Goes Without Saying - self-sabotage & breaking cycles: am i the drama?

Episode Date: August 28, 2023

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Acast helps creators launch, grow and monetize their podcasts everywhere. Acast.com Goes Without Saying. You're listening to Goes Without Saying with Sefi and Wing. I'm Wing. And I'm Sefi. This is a really lovely episode we've asked as always on our instagram for you to feed in with your insights to be anonymously featured on the episode it's the best place to get your conversation into our conversation on the podcast this is a lovely chat

about all of our kind of quote-unquote toxic traits the things we're working on the things we're working on accepting the self-saboteur in us all send to your mates share on your story we're very appreciative we want to say hi hope you're doing good hope we find you in a lovely point of your universal journey and we'll speak soon bye all right we're back by the skin of our teeth this has been quite a crazy process to get us to the microphones today i feel like you're gonna hear thunder and lightning on my end i'm also by the time you're listening to this gonna be sunning it up touchwood on holiday seph is gonna be dog sitting i can't wait i can't wait i feel like i'm more excited

to dog sit than you are for the holiday like Like, I'm always like, I'm really treating this like a vacation. I hope it is a vacation. I just feel bad. I feel like I sprung it on you and like... No. I love to be sprung. What I don't like is like, Ozzy is going to bite you. Oh, I'm prepared.

He will bite you. And like, it's not personal. Maybe he's got no teeth. It's not going to hurt. Okay. I'm ready. Just don't... Yeah, yeah just don't yeah yeah don't what don't lose him or like hurt him oh god that shows what you think of me no it's not it shows

what i think of him right i'm gonna be i'm gonna be so careful with him when he's easy he's so easy i think he's gonna be so easy all right i think you've seen him around like he's pretty chilled like yeah oh my god he's so chill the thing that i'm worried about is that i is going to be so easy. All right. I think he will. You've seen him around. Like, he's pretty chilled. Yeah, oh my God, he's so chilled. The thing that I'm worried about is that I'm going to the... Oh, I'm so gutted I'm missing that. I know, I know. They messaged me again last night being like, a douche or wing can't come.

And I was like, she's on holiday. That's gutting. But I am going roller skating with Billie Eilish. I can't wait. I know. Sounds so good. In my head, that's gutting i am going roller skating with billy eilish i can't wait sounds so good in my head that's what's happening but um it's like it's like a climate change event sounds really cool and billy eilish and phineas are hosting it so cool and it's in a roller rink i have to go but i'm concerned about leaving aussie for the time that i'm there so i'm gonna have to rush and rush back no don't rush and rush back you'll be fine he'll be like i'm just gonna

lap around the loop with finny boy and roll straight back he'll be like he'll be like i'm just gonna lap around the loop with finny boy and roll straight back he'll be like and stay out you'll get back in the house oh ozzy i'm so excited it'll be really cute thank you for doing it i really appreciate it um no never i'm so excited having the time of my life by the time this comes out i hope you're having the time yeah so you're gonna be so you're gonna be in roads i'm gonna be in roads chilling and that's kind of it i'm really i'm really looking forward to like being in the sun and by by the sea by the sea being in the being in a bikini and eating all day is i said i said to you the other day and i said to my boyfriend the other day when i was in a pool with my boyfriend i was like in brighton i was like i think i was made for this

and it's like i'm in a pool with a drinking it's like i'm drinking cocktails in a pool and i'm like i think this is what i was born to do it's like yeah everyone thinks that like obviously that's a coincidence yeah but also it's like look get into it like yeah i think that's what i was born to do it's like yeah fuck it why yeah we are also on a little bit of a high because we just have on an extreme high yeah but i'm actually on the countdown of it now i think what i've learned from um our lives as kind of podcasters is that when an exciting thing comes to us or like whenever we do something exciting like even if we go live there's a huge extreme burst of energy it's like an insane amount of energy and then about like an hour mark you crash down

