HR BESTIES - Bosses Behaving Badly

Episode Date: November 1, 2023

TODAY'S AGENDA AND NOTES: One of our own behaved badly ... with a pumpkin! And it cost her a job! Inappropriate behavior, like the CEO and Chief People Officer at McDonald's creating a party atmosphere at work, is the big agenda-item for today. (Happy Meal, anyone?) We also discuss power dynamics in such situations, where employees may feel uncomfortable or unable to report inappropriate behavior due to the positions of the individuals involved. This week's sponsors are: Hello Fresh — use code 50HR to save 50% and get free shipping To learn more about the HR Besties, grab merch and reach out for partnerships, visit HRBesties.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Did I ever tell you all about the time I got fired because of a work Halloween pumpkin carving contest? Oh, do tell. It sounds juicy. This is pretty ridiculous. Back in 2013, we had a pumpkin carving contest. I went out, I bought like 30 pumpkins for every department. Everyone got their department, you know, and we put them all in the front lobby so everyone could come by and see. But for some reason, mine was an issue. I had done Miley Cyrus, peak Miley Cyrus 2013. I did cute

little space buns, her tongue hanging out like that. You carved that into a pumpkin? No, I painted it. Oh, okay. I am pretty artsy. We should put a picture in the show notes. Look at me talking like I know what the fuck I'm saying. The Robin Thicke, the Amaze performance inspiration. Inspiration, decoration. But within an hour, I have a call from our general manager being like, you need to go remove your pumpkin. And I'm like,

which pumpkin? Like, I'm not thinking she's means my pumpkin. Cause it's not like I have naked Miley Cyrus. I just have a face with two little mini pumpkins, like her space buns. And she's like, no, your pumpkin. And so I walk up there. The HR leader. Yeah, me. The only HR over the entire company. Go up there, get my pumpkin, and I come back and she calls me back again. Did you remove it? Yes, ma'am, I did. She's like, we need to talk. And I was like, oh, fuck. A ma'am, too.

Yeah. Yes, ma'am. Yeah. And so no sooner I get off the phone with her that the regional director of HR, who's over a bunch of properties, calls me. And yeah, so I got fired over a Miley Cyrus pumpkin. They fired you for that? Yeah. Why?

They should have promoted you for being able to do more than a couple triangles and some jagged teeth pumpkin. You know what I mean? That would have been mine. That's talent. I think I got fired because my pumpkin would have won. I'm just going to put that out there. Yeah. Because see, I would have had the pumpkin that just said ditto on it with like an arrow to like a

cooler pumpkin. You know what I mean? Like I would have had that, right? For sure. Yeah. Why did they fire you? Like, why did they say it was so offensive? Cause the tongue or what? What material was the tongue? It was, um, the felt shit you buy in the, like a craft store, like a Michael's. I mean, I did it all myself. Like I thought, and I had like a newborn at home. Like you worked hard to get fired is what you're saying. Yeah. Did you take it home and put it on your front porch? I did take it home. I was very proud of that pumpkin. They didn't go and bash it in the parking lot and had you watch.

I know. Gosh. I worked really hard. Do you have the termination form from that? I don't. That would be a framer. It goes on the fridge. It goes on the fridge. Yes. And then take like a Polaroid of the pumpkin and, ooh, I should hang that in my office. Too bad I don't. That would be a framer. It goes on the fridge. It goes on the fridge. It goes on the fridge. Yes. And then take like a Polaroid of the pumpkin and, ooh, I should hang that in my office. Too bad I don't have that anymore. I was quite upset because I thought that was the lamest termination reason. And like my husband's like, you should sue.

And I'm like, that's not worth it. I don't even like that job. Pumpkin claim protected class Tennessee. Oh, it is protected, isn't it? Yeah, it's protected. It should be if it's not. You know, Miley, if you're listening, I would like the one month of compensation until I got another job. That's fair.

