How Did This Get Made? - Matinee Monday: Snowmance

Episode Date: December 18, 2023

We never thought we’d do another Snowman movie, but here we are. Join Paul, Jason and June as they dig into the 2017 holiday film Snowmance. Jason schools us on the definition of ‘limerence’ and asks the question, can you really be happy for someone while being sad for yourself? Regardless, we’d rather have a Snow-Beau than No-Beau, so you know what that means… (Originally Released 12/16/2021) HDTGM is going on a European tour in March & April! Go to hdtgm.com for tix and info.For more Matinee Monday content, visit Paul's YouTube page: youtube.com/paulscheerFollow Paul on Letterboxd: letterboxd.com/paulscheer/HDTGM Discord: discord.gg/hdtgmPaul’s Discord: discord.gg/paulscheerCheck out Paul and Rob Huebel live on Twitch (www.twitch.tv/friendzone) every Thursday 8-10pm ESTSubscribe to The Deep Dive with Jessica St. Clair and June Diane Raphael here: www.thedeepdiveacademy.com/podcastSubscribe to Unspooled with Paul and Amy Nicholson here: listen.earwolf.com/unspooledCheck out The Jane Club over at janeclub.comCheck out new HDTGM merch over at teepublic.com/stores/hdtgmWhere to find Jason, June & Paul:@PaulScheer on Instagram & Twitter@Junediane on IG and @MsJuneDiane on TwitterJason is not on Twitter

I'd rather have a snow bow, then no bow. We saw snowmants, so you know what that means. Women just in the Kelly, a man to see a hard last show When they call and take a pose with me To hit the hoops, control J.M. Big Paul and the poof, to join When I take you from the pool, while the wind is through the road Bring the air to street, body, hope to go all-stay Just to suck a bunch to our life, a typical way Show me the fruit, tell me, can't we stand in line?

They call me when they're bad ass, and he's on the line Break the name, shake, live the limits cause they cool the sights Cause they're bad, gym, funny, looking kind of night All is true, get in there, we'll chase him, let's get in lane Dune his name with shower, I'm on your shots in the pain They're just a bunch of movies while they're making the grade Here's a real question for you, how did this kid hang? It's a good look of him

Hello, people of Earth, hello, people of Twin Cities, and hello, people from around the world. Welcome to How Did This Get Made, a virtual live show. I am tall, John Sheer, and we have a movie here for you that really isn't interesting. When I didn't think that we would do another movie about a snowman coming to life, but here we are. Here we are once again reminiscent of Jack Frost. This one's a little bit different for 20 years. A girl creates her perfect, perfect man out of snow for a handful of days and then longs

for him all year long until one year it becomes true but she doesn't know that. Actually no one knows that. I have a lot of questions about this whole fucking snowman story. Anyway, that is the premise, that is the plot of snowmants. You don't need to know more than that, but you do need to know that there's another man in the story. That man is her best friend who is in love with her, and she doesn't know it.

She doesn't know that there's love right in front of her face. And that's the story. Really love, romance, what's better? Is there a difference? This movie seems deposit that there is. All right, well here to discuss this film is Jason Manza. Please welcome Jason Manza. Yes. What a jerk. Here we go. Oh, snowman's Jason. I know that you love a romp. Snowman's is better than no man's, Paul.

I know. Well, that's what I was saying. I brought it back to the beginning. I said I'd rather have a snow bow than no bow. But you know, we are in our second snowman who's come to life film. And there's so much to discuss here. And not only that, the third inanimate object that comes to life Christmas movie, because the nutcracker won from

Wasn't that last year or was that two years ago? That was last year. Yeah, yeah, it comes to life So we are unbeknownst to me We exist in a world in which there is a common fantasy that a inanimate Christmas object will come to life and be your dream man. Is that like, that's like a series. It's a pattern. It's sad to me to think that we have come so far in humanity that we believe in an inanimate

object will give us more joy than a human being that we live. He have a dick. That's what I want to know. I still dick. Does he have a dick? Well, let's get into it. I don't want to go down in your rabbit hole too far, but for the rest of the show, I want you to know that you can call me Quaint Paul because I am just like her dad, Quaint Paul's furniture, St. Paul, Quaint Paul. And you know what, a person has been calling me Quaint Paul for a very long time. Please welcome my other co-host,

June Diane Rafeville. Welcome June. Oh my word. Oh my goodness gracious. Oh, me oh my. I, now listen, Paul Jason, I'm so happy to see you both. Sometimes I come to this podcast, begrudgingly. You know, I've had to watch this whole movie.

So much has upset me. Tonight, for this live show, I couldn't be happier to be here. So happier. I couldn't be more ready to get into this. I love that. I love that. Every second of it. I have notes. This is maybe the most notes I've ever taken. Yes, me too. Same. I took so many notes, Paul. I took so many notes that I was worried about the audio in terms of having to like flip pages. So I have them all laid out in like all these legal pages over the desk because there's there are just there's so much to say.

All right. Well, let's get into it. This movie opens up with an image that I think is very disturbing, which is a young girl makes a snowman and is about to like start making out with it. What's disturbing? She isn't going. You're saying you didn't practice making out with like objects that you would create in the wild outside in the world. A cold ball of snow, like to put her tongue in, because she looked like she was gonna give a tongue kiss to it. She was really going in. Here's what I'm gonna say.

Yeah. Here's what I'm gonna say, controversial statement. I'm coming in hot. That is the most romantic kiss of the movie. Well, I said to Paula one point. They're most chemistry between any couple is between that little girl and that snow. You know what? You know what? You might be right because I said to Paula at one point, I'm like, have have these two

Sarah and like current snow snowman. Snow bow. Have they fucked? Like has anything have they kissed? Nothing. They appear to have done between these two people. One thing, these movies reveal themselves to be so chaste and so desexualized as to live in a world in this. But you had also perverted.

Oh, hugely perverted. Deeply perverted. And deeply like perverted. Seatbly perverted. And deeply, like, here's the thing. I would understand. I would understand it if the people in this movie Sarah, Nick, I guess, Cole, but Sarah and Nick primarily were like in their early 20s. Did these people are in their 30s and they are acting like children? These are adults. I mean, I just, I want to get into like the mythology, the snowman, but I do just for

the audience here, just showing this opening tear for it. Just the tear for it. Oh, look at that. A Moroccan mint, guys. A Moroccan mint. I'll take a sip of, talk about adults. I'll take a sip of an adult drink. Thank you.

I have my Santa mug and I am drinking some with Santa mug. Oh, nice. Some bullet bourbon, there you go. Okay, let's take a look at this first clip of just the kiss, because I wanted to see this, this basically is the premise of the whole movie. It was love at first sight.

Anyone could see that. And it was obvious that this would be nothing short premise of the whole movie. I think you feel the same way about me, don't you? What are you doing? I don't know if she's attracted to a snowman or she's using it as a sexual toy, but this is where the music... I don't think she's using it as a, hold on, I'm gonna put it. I don't think she's using it as a sexual toy. Let me be very clear.

Well, I don't think, I mean, I don't think that is an ex-boy. I don't know that she's not actually. I think this is going to escalate. Well, no, here's my thought. I don't know the carrot. They're all sorts of things that could have been. Okay. Okay. I didn't, I didn't know. I didn't know what was happening. And here, you know, but, but to Paul's point, Jason, and to yours earlier, like the Nutcracker was at least like shaped like a man, like a figure. It was figurative.

Yes. Agreed. It was yes. Yes. No. This blob. This is. Look at this.

Look at she is going in for it. She was going in an ennoyce romantic. Here's what I'll say. What is a sex toy? A sex toy is something that you would. This is something I'm glad you're defining because I've long wondered, so please Paul. I'm just saying that like, she is clearly in the beginning,

she believes that that is not the boy that she wants. She's creating an image of him and then, and connecting with it in an intimate way. That to me would be a sex toy. It's an object that she's treating as human for pleasure. All right, well now I'm back on Jason's side. I wanna get off this. Oh, it's a gander.

Holy cow, that is, I mean, I could, we could spend the rest of the night unpacking what you just did. Yeah. Because Paul, she is, she's playing house and she's, right, exactly. She's not playing acting. She stole a boy's hat.

She stole his hat and she got his, I mean, we don't know that she stole it. Well, where the, how did she come to the pro? She just happens to be in possession of it. Yeah, okay. We're giving this girl way too much leeway. She stole the hat. She's kind of creating some sort of ceremony here. So the snowman smells like this young boy.

Wow, she's like a witch. That she got the boy's hat. She created a, this, so you think this is like a magic movie in which a young witch conjures the perfect boyfriend. There is witchy shit here. Wow, actually that is the movie though. I think you did. That is actually the movie.

So now I'm not with Paul. But the craziest part of this movie, I mean, there's so much insanity. But to just get into the magic of it, you know, because all of these, and I don't know, is this a lifetime movie? Because I feel like a lot of different platforms are now. OK, a lot of different platforms are now, okay, a lot of different platforms are now creating

their own genre of lifetime Christmas movie. And a lot of them have these magical elements like Nutcracker, but what we learn in these flashbacks at 18 years, I wanna respect the title of very, very netty Christmas. 18 years ago, 11 years ago, three years ago now, is that every year these two adults, adults get together.

To decades. I'm going to say they are in their mid 30s. I'm going to say they are early to mid 30. That's how they're crossed. That is how they're cast. I'm going to say they're in their mid 30s. I'm gonna say they are early to mid 30. Would you agree? That's how they're cast. That is how they're cast. I'm gonna say they're in their third, they seem to me to be people in their 30s. And here is her. Yes, they're in their mid 30s. And I'm just trying to wrap my mind around these two people,

friends, not friends, whoever they are to each other. Well, they're getting together. Oh, I know, but I'm saying in any relationship, this is strange. They get together every year to create a snowman. That is the ideal version of the man that she wants to fall in love with. Yeah. That yes. It's a very cuckolded position, I believe, of that boy because he is getting nothing in

return. Yes. Well, but the only thing they're doing though, really, because they are not like master snow builders. What they're doing is creating foundation, well later, but foundationally just a regular snowman and putting different, and I mean, like, not that different actually, items on him. Yeah, with the one exception, which is that at the end of every montage, at the end of

every, there's a montage that kind of time elapses us from whenever they are at 12 or 13, always through to adulthood, so that gives you the sense of time passing. She always takes Nick's hat off his head and puts it on the snowman. So every time it's her best friends, so the first hat is the hat that is Dean Greek last name's hat. I know, Apple. Yeah. Yeah, Dean Poppidopolis.

