Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast - GGACP Classic: Kevin Pollack

Episode Date: December 8, 2022

GGACP celebrates the 30th anniversary of the classic courtroom drama "A Few Good Men" by revisiting this interview with comedian and impressionist Kevin Pollak. In this episode, Kevin joins the boys for a frequently hilarious conversation about the legend of Harry Houdini, the cinema of Barry Levinson, playing pranks on Paul Reiser and Alan Arkin, joining the cast of "The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel" and sharing the screen with Tom Cruise, Robert De Niro, Jack Lemmon and Rod Steiger. Also, Steve Martin packs arenas, Walter Matthau hits on Sophia Loren, Don Rickles runs afoul of Joe Pesci and Kevin attempts to explain France's affection for Jerry Lewis. PLUS: "Morton & Hayes"! In praise of "Avalon"! Riffing with Robin Williams! Remembering J.T. Walsh! And Kevin wows with impressions of Albert Brooks, Peter Falk and Jack Nicholson! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Trivia and dirty jokes, an evening with the boys. Once is never good enough For something so fantastic So here's another Gilbert and Franks Here's another Gilbert and Franks Here's another Gilbert and Franks Colossal Podcast with my co-host, Frank Santopadre.

Our guest this week is an actor, writer, producer, occasional director, and one of our favorite podcasters, a gifted impressionist, and one of the world's most successful and dynamic stand-up comedians. In fact, Comedy Central deservedly named him one of the top 100 comedians of all time. As an actor, you've seen him in hit TV shows like Entourage, From Earth to the Moon, The Simpsons, Better Things, Mom, Billions. The Rob Reiner created Morton and Hayes, and most recently it's the force of nature known as Moshe Maisel on The Marvelous Miss Maisel. You've also seen his outstanding work

in popular and critically acclaimed films like Willow, Avalon, Ricochet, Casino, A Few Good Men, The Usual Suspects, Grumpier Old Men, The Whole Nine nine yards, just to name a few. He also directed a fascinating documentary called Misery Loves Comedy about the connection between comedy and being miserable. And how I wasn't in it remains a mystery. This man started performing comedy

at the age of seven. Well, that's not exactly true, but it's close. And has gone on to work with icons and luminaries such as Jack Lemmon, Tom Cruise, Denzel Washington, Robert De Niro,

Don Rickles, Walter Matthau, Tom Hanks, Sophia Loren, Steve Martin, Jack Nicholson, and even me, Gilbert Gottfried. He's also worked with a few of our podcast guests, including Alan Arkin, Rick Overton, Alan Alda, Rosanna Arquette, Joe Mantegna, and Barry Levinson. And speaking of podcasts, for 10 years, he hosted a great one. The terrific and essential Kevin Pollak Chat Show. And you can find it on YouTube. And he's currently the host of the new iHeartRadio podcast, Alchemy This. And did we mention the guy does a more convincing Peter Falk imitation than Peter Falk? Frank and I are excited to welcome to the show show, one of the world's funniest humans, and a man who says he got notes on one of

his stand-up specials from none other than Jerry Lewis himself, the multi-talented Kevin Pollack. Yes, hello. Yeah. And I don't know where to start, i'll i'll start with the last comment the funny thing about jerry lewis giving me notes on my stand-up special it was after he watched it on television he called me and said i i thought it was the hippest joke ever he was already way late in his 80s i thought it was the hippest joke ever and then he said no i mean i wrote down notes so that when we talked i would remember what to tell you which was he went from super hip edgy to incredibly sweet. Yeah. And then he would call and leave random voice messages on my machine.

Kevin, I just saw Ricky say, meh, and then hang up. So he became like my Aunt Bessie. It was basically our relationship. So first he told you how cool and hip your special was and then said uh he has notes i got notes yeah yeah well he never disappointed but he was a hero i mean we should we should also give it some context you played his son in max rose after uh yes after many of these phone calls and sitting with him um for a redonkulous lunch that he brought as a gift he brought the script and then he brought 10 refurbished films uh five martin and lewis and five of his film wow as like a dvd collection parting gift

yeah so we get to add kevin to the list of people jerry was nice to gil yeah yeah yeah i mean i even got to the film we did together ended up playing at the can film festival Festival. So I got to see, I got to be with Jerry and see how the French react to him, the long-running, I don't know if it's a joke, but certainly observation that the French love Jerry Lewis. But I got to find out why, because I was curious and made a point of asking. So Jerry, after Martin and Lewis broke up in the late 50s jerry got a unprecedented

deal with paramount to direct and star in 10 films over 10 years for 50 million dollars or 5 million a year in 1959 i don't know what that would be equivalent to today, but a lot more. Yeah. Yeah. And so he did those films, you know, and from those films came The Naughty Professor and many others. But towards the end of that, he started hosting the telethon. But towards the end of that, he started hosting the telethon. And then at the end of that 10-year run, he was focusing just on the telethon. And because there was no Internet and no international version of the telethon, while we here in America got to see the decline of a once biggest star in the world to the host of the annual telethon.

And I say decline simply because of, well, obvious reasons, but while he was doing this great philanthropic work, he had walked away from his show business career. But to the French, and if not all of Europe, but to the French who revered that 10-year run, they saw him just walk away early in his life and into the ether. You know, like imagine Charlie Chaplin doing a handful of films and then never being seen from again. That's what the French were insisting was the ghost nature of the exit. Because, again, they had no coverage of the telephone, which over decade, over decade, over decade in America became this diminishing of what was once.

You know, he and Dean were not unlike the Beatles in terms of leaning out of a fourth floor hotel room and down below were 10,000 screaming kids. They were matinee idols and worshipped by all ages, but teenagers in particular also considered them sort of pop icons, which is silly and strange and bizarre to me to think of a comedian, you know, a clownish comedian at that. Yeah, biggest rock stars in their day. They were the original sort of touring rock stars in that way. Yeah. He told me that they had like a three-car train when they went on.

They did something like 60 cities in 63 days almost like a whistle stop for a presidential campaign and there were three cars on this train one car for just the two of them one car for the band and one car for the suits you know the accountants and the managers and the agents and um I just, that tour to me seems like there's a movie in there somewhere. It sounds it. And it's funny, when I watch Martin and Lewis movies, you know, they're entertaining. Right. But I don't see any of that.

Like, people talk, people who saw Martin andis live yeah they talk about it like it was a religious experience yeah i think um because dean martin had established himself as this um hit singer and extraordinarily handsome fella but but you know silly at times in his own act, but for the most part a stoic, handsome singer. And this clownish comedian sort of heckling him from the audience and in his 19, 20-year-old self and improvising tremendously so that each of those audiences that saw them live had that unique experience of, oh, this is only happening right now in the world. And that was a fairly unheard of sort of act. And I think it contributed a great deal to their legend. And then the radio show and then the TV show.

Right. I like your idea, by the way, sort of a hard day's night. Martin and Lewis on tour. The craziness and the hotel rooms and the crazy fans. Be fun. It's nice that the two of you, too, because meeting your heroes in the business, as we know, can be treacherous. And both of you had a very positive experience of Jerry, which is nice. And I always get to use that, my favorite line, which is, well, he was always nice to me. Yeah, exactly. Hey, did you see that movie? This was a strange movie that was obviously supposed to be Martin and Lewis. Oh, Where the Truth Lies.

Oh, yes, yes. Yeah, the one with Kevin Bacon. Kevin Bacon is Jerry Lewis. lewis and the where the truth lies oh yes yes kevin bacon kevin bacon is jerry lewis you're talking about yeah colin firth and kevin bacon it was based on rupert holmes book rupert holmes book about martin and lewis or just about these two characters rupert grew up loving martin and lewis so he wrote this book where these characters are loosely based on so he wrote a novel yeah they made a film about it with colin firth and and the characters in the novel and this movie a singer and a comedian yes yeah oh wow i'm gonna have to see they acted just like them and uh oh oh also uh we were in the same movie but we were in the same movie and that is that i was working i i did a couple of weeks on a movie called another you oh my oh yes uh with uh that was the last of the gene wilder, Richard Pryor comedies.

Yes. And when I was doing it, I knew it was bad. And then the original director, Peter Bogdanovich, was let go. And then they said, we'll let you know when we're going to continue shooting. And then they called and said, they don't want you in the picture anymore. And we're scrapping old previously shot footage. Wow. Okay, so what do you know about this?

I didn't know any of that. I just knew that Richard P richard pryor was was certainly ailing at that point oh yeah in his life um with ms and um a very long hard lived life but but ms was settling in pretty good so um he he it's difficult to fathom why the idea sounded like a good one to put someone who was clearly visibly not in good health into a comedy to elicit laughter instead of breaking your heart every time you see him on film in the movie. him on film in the movie um yeah there was it was difficult to say no to this is richard prior and gene wilder um when i was in fact asked to be in the director's version who took over i i i don't think i even knew until this very moment that there was a Bogdanovich version. There you go. This shows nothing if not educational. And I thank you for that. Yeah, and I remember when I met Pryor,

he couldn't have been nicer to me. Sure. He treated me like he was a kid and I was the biggest star he ever met. But it was, it's like you looked at him and you go, you can't laugh at a guy in such horrible shape. He ever met. But it was, it's like you looked at him and you go, you can't laugh at a guy in such horrible shape. Yeah.