Oh, I agree with that. Back pay. Yeah, back pay. Make you whole. 2013. Don't worry. I wasn't making a whole lot of money back then. Did they just hate her music?

I think she was just controversial at the time because of her VMA performance so your values didn't align with the values of the organization exactly that lady was a see you next Tuesday anyway she um I was hell-bent on trying to get pantyhose removed from the dress code and she refused the Norma Rae cause right there. Thank you for your service. Oh, my God. Like, I worked so hard and she was like, no. And so we had all these beautiful women in sales and they had to wear pantyhose. Did the men have to wear pantyhose? Yeah, they did, too. All the way up to their balls.

I would have worked there to see that. Oh, okay. They tucked. Tucked. They tucked. Tucked. So for the sake of time, since we do have a hard stop, over to Jamie to run through the agenda for today's meeting. I'm going to kick it off with our cringy corporate speak.

And then I'm going to pass it to Ashley with our hot topic of leaders behaving badly. And apparently Ashley has a juicy story for us. Tasty. And then we're going to round it out with some Qs and Cs. Yeah, some questions and comments. I love it. All right. So let's jump into our cringy corporate speak. Today's word is unpack. Oh, gosh. Let's unpack that. Let's unpack that. I just hate when that's said in a meeting. Like there's a lot to unpack here. It's like, well, no shit. That's why we're having a meeting. Right. I think the

only like business that should do that UPS. Yeah. Right. Like if you're in shipping, wouldn't that be cute? Totally. Yeah. Like anything like headquarters is like a mile from where we are right now. We'll drive by there later. Yeah. A 100%. Oh, God. But if you're in shipping, yeah. That is cute. That's fresh, right? If you're Amazon, that's fresh. You know, let's unpack that. You know, they have all this like, all those funny little quips they probably have.

Yeah. Maybe. I don't know. I just made that up. But no. If you're in a meeting, we got a lot of shit to talk about, guys. Yeah. That's the point of a fucking meeting.

I'm listening. I am listening. I got you. Talk to me like it is. Let's unpack that like you're a psychiatrist, you know? So, Ashley. Speaking of unpack. Yeah, let's unpack.

Leaders behaving badly. Some leaders behaving badly. I can't wait to hear the story. And guys that are listening, we have not heard this yet. So you are going to get our real reactions to the story. If you remember some wisdom that we got from the great HR guru, Dave Ramsey. Oh, yes. He had all the tips, a dozen of them for good hires. And one of them was to hire people, people like you, because thoroughbreds run with thoroughbreds. And the

story I have proves that to be true, which is the story of executives at America's favorite McDonald's chain. So McDonald's CEO, Steve Easterbrook, he was CEO a few years back and he had worked out of the London office and he met a colleague that he really got along with named David Fairhurst, who was chief people officer. So when they were in the London office and then all of a sudden Easterbrook was coming to the U.S., he brought his thoroughbred, his David Fairhurst, 100% to come work with them. Well, a lot of times you hear from people saying executives, they never get called out for their behavior. But the reason I know these things is because they've been reported in many, many news articles. So as the story goes, the culture at McDonald's was not just about the tasty, juicy burgers and the patties and the making food,

but it was that party, fun, loving atmosphere that was going down in McDonald's U.S. headquarters. Wow. Led. Nobody can party like a CEO and chief people officer. That is actually facts. Yes. Hashtags. CEO and chief people officer. That is actually facts. But the epilogue of this story in part is that so many people know about this because people had to then talk about what happened because in this party atmosphere, there were things like the open bar, the party open bar, the allegations that those leaders were telling recruiters to hire the young,

pretty females and keep that party going. But at the party, I like to have specifics and paint a picture. Like they were hiring groupies, like their own groupies for these parties? You know, and in the party atmosphere, as you like to have a picture, like be specific. Well, there were not just one or a few, but 30 employees reported in the ensuing investigations that the chief people officer had employees, pretty female, come sitting on his lap at these party atmospheres. Was it a Christmas party and was he Santa? Dick in a box. Oh my God.

