How To Fail With Elizabeth Day - Bonnie Tyler - Her first ever podcast interview

Episode Date: May 1, 2024

TW: miscarriage This week, brace yourself for A TOTAL ECLIPSE… of all other podcast episodes, because this one’s a total banger. I could not have asked for a more open, hilarious, moving or riveting encounter than with the formidable Bonnie Tyler. She grew up in a working-class Welsh family and answered a newspaper ad for a backing singer when she was 17. From there, she went on to be one of the most iconic recording artists of all time. Her hit singles include It’s A Heartache, Holding Out for a Hero and, of course, Total Eclipse of the Heart. At 72, Bonnie is still hard at work, and managed to squeeze in an hour on How to Fail between gigs and the release of her new album, In Berlin. It’s also her first ever podcast interview. You might want to bring the tissues for this one, as we have a bit of a weep when Bonnie talks about losing her amazing mum.  We also touch on miscarriage and a childfree life. Plus: Bonnie’s failure at elocution lessons, the fascinating story behind her friendship with Tina Turner, performing for Putin (no, really), being a bit of a hoarder and the secret to a 50-year marriage. As always, I’d LOVE to hear about your failures. Every week, my guest and I choose a selection to read out and answer on our special subscription offering, Failing with Friends. We’ll endeavour to give you advice, wisdom, some laughs and much, much more. Have something to share of your own? I'd love to hear from you! Click here to get in touch: howtofailpod.com Production & Post Production Manager: Lily Hambly Studio and Mix Engineer: Gulliver Tickell and Josh Gibbs Producer: Hannah Talbot Executive Producer: Carly Maile How to Fail is an Elizabeth Day and Sony Music Entertainment Production. Find more great podcasts from Sony Music Entertainment at sonymusic.com/podcasts To bring your brand to life in this podcast, email [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Let's go seize the night. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamex. Benefits vary by car and other conditions apply. Hello and welcome to How to Fail with me, Elizabeth Day. In my podcast, we look at and celebrate our unique individual failures, because ultimately, they're the stepping stones to success. Every week, I invite a guest to look at their failures and what has come afterwards that might have helped them grow and succeed. Before we begin, I just wanted to remind you about my subscriber series, Failing With Friends.

Today, Bonnie and I look at your questions and give our advice and cover not getting Taylor Swift, and whether you should talk to your friends about it, a cooking failure regarding soufflés, and is it too late to succeed in your 60s? Absolutely not. We'd love to hear from you. Please follow the link in the podcast notes to share your failures and questions. Last month, a total solar eclipse was sighted across America. As people rushed to put on their special spectacles to stare at the sun, an unexpected consequence was that a 1983 power ballad once again became number one across the United States. The song was Total Eclipse of the Heart, and its singer, Bonnie Tyler, is my guest today. She was born

Gaynor Hopkins in Wales near Swansea. Her father was a coal miner who had fought in Dunkirk during World War II. She grew up in a council house and started singing in local clubs where she was spotted by a talent scout. Eventually, she was offered a recording contract by RCA Records. The legendary Ronnie Scott was one of her managers. Her hit singles included It's a Heartache and Holding Out for a Hero, but it is Total Eclipse of the Heart from her fifth album, for which she remains the most well-known. It has sold almost six million copies to date and remains a firm karaoke favourite. Tyler has earned three Grammy and three Brit nominations during her illustrious career. She was one of the first Western singers to tour the then Soviet Union and, in 2013,

She was one of the first Western singers to tour the then Soviet Union and in 2013 represented the UK in the Eurovision Song Contest. Nine years later, she was awarded an MBE for services to music and charities. These days, she's still touring and last year released her memoir, Straight From the Heart. Tyler turned 73 in June, although you wouldn't know it. But she says she has absolutely no intention of slowing down. I class myself as a working class girl and I've never stopped working. I do an awful lot because I feel other people would love to be offered what I'm offered. Who am I to say no?

Bonnie Tyler, welcome to How to Fail. I know what a strange title that is for someone that's done so much. Exactly. Well, we're going to flip the notion of failure on its head because ultimately, it's all a learning exercise. And you sit before me as this legendary success story. And I am so honoured that you're here today because I understand it's your first ever podcast interview. Well, I've done thousands of interviews, but I've never actually heard them called podcasts before. Well, I hope I will endeavour to make it a good experience. Great. Thank you, Elizabeth.

