Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - 195. Craig Bierko

Episode Date: February 19, 2018

Tony-nominated actor and singer (and friend of GGACP) Craig Bierko returns to weigh in on a wide range of topics, including: the lost era of "Clubhouse TV," the importance of a showbiz "hook," the generosity of Alan Alda and Carol Burnett and the similarities between Yiddish theatre and "Guys & Dolls." Also, Jack Paar gets intimate, Steve Martin plays to the cheap seats, Richard Dreyfuss "inhabits" Spencer Tracy and Ted Danson borrows from Dick Van Dyke. PLUS: Peter Tork! In praise of Richard Kind! Craig wows Stephen Sondheim! Gilbert teams with Larry David! And Nathan Lane pays tribute to...EVERYONE! This episode is brought to you by Leesa (www.leesa.com/GILBERT) and SeatGeek (download SeatGeek app and enter promo code: GILBERT). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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So whatever the sport, whatever the moment, it's never ordinary. At Bet365. Must be 19 or older. Ontario only. Please pay responsibly. If you or someone you know has concerns about gambling, visit connectsontario.ca This is where the DJ talks. Don't say anything. Okay. Hey, I'm Dave Thomas. You're listening to Gilbert Gottfried's amazing colossal

cod... codpass? Codpiece! This amazing colossal codpiece. Alright, let me try that again. Hi, I'm Dave right. Let me try that again. Hi. Hi, I'm Dave Thomas. You're listening to Gilbert Gottfried's Colossal Amazing Podcast. Is it?

It's Amazing Colossal Podcast. One more time. Hi, I'm Dave Thomas. You're listening to Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast. Perfect. Yes. Perfect. Yes. Fantastic. Hi, this is Gilbert Gottfried, and this is Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast. I'm here with my co-host, Frank Santopadre, and we're once again recording at Nutmeg with our engineer, Frank Furtarosa.

Our guest this week is a dear old friend of Frank and mine, and a loyal friend and devoted listener of this podcast, which will give you an idea of his priorities in life. He's a popular and much admired actor and singer who's appeared in everything from top rated situation comedies like Murphy Brown, New Heart, and Sex and the City, to prestigious TV dramas like Damages and The Good Wife, to feature films such as Cinderella Man, The Long Kiss Goodnight, Scary Movie 4, and Larry David Sour Grapes, which was a piece of shit. You didn't share for it, is that right? Yeah, I thought that was a piece of shit. Wait, I didn't write that.

Yeah, it's right here. This was the original title. That was the original title. Yeah, which was a total worthless piece of shit. Yeah, as the Sheridan piece was actually called that. Yes, yes. To starring in lavish Broadway musicals. I didn't know you were gay.

No, I'm not gay. I don't know what lavish and it's lavosh. We were getting into the food, I thought. I love a lavosh. I love a lavosh. Like Guys and Dolls, the music man for which he was nominated for a Drama Desk Award and a Tony Award for Best Actor in a Musical. Now, I also read somewhere.

He's never going to get through the intro. Most people are embarrassed by the intro because it's not enough. Yeah. He just missed something. He missed things that are like important things. But it's okay. It's all right. Yeah, you can throw them in.

I don't remember. Now, by miss, you probably say I miss the fact that you're proud of your Jewish heritage. No, I was miss fact that you're proud of your Jewish heritage? No, I was Miss Proud of Jewish Heritage 1973. And then you took the title away from me and I've never heard the end of that. It was Nancy Walker for four years. It was Nancy Walker and that's when we bonded. First Nancy Walker reference on the show. Is that right?

Probably. All right, that's the end. But it won't be the last. Yes. Alright, that's the end. But it won't be the last. Over the course of a very busy career, he shared the screen and stage with dozens of popular and

recognizable performers including Will Farrell, William Shatner, Glenn Close, Michael J. Fox, Candice Bergen, Christopher Guest, Betty White, Stephen Colbert, Bob Newhart, and Renee Zellweger, to name a few. series, the hit comedy Unreal launches its third season tonight, February 26th on Lifetime. And we couldn't be happier that he's here with us now. Please welcome to the show a man of multiple talents and someone who wishes he was half as famous as I am.

Wait a minute. A guy who, according to legend, is proud of his Jewish heritage. Oh, he added that one, too. Yes. Craig Bjerico.

Thank you, Bjerico. Bjerico. You got an extra syllable. Now you got an extra syllable. Bjerico. Thank you, Pierico. Pierico, you got an extra syllable. Yeah, you got an extra syllable. You got an extra syllable. Now I have even less time for one of my great flatulent showbiz stories because you had to put a ninth syllable in my name, which is already uncomfortable.

It already sounds like a man falling down a staircase. You had to give him an orthopedic limb. What didn't you mention? You just didn't. There was something I did. It was Cinderella Man, and then there was something else. I tried to get all the things in there that you were proud of. I didn't say company.

I saw that show. Oh, that was good. You were good? Oh, I had a part in company that they put back in. They did the original like in 1968 or something, whenever it premiered. Barbara Barry. Barbara Barry was in that. back in from, they did the original like in 1968 or something, whenever it premiered. Barbara Barry. Barbara Barry was in that and it was really something

and a, you know, a cutting edge because it all took place in a split second. A guy deciding whether or not he's going to go into his surprise party.

That's basically, it all takes place in his head. Literally, very uncomfortable for the actor playing the part. Just, that's how I know you're not listening.

That you go into, you go into a just you it's not enough to just face the person and i'm going to test you like it's going to come up every few ever i'm going to do it every uh but anyway that so when we did this production we did this production my part was it it was the part of peter which was not which was largely cut out of the original production because back then he made a pass he made a homosexual pass at the lead character who was straight wow but they wanted to explore that theme uh and see what you know when it was the hip you know that kind of hip new york society but they felt uh it wasn't it it wasn't cut the audience wasn't comfortable with it yet so they felt it wasn't, it, it, it wasn't cut. The audience wasn't comfortable with it yet. So they put it back in and Sondheim was there.

Mr. Sondheim was, was there. He wanted the scene back in, paid me an enormously great compliment about it, which I'll carry around forever. And he, and, but it was, it was the part that people said, you're doing company. But it was the part that people said, you're doing company. What part are you playing? And I wanted to see how small the role of Peter was. Instead of saying Peter, I'd say, Glenn. I'm playing Glenn.

And they'd go, oh, because there's no Glenn. And Peter barely existed. And there's a little bit more. So there's this great scene where he does, you know, they do that scene. I saw you live. Did you go to the Philharmonic? Yes. It was you. Well, you don't go to the Philharmonic.

You don't do things like that. Gilbert? No. What would happen to you? I entered about maybe 10 minutes ago. I spoke briefly with you and your wife. We reminisced. As close as you get between blinks.

You lose everything goes between blinks. That should be the movie for you. That's the project that I would. Not even a short-term memory. It's a full night's sleep, and it's not even the Dana Carvey thing. It's every blink, and you don't know. Even half a second. Between blinks. Yeah, between blinks. It's a good memoir name.'t know even between blinks.

Yeah. Between blinks. Memoir name. But I don't remember. Yeah, you were good in it. Thank you. It was you, Neil Patrick Harris. And Stephen Colbert, who's doing his television show every day, thought he was going to walk out in a tux, sing a song, get a standing ovation, walk back out and get back to work on his show

and found out, no, we're going to, they said, no, we're doing the actual show. And he said, I looked at the opening number and got vertigo. Yeah. And I just thought, and he did it. He stayed and he did it and it was all memorized and we did a full production in two weeks. It was fun. And, and he did it. And I thought, that's a worker. That's a fearless guy. It actually reminded me of the story you told about, you know, I hope you tell it again and make it an even 112 about you doing the aristocrat story. But he was that kind of like, I'm going to walk into fire. I'll probably burn to death.

Here I go. When he did the thing with George Bush, remember? And he's got George Bush right there. And they thought he actually was like Bill O'Reilly. Nobody had gotten quite that he was parodying them. I was on the train with him and heard him talking to somebody, I guess his co-writer. I went to college with him. He was a long-haired, like, turtleneck-wearing hippie.

He was a great guy. All you need to know about that appearance at the Correspondence Center is they were so shell-shocked that Rich Little was the emcee the following year. Oh, jeez. There was a correction. Oh, God. Yeah. They may have thought the character was real.

