Hollywood Handbook - Jamie Loftus, Our Book Friend

Episode Date: July 4, 2023

The Boys welcome back JAMIE LOFTUS to discuss her book Raw Dog.Watch the video of today’s episode with Jamie at Patreon.com/TheFlagrantOnes. Like the show? Rate Hollywood Handbook 5-Stars on Apple PodcastsAdvertise on Hollywood Handbook via Gumball.fm See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is a HeadGum Podcast. obo with you no i don't know but i do have one at my house obama thanks obama thanks obama um you're the obama yeah yeah that was a big eight years for me obama.com i mean a pledge kevin check that domain name for me. I'm ready to invest. It's open. That's good. Let me say something first.

When we have a guest coming on, Kevin, the night before, an hour before, in a pen is texting. Not just that we have a guest, but going, I was thinking maybe we could talk about this with this guest. Maybe I deal with this guest. The last time this guest was on, we talked about this. And maybe there's a way to sort of cannibalize our own thing and reference something that no one will remember. And he's just like always going like,

what are we going to do? What are we going to do? Can this rut get a little deeper? You're coming in today. Yes. Did not for one second, his confidence in you, your ability to riff, your innate charm is so high. He didn't send a single idea of what we should talk about.

Unspoken is, Jamie's here. I got the day off. It's going to be fine. And I plan to go nuts today, just so you know. And I think he could sense it that you were going to go nuts oh but as we used to say fucking taz out on the show i love to taz out and that feels good to hear about kevin because on previous appearances i've had long meetings he preps you a lot right yeah he drills me a couple of zooms where you're getting where

you're getting intensive drills yeah i and he wanted to set them for when i would normally take my pilates classes just eight in the morning and because after that's not gonna like no you're gonna be spent yeah exactly he said that like all the like little muscles that you use for like balance and stability are crucial. I use my obliques. Yeah. Right now. Yes. Those are very important to his process and he can't have you burning them out.

Yeah. And he doesn't even want them toned, which is like bizarre. No. He wants to shape them himself. He wants to bulk them. They'll fuck them up he says so i yeah i quit for a while to you know prep with kevin and i mean i it feels good to you know not have to do those calls where you going usually do you go to dr pilates i go to pilates punks okay yeah okay

i'm not allowed in there they said i have to have a mohawk to take the class. Yeah. They like pinned me down and started shaving my head and I said no. And they said, oh, then I guess you're not serious about Pilates. Yeah. So. I would agree with that.

I didn't used to feel that way, but now I do. They said I have to hold a paper clip up to my nose. Do they make you? I don't have to actually put it in there or anything. I just have to hold it up like it's in there's in there they told me i had to slag off the queen they said you better start slagging off the queen well did you i mean it i didn't have a little bit i didn't really put my ass behind it you know i mean i was doing it but it was just like, oh, that bitty. She's, you know. I said she was a nutter. They do need you to put your whole bussy into it before you can go in.

That was the message I received as well. I named the five bands, and they just let me cruise on through. I named five at the door, and they said, all right, let's see what she's got. What'd you name? Yeah, what were the bands? Because there's a lot of bands. It's a lot of bands. Yeah, five?

Yeah. I could name maybe two. Okay, Ramones, that's number one. Okay. That's one punk band. I wouldn't have gotten that. Next, you have New York Dolls. I would not have gotten that.

Then I just started looking at- Is that the American Girl Ball Store? They played that in there. One of them is a New York doll. One of them is a New York doll. And then the last three, I was kind of panicking, but there's stuff hanging on the wall. Is Sheeby Gebe one of? Sheeby Gebe?

Is Sheeby Gebe one of the bands? Is Sheeby Gebe the band? I didn't name that one. Okay. And I think that they broke up well that's what she broke up okay yeah okay and then there's modest mouse and then she kind of lit up when i said that not in the way they want me to know them exactly exactly because when you say modest mouse then you have to say like

they're early stuff right modest mouse before yeah before the hits yeah uh and then and then i said uh no doubt and then i stuttered and i said no doubt again and they just let me in okay that is five well yeah again they didn't even i didn't get to the band part of it. If I had, what would I have said? Top five. Top five. Okay. Dead or alive. Is P. Diddy a punk band?

That's a good question. I remember some pretty loud guitars in some of those songs. You know what? They do count because I checked the roster too because I've been going there for a while. And after a while, they let you look at the list of bands. You can say Jay-Z, but you have to say with Linkin Park. Jay-Z with Linkin Park. With Linkin Park.

Oh, you got to say it really fast. That's an acceptable answer. Yeah. Okay. All right. Okay. How many times have you been with us when you do the show? How many? Hayes was asking me yesterday

and I had no clue. I don't know. It makes more sense for you to know than us. I should, yeah, because you're doing the show all the time. We did 500 plus probably even 100 more at this point. I saw. I noticed. A lot of our guests don't know about it.

Okay, that's great because we got zero press. Oh, my God. That's really, was that hard? To get no press? Yeah. Getting no press has been the easy part of my job. I am actually curious for Kevin if it was hard fending off the press. Yeah.

