Habits and Hustle - Episode 227: Dr. Will Cole: How to Heal Shame-flammation

Episode Date: March 28, 2023

Did you know feelings of shame can physically appear in your body? In this episode of Habits and Hustle, I chat with Dr. Will Cole about shame-flammation. Given that your body is a cellular library of the thoughts, emotions, and traumas you live, these cells can deeply impact your health and express themselves through autoimmune and metabolic issues. We also chat about the different supplements you can take to support your nervous system, and gut health, and reduce inflammation. What we discuss: 01:33: Will’s latest books 04:18: Why is gut health not adopted by modern medicine? 06:37: What are the root causes of chronic illnesses? 09:49: What illnesses correlate with shame? 12:28: What is shame-flammation? 14:10: How can you heal your shame? 19:37: How can you support your vagal tone? 26:29: How can people who are Type A appease their vagal nerve? 29:16: What other ways can you heal your feelings? 36:30: What are the symptoms of gut health issues? 38:19: Does inflammation cause depression? 41:13: What are the symptoms of IBS? 45:09: How do probiotics help with gut health? 50:40: What is the issue with magnesium? 51:30: What other supplements should you take? 55:04: Is ashwagandha necessary for our nervous system? 57:25: How does basil enhance your health? 1:00:03: Can we become allergic to foods we often eat? 01:03:33: What’s the difference between allergies and intolerance? 01:04:27: What are the signs you have a dysregulated system? 01:06:59: Where can you learn more about Dr. Will? Thank you to our sponsors: This episode is sponsored by Hostinger. Visit Hostinger.com/HABITS and use promo code HABITS for an extra 10% off. This episode is sponsored by Notion. Visit notion.com/habits to try out Notion AI for free. To learn more about Dr. Will: Buy Gut Feelings: Healing The Shame-Fuled Relationship Between What You Eat and How You Feel here: https://drwillcole.com/gut-feelings Visit Dr. Will’s website here: https://drwillcole.com/ My links: Website: https://www.jennifercohen.com/ Instagram: @therealjencohen  Key Takeaways: Shame-flammation is a concept where most of the inflammation that is behind the common diseases and illnesses we experience is caused by the feeling of shame and/or guilt. The reason why these strong feelings of guilt and shame cause inflammation is that our body is composed of millions of cells, which all carry the weight of our thoughts and our emotions. When we constantly feel these negative emotions, our cells build up a library of these negative thoughts. As a result, our negative emotions make us physically ill through inflammation as this library becomes the make-up of our bodies. Most of the imbalances that we experience in our body, such as hormonal imbalances, are a symptom of an imbalance in our gut microbiome. When we constantly feed ourselves the wrong things, whether they be food or thoughts, our gut’s health deteriorates, which in turn can make us develop mental health issues such as anxiety and depression that are difficult to treat.  Dysregulation in our body manifests its way through different physical signs and emotional signs. To regain control over this dysregulation from an emotional perspective, it’s important to focus on supporting your vagus tone. What you want to do is to find a meditation type that works for you and your lifestyle and stick to it to bring your body back to a parasympathetic state. Once you learn to appease your mind, you learn to appease your gut and reduce inflammation in your body.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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San Antonio, Texas. Hi guys, it's Tony Robbins. You're listening to Habitson Hussle, Crescent. Today we have Will Kohl on the podcast who is a friend of mine and also a wonderful functional medicine doctor and what the first person to start telemedicine, telehealth 13 years ago. Functional medicine, telehealth clinic, yeah. Before anybody else and He now has his second book out called gut feelings his first book was a New York Times bestseller It's actually my fourth book what's a second with good press. Yeah, I go way back Molly, okay, I thought this is your second book. What was before we knew each other? That's why okay?

What was the first two? This is like before Jennifer? Yeah Different era totally different era. That's true. Okay, what were the first two? This is like before Jennifer, what a life, it's a good different era. A totally different era. That's why I have no idea. And probably you don't either. Now I can't. What would you do? Keto Terry, and actually I think to this date, sold the most.

Keto Terry was the first book. And the second is the inflammation spectrum, which people love that book. Third was intuitive fasting. And now gut feelings is out of all my book babies. This is my favorite one. Really? So these are the last two were on group press. Who were the other ones on? Still under Penguin Random House, but under Avery. Avery, so you know how the book world work. So it's like these imprints with an imprints, but there's Penguin Random House

and then Avery. Now I'm with Penguin Random House road ale, Goopress. Okay, so you had, because I thought the last book before got feelings, that was a New York Times best seller. Yes, it was. So the two prior were those also? They were not. They were all the other ones, like the US, like US, USA today. Today and Wall Street, Canada, did Big and Canada. I'm Canadian, I like that I like that, okay. Yeah, but didn't hit the list But you know how those things work too because they actually sold more than the book that made the times list Isn't that crazy how that works? That's literally a whole other podcast. Yes, I mean it's we consider it's curated

Let's just say it's lovingly curated lovingly. I wouldn't use that word, but okay, well, use that adjective because you're much more PC than I am. Subjectively curated. Subjectively curated. I love that. Actually, I love this book. This new one because it was very much tied with, like, obviously, emotions and how you're emotions. I was like, very interested in like understanding and learning,

like your nervous system with your gut health, your mood, your depression, without that effect you. But you went like in the weeds a little bit more than the topical that I've seen other people talk about. Like we all hear like, you know, your gut is your second brain or we all hear that stress can be very harmful for your health. And then, but what I like is like,

you go from emotion to emotion, which I thought was so interesting and I really enjoyed it. Thank you. Well, I mean, you're right about that. The conversations around the gut and the brain, I've been talking about it for 13 years. So there would be no reason for me to write a book about that because I've written hundreds of articles about that.

But I really wanted to get deep, like I've never done before in a sort of literary way. Yeah. Talk about the things that I see play out in people's lives as far as my patients are concerned. And delving into these complex issues of chronic stress and trauma and intergenerational trauma, these are big things. Totally. But the science is just so compelling of how these things can literally be stored in ourselves, dysregulating our nervous system, raising inflammation levels, impacting hormones.

I look at labs all day long. So I see it play out in both the gut and the feeling side of it, the physical and then this mental emotional spiritual component of it. It's a both and conversation when you're talking about mental health issues, and when you're talking about autoimmune issues, and those are my people, people that are looking to reclaim their health from these things that are really keeping them down. And what I, it's also like a whole trauma piece of it too,

right, like how that really does impact your health. And what's interesting, like you talk about this a little, well, a lot in your book, that regular medicine does not even, like, touch on this at all. Yeah. I mean, and you think after so many years and like, and now, like, the evolution of where we are in the health space, that it would kind of take a piece of it.

Why is it not at all been, it's never even broached if you go to a regular MD? Well, I think in many ways, when you're looking at chronic health problems, it's really a chronic health problem management issue, right? Because it's not just about the trauma as peace, it's about really all the underlying components that researchers are looking as to

what's even triggering all of these problems. Like, why do we have this epidemic about immune issues and mental health issues? Why? And they're not really, researchers are looking at it. But the trickle down effect of when it hits sort of the mainstream, this is a conversation I'm having with my PCP, my GP, my endocrinologist, my rheumatologist, it just takes so long and there's so much red tape. The problem is mainstream medicine in many ways is fragmented.

It's true, yes. It's the sort of go from specialists to specialists instead of realizing the body's interconnected. So it's a fragmented system that treats the body fragmented. And that's the problem. A lot of people fall through the cracks of that. I mean, most of my patients, when they meet me, they're extremely compliant people. They're well-read, they're airy-dye, and they're compliant, meaning they wanna do what their doctor's telling them

to do. And they are doing and have done it, but they're spinning their wheels because they aren't seeing the answers. So some people certainly, and I know both, no, there are people that are helped by the system. There's nothing, I'm not making broad sweeping stateless. Some people are helped,

but then you have to look at the countless of people that are maybe it's a piece of their puzzle, but it's still not getting them to optimal wellness. Maybe it's managing some symptoms, or as I hear, oftentimes from people like taking the edge off of some of their symptoms, whether autoimmune issues and mental health issues, but it's not dealing with the breadth of things that are underneath the ocean to use that tip of the iceberg analogy. They're just scraping the surface.