I think that's what it was, but I heard him on the train ride going down there. Then I assumed he was referring, he goes, no, if we're going, let's do it all the way. I want to go all the way.

Let's do it all the way. Yeah. You know? I admire him. He's a great talent. Fearless. Yeah, and fearless. Like Gilbert. Like Gilbert. Yeah, and fearless. Like Gilbert.

Like Gilbert. You're also fearless. It is. Who I have yet to see live, which is hard to believe. I'm going to get the more laudatory stuff just to make sure you're awake during this. Don't take anything for granted. The movie, I watched the movie up in Vancouver, and it really was just so stunningly beautiful. My condolences to you on your sister, on the lost sister, who I fell in love with.

Her whole family I fell in love with. Lovely person. And the person, and the locus of you with your family, the, I mean, you were still you, but the difference, it was like watching somebody morph into like into a i don't know somebody like morph out of you like it was just this other creature a lovable quiet shy uh person and i just and i just thought to myself, oh, my God, he's your – the right director, the right – you could do anything. There's so much going on in there and there's so much that's just quiet. And because – I mean, obviously, you enjoy your bombast and we enjoy your bombast with you.

You saw the potential in him as a performer by watching the show? No, that sounds belittling. I mean, I know Gilbert well enough to know. I mean, I've seen your performances well enough to know that you're not like a comedian who goes on and doesn't inhabit a character. Like in Problem Child, you are that guy. Like, I believe you're that guy. There are other comics that come on, like Rodney Dangerfield. And it's funny, in Caddyshack, when he's literally doing stand-up.

Oh, yes. Looking right down the barrel of the camera. You could see somebody at the camera going, just don't look right into the camera. Yeah. What did he say? Don't look into it. What did you get with that? A free bowl of soup?

A lot of Bob Hope movies. Oh, absolutely. But I don't know if you get what I'm like. I don't even know if that's somewhere you would want to go. But I saw, I was like, oh, I see like Marty. I see. Marty. Interesting.

Yeah, I really do. If it was, well, there was all kinds of stuff. I watched that movie. It was a revelation because it wasn't anything I thought, A, these probably wouldn't be interested. But there was – it was – the movie really took me by surprise even though I thought I've been overprepared for this thing. Everybody says it's just so lovely and it's really – but it was – first of all all it really hit me because it's everything i think everybody's looking for and that thing you say at the beginning uh that you said it was so honest and i know that feeling of like i don't i can't quite wrap my mind around it actually that it's

actually happening i can't you mean having a wife and children? That I've had this life? Yes, connecting to everything's fitting. Yeah. I don't think he's quite figured it out yet. I compared it there and in real life, like waking up in a Twilight Zone episode. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You also said at one point if your parents walked into the room and saw everything, saw the kids and saw the wife. If they come back to life and then die, immediately die of a heart attack. Yes. And I also talk if I could introduce myself from a couple of years ago and said, OK, this is where I'm living now now and this is my life now would have been yeah i i feel the same way and maybe some maybe some of it is uh some of it is i mean it was it i gave a lot of credit to the filmmaker name the film berkeley yeah it deserves all the credit in the world oh i i he did a beautiful job because i really do feel like i'm standing

back and just and i've been in your home and seen and i just felt like i'm observing you and i'm not in the way but and it feels very natural and uh i was just just it was beautiful it was a piece of art but it also felt like a true documentary like the kind you don't see yeah it's also very very funny to funny to see him in his environment. I watched it and went, I can't believe I haven't seen Gilbert live. I haven't seen you live. Free tickets. But I'm thinking tomorrow night.

What are you doing tomorrow night? There's a benefit. Dara's benefit is tomorrow night. And the movie's Gilbert and it's on Hulu. It is. I saw it. He's been trained to plug it every time it comes up. It is well worth your...

Yeah, it's great. You know, it's well worth pirating. I'll tell you that much. Yeah. No, I own it. I own it. It's in my holster. It's a go-to.

Yeah. So, how about that, Gil? Yeah yeah the first thing he said to me on the phone i saw gilbert's movie wow yeah i loved it wow and i he i just picked up the phone he didn't even say hello i thought it was room service and did he say it's on hulu amazon he did it's worth owning because there's all the extra things that you get. Yeah. You know, the visit. You promised the visit.

Oh. You had to stay over in the cooking of the dinner. The drive if you're drunk and you need a lift. It was lovely. It was just so lovely. There's nothing i love more and it is it does go back to what drew friedman does i think a lot which is just when you get shown something you're so familiar with or an aspect of someone that you're so familiar with and then you see it from another angle it's mind-blowing like i drew a picture the other night just because i

thought i want to see what of the back from a view from the back of lucy's apartment you draw you draw yeah yeah yeah i should have bought it i probably have it somewhere i'll show you uh you do you doodle or do you take it seriously and actually i take it pretty seriously uh but i'm like you didn't you like you because i saw some of your artwork and you were said yeah that was like 17 years ago I don't do it anymore that's what happens with artists is you put the pen down

and you realize I haven't picked the thing up for like yes and then you hit middle age and you're like I'm not blind but I can't see anything that isn't 15 feet in front of me

very clearly and it's just you doing the glasses thing but I've started working with like polymer clay and stuff I didn't know that about you. But I've always drawn. Well, that's what I was doing when everybody else was listening. We all did. I went to art school. I was an art

student. Where? I went to school of visual arts. My dad was a painter, as you know, and an illustrator. And I did that for a long time. And Hitler was a painter. Both of us. I happen to think he was like, I think he got fucked. I think he got fucked over.

But the good news is he took it well. He took it and you roll with those punches, right? What are you going to do? You're going to flame a hole? I forgot you were in the house and you saw his artwork because he has it hanging. People don't know this about you. That your doodles are on the wall in your house, but you haven't done it in a long time. Yeah.

You're out of time. Yeah. When I was a kid and a teenager, I used to draw like crazy. And also. Was it an escape for you? I guess so. And maybe you don't need that hatch anymore. I guess there was all that craziness spinning

around yeah it's going to come out somehow and if it would you would have been doing i would have been a cartoonist or this there was no way i was going to be sitting behind a desk going let me tell you about this plan like i was never going to be that i didn't know you were that big a fan of cartooning i know you're a fan of drew's i know that that's how oh i began he was the first guy that i ever and then i learned it's actually good to, to copy and emulate. You know, it's,

it's a, it's a, it's, that's how you learn. But I, but I literally used to just do the Jew dots and I would just go, Jesus God, it's 500 o'clock in the morning and this isn't even that great.

But I had, uh, I think I, the one that I had that was supposed to be, and I did the dots all wrong. Like, it didn't look like a photograph. You did point to listen. It just looked like somebody.

Dots. Yeah, just like. It just looked like somebody. Yeah, somebody looked like a lot of flies died on my picture. It looked like you took a drink of ink and then sneezed. Yeah, you did a spit taste. Not even that would have been Ralph Steadman. It was like he was, it was, no, it was Macbeth. And then it was as gothic as I could make it.

And then Dagwood Bumston was just, this is Dagwood I see before me. Not funny. Yeah. Right? And it was all because I'd met a guy named John Weidman who used to write for the Lampoon. Oh, John Weidman. And he came to our college. He goes, you should be working for the Lampoon. You'd be making dozens of dollars now. Didn't John Weidman. And he came to our college. He goes, you should be working

for the Lampoon. You'd be making dozens of dollars now. Didn't John Weidman end up writing Assassins with Sondheim? Yes. Wow, big talent.

Yeah, very, very smart, interesting guy. And at that point, they'd written a musical about Al Capone called America's Sweetheart, which was fascinating. Big talent.

Oh, my God. John Weidman. Yeah, I remember reading him in the lampoon your stuff always reminded me a little bit of basil wolverton gilbert you know that artist no take a look because your stuff is is eerily similar and i don't obviously since you don't know for the people i of course know who he is but for the idiots at home who don't he wasn't i get what you call him an underground cartoonist he was one of those guys around. Dead? He's dead now.

I know some other people compared it to. Crumb? Yeah, Crumb. A little bit. Yeah. A little bit. Yeah. That's like a line out of Daniel. Did you?

Little bit. Little bit. Little bit. Little bit. Little bit. So, Craig. Oh, the comedian. Have you seen the comedian?

