Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - 181. Joyce Van Patten

Episode Date: November 13, 2017

Gilbert and Frank welcome veteran stage, film and television actress Joyce Van Patten, who shares fond memories of working with some of Hollywood's most iconic figures, including Lucille Ball, Jack Benny, Danny Kaye, Dean Martin and Peter Sellers (to name a few). Also, Joyce dines with Vincent Price, tours with Tony Randall, treads the boards with Al Shean and remembers the late, great Herb Edelman. PLUS: Mr. Big converts! Rod Serling stops by the set! Joyce praises Martin Balsam! Andy Griffith hates on Jack Lord! And Bob Denver adopts a monkey!  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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five must be 19 or older Ontario. And this is very responsibly. If you are someone, you know, has concerns about gambling, visit connects Ontario.ca. Hi, this is Gilbert Gottfried and this is Gilbert Gottfried's amazing colossal podcast. This is Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast. I'm here with my co-host, Frank Santopadre.

And once again, we're recording at Nutmeg with our engineer, Frank Verderosa. Our guest this week is one of the most prolific, visible, and respected actresses of the last seven decades, and a member of a prominent showbiz family with dozens, and I mean dozens, of film and TV roles to her credit. You've seen her in classic television shows like Gunsmoke, The Untouchables, The Andy Griffith Show, The Danny Kaye Show, Columbo, Love American Style, The Odd Couple, The Sopranos, Desperate Housewives, Boardwalk Empire, and even the original Outer Limits and Twilight Zone. She's also appeared in well-known films such as I Love You, Alice B. Toklas, The Bad News Bears, Mame, Mickey and Nicky,

The Falcon and the Snowman, St. Elmo's Fire, Blind Date, and Monkey Shines, and in hit stage plays like I Oughta Be in Pictures, Same Time Next Year, Jake's Women, and Brighton Beach Memoirs, in a long and extremely active performing career that began even before her first birthday, she's worked with Jack Benny, Dean Douglas, Milton Berle, Brock Hudson, Elizabeth Taylor, and Peter Sellers, as well as former podcast guests Lee Grant, Matthew Broderick, Bruce Stern, Jessica Walter, Ron Liebman, and Dick Van Dyke, just to name a few. We are pleased to welcome to the show an actor's actor and a woman who once auditioned for the role of Bonnie Blue Butler in 1939's Gone with the Wind, the versatile and multi-talented Joyce Van Patten. What an introduction. Wow, I did all that, huh? Did you think you had a career like that?

No, but I did. I kind of have a dim memory of getting on a phony horse over a 20th Century Fox when they had studios in New York and trying to get into Gone with the Wind. I have a kind of memory of that. Well, you had to be five. I was something. Five or six. I was like a child. I was definitely a child. And I never thought the girl that did it was very good.

So you stayed bitter about it all these years. I was still bitter all these years later. Oh, that's great. You're one of those guests where I was thinking of throwing away the introduction and saying, just name a TV show or movie, and chances are she was there. It's staggering. Well, you know, really, when I first went to California, I had done a lot of stage work. Then I went to Los Angeles in the 60s. It was very easy to get on television.

It's become very complicated now. There are so many decisions and people. But then they were just, because we came from Broadway. That was a new thing. They were excited that all those New York actors came at that particular time in the 60s and wanted to do television. That was big. That was exciting. And you would just get jobs now.

It's so complicated. I don't know how anybody can stand it. You just went from show to show. If a director liked you, it was either you or somebody else. Do you know what I mean? It wasn't like 12 women all piled into an audition. It was all simpler. Maybe because television was still relatively new.

Yeah, it was relatively new, and it was exciting. You know, it was all different. Before I forget to ask, Frank brought it up, and this is a name that's popped up on the show. Only on this podcast. A bunch of times. Yeah. You worked on stage with Al Sheen.

And for those people who don't know Al Sheen, first, shame on you. Why are you listening to this show? He was the uncle of the Marx Brothers. You know, I never knew that. I never knew. I know that I was in a play with him. You know, I never knew that. I never knew. I know that I was in a play with him. Then again, I was a kid. It was called Popsie.

I know that it was a flop. And that was like the thing in our family. Popsie was a flopsy. It was the thing. And I remember that. And do you remember the actress? She made herself Jan Sterling, but she was Jane Sterling then. Yeah, sure.

Yeah, she was like the ingenue in it. And I remember, things you remember, I remember she would bring me lollipops to the theater. But it wasn't a very long run. But I did not know that. I knew that it was Gallagher and Sheen, right? They were a family. Sure, sure. Absolutely, Mr. Gallagher.

Positively, Mr. Sheen. Was that the Sunshine Boys? Was that what he was using or not? A little bit. A mixture of them and Smith and Dale. Smith and Dale. Yeah. Right, right, right.

Yeah. Yeah, so that's good. I mean, I'm glad I know that now. But you remember? I did meet Garcho Marx, you know. You did? Yes, and I don't remember why, but he was very nice. You know what I mean?

He was very accessible. So he was going with a girl named Erin Fleming. Oh, she's come up on this show many times. Oh, yeah. It's a sad story. I know, yeah. I knew Erin Fleming because she did a play at Mark Taper Forum, you know, in Los Angeles. They would do new theater.

It's still going on. They have the Amundsen. They have the Mark Taper. They have the Amundsen, they have the Mark Taper, they have the whatever. We were doing a new play, and she had a scene. She was playing, you know, like a very attractive woman opposite, I guess, the man that was supposed to be my husband. I don't remember the plot complication.

But she took off her shirt and showed her breasts. I mean, that was sort of new. It was like 1960. Well, no, it was sort of new. It was like 1960. Well, no, it was in the 70s. She did that. Yeah, this was Groucho and his lady years. Yeah, and he came around. He was there.

He was very, he was sweet, it seemed like to me. She came to a rather bad end, sad. Horrible. Yeah. Horrible end. I don't know the real behind story but she killed herself she did yeah she was homeless for a while yeah and then she shot herself you know they were after the family hated her the marx brothers family and you know they hated oh yeah they were after her they didn't

want her to get anything that's the story that i well and there was a famous trial was there oh see i didn't know that i missed the trial yeah yeah Yeah, yeah, yeah. You also worked with Kirk Douglas. Yeah, but I— You and Dick, your brother? Yeah, we were in a show called The Wind is 90. That must have been right near the end of World War II. That was 1945. Yeah, so it would have been when the war ended, actually.

And Kirk Douglas was in it and went right to Hollywood and became a star, actually almost immediately after the play. And the other man that was in it was Wendell Corey. Do a star, actually almost immediately after the play. And the other man that was in it was Wendell Corey. Do you remember him? He went also to Hollywood. He didn't become quite the star that Kirk became, but the two of them were from that period. What do you remember about Kirk Douglas back then? He was nice. I was 11. Oh, you weren't judging anyone too much at 11. You know, and he was very nice to me. And he wrote in my autograph book, you know, I can't wait to see you when you grow up.

You know, some cute thing. How nice. You also, I love doing this research, Joyce, because I find some really good stuff. I mean, your theater credits. You work with Shirley Booth, for God's sake. Yeah, more than once. Yeah. And a young Lou Gossett.

Yeah, Louie. Yeah, and you did Hole in the Head with our friend Lee Grant. Right. And Connie Sawyer. Oh, my pal. Who's still alive. 106. Wow.

Can you believe that? 106. She's at the home. We've got to get her. Yeah, well, let's not rush on that. She's at the home and she's just full of energy and she has a little cottage. She in Los Angeles? In Los Angeles.

The home in Los Angeles. You know what I mean when I say the home. And you acted a bunch of times. Another name that pops up only on this show and that's Herb Edelman. I worked with Herb a lotman. Oh, a lot. Great Herb Edelman.

Yeah, I did a series. I worked with Herb a lot. We did a series together. We did Alice B. Toklas together. You sure did. We did a play at that same place that I was on the rock table. We did Valpone together. We worked together a lot.

And what do you remember about Herb? I loved Herb. What a funny man. He was very, very funny. He never seemed to take anything that seriously. You know, we'd go through, you know, what it's like putting a television show on, all that stuff. He went with everything. He was good. And he was just such so funny, too. Then he wound up being Murray the Cop's boyfriend, right? The Arthur's boyfriend on The Golden Girls. And he was great. Right. And also Murray the Cop in The Odd Couple. Oh, yeah. Yeah. He was always and he was great right and also murray the cop in the odd couple oh yeah yeah he was always he was great loved him tell us a little bit about the good guy since you

brought it up with bob denver yeah well the good guys was uh i can't remember leonard leonard stern leonard stern was the producer and we did the pilot this is just a nice story about bob denver really and of course it was traditional to fire somebody after the pilot, and I was going to be fired. And I was very upset about it, of course, but I knew that it was going to happen. And Bob found out about it and refused to do the show if I wasn't on. How nice. Wow.

