Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - 260. John Davidson

Episode Date: May 20, 2019

A long sought-after guest, singer-actor-TV host John Davidson (finally!) joins Gilbert and Frank to talk about his six decades in show business, his admiration for stand-up comedians, his ability to play the role of "John Davidson" and his memories of working with Julie Andrews, Lucille Ball, George Carlin, Bob Hope and Elvis Presley. Also, John dines with Walt Disney, opens for Jack Benny, steers clear of Paul Lynde and guest-hosts "The Tonight Show" 87 times. PLUS: "The Streets of San Francisco"! In praise of Peter Marshall! The sex appeal of Ricardo Montalban! Don Rickles lays it on the line! And John looks back on the golden age of variety shows! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Alcohol in select markets. Product availability may vary by Regency app for details. This is Ron Friedman speaking under great duress, reminding you that this is Gilbert Gottfried's colossal, amazing, unbelievable, stimulating, should be rated X because it contains things that could be harmful to your genitals podcast. Lucky you. It could be a shitty weather report. Hi, this is Gilbert Gottfried, and this is Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast. He's laughing already. Yes, our guest is.

How does he do that? Do more, do more, do more. Oh, do more. Do it again, do it again. Your wife says that all the time. So I'm still Gilbert Gottfried, and this is still Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast with my co-host Frank Santopadre and our engineer Frank Ferdarosa. And our guest this week is someone who we wanted a book from the very beginning of this show, but in spite of our best efforts, he's cleverly

managed to evade us. I was scared. I was scared. I mean, who wouldn't be? You're an amazing persona. You are... You know, you're not a regular guy.

That's for sure. I mean that in the most loving way. You know, not a regular guy. That's for sure. I mean that in the most loving way. You know, so first of all, I thought, why would he ever? And Dara, your fabulous wife. How you ever got here, I don't know. I don't want to hear about that.

But she said, would you be on Gil's show? And I said, no. I said, first of all, what would he ever do with me? I couldn't get on Letterman years ago because he said I wasn't square enough and I wasn't hip enough. He wasn't square enough to make fun of me

and I wasn't hip enough to be cool. I've just never been. I'm the Hollywood square. So anyway, I couldn't get on Letterman. So I figured, what would you do with me? So it's... I'm so grateful to be here. And I'm still scared.

Now can I... Yes, go ahead. Oh, you want to speak on this show? Go ahead. No, I just... I want to... Go ahead. Get some of your credits in.

Pull yourself together. Anytime you want to jump in, that's fine. You were over there. Okay. He's a musician, singer, and he's playing

with his plastic water bottle. He's a musician, singer, recording artist, actor, former variety show and game show host, and one of the most versatile

and visible entertainments of the last half century. You've seen his familiar face on dozens of TV shows. Who wrote this shit? What is this? It's a bio. It's a long intro. That's not my bio. I don't say

that on my bio. Who gave you that? You're not versatile? I've never learned to do anything well. So let him get through it, John. Then you can dispute it. Go ahead. I'm so humble.

You called him an entertainment, by the way. He's an entertainment. Yeah. He's the entire, he's a television set in himself. And he's a familiar face on dozens of television shows, including The Entertainers, The Ed Sullivan Show, Here's Lucy, The Craft Music Hall, The Merv Griffin Show, The Carol Burnett Show, Love American Style, The Sonny and Cher Comedy Hour, Tony Orlando and Don, The Tonight Show starring Johnny Carson, a show he guest hosted 87 times. He's also served as host of the hit game shows, The $10,000 Pyramid.

Don't get through it. Maybe a little faster. And the Hollywood Squares, as well as his own variety show and talk show, the John Davidson Show and the John Davidson Show. He appeared in two Walt Disney musicals, starring, and he starred in his own NBC series, The Girl with Something Extra. Sally Field was the star of that show.

I was just her husband. Just shut up. I don't want to get through this. I'm sick of these interruptions. I have a show to do here. He guest starred in a memorable episode of The Streets of San Francisco, playing the part of a homicidal transvestite, a role he barely edged me out of.

For five seasons, he co-hosted the hit, hip, prime time, hit, prime time series, That's Incredible. And and somewhere along the line he found time to record 15 albums host award shows beauty pageants and christmas specials and star in his own one man show at the john davidson theater in Branson, Missouri. He even turned up in the movie Edward Scissorhands. You want to know who he's worked with? Everybody. George Burns, Gene Kelly, George Carlin, Richard Breyer, Chuck Berry,

Ella Fitzgerald, Mickey Rooney, Sid Caesar, Julie Andrews, Fred McMurray, Captain Kangaroo, the Ritz Brothers, and even Walt Disney himself, just to name a few. Please welcome the ideal guest for this podcast, a true show business renaissance man, and a man who posed nude. It wasn't nude. Yes, it was.

It was not. No, I was wearing a towel. It was for Cosmop... I was the follow-up to Burt Reynolds. It was not... It wasn't Playgirl. I was called a semi-nude. I had a semi-nude. It was very suggestive. I saw your schmeckle. No, no. I was

Mr. February, which is the shortest month, but it was so stupid. And... She'd never have done that. And claims... Oh, he posed nude and he claims... I didn't pose nude.

I was wearing a towel. Shut the fuck up, would you please? I'm trying to do a show. I brought this picture back. I showed it to Paul. All right. I'll tell you about it. John Davis. That was the biggest mistake.

People like Art Lincoln. The posing or the intro? The posing. Yeah, that intro. After I did that, I was a follow-up to bird reynolds it was so my manager said uh uh helen girley brown called said wants to do you as a center of all i said this is ridiculous no one wants to see me nude i don't have that kind of a thing i'm not a tom jones or an ankle bird or that sort of a thing so i did this picture and I brought it back and showed it to Paul Lynn on the Hollywood screen.

Oh, God. Paul Lynn took one look, and he said, well, you should have been the ambassador to underdeveloped countries. You know that that stuff was all written for Paul Lynn. Of course. Yeah. But in a way, how do you relate to Paul Lynn? Did he make you laugh? Because he had that sort of element like Gilbert, isn't it?

You know what? I remember seeing some, well, it was a documentary about the history of Hollywood Square, something we have in common, both you and I. And they would say, oh, like the host would ask a question and you could see the wheels turning in Paul Lynn's head. And and and he put in gay reference. I would shock every. And then when you listen to it, the questions are. And who do you find in fairy land?

And where do you locate Boys Town? Well, Bruce Valanche was writing some of those questions, setting them up. Yeah, and you're going, oh, he, but it's Paul Lynn being such a rebel, I put in gay jokes. He never did stand up. He's just a guy that said things funny in a funny way. But he never wrote any of it as you do. He wasn't that kind of a performer at all. And he hated the Jews.

Yeah, yeah. I heard he would get drunk in the lunch hour. All the other guests were having fun. And Paul Lynn would be there there bombed out of his skull going oh those fucking jews they're the reason i don't have a career you found him to be a dark character didn't you john well i did yeah and because i when i was when i was guessing when i was hosting the show joan rivers was my center square. But when Peter, Peter Marshall, the classic host, was doing, Paul was in the center, of course. And Karen Valentine would be on his left, and I would be on his left, I was on his right.

And he was mean to us. He was really a mean guy. I don't mind saying that. And he was miserable. I think he just had a, I don't know, he just wasn't a very nice man. At least to me, he wasn't. No, I've heard that. And then when he got drunk, he was a mean drunk.

I never hung out with him. I tried to stay away from him. And I got the feeling that Peter Marshall tried to stay away from him. I just, I don't know. I mean, I don't know that. But I think we all just kind of tiptoed around him so he wouldn't get ticked off. It was unfortunate because he made people laugh. We've now had all three Hollywood Squares hosts on this show.

Oh, my God. We had Tom. Wasn't he great? And Peter. Yeah. Both great. Tom was live. Peter was on Skype.

Peter's 93 or something. Lovely man and sharp as hell. He's still singing. Yeah, he was great. And still has the voice, the same voice, same personality. Circle gets the square. A wonderful guest. See, I like doing Hollywood squares.