Yeah, and especially given their chemistry as a comedy team in previous films was buoyant, if nothing else. Yeah. And the buoyancy was completely gone, and it was just heartbreaking. Yeah. Yeah. I find it interesting, too, that another thing you guys have in common is how young you started in stand-up. And, Gilbert, you were 15? Yeah.

And I believe, Kevin, you were even younger than that. We're talking about high school, junior high school? I started performing in front of large audiences when I was stand-up. I was lip-syncing a comedy album when I was 10. 10. All through junior high, what they call now middle school. I wish I could have been present for the decision-making process for that transition, because junior high just wasn't working out as a name of a form of institution of lesser than high learning.

But I did it all through junior high and high school, this record act, until I was about 16. And then I started doing impressions and spoke. And then I was doing nightclubs by the time I was 17. So professionally, I was 17. Early bloomers. I heard you say that San Francisco was very welcoming and a nurturing environment for stand-ups in those days. Well, starting back at the 50s with Lenny Bruce and George Saul and Woody Allen and Jonathan Winters and a lot of great acts who had tremendous success in the 50s and 60s in San Francisco. And in the 70s, mid-70s to late-70s,

was sort of the next wave of, you know, Robin Williams and Dana Carby and myself. And did you tell Jerry Lewis that you started off miming records? Because that's how Jerry Lewis started. started yeah a lot of those guys dick van dyke too yeah we did talk about it he did a a danny k album that was his that was jerry's shtick was lip-syncing a danny k album yeah and we we did talk briefly about it because the idea was we didn't have to write the material. Not only that, it was written by brilliant performers in both cases.

And, you know, it was stealing their magic. As a young, you know, I started out, like I said, 10 years old. So imagine a 10-year-old precocious jewish kid lip-syncing a you know a comedy album and um you just had to clear your throat at the right times and you know to match the album and it was astonishing how this 10 year old could do this um yeah telling gilbert some of the funny stuff from the book i loved the uh i love pen gillette saying that kevin pollack is the man to play harry houdini yeah he wouldn't let go of that for the longest time. Um, uh, yeah. I mean, Houdini was a squat Jew. Um, that looks somewhat like Eric Weiss looked a lot of like my relatives, Eric Weiss. Yeah. His father was a rabbi. Um,

but he did look a lot like my relatives. So when Pendant started insisting on this over, I don't know, 25 years ago when I first started to know him, I found it endearing as hell, but also I had for some reason grown up not with any interest in performing magic, but mesmerized by the lore of Harry Houdini. And also the way that he tried to debunk, you know,

Spiritualist. Yeah, the charlatans of the day. Seances. Yeah. Yeah, he devoted his life later on. Yeah. To just exposing these frauds. Yeah.

I totally buy Kevin Pollack as Houdini. Yeah. Way more than Bernie Schwartz. Yeah. At least they hired a Jew to play the Jew. But growing up, even having missed his entire performing years, of course, there was just this legend that I could read about and whatnot. You talk about those early traveling performers,

you could argue that Mark Twain was one of the first stand-up comedians, and Will Rogers. And so Harry Houdini was this larger-than-life-traveling, singular performer that would draw crowds of tens of thousands. You know, that really wasn't a thing. I know in Gilbert in my age, Steve Martin was the first sort of arena comedian who started playing to 15,000, 20,000 people, which he hated.

I ended up doing a couple moves with him and getting to know him. And, you know, there was no one in the workings who said, yeah, don't do this. As you rise through the ranks of success as a stand-up comedian and you get to this newfound lofty position of, you know, you could sell 15,000 tickets in one location all across the country. There was no one mindful enough to say,

let's not do that because it isn't what you're, what stand-up comedians, you know, should be doing necessarily. Because losing that intimacy, we all prefer theaters, I suppose, just not to hear the clanking of glasses and bar service. And there are certainly comedians who have played larger venues in the last 10 years. But yeah, Steve did say it's sort of law and he said also because it was

such pandemonium he said i would put my worst material in the first 10 minutes because it didn't matter what i said interesting they were just cheering and going nuts with every gesture so that's what the beatles that's what the beatles said yeah yeah that couldn't hear them couldn't hear themselves they they didn't know what they were singing up there. Yeah. And they just heard screams. Yeah. It's funny you're talking about magic, Kevin, too, because Gilbert and I talk a lot on this show about forms of show business that you just don't see much of anymore.

Growing up, magicians were on television. Magicians were on The Sullivan Show. Also comedic magicians like Carl Ballantyne. Sure. And people like that. And impressionists. Impressionists. Rich Little, Frank Ocean, Will Jordan. George Kirby.

Yeah. John Beiner, who we had here. George Kirby. Will Jordan. Yeah. It's interesting there there are those uh there are those kind of forms of of of show business that we all grew up with that are considered i guess quaint yeah yeah maybe or novelty acts but you know the magician you know penn and teller would certainly argue that they've done a hell of a job keeping alive the comedy magician yeah um and certainly david blaine and then there was this guy who had the theater piece that ended up being on hbo

forgetting his name that frank oz directed um sort of a magic experience um i know you're talking about i can't think of his name vegas vegas you could find magicians and impressionists. Right. But it's not like it used to be on TV when they pop up. Yeah, even when Letterman asked me to do, be the closing night of Impressionists Week. I remember that. You know, it was a silly novelty idea for his show to do,

bring back what he was almost showcasing as archaic, representing another time when you would see people doing impressions on TV all the time. Yeah, he had Beiner on there, and I remember that. Which brings me back to my earlier question. Do you remember the first time, because both of you getting on stage early. Gilbert, your early act was Impressions. Yes. Like Lugosi and Bo. Yeah.

See, even back then I was dated. Well, yeah, because when you're young and you do the stars of the day, they're all considerably older. You know, you're not doing your contemporaries like maybe you would now. So, yeah, I mean, I was doing Groucho. Oh, you were? Sure, sure, and the like. First impression I ever did, I guess, was the high school football coach

who had a very distinctive walk and demeanor. And it turns out he was not a fan. Which I found out in an unfortunate way as I was gathered with some friends, school pals in the quad at lunch. And someone came up from behind me and got me into a headlock. And it was the coach. And he whispered in my ear i heard

about it and i don't think it's funny and i remember as i was passing out i thought i could probably learn how to do marlon brando much safer yeah What are the chances that fat fuck's going to get me in a headlock? And the funny thing is like every single impression is basically it was, and if your waiter was James Cagney, it might go something like this. Yeah. I even tried to personalize all of that from the very beginning, which then eventually became stories of working with these people. So like when I would tell a story of working on A Few Good Men, I would tell where my mom came to visit the set and ended up hitting on Jack Nicholson,

and then I would impersonate Nicholson within the story. But even from the beginning, I told a true story when I was a waiter and the cook would screw up the order. For most waiters, that's a nightmare. There goes your tip. But for me, it was a golden opportunity to launch into an impression, be it Peter Falk. Oh, geez, I'm sorry. Did you ask for rice? Why do you have a baked potato?

This makes no sense. And the tip went through the roof. So when I started doing impressions, I would draw from personal experiences when I found times to hide behind voices that helped me through life. And, you know, I should tell the audience who isn't seeing you

that you're doing an imitation also of Peter Paul's glass eye. That's the uncanny part. Yeah. So he was very open about having a glass eye. He was in a car accident when he was three years old and had a glass eye from the age of three. And so when I started doing it and I saw him tell stories about that on the Tonight Show I thought well I I should train myself to figure out how to move just one eye and I saw Anne Bancroft in a close-up shot in a Mel Brooks film her husband um oh it's in silent movie yeah where she she crosses her eyes and then

uncrosses them and crosses them. And she moves one. I mean, I could do it again on the Zoom and your audience won't see it. Wow. And so I thought if I could just isolate one half of that, then it'll be just one eye moving back and forth. And I sort of figured it out. Yeah, I remember one of the stories Peter Falk told. He was playing Little League at age 12,

slid into second base. The um um called him out and he took out his eye and handed it to him and said you clearly need this more than I do that's great and I thought that's the hippest 12 year old that's ever lived so uh when I when yeah so it it it became a great thrill when I did do the tonight show, to sit next to the King, Carson, and do the Peter Falk, because I knew he loved Peter Falk, and I took advantage of that. And he flipped out at the one-eye moving.