But so the challenge is that these leaders at the top, and so what you see happen in these stores is people think that they are, well, I was going to say untouchable, but maybe that's not exactly what I mean in that situation. But you had allegations. But when your boy, your thoroughbred gets accused of things and you want to keep them going, then you don't exactly then you don't exactly report that. You don't take action. Where do you go if you can't go to the chief people officer or the CEO? If you look and you see the chief people officer and he is having people come and sit on his lap, then when you're experiencing something, who are you going to go to the chief people officer or the CEO. Right. If you look and you see the chief people officer and he is having people come and sit on his lap, then when you're experiencing something, who are you going to go to? Who do you report that to? When the policies often will tell you

to go to those very people. Well, then when it came out, of course, in fact, Steve Easterbrook was having relationships with different employees. But part of the problem is that not only was the CEO fired, but immediately the chief people officer was as well. But that's not where the end of the story is, because some of the people that don't like that are shareholders in the organization. So the shareholders, McDonald's is publicly traded, had sued McDonald's and sued, including the chief people officer personally, saying that as head of HR, it was his responsibility not to keep the party going, but that he actually had to do that due diligence and make sure that the CEO was keeping in control. So the party atmosphere that was happening at this burger chain has made all these news. And it was a groundbreaking lawsuit where a judge had held that it could proceed, that this chief people officer could potentially be responsible for his decision to allow this party atmosphere to continue. And so we won't get into the legalese because people don't want to hear about lawyer Ashley.

But the problem that happens is two things. One, there can be legal issues, but there's also reputational damage, not just for the organization, but for those people. So when you have that party atmosphere and you as a leader are emboldening it, then it can have ramifications for you personally. It's dangerous for the brand, the actual company, your personal brand. 100%. So what you're saying is McDonald's will never be a sponsor of this podcast, first and foremost. Yeah. Right. But I do have a question for you because I had not heard of this, right?

But that's okay because there's all sorts of leaders behaving badly all over the place. I can't hear about all of them. There's so many. But was this happening in the workplace? Like, was it open bar, like at headquarters? Like, were they doing like happy hours at work

or like, you know, how, do you know any details on the environment? If the ice cream machine was broken? Right, was Grimace there? That you can count on. Absolutely. I understand that the eighth floor of the corporate headquarters. And so in the challenge, the party floor, the eighth floor is the party floor. And so some of that challenge is then people say, oh, what does it have to be? This, this, oh, it can be the no fun zone. But there's quite a wide difference between the having a good time and having an open bar, especially in the suburbs of Chicago, where I have to imagine people are driving home from work.

So this is where, you know, this is where there's all the, where there are some of those. But again, you have these situations. But can you imagine being in these interviews and the 30 employees who are spoken to? And it has to be much, much more than that. And being that HR person and over and over. And do you have anything? Did you witness did did you witness the people officer? Did you see anything or anyone in his lap?

I mean, what kind of experience? Could you imagine sitting in a co-worker's lap, let alone the CPO? You know where my head immediately went, though, was like, if I was bring me back to like little 24 year old, cute, skinny Jamie in her, you know, her her corporate blazer. And if some man like the chief people officer was like, why don't you come have a sit on my lap? I literally would have been like, oh, gross. No, but I think so. But I think a lot of a lot of people, I think, don't you come have a sit on my lap? I literally would have been like, ew, gross. Nah. But I think so. But I think a lot of people, a lot of people, I think, don't have the courage or potentially the flair genes of 24-year-old Jamie.

Yeah, I would have been really cute in heels too. But you, but I think that's a challenge. People think like, I don't know, or I'm afraid to say no. But then my mind goes, would I have gotten fired? Oh, I know. Because I would have been that bitch. I would have been like, absolutely, I'm not sitting in your lap. Exactly. So then I been like, absolutely, I'm not sitting in your lap. Exactly. So then I'm like, but do I have to because I'm going to get fired? Yeah. You know.