hard and i think i'm i'm approaching the crash i'm approaching the crash she's crashing all right well this can be soft and gentle lisa's geese you know the drill um 100 i hope everyone else all right oh should we say well the exciting thing was actually yeah sorry so it's a secret project sorry about that to be honest it's probably nothing like who knows what will come of it but we've got a really exciting we're really excited yeah we're about to have hopefully the first of many conversations tomorrow about potentially well with a literary agent we can say that i'm gonna be sick do you know what we i was like what before we got on yeah on this recording i was like we can't say anything we can't say yeah because i'm kind of i always hear these

kind of youtubers saying i can't say anything yeah because almost i think it's like are you not allowed it's not a secret but then you were like well we can say we're having a meeting of course we can and i also think it's important that everyone comes along for the ride with us and like basically what we've been saying for the past hour which is why sephie's crashing hard right now is because we've been going in and out of the conversation of like this is so important to us this is such a life goal this is not a money grab like if anything i'm looking to get into a financial deficit from this like i'm prepared to lose money for through this endeavor um it's almost like we were saying like it in terms of our most important things in life i guess

it's like having kids writing a book it's like those are really kids and books i think if you know what that's surely the most you know we've spoken a lot about like you know we're always writing things and we're just with the english kids like you know you know the drill um it would be insane but we've got a meeting tomorrow so don't put your evil eye on it oh my god get it all far away and that's that but i'm scared of getting into trouble so i was like we can't say anything we We can't get into trouble. Who are we getting in trouble with? I don't know. There's no one here.

No one cares about us. They hate us already. No one cares about us enough for us to be in trouble. We're banned from books. We're only saying good things. We're banned. We're saying good things. Yeah.

It was beyond funny. It's almost just like the biggest fucking thing. I couldn't even. Just something that we really don't take for granted. It's too big. I think as well. If this is something that we're going to be talking about more and more we'll get into the ups and downs but i think if you know us you know like yeah this is something that we appreciate to like a crazy degree so we'll see yeah we'll see to actually like a sickening amount

like we have been talking about how much our bellies hurt like we feel so sick should we get into this actual conversation let's do it okay i'm feeling good at you yeah i'm feeling good i'm feeling good the crash has been postponed it's in 40 minutes time i can feel it so let's let's do this and then i can clap okay so my question is so we put on the story which how and when do you self-sabotage? And I guess the topic of the conversation today is going to be us sharing, I guess, like red flags and like the really almost like masochistic, like self-indulgent, bad habits, self-sabotaging that we do. You know, when you know you're doing something and it's like, I'm not going to stop though,

am I, realistically? Do you have any that come to mind that you would want to share i almost did one today i stopped myself okay i really did stop myself so i was reading someone's sort of article about their like history like kind of how they got over like i think i think they had anorexia and i think they also have been jita and i think they also had the talk about body dysmorphia as well okay my body dysmorphia we know my two um most hated words um and i was reading that and they were like i was obsessed with like i think it was like probably like thigh gaps something else um hip dips do you know i mean like one of these fucking stupid words

and also i'm not even going to say it a blah blah blah i don't know what I mean like one of these fucking stupid words and also I'm not even going to say it a blah blah blah I don't know what it was and it was a term that I'd never heard before you don't it was basically I've never heard of it before but I don't want to know what it is yeah so it was a term that I heard and I thought what the fuck is a blah blah blah and it's basically just a new part of your body to hate a new thing to hate and feel a shit about and i hovered over it for three minutes maybe where i was like going between like i want to look and google what that is i want to know what that is oh my god i want to know what that is um and the like almost the like the like dedication or like determination maybe to like put my laptop away and be like i am

not i'm i don't even trust myself on the internet right now like get away from your phone you're addicted to hating your body so much that you need to find out what this new way is so as if you haven't got enough yes ammunition yeah for yourself let's not find out a new phrase and a new part of your body that you hadn't even like to keep tabs on before yeah i'd had only found out about fucking hip dips a fucking few years ago and i'm like showing what the fuck is going on like all these things that you would never even notice yeah about a body yeah people talk about all of a sudden so i that took a real like that was almost a self-sabotaging moment of like i oh, I'm going to go look what this thing is. And it took a lot for me to be like, you want to know. But that's just a load of bullshit.

