Good Inside with Dr. Becky - Revisit - Confidence Isn't Feeling Good. Confidence is Self-Trust.

Episode Date: September 24, 2024

This is a repeat of an earlier episode. When your kid comes home from school and declares "I'm the worst at math" or "everyone is better at gymnastics than me", you might think that you can teach them to believe in themselves with some words of encouragement. But confidence doesn't come from the outside. True confidence comes from feeling good enough inside. This week, Dr. Becky talks to a mom who is doing all the right things to teach her son to believe in himself but it just isn’t working.Get the Good Inside App by Dr. Becky: https://bit.ly/4doK9nFJoin Good Inside Membership: https://bit.ly/3zblFjoFollow Dr. Becky on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drbeckyatgoodinsideSign up for our weekly email, Good Insider: https://www.goodinside.com/newsletterOrder Dr. Becky's book, Good Inside: A Guide to Becoming the Parent You Want to Be, at goodinside.com/book or wherever you order your books.For a full transcript of the episode, go to goodinside.com/podcastTo listen to Dr. Becky's TED Talk on repair visit https://www.ted.com/talks/becky_kennedy_the_single_most_important_parenting_strategyToday’s episode is brought to you by Airbnb: Before Dr. Becky was a parent, she thought planning a family vacation would be a breeze… until she realized how much has to come together for a trip with two adults and three kids. Then she discovered Airbnb Guest Favorites. No more combing through options, reviews, and features. Guest Favorites are the most loved homes on Airbnb according to other guests. And that peace of mind when preparing for a trip is huge. Using Guest Favorites couldn’t be easier: Just go to Airbnb, add your destination, tap the filters and hit the toggle for Guest Favorites. It’s that simple.

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to learn more and download today. here, so follow the link in my show notes to learn more and download today. I'm Dr. Becky, and this is Good Inside. So your kid comes home from school, or gymnastics, or baseball, and tells you that they just can't do it. It's too hard, and everyone else in their class is better at the thing than they are. Well, this week, I'm talking to a mom who's been doing all the right things to teach her son to believe in himself. And it still isn't working.

And I think what triggered probably my worry was my son was like placed into a like gifted and talented pre program. he struggled with it. He told me, I'm the worst in the class. I always finish last. I'm dumb. I don't want to be in this class. And I think he was accustomed to being kind of like

the first one in his class being finished, being praised for doing well. And once he was placed in the class, he felt like he was the worst out of this group of other children. We'll be back right after this. On my family's last vacation, we found the perfect Airbnb within walking distance of a beach. It was practically in our backyard, which meant we could get up when we wanted and the day's activity was just right in front of us. And it meant that when one of

my kids had that inevitable beach meltdown, I carried him back to the house to chill while my husband got to stay with my other two kids on the beach. And the Airbnb had this amazing screened-in porch, so I didn't feel locked into some tiny hotel room. I still had a view of the beach. I kind of felt like I was still there. You know, for us, Airbnb has just been the thing that's made it possible for vacations to feel less stressful

and more enjoyable for everyone. So if you're planning a trip, feel free to search exactly like I did on Airbnb. I just went and I selected by beachfront. But check it out yourself because there are so many ways to personalize it so it meets your family's needs. My name is Christine. I have two boys, ages eight and six.

I'm a, I guess, recent COVID stay-at-home mom. Prior to that, I was working, and so I'm now very involved in the day-to-day lives of my boys. And I've noticed, with my older son in particular, he is very hard on himself. I've noticed it in academics and I've also noticed it in sports, but like it really has to do with confidence, I think. And I'm not really sure why he is so hard on himself. We really try our best to kind of emphasize effort

and feeling good about yourself, having a good time. Sports is not about being the best. And same thing with school. It's like learning is a process. It should be fun. It should be engaging. You should have lots of questions, be curious. But really, I'm kind of at a loss for how to handle a kid who is very bright,

but at the first sign of any struggle kind of shuts down. So I feel you. And also what I'm hearing, I feel like, Christine, you're like feeding growth mindset to him. You're like, I am feeding you. Do you know what I mean? You're like, I am giving you the stuff. Like, I know it, it's about the process, not the product.