The real St. Prupper. Dean Poppidopolis. It was very astute, yeah, D. Poppedopolis. He didn't poppedopolis. It was very astute, by the way. D. Poppedopolis comes in with very little information, just that his hat's on a snowman. He's like, hey, is that me? Are you trying to make out with me? And then, and then destroys himself. He's not wrong.

He's not wrong. He's not wrong. But he's, he's a very astute for a young boy. And then destroys the effort. Like, he destroyed he destroyed him destroying himself is very interesting because in the reality of this movie, that is Cole. Yeah. Or is Cole the next one? Cole is the one that they made in the is the last one. No, Cole. Cole says I always loved looking at the house. He was always there. Cole was there.

He's been there from the beginning. And every snowman is cold. Yes. Every snowman is cold. Okay. Guys, it does call us to know all the other snowman in town. Okay. Cole has been worked on this.

This is what's troubling. So I don't know what's going on. I don't know what's going on. They have been working on building coal. Their entire lives since they were six years old. Now the thing that's so strange in the movie though, and I want to still get to the magical piece and the mom scarf that comes into play and when those people eye- I love to discuss whether coal is good or evil. Evil.

Okay, so what I was going to say about it's he and Nick have such an antagonistic relationship but Nick has really made Cole like Nick is Cole's maker Sure, you know Yes, yes, no, no, no, no, no, no, it seems to exist as the as the human embodiment of the wishes exist as the human embodiment of the wishes, Sarah continues to wish what she wants from the perfect man, a sense of adventure. So Cole is an adventure travel guy. Sweep her off her feet because she does that, adventure tourism, rather. Like she has this list of what she wants from the perfect man and Cole represents the personification

of that list. Well, it seems to me that while Cole has been the same for 20 some odd years, by the way, she's 29. In the movie or in the movie. In the movie. So still too old to be honest. So, coal is not the amalgamation of all the ones because we saw punk rocker, we saw go-t wearing one, we saw some very different personalities. They listed, they like, they stood in that one moment of them playing

air guitar for way too long. But he is the personification of the most recent coal, right? So like every year changes based on what she wants. So this year she wants to travel writer. And she is. He says he's always been there. And he's always wanted this for her. What is he referencing? Well, he also says, I've always loved this house, which means he's been there every year. I think there's some, I think the movie, let's be clear, I don't think the movie has a clear mythology, but I think some version of what the mythology is, is the spirit of Sarah's perfect man as personified inside of the snowman has existed throughout all of the snowmen that she and Nick build together.

Somehow in this instance, it comes to life. So Cole has all these kind of memories of, I always loved this house, dot, dot, dot. But like so he seems to be a representation of her, her in immature desires or immature ideas of what the perfect man is. of her in immature desires or immature ideas of what the perfect man is. Well, are we just basically saying, I mean, well, we should get into the lesson in a second. I wanna bring up something that June brought up.

And actually, I saw somebody in the chat bringing this up as well, but I have this written down. You said that Nick is Cole's maker. So would that make Nick Cole's father? Yes, it would also make Sarah his mother. Sarah his mother. No, that doesn't make any sense because they are building a perfect boyfriend.

They're not building a son. Okay, so it becomes, all right. So, well, so you're saying that Sarah gets is not a pain. Nick is participating in building his own competition every year. I don't think Nick is Cole's God because Cole is negging Nick the entire movie, calling him little, calling him little guy, like treating him like he's the, in a traditional romcom, you know, like this would be, Cole would be like, have a, a sweet face to Sarah and then snarky and shitty to the competition to her friend, right?

And he'd be like, That's probably what happens here. No, but it's a little bit like that. Cole is a little bit of a dick to Nick, you know, I have so many issues about little guys. Let's call him a little guy and be like, come on, little guy. You know, there's like, I mean, listen, I thought Cole was amazing. Paul knows I was taken with Cole and June jumped out of the bed when that shirt came off.

She was. I was gluten and hollering. I was like, yes, thank you. Like, it was so great. And I think this actor is wonderful and an untapped talent. I thought he was hilarious. The scene in which I knew you were going to play it, but the scene in which he's just standing as a snowman. And, you know, he-he-he-do-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w-w- dead eyes and she has to like force him to engage with hilarious. So so my point though, Paul is that coal.

Coal is it. Coal actually is a grown man. And I love that that actor chose to be he's playing something that is for chill. You know, he's he's an object that is a child's object. A child's like a child's wish like a child's wish. A child's wish. Like a child's wish. A child's wish. A play thing. Yes.

And he plays it. He made the choice to play it like a grown man. And I thought it was such a great choice. And I felt that he wasn't antagonistic. I know I said he was antagonistic before. I felt like he was treating Nick the way Nick deserved to be treated. Oh wow. No, no, no, no, no. Okay, wait, I need a strong disagree. Yes, because here's the thing. Sorry. What we know about Cole is this. Come here, I think we need to set a base on

here. Cole is a fucking liar. Cole does not work for an extreme travel agency. What is lying. Buddy. Yeah. Why? I disagree. You think he works for it? He. You think he has parents?

No, none of that is real. Here's my question. Okay. How does Cole have a phone? Colesie has a cerebral point. He's not even wearing. How does Cole have a phone? To me, like, let's go back to the Nuggets call.

He's a very nutty Chris. Yes, where does Cole go? I believe, where do you believe, I believe Cole goes outside and turns into a snowman at night. I don't know, but there were no, like, no, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not really happy, but what I'm saying is, like when the very, the rules, they're very bad about the rules in this movie. There's no rules.

They were good about the rules in the Nutcracker movie, right? Well, he comes to life. Very nutty Christmas. When he comes to life, he has a purpose, a drive, he's gonna help her. It's like this movie lacked the high jinks that that movie had because coal, as a snowman, come to life should be not good at interacting with the world. And in fact, he's just doing all of the boyfriend stuff that a 12 year old imbued him with. And as a result, I agree with June.

His performance is childlike because his entire persona is that of, he's been populated by the wishes of a young girl. Hard, hard disagree. Hard disagree. Hard disagree. Hard disagree. Hard disagree. I needed him to get into more interactions with more people because he actually seems like a real man and I don't think he is.

He's a snowman. Well, this is my question. Okay, well, this is the issue. What is he? Is he a demon? Is he like, because what he is is a snowman. I also wrote is Cola demon in my nose. Yeah. I wrote that in my nose. What is he? Like what is he like because what he is is a snowman. I also wrote is Kola demon in my nose. Yeah, I wrote that in my nose.

What is he? Is Kola demon? Like we don't know any rules. There's no logic. He's got money. Like he just like I get I'm all for a magical movie. I'm all for a magical movie. But there's like there's no elf here like in the sense of like the buddy the elf comes

to New York and he's like oh my gosh what the world's great. Like he's not impressed by the world. He knows the world He's telling her that he like works for a travel agency. These are all lies that will eventually be revealed He is a bad guy Well when I don't but you're I think the I agree with the first part of your story because Are you theory because Nick is constantly peppering him with questions and Cole has no answers, right? But I don't think he's bad. I don't think his, I don't think he has malice or malicious intent. I don't think he is a evil character. I think he is just, he is too dimensional because that is

what she thinks she wants is something that doesn't have depth, that doesn't have reality. The her, it coal is a representation. Oh my God, we're getting into drop dead Fred. Holy. Oh no. Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Cole is not evil at all, but I believe he is the, some, the collection of, when she says that list and they do, they repeat it a number of times. He is the physical representation of that list.

But yet, okay, what's his endgame? Because he says, oh, my hands are cold. So is he a snowman? Does he have any like, like, does he? Well, that's my, because he was a snowman. He says his purpose. Now why in this movie? Now why in this movie, all snowmen need to, well, or at least he needs to leave by Christmas. I don't know. Yes. I don't know why Christmas is our the state. He says he needs by Christmas.

He was taking her with, like, so his whole game plan was that she was going to leave him? No. Yes, his whole game plan is, it's very carefully worded. He says, I'm here to make you find love, right? But what she thinks is with him and what he means is with Nick. He is a catalyst to show her that she's really in love with Nick. So what is he doing with Hank the snowman? Because Hank the snowman, well, she's at work. So he's going to go play in the pool.

And he does have downtime, Paul. He's got, he's not listening. Okay. He's got to kill some hours. Now Cody, I just saw. He's not friends, to visit. Yeah, he's, yeah, he's got to kill some hours. Now Cody, I just saw put in the chat that there's a team Nick team Cole thing going on in the, in the shows chat. And I have to push back.

It is not possible to be team Nick. There is no team Nick. Nick is the wrong choice. Pfft. Pfft. Pfft. Pfft. Pfft. Pfft. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha Paris, go to Paris for seven days or 10 days or whatever it is, fuck the snowman and then come back. He got an iced dick, June, he's got an iced dick.

That's the tension. What did you want? That was the tension. I fucked the snowman. If his hands are cold, if his fingers are cold, imagine what his dick would be like. He's constantly, I mean, I'm just, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to

be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not trying to be, I'm not's very clear, in the mythology of the movie, there is no going to Paris with Cole. Okay. He knows that's not going to happen. It's all because she needs to realize she should be with Nick.

And I, but to June's point, to June's point, here's what's interesting, the movie, the movie rip, they have terrible chemistry. I really missed Melissa Joan Hart. I really missed some of the people that have been in some of these other movies. Because they had sold us on the chemistry between Sarah and Nick. This movie would have worked so much better. But we have, it's almost as if they meet once a year to make that snowman. Their relationship seems so distant from each other, but they're

best friends who live in the same town and see each other, I believe, all the time. They're best friends. She is a very sour character. I found her to be sour groups. They also seem to live in like stars hollow. They seem to live in the tiniest of tiny towns, but they live in the twin cities, which is a thriving metropolis. I also need to talk about this.

