Judge John Hodgman - Animal Crossing Examination

Episode Date: August 5, 2020

Kelly brings the case against her wife, Maureen. They both play the video game Animal Crossing: New Horizons. Kelly says that Maureen is adept at earning bells, which is the game’s currency. Kelly would like Maureen to share her profits, but Maureen is opposed. Who's right? Who's wrong?It's the final week of MaxFunDrive! Thank you so much to everyone who has become a member, boosted or upgraded their membership, remained a member, and spread the word! Every little bit helps and we are so appreciative of all of you. If you want to join the fun, visit maximumfun.org/join!Thank you to Briana O'Sullivan & Emily JoAnn Holasek for naming this week’s case! To suggest a title for a future episode, follow Judge John Hodgman on Facebook. We regularly put out a call for submissions.

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Kelly brings the case against her wife Maureen. They both play the video game Animal Crossing New Horizons. Kelly says that Maureen is adept at earning bells, which are the game's currency. Kelly would like Maureen to share her profits. Maureen is opposed. Who's right? Who's wrong? Only one can decide. is opposed. Who's right? Who's wrong? Only one can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents an obscure cultural reference. Listen to me, Copper Top. We don't have time for 20 questions. That's it. Bailiff Jesse Thorne, swear them in. Kelly and Maureen, please raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth,

the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? So help you God or whatever? I do. I do. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the narrow range of fruit trees he owns? I do. I do. Judge Hodgman, you may proceed. That's got to be an Animal Crossing reference, correct? Bailiff Jesse Thorne? Yeah, I can't say that I've played Animal Crossing since my senior year of college, 2003 with my friend Nathaniel Chapman in our apartment in the Beach Flats in Santa Cruz, California. But I remember it was really important to have different kinds of fruit trees. You need different kinds of fruit trees in this life.

Kelly and Maureen, you may be seated for an immediate summary judgment in one of your favors. Can either of you name the piece of culture that I referenced as I entered this courtroom? Kelly, let's start with you. Is that from The Matrix or one of the movies? Is that from The Matrix or one of the movies? More a question than an answer. Feels like I remember hearing Coppertop from there, but it's been a long time.

Okay. Shall we say The Matrix or one of the matrices? Yeah, or one of the many matrices, yes. One of the matrices. I'll allow that. Coppertop maybe was Cornel West's character in Matrix 2. They had an underground rave. Maureen, what is your guess?

Yes, I have no idea. I did not prepare for this. There's no way to prepare. Because you know why? I'm like a trickster. I'm like a Tanuki. I'm like a Tom Nook, a Japanese raccoon dog. Tricking you.

Always mixing it up. There was nothing you could guess. You want to guess one anyway? I'm going to go for specifics with The Matrix 2 since she said The Matrix in case you don't give it to her for being a general trilogy. I love specificity. Did you mean to say The Matrix 2 Reloaded or The Matrix? Two Reloaded. I'm going to go for the middle one. I see. Because I'm here at WERU up here in Orland, Maine, in a hermetically sealed room, looking through a cloudy glass window at Joel

Mann, our summertime stoic producer up here. How are you, Joel? I'm doing very well, Judge. Right. So we're adapting to some new audio, not only a whole new world of social distancing, but also some new audio tech here as we record up here. Did you hear Maureen say the Matrix 2 reloaded or just the Matrix? Just the Matrix.

Yeah, that's what I heard too. I mean, I heard not two. I only heard the Matrix. Because guess what? Kelly and Maureen, you guessed the Matrix. You're both right. We both win. You cancel each other out.

But even if only, Kelly, you had guessed the Matrix Marine, you had guessed the Matrix 2 Reloaded. I still would not have given it to Kelly. Do you know why, Kelly Marine? No. Because you didn't name the character. Look, there are a lot of Matrix quotes. Long, recognizable ones. Kelly, I applaud you for of Matrix quotes, long, recognizable ones. Kelly, I applaud you for remembering that term, copper top,

which is a reference to the fact that Neo, Keanu Reeves, as we all know in the matrices, begins life in the simulation. He doesn't realize that he is a human battery. So they call him copper top. But who calls him copper top? Kelly or Maureen? Going once, going twice? No sale.

Morpheus? No. Switch. Oh, that makes sense. Minor character. Yeah, Switch, like Nintendo Switch, which is what you play Animal Crossing's on. Oh.

See? So clever. And what I did not learn, Kelly and Maureen, and this is a short quote, but this is a long explanation. What I did not know until I was frantically coming up with a cultural reference in the dirt parking lot of WERU here in Orland, Maine, 89.9 Blue Hill at 99.9 Bangor, and online at WERU.org. I did not know that the character Switch,

portrayed in The Matrix by Belinda McClory, was called Switch because they had different genders inside The Matrix and out, at least as originally scripted. Oh, wow. Yeah, I know. Cool, right? That's so cool. That's so cool.