It's about the learning and not the outcome. And I do it and I do it and he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not buying it. It's like so frustrating. Right? Because like, I'm not buying it. It's like so frustrating. Right? Because I'm not even gonna go over that, right? Because you're like, I've read it. Like I've read the book, I've done the workshops,

I've done the things, right? And so, I know you're not asking this, okay, but I just want to say it from the start in case it's in there somewhere. This is not your fault and this is not something you've caused in him. What's your reaction to that? Um...

Thank you for saying that. I... I believe you. I honestly think to myself... I know that that's true, but I also know that me, myself, I'm very hard on myself. And that's what makes me, I think, more nervous about the situation. Like, I feel like, oh, this kid is very similar to me

and I can see it. And how can I pull him out of that before he develops issues with confidence and with comparing himself to others and particularly in the academic world? And so, I know it's not my fault, but at the same time, I'm like, oh, it's me. It's been passed down. It's innate in him.

I hear you. And I think there is this nuance. Like I often say to parents, what's going on with your kid isn't your fault. And as the leader of a family system, it's our responsibility to figure out what's going on with your kid isn't your fault. And as the leader of a family system, it's our responsibility to figure out what's going on. And then to think about what's in our control to change, to shift a system kind of slightly to help our kid. So I think that's like that line where I actually really

do believe both are true. What our kid struggles with isn't our fault. And because we're the leader, it is our responsibility to figure out what comes next. Does that difference make sense? Mm-hmm, yeah, I like that differentiation. And I think that's something I would say to yourself a lot. And I actually find it's very empowering

instead of freezing. Like, to me, it's my fault, and I gave this to my kid, and I'm really hard on myself, and I'm gonna be a psycho breaker. Oh no, it didn't happen. I failed, I struggled, right? Like I didn't do that. That's one perspective and it's very freezing.

To me, it feels very different than, okay, this thing's going on with my kid. Ooh, like this is my responsibility, not from a heavyweight, almost like an opportunity. Like I'm the leader. I have this opportunity to figure out what's going on and make some shifts. And if I make a few shifts in the system,

my child will inherently make shifts as well, because that's what happens in any system, right? A partnership system, a work system, a family system. When one person in a system makes a change or changes something, everyone responds. It's kind of like the beauty of working in a system. And so first things first, give me a little bit of insight into what you named. You said I'm really hard on myself or I don't know if that was a big emphasis in your

family, kind of these things that you're trying to shift with your son. Yeah, so I grew up where my parents were very focused on academics. And I think early on, I did well. I did well. And maybe this is triggering in the sense that there's like gifted and talented programs in elementary school. I was in one and my parents were very excited for me. And then as time progressed like throughout middle school, I wasn't as strong academically and I struggled. And so, net-net, I ended up like from an outsider perspective, they would consider me academically successful. But amongst my siblings relative to me and my siblings, I always am like, oh, I wasn't the smart one. I wasn't the best at school.

But if I pull back from an outsider perspective, I'm like, actually, I did pretty well for myself. Like I ended up like doing very well in school relative to the general population, but I am very hard on myself because of that. And I don't think my parents weren't very strict or mean about it in any sense, but it was this, you have so much potential, you could do so much more.

If you just tried a little harder, you would be like a top student kind of situation. And I think that's my background coming in. And I think what triggered probably my worry was my son was like placed into a like gifted and talented pre program, which seems ridiculously early to be starting in second grade, but he struggled with it. He told me, I'm the worst in the class. I always finished last. I'm dumb. I don't want to be in this class. And I think he was accustomed to being kind of like the first one in his class being finished, being praised for doing well. And once he was placed in the class, he felt like he was the worst

out of this group of other children. And Christine, what happens for you when you hear that? Or even when you say that out loud now, you're hearing these words, I'm so dumb, I'm the worst. What happens inside you? Oh, I feel horrible for him. I just, I'm like, but why would a child be so hard on himself?

Why is he comparing himself to other kids? And in our house, we try our best not to do that, but he innately does it. And those are things that I know I would say to myself. And I know you love to talk about inner voice and how can we kind of help set our children up for success in what their inner voice is. And, you know, I, despite my efforts, I'm concerned what his inner voice is telling him. He gets caught in the part of the arc where he says to himself, like, he just kind of gets stuck.