Isn't that something? He was sweet. He's a sweet guy. Leonard Stern told a story about his fan base, about Bob Denver's fan base coming to the tapings. Oh. There was a smell of. It was more than the fan base. It was also he was married.

Bob was married to a girl named Butch. She was like a hippie, you know, and she would wear funny jeans and like long stuff in that day. And she had two beautiful Hawaiian children from a former marriage. So they would come. They would stand. You know, it was an audience show on Friday nights. She would stand over there with the two beautiful children and looking, you know, kind of very hippie-ish. And their monkey.

They had a monkey. They had a monkey. God bless them. Can you imagine? That sounds like a Bob Jenner sitcom. Can you imagine? Nobody looked at the show. They were all over there looking,

what's the monkey doing now? Henry, yeah. So that's really all. And it was a time, I don't think, they didn't know how to write for a woman. They always had me coming from the grocery store. And I was like, well, why don't you have me doing something interesting?

It was a boy's show. It was a boy's show. Did they have you in aprons a lot of time? Yeah. They didn't know what to do. Remember the good guys? They opened a diner together. Herb Edelman.

And I think we ran about two years. I don't think we ran longer. I think so. I think you added Alan Hale Jr. in the second year. Yes, they did. And also the other one, Jim Backus. Jim Backus, because the ratings were flagging. And you were married to another name that comes up on this show, Martin Balsam. I was married to him, and we have a daughter, Talia Balsam.

Yes, Talia Balsam, who's a very busy actress. Yes, and lovely, lovely. Yeah, Marty was such a, Marty Balsam was such a wonderful actor. Oh, we talk about him on this show. Oh, such a wonderful actor. And I tell you, this thing is driving me crazy with people not knowing who anybody is anymore.

Well, Joyce and I talked on the phone yesterday and I was explaining that, obviously, she's a friend of Lee's, Lee Grant, and also Ron Liebman and Jessica. Right. And Ron and Jessica were here and they said to of Lee's, Lee Grant, and also Ron Liebman and Jessica. Right. And Ron and Jessica were here, and they said to Gilbert and I, you know, please keep doing this because it's important to keep these names alive. And so Joyce and I were talking on the phone, and she said it's so sad that people don't remember a lot of these great people.

And that's kind of what we're trying to do here. And also not interested enough to look it up. It's so easy now. Google them. You know what I mean? Of course. You can find so much out. More than ever. We were at a table recently.

We were having dinner, Frank and I and Gino. And we mentioned to this girl, Groucho Marx, she had no idea. She was all of 24. We should say in her defense. Yeah, but my feeling is I could be wrong about this. I could be wrong about this. We all knew. I mean, you're younger than I am, but I mean, we all knew who the silent screen stars were.

I mean, we all knew who the people were. Yes. But there's no interest. I don't know. No, it's true. It's true. While I nudge Gilbert awake, listen to these words from our sponsor. Were you speaking?

Gilbert and Frank, we can't live without you. Gilbert and Frank, we can't live without you. Gilbert and Frank, we can't live without you. And now we return to the show. Getting back to Martin Balsam, he was one of those actors that made it look easy, like there was no effort involved. Absolutely. He was also such a nice guy, even though we didn't stay married. He was always so generous about other actors. When I met him, I was, you know, like, I don't know, 16 years younger. I was quite a lot younger than he. And I was like, you know, jealous of a lot of people

that were working. He did not have a, he did not have that in him at all. It was like every, you know, they know that guy is great. You know, Jack Warden is great. I'm not upset that Jack Warden got the job that I wanted because Jack Warden's, he had that kindness in him. That was nice. And you know, Lee Grant has that too. That's a lovely thing. Yeah, Lee was great to us. And for those who might not know Martin Bolton, he was abrogased in Psycho.

12 Angry Men, 1,000 Clowns, and all the President's Men, and On the Waterfront, and Catch 22. 5,000 Clowns as he won the Oscars. Absolutely. Oh, and after the Fox. And Catch-22 and Cape Fear. He was hysterical.

Yeah, very funny. Funny in comedies. Yes, yes. And a stage actor as well. Yeah, Roxboy, local boy. Yep, local boy. True enough. Yep, yep, yep.

And you worked another name only Frank and I would get totally excited about. I know where you're going. You worked with Hunt's Hall. Yeah, I did. What's the name of that movie? Oh, my God. I have it in my notes. It's the something Manchu Eagle Murder Mystery.

It was the Manchu Eagle Caper Murder Mystery. Gabe Dell. Yeah, Gabe Dell was in it. And Jackie Coogan. Oh, my God. Every child actor. Why were we all in that movie? And Jackie Coogan. Oh, my God. Every child actor. Why were we all in that movie? And Sorrel Book.

Oh, yes. I loved Sorrel Book. Oh, he was wonderful. I loved, I forgot all about Sorrel Book. Wait. Yeah, that was a movie. Boss Hogg. We brought him up on this show.

Did you? Gilbert loves Bye Bye Braverman. Well, that's a good movie. Isn't Ronnie in that? Isn't Lee Mack? George Siegel. George Siegel. George Segal. Yeah.

Yeah. But Jessica Walter. Oh, she's in it. That's right. Oh, that's right. And the only Jewish Bond villain. Joseph Wiseman. Yes.

He played Dr. No. He was good. Although I must say a fan wrote to us and said, Gilbert is mistaken. There is a second Jewish Bond villain. Who? And it's somebody that Joyce worked with. But it doesn't really count in the sense that he converted to Judaism.

Oh, okay. Yafit Kodo. That's right. Yafit Kodo is Jewish now? He became Jewish. Yes, he did. He converted to Judaism. He doesn't have enough problems?

He wasn't bad enough being black. He had to be a Jew. Well, as long as he's happy. Did he get married? I don't know. We have to have Yafit Kodo on the show. I'd kill to have him here. He did a movie with Joyce Colbone, a Larry Cohen movie.

It's a very disturbing movie. Yeah, it is. It's good, though. I thought it was kind of good. Yafit Kodo. I was just going to say something about him, but now it's left my mind. That's all right.

We'll go back to Hans Hall and Gabe Dell. Yes. I think Gabe Dell played my husband. He was a private eye. Yeah, I think he was. And what do you remember about Hans Hall? Joyce shaking her head and shrugging. So he didn't make an impression.

But when I did Dead End at the Amundsen, it was a play originally, and the Dead End kids were in it, and that's why they all went to Hollywood. Okay. So now the Dead End kids, probably most of them dead, had children. And those children came to see the play. And they're not children, of course. They're middle-aged men, middle-aged to old men. They came.

I don't remember whether Hunts Hall had a son there. Wow. I don't remember, but they all came to see the play. Wow. Do you remember Stanley Clements and the Bowery Boys? He was a lesser. Yeah, but Stanley Clements also played a jockey in some movie. He married Gloria Graham. Yes. But he used to chase

my mother home from school and try to kiss her when they were grades. And my grandmother hit him with a broom. I just want to throw that out there. Well, it's good. It's a good story. It's a good story. And getting back to your daughter, Talia. Yeah. She, I guess at one point in her life

must have been hated by every single woman on the planet. Yes, I guess so. Yeah. But not for long. She married George Clooney. She did. We all went down. Our friend, Richard Kine.

Richard Kine. We all went down together to Las Vegas. Yeah. Hate to bring that up now. Yeah. And they got married. They got married. We spent the weekend Las Vegas. Yeah. Hate to bring that up now. Yeah. And they got married. They got married. We spent the weekend in Vegas.

And I'm sorry that they didn't stay married, but they both went their own way. I think George has been amazing how he's handled his being famous. I think he's done all the right stuff. Don't you? Yes. He used his celebrity. Yes, he's an his being famous. I think he's done all the right stuff, don't you? Yes. He used his celebrity in such – He used his celebrity in the greatest possible way. And he's spoken about the marriage,

and he really takes the blame on himself that he just wasn't ready, and he just, you know, didn't give it a chance. Yeah, I guess that's what it is. Yeah, they were, I guess, young. Pretty young. Pretty young. But it was a fun marriage in that it was two showbiz families. Yes.

Two famous showbiz families. It's true. Kind of joining forces. But I would marry George Clooney. Yeah, yeah. Why not? You're spoken for. Yes.