This paper she works at, but I wanna get, I don't wanna go too far away from Cole. I do wanna say two, that Sarah reprimands Nick, for having his feet up on his own couch. Why is Nick's door a bank vault door? I was very confused by that. Okay, so the way they set up Nick,

I mean, this is the thing about these movies. Whenever in one of the lifetime movies, you see a man who has a messenger bag on, you know immediately, we as the audience are supposed to think like, he's like a real renegade kind of guy. Like he's the artist, he's like not in a suit. And I knew we were supposed to think that about him, Like he's the artist, he's like not in a suit. And I knew we were supposed to think that about him that he wasn't sort of the obvious choice,

but it's like I am so turned off by this gentleman. Oh, come on. And for you, wait, do you think, can I ask you, June, do you think men in messenger bags, do you think, can I ask you, June, do you think men in messenger bags? Do you have a take on this? Like, is that like a, oh, you just, that look. Wow. That look. So, I mean, Jason, I'm learning so much about my wife. What if I was wearing a messenger bag and drinking tea? Yeah. What would you think?

Listen, I do think that there was a time in New York City when I was going in with you where every guy was starting out with messenger bags. And it was such a look. And then there's the corporate messenger bag, which is the guy who's like, I'm not gonna carry a suitcase, I'm gonna carry a messenger bag. And I don't like what it says, you know, I'm like, my mom once got me leather, like I got a fully leather saddle bag. And she's like, this is you. And I was like, it's not

me. It was so like, it was like that, that middle ground, which I've seen so much like, I'm wearing a suit. And my briefcase is like a $600, like, like, messenger bag because I'm still cool. And it's like, I got it. I still got it. And also for him, it's like, why do you need that messenger bag? Because all of your work seems to be in one iPad. And I know we're gonna get into the iPads in this movie

and I know Paul is a lot to say about. I mean, this movie, the no one has a fucking iPhone, everyone has an iPad. You're cartoonist, but you don't have tools in there. Like you don't have brushes and pallets and canvases. Like you just have, you have this finger and this screen. We may have an Apple pen.

He may have an Apple pen. Yeah, he might, that is, he can't, he might have some sort of stylus, but like. I do, I do believe he can do that, but I want to talk about this guy, this cartoonist who is not working getting rejection letters that can fill the room Let's just take a look at this vault door and this apartment because for a person that is Completely unemployed. All right. There's the vault door He's working it out. I mean so I mean what is like the and even the sound like they fully into it sounds as though

Like it's it's it, it's, you know, like from a bank. I know he's not working in an old bank. I mean, this is not like a, not a reddit. It's like, it's kind of founded me. This is what's so weird about him because like he's supposed to be this interesting, the way they set him up as a six year old, he's got that fun haircut. He's supposed to be like an artist, you know, but they put him in that sweater.

Well, he's got it. It's interesting. They've set him up as, I think in order to set him against Cole, they've set him up as like kind of a failure insecure, someone who's never succeeded. You know, she's basically like, everything's not so, what does she say? Everything's not so great in the cartooning world or something, I can't find the quote. I wrote it down at one point.

I wrote it down. But I was like, wouldn't you know that? You're his best friend. mustn't this be what you guys talk about all the time? But Jason, she's a terrible friend. She never asks him one question. She never just says, hey, are you interested in endating anyone?

Oh yeah. You had any interesting experiences with women. Are you with, are you with a red dimensional person or are you just a reflection of my needs from me? They meet or they don't meet, but they get together and they, the idea of this tradition, the snowman tradition, is born because he was dumped and she was embarrassed, right?

Like, because she, like, the, you know, Dean Poppidopolis knocks over the, the, the snowman and then all of a sudden he comes over and he's like, oh, Jen doesn't like me there. And then they build their perfect snowman for her, but she doesn't go like, let's now build a snowwoman. Like, no. She, like, she just takes it and then we find out that he actually dated. And what was that like? Well, we're part of the mythology of this movie though. like she just takes it and then we find out that he actually dated. And what was that like the next day?

Well, a part of the mythology of this movie though, that's so strange. Aside from the snowman, although connected, your right, Paul, to that first snowman is that her breakups are like iconically embarrassing. And it's just weird, like the one that we speak about. Everyone knows about it. Everyone knows this. There's like a part of the town's lore. But the weirdest thing is. She's broken up with Brian and her dad knows

and Nick knows the break. And then she reveals they've only been dating for two weeks. And not only that, but when. Who would tell somebody about someone they've only been dating for two weeks? You're an adult. You're an adult. You're an adult woman.

You're an adult woman. And how many dates have you done in two weeks to even make it like a breakup? That seems like. It's not a breakup. It's not a breakup. It's something that happened. Now, and the weirdest thing about how embarrassed she is is when you see his animation, his cartoon of what happened on the last date, now when we're in present day times, it's that they broke up and then the waiter spilled soup.

Well, to add insult to injury or injury to insult or whatever, she broke up with him and then the waiter poured soup in his lap and they're laughing at this. They're awful people. She's an awful person. Yeah, I didn't quite, I didn't clock that either. She just seems to have no interest in Nick's emotional life. I think because, were she to be curious, she would have to understand and acknowledge the obvious fact, which is that he is visibly in love with her in every scene that they're in together.

Because otherwise she just must think, oh, this is my friend Nick, he's asexual, which is great and fun. Yeah, like he doesn't have. Why not have Nick have, we never populate Nick's life so that he's had X's that we need in town or something like that. We don't understand him to be a three-dimensional person.

He only, if you told me that this movie that we need in town or something like that. We don't understand him to be a three-dimensional person. He only, if you told me that this movie in the last moments pulled out and like, it was like WandaVision, like she was the only real person and she was populating everybody and the thing with her mind. Like I would believe that because nobody exists but for their reflection in her eyes. Well, to me, I would have been very happy to see Nick and the Elk Jerky girl get it on. Oh, I loved her. I loved the Elk girl and the boss and the boss.

And the boss. Give me that all the references. Now also, I would have loved to have seen like two months from the end of the movie because I think what's going to happen to Nick who seems like a genuinely nice person. Wait a second. You know you changing your tune on Nick? No, I do think Nick's a genuinely nice person. Okay.

Yeah. I really do. I also think there's like no competition though. And there's no reason for the way he's behaving throughout the movie, why she should be interested in him, because he's pathetic. But I do think he is a nice person. And I, but what's going to happen to Nick two months from the end of the movie, which I'd love to see, is that he's going to realize that this woman is incredibly selfish.

And he's not going gonna be interested in her. He's not gonna be interested in her. Here's the headline. And this is what makes the movie tough. Nick and Sarah will succeed because they're both duds. They're both duds. They're both duds. They deserve each other.

I was not into, I wasn't rooting for them. Yes. And not that I was rooting against them. They deserve each other. I was not into, I wasn't rooting for them. Yes. And not that I was rooting against them. They deserve love. They don't deserve love. And Paul, they don't deserve love. They don't deserve love. They deserve the love of each other, which is a, which is a, and Ikea showroom version

of love. Just like Nick's house, it's empty, but it looks pretty. That's it. Here are the people in the movie who deserve love. Dean Papa Dapados. No, no. That dickhead? That dickhead real estate.

No, no. The herbos, her friend, the Elk Lady. Elk Lady is a straight up murderer. Like Elk Lady is killing too much of. I love Elk Lady. I want that movie. See, that's the thing is. I love it. A lot of the other holiday movies we've done were better populated with more characters

like Elk Jerky Lady and the boss and all those people. And this movie was, I think the cast list of this movie is a grand total of six speaking parts. I mean, it's dead daughter. I remember like the nutty Christmas, they went to a big party. It's sick. It's sick. It is sick. No, there are six people here.

That's it. Yes, that's it. It's her. By the way, is the elk lady, I have a question about this, is elk lady a journalist? Like why is elk lady coming? She works at the magazine, I don't know what her job is. Okay, so the assignment that they get, by the way, I have issues about this. I have so many things I want to unpack.

Again, it's a Twin Cities magazine, which is Minneapolis St. Paul, which is digital magazine. Digital magazine. What? It was called a digital magazine. Oh, oh, oh, okay. But that means a magazine magazine. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no mean Paul said at one point, he's like, well, they're all doing Canadian accents. I go, Paul, those are midwestern accents. Well, I think that does midwestern accents. We're like, we watch a lot of Fargo

and we're gonna do the best job that we can. Because like, it was like Maravise town. It's like all of a sudden, one character is like going like, I'm Maravise town. You betcha. Check out this Pennsylvania. Yeah, yeah, this is my Pennsylvania accent or Pittsburgh accent, whatever that is. And then everyone else is like, I don't have that. Like, why make it, why make them, what I couldn't figure out is why make them twins, why

make it Minneapolis, St. Paul, if it's obviously a tiny small town in the Midwest or it is just Canada. Because her desire to travel, her desire to see the world, these are two thriving cities that have arts and, you know, like massive populations and, you know, like it didn't make sense to me that they're out of here. Sarah is pitching a travel segment for the, like she's pitching a brand new segment of the magazine and they're like, no, no, no, no, no. This is Twin Cities magazine.

We don't, like, we only cover Twin Cities going on. Like we are not catering to the traveler. But here's what we could cover, Prince from that air. You know what I mean? Like it's not like, this seems to be shot. Like, he shows up in a carriage. They drive through like what looks to me like the wilderness in the carriage. Also, how long is that lunch break? They seem to go on lunch breaks for like six hours. And they go like a fancy restaurant. They're going to a relevant.

They're going to like a four star like evening place for a, okay, to just talk about this, because him seeing the deer, which is clearly stock footage is amazing. But when they go to, when they go to dinner or lunch or whatever they go to lunch, there are carrots on his plate and he's like, oh, like he gets freaked out that there's a carrot there. And I'm like, oh, he probably won't need those carrots. Then he kind of picks up the carrot and like smells it like. Yeah. So is he going to eat them?

Like, I don't understand what the snowman is. I think he's thinking, like, is this, am I about to eat a nose? Is this a nose? Are they, are they serving me nose? Interestingly, I don't believe we ever see coal eat or drink. And he's afraid of fire and is comfortable in the frankenste. Brigitte of temperatures with the coal. So he is literally a flesh hands.