And he's probably pulling people in. Everyone's drinking, right? Of course. He's probably just getting handsy and it's like, oh, you know, pulling people. Oh, exactly. I know. It's all funny. It's all funny.

I blow good. Come on, have a seat. Oh, my God. But the idea of these leaders behaving badly and some of these things. And there's people that are like, that sounds like fun, a good party atmosphere. The problem is, is it's not, it's the power dynamic is so skewed. It's so completely skewed. And so when people feel uncomfortable, they feel like, like they have to, they have to participate or they can't say anything. And even then you're talking to an HR person and they're saying, tell me what these people who make gazillion dollar salaries have chief in their name. You tell me about their

misdeeds. Even at the end of the day, you can give me all the like anti-retaliation in the world. It still feels incredibly uncomfortable. But why do these leaders do this? I think it's like a definite, the power dynamic. Yeah. The power dynamic. It's like, who the fuck are these people going to go to? Right. Like who are, where to go after the chief people, after the CEO? Oh, well, they're both partying. They're buddies. Yeah. Yeah, they're both doing it.

They're having to pass the girl off the laps. I mean, you know. But it's very much so the startup culture, right, that we hear in the news all the time, right, and the tech bros and all of this, right? And it's because, hey, you built this company. Yeah. You probably have never worked in a structured corporate environment. You're creating it from scratch. You don't even know what the functions do. And you're funding this with VC. Oh, exactly. Exactly. And they're treating it like college. You know what I mean? And I think there's a huge risk to that, right?

Someone coming in off the street, creating as brilliant as it is being an entrepreneur, but creating this type of environment. And, you know, the laws be damned. They have no idea what they are. They don't even know what HR even stands for, I swear. It's budget season. And I don't just mean corporate. As we get to the holidays, I'm trying to be mindful of my personal budget. Weekend Ashley will say, I'm going to cook from scratch this week. Then weekday Ashley says, I am too tired. I'll just order takeout. Then credit card bill Ashley thinks, okay, back to cooking, please. So when HelloFresh signed on as the very first sponsor of the HR Besties

podcast, I can say that it makes weekend, weekday, and credit card bill Ashley all very happy. Because it really is easy to cook yummy food. There's even 15-minute recipe options. And HelloFresh can be 25% cheaper than takeout. So I'm saving money too. This week we had shepherd's pie. I think I may have spent more time looking up why is it called shepherd's pie than cooking it. And as it turns out, there's a few reasons why it's called that that we debated as a family. But what we did not debate was that it tasted delicious and was easy to make. Go to HelloFresh.com slash 50HR and use code 50HR for 50% off plus free shipping. That's 50 as in five zero, not 50 like the word. So you don't even have to worry about spelling. Go to HelloFresh.com slash 50HR and use code 50HR for 50% off plus free shipping. HelloFresh. It's America's number one meal kit.

Have you seen leaders behaving badly like this? The McDonald's CEO? Any fun nuggets to share with us? One involved... Because I would like to know everything. Tell me everything. Oh, I love it. I love it. Unpack it for us, please. It was an executive

and it involved booger sugar. Booger sugars. Oh, okay. I got that now. That actually really makes it cute. It's drugs. Booger sugar. That's precious. Yeah. Like same thing, executive. So he I don't think he ever thought he would. It would have mattered or even getting caught in his position of power. And like he's offering it up to young interns and, and yeah.

Which offers like, again, like people like, oh, I guess I have to. Oh my God. Yeah. And, and so it created this very like unsafe place. Of course. To say the least. Yeah. And they were also terrified. Like, so apparently this was going on for years, but no one come forward until there was finally someone who felt strong enough. And I say that because it's not even about being brave. It's like literally they felt strong enough that they were like, I can do this. And then, you know, you investigate it. It's like, holy shit. And then, you know, you investigate it and it's like, holy shit. This man has been booger sugaring off women's tits on the eighth floor. Like, oh, my God. At work.