She's got a cute husband now. Oh, she's married to John Slattery from Mad Men now. She always had those. I never, when I was dating and stuff, I never particularly had great looking guys. I always wanted funny guys. Oh, it's your mistake, Joyce. She always dated these great looking men. Oh, yeah.

And so now she's married to one. I'd like to also point out before it's forgotten on the show that Joyce is half Italian. Yes. Yeah. I want to get that in there. God damn it. Because you're always claiming ownership. Yeah.

You'll have to find. There has to be a Jew somewhere in your past. Got to be, right? Got to be. Got to be. She's also a New Yorker, like 90% of our guests. I actually think that is the same thing almost. If you grow up in new york

you know about being jewish do you know what i mean i feel partly jewish yeah no i think it's i think it's part of of living here of growing up here well uh tony orlando's father is very he grew up i guess he grew up in new york manhattan yes in the Garment District. Yeah. And his father is buried in a Jewish cemetery. Tony Orlando's father? Yeah. You like that? Now tell us what you were telling us outside, just a little backstory about the family and about your mom and how she was a stage mom. She was a stage mom. By the time, you know, when Dickie was born, my mother's whole family, they went to live in Woodhaven at the time. And they signed a petition to get the Italians off the block.

But they didn't get them off the block. They stayed there. So there was a lot of that. I would have signed that. I know. I'm sure you would have. And then she met my father, who was not an Italian. He was a beautiful blonde.

And, you know, there was the whole thing. They got married. And she had this beautiful baby boy. And Dickie was absolutely the most adorable child. And she decided that he was going to be a model. And he was modeling very, very young. And then he was doing little theater. You know, they used to do plays that had a lot of people in them because it didn't cost a lot of money. Most of the plays that I did and that Dickie did had something like,

you know, it would be nothing to have 28 people in a play, you know, or 30 people. There were always a lot of kids in them. And so he was doing that. He did radio. So by the time I came along, I was like, that's what I was going to do. So there's pictures of me in, you know, baby sweaters, modeling baby sweaters. You modeled for the Sears catalog when you were like five months old or six months old or some crazy thing? It's amazing. It's sort of interesting. And your brother Dick also has a ridiculous resume. Amazing.

He acted with the Luntz. Yeah. Yeah. For five years. Can you imagine? Yeah. He's a billions Luntz. Yeah. Yeah. For five years. Can you imagine? Yeah. He's in billions of movies and TV shows. Oh, everything.

And he was also, he seemed to be in with that crowd of Mel Brooks. Mel, yeah, he's close with Mel. And Don Rickles and all those people. And who's the guy that did Get Smart? Don Adams. Oh, yes. So he was in that group. And Don Adams had a brother.

Yeah. Oh, Yarmie. Dick Yarmie. You're good. Yeah. Yarmie's army. Yeah. They all gambled.

I mean, that was the, I mean, I don't think Mel. Yeah, Mel does too. I'm wrong. And that was the bonding thing. I think they all had that. I did a little research and found out Dick liked the horses. Oh, no, that was his. He was very much more interested in that and poker than he really was in acting. But he beat out Brando for a part. He beat out young Brando, I found. Really? In my research. In what? I'll have to double check. No, I think what, if I may, sir. Okay, correct me.

check on that. No, I think what, if I may, sir. Okay, correct me. I think what happened is when he did I Remember Mama on television. Right. Brando had played that on Broadway. Is that what it was? Well, I don't know. Okay. That's the connection. I don't think he ever, but maybe he did. I'll double that. But in other words, he played Nels, which was the character that Brando had played on the stage. I did find a story he told about acting with Tallulah Bankhead, her asking him to come into a room to read a line, and she was naked. She was stark naked. Oh, he was a good storyteller.

He was a great raconteur. Oh, I wish we had him. I wish we had him on the show. Yeah, oh, you'd have loved it. Yeah, he really was great. And you worked with Jack Benny. It was so thrilling to me, I can't tell you. I was pretty thrilled when I went to Hollywood because it was in the 60s and the studios were still there.

It was still MGM. And when I went to work there, there was Andy Hardy's old house. You know, they had the back lots. Wow, still on the lot. And they had all of the clothes. I wore a lot of Eleanor Parker. Do you remember her? Sure. I used to wear a all of the clothes. I wore a lot of Eleanor Parker. Do you remember her? I used to wear a lot of her clothes if I was working at MGM. And they had

the studios filled with those women that would make these things. I mean, it was so great to just see that part of it, you know, to me, because the movies were like, you know, amazing. And then to work with people like Gladys Cooper. Do you remember her at all? Yes. Well, you guys remember. She was in everything at MGM. She was the character. To work with those people, it was like a dream come true, really. And what was Benny like? So nice.

Oh, God, he was so nice. Did you tell me on the phone he had a little thing for you? I felt he had a little crush on me. I don't want you to feel that he did anything he shouldn't have done. Oh, that's great. But he was just so sweet to me, and he kind of could sit with me at lunch and everything. He was just darling. And here's a nice story about Milton Berle.

Oh. I know. That's why I say you don't get a lot of those. I was leading into Milton Berle. Well, we were going to do it. It was supposed to be done live. Yes. And Milton said, I don't trust myself, and I don't want to do anything to hurt Jack.

He didn't trust himself not to be piggy. Not to be what? Piggy. Piggy. Oh. You know, to do stuff that would make Jack not happy. Well, this was an episode of the Benny Show where Uncle Miltie was being adopted by you and Jack Benny. Yeah, yeah.

I'm trying to wrap my mind around this. But I thought that was sweet. I mean, that's a nice story. He was afraid he would over... He respected Jack Benny, I guess is the story. And he didn't want to do anything that would seem disrespectful to him. And it's funny, Benny is one of those people I've yet

to hear a bad thing about. No, there's nothing bad no there's nothing bad the writers all liked him that's classic the writers hate the right the writers hate the comment they like annie k very much we we can't touch upon milton burrell without touching upon what he's best known for. Which? He's supposed to be extremely well-endowed. He would make Donald Trump jealous. Yes. Did you ever actually walk in the trash? I have no information on that at all.

But he was certainly, you know, he was married to a girl named Joyce. So that was always like, that was his thing with me. I was married to a girl named Joyce, but he never made any kind of moves on me. And never showed you. I have to tell you, people didn't make, you know, you always hear those stories about, and then they got me on the couch. That never happened to me. Well, it did happen to me once.

Do you remember a character actor named Bill Conrad, William Conrad? Of course, Cannon. Sure. Yeah, he just made phone calls to me late at night. Oh, my. With that deep voice of his? But that was depressing that that's the one guy. But at least he had that great radio voice.

That Rocky and Bullwinkle voice. He was Matt Dillon on the radio. At least he had that great radio voice. That Rocky and Bullwinkle voice. He was Matt Dillon on the radio. So he would call up with dirty phone calls? He had a show called Cannon. Cannon, yeah, he was a cop. Just while I was on the show.

I mean, he didn't stalk me or anything. But while I was on the show, I guess he had a couple of drinks, whatever, and then he called me. While I was on the show, I guess he had a couple of drinks, whatever, and then he called me. That's my only time that that ever seemed to be a problem. And now here's something, whenever I ask actresses this, and I always scream bullshit. You worked with Elvis Presley. Yes. The Trouble with Girls.

Every single actress claims they didn't have sex with Elvis Presley. I definitely did not have sex with Elvis Presley. Yes. The trouble with girls. Every single actress claims they didn't have sex with Elvis Presley. I definitely did not have sex with Elvis Presley. No. All I can say about Elvis Presley. You should have remembered that. Yes, I would have remembered that. Is that I can only say what everybody says about him. He was very polite and nice. Also, I didn't really have anything to do with him.

You know, it was one of those, it was like a Chautauqua, which was, and I was playing Gertrude Ederle, you know, the woman that swam the English Channel. So, I didn't really have anything to do with him. So, I don't, I can't, I have no reports on him at all, except that he was polite and

nice. That's nice. Yeah, I heard like Elvis used to call everybody sir or ma'am yeah martindale's wife dated him oh that's right we had her on the show that's right and so you're still denying you i'm still denying let's pull another name off that list uh because you were just talking about how the writers loved benny but one of the one of the guys the writers didn't always have a fondness for was danny yeah you know i'm glad you brought up danny because the truth i when i think about my career coming

into comedy is paul mazerski oh wow because he was doing this is not there was no danny k show Oh, wow. first set would be stuff that you set and then the second thing that you know what that is and then the audience would give you ideas so i went and i auditioned and i got it so it was paul mazerski me larry tucker who became paul's alan sues and a girl named liz shaw who was very beautiful and i never really saw her after this so we did. I'm going to say we did it for about three months. I was working in a nightclub, which is interesting to do. And then that was the end of that. And then Paul and Larry got on The Danny Kaye Show. And The Danny Kaye Show was on for—this is a good actor story.