He's a hunky snowman. He is just a snowman. Well, she did, she chiseled abs on him. I mean, this is the issue. So here's my question to you because my issue is that we think this is a movie about Sarah finding true love, but it seems to me that to June's point, this is a movie about Nick getting true love. Like Nick is his creator and it looks like, yes, it's, it is presenting

as if it's Sarah's wish, but it truly is Nick's wish. Well, sure. But it truly is about, it's truly about, I don't know, I don't know. You're saying it's Nick's wish to be that snow person. Well, no, no, because what it is is like, this snowman motivates Nick. Nick says, I've loved you since the day that we met. She's like, well, if you thought that, why did you say it now?

We just such a dick response. But it motivates Nick to be not passive anymore. Like Nick makes more character choices in this movie than Sarah does. Here's what I'll say. I can come at it from a different point of view, which is that Cole is the catalyst for both of these people to realize that they are in love.

But what is she realized? They're telling her, don't fall in love, they're saying like everyone basically says, sure you love this guy or sure he's romantic, sure it's fun, but that's not love. Love is not fun. You know, I kept on thinking like, well, what is love then? Why are they making such a distinction between love and romance?

Or true love and romance? Well, I feel like what they were saying was, I felt like what they were saying was, you as an adult are, are, are coveting or thinking what love is, is the things that a 12 year old thinks love is. No, it's a 29 year old love. Real love is about, the father says it. Yes, of course, when I saw your mother with the red scarf, I, she stuck out, but then we really had to be in love.

And what that means is what we all know is doing the work of being in love. It's not about like a lightning bolt hitting you and somebody sweeping you off your feet and taking you on adventures and all of these. It is in the beginning. You have to like, they're basically like, That's a problem.

That is a problem. What everybody is telling her is like, don't look for that special feeling. Don't find that for. And it's like, I don't know. Yes. And which isn't to say, which isn't to say that that can't transform and grow and that long

relationship. But you should have that star death to that face. When you should have that star death to that face. What they're saying is you're only looking for that special feeling because when it starts to fade, she bales on relationships. Her character's backstory is what she has myriad boyfriends who once that stage, we just called limmerence once limmerence. Well, wait, hold on, James.

Well, wait, hold on, James. She's so good. She's so good. She's so good. So talk to me about limmerence. I've never heard this term. Limmerence is the honeymoon phase. Limmerence is that the initial part of a relationship where you are just getting that hit of,

oh my god, this person is so exciting. Oh my God. Everything we're describing, right? And but the problem is, when, when Limerence ends, the actual relationship, an adult relationship has to happen. Sarah thinks love is Limerence all the time.

And so when it stops, she breaks up with every boyfriend. And that is her problem. I guess I would agree with that. If it seemed like she was even getting past the stage of Limerence with with these other things, it seems to me like she's, but that's what the movie is telling us like with Brian, the boyfriend at the beginning. You know, again, two weeks, it's like, I would hope lemon's for it. That's not lemon. That's not lemon.

It would last for a month. Six months a year. I mean, she and I have been together for almost like 20 years. I mean, I've barely, has it ended yet? I think, no, I'm still in total lemons. I think the movie is telling us for her, with a minute she sees something real that isn't these adventurous, this, this, this, this, this, she bails.

And what her dad and what other people are trying to say is actually love it, love starts like that, but it actually has much more depth and much more. Right. She's not doing attention. That's wonderful. That's so wonderful. And love that, love that for her. And cold for everyone.

But cold represents only limmerance. And Nick everyone. And coal represents only limmerance. And Nick, I think poorly represents zero limmerance. Yeah, zero limmerance, but the promise of the... But you can just throw her onto him, to force her to consider him, to have so many people telling her that she should consider Nick like without any, when she doesn't feel that and for her to, it felt like she was getting brainwashed to just look for someone who has been there a long time.

It's like Sarah is the word that you need to settle. You need to settle. You need to settle. And by the way, I'm a big believer, like I read this book that was really transformative for me, but there was this idea that like sometimes settling is viewed as a bad thing, but settling is really just making a choice. And instead of not making a choice, right? Like you've like, we have this idea of like, like, FOMO, but FOMO is, well, I made this choice and I didn't do that thing. So I, like, enjoy your settling.

But to me, it felt like, Sarah, stop looking for the big thing. Just, you got somebody here who's going to be here, like, it didn't feel like we saw enough of them really fighting. I never really thought about falling in love. And that, that was troubling to me. Well, I think what they were saying was, I think what the movie is trying to say is, love doesn't just look like what you thought it looked like

at 12. Love is adult, long-lasting love is a different thing, and you have shut yourself off to that, because you're so consumed with checking these boxes of a list that you made when you were 12 years old. You know? People are saying this thing. You keep on saying the same about 12 years old

because I will say, all right, so I guess, let's just, I wanna understand where. I only say it because they keep repeating her list and it's the same list. Okay, okay, so I say what you're saying. so she's always like, I want someone to sweep me off my feet. All right, so there's like one adventure. Okay, yeah.

Okay, so I guess what I was saying was, I thought you made the list of 29. All of those things. Okay, all right, I get you. So she's never changed what you wanted. She was not wrong. She was not wrong, the role guy. Sarah is emotionally 12 years old and her understanding about what adult love looks like boom. I am single What I wish I had seen from her Nick is the only act of kindness was that she like got him a job at the online magazine

That's it So that's but that's a great great thing. It was a very nice thing, but I would have loved to have seen them having a laugh together, taking the sound of each other. They should have been palpable. Yeah, and it's like, but that's what I mean. They're both the two not like each other actually. They,. Oh, I'll go one further. They seem to not know each other. They're constantly telling us their best friends and they seem to not know each other. So much so that I was like, oh, she lives for a long part of the movie. I was like, oh, she lives somewhere else and only comes home at Christmas.

So this seems like, it seems like, or he did. And this is just like a Christmas friendship. For half of the movie, I thought he was visiting because she says I've never left town. I thought he was visiting and then I was like, oh, wait a minute, no, they are best friends who see each other all the time. They're fucked. They're not, there's no chemistry to these people. Well, but I mean, they could have a fun, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they,

they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, they, no, you're just psyched. Here's my question. Besides the fact, why are they starting the big Christmas story on December 13th? That seems like way too short of a lead time for the giant issue.

She also says, I need to fall in love by Christmas. What? That's like, you think, again, you're 30 years old and you think it's possible to meet and fall in love within 12 days? Nope, that's crazy. That's crazy. That's crazy. And I also think these movies's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, to have somebody to kiss on Christmas Eve, that normal thought, like not new year's eve.

I just want to have somebody to kiss on Christmas Eve. It has never occurred to me. If anything, it's like, I want to be like, I want to be in a food coma on a couch. Like Christmas to me is not like a sexy time. Like Christmas is a time to be in your comfy cozy. I agree, I agree with that, but I think you're equating love with sexy time and I will say the idea

of spending the holidays alone is sad. Of course. And I don't, I'm not just saying that, but she's got her dad there. But that's exactly what I was just going to say. She has family. She has not only family, but a best friend and many other friends and a support system. She's not, the movie would make sense if it was like she's alone someplace. Nick is her best friend. He comes to visit.

They do their tradition and like, you know, the snowman comes to life. By the way, how the fuck do you make this movie and never reveal to Sarah or Nick that Cole was the snowman? Well, I mean, that's my issue. The snowman doesn't seem toick that Cole was the snowman. Well, I mean, that's my issue. The snowman doesn't seem to know that he's a snowman. They don't get to that reveal. There's no stakes to the snowman.

That's the whole fun of the movie. Well, here's my question. Here's the snowman. I said, I said, this is June and June disagreed with me, but I'm gonna say to you here, I believe that Sarah's mom was a snowwoman. Okay, so you're saying or something. Okay, what?

You think Sarah's dad's not person? Well, okay, because here's the thing. I don't know. Okay, well, let's get into that. Go off. Go off. Go off. What's the magical scarf then?

Like what's, okay, so this is like, this is where I'm kind of confused. Yes. The might be big because now this idea, right, so this is like, this is where I'm kind of confused. Yes. The mind is big because now this idea, right? The scarf is the thing that the snowman comes to life because of the scarf. And again, the father's like, I heard the scarf. So what, so that was a scarf that her mother was wearing. Is that a thing that brings it, was her mother a light post, a her a lamp post in France and then that like,, what does this magical scar bring? Does it, does it scar bring the things you like?

I think that that's the movie trying to draw a cute and sweet connection between the love that the parents had, which is what Sarah repeatedly in the movie says, I'm looking for the kind of love that you and mom had. And, and wait, okay, why does the dad wait until she's 30 something? Yes. Give her the scarf. Because I'm telling you, I'll tell you why. Give her the scarf, give her the scarf. Because that dad, she is too attached to that home and that dad.

And that dad had been holding that scarf back because that dad wanted her working on that furniture. And that dad wanted a lot of times what happens with dads is when mom dies, they make the daughter a little wavy. And I think that's what was going on. I don't disagree with you, but I also want to talk about something here too.

Quaint Paul furniture in that big, beautiful house that they have. He freaked out his again. I think you should, your company name should be Quaint Paul furniture in that big beautiful house that they have. Like he freaked out. I think you should, your company name should be quaint Paul podcast. Oh, I mean, I'm gonna get into quaint Paul ready to go. But quaint Paul says like, ah, honey, you shouldn't bought me this stain. It's too expensive. She was like, nah, wasn't daddy.

For Father's Day. For Father's Day, she got him furniture stain. And, and by the way, it's from Italy. And you're telling me you live in St. Paul Minneapolis? No. But by the way, by the way, like he seems to have a, and crit for that house, unless the mother died in some sort of freak accident where they won a ton of money, like, like, like she was, you know, killed by a toaster fire and

black and decker like paid them out like $12 million. Like Quink Paul furniture is doing good because she's not making that much money on that digital fucking theme. But he says, well, she's working for the magazine and she's also listing his refurbished furniture and making money. And occasionally working on it herself. Right. Yeah. But she's not paying rent there.

She's making it, she's a very successful business, as all I'm saying. It's like that quink Paul furniture is paying the mortgage of that house. I'm just saying it's not a small house. I think they own that house outright. I think it's true at this point. From what? From the first world town and them living there forever.

I guess from quink Paul furniture. And I think Paul that you and I, because I actually really loved the kitchen in this, in this movie and their kitchen in that house. I loved it, loved it, loved it. But I do think the house was not set up. I think you saw it as this mansion. I don't think that's the way it was supposed to come across. I think it was, they were supposed to come across as modest, you know, in this sort

of old fashioned. It's giant. But the house only makes sense as a big house in a small town. It doesn't make sense as a big house in a big city. It looks like it does. Yeah, it looks like it. I agree. Yeah.

