was a practical joker, right? Oh, yeah. What do we have here? Oh, wait a minute. Our engineer is calling something up here. What is that?

Oh, it's a love boat. A love that? Oh, the love boat. A love boat theme. Very nice, Frank. Okay, now, Stuart, by law on this show, I have to ask you, have you ever seen Milton Berle's penis?

No. I've heard about it. He's a legend. And've heard about it. It's a legend. And I heard about it from Milton. Milton? What did Milton say to you about it? He made some comment once. I'm not going to go into a lot of detail, but

I didn't need him to tell me because it was legend. The night that I won the Emmy, the first time I won the Emmy, It was legend. I know the night that I won the Emmy, the first time I won the Emmy, I came up, I got it, got off stage. And I guess they went to a break and Milton Berle walked in front of the stage. He said, Stuart Margolden. That is a fun Love Boat episode, I have to say. And you directed another one with Will Gere.

Yeah, that's right. I did. And also John Ritter was in one. I directed at least a couple of scenes, I remember, because I had known John before when he really got going. And so he was just starting to get the career really going when he did the Love Boat. His name comes up a lot on this show. And also, speaking of Love Boat and Kelly's Heroes, the captain. Oh, Gavin McLeod is in Kelly's Heroes.

Oh, wow. How could we forget? Captain Stubing. Yep, yep. But you also worked with Gavin when you directed the Mary Tyler Moore show. Right. I did. So there you go. And on the Mary Tyler Moore show, if I'm not mistaken, you once played a guy who's obsessed with Mary. Yes, I was. I kind of drove her crazy. She we had a few dates and she couldn't get away from me. I wouldn't let her get away from

me. And I think the leer was back in work again. But being around Mary, I kept it down. I held it down a little bit. I remember that episode. I'm a Mary Tyler Moore. We had Ed Asner on this show, by the way. Oh, great. Who was just a wonderful guest for us. And what I remember about that Mary Tyler Moore episode, and I'll just talk about the one you directed, too, in a second, but the one where you were Warren, the boyfriend who wouldn't take no for an answer. Right. You did a Don Adams impersonation in that episode.

I did? Yeah. I played harmonica. I remember doing that. Yeah, yeah. But that's. And the one you directed, and Gil knows this episode, too, the one where Lou and Mary go to Washington and he's trying to impress her. Oh, yeah.

How many people he knows in D.C. And they're in a hotel room and it ends with Betty Ford on the phone. And Mary. When I originally got the call, it was going to be the president. It was going to be President Ford. He said, President Ford's going to be in your segment. And I got scared. I thought, why me? What happened?

But then it turned out that it was his wife that did the show. That's a fun episode. Yeah, that was. It was a good script. All of those scripts were great writers. Brooks and Burns. And I remember

the episode of MASH. Once again, Yalir came in. Which one? He was the shrink or when he was the plastic surgeon? Yeah, the plastic surgeon because they said they were promising you a girl. And they didn't have oneerting because they said they were promising you a girl.

And they didn't have one, but they said if there's a girl who's going to have sex with somebody, this guy will find them. Yeah. Hot lips. I jumped her in her room. And then you and Alan Alda, is this true that you guys hadn't seen each other in a number of years until you did 30 Rock together? Right. Yeah, it's been a long time. It's been a long time. He's a nice man.

One of the finest people I've met in LA. Boy, we could go all over the place here. I'm looking at my card, Stuart. You've done so much. And you were on, it's so funny, so many people that you worked with have been on our podcast. We had two of the monkeys. Yeah, we had Mike Nesmith and Mickey Dolenz were here. So you worked with the monkeys.

Right. I acted in the monkeys. It was a lot of fun. And I remember, well, I saw, I came in when they first made that pilot and Bert Schneider and his partner. Bob Rafelson. Thank you. They were showing it to people like, do you want to write for whatever? And Nesmith and Mickey were clearly, I mean, the young English guy was a great singer.

Davy Jones. Yeah, Davy. But Mike Nesmith had wonderful timing and personality. He was great. Yeah, you played the next year too. What's he doing? Is he writing songs? I heard he was directing, and they still go out on the road.

Well, we grabbed him at a nostalgia convention in New Jersey and we kind of we kind of went up to his room and hijacked him. But he gave us a great episode. Nice. Yeah. And I'm looking at this card and so many fun things on here that we have to ask you about, Stuart. In addition to MASH, in addition to the monkeys, a show that Gilbert and I, and I know we're jogging your memory here. It's been 40 years. A show Gilbert and I talk about, Land of the Giants. Yes.

I remember so little of that. I think you played a robot. There you go. That's probably why I don't remember. I didn't really remember much about that a week after I finished it. I just,

thank you for reminding me I played a robot because I kept wondering, why don't I remember anything about that show? And our engineer is bringing up the theme song for Land of the Giants. He's trying to jog your memory. What was the Englishman that played the lead?

Oh, gosh. Land of the Giants. I remember Gary Conway, I think. There was at the time, he seemed elderly to me, but he was English. He affected an English accent all to me, but he was English. He affected an English accent all his career, one or the other.