That was the thing that completely... It's great. And then he asked me to teach him how to do it the next time on. And then here's the brilliance about Carson that I'm convinced he had something similar with a lot of the guests. So you're backstage, you're about to go on, you hear the band playing down from commercial, and you hear Johnny introduce you.

You know, it's one of the most nerve-wracking six minutes of your entire life, let alone that year. And every time after that second appearance when I taught him how to do the Peter Falk guy, and he announced me, please welcome, he's been a friend of the show, he's been on before, please welcome actor, comedian, Kevin Pollak. And I would come out and I would, you know, wave the dock and sit. But there was a three seconds or less where you would pass in front of him. He would stand at the throne waiting for you to arrive. And you would, as you were in the motion of sitting to his right, you would pass in front of him with your back to the audience for a nanosecond to shake his hand, what have you.

But in that nanosecond, religiously, after the second appearance for another, I don't know, 12, a dozen and a half, he would lean over, move one eye and say, excuse me, I hate to bother you. That's great. The genius of that is in the most nerve wracking six minutes of the year, we have an inside joke, have a seat. You know, that sort of calming effect of that, no matter how nervous or in my head I might have been.

The moment he did that, it was, oh, I belong here. And as I'm sitting down, this is all playing out, right? Every time. And I know he must have had something like that with guests that he liked. He had that ability to put people at ease. Yeah. And then Falk, what, you run into him in a supermarket one day? At Ralph's in Los Angeles about six months after that first,

that appearance rather where I did the Peter Falk and Johnny flipped out. I did. I was accosted by Peter Falk in the produce section. And he literally stopped me and said, how do you do that with your eye no no me i understand but how do you do that he was tickled and also genuinely curious that's great he wanted me to teach him how to do it. That's surreal. Yeah, and we sort of were friendly in the sense that

any time I would see him thereafter, he just got such a kick out of me, just the monkey who impersonates him, I guess. But he really did get a kick out of it. To his credit, he had a sense of humor about it. Oh, boy, yeah. We will return to Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast after this. FanDuel Casino's exclusive live dealer studio has your chance at the number one feeling, winning,

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You'll flip for $4 pancakes at A&W. Wake up to a stack of three light and fluffy pancakes topped with syrup. Only $4 on now. Dine-in only until 11 a.m at anw's in ontario and so you knew uh both uh peter falk and alan arkin my two heroes um because the in-laws is my favorite comedy that's the best of all time and And to meet Peter that day and become friendly and then work with Alan Arkin on the film Indian Summer and become friendly with him for life. Yeah, it's a bit surreal.

But Alan told me the story of how he put the in-laws together as a film. Sitting at home one night watching late night television. Oh, that's right. He saw Peter Falk on The Tonight Show. And he, as Alan told me, at the time I had a little juice at Warner Brothers and I called up the president of the studio. And I said, I want to do a picture with Peter Falk.

And he said, great, what's the picture? And I said, I don't know. He annoys me, I think, is the story. And, you know, the studio had said, all right, well, when you figure it out, let me know. And so then I had read a very early draft of Blazing Saddles written by Andrew Bergman, where the black fellow who comes into this western town

is actually a jazz singer from the 40s. It was the most fucked up story I've ever read, and they didn't make it, obviously, but I remember it stayed with me as just surreal and crazy and hilarious, and so I'm the one who selected Peter and Andrew Bergman

to write and direct, and again, had just enough juice at the studio to get the damn thing set up. Yeah, how about that? Miraculous. Yeah, we had Andrew here, actually. So that would have been the Tex-X version before it became. Right.

Yeah. It was much more militant. Yeah. Yeah. And we had Alan Arkin here, too. We had Alan and Adam. We did a Father's Day show with Alan and Adam last year. Oh, that's spectacular.

What a national treasure. We've got to put you on the spot and make you tell the story, though, of calling riser when you were a young performer. It's so good. Let me plug the book, too, Kevin. It's called How I Slept My Way to the Middle. Really funny. Great stories. Great backstage stuff. And I think one of my favorite stories in the book is you calling Reiser in his hotel.

Well, yeah. So I was a San Francisco comedian. And, you know, I, seven, eight, nine years old, would watch comedians on The Tonight Show and collect them like my friends collected baseball cards. And so when I started doing stand-up, I already had many years of being a devoted fan of comedians and their nuances and their presence, but also when they ever made the transition to acting. So when Don Rickles and Kelly's Heroes and so on, it really, really grabbed me and also instilled me with enough stupid confidence that, well, clearly starting out as a stand-up comedian to become an actor is a path, which I'd already devoted myself to the stand-up comedian part.

And I hated school, so the idea of going to acting school just sounded like the worst possible idea. So when I saw in the marquee that Paul Reiser was in town, I had loved his work in Barry Levinson's movie Diner, And as many comedians did, it was truly inspirational to stand-ups who wanted to be film actors. And so I didn't know if he knew or cared about Peter Falk, but I knew it was recognizable enough.

So I got the number of the hotel that he was staying at while performing in San Francisco from the club, Booker. And, you know, back then you could say to whatever receptionist answered the phone at the hotel, could you ring Paul Reiser's room, please? And there was no questions. They just put you through to Paul Reiser. In those days. Yeah.

They just rang his room. I didn't need a room number. These days, for the longest time, I stay under the name John Lovitz. That way no one will bother me. So I just called him up, and they put me through, and he answers the phone, yes, hello, and I just launched into it. Paul, listen, this is Peter Falk. I'm in town and the wife and I saw your name on a marquee,

someplace called Cobb's, I think. Anyways, we would love to come to the show tonight, tomorrow night. Well, he launches into such reverence and and and over joy he just can't believe that peter falk tracked him down and is talking to him in his hotel room so much so that within three or four minutes of his adoration for the real peter falk i couldn't stop doing peter falk for fear that he would never speak to me again because he was so happy to be talking to peter falk you know it would have gone from oh that's very funny to what is the matter with you you know i just i it played out in my head if i were to break character. So I didn't.

I didn't. We talked for over 10 minutes and I never broke character. And he spoke to Peter Falk through me at the end of which the arrangements were made. I was good. Peter Falk was going to the second show. And then after I hung up, I realized I had to call back and bust myself. But it also meant the end of any chance I had at a friendship with Paul Reiser. Because it just wasn't going to go well. So I called him back.

And sure enough, they put me through to his room once again. And he answered, yes, hello. And I said, Paul, it's Peter again. Listen, I have bad news. And the bad news is this isn't Peter Falk. I'm a local comedian. My name is Kevin Pollack, and I'm the biggest fan of your standup and your acting. Your work in Diner was the most.

And he just stopped me and said you're a bad guy can i be honest with you you're not a nice person that is really but he also had a little bit of laughter in his voice you know you could i could he let me off the hook instantly and um and we did become friendly and you became friends i love that and and you once left a crank call on alan arkin's machine yeah so the way it goes is uh i was in the habit of calling people as alan arkin for a while and uh just to leave messages on their voice answering machine and um i had not seen paul in quite a while we ran into each other and we set up dinner with the wives for a couple of weeks down the road the two weeks go by i call him that morning and to reconfirm but I got his voice answer machine, and I spoke to it as Alan Arkin, and I said,

Hi, Paul, Alan Arkin, how are you? Listen, I don't know what your schedule's like. We'd love to see you. You could come over. You could stay for a while. Whatever works for you. We'd just love to see you, okay? And so that night at dinner with Paul and his wife Paula

and my then wife and myself, you know, we're having a good time. And at one point during the meal, I see Paul lean over to his wife and say something to the effect of that's like when I got the call from Alan Arkin this morning and you know and rather than just saying that

was me we'd already been through this I thought for sure that he would have known it was me so I just let him go for a while and finally i said putz that was me and and um he was very upset again and he said he got alan's number he made a point of getting alan's number to call him and leave a message saying how tickled he was. So when I got home from dinner that night, this message was waiting for me on my machine.

Hi, Kevin, it's Alan. Listen, that's not funny. I don't know Paul Reiser, but apparently he's staying over for a week. Well, listen, Paul got to work with Falk. He got to make that movie with him. He got to live out his Peter Falk dream in the end. Yeah, and he certainly got to listen to Alan Arkin talk to him on his voice answer.

Yeah. This is an embarrassment of riches, Kevin. We love these impressions. Is there a Richard Kind impression? Not to keep putting you on the spot. Well, everyone, to my knowledge, does a bad to good Richard Kind. Have you heard of Bjarke's Richard Kind? I have. It's tremendous. It'so's Richard Kahn? I have.

It's tremendous. It's pretty good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's a group of people who, Stephen Weber actually went to the point of having a puppet plush doll made. Oh, yes.

I've seen it written in Craig's house. Yeah. Yeah. And you squeeze the hand and there was like six recordings of different kindism. So, yeah. And, you know, Hank Azaria, there's just so many better Richard Kind impressions out there. I see. That I don't know if, I mean, I'd be happy to do it.