Well, I'm always curious, like when do you know, like as a patient, as a person, when it is something that's much more traumatic, like some that you're dealing with emotionally, traumaticly, or whatever, versus if it's actually just because it is the state, like for example, okay, I have eczema, right? How do I know if it's just because I was born

with a bad skin issue, and that's what it is, versus like there's something deep-seated that I don't even know, or maybe I'm dealing with something that I'm not even aware of, that's causing this root, the root cause of it. Yeah, so it's, I mean, in my clinical world, it starts with a health history history and really getting deep. We're talking about a very comprehensive, granular,

in-depth questioning and learning and the sort of, like holding space for all of these sort of intricate variables that maybe seem inconsequential to the person. Right, right. But for us, these are clues or clinical purls as to things we need to be investigating. Okay. And then labs, I think, would be illuminating too. But for us, these are clues, are clinical purls as to things we need to be investigating. And then labs, I think, would be illuminating too.

But some of the questionnaires that we ask, if you're thinking about, okay, is it physiological or is it mental emotional spiritual? And typically, it's going to be a confluence of both. That would say the difference because for people who don't know. Sure, so physical, I mean, and the book is really an exploration of this bi-directional relationship between gut and feelings or the physical and the mental and emotional spiritual. So when I say physiological, some examples of that are going to be underlying gut problems where dysbiosis or leaky gut syndrome or some sort of fungal overgrowth, that's an example,

or nutrient deficiency would be another example, or a hormonal imbalance would be another example, or some sort of chronic convection. If you see a lot of mold toxicity, my mycotoxins, and chronic Lyme disease, those are physiological things that will raise inflammation levels in the body, which will impact many things, depending on who you're talking to, for people that are going through anxiety and depression, brain fog, fatigue, neurological issues. It is, though, all of those things I just mentioned are associated in the research with triggering neuroinflammation. Right.

And for people with autoimmune issues, it's somewhere else. If it's autoimmune thyroid issues, it's against the thyroid, or if it's just some general metabolic issues. Like, I have trouble losing weight. All of those things I mentioned can impact blood sugar and your insulin resistance,

which will make it really difficult to lose weight and give you a lot of blood sugar, metabolism problems. That's just the physiological stuff or the gut stuff that I talk about in the book. The feeling stuff, like chronic stress, shame, trauma, those things are just as much influencing inflammation levels in all of those areas. So it's, again, this both-and conversation around these, you know, the analogy of these junk foods for the soul in some ways.

Like these junk foods that are metaphysical, that are also, that are impacting the physical, quite profoundly. So how do you know that? It's getting to know somebody, and then for the person that's listening to this, getting to know yourself, getting inquisitive, and start to delving into these deeper layers that I teach about in the book,

and in lieu of me being there, like, I'm not your functional medicine doctor, that's why I wrote the book, is for you to learn a functional medicine approach to say, how is trauma a piece of my puzzle? Is an underlying gut problem, a piece of my puzzle? Is it a bit of both? And then they can start to learn and lean into these protocols that have seen really be effective for people to start to untangle these quite entangled things. Well, you know, you just set it right here. I wanted to ask you about shame, because you just mentioned it. Like shame, you said, is the most damaging emotion in the world,

and it can cause so many like health problems. Yeah. And like, you never even think of, you can think of these other things, but so can you say two things? So what usually correlates with shame? Is there like certain illnesses or health issues that usually you feel that shame is like the root cause so people can say, oh, maybe I'm feeling this way because you know what I mean, to kind of for themselves to kind of not self-diagnose but have more understanding. Yeah, well I think shame is a common emotion

that is associated with things like trauma and a common emotion that's associated with things like trauma, and a common emotion that's associated with stress. Like, I know a lot of patients that are stressed out with work and their family, and they feel like they're just not good enough. Like, they don't have the bandwidth to do the things they want to do, and they feel like a failure. And then there's a lot of health-related shame,

like shame around people's bodies, about around food. So what I call in the book, shameflamation, is really sort of the confluence of the chronic stress and trauma piece of how it's playing out in people's lives and they feel varying degrees of shame because of the sort of, it's a sympathetic, it's the aspect of the autonomic nervous system being overactive for too long.

That sympathetic, fight-or or flight stress in flame state, it's just always going in perpetuity to varying degrees for people. That's the problem. So how people can know about it, it's just, I think being more mindful in looking and how you feel. I think some people just are on autopilot

so much of their life. They know their health could be better or they know their health is really in the gutter, but they don't, they're always, our culture, so in distraction, so embedded in our culture. And it's designed that way today, right? But, and on top of that, people just live busy lives. And they, months turn into years,

and years turn into decades for some people of just like dang, I should have dealt with this a long time ago, but I see it snowballing. And to varying degrees, people start to have these wake-up calls to know they have to do something different, to see something different. But shame is an integral part to many people's health puzzle and to dealing with that.

So like the practices of self-compassion that I talk about in the book are just so powerful to modulate the nervous system and the immune system, i.e. lowering inflammation, but it's not sexy so much, right? Yeah. It's not. But self-compassion is sexy. That's what I'm trying to do with this book. I'm trying to rebrand self-compassion. To make it sexy. Yeah, that's right. I love it. Okay, so that's so that's the, what's the definition of shameflation. Shameflation. Shameflation.

Shameflation. I'm amalgamating shame and inflammation. And inflammation together. But you're not the only person when I, when they first see that made out word that I made up. Really? What does it even mean? I don't read it like a hundred times.

I'm like, shame, I haven't written down a shameflation, but how do you say it? Shameflation. Shameflation, but how do you say it? Shameflamation. Shameflamation. Okay, that's hilarious, because to great name though. So that is basically what is really a lot of time sabotaging our overall health, right? Yeah, it's the feeling side of that gut feeling puzzle. So it's not the only one, but it's that,

if you're talking about that by directional relationship relationship that's going to be a major part that's shameflammation meaning that mental emotional spiritual component How are things like that like stress shame and trauma impacting my physical health and the research is very clear that These mental emotional spiritual things that aren't serving us are emotional, spiritual things that aren't serving us are literally stored in our cells. Our body, it's made up of trillions of cells, is a cellular library. It's keeping all of the thoughts and the words and emotions and trauma accumulated over time. And in some people, they've hit that tipping point where it's expressing itself in the form of anxiety and depression and autoimmune issues or metabolic issues.

So it's really vast as far as its implication and why people should care about this. I mean, even if you think about the hormonal problems that people see, oftentimes it's what I call shame inflammation, that mental emotional and spiritual component that is contributing to at the very least, if not completely causing it for many people. So then how do people get better really? Like if they still are dealing with those feelings, right? Even if they come see it, go see you or whatever, you do all these tests on them. How do people even heal those things? With O, like that's a lot of like, is that a lot therapy? Like is it, what how do people get better? Yeah.

If this is the root cause. Yeah. And it's not just taking a pill or not just doing X, Y and Z. Yeah, and I love that you said Z. That's okay. I love Canadians. I know. It came out.

Whoops. Don't take it back. I will never. Don't you worry. Z and Z. Don't let LA take the Canadian out of you. You can't take, you could take the small town girl, or it was like that you could take the girl

out of the small town, but not the small town. Yeah, hey, speaking to a small town guy who still lives in the small town. Exactly, that's why I like you so much. Yeah, that's right, small town people have this affinity. That's right. Totally, it's like, I see you. That's right. So what do people do, I see you. That's right.