And he was one of the leads. I feel like most of the scenes I played were with him. We'll have to have our researcher, Paul, find that. Paul, can you dig that out? English guy on Land of the Giants. Stewart's wondering who the English actor was on Land of the Giants. Or he had done a lot of Shakespeare. He may have been from Mississippi, but he sounded like he was English. What about the Partridge family?

You played Snake, the motorcyclist. And yet another guest on our show, Danny Bonaduce. Oh, yeah, great. Yeah, I had a wonderful time with all of them. And it was a part originally Rob Reiner had created, the biker. Oh, yeah. And then when they were going to, there was a wedding. I think I was the groom or something.

I rode in on a bike and Rob was either already doing all in the family or something so i got cast and i did a couple of segments of that and uh shirley was wonderful and and uh all those kids were great and was danny crazy back then yeah Yeah. Little but crazy. And David Cassidy, he was at the height of his like pop sex symbol. Oh, the teen idol thing. Yeah. Well, he was just growing into that. And his brother, Sean, Sean Cassidy, was actually a pretty big star at that point. Sean. Sean Cassidy was actually a pretty big star at that point. And I had known their father from New York when I really first. Oh, no, Jack. Jack Cassidy. Ted Cassidy was Adam's family.

That's right. And Jack was. I'll take you back. He did a show called Shangri-La, which at the time was the most expensive flop on Broadway. I remember him in the Superman musical on Broadway. Jack Cassidy? Sounds right. The one that was written by the Bonnie and Clyde guys? Oh, we have an answer to your English actor. Land of the Giants. Okay, so I've got the whole cast up here. Is Gary Conway the guy you're looking at? No, he was American. Okay, Don Marshall. Also American.

Don Matheson. And the occasional woman, Stefan Arngrim. No, it was a guy. Kurt Kasnar. Kate Kasnar? Kurt Kasnar? Kurt Kasnar. No, I know Kurt.

That's the whole cast that I've got here. I wonder what, well, maybe it was one of those first names you mentioned. That's the whole cast that I've got here. I wonder what, well, maybe it was one of those first names you mentioned. Like I say, it was just a guy that worked with an English accent. A hundred years ago. Yeah. So let's ask you, we'll get it out of the way.

Let's ask you about Lanigan's Rabbi. Yes. With Art Carney. Well, it was, you know, I read those books and I thought, oh, this is very exciting. And we did the show and I was pleased. I kind of felt like at the time I was playing myself more than I had in any other part. I thought, I'm not going to go for any weird character, just, you know, play the thing. And then it ended and we saw it and people, yeah, they're going to do more. And I thought, it's weird.

Me and Art Carney and nothing's funny. You know, something's wrong. Interesting. Art Carney was like the chief of police. Police. And you were his best friend, a rabbi. Yeah, kind of, again, you know, kind of getting in his turf all the time and he being very patient with me. So I made some suggestions to Mr. Stern, Leonard Stern, about if it's possible to be – what we could do maybe perhaps to be funnier since you've got Art Carney.

And then they replaced me. Right. Right. With then they replaced me. Right. Right. With the immortal Bruce Solomon. So that was, but I enjoyed doing it. I love working with Art Carney. Yeah. Oh, and, oh, yeah, tell us what Art Carney was like to work with.

Well, he, you know, he wasn't, I remembered him from way, way back when the, from the honeymooner days from the beginning, because that's what I watch with my folks. And, and also the, oh, the movie Tonto and I, or what was it? Oh, the Mazursky movie. Oh, yeah, yeah. Harry and Tonto. Yes. So good in that.

And so that's, you know, it was, for for me it was just a pleasure to be able to talk to him and hear about, you know, what it was like in the day and what he had been doing. And he was very open about all that, and I loved that. And Frank mentioned to me something we're both interested in, and that's the fact you were in the movie S.O.B. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. The Great Blake Edwards. Yeah.

Used it a couple of times. In the scene where Julie Andrews shows her breasts. Yes. I'm on set, as I recall, or else I fantasized it. And I didn't have to leer at all. It just came naturally. Yeah. She's a beautiful woman and a beautiful figure. And I always say that was my first screen kiss with Richard Mulligan.

Oh, yes. Yes, yes. Well, a couple of things. First of all, tell us about Richard Mulligan, and then we want to ask you about Blake Edwards. Because you did a fine mess with Richard Mulligan, too. Right, right. Well, Richard and I hung out together for a while. I had known his first wife, Joan Hackett.

Oh, sure. She had a big career. Yeah, and she's a terrific lady, and she had introduced me to Richard years before. And then we just kept bumping into each other, and we hung around together. He was a wonderful, wonderful guy. And so it was great fun to be able to work with him all the time. I don't think a lot of people know that his brother, Robert Mulligan, was the director of To Kill a Mockingbird. Oh, geez.