Listen, I don't want anything from you. If you want to just write a check for $10, that's fine. That's fantastic. Yeah. Let's go to A Few Good Men since you mentioned it and the story of your mom. I got a kick out of the fact that both your dad and your mom visited film sets. Your dad, I believe at the set of willow yes and your mom came to the few good men set i introduced my dad to george lucas who was

producing willow uh and my dad said i really loved et and george lucas mistake george lucas to his credit said so did i yeah pretty sweet mistake pretty sweet when my father became homer simpson but my uh yeah my mom i i told it was such a almost cornerstone of my stand-up act. I'm a little underwhelmed at the opportunity to tell the my mom hit on Jack Nicholson story just because I've kind of told it to death. Yeah. But, yeah, it was based all in truth because she did visit, and when she came to visit visit we're shooting a courtroom scene

the camera was already set up and it was over Nicholson's right shoulder shooting his point of view or POV of the entire wide courtroom from his point of view and so within that wide camera angle there was no place to put my mom where she could stand and watch us shoot, where the camera wouldn't see her, so they ended up having to put her over Nicholson's other shoulder. So just without going into the detail, just imagine you know you're working on the most important film, arguably, of your life, important film arguably of your life and you're surrounded by giant movie stars and your mother is in your eyeline you know i'm sitting across from lincoln at the table with tom cruise and demi moore and i'm supposed to be looking at Nicholson in the shot. And two inches from his head is my mother's head bobbing up and down with excitement.

And, yeah, it was about as unnerving as any moment I've ever experienced. But how nice that your parents got to see your success up close like that. Oh, very much so. To share in that. Yeah. success up close like that oh very much to share in that yeah when i worked on barry levin's in film avalon um my mom visited with um my stepdad they uh they were actually together longer than my folks were together 24 years and then um stepdad was probably 35 years so uh love love love love richard harlow and so rich that the two of them were visiting on avalon now i have no objectivity because i'm in avalon but i i insist

it's barry's masterpiece i i think that it is an extraordinary film for all the reasons cinematic. One of which, if not near the top, is the cinematographer Alan Davio, who did E.T. and Color Purple and Empire of the Sun and Defending Your Life. Many beautiful, stunning, gorgeous films. And while my mom and stepfather were visiting, we decided it was time to have a picture taken of the three of us just when my stepfather looked up to see who might take it the uh multi-award winning cinematographer alan davio was walking by and my dad didn't know him from

adam and said pardon me sir would you mind taking a photo of us? And I just, to say this moment was cringeworthy for me might be an understatement. But Alan couldn't have been sweeter and took the camera, it was probably a disposable little camera, and took a few photos of us. And in A Few Good Men, you didn't have any direct scenes, direct dialogue with Nicholson, I don't think. And then you were surprised at one point during one of his speeches.

Well, it was in the script, so I was only surprised when I read the script. But Aaron Sorkin, who wrote the play and screenplay, I guess, decided that this hate-filled and hate-worthy colonel that Nicholson was portraying in the movie was not only sexist and misogynistic and and you know sort of evil incarnate but he was also anti-semitic because yes there's a moment in the film where he's on the stand he's giving his this is the soliloquy you know you need me on that wall you want me on that wall. You want me on that wall. Who's going to do it? You? You, Lieutenant Weinberg? Now, why he singles out Lieutenant Weinberg, I believe is your question. When our characters meet once, we shake hands in his office. We're introduced, but we don't speak to each other.

introduced but we don't speak to each other what follows that is uh tom to me and i and and and the colonel and his right hand and maybe keifer sullivan's character seated at a lunch outdoors in what's supposed to be guantanamo bay which was shot in long beach california because the marines read the script and said yeah i don't think we're going to support this. Yes, I'd heard that. That's painting, portraying a Marine colonel as a lunatic. So for that outdoor scene, our characters don't speak either. We do not address each other. Correct to your point, Gilbert.

So, yeah, there's no other reason for him to single me out than Aaron Sorkin wanted everyone to know this prick is also an anti-Semite. Now I'm going to, I've seen the movie a hundred times. Now every time I see, who's going to do it? You, Weinberg? I'm just going to laugh. Because it's very funny. Yeah, I mean, it's a secondary.

He's asking Caffey first. Who's going to do it? You? You know, spitting, it's a secondary. He's asking Caffey first. Who's going to do it? You? You know, spitting into Tom's face. Who's going to do it? You? And then turning as a completion of the thought.

You, Lieutenant Weinberg? Like, he even knows the guy's name. Yeah, I know. Why not just say, who's going to do it? You? Or is the Jew over's going to do it? You or is the Jew over there going to do it? And you said that Nicholson, when he wasn't in character as the Colonel,

what had to explain, describe how Nicholson was when he wasn't. You didn't expect him to be so approachable. It was a complete surprise to me. I thought someone who was cool to five generations um who wore sunglasses in the front row of the academy awards who you know i i thought in order to be that cool you know he never did a talk show as in his entire life he did only three maybe four print journalistic interviews and no other interviews exist.

Think of another star of his stature who pulled off that feat. I didn't know that. Yeah. And so consequently, no one knows much about him unless you know him. And I had such reverence. So I thought, I'll talk about Jack. I won't talk to him. And I had such reverence. So I thought I'll talk about Jack. I won't talk to him, even though we're technically, if not legally, co-stars on this film. I'm going to leave Mr. Nicholson alone. And so I was absolutely thrilled and baffled that he was such a goofball and an absolute silly, gregarious, approachable. I'd never seen anyone more comfortable in their own skin. No one does a Nicholson impression better than him.

It's spot on. He's got all the nuances and all that. It's so authentic. But, yeah, he was just a larger-than-life silly goofball who they'd finish a take, and his one assistant, he nicknamed her Staff to suggest he had a team of people working for him. That's funny.

Yeah, Rob Reiner would say, Cut, and Jack would stand up from the stand and yell out for her staff. Like me, holding up two fingers ready for his cigarette. You know, I've told you I've watched so many episodes of the chat show, which we'll get into. I talk about your wonderful podcast that you retired not long ago. You're interested in some of the things we're interested in, which is journeys and career turning points. I heard you talking to Richard Benjamin about that very thing.

Here's an odd thing that Morton and Hayes, which is beloved by people like Gilbert and I who care about Abbott and Costello and Laurel and Hardy and those kind of people, which is a failed series, winds up being a turning point for you because it leads to this mega movie. Well, there's no question if I wasn't having lunch every day with Rob Reiner, who, along with Christopher Guest, created Morgan Hayes, if I wasn't in his face while he was casting a few good men every day at lunch, we would hole up in his trailer. And yeah, one day he wagged his sizable finger in my face and said,

this next movie I'm directing was a big Broadway success. It's called A Few Good Men. I got Tom Cruise to play the lead. And I think I'm going to get Jack Nicholson to play this insane colonel. But there's this part of Tom's co-counsel and friend that you're kind of perfect for. I have an offer out to Jason Alexander, and if Seinfeld gets picked up for a second season, you know, I feel like you would be a great choice. Well, for context, Seinfeld in its first season had only aired four episodes. It was called the Seinfeld Chronicles.

It was on Friday nights, not Thursday. And about 11 people were watching it. So I was flattered and amazed that he brought it up. But I also instantly thought, well, Jason Alexander is going to do a few good men. He's certainly not doing another season of that crap. And thankfully I was dead wrong. And things worked out very, very well for Jason and I both. Yeah, it's a great twist, though, that the failed the noble failure of.

Oh, let me tell you one more. Let me tell you one more aspect of it. Bringing back the aforementioned Andrew Bergman. So Andrew Bergman wrote and directed a film. I'll get to the title in a moment to not give away the end of the story. And was enamored with the idea of me starring in it prior to A Few Good Men, which is a time when no one was thinking such things. But the character in the script was a younger Albert Brooks,

a very nebbishy, funny, you know, Jewish fella, a mama's boy. And he wanted me to do it. And the studio did not. The studio wanted someone else. And that someone else and I both screen tested opposite the female lead, Sarah Jessica Parker. And the film went to that someone else by the name of Nick Cage, A Honeymoon in Vegas. But again, if you had read the script, it would be clear to you, too, that physically and what have you, I was certainly it made sense why andrew bergman wanted me for the part fascinating or any other funny squat jew but in this case he did want me

and and that was as close as i got to that ginormous brass ring of starring in a studio comedy which was kind of the fantasy after seeing Michael Keaton in Night Shift or Tom Hanks in Splash. You know, there was this idea of that world opening up in a second, right? So when that vanished, you know, again, the writer-director insisting I'm his star, screen testing with Sarah Jessica Parker, all things to to end with thank you goodbye was something I also had not experienced and I was devastated beyond the ability to speak for several weeks until three or four weeks later I was cast in A Few Good Men

and Honeymoon in Vegas is great Nick Cage Cage is fucking hilarious in it. Yeah, it's a fun movie. Super fun, but it's not a career starter for me the way A Few Good Men was. And I went from auditioning to getting offers, which has been the case since 92. Yeah, big prestige picture. You can't beat that with that cast. I would say that, again, things worked out very well for Nick Cage and I both. And you said that I think Nicholson went home for the day and they had like a scene to shoot that had Nicholson in it. Right. So Jack worked 10 days on the film total. worked 10 days on the film total.