He's such a pro. To delay the interviews. It was very hard. There was a lot of emails I had to not respond to about depressed. I got depressed. Yeah, we got depressed. By Kevin. Yeah, we got depressed. Is Train a band?

Is Train one? The later stuff. Yeah, the late stuff. Not the early stuff. The after. The early stuff is sissy. After the hit yeah the uh because we're on a bit of a run you see we don't like to you know we don't like to talk we don't like to jinx the streak by discussing the streak but you are uh finding us in the middle of a hot zone that's amazing i'm so thrilled yeah and you could get infected with some of the comedy in the in the center of this hot zone because it's going viral it's going by all the time

and be thinking about we've been cutting we've been doing clips degrees of viral but yes always always at least a little bit a low simmer or a hot yeah think about what would make a good clip from your episode like try to do something that generates just like, if the episode's good, great, fine. I don't know. Nobody really listens to the episode, but we have TikTok now. And we need help with the clips. Kevin's clip instincts are fatal.

I'm realizing that he named his hedgehog clippy ironically oh god because because that's the only thing that he's not he's not really able to like wrap his head around he's so good at the other stuff telling press no thank you getting a guest and then not really preparing anything for them um i guess telling us what we've done before like all that stuff he's like got his head around but naming a hedgehog finding a clip well naming a hedgehog you said oh god and clippy is unfortunately with oh god right now oh rolly's with oh god oh rolly's with oh god sorry i forgot sorry i forgot i was supposed to Oh, no. Kind of a fatal bonk. It's like when I was at tennis camp and my parents didn't tell me that my mudskipper died until I got home, you know?

I went on vacation. Elliot was his name. Elliot? Yeah. Oh, that's how long did he live? Pretty long. A lot longer than the one we got after. Yeah, he started a trend.

Once the other mudskippers heard how easy it was to just fucking. It's too bad that elliot's uh elliot's death went viral like that because it just gave other mudskippers big ideas yeah yeah 13 reasons why for mudskippers yeah so i just read this entire book uh-huh holy shit the book is raw dog the book is raw dog it says part travelogue part culinary history all capitalist critique jamie yeah i know and yet i noticed the book is for sale and yet i noticed the book is for sale for money. Okay. That has been. Where does the money go? To the DSA?

You know, I would say it doesn't. It doesn't. And that's something that the good people on Goodreads have been confronting me about this pretty consistently saying, oh, that's interesting. Yeah. Are you accepting money for this when you seem to hate money so much? I guess it's a capitalist critique. It's a critique that is capitalist. Yeah, it's a critique.

Coming from a capitalist, I'm criticizing those doofuses that don't want money. I'm so sorry, but I'm obsessed now with I cut you off. You had said I was on vacation. I told the tennis camp story pretty touching i was really hoping we could let it go i told the tennis camp yeah mark that for a clip and then you said but and then and then maybe stitch this in after because jamie's got a good vacation story that she didn't get to at the time we'll go back to the book the book's going to be a lot of the episode sure sure you but you were on vacation what happened what where were you

i regretted that sentence the second it came out of my mouth well because it sounds pretty bougie you know what i mean we got this big capitalist critique meanwhile and here i am on vacations and was it a nice vacation no but it was a vacation i took some time off where did you have a vacation uh with my mom in orlando florida okay we got there we got to the where we did a little touch and go with my mom of it all right well you know we're staying at the sheraton weaton. We have a timeshare there. Now, that's a little bougie as well. The timesheraton.

That's what they call it there. And they're always trying to upsell you. But, okay, I was 26 years old. I went on vacation with my mom in Orlando, Florida. Asked my roommate to take care of my hamster. And I was so inspired by hearing Elliot's story that I wanted to share my hamster story. Because while I was gone, she got something called wet bottom

and died within a day. It's very terminal for hamsters. It's like one of the top reasons. Oh, no. And there's nothing you can do. This is so scary. I think I have it. Are you serious?

I think I might have it. Oh, my God. There's really not a cure. I'm just working back through the last couple days, and I'm just imagining what it could be. There's really only one thing, and I have it, which means like. Have you called an exotic pets fit i'm i guess but you're saying it's terminal like maybe it's maybe rather than undergoing treatment

is it yeah yeah you probably you have more time at least okay all right so maybe i can get some stuff done record a couple more podcasts before i say goodbye i don't want to get too like clinical with like what the the epidemiology you know like the hamster epidemiology and like how it impacts them and things like that but basically they back up onto the little dripper it's yeah so you you've seen it oh yeah so you've seen yeah enema of the state right would that get me into the punk pilates bar you might be able to trick them if you scowl really hard while you say it and then i must not have heard i think you could go harder I think you could go harder.

I went on vacation too. Okay. All right. And we asked the neighbors to take care of my pet bird, Larry Bird. And then what? And he flew in a window and his head broke. We've all been through so much here. He died.