Yeah. I mean, it's why not i mean well we know why not it was 1999 yeah warner brothers freaked out couldn't handle it but i mean within the world of the matrix it would make a million times sense that you would have a character who as scripted switch was gender assigned at birth male in the real world of the Nebuchadnezzar, like underwater spaceship or whatever it is, but in the simulation switched to present as female. And Warner Brothers said, uh, no. Boo.

But in any case, I'm sure they would do it differently now. That was the origin. It was so fascinating. So anyway, here we are. This is not about the Matrix. This is about Animal Crossing. Who comes to my court to seek justice? Maureen or Kelly?

I do, Kelly. Kelly, what is the nature of the injustice that you face? Well, Your Honor, back in March when Animal Crossing New Horizons was released, my wife Maureen and I both purchased copies of it. We're both very big gamers. We actually met gaming. And we decided to have our own islands, but they would be like sister islands.

So we decided to help each other out as we built these islands. At the same time, we ended up coming down with COVID very shortly after we bought the game. So the game became very important to us. It was the only thing that we could do from our beds for the month that we were very, very, very sick. I am so sorry. I mean, obviously, Animal Crossing New Horizons has been important to a lot of people's lives during this time of social isolation and staying at home.

Never mind having COVID. Would you feel comfortable describing what the experience was like? Sure. We had similar experiences, but I'll let Maureen tell her own. I have lupus. So for me at the beginning, I was like, is this a lupus flare? But I pretty quickly got very sick I did have some difficulty breathing and needed an inhaler and had to use a CPAP machine which I had never used just during the day to kind of get some oxygen in at times I was one of the

first people I knew to get H1N1 back in the day. And at the time, I said, this is the sickest I've ever been outside of lupus. I would definitely say COVID beat that. It was very painful as far as the coughing was very hard, difficult to breathe, the headaches, all over fatigue. It was definitely a very rough illness. For lots of people who get COVID-19 and are diagnosed, you know, who recover at home, as you did more or less, what people don't know is that the recovery is extremely prolonged. Yes. And you're uncomfortable for a very, very long time, but it really takes quite a bit out of you. Yes.

I would say even now we are still two degrees recovering. I still have some difficulty breathing. I still need an inhaler. Right. And I would say that I've definitely not gotten my sort of pre-COVID strength back. And, of course, it triggered a lupus flare, too. So that was fun. Maureen, was your case of COVID as severe, would you say?

It was not. Great. I find in Kelly's favor. Thank you very much. This is the sound of a gavel. I mean, it was horrible. No, mine was more mild for sure. I had a lot of joint pain. I had very, very bad fatigue. I had a lot of gastrointestinal issues and headaches. I had less the shortness of breath, the classic shortness of breath and coughing, which I think really takes the cake, but it's not the illness Olympics. And I understand from my briefing here that you are in St. Louis, Missouri. That's correct. Yeah. And how is Missouri doing, in your opinion? Very bad.

Governor Parsons is kind of like, open it up. Yeah. That's how I feel. I've got a message from mike parson governor of missouri you know missouri is called right jesse thorn oh what's that john the show me state mike parson you got shown kelly maureen it's not a joke not jokes not a hoax not at all people are sick and suffering you got shown i'm sure he listens to this podcast. Right?

Probably that's true. Kelly Maureen, I'm very glad that you're recovering as best as you can. I hope you're as okay as possible. Thank you for joining us on the Judge Sean Hodgman podcast. I'm glad that you have enough personal, physical, and emotional reserve, having faced this disease and continue to face it i'm glad you have enough emotional and physical reserve to get really petty and come on a podcast animal crossing glad there's still that space in your life hey joel band you ever play animal? No idea what you're talking about. Okay.

Maureen, tell Joel what Animal Crossing is and why it's so compelling. Okay, Joel. There is Tanuki who's going to give you a loan to build a house to make friends with the neighboring animals, and they will sometimes give you presents. Wow. Joel. That sounds like fun. Do you know what a tanuki is? Nope. It's a Japanese raccoon dog. Well, there you have it. Famous in Japanese and Asian folklore in general.