And some other good films. Yeah, yeah. Some other really good films. Yeah. No, no one ever puts that together. His dad was a cop, as I recall. They were real New York kids. And I believe Richard's dad was a cop

and he didn't talk about his brother too much just said yeah my brother directs films good films and also another guest we had on this show Howie Mandel oh yeah Howie and

Dan and you guys did a fine mess right right it was interesting And you guys did a fine mess. Right, right, right. And it was interesting. Blake, when we started that film, as I recall, I know he was weak. And he wasn't all that well. And I think there were some questions whether he should do it. And I think, what was that called?

The kissing disease? What was that thing? Mononucleosis? He had mono when we started. And so he got over it real quick. But I always think that he was really under a heavy burden during that period of time physically, trying to get the energy that came so naturally for him, like in SOB, which is my only other experience,

where he was like, he had a thousand ideas every second, you know. You had some nice moments in SOB, too. You have that nice scene after Julie is kind of traumatized, Julie Andrews' character is kind of traumatized and she takes to bed. Right. You guys have that nice scene together and you have some really funny moments with the Asian chef.

Oh, right, right. It was actually the restaurant owner. Right. Mr. I can't think of his name. Yeah, the restaurant Beverly Hills Forever. Was it Mr. Chow?

No. No. No. It was even older than that. More famous than that, more famous than that, from back in the 30s maybe even. We love Blake Edwards on this show. We've talked about The Great

Race and many of his other movies. We talk about great films. Oh yeah. And speak about a reason to leer you were in class with Jacqueline Bissett right he's got a one-track mind yes no no I can I can dig it

she was stunning stunningly beautiful and uh all those kids were new then. Rob Lowe? Right now. Andrew McCarthy. John Cusack. I don't think anybody had seen those kids until that movie. The director... Virginia Madsen, I think, is in that. Is she in that? I think so.

I didn't have any scenes with her. She shows her breasts in the movies, so I remembered. You're kidding. He would never kid about a thing like that. No, that's something important to me. Oh, nice. I'm going to ask my wife a question here. Louis Carlino was the director.

Oh, Louis. Yeah, the guy. Yeah. A great writer. A great writer. And I've gone blank on his name. He made that movie Resurrection, one with, I want to say Louise Fletcher. Was it Louise Fletcher?

Maybe it wasn't him. Maybe it was Ellen Burstyn. I think it was. I think it was. And I think the great Santini. Yeah, that was his script. Right. And he directed it, too.

That's right. But there's some other scripts that he wrote he didn't direct there was really top notch stuff and he was a wonderful person he may still be a wonderful person I haven't talked to him I wonder if he's around

after that film I lived for about 22 years on an island up in British Columbia. And Louie got a place on another island up there, and we'd go see him or he'd come see us. And it was fun. You know that movie, Gilbert, The Great Santini. Oh, yes. Robert Duvall.

Michael O'Keefe. Yeah. Yeah. Very good picture. Good Duvall. Michael O'Keefe. Yeah. Yeah. Very good picture. Good writer. Yeah. Really good. Wrote some plays, too.

Yeah. Well, this is a perfect segue for us, Stuart. Did you, and I'm curious about this, did you start as a playwright? I know you wrote some plays. I know that's kind of how you got involved with those music guys, with Smokey Roberts and Murray mcleod and those guys well i went to high school with murray in scottsdale arizona uh and uh we graduated together we were in the same class and then years later i'd written one act and smoky was in it. And he said, hey, you ought to come by our offices. McLeod, who he went to high school with, and I, there were writing songs.

So I hung around at their offices for a long time, and that led to them writing, what do you think of these lyrics? writing, what do you think of these lyrics? So it was a tremendous time because it was like mid-60s, 64, 65, 66, 67. And the music business, as I remember then, I'd done theater and I'd done film, and it was just exciting, everybody knows. But that period right in there, 65 to 69 maybe,

something like that, the the real creative excitement in the world from my point of view and from i think a lot of people's point of view was what's the newest song what's on the radio this week whether it's the beatles or dylan or the stones or that had much more uh currency than than the films the films in that specific period. It was all about who's doing what. Well, there was a hit song called Sunshine Girl. Right. That those guys did.

They called themselves The Parade. Was that the name of the group? Yeah, yeah. It was Murray and Smokey and a guy named Jerry Riopelle. Later, Jerry and I continued to write together for years and we were still real good friends. He lives out in Phoenix. Yeah, I did. I found a little I found some stuff on him. He's had a from early days of rock and roll. And he had a big, it was one of those curious things, he had a huge hit album in, I'm going to guess, 69 or 70. And in Arizona, it was the number one album for like five months, in the midst of everybody else that you can imagine putting out albums.

And he continues to play there, you know, continues to have crowds come see him. Yeah, I found his videos online. Now, Gilbert will find this interesting because this is fun trivia about you. And we had Paul Williams on the show. I've got a part for Paul. Next time you see him, tell him. Okay. We will for sure.

A sweet guy. Yeah. But there's another connection. You know, we've done so many of these shows. We've done 110 of them or something like that now. And I was saying to my wife last night, it's interesting how many of the guests start to intersect. Oh, my God, yes. I can imagine.

And Roger Nichols, who wrote We've Only Just Begun with Paul. Right. And I think the Rainbow Connection, if I'm not mistaken, if I have the right co-writer. Yes. Roger, you mean. Yeah, Roger Nichols. Yeah. And you wrote something with Roger Nichols. No, I never did.