I'm so dumb or I'm the worst, right? And it sounds similar to what you were saying. You're like, I used to compare myself to my siblings a lot. It's easier to look around and do that. So when he's comparing himself to others, I'm so dumb or I'm the stupidest one, what do you tend to say back to him? I usually say, do you think that's true? And when he pulls back, he says, I mean, no. Do you think that's true?

And when he pulls back, he says, I mean, no, but I am the slowest and the class is hard. And so we walk through like, what does that mean? Like, is being the fastest the most important thing? Like, if something's hard, what can we do about it? Can you ask the teacher for help? And, you know, he tells me all the problems with that. So, and all of that, I mean, this, Christine, sounds like such beautiful interventions and comes from the right place.

And actually, like, I could see actually that totally being helpful, only because you're saying this is still so much on your mind and seems so much on his mind, I want to share... kind of an additional intervention just to keep in your back pocket. Okay? So, there's this voice your son has. This voice that says, I'm so dumb, I'm the worst, I'm last, I'm slowest, whatever it is, okay?

The truth is it's all from the same part of him, right? It's like, I don't know what we want to call it, but it's like the, I'm the worst at everything, I'm no good part, I don't know, something like that. Often as a parent, when we see that in our kid, a natural inclination, it's like, stop, you know? Like, what, stop! We don't want to hear that voice.

Like, we want to hear the voice in our kid that says, this is hard and I can do it. Or, wow, I'm even in the gifted and talented program, mom. How amazing am I, you know? I feel do it. Or, wow, I'm even in the gifted and talented program. Mom, how amazing am I? I feel really good about myself. And we do often look to kind of logic our kid out of the I'm not good at anything voice as a way of kind of thinking maybe we can get them

into the oh, I actually do feel kind of confident and grounded voice. Is that making sense so far? Yes. Okay, so here's the intervention that's a little different. And it comes from this understanding. The thing our kids need help with more than anything else is actually learning how to talk to and relate to all the different voices they have in themselves. Not make their way out of the painful voices and into the easier, more confident ones.

Okay, so if I take that and put it into action, I'm just gonna model something. Okay, I'm gonna be you, and you're gonna be your son. Okay? How was class today? Horrible. I finished last. I'm so dumb. Okay, so that's this, right?

Ugh, there's that I'm so dumb voice again, huh? What might he say? But it's true. Like, listen, sweetie, I know this sounds kind of complicated, but you are a pretty smart kid, so I think you can get it. I believe you that when that voice speaks up, it really is convincing of how true it is. I believe you. I'm just gonna play this out.

So you're saying it's not true? I'm not saying that. And this is where Christina has the opportunity to do something really powerful. I'm gonna play out this role play a little bit. Let's actually zoom out. Let's pause this for a moment. Sounds like today was tough.

Happy to get back to that. But I don't know if you and I have ever really talked about something that's super important and that we really have in common. And this is where you can get some intrigue building from kids. I always do, I don't know. I mean, usually I wanna talk to you about a kid

till they're like 10 and you're only eight. I mean, kind of usually keep it to myself. It is kind of complicated and I just haven't talked to that many people about it. What do you think he'll do if you kind of have that entrance? Super intrigued. A hundred percent. Aren't you? You're even like, Becky, what are you about to say? I gotta know. Right? It's like such a good way of, you know, getting a tween or almost tweens attention. Okay. You know, we all, and you can either say voice or part. It doesn't really matter. We all

have different parts of us. We all have different voices in us. And that's normal. Everyone has them. And I know I have a voice in me. That when something's hard, what the voice says isn't, this is hard. Or this is a challenge. You want to know what the voice says? It says, I'm so dumb. Or it says, I'm the worst. Or it says, I'm the worst. Or it says, I'm the stupidest. Or sometimes it even says, I can't do this anymore. I'm just totally done. I can't be this. I don't belong to be, I don't deserve to be here.