Like you're going to find new shit and obsess. You know the routine here. So how do you think you have like gotten better at almost like stretching those muscles of like learning to hesitate over the google search and like not press send on that thing and like almost giving like getting the distance like how have you done that i do think it's exactly what you said of like hesitate i do think so much of like self sabotage is just like a habit of like whatever you jump to next that you can jump to any emotion so easily i feel like it's it's more

just like the pathways in your brain yeah the neuro pathways whatever the science kids say like just going from like you see a word you're triggered by it you want to find everything about it you want to like you know obsess over it whatever i do think it's like creating the space between like the automatic response and like checking in with yourself and i think it's almost like before my hands went to the keyboard and i started typing away over this fucking word it's almost like just take a moment like remember you're here you're alive you're in a bed you're in a bedroom oh my god downstairs there's tea you should make it come to go down and do that like almost like you haven't had a glass of water you need a wee like almost like checking into like the real world

real life and then it's like you close your laptop and it's like oh I've forgotten like it's not I would have forgotten that really unless it was brought up right now sorry a couple of hours ago yeah but it's like it's something that is just like rather than I just feel like on a phone on a screen it's so easy to get lost in stuff I do think it's so important just to like almost just have a moment where it's like pause and then it's like think basically just think what you want to do and also it was a thing that I learned in therapy and it was just this phrase it was like rumination cues action which at first I was like huh what does that mean but it's like every time that you can feel yourself obsessing obsessing ruminating on a thing it's like you it's not easy to stop thinking about

something unless you go and do something else so as soon as you you feel the thing starting it's time to go make a cup of tea it's time to go for a walk like it's time to listen to a song like it's you have to do something like because your brain won't stop otherwise i think and that's been huge well you know what congratulations let's just give that a moment to just let that hang of like well done good for you actually because we could have just let that go horrible google yeah well done i'm happy about that i think as well there's like a tendency as well or like another layer of when you can identify that you are about to self-sabotage or you have self-sabotage or you've done something that like

oh shit that doesn't align with like what my therapist would have told me to do or like oh shit i told myself i wasn't going to do that anymore um like oh fuck i was trying to not blah blah blah now i've done it shit actually the feeling of like failure failure completely let me actually go through some of the like responses that we got like for example someone said they're self-sabotaging with their obsession with their ex's new partner or scrolling to relax at night when i'm tired instead of going to sleep early or if i know i can't do something perfectly i refuse to do it at all like all of these things that we are aware that are things that like we would like to work on or like we know they aren't necessarily helpful for our general well-being in life yeah and can be really damaging it's really amazing to be able to like have the moment of hesitation and like pause and like take a minute and come back and like act

in alignment with like who you want to be how you want to treat yourself all of these things like you've taken the breath yeah you've you've done it you've avoided the near miss hazard perception it paid off like well done we've avoided an accident at work that wasn't your fault but i think the added layer often is like when you have done it or even when you have been working on it for a while there's the temptation as well to not only see that you are like struggling with a certain negative habit but like guilt and shame and like kind of villainize yourself for it so like well i'm such an idiot like why do i always have to go and search what the thing is or like i know i've got an issue with it so why do i always do that like oh it's so dumb of me what do i think i'm gonna see when i go and look through his phone or blah blah blah like it's because it's so self-hating it's so self-hating it really

is and almost like sometimes it kind of feeds into the thing of like hating yourself to interchanging it's like you can't hate yourself into someone new it's like because you're working on yourself that doesn't have to mean that you're hating who you are and like all of your flaws like you can have like an understanding of the things that you want to work on and it doesn't necessarily mean that you're like the biggest piece of shit scum of the earth yeah like give yourself a break sort of thing for all the natural things that we do like of course we have these tendencies yeah to be like a little bit silly sometimes and that's fine i think it's interesting they said about like i'm obsessing over their ex's new partner because i think a lot