Mm hmm. Oh, my God. Oh, all right. Pretty wild. God. Yeah, that is. But that is wild. Like, I'm sure we all in all of our years put together, we all probably have like a crazy leaders behaving badly.

But it's not even just like the wild booger sugar stories. It's even the stories of just leaders being shitty leaders. Oh, of course. And like creating a toxic work environment. Yeah. And then I think. That's just poor leadership, which is like 80%. Right. It's 200%. Yeah. Yeah. And then it's like, how does HR deal with that?

Well, I'll tell you, I mean, I've definitely had some doozies in my career, you know, but what is so funny is, is that I don't necessarily go looking for it. Some things I can see, right? Like I've had the, you know, the alcoholic CEO that was just chugging mouthwash and drinking that with their coffee every day. You've got everything from that to, of course, the frontline supervisor having affairs in the janitorial closet. And then the wife starts writing letters and then comes in. And wow, boy, does that turn ugly. Dave Ramsey would not have allowed that. No. He wouldn't have.

No. Because he does the spousal date. The spousal date. He wouldousal date. So maybe we need to do the spousal dates more. I don't know. Right. Yeah. But then, you know, you've got, you know, the leader running the brothel, you know, at work, you know, and that is, boy, that really takes it to the next level. But, you know, besides those, to your point, Jamie, you know, you do have on the daily just leaders not doing the right thing. You know what I mean? And thankfully, that's the majority of leaders behaving badly. It's really not illegal stuff.

But it's funny. Like, I don't ever really as an HR leader. I'm not personally as a servant leader myself. I'm not. They make fun of me for being a servant leader. But it's like, you're never saying it. Oh, yeah, I know. But, you know, I'm never I'm never trying to set a leader up.

Like, I'm really not. Even my poor leaders, I'm always constantly trying to develop them, coach them. Like, I'm trying to get them there. But how I find out about things, employees, like, boy, they create dummy emails. And then they send you all this stuff. I have gotten so many mugshots from employees in my career of my leaders. It is ridiculous. I get the ransom notes, like literally like ransom, like they're cutting out letters. Look into this leader. This leader got arrested

on Friday. I mean, I've kept some of them. I put a couple on my fridge, like, you know, just some of the documents. I know exactly. Cause it's like, wow. Part couple on my fridge, like, you know, just some of the documents. I know, exactly. Because it's like, wow. You did a lot of work. Part of me is like, well, I'm part of me is like, I'm so thankful that, you know, they entrusted me with this. They knew I was going to do something about it. But I also hate that they feel like they have to be so confidential and anonymous. And that just goes to show the power yielding of some leaders and how unsafe of an environment they're creating with their workforce.

Right. It's I think that the biggest I agree like that, like the McDonald's type story. That's wild. There's a reason that that makes headline. It's unbelievable and other things like that. But the biggest issue I see is leaders who aren't thinking about how what they're doing appears from the employee perspective. So it's either that leader that's telling everyone to come back to the office while they're Zooming from, you know, I literally was about to say Tahiti, like that's weird, but like from there or from their vacation

house and having this and not understanding the realities of what it's like for that employee, or you have the employee serve it And to the point, when someone reports a leader for their mugshot, my guess is 98.7% of the time, that leader's first question is, who was it? How did they figure that out? It's the same. It's like, dude, why do you have a mugshot from Friday night? Let's unpack it. Let's unpack it. What did you do? You get the employee survey and you you get the different camps of employees.

What am I going to say? Am I going to tell the truth? Maybe it's not worth it. And then they tell something real. And the leader real quick is, you know, IT, HR, can you figure out who said what? And they turn it around and it's this obsession about who they are or this is my company. I'm an executive. Those are those narcissist leaders.