I wanted to start off talking about the importance of working to you. What does it mean to you to work? Well, everything. When I left school on the Friday, I was determined to get a job by the Monday and start earning money so I could go out and buy things for myself. Although it was only a shop assistant, I got two jobs by the end of the day on the Friday after I left school. I had no qualifications. I was terrible in school. I got one O level and that's for cooking. God knows why. I think she felt sorry for me. So I was working right from when I was 17. But then when I was 17 and a half, I really,

because I'd always been singing in my bedroom with a hairbrush, you know, and it was kind of like fate was tempting me to answer this advertisement that was in the local newspaper, you know, and I did. And actually, that came after I entered a talent competition in the local rugby club. My auntie put my name down for it. But anyway, this advertisement said, looking for three girl singers to join Bobby Wayne and the Dixies. No experience needed. I thought, that's great, that's me.

I'd never actually sang on a microphone before. You know, I'd always used a hairbrush in my room. So I went along to the audition. There was about 34 girls there. And I thought, I've got no chance here, you know. But I did. I became one of the Dixies. And I was with them for about 18 months.

And then formed my own band. And we were working six nights a week, every week, you know. And we loved it. And this is why I call myself a working-class girl, because I've always, always worked. And I've always thought, like you said in the beginning, people would love to have the opportunities I've had. And to say no seems morally wrong, you know.

Of course, I don't do everything that comes my way. But, you know, if it's right, I'll do it. You've turned down quite a few celebrity reality TV shows, I understand. I've turned them all down, I think. Do you regret saying no to any of them? No, not at all. Go in the jungle? My God, I couldn't think of anything worse. Oh, not at all.

Go in the jungle? My God, I couldn't think of anything worse. You know, I tell you, they've offered me really good money to do that. About five times, no chance. There's no point in ever asking me again, you know, because I'm never going to do it. And of course, Big Brother years ago, they asked me, no chance. I'm busy with my band anyway. My band have been with me for 35 years some of them you know i have an awesome band and just the other night now i'm visiting when sold out shows in

europe you know and i've come home for this podcast well i'm again very flattered let's talk about total eclipse if you're if you'll allow me to um tell me where you shot the video because it's also an iconic video as well as being an iconic song absolutely yeah and I was very lucky at the time that mtv had just started so you can imagine how wonderful opportunity what wonderful opportunity that was to and I was on heavy rotation sounds rude I was on heavy rotation on MTV you know and the video was extremely hard to do it took two days and we were in an old asylum somewhere outside of London. It was freezing cold on that day.

In fact, there was snow on the floor as well. And I had to run through it barefoot. But Jim Steinman wrote the most incredible storyboard. Couldn't understand it, but I did it. But it was an incredible video and it got nominated for a Grammy. And I lost out to Michael Jackson for the best song. That's right. He won it. And I also got nominated with the video with him.

Thriller won it. And I, what company to be in here? I know. I guess we can live with that. I guess we can live with that. And I mentioned that it was a hit karaoke song and still is incredibly popular. Have you ever either performed at a karaoke or walked into a karaoke booth where someone is singing it and murdering it? I've seen many of them on YouTube that they send to me, you know, my friend and I were out

last night and have a look at this video, you know, and it's like, oh, my God, they love it. You know, they just all get together. But yes, I did actually do it once, years and years and years ago. We were at this party down in Swansea, some local pub somewhere, you know, and they had a karaoke night on and somebody put my name down, didn't they? Well, of course I had to do it. Otherwise I'd come over, I'd get right spoiled sport, you know. So I actually did two total eclipse of the heart and holding out for a year or, you know.

Oh, I wish I'd been there, Bonnie. What a night that must have been for those locals. It was fun. Tell me a bit about your voice because you have this extraordinarily powerful voice and it's got a slight raspy quality to it. And I understand that that's not something you were born with. That's something that happened. How did it happen? Well, you know, I was singing for seven years before I got discovered. I was singing locally for six nights a week and that took a lot of wear and tear on my voice. And I developed nodules three times in my career.

And they went away with rest twice before. But this time they just wouldn't go. They were persistent, you know. So I had to have surgery to have them removed. And after the operation, I was told to be quiet for a month. Bonnie is actively rolling her eyes. Can you imagine me being quiet, you know, for... Anyway, I tried my best.