Did you do a lot of them? Not when I, I don't think I ever had you on when I was hosting. No, no. I did it when it was. With Bergeron. First, yeah. First it was Whoopi Goldberg was producing, and then later on Henry Winkler. And it was Bergeron was the host.

Oh, later then. That was after. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's a classic idea. You set people up to be funny, and it works. It was fun.

Yeah. Yeah. Tell us about Bert Lahr, John. I don't think we've had anybody who's ever worked with him on this show. Bert Lahr, of course, is a cowardly lion for people that don't know that name. But if I were king of the jungle. And I straight out of college, I got to New York, and I was a college graduate,

and it was a part David Merrick audition for a part of a college graduate who goes to the Yukon to visit his dad and his buddies, and I was the son of one of these buddies. And so I was just perfect for it. See, when I got to New York, nobody smiled. I came from Denison where I had the Denison hello. I was walking down 42nd Street saying, hi, how are you? Only hookers and gay guys would speak back to me.

So it was like, I couldn't understand why everybody wasn't saying hi to me. But I smiled a lot. And everyone else was doing Al Pacino and Robert De Niro in this very, you know, serious. New York method, yeah. And so my first role was in Foxy with Burt Lahr, and Burt Lahr was a worrier. It never was funny enough for him. Are you like that, Gil? Do you go offstage and say, God, it just wasn't funny enough to you?

Are you? Oh, yeah. You get down on yourself. You're trying, how can I make it funnier? Because a lot of comedians are too hard on themselves. Because a lot of comedians are too hard on themselves. Sometimes when I'm on stage, I feel like, or doing an interview, I feel like, oh, well, that was a bad Gilbert Gottfried imitation I just did. You're hard on yourself anyway.

Yeah. When you do sets. I think. Yeah. Yeah. You're not satisfied that easily. No. No. Burt Lahr was like that.

Oh, and you know what? Jumping around again, when you said you weren't happy with posing with your penis out. It was. I was wearing a towel. I heard, I saw in interviews, Burt Reynolds regrets having. He did it before John. Yeah. He was the first.

Oh, he was the first. Yeah. Yeah. My manager thought it would broaden my image or something. But I think, I don't know. As I say, Art Linkletter caught me at a restaurant, the old Brown Derby. I'll never forget. And he said, why did you do that?

And I guess it was a mistake. I don't know. I mean, what did I want? What did I expect? I don't know. As I say, my dad was a preacher. I was a preacher's kid. I'm an atheist. I'm a secular, progressive Democrat. But it upset my folks, you know, because I was a preacher's kid. Did going into the business upset my folks because I was a preacher's kid. Did going into the business upset your folks? They okay with that? My first contract was with Columbia Records and they were going to have a cocktail party

and my folks stupidly said, well, are they going to serve alcohol? Wow. It's a cocktail party. And I said, of course they are. But right away they saw that I was going to do my career. And that's just, but they, right away, they saw that I was going to do my career. But you mentioned George Carlin.

I went out to the West Coast in 66, now this is during the 60s, to host the Craftsman Music Hall. Bob Banner, the television producer, discovered me in a Broadway show. Sure, we know that name. In Foxy, in Foxy. Yeah, we know that name.

Big name. Bob Banner had discovered Carol Burnett and developed her. Yeah. He said, I want you to be a variety show host. i said i just want to play curly in oklahoma or what i just want to be you know the music man in in harold hill and he said no you can you can figure out how to play john davidson we can talk about that i consider john davidson a character that i played all these anyway so he brought me out to California and I hear George Carlin

was the writer of the show and also Richie Pryor was on the show. And I was sort of in a bubble. I was just, I looked so cute and so wholesome. A lot like Gil. And so I think George,

it was like oil and water. I mean, George, this is the button down, Carl, and though, right before, before the transition back then.

Yeah. And prior to, I think they didn't know what to do with me. And I didn't know, really, we never hung out with them. I'm so sorry for that. Since I've met, since George passed away,

I met his daughter, Kelly. Kelly. And we had her here. She's lovely. Yeah. And, uh,

just, we talked about those, those years when I was just so in another, you know, I was like Pat Boone back then. It was really a very, and the greatest thing that happened to me is meeting people like Gil and George and Richie and people in show business that broadened my life. That's why I became a theater arts major, because of the people. Right. Well, you're quick to describe your dad as a Northern Baptist, not a Southern Baptist. So they weren't that conservative.

They can dance. Yes, right. Yeah. As a matter of fact, it was hard to pin him down. I would say, you know, Dad, really? The virgin birth, the resurrection, the walking on water, you know, changing. And he said, what does it matter whether that happened or not? Look at what Jesus did for the world.

Well, we've killed a lot of people because of Christianity. It started a lot of wars. You can't make the case that morality has to be with a supreme being or with a Jesus. Morality was there long before Jesus. He collected a bunch of the good. And who knows what Jesus really said? I mean, the Bible was written 30 years after Jesus died. These were verbal stories.

So when they say this, these are the words of Jesus Christ. Well, come on. Do you spar with him about this stuff? You couldn't spar with him. He'd say, what does it matter? Look what the church is doing. Well, look what psychology is. It'd be better to get a good psychiatrist, I think, than to become religious.

I blame Gilbert for a lot of that violence that you mentioned. And when I heard you were friends with Penn Jillette. I love Penn Jillette. I love Penn. First of all, their show is a killer show. Oh, yes. I love Penn Jillette. I love Penn. First of all, their show is a killer show. Oh, yes. I've seen it three times. And so I knew then.

I said, well, this guy's an atheist. If Penn sneezes and you say, God bless you. Oh, yeah, he's hardcore. No, he doesn't. He's hardcore. But he and I did the Free Thought Society thing in Washington. We went and spoke on the green there in Washington. So exciting.

That video's online. I think it is. Yeah, you're singing that song about being a liberal that we were talking about. Yeah, I love Roy Zimmerman. Roy Zimmerman is a singing activist, guitar player, songwriter. I hope I said that it's a Roy Zimmerman song. I think I gave him credit for that. You did, for sure. I hope I said that it's a Roy Zimmerman song. I think I gave him credit for that. You did, for sure.

I admire him a lot. But I told a story on that about, they asked me to sing the seventh inning stretch at the Kansas City Royals game because I was doing a show in Kansas City. This is before I came out as an atheist. And you're going to sing, take me out to the ball game,

take me out to the park., take me out to the park? Great. Three days before I'm supposed to do it, they said, John, we've changed our idea here. We want you to sing

God Bless America. And I thought, I just, I can't, I don't want to sing that song. I just, I don't want to, I know my little statement

isn't going to mean anything to anybody, but it, so I said, I've got a rehearsal at the theater. I'm sorry, I don't want to do the seventh, and I canceled. Looking back on it, what would have happened if I walked out in the field, take the microphone, and sang, I love America. It's the land that I love.

Stand beside her and guide her. The lights from above through the mountains. I love America. My home sweet home. I love America. My home sweet home. They might have shot my ass right out of there. They might have Jose Feliciano'd you.

Remember that? No. When he impro shot my ass right out of there. They might have Jose Feliciano'd you. Remember that? No. When he improvised the Star Spangled Banner on an acoustic guitar. And he got a lot of hate mail for it. Maybe it was the World Series. Yes, I'm an atheist. There came a point where I just, I've wrestled with religion all my life. In college, I was a philosophy major because I wanted to be

closer to my dad. Because my dad was a philosophy major, but went to semin closer to my dad because my dad was a philosophy major but went to seminary and my first two courses were logic 101 and comparative religions of the world well right logic and religion just doesn't go together and and religions of the world you begin to realize that man created religion out of his fears and because of his self-doubt and his way of getting through life. There's no question that man created religion, created gods, all the Greek gods. Are we an atheist because I don't believe in Zeus? It's interesting.

No. Sam Harris. I saw what you're talking about, Sam Harris. I said to my wife, I'm going to get along with this guy. Christopher Hitchens. Richard Dawson. Can't get, Sam Harris. I said to my wife, I'm going to get along with this guy. Oh, Christopher Hitchens. Richard Dawson. Can't get enough of him. What are you, a Satanist?