I don't belong. I don't know. I'm just done, done, done, done, done. I have that voice. And here's something I think is interesting. I think you have that voice too. I also know we're not the only two. There's actually a lot of people that have that voice too. I also know we're not the only two. There's actually a lot of people that have that voice.

And if it's relevant, even... Do you have a partner? Mm-hmm. So you can say, you know, that parent has that voice or Aunt Suzie has that voice, whoever it is, right? Um, but I'm gonna pause there. How do you think he might react to that? I think he would feel very seen. I think it's interesting.

I've tried that tactic with telling stories about what was I like or things like that. And it makes me seem much more human and much more relatable. And I love that idea. And it's so interesting. I know about this inner voice and I'm always, I think about it, but I've actually never talked to my son about it, about like you have an inner voice. Yeah. And like kind of like we all do, right?

And look, you could share this image with him. It's interesting. I actually often recommend drawing it out. Let me tell you, I'm literally the worst artist in the world. So artistic talent not required. Okay. But between you and I right now, world, so artistic talent not required, okay? But between you and I right now, Christine, when we think about parts, okay,

there's a couple images we can think about. One of them is like, you're the driver of a car. And in the passenger, there's a lot of parts of us. There's a lot of voices, okay? And when a voice comes up, that's annoying. Our instinct often is to like try to kick it out of the car. Like even if we're on the highway, we're like, get out of here. you know, we only want the nice voices.

But the truth is we can't kick any voice out of the car. Okay, we just can't. And so what happens if we don't talk to a voice in the passenger seat is just like kind of an annoying toddler. They get louder and louder and louder. And then before we know it, they're in the driver's seat. And the thing to know about our parts or our voices is none of them are bad.

The only thing that ends up working against us is if any part of us takes over the driver's seat, because then we've lost control. And I think when we hear our kids say stuff, like, I'm so stupid, and of course, it's so natural. We're like, get out of here! Like, because also we look at our kid, we're like, you're the most amazing human in the world.

Like, you're so spectacular. So it's dissonant to us, right? But given we can't ever get rid of our feelings or thoughts, we also wouldn't want to because they actually have, they're often misguided, but at their core, they have useful information for us. Probably at the core, he's saying, I feel insecure, or I'm not so sure about this. It's just gotten heightened. And as long as we talk to a passenger in our car,

it will stay as a passenger. Because when you talk to a part of you, you are inherently reifying the fact that it's a part because it's me, Becky, talking to this part as opposed to the part taking over Becky. And so I want you, you know, in some ways to rethink of your goal as my goal is not to get rid of this voice and my son. Yes. It's actually hugely

relieving. It's like, oh, all right, okay. Anything besides getting rid of it is probably easier. My goal is to help my son develop a relationship with it over time to start to anticipate when it's gonna come. That is like the money move and you're like, you know what? Before math, I have a feeling my I'm so stupid over time to start to anticipate when it's gonna come. That is like the money move. And you're like, you know what? Before math, I have a feeling my I'm so stupid voice is gonna come up. I wonder if it's gonna come up at problem two

or problem five. I'm gonna make a little bet with myself it's gonna be five. Oh, it was two, huh? You know, you beat me. You were earlier than expected. Like it's now, I now have a totally different relationship with it.

And as soon as we start talking to a part of us, it doesn't make decisions for us anymore. Right, when that part becomes the driver, it gets off the highway. Cause like I'm so stupid, I don't deserve to drive, I can't be in this class. As long as we can be in a class or working on a project and we're able to say, oh, there's the stupid voice again.

Hello, I see you. It is a completely different experience. I'm literally able to continue in the driver's seat. Maybe I'm just gonna say, okay, you know what? You're allowed to be there. I know. I also have other voices.

I also have a, I'm a kid who does hard things voice and lots of different stuff going on. I'm just gonna do my next math problem and see what happens, right? And now because I'm in a relationship with that part, it completely kind of diffuses it. Parenting for the Future with Pedal Modest is hosted by lawyer, associate dean at Columbia Law, and mom of two, Pedal Modest.