I had a notepad and paper and a thing around me saying, I can't speak to you because I've just had a throat operation, you know. But in the end, I just found it too hard not to talk. So I stayed in. Well, of course, when I stayed in, and I had to stay in for like six weeks, and I ate a lot, you know. I'd never had time off work the only time I've been off work in my life was after this operation I had to be quiet but I wasn't quiet

enough and it ended up with my going back to the consultant and he said to me what have you done you've been you've been singing haven't you you've been I said no yeah yeah he said to me, what have you done? You've been singing, haven't you? I said, no, yeah, yeah. He said, you've been talking. I said, I couldn't help it, I couldn't help it. He said, well, you've done it now. You're going to be like this probably forever. It wasn't so bad.

I went into the studio and I went, it's a heartache. And they said, oh, my God, your voice has changed, you know. But we like it. And so it turned out to be a positive thing for me. That's so great. And that's really at the heart of everything this podcast is about. Something that might be perceived of as a failure, one minute actually turns into this unique selling point.

Yeah. I had my first number three in America. You know, everybody's dream is to make hits in America, you know, and I've done it a few times. But that was the first time with It's a Heartache. had already copied and released it, but they never got played because they liked my raspiness, you know, and they played my version. And it went racing up the charts, you know, to number three. Three or four in America. I mentioned in the introduction that you were born Gaynor and on stage you are Bonnie.

Yeah. Do you feel you have a split personality? Do you assume a role when you go on stage? Funny thing, yes. I'm Bonnie on stage, full of it, and I'm Auntie Gaynor, Gaynor at home, you know. And all my family call me Gaynor, of course, and my friends. Before we get on to your failures,

I want to ask you what it was like touring the Soviet Union when you did, one of the first Western artists to do so. I was one of the first girls, I think I was the first Western girl to perform there. And it was very, very strange, but beautiful in a way as well, because I had my own band, obviously. obviously I had my my crew and we had a Polish crew there as well and we took our own catering thank god because in them days you had to queue for anything you know we had I believe it was the KGB taking care of us uh we were in all these massive halls, you know. It was a bit strange because there'd be a lady on every floor of the hotels we stayed, you know. It's a normal thing.

It was a normal thing in Russia then. But they watch everything. They write everything down. Whoever goes to room, it's all written down, you know. But the audiences were loving it, you know, because they'd never had this before. But the strange thing is, the first 20 rows or something like that was all soldiers, you know. And police, the audience had to be very well behaved, you know.

I mean, when you go to a concert, you want to go, yeah, you know, and sing along. Do you know what I mean? Oh, in 1988, there was none of that then, you know. It completely changed then. I mean, I've been to Russia so many times. I've sang in the Kremlin three times. Have you? Who for? Putin, I know.

What was that like? He was in the front row at one time. Was he dancing? Please tell me. No, he had a face down to his feet. The image, I sort of want him to be like mouthing the words to Total Eclipse of the Heart. Well, he was there because it was, I think this particular thing was like a charity for younger entertainers getting into it.

Obviously, that's not going to happen anymore, which is a great shame because the the it had turned completely different to what the first time I went there and then when I went back I couldn't believe it like designer stores everywhere you know I didn't have to queue for anything I mean we took our own catering we We had articulated lorries full of stuff, you know, that we'd taken over and playing. I don't know how the hell they managed it. I even took my sunbed over there. Can you believe it?

Did you? No wonder my skin is fried. Your skin is gothic. Thank God I never did my face, though. I always covered my face with a towel because I'd never looked good with a tan face. But my body was always brown. Now I'm paying for it, you know, because my skin on my arms and my legs and whatever. Oh, God.

But... Well, you look great. My face is all right. Yeah, your face looks fabulous. Okay. So your first failure is elocution lessons. Oh, yes. How old were you when you started having elocution lessons. Oh, yes. How old were you when you started having elocution lessons?

Well, I'd already started singing and I was working like six nights a week in a nightclub. And I used to be frightened about talking in between songs, you know. I mean, I tell stories now in between every song, you know, and I go on and on. I tell stories now in between every song, you know, and I go on and on. But then I was really nervous about talking, you know. And so the owner of the club where I worked, his daughter had been going to elocution lessons and she spoke very nicely, you know. And I said to her mother, where does she go for her elocution lessons? So she told me, Mr. Veganer Powerwell.

So I said, can you give me a crash course in elocution lessons? Well, that didn't last very long. I said, I better leave you before you end up talking like me. So were you going because you wanted to diminish your Welsh accent? Yes. I wanted to calm it down a bit, but I got no chance. I'm all over the world working, right? But there's no way I'm going to get rid of my Welsh accent.