of that happens online yeah and i think that is where the brain is almost you go into a zone that it's like it's quite like um it's like no man's land primitive almost you just follow your your desires on there you're not really um using any any like intelligence in your brain you're just using like just almost whatever flashes first you click like you it's very weird so i think that is like the idea of like when you feel yourself typing in a name that you shouldn't be typing in that's a bad one when it's like clicking a name i just want to go look i just want to go and look it's like no don't like really don't like i think it can be so hard to stop yourself because like basically it's just

curiosity but also it is like a bit of a it is kind of a form of self-harm as well in so many ways it's just like a low level form of emotional self-harm but it's just or sometimes it can be quite high level but i really just think don't like don't the name that you shouldn't be looking at right now would that be like an ex-partner or an ex-partner's new girlfriend whatever literally just don't yeah every time you go to type that in why don't you type in um sephie and wing instead or like jim carey fun facts like why don't you type in like dwight shroop best moments instead oh boy you're in for a treat gag reel nick miller best moments oh my god nick and jess compilation school of rock final do you know what i mean interviews like why don't we just take a minute and like actually think about what might be even

more somehow even more enjoying enjoyable yeah somehow even more enjoyable than looking at looking at a painful photo do you know the bad one i phoned you in a bit of a state this was a few months ago but i this was a real example of like that kind of self-sabotage i had oh god yep bear in mind like i was about to like everything was great i was about to go on holiday with this guy like it was mental of me to do this i went looking it wasn't see it wasn't mental of you to do this it It was... It's quite human, but it was an example of self-sabotage. It was a really...

It was a bit foolish. It was foolish. And I spoke to my other friend and she said, have you not got anything better to do with your time? And I know you do. Put it bluntly, you're so fucking right. Like, thank you for that check. And I phoned you in a bit of a state about it but i not even a state

but i'd got myself into a bit of a like internet hole but i had looked at the guy that i was dating the photos that he had liked and i've seen something like who he was and then the photos of that he was following like oh god it's a dangerous no it's not at all modern dating is crazy i hate to call a girl a psycho but i'm gonna that's not psycho it's so like it's like it's i don't like that in myself like it's so human but it's so nasty when you get that get into that yeah and i had found some things that he liked that i did not like the look of and i remember phoning wing and being like what the fuck what the fuck and then you being like this is a normal part of dating and i was like but i don't want it i don't want it then i opt out yeah foreshadowing really foreshadowing hey yeah massively yeah but i think the online i feel like you know when you're looking at something

you shouldn't be looking at totally whenever i have looked for things go looking for people that are trying to kill me i i know i shouldn't do that yeah i should hope that's right yeah yeah i know i shouldn't you know when you're googling the wrong thing you're typing in the wrong name just don't do it it's so bad it is literally just to like send a stab of pain towards yourself like what are you doing what is the best feeling though is like almost when you can feel yourself slightly outgrowing it like before you know it it's like oh god i think it's been like a couple of weeks since the last time i checked x y and z and then god that feels quite good when you slowly like stop to care stop caring oh my god that's so nice yeah i love that when

when almost you think oh i haven't thought about yeah that in like a little while yeah like two days three three days oh my god i haven't thought about that in a week so stunning um what's an example of self-sabotage that you have acas powers the world's best podcasts. Here's a show that we recommend. In the early 1980s, gay men started to get sick from AIDS. Years before ACT UP, before HIV was discovered, before the history you know, there were people on the front lines of the fight against AIDS.