And here's my question. I have a couple questions. Okay. There's places I want to go. We didn't really break down the scarf thing, but I will say that. But I do think the scarf was the magical element that caused Cole to come to life. And then Nick wears the scarf at the end. When they're their final meet cute.

And it's when she finally sees Nick, sees Nick, because he's wearing the red scarf, she sees him as the one that she's supposed to be with or whatever, the way that her dad just cried, seeing the mom. I think that's the connection, the movie. Again, the movie is clumsy. I'm not saying they're doing a good job of this. You know what I mean? I didn't love this the way I loved.

What world do we live in? Where I'm saying I didn't love snowman's as much as a very nutty Chris you are looking for you're saying I need a little bit more of a most of Joan Hart and I'm gonna tell you this movie didn't a little bit more comedy chops and I do the snowman was good but I thought the characters I thought the snowman was good but also a careless guy give me I needed a resolute organ isles in this guy I need a character is welcome we need characters are you not going to this debate and we just barely started it off Resolute organ isles in this guy. I need a character. Yes, I need a character. Welcome.

We need character. We need that. We need character. Alright, so Gina got this debate and we just barely started it off the screen and I want to bring it up here. When Nick says, I'm happy for you. June says that's a lie and I go, that's true. He is happy for her because they are friends, but he's not happy for himself.

And I believe that that could be, two things can be true. No, what he says, Paul, and this is where I took a shoe with it. He says to her, when he finds out that she's living for Paris with Cole, he says, I'm happy for you, but I'm just not happy for me.

And my point was like, well, then you're not happy for her. And that's actually just fine, but you're lying. And Paul, I mean, I do feel like I uncovered something about you, because Paul kept on saying, no, no, no, no, no, he is happy for her, but it just hurts him. And my point of view is like, well, that's not possible. That's a lie. And that's an okay lie to have to tell yourself or to have to tell someone else. But it's actually

not true. Do you think you can be happy? What do you mean? Can you be happy for someone, but also be upset? Like it's sort of like, hey, I'm so happy. Oh, yes. Yes. I think you can be. I think you can be. I think you can be happy for someone because you love them and you want them to be happy, even if that means their happiness makes you unhappy. Yes. If you're unrequited love, if you are, if I'm unrequited love with someone and they love someone else, I want to see you happy.

I've never been unrequited, so I guess I don't know. Wow. You've never had unrequited love so I guess I don't know. Wow. Well, never had unrequited love. I guess I have, but not to the degree. You've always gotten everybody you set your on. No, no, no, that's not true, but I've never had the experience of thinking to myself, I love you so much that I'm happy

that you are with someone else that you love. I don't believe that that's ever a feeling I have ever had. Honestly, and I don't think that's possible. So you would rather than be unhappy, but they care's my question. I'm not saying I'd rather than be unhappy. That's not the equivalent. I'm just saying I could not honestly say I'm happy for you if I was not, if it was causing me that much pain. Wow, okay. I think it was my best friend.

I think if it was my best friend. Cody Molle, what do you think? I wanna hear Cody. I like it. I think it was my best friend. If it was somebody that I was super close with, even if I had real feelings for them, that I knew it.

And I knew it. If I felt like they weren't in love with me, but they found love. I would be happy for them and I would be heartbroken for myself. Super producer Cody says. Super producer Cody says, I'm with June. I'm with June. Producer Molly says, I am not with June.

So we are, I guess it comes down to how we are as human beings. What I think is it's a lovely and not actually necessary mechanism of self preservation. And I think that I understand it. And I think it's lovely and important to... When I said, when I said I was happy for the actor who got the role in the M Night movie old, I meant it. Now I wasn't happy for the actor who got the role in the M Night movie, old. I meant that now I wasn't happy for myself, but I was happy for him because there's a great opportunity.

Now I also can say, if I was there, would have made a couple of different choices. But I think if you can't be happy for someone you love, to find love that is not with you, then I think you are selfish. I think you are being selfish because you're someone you love to find love that is not with you, then I think you are selfish. I think you are being selfish because you're saying, you're saying, only me.

Right, only if you're not allowed to have happiness on your own terms, only with me. No, but see, that's not what I'm saying. I don't think it's that black and white. I'm saying that I would never stop someone that I was in love with from finding or standing any sort of way. I would say, go, go, do what you need to do.

You would be, you would be. You would stand here and say, I'm happy. That is a lie. And that's. I'm happy for you. Yeah, I'm happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you.

I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you.

I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I'm not happy for you. I don't know. I understand the feelings behind it, but I would hope that I could be selfless enough to wish for and be happy for a, like the person

I love to find love. You have a question. I think what you're honestly saying is you're at peace. That's fine. I'm at peace. Oh, actually don't think I would be at peace. No, I'm not at peace. I'm happy.

I would be, I would be a mess. I would be a fine, not a bad, bad, the line. And how would you say you're happy for them if you are because I am. Because I am. I'm happy a mess. I would be a fuck. I'm not a sad person. And how would you say you're happy for them if you were a mess? Because I am. Because I am. I'm happy for them. I'm sad for me. I'm happy for them. I'm sad for me.

I'm happy for them. I'm sad for me. That's the shirt. Write it down. But here's the thing. I believe that you can be an inner turmoil. You can be an inner turmoil. But also know like it was the best thing for them. Like I'm Nick, I'm a fucking god. Again peace.

Peace. That's not happy. I'm not a peace. Peace. I'm not a peace of it. Resolve. Yes, conclusion. That's not happy as active.

And it's false. And I think that sometimes we need those false narratives because they make us feel better, they make us feel like we're not selfish. They protect us, but I don't think that that's true. And I think- But you're saying as if there is a truth. And I don't think there is like- I don't think there is one thing at one time.

That's what Molly said. Of course you can. And I think that's absolutely right. That you can feel like, oh, obviously, even though I'm devastated, I don't want them to be with me. If they don't want to be with me, of course not. That again, peace, resolve, go with God. Happy?

No. Okay, let's have a this. We know that Nick is an honest guy because all three of us are writers. We've all made money writing. And when Nick reads her article, yeah, when Nick reads her article, making money. And I love it. But here's the thing, wealth that I've generated, you know, just. I got those.

I got those word bucks, baby. Jason, if I came up to you and you said, Hey, Paul, can you read this script? And I said, yeah. And I read it and you said, Hey, Paul, can you read this script? And I said, Yeah. And I read it and you said, what did you think? And I'd say, it's accurate. How would you feel? It's very accurate.

Is that a good? Yeah. I think that's him saying something that is like he's, he, it's a flat response. It's a flat response because he's, he's still struggling with every scene Nick wants to tell her, I love you. And he's basically saying, yes, you wants to tell her, I love you. And he's basically saying, yes, you've written what happened, you know, those are, you've described to the events that have happened, you know, right. So, but like you've translated this experience.

And that, like that's me seem like the most, the most, the most cutting line in the whole movie. It's very accurate. It's very, it's sort of like someone going up to you after you've done a play or something and saying like, wow, you learned, you knew all of your lines. Right. That would be incredible.

What an incredible, if I had to go to my car and- You said all of your lines. No, that's something that people say. Like, oh, wow, how did you learn? It was amazing to me that you learned all of your lines. You said all of your lines. No, that's something that people say. Like, oh, wow, how did you learn? It was amazing to me that you learned all of those lines. It's like as an actor, that's the least of my concerns. I think it's more damning than that. I think it's like, you said all of your lines.

It has nothing to do with that. Yeah, I think it's there. I think you did, but when you say to say, if you, if someone said to me, wow, you really memorized all your lines, that's the bare minimum. Bare minimum. Then, then I have failed. Yeah, it's like the people in this movie memorized all their lines.

Sorry. I mean, you have different conversation. I think we would be having a fundamentally different conversation if the casting had allowed for Sarah and Nick to have chemistry. If Sarah and Nick had chemistry, if we were rooting for Sarah and Nick, if we believed in Sarah and Nick, we wouldn't be having this conversation. The problem is, and I think June, specifically what you're reacting to is that they don't seem like soulmates, so it feels like they're settling.

There are feels like they're being, she's being told, and in fact, she is being told in, at one point in the movie, to settle. And the reality is, their friendship should be represented as something that gives her all of the actual things that she needs in life. While, you know, like in terms of emotional, emotional needs, not external fireworks, but her, and if they had rapport and chemistry and banter, but that she was still like, but I, I'm, you're in the friend zone, I'm still looking for that guy that makes me feel like I got hit by lightning or whatever she wants. She wants a love story, and if they had set up a relationship for her that would look

like love, even if it was friendship love, that she just needed to be shown, this is actually maybe potentially real love. I want to do something with you guys. We would be more on board. I have the whole article here in front of me right now. Pick a paragraph and I will read you a section of the article. I have one, just pick up, for one to ten, I'll read you one of the one of the a pair four. Okay, great. Many stories are told while sipping on a Christmas mug around the fire. And it's here that we

bond close with friends and family, which make the holiday is one of the best times of the year. For years, we've been saying that Christmas has become commercial with too much emphasis on shopping and buying. And it's been a tough year for my family. Whenever my mom looked over at the tree and the scattered presence, she would sign, say, there won't be as much for Christmas this year trying out to be disappointed. Like, this is a dark article.

There's my, my, my, my, can't. This is the article. This is the article, mom, I can't. I was stopped by my mother's eager, joyful look. I look at, couldn't understand. In my world, we're receiving outweighed, giving, by light years, my mom's active selflessness was incomprehensible.

It was a huge act. Cheers filled my eyes and I thought in disbelief about how much my mom must love me to give up her Christmas so I could have a few more presents. This is the article that they wrote. It seems like it's not covering ice skating or a smores. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no a big, but Sarah. Yeah, he's, well, he's definitely like, well, again, like he has no, he has no point of view on himself. So he really just draws her. So he, he's not, so for Nick, Nick, until the end of the movie, Nick isn't a character in his own cartoon.