So what do people do? It's big. It's a big, complex thing, but that's really what I'm delving into in the book because there's a protocol in the book that really goes, oh, spans over 21 days. It's by the way, it's a 21 day, got feeling fun. Got feeling fun. To teach people every day what's a practice,

because it's not as they say in the book. If you're talking about trauma, you're not gonna heal all trauma in 21 days. But what I want you to do is to start to learn what are the most well researched, the most effective in my experiencing patients for the past 13 years, ways to start to reconnect that gut feeling connection, start to regulate the nervous system,

start to lower inflammation levels effectively. So these are just basically 42 of my favorite tools that I put in patients' protocols, 21 gut action items and 21 feeling action items. So on the gut stuff, it could be, like I talk about a gaps protocol in the book, which is an acronym that stands for Gut and Psychology Syndrome,

or Gut and Physiology Syndrome, either one. And it's a way to use food, sort of nourish the gut, the second brain, common inflammation levels, and support that vagus nerve, which innervates the gut and the brain. And a feeling action item could be, I talk about breath work and the power

of different breath work techniques. And you know, one Solomon, I actually did it the other day together, my son's here in the studio. And it's the honest phone. He's like, four in his hell already. I don't blame him. I'm just kidding.

He's listening to this pride for the 400th time. No, this is a completely different conversation, by the way. I think one of the best, I've told you this the other time, I believe talk, you're one of the best interviewers that I've ever been on. I told you that last time. I didn't tell you that. That's so nice.

Why is that? I don't know, because everybody and their mom has a podcast these days. It's true. And it doesn't mean they're talented. They may have a following, but it's not necessarily that we would never get picked up on like, if it was an actual business.

Exactly. But yours could. And I think that there's an art to it and a skill set to it that not everybody has. I love you for that will. We're gonna cut that into a teaser. Will is gonna put it on then not everybody has. I love you for that. Will, we're going to cut that into a teaser. Will is going to put it on his social media page. We're going to send it into every network.

That's fair. No, I'm joking. That was so nice. I appreciate you saying that. It actually means a lot because I agree. Like everyone and their mom and their dog and their cousin now thinks, well, podcasts are hot. Let me just try it out and do one.

And they're like, they don't research, they don't prepare. They don't know how to even have a conversation. You know, that's true. We show up to someone, I'm like, what the heck? I mean, even with, I'm actually offended if I go somewhere and they're like, so tell me about your book. It's like, are you serious?

You didn't even like take, you didn't respect me even that much just to read the first page or even the, whatever it is, I find that to be so insulting, but anyway, that's the majority of people, right? I hate to say it. So the fact that you recognize that, it makes me very happy, thank you.

It is noticed, for sure. Thank you. But yeah, I mean, so it's, it's these gut and the feeling action items are just a perfect, perfect. But, back to that gut feeling action items are just a part of it. Oh yeah, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, but, big breath work him and I with this group and that's what it's a great way to sort of metabolize store stress and it is it is a sort of I would call it a more advanced breath work Okay, he meditates as a general rule This is a 16 year old going on 34

Pretty much and so it's a great way to strengthen the Vegas nerve, which is, again, the largest craniol nerve in the body. And it's one of the main governors or components to the parasympathetic aspect of our nervous system. Well, tell people, because I know you say it like very, everyone knows. And I understand this. But for people who are listening,

because you talk about this a lot in the book, the vagus, you call it even the vagal totals, was it? Vagal tone, yeah. Explain all this and how it all connects together. So breath work and just like basically all 42 of these tools that I talk about in the book are all meant to support the parasympathetic nervous system and part of that is improving vagal tone.

So the vagus nerve, longest cranial nerve in the body, it translates, it comes from the word which translates to wondering or wanderer. So this long nerve that's connecting the gut and the brain and we mentioned this, like we're assuming that people know, but like the gut and brain are formed from the same fetal tissue. So, when babies are growing in their mother's womb, they're formed from that same fetal tissue, and they're linked for the rest of our life through what's known as the gut brain axis in the research. Well, the gut brain axis is in part what they're talking about there is the vagus nerve. So, most people, because when you're talking about the autonomic nervous system,

and I mentioned the parasympathetic, Vegas nerve, rest, digest, hormone-balanced, calm, the sympathetic, the fight-or-flight-stressed aspect of the autonomic nervous system is overactive, i.e., inflammation, mental health issues, autoimmune issues. So we have this sort of seesaw effect of the autonomic nervous system. Most people are overactive and sympathetic, and underactive in the parasympathetic. So, what we're trying to do is regulate the nervous system or modulate the nervous system in a way where both can operate optimally.

You don't have a hypervigilance in sympathetic and you don't have sort of a lack of any resilience in the parasympathetic. So, that's when I say poor vagal tone, that's associated in the research to just about every chronic health problem, autoimmune issues, mental health issues, digestive problems. Very overactive in the sympathetic area.

Now, you're saying in your breath work, the comment I'm gonna talk, the one you just mentioned that you do with your son, breath work, stuff like another thing. So you have to love somatic practices. Practices in there that help even out, basically equalize the sympathetic and the parasympathetic, is that basically?

Yeah, they're basically like, yes, it's a nervous system workout in many ways. It's like a nervous system and vagal nerve workouts. So that's really interesting because when you said that about the sympathy overactive, like all those things, I feel like you described me and probably a lot of people who are listening. Now, and I always say, oh, I hate breath work. I hate meditation. I'm not good at it. I don't want to do it. And so I don't. And so that's probably why then you go, you go more all in on the things that you're good at, which are much more again intense

and hard core and high intense training. But that's just making it worse, right? Because you're not balancing it. Yeah, it can. And that's why the Yin and the Yang, they're both important, right? It's super important. And it's And you don't want to forget the other. And it is. It is not as, especially in our culture where it's so exterior in that way. It's the thing that you notice. It's the thing that you notice. You change the way you look and you can look better. And you sweat. You can feel it.

Exactly. And these sort of things that are, like I call them acts of stillness, they're not as sexy in our culture. Again, I'm trying to re-brand that. You're going to make it sexy again. But like, breath work is a great way to work out your vagus nerve, work out your nervous system, work out your autonomic nervous system to start to, and not just work it out, but actually cathartically metabolizing clear out things that are stored in your cells, like

trauma in your life, but even answering your ancestors life, like that you're passed down through generations. So do you just said that you guys did a special kind of breath work? What was that called? Hallotropic. What is that? Hallotropic, or it's a type of breath work. I talk about it in the book. It's the Advanced Breath Work section where it's...

That's the page I skipped through. See? And new. Yes. Told you not liking this part right there. So it is just, I would say, you breathe the way that we have done it. You breathe through your mouth. And from your mouth and out of your mouth, you're not really doing any nasal breathing,

which has its place. I mean, we do a lot of mouth taping for to like get their proper sleep at night and not be. Do you believe in that by the way? Oh, absolutely. Really? Okay. Any patient that has dysregulated sleep wake cycle, looking at cortisol and melatonin on labs, mouth taping can be a great way to optimize sleep and some of these waking up at the lethargic, or even I see a lot of people that they say, oh, I sleep fine,

but you look at their or ring or the hoop band or their labs and it's like not good. Their rem and their deep sleep are just in the gutter. And mouth taping can be a game changer amongst many other things. Do you do that? I don't, but my sleep scores are pretty good. We're in competition normally. Solomon and I, but he's normally better than me.

Yeah, well, he's also 16 years old. Yeah. And he has less things on his plate. Exactly. Are you think, really? 16-year-olds? Just slightly. He thinks he thinks it's worked out.

He works for him. He runs his social media or does something. I don't know. He's a 16-year-old employee of yours. Yeah, he does. He's part-time. He's an intern. He's an intern. Okay, I like that. Yeah, he does. He's part time. He's a intern. He's an intern. Okay. I like that.