Oh, he's in it. Not only, yeah. Oh, that comedian. Have you seen the comedian? Oh, he's in it. Not only, yeah. Oh, that's right. He's in it. Yeah, I'm in it as like a weirdly kind of recognizable extra. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Where you go. It's the first time you see him, the agent comes in, right?

Out of the rain or something like that. Yeah, I'm there on the dais when he's, that movie, oh boy. For some time he's been just circling the edges of, like the big comedy sensation. Yeah. I think I'm a comic sensation. Yeah. And it's weird because on the Rickles tribute he did like a, I got a tight 10. Yeah. And i was like

it was really odd it was very odd and yet he can be funny with the right material i'm sure he's i'm sure off the cuff he's funny yeah he is funny off the cuff uh but that was but that was hilarious hilarious miss but the the well i didn't see the whole movie i saw you but i i didn't know where the movie literally wandered out of my apartment if you see him in brazil if you see king of comedy midnight run he can do comedy i want to say very clearly one of my favorite actors yeah in the entire world but there's also something i don't think he's a funny guy personally no well when you see tech when i when you see him when you see the pure grain young taxi driver driver, I'm not going to get too close to this guy. No.

I'm not worried. He can stand five people in front of me, craft service, always. I'll never go near this guy. There was something, and he's, there's something that comes with youth that just, you probably have to really fight to hold on to. He's become, now he's a corporation. He's an entity. Yeah. He really is.

It used to be like magic when you'd watch him years ago. He disappeared. Yeah. Yes, he disappeared into the role. I mean, taxi driver, raging bull. I mean, it was magical. But what is that? He had learned his part well enough to disappear and just live this guy's life and was fearless. And that was what I was talking about, whether or not you do that.

And it would still require, I still think an actor needs a director and all that kind of stuff. But if you can go to those, he could still go to those places. You just got to want to go there, you know, and after a while you learn tricks and you go, I'm in my, you know, I'm in my seventies. This is going to upset my back if I sit like this and do it the way that I would have done it when I was in my twenties. He even disappeared into roles that he wasn't, you know, you think of him as LaMotta, you

think of him as Travis Bickle, but like playing a priest in True Confessions. Yes. He would disappear. Forget you were watching Robert De Niro. Somebody said his face was haunted. I thought that was a beautiful way of putting it. Just forget you were watching an actor immediately. A southern ball player and bang the drum slowly.

Yeah, yeah. Like, not at all something you'd see. Deer hunter. Just a canvas, a canvas. Somebody said to me a true movie star is 75% complete as a human being. There's 25% of them that is just empty. It's for pocket change in real life. And it's there to be filled.

And they get on screen and people project the rest of the person onto them and that was a fascinating idea i don't know if it's true or not but that like interesting people aren't great movie stars no that's interesting while gilbert tries to remember who our guest is. And what's your name? A few words from our sponsor. What if we told you you're already off to a great start with so many ways to squeeze the most out of summer right here? From our largest shrimp skewers ever

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Visit mila.ca to learn more. Gilbert and Frank, what's your game now? Can anybody play? What's your game now? Can anybody play? And now, sadly, we return to Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast. Tell me, we talked on the phone about directors that you'd work with, and you were making some very interesting points. With Ron Howard, you were talking about Larry David.

We had David Zucker here, who you worked with. He wrote that piece of shit you were talking about Larry David. We had David Zucker here. Oh, yeah. He wrote that piece of shit you were in. Amazing. It is kind of amazing. Up until recently, I thought, I'm in the only piece of shit that Larry David ever made. But the truth is, he was, you know, what else was there? Fridays. Listen, Fridays was not exactly, you know, the golden era of television.

And he wrote Norman's Corner. He wrote a show for Gilbert. A pilot for me. For the old Cinemax comedy. Oh, I'd like to see that. Is it terrible? It was so bad when they were trying to sell Seinfeld to a network. They said, OK, Seinfeld's a star, and who's going to be writing it?

And they said, Larry David. And one of the execs said, isn't he the one that wrote that piece of shit for Gilbert Gottfried? I'm just so happy to hear it wasn't Craig Bierko. Or Craig B-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R-R- Like you would say Extra syllable Amazing Arco Arco

Craig and my My levels just blew Do you have a copy of Norman's Corner? It came out on VHS I'm sure I do You show me that And I'll show you my first movie Which was a Christian film.

Oh. A witnessing film called Love Note. It was a Christian movie. I was at Northwestern University and my lovely first girlfriend, who's a brilliant Steppenwolf actress named Sally Murphy, got the lead in this movie. And I was hanging out and I said, could I try out for the boyfriend? Now, you know what a witnessing film is? Like they show them at the church. I know what they are.

And you're supposed to be so moved that you go, well, I got to go with Christ. Yes, yes. Like roller coaster. Like roller coaster for us, right? Is that a reference to the George Segal movie that was incensed around? Sure.

I don't know why that jumped into my mind. And Helen Hunt. And a young Helen Hunt. Yes, and Richard Widmark. Yep. Bless you. Oh, the intrepid George Segal is the solving the rollercoaster mystery. They're killing people

on rollercoasters. Why don't you turn the machines off? No! That's what they want us to do. I don't remember a young Helen Hunt in it, but I do Young Helen Hunt paid to see that one in the movies was it kind of like

Davy and Goliath you got to remind me again that was those animated he's saying the religious film that she did wasn't like this no it wasn't like that and also the really good

Sunday morning shows like Lamp Unto My Feet or whatever it was Lamp Unto My Feet was that the dramas with Martin Sheen used to be? And he used to go, I know this is religious. He's supposed to be Christ, but I'm enjoying this show and I'm 10. Sunday Semester.

That was what it was. That was another one. Such a good actor that he made me watch. It was like little spiritual Twilight Zones. They were odd. Yeah. Interesting. But no, this was a witnessing film, and I was hired to play the guy, the Christian. If you look out your window, Frank Verderosa just put out the entire cast of Davy and Goliath.

Can I tell you something? Frank has them in a box. In all seriousness, I am so confused by my erection right now that i don't know how to express it don't be can i it's the mom can i have my dara uh am i pronouncing that right can i have the no no no not that is there's that it's that's my coffee my bulletproof coffee have you had tried have you tried the bulletproof coffee thanks for bringing the dog by the way you classed bulletproof coffee? Thanks for bringing the dog, by the way. You classed up the place. Boo is here.

Excellent. Beautiful dog. People love Boo. Thank you. Thank you, Darren. You can smell. There's no liquor. Frank, you just happen to have the Davy and Goliath figures lying around.

I forget who gave that to me, but yes, I do. Those would always be like Davy would get lost in a park or a county fair, and he'd be with his dog, Goliath. And then they'd find out. Who's a little too big for the family, actually. A little menacing. And they'd find out at the end, you know, it would be like, well, you were lost, but god always knew where you were does good does god also have no features because i looked exactly like mom if mom was shorter and had my shirt on why are sister's arms longer than her legs well that was your introduction to show business yeah well yeah it was actually and i i really tried as hard as i could and i and uh and um

uh we were up for a dove award sally won hers a dove award yeah um it was it was very strange we went yeah we did it in the belt buckle wars, Indiana, and they put us in separate homes on a separate side of town. Oh, jeez. But it's out there. And if you show me Norman's asshole, what's the Norman's corner? Norman's asshole. Yeah, that was the original title. Norman's asshole.

No wonder it didn't fly. You know, somebody at NBC was like, I thought Norman's, I didn't like Norman's asshole. I liked Seinfeld. Who that guy was. Who's the guy? All the guys at NBC who worked in the office and took credit for Seinfeld were like, who's that guy who ran? I don't remember anybody. Littlefield was there.

Yes, yes. And they're like, I'll tell you. Now he's lecturing and running. And we heard Seinfeld. You know what it was? It was an anomaly. It was an anomaly. And all they did was want to kill that show. They would get meetings and go, somebody's got to say I love you at some point.

And he said, no one will ever say I love you on my show, and that's a deal breaker. And they're like, okay. They wanted to ruin the show. George Shapiro was here with us a couple of weeks ago. Did he say that? There was one executive, a guy named Rick Ludwin, who took a shine to the show and kind of went to bat. And got it. He got it, and he went to bat for it.