I can't do anything about it. It's a bit like Tom Jones, I suppose. Look at him. He lived in America since God knows when until recently, and he's still got his Welsh accent. I just imagine that all Welsh celebrities know each other. So do you know Tom Jones? Do you know Catherine Zeta-Jones and Tom Jones? Well, Catherine Zeta-Jones is my husband's second cousin. So her father is Robert's cousin. And I actually sang in their wedding in New York. But Tom Jones, yes, I've worked with him a few times. In 1979, I think it was, when I had It's Heartache, a huge hit in America, I did three shows with him, supporting him as if he needs any support.

He doesn't need anybody to support him, but his manager knew my manager. And so I was on the bill, you know, and it was incredible. He was incredible and he still is. And we all went out for dinner every night after the show. It's fabulous. But no, I don't have his telephone number. I can't call him a friend as such, you know, because we're not in touch.

But, you know, the last time I saw him was at, we were doing a charity show together with lots of other artists in the O2 in 2020, just before the lockdown came. That was the only other time I hadn't worked it throughout my life during lockdown, you know. But he was very nice. I got a lot of time for him and he's still awesome, you know. Yeah.

His voice is as strong as ever. Well, ditto for you. Hi, I'm Matt Lewis, historian and host of a new chapter of Echoes of History, a Ubisoft podcast brought to you by History Hit. Join me and world-leading experts every week as we explore the incredible real-life history that inspires the locations, the characters and the storylines of Assassin's Creed. Listen and follow Echoes of History, a Ubisoft podcast brought to you by History Hit, wherever you get your podcasts. Peyton, it's happening. We're finally being recognized for being very online.

It's about damn time. I mean, it's hard work being this opinionated. And correct. You're such a Leo. All the time. So if you're looking for a home for your worst opinions, if you're a hater first and a lover of pop culture second, then join me, Hunter Harris, and me, Peyton Dix,

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Follow Let Me Say This on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new episodes on YouTube or listen to Let Me Say This ad-free by joining Wondery Plus in the Wondery app or on Apple Podcasts. I'm very interested in this idea of Welshness and your Welsh heritage, though,

and I would love to talk about your parents, who sound amazing. Tell us about your mum and your dad. Your dad was this World War II veteran. Yes. And very affected by what he'd witnessed. Well, he saw my uncle and his brain shot out, you know what I mean? Sometimes, occasionally, when he'd come home and he'd had a few drinks, he'd be like crying and saying about Uncle Frank, you know,

and, you know, the things they went through. Can you imagine? No. You can't imagine, can you, you know, being in Dunkirk, you know. And my other uncle was there as well, my Uncle Ernie, and he had terrible problems afterwards psychologically. But my father didn't have it that bad, you know, it's just memories coming back to him in drink, you know,

and he'd be like, there's a word for it now, isn't there? Post-traumatic. Post-traumatic stress or something. But no, they just had to get on and deal with life, didn't they? But my father, he was only a miner for a very short time when he was a young man. But he was working as a fitter and turner in the oilworks, in the BP. And when he was young as well, he used to be a very good boxer. You'd never think so, Maren, because he was so beautiful. He was absolutely gorgeous.

But I have got his blue eyes. You do have amazing blue eyes. My daddies. And was it a happy childhood? Yes, it was very happy. We didn't have any material things as such, no. But nobody did in them days, you know what I mean? I was born in 1951.

And when you think of it, that's not long after the war, is it? But my pride and joy was my bike. I love my bike. I used to go everywhere on my bike. Growing up in a big family, three sisters, two brothers, there wasn't a lot of, hardly any money around, just enough to get through. You know what I mean?

The pantry was basically what was in the garden. You say you have three sisters and two brothers. Yeah. There was another sister. Oh, yes. Pauline. Yeah, Pauline was stillborn. My mother never, ever got over Pauline dying, you know.

She was full term, you know, nine months. Do you know the thing is, term, you know. Nine months, I can't. Do you know the thing is, see, when you're young and you're told that you would have had another sister, but she was stillborn, it doesn't sink in. What actually my mother actually must have gone through. Carrying a baby for all those nine months and then nothing at the end of it it must have been traumatic but she never really showed us her pain but it must have

been terrible for her but she never did get over it mind she always whenever people said how many children do you have and she always counted pauline you know and actually in 2020 my brother my eldest brother died lynn he was so proud he was you know he was wonderful and he wasn't ready to go he was enjoying his life you know he loved life he loved his kids he his grandkids. And he just died in his sleep. I'm so sorry. You know, and now it was an awful shock. Awful shock. Bonnie, I'm so sorry. Anyway, sorry.