Yeah. So basically, it's, I'll tell you the history around holotropic breath work. It, it was used as an alternative to elicit similar experiences as psychedelics. Oh, really? Yeah. So you can have a very similar experience from holotropic breath work as you can have a very similar experience from holotropic breath work as you can from psychedelics and just with like with cellulosex, because of the oxygen and the gases of your, that you're kind of modulating with your breath to impact certain centers of the brain and the nervous system to list at this sort of ecstatic experience or psychedelic experience. But just like with psychedelics, you can dose differently to you people are microdose things like

it looks you don't get a full you know trip, you can do the same with breath work, you can slow it down, the breaks are breathing through your nose, it kind of slows it down. So you can self-paced this for yourself and not everybody has to have the same experience because there's many types of breath work. Hologotope is just one path for people to try. But what makes it more, not seeing, what makes it more advanced because you're breathing from your mouth. Because you're having more of, I would say, a somatic experience. So let me ask you something because I've

been to a couple of these retreats and things where they're, and things where they put you in this room to do breath work. To your point, a lot of these people are having these crazy meltdowns or crying and having these psychedelic type of reactions. I'm literally sitting there looking around nothing. It's embarrassing. It's embarrassing. My eyes are open. Everyone's eyes are closed.

I'm looking to see who's doing what? Like what happens for people? I'm asking for a friend for those people who cannot shut their brain and like their ability to even get to a place where they can even try these things. Like these type A personalities, you know, like a friend of mine. What would it what did they do? Yeah, you know like a friend of mine. What would it what did they do? Well tell your friend I would say that the reality is none of us are Good really good at it. Some of us seem like you're pretty good. No, I'm not

Some of us are better than others, but I think we're all really sucky at it, which is why we need to do it. And we are, that's why they call it a practice, right? And it's just like, if we went to the gym and I went to the gym one time and I'm like, I'm not good at it. I've never been to the gym before. And I'm like, the gym's not for me. It's like, well, no, it's like, I've just suck at working out. And I need, I have some weak biceps, I need to strengthen it.

And that's what we're doing with breath work and meditation is strengthening that mindfulness muscle. And the people that typically say that, which I would say, you know, your friend is saying that right now, typically you're the ones that need to do it the most. 100%, I totally agree with it. And that's why my friend tries it all the time.

Goes to these things and tries meditation and tries all these other practices, like the breathwork that you're mentioning, and eyes wide open, not able to even concentrate for three seconds enough to even do it for a time where they can get potentially even a little better. And here's the deal with this, is that our mind, that perfection of perfectionist, like type A,

mind that you mentioned that we all have to varying degrees, it's that we see that as failure, or I'm not doing it right. That's shame. Right, that's shame. But really realize that we can actually use that distraction thoughts as a meditation too. And like the analogy that's used is like seeing

and just ultimately realizing that we aren't our thoughts and emotions. We are the observing presence of them. And you start to be that awareness around the thoughts and see them passing by like the analogy that I use the book that many meditation speakers talk about is like seeing your thoughts as clouds that pass by and see yourself and realize, oh wow, on this vast

sky, not the clouds, then you have a bit of a humor and lightness and grace to the whole process. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And realize, okay, this is just where I'm at right now. And it's going to be sort of these rapid, rapid, torrent of thoughts as we are beginners in these practices, but then can start to strengthen that, that resilience around meditation. More from our guests, but first a few words from our sponsor. Blazing deals, boundless options. Its hot grill summer at Whole Foods Market from June 14 through July 4. Fire up the grill with quality cuts at the best prices.

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Use promo code Habits for an extra 10% off. Again, that's hostinger.com slash habits and promo code habits. And you can find the link and promo code in today's episode description. So what other practices, you talk about the 42, that people can do in the 21-day plan to help heal themselves. Yeah, so they're on the feeling stuff, what we're talking about that. Different meditation, the beyond-breath work, like body scans and present moment awareness

and mindfulness meditations, mantra meditations, like loving kindness meditations. You believe in the mantras? Yeah, absolutely. It's under, yeah, I don't want to say believe, but I think there's some compelling science, and I think it could be a good entry point for people that it resonates with.

So when I talk about these 42 things, I don't not think everybody has to do these 42 things all the time. That's not it, but I want you to explore and experiment, because again, I'm not there as your functional medicine doctor. I mean, many of my patients will read the book too. Maybe hopefully all of them will. But ultimately, it's going to be for the person, the reader, to say, what resonates with

me, what really like, oh, yeah, I'm going to try that. And to that meditation is not for me, sort of thing that your friend keeps saying. Yeah. So, she's, I mean, you know what, we need to talk to her. I know. Let's so smart. I mean, you know what, we need to talk to her. I know. Let's have her to call you. I was set up a console. So I'll go and tell her.

But the reality is that maybe that type of meditation isn't for you, right? Maybe it's like not residing with you. Like the right, the right, the best type of meditation is the one that you can stay consistent with and that you are excited about or at least able to do the work. Well, you have been saying in the book, which I would always say too, is why I laughed,

is that like, if you hate doing something, then don't do it. Do something different. You know what I mean? That's also a source of like a lot of angst and not good on the emotional side, right? When you're forcing yourself to like do something because you think you should all the time, is pretty much like bad for your health overall, right? Yeah, stressing about meditation, stressing about healthy food, isn't good for your health. That's all shameful nation that I'm trying to like undo for you.

Well, you know, that's, you know, it's funny because even like we're saying early, but the sleep trackers with the aura and whoop and all these things, like, I feel and tell me what you think that with like all what's happening with technology, like we're like gamifying all these things for our health to like biohack ourselves to live to 180. Now, isn't that in itself just super stressful? For the average person, yes, it is. I would agree with that wholeheartedly.

For many of our patients, we have them do it for specific periods of time. If they have a health issue. So we're not just looking for problems just to find them or like obsess about something, just for the sake of it. We are, the context is let's learn and get some data points for you

and put it in context with how you're feeling and can we make action steps as far as your protocols concerns. And then drop it. Like at a certain point, we're optimizing things if we're doing our job or if the person that's reading the book, if they're, these things are working, then at a certain point, you can simplify your life. And I think the bandwidth for most people, they don't want to have to keep looking at all these data points.

And I do feel like the data points at some point in the earlier and in their journey, or when they do need to check in on themselves, when you get that feedback, and know when I, oh, when I feel like this, my numbers tend to be like this, then it becomes intuitive and mindful. So it almost use those biohacking, like tracking things, just like you would, maybe a diet tracking app for some time.

For analytics a little bit. Analytics checking. And then drop it. If you're truly like a biohacker, and some people just really get excited about it, and it's not a source of stress or shame at all, then keep doing it. But I think for the average consumer out there, it's something to check in, but I'll not necessarily have to use all the time.

So meditations, some of the other tools, I'll talk about Shinra Nyoku, which is forest bathing, the research out of... Talk about the forest bathing. They have it as a note, like asking about forest bathing. No, it's not taking a bath out in the forest. And that's why I was like kind of like, what is this thing?

Yeah, how weird is this guy going to be? Yes, exactly. No, but it's a Japanese translation that translates literally into forest bathing, which I think is a beautiful description of what they're trying to, like what they're saying in the original Japanese. It's using nature immersively as a meditation and using nature as a medicine. So therapeutically, it's going to be supporting that parasympathetic aspect of the nervous

system. So it's multifactorial because you're taking it in a sensorial experience, so taking nature in with your eyesight and the sounds and the stillness of it all, but also the smell of it all. Like the essential oils from nature. So what do you do? Give me an example. Tell people what it is really. So you walk very slowly within nature and you just take it in. It's very simple. So it's like, if you may only get a few feet within 20, 30 minutes, but it's just taking it in, looking and observing.

So instead of it being about the destination, it's about the whole process of it. And it's slowly going through that process. Yeah, but you could even sit in it. You don't even need to move. You could just sit and just taking it in. What our ancestors would just call life, we now have a term for it

and randomized controlled trials for it. But now we know the exciting mechanisms of it, like these essential oils have been shown to lower inflammation and boost mood and regulator nervous system. And there is this one study that I talked about in the book where these kids, there was a group of kids that did it in this study that the study was looking at kids in forest bathing and how it impacted their health. And the participants in the study actually improved their microbiome because they're breathing in nature's microbiome,

which is just so profound. Again, this is where 95% of serotonin is made. 50% of dopamine is made in the gut. So the gut is the second brain. So we're just beginning to understand the mechanisms of how we all intuitively know, yeah, getting out in nature, creating some stillness in your life is good for health, but health.