And for $5 million, by the way, I didn't have the courage to ask him, when you're making half a million a day, do you hit the snooze alarm? I think I would race into the shower. Yeah. I don't think I would snooze. But so, yeah, he worked 10 days total. And on the 10th day, Rob Reiner, the director, was not confident he was going to finish shooting with Jack.

And so he had the nerve to go to Jack and the relationship at that point and ask if Jack could stick around for the next day, only half a day. He said, I promise I'll get you out at noon, no matter where we are in the shooting. And of course, we can't afford your daily rate. I just, it's a big favor. And Jack said, whatever you want, Robbie, you want me here tomorrow? We'll finish this tomorrow. So he comes back the next day and at 12 noon on the button, Rob Reiner stands up, no matter where we were in the moment of shooting, yells cut, says that's a wrap on Jack Nicholson.

The crew of hundreds and cast erupt in applause the way you do in a moment like that. And what they were shooting was coverage on the judge from Jack's point of view. So off of Jack onto the judge. And Jack at that point was actually doing what's called off-camera lines for the judge, which is why it made sense for me to go to Rob Reiner and say, hey, if it's helpful to AJ, the actor playing the judge, I could sit on the stand and do Jack's lines for him. I'm not doing it to entertain the crew for anyone's laughter.

But if it's helpful to A.J. to have Nicholson's aura continue doing the lines, I've been watching Jack do this. I'll even hold the sides, you know, the script. I don't want to mess up the dialogue, but I've been reciting it in my rear view mirror on the ride home every day. So I think I got it. But again, I don't want to do if it's stealing focus from AJ's work. That's the three of you that can see the Zoom. That's Andy in the background. Oh, look at that. Kitty cat. A cat of prey. Looks like a puma. That is that is scary wow that's like something out of universal classics and he's just except as it turns out he's an idiot because that's a pile of t-shirts he's just snuck up

nice work andy um so I explained the situation to Rob. I'd be happy to. And Rob went to the actor, AJ and said, you know, explain what I was offering. And the actor said, man,

I would love that. And I sat on the stand with the script in my hand and I did Nicholson's off camera lines. Um, and the greatest compliment I think I've ever had of any impersonation was two days later, Rob came up to me while we were shooting and said, I saw dailies at lunch today of Jack's last half a day work. And it wasn't right away that I knew it was you doing his lines. There's probably two or three takes of you doing his lines before I even remembered, oh shit, that's not Jack anymore, that's Kevin. So that was, you know, something silly in a personal high and, and, um, yeah.

And a nice thing for you to do to your, for your friend, for Rob. For, for Rob and AJ, the actor. Yeah. Yeah. If it was helpful, you know, um, it's kind of, uh, silly. Well, you know, there's no shame in losing a part to Nicolas Cage, Kevin. But there may be shame in losing a part to Billy Barty, which Gilbert did. I lost a part to Billy Barty. Who's in Willow, by the way. Yeah. Yeah.

You know what? You're different types. He's taller than me. He can't play Jewish. I wouldn't worry about it. Speaking of playing Jewish, I did want to mention Deterrence from 1999, Rod Lurie's film. Terrific performance by you. Our friend Sean Astin is in there and Timothy Hutton, great little cast.

It's a really interesting movie shot in one location. It's a little bit of fail safe. It's a little bit of the missiles of October, if you will, but also notable because possibly the first Jewish president of the United States on film. Yeah, which Rod Lurie wrote and directed. His next film got a lot of attention and a couple of Oscar nominations

called The Contender with Joan Allen and Jeff Bridges and Gary Oldman, a great film. But so naturally I starred in the one he did right before that, that nine people saw. But I did play... It's quite good. I did play the first Jewish president, but he also painstakingly over-explained

how a Jew got anywhere near the Oval Office, which is he was a Jewish vice president, and the president died, and so the vice president became president. And when the movie starts, this president who's who's not been elected is on the campaign trail to be reelected or elected for the first time to continue his presidency. elected or elected for the first time to continue his presidency um and uh you know it was it was pretty pretty amazing and well written and a tight little political thriller and um yeah something different for you did he write that for you i know you knew he was a poker poker yeah we we did we met playing poker and one night at the poker game. He was a Los Angeles film critic. Yeah. And I knew him as a film critic on ABC Radio and and as a friend who I played poker with.

And one night he said, I'm writing the script. I'm about 40 pages in and I'm writing you as the lead. And I said, so you want no one to see your film? What do you mean you're writing the lead he said well you know it's a small film i'll be lucky if i raise a little over a million i want to direct it and so anyways um would you read it i said yeah when you get past 40 pages maybe over 100 sure uh and i read it and it was extraordinarily impressive and um yeah i, I'm very proud. Good little film. I will tell our listeners to find it. I'm very proud of it.

I think it might be hard to find. Yeah, deterrence from 99. We will return to Gilbert Gottfried's amazing, colossal podcast. But first, a word from our sponsor. Gifting Dad can sometimes hit the wrong note. Oh. gifting dad can sometimes hit the wrong note oh instead gift the glenn livet the single malt whiskey that started it all for a balanced flavor and smooth finish just sit back and listen to the music this single malt scotch whiskey is guaranteed to impress dad this father's day the glenn livet live original

please enjoy our products responsibly you are in grumpy old man yes and it's geniusly entitled sequel grumpier yes i i must apologize that we had grumpier old men in the intro instead of grumpy old men well what's we would we wouldn't lead with with a sequel. One had Sophia Loren, one didn't. Yes, Gilbert took great delight in what Matthau said to Sophia Loren when she showed up for work. Well, yeah, so we did the first movie, and it was outrageously successful, which was thrilling for Matthau and Lemon in the twilight years of their lives and careers. And to be anywhere near greatness like that, along with Burgess Meredith and Buck Henry and Margaret. So when they announced the sequel, it was very exciting. And not just because ain't no money like sequel money, but also because they were adding Sophia Loren.

And she had not starred in a film in maybe 25 years. She was in The Player, but certainly not a star in the movie. And other than The Player, where she played a small part, she had not acted in a film in decades. So it was like royalty from cinema and from Italy showing up, and everyone was very intimidated when first order of business was the table read. And Walter was doing a play on Broadway,

I'm Not Rapaport. And so they flew the rest of us on the Warner jet from sunny Los Angeles to Walter Matthau's New York. And on the plane, I'll tell you, everybody was on eggshells. Nobody really wanted to say the wrong thing to Ms. Loren. So it was a pretty quiet flight. Everybody was being very nice, but still no one wanted to bother her. And we go, we're limoed in from the airport. We're rushed

into a conference room at the hotel that walter's staying or can get to from where he lives and uh we're sitting around this large table waiting for walter uh to start the table read he's late we flew across the country and he's late getting to the table but he walks in and he walks straight up to Sophia, having never met before in either their lives or careers, and says, great to meet you. Love to eat you. So good. Yeah, as an opener. And maybe a closer.

I don't know. But every chin other than hers drops to the table when he says this. She sort of waved him off very, you know, demure and flattered and also, oh, well, you know. And he turned to the rest of us and said, I'm not kidding. Everybody else clear out. Great. Great. Yeah. What did he say to you on the first day of shooting

you were trying to break the ice? Oh, I did. On the first movie. I have a golden rule to never do an impersonation for the actual person unless they ask for it because they don't see it almost ever. Alan Arkin loved it from the beginning, and he added, You know what, Kevin?

I've decided after watching you do me, I'm going to stop stammering. I don't like the way it sounds. Yeah, I'm going to lose the stammer. Look at me. Look at me right now. I'm just talking. There's no stammer look at me look at me right now i'm just talking there's no stammer this is great uh yeah now so oh go ahead no i was so uh i first day on grumpy old man i decided like like an idiot, I was going to make, you know, Walter laugh at small talk. I said, so Walter, good script, huh? And he turned to me and said, the script sucks, kid. I owe my bookie two million. And he wasn't kidding. Oh, wow. And then once I got comfortable enough to have an actual conversation with him and not, you know, being what they call now a fanboy, but just sort of trading barbs about working on this and working on that. And the odd couple where you throw the bowl of pasta against the wall when you're arguing if it's called pasta or spaghetti.

And you throw it against the wall and say, no, it's garbage. And Matthau said, no, our garbage. I love that. So it was an instant review and critique. I love that. So it was an instant review and critique. And did you witness, like, you must have witnessed the friendship of Matt Allen Lemon. Extraordinary.