I'm so sorry. Oh, well, you know, he had a wonderful life and I know he's in a good place, but it was a terrible shock yes and so you could relate presumably even more to what your mother must have been through yeah yeah you know because yeah at least he's with my mother and father now and pauline and uh you know Will you tell me the story of the father Christmas napkin? Oh, right. Oh, gosh. I'm sorry. I read it and it was so beautiful.

Yeah, I know. But my mother, she died of Alzheimer's, bless her. And shortly before she... We don't have to talk about it. I'd be all right now. Okay. Shortly before she, you know, got really bad with Alzheimer's, she was at my house and it was near Christmas, I suppose, because I had these placemats on the table

that they had like a Father Christmas on them and like a pocket where you put the napkin in. And it was very Christmassy, you know. And she folded it up all the way into like a little triangle. It was a linen placemat that you put over a placemat, you know. And she folded it up into like a little triangle. And she gave it to me in my hand. And she said, when I go, please put this in my coffin, right?

I said, ma'am, don't talk like that. You know, I want you to put it in my coffin, she said, because I want to give Pauline something when I get there, she said. Oh, God. Anyway, so I did it, along with us all, putting little things in the coffin, you know, photographs, like you do, you know. But she wanted me to do that, so I did it.

And I still got one. You had a tear as well. I've still got one in my house. Thank you. Oh, thank you. That's a tissue. I'm so sorry. Oh, gosh.

Oh, I had the best mother in the world. I know we all say we got the best mother, but I did. She was an angel. In fact, when I had my boat, I had a 50-foot, what do you call it, princess boat.

And it was for my 50th birthday, but just before my 50th, my mother died. So I said to Robert, forget about the boat. I don't want it. Nothing. After your mother, you know.

Yeah. Nothing mattered. And anyway, I did the following year, and my father was still alive then. He was alive for 18 months after my mother. So the boat was being built down in Plymouth. So before we took it over to Portugal, where we have a house there, we said, Daddy, come in and have a look at the boat, you know. And so we took him down to Plymouth and he kissed the side of the boat, you know, and we took him out for a spin in it, you know. It had a flybridge and everything, you know, it was a fabulous boat with three bedrooms and Daddy absolutely loved the boat. But I said to him, Dad, I want to name it after Mammy, but I don't want to call it Elsie, you know.

Straight away, he said, there was an angel in the harbour, you know. He pointed at the angel and he said, call it Angel. He said, your mother was an angel. And so we called it Angel. Yeah. So I had that boat for about 21 years. We had wonderful times on there with all the family and everything, you know, great holidays with friends and family. And I sold it

last year because I found that I wasn't going out in it so much, you know. I cannot thank you enough for sharing that. Oh, I'd love everybody to know, actually, what a wonderful person my mother was and my father, you know? Yeah. I think you have paid great tribute to them with that. Thank you. And what a testament you are to them, too.

She always brought us up, all of us, to believe in ourselves, you know? It's strange because she was such a gentle person right and of course with six children or seven mum you would have said yeah she was working so hard in the house keeping the house clean and washing and ironing and we were terrible mind we weren't any help at all I can't looking back now I think god, God, you know, about the only thing I did do was, like, tidy my bedroom now and then, you know. And I can't remember ever learning to cook or anything like that, you know. My mother was too busy doing it for us all, you know.

She brought us all up to believe in ourselves, even though she was a housewife, you know, and she was doing everything. A housewife's job is so hard anyway. She didn't have a chance to do anything else, even if she wanted to. But she had the most incredible opera voice. But she only did it in the house. You know, people used to stand outside of my house just to listen to my mother sing an opera you know that's amazing fabulous I mean there was all kinds of music in my house

because of all the generations different generations you know there my eldest sister was into like Frank Sinatra my my brother Lynn love him he loved Elvis Presley, Eddie Cochran and all that, you know. And then there was Angela, The Beatles and, you know, all the 60s bands. And she gave me my first album, A Hard Day's Night. I know every single word of it, of the whole album. And I got to meet Paul McCartney in the end. Oh, wow. That must have been an amazing thing.