You guys are credited on, co-credited on the song, I Can See Only You. Oh. You may have written the bridge of that. Okay. You know, he and Murray McLeod and Murray's sister had a group. I'm not going to be able to think of their name. It was real soft rock, kind of like the Carpenters.

They were on A&M Records. Circle of Friends. A Small Circle of Friends, I think. Right, that Records. Circle of Friends. A Small Circle of Friends, I think. Right, that's Small Circle of Friends. And so it was through that that we happened. Is this ringing a bell, Stuart? Yeah. Yeah.

You know that that's Roger to change those chords like that. There you go. that's Roger to change those chords like that. There you go. That's great. Thank you, Frankie. Thank you, Frank. That's Frank, our engineer. And we haven't even touched upon the Rockford files. Well, obviously goes back.

Jim and I had done oh I want to go back to remember I said I did a little like 20 second bit once on Love American Style when they maybe the second show they ever did they were just starting and I played a drunk in a jail cell right

so I go in they said you have a meeting with Jim Garner and he's doing a series called Nichols over at Warner Brothers. And so I walk in the office, and he points. There's that guy. He had seen that little bit where I bumped the drunk that bumps his head against the bars. And that's how I met Jim. bars. And that's how I met Jim. And then I ended up playing his deputy on Nichols, which is,

I think, a really good show. Frank Pearson was the head writer. Another good writer. Yeah. Dog Day Afternoon. Sure. Cool. And Luke. He was a head writer. And we had all kinds of great directors that were kind of somewhat starting out at that time. And it was a wonderful show. And it was the sponsor was Chevrolet. And I'll never forget there was the story. I heard it from Jim that the president of Chevrolet and his wife who came to network.

And they said, this show's been on the air five weeks and the sheriff's taken five bribes every week. They didn't want to take that. That was a good show, Nichols. I think it was only one season. Do you remember Nichols? Yeah. Gilbert?

He vaguely. Stewart played the deputy. Margot Kidder. Margot Kidder was in it. Really good show. Yeah, yeah. And a bunch of wonderful people. So anyway, that lasted one year, went off the air.

So about a year after it was off the air, I got a call from them. They said, we think we're talking about doing a new show. And it's called The Rockford Files. And Steve Cannell wrote this two-hour pilot script, and I did that, and they sold it. And, you know, I only acted in five a year. This is Jim Rockford. At the tone, leave your name and message. I'll get back to you. That was the answering machine

at the beginning of every Rockford file. Oh, there it is. The Rockford files would always start off with some funny answering machine message. Jim left a message. People leave a message for Jim. Right, right, right.

But as I'm sure you know, to talk about great writers, Cannell was in his heyday. The second writer behind him was David Chase, who went on to do The Sopranos. Juanita Bartlett was on the staff and she went on and did three or four series it was terrific writers but I was just starting to direct then and I went to Jim and Mita Rosenberg was the executive producer and I said I'm hoping to direct some

so maybe I wouldn't be in every week. And they said, whenever you want to, just let us know. It was the kind of thing that no one has ever done. I mean, one time they said, well, we're going to shoot something in September with Angel. And then August rolled around, and I had a chance. I was rewriting a script on a movie that was going to Macau in China, Hong Kong and Macau. And I called and said, is there any chance? They said, yeah, when you get back, call us, and then we'll do that show.

Well, that's unheard of kindness. Yeah, yeah, sounds it. I heard that James Garner talked about how he was like always getting beaten up in every episode of the Rockford Files. And he had like basically like sports injuries. His knees would have to be operated on. Well, he did. You know, he some of the injuries were old. He he played football at Oklahoma, which is curious enough, he was on the same team with Dennis Weaver.

Oh, that's so cool. Another guy you worked with, by the way. Right. They were on the same team. Then he went to Korea, and as he said, he got shot in the ass running south. He got a purple heart for that. And then, you know, all those movies he would do. He was early days doing his stunts and everything.

So by the time Rockwood came around and they found it was a great audience pleaser to see your hero get beaten up every week. Well, obviously he didn't really get beaten up, but even in faking falls or faking this, he hurt himself. And then one show he stepped, he was coming down some staircase somewhere on the back lot at Universal, and he tripped and he took a really nasty fall and the knees took it and he hurt. You know, he hurt. I find it's great trivia that you got that part kind of indirectly from Love American style.

Yeah. Yeah. Never knew that. It's weird little thing. You know, somebody sees it and next thing you know, you're heading in another direction. Do I have this right too, Stuart, that you were reluctant to get tied down to a series? To get— To get tied down to a regular series at that time.

You said there were things you wanted to do. Well, that was at the beginning of Rockford. I was starting to direct, and I was just fortunate to be talking to Jim and Mita, who let me do what I wanted to do. And they said, when you're available, call us and we'll put Angel in. So it was a dream gig that way. And I've heard you say you knew guys like Angel, too. You knew those kind of street hustlers. Yeah.