He was the guy. And everyone who tries to stop a show or stop someone's career and then sees it's a success later on or that person becomes a star, they're always like like make them out to be the lone person in the company what is that i fought everybody on it's the exact opposite you did fight everybody but for the wrong reason and you were a viking why are you claiming to be well that's the way he was with the podcast he bailed early and now he wants to take credit for it yeah yeah after the first one he was missing out on all that money i wanted to get the fuck out of here didn't he he was gone man didn't did he tell you that i that i said this is the next natural step i mean do this as long as you want but it's because it's a joy, but it's like, we put this on TV for crying out loud. Oh, your lips to God's ear, buddy. Because I miss clubhouse television, like what Conan was at the beginning where you

just felt like, I think I'm, it's not UHF, but it's close. And I'm the, you know, and the audiences were smaller and you kind of felt like you were watching, it felt like late night. Oh, yes, yes. And now every, and now like the late, late show is as big and loud as what did you tell me this show should be on at 4 30 in the morning no this was an idea that steven weber okay had and pitched to me i actually thought it was a really brilliant idea but steven weber's another one who says something and by the end of the sentence, he's deep in a conversation with somebody else.

And his ADD has beaten my ADD. Well, you got him here. Yeah, I know. He goes, I have a great idea. And I go, I look forward to listening to 18.3 seconds of it before you call somebody else and you're married. And Jack Parr, he's... There's some ADD for you. You mentioned... Jay Silverhills. Yeah, no, Jack Parr,

it's going back to what you were saying about a late night show. Yes. Jack Parr, you know, he always whispered, like it's all of his talking was like that. We don't wake anybody up. And all of his talking was like that. We don't want to wake anybody up. And all of his guests, they was all very quiet.

That's interesting. I thought about that. And Jack Parr wanted it to be like that. That I never heard. He said, people are like it's the end of the day. You're lying in your bed. You want to relax. Yeah.

And they didn't want any loud voices or loud bands. It was so very quiet. I think that's actually – well, listen, I fall asleep with the telephone on my face. Yeah. You know? So I'm the last one to talk. But when it was just television, yeah, I used to thought, oh, the way they programmed it. And they just kind of lull you to sleep?

And I just thought, oh, but what I miss was it just doesn't feel like – it feels – the late, late show or – I'm not blaming any of these, any particular show. It's just they all seem as big and loud as the one that precedes it. There's no – nobody ever shuts up. The band blasts really loud. It's like it's happening at five o'clock in the afternoon. And it should be late.

It's for later. It's, it should be a one guy with a harmonica and, you know, like the Joe Franklin show. I think audiences now wouldn't be able to accept a quiet show. It's a different world. Well, look, did you – listen, when you were at the pizza store –

Yes, I do listen. When you were at the pizza store, did you think anybody would ever listen to this? And here you are 18 years later. Feels like it. We've been running longer than mesh. I just say – It's like it. We've been running longer than Mesh. I just say it. It's so funny. You think this show has the qualities of a late night show and you could see it on television?

Absolutely. Okay. Because what you – first of all, the thing that you don't have, the thing that you have that is impossible to capture is the chemistry between you guys, which is, that's impossible. It's impossible. That was why it was so great when, when, uh,

Conan came back and he brought Richter back and I was like, yes, it's better. Yes. Yes. Yeah. He, he's so smart.

I mean, I don't know what the Richter wanted to leave because Richter wanted, you know, he wanted, he wanted to act. He was going to be a star. Got a pilot, got a series.

Yes. Which it was actually really funny. I thought, um, Richter controls the universe know, he wanted to act. He was going to be a star. Got a pilot, got a series. Yes, which was actually really funny, I thought. Andy Richter controls the universe. That's right. Yeah. And then, and I love that he's back. He's really, really, he's very good at what he does. They're good together. Yeah, and I think that's what you guys have.

I would love to see it on TV, but that's a private thing. What I was talking about with Weber was he said, hey, I had an idea. You know, that netherworld of television between like 230 and like 530 where there's just who knows what the – I mean it's still like just, you know, even on networks, they're still showing like, you know, what are those infomercials and stuff. Take that time and tell the network, give us a minimal amount of money. Just give us five cameramen and those stupid, like the early SCTV sets, like the flats, you know, a couple pairs of sandals, a wig and a lady, you know, and let us and then let us go out and find writers. And because it's the age of the DVR, nobody has to be watching it live. Let us fill those hours with something and let people fill their DVRs with it. And it will be a sort of visual podcast era.

You'll pay no money. And every fifth show will be great or whatever. With the same format that we have here? I don't know. Well, no, it wasn't. I wasn't connecting the two for that. I think you guys deserve a bona fide, you know, an hour when people would actually be awake.

That's very nice. We're going to continue to try to do that. But that would be an interesting thing, too, is why not? It is. People tape things and watch things in the strangest ways. Nobody knows what's going on, and anybody can predict, tells you they can predict how this is all going to play out is lying or they're crazy. Why not during those hours? Televise it during those hours for the five people who are up, you know?

And then I'm sure your fans, a lot of them are up, right? We hear something in the middle of the night. Reloading. But, yeah, it's just always seemed like it's dead air time, but there should never be dead air time. And especially with a recording device. Listen, I would run the network so differently. Even knowing what the Marx Brothers did, that they used to take a play, tour the country, and that's how they wrote their movies. That's why they were so fucking funny before MGM because they knew where the laughs were.

They knew it backwards and forwards, and they did it with certainty. And then MGM didn't want to do that anymore. Yeah, they were funny with Paramount. Yeah. That was their early. Because they toured for, you know, they toured as a play. I think Day at the Rays was the last time that they took something out. Take a sitcom, take four episodes, take your actors, go to Chicago,

go someplace where it's not going to make any, you know, and tour the sitcom and make it great, learn where the laughter, and come back with cheers rather than, you know, Johnny Chase is a bus. It's a great idea. Johnny Chase is a bus. That's a great idea. Johnny chases a bus. You and Weber are visionaries. Well, we're flattered that you listen to the show as often as you do. I love the show.

And thanks for tweeting about it and putting the word out the way you do on social media. Does nobody else do that? Of guests, you mean? A lot of our guests don't have a computer. That is true. They don't have a phone or an electric device. I don't have room for that giant reel-to-reel

whirr, whirr, whirr. Yeah. You gotta have a lady with a beehive haircut to run it with a stencil. You have a machine that heats up food? That's crazy. We do appreciate it, Craig. I love

the show and I love you guys. The other one who promotes us a lot is Richard Kind. Richard Kind has been a godsend to the show. I'll tell you something about that. First of all, a lot of you might be surprised to see me in a movie about Gilbert, but it's the law. I'm in every movie. I'm being edited into Bobby Guts Lumbago currently.

This is a truth. This is the truth. I'm a friend of George Clooney. I just thought it. I didn't say it. I didn't say it. But the thing about Gilbert, he is an angel and he's the devil. And I only hope that Kara, it's Dara.

Let me try it again. I'll have a little fun with it. Keep rolling. I'll have a little more fun with it. I hope Dara saved his life. That's Dara saved his life. He said, I have watched that over and over again. I have a cut.

I have a cut. I have a cut. I'll put it up. I have a preview of your movie. It has the boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Oh, yeah. You never show up. And he goes, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

And now one of the greatest, craziest, you know, and it's got the Letterman introduction. This guy, he's not just crazy. This guy's crazy. And it just cuts to Richard going, he's got the devil. And he's got an angel. And I think Dara saved his life. Richard Kind in Gilbert. I'll send it to you.

Because there's nothing more fun. Oh, Lord. It's just, it's two shooting fish. It's shooting Richard Kind in a barrel, which how fun would that be? This is the first Richard Kind imitation I've ever heard. It's flawless. It's pretty good. I do a pretty good Richard Kind.

Oh, my God. I can't imitate anybody else. But Richard, yes, I want to tell you something. I saw the show last night. And I say this because I've seen you great. You were terrible. It was terrible. I played Harold Hill, he told me, in his underwear,

which if you've never seen, treat yourself to that. I played Harold Hill. I was terrible, but I was a lot of fun to watch. I don't know. I still don't know what that means. When he was in here, I tried to get him to sing something from the music, man.

He wouldn't touch it. Well, you've got trouble, my friend. Actually, we were doing Guys and Dolls, and you think Guys and Dolls, that's bulletproof. You and Oliver Platt. Yeah, bulletproof. Bulletproof.