Oh, wait. We found him walking in the street. I've done that too. That's how we first found him. You found the bird? He was walking down the street. We picked him up

and took him home. Oh, before he died you found him walking down the street. That's how you acquired him. That's how we first found him. Initially acquired Larry Bird. He was walking down the middle of the street. What kind of bird was he? On Cape Cod.

That was on a different vacation. He was a parakeet. Blue parakeet. Wow. Just out for a stroll, right? Scoop. Okay. Seems like someone's picking my ass up now.

You're the cops. Yeah, basically. Did you ask for consent? Like, what was that process like? To pick up Larry Bird? Yeah. Scooping his ass up. Did you check in at all?

I guess. um scooping his ass up did you check in at all i guess i i was like hey is it okay if i throw this entire towel over you yes i did say that okay i've got this gigantic towel is it okay if i just drop it on your ass and he was fine yeah he was very very chill about it wow Wow. Jamie, I know you know about the show. The show that you're on. Of course. I think you famously told us once that you had a roommate who said you wouldn't get it. Yes. That's true. And I'd never get it, is what they said.

Thank you, King. Never. I honor you, King. We need our gatekeepers. Yes, that's right. Otherwise, the gates just open. Yeah. So, you know that we've been going a little bit,

especially since you heard about the 500th episode, that we've been going through the history of the show. Huge, yeah. Some of our biggest moments. And one thing that people to this day reference even was assured at one point is we would say

and we didn't know what it meant but we would say hot dog go to bathroom that's a legacy do you remember that that's fun do you remember that

I don't remember that you don't remember it no it was like a quiz it was like what's your perfect day at the beach or something it was a multiple choice

and the choices were like go for a walk like collect shells like and then the last choice was hot dog go to bathroom and man we laughed at us saying that is hilarious we were loving it cut to nine years later you write a book hot dog right to be read in the bathroom yeah preferably and it's and it's raw dog the book and what kevin said i don't feel this way necessarily but kevin said that we know she's listening the episode she's stealing right she's a stealer and then he said to me and this i'm quoting him i want to be, because I don't say this stuff. First, he asked, do you know who C.S. Lewis is?

I go, yeah, I do. And he goes, then you'll love this. The lion, the witch, and the audacity of this bitch. Are you serious? I mean, I had to sit my ass down because i was like kevin this is a friend this is a return guest like that's precious to us we need return guests weird to say like do you know c.s lewis i don't know why that was part of it and like yeah i guess because some people might be like no and they'll be like okay well i know that that title is land like yeah i guess because some people might be like no and they'll be like okay well i know that that title is familiar to me i guess you can't say do you know the lion the

witch and the wardrobe yeah i think that was part of it but like yeah it's like i'd say at that point just roll the dice even if i thought you were making up the rhyme like it's gonna have a similar impact well i will say and and this doesn't feel good to say because I'm pretty pissed off right now, but it did land for me. Yeah. Yeah. I thought it was pretty funny.

And it's difficult. Well, you love hanging out with Kevin. He's been saying it more and more. Well, he's been drilling me for years. So it's really frustrating to hear that he's these you know and you can like sort of get the vibe from someone who's going to talk behind your back i can hear in your voice how furious like it's really i just feel like a lump in my throat because i just didn't think it's always a person you don't think is going to do it yeah you know what it says on the book trust what that's adult adult you know that means what porno porno stuff so the book says adult can

i see that oh good catch okay it says porno adult adult humor porno jokes they don't put that at the front of the barnes and noble that's why they're not doing that Don't humor porno jokes. They don't put that at the front of the Barnes and Noble. That's why they're not doing that. Yeah. Yeah. All right. They have to put it in the back.

It's too dangerous. What kind of porno jokes are in here? I, you know. Oh, I can't be giving away my porno jokes for free. The one where it's like the it's like a breathalyzer but it's he's like giving her breathalyzer but it's she's like what are you talking about actually giving the dude dome oh i don't know what i mean ah dude such a porno joke okay and now i'm and now i'm lost in the book yeah a world of words and i've been there's something on every page hayes you take over there's something on every single page

jamie's little aside there's footnotes there's and i like the way they're formatted i don't want to flip to the back for my footnote no i want it right here when I ignore it. You know what? You go, oh, shorter page. I don't want to feel like, yeah, I don't want to feel like I'm being lazy because of the structure of it. I want to just be like, yep, no, thank you. I'm in the middle of reading. I don't need to stop and go read so I could keep reading. That's not me. I did that for you.

That's okay. That's good. Let's talk about the book. Big ass footnote. That's not me. I did that for you. That's okay. That's good. Let's talk about the book. Big ass footnote. It's pretty long. It's the only one. That's just a little inside baseball with my awesome book. Page 156 and it's footnote number one.