Embodied in Animal Crossing by the character of Tom Nook, who is kind of the godfather of the Animal Crossing world. Accurate accurate he owns a shop he loans you money that you have to repay by working for him and you play and you can correct me maureen kelly where i get wrong because i have not played or seen any of this new animal crossing all my information goes back to animal crossing City Folk circa 2008 on the Wii. But you play a human living in a open-ended world full of anthropomorphic animals,

and basically you build a life for yourself. You get a house, or you get a mortgage for a house from Tom Nook, predatory lender. You furnish it with stuff you buy from Tom Nook. I mean, if he's a tanuki, he's literally a predatory lender, right? Yeah, that's right. They are predatory animals, right? I think they seek prey and they seek high interest rates. Everyone knows, right, Jesse? Yeah. Yeah. And this all happens in Missouri? Everyone knows, right, Jesse?

Yeah. Yeah. And this all happens in Missouri? Correct. Okay. All right, Joel. Getting a little too feisty across the glass. That all happens in the video game.

In the video game, you make money, which is called bells. Instead of dollars, they have bells, by working and by raising what, Kelly? By raising fruit trees, by raising turnips, and in particular playing the stalk market. S-T-A-L-K. Yes. Yes, Your Honor. So essentially, you purchase turnips from your local turnip vendor every Sunday, hopefully at a good price, preferably below 100 bells. And then you have two options. You can wait on your island and watch the turnip price fluctuate throughout the week

and hope you get a really good deal. Or you can be bold and meet other people who are playing Animal Crossing and see if they have a better deal to sell and then sell your turnips on their island. So Kelly and Maureen, the stock market is kind of at the center of your debate, correct? Yes. All right. You have separate islands. That is to say, you each have your own sort of world. You are not collaborating. Correct? Correct. Not directly correct. And so Kelly, what is Maureen doing in the stock market that brings you to this court? Well, Maureen is very, very good at playing the stock market. Buy low, sell high.

Exactly. She immediately dived into that area of the game. She was able to network with other random players and go onto their islands and sell for very high. She also does something called time traveling, which allows her to buy turnips multiple times per week, per our week, and sell them multiple times. So she's a bit of a trickster as well. Wait a minute, Maureen, are you a Time Lord? Are you a Doctor Who? I am the Doctor Who of Animal Crossing, yes. What is time traveling in the game? It was previously quite frowned upon by the Animal Crossing community.

And there was a character who would come yell at you when you do it. It's when you change the clock on your console. So for me, I change it on the Nintendo Switch. Because the game operates in real time each day. It's set to your console clock. So I'm like, alright, I'm gonna change my clock till tomorrow so that I can play tomorrow today

instead of going to bed like a normal human being. So you're hacking the system. Yes. You're putting a glitch in the matrix. Oh, no. It came full circle.

You're seeing two cats instead of one. Because, if I understand this correctly, you can only purchase turnips on a certain day, and you're tricking the program into thinking it's that certain day, day after day after day. Correct. Correct. All right.

And you say this was previously frowned upon by the Animal Crossing community, which, correct, I would frown. I'm frowning. Sorry. Frown. If you're a Doctor Who, you're supposed to be out there saving the day, not hoarding turnips. Yeah, I bet Doctor Who doesn't even have two or three turnips.

I'd say maximum Doctor Who has five turnips. But Jesse Thorne, can I tell you something? At some point, Jesse, you and I really should have, maybe we should do this someday for a MaxFunDrive special episode, like bonus content for members only. Because you, Jesse Thorne, are an expert in men's garb. Yeah, true. I would really love to sit down with you and hear your opinion and reaction to the clothing of every Doctor Who.

Because some of them get a little wacky. Yeah, I'm all for that. Sold. That's good, right? that sold that's good right the sixth doctor who not only wore sort of like a cricket sweater and white pants and trainers everywhere he dressed like a cricket batter all the time but he also wore a tan jacket with red piping around the lapel and on lapel, he pinned a stalk of celery for no reason. Wow. Could have been a turnip. That's like Prince Charles will wear a thistle on his lapel because he's king of Scotland or whatever.

Sure. I don't know exactly how it works. Sorry, Britons and citizens of the United Kingdom. But it was a celery stalk. That just indicates that probably that he likes to make sure he gets his fiber. Yeah. You know what, Jesse? I'm going to send you a picture of him wearing this celery stalk right now.

I just, I can't. And by the way, everybody, stop emailing me. Everyone's time traveling to email me angry letters right now, even though this hasn't even been released yet. Because I said the sixth doctor. It was the fifth doctor. peter davison stand by one second jesse i'm gonna send you a link oh wow yeah wait this guy's from uh is this guy from all creatures great and small yes he's the junior vet in all creatures great and small so in the television show dr who does he play tristan farnon from all creatures great and small but he became he becomes a time

lord or does he play one of the other characters from all creatures great and small who's become a time lord the bbc never aired the final episode of All Creatures Great and Small because it was too controversial. Because Tristan was made into a Time Lord at the end of it. It was a time lord. That is not in the books. You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast always brought to you by you, the members of MaximumFun.org. Thanks to everybody who's gone to MaximumFun.org slash join. And you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by our pals over at Made In.