And my niece was doing the show in high school at the same time, and their run was longer i was like how do you do it week after week she's like i don't know i guess because we it was just so bad and it was really because it's lower east side jew and we had this canadian canuck it was the least uh it was just, it was so awful. And at any rate, but I think Oliver Platt lacked the director to tell him, you know, the guys who, what you need, Oliver Platt did say, you know this,

and I knew what to say and I didn't have the guts to say, which was go watch all the Bilko you can and watch all of – because the same guys wrote this. The same writers. It was the same writers. And to listen to the Skies and Dolls, I don't know if you've ever seen it, but you can't stop listening to it. It's perfect. And it's like a Bilko episode, but it's spiritual. It's all about – it's perfect that it's and it's a like a bilko episode but it's spiritual it's all about it's beautiful and the music is flawless it's just it's a it's a real masterpiece so and he was he was just kind of playing it uh very quiet because he's a very

good actor and he was searching and he didn't have a director to say no no no because they wanted to play the two leads wanted to play uh nathan and uh what's nathan and adelaide as kind of bonnie and clyde kind of in on it and uh i said no no you see no first of all nathan and adelaide are functionally retarded they shouldn't there's no reason that they should have lived this long that's how stupid they are they they're not they're these aren't smart people they're morons you know and uh when they get in trouble they're surrounded by all of these characters they're beloved love wins the day and all that but no they're not they're not bonnie and clive they're not shrewd it's the wrong approach yes and so there so there were misfires all over. Plus the staging was, we had animations. Like, so, you know, there's a scene where Sky Masterson takes this girl down to Havana.

So all you need is an offstage kind of, you know, you need Charlie Callis. Oh, yeah. Charlie Callis. We had a screen with an animation, like a $10,000 plane that flew over the audience and scared the shit out of everybody. Yeah, it was just ridiculous. Did you? You know, it's funny because you mentioned Bilko. And I think there's a case of also a show that was really well prepared because I think I was talking to Richard Belzer.

He saw like a really early episode and he said it didn't change. Yeah, it's true. You know, when you watch early episodes of sitcoms, all the characters are different. Yes, they don't have their mojo yet. Yeah, they would never say that they would never also well also the everybody's coming from the theater in the early television the writers and the actors are coming from the theater so there's still so and he's and

his character is a stay he's already this guy he knows he's already yes he's already there and all of everybody's cast and they've you know we, now it's the generation after the generation of people who did theater. They grew up on television and nobody's been in front of a live audience. I remember watching early episodes of Cheers. I'm a huge Ted. I think he's one of the great leading light comedian. He is. Of all television history.

And good in dramatic roles. Yes, he's just damn great. And I had an occasion to talk to him and I just said, where did that come? all television and good and dramatic roles. Yes. He's just damn great. And, uh, and, and, uh, I had an occasion to talk to him and I just said, uh, where did that come? I know that the first time I ever did a sitcom,

I grant, I noticed I was, I had made a decision to carry a small soda bottle because you did it on cheers and you kind of used it and you used it to drink. So I'd always have something to do. And I'd have like a little George Burns thing to button. A little piece of business. He goes, I did that with Dick Van Dyke.

The first few years on Cheers, I'm just, I'm not doing Dick Van Dyke, but I'm, I mean, I'm stealing and I'm just, I'm scared out of, everybody's got, I think everybody, that's with the drawing, with the dots, with everybody, everybody's stealing from everybody. I look at Nathan Lane, I think he's a tremendous comic actor, but I look at him and I see the history of American comedy. I'm glad you said that. When I went to see the producers,

I may have told you this before. I saw every comic actor in that performance. He was doing Burt Lahr. He was doing Ed Wynn. He was doing Zero. He was doing Gleason. Yes. He was just...

He's masterfully. Yes. It was like going to the Comedy Hall of Fame. he was doing Zero he was doing Gleason yes he was he was he's pulled down masterfully yes it was like it was like going to the Comedy Hall of Fame and and going in and out

and the thing that sets him apart from somebody who's just like a great like there's a guy who does Gleason I can't remember his name but he did the best Gleason ever

is and I don't know maybe he turned into a great actor is that Nathan's a great actor and if you don't know, maybe he turned into a great actor is that Nathan's a great actor. Yep.

And if you don't inhabit like Gleason inhabited, he, Gleason also did the hustler and there, you don't even think of Ralph Cramden. No, I don't think he crossed my mind when I saw him in the hustler, which is amazing because you'd think somebody in the hustle would go, you know, you look like Ralph Cramden. I mean, I'm just saying. Or soldier in the ring. Yeah. Yeah. great that's great acting yeah it's i mean i mean and he had he was something it's funny you said that about nathan lane yeah you really it's just you just it's he's got you could see what a fan of show business he is what how knowledgeable he is but he'll also go every one of those people, but everything starts from

the truth. You know, I did Music Man. I opened my mouth and it sounded like it sounded, but I'd been listening to Robert Preston all my life. I'm not going to change the choices, but if you don't inhabit the role, then you're just, you're at Disneyland in the Hall of Presidents. You know, you're just, you have to connect with the other person. You have to put it out on the line. And it's still acting. That's why I look at Nathan Lane and I love. Luke Costello, too.

That was the one I forgot. Oh, yes. You could name everybody. They're all in his performance. I don't, I think it's almost like Robin Williams is he probably can't help but absorb what's great. Yeah. It's an homage to all of them in a way. He's throwing them at you.

I always watched, like, when the Adams family was on, I always watched John Ashton and said, he's just Groucho Marx. Yeah, that's true. So was early Hawkeye Pierce. Oh, my God. Absolutely. And he'll tell you that. Yes.

You steal from the best. The nicest man I ever met. Alan Alda? Alan Alda. Me too. Well, there's so many of them, but he was one of the few celebrities who you meet and they turn out to be who you want them to be. And he had come to see Guys and Dolls, and he came backstage, and I was drawing all over my walls. I drew.

So I had all these characters from the 50s. Like in the Dice i had ralph crammed and i had norton i had it you know and he came and he saw it he told me all about his watching oh it just hit me his father was the original sky master sky masterson and i thought he's being very nice and deferential and he came a week later he came to see the show again only this is when it happened so it's alan alda you know i i actually told him i said you should walk around with a cup and actors should give you a dollar because everybody's stolen from you and uh you know i have nothing on me but because i'm doing broadway but if but

i would you know but uh really and he couldn't have been nice he came back with his wife arlene and he goes i wanted to show her the room you know with that smile yes and he comes and he couldn't have been nice he came back with his wife Arlene and he goes I wanted to show her the room you know with that smile oh yes and he comes and he shows her the room and I'm in a panic like a jack

a jack tripper oh shit I gotta get him out of here because I had invited Peter Tork to see the show what and Peter Tork can't coexist with us

because I always thought when I did the music man I wish I had invited why not invite Paul McCartney who sang told it was you why not invite Mike Nesbitt why not to the people what do you think how do you think people get ahead like or just get to meet people like smart I met so many people backstage why not just and so I said if it ever happens if I get I'm lucky enough to do a show and I had read that Peter Tork at that point was suffering from throat cancer. And I didn't have to get in touch with him.

But I went online. I found his manager. I said, if it would give him any comfort. I understand he's going through a challenging time. If it would give him any comfort, he wants to see the show. I would love to have. And he shows up, calls me from outside the theater. This was pre the monkeys like third explosion.

You know, it was right before that so he he called me goes can you let tell them to let me in please because they're not letting me in oh yeah can you believe that so he gets in i remember we had a particularly quiet show that night uh it was you know once we got our bad reviews audiences take their orders and they go we're watching a bad show but the previews they were dying but once we got our bad reviews, audiences take their orders and they go, we're watching a bad show. But the preview is they were dying. But as soon as the bad reviews come out, they just they stop. It stops like that.

And I just said, oh, this is too bad. I'll just pretend it's a good show. But Peter Tork is out there in the silence somewhere. So Peter Tork walks in. I've never met him. But I have this thing for the for the monkeys. And he walks up the stairs and I put my arms around him. And I remember thinking I wanted to feel like my older brother, but I'm feeling like my dad.

You know, I'm feeling a 70-year-old guy. I'm immortal. And then behind him I hear, hey, I just wanted to show Arlene. And I was like, get out of here. I'm with Peter Tork. Oh, wow. And he introduces himself. He goes, hi, I'm Alan get out of here. I'm with Peter Tork. Oh, wow. And he introduces himself. He goes, hi, I'm Alan Alda.