It was on for about a year. Getting to the end of the first year, he could not find a woman that he liked. They talked him into having me. I did, like, the last show of that season or whatever he liked me i was going to be on the danny k show and then i spent three years on the danny k show and that was really great he was always very he would he was nice to me but he wasn't always nice to everybody i know we heard some bad stories from previous guests yeah yeah men yeah yeah i think that he was nice to me in fact in tony curtis's book well he says he was at a party and danny was being very rude to him and very insulting and tony said he looked at tanny in the eyes at one point and said,

fuck you, Danny. We had a couple of people here, Jamie Farr, Bernie Coppell, a couple of people that didn't enjoy their experience of working with him. Yeah, he's had some. Oh, no, no, he was difficult. He didn't talk a lot to you. I remember once he had a dressing room that was like you could eat there. And one day he had Roddy McDowell, who was a guest on the show, and myself and Harvey, and some man who I don't remember that was from the TV guy.

And nobody talked. I remember the sweat was like dripping down my chest. You know that feeling? Yeah. Nobody knew what conversation to have. And if we, if somebody and Roddy, who was terrific, you know, you start something and he would be, it would be, he just wouldn't pick it up. It was the most awful lunch I've ever had. Roddy seemed like a nice guy. Oh, he was adorable. Another raconteur. He was a raconteur and he loved people and he loved to entertain. And you know, he was adorable. Another raconteur. He was a raconteur, and he loved people, and he loved to entertain.

And, you know, he was— We hear lovely things about him. Harvey Korman. You and Harvey Korman were the repertory in that repertory company. Howie Morris, too? No, the other one. Howie I knew, of course, and he was on it. Well, Conway—

Tim. Yeah, it was the first time that Korman and Conway— Yeah, yeah. No, those were great years for me. I have to tell you, great years for me. I worked with Art Carney. They were just wonderful people on that show. Vincent Price, Art Carney, Satchmo, Don Knotts, Liberace,

Gene Kelly, George Burns, Peter Ustinov. What a... That's not bad. Insane. Yeah, that was good. That was a wonderful time for me. But here's the payoff. So then the show is over,

and Paul and Larry write a movie called... I Love You, Alice B. Toklas. I Love You, Alice B. Tok then the show is over. And Paul and Larry write a movie called? I Love You, Alice B. Toklas. I Love You, Alice B. Toklas. They're desperate. I Love You, Alice B. Toklas. And so does Herbie Fine. I Love You, Alice B. Toklas. And I Want to Change Your Name to Mine.

Also Herbie Fine. Oh, Herbie Fine. He's Herbie Fine in the movie. No, so they wrote the character named Joyce. And they were desperately frightened for me to meet Peter Sellers because he was such a difficult man. And they got me so nervous. Be careful of what you wear. Don't wear purple. You can't wear purple.

Be careful. They had me so nervous. He was making another movie at Columbia, and I met them there. I went up to the dressing room. Of course, they waited downstairs for me. I went in, I talked to him for, I'm going to say 10 minutes. I don't remember it being particularly difficult. And, uh, I left and then the boys went up. They said, wait, wait here, wait here. I waited and they came down and they said, the job's yours. I never read with him. Wow.

Nothing. You're very funny in that movie. Oh, thank you. He was, you know, he was great to me. There was another person that was great. I've heard with Peter Sellers, very much like Sid Caesar, that in character, they were comfortable. But if they were out of character, it's like they didn't even exist. That's interesting. I think that is probably true. But he was much easier and more available

than Danny. Danny, you know, if you didn't want to talk about, he liked to talk about flying, you know, airplanes, and he liked to talk about operations. You know, he would go into operation rooms with doctors and watch them do appendectomies or whatever danny k yeah strange i mean if you didn't talk about that you sat at a table sweating it was a baseball fan he was a big brooklyn dodgers guy he wound up buying a baseball team yeah yeah but that was a great three years for me really a great three years i saw a clip of you danny fred gwynn in a serum in a cyrano skin yeah amazing and what was harvey korman like perfect perfect in every way he had what herb had they just gentle sweet men wow i loved i loved him

don't you think he was great? Oh, yeah. Terrific. Absolutely. We've had friends of his on the show who've just adored him. Everybody liked him, I think. Don't you think? Well, Ronnie Shell told us he was paranoid. Oh, Ronnie Shell. Oh, yeah.

But I remember reading- We've had him on twice. How is he? He's good. He's in L.A. Do you go to L.A.? No, we do it on- We have a hookup from L.A. here, and we just do it on Sunday.

Oh, my God. You know, I love American Style. I always had somebody like that. Oh, yeah. You did a Love American Style with Rich Little. And Mort Sahl. And Mort Sahl. Wow.

This was so lucky. I really mean it. This was all just lucky. Unbelievable. Yeah, really. Everybody we worked with. Yeah. Paul Mazursky.

Also, Pat McCormick was a writer on that Danny Kaye show. Yes. Oh, my God. And Larry Gelbart. And, yeah, I heard, I remember Dick Van Dyke said of Harvey Korman, he was the world's greatest second banana. No argument. Yeah.

I think he was flawless, yeah. Yeah. I agree. He could do anything. Yep. Go ahead, Gil. And you worked with Peter Falk on Columbo. I agree. You could do anything. Yep. Go ahead, Gil. And you worked with Peter Falk on Columbo. I did.

I worked with Peter Falk on Mikey and Nikki, too. Mikey and Nikki was a lost movie that was done by Elaine May. She wrote it and directed it, and it was John Cassavetes and Peter and other people, me, but other good people that I'm just not remembering right now. I've never seen it, but it has a reputation. You know, you should try to see it. I will. I like Elaine May a lot.

I see Elaine now. I still see her. They re-released it, and it got a lot of good reviews. She was laughing about it. I mean, it was suddenly getting good reviews 20 years later. We love her work. Yeah. I've never caught up to it, but.

It was interesting. Got a following. When Mike died, did you see they were showing a lot of the Mike and Elaine's things? And you'd forgotten how great they were. They just were fabulous. And Herb turns up in I Love You, Alice, Be Talkless, too. Yes, he does. Yeah.

I just watched it. You're very funny in it. There's a lot of good comedy in that movie. Yes. I mean, the Mexican family and the neck braces. It's always good. It's a very good script. Yeah, it was a good script.

Harold? Hmm? Do you know what happened this time? Huh? The earth moved for me Like in Hemingway Did the earth move for you? Uh

No, I don't think so I didn't satisfy you Of course you satisfied me It was just that the earth didn't move this time that's all but it has moved in the past oh joyce you know many times many times when well you know a couple of weeks ago it moved we must psychedelicize their impoverished dreams. Teach them how to live again.

Make them stop playing the ego game. Teach them how to die. So that they can be born again. So that they can become a flower again. Harold? Is your asthma bothering you? I have a little tickle right

now, yeah. It's a little heartbreak kid. A little bit. And then it's about a guy who's a reluctant groom, and he meets a younger woman, and yeah, but good, but succeeds on its own terms. I worked with Tony, too, Curtis.

Oh, yeah? Tell us about that. That was sad. He was originally in, I would have been pictures. He was the original man in it, and he was really, you know, I think he was a very good actor. Do you agree with me? Oh, yeah.

I think he was a very good actor. And it was about a guy that had been a big writer in hollywood and wasn't anymore so that was great because you know he carried that on stage with him but he just they couldn't count on him they literally couldn't one night he would be great the next night he would be terrible the next you know then he would be great he never knew why he was why it worked when it worked. So they fired him, and they replaced him with Ronnie Liebman. Ron Liebman replaced him.

Oh. Yeah. Always felt bad for him. Yeah, he seemed like a troubled guy. He came from a really bad upbringing. Yeah, but he had a long career. Sure did. And he got himself in trouble, I think, too.

Yeah. You know, doing eight shows a week, you can't play around with stuff. Oh, yeah. You know what I mean? You can't do it. Of course. He had a drinking and drug problem. I think that's what it was.

But I felt bad. It was just awful to work with someone. Because he was a really good guy. And he was a big star. He had been such and drug problem. Yeah, I think that's what it was. But I felt bad. It was just awful to work with someone. Oh, absolutely, because he was a really good guy. And he was a big star. He had been such a big star. But then Ronnie, of course, was great. We love Ron Liebman. Yeah, they were.