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Save up to 25% this Memorial Day from the 18th until the 27th. Visit madeincookware.com. That's M-A-D-E-I-N cookware.com. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by the folks over there at Babbel. Did you know that learning, the experience of learning causes a sound to happen? Let's hear the sound. Yep. That's the sound of you learning a new language with Babbel. We're talking about quick

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our listeners right now. Get up to 60% off your Babbel subscription, but only for our listeners at babbel.com slash Hodgman. Get up to 60% off at babbel.com slash Hodgman spelled B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash Hodgman. Rules and restrictions apply. Anyway, you're a time traveler, Maureen. You're not using your powers for good. You're using your powers for acquisition. You're hoarding up turnips at a low price, selling them a time traveler marine. You're not using your powers for good. You're using your powers for acquisition. You're hoarding up turnips at a low price, selling them at a high price. What was the animal that would come and yell at you?

He was a mole, I think. He was Mr. Resetti, like reset. Like, hey, I caught you resetting your game. But did they take that feature out? Is that now just part of the game now that all norms are shattered and society's basically collapsed they're like do it do whatever you need to do yeah i think they were like you guys need this we're not gonna yell at you anymore which we took as permission and by we you mean you maen. I mean me and every other time travel, because it's quite popular right now to be a time traveler.

Well, as long as everyone's playing by the same rules. So, Kelly, I don't understand what the dispute is here. Maureen is playing the game her way. Hoarding turnips, time traveling. Sounds like a lot of fun. How is this frustrating you? Sure. So at the time, I felt that we were having and sharing a very collaborative Animal Crossing experience,

both as a partnership and as people with COVID recovering. And the first time that she actually made the bells, I will admit it was with my help. They were very low on my island and she was able to sort of sell them very high on her island. So that's where she learned the trick. So what you're saying is turnips, you sold turnips from your island to Maureen at a low price. She turned around, classic pump and dump, sold them for a high price. And she made a lot of bells as a result. Yes. And she did give me a portion.

That turned her into the wolf of Turnip Street. It did. It did. And I was, you know, just kind of accepting of it. And I took my portion of the profits and continued to pay off my mortgage. We then began to where I was able to gather and craft things for Maureen that she couldn't because partly she was busy making turnips or buying turnips and selling them. And so I felt that we had a sort of collaborative experience much like in our real lives where we share an income. We do share a lot of the same hobbies. As I said, we did meet through gaming. I feel that if she's going to continue to make these acquisitions, which is something she loves to do and something that I'm not very good at doing, and in fact, do not like to speak to strangers on other people's islands,

that she should split some of the profits with me, especially as I am busy creating things for her and finding her things she likes. I don't believe it should be 50%. I will say that. What's an example of something that you've created for her that she likes? So in the evidence I submitted, you'll see a picture of our Animal Crossing avatars on a shell set, sort of a pearlescent outside cafe area with a fountain and a table. And it's sort of a cute little area. And I created all of those for her. So we're going to share these images, obviously, on the show page at MaximumFun.org, as well as on our Instagram at JudgeJohnHodgman on Instagram. I just need to acknowledge the caption of this particular piece of evidence.

The caption is, important evidence showing how cute we are in game. And I absolutely have proven your case. Yeah, it's definitely adorbs yeah incredibly cute avatars but what you're trying to show here kelly is these pearlescent shells is that something you made in the game yes i made the entire furniture set for her as a gift or as part of my imaginary i guess exchange the partnership i believed you basically have your avatar swallow a grain of sand then you time travel forward far enough and then you vomit up one of these shoes exactly is that true no no no speculative on my part, admittedly. So these are two cute, for those listening,

these are two very cute, adorable avatars having a little afternoon hang by a table made out of an iridescent sand dollar that was created by Kelly in the game and sitting on little beautiful iridescent sand dollar that was created by Kelly in the game and sitting on little beautiful iridescent shelled stools also created I guess by you Kelly right? Yes. Right and whose island are you on who are you having this little party the smile party? It's on Maureen's this is Maureen. Okay Maureen I got it you're parten. Okay, Maureen, I got it. You're partying on your island with stuff that Kelly made for you,

and you don't want to give her any bells. You don't want to share the bells that you've made in the turnip market. Is that correct? Well, kind of. Let me ask you a question, Maureen. How many bells you got? So I currently have 42 million oh oh being a bell millionaire is inherently immoral yeah right i was afraid you were gonna have a billion

42 million, though. Getting there. How many bells do you have, Kelly? I currently have a little over 1 million. This is a disparity. Would you agree, Maureen? A little bit. Do you know what I find millionaires, or in this case, multimillionaires, are really good at doing?