But, yeah, funny that my mother gave us all so less to be confident and yet she was a very, very low-key herself, you know. So you were all into music and you were all into singing. So why do you think you're the one who became... Fate, I think. Do you think it's fate? I really do think. And not only that, I heard somebody saying the other day something,

and I thought, yeah, that's really good, that is. Fate comes your way, but be ready for it and bite its hand off. Yes, yes. Oh, Bonnie, thank you so much for telling us about your family, your wonderful, wonderful family. So you have this innate talent for singing you become a superstar and then we come on to your second failure now this failure I couldn't believe it it's such a good one again because it goes to the heart of everything that we're talking about

simply the best oh yeah tell us which is actually called the best which I didn't know until I read your failure people misquote it all the time. So what happened with The Best? Well, in 1988, I was recording an album with Desmond Child in Woodstock. Actually, in Janis Joplin's old studio, right? Can we just pause? That sentence is one of the most iconic sentences I think has ever been uttered in this studio. Okay, carry on. Well, of course, Janice had died in 1969, but I was working in this studio that she used to work in, that her and her manager owned. I was doing an album, a very budgeted album, you know, like after Total Eclipse of the Heart and Secret Dreams and Forbidden Fire with the late, great Jim Steinman. The record company had forked out fortunes for them, you know what I mean?

But for this next album, Desmond was given a meagre kind of budget to work for the whole album. They only paid him really enough for seven songs, but we ended up doing, I think it was 14 or 15. And this song, Simply the Best, I recorded then. And it was not played, you know, nobody played my version of it. And then two years later, Tina Turner released it. And it was a massive hit, you know. I always do a tribute to Tina in my show, you know, because when I was young, I was always in my bedroom with, you know, playing I Can Tina Turner songs, Tina Turner, Janis Joplin, Wilson Pickett, you know, big voices I loved, you know.

I do a tribute to Tina and I do that song. And I used to say, I did it two years before Tina, but it doesn't seem right to say that now because she's such a legend that she's she was such an inspiration for all of us girl singers. You know, she was incredible. Absolutely the best. Simply the best. So I just say I'm going to do a tribute. I don't even say anymore now that I recorded it two years before you know and what do you think happened there why do you think it was

successful when she sang it is that about subjectivity of taste is it about the time being right I think it was the time where they weren't playing certain people over an age, and yet they played Tina Turner. She's older than me, she was. But, you know, they didn't play my records anyway. And it turned out to be quite a successful album, actually. In fact, there are three or four songs on that album that I recorded before other artists. I did Save Up All Your Tears

before Cher did it. I did To Love Somebody, the old Bridget song. I did that before Jimmy Sunweather had a number one with it. And Don't Turn Around, Aswad had a number one with it that Diane Warren wrote. I did that. And nobody played my versions of it. I'm simply the best. Yeah, but the album is, it's a great album. And Desmond Child is an awesome producer as well. The Tina Turner thing is very interesting because hearing you talk about it, you're so supportive of other artists and particularly other women. Was there ever a point where you felt a bit resentful? Hang on a second, this was my song. No.

No, it actually gave me my confidence back in my choice of material because I thought, I was sure that was a good song. Then it went to number one for Tina Turner. I got the same one. My mother, bless her, she said, it's not fair, see, you did that song before Tina Turner and they didn't play you worse.

But you never felt that? No, not really. You know, I mean, of course, I was disappointed. But, you know, I love Tina Turner. I was so lucky I met her a couple of times. What was she like? Fabulous. She even asked for my autograph.

She gave me her autograph, because I asked her then when she asked me. And when I walked into the studio, this was before she was huge, after she left Ike and she was trying to get back. And it was before that big, what's love got to do with it you know and she she was singing a song called um the black widow i'm sure it was called and she was on a tv show with me in germany and she saw me walking in because i i'd heard tina turner was on the same show so i wanted to see her rehearsing so i walked into the the studio to watch her and she saw me coming in and she went, it's Bonnie Tyler. Oh, my goodness.

Yeah, I was chuffed. And another time then I was doing the Terry Wogan chat show and she, mind I'm telling you too much now. No such thing. No such thing. What happened with Terry Wogan can you not tell me uh well it was a change of clothes that we had to make because I came out of my dressing room and Tina came out of her dressing room and she went uh-oh one of us has got to change and I said well I hope it's you because I haven't got any of the girls with me.

Were you wearing the same thing? Very similar, red leather miniskirt and a red leather jacket. And she had a red leather dress on. She looked absolutely amazing with them legs, you know what I mean? But fair enough, she had things to change into. I didn't. And she had things to change into I didn't and she changed wow but we both had black fishnet stockings as well you know and black shoes and it was really really strange yeah it's like you're connected twins will no one rid me of this troublesome priest?