The first time I said, I don't believe in God, I really thought that lightning was going to strike me. Yeah. Weren't you going to follow in Dad's footsteps when you were young? Get off my show, you Christ killer. I figured out right away only christians were the reason why i want to be a preacher yeah was to get up in front of people that's right that was the part that attracted you i didn't want to do funerals i don't want to visit people in hospitals i want to get up and speak in front of you see i bet you i mean aside from the money that preachers get, I bet you like probably 99% of them love the Adulation and love the crowd. What about Jackie Mason, right?

Was it a canter? It's a great position to be in. I think that's the other thing. I wanted the respect and the love, the adoration that my dad got. Because I grew up seeing him in the pulpit wearing these great robes. And people were mesmerized by what he said. Well, that's a cool position to be in. And your father looked like God's messenger.

Like he said here. That's right. But you're selling voodoo. Yeah. It's voodoo. here you that's right but you're selling voodoo yeah it's voodoo and uh it's it's uh you know i spent a lot of time in mexico where these poor people walk up to these cathedrals that they think of the money the catholic church has oh my god and george carlin said the first thing he learned about god was that he always needs money he's always short of money anyway yeah you know what was the weirdest story

though that came out with uh with his daughter uh george carlin when when his when the mother mrs carlin was pregnant with george yeah they they discussed it and they discussed uh having an abortion when george was in her belly yeah that's true and she went to the abortion doctor and saw a picture of the virgin mary on the wall and felt so much guilt that she didn't have the abortion, thus giving birth to one of like the most anti-religion people. A spokesman for the movement. Let me not hesitate to say that just like Penn Jillette does not say when he entertains people as a magician, he never gets into anti-religion. It's on his podcast and i don't public about it and i don't in my show either no but i do my shows now i i do jokes i sing songs i

i i might mention that i'm not religious but i i don't carry on about it at all i entertain people yeah it's like talking about politics and yeah so you fell in love with performing and you came when you came to new york what were you in your 20s and early 20s? Yeah, 23, 24. 23. Yeah. And my first television show was The Fantastics. I played the boy on The Fantastics. Ricardo Mantelban. Ricardo Mantelban.

Cordoba. I had such a crush on Ricardo Mantelban. Did you? See, I think it's very normal for guys to have crushes on other guys. You see, Gil? Yeah. You see?

Are you a hard ass about the gay life? Are you not? Just teasing him. Okay. I'm not gay. I've never had a gay relationship. I've been married for 46 years. Holy crap. To two different women. But Ricardo struck a chord.

But I've certainly been attracted to men. Not sexually, but just want to be closer to them. And gee, I'd like to be like that guy. I mean, that's what keeps fraternities together, right? And it's so natural. fraternities together, right? And it's so natural. I think we've evolved so much in this country to recognizing that gayness, that homosexuality is a human response. I think so many of us are bisexual. Again, I've never had a gay relationship, but I think it's so normal to be bisexual to be attracted to anybody any human being i think that's the most normal thing in the world you're quiet now because hey you're going bisexual what are you a? Hey, you ever like to take it?

I'm getting back on track here, John. You're in your 20s. You're on Broadway. Bob Banner sees you in Foxy, decides this guy is a project I'm going to take on, and helps you build a persona. I said, I just want to be a leading man on Broadway. He said, no. You got to be, you want to build a persona? I said, I just want to be a leading man on Broadway. He said, no. You want to be a spear?

Tony Bennett is a spear. He does one thing, does it very well. Johnny Mathis. Johnny Mathis is a spear. He does one thing very well. He's never tried to act or do other things. He said, you're going to be a Swiss Army knife. I used to say a pitchfork, and now I say Swiss Army knife.

In other words, if someone, you want to do Shakespeare? Yeah, I can do Shakespeare. You want to host a game show? I'll do that. Yeah, you want to sing God Bless America at the Kansas City Ballgame? No. You want to, whatever. So I've done a sitcom, you know, I've done Broadway musicals,

I've done a nightclub act, I've done serious drama, whatever. That's why we refer to you as versatile in the introduction. Oh, that's right. You are a Swiss Army Knife. I'm a Swiss Army Knife. But I've never made it. I mean, people say I'm over the

hill. Well, I don't remember peaking. I never made it. I was just one of those guys trying to get it right. I'm still trying to get it right. We can dispute that. So he had a whole plan for you. This is what you're going to do.

Yeah. As he did with Carol Burnett, didn't it work? Was he involved with Bob Newhart's career as well? And Dom DeLuise? Dom DeLuise, yes. But he does television. DeLuise got into film. And Bob Newhart got into other types of TV.

But we all started on the entertainers. That's right, in 65. Right. Frank, you know so much. Well, a lot of it is research. A lot of it I remember. Gil, not so much. It took him 15 minutes to crack the code.

Yeah. I've got to talk to you about some of those variety shows, because these are shows we've talked about, Gilbert. Yeah, I... Hollywood Palace, Craft Summer Music Hall, you mentioned. I remember Barbara Felden was on this show. Who John worked with. Oh, tell us about working with Barbara.

I don't remember. Oh, okay. I mean, she was great. Sally Field is the gal that I've just, there's another crush I had. I had a crush on Sally Field. Gidget. Yeah, but then we did The Girl with Something Extra, and she was in transition between becoming the Academy Award winner twice,

and she wasn't Gidget in The Girl with Something Extra, but she wasn't yet Sybil, and she did Sybil or something, but it was right around that time. She helped me so much with acting, and Sally Field is a great lady. Here's quickly, just because I told you,

because I plugged this, I threatened you with this before we started, a short list of people that we've had here on this show that you work with. Bernie Coppell, Ed Asner, Tony Orlando, Orson Bean, Paul Williams, Dick Cavpell, Ed Asner, Tony Orlando, Orson Bean,

Paul Williams, Dick Cavett, John Beiner, Tony Sandler of Sandler & Young, Alan Alda, Barbara Felden, Ronnie Schell, David Steinberg, Rich Little, who you worked with a lot, and Robert Wagner. That's a lot of people. For a guy that didn't make it.

I never made it. Was I any good in those shows? I'm sure you were. I was good at times. I've been good. I've had good moments, but I always think I can do it better. I always think, you know...

I found it interesting. You said to somebody who asked you that your best role you think is still to come. I'm still, yeah. Yeah, your best work. Right now, I'm trying to put together a show for Birdland. I'm coming into Birdland the end of May. Right here, New York City.

And I've never played Birdland. This is New York City. I used to play the Persian Room at the Plaza years ago, but that was the old... Wow. Now, I'm reinventing myself as a troubadour with my guitar. And singer-songwriter, written a lot of original songs and stuff.

But I wrote a song for Gil. I want to share this. Oh, wonderful. Even though I'm in my... Perfect. I thought in my 70s I would have all the answers. But now I have more questions

than answers. Why do men have nipples? Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. Why do men have nipples? How come Tarzan has no beard? Think about that. Why do bars have parking lots if I can't drink and drive? Am I the only one who finds this weird? Why did Adam and Eve need navels?

Think about it! Yeah. If your doctor's practicing, is he practicing on you? Why wash my bath towels? I'm so clean when I use them. What are training bras

training them to do? Why did kamikazes wear helmets? See, you like the sick ones because you're really a sick fuck. Why is a boxing ring square? How will I know when my invisible ink runs out? Why isn't mouse-flavored cat food in stores everywhere?

Why are there Braille dots on drive-up ATMs? Is the alphabet in that order because of the song? Why did Superman wear his underpants outside? And why have you let this song go on this long? There he is, ladies and gentlemen. John Davidson. Versatile, versatile. I never thought I'd hear John Davidson call me a sick fuck.

Wow. That's like the biggest honor. I did that for you. I did that for you. It's Carlin-esque in its absurdity and its observations of absurd things. Yeah, and he's a sick fuck. Yeah. Or Stephen Wright, too.

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Hot chicken in the window. This is one of many sounds in Tennessee with a story to tell. To hear them in person, plan your trip at tnvacation.com. Tennessee sounds perfect. Tennessee sounds perfect. And it's funny, when you were talking before about wanting to get better, we had on Bruce Stern on the show. And Bruce Stern, I don't know how old he is now, how many movies.