You know, we shot in Minneapolis-St. Paul in the dead of winter, which was really stupid, but it worked for the story. And both of their reps were looking for the best hotel room to stay in. And it turns out there was one extraordinary presidential suite. And their reps were fighting over who was going to stay there. And Matthau and Lemon, as the story goes, found out there was a second bedroom. And so while we shot the Grumpy Old Men movie, the two, the odd couple were roommates in this giant, you know, with a kitchen and a piano. And it was really, really, really was something. And so we would be asked up there for dinner on occasion. And so I got a chance to see them away from work a little bit.

They just loved each other. Lifetime friendship. And yeah. What a nice, nice thing to be part of. Truly was. Ridiculous gift. You were talking before about how you collected comedians' names and took comedians into your heart,

almost the way a kid collects baseball cards. I've heard you say you did that with character actors as well, that you share our fondness for character actors on this show you've you've worked with some great ones uh john lithgow and gabriel byrne and joan plowright and and then giamatti i could go on yes but tell us about and this is not necessarily a character actor he could be a character actor at certain points in his career but also a leading man and that's rod Rod Steiger, a favorite of Gilbert's in End of Days.

Yeah. You did Favreau's show with him, too. You did Dinner for Five. Yeah. Yes. He was... I would call him a character actor. In my opinion,

Matha and Lemon were character actors who got to be movie stars but they were definitely character actors and i would even push the notion as far as to say brad pitt is one of our best character actors he is a bona fide bigger than life movie star but his character work in Burn After Reading. Oh, that's a fun one. Even True Romance. I mean, he's always looking to do, it seems to me, a character rather than a romantic lead. He's amazing that way because here's this guy who's like the most handsome guy on the planet. Yeah.

And yeah, really a talented character. Oh, Benjamin Button, Moneyball, so many. Yeah, but you know, you could argue even Moneyball was a sort of leading man. Oh, you're saying when he's not the main focus. I'm saying it seems to me he has a real heart for character work. And, I mean, his character in Inglourious Basterds is damn near cartoonish. And it's pulled off brilliantly. And there are moments of Cliff Booth in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood.

And you were on a horsey. I remember you. Yeah, you know, where he sort of leans into the character guy. I like your theory, too. There's a thin line sometimes between character actors and people who become leading men. Well, yeah, I'm sort of pushing the idea of how I've collected character actors.

It's really, from a very young it was it was the sidekick or the character supporting actors who really caught my attention for whatever reason um the slim pickings of the world and the struther mart struther martins and yeah those guys yeah and what was rod steiger like to work with? Well, I don't have too fond of a memory about it. Oh, uh-oh. I mean, it might have been that he didn't want to be there. You know, sometimes you just sort of sense that. I mean, he was doing really solid work,

sense that, I mean, he was doing really solid work and, but he was, he was pretty difficult and demanding in terms of his work process. Interesting. Um, which made for a slightly unpleasant environment. Um, it didn't mean he deserved less respect, but it's just his process. I, I, uh, because I don't come from the theater or am even a trained actor, I'm there to have fun. And it was Rob Reiner, actually, who almost as a mission statement at some point we're shooting,

he said, if you're not having fun, there's literally no point to any of this. And there was less than zero fun on on set when when i did work with ron sorry well i am gonna remember we had james caron on this show another great character actor and and he had worked with steiger and i asked him to tell the audience about working with Steiger. And he just said, I don't like to speak ill of the dead. Yeah. Yeah. In my book, I tell a very funny but disparaging story about Michael Clark Duncan. And he passed away about six weeks before the book was published. And the publisher called me and said, I don't know if you heard today's news, but Michael Clark Duncan passed. I don't know if

you want to keep the story in the book. And I thought for four seconds and said, you don't know if you heard today's news, but Michael Clark Duncan passed. I don't know if you want to keep the story in the book. And I thought for four seconds and said, you don't get a pass for dying. You know, the story is funny. And he was a really shitty thing that he did. And there were witnesses and, you know, on the whole nine yards. Well, did he do? There's too much detail in that one but gilbert give since we have two gifted mimics here give give uh give kevin a little bit of your rod steiger please for him

to appreciate oh please my people you want to know the secret of our success will you start off with the no nothing no land to call your own and then you find a piece of cloth and you rip it in half and you sell that for two for one cent profit and do you never do you think of buying a toy for your child oh man, man. But then you find another piece of cloth and you rip this cloth in three pieces. Kevin, you love... That's beautiful. You love character actors. Do you know John MacGyver?

Do you know that actor? Do I? If you saw him in a second. Bald actor. Did a million TV shows. He's in Midnight Cowboy. He's the John. What's his name in there?

Do the voice for him, Gil. Wait one second while I look him up. John MacGyver? You'll get it right away. He was short, bald, always played like buffoonish authority figures. Always in everything. Oh, love him. Yes.

Go ahead, Gil. This company is run like a ship. I will have no slackers in this company. That's it. This is a ship and I am the captain of this ship. Andrew Bergman could not get enough of Gilbert's John MacGyver. No, there's no way to get enough. Speaking of great characters.

That's beautiful. That's beautiful also because of the joy of doing someone so esoteric that no one thought previously of doing. You have a few of those in your repertoire, don't you? Yeah, I mean, I didn't hear a lot of people doing Albert Brooks before I did it. Right. I don't think I've ever heard anybody do Albert Brooks but you. Yeah, I mean, it is amazing to come across a gem like that, just someone who caught your fancy and your attention

can you do some albert brooks listen gilbert i don't want to be the one to say this this has been a lot of fun but i've got a life to get back to you understand don't you i'm gonna i'm feeling a little nauseous i'm gonna go lie down okay is that okay with you? Jesus. Great Albert Brooks story in the book, by the way. Here's a character, just to get back to Avalon for a second, and I agree with you, I think it's Levinson's. I love Tin Man, and I love Diner. Yep.

You know, and I love Good Morning Vietnam, but I do agree with you about Avalon. And here's a character actor, a great one, that has been kind of indirectly inspiring your Mrs. Maisel performance. Not indirectly. Complete lift. Complete lift and rip-off of Lou Jacoby. Yes. Your audience would know him

if they didn't see Avalon. I can't believe... I can't believe I ate the whole thing. Yeah, I mean, he's been around forever. My favorite year. Yep. Woody Allen's movie, Everything You Wanted About Sex. Yes. Plays the guy who dresses up in the lady's clothing and has to sneak out of the house.

Yeah, just brilliant beyond belief. And because I did not have this formal training, when I finally got into acting in films that were more drama than comedy. And I just did not want to ever get caught acting. It's one of the Barry Levinson schools of acting is he hates to see acting and rather everything looks spontaneous. And I was very fortunate that Avalon was my first real film in terms of the sort of drama and comedy. But yeah, so I was hell bent on throwing everything away to underplay. The less is more technique. In fact, J.T.

Walsh on A Few Good Men, I confessed to him one day in his trailer. One of the great character actors. Another great character actor, yeah. Out of Chicago, a lot of David Mamet stuff. And I confessed to him one day in his trailer. I said, I'm going to be found out on this movie, if you're a good man. Everybody around me is brilliant. And I'm a comedian who's, you know, fooled everyone. This is the eighth attempt and it's not going to end well. And he said, well, you're already doing a form of acting that people train to learn and master it's called

less is more but i will tell you if you can figure out the other half of that less is more nothing is best if you can do nothing in a scene and steal focus you win and it resonated to the point where i spent the next 30 years underplaying trying to and then the first time I play a loud obnoxious Jew channeling Lou Jacoby and the marvelous Mrs. Maisel I get the best notices of my entire life my own significant other of 14 years says it's a role you were born to play born to play did you not hear me just describe it as a loud obnoxious jew i i remember jack lemon would tell that story of working with billy wilder and uh where he said could you give me a little less yeah and then he goes now no, no, no, less, less. Now a little more, less.

And Lemons says, well, you're telling me not to act at all. And Wilder says, oh, God, yes. That's great. Speaking of great impressions, Billy West's Lou Jacoby, which is one half Lou Jacoby, he's Dr. Zoidberg on Futurama. One half Lou Jacoby and the other half Georgie Jessel. It's a thing to behold.

That's a great combo. Yeah, I know you've had Billy on chat show. Let's talk about chat show, and then I just want a couple of more questions I want to ask you about Mrs. Maisel. Why did you stop after 400 shows and i and i want to give this show it's due because i was telling kevin on email that it's a it's not only a terrific show it's a show i relied on as a resource uh we have we have richard benjamin coming up tomorrow and i just and i re-watched your richard benjamin interview it's a it's a it's a masterclass. Well, thank you. You know, I got into doing it at a time when you had to explain to people what a podcast was. Us too.