Yeah. Lucky that I found it, honestly. It's kind of an adult humor joke in itself. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Did you ever eat a whole hot dog? I don't think so tough to even find one these days it's i'm glad you said that because that's i was censored a little and i couldn't say you know where the hell am i supposed to get the rest where's the where's

the rest of the beef where's the rest of them okay see i can't say where's the beef there's certainly some here but where's the rest here's the beef but where'd the rest of the beef? Where's the rest of them? Okay, see, I can't say where's the beef. There's certainly some here. But where's the rest of the beef? Here's the beef, but where'd the rest of it go? Here's the beef, some of it. Where does the rest of the beef go? How would you punctuate that? Sorry, so the scenario is I'm transcribing my own question?

Yeah. She's got to steal it, put it in a over this is what she does she takes shit that we say so clearly now just the level of laziness i think it's interesting that before oh it's just kevin that thinks this but now all of a sudden it seems like maybe hayes shares his opinion well of what i kevin has been known to infect our brains. He is a virus. He's sort of like crafted the show to his specifications now. We used to do all kinds of shit,

you know, and now we just do like the one thing that Kevin thought the show was over and over again. He would just accuse people of stealing from us. He's got to get his. And he asked me like

related to this he asked me if I know he asked me if I know C.S. Lewis oh god I know where this is going and I said yes and he said the butcher the baker and the idea taker

this bitch and I was like okay I don't think the butcher, the baker, and the idea taker in this pitch. It's like, okay, I don't think C.S. Lewis wrote that. I don't associate that. Fucking believable. Well, maybe Kevin could benefit from stealing some ideas because that's not a very good one, is it? No. That one definitely wasn't as good.

Maybe he needs an idea stolen from someone else because that one doesn't seem to connect to C.S. Lewis. No, not at all. It feels like a stretch to get the B word in there, which is like, I guess, like a primary. It doesn't rhyme with the middle thing at all. Yeah. Which in 2023 doesn't feel very appropriate to be calling me something like that. I hated it.

I hated that he did that. He shouldn't have done it. But, you know okay fine kevin don't do that it's not nice again this is to repeat what i said at the time and no way man on the on the floor which is what your book should be called come on man threw up on the floor the book right. Right? Yeah. Mm-hmm. It's so frustrating because now that I'm thinking about it, like in these sessions that Kevin and I would have,

he would be calling other people in his life bitches all the time. I don't know why I thought I would be exempt. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, it is funny. You work back through all the interactions you've had. All the signs were there you're like every time you brought up anybody else in his life like even like when hayes wasn't there he was saying it about hayes why did i think it wasn't happening about me when i wasn't there you know yeah yeah uh when someone tells you who they are uh do me a favor go ahead and believe him bitch that's what Kevin said to me

he said that to me too and I didn't use it to you know he was warning me about himself that's what I found out you know one time he asked me if I knew who C.S. Lewis was

and I said yeah like we've talked about this before. He just was like more like Prince Aspian. So that wasn't even it. That is a C.S. Lewis thing.

Yeah. Well, he's hit or miss. I feel like I can break our, you know, Kevin, you know, my agreement. You know, our cone of silence is just broken at this point because the trust is shattered. It's all out there. And so he did ask me one time if I knew who C.S. Lewis was. Sure.

No, he'll do that. Yeah. Story track for me so far. That's my experience with Kevin as well. And of course I said yes. And this is like... You write books. I mean, you know C.S. Lewis.

Yeah, I think I've heard of him. Yeah, right. You know, a fellow author, right? And this was a day he was a little frustrated with Hayes. Hayes had cut him off at some point. And so he said, have you heard of CS Lewis and I said yes and and Kevin said I know why the caged bird won't shut the hell up okay that's definitely not okay that Wow and so and then I just said like i have to go it's offensive and thinking it's c.s lewis

is offensive it's really difficult and he says if he just said that i cut him off you might be thinking that i like cut off communication with him or cut him off on the road or something like What it actually was was schnapps. At the party, yeah. No more schnapps. Yes, he had been over-served. That is your last peach tree schnapps. That is your last one. You will not be getting another one. I wonder if it was a reference to Larry Bird.

Wow. That he knew that Hayes' blue birdie is Caged Bird. This week on the Patreon, the boys write a eulogy for the Stitcher app on the pro version and the Flaker ones are mostly talking all things basketball.

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Yeah. And it's out now. And it's so much hot dogs in the book. Jamie, talk a little bit about, I saw a treat at Trader Joe's. It was called Perfectly Pickled Dogs. It was a frozen package of hot dogs that are covered in, it's almost like a corn dog breading. I was going to say, to talk about the dogs.

But there's a pickle-flavored breadcrumb surrounding it. What? Is that in the book? Is that in the book? It's a pickle hot dog at Trader Joe's. Perfectly pickled dogs from Trader Joe's. I'm curious about it. It's a pickle flavor breading.

It's like a corn dog where it's got like a, it's like dipped in some, but there's a pickle element to it. That's Trader Joe's capitalizing on the craze. Is that in the book it didn't make the book i did i had certain rules with corn dogs for the book uh-huh and it it sucks because i know exactly what you're talking about and i really wanted to put it in and but they said you know that sucks that sucks doggy that sucks it reallygy. I mean, it was like so.

No. I was really bummed. Were you crying? No, not today. But like I just because I've worked through it, you know. Yeah. No more tears left for this one. No.