He used to be loved. Underrated. And speaking of Iota being pictures, now I'm reminded of who played the role in the movie, someone else you worked with, Walter Matthau. I'm so boring, but i loved him too couldn't have been sweeter you did bad news bears with walter and you know his wife was in mikey and nicky whoever that he was oh yes carol carol um oh hell yeah i'll think of it she's good and what

was mathau like the best just loved him and he we shot you did you ever see bad news bears oh yeah yeah the greatest i mean it's just such a wonderful movie but when you were making it you hated it because it was hot and you were on that ball field all the time he and there were all people coming he would go up to all the people all the fans he talked to them he gave his autograph he was like he just was adorable you were cleveland. I was Cleveland. I was. I was. And then Tatum O'Neill, who was a young and troubled 12-year-old, she wouldn't give anybody her autograph. There's Walter Matthau giving it out.

Walter Matthau was out there signing it. Yeah, that was sad. And he was funny in person, too. You got to work with two Felix Ungers and two Oscar Madisons. Because you worked with Art Carney in the K show. You worked with Matthau. And you were telling me on the phone that you knew Tony and Jack. Tony and I did a tour.

They used to do a thing through the Floridaida tour where you'd play palm springs and you'd play fort lauderdale and with a new play called the button and it was him and me and john mcmartin who was john mcmartin love him too just passed recently yeah he did so that was tony tony who had a great sense of humor and kept you laughing all the time. There's a certain kind of, once we realized the play was a bomb and we were in Florida, he would do anything to break you up on stage, you know, so it got to be about that. Who can break who up? He'd tell you that he'd confide in you at some point and tell you that he had a difficult relationship with his dad, Tony Randall? He had a mean father.

Yeah. Yeah, how did you know that, though? Did I tell you that? No, I just go very deep into research, and I have a lot of help. Yeah, it was surprising to me when he told me that. Yeah, he did. What was wrong with him and his father? His father was mean. I'm going to say his father was a rabbi. Is this possible? I don't know. He's Lenny Rosenberg from Oklahoma. Yeah, I think there was a religious thing that was involved with it that really cut him down. Interesting. Really, really cut him down.

And he did tell me that. And then later, you know, he was married for many years to a lovely woman named Florence. And then she died. They never had children. Right. And then he married again. And I think he had two kids. Yeah, one of them.

He was in his 70s. Yeah. And then, you know, he I think he had two kids. Yeah, one of them. He was in his 70s. And then, you know, he passed. One of our favorites. And what about Jack? You knew Jack and Brett too. Yeah. I feel like I knew them all my life because they were here in New York, you know. Of course.

And they were in the village. And is Jack's? No, we lost Jack. Oh, no. About five, six five six years ago okay it's hard to keep track of it i tell you yeah yeah and you were in a i have to tell our fans i would be remiss if i didn't point out to our odd couple fans that you're in a you're in a memorable episode with george firth with george another guy who was a good friend of yours you know george firth oh yes he's in blazing saddles and many other wonderful things. Many, many wonderful things.

And he was on The Good Guys, I think, more than once. Yes, he was. Yeah, I think he was on it quite a lot. And on that other actor that they used a few times. Richard Stahl. Yes. Another funny guy. Yeah, he was good.

Another funny guy. Yes. Like, so, like, deadbeat. Mm-hmm. So you were watching all these things when you were kids? Oh, yeah. We're addicts. Yeah, we're pathetic.

So is there anything happening now, television-wise, that you can't miss? I wouldn't know. I'm enjoying Fargo, but I think I'm like two years late. No, I've only seen the one. They do it really well. Didn't you think? Gene Smart in the second season was a revelation. I don't know that I saw it.

Gee, I hadn't heard their name in a while. I'll give you the discs. Yeah. Yes. That's the best thing I've seen in quite a while. But other than that, I'm like Gilbert. I'm a throwback. I'm lost in the 60s and the 70s, so I don't watch a lot of new television.

We're still catching up on... And yet another show you were on. You can't name a show you were on. Oh, my God. Did you look at that IMDb page? It's insane. Every show. Isn't that something?

Ben Casey, The Detectives, The Untouchables, Andy Griffith Show, The Don Rickles Show. You did every Western. I liked him, too. Oh, tell us about Don Rickles. He was great.

First of all, he was really smart. I mean, you know, if he went after you, it was very – he got you is what I'm trying to say. But, no, I mean, he got you in a good way almost. Oh, yeah. He would insult everybody. He hated the way I dressed, which is good because I didn't really – you know, I didn't dress the way women should dress according to him. But he was – I thought he was, I thought he was wonderful. And he was good. I thought he was a good actor.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah, you see him in, what is he in? Run Silent, Run Deep? Yeah. And he's in Run For Your Life with Ben Gazzara. Oh, my God. Where he has a nervous breakdown.

He's in a couple of those Beach Blanket movies, too. Yes. Oh, and he's the... And the man with the x-ray eyes. Yeah, the crooked carnivore. With Ray Moland. Yeah. We're freaks, Joyce. I never got a chance to meet Rickles.

You would have liked him. Yeah. I think you would have liked him. I did. Tell us a little bit about... When you were in that Elvis movie, John Carradine and Vincent Price were in that movie. I didn't. Didn't interact with them. But I knew Vincent.

You knew Vincent. I knew Vincent. I think originally he was sweet. I'm a big bore. I really am. But like when we were doing the Danny Kaye show, it was right next to where the farmer's market was. So he would go. We'd go for lunch.

right next to where the farmer's market was so he would go we'd go for lunch and then talia my daughter was a little girl and he bought like a little uh thing of honey you know a little bear that was filled with honey for my daughter i thought that was like sweet and then i used to see him and we had a mutual friend and we'd have dinners together he was another great raconteur oh yeah all the people we missed out on on this show, we kick ourselves. That's a shame because he really had tales to tell. I met him twice very briefly. Yeah. And just totally charming. Yeah, totally charming.

Lovely. Lovely. You know, we're not even going to get to – I'm not going to say it, Verterosa. I'm not going to say scratch the surface. But we'd have to do a four-hour show with you, Joyce. I was thinking that. I mean, I was looking – I have to say scratch the surface, but we'd have to do a four-hour show with you, Joyce. I was thinking that. I mean, I was looking. I have to say, we've done 175 of these.

And looking at your IMDb page, and I said to my wife last night, putting the research together, I said, I can't even get my arms around this. You've done so much. Well, that makes me feel good because sometimes you wonder what you've done. No, it is. It's a body of work, Joyce. It's really nice to be here. and it's charming to talk to both of you it is and it's always good to talk about myself well the typical typical actor yes i'd

love to talk about tell us about lucy you're in maim with lucy and b arthur she was god's sake and robert preston oh god he was a prince he was nice to me. And Robert Preston. Oh, God. He was a prince. He was a prince. I love this. Yeah. There's got to be somebody I didn't like. We'll find it. Maybe it's Gilbert.

Let's see. No, because I dislike people, but I can't think of any of the... She was extremely nice to me. She talked all the time about Desi. Wow. Don't you find that interesting? And this was 1974.

Oh, they were long. She's married to Gary Morton at that point. But then she turned on me, and I don't know why. Not during the movie, but then she invited me to several things, and I think she was really lonely in a way, and I think she really wanted a friend, and I was married. I didn't have the time to play whatever she was playing. Oh, interesting.

Yeah, and then she didn't have the time to play whatever she was playing. Oh, interesting. Yeah. Then she didn't like me anymore. I think she wanted a friend. You know? She thought I was good. She liked acting with me. Yeah. Desi would have been an amazing guest. Well, all of these people. He invented television. Yeah, pretty much.

And I think with Lucy, she you know, they couldn't get along as a married couple. But she always greatly admired him. I think she was crazy about him. I really do. They say she never got over it. Well, why was she talking about him, you know, all the time? And when she was in another marriage.

Yeah, but that marriage made sense to me when I looked at it. Because he was like a very good valet or something. Do you know what I mean? Gary Morton? Yeah, I mean that even in a nice way. He was there. It was like having a good assistant more than being in love.

I have no right to say that. I rarely saw them together, but that was the sense that I got. And opposite Captain Nice, I think you appeared on Mr. Terrific. You remember doing a show called Mr. Terrific? Yeah, you know, and whatever happened to that guy that did Mr. Terrific?

Stanley Strimple? Tell me whatever happened. Stephen Strimple. Stephen, how do you know that? I don't know. He was so excited about it. I must have done the second or the third of those, and he'd come from New York. He was a New York actor. Yeah, Dick Godier was or the third of those. And he'd come from New York.