He goes, I'm Peter Tork. I used to be in show business. And, you know, making light of himself. He goes, but he didn't know who he was. And it was such a strange moment. But I was thrilled that Alan Alda came back. I was thrilled to hear the stories of Alan Alda talking about these Lower East Side Jewish comics doing these lines. And he repeated one of them for me, which was, I won't get the line right.

Steve Rosen, an actor, did it so great in the show. It was when they lose the crap game to Sky and now they've got to all go to the mission. Have you seen the play? Oh, yes. They all got to all go to the mission. Have you seen the play? Oh, yes. They all got to show up to the mission, and one of them, Big Joe Lee, I think, stands up and goes, or not one of the guys, Benny Southstreet stands up and goes, listen, I just want to say when the first Sky challenged us to a crap game against our souls, and if we lost, we'd have to show here.

I thought if we lose, I wouldn't want to be here. But now that I'm here, I still wish I wasn't here. Like, that's how Alan Alda did it. And he said the whole show was like that. It was Yiddish theater. Like, I still wish I wasn't here. That's great. Wow.

And he just said it was people were literally rolling in the aisles, tearing the carpet out. And he was very nice about our show. I think it was serviceable, but it was. That's tough. You're playing his dad's one of his dad's signature roles. He couldn't have been nicer. And, you know, there's not it's not it's yeah, it's a it's the Peter Lawford role. It's like it's like, yeah, you just got to be smooth and wear a suit.

He's the most down-to-earth person. He's actually – he's almost embarrassed about his celebrity because he's now – he's into science and he's such a – he's really such an intellectual. He's one of those people who, like we were talking the other night, like Steve Martin, who has – when I read his biography, I had no idea. Like he wasn't that funny that he didn't grow up. And he actually said, I have no talent whatsoever. I worked really hard. Someone literally when, you know, I started doing little things here and there, I started working at Disneyland. I got infatuated with this banjo player and the way he would toss off jokes.

And bit by bit, I got drawn into show business. And when I got a job on this Mother's Brothers show, the head writer actually said, you put the punchline here. And he drew a red circle. He said, you got to go back to the setup here. So the punchline comes after the setup. He said it was literally that level. And he just worked. And he said it took 10 years for him to build that, you know, that wild and crazy guy.

And that was largely what the book was about. And then he said the four years of rock stardom, he didn't really enjoy, you know. And I, again, it reminded me of the sort of that sense of I got everything I want. I'm having trouble feeling it. Yes. But in a different way because that's nothing. What you have is everything. But it's almost like James Taylor has this great line.

It's much too much emotion to hold in your hand. It's like the waves are out on the ocean. It's like trying to embrace the ocean. What you and Dara have, it's like trying to hold the ocean. It's too much. You'll never feel it. Just swim, you know know and that's what he said about you know being a this rock star he's like i gotta get out of this because what i am is

a quiet guy and i want to write he wanted to get to his other thing and the most amazing thing to know was i when i met him uh i was prepared to meet a legend an idol like a john lennon to me and uh he had been in the room for 10 minutes before i noticed him so he learned to turn on the klieg lights that lit up nassau calcium we both talked i saw that show at nassau calcium i saw the back row and he comes goes this is for you people in the back row. It's called the dime trick. And I just thought that was genius. And he was that guy.

And then I remember being heartbroken when he stopped. But now I have so much respect because he likes to sit there with his typewriter and he likes his art. And I can relate to that more. And when he walked into a restaurant, nobody looked up. he learned how to turn it off it's remarkable and i heard like steve martin uh and like they say he took a lot from carl valentine oh i think we that's hard to that's like i i've what did they say that about Bob Newhart taking from Shelley Berman? Yeah, Shelley Berman thought so.

Well, what would Shelley, I mean, listen, I have very strong personal feelings about the sanctity of a creation and having a conversation with somebody and coming to some agreement. I don't, uh, you know, uh you know, I have very strong feelings about it. And a great personal loss stood up for myself against it. I really do believe in the sanctity of somebody's creation that's sacred. But it would have been something completely different. Yeah.

You know, we were joking around last time because I am sort of like, be careful what you ask for if you want to be famous. I'm probably most famous for having turned down friends, right? Certainly in the industry. But what would have been worse? It's not on my cards. I wasn't going to bring it up. But what would have been worse? No, I go around barking it.

Listen, I just, you know, my first thought was, how do I make this my Jack Benny violin? I know I need something. I'm a leading man. It's going to be a little bit – I can't get up and just start talking about how hard life is. I need a thing. I got a thing. And it took me a while, but I found a way to use that. Very smart.

Yeah, you needed the – I needed my – yeah, you need your violin. I needed my – yeah, you need your violin. I just don't think – first of all, there would have been room enough for both of them to make phone calls. I remember watching Shelly Berman do the phone call of the woman on the roof or some guy jumping off the roof and never once thinking about Bob Newhart. Why did he stop? He didn't have to stop. Why did he stop? There's no have to stop. Why did he stop? There's no trademark on that.

And they were different. They were completely different styles. And, yeah, and Shelly Berman was coming from a dangerous place, a dangerous place, and Bob Newhart was coming from middle-of-the-road, you know, a tax accountant, funny guy, you know. Different styles entirely. I don't know. That was the thing i

didn't understand was what was the problem why did he stop doing the burman burman was his own worst enemy in certain ways he had a self-destructive streak that that hurt him especially early in his career that's too bad well i know there was that special right that i that have you ever seen that the tv special was an incident of him of him shouting i'd like to see it it was like pre-reality show it was a reality show where they followed him around a phone rings backstage yeah and he got angry yes and that followed him around and but i heard two other people who've been on the podcast say they think it was more than that. Like it was just he himself. I think so, too.

I don't think it can come down to a moment like that. I think, you know, I see it all the time. I started in trying to remember in your your mother was talking about when you were at the table about you get a video camera in here and suddenly he's he doesn't want to do what he's doing around. It was the molecule of you with your family. That was who you were with them. It was adorable. It was really, really something because otherwise I never would have seen

that part. But like, oh, I forgot. I'm 53. What the fuck? But I'm sure it was going to be great. Let it in later. And, you know, I'm getting the worst mental block now.

Go ahead. I'll help you. And it's killing me. The actress we've had on the show who's been in all the Scorsese films. We had Ileana Douglas. Ileana Douglas. She's got bigger eyes than I do. Between us, we got about 20 pound of eyeball. You did

the Ikea show with her. Yes. She's a doll. That was killing us, we got about 20 pound of eyeball. Well, you did the Ikea show with her. Yes. She's a doll. That was killing me. We love her. You mean the Ikea show? No, no. When Ileana Douglas was on, she said in her acting,

she was always trying to inhabit Richard Dreyfuss. That was like the thought. Imagine that. And she then told this to Richard Dreyfuss, and he said, well, I was always trying to inhabit Spencer Tracy. Yes. I'm glad you remembered that.

Yeah. That was insightful. See, I pay attention once in a while. I remember there was a period. Usually I take a once in a while. I remember there was a period. Usually I take a nap. I would have think you would have liked to have inhabited Elaine Joyce. Yes. How do you mean inhabited? You know what I mean.

Elaine Joyce. Of all the names from the pullout. I'm right, though. He could have said Juliet Prowse. He went for Elaine Joyce. Oh, my God. Now, Juliet Prowse. He went for Elaine Joyce. Oh, my God. Now, Juliet Prowse. South African.

Yeah, yeah. She is literally an African-American. And legs that goes up to the woman on the floor who lives above her. Yes, yes. Legs all day. Oh, boy. Do you want to talk about, in the time that we have left, do you want to talk, first of all, I want you to tell Gilbert. About sour grapes.

You know what? It was a funny thing that he did during sour grapes, and it was much funnier than anything in the movie. And I listened along. I am sorry. I'm sorry. I'll give you a, what was it, five bucks back then? I can't figure out why it was a misfire because every page of the script was laugh out loud funny. I don't know.

I don't know what happened. It was miscooked. I don't know what it was. I think it was the cast. It may have been. I may have been miscast. It's happened before. Oh, wait.