This is a time of great foreboding. These words supposedly uttered by a king over 800 years ago. These words supposedly uttered by a king over 800 years ago, set in motion a chain of gruesome events and sparked cult-like devotion across the world. I'm Matt Lewis. Join us as we unwrap the enigma and get to the heart of what really happened to Thomas Beckett by subscribing to Gone Medieval from History Hit. Like Ed O'Neill. I had friends in organized crime. Sofia Vergara. Why do you want to be comfortable? Julie Bowen. I used to be the crier.

And Aubrey Anderson-Emmons. I was so down bad for the middle of Miranda when I was like eight. You can listen to Dinners on Me wherever you get your podcasts. The music industry is famous, or perhaps infamous, for being quite unstable, demanding, but you have had one great source of stability throughout your entire career, which is your husband, Robert. Yes! How long have you two been together?

We were married for 50 years last year. Congratulations. 51 this July, yeah. What do you think the secret is to a long-lasting marriage? When we travel together, I think, you know, when you're together all the time, it's a good thing. Now, you don't have children and neither do I. Yeah.

And that's why I'm very passionate about asking women who don't have children how they have navigated their life? Well, I left it too late, to be honest, to get pregnant. Because when I did get pregnant, when I was 39, it didn't last very long, a couple of months, you know, and I had a miscarriage. Yeah. I didn't dwell on it, though, you know, because what's to be will be, you know. I always had a feeling, though, that it was a boy. I don't know why, but it's in my mind that I would have had a boy, you know. Yeah, we had a miscarriage, but I've got so many nieces and nephews,

and one of them lives with me and his partner, John. So Chris, Christopher, and John, they'll be there now when I go home. I've got 16 nieces and nephews, and I see a lot of them, you know. We're a very close family, you know. And we've got another one on the way. Chloe's pregnant now and she's due next week. Oh, that's so lovely. Yeah.

And the strange thing is, right, me and Chloe, we like clones, you know. She looks like me. She, you know, of course, she's only in her 20s. But when I was her age, we were like twins. You know what I mean? Very often I used to say to her, you know, darling, don't leave it too late now because she got married a couple of years ago. Don't leave it too late like I did, you know, because you may regret it, you know. I said, we left it a little bit too late and, you know, we had miscarriage when I was 39.

And I think she must have taken it in because she's got a baby girl coming and I'm hoping to see her next week. That's beautiful. Thank you so much for talking about that. I'm someone who doesn't have children and I've also had miscarriages have you had a couple of you I've had three oh dear god but so I understand a little of what that is like yeah and I also although none of them was as late as your mother's and actually even thank god thank god yeah even the term miscarriage for what

your mother went through is not appropriate but i can understand a little of the grief because really you're grieving and something that never happened you're grieving in absence as well as a presence and it's very powerful when women like you share your stories well what I did, I wrote all my feelings down in a book, right? Not in a book to sell. Yes. In a journal. Something, you know, and I've put it at the back of the cupboard somewhere. I think that's so wise because actually you need it. Well, you will know that as a songwriter yourself, you need to put your feelings onto the page or somewhere so that they no longer

eat you up from the inside. Yeah, I think it helps to write it down, write down your feelings. And actually, I'm not a great songwriter. I'm very lucky that I work with incredible songwriters. I have written songs and my brother's a rock singer, you know, in a band called Sunshine Carbon Co. And they work in like regularly every week still. And he's like, he's my little brother, right? But he's 60. Anyway, I used to write some songs with him, you know, and a couple of other people.

But I've never had a hit with my own songs, you know what I mean? Well, it's not too late, Bonnie. You're still going, you're still churning them out. I think maybe you should write a song for your 75th birthday. I'm 73 in June. Don't jump two years ahead. I was just thinking of the next significant one. But how do you feel being in your 70s? I mean, you look like you're in your 30s, but how does it feel? No, I don't look like I'm in my 30s. But I, you know, I did have a knee operation before Christmas.

I had an old skin injury, cracked my meniscus bone, and it gave me jip. All these years later, I had this when I was in my 30s. But I had to have an operation. But anyway, the surgeon said, it's going to take six weeks. I said, I haven't got six weeks. I got two weeks. I'll be on that plane in two weeks. Nonetheless, I say so, he said.

I was. I feel yet you have a history of defying surgeons' advice. Yes, yes. Your third and final failure. In your words, I'm not too good at getting rid of things. So are you a hoarder? No, my dress room at home and in Portugal is rammed, jammed, you know. I do have a clear out now and then and give it to my nieces

you know but um I'm due for another one now all the cabbets are all full all wardrobes and I got all around the whole huge room and I've got rails everywhere you know know, I've got to wade through the rails, you know. But mostly I wear jackets and trousers and I don't hoard. I'm not a hoarder as you see these on the television, you know. And my kitchen cupboards. I think we've all got every gadget that's ever gone. My latest is the air fryer. Oh, are you one of those? But I actually like that.