No, what? justifying their existence and also explaining why they should be rich why should you have 42 million bells and why should you not share them with your wife, Kelly. So I have 42 million bells because once you complete the game and you have completed the content, because they update for different holidays, they're always putting out new content. But when you time travel, you burn through it pretty quickly. So what I'm trying to do to entertain myself in animal crossing now is decorate my island and i've created like additional humans to live on the island and i'm upgrading

their houses so they have like a little beachfront cafe and a little um like place for my friends to go so they can look at clothes and tell me what clothes they want. And I will send them the clothes. And you're spending bells on this. So I'm spending a lot of bells on this. And this is on your island, Maureen. And it is on my island. What you're saying to your wife is, I can't share any bells with you because I'm too busy spending all my bells creating a perfect society without you. Well, now there was...

I'm creating new friends. There was an incident, Your Honor, where I decided to redo my island one night and I didn't want to lose the things that I had and I asked if I could store them

temporarily on her island and she did charge me rent. Ha! I would like to clarify why i charged rent if possible all right go ahead it's because she did not move her items from my island for two weeks and it was affecting my in-game rating i thought it would make her hurry. It's hard for me to describe the look of confusion and concern and even disgust on Joel Mann's face right now. I think they should go out to Matinicus and see how many turnips those bells will buy. Talking about Matinicus Island here in Maine? Yes.

Yeah, that's all they got over there. They're lucky if they have a turnip. Tinnitus, a very depopulated island in Maine, very remote. You know, Joel expressed some confusion about why this is a game. Since what you're describing is like, I have to pay my mortgage. She left her stuff on my room for too long, so I charged rent. Like this whole virtual world is just full of what we would call some of the most mundane, real-world problems. Is it fun, Kelly? It's actually very fun. I would argue,

especially that in this time, those mundane problems are kind of nice. I would argue especially that in this time, those mundane problems are kind of nice. Okay. So especially at the time, I would say that it was just sort of bonding and nice to talk about mortgages and also to be able to pay them off. As millennials, that's something that both of us have to think about a lot. Maureen's contracts, her jobs at the time had been paused due to the pandemic. And I was actually on disability at that time for my lupus. And so it was sort of a tough financial struggle at the time as well. And so I think there was this nice feeling of being able to live a very comfortable virtual life. Yeah. Okay, I got you. It's a kinder form of capitalism,

one in which there is the potential to succeed. Would that be fair to say? Yes. I would definitely say that it is a much kinder form. One extremely kind form of capitalism would be no capitalism at all. Yes. Socialism. Redistributed wealth. Right, Kelly? You're what Ayn Rand would call a moocher. Marines out there moving her money around,

playing the market, having the interactions with the strangers, which, by the way, I don't want to have either. She's earned these 42, arguably, she's earned these 42 million bells. And now you just want to confiscate that wealth? Who are you, AOC? By the way, I love AOC.

Incredible. We do too. Your argument would be, Kelly, that Maureen should give you a percentage of her bells because you're married, right? Also because I felt that reflecting our marriage, I was also contributing to the partnership. Right. You're giving her all these iridescent shells. Now, Maureen, do you take value in these iridescent shells?

Is this just garbage that you're storing on your island rent-free because you don't want to hurt Kelly's feelings? That's a great point. I have a lot of your items on my island that I'm not charging you rent for, but just kidding. I love them. They're wonderful. They bring me joy.

All right. You are getting value. I mean, like, you wouldn't have these shells because all you're doing, you're like Lin-Manuel Miranda as Hamilton in Hamilton. And Kelly is like David Diggs as Jefferson. You know, she's creating. You just want to move your money around, right? I will say that since I time travel, I do collect rare materials to make recipes with. And recipes and DIYs are what you get to make the shells. So I'll be like a season ahead, like, oh, I've got acorns. Would you like an acorn wreath?

So I do sometimes give her things as well. And do you accept, Kelly, do you accept these misbegotten gains? I do. I admit it. They're very pretty and they look very good on my island. There is no ethical capitalism. Maureen, you're out there cheating. You're cheating. You know that you're cheating. Mm-hmm. Right?

Wait, John, I have one. ATAB. All Tanookis are bad. From where I sit, Maureen, you're out there. It's an accepted cheat at this point, but you're cheating the system. I mean, you're a super capitalist, right? You're just acquiring wealth and you're using your wealth to gain more wealth. And exponentially, you get more and more wealthy. You're using every loophole to your advantage.