But how? Now we know these essential oils and the actual science of nature is really beneficial to our health. What also can you include in forest bathing bathing then getting the big one is going outside for the first 10 minutes and getting some 10 minutes of sunlight by the mid-end. Another one is like grounding,

putting your feet on grass, whatever. Are those would that be considered forest bathing? It would be, I don't think the researchers around forest bathing would call it forest bathing, but in a way, you really are tapping into the same mechanisms. Yeah, because it's, yeah, it's really sensitive around the same thing. I don't think that's how the researchers were doing it in the specific studies, but yes, any green space you can get, any time you can get out.

So if you just call it grounding and you're not really going through nature just in your backyard, it's still a very, very effective tool to literally modulate your nervous system in a positive way. Okay, so can you tell me a few of the biggest health issues that people come to you for the three top, like top three? So, I mean, leaky gut syndrome is ubiquitous. It's a varying degree, is it's really a common thing, but not a normal thing within the modern human experience.

Well, what are the symptoms that maybe someone has it and they don't even know what it's called these? Yeah, and most people don't even know, because you don't necessarily have to have extreme digestive symptoms that have underlying gut components to it. So they may be going to the bathroom just fine. But it's the systemic inflammatory component that's impacting it. So mental health issues, if you look at the epidemic of what's going on there, anxiety, depression,

depression is the leading cause of disability worldwide. I know. I think 40 million Americans have anxiety. And that's just the diagnosable ones. A little loan, the spectrum of mental health issues that we face as a society of this sort of background anxiety, this sort of low grade, wired, entire feeling that many people have. These are in part inflammatory, if not exclusively inflammatory for most people. And this isn't just my opinion of

it. This is very well researched. It's called the cytokine model of cognitive function. Cytokines are pro-inflammatory cells. So as researchers looking at how does inflammation impact how my brain works. Well, most of the inflammation, 75% of it, is made in the gut and stored in the gut. And I mentioned earlier how things like serotonin and dopamine are made in the gut, stored in the gut too,

of which many antidepressants work upon in theoretically serotonin, which is a different conversation. But flimsy science at best anyways, because it's really the inflammation in my opinion and what most of us are looking at the research is pointing to. It's really inflammation that is causing any dysregulation of neurotransmitters, and that's really the thing that we're trying to optimize for people.

So is that mean, if you're depressed, does that cause inflammation or inflammation causes depression? It's both for people, right? But that's sort of the bidirectional aspect of it, right? So it's, first and foremost, it's a causation of it for many people, meaning it's, there's underlying gut components like bacterial imbalances that, for one study that I mentioned in the Most and foremost, it's a causation of it for many people, meaning it's, there's underlying gut components like bacterial imbalances that for one study that I mentioned in the book that lower levels of these beneficial lactobacillus and diphthytobacteria and bacteria are causing

anxiety and depression because of how they are producing metabolites that cross-talk with the brain and produce optimal brain function that are removed. So inflammation we know causes anxiety and depression, and I would say brain fog and fatigue for most people, it's multifactorial, right? There are other components to it, like situational issues as well. But for many people, the physiological component

of what the commonality is is chronic inflammation. But to your point, when people then feel depressed, that creates a bigger cascade. It becomes this negative feedback loop because then they're stressed and depressed about not feeling well. And it's like this big vicious cycle of that we need to break, right? And so, and you talk, you say this in the book, and this is something that I know, but I think it's very important to mention,

that exercise has been shown over time, and this is not just flimsy science, way better than any antidepressant on the market, bar none, for helping lowering all that stuff, right? Absolutely. Yeah, and like these are something that we can do our own without going on medication. Okay, so name a couple other ones.

So, leaky gut, Oh, yes, leaky gut syndrome, which we can quantify in labs. You can measure the protein called zonulin and occludin which are the proteins that govern your gut lining permeability. So through a blood test, stool test, you can quantify these things.

Cebow would be another major one that we see clinically. I hear everyone talking about that lately. I've never heard it in my life until like six months or a year ago. Yeah, we've been talking about it for 13 plus years in functional medicine, but I think to your point, I'm actually in some ways happy about it, like becoming more and more mainstream and people aware of it

because it's not a new thing. I think it's happening more and more because I think digestive problems, gut health problems, i.e. gut microbiome problems because of the damage that we're having to all the bacteria and our gut. That's a problem. So it's a lack of homeostasis in the microbiome.

So we have a lot of opportunistic or even normal bacteria, sometimes growing where it shouldn't be growing into the small intestines, which is what SIBO is actually described as, it's not necessarily any opportunistic or pathogenic bacteria, it's quote unquote good bacteria, growing where it shouldn't be growing.

So what are symptoms of that, and how does that even happen? SIBO is the underlying cause of most IBS cases, at least a big chunk of them. I think it's 40 to 60%. Oh, wow. So, it's a vast majority of people that have irritable bowel syndrome. The underlying cause of that is CBO, small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. So, it's kind of like weeds overgrowing in this gut garden where you...

There's nothing wrong with the weeds. They're part of nature, but you don't want them overgrowing in this gut garden where there's nothing wrong with the weeds. They're part of nature, but you don't want them overgrowing and taking over the garden. And that's the analogy that's used with SIBO. So it's described, I mean, it could just look like a IBS. It's also an underlying cause for many people's acid reflux and digestion, gourd. It's also one of the leading causes of people, it's associated with different autoimmune issues. It doesn't necessarily mean you have an autoimmune condition. It's just saying that it is a lot of people with autoimmune conditions have SIBO, because

again 75% of the immune system is in the gut. Some researchers are even postulating that SIBO may have an autoimmune component in and of itself. Like, could Sebo be an actual GI inflammatory problem? That's actually an autoimmune condition in and of itself. That's sort of early stuff. But I have, I mean, we know very clearly, if nothing else, it's associated with many different autoimmune issues.

But it could look like someone may not even identify as having, you know, IBS, but it could be uncomfortable bloating. That's a very common one. Women will say, well, I feel nine months pregnant, but I'm not even pregnant. Right. Right. I feel like-

I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like-

I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- I feel like- Doesn't have to be one of the other. Most people with SIBO, I would assume, have Likki Gut Syndrome. But not everybody with Likki Gut Syndrome has SIBO. This is so complicated. You need a textbook to refer back to.

Maybe that will be my fifth book. I was gonna say, please, because this is honestly, I need notes taking for this, because it's so much information. The body, what do you mean? It's not one doesn't necessarily mean the other, and one doesn't. There's so many like intricate details. What's the third and the other thing I was going to say is doing these 42 things that you talk about, could it help cure these other things?

By doing like the breath work, I'm going to get into the other stuff soon after this question about food things because I think that's important too. But could by them doing this 21 day gut feeling plant help, I believe he got the sea, but what's the other third one you said? Well, I mean, there's so many, right? I mean, if you could say, one that comes to mind would be Candida Overgrowth,

or if you could call it CFO as the acronym, it's small intestinal fungal over growth. So it's just that someone can have bacterial overgrowth that can have fungal overgrowth as well. Candida, nothing wrong with Candida, abacans or any other types of Candida, but it's part of the human microbiome, M-Y-C-L biome. It's all the beneficial yeast and fungus. Again, nothing inherently wrong with it. It's the overgrowth of it. It's a problem. So then what is with all this, like everyone's like probiotic probiotic, if you take a probiotic or anyone takes a, is it beneficial? Can it help with a lot of

these issues? It can. You have to be judicious with probiotics, right? Because there's so much information out there on probiotics. It's so confusing. I'm so confused. I know, and it's the wild west for many people. It is. It's so many brands doing so many things. And they all say that they're the ones that are the most special, that the ones are most effective. How do you know that they're like, we have a special strain. No, no, no, we have a special strain. Yeah. We don't need to refrigerate ours because we're so much better than the other one. And then we also have a prebiotic. I'm like, okay, I'm so confused. I'll just have Candida and live with it, you know, because it's so confusing.