Yeah, they sound brilliant. And I have a thermostat a thermomix thermomix my parents are obsessed with always brilliant we got one in portugal anatomia so the clothes do you hold on to them because they are full of memories well some of them, I actually have got a big trunk in my attic from Bobby Wayne and the Dixies days, right? Well, you would never believe the size that I used to be. I used to be probably what you would call a size six now. I'm a size 14 now and a 16 jacket. I was always tiny, tiny like Chloe is.

Even now, she's only got the baby bump, you know. And Chloe, my niece, was having a baby next week. I have a trunk with clothes from them days, because it's like, it is memories, you know. And my hot pants, you know, they were about this big, you know. I'm doing this on a podcast. So what do you fear would happen if you let all of that go oh I probably should it's ridiculous I don't know when I even looked in that trunk last must be 20 years or something you know they probably I don't know if they can get through a metal trunk I don't know it's probably m get through a metal trunk, I don't know. It's probably moth-ridden.

I feel that there's something so beautiful about you, which is how rooted you are, how grounded you are, in spite of all the incredible success and legendary status you've achieved. And maybe you understand the profound importance of staying true to your past self. And maybe that's what it's about. I wonder. I am down to earth and everybody tells me all that's what it's about. I wonder. I am down to earth and everybody tells me, a funny thing is, before I came here, there was two guys at the hotel, you know, and they walked in and they saw me and my husband.

And one of the young boys said to me, well, said to us, gosh, you look so well-dressed and so you look like celebrities. So anyway, we were still waiting for our taxi to come, right? And we were waiting for a while. And he said, well, what do you do? And I said, actually, I only told him, you know, I said, I'm Bonnie Tyler.

And he was a very young boy. He must have been about 21, something like that. And his mate was the same. He had his laptop with him. He Googled it straight away. And he said, my God, you've got four million people on, what do you call it, you know? And, yeah, I don't normally do that, you know. I don't say, well, I actually embody Tyler.

And he said, but what's your husband do? I said, well, he's an Olympian. He went to the Olympics in 1972, way before you were born. As a judo champion, right? Judo. Yeah, he's a third Dan Blackbelt, you know. That's extraordinary. Yeah.

And the thing is, in them days, Olympians weren't paid anything. He had to work and train. He had no money. We got together and everything. And in the end, very successful. We had clubs and things. And very successful personally, too, as a unit. Yes.

50 years, so congratulations on that. Thank you. Oh, Bonnie Tyler, I can't tell you how much I've loved this conversation. I would love to draw this part to a close by asking you what you think your parents would say to you. They must have been so proud of you. I think they'd say, my mother said to me, you know,

keep the family like this, she said, right? Yes. Keep the family like this. And we are. You're so close to that. And I think she'd say, doing a great job of all of you

sticking together, all of you being the family you are, you know? And it's because of my mother and my father, you know? You'll have me crying again now. I'm so sorry. I'm going to stop. I'm going to stop now. But I'm so excited for you to meet your newest niece next week.

I am. I don't know what they're going to call her. I mean, Bonnie is a great name. Oh, and do you know Chloe, right, who's having the baby? Her second name is Gaynor. Yeah, her sister named her after me, you know, my sister Avis, who's also a brilliant singer, by the way. But she sings for the church and charities and things, you know.

Lovely. Well, I think being an aunt is a beautiful role to and i think i'm a good auntie i can tell you're a good auntie i want you to be mine so we need to talk after this now don't go anywhere because we're going to ask you about listener failures on failing with friends okay and we're going to have agony auntie gainer on that show but But Bonnie Tyler, I cannot thank you enough for gracing me. I really enjoyed it, Elizabeth. Thank you so much. I've loved it. Thank you so much. Don't forget, I continue my chat with Bonnie Tyler over on Failing With Friends,

my subscriber series. Here's a bit more of what you can expect. How old do you feel inside? My 40s. Yeah. I feel 32. I remember asking my mother when she was in her 70s, what's it like, mum, you know, when you get older, how do you feel? I feel like I'm in my 30s, she said. So interesting, isn't it? Souls never age. And remember to follow us to get new episodes as they land wherever you get your podcasts on spotify amazon music or apple podcasts and please share a link with everyone you know this is an elizabeth day and sony music entertainment original podcast thank you so much for listening.