Well, he is when he's getting eaten by the no man. That's true. I guess. And at the end, he makes the cartoon. Well, he is when he's getting eaten by the snowman. That's true, I guess. And at the end, he makes the cartoon for her, the cartoon series of cartoons, that's about them where he puts himself in place of coal. And it's like the end of the painter and the thief, the documentary, which is an incredible moment where she's painted herself into the painting.

And I cried for like six hours. I need to get a couple of questions from the audience here. I want to ask you one question before we do that, which is simply this. Do you think if Hank the Silman is real because we see Cole talking to Hank in the forest, is the shark also real? No. Oh God. No.

What's the logic? So is the no interact with the shark? Cause Cole has a lot of feedback for that shark. Yeah, or the angel. I think this is, I mean, a very good person. He doesn't talk. He talks, he talks to a bunch of snowmen. Yes. Right. Well, I just remember one. Talk to the, maybe it was a joke, maybe I'll be so forget, maybe it was just the one. But he seems to not recognize the angel or the shark as like sentient the way he thinks. He thinks. His other, I this is again, he's the movie. He's pushing Hank's head together. He's he's bleeding out. He's bleeding out. He's like, he's a war trauma. I don't know. I don't know. Well, baby. Yeah. That's true. It's a great question. And you know,

we have to bring them fish. Why does he bring them fish slop? Why was that? Why was that? I don't know there. I didn't know what was going on. No. Okay. First of all, he's created all these lies, right? That he's from there's parents are from Norway, grew up in Norway. And that's a real Ludwig or a Ludwig. Oh, that must have been. right? That he's from, there's parents are from Norway, he grew up in Norway, and that's a real Ludwig or Ludwig. Oh, that must have been it. Yeah, so he's like, but it's like, I mean, that's why I think he's a liar, because clearly he never had that unless he has been alive,

or unless he has been in Moscow Square, and the way it kind of keeps him thinking about it is like, is he snow or is he water? Because if he's water, then did he evaporate as a snowman and then go back up and then come back down in the Moscow Square? Like, what is going on? Geez.

You know, I don't know. And at the end of the movie when he gets in that Uber, like to see melts. Well, that's the thing we never see. I wanted closure for Cole. I wanted us to see. Here's what I want. Justice for Cole. The movie should have ended justice for Cole.

The movie should have ended justice for Cole. The movie. I want Cole in Fast and Furious 10. Boom. Get him in there. I think the movie should have ended with them, right? Kissing with chemistry, then kissing, then looking out the front window and the snowman is back. Cole is back. Cole is back. That's the last shot.

That's the last shot. Yeah. Oh, then that's cool. That's cool. That's cool. Well, what was Cole talking about? Cole really talks about that for a little bit. Remember, dad is like, remember dad is like, oh, you guys didn't make a snowman.

Right, he saw it. And the snowman is that they made the night before has gone. It's turned into Cole. So this is Cole turned back into the snowman. Right. He's on and and and the snowman is that they made the night before has gone. It's turned into coal. So this is coal turned back into the I would have liked a moment where Sarah and Nick look and go. Cole. Right. You mean right? Something you need to understand. And then they go, then they go and they like beat the shit out of it with a baseball bat. And they're like, with a baseball bat and they're like, you motherfucker, I fuck that, I fuck that man. She did though, I don't think, but here's my question.

No dick, I don't think Cole had a dick. I too think he had a dick, but. No, because I think he had a hole. I think he had a hole on the snow. I don't understand that works, but it was a freezing cold dick. It had to be heavy. I mean, I have cold fingers,

but I'm not a snowman abs. So he had abs. Like the snowman didn't have hair. So many things. So the snowman doesn't even have the shirt that she puts on him. She puts a blue shirt on him and he wears a red shirt. He doesn't have a carrot for a nose. He doesn't have a pants.

He has a sick arm. He has sick arms. Give me something. All right, let's go to the crowd. Let's go to the crowd with a lot of to the crowd. Let's go to the crowd. We'll call one more person. In the chat. Hashtag does he have a dick?

Yeah, I want the chat. He's definitely has a dick. Paul. All right, is his dick a carrot? It's possum New York ass. No, they would have put it there. Right. So if it's not there, it's nothing.

Okay, but they've had to have put a carrot where the dick is for him to have had a human dick. June, I didn't mean to cut you off. What were you saying? Well, Manila, I was going to say, my question, there's so many frames in this home of and pictures in his home in the bank vault. I'm sorry, in Sarah's home in the bank vault, of them as little kids with snowmen. Did they think about for holidays though? Is that like, I think like, we take out the

Christmas dolls for holidays. Did they take out the special snow portraits for holidays? Or are they all year round? I think that's just, that their lives are so sad that these are the stories. These are the pictures of their life. Is that they take a selfie every year with a representation of her. With a giant ass iPad, not a phone.

A representation of her idealized man. And she puts it as a screen saver. Yes. Oh, God. There's a lot of, in the chat, a lot of people are saying yes, he has a dick. All right, some more questions from the chat. Let's see what else we have here. All right, next question from the chat is this.

Natalie asks, do the star eyes mean he's a spirit or an alien or a ghost from space and happening a snowman or is that magic from the universe bringing him to life a spirit or an alien or a ghost from space and happening a snowman or is that magic from the universe bringing him to life? I easy possessed or activated. Yes, this is a question. Is he a demon? We don't know. Thank you Natalie. We don't know what he is. They don't examine the magic of it at all, which is I think foolish the way that like a nutty Christmas and other things we need a line. A line to Jack Frost, right? Yes, right? That was the other one.

Jack Frost, do I have no dad than snow dad? Or I'd have a snow dad than snow dad. Snow dad than no dad, yeah. But the other thing is like when she finds out from her dad that there's snowman has disappeared overnight and she's like so angry and she's running out and she assumes like kids have fucked with it, we never get to see what was left there.

Like we never get to see the remnants of the original snowman because he's just at the door. Cole is at the door. What do you think? With the scarf. With the scarf that they put on the shoe. Which kicks away the magical part of it because in my mind, he should have been wearing that scarf the whole movie. So he like that like them them again like we don't know what the magic is. We're talking a lot of different scarves. I mean by the way that guy never wears a jacket. He must have been a freezing cold actor.

God bless the actor of what's his name and his name and his. He's working his ass off. He's making choices. He's working his ass off to give Cole some kind of a vibe, which he has, which I very much appreciate. Which I very much appreciate. I love 15 degrees. And I laughed out loud when he's spiting.

But what I'm putting figure out is how does he have a cell phone? Or how is it? By the way, how does he, I can't go back to this. How does he have, how does he handle? Hands, how does he understand how anything works? How does he call him in Uber? How can't go back to that. How does he handle hands? How does he understand how anything works? How is he calling it Uber? How's he getting tickets to Paris? How is he speaking? We're not just stringing. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Molly asks how you have a passport. Next question from the audience.

What do we got here? Maddie the cat asks Sarah, I don't want romance. I want love. Okay. Sarah says I don't want romance. I want love. But it's the mean. The way that romance and love are mutually exclusive. It's the mean. I don't want romance. I think, I think what she's saying is. I think what she's saying is. I want love.

It's inside of what the father is saying to her where he's like, yes, when I saw your mother in the red scarf, it was like a lightning bolt hit me. But then when that faded, real love kind of took over. And what she was saying is, I'm ready for real love, not the- Listen, talk about two- Talk about two things are possible. Two things can be true at one time. Like this movie is setting up a world in which you can't have both.

That's the problem. It's like, it's the, the moral of the story, if it's a hallmark movie or a ABC family movie, I don't know what kind of movie it is, is saying to the audience, hey, look, I know you want to travel. I know you want to like have a better life. I know you want to move out of your small town,

get out of the house with your dad. I know you want your own place. Well, the message is, the message is, your life is enough. You have everything you need. Well, the message is, the message is your life is enough. Yep. You have everything you need. I love it. Don't aspire to more.

Don't aspire to more. Right. Don't aspire to more. Don't dream. Don't dream is the answer. And here you go. This is the question from Peter. I don't want to hear this.

Follow, follow through on your dream. I would have loved to go to Paris. Why couldn't you go to Paris for a week? What if Cole would have said, like, when they broke up there and Cole went over to Nick and said, here's to his Paris taker. That would have been a better ending to me too. Like, listen, I wish we had that ending.

To me, I don't care how great Nick is, I don't care what she's realizing. I cannot get on board with this woman not going to Paris. That's insane for seven days. Texas. Like, if a friend of yours was like 48 hours ago, a stranger showed up on my doorstep. I'm just going to touch it. It's a lunch in a carriage where he did not eat. He tried to, he tried to sell my home and has now invited

me to Paris. Should I go? Also, I'm in love with him. Yes, go. No. Okay. Then you were advising this person to go, this person's, Cole presents as a murderer. Yes. He has no family. He has no family, no background. He can get nothing. Yes, I would trust. He's ungoogleable. You can't go over to that. Did you ever do that, you know what I know?

Did you ever do that? Did someone at your bar come up to you and say, let's go to Paris and would you just jump in? No, no. And I wish that it happened to me. If someone had come up to me who I was attracted to and love with and said, let's go to Paris together for seven days.

I have a ticket. It's booked. There's no way I wouldn't have gone. And I did not and I cannot get on board with her not going. Even if she wants to come back and explore what's going on over here. Like great. You never had a snow, you never had a snow france. You never had Like, great. You never had a snow france. You never had a snow france.

You never had a snowmouse. I never had a snowmouse. All right, let's get another question. This one actually comes with a video clip. So let's take a look at this. Lucky the pizza dog ass. What was the deal with Sarah's boss? Was she an alien attempting to replicate human interaction?

Let's take a look at this clip of the boss. Here we go. I love it. You do? Oh yeah, it's perfect. Okay, so what exactly is perfect about it? Young love, Nicarage ride, a staple of downtown St. Paul. I mean, that is your story idea, right?

Exploring the traditional fun, romantic things young couples can do in the twin cities at Christmas time. I mean, obviously that's what we were going for. Okay, so watching that clip, I realized she's making eye contact with no one. I also noticed that for the decoration on the table, it's like a vee is with candy canes in it. But that, that actually was really unnerving to watch that close. She's not looking at either one of them. And she also feels like she might be magic.