You know, we've just been through the whole process. Shit. Okay. Well, that's all I had prepared. Did you try that hot dog? No. No? You just looked at it?

Somebody sent me a picture of it. I don't think they've tried it either. I mean, I would try it. I'm curious. What's the, what house? What house? The book. What?

The publishing house. Great question? The book. What? The publishing house. Great question. Hang on. Forge. Sean, you tell them. Yeah, it's Forge. Forge. It's Forge. Wow.

Yeah. Not one of the X-Men, no? Forge? Yeah. Yeah. He's the strongest one. Isn't he? Sorry.

The strongest one. Who strong the strongest one who's the strongest one i actually think that storm is the strongest one yes thank you think that ability to control the weather but i guess i guess you think i think he's the strongest boy uh actually i think the girl x-mens are actually one of them too it could be the strongest one. Really? Mm-hmm. I don't know. I just don't think that that's true.

Well, you know. As a woman, I think Forge is the strongest one. I would say that Forge is very strong. Yeah, obviously. The strongest one, I would probably say Storm. Storm. Storm. Mm-hmm. yeah obviously but the strongest one i would probably say storm storm or rogue who god could acquire forges forges powers at any time that she wished by using her powers of seduction

i i see i don't think forge would fall for it i think when forge fell for it one time it was a play. He meant to steal powers. Letting her think he could fall for it so that if she ever was going to do it, then he would be able to be strong and build a plane or something. That's what he would do, yeah. Yeah, he could break her heart. He would just build a plane and leave.

Is that not strong? It's very strong. The ability to build a plane and leave is that not strong uh it's very you know it's it's very strong the ability to build a plane and leave that's quite a power i can't do either of those things did you write forge how did this come about well forge reached out funny email yeah forge reached out reached out to you yeah so they wrote the funny email. Yeah. And I was like taken aback, obviously, you know, because it was a couple years ago. It was during lockdown and Forge reached out and said, you know, that the world needed joy. And how can we get there? You know, and I really I've been such a big fan of forge over the years and it was just like an honor to hear from him and so actually this was at a time where kevin

and i were still doing the session yeah sure and so that's like part of why it's so painful to see him today because i started canceling my sessions with Kevin so I could be with Forge. To be with Forge for the book. Right. And I thought Kevin would be happy for me. No way. Well, yeah, I know. That's clear now, Kevin. I know.

We all understand no way now. I just didn't. I mean, I don't like to take it back there. But I just was surprised the extent, how low he was willing to go. When you had tried to cancel the sessions because of lockdown, and he said, no way. Yeah, he said, we're going virtual. And I would try to, you know, I would say no. It was in person, but he was wearing an Oculus Rift.

He had to wear a VR helmet or something. I was so stressed out because I was like, we can't meet in person right now. And he said, want to bet? And then I just like didn't know what to do. So we were, you know, it was like a yard. It was safe. We were in the yard, but, and I was wearing a helmet. He was wearing a helmet.

And it was just like, I don't know. And then when we went virtual, it got even worse because he would send the calendar invites always with the calendar invites and i would say no at some point i well and the invite said want a cyber yeah that's really like which is like there's no way he didn't know that there's like another way to read that because it was it was and and to defend him i i know because i've gotten the same he was we did some virtual meetings we did some virtual okay and he did drill me and and i did i think improve my hosting presence you can even see today i'm fully self-possessed all of my ideas are good really present i'm expressing myself really clearly i'm talking to the guests occasional eye contact yeah all things that were weaknesses for

me before i'm not saying the drilling didn't work i just like i was trying to say when, you know? And he would not allow it. Can we talk about podcasts? Yeah, of course. You did that. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I mean, so much. We miss you.

We miss you over here. Something's different. Where's my friend? Does this, like, with the microphone and everything, does it make you think, like, It's such a throwback for me what if i went back and i did an irish goodbye it's such a throwback the book i'm just like wow it's not a podcast yeah there's well i've gotten so many emails saying i i really enjoyed not to bread i really enjoyed the book it's like a really long podcast um and i find these emails really really really

frustrating to receive but it's nice to be back did you bring the book you give me the book did i give you the book you have the book i don't know whose book that's that's pretty that's somebody else's let's see oh shit says to nick and mitch oh come on fuck yeah did you do that and they left it here the original dog boys yeah i said the real boys um but it was just a joke dog boys it's just a joke i have with dog boys without uh dog boys that those guys what we actually prefer is that you just going forward from when we schedule these again is that you do us first and then you go do their show okay and then we we don't have a direct line for them but we do need you to speak with them about us being able to do yeah no i'll hit

i'll hit the group chat right after this get on there yeah and i'd be willing to write a book this book or another one if it meant me getting back on the show do that do this one it's great yeah you're gonna really like it i you know i didn't give me the book i didn't give you the book but you said you're so you said you didn't want to read it i know i don't want to read the footnote you want to read everything around the footnote reading the book see okay i can't i'm in flow you know i don't want to break up the flow got this nice rhythm going i'm gonna stop down now no you're right i mean you're stopping to tie your shoe in the middle of a race.