You're hoarding wealth from your very wife. Tell me a reason why I shouldn't order an eat the rich edict. Oh, my gosh. That's so funny because my't order an eat the rich edict. Oh my gosh. That's so funny. Cause my flag is actually eat the rich. You have a town flag. Maureen, you have a town flag that says eat the rich on it.

Ironically, she does. That is pure performative progressivism. Rich eat thyself. Why do you have a flag that says eat the rich? Are you a Motorhead fan? No, because in real life, I'm a pretty big anti-capitalist socialist. This is getting delicious. A pretty big anti-capitalist socialist. But, um...

This is getting delicious. IRL, you agree that capitalism is a rigged system, perpetuating greater and greater inequality of wealth. I do. But when you get on your island, you love hoarding those bells, don't you? Sorry. Hold on. I do.

Yes. I appreciate your recognizing that you're under fake oath and telling the truth. That's fun. Role play is fun. Role play is fun. Yeah yeah playing a different version of yourself maybe one that goes against some of your principles in a game-like environment that's a that's a an emotional release i get it yeah like when you pick the mean answer in dragon age yeah it's like when you pick the mean answer in dragon age that's just what i was thinking yeah yeah joel it's like when you pick the mean answer in Dragon Age. That's just what I was thinking. Yeah.

Yeah, Joel, it's like when you pick the mean answer in Dragon Age, you know. Yeah, part cheesy. Right. So, Kelly, how much bells do you want? You know, Your Honor, I'm honestly just looking for a percentage. I don't need 50%. Maybe 25%. 25% tax. Yes. Right. In consideration of shared income IRL and in consideration of stuff that you make. Yes. Just a basic bookies vig. Exactly. 25%. You want 25% off the top right now or 25% of what she has and 25% everything going forward?

Yeah. Is this an income tax or a wealth tax? Yeah. There we go. Thank you. And are you prepared to take the wealth tax all the way to the Supreme Court? Well, I thought that's where we are now, the Animal Crossing Supreme Court. Oh, who do you think I am, a finger-wagging mole?

Animal Crossing has its own court system. I'm not part of that. Judge Hodgman is the court in the court of Seaman, the man-faced fish that lives inside your Sega Dreamcast. The man-faced fish that lives inside your Sega Dreamcast. I'm comfortable with a continued portion throughout time. It doesn't need to be every run, maybe once a month. Once a month, you're going to take 25% of Maureen's wealth.

Is that what you're saying? Be specific. If we both agree that the services I've provided and also in the name of our wonderful marriage, yes. Well, we don't both agree, right, Maureen? Why is 25% confiscatory? Because of the rent incident, I was not under the impression that it was, you know, an arrangement where I was receiving goods for bells. I thought that I was returning that with other goods that I gave her. So I think it's just taking advantage of the situation.

Did you have a conversation about what it would mean to have different islands when you chose to play separate islands as opposed to one island absolutely not um the only conversation that we had was boy i'm sure glad we each have our own console and that we can play with our own islands anytime we want and decorate them however we want. You guys have two Nintendos? Yes. To be fair, we both had them before we were married. But then you got two different animal crossings. We did. Wow.

John, it's possible that this is the next level in your two beds, two bedrooms argument for married couples. Two beds, two bedrooms, two Nintendos. Yeah, you're right, Jessie. That's a good point. Kelly, how does it make you feel when Maureen doesn't share bells with you? I admit I'm hurt. Tell me more. And I will say that it hurt my feelings a little bit. How do you respond to that, Maureen? How does that make you feel?

Well, my bad. I'm very sorry. But we have never shared income in any other video game before. Most sincere apology ever, by the way. I love you very much. You're the light of my life. If you want some bells, I can give them to you, but just not like, you know,

an obligatory every run, because that puts pressure on me. You hear what she's saying, Kelly? You have to beg. I do. I hear that. Do you share your income in real life? Yes, we do right share everything else equally right going yes we do we even wear the same shoe size but you have two different nintendos

we do there is precedent for not sharing certain things even wear the same shoe size it's adorable and adorabler. Yeah, we share clothes and shoes and everything. Do you ever dress up like those old lady twins that used to walk around downtown San Francisco all suited and booted? I would like to. I've mentioned that I used to live in San Francisco, so I would like to do that. Who are these people, Jessie? There were these two lady twins. I'm going to look it up.

Yeah, send me an image. I'm Googling San Francisco two lady twins. I'm going to look it up. Send me an image. I'm googling San Francisco old lady twins. They had matching perms. The Brown twins, Marian and Vivian Brown, were two American identical twin actresses who also appeared on television talk shows and television commercials. They were icons in San Francisco known as the San Francisco twins. and television commercials, they were icons in San Francisco known as the San Francisco Twins.