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or recently what's the way that you self-sabotage yourself mine are quite basic well mine are like there's minor there are so many there are so fucking many but the ones i'm gonna go into are quite basic almost like i'm not very good at um living i'm not very good at like just general practice of like taking care of myself like it will take me ages like for example like you said earlier like oh shit i need to like drink a glass of water i think i do get into the thing of kind of forgetting that i'm like a human being i'm like a mammal on earth and i need like food and water and sunlight yeah and stuff like that to survive i i think i sometimes put myself through like long periods of time without like making an effort to

take care of myself and i'm like shit like you need to wash your hair like what is wrong with you like and then the self-hating comes out of like what is wrong with you why can't you yeah like duh but it's but it's just do you know what it is it's so simple it's so unhatable to hear someone else's form of self-sabotage because it's just like it's so human but things become so deep when it's you and you just hold yourself to a high standard because it's like obviously i can see why should she have to wash her hair no and i do see it too it's i think it's partly why should she have to um habit of just like the way it's also like it's kind of that self-deprecating humor of like we've been socialized to think that it's kind of cute

and funny and normal and like kind of best practice yeah in the english language and like british culture as well to just naturally lean into talking down on yourself a little bit yeah um yeah because i have a lot of time i'm really feeling like um like even earlier i text well actually you text me i was gonna text you i was gonna text you this morning but you got you got to me first i got there you did yeah and i knew it with a classic little how's it going did you how many of those do you reckon we send a day i don't know quite a few how's it going it's like is it even no but it's i don't even like it i like it as a phrase because it's like how is it going because it's almost it's more than just how are you? It's like, what are you up to?

What's the events, news and events? Like, filming? Where are we at? That sort of thing. It's like, what page are you on? Yeah, it's almost like, I spoke to you this morning. So how are you is a bit weird. But how's it going?

It's like, what's happening? We haven't spoken yet. That was the first thing we said today. No, no, but that was early in the morning. It was like 11 o'clock. Yeah, it's early in the morning. Oh, right. Okay. Yeah. we said today no no but that was early in the morning it was like 11 o'clock yeah it's early in the morning okay yeah jokes i woke up at 7 30 this morning that's horrific because i was up again late last night reading hunger games till um 1 30 so 7 30 is early half seven oh sorry it's half seven thirty so what would that be in my dumb brain

that shows how dumb you think i'm so bad you do it to me all the time like there are so many things that you say something and i'm like that obviously wasn't what i was asking like it's it's almost like i needed to verify that it was that i'm not too sure late that was early 11 is oh 7 30 is so early got you so early like oh my god i don't my i wake up usually in the hour of eight well that's not that far off then is it no but saying a seven saying a seven it's like what have i got school you'd be late for school i think 7 30 what time are you going to school no that was the time my alarm would go off for school 7 30 and i'd leave at half half eight i remember thinking run if i'm not ready by 7 30 i'm not going to school that was all my attendance got so bad oh my god yeah loser not ready by 7 30 how long does it

take you to get to school 10 15 minutes just a big old drama queen really anyway um i do get that but i used to watch this is really weird I used to watch, this is really weird. I used to watch Moulin Rouge! Every day before school. I'm not surprised. Why am I not surprised? I had like a tiny little, like this was like probably in like year nine. I'd like never been allowed a TV in my room. And I'd found this TV.

Probably it was real Michael Scott's tiny little TV. I'd found it. Like, I don't even know where I'd found it. But it had like a built-in dvd player and i had the dvd of moolah and rouge and every morning i would get up early to watch i would watch probably usually half of moolah and rouge every morning would you finish it the next day or did is one of those things where it's like you either split it up so you've got it on rotation so you watch the first half then you watch the second half the next day yeah yeah or it's one

of those things where you are very familiar with the first half yeah no i am very familiar with the first half but i also i would usually try and split it i would usually try to go halfway but what i would really weird like it's almost like getting up like i would remember get you in the spirit feeling myself out of bed so tired like it's not like i had energy i'd be absolutely exhausted probably the most tired i can remember being in my life but for some reason i had to watch did you enjoy it yeah good good for you i love no i loved me language so much i loved it so much when was the last time you watched i had like a weird mannequin that was in my room that i called sateen as well like i was really