And it was brought up to me that it would be bitchy to add a footnote so late. Kevin said that. He said that? Yeah, Kevin. Oh, he didn't say that to me. That's who I thought you were saying brought it up. No, he said to me, I left the footnote.

No, he said it me, I love the footnote. He said to me, no. He said it was. Oh, is this bitch going to put a footnote in here? Yes. I said, Kevin, please. Stop. Instead of his bitch made behavior. Yeah. Well, okay. At this point, I'm just like not even surprised.

I'm just like feeling more. Does the footnote have a star? Let's see. Well, I know what page it is, 156, because I said it. Mm-hmm. Okay, so I am here, and there's a one. There's a little one. It's a little one?

Little one. Okay. And then it goes down. I insisted on that. Yeah. Okay, so I know I'm supposed to find the other one. And then I get to the end of the footnote. Mm-hmm.

Where do I go now? It doesn't say. I've already established that there's a little code. Yeah, I guess what at the bottom. So at the last word of the footnote, what there should be after that is like a little star. Or a new number. Would you know instinctively what the star and then you well yes because the star would then be found up on this page so this it's like the one takes me

down to the one and then the star takes me back up to the star because i end up getting lost like i finish this and then i start reading the next page but i'm in the middle of the sentence that i don't know about my pants my belt buckle god that's so that's really that's useful feedback thank you I guess I never considered the star system but that is mostly doesn't have to be a star doesn't have to be a star it has to be a little something to help me I'm lost I like I like the little cross the little cross I like to add the little cross because it feels and so Jesus is reading the book and he's like okay thanks for reminding me of that just trying to enjoy about a hot dog yeah he can't catch a break yeah i remember that a good far side cartoon i like i like when i but i would get confused

because when i see the cross i'm like oh i should put this down and pick up my bible and then i stop reading the book and i'll finish it that's true i end up doing the entire goddamn rosary i end up doing the whole motherfucking rosary and then you're exhausted across in there yeah then i need then i need a nap are the other are your other little friends like is kathy writing you and being like hey it could be sort of funny to do a podcast about Kathy eats a hot dog, you know? Yeah. Now that you've like just straight up moved on and left their spent carcass in the wake of your ambition. I think maybe she, I mean, I think maybe people would have reached out if I hadn't. I think in retrospect, I shouldn't have bridge burned as severely as I did.

When the bocala of a skate is reaching out, they're going, what if Lolita eat a hot dog? You know, rather seductively. And you're going like, no. When you do a podcast about someone, your body makes a promise. And that it is a sacred, it's not something that you can just like act like it never happens like you don't get this happened it did happen you did a podcast about kathy yes you were you were a willing participant in that in fact i think you initiated i think you were the one that seduced kathy originally yeah it was really and now i had a picture having the confidence to just

show up and be like hey like jamie could you do a podcast do you want to do that that's not no everyone knows that it's you no and she i think now thinks of it like wow you know she was so thirsty you know like reaching out repeatedly but i think it's just like you know when am i allowed to move on when men say eat a hot dog i want to talk about calling well yeah maybe menza could eat a hot dog i don't know hey i just had a genius idea lol rofl uh maybe men say eat a hot dog right i would let the i hey look nothing's stopping them but uh but i, you know, I'm just like, I'm not stopping them. You're stopping them. How am I holding them back at this late stage?

I just feel. Because they trust you now. They have your mind. They trusted you. You took their hand in yours and said, let me guide you. Let me show you. And then you went to write a hot dog and they said, may I have a bite of hot dog? And you said, oh, so so busy i have to go like

i yeah but at some point you know it's it's just you have to move on kevin can you have them keep it down out there i saw ben rogers i know ben rogers and um john gabrus maybe are out there can you have them be quiet just while we're recording yes sir casey when you do a second studio if you do one a little soundproofing could be helpful because there are people outside and they are having conversation and sometimes they're being funny laughing i don't begrudge anyone having a big laugh noted but i but i do think that when you're inside the studio doing a recording with a guest like jam Jamie wrote a book. We need to be able to discuss it quiet.

Well, see, I am a little frustrated because Ben and Gabrus know that. They know that I wrote a book and they're still being, you know, a little loud. I didn't give them the book. I didn't give them the book. I've only got so many. How do they know about it? You literally just said they know about it. They're literally

well I mean they're obsessed with the library. They love reading. Not to call you guys out but like if you were at the library you would know. Okay.