Every week she talks with renowned experts about phenomena shaping and changing the world and the steps parents can take to prepare their kids to thrive in and impact that world. Pedal demystifies issues that we've long grappled with, like systemic inequality and sexism. And she digs deeper into newer challenges like AI, climate change, and demographic shifts. And she shares scientifically proven strategies and tools that parents of any background can use today to make their kids future ready. Parenting for the Future is available wherever you get your podcasts. Christine, do you want to know something I immediately love about you? Even though I can't see you. Do you know what I'm going to say? You're a note taker.

Oh, you can hear me. And I love it. Like, I love it. I love it. OK, because you it. I love it, okay? Because you're like me, like when I'm in a meeting that feels really important and I don't write down things, I'm like, this is amazing, this is amazing. I walk in the room and I'm like, I literally remember nothing about what happened. Like it's somewhere deep in my body, but it's not accessible at all.

So note takeaway, I'm loving it. So but I am curious because I think this will bring up some like highlights and things to hold onto. What resonates? What was worthy of note taking there? What feels like something, oh, I could do that, or that feels like me, that feels like it could be useful. I mean, I love the analogy you have

of this like driver versus passenger. I think the kids can really, both of my kids could really understand this concept. And I was just imagining sitting at a table being like, oh, what would, like innately as a driver, who are you as a person? And like kind of painting this picture of like who they are and letting them kind of join in. And then on the side, talk about other passengers that are in the car and talk about like how they interact based on like what you said. Because it's true, you can't suppress feelings. They're always there. And I can tell from my son, they will

always be there. And he just has to learn how to kind of control it, anticipate it. I love the anticipating it. Because I can see myself doing that. Because as an adult, I think I've learned to suppress that voice and build confidence. But it took a long time to get there, I think. And I love this kind of visual illustration that I can literally draw out for them and talk to them about. And I would this kind of visual illustration that I can literally draw out for them and talk to them about.

And I would, right? Anytime we make something kind of nebulous and confusing concrete, it immediately becomes easier. This is why we make lists, right? We're like, I have so much to do. And you're like, I just made a list and I feel better, even though I didn't check anything off. Because it's palpable, we can represent it.

Part of why feelings are so hard to deal with is actually because they don't have a concrete marker. Right, when you fall down and you scrape your knee. I mean, nobody loves blood, but it's useful. You're like, look, what happened to my knee? Like, I see it. When you're overwhelmed with feeling less than, or when you're worried,

oh, am I not smart enough to be here? Part of actually what's so hard to deal with is that on some level, you know I'm having an intense visceral reaction, but it's very confusing. And so for your son to have truly, it's like a mental model, but it's also a concrete model for like, this is what's happening right now. Because once you have that car and you're already making this extension, which I love, but there's so many things you can play around with.

Because another thing I could see you saying, right, after you kind of develop this, and let me be clear, I would not like put this all on him all at once. He's gonna be like, mom, this was like, this was intense, you know? So like, give it a few days. I'd be like, you know what I realized about my car? When something's hard, definitely I have that,

I'm stupid voice, oh, loud in the passenger. I actually do think, okay, I do think deep in there, there's this other voice that says, okay, like for me, she says, Becky, you can do it. She says, Christine, this is hard and I can do hard things. I just think the I'm stupid voice is like so loud that she just like drowns her out. But you know what? I'm drawing her into my car.

I'm gonna cry now, Christine. I'm drawing her into my car because like, you know sometimes we just know something's there even though we can't hear it, but we know it's there. Like I know she's there and I have a feeling. I have a feeling he's there for you too. If we really think about what is confidence, there's so many different ways we could define it, but if we're using this car visual, to me confidence is the driver is the driver who's able to kind of feel like themselves

and feel sturdy as a driver with kind of the widest range of passengers. Confidence isn't the driver who says, I feel like a really good driver only when I have someone in my back's seat saying, you've got it, you've got it. You're a great driver, you know? Like, I still, it's not as fun and it's not as easy. But I still do feel like it's kind of okay to be me driving. Even when there's other stuff going on in the backseat.