Here I wanted to bring up to you. He sat down across from me, and it was the first day he sat across from me. He goes, well. And I went, oh, I'm getting fired. Because we did struggle with the scene a little bit. Yeah. down across from me and it was the first day he sat across from me goes well and i went oh i'm getting fired uh because we did struggle with the scene a little bit yeah and uh he goes well i have decided to start eating with my mouth closed i'm 50 well you and weber got a lifelong friendship. I love Stephen like a brother. It's like when you were talking about Alan Alda talking about the early...

Guys and Dolls. Guys and Dolls. And how it was like Yiddish theater with them screaming out the lines. So, what is your opinion knowing that and to the movie version well i think a lot of it was uh that you talk um why didn't uh wouldn't you have loved to have seen dean martin yes play sky he was born to play him. Yeah. What happened there? Joe Mankiewicz. Yeah. I don't know.

I think Frank was a lot of it. But why did you pick a guy? Why would you? It's like picking You Know Who I Want to Sky? Benicio Del Toro. Oh, yes. It feels like a studio. It feels like a studio decision. Like it was a marketing decision. Hey, Brando's hot.

Yeah, they don't know. He'll play Sky Master. I think there are people who think only in terms of, you know, graphs, and they're not seeing what's going to work. The other problem is that the guy that owned the part on Broadway and did the shit out of it was probably considered unbankable as a movie actor, Robert Alden. That happened all the time. So you got that problem. My niece, who's very, very preternaturally smart at four years old said, Craig, why? Uncle Craig, why aren't you playing Harold Hill in the movie? And I said, I really don't know. And my mom, he says that it's because

you're not famous enough. And I said, well, that's probably true. Then why did you say you didn't know? I was like, listen, you're four. That's going to wear off in a while. You're going to end up without teeth. And I'm your uncle. All right. I love Matthew Broderick to death, but he did not have.

I never saw it. And I told him, I said, I can't watch it. I can't go back to that play unless I bring my kid or it's just too – I just think he lacked your presence. Well, I'm a big man. In the part. And also, you had the unenviable task of following Preston. I'll also say that I think – now, I never saw it but uh a lot of it i a

lot of it comes down to the director and they had a director who i did work with on boston legal he did a great job of directing boston legal but i never would have looked at this guy and said let's get him in river city because uh you it wasn't – it's a musical. But tell the Carol Burnett story to Gilbert while we're talking about it because it's worth telling. We had just made very violent love. And when we made love, it was always – it was – she said, take me to the edge. And I said, what do you mean the edge? Because I'm working with cutlery.

And she said, you know what I'm – I want to feel, I want to look at death right down the uh, no. Or the other, the other, you mean the other, the charming backstage story. Is it true that when, when she came, did she pull on our ear? Stop that. That's not right. Now that's not appropriate. That's not appropriate.

that's not appropriate I used to say I dreamt that I I was I was fucking my cat and I I he the cat turns around

and says something to me that's so inappropriate I'm not gonna repeat it but no when you were fucking Carol Burnett oh no stop it come on

did you ever come so hard That she afterwards Came out with a mop I don't know You know why Because I was hovering I was like a hovercraft Of ejaculate up and down

For half an hour It's like look at this Go by the window Look at this He's got six minutes of new material From the Carol Burnett From the Carol Burnett bit. I love Carol Burnett.

It's a sweet story. Hopefully he'll be quiet long enough for our listeners to hear. I think we've pretty much made it into the Manson murders now. Did Charlie Callis pass that one?

Oh, it's a touching story. He won't appreciate it. But our listeners will. Yes, he will. He has a heart. You saw the doc. I had mentioned earlier the girl I did that film with, Sally Murphy, who is an excellent actress. We hadn't seen each other for a number of years.

And this is one of those weird things that happens in life. I get cast in The Music Man, and she's doing a play called The Wild Party right across the street. We hadn't seen each other for close to 10 years. We're boyfriend and girlfriend. And we become friends again. party right across the street we had seen each other for close to 10 years we were boyfriend and girlfriend and uh all of us and we become friends again and there we are at the tony awards both standing on the edge of the stage watching whatever both about to go on for our respective shows and we looked at each other and we're like how about this shit but it was also too big to feel oh yes because a you've got a performance coming on But it was also too big to feel. Oh, yes.

Because, A, you've got a performance coming on. But it was like, even now, I look back and go, God, if we had known that. But Carol Burnett came up to me and I said, could this moment be any weirder? And I feel a tap on my shoulder. I turn around and it's my sex partner, Carol Burnett. my shoulder i turn around and it's my sex partner carol burnett and uh and carol and carol burnett says uh i saw your show and i loved it and i think you and i knew robert preston he was the greatest man you would have loved him and he would have loved you and i think you're sharing a soul right now and i did say you know it's a it's crazy you know you say these things in public because the private little moments but when you're scared and it's a new experience i just said if

you're up there and you want to take a ride anytime download yourself and i like to think you know he did that's nice you know that is and it was it was such a generous and i remember her saying that and uh she has got to be the warmest human being. She took my hand, and she's about to go do the Tonys too. It's scary. And for her to come over and take the time to say that to somebody that she doesn't know, I just thought it was an incredibly generous thing. That's very sweet. Those people make up for the—

People like Gilbert? The C-words you meet. You know what I remember? I've told this because I just... I've told stories. There are episodes where I would love... There's got to be a story that you've told every single episode. Yes.

Which story would it be? Cesar Romero and the Orange Widges. No, that stopped after a while. It waned. Yeah. But I remember a moment like that where you go, wow. I was on a show and I did some bit. I did just some shtick, improvised.

And afterwards, I feel a big hand on my shoulder and it's Vincent Price and he goes, I loved your Peter Lorre and I thought wow I wish your story came before mine so it had a chance

wouldn't that have been you cut it that's an amazing thing. I know what he means to you. Those moments are few and far between. Hey, it's why we do this. You look like a man who is so

packed up and ready to go home to his wife. No, no. I'm looking at the people out there. Okay. You haven't chimed in will you chime in i frank fedorosa chime in i haven't yes hello yeah hi well just chime in but what do you think how's the show going so far you listen to any of it when you guys let me know when to record what you want to do wasn't sam levine and geisen dolls yess a line? Yes, he was. Yes. I believe he was the original Nathan.

He was the original Nathan. You know, he had five songs. You know how much he ended up with? Nothing. Oh, jeez. Because he couldn't sing. And so out of town, there's a book about it, and he'd go, why are you cutting another song of mine?

And they said, Sam, because you can't sing. He said, what do you do? Play the song. He goes, hit a G. And they go, ding. And he go, hey. And he goes, that's why it's cut. He goes, what are you talking And they go, ding. And he go, hey. And he goes, that's why it's cut. He goes, what are you talking about?

That's great. What are you talking about? But they loved him so much that he was Nathan that they actually, his acting drove away the songs. There was a song that he and Sky sang called Travel Light. It's out there if you want to hear it. And you can't imagine the show. It doesn't, you know. Do you guys want to attempt something together?

Yeah, come here, get your pants off and let's just go. Let's see what happens. As you suggested on the phone? No, I don't want to try. I'll do whatever you want to do. I'll follow you. You start and I'll come in. All right.

Here, this may be a disaster, but we can always cut it out. Well, with your kind of belief in us, I don't see how it would go wrong. All right, Frankie. Who says something like that? What song are we going to do? We're going to try this one. Okay, what do we got, Frankie? Oh, he's setting up the tripod to shoot you guys doing this.

That's how confident he is. Oh, we don't want that. I think this would be a good promo when it's time. In fact, there was a part in the documentary where I'm going to sing with Dick Van Dyke. Oh. And he says to me in the beginning, very seriously, he goes, well, the beginning is like a D. Just do it. Gave up quickly.

All right. I like your confidence, Frankie. I might bail on this one. You see your parts, CB and GG? Yeah, yeah. Okay. Good luck. They call you lady luck

But there is room for doubt At times you have a very Unladylike way of running out You're on this date with me. The pickings have been lush. And yet before this evening is over, you might give me the brush. You might forget your manners

you might refuse to stay and so the best that I can do is pray oh disco Disco.

Luck be a lady tonight. Yes. Luck be a lady tonight. Luck, if you've ever been a lady to begin with, look, be a lady. All right, now time for the rest. Time for the rest. Look, let a gentleman see how nice a dame you can be. He's way off.

Oh, I don't know. I've seen the way you've treated all the guys you've been with. Luck be a lady with me. Luck be a lady with me. You know, Gilbert. A lady doesn't leave her escort. It isn't fair. And it's not nice. A lady doesn't wander all over the room.