That's interesting. They have invited me to the library a lot. They said you gotta see what's in there they said the copy machine goes crazy it goes nuts and some of the some of the books have porno well there's some adult books adult humor some porno jokes yeah and they actually are responsible for the curtain uh in front of the adult books

that didn't used to be the library yeah okay yeah but they saw some wanderers that maybe shouldn't have been in that section and uh i think they did they did the right thing it used to be a a screen door and they were like well this is you know it's effective so a breeze can get in which is nice and actually pretty necessary if you're reading now that's the problem with the curtain is my understanding you can't get just stiff breeze is that it's just it's it's keeping out the the air flow in a way that we do need to get some air back in there it's true without having the curtain be open well how would you like so you have been to the adult book section of well i'm you know these are like my friends like i actually

talked i've gone there to pick them up and stuff before but never going to ride because they're like getting so crazy with these books yeah they're just like i don't trust myself to drive home yeah you shouldn't drive home but they're like sitting in the car it's from personal experience and they got kind of like must be in there like behind the curtain you know what i mean they sort of built up a little like film from like not having the the necessary airflow in there i had to take the top down on my old jalopy have you got any idea for a podcast put your finger on your chin if i'm hot dog i just want to say like i'm sure hot dog is feeling pretty good right now. But look at the wake of destruction behind you.

I'm different. Hot Dog is like, I'm different. She really likes me. I'm different. She won't immediately move on to some other thing. And I won't. And I wouldn't do that. Okay.

And I think that people take stuff really personally. What's next now that Hot Dog has served its purpose? You've used it up and spit it out. I'm staying. I'm staying. I'm staying with hot dog. I'm going to stew, kind of stew in the juice. Come on.

You can tell us. Be honest. What's it going to be? No, I can't. Another food? Another cartoon? Did you eat your whole athletic greens? Yeah, and I've kind of just been fucking around with the jar.

Wow. I kind of forgot that there was video on but i bet uh the video would tell i was just twisting it uh yeah yeah it was heating up in my hands so i started drinking it faster but i liked it it's nice it's a little crushed the ag one damn you're getting right about now a mouse. Nah, I think that mouse is covered. The thing is like, yeah, hot dog wasn't covered. Mouse, there's plenty of mouse content out there. I don't want to clog up, you know. I don't want to speak out of turn.

I feel like I have nothing to add. I've thought about it, but I have nothing to add. Okay. I'm just asking like yeah okay like literally just yes or no is fine okay are you gonna write a book about a mouse no yes i am no no i'm not no you're not doing a mouse i'm sorry okay think something else okay fine no free country yeah that's why i'm not writing a book about a mouse okay i don't want to talk about it it's really jam man's you think it was bad this is a long pause so you think the guy that that

the other book about a mouse is bad no i think it's so like i i think the hubris of trying to outdo Stuart. I can't do that. That mouse could drive a car. Stuart. Yeah. That mouse could drive a car, so I can't. What am I going to do? Mr. Clean.

The story of Mr. Clean, right? See, now we're talking. Yeah. Now we're talking. I would be thrilled about that. Who was Mr. Clean, right? That's podcast, book, whatever you want. 12 hours at least. You had a crush on him when you were a kid or something. Clean, right? That's podcast, book, whatever you want. 12 hours at least.

You had a crush on him when you were a kid or something. Oh, yeah. You have to. I was in love with Mr. Clean. You have to start with. I would steal the Mr. Clean bottle and hide it under my pillow. Yeah. So, yeah, I actually.

I inhaled all the fumes. Did you guys know I did a pilot about that? I'm high as hell. I'm still high off the Mr. Clean fumes. That's why I'm writing so crazy. It's funny, first of all, to say things like that. Okay. And I would like to finish my project about Mr. Clean.

I think it's a weird way to bring it up. I didn't know you did a pilot about that. Well, I did. And yes, it did start with a cute little anecdote to bring it up. Yeah, I didn't know you did a pilot about that. Well, I did. And yes, it did start with a cute little anecdote that I made up. Yeah. And it started, I liked the cadence I kind of hit for that one too. I feel like it was really coming into my own with the cadence where I was like, Mr. Clean, you've heard of him, right?

And then a little music comes in. And say, of course you've heard of him. Maybe you saw him on TV when your mom was watching soap operas. Maybe you saw him at Chuck E. Cheese when you were enjoying a slice of pizza as a child. That's where it lost me a little bit because I just don't think that you ever see Mr. Clean there. I don't see Chuck E. Cheese. I don't see Mr. Clean at Chuck E. Cheese. I saw him at Chuck E. Cheese. Oh, you see Mr. Clean at Chuck E. Cheese. I saw him at Chuck E. Cheese.

Oh, you did see him. Okay, but that's made up too? This is all made up. Okay. Yeah. My mom didn't watch soap operas. Yeah. We didn't go to Chuck E. Cheese.

That's like one of the biggest bullshit lies I've been telling that one for years. And then the music changes a little bit. Her mom didn't like soap operas, you know're well look this isn't gonna i'm supposed to do some sob story then the music changes a little bit again and i say but who is mr clean and then we get some voices in oh my god i got these fre guys. They just get from the library. They're always cutting up. Yeah, they can come in. Sure, that's what we need in here. More bodies. Yeah.