He was a New York actor. Yeah. Dick Godier was in that. Oh, yeah. Yeah, who you worked with. And I remember. And John MacGyver. Yeah.

Oh, God. Did you know him? John MacGyver, one of my favorites. Now, wait a minute. Who was John MacGyver? Gilbert, give her a little. John MacGyver. Oh, he was great.

Absolutely. No, no, no. He was great. John MacGyver was a very good friend of Carol O'Connor's. Wow. Isn't that a good? I love that. He would always play like very pompous.

Oh, perfect. Total buffoons, you know, who are in charge. Yeah. He'd be like the hotel manager or something. How do you know this? Everything must be done according to schedule, sir.

That's perfect. He said, just like him, you really do. Isn't he a good mimic? A very good mimic. You should hear his Peter Lorre.

He was great. Peter Lorre was great. Did you ever work with Peter Lorre? No, I wish I... And I never met him. I wish... I think. He was great. Peter Lorre was great. Did you ever work with Peter Lorre? No, I wish I... And I never met him. I wish... I think he's so great.

Don't you just think he's great in movies? Oh, terrific. Oh, my God. So great. One person you did work with was our friend Abe Vigoda on a show called

The Comedy Company with Jack Albertson. Do you have any recollection of this? Okay, that was... Are you sure it's me? It's you. This was going to be our girl, our Grill the Guest question.

Dickie? Or Will Harris? No, a gentleman named Will Harris. We do this thing called Grill the Guest where we basically. So you don't remember Abe Vigoda? I know who he was, of course. It was Howard Hesseman, Abe Vigoda. Howard Hesseman I worked with.

Don Kalfa, you, and Jack Albertson. And Comedy Company. The Comedy Company. All right, we're going to get to the bottom of this. Something about the Comedy Company is ringing a bell, but not working with those actors. How about Lloyd Bridges? You did a ton of stuff with him. Any memories?

The Goddess? I never worked with him. You did the Lloyd Bridges show? No? No memory. I have no memory. Of these. You never went scuba diving we're gonna find someone

you dislike i knew the family i knew the family i knew the boys when they were young jeff and and bo and jeff yeah yeah in my notes it said you did the lloyd bridges show and you did a pilot with him but maybe that's not right here's's somebody you definitely work with a lot, Andy Griffith. A lot. Yeah. Tell us about Andy Griffith. He was... Let me guess, he was a prince. Tell us he was a mean drunk.

He beat his kids. He was... He hated very much... We hawaii 50 together and he hated jack lord so much oh really he could not stand him well actually a lot of people couldn't stand he was a bit of a you know i don't know he was very full of himself. You guys played grifters. You played a couple of confidence men and women. Yeah. Actually, you know, I replaced Carol Burnett on it because she couldn't do it at the last minute.

And they were afraid that Andy would not want to do it without Carol. But he did. And then we worked together a lot. But he did hate him. That's good. And he wanted – he almost wanted jack lord to know that too you know what i mean he would walk away from him when he talked it was really funny and but then we did a lot of stuff together i worked with him a lot yeah yeah a movie called winter kill we did that and

of course the andy griffith and the andy griffith show yeah where that's when i got alice pitocos i got the call oh yeah i got the call on the phone that i was going to do alice pitocos i got the call oh yeah i got the call on the phone that i was going to do alice pitocos and it was the contracts were being signed and everything and the a woman that played aunt b came to me francis babier she said i'm very happy but darling remember this it goes up it comes down it goes up it comes down. It goes up, it comes down. Wow. Isn't that great? You remembered that. Yeah. And I heard Andy and Aunt Bea hated each other. Well, that I wouldn't know because I didn't spend that much time on the show.

But that is great. Yeah. What she said, it goes up, it goes down. Wasn't that good? It goes up, it goes down. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here's some other names. We're just going to keep throwing these at you.

You did a movie called Malice in Wonderland with Elizabeth Taylor. Yes, and didn't get to meet her. It was so heartbreaking for me because she was my idol. I loved her, you know. Well, you didn't have any scenes together. We had no scenes together. I had worked with Jane the whole time, so I didn't get to meet her. It was an interesting – it was about Hollywood.

It was about Hedda Hopper and Luella Parsons. Yeah. What about the Mary Tyler Moore Hour, which you did? Yeah, we did 17 of those and David Letterman played my boyfriend. Michael Keaton was on that show. Ron Rifkin.

And Ronnie. Yeah. But it was not a... It was after she had done The Great Show. Yes. And this was going to be part a variety and part a regular. In other words, she was an actress who had a show. Right. And I was her secretary.

And, you know, Michael Keaton was the guy that worked at the studio. You know, one of those guys in his uniform. And she had a press agent. you know, it was that. Dodie Goodman. Do you remember Dodie Goodman? Dodie Goodman. Oh, yes. We loved her from Mary Hartman.

Yeah. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And what do you remember about doing Twilight Zone? I, it was, first of all, it was thrilling to do Twilight Zone, number one. Number two, we shot the sets for the old sets for Marie Antoinette. You know, it was at MGM. So it was all that stuff.

And it was Gladys Cooper. Oh, yeah. Wilfred Hyde White, Cyril Delamonte, Cecil Kellaway. Alan Napier. Alan Napier. I couldn't believe that I was. And they all, Gladys Cooper and Wilfred Hyde-White wanted to talk all day long about everything. They loved to gossip about Rex and Kay.

Rex and Kay. I mean, it was like. That would be Rex Harrison. I couldn't believe it. It was so great to do. I mean, you're a kid from Queens. Exactly. And suddenly you're on the soundstage in Hollywood with these veterans.

And my friend Lee Phillips played my husband. So that was nice. So I had Lee Phillips played my husband, so that was nice. So I had Lee as a friend there. So that was, I remember, only wonderful things. And Rod Serling came around, you know. Oh, that's what I was going to ask. Yeah, he came around. I forget whether it was a meal that we all had or something.

That was a class act, and it still is. You know, you can make money if you sign pictures. And Rod Serling was nice? Yeah, he was. He smoked a lot. But people did then, didn't they? That's the passage on the Lady Anne. That episode is one of the

hour-long episodes. It's very spooky. It's you and Lee and you get on, I guess, what is essentially a ghost ship. It's a said, yes, and we're ready to have a divorce, but we're ready to have a divorce, but we're trying to stay together, and then through this we get back together. It's sad.

It's an interesting Twilight Zone episode because it's romantic. Yeah. And it's sad as opposed to scary. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and the actors are charming as hell. God, yes. Oh, excuse me.

What about this one? The Lady Anne? Oh, I don't think so. Why not? Well, for one thing, it's very nearly the oldest boat in the water, and it's certainly the slowest. Thirteen days to Lahav. Another half day to Southampton. If there are favorable winds.

Well, forget it. No, no, no, wait a minute. It leaves on Thursday. That's less than a week. Please, Mrs. Ransom, forget it. Take your husband's advice. The Lady Anne is an antique, a relic. Look, we can relax when we get there, if that's what you want.

Don't make such a big deal out of it. Well, it is a big deal to me, a very big deal. Give us two tickets. For this? Yeah, that's right. The Lady Anne. And before I forget, Mr. Terrific didn't have words

to the theme song. You're going to sing Joyce the theme song? Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da- Oh, tell us about Rock Hudson. You did the Martian Chronicles? Yeah, but I didn't really get to know Rock Hudson. I worked with Darren McGavin. Oh. You know, they were Ray Bradbury short things from Fahrenheit 4. Sure, sure. So it was Darren and I. But we were in Malta, and so I did see him at the hotel and everything,

and he was very good looking and very nice but i didn't really spend time well then tell us about darren mcgavin who we love he was great was he nice to you yeah he was we hope you're gonna say that about us when this is over well i will well that'll be pushing it what was working with gilbert goffreid Yes. He was a prick. Oh, and you worked with yet another favorite over here, Jack Guilford. Oh. Here we go again. The best, right?

We hear nothing but nice things. Little sweetheart. He was a sweetheart. Yeah. And so good. Wasn't he so good? Oh, we loved him. Everything. We did a play together.

We did supporting cast. That was written by George Firth, actually. Tell us a little bit about George. You were starting to tell us before. George, well, he just was wacky. You had to be careful around George. You know what I mean? There are people that you have to just watch your step.

But he was wonderfully bright and interesting, but he could start trouble. Really? Interesting. Wow. We love him. What about you did a Western with Dino and Brian Keith? Yes. Called Something Big.