And blow on some other guy's dice. Go! So, let's keep the party polite. Nice and polite. Not bad. Never get out of my sight. Paper close.

Stick with me, baby. Like flypaper, baby. I'm the fella that you came with. Yeah. Luck be a lady. Luck be a lady. And let it go now. Luck be a lady tonight.

I'm sure the guys playing their solos really appreciated that. Here we go. Hey, luck let a gentleman see How nice a dame you can be I know the way you've treated other guys You've been with luck to be a lady with me A lady wouldn't flirt with strangers She'd have a heart She'd have a soul

A lady wouldn't make little snake eyes at me When I, I bet my life on this roll. This part I really don't remember. Roll them, roll them, roll them, stick. I don't know this part. Rawhide. Rawhide. Roll them, roll them, roll them.

Go down. Don't ball. Go down. So let's keep this party to polite. Let's keep the party to the light. Let's keep the party to the light. Party's coming. Hey, yeah. Luck be a lady.

You ready? Luck be a lady. Tonight. Tonight. lady tonight how did all these people get in my dressing room oh straight from the bar ladies and gentlemen Gilbert Godfrey don't tell your mother

how did all these people get in my dressing room oh god in my dressing room. Oh, God. There are some ruined burial texas. Some nicely pressed burial tuxes are ruined.

Oh. I think Luck ran out. Luck is running up 6th Avenue by the Bronx right about now. 40 seconds in. You, you, my friend.

You had faith. I know. You had faith. Well, it's the death of me every time. Tell us, as we wrap it up, tell us about Unreal. Oh, Unreal. I love this show. I'm very proud to be a part of it.

It's great. It couldn't come at a more interesting time in history, actually, especially during the Me Too movement. Lifetime wanted to rebrand itself, which is always a loaded effort. You never know what's going to happen. It can go AMC and you get something like Mad Men or they can rebrand themselves and nothing happens. But it just so happens they wanted to do an edgy show that was created by Sarah Gertrude Shapiro and Marty Knox. And they hit it out of the park as far as it's a women. It's a show about women who don't who weigh more and are older than 28 there's like an entire demographic of women and it's uh and uh and i have a fantastic part i play a drug addicted producer of a reality show but it's a it's a very dark uh it's uh it's got a real heart and soul to it and um yeah and you're getting great notices for it, my friend. Oh, that's nice to know.

Congratulations. Thank you. Notices, press. You're getting a nice piece of press. What did they used to call it? Not notices. What did they used to call it? Buzz?

Oh, no. Notices. I just want to say you're going to make a beautiful dollar in this business. That's the one I like. I want to be a part of your television show i want to be your tony randall showing up with the blue blazer when alec baldwin doesn't show up you can it can be arranged i think this is your year yeah you might have to fight kind richard for the uh i have footage i'll send you of us we did we improvised something together that it never

happened but we were two owners of a hedge fund and we just improvised and it's four minutes of us uh just going nuts i have to send it to you because he's so fucking funny he's one of the funniest people i did see him live it's i you know i make fun of him a lot but there's he is there's no don nots or there's no one who does it. Well, there's you. You're the last of a dying breed. People who do something that nobody else can do. That's it. Imitated.

And then, you know, you see that they can do other stuff. I've seen Richard do beautiful, very quiet, you know, subtle drama. But but nope. This New Yorker cartoon he's become, you His work is, it's a creation. He's conscious of it. He's fully in control and he's a master at it. The Coen Brothers picture, the beauty of the performance

in the Pixar movie and Inside Out, he really deserves a lot of credit for his work. And his television work, you know? A lot of his stuff on Mad About You,

it's just, his timing is, and he's impeccable. Been great to this show, so we really, we have to thank him. I want to give, I have a suggestion.

Maury Riskind Rabinowitz. He's been dead for 15 years, but he's so funny. Maury Riskind. His brother's a rabbi. Before you get out of here, tell us about this charity that you work with, Loma Linda. Yeah, you know, I guess I was 45 years old and I realized, I don't know, this business of getting up in front of people, it seems silly to me. So I went to a children's hospital that my cousin had been inviting me to for uh years and i couldn't get out of it anymore i had no more excuses uh and my and my show that i was doing which was called

unhitched uh we called it unwatched uh you and rashida jones yes yeah yes we we had just gotten canceled but i promised i'll come out i'll'll shake some hands, you know, whatever. But I felt like such a loser. My show had just been canceled. And I really didn't know. I'm literally driving through a desert going, I got it with the metaphors. I got it. I'm driving through the desert not knowing that I want to do this anymore, literally. It's just, you know, I don't need to stand in front of people.

Plus, nothing works. Nothing seems to work. So I was having one of those days you could say and I went to this hospital and the woman said have you ever been to a children's hospital before I said well the once and then I had tonsils you know but other than that I was being cute she said okay well I just you know just so you know it's it can be emotional I was like I got it I got it you know I in and I lost it. I had never seen a preemie baby before. I'd never seen, and the kids with cancer who are watching television and laughing and playing,

I've been told that there was a baby just recently had passed away who a nurse was carrying during a night shift. And another nurse said, why don't you put the baby down while you're doing the paperwork? Said, we know that this baby isn't going to make it through the week. So all the nurses decided that its feet will never touch the ground and the baby's feet never touched the ground. And they, you know, they did beautiful things like this. I left there, uh, and the stories go on and on. And I left there. It's the Loma Linda Children's Hospital. I will give you information that you can insert later because I don't have. Please do. Please do.

I'm sorry. If you want to make a donation. It's a very worthy cause. You can't do it over the phone anymore. That's what Boo and I used to make films. And we still do it. But they don't have a call-in number anymore. But you can make a donation.

And what they've done is they're incredible. They were so thankful to me. And I listen i just got canceled the version of what you do is the patient died yeah you know and they're like it didn't hit them that the fact that anybody took the time to come and help uh and i realized i don't know what i can do it's too early for too late for med school but i can pimp the shit out of my friends. And I put on, every once in a while, we'll put on a benefit and make money. And I thought, if I can do this stuff and enjoy myself and feel like I'm contributing something to these people who are amazing, I feel good. And I got to pick people I got to appear with. So I met Mickey Dolenz.

I just said, he'll be in the show. And he showed up. That's fantastic. And he couldn't have been nicer. Martin Short showed up. Ryan Reynolds showed up. Will you put Gilbert in the next one? If you want to come, it's one of the most special evenings.

Only if I can sing. Yes. They would love it. We'd love to be there. It's a great charity. You've done great things for them. Thank you so much for mentioning it. Okay.

Thank you for mentioning it. Loma Linda Children's Hospital. We'll put the information on the website and on Facebook and on Twitter. Gil, you want to let this man go home? Okay, this has been Gilbert Godfrey's Amazing Colossal Podcast with

my co-host Frank Santopadre and we've been talking to Craigman Weyville Seiden. He shortened it. Seiden Weyville Seiden. I shortened

it for show business. My friend, thank you. Thank you. I love you. Shut up, Gilbert. Mothers of River City, heed that warning before it's too late. Watch for the ten-tailed signs of corruption. The minute your son leaves the house, does he rebuttal his knickerbockers below the knee?

Is there a nicotine stain on his index finger? Is he starting to memorize jokes out of Captain Billy's whiz bag are certain words creeping into his conversation. Words like swell. And so's your old man. But if so, my friends, you got trouble right here in River City. We're the capital T and that rhymes with P and that stands for pool. We've surely got trouble right here in River City. Remember the main Plymouth rock and the golden rule. Oh, we got trouble. We're in terrible, terrible trouble.

That game with the 15 numbered balls and the devil's tomb. I actually got trouble, trouble, trouble. I actually got trouble, trouble, trouble. The L-line with T. And that stands for fool. Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast is produced by Dara Gottfried and Frank Santapadre with audio production by Frank Verderosa. The Godfreed's Amazing Colossal Podcast is produced by Derek Godfreed and Frank Santapadre with audio production by Frank Verderosa.

Web and social media is handled by Mike Lee Pratton, Greg Pair, and John Bradley-Steeles. Special audio contributions by John Beach. Special thanks to Paul Rayburn, John Murray, John Fodiatis, and Nutmeg Creative. Especially Sam Giovonco and Daniel Farrell for their assistance.