And he said he's still trying to be a better actor. Aren't you trying to be a better stand-up? No, I've given up. As long as the check. No, you care about this stuff. You do. It's a, you know, I suppose you've dealt with the criticism that it's easy to be funny if you're dirty, right? Yeah.

You go way beyond that because these are clever things that you're saying. You're not part of a shock jock in the morning, right? That's one way of being funny. You go way beyond that. Have you seen him live lately, John? I saw the great documentary. Oh, you saw the doc? The documentary has great moments.

Yes, it sure does. Where you're just slaying him, just slaying him. No, I would love, when can I see you live? Because you saw the doc. The documentary has great moments. Yes, it sure does. Where you're just slaying him, just slaying him. No, I would love, when can I see you live? Because you're not here. I'll give you a hip price ticket. I can pay for a ticket now. Yeah, the documentary is called Gilbert. What?

The documentary is called Gilbert. We'll give Neil Berkley a plug too. He did a great job. And where do people find that? On Hulu, I think was the last. I mean, you've got to, too. He did a great job. And where do people find that? On Hulu, I think, was the last. I mean, you've got to see this. There are a bunch under Gilbert's bed. I mean, it's an inspiration.

It's touching. It'll make you cry at times. You know, do you mind that? No. Yeah. Very good. I sort of had a crush on you during it. So speaking about crushes.

You just want to fuck every guy you see. I like people. I usually... Especially men. No, no. What the fuck is the matter with you? I have crushes on a lot of women. I could go on and on.

He's talking about non-sexual crushes, Gil. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. That's the crushes women have on me. How did you find your way into those... How did you find your way into two how did you find your way into two disney live action musicals they saw me on a bell telephone hour way in the 65 or something uh mary poppins had just come out and so they wanted to make the follow-up to mary poppins and they signed me to a three picture deal actually

was banner managing you at that point banner which let me see was. Before Jerry Weintraub came along. Yeah. Yeah. I guess, you know what? When I went out for the screen test, he wasn't. But then during that is when he signed me. Two of them, one was called The Happiest Millionaire. Sure. And Walt Disney was alive. And we called him Walt.

He ate in the commissary on the table. That's the last movie he was directly involved in. Exactly. Frank, you know so much. He called me John. And that's Walt Disney. I also worked for the company. He called me John.

Really? Yeah. And he wanted me to call him Walt. By the way, he was a chain smoker. Smoking one cigarette after another. I heard, someone told me that back when Disney was alive, there used to be a guy whose whole job was to take photos of Disney and erase the cigarette from his hand. I'll bet. I'll bet.

That's interesting. If the employees of Disney were screwing off, they knew it was time to get back to work by his loud cough. I don't remember him coughing. I don't remember that at all. No, I don't. We didn't see him. We saw him at lunch. And when he was coming to the set, everybody said, Mr. Disney. They'd say, Mr. Disney.

No, they wouldn't. They'd say, Walt. Walt's coming. Walt's coming coming to the set, everybody said, Mr. Disney. They'd say, Mr. Disney. No, they wouldn't. They'd say, Walt. Walt's coming. Walt's coming down to the set. And so we'd all get nervous and we'd try to act like we were making a movie while he was standing around because we were still in awe of him.

But I never heard him cough, I got to say that. But then the second film was called The One and Only Genuine Original Family Band. Yep, with Walter Brennan. With Walter Brennan, Buddy Epson. Another guy who hated the Jews. And blacks. Walter Brennan hated blacks and Jews.

He was very, yes, I can understand that. I tried to stay away from him. Yeah, I hated blacks and Jews. Very good, Gil. That's disturbing and accurate at the same time. Can't stand those shoes. But in both those films, I had another crush on Leslie Ann Warren. Yeah.

I heard an interview with the two of you for the 50th anniversary. Yeah. And she doesn't remember you having a crush on her, and you don't remember being set up on a date with her. I kissed her once in makeup yeah and we we kind of held on a bit i thought geez this is she had her eyes were so big you wouldn't think they could be coordinated but they they went the same they worked together but they these huge eyes and uh just just great she was too much for me though i realized that she she was too most actresses are, are

emotional and volatile. That's what makes them great. So, and, and I just, I've never been like that. I've never, I felt more stable or something. I don't know. How about Fred McMurray, who was known as the cheapest man in Hollywood? He said what? It was supposedly the cheapest man in Hollywood, Fred McMurray. I said, what are we doing here? He said, you know, I was a saxophone player. And they came up and said, you want to make a movie about a boxer? I forget what his first film. He said, I'm the least likely guy to be in this business. He was just a shy saxophone player. Came a star. And they thought he was good the way he sort of mumbled. And great man, nice man, but not show busy at all. Didn't you ask him to be a guest on your talk show years later?

I did. Because I was sitting in for Carson. Yeah. And I said, you know, it's important for me to have important people on. Sure. And he said, I just can't do that. I don't do talk shows well. And maybe he was right.

I don't know. That was the thing. When I sat in for Carson, I wanted to have Jacques Cousteau on. And they said well no that wasn't good we'll give you ruth buzzy we'll go yeah i would love ruth i wanted to have kenny rogers on and they said he's a singer i said kenny rogers is a storyteller uh-huh amazing personality so i finally had him on and it worked but but yeah, so when you sat in for Carson, you realized that, I mean, Johnny's name is on the coffee

mug, on the pencils. Yeah, the cigarette case on the desk. The chair is his. I did that three times in my career. I took over people's shows briefly, the Carson show when guesting. And then I took over the Mike Douglas show in the afternoon. Mike Douglas said some terrible

things about me. It was very, you know, just he resented the fact that I took. But his producers were letting him go and they came to either me or Dick Clark and I got it over Dick. I think maybe Dick Clark turned it down, but they told me that they chose me. The third one is the music

man. When I first started being Harold Hill, I did a lot of tours playing Harold Hill. I had to fill Robert Preston was the music man. And I thought, if I can't be Preston, then I can't do it. Sure. I discovered, and anybody just getting any line of work, you've got to bring your own shoes to the studio, to the stage. You can't fill people's shoes. That's interesting.

And now I just realized we've had two stars of the music man. Our friend Craig Bierko, I don't know if you know Craig of the music. Our friend Craig Bjerko. I don't know if you know Craig. Oh, yeah. He did it on Broadway and he did it wonderfully. Oh, I saw you. It was wonderful. He had to audition for Meredith Wilson's widow to get the job.

And he was, you know, the music man back now with a huge, huge album. I know. It's going to be fast. I'm sure he will be. I'm sure he will. He's cut out for it. Fred McMurray is one of those people. There were a handful of people who owned California.

Real estate. Oh, yeah. He bought a lot of it. Their idea, like Bob Hope, was to buy land. Buy land. And Bing Crosby. Yeah. And what was the hero?

Gene Autry bought a lot of land. Gene Autry. Yeah. And TV stations. You and Leslie Ann are charming in that movie. Yeah. You have those of land. Gene Autry. Yeah. And TV stations. You and Lesley-Anne are charming in that movie. Yeah, you have those nice songs, Bout Time, together. You can see all that stuff, those great Sherman books. It was great.

Yeah. But she was dating Peters. John Peters, the hairdresser. John Peters, the hairdresser. Right. I thought, come on. Now, here's a name I have to ask you about because I got such a scary reaction from Robert Wagner. Have you ever worked with or met Jerry Lewis? Yeah.

I wish we were a video podcast in that moment. He's a great man. He's a great man. I did the telethon and did that, and he was very nice to me. There you go. But, oh, I heard some terrible stories. I don't want to go there. It was very nice to me.

I was afraid of him, as I was of you. You know what? Let me say here and now, I'm not afraid of you anymore as I was of you. You know what? Let me say here and now, I'm not afraid of you anymore. That's nice. That's nice. That's why it took us five years to get him here. You've lost your edge. So after those two movies, did you and Banner, did you think, I'll have a movie career now?