Oh wow. You think she's magic. She seems unwell. The thing that I love about all of these movies and Lifetime Christmas movies in general is that there's not one frame, not a one where you don't see somewhere in the frame a Christmas ornament, a garland, a something. They're everywhere. Even when they're in the woods, I know, but it's like even when they were building snow creatures, the trees had red bows on them.

Like they would have to know. The woods are decorated, the birds. The woods are decorated. By the way, Devon, our amazing Devon, says, that is the word, Devon who lived in Minnesota, worst attempt at a Minnesota accent, I have ever heard. So this is coming from,

where you can speak to truth, the power here. I would have loved for there to have been more life for the rest of the townspeople, the other people that they worked for, the dad and the old man that he works with. I would have loved for a, because this movie felt so thin, I would have loved for there to have been depth

by using some of these other characters. As a result, having a B or a C story would have been really interesting. Yeah, sure. And made, would have made the movie a lot more enjoyable. Yeah. As it was, it was, I enjoyed watching it. No, by the way, get me wrong. Can you imagine what this would have been like, I enjoyed watching. Now watch, by the way.

Can you imagine what this would have been like though in the hands of one of the great actresses of her time, Melissa Joan Hart? I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean,

I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean fine. By the way, but, yeah, I mean, Jesse Hutch does a great job, but I think Mario Lopez as Nick would have been great too. We want a little bit of competition. I think that, you know, that's interesting. Huggins in this role would be great.

I think Huggins should have a, so. Would have knocked it out of the park. I would have knocked it out of the park. I would have knocked it out of the park. Here's the thing I'm going to tell you though, you think that this is a low budget movie. It's a movie cost $140 million. That's it. Emma Roberts.

Put Emma Roberts in this. Paul, it's a lie. What did you, what did you just say? The movie cost $140 million. The movie cost $140 million. The actors took a large chunk of the page. The actors were doing the best they could. They were simply not quite, and the chemistry wasn't there, you know, and you really did

need it. They should have known chemistry. I would have loved it if Nick fell in love with Elk Jerky lady. I thought we were going something new. You were on it, they were kind of finding their bond. I wanted more life for Elk. So Elk, Jerky, lady is like the, is the, the, the, the stars hollow, you know, like one of the characters could the Kurt in stars hollow. Like give me, give, I think that I can be together though, Jason, because he's too boring.

Both redheads. Oh, and they can't, they can't slay each other out. June did say to me she whispered in the middle of the movie. She said, wait, Jay, Jay, what we got? Tell her, tell her what you said there. You see, you see. You guys. It never seemed to redheads together. It's, it's on the redheads.

Oh wow. Wow. Wow. The chat is by the way, shipping Isabella Nick. They like Isabella Nick. I love you too, but we know they could never work. You know, they could never work. Oh, that is a shocking question. So he's just what I said to Polar are watching it. I was like, if you look closely at Nick,

like he's just on the verge of being a redhead. Like he's like right on the edge, you know, in certain lighting, in certain rooms. Like in my lighting right now, he'd be a redhead. And Paul's, he probably wouldn't be. But he is a redhead, you know, at the end of the day. And so they wouldn't, you know, they couldn't. I'm not disagreeing. I'm not trying to, I'm, I'm not disagreeing vis-a-vis the redheads. You ever seen a movie with two redheads falling in love? I, there is, I mean, I will say, Mr. and Mrs. Weasley are both redheads. They are, they are the personification, they are the personification of true love. And have produced a series of red-headed children.

And now listen, you know, did we watch them fall in love? No. No, would I watch a movie in which they do fall in love? Yes, do I want to watch them fuck? Absolutely. Let's just haven't seen it. Clearly we have an opinion about a lot of things, including redheads and gingers, but there are people out there with a different opinion about this movie.

It is now time for second opinions. And here are some second opinion themes that were sent in by our listeners. Take a look. Second opinions that are found on Amazon. This movie was shit, but they say it's legit. So let's hear them from tall John. A great one. All right. Here's that. That that Pam Rose. Let's hear from Tom McWaters. I know you think this movie sucks. I couldn't give a thousand fucks. So take it with a grain

of gin. Here's my sick and opinions. I got a pain. I love. Yeah. Great. I love yeah great. I love Tom. I love that is from in Tame Rose. Yeah, they are great. Tom does a bunch of songs of the show. Pam's puppet work there was great. Well, and with Lacey also from the discord. Here's Lacey's song. There was a snowman who turned into a real boy. He was scared of carrots and he just couldn't bear it to work clothes in front of the fire. He likes buttons, he likes winter, colds, his name no lie. He was born in a snow and the children know. It calls everyone little guy. Amazing.

That was Lacey. I also love to give two trees. Two two trees two trees junior big fan of two trees You want to tree in the bedroom a tree in the living room? Yeah Jason you have any trees in your house? I have a tree I have a tree in the in the living room. I just have I just have a single tree Do you put lights do you like lights and decorations or lights? Well, here's what I'll say normally I would have a Well, here's what I'll say. Normally, I would have a real tree with lights and ornaments, but because of pandemic times,

I have, last year I got a fake tree that has lights, and so I've been using that last year in this one. So, yes, lights and ornaments, but this one happens to be fake, which I don't love. Okay. I will say this, there are 119 total reviews of this movie. 60% are five star, 3% are one star. So people love this movie. I only have three reviews, I'll read them very quickly,

from retired soldier sailor, they write, like I said, I buy a lot of Christmas movies. I enjoyed the heck out of this one. Buy it. You'll like it. Enough said. Five stars. And the title is, I buy a lot of Christmas movies,

but this one is different. This one is from Tom F.B. Tom F.BB writes this, too close to people to realize you love them. Five stars, no title. That was a little, wow. I feel like that one emotionally connected. And finally, from Butterfly Mom 54, I love this movie.

I love Snowman, I collect them. I love snowmen. However, I pass this movie over a few times, the trailer did not appeal to me, but I decided to give it a go. It was the best 399 I have spent in a long time. The beginning was a little slow and silly, but all of a sudden the movie took an unexpected turn and the results were hilarious to me. I kept on laughing and I love Jesse Hutch in this movie. He is really funny. If you watch it, you will know why I love this

movie and why I mention that I love Snowman. I see this as a good movie for a guy and a girlfriend to watch or two females. So this is either a guy girl movie for a guy and a girlfriend to watch or two females. So this is either a guy girl movie or a guy guy movie. This is definitely like seeing Jesse in one very revealing scene. Not gonna give it away. What I did not like and I tried and it tried my patience. Was the way that that male friend was so jealous. That girlfriend was so clueless and the boss was so weird. But kind of funny. The part with Jesse Hutch were my favorite.

So funny and so unexpected. I do not see this as a family movie as it is an adult themed, but clean. I just don't see young ones being interested. Maybe a young husband and a wife, all their couples would probably roll their eyes. I just see this as a romance movie as much as a study in relationships. Good graphic art seems to enjoy five stars.

And the review has titled a fun frosty story. Wow. But now there's one review that I thought was actually really interesting. Um, and it is from the UK and is by Jessica St. Claire. Take a look. What? Oh boy.

Here we go. Jessica, I'm so sorry that I can't be with you tonight. I love watching Christmas movies with you guys. So this is breaking my heart. Paul did send me the trailer of Snowmance and asked for my thoughts. Now, I don't know the full plot of the movie, but that has never stopped me weighing in in the past. Just my main takeaway is the moment I saw that snowman. I knew this was going to be a movie about a woman who wants to fucking an animate object. And listen, I'm a

special guest of this the next gal, but you show me a human being who gets off on a snowman. That's just it doesn't exist. Because the entire movie I'm concerned with what's going on downstairs was the same problem I had with that Nutcracker movie when we were talking about is it a smooth woodish? Yes. Here I might be made of ice, is it grit? I just I these are the things I can't let go. Couple other things, just, you know, again, on the superficial side, the actor who plays Cole who is forced to take his shirt off at a bonfire,

which I initially thought was maybe he had like a fever, you know, that was causing him to be delirious. He violates, again, I hate to say this, but what I like to call the Mario Lopez rule, that we set out in that Melissa Joan Hart movie where everybody had the exploding diarrhea during the filming. And that is, I want my actors in my home.

Too much hair. Yeah, no hair. Or all the hair in the world. He had a kind of smattering and it looked, you know, like they trimmed it up and I appreciated that, but that is violating a key rule for me. I want, and you know what? Honestly, I want my men's hair list, okay?

I do. In those movies, I want them to have no hair at all. One last thing to say, I'm a woman who loves the olden days. And I've seen enough carriage rides now in these movies to know that I don't want that. And I certainly don't want someone picking me up at work in a horse-strong carriage. It's a very sad. It's just so many red flags in this movie. So anyway, I'm sure there's much more disturbing things in this film and I can't wait to listen and listen. For all of you out there who would fuck a

snowman, please let me know. I'd love to have my mind opened about it. And I'm sending all my love. Bye. There she is. The queen of Christmas. She is just too much. And only watching the trailer nailed so many things. I didn't drill down on the hair on his chest. But I think she's right.

It wasn't, I think for hallmark, it's easier for us gals to just have a more sort of kindle experience and keep the whole thing sanitized. These, yeah, I sanitized this right. These hallmark and lifetime and like the kind, these, this style of, but one of the notes I made was like, I really, and maybe this is just like a different type of a movie, I want this movie to have like sex, not like a sex scene, but I want to believe that Sarah and Cole, as they're falling in love,

that attraction and physical demonstrations of that love are part of it. I'm not gonna go to Paris with someone if I don't know if we are good kissing parts. If I don't wanna get to Paris and be like, oh, he's like, does that thing where he jams his tongue in my mouth the whole time? Or whatever, like, if I'm Sarah, I'm like, let me figure this out.

He seems to be cold-blooded. So let me figure out if I can, if we have sexual chemistry. I would've liked the last one. The last one of the movie would've been like, and when he fucked, it was weird. Yeah. But let me know. Or Nick is like, do you think that, wait,

do you think that Cole was the snowman? And she's like, well, his dick was an icicle. So, or he did come freezing cold slush. I don't know. I mean, I think we unpacked a lot here. There's no mythology to break apart because we don't know if Cole could exist in this world. Jason's saying that Cole never was supposed to exist in this world. I mean, there's so, there's so much.