Like, okay, okay. Why does that make you any different from anybody else in the lifeblood? They're so far removed from all the other levels and the people that are actually doing the work of the organization. And so- The leader's behaving badly again. I agree. I think it's far too often. It's just making these decisions that are weird, that are super weird. Yeah, but it's also like... And illegal. Like just flat out morally, ethically wrong. Exactly. And then I think... Those are the baddies. I'm a rule follower. Ashley and I are both very rule follow.

I love how you leave me out of there. No, you were totally right to do that. You know, I don't follow all the rules. I'm the ask forgiveness person. You know what I mean? I like to mix it up a little bit. You know what I mean? But I just love how clean that was, though. My permission slip gets notarized in advance. Oh, my God. No, that ain't me. So you were spot on. No, go ahead. Y'all are rule followers. No, no, no, no, no, no. but i'm still an hr professional like yeah yeah i'm still a leader exactly yeah you know what i mean i'm not doing like all this illegal shit but yeah i get what you mean by that no i'm just saying i'm cutting corners okay i i know i know

nothing illegal though yeah just saying like it's honestly always surprising jenny's thinking real hard in her head right now what am i saying it's always really surprising. Jamie's thinking real hard in her head right now. What am I saying? It's always really surprising though, when like this gets brought up about a leader and then you're like, who the fuck raised them? I know. It's like, how did they get here? People so morally corrupt.

Money. I mean, a hundred percent. It's money. And you just feel, you feel so untouched. And a lot of them, they're like, it is like the Michael Scott mentality, like just looking for a good time. Just like everyone, everybody to come along and have a good time. And you're either on the

good time bus or you're on the bad time bus and get off my bus. If you are not here with me to have a good time, everybody get, get your work done, but come with me. We're, we're gonna, we're gonna have a good. Until you don't realize that your good time is many people's very bad time. And they are going to keep that in their pocket unless and until they bring that out. And you're like, what the fuck? I thought we were having a good time. Now we're not trying to make all leaders good today, right? Because leaders behaving badly means what? Employment for HR professionals, right? 100%. Thank you for my job. I know.

Thank you. Thank you so much. Again, we always circle back around to job security for the attorneys in the room, right? Thank you, leaders, right? Nobody's perfect. And we do not expect perfection. No. And I'm not perfect.

I mess up all the time. Exactly. And I'm not perfect. And I think that's a lot of the questions and, I mean, comments we get on our social media is we don't say that we are perfect by any means. And we make mistakes. And, you know, me being a leader in my company, I know that I've made questionable probably decisions myself. But we're also not doing booger sugar off of somebody. That.

I'm not doing that off no one's ass in the workplace. You've never had a booger sugar? No. No, but I'm not. Yeah, to your point. You know what I mean? Right? Gosh. So to that point, what a riveting hot topic, right? I'm sure we'll explore leaders behaving badly in the future. There's just so much to unpack with a topic like that. Am I right? Am I right? You like that, right? So yes, yes. So again, for the sake of time, I know we do have a hard stop. Jamie does. Jamie always has a hard stop. We do have

some Q's and C's. Again, questions and comments. Does anyone have a question or a comment that they would like to share? I have a comment. So as we were actually discussing the imbalance of power and the power dynamic, really thought of something that was real big in the 90s, a scandal that happened. Oh, do tell. Bill and Monica. Gosh. God, you had, oh man. Yeah. Leaders behaving badly. Yeah. The ultimate example, isn't it? Yeah. Oh, damn.

And an intern, the exploitation of power. Yeah, an intern. I like, did you watch the American Crime Story on that? No. Oh, it's- But I will, because boy, I'm a slut for a documentary. Well, it's not, it's a, it's actress, actresses playing it. Oh, that one, yes.