I don't know. Did you want to go back to the stage? Did you want to just keep doing musicals? I don't know. I was playing a lot of Vegas. I played the Elvis showroom. I can't believe what I was making in Vegas those years. Did you meet Elvis on your travels?

I met Elvis twice. I went to see his show and went backstage, met his dad. I went back to the dressing room full of women. He had girls lined up on the couch. I thought, oh, this is great. It's good to be the king. Yeah. And Elvis was just a great little country boy.

You know, just always was this very country boy. Everybody that we've had on this show that worked with him found him very polite and very gracious. Right, George Shapiro and last week Erwin Winkler? Yeah. It was almost a sad moment. Now, here it took all the self-control I have not to get to this. You worked with Milton

Burrell. Yeah. You know where he's going, John, with this. I don't know. Have you heard about I know you're not religious. He apparently has a very large penis. Yeah, he's blessed with a large penis. There are stories about him wanting to show it to people. Sure.

Yes. I never saw that. I don't know. They didn't want to show it to me. I don't know. The only thing, I did a benefit or something in New York, and I did a couple of jokes when I was just starting out, and it was awkward.

You know, I was trying to be like you, and I was just starting, and he came up after me and said, John, just sing. Just sing. Forget about the jokes. And I said, okay. But I love, I was always jealous of the opening act. My opening act for years was Jay Leno.

Oh. And then Kip Adata. Oh, I remember Kip Adata. Yes. Funny guy. Sure. Yeah. And I was always jealous of the reality.

Still around. Lonnie Shore, Freddie Roman. Lonnie Shore. Freddie Roman's a killer actor. Funny guys. Oh, Shore. Freddie Roman's a killer actor. Funny guys. Rich Little. And I always wanted to get that response that you guys get. If you're just a singer, people might cheer or applaud, but they don't laugh.

And laughing, an audience is really giving you so much, that love. I wanted that. And so I started stealing the jokes from the opening act. No, no, love. I wanted that. And so I started stealing the jokes from the opening. No, no, no, I didn't. You know how I started doing jokes? Jack Benny, first of all, presented me first at Caesars Palace. Oh, I was going to ask you about Benny.

In 66. Sure. And Caesars was just opening and I would watch Jack Benny every night. And so after that I would say, you know, I just came from Las Vegas and I just worked with Jack Benny every night after that. And so after that, I would say, you know, I just came from Las Vegas. I just worked with Jack Benny. And Jack Benny would say, and without doing, I don't do an impressions well, I would do Jack Benny's stuff by saying it's Jack Benny.

And across the street was Dean Martin. Well, Dean Martin says, you know, when we crawled in bed one night last week, I found we had the same physique you brought a new kind of love to me and i do some of his parody things like these stupid parties you know uh-huh you know the night when i came home you said you weren't alone you said you were alone you said he was a nudist who came in to use the phone. Oh, thank you so much. But I would give them credit from the comedian,

and that's how I started doing jokes. And then I would try to find my own. Now, tell us about Jack Benny. Incredible ego, you know, very secure in what he was doing. But I was just, I did 15 minutes and maybe 20 in what he was doing. I was, but I was just, I did 15 minutes and maybe 20 in his show. Just songs.

Yeah, songs. Yeah. No, just singing. Yeah. And then he did a little shtick with me on stage and it was very, well, John,

you know, how do you, you know, it was very, he was very secure in what he did and I really didn't get to know Jack Benny. He got,

he was very close to Johnny. To Carson. Yeah. Yeah. I don't, I don't quite believe that. I doubt anybody was really close to John. That's interesting.

I bet Ed McMahon was not close to Jerry. Interesting. Well, tell us about that. He was such a gentleman and so such a great man, but I never got to know Johnny. And I guessed it a lot on the show. You guys were good together. There's some clips on YouTube.

There's that one where you're trying to explain the history of Christmas cards. And it's a lot of fun to watch the two of you. You got a nice timing, a nice patter. He just, I love the way he treated me. And I respected him so much. And I think he was a great man. But I don't think anybody got to know Carson. He started as a magician, I think, which says a lot. Because you picture him in fifth grade.

Carsoni. Getting the girls around him. I mean in high school. Say, here, pick a card, pick a card. I think magicians find that's the way to get girls. First, you ever see one of these? Look at this you know

he was a very shy man all those years you knew him you never really got a sense of him Gil are you a shy are you a shy guy were you

no no I'm real outgoing no that's your act no no that's your act yeah he's very shy you're not like Rickles

you're like Newhart aren't you as far as being shy? Yeah. And you put on this bombastic, brash thing, but that, is that you? If I'm in a situation with a lot of people, I find myself being the one sitting in the corner. Yes, like at the Christmas party this year. Yes.

Yeah, yeah. You went and hid. I'll find the spot where the least amount of people will notice me, and I'll, like, wander over there. Yeah, yeah. One question about that Milton Berle show, and this could be totally bullshit because IMDB lets us down all the time. Do you have any memory of being on that show with Peter Lorre?

No. Okay. Okay. Oh. It's okay. We can cut that part out. It says Peter Lorre and Anne Jeffries. Another person that's been mentioned on the show a number of times,

Joey Bishop. You did five episodes of the Joey Bishop show. No, I did not. Yes, you did. With the Ritz brothers, no less. Yeah, but that's, who cares? I know, but it's just fun for us. This was in 1914.

It's fun shit for us. I don in 1914. It's fun shit for us. I don't think... I did a lot of Griffin. Griffin was great at bringing people out. Oh, great. I didn't have a crush on him. So we found the one guy that you don't have a crush on. The one that was gay, right?

Yeah. No, but he was great at saying... You know, he would sit on the edge of his chair and say, so how did you do that? Right? Griffin would sit on the edge of his chair to pull people out. They said, Merv makes the stars shine. And he did. Yeah. Even as a young kid.

That's a talent. He treated me like a star. He always made it sound like he was fascinated with whatever he just had to say. Yeah, yeah. He was very good. Do you remember working with Gene Kelly? Mike Douglas? I remember working with Gene Kelly.

Yes, you did. No, I didn't. The Sandy Duncan show. Oh, I'm saying, well, yeah. But you say Mike Douglas was a prick. Well, he felt that I was taking his show away from him. And the truth is that they were letting him go. There was a budget thing.

He was asking for too much money. I said, well, he's out. So he felt that I should have called him because we were friends. I should call him and said, they want to give me your show for Westinghouse. What should I do? Well, no, you don't do that. I can't do that. And later, when I would have liked to have called him,

he just said terrible things about me. And I had a lot to learn as a host. I was an entertainer trying to be a host. Yeah. Anyway. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think he's a good man. And, oh, here's another thing,

because we both worked on Hollywood Squares. I heard the variety shows in those days, particularly Hollywood Squares. I heard the variety shows in those days, particularly Hollywood Squares, they used to have a wagon with like wine and other alcoholic beverages that they were very open about. They loved to get the people a little loopy.

Well, the thing is, you know, Hollywood Squares, you make in one day. You know, right? So you have dinner between Wednesday and Thursday. And there's this buffet dinner when everybody drinks wine and beer. Some people do drink wine and beer. And I remember on one of those shows, not Steinbeck. Who's the comedian?

Not John Steinbeck. He wasn't that bad. I would have loved to have seen that. David Steinberg. David Steinberg. Yes, yes. He said, you want some stuff? He said, it'll make you funnier.

I said, what are you talking about? I think it was either Coke or grass or something. And I said, I don't think that'll make me funnier. I couldn't believe that. And that's the only time anybody's ever offered me anything like that. So David Steinberg was trying to get you stoned? I think so. There's no question that he had some stuff in a bag.

Hey, John, I've got some good shit. I think of him as being very clever and very funny. Oh, very funny man. If anybody doesn't need that, but maybe he was just

going through a thing, you know. Come on, John, I'll get you wasted. Variety shows really are gone for the most part, John. I mean, there's their award show, American Idol,

yeah, but they've come back. But I mean, the golden age, I mean, and you did every one of them. I did. I think what killed them was those bad sketches, because not everybody can be Conway and Harvey Corman.

Yeah, but they made Donny and Marie and Tony Orlando and Sonny and Cher. Right. Everybody had to do this forced comedy. Shields and Yarnell. The Starlight Vocal Band.