why don't you watch it now um i haven't seen it in ages i can just feel a new face coming on yeah maybe it is back in my christian and saturn yeah but really but i just that sort of thing came back to me really weird so you woke up early at 7 30 is half past yeah i'm glad we got that supported because i was reading hunger games late last night don't know why i was telling you that because i've told you that in the last episode yeah but i love to hear it i don't know how that was relevant though sorry though 7 30 is early right thank you yes i got i got that much but i can't remember where the point was going from there i think the crash has hit guys we can bring it back we can bring it back we can bring it when have you self-sabotaged did you answer yeah i don't wash my hair and yeah

washing your hair gross peewee mango um i was gonna say how do you self-sabotage in relationships oh there's a whole nother ball game do you know what such such a different game um i recently read the book attached not even that recently a few months ago read the book Attached. Not even that recently. A few months ago. Read the book Attached. Yeah. And I have decided that I haven't... You will disagree. You think I'm avoidant, avoidant, avoidant. I think you can have avoidant tendencies.

I disagree. Okay, go on. I think I have an anxious attachment style. I don't disagree with that. Yeah. Because I will tell you go on so i think i self-sabotage in basically when i was reading the anxious traits i was like this is getting a little bit hot in here this is this is um reminding me of someone i just really think i self-sabotage in

the ways that like when i would feel insecure they were talking about this thing called like protest behavior that's like when someone does something that you don't like rather than being like oh that really made me sad that you did that i think i'm good with it in friendships i am yeah i think in romantic relationships i'm really completely different yeah that if someone was to do something that would make me feel insecure i would almost be like a bit like arms folded like storm like a bit elsa fine then yeah ice queen ice queen let's put it like that it makes it cool yeah it's cool just just kind of i get very cold and it which i think it kind of looks a bit avoidant but actually i think it's it is kind of just an anxious thing of like i'm in those moments desperate for like

the reassurance of them to be like oh my god no i didn't mean that to make you insecure but rather than just communicating like someone i've learned with a secure attachment style i would be like kind of just like roll over in bed and i kind of face the other way sort of thing it's like jesus i think even having the awareness that you need reassurance in that moment is a whole nother issue like i think even sometimes we have the conversation where like i feel like i've said to you before i know i'm coaxing you into certain things i don't want to be putting words in your mouth but i feel like you're coming across one way but maybe it's because are you feeling this this and this and you'll be like oh yeah i guess so sort of thing like i think sometimes it takes us time to like almost like we shut not just other people out from that emotion

but ourselves like we can't even like admit to ourselves how we feel yeah no completely it's intriguing it is but i do i would recommend that book for everyone like it's kind of it's kind of a bit i feel like a lot of books like that are quite repetitive. Like almost that you could get the bullet points really. But I would recommend reading maybe like the first quarter. A Sparknotes summary. It is interesting. That's what everyone's going to do with our book. Yeah, no, genuinely.

Top line. Top line summary. You can just read the first quarter. It's quite repetitive. I could give'll take it but yeah that's a horrifying thought that's actually so sad that's my night oh i love this all right let's do this one go on i really recognize this username as well so hey if you recognize yourself in this message because i'm not going to say what username is because it's whatever anonymously this person said that they self-sabotage by being so socially

aware of myself that i enter a paradox of negativity about how i'm acting yeah and it kind of reminded me of i watched um what's her name alex cooper from famously from call her daddy yeah she was talking to someone god the people she's spoken to i mean i couldn't begin to guess i've never seen anything or from that podcast other than cole sprouse smoking the cigarette did you see um she had miley on a long time ago yeah i remembered this being a thing i saw a clip of zayn zayn recently uh hayley bieber i would love to listen it's just one of those things i haven't really gone into the world of call her daddy but i'm intrigued well i remember her saying to this unknown character in my mind yeah about how she interviews people and like the conversations that

she has with people and almost you want them to be i'm gonna butcher this but the idea of like you want them to be as comfortable as possible but also like not self-aware at all because the more you try and come off like authentic or nice or whatever like you want to come off well or whatever blah blah blah you just end up coming off like an arsehole weird you come off really weird and it is quite hard to kind of run yourself through a filter of like um you kind of become like the ambassador of yourself rather than like your actual self yourself yeah so i'm the representative for wing from sephie and wing and i can't really tell good jokes and like i can't