I want to just talk to you about the writer of this movie, the Blaine, uh, Shepehda, writes two types of movies according to our research, uh, Guru Nick Kylie, who did the Lord's work in finding research on this movie, um, that has 25% of Rotten Tomatoes. He said the Blaine writes two movies. Movies that are called Dangerous Lessons. You may now kill the bride, nanny surveillance, and the deadly assistant, and then movies like, last Vermont Christmas, the Christmas Pact, the perfect Christmas present, always and forever Christmas,

and then the jingle bell Christmas. Like he's going between hardcore, most likely to murder, jingle bell princess. So he's going back and forth. He just switches off between a murder film and a Christmas film every year. And that's kind of, that is kind of thing. And the tagline is movie.

I'll say it. We say it every year. Well, somebody just have the courage you cowards. They have they have tried to put us in. They have tried to put us in one of the they have tried. They have tried. I want to be honest. I just it just hasn't gotten to. It hasn't gotten to you. We were asked to it. Okay. Then we were asked to attach ourselves to a film before. We want the film to be picked up. We will be involved. We can't go and pitch this thing.

We have to, like, homework's got to come to us and say, like, you got a green light. Here's the keys. Here's the keys. And the problem is, like, it can probably can't be homework because it's going to have to have nudity. I mean, you have to. Let's do it. Yeah, and have nudity. I mean, you have to. Let's go. Yes.

Hair and nudity, all of which is me. To be clear, all of which is me. I am bringing the hair and the nudity. You're right, we're like, you're gonna see all the hair and all the nudity. I want to go, I want to, you will have no, I want to play, I want to play the snowman that comes to life and I want to show you this snowman has a dip. If you are one of them, here it is.

HBO Max Snowman's movie. I want to just end on this one question because it needs a great way to rent around Rob in the end here because I think we covered a lot of stuff here from Brandon. I'm going to keep up a Brandon's question on the screen. Brandon asks, who's the most redeeming character in this movie and why is it her? Herb is the father's assistant, is that right? I believe it is. I mean, I agree.

The father's assistant. I loved that character. The deaf man who worked for a heart of hearing. The guy who was just kind of like sweeping or doing whatever in the background of the wood shop. I just, I enjoyed and that they were like, he was like, I can't let him go or something like that. I don't know, I was obsessed with that guy.

Yes, I agree. I think that her business was done. All the side characters were the most interesting people in the movie. Truly. I want to believe that the jerky was something that that actress came up with and they're like, yeah, yeah, keep that, keep that. She made a choice and they put it in. I mean, she was really great.

I liked her so much. This is a movie. If this, if I'm going to continue to compare it to Gilmore Girls, it's a movie in which everybody's deemed. All right. Well, this is great. Would you recommend this movie, Jason June? What do you think?

I sure. I mean, it's something to, honestly, it's something to be seen. It's something to behold. You know, and that's all I'll say about that. I did enjoy watching this movie very, very much. And there are a couple of really funny moments, like when he's pretending to be a snowman, and not pretending, when he is being himself and falls back on his instincts, it's really quite funny. The movie doesn't, of course, like amount to anything, but there's some wild stuff in here, and I enjoyed the hell out of it.

Do you have Jason? I agree. I agree with you. I feel very similarly. While not as fun, perhaps as some of the other, like we've been saying, a very nutty Christmas or some of the other holiday and handcuffs, those I think were better iterations of this kind of a movie. This is a little bit worse, but I still, I had a blast. I think it's like for the sake of the podcast, absolutely. I do.

But there are other Christmas movies that I suspect might be a little bit more fun. Let me pause at this. I don't disagree with what either of you have said. I will say this. I feel like this movie is more of a drama than it is a comedy. The other movies like understand they're being fun and I don't think that this movie had the same sense of playfulness.

I think it was played a little bit too straight. That's my point of view. I enjoyed it, but I think that that's what was missing from it. Like it didn't seem fun. And I think here's what I'll say to amend my point is, if I had just watched this movie and not gotten to have this conversation, or if I'm somebody in the audience, to have listened to this conversation, if I just turned it on and watched the movie, I think I would be disappointed.

I will tell you this much. That June and I have a movie. Without any. Yes. June and I have a movie that we have planned for next Christmas already because we stumbled upon it because our child selected it over Thanksgiving. And I feel like these movies are our hard for us to do. You mean a hard need built a hard need built a thread, but you're right. Like it is it is not as insane as it should be. Nor as funny as it should

be. But yet it is interesting because it's confounding. Like it's like, and I think that that, like there's something about these movies, always play it safe so that they can just be like family friendly, safe, safe, safe, nothing sexual, nothing dirty, not even any like intimations of stuff, nothing, I would, you know, it's, I don't know.

I, again, I wished I was missing Melissa Joanhart. I was missing. I was missing. I wish, I found myself being elated when Elk Jerky would come on or when the boss would be on or when other characters were there to kind of in live in. It was cool. Otherwise, it was a cold. God, if a cold, I, cold's doing good stuff, you know.

And but she also didn't have chemistry with cold. A great. I mean, it was cold. Yeah, you know, but cold was doing something. And they're all, they're all working hard. They're all working their asses off in the constructs of, in the confines of the rules of the movie, which is tough, you know, like, it's not a lot.

There's like, like we said, I think there's six or seven speaking roles. There's no extras. There's, there's very little happening in this movie to work with. I'm just saying as an actor, yes. I think there's very little. Everyone's making their own choices. Everyone's doing their own thing. And now it would be surprising that Lars Van True directed this.

Amazing. It would. It would. It's a dog, but it's it. Here's the dog. When I've ruined this surprise me. I will say this. June, we talk about joking around about being a Christmas movie. June, you are in a Christmas movie and a very good Christmas movie and it's on HBO Max right now. And if you've not seen it, I just want to promote it and just say that.

June's fantastic and the movie is really, really, really good. So you've done it. You've done it before any of us in getting in a Christmas film. I have gotten in a Christmas film and I will say it is a great movie. It's a great Christmas movie. It's called Aitbit Christmas. It's on HBO Max and you can stream it now and watch it over the others.

It's Neil Patrick Harris, Steve Zahn. David Cross. David Cross is in it, and it's just funny, warm, and just delivers on everything you want from it. And our children have watched it at least 30 times, like at least, oh, that's great. That's great. I just watched the trailer for it, and it also had like real, it felt like real nostalgia vibes. It felt like a kind of Christmas movie that like we grew up.

It is very much like, that's what it feels like. Like what I think the Christmas story was to our parents like reminiscing about like the 50s. This feels like that same idea. Like it's right. I'm so excited to watch it to kind of wash away snowman. It'll be a great chaser. Yes, exactly.

Jason, what do you want to talk about? Oh, nothing really. You know, if you're not watching Star Trek Prodigy, watch it. It's a wonderful anime. It's so good. And you're great in that show, Jason. That's so good. Oh, thank you so much.

And that's about it. You know, everybody, you know, it's that show, Jason. Oh, thank you so much. And that's about it. You know, everybody, you know, it's that time of year. So if you find yourself in the position where you can give money, there's a lot of great deserving places that need those donations right now. So get to work with that. I'll mention one of those. Fripping America is one of those great organizations

that you're working with them today. They do a great job for people who are food insecure and they are just an amazing organization that has throughout this entire pandemic seen their numbers rise to such a high level and have stepped up and met that challenge and continue to meet that challenge and it's all through the generosity

of so many people giving money, volunteering their time and to work with them today was a really amazing opportunity. I will say also, not that it's, well, just plug it because it's, why not? Pacemag Magazine released their 20 favorite comedies of the year, and this movie I did over the year called Happily was on that, and I think it was a nice reminder that if you have not seen Happily, it's streaming. It defies kind of a definition. It's a romance, it's a thriller, it's a horror movie,

and it's a friends hanging out movie. It's all in one kind of a weird lynching thriller kind of thing. Oh, and Paul plugging one other thing. I know these plugs are growing long, but I just wanted to invite our listeners because so many of the How To This Get Made listeners came to our Jane Club virtual summit last year. And we are, we've just announced our third virtual summit. It's going to be in 2022 on January 22nd. It's called New Year

New Jane. It's a time to kind of set some New Year's resolutions and tensions within community. It's a really, really incredible day of writing, reflecting, we have different topics, and it's just absolutely restorative and wonderful. So we just put the tickets on our website if you head to jankclub.com and click on special events, and then head to New Year New Jane, the tickets are now available. I love all of this. Thank you guys for listening. Our month of Christmas continues. On Christmas Eve, we'll be releasing the last episode of this podcast, which is the episode that Jessica St. Clair forgot to record. So we have figured out our brilliant engineer, Devon, has a piece together, something that sounds about

right. It may not be perfect, but it sounds about right, but that's our Christmas gift there. It's a night before Christmas, and that will be coming out Christmas Eve. T-Publok right now, if you go to tpublok.com, you can get 30% all-how to just get made shirts. A big, big thank you to our producer, Cody Fisher, our sound engineer, Devon, Bryant, and of course, our producer, Molly Reynolds. All three of them working late on a Friday night. We appreciate you, but I also want to give a shout out to our special amazing person who

runs the whole show here. Kayla Miller, who is doing shit in the chat, pulling up video clips, activating everything. Kayla, thank you so much for making this show run incredibly fallacy. And a huge thank you to our research guru that is Nick Kylie, our producer, Avril Halley, for picking this film and all the films we do in this podcast. You can continue this conversation on our Discord. There's a chat going on right now, discord.gg slash httgm.

You can get in there and continue the party there. You can also go over to my Discord where I think there's a little bit of a chat going over there too. That's discord.gg slashHDTGM. You can get in there and continue the party there. You can also go over to my Discord where I think there's a little bit of a chat going over there too. That's Discord.GG-PulseShare. Chats are happening, so there's an after party. If you want to go there, enjoy it. We'll be doing a sorted live show, so just check out HDTGM.com for all the tickets and details on that. A big thank you to the people who do all of our amazing art. I'm talking about the Ghost of Craig Teenales on Instagram, Zach McElise, and also Kyle Waldron, who you see all of his art on our Facebook and Instagram pages.

You'll like the show, right in review it as always. But just thank you for showing up. Thank you for spending your time with us. Thank you for spending your money here with us. I know that that's tight too. So we appreciate you. We will continue to be back. And I hope you all

have your perfect snowman