In Dallas, they were called character. Hustlers, you know. But I'm, you know, everybody knows them. You know, they're all over. What was James Garner like? Well, he was, I've said it so many times, but I'll say it again, and then I'll go from there. No one treated me better with the

exception of my father than jim did i i couldn't express all the wonderful things he did for me and just the friend that he was for me uh in a lot of uh over a long period of time. And his wife, Lois. We got to fortunately toward the, when we started doing the two-hour Rockford's kind of in the mid-90s, we had a wonderful trip. We all took together, went up to, I was living up off the coast and we met in Vancouver

and we all took the train up to Jasper and played golf and drove around. It was great. We had fun. Yeah, you worked with him so many times, and I want to recommend to our listeners, too, a TV movie you directed called The Glitter Dome for HBO, which I watched again last night. I remembered seeing it the first time. It was very good, and Lithgow and Garner. I remembered seeing it the first time. It was very good.

And Lithgow and Garner, James Garner, gave great performances. Yeah, they were wonderful together, I thought. And that had a wonderful guest, John Marley. Yeah, I was going to tell Gilbert. I think it's John Marley's last appearance. Wow. Yeah. Jack Waltz.

Oh, yes, yes. And you have another Godfather connection, Stuart, which I'll get to later. But I also want to recommend the—what is it called? The Long Summer of George Adams. Right. And I believe you mentioned Joan Hackett before. That's right, Joan Hackett. Another terrific movie. Thank you.

I'm proud of that film. It was from a novel that Jim had always loved and bought the rights to. And they, you know, no one would make it as a feature. It was kind of soft for a feature. So they did it as a TV movie. And I had the privilege of directing it. Shot it in East Texas. I think even for all of the kudos and the credit that he gets in his career, I still think in some ways he's underrated.

I agree with you. I don't think, you know, people, because he's so at ease with whatever he does, that they go, well, he's just being himself or something. But he had a great, great voice, just an endearing. great, great voice. Just an endearing, if you heard the voice, people knew who that was. Or if they didn't even identify it immediately, it was kindly to

them. They felt good about whoever that was talking. And great comic timing, obviously. Great comic timing. And I think of movies like Murphy's Romance and The Americanization of Emily. And also Victor Victoria. And Victor Victoria.

He's wonderful in that. And to support your local sheriff and support your local gunfighter or a hoot. And wasn't he the one who said, beef, it's watch for dinner? I believe he was. Yes. I don't remember that. I think he did a series of – but, you – but an underrated actor and he could do drama. And he could do comedy effortlessly.

And I don't hear him getting quite enough credit. No, I think that – I mean, who knows what. But I think that it all came – his work was so effortless that people don't take it as seriously as they could. I mean, even you go back to, you know, his other great attribute is as the rebel. He quit Warner Brothers and got the old, you'll never work in this town again from Warner's. And he went, no one would touch him for a while. He went back. He did some Broadway.

Went on the road with the Mr. Not Mr. Roberts. K-Mutiny. Uh-huh. And then he was in Sayonara. I don't know if you remember. He became good friends with Brando.

He was Brando's buddy, the young officer in Sayonara. He was wonderful. What was that story? He walked away from a contract? Well, yeah, it was like in his fourth year of Maverick, making a fast $500 a week, and they couldn't kick it up. And there was something in the contract, which is a good story. And I'm going to forget, so hopefully somebody in your offices there will know this. He got an attorney, and they found something in the contract that had been breached by Warner Brothers. Don't ask me what it was. But the attorney, whose name also escapes me, found it, and they used that to get out of the contract.

And that was when you'll never work again. Now, for Jim, it was you'll never work again. For that attorney, he was hired by Warner Brothers and later ran Warner Brothers. Wow, I never knew that story. Did you, Gil? No. I'm trying to think of the attorney's name. He's quite a guy.

He climbed Everest. Wow. He was's name. He's quite a guy. He climbed Everest. Wow. He was. He ran Warners for a while. Not Burt Fields. No, no. Now, I have to get back to another show that you had a chance to leer on, and that would be you acted with Linda Carter as Wonder Woman.

No, I directed her. You directed her. Linda Carter as Wonder Woman. Yeah, I had to do my leering from behind camera. Has anyone ever told you you were famous for leering until today, Stuart? No, no, I never, never, never, never did that. And I may go back to it. I'm going to go check it out.

And you did a TV movie, The Ballad. Oh, yeah, that's a very, well, yeah, he wrote it. He wrote it. Yeah. Now, what strikes me about that movie is people have compared it to Burt Lancaster's The Swimmer, which is a favorite movie of mine. That's weird. Yeah, I think it's something about the style. And the theme song keeps repeating itself.

You know, I have to say, I watched it. I had seen it way back in the day. And a couple of things about it. Lee Majors is terrific in the part. Yeah, yeah. And all good actors. I mean, Pat Hingle, who's a favorite of ours. Oh, wow.