Yeah, and look, some people don't even need to go and buy a probiotic. Some people can just maybe start judiciously with like some fermented foods and try that. Like, do kimchi or... How does that help? What does that do? Same thing, it's probiotics. It's you're getting beneficial bacteria in food form to support gut health because basically we think of probiotics or probiotic rich foods like kimchi,

or cuffee or sourcrow or kombucha as like grassy. They're not as like that as much as influencers of the economy of the microbiome. They basically encourage other bacteria to grow, basically creating a more hospitable environment. But then it's their growing and we already have overgrowth, so do you get more overgrowth? So that's why you have to be judicious with the SIBO component. So people that have SIBO to getting a lot of fiber, like especially for mentable fibers and probiotics, you have, it can work, but you have to be judicious.

So there are certain colonies that tend to be more tolerated to people that have SIBO. We tend to go more towards the spore-based probiotics that just are less reactive and actually act in many ways as antibiotics, because probiotics are sort of, if it's agreeing with your body, they are regulators of the microbiome. So they actually will help to modulate some of these opportunistic and pathogenic bacteria.

My advice for people that have SIBO, start off low and slow, test these things out. Obviously, when you have a functional medicine doctor, these things can be, you know, the guess work can be taken out of it. So what would you recommend in terms of a, you don't have a probiotic, you should, by the way. We do, we do, yeah, we, I can't, you never promote it. I know, I don't, I'm a horrible business member

that comes from supplements like. I mean, that's actually kind of, it's actually endearing because then you're not like plugging like just like a product. Yeah. But I mean, I was gonna say, if anyone should have one, it should be you. Yeah, we have, we do have it.

It's part of the collection. We have nine. The reason why we released it is because, and this was years ago, but people asked us, okay, I don't have a functional medicine doctor. What are the core things that you see on labs to be beneficial? Yes. So, that's why we released it. It's just, we don't really market it.

It's just there for people. What are the core things? It is a probiotic. It's a multi-strand blend of lactobacillus and bifuribacteria, which are really well tolerated and can really help people to have digestive problems. Okay. And there's the magnesium.

Okay. Magnesium deficiency is so common. That's, I was gonna ask you about that. I want to ask you about that. And you said, and also digestive enzymes. Yeah. The digestive enzymes. digestive enzymes are not in the collection, because I wouldn't say everybody needs them,

but who does go on them then? People that have hypochloridria or decreased hydrochloric acid, which a lot of people see bo have that. It's basically lower HCL production. It's causing putrification of things like proteins. In English, please. Malabsorption. Their body's not breaking down protein, especially people that have been vegan or vegetarian for many years.

And some people that are just regular omnivores that are not breaking down protein. And then they think, okay, meat isn't for me, but it's really your low HCL production because of your bacterial overgrowth. So digestive enzymes can be used, in my opinion, temporarily, while we actually get your gut to do its job in the first place.

Because there's a lot of, what is it called when somebody is not, their body is not absorbing the nutrients of the food? What's that? Malabsorption or maldigestion? Okay, so that's when you should take this, a digestive... Yeah, and you don't have to be overtly an extreme malabsorption,

like malnourished person to benefit from it, but it exists on a spectrum. You could have functional malabsorption issues, and we quantify these things on labs. But if people see undigested food in their stool, if they feel like bloating, then yes, digestive enzymes can be a tool. And that's going to be things like lipase and protease and amylase and breaking down proteins, fats and carbs. Perfect. Okay. So in your nine, there's magnesium.

You said because of the problem. Yeah, magnesium, methylated B vitamins are in there. That's very, very important for people to either get it from food at the very least, but supplementation can help many of us. You said about magnesium. I you say something about magnesium, I just remember something I wanted to ask you. There's two different things. There's magnesium and there's another magnesium that people talk about.

There's actually many types of subtypes of magnesium. Magnesium, three and eight, is a blend of different magnesiums, which helps with bioavailability. So magnesium, glystinate, magnesium, three and eight, there's magnesium oxide, there's magnesium, there's tons of magnesiums. But they all have their own strong suits as far as how the body utilizes them and the bioavailability of them.

So the body doesn't store much magnesium, so taking it every day can be beneficial. And it's really important for a parasympathetic nervous system and our digestion. So then the magnesium glycinate, do you know what that is? Of course you do. When do you take, what is that then and why? That's in the blend that I mentioned too. So it's a magnesium glycinate or glycinate. It is well tolerated, I'd say it's well tolerated. And it's one probably talked about the most.

There's the magnesium, I forget the one that's in the natural calm. It's magnesium citrate, sorry. Magnesium citrate or citrate. That's the most common one. Yeah, probably because everyone's buying that one product and it does increase GI motility. So people have a little bit sluggish bowels. I see people doing that. But look, again, my job would be to,

well, why do you have this sluggish GI motility in the first place? Right. Magnesium deficiency could be a part of that, but the problem is those magnesiums like increased bowel movements, like magnesium citrate, they tend to not be as well stored in the body.

So I have patients that meet me for the first time and they've been taking magnesium citrate for years and the magnesium's still low. So you need different compounds of them, in my opinion, for most people to get actually the magnesium RBC, a biomarker that we run via blood, to actually be optimal, i.e. your body having it in the cells to help your nervous system out. So in the nine, does that mean that people should be taking it every day? And any, just

a plain magnesium? Yeah, I would say most people, yeah, if I look at the ubiquity of magnesium deficiency, it's almost everybody. Okay. There's been a lot of buzz around AI lately, but maybe you're still not sure how it fits into your daily life or workflow. Well, notion has just launched a new incredible tool,

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You're right. It's the super savvy people have, but yeah, because they see the D3, it's one that gets all the attention. Exactly. And so most people I know who think they're like, they know their health, they don't know inside and out, they're not taking the K2 piece. Exactly. And so most people I know who think they're like they know their health, they know inside and out, they're not taking the K2 piece. Yeah. And all that's all you will vitamins, I think, are, are, are something to be mindful of. I would recommend getting some of the other ones from food, like vitamin A, specifically. But it's hard to

get vitamin D from food. So you supplement or get some healthy sunlight and maybe some, you know, mushrooms have some vitamin D, ghee has some vitamin D, fatty fish have some vitamin D, but small amounts, right? You're really going to get it through sunlight or supplementation. Also, I should say that when you go anywhere, Amazon or whatever, you don't really see very often vitamin D with K2. That's like, it's also not as common at a store or at a place to purchase. Yeah, they buy them separately. They buy them, is that the best thing to do is buy them separately? Well, no, we combine them, but I think you're right.

The people that are mindful of it typically are buying them separately. And then they combine. So how much of the vitamin D should you have and how much of the K2 amount should you have to make it a good supplement? It depends. At the K2 can really vary on the person.

But vitamin D3, I would say, if I'm looking at the average person's labs, it's about 5,000 I use. Yeah. You can do 2,000. And what I would say is this, if you're going to take 5,000 I use,

I would get your levels tested pretty periodically, but every six months are still, because you may not have to be on 5,000 I use forever and ever. It's so funny. You just said that because I have friends who say, you know, like, you know, it's not like less is more. It's more is more and better is more are taking 20,000, 10,000 and that you can also be poisoned by vitamin D.