They were probably, well, but now there's 2 million. When I started in 09, there were less than 50 on iTunes. And so to me, it wasn't I was starting something that I thought would take over the world. I was, as you guys are, genuinely fascinated by people's trajectory. And how did you get from there to here we are so the idea was to have a one-on-one conversation with comedians and character actors and writers and directors and musicians and sugar ray leonard was one of our largest and we streamed live on on video i made the mistake of choosing video podcasts which they were all available as an audio track as well. So anyways, yeah, we average about 40 a year, 10 years.

And so as we were coming up on the 10th anniversary, I realized that we were also rounding up on the number 400. And because I had always diversified my output from all the things you spent 14 minutes in the opening describing um i i never sort of pursued the podcast to be uh an institution like mark maron or um the others and so after 10 years and 400 episodes i realized i had not in fact turned it into an institution and those and those who came around the same time as me had um and i sort of felt like i i feel like 10 years is a good time yeah it's a good run. Yeah. It will still be, in the insistence of a couple of friends of mine, my legacy in terms of what you're describing, you know, just a long-form conversation. And I was super proud of it, but yeah, it was—

And you should be. Well, there's such little such little long form conversation anymore. But I also, you know, the big part of it for me was having started in 09 with a machete in each hand. I. I had no booking person. I had no producer who. You know, handled the pre-production of the show. We had a crew, and I had people helping to render it and put it up. But the casting of 400 episodes was almost solely on me.

And it got to the point over the years where every time I entered a social gathering where there were famous people, I was incapable of enjoying myself because I was trying to angle and figure out ways to invite people to be on the podcast. And after spending 10 years doing that, I was wildly ready to give that up. That's what I'd heard, that you were tired of asking friends to do it. Yeah. give that up. That's what I'd heard, that you were tired of asking friends to do it.

Yeah, I coined the phrase being asked to be on a friend's podcast is the new jury duty. Yeah. Well, you should have been like Gilbert. He's never asked anyone. Yes. I would have loved to have that good fortune. Yeah, I'll meet with

Frank and say, I was having lunch with Charlie Chaplin yesterday. He'll go, did you ask? Yeah. Here's just a quick question, Kevin, from a listener, Paul Krosulik. Years ago, I stumbled across the movie Indian Summer on cable. I fell in love with it.

I waited for it to play again. I watched it again, loved it again. I watched it for the third time. Even though the movie doesn't change, you kind of have to be in the mood for nostalgia to enjoy it. What are your memories of filming that? Terrific little movie. You and Diane Lane and Kevin. Bill Paxton and Alan Arkin.

Late great Bill Paxton. Sam Raimi. Yeah. Kimberly Williams. Matt Craven. I'm forgetting people but... Elizabeth Perkins in it too? Elizabeth Perkins. There you go.

Yeah. It was extraordinary. Great deal of fun. It was a shot at the actual camp that the writer-director Mike Binder went to as a child. So he refurbished it for the filming of it. You had to take a boat to get to this camp.

So there were no trailers available. So our actors at trailers were cabins. So Sam Raby and I shared a cabin while we were shooting. You know, those kind of things in terms of a work experience make it pretty damn special. And then just to follow one of my heroes, Alan Arkin, around on the set every day was pretty extraordinary. Had you done the Arkin impression? Was that in your repertoire before you met him? No, I didn't think of it and learned it while being around him.

There's no greater source than the actual. And I heard you, something that happened that I was lucky enough to happen to me a few times, too, was Robin Williams inviting you on stage. Oh, yeah. So while, you know, having come out of San Francisco, having started the San Francisco stand-up scene in the late 70s, Robin had also, before moving to L.A., sort of came up through San Francisco. His family had relocated there, and he had grown up. ago his family had relocated there and he'd grown up and um you know it it was the birthplace of that wave of stand-up and he had already gone on to start morgan mindy around when i showed up in

78 um but he came back constantly and and befriendedended and supported all the young comedians to great joy for all of us. And so when in the 80s, when I was shooting the film Willow in Northern California, around San Rafael, the largest blue screen facility in the world, uh, around San Rafael, the largest blue screen facility in the world. Um, Rick Overton and I were the two brownies and Rick's one of the all time brilliant improvisers. We love Rick.

Yeah. And Rick was very close to Robin Williams as well. And so Rick would, well, we were at work, call up Robin and say, we're thinking about going to X club in San Francisco tonight, whatever that club name was at the time. Do you want to maybe jump on stage and and fuck around a bit?

So the three of us would get on stage and improvise, which really equaled or turned into me working my way to the back wall of the stage and watch those two brilliant people go at it but we did share several you know scenes over that six-week period on stage improvising and fucking off but then robin was very very sweet to appear in my first one hour hbo special um i i did this black and white mockumentary along with the concert in color uh madonna's truth or dare had just come out in theaters and where she hired a crew to document herself which i couldn't stop laughing about um and so david steinberg the great comedian director directed the piece and helped shape the we wanted to do sketches and stuff and he said you know you should really pimp madonna's truth or dare so we did this black and white

mockumentary backstage and one of the scenes starts with me in a dressing room sitting in front of a lighted mirror and looking into mirror talking but you hear me in voiceover saying over the years people have asked me how do i learn impersonations well i find uh that studying the right uh you know people uh is the best i think i may have found the best way so my voiceover uh dissipates and we hear my verbal track sitting in front of the mirror where i'm impersonating Robin Williams. Whoa, done, Mr. Happy. That's not quite it. Whoa, don't be frightened. Shit, that's not it.

How did you do it? And the camera pulls back and Robin's standing right there. That's cool. And then I stand up and he teaches me how to do the Robin Williams impression. Yeah. He was a great joy to be around. Gilbert, how many times did you get on stage with Robin and mess around? Yeah, he'd just be on stage and he'd yell, oh, Gilbert, come up here.

He loved you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I saw that on a number of occasions. He loved you. Much missed. Much missed. And a terrific actor.

Brilliant. You know, I'm discovering films like What Dreams May Come and some of these other performances, some of his lesser-known, Bicentennial Man, some of his lesser-known performances. Right. Everybody knows, you know, Moscow on the Hudson and Good Will Hunting, but Fisher King really turned in

a lot of wonderful screen performances. Yeah. Yeah. I watched something he did on Homicide Life on the Street. Yeah, the pilot. Yeah. He was terrific. Speaking of great actors, before we get you out of here, Kevin,

you got to tell us a little bit about the blueberry muffin and De Niro and Scorsese. Because I watched Casino again. And Gilbert found it fascinating, by the way, that De Niro was tickled pink by Rickles' antics, but not so Joe Pesci. Yes. Experience, as hard as it may seem, of working in a Scorsese, De Niro, Pesci, Sharon Stone film with Bob Richardson, cinematographer. I mean, the whole thing was incredible. Written by Nick Pelleggi, who wrote Goodfellas. Was that Don Rickles is in the movie. So he and I would pal around and watching him, Don, go after De Niro on set in front of everyone.

Watching him, Don, go after De Niro on set in front of everyone, I don't know that there's been a more enjoyable experience working on film than seeing De Niro in the middle of a scene, camera rolling, Scorsese's watching, De Niro is acting brilliantly. In the middle of a shot, Rickles, who's in the scene with him, would just step out of the moment and turn on him and say, is that the way you're gonna do it like that no no you got the awards i'm sure you know what you're doing get ahead and and rickles and denaro loved it i mean loved it beyond belief because he had a background

in new york where he enjoyed those guys in the street who would rank on each other. Well, yeah, so as Rickles explained it to me, yeah, the dozens. It was two types of peer groups on the street corners. It was a doo-wop group where you stood around in a circle singing songs, or it was a put-down group where you stood around in a circle and said, your mother this, your mother that. And Demure De Niro, believe it or not, was in the put-down group. Hard to believe. Rickles,, your mother this, your mother that. And Demure De Niro, believe it or not, was in the put-down group. Hard to believe.

Rickles, I know. So Rickles tells me this as a way of explaining why Rickles knows he owns De Niro. Because to those kids in that circle, De Niro was God. Or Rickles was God. So that's why Rickles freely went after De Niro on set. To De Niro's delight. I mean, he couldn't. He just couldn't get enough.

Whereas Pesci weirdly seemed to have no sense of humor at all. Wow. I'm sure he does, but he didn't when Rickles pointed out that Joe was so short, he's going to ride him around the set like a Shetland pony. and run the set like a Shetland pony. And Pesci did not appreciate. No, I get it, I get it. You're a genius and I'm a... Go fuck yourself.

You know, he was really upset. Wow. Wow. The scene watching it today, the scene with you and De Niro, and look at all these wonderful, iconic actors you're sharing scenes with. I mean, Lemon and Matthau and De Niro and on and on. I've carried them all.