They had identically bright, snappy outfits and hats atop meticulously coiffed hair. Matching perms. That's the secret. Matching perms. Will you text me an image? Yes. Great.

I'll look at it in my chambers in a moment. Kelly, unless I were to intercede and order some redistribution of wealth, is it your position that you would stop helping Maureen source DIY recipes? That you would stop making shells for her? That you would withhold these goods? I'll admit that I would not stop. Right.

Right. You just can't help being ground down by this system. Maureen, she loves you. She's going to make those shells even if you don't give her some bells. I know, I'm very lucky. She's making shells for no bells. Is this how you treat the love of your life?

Hoard up those bells? Apparently. If I were... She made me pay rent. That was one thing. That was one thing. That was one. Do you know how much money she charged me? No, how much?

What was it? Just one million bells. Yeah. Should have been 42 million bells. I see that now, Your Honor. Maureen, you sound just like an IRL millionaire. Oh, no. Do you know what I mean?

But it's a video game. One of my employees looked wrong at me once, so therefore I will never help them again. Mean. It's like the mean answer from Dragon Age. You picked it. I do pick them sometimes. Yeah, I can tell. All right, so if I were to find in your favor, it would be

whatever. You would only give bells to your beloved wife if she asked the right way. What would be the right way? Maureen, do your imitation of how Kelly should ask you for bells that would work. Hey, babe, I need to build a bridge.

Can I have two million bells? Okay, sure. I don't believe that. Don't you want her to be obsequious? Groveling? I would not make her do that. So you're just saying if Kelly asked you for a few bells

to work on a project, you would invest in that project, like Shark Tank. Correct. I just don't like the pressure of being obligated to share like every run is how I feel right now. Kelly, you want to ask Maureen for some bells right now on air? Maureen, I have a small project I'd like to complete. It will be 42 million bells. May I please borrow those? No. All right, I've heard everything I need to

in order to make my decision. I am going to go to my own private island of my mind, which is located not in Animal Crossing, but underneath this plastic conference table in the studios of WERU, where I hope it'll be slightly cooler because we have the AC off, at my request. It's better for the sound.

I'll cool off. I'll think it over. I'll be back in a moment with my decision. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Maureen and Kelly, how many other of these video game machines have you got? You got any ColecoVisions? No, we're not that cool.

No. If you're asking for real we have uh like a ps4 uh xbox one and some like older gen stuff and some portable systems a nice man sent me one of those playstations so i could pretend to be spider-man it was a lot of fun that's a great good game it's a very good game. It's great. Spider-Man, he's jumping around, shooting webs. You wouldn't believe the stuff this guy does. I love that game. You got any hot tips for Zelda? Because my friend Jordan gave me his Nintendo Wii U and I've been playing Zelda and I don't know.

I guess I need some recipes or something. Oh, Maureen's good at Zelda. Oh, you're playing Breath of the Wild? Yeah. I was like, if you're playing Skyward Sword, I have no help for you. You need a good controller. Was there really one called Skyward Sword? There was. Wow, what an awkward name. I know. Yeah, and you had to hold the Wii remote in the air, point it up. It was very uncomfortable.

How do you feel, Maureen, about your chances in this case? Feeling pretty bad right now. Yeah. Kelly, how are you feeling? I'm going to reserve judgment. Yeah, we'll see what the judge has to say about all this when we come back in just a moment. when we come back in just a moment. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney.

I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace because, yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls.

If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-O-D-C-A-S-T-I-H. Hmm. Are you trying to put the name of the podcast there? Yeah, I'm trying to spell it, but it's tricky. Let me give it a try. Okay. If you need a laugh and you're on the go,

try S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah! We are so close. Stop podcasting yourself.

A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh and you're on the go. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman re-enters the courtroom and presents his verdict. So, Bailiff Jesse Thorne pointed out that your two Nintendos, two islands lifestyle is in line with this court's precedent of encouraging a certain amount of physical and emotional independence within a marriage, which is specifically, you don't have to sleep right on top of each other. If you have the means to get a king-size bed, do it. And ideally, you could each have separate bedrooms connected only

by a slender slate walking path over a reflecting pool. That would be an ideal bedroom for me. I don't think that's true. I love spending time with my wife. And it's just a fantasy that I have from time to time. And what we're talking about here is a fantasy that you have from time to time. And what we're talking about here is a fantasy that you have from time to time. You know, your cute end game that's been proven by evidence. And though we've not met in person, I don't believe. It's been really fun to talk to both of you. You both deserve better from the governor of St. Louis, governor of Missouri, I mean, Mike Parson. Governor of Missouri, I mean, Mike Parson. You deserve better in your state government. You deserve better in your federal government, to say the least.