Everybody had a variety show. Everybody could do those sketches. That's a real trick. Carol Burnett is one of a kind. But it's like before when I mentioned Barbara Felton. She said back then she was known, she became known for Get Smart

and then she worked constantly in variety shows. There were so many. Yeah, you could work every week. She was so smart and all. I remember hosting, guesting on Sonny and Cher, and it was right across the hall from Carol Burnett. And I couldn't figure out why no one

welcomed me to the show. Finally, on about the third day, Sonny walked up and said, John, it's nice to have you on the show. Oh, great. Cher never did say maybe hello. Wow. But they weren't that sort of welcoming hosts, you know, like Carol Burnett had been and other people. It's a very different situation. Now, maybe they weren't getting along. Maybe. Maybe I just caught them on a bet. Yeah, might have been.

So, Carol Burnett was one of those that was very open and warm? No. She was so nice to me. I think Carol was more at ease in front of an audience. To me, anyway. I didn't get to know Carol that well. No, I didn't. You worked with Corman and Conway a few times. Yeah.

The second bananas. I think they developed that question and answer thing. I think Bob Banner developed that for Carol Burnett so that Carol Burnett could loosen up. Oh, interesting. The point of that was Q&A with the audience. Yeah, how interesting. You're smart of him. You worked with someone who I've heard was one of those people that

existed on stage. If you gave him a character, an accent, he was his... and that was Sid Caesar. He's going to say his... And that was Sid Caesar. He's going to say, I never worked with Sid Caesar. I could see it. I could see it forming. On the Julie Andrews special.

I'll tell you about working with Julie Andrews, but I... No, I met him. We guested with Carson. I guested together with Sid Caesar and Carson. He'd been bodybuilding. Came back, had this incredible body. And no, I didn't really work with him. How about this one?

How about Mickey Rooney on the Carabinette Show? Yes, I did. Okay. We hit on one deal. I never met him. He's amazing. A piece of work. Oh, tell us about Mickey Rooney.

I didn't do that much with Mickey Rooney, okay? Don't hold it against me. But Julie Andrews and I sang a love duet, and it's a lazy afternoon, and just singing with Julie Andrews was a thrill. But it was like a romantic thing, and I thought, she's too old for me. I didn't think that we worked together.

I don't know how old she is. I'm 77 now how old will julie andrews be oh god she's like 87 gotta be in her mid to late 80s yeah so i thought it was but uh writing a memoir so beautiful so pretty and it was a thrill singing with her so you don't remember working with any of these people not really i won't i won't remember this show after today. I'm an old man. How about Bob Hope? Oh, yeah. Now, Bob Hope was great to me.

I did a special with him. I did sketches with him. Think about Bob Hope. Everything was on cue cards. So, like, Frank, I'm looking at you, but Bob Hope would be doing his lines over your shoulder, looking right over. And Walter Brennan in the movie was all cue cards looking over your shoulder. He said,

well, you know I love you. I know I love you. I can't do Walter Brennan, but he's looking over your shoulder. He never memorized anything. So Bob Hope was doing such topical jokes

and maybe he was older, but it was all on cue cards, even in sketches. I remember even as a kid watching Bob Hope. Watching those eyes wander to the cards. Yes, yes.

Yeah, wander away. He didn't hide it at all. But he was very nice to me. Uh-huh, yeah. And then I remember he adopted that whole character into his later movies where he would, I swear he must have had cue cards in the later movies. And he would time it for like, oh, like the laughs are coming now. We will return to Gilbert Gottfried's amazing colossal podcast after this.

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Echo, thanks to its presenting partner Sun Life and its official partners Air Canada and MasterCard. How about Rickles since you brought him up before we turned the mics on? Oh boy. I worked with Rickles twice. One at Westbury and I would do the first. I was his opening act. I did like 45 minutes. What a kick.

What? I said what a kick. I thought you said what a dick. I thought so too. Did we just go there? I thought. I thought. What's I said, what a kick. I thought you said, what a dick. I thought so, too. Did we just go there? I thought. What's wrong with both of you? It sounded like you said, what a dick.

What a dick. And when I would finish my set. He worked with Milton Berle. When I finished my set, I would watch Rickles every show. Rickles was just amazing. He started the motor running before his show, and there was a spine where he's, from the little I've seen of you, Gil, you do that same thing. There's a motor running while you're on stage, and you don't let him off the hook. Rickles was like that, just a machine.

And not that he didn't take pauses, but the motor was running all the time. Didn't take pauses, but the motor was running all the time. But one night at the Riviera, I was doing like 45 minutes usually. And one night, my audience bit. I do a bit where I used to ask people what year they were dating, and I had a medley for each year from 19, used to be from 1940 to 1965. That's fun. I memorized these songs from every year, love songs, sat on the ladies' lap. Well, one night, it didn't go well.

So my show was like seven minutes short and I came off stage and Rickles, who was usually there just, just, you know, like, like a bull. He wasn't there because I was seven minutes early. So I went up the steps in the Riviera and there he was just leaving his dressing room to come down and stand off stage. He said, what are you doing? And I said, well, my audience bit didn't go well. So I had to say, you can't do that.

And he dashed down on stage. And after his show, he took me into his dressing room and said, son, you can't do that. Do your time, man. Do your time. Never do that. Because I left him high and dry. I did. As an opening act, I was too short.

So I was really sorry. He was such a pro. Such a pro. Yeah. Anyway. Yeah. What about Lucy? Oh, Lucy.

Oh, boy. I love Lucy. You were on an episode of Here's Lucy as a professor. Yeah. I think the family, I don't know this, but I felt a little bit like I was being set up to be Lucy Arnaz's guy. I don't know. Really? Interesting.

Well, you were on that episode. Yeah, we did two shows, and it was great. And I was invited to dinner at the house with Gary Morton, and they were all very nice. And I don't know. They were very nice to me. I don't know. They were very nice to me. But one day on the set, little Lucy and I were doing a scene.

And Lucille Ball was up at the back of the auditorium. And she said, stop. And tromping down the aisle and had a, what look, I guess it was water. I don't know. But it was a vodka bottle, a vodka bottle. And she threw the bottle on the floor. The glass went everywhere. And she said, don't you ever, to Lucy, not to me, it was all to Lucy,

but I was standing there just wanting to be anywhere else. It was so embarrassing. She laid into Lucy. She said, you don't turn, say the line and then turn. You do not,

that's not how you do comedy. Don't fool around with this. It's serious business we do. Lucy would do, even though she had a director, she had a lighting director, she did everything. Yeah.

Scripts, lighting, sound, wardrobe, attitudes, very strong lady. Hands on. Wardrobe, attitudes. Very strong lady. And she felt that she knew how it should work. So I saw a whole other side of Lucy. But what a master at her craft she was.

Wow. And I love Lucy Arnaz, but I don't know. I just had the feeling. This is a name that's come up, John. We're going to test you here in our travels in, what, 200 of these, 250, 60 of these things. You ever work with a legendary comedy writer, Pat McCormick? I had him write some material for me. Okay.

Do you know that? No, but he's come up on this show a lot. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I was trying to get comic material. How do I get stuff? And so he wrote me. I did a thing on Streets of San Francisco.

We're going to talk about that in a minute. And I said, can you give me some lines about that? He said, yeah. So he wrote me like 12 pages of stuff. And it's just so hard when people write material for you. Because it's got to fit like an old pair of jeans on you. And it's got to come out of you to have comedy writers. I don't know.

So anyway, the joke he wrote for me was, anyway, I played the part of a man and a woman. And I'd shoot all the man stuff one day, and then I'd shoot the female. I played the part of a transvestite who kills people. With a hat pin. With a hat pin, yeah. And you've watched too many of my shows.

I have. I watched that one at first. Do you know something? This is so weird. What? I remember as a kid, I loved reading TV Guide, and I remember seeing

that you were going to be playing like this transvestite killer. Yeah. I rehearsed with a female impersonator for a month. Craig Russell? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, you're in our friend Frank DiCaro's new book about the history of drag and show business. Well, I mean, I think I was pretty good at that part of it, but it was Stre streets of San Francisco. So we're shooting in San Francisco, and I'd had too much coffee. So by about 11 o'clock, I've got to hit the men's room. Now, I'm in full drag. If you're in full drag and you're shooting in San Francisco, which restroom do you go to?