I don't feel like I need to exit or, you know, maybe I have to pause. But I don't feel like I, you know, kind of disintegrate. I think that's really what confidence is, right? Because fast forward, your son hopefully one day will put himself in a position where he's surrounded by people who are saying lots of things he doesn't understand. He's like, wow, these people are really smart in this room. Or he is going to, you know, be assigned, I don't know, something at work where his first thought is, I don't, I've never done this before. I don't know if I can do this, right? Like, those are going to be passengers

in his car forever. And to me, like, one of the best gifts we can give our kid is by the time they're out of our house, to some level, they have practice in being able to say, oh, hey, I see you. You've been a passenger here before. And I know I can kind of keep driving. I love that definition of confidence. Because when you originally said it, how do you define confidence? I was like, I have no idea how you would describe confidence.

And I think that's really it. Like someone who feels like sturdy with everything they have inside of them, the good and the bad. That's exactly right. Like I always, I always kind of like alternate definitions because it's hard to pin down such an important topic. But one of them I think is feeling like it's okay to be us with the widest range of feelings and thoughts that we have. You know, some are unenjoyable, so like, oh, it's okay to be me. Like, it's okay for your son to be him doubting himself. Like that's okay.

And I think another simpler way to think about confidence, and this is, you know, really the thing I like to run with and give a lot of strategies around is confidence isn't feeling good. Confidence is self-trust. And I think, you know, when your son says to you these things, when you're able to help him relate to that voice instead of get out of it, it's almost like saying to him, like, I trust you that you really are hearing those words inside you.

So, like, let's just call a spade a spade and figure out how to deal with it. To some degree, when we try to convince our kid out of the feelings or thoughts they're having, we're kind of saying to them, never meaning to, like, I don't trust you. I don't trust that that's real. Tell me what feels kind of most actionable or usable. What do you see as the next thing? You know, what do you feel like, ooh, I'm feeling it tonight.

I'm going to make a move with my son. I'm going to do this thing. I really think it's the car analogy. I think this idea that you can, that they all coexist, like in one space, everything can coexist and kind of like you're in control of which ones are in the driver's seat. And I think just being able to acknowledge that those feelings are there. I never thought of it like you said, it's like when something is hard, that undumb voice comes out. And I mean, logically, I understand that, but it's like, oh, yeah, every time something

hard comes up, that's what he says to himself. I mean, logically, I understand that, but it's like, oh yeah, every time something hard comes up, that's what he says to himself. There are also kids who I know, they say a mantra of like, I can do hard things. We've learned it from you, Dr. Becky. And I regularly will say like, who can do hard things here? And they'll both say, I can. And we'll give like examples of things that they've been able to overcome. And you know, they do have that voice inside them.

And I forget that like, that is the answer to the opposite that they're having. Like, it's actually because something's hard that they're saying that they're having. Like, it's actually because something's hard that they're saying that they're done. And the kind of opposite voice of that is I can do hard things voice. Yeah. Sometimes that voice gets drowned out, you know, so we've got to deal with the voice above it. And this is that voice. I think I really mean this, Christine, like I can, I can tell I feel really, I feel really confident in your ability to start to make headway on this with him. And I mean that. Like, I can feel it in you.

I feel confident. I trust you. I have a ton of hope that this is like gonna, I think you're gonna do this with him. You're like, wow, I just, I felt like a shift. Like some, I feel movement here in a different way. Yes. Yes. Thank you, Dr. Becky. Well, you are so welcome. I'm so excited for you. I also need things to be spelled out super simply. Most of us do. So please do circle back. Let us know how it goes. And

I feel like this is a really great moment and kind of next step in the journey of confidence building with our kids. Thanks for listening. To share a story or ask me a question, go to goodinside.com slash podcast. You could also write me at podcast at goodinside.com. Parenting is the hardest and most important job in the world, and parents deserve resources and support so they feel empowered, confident, and connected. I'm so excited to share Good Inside membership,

the first platform that brings together content and experts you trust with a global community of like- like valued parents. It's totally game changing. Good Inside with Dr. Becky is produced by Jesse Baker and Eric Newsome at Magnificent Noise. Our production staff includes Sabrina Farhi, Julia Knatt and Kristen Muller.

I would also like to thank Eric Obelsky, Mary Panico and the rest of the Good Inside team. And one last thing before I let you go. Let's end by placing our hands on our hearts and reminding ourselves, even as I struggle and even as I have a hard time on the outside, I remain good inside.