He was sensational. Shows up. Tell us about Pat Hingle. I always liked him. Well, I always loved him. So that was the first time I ever met him and fortunately he really liked the part and outside of meeting him and watching him play the scene and just thinking like yes perfect you know he was a quite the gentleman you know he'd had some terrible accident well I know he was missing

a pinky I think I don't know yeah what Was it some kind of elevator shaft or some weird thing? There's a story I heard. I certainly never discussed it with him. But Agnes Moorhead played Joey Heatherton's mother. Yep. And Jimmy Dean played Lee Major's boss. And one of the Righteous Brothers, the shorter of the two. I think it's Bobby Hatfield.

Bobby Hatfield played his buddy. Right. It's an eclectic cast. Yeah. And you forgot Marvin Gaye. Well, no. I can tell you that my finest moment in life, as I look back over all these years, my finest moment in life as I look back over all these years.

I wrote the script and Aaron Spelling was partnered with Danny Thomas at the time. And they were just starting Movies of the Week. And so it was, I think it was the second one made. And so I was supposed to be

an associate producer, which basically meant stay away from everything. Don't go, don't do that. So I was like, what can I do? He said, well, why don't you do some casting for it? Great. Well, what about this character that he had been in Vietnam with, you know, the African-American guy that at the end of the film is the last friend he has left?

And he goes to see him. I said, OK. guy that at the end of the film is the last friend he has left and he goes to see him i said okay so uh aaron said okay here's the william morris casting book it's gotta come from william morris okay all right so i'm going through and i see well marvin gaye i said maybe i can meet him you know i don't know if he wants that so anyway anyway, he took the part. And we met. I was songwriting then over at A&M on La Brea. And I shared the office with Murray McLeod and Jerry Riopelle. And Marvin Gaye came over to kind of go over the dialogue to see what would be most natural for him. I'm just saying. And so we worked on the dialogue.

And then everybody kind of split. And it was Marvin and I were there. And he sat down and played the piano and sang. And I sat on the floor, my head against the wall. And I thought, it is never going to get any better than this. That's great. It's a good movie, too. It's a little like coming home.

Well, it was at the time, as I recall, they said it was the first film about Vietnam. And how it came about is pretty organic in that, you remember, I wrote it in 67, 68, and I was hanging around on the strip. And if you remember 68 in L.A., the strip was just haywire, man. It was crazy people all over the place. And I saw two Marines walking down, strutting down the street who clearly had not been in the United States for a few years. And some of the kids and the people were, they weren't making fun of them, but they were oddball.

They stuck out like crazy in the midst of what was going on in the strip. And that's what prompted the script. I thought, these are two guys that left this country before the revolution took place here and came back. And it was a different country they came back to. I think you captured it. I think you captured the feeling. It's a heartbreaking ending. Yeah.

And you were in an episode of Bewitched. Right. Right. Right. And now was this with the original Darren, Dick York? I think I did two of them because I worked with both the original and the actor that replaced the original. Yeah, Dick Sargent. Dick Sargent, yeah. Now, Dick York, I heard, had health problems for a while.

That I don't know. Well, at the for a while. That I don't know. Well, at the very end he did. I don't know. I'll tell you another. Go ahead. No, no, I was just saying, I say that only because I remember there were two different guys played that part on the two times I did the show. You know, one more thing that's interesting about Andy Crocker is that one of our favorite actors shows up, Peter Haskell from Brackenswerth. Oh, yes.

Right. Right. Yeah. Forgot about him. He was her husband or her fiancé, I think. Yeah. He's one of the – well, the girl he meets when he goes to the party. That's right. He's one of the hippies that kicks girl he meets when he goes to the party. That's right.

He's one of the hippies that kicks him out, that doesn't want his kind there. And he steals his bike, I think. Yeah. He took the triumph from him. It's very well made. Yeah, it was an exciting time for me to see it made. It's good. And as we wind, what do we got here?

As we wind down stewart i want to ask you just a couple of more things about your music career because gilbert will appreciate this and i was saying i was alluding to a godfather connection before do i have this right that al martino who played johnny fontaine covered one of your songs uh yeah there was, it was, uh, Oh God. I think it's, I can see only you. Oh, I was thinking, so we got covered. We wrote a song with a couple of other guys called day after day, which was from a, it was like a Calypso day after day. More people come to LA. Don't tell anybody the whole place slipping away.

We were getting, we made made we stopped out to write a song we said there's too many people in l.a let's drive people away so true that's true so we recorded this song and by the time i think it was 1969 the day that it hit the radio stations was the beginning of an 11 day rain back in 69 and there were earth slides and all kinds of and the song went to number one in LA and California

went to 20 in the country it was all that and I remember because I think at some point some of the executives at A&M who were involved in real estate were not thrilled with the fact that they had a hit song that was saying, move from L.A. Did you write music, too? This is, again, this is Internet research, so forgive me if it's faulty. Did you write music for the John Astin movie, Evil Roy Slade? Yes. Oh, wow.

Well, I wrote the theme song. Evil, evil, it's one of my favorite lyrics. Evil Roy Slade made fun of old people. That's a hell of a movie by the way that john aston and mickey rooney jerry bells and gary marshall that's right that's right and uh we had a great fun

there was a what's dick uh oh man he played the kind of the cowboy hero. He was a wonderful comedian. Oh, Dick Shawn. Dick Shawn, right. And his entrance, we couldn't figure out, what do we do here? Because he was so wild looking. He was all in white. And we wrote like a Beach Boys song for a Western. I was real proud of that.