It is, it is very good.'s it's actress actress is playing it but it is it is it's it was it's it it is very good and it reminds you of that power and balance now what I love is how she's been unpacking that throughout the years though and she is so freaking funny on x or twitter whatever you know what I mean like come on and you know it's funny big fan you know sherm oh I knew you were going to bring that up. I was waiting for that. Bill Clinton speak leadership on motivation or leadership empowerment. What's the topic? I think it was something about leadership, which is servant leadership.

Yeah, he is servant. I think, never mind. Oh, no, no, no, no. Oh, my gosh. That was, that was, that was really, that was really. That's quite the comment. Yeah. Okay, sorry.

I have a comment. So as I talk about McDonald's, you know, what's interesting is in the franchising context. And so McDonald's restaurants, some in any type of, you know, fast food industry called QSR, quick service restaurants. There are things like corporate stores, and that's where the company makes that decision. So those would be owned by a big company like a McDonald's or any of those, but most of them often are franchisees. And what that can present is often franchisees may have like a few restaurants. And so the interesting thing you'll often see when things are reported, like recently, I think it was at a McDonald's a few months ago, and there was a sign that was posted that said, you have to get manager's permission to quit.

Oh, my God. Gross. I just threw up in my mouth. And the headlines were all McDonald's says you have to get a manager's permission. And of course, McDonald's corporate is towing this line where they're like, not me. I don't know. I don't know her. But the franchisees, which are often these at times, it may have been someone that inherited that restaurant from their family.

They do not have the robust training that ostensibly McDonald's corporate chef. And so it's always interesting to lawyer Ashley when you see it, because every time I see one of those headlines, I giddily click it because I'm sure it is going to end up being a franchisee and how they navigate the PR aspects of like, that's not us, but yes, that's us. And so when you see those headlines, I encourage you to click it and see if they talk about that franchisee franchise or relationship, because that's that's where the lawyer actually takes over. Oh, my gosh. Well, you can't you can't let me quit, but you can't let me quit. Yeah. But but when I don't show up anymore, how about that? You can't quit without permission. Can I quit? You may not. All right. I will see you tomorrow. Thank you. Well, not a question, but a comment. And, you know, this whole talk about really food service

reminds me of my first job, which was actually in a restaurant in high school. So I started in food service like so many. I think I saw some stat that like one in five American workers have worked at McDonald's at some point in their career. Something, in five American workers have worked at McDonald's at some point in their career. Something, you know, I never worked at McDonald's, but I did work at Chewy's Tex-Mex. And I'm going to do a shout out for Chewy's. Okay. They're out of Austin. Absolutely adorning. That's my first job. Yep. And I'm in San Antonio. But, you know, I didn't actually mean to get a job there. What happened was, is that a high school friend of mine was like, Hey, I'm trying to get a job at this new restaurant. This is back in the

day when they were first starting. I'm trying to get a job at this new restaurant. Will you come with me? You remember how it was always the buddy system, like in high school and in university. Where we work in the summer. Exactly. Exactly. So I was like, okay, yeah, sure. I'll go with you. You know? And I ended up in an interview, like an impromptu, I didn't know it was like an open interview time. And the guy said, so tell me about yourself, whatever. And why do you want to work here? And I said, well, I've always wanted to work at Chili's. I said the totally wrong place. And he goes, well, that's fantastic, but this is Chewy's. And I was like, well, I've always wanted to work at Chewy's as well.

I know you misheard me. I've wanted to work anywhere with a C. OK, but but I got the job. And so my first job was as a hostess. And there's, of course, numerous stories from that. But cheers to food service and beginning your career there, because, boy, do you learn about people. Oh, my gosh.

You know what I mean? Yes. That is a crash course. You know, that would be a fun fact. Like, I wonder how many HR. For real. Have done retail. Have worked in retail or food service.

And obviously. Better than the 90%. I know. Because you are masochistic as well. Yeah. Right. So on that note, thank you so much to the other masochists out there that work in HR for listening to this episode of HR Besties, where we talk business and BS.