So I figured, what the hell? I charged into the ladies' room. I wasn't there three minutes. Lady walks in and said, what are you doing here? I said, how did you recognize me? She said, you were the only one standing. That's a joke. That's a joke, right? Pat McCormick wrote that for me is what I'm getting to. That's what I'm getting to. That's a joke. That's a joke, right? Pat McCormick wrote that for me is what I'm getting to.

That's what I'm getting to. That's great. Now, what did you think, if you remember, the two stars on this, Michael Douglas and Carl... Michael Douglas wasn't there very much because he was running off to edit a little movie that he was making called... One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest. Yes. Which turned out to be an incredible film.

Which I think is what caused a great deal of uncomfortable. Oh, because it was supposed to star his daddy. Kirk Douglas. Kirk Douglas tried for years. He wanted to play McMurphy. And he was desperate to get someone to... Yes. And then his son takes it.

But he aged out of it. Yeah. Well, don't you think it was the right choice? Sure, of course. Oh, Nicholson was terrific. Who could fault that? I don't think Kirk Douglas ever got over that. That's interesting.

But that was a big departure for you to take that part on. It was. It was the same manager that had me do the centerfold with the towel where I wasn't naked. He said, we're going to look for different things. Right. Because up until then, I'd done boy meets girl. Sure. Biggest problem is pimples, you know.

Right. And so this was a real stretch. What I discovered in playing a woman, you know, when you start to do a woman, you talk like this, right? Hi, come on in. Well, that's Minnie Mouse. And I discovered that if I raise my voice up here, that a lot of women talk right in there. So I discovered that...

And then to be overly feminine is like a drag queen. To really get away with playing a woman, you can't be overly floppy feminine. That's drag queen woman, right? Which is done usually for laughs. So in finding the woman was a real challenge. People still talk about that episode today. I mean, it was a... It was a stretch.

A big moment. The episode of that show that people remember the most, certainly. Yeah. It was a stretch. A big moment. The episode of that show that people remember the most, certainly. Yeah. It was a good show, Streets of San Francisco. Well done.

Carl Malden. Carl Malden. Great man. Great man. His nose was really that big. So you have no memory of working with Joey Bishop. No.

No memory of working with Gene Kelly. Carl Malden's nose. Well, this was an unusual part. And then the same producer of Street San Francisco did the show in Boston with Bob Urich. Spencer for Hire. And I played a deranged minister on that. Right, that's right.

You did. Another role on that. And it wasn't as good as the man. What was the mail like? What was the fan mail like? What was the reaction from playing that? I can't remember. Yeah, yeah.

My brother is a surgeon. He's gone now. But my brother was a surgeon. Because I saved off my eyebrows to do it. I remember that. And he said, you should never have done that. He said, sometimes eyebrows don't come back. And now I got my eyebrows back.

And my wife thought it was really weird walking around with no eyebrows. I remember Johnny Carson doing a joke about you in a monologue. Do you remember the joke? No. He said it was so windy in L.A. today, John Davidson's hair actually moved. Yeah. Do you remember that? But it stuck with me for 40 years. I can grow hair. actually moved. Yeah. Do you remember that? They do hair jokes.

But it stuck with me for 40 years. I can grow hair. Not much talent, but I can grow hair. And at my age, now hair is the one thing my body can still produce.

So it just keeps growing. I'm like an albino chia pet. My wife said to me, your hair's too long. You look ridiculous. Because I used to have a ponytail. Last year I had a ponytail. Saw it online. She said, why don't you cut your hair?

And I said, honey, I'm going to be 78 years old in December. I don't want to look like an old man. She said, great. Now you look like an old woman. Pat McCormick. Yeah. Do you have tapes, John, of the talk show, of the John Davidson show?

I have a basement full of tapes I could show you. Because I'm looking at some of the... And nobody cares. No, well, listen, Gilbert, listen to some of the people John had on his talk show. Mel Blanc, Chuck Berry, Aretha, Red Fox, Peter O'Toole, James Brown, Steve Allen, Ruth Gordon, Betty Davis. Yeah, I did.

Yeah. Yeah. Do you ever have an urge to go back and dig them up and look at them? I don't have all of them. I have a lot of them. They're great little time capsules. Yeah, they are. It's like when you look back at That's Incredible, they try to bring That's Incredible back.

I remember. And it bombed. It was just out of date. It was, you know. So when you look, you know, there was a certain time for these shows.

If you look back at Sid Caesar's show of shows, Imogene Coke, all that, they're dated now. You look back and they're basically

doing vaudeville or whatever. It's just like every, just about every year, someone makes the big announcement, I'm bringing variety shows back. And it bombs horribly. Who cares? Yeah.

But you can do another version of it where you just have to redo it. Everything old is new again, but you've got to make it new again. And the other two shows they tried to bring back and both failed horribly were The Love Boat and Fantasy Island. Two shows you did.

Yeah. Ricardo Montalban. Let's get back to your Ricardo Montalban fixation. Well, I also did Fantasy Island. And he's just a great man. He was just so charming. He was so nice to me and treated me so nicely. Loveboat, you know, the Loveboat only left the dock.

Loveboat only went. It was on the back lot at some studio for most of the year. We've got Gavin McLeod coming up Monday. Once? What? We've got Captain Steubing on the show Monday. He was good. Yeah.

But like once a year, maybe once every three quarters of a year, the boat actually went out. And I got to go to Scandinavia with Jack Klugman and his wife. Wow. Great man. Great man. Telly Savalas and his wife, Julie. And so we got to know them and Telly Savalas said something to me that I should have listened to.

He said, John, you smile too much. And he was right. Even now, if I don't smile, well, people don't recognize. I'm not on television like I was. But if I smile, people, if they're going to recognize me, people over 60, they recognize when I smile. There was a guy on Kojak who didn't smile at all. And I think Telly had gotten to him, one of those younger guys on that show. When you don't smile, people assume that you have more going behind your face.

When you smile and lay it all out there, it's like, well, that's all the guy's got. I think that's what it is. That's interesting. So it's a mistake that I've made. I've smiled too much. But when I'm nervous, I smile more. And tell us about Jack Klugman. Oh, great man.

Just a very real, real guy. And his wife, too. Great man. What else did I do? Did I do a guest shot on Quincy? Quincy? Was that his show? Yeah, Quincy, where he's a medical examiner.

Medical examiner. I think I did it again because I remember shooting on the back lot. You know, I hate to be so forgetful, but I've been doing this for 55 years. I know. And I've forgotten. You're doing pretty good. I can't remember. No, I'm not. I can't remember a lot of this stuff. I. I know. And I've forgotten. You're doing pretty good. I can't remember. No, I'm not.

I can't remember a lot of this stuff. I wish I could. I wish I could. You're doing pretty good. One of these stories from, I found one of your albums is called John Hamilton Davidson is a funny guy. And it's songs and it's stories. Yeah, a bunch of stories. What is the story Burt Reynolds is afraid to tell you?

Can you share that or am I stealing from the cabaret act? So he came on Hollywood Squares. He did the pilot for Hollywood Squares. Uh-huh. And so did Johnny, by the way. But Burt Reynolds, so we're having this dinner in between Wednesday and Thursday. And he says, you know, Johnny, I see you did that

centerfold there with Cosmopolitan. He says, you know, I was the first. I said, I know Burt and you look better than I did. Yeah, I think so. And I said, how did that come about? And he said, well, Helen Gurley Brown came up and said, would you like to do a centerfold? So he brings, Bert Reynolds goes back to New York City, meets with Helen Gurley Brown, says, we're going to do this thing. Now, how do you look? Bert says, I think I look pretty good. She says, well, no, I mean, do you have a tan line? You know, even though this isn't totally nude, you can't have a tan line. You can't be two-toned. You gotta be all one tone. So he strips down and she says, yeah, you see where your bathing suit was, you got a tan line.