More bros, right? Jeez. Okay. I feel a little oppressed. Okay, you're not on mic right now. Arm the mic. Well, it's fitting. we're talking about raw dog and this just became a real sausage fest i'll tell you what we got two more i'm feeling a little oppressed coming in well you know i actually read the book and i loved it okay how did you get the

book yeah how'd you get it because she said she didn't give it to you did no i bought it oh you bought it yeah and you guys could have done that pre-ordered on bookshop.org book is a critique of capitalism yeah the money doesn't go to me it goes to uh it goes to somebody else it goes to uh it goes to other organizations and uh people well now i have to buy it because i am so big on organizations and people. You and people. I like time to put my money where my mouth is a little bit on this one because I've been saying for a long time that I'm like Mr. People Organizations guy, you know? I've heard you say that once or twice.

Jesus, man. Thank you. It's a fucking broken record. I have his back on this. He's a big organizations guy. It's funny because I was thinking he was maybe bullshitting me on that one, but I mean, I'll take your word for it because you read the book. I read the book, so I know the book and I know where you stand.

And I know where you guys stand. Sean won't stop talking about organizations. Yeah, it's just like because it's because honestly you said organizations and people yeah to me organizations are really just the people that make them up and organize them you know like it's all the same right yeah now your favorite part of organizations? No. Oh, okay. Ben. Oh. The, of Raw Dog. I do have a real answer.

Don't say the footnote. It's. Don't say the footnote. Giving me shit about the footnote. We didn't even talk about the content of the footnote. Well, there's one point where a friend of yours gets bullied by a child who you say tough, he said tough titties, old man. He did say tough titties, old man.

And that part is stuck with me. Made up shit I've ever heard. You think that's made up? I will say this. Fake is the fucking Mr. Clean anecdote. The Mr. Clean anecdote was fake. The Chuck E. Cheese stuff was fake. Mostly how I've characterized my family and my life has been completely made up.

But the tough titties old man anecdote is real. And that's why it stuck with you is because it's the first true thing I've ever written down. Oh, wow. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Because I thought the part where you called my hometown Buffalo, New York a miserable place was also made up maybe. Yeah.

No, I think it's a really fun place. I had the best time and I actually stayed for a couple of weeks, but I didn't, you know, I was afraid of what people would say. I get that. Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. I'll tell you, wings that wild don't come from a life of ease. They come from hardship.

They have a story. You know, from being oppressed, pushed down, and that is where you need to then spread some truly wild wings. Yeah, I think that's an Ohio-based franchise. I don't think it actually has anything to do with the city of Buffalo. Okay, so now you're saying, like, okay. I don't give a shit. Okay.

Yeah. What are you talking about? What else do you think? It's not like, yeah. What are you talking about? Hey, welcome to another? It's not like, yeah. What are you talking about? Hey, welcome to another episode of Ben Thinks. You know what I mean? I thought this shit was called fucking Hollywood Handbook.

Hey, you guys waving my ass in here. I regret it the moment I sat down. Well, you shouldn't have been in the window making crazy faces. I saw my three friends. I got excited. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyway, you were trying to buy the book trying to distract me here's a thought here's a thought for everybody buy this fucking book i mean i would and he's leaving yeah he doesn't believe in what he said doesn't want to stay in defendant yeah he he can't back that up he can't back that up. He can't back that up. Kevin, did you ever have sessions with him?

The whole thing felt very orchestrated to me. Jamie's here. They've obviously communicated. He's read the book. He's read the book. He cuts up. You remember the last thing he said before he was leaving? I don't know.

I don't remember exactly either. Something about Ohio or something. He was being so pissy. I think he was being great. I think he was being great, and I don't think that't remember something about ohio or something he was being so but he's so pissy i think he was being great i think he was being great and i don't think that was scripted at all i think that he was doing the right thing i don't know who to trust anymore well uh the book is raw dog it's raw the book is what is that lauren talking about the book? He's introducing the book instead of a musical guest. Which he also doesn't really do. Ladies and gentlemen.

Ladies and gentlemen. Raw dog. The book is raw dog. Ladies and gentlemen. Raw dog. Find it in stores. Ladies and gentlemen. Raw dog.

It's just a zoom in on a book on a shelf. Just on the stage. I could play the audio book. That's like. You could play the audio book. You could play the audio book. I'm hoping someone does a skating routine. You like people doing the audio book or you'd rather they read the words?

Did you read the audio book? Yeah, I read the audio book. You did it? Yeah. No, it's not a podcast. It's different. You care which way people enjoy it? Yes, I do the audiobook. You did it? No, it's not a podcast. It's different. You care which way people enjoy it? Yes, I do.

Which way? I want people to hold it in their hands. Hold the book. Yeah. Even though I don't do that. I don't like reading. Not everyone can do that. Yeah.

That was very fucked up of me. Okay, so. Some people could get really hurt if they heard that. Ableist author Jamie has written a book called Raw Dog. Well, not everyone can hear it either. So you've got to have options. Right, but you just said that you could only do one. And there's one that you think is the good option.

Yeah, and also the righteous and the moral option is to hold it. Jamie, can I pitch you a comedy bang bang character you can do when you promote the raw dog book bye oh I don't know

Hollywood Handbook that was a hate gum podcast