I mean, with the same kind of harmonies and everything. It was a pretty funny entrance. You know that movie, don't you, Gilbert? Oh, yeah. Everybody and their brother turns up in it. We've got to get John Astin on this show. We're chasing him.

Say hello to him, too. We will if we get him. Do I have this right, too? Gilbert will appreciate this, that one of your songs was covered by gary lewis oh wow jerry lewis's son uh i don't know about that that's what they have that's what they have you down for on gary lewis and the playboys they said that your songs were covered by gary lewis and rb greaves who was famous for take a letter maria oh my god yes well that song that i just, day after day, the Calypso, that was done on TV by, of all weird people, Donovan.

Wow. And Diane Ross did it one night on a show. That got covered in that time period where it was number one in LA. So you joined after the parade had Sunshine Girl as a hit. You joined the band. Yeah, I was actually with them before that. In fact, the B-side I think of that song was one of mine. With them. I would either write with Murray or Smokey or Jerry or the four of us or two of us.

Smokey Robards is an interesting character. And Gilbert will appreciate the fact that he was in the original Planet of the Apes. Oh, great. That's right. That's right. Yeah. He lives in, is he in Arkansas now? I don't know. Nashville, one or the other. It's right. Yeah. He lives in, is he in Arkansas now, I think? I don't know.

Or Nashville, one or the other. That's the last I heard. What an interesting group of characters. Yeah. Murray's still around. Murray's married to Stephanie Edwards, who always does the Rose Parade. Yeah. As for years.

Yeah, he's in a lot of stuff, Murray McLeod. Yeah, he was doing a lot of acting then himself.Leod. Yeah. He was doing a lot of acting then himself. Some big John Wayne film, I forget the name of it. Anyway. Yeah. Well, I also want to tell our listeners as we wind down, I want to tell them to look for you and Griffin Dunn

in this terrific independent film called The Discoverers. Thank you. Yeah, and he's wonderful in it. I mean, he's really, really funny. And the girl that plays his daughter is also. The whole cast is good. Stuart, because Gilbert hasn't seen it, Stuart plays a Lewis and Clark reenactor.

Yeah. One of these guys that goes into the woods. But he's mourning the loss of his wife. And it's a lot of shades to that performance. And it's funny and sad. I really liked it. Good, good. He's a good director.

I'm just going blank as I want to do. Is it Schwartz, I think? Yes, yes. Now, you were in another movie that Frank and I have discussed on this show a few times, The Big Bus. Oh, yeah. That's got a cast. Written by Fred Freeman and Larry Cohen, who wrote Start the Revolution Without Me and Spies Like Us.

And Big Bus, I'm crazy about that. With Stalkerning yeah joseph bologna joseph bologna uh and richard mulligan and sally kellerman yes renee arbojonois right oh yes gotta get him for the show and uh and uh oh god uh sereno de bergerac. Oh, José Ferrer? José Ferrer, who was in like an iron lung, and he always had a date with him in the iron lung. What do you remember about directing a show called The Texas Wheelers with an actor named Jack Elam? Well, I tell you what I remember. I was looking through the lens. I think that may have been the second thing I ever directed. But I've obviously been around, and I was watching the kids play,

and I looked, and I was watching Gary Busey, who was new. And I thought, man, this guy is really good. He can really act. And, and he, uh, you know, he, he should have had a different career than he's had because he was capable of big time work, you know, as he, as he showed, you know, when he played Buddy Holly, but, uh, he, he had the stuff, you know, he was good. That's what i remember you directed one of gill's favorite actors too jack warden oh yeah that was great oh tell me tell us about what crazy like a fox tell us about jack ward i i kind of worked with him twice but we never had a scene together in the Problem Child movies. Oh, well, what I was fascinated to hear about is how he came out of the war,

G.I., G.I. Bill, and he went to work first in theater in Dallas and Fort Worth, which is obviously where I came from, and he worked at the little theaters there, and then he worked at some other little bigger theaters, and he worked his way to New York. So he came up through that odd circuit, which is local theaters around the country, which not a whole lot of people stay in. Usually people start in that, and then they go new york or they go to la but jack was with that a few years before he came to new york and uh so his chops were in good shape he's great humor great terrific actor and i heard um right now he could do anything. And I heard Jack Elam was a war hero, I think. I don't know anything.

Jack Elam, yeah. Yeah. I think that's right. Is that right? That was a short-lived show with Mark Hamill, Gary Busey, and Jack Elam. Right. Texas Wheelers. And tell us how Jose Ferrer was in person.

Well, he was I'd have to tell this story, but I was his brother in the big bus. So I'd go talk to him. So one day, as I recall, it was it was either

Christmas Eve or something. He said, I lived on Beverly Glen. Can you take this? It was a present. It was wrapped up. A present. Take this and drop it. He gave me the address. I'm going to

say birthday because I guess that's what it was. Christmas. I drove over to this house in Beverly Hills and it was Rosemary Clooney. And I realized, oh, man, who are you? What is this? So, well, Mr. Farrar said to drop this off here.