really respond on my feet and i don't have my best vocab like she does but i for some reason think i'm the more appropriate person to bring to the microphone than actual wing it's weird right but that is i almost feel like the it's definitely been a process to get to the point where we can speak as ourselves and not as the representatives i still feel like a representative in lots of ways though do you know what i mean this is definitely not my best self that turns up here no no no i hope you guys don't have the wrong impression of me like i think we're i mean i'm sure they do no they don't have the wrong impressions like this is why i have to remind myself like before most episodes of just like i have nothing to prove in this i've got i'm not trying to convince anyone that i'm funny and clever and

cool and blah blah blah and like almost i've got nothing i love to come to that people often ask do you guys like prepare what you're going to say before and i am absolutely like firm in the belief of like we are better, the least prepared. Like I have to come with nothing to say. You really come, almost quite right. I think you're your best when I spring something on you. When you think on your feet.

Because if I, if I come with like, usually the best thing that people say is the first time they say it, the more rehearsed and the more like, the more like, um, the time I've got, oh,

I really want to get it into this episode that i've done this cool thing it's like no no no no no it doesn't fucking matter i don't give a shit or nothing to prove like i really feel like on your own as well but i think in a in a dynamic where like we're already friends like yeah so then it's almost like you're telling your friend that you did something this week then there's a microphone there but you're also saying it's just so bizarre it can never be but i think the concept of like presenting yourself in a certain way comes out not even just i mean it comes out massively on social media obviously but i think a lot in our real lives and i think a lot of people do it in relationships and

when they're getting into new relationships with people yeah you feel like you need to present yourself almost like as the best or like this most specific version of people yeah you feel like you need to present yourself almost like as the best or like this most specific version of you and you become like the representative it is a specific version of you though like i definitely think that's one of the things when you're kind of transitioning from like dating someone to like spending time with them outside of like a two hour three hour date that you are presenting like the romantic version of yourself to someone for a short period of time and then when they start to like sort of you're hanging out with someone in non-romantic settings it is actually quite the transition and that's why

it's so much better just to go in as yourself immediately rather than be the kind of you're kind of the caricature of yourself in a romantic setting on a date it just then becomes a bit difficult to bridge the gap between like you and a supermarket yeah like maybe just go in as yourself and it's all fine it just is so much better okay this is a nice one to end on you self-sabotage this person said whenever i feel inadequate i feel like that's the end of the episode to be honest whenever i feel inadequate like i'm going to fail anyways i tend to self-sabotage it's like oh look let me just suck it in almost like you can't reject me if i just reject myself world yeah i think that is it when i'm feeling inadequate it's like yeah you don't self-sabotage when you're feeling good

and almost like when you've lost the hope of like trying as well as i actually don't even have it in me to try it's like oh it doesn't matter anyway it's when you become lost the hope of like trying as well as i actually don't even have it in me to try it's like oh it doesn't matter anyway it's when you become quite like apathetic i think yeah almost you're quite exhausted it's like oh i just don't even have it in me to like to do the things that i know i should do i just don't care anymore it's a really horrible place to be in actually it is really horrid i also feel like there's like a there's almost like i've heard a few people say sentences similar to kind of i'm just i just have self-sabotaging tendencies like i have i i am a self-sabotager saboteur i'm a self-saboteur um fast you could say it's such a

myth like i feel like it's one of those things we've spoken before about like the myth of being like i'm a morning person i'm a people pleaser i remember i'm a blah blah blah whatever you want to fucking put terms on yeah and how they can be helpful but how they also kind of lock you into a narrative and i think people are so quick to put like negative labels on themselves like no one ever gives himself a nice like notice how they're all hot it's funny isn't it it's never like i'm a i'm a naturally intelligent and great listening person i'm just naturally so funny i'm just such a funny person yeah you're not gonna hear it um but i just that's sorry cut the pause um but i just feel like it wait let me get it but i think that's why this topic i'm sure i'm sure everyone will be clicking on this episode self self sabotage duration yeah yeah self sabotage