Oh, and here's a nice story about an actor, Dean Martin. Oh, there you go. So there I was. We were in Mexico, and I'm on a hill, badly dressed, with this other actress, Judy Meredith. And down the hill is Dean Martin and I guess Brian Keith. And Denver Pyle was in it. Who's also a wonderful actor. And Dean Martin starts walking up the hill toward me, just about to start shooting.

And he says, wait a minute. And he says to me, I just saw you in Alice Betokos and such a wonderful performance. Wasn't that a nice thing to do? How nice. And then he went back down the hill. And I thought that was so nice to do before your first shot in a movie to make somebody feel good. Oh, wow.

Yeah. How nice. So that's a good Dean Martin. But you never heard a bad thing about him either, did you, Dean Martin? No, no, no, actually. Yeah. So that's a good Dean Martin. But you never heard a bad thing about him either, did you, Dean Martin? No, no, no, actually. No. Well, I heard he and Frank Sinatra beat up the chairman of Hunt's Food. I don't think it was Dino.

I think it was Frank, as the story goes. Why would they do that? They were both, you know, in the bottle. And they owned Vegas. And he asked them if they could hold it down a little. And they didn't like that. And I heard they beat up the chairman of Hunt's Foods. And he crashed through a glass table and was in a coma for a while. He almost died.

And never, even scarier, he never pressed charges. Scared to death. Yeah. He was scared to death. Yeah. Those were the days when they didn't get that in the paper. Oh, yeah. Now you could do something alone in your room. Everybody knows it.

They protected those people. Yeah. Back then, they were having affairs. They were having people killed. It was like, you know, okay. I'm so knocked out by your long list of credits here, Joyce. I'm just going to throw some more names at you. You did Murder at the Howard Johnsons with our pal Tony Roberts. Yeah. And the great Bob Dishy. Bob Dishy, another funny guy. Oh, yes. He lived in New York.

We've got to get Bob Dishy on this show. He's here. He's hilarious. I was with him not that long ago doing a play reading. I wonder if he'd do this with us. I bet he would love to do it. I love Bob Dishy. Yeah. I think he's a comic genius, actually.

We do, too. I think he's a comic genius, actually. We do, too. I think he's a genius. And that play, if that play, that's Ron Clark and Sam Bobrick. Sam Bobrick. Yeah, good guys. Also writers on the K show. If that had had a good producer, that play could have run. Because it was three characters.

It was an audience pleaser. And Bob Dishy gave an incredible performance. Yeah. And so did Tony but Bob had the showier part funny guys and and you're I guess it's your nephew uh Vincent Van Patten is Dickie's youngest son yeah yeah and he was both a championship uh tennis player and an actor yes he I actually watched him play at Wimbledon one year. But now he does this poker thing.

Do you know what he does? No. They do poker on television. And he's, what do you call the people that talk about it? Oh, he's a color commentator? Color commentator. Oh, that's interesting. And he goes all over the world. He goes to Monaco and wherever, and they do that.

Shared his dad's love of poker. Yeah. I remember him on Apple's Way with Ronnie Cox. Yeah, right. Remember that show? Oh, yeah. He was the son. He was a better routine heartthrob.

Yes, he was. He was in all those Tiger Beats. He sure as hell was. Tiger Beats. Yeah, really handsome guy. Yeah. How about Karl Malden? He's another nice guy.

Well, what the hell are you doing on the show we're gonna find a bastard i'm gonna keep throwing through my i must have hated somebody surely there's somebody i can't stand you were in that movie a very odd film falcon and the snowman yes Yes. And that was Sean Penn and Tim Hutton. That's right. And we shot that in Mexico City. John Slesson. And I think Pat Hingle. And Pat Hingle.

Pat Hingle, another good actor. It's funny that you mention him. I just saw a little bit. Murder, She Wrote was on the other night, and he was on it. He was a nice guy. Oh, yeah. He was very not like an actor in any way. He was like a small town guy in a way.

Sweet man. He was always good at those parts. Yeah. He was. I think he played my husband in that. That was a true story, The Falcon and the Snowman. Yes, yes. About these two kids who were taking government secrets.

Yes. Bringing them to the Russians. Bringing them to the Russians, yeah. Well, you knew Sean Penn's dad, didn't you? Leo. Leo, yeah. We did one of those. Remember Amazing Stories?

Of course. We just had one of the writers in there. Leo and I did that. Yeah. Yeah, Steven Spielberg's Amazing Stories. And you worked with Blake Edwards on Blind Date. Yes, I did. But I didn't have much to do in that.

And Pat Hingle had a pinky missing. He did? Yes. He fell down an elevator shaft. Wow. That was it? That's how he? I thought that would have been a great story.

No, it's true. It's true. He did? Yeah, he fell, but I don't remember the specifics of it. Do you remember? I don't have that in here. So he fell down an elevator. It was a bad accident, and it was in the papers.

It was some kind of accident, and he did something to his... Yeah, I know he lost a pinky, and it's in films you could see. He could have lost more than a pinky. Oh, my God, god yes but it was some elevator thing that happened but yeah he was a terrific character yeah wonderful wonderful it's amazing i i honestly i i james whitmore jimmy whitmore yeah another nice what did i do with him um says here so a show called the loner created by Rod Serling with James Whitmore. You don't remember some of these.

You know the truth is about a lot of these things when you do the television thing, you don't get to be with each other that much. I think when you're in a play with people and you see them eight times a week and you have that long, long – that's when you can really begin to hate people. But when you just, you know what I mean? When you do a podcast with them. Yes. But it's true.

I mean, that's when you get your little, you know, they get under your skin. Every tiny thing about their personality gets on your nerve. You were also married to Dennis Dugan. I was. You and Gilbert have somebody in common. Oh my, you were married to Dennis Dugan? Yes, I was.

Yeah, he directed Problem Child. That's right. Starring Gilbert Gottfried. Yes. But I was married to him not then I we were divorced then

oh you would have known that yes but I have worked with him since and he was what was the show he starred in well he did Richie Brockleman

that was right yeah wasn't that a wasn't that a Rockford spinoff yes no I don't think so it was a spinoff of something I was married to him then

richie brockelman that was good like yeah i mean i remember who was the man in it it was an older star oh god is paul out there hey paul let us know the older star from richie richie brockelman private eye he'll have an answer in 10 years that's our researcher, Joyce. He was fun on that show. It didn't last long. No, but he was very good on that. Oh, yeah.

He was my director, Dennis Dugan. Wow. Yeah. Yes. And recently directed you in Grown Ups. Yeah, the first Grown Ups. The first Grown Ups. Paul, what do you got on Richie Brockleman, Private Eye?

Hi, Joyce. Nice to meet you. Can I share your mic? Sure. Yes, please. Be my guest. Just to meet you. Can I share your mic? Sure. Yes, please. Be my guest. Just pull it over. What are we looking for? Pull it to yourself.

Pull it to yourself for a minute. Pull it to me. All right. So what are we looking for? Richie Brockleman, Private Eye. What are we looking for? What are we looking for? Yes.

I have answers. See, this tells us. He doesn't even know the question. So Dennis Dugan is Richie Brockleman, Robert Hogan, Barbara Bosson, Norman Fell. Norman Fell. Norman Fell in the pilot as Mr. Brockleman.

Wasn't there another man that was the star? John Randolph as Mr. Brockleman in the series. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it was just him, but I feel like he had a Jim Garner with him or somebody like that, but it wouldn't have been Jim. Does it say that it was a Rockford Files spinoff, Paul? Let me see.

What does it say here? Is this picking him up, Frank? Hopefully. Yeah. I'm at a really awkward position, if that helps. Now, did you ever work with Norman Fell? Sure.

Yeah? I don't see any more in Brooklyn. All right, give him the mic back. Give me my mic. Thanks for the loan. Not at all.

Work with him. Knew him. You know, knew him from New York. Like, I knew Brett and Jack. You know, they were all from the same period of time. Yeah, I met him once briefly.

He was cute. Very, very nice man. Fun. And he was one of those who was equally good in drama and comedy. Yes, I agree. I think he was, too. Yeah, yeah. How about Fritz Weaver?

Yeah, he just, you know. He just lost him. Yeah. Fritz and I, I did a thing with Fritz where we all, all three women tried to kill him. It was like one of those things. They tried to do something from 11 to 1230 at night on NBC, I think it was. So it was like three of his ex-wives tried to kill him. And weren't you in a play with him too?

Oh, yeah. We were in, I can't think of the name of it right now. Was it the Belasco? Yeah. I'll think of it. Good actor. Oh, and another great guy. Another adorable guy.