I heard. It's that's all you're both stored in the fat and it doesn't clear out as well as the water soluble. So, yeah, I have patients having to go off with these mega doses of vitamin D. It's crazy. Yeah, more is not always better, specifically with fat soluble vitamins like vitamin D3 and vitamin A. So, that's why food is so a great thing to start with, right? I mean, if it's vitamin A, you can get from food, but with vitamin D, it's really not something. So I would be mindful of continual high doses of

any vitamin D3. But look, I am more concerned with vitamin D deficiency than I am with high vitamin D. You are. Okay. What are the other ones then? Did we miss any? Yeah. Well, there's nine. I'm again, not the best marketer of it all but apparently not there's an adaptogen Rainman tell me what to say exactly There's an adaptogen I I'm such a fan of adaptions. I should talk about them in the book You don't have to tell me I know it says tips on calming our nervous system adaptogens holy basil Lions main ashwaganda Which is why I put it in one of the nine in the collection, too, because it's a blend of adaptogens that helps to modulate our parasympathetic nervous system.

Mainly this one is modulating the body's stress response, which in turn acts as a support to parasympathetic nervous system. So it's supporting the hypothelamic pituitary adrenal axis, or the brain adrenal stress response, which is the main hormonal stress response that we see. Oh my gosh. So, yeah, adaptergins are throughout gut feelings because it's something that I've used in patients' protocols, so of course, we're gonna talk about it.

So, ash will gone as a supplement. Is it something we should take, we could take every day to help calmer nervous system? Yeah, it's not necessary to take every day for everybody, but yes, if someone's going through a stressful time in their life, or they're just normally anxious, more and more prone to anxiety,

because some people do have different methylation gene variants that we quantify on labs that make them prone, they're more prone to that sort of anxiety or stress response or. And it helps? Yeah. Really? You could take breaks off of it and go back to it.

It's not something you have to. It's not like someone has an adaptogen deficiency, like vitamin B or vitamin D. But it's an herbal tool to support the nervous system and the endocrine system. Whether you're doing a dance to your favorite artist in the office parking lot, are being guided into Warrior I in the break room before your shift, whether you're running on your Peloton tread at your mom's house while she watches the baby,

or counting your breaths on the subway. Peloton is for all of us, wherever we are whenever we need it. Download the free Peloton app today, Peloton app available all of us. Wherever we are, whenever we need it. Download the free Peloton app today. Peloton app available through free tier or paid subscription starting at 1299 per month. And what is, I thought lion's mane was great for your focus and brain. It is. So it's a medicinal mushroom which has some adaptogenic properties because the

brain is what's modulating the endocrine system, right? So it's improving nerve growth factors of the brain. It's been shown to improve neuroplacicity actually helping the brain make new neurons so it's it's not just shaving a main off of a lion and it is a mushroom don't do that yeah please don't do that don't do that and so and then holy basil like how do you buy that you buy that in a supplement that's second Canadian thing that we heard today. Basil versus basil. Basil, how do you say it here in the city?

Basil. Basil, or basil? I say basil. I say basil. But you say basil. Tomato. Tomato. Z and Z.

Exactly. Oh, I love them. So cute. And aluminum. And aluminum. That's right. Oh my god. I have Canadian families. And aluminum. That's right. Oh my God. I have Canadian families.

Okay, but would you say about the stink? I say garbage disposal. We would say garbage disposal. No, I say that. Garberator. I say garberator. Garberator. I never heard that one before.

Wow. Garberator. You don't say that bit. Garberator? Yeah. No. It sounds so like 1950s, like Jetsons. I'm 140. forty. Yeah, I mean that was when I there's so many of these little words that I can we can have a whole other podcast about but okay so holy basil you said you a basil whatever you buy it in a supplement you just eat it in a

like what is it? But yeah well you could If somebody lives in India and wants to go forage for holy basil, Tulsi, they could... First of all, you can, you can, what do you call it? You can plant a basil plant in your backyard. It's not the same plant, but you could grow it. It's not the same plant. It's not the same plant as basil or basil, but I do, I don't know anybody that does

grows a dapte-gint like like that No, no, no, no, the tropical ones right you can do some other ones, right? But I don't know how they would grow in certain climates probably here in Southern California You could yeah, maybe whatever but holy what is it though? What does it do the whole? It's a plant that's been used in Ayurvedic medicine or it's also known as Tulsi or holy basil Oh, okay, and it's known as the queen of adaptogens. It's been used for thousands of years in traditional Indian medicine to support stress and your body's resilience. So it supports that circadian rhythm between the brain

and adrenal glands, similar to Asuraganda, which most people have heard about Asuraganda, which has also been used in Ayurvedic medicine for a long time. So they're typically found in teas, in tinctures, powders or capsules. Okay, and so we should take, if to calm our nervous system, it's that we should take all these, right?

The holy basil, the lion's made ashwaganda. Now you don't have to take all of them. So sometimes blends can be great because it's a sort of a synergistic benefits of it. And there's a lot of sort of curation and that's sort of the art and science of I think of herbalism and what I do in functional medicine. But look, I think there's some merit to saying, oh, let's just, if we want to keep things simple, let's just, if the study was done on X amount of milligrams of whatever adaptogen we're talking about, let's just try one and see how we feel. How it works.

So you don't have to have all of them, because they're all in some ways are really doing similar things. Some have some hallmarked things like you mentioned, lines made. Some of these medicinal mushrooms have some extra neuroprotected benefits that haven't really been researched in the other herbs,

but they all have their strong suits, I guess, is what I'm trying to say. Got it. And then one thing you talked with a book, and I was, I find this to be very interesting, because I think this is what happened to me, is that you shouldn't be eating the same food all the time. You should have a variety. So, like, for example, I've been eating like eggs for breakfast for like 20 years, right? And I think I became allergic to it. Where now when I got my test done, it was basically saying, I'm highly, highly allergic.

I should never eat another egg again. And that could be the reason why I have so many of these like skin, like eczema and stuff like that. How can... So, is that something what happens? Like, you can actually make your body allergic to a food if you eat it too often.

Higher immunoreactive foods, there's the potential to do it. And eggs, the albumin and the egg whites, does have the potential to do that. I'm saying that in the book, mainly from a microbiome diversity standpoint. Okay, not so. Not for a while. Well, we can talk about that because it's important, but I just wanted to have someone have a diverse microbiome and the different foods that they eat,

the more diverse your microbiome is going to be, which is associated with longer, healthier, life, less inflammation, better brain health. Right. Which, because you have better gut health. But, that's an interesting point, and I'd be curious to see that test that you ran. I would love to show it to you. Because it's, is it, was it an actual

allergy test or was it one of those sensitivity tests? Some, one of these very well-known, like he's like the top nutrient, like he's like from a NASA, some NASA, then he like now does all the sports teams and sports athletes. He took a panel like, I don't know how many thousands of like things. And it came back saying saying what I'm deficient in and what I'm not deficient in and like, apparently I'm really like deficient in a lot of things that I never even knew, which I think a lot of people may that would happen. But the eggs was like really surprising because I eat them so often. really because of some intestinal permeability or leaky gut syndrome. So I would say yes, eggs can be inflammatory for some people. They can be reactive for some people. And not even know it.

And not even know it. Because it could be a source of inflammation. It's not that it's causing extreme obvious digestive issues, but it's contributing to the larger level of inflammation, the cascade of inflammation that's in their body. So people have to kind of way, do I really love eggs if it's not causing any obvious issues, can I, or just maybe mix it up? Because I see that sometimes when we do reintroduction, when we've gone off of eggs for a while, done some reintroduction, we measuring antibodies to albumin, which is the egg white, which is

the more problematic part of it, as far as the inflammation can part of it, because there's molecular mimicry. Like the theory that the researchers are talking about is this case of mistake and identity. When the immune system sees albumin leaking through the gut lining into the bloodstream and it's similar enough in structure to our own proteins, where it's creating this inflammatory response. That's what happens many times where you get a blood test. That's really what you're seeing is sort of some sort of IgG, some sort of immunoglobulin response to a Buman.