He says, give me a week. Goes back out to Malibu, takes off all his clothes, lies on his private beach, lies on his back in the sun, comes back a week later, how's this? She says, well, where you were red, where you were brown, now you're redder, where you were sort of almost white, you're redder and it just doesn't match. He said, give me one more week. Goes back to his private beach, private beach in Malibu, takes off all his clothes, covers himself in sand, totally in sand, except for two straws for his nose

and except for where his bathing suit was. Can you picture this? He's lying there and he's totally nude except where his bathing suit was. Wouldn't you know at that very moment, two old beach comers, Marge and Ethel, are coming down the beach. Marge says to Ethel, would you look at that, Ethel.

When we were 24, they were Ethel! When we were 24, they were chasing us. When we were 44, we were chasing them. Now that we're 84, and don't give a darn, they're growing wild all up and down the beach! That's the Burt Reynolds story. That's the Burt Reynolds

joke. You put that in the set. I love that joke. Yeah, it's a funny joke. Don't you love jokes where at the end they take you on another journey? Gil, you knew that one. You knew that one. Oh, yes, yes. Did you? Yeah.

What's the Teddy Roosevelt one? The survival kit and Teddy Roosevelt? Does that mean anything? Well, Teddy Roosevelt's, yeah. No, that's a speech. I did a one-man show on teddy roosevelt and um uh it's uh he gives a speech about it's the man in the arena okay it's not the critic who counts it's not the one who it's it's the man in the arena whose face is covered

with blood and sweat i can't remember right now, but it's, you know. People forget you put out 15 albums. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You recorded a lot of music. Yeah, and still am.

You know, I still do shows with my guitar and telling jokes, and I just put out a new album. So what can people expect when they come to Birdland on the 27th? Well, I... What are they going to see? I open with this. No, I open with this. No, I open with this. If my song can raise your spirits, if my song can make you dance, if my song can make you dare enough to chant some new romance,

Dare enough to chant some new romance If my song can make you reminisce Of some sweet day gone by Then let me be your songbird And soon your soul will fly I'm standing on the corner Your soul will find. I'm standing on the corner of nothing and nowhere. And it basically, it's a busker singing on the corner, just realizing that at this point in my life, I'm nowhere. And it's the confusion of trying to figure out life.

What do you do with your life? And I'm developing a pilot for a TV show. Tell us about that. Yeah. Gil is one of my celebrity guests. It's Gil and Penn Jillette, my two guests. Can't wait. And the whole idea is what's next?

The show's called What's Next? What do you do with yourself in your 60s? Now, I know what Gil does. He's doing what he does best and still doing it. But for a lot of people, the challenge of, I've just been let go of my job or I'm tired of doing what I'm doing. How do I reinvent myself for the 60s, 70s, 80s?

Whatever. That's what it's all about. And I wrote the theme song. What's next? Over the hill and round the bend. These golden years will make us great, my friend. I'm not going to take that final bow. The show ain't over, no way, no how. We've all been shakers, fakers, money makers, dads, or stay-at-home moms.

We've been finders, keepers, losers, weepers, creatures of.com. Each time I start to whine about the wrinkled state I'm in, I step it up, suck in my gut, and grab a second wind. What's next? So it's a song about what do I do with my life? And so I'm interviewing people. After we do your show, I'm going to go out to Times Square and find people in their 60s and do Man on the Street. I'm going to walk up to them.

Really? Yeah. Good for you. Just like you were in 63, smiling at strangers. Yes. On the street. I'm going to say, what are you doing with your life? You know?

I read a thing, people who have regrets looking back on their life. Now, Gil obviously doesn't have this. I regret everything. You don't regret not writing your own story. You are writing your own story, man. You are doing it. You say you're not in charge of your life. You are doing it.

Second thing that people regret is they don't express themselves. Why haven't I been able to express my feelings all my life you're you're you're getting it all out all the raw shit in your body is coming out you just vomit this shit out every show he's got you pegged gill you know and and it's great because you're letting that go you know i don't sense you sense you're frustrated. You're just, boom, you just let it go. Second thing is not spending more time with friends. I don't know how you, a lot of people regret they didn't find more time with friends. Another regret is they didn't choose happiness. You know, happiness is a choice.

People who live in a mud hut can be happy, you know. And that's one of my regrets that i didn't choose to be happy what one of the things i've tried doing lately when i because i get very negative and and you mentioned me earlier that sometimes you get negative i tend to get so negative but lately i've started turning my mouth up and as you people people are listening, smile. Start smiling. There's a chemical or something that's released. You tend to get content and happy. Isn't that amazing?

So one of the regrets is that you didn't choose happiness. So that's what my show called What's Next is all about. But I haven't sold the pilot yet. When I sell it, I'll be glad. And Gilbert is a celebrity guest. Celebrity guest. How did that happen? And he didn't say fuck one time. I'll be glad and Gilbert is a celebrity guest celebrity guest how did that happen and he didn't say fuck

one time he must like you John what other plugs johndavidson.com is the website people can get your swag and your records there

and my appearance schedule I'm singing somewhere I'm singing in a theater near you most every week. You want to sing something with Gilbert or is that just taking it

way too far? Not really. Okay. Does Gilbert, do you sing? Do you sing? It doesn't stop me. You are my sunshine.

My only sunshine. You make me happy. You make me happy when skies are gray. Good, I chose the right key. That's right, and your key. Yeah, it's an other key. You'll never know, dear, how much I love you. Please don't take my sunshine away.

Are we still on? It's a parking lot now, right? It's over. We stopped recording 25 minutes ago. Oh, okay. No, I'm kidding. John, this was great. I hope you can make a show out of this.

Can you cut out the bad part? Be a little bit of editing involved, but not much. Because I was boring at times. No, not in your life. We've got to cut out every single part we mention someone who you didn't work with. I've got more names. Liberace. Do you remember Liberace?

I don't. It doesn't reflect on those people. It reflects on me. Did you work with Liberace? Any memories? I met Liberace. Okay. I stole from Liberace his idea.

And you do the same thing when you come out on stage. What does Gil do when he comes out? He does this. Ah, yeah. That's the big hammy. It's like. Loves the audience. It's like, look at you.

Liberace, in his mind, used to say, look at you. You came to see me. How many performers don't give a fuck about who came to see him? You care. Or you pretend to. And that's what I try to spread as much love as Liberace used to spread.

I don't do it to other men. I do it to the audience. Last bit of fun personal trivia. What is it now, Frank? Last bit of fun personal trivia. Did your dad marry

Dick Clark and his wife? As a minister? As a minister? As a minister, yeah. That's kind of cool. He married Kenny Rogers and his wife. I like that. And he married Dick Clark, yeah.

I like that. That's cool, yeah. I'm out of bullets. Gilbert, what do you got for this man? Let him go home. Let him go to Times Square. So,

do you want to come out to Times Square with me and do 10 minutes? Okay. You don't want to do that? I'll be your opening act. Hi, folks. That was good.

Don't make off-beat here. This is John Denver. John Denver, say a few words. Davidson, Davidson, Davidson. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. John Davidson. Tell me the truth.

Years ago, before you met me, didn't you think I was probably an asshole? I still do. Yeah. Hasn't changed. I mean, we're so different. We are not, we're like, I'm vanilla, and you're raspberry ripple.

Or whatever. You were born in this for four years, John. Now how do you feel now that you've done it? I wasn't ready for you four years ago. Can you endorse it? Can you recommend the show to others? Oh, of course. Okay.

I hope you had fun. This has been Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast with my co-host Frank Santopadre. And we've had on a guy who's wanted to fuck every male co-host Frank Santopadre and we've had on a guy who's wanted to fuck every male co-star he's worked with and still says he's not gay. John Davidson.

I'm not gonna comment. Ahahaha! I'm going to go. Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast is produced by Dara Gottfried and Frank Santapadre, with audio production by Frank Verderosa. Web and social media is handled by Mike McPadden, Greg Pair, and John Bradley-Seals. Special audio contributions by John Beach. Special thanks to John Fodiatis, John Murray, and Paul Rayburn.