What's that? I've carried them all. You carried them all. The blueberry muffin, though. There's a bit in the book about it. Yeah, you've just got a great little moment written by the great Nick Pelleggi. And I happen to be in a scene where it's just DeNiro and I sitting at this table, this four-top. And the way that Bob and Marty, which is ridiculous to say, work is they like to do 30 takes or more and i'm again

not a trained actor so i'm i'm dead in the face after about five takes i mean i i just feel like i'm acting there's nothing fresh there's nothing i don't have the technique but they they just love to warm up and um but after every take uh i just remember a little bobbing Scorsese head at the edge of the table. He was kneeling down. He's not that short, but he was kneeling down and his little bobbing head. So that was great. That was great. What do you think?

Is he more angry? Is he less angry? What do you want to do and he he really was saying and meaning what do you want to try as opposed to some directors if not a lot who will who will know i'd like you to do more but they don't want to say i want you to do more so they'll come up and say what do you want to try more or less and then if you say less and they want more they go all right let's try less so that they can get it out of you and get it out of your system and come up the next take. Let's try more now.

And then that's what they'll have in the editing bay. Whereas Marty definitely wanted to do that scene over again. He left out seven fucks from that last scene. Yeah, it's a perfect example. He would find the stuff that he thought De Niro would be upset about. That's classic. Since you brought up David Steinberg, one more bit from Gilbert. You have to tell Kevin about David Steinberg directing you.

He was once directing me where I had to say a line and then, you know, run off. And so I do it. And then he walks over to me like very meekly and unsure. And he goes, I'd like to do that scene again, but this time could you run a little faster? And I said, I guess I could run faster. And he goes, no, no no I don't really mean faster I mean more graceful could you run a little more graceful and I said and then I like just I'm staring at him and he says well you know not so much like stumbling moves, more even.

And then he stops and he shrugs his shoulders and he goes, can you run less Jewish? That's a perfect David Steinberg story and impression. Let's let's plug this book from 2012, which you can still get. Kevin Pollack, How I Slept My Way to the Middle. Great stories. I will not give away all the stories. We'll make people buy the book because they should. People who love this show will love these stories. There's a Rip Torn story in there

that'll knock your socks off, and a couple others. You'll find the Michael Clark Duncan story. Really, really funny stuff in there. One thing about Maisel 2, as I was saying to you before we turned the mics on, Kevin, you know, this show, we try to make this show a valentine to old showbiz and character actors and people we love.

There is a show that is a valentine to old show business. And we were talking about Don Sherman, Amy Sherman's father, who was a comic. And I don't know how many people know that the show is kind of a little bit of her tribute to her dad, in a way. Well, it's a tribute in the sense that she grew up around that world and could draw from it freely. And of course, in that regard and others, it's a love letter to her father. The idea of finding a female central character

to drive the narrative, of course, not at all inspired by her father. Yes. But the era and the rhythm and pattern with which people spoke and all of that was something she grew up around because of her father being a touring professional comedian. Do you, and you get to, you really get to chew the scenery as Moishe. Oh boy. Yeah.

And I wrote down one line when you're up at the resort and Tony Shalhoub is telling you to take it easy because you're not fully understanding what a vacation is. You've got a phone in each hand and you say, excuse me, but in my business, a man sweats and stinks until he dies. Do you regret looking back, underplaying all those parts? looking back, underplaying all those parts? Well, it's, you know, it's been an extraordinary journey, and no one pointed out from the beginning. I just needed to be a loud, obnoxious Jew, and had they. You know, everything comes at its time, and I was,

I find that to be true with a fan of other people's work also, that people grow into certain abilities of moment in time of a character and meeting a performer. So, yeah, I think the timing was exceptional in terms of me being ready and free enough. You're fun to watch in that part. You and Tony enjoy going at each other? We do. You know, because we're both character actors,

we'd not met because we were always up for the same parts, we both figure. Oh, interesting. So we hadn't met, let alone worked together. And we fell instantly in love and still are. And I'm so happy to report that we just finished season four and everyone is still madly in love with each other. There's no divas in the cast.

I remember they had me on one episode. You were in the first one. Yeah. And so I should know the name of the show. Technically. Far be it for me to point that out. But I'm with you, though, Gilbert. If you just use me in one episode, I don't have to point that out. I'm with you though, Gilbert. If you just use me in one episode,

I don't have to remember your name. We want to shout out Luke Kirby too, who was being interviewed by the New York times and said that he listened to this podcast, which was very, which was very flattering to us. And so in the episode I'm on, I'm like a strip club emcee, and I bring up Lenny Bruce. Yeah. Yeah, played by Luke. Yes.

And yeah, I thought he did a terrific Lenny Bruce. He's astonishing. We won't get into how Kevin was forced to play Lenny Bruce once, but it's in the book. And tell us about the guy from the Green Mile or whatever. Oh, it's a long one. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, just know it's salacious, real, funny, awkward, unfortunate, and funny.

It's dinnertime in L.A., and I'm sure Kevin wants to eat, but tell us about the new podcast. Oh, so it's an all-improvised comedy podcast called Alchemy This. I frequent the West Side Comedy Theater near my home where there's a lot of sketch and there's a lot of improv and stand-up as well and you know improv is one of those things that's magical when it works so i i also was raised on these um comedy albums fire sign theater and lemmings and national lampoon comedy hour and radio dinner yeah yeah so they were, but the idea of theater of the mind always interests me. And I, when I decided after chat show ended and I wanted to do another podcast that I love these improv performers at the West side comedy theater in Santa Monica,

California. So I'd sort of cherry picked five of them and asked them to join me. And the scenes are all suggested by fans. I am the only one who sees them. I read the emails with the scene suggestion. And then the six of us improvise scenes from those. And then we've been doing it coming up on three years on the iHeartThere media. And, yeah, it's a great joy.

And fans all over the world of improv. It's very good. Yeah, these other performers are masters. I've gotten better at it, but they are all extraordinary. And less work for you. You don't have to ask anybody else. You don't have to hit up your celebrity friends. Yeah, no.

It's all play, no work. I also will recommend your doc, Misery Loves Comedy. We made a joke. If there's a miserable comic that should have been in it, it's Gilbert. Yeah. I wish I had access to you. You would have been perfect for it.

I didn't. It was one of the things based on the chat show all those years. I just reached out to people who I could text and so if I knew you, you were in the doc. I didn't use anyone's agent or manager. And it's a talking heads documentary. But the premise being, do you have to be miserable to be funny? So yes, I interviewed- I found it fascinating because we've run into a lot of comedians on this show. And one of the

first things in the movie was stories about their parents. Did you become funny to make your parents laugh, one or the other, or cure their depression, which we know is true of Gleason and other people. And that was really fascinating. Yeah, it was a hell of a journey. I ended up with over 60 hours of content with no script or story. And I sort of had to make one. This is why I edit the film for about 10 months but it was uh i'm very proud of it yeah it's on amazon you should be so mrs mazel season four alchemy this is the podcast let's thank ed krasnick who introduced us indeed thank you ed

krasnick and i were working on um on a new project together that I can't yet talk about, but it's unbelievably exciting in the podcast world, an audio book, but one that'll be right up both of your alleys, I promise, and I'll tell you more when I can. Oh, I'm excited. Yeah. Yes, we love Ed.

Let's give Ed a shout out. And the book, again, How I Slept My Way to the Middle, which is full of wonderful, great stories. Anything else for this man, Gilbert? No, I think that wraps it up. Thank you both. Kevin, this was a kick. Thanks for making the time.

My pleasure. Thanks for your interest. And thanks for being a podcast inspiration. Well, you guys have carried the torch beyond anyone's hopes and dreams, and please continue success to you. Thank you. We're coming up on that magic number on 400.

You're doing extraordinary work, and as long as you're having fun, don't stop. We are. We're proud of it. Thank you. Thank you. So this has been Gilbert Gottfried's Amazing Colossal Podcast with my co-host, Frank Santopadre. And we're talking to the man who's now in the fourth season of The Amazing Muselman. Kevin Pollack.

What did you say Slayton called it? The Amazing Mrs. Moxer. Oh, Pollack, I love you on that show, The Amazing Mrs. Moxer. Thank you, Kevin. All right, take care of both of you. I'd work for you I'd slave for you I'd be a beggar or a knave for you If that isn't love

It'll have to do Until the real thing comes along I'd gladly move The earth for you to prove my love dear and it's worth for you if that isn't love

it'll have to do until a real thing comes along with all the words dear at my command I just can't make you With all the words dear at my command I just can't make you understand I'll always love you, darling, come what may

My heart is yours, what more can I say I'd sigh for you, oh, cry for you I'd tear the stars down from the sigh for you, oh cry for you. I'd tear the stars down from the sky for you. If that isn't love, it'll have to do. Until the real thing comes along. ¶¶ With all the words, dear, at my command I just can't make you understand I'll always love you darling, come hold me My heart is yours, what more can I say

I'd sigh for you when I cried for you I'd tear the stars down from the sky for you If that ain't love, you'll have to do Until the real thing comes along Until the real thing comes along Until the real thing comes along