I don't have the lab that you got done, but that's typically how we're done. So my goal in that case would be just to let's heal the gut and reintroduce it. So I don't think people need to be fearful about eggs and people Really had to deal with these upstream root causes Well, eggs just mine, but could be for anybody. It could be anything for anybody Okay, see these people with these food sensitivity tests I have like a hundred things positive It doesn't mean you have a hundred different food sensitivities. It's less to do about those foods and more to do with the immune systems over reaction to those foods.

And they're typically the ones that are positive are the ones that people just eat all the time. All the time. Well, that's why I think there was like such, you know, in the last 10 years, everyone's like now gluten intolerant. No one was gluten intolerant like this 10 years ago. But now, because people eat so many carbs,

that it shows up, but an intolerant and an allergy or not even the same thing. Yeah, intolerant sensitivity and allergies are all different things, actually. So, insensitivity and allergy are both immmediated, meaning that the immune system is responsible for it. The allergies, what we know, it's the more of the immediate response, and it is, like, it can be very life-threatening, right, for some people, but not always. And then the sensitivity still, you know, lobulin, it's still immunmediated, but it's typically

delayed, it's typically chronic, typically, like, sublime in the sense that people don't really realize it. And intolerance is technically aren't actually immunmediated. They're an enzyme deficiency. So a lactose intolerance is a deficiency of lactase or any other intolerance. It's really an enzymatic deficiency, which is still a gut health problem.

But it's a production of the enzyme issue, not an immune system issue. That's so interesting. And then I wanted to ask you this, and then we went into the ways for calming your nervous system. And that's how to, what are some signs that you have a dysregulated nervous system? Well, and then I'm sorry we can I'm in talking to you Talking to you

Well, I mean look I have been going on for like till tomorrow by the way I have pajamas. Yeah, well get well Can we get in the Guinness Brook of Old Records? We should just see what the level of the longest podcast is. I mean, by the way, five days, Solomon said five days. Five days? Well, wait, how long has this been? Has it been that long?

No, I just am joking. I know you're joking, but how long has this been? It's a different age. Oh, I thought I was going 45 minutes. Sorry, Will. He's like, he's like stretching in the chair. No, no, no, fine. Just have a really no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, And then we were started, by the way, how long is this, he's like, this is not gonna be like a three hour podcast.

And I'm like, no, of course not. We outta here in an hour. It was like two hours and 45 minutes. We're still going. I ain't like you're over. Exactly, I'm like, oh my God. Anyway, sorry. Okay, so question being, what are some signs

that we have it just regulated in our system? Well, I did, you know how people like quizzes. I adapted questions that I asked patients during an initial telehealth consult. Yes, you do like quizzes. And I adapted questions that I asked patients into a quiz. It's on the website. So people go to drwokole.com, just go to the gut feelings section, and there's a shame inflammation quiz.

That's just really an amalgamation of different questionnaires that ask patients. But if they wanna get granular, they can take the quiz. But for the sake of today's conversation, I mean, look, if your question was a dysregulated nervous system. Yes. So anxiety, I mean, look, anyone that's anxiety,

anybody with depression, anybody that has an autoimmune issue, anybody that has chronic fatigue syndrome, anybody that has an autoimmune issue, anybody that has chronic fatigue syndrome, anybody that has a metabolic hormonal problem, anybody that has a digestive problem. You know what this sounds like right now? Do you know whose commercials were in like, they're like give you like a million different things

that can go like anyone who's tall short, you know? Long and short, right? But it exists on a spectrum, some people it's mild. Yeah. Some people it's very extreme. Oh, this is, I love all this stuff. That's why I mean, I can talk to you for hours, but I know you have other places to go.

So I love talking to you, like I said. I love you. Master, master interview. Oh, I love you for saying that. Where could people, okay, first of all, where could people find more? You just told people at willcool.com. Dr. Will Cool.com.

Dr. Will Cool.com. Dr. Will Cool.com. The book is called Gut Feelings. You're all over social media and group, right? And people, you are seeing patients. You probably don't need any more though. But we have the proper bandwidth of team. People can, I still see all the concierge patients on group calls, initial consults. Yeah, that's my day job. But there are other

options for people too. We have group class options, which I still see them weekly. And group. Group. Yeah, we have group. We have concierge one on one and we have group models to make it more accessible, affordable. Really? I've never heard of that. What do you mean? Well, the Cleveland Clinic's Functional Medicine Center, historically, and they opened up after, you know, we started before they received an Emanclean Clinic functional medicine center. But when they opened, they had a group model. And I don't know if they still do that, but I think that they have a long waiting list

there too, and they're doing amazing things. And they tend to have a lot more group models. And that's something that I always knew, okay, this is one path for many people. To further democratize this and get people access to it. It's lower the cost for it. So they still have their individual health coaches, but there's a lot of the group things with me are via group, a lot of the sessions with me.

It has to work, like there's more than like, there's like 10 people on a screen. Yeah, there's like a lot, lots of. Yeah, there's like lots of people. Like how many? I mean, right now we have in just the group model alone, about 250 people. On a call. Yeah. Not everybody joins every week because they're getting such good care from their coaches,

but the calls are every week. So there's like, wow. Dozens and dozens and dozens of calls with me. So they don't have to join every week. And so what do you do? You go over topics of things or... Asking answering questions, topics, just deep dives on things. Again, they still have their one-on-one code,

so it's not, it's a hybrid, it's not entirely group. So when you say I want to, like, one-on-one coach, like another functional medicine doctor who works underneath you or... A functional diagnostic nutrition practitioner. So they're basically, you could call them nutritionists, health coaches within functional medicine. Yeah.

And then what if they want to see you? So that would be the concierge side of things. So that, and I still do that too. That's most of my day is that. Oh, that's what you do. So what do you do with Goop? What's your relationship with Goop? So Goop, just my friends, they're fun.

They're just friends. My friends, my friends and my book is, I I'm doing impressed. Yeah, that's it. That might they were friends first before the book so okay I didn't I thought you were involved in their website or something. Well, the history's long but I History because I start I hosted one of the first group podcast spin-off. It's called good pillars Oh, my whatever happened to that they need to bring it back. I have my own podcast now one of the first group podcast spin-off, it's called Goop Pillas. Oh my, whatever happened to that? They need to bring it back. I have my own podcast now,

it's called The Art of Being Well. But it lasted for about a year, so I just think the pandemic happened, right? And I think they just readjusted how they were doing and they're focused on the podcast side of things. And Shemus, Molland, Sulefront of Mine, everybody could still a friend of mine, it's just the podcast we never revisited it. And we're all busy doing of things. And Shamist, Mollin, Silla, Friend of Mine, everybody, good, Silla, Friend of Mine, it's just the podcast we never revisited it. And we're all busy doing different things. Right. And was it just for fellas then? Or?

No, it wasn't. It was for everybody. A lot of women like listen to group fellas. Maybe the problem was it was named the branding was off. People thought maybe they were men who listen to our majority, people listen to podcasts. They were scrolling and they're like, oh, this isn't for me. It's not for us. Well, that could have been it. But here's the deal with that is that, Gupe what is still, like really does a lot of things for men. And I think it was their way to bring in more people to the conversation.

Oh, I remember that now that you said that. Yeah, I'm blast from the past. Yeah. 100%. Yeah. And yeah, so they're just that's my relationship with them. So I write, I write for them occasionally. And that's about it. Oh, okay, well, I don't work for group. I know what I know you don't work for. I mean, because even on your like pressed up, it says something about group. And I was just a good press. yeah, it's a good press. It's the book is Guppress.

I understand all that stuff. Oh, I understand now. Well, this has been very, very enlightening. I appreciate you being on this podcast as usual. You're a wealth of information. I have a million more questions, but you can just come on again next time. Thank you so much.

Yeah, this is amazing. Thank you, Will. Thank you. Bye. Hope you enjoyed this episode. I'm Heather Monahan, host of Creating Conf confidence, a part of the YAP Media Network, the number one business and self-improvement podcast network. Okay, so I want to tell you a little bit about my show. We are all about elevating your confidence to its highest level ever

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