and being like oh that's so mean that's so mean that's so mean it's like we forget that it's so universal like i almost think everyone thinks they've got this like kind of really annoying stupid bit that doesn't make sense that they just always do things they end up doing things that don't help them it's like yeah it's clearly natural it's clearly right exactly it's like are you someone who has all of these horrific self-sabotaging tendencies or are you just a person who is kind of inundated with all of this messaging around evolving and becoming your best self yes so much stimuli on why you're not good enough and why these behaviors aren't helpful and are actually destructive and what if they're not the problem you're the problem and you need to work on this and you need to be better constantly be

improving it's fucking knackering and maybe it's not a problem of self-sabotage maybe it's just human nature to go through ebbs and flows of emotions emotions and behaviors do you know what i saw a tiktok from this girl who seems so cool i literally don't know her name though but she's because i watched like her video like the whole way through and it was a long video she comes up a lot but i don't know her name but maybe i'll see her again i'll tell you but she did a video i think it went quite viral but she was saying like um she was like i am i'm someone that people always comment on being so confident blah blah blah blah people always say i'm so confident confident blah blah and the reason why that i

think that is is that um i'm never involved in a process of improving myself and i'm really trying to quote her i'm using the first person so it may go confusing i um i don't get lost trying to improve myself and i do things that i don't like and when i notice that i've done something that's like oh i didn't like that behavior i just won't do it again but i'm not involved in like a process of i'm just trying to improve this i'm never on like a self-improvement journey i just thought really cool yeah like the confidence of that to be like i'm just living i'm not actually trying to improve myself i feel like we're so as you were just saying inundated with the messaging of like you should be improving improving improving improving and it's kind of like until what yeah until you die until literally you're not here anymore. Until you die.

I've seen old people. They are not happy with who they are either. I've seen them. You improve and you improve, improve, improve. Until what? You're the perfect version of yourself for two magnificent years and you die. No, that doesn't happen. Even in those two years, you're still going and going. It never reaches an end point.

So I quite like the thing of just like, I opt out. Yeah. I am myself. I think finding the line. never reaches an end point yeah so i quite like the thing of just like i opt out yeah i am i am um myself finding the line i make mistakes and i learn from them but i'm not trying to improve my myself i'm not interested in it i think you can't go anywhere near or like i think it becomes a danger i think it can really easily become a really dangerous slippery slope i think it i think i think it the energy is so insane i think it becomes that was my representative that wasn't me yeah that was she just jumped out did something weird this whole episode in fact has been for my

representative it hurts and i don't know what she's doing i think it is a dangerous game when we prioritize self-improvement over self-acceptance and almost push self-acceptance into like the far-off horizon as something that is like oh yeah of course i'll accept myself when i'm a different person and i'm perfect and i've improved um but i think we're just here to say, like, you're probably fine as you are. I will actually go as far as like, you definitely are fine. I think you're great. Well, I hope I'm having a lovely holiday. And it's just the same message as always.

Just relax. Chill. Have some fun. That's what I'm doing right now. Same message. Ooh, nice. I had a hot chocolate that was so good the other day. I was going to have one earlier.

But when we had our book news and I was like, I'm going to be can't do that i'd have a tea instead um you know when you're drinking a hot chocolate and you almost can't stop and it's almost like a kid i do that with ice coffee that's the problem i guzzle ice coffee it's like i just made this literally 45 seconds ago it's already gone i think i just don't like coffee, but I love it. I drink it every day, but I also drink it, I think. But when I had the hot chocolate, I was like, that was nicer than a coffee. Just definitely. The flavour of chocolate is definitely nicer than the flavour of coffee.

They're just not even comparable. They're just different, almost chocolate. She's in her own league. She's not fussed about the why is it the opinions of sheep chocolate exactly about what the coffee's thinking right i'm sorry i'm cutting this no sorry zip it yeah yeah no bye if you don't hear from us assume the worst jesus christ Christ.