So I gave her her birthday present from Jose. That's what I remember. That's a nice story. Yeah. What are you working on? We're going to wrap it up, Stuart. What are you working on now? Do you have a project about Jack Ruby?

Oh, yeah, I do. I'll talk about it. But right this minute, I'm doing on Golden Pond. Wow. Outstage. Cool. Doing it with Gretchen Corbett, who was also in Rockford Files, played his attorney. I remember her.

And she came out. She lives in Portland, been doing rep for a few years. So she came out. We opened up last week and had a very good opening. And we've got a few more weeks to go. I've written a film that's going to be made, I can't believe it, shot here. I can't tell you who the stars are. I was hoping I'd get a call before your call, but it'll probably be next.

But a couple of superb actors and a young director named Christopher Martini. And a young director named Christopher Martini. And it stars Max Martini as one of the stars. His older brother who was in 13 Hours and Pacific Rim and was in the series The Unit. Okay. Yeah. And so anyway, that's hopefully we will start shooting the end of september or the first week of october and the jack ruby is a musical a musical but it's really it's not i mean jack ruby's in it right but it's really about candy

bar oh it's about the the carousel uh. That's where I first learned to leer, by the way. Oh, really? You were in the actual carousel in Dallas. Well, I was a kid then, you know, and but that sign would be out front, you know, with candy in her outfit. And so anybody that was over 11 years old, you know, kind of like she was the hottest thing going. And I followed her career and I got to meet her finally in L.A. way back in probably the late 70s. Wow. Yeah, the late 70s. And so it's about her story, which is a fantastic story. And Ruby discovered her.

And they were always friends right up until a couple of weeks. She was in prison, and he visited her. And then two weeks later, he went and killed Oswald. Right. And so the feds, all of them, you name a branch, they questioned her and questioned her. I was just going to ask you if she was questioned by the warren commission but no no and uh anyway don't get me going upon that but uh she's a wonderful character a wonderful uh outrageous human being that uh is part of texas lore and uh pretty crazy lady you You've done everything, Stuart.

You've worked with everybody. Well, a lot of good people. I know that. I'm looking forward to – I like writing now, and I hope I continue to do that. Well, we appreciate your time. We appreciate you being a part of this. Thank you. We're trying to piece together the story of show business

in the 20th century. Well, toward the end of it, I'm in there. Thanks for telling your story. We appreciate it. And I gotta ask you one dopey trivia question, because I've seen the movie so many times.

Can you tell us the, because I've seen the movie so many times. Can you tell us the, because I remember this, the name of the gunslinger whose gun is in Death Wish at the gun club? The name of the, you mean

who it had belonged to? Yes. No. Oh, okay. You tell Charles Bronson, well, this gun belonged to a gunslinger named Candy Dan. Oh, really? Yeah. You stumped Stuart Margulies. Candy Dan. Yeah. Can't stand. And I remember your scene when Bronson's leaving for the airport,

and you go, are you going to check this? And he goes, yeah. And you put in this, like, little box. Oh, yeah, that I remember. And then when Bronson gets home, he opens it, and there's, like like a cowboy gun. A weapon. Yeah.

A weapon. Like I say, my memory goes to that night when I went to see the premiere, and this famous critic was on the phone. Quoting him exactly. I'm always taken out of every theater in the country. I love that. You're also in one of my favorite movies in the world, and that's Days of Heaven. Yeah, that's one of my favorite movies.

And that's the only, I would say probably the only genius I ever met in my whole time that is Terry Malick. What was he like? I mean, he's a legendary. Well, he was a recluse for years, and then he made a comeback. He's, uh, he was a he's a brilliant man. I mean, I don't know if you know the history of

he studied agriculture and economics at Harvard and went to South America and worked for the government and then came back and at the AFI, American Film Institute, and then made Badlands, which is my favorite films ever. And I saw that as screening. I thought, I've got to meet this guy.

And we met and hit it off. And I had a wonderful time up in Alberta doing that movie. If you haven't seen that movie, Gilbert, it's a masterpiece with Richard Gere and Brooke Adams. To look at it. Oh, and Nestor Alamandros. Nestor Alamandros, right. And Sam Shepard. Yeah.

Everything about it's great. And to our listeners, try to see it on a big screen. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So we're going to. Thank you, Gilbert. Oh, wait. Oh, I just So we're going to. Thank you, Gilbert.

Oh, wait. Oh, I just have to say the ending. Thank you, Stuart. Sure. And okay. I'm Gilbert Gottfried. This has been Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast with my co-host, Frank Santopadre. And we have been talking to the very obscenely leering. He's just a good actor. He was convincing. Stuart Margolin. Acting naturally.

Yes. And to our listeners, find the ballad of Andy Crocker and also The Discoverers. Thank you. Thanks, Stuart. Thank you. Thanks, Stuart. Thank you, Stuart Margolin. A treat for us.