And his wife is a very good friend of mine. His wife, who is his widow now, is a very good friend of mine. What were you going to say about Robert Preston before when we brought up me? He was great too. You've been lucky. I've been lucky. I have been lucky. Yeah.

We're going to make you get some of these people for us. I thought actually in the long run when I was sort of angry that I had been a child actor for a while and then I thought, you know, really, if you think about it, it's not a bad environment to be brought up in. It's democratic pretty much. So from the time that I was a kid, really, I was working with African-American people. I was working with Asian people. I was, you know, so that was good. And you got – because I didn't have like a great education. I really didn't finish high school.

But you pick up like intelligence from plays. You pick, don't you think that's true? So that's why I feel like in the end that you could do a worse thing in your life. I'm sure. I think Danny Bonaduce said, like like because they say it's so terrible child actors and he said uh being a child actor is great being a former child actor is is what sucks i actually worked with him what did i do with him danny bonaduce yeah i gotta go when he was a kid his father was a writer joe joe bonaduce his father was a got to go. He was a kid. His father was a writer, Joe Bonaduce.

His father was a TV writer. You know, he may have done a Good Guys or something. Okay. As a kid. We'll go digging. Is it true you never worked another job outside of acting? Never had another job. Isn't that fascinating?

Well, you started when you were a baby. Yeah, but you know, most of the kids don't go on acting. I mean, it's – and you wonder whether it's that they're not that interested, which is what I always hope. Yeah. That it isn't that they want to, but they can't. I don't know. But most of the kids that we grew up with did not stay in the business. What I find very weird and depressing is like on the Internet and magazines, they'll say, oh, you know, here's the child actor back then, adorable. And here he is now. And you go, well, he grew older like all of us grow old.

Yeah, but he's not a freak. Yeah, no, he'd be a freak if he looked us grow old. Yeah, but they... He's not a freak. No. He'd be a freak if he looked five years old. How about Bob Newhart? Since I'm throwing names at you, another gentleman. Well, you know that's true. Yes.

I mean, you've never heard a bad thing about Bob Newhart. Oh, we wouldn't necessarily want you to say anything bad about him. Maybe just an anecdote. No. Yeah. I wish I did, but I worked with him a couple,

you know, a few times. I had a very good, Marsha Wallace was a good friend of mine, and she was in the- What a talented lady. Yeah, yeah. I miss her still. She was in L.A., and I was in New York, but we used to talk an awful lot on the phone. How about Alan Alda? You did a play with him.

Yeah. The best guy, right? He's great. And we were in a play together for a long, long time. Jake's guy, right? He's great. And we were in a play together for a long, long time. Jake's Women, right? Yeah, and then we even did it on television. And you didn't even hate him in the play? I didn't hate him.

There's not a guy you can ever hear a negative word about. No, he's another one that you can't hear. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So there were all these nice people. You've had a charmed career, and everybody's been so sweet to you and so kind to you. Except for William Conrad calling you at 2 o'clock in the morning. Said dirty phone calls from William Conrad. And yet it can be an abusive business, I think.

Yeah, I'm sure. You can get your feelings hurt, I think, a lot. I'm sure. Not necessarily with the people you work with, but, you know, people can make you feel like not so good. And it is with child stars. If their voice changes slightly or they get a pimple, people go, oh, God, they're not cute anymore. They're not cute anymore. Get rid of them.

It's horrible. That's true. That's true. And then a lot of child stars, it's like they don't know how to live in the real world after that. They just know being on a soundstage. Yeah, and that can be very unreal, being on a soundstage. I mean, the real world is not being on a soundstage. And so some of them, they don't know.

They don't know how to make a dentist appointment or anything like that. No, that's very true. That's very true. No, it can be bad. And then they can lose their money. They can work very hard and not end up with any money. Oh, yes. Oh, Jackie Coogan.

You know, stuff like that. That's the ultimate story. And you can't get too – you have to get out of that. I think it's harder in Hollywood, honestly. I think that that's really a company town. I think you have a better chance of staying really in the real world if you're in a city or – a lot of those stars now, they don't live in Hollywood anymore. They live in Wyoming.

Sure. No, I get it. I really do get it. Or if you're George in Italy. If you're George, you're in Italy. But I get that, don't Wyoming. Sure. No, I get it. I really do get it. Or if you're George, in Italy. If you're George, you're in Italy. But, you know, I get that, don't you? Sure, sure. And getting back to Problem Child, we had on the Problem Child himself. We had him here, yeah. Michael Oliver, who was the kid. And for a while, it looked like his whole life was going down the drain. while it looked like his whole life was going down the drain. And now he, like, works with computers.

He's very happy, very content. Oh, good. He supports himself. He, you know, he accepts his former childhood stardom. But now he's got another life that he totally accepts. Well, that's great. I mean, that's great that you can do that because I think some people can't. You worked many times with an actor we had in here who was a child star. He was a teen star, but Matthew Broderick.

Oh, yeah. No, he's my friend. I love Matthew. I was with him, you know, when he became a star. And that was really interesting. That was Brighton Beach Memoirs. Yeah. And he turned 21.

And, you know, it all happened. Memoirs? Yeah. And he turned 21. And, you know, it all happened. We did the show first in Los Angeles and then in San Francisco, and then we opened on Broadway. And I mean, it was it was gigantic. He became a huge star suddenly on Broadway overnight. And I and his father had just died. Yeah. Just about, you know, like, I don't know, nine months before, eight months before. And, you know, it was really don't know, nine months before, eight months before. And, you know, it was really something to see him try to handle himself through it. And he, I think, is a real person. I mean, he never bought, he never drank the Kool-Aid.

New York. Yeah. Growing up here instead of growing up in the theater world. Very unassuming. Totally. Totally real. Never changed.uming. Totally. Totally real. Never changed. Yeah. Really.

Yeah. And it's so funny because he thought it was all over when that movie fell apart. He was supposed to make that movie. Which movie? With Martin Ritt, No Small Affair, and Sally Field. He came in and told us that. Oh, right. And the movie fell apart.

And he thought, that's it. I'm done. Yes. And then he had a cold streak where he couldn't get any he couldn't get any parts and then boom and he's so good i think he's so talented so good and everything yeah yeah yeah and she's you know darling talia my daughter is on a show with sarah oh she's on divorce they're on divorce yeah yeah yes yes now have you ever worked with talia yes we were in Jake's Women together,

actually. Jake's Women is another Neil play that we didn't work together. Yeah. Alan, Alan Alda was in it, and Talia, and yeah, she's a great girl. Yeah. Joyce, you've had an incredible career. I have an incredible run i didn't realize what a great career i'd tell you i i was spent the afternoon or evening i should say with you two guys you're so sweet i am definitely gonna feel very good tomorrow sleep well tonight we'll come back and we'll do it again and we'll go through the other half of your credits okay yeah i'll figure out who did richie brockham with dennis i'm gonna figure that one our listeners are screaming it into their uh

and i guess there's no way to avoid the line we haven't scratched the surface no i mean you know you look she's like mcleod and manix and hawaii five-o and canon and and every sitcom dennis was good what was dennis weaver yeah he was funny you did everything i did everything what more Hawaii Five-0 and Canon and every sitcom. That Dennis was good. Dennis Weaver. Yeah, he was funny. You did everything. I did everything. What more? Now I'm going to go home.

Well, you have anything you want to plug before you go? I have nothing to plug, but I have a dog. And I know that right now that dog is going, where the hell is she? Tell us about the dog. She said it was just going to be a couple of hours, and now what's going on? Where is she? But I totally enjoyed this, really. Oh, it's been a thrill for us. Oh, thank you.

This has been Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast with my co-host, Frank Santopadre. And we've had on Joyce Van Patten. Thank you, Joyce. Thank you. Thanks to Richard Kind. Red velvet trees and lions, grinning lions, candy witches,

eating lychee leaves, spinning rainbowing lights. Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast is produced by Dara Gottfried and Frank Santopadre, with audio production by Frank Verderosa. Our researchers are Paul Rayburn and Andrea Simmons. Web and social media is handled by Mike McPadden, Greg Pair, and John Bradley-Seals. Special audio contributions by John Beach.

Special thanks to John Murray, John Fodiatis, and John Bradley Seals. Special audio contributions by John Beach. Special thanks to John Murray, John Fodiatis, and Nutmeg Creative. Especially Sam Giovonco and Daniel Farrell for their assistance. Clean cannabis sativa, sweet sativa, chocolate mountain soul. I love you Alice, be don't cry I'm gonna change your name to mine I love you Alice, be don't cry And so does the food sign I love you Alice, be don't cry I'm gonna change your name to mine

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