You deserve a functioning federal government that mobilizes information and resources in a coordinated way across the nation to respond to a not just national but worldwide health crisis that affected you both personally, you deserve better. You deserve better in the real world than an economic system that is obviously unfair and favors the wealthy. As I was explaining to Joel Mann, every game of Monopoly ends in tears because it is presented as a game, as a capitalistic game of fair play where everyone starts at the same spot on the board. But the first person to randomly accrue any wealth whatsoever exponentially grows wealth until the rest are crushed and ground beneath their feet. Ha ha, fun for a family. Very representative of what happens in capitalism as is practiced today. And I'll be honest, you know, I consider myself a capitalist.

I am a small business. I don't create iridescent shells. I create words and ideas that I put out into the marketplace, and I hope people value them and pay me for them. That's the only way I understand how to live, is to have work like you, Kelly, that I can put my hands on. Small scale stuff, making pretty shells and giving them away or selling them away, whatever makes you happy. I don't understand the high finance of the turnip

market. I'm never going to play those markets. I don't get it. And if it weren't for a lot of luck in my life and a lot of privilege in my life, I would have been ground down out of existence, my funny jokes or whatever, nothing. I got a lot of good turns in my life, never mind the fact that I was born looking this way, and I was born in a stable family that had some not generational wealth behind it, but economic stability, right? I think we all understand in the midst of this crisis that we all deserve better. And I think one of the great awakenings of this moment is a lot of people who never thought that they were going to be laid off. A lot of people who the system sort of favored as it worked every

day. A lot of people were never going to have to get food stamps. A lot of people are never going to have to get unemployment insurance. A lot of people were never going to have to get food stamps. A lot of people are never going to have to get unemployment insurance. A lot of people are never going to have to seek disability. Suddenly had to. And they realized how faulty the system was. They realized that the system that other less privileged people were interacting with every day was not helping them or anybody. And meanwhile, these turnip billionaires are floating above the earth, whining. This is what you sound like, Maureen, like Elon Musk, whining about how California isn't being nice to me because I can't make my electric cars fast enough because people are dying of COVID. Gross. Gross.

Maureen. Gross. Yes. It was just rhetorical. Maureen? Gross. Yes. It was just rhetorical, Maureen. Okay. In real life, you both deserve better than what has happened. We all do.

We're all human beings. Sometimes you pick the mean answer in Dragon Age. Games are a place to explore fantasies. Games are a place to play a role. Games are a place where it can feel good to actually pay off a mortgage, when IRL, paying down a mortgage, paying off a student loan, is often a seemingly impossible feat, given the structure of even a functioning economy such as what we had prior to March. even a functioning economy such as what we had prior to March.

You made a decision to have separate islands. That was a lifestyle you chose to explore in this game. You could have had the same island. Look, maybe you can't in Animal Crossing. I don't know, but you see what I'm saying. Made a decision to have separate islands, To play the game in different ways. Is Maureen a monster in Animal Crossing? Yes.

Is she as bad as Tom Nook? No. Yes. Capitalist monster. In game. Progressive activist. Out of game. Good balance.

She deserves, don't you think, Kelly, the right to play the game that gives her the most pleasure, however perverse that pleasure may be. She not only is making a lot of money on a financial market, but is frankly exploiting your labor, Kelly. She's frankly taking shells from you, knowing that you would keep making them even if she didn't ever pay you for them

or reimburse you for them. The symbiosis of your relationship in this game is sadly more resonant of the toxic symbiosis between labor and capital in the real world that's why joel man doesn't ever want to play this game dude has a mortgage joel i don't want to get personal with you but but you've you've had a mortgage in your life right i have one mortgage now i don't want another one right exactly, exactly. Not even a fake one. Sold to you by a folkloric raccoon dog? I wouldn't be able to sleep at night. No, I know.

But that's okay. That's how you have fun in the game. Maureen is having fun in the game. And now that it is clear that she wants to continue to have this exploitative, accumulative, capitalistic fun in the game, even at the expense of her wife's feelings. Now that that's clear, now that you both know this about each other, we'll have some interesting conversations outside of the game, perhaps. But in the meantime, I want Maureen to play the game that she is playing.

And Kelly, I want you to play the game that gives you pleasure. So for that reason, I cannot approve a 25% confiscation of Maureen's wealth, which would be applied at some obscure timeline from time to time. I mean, Kelly, let's face it, you didn't have a very clear program. You didn't have a plan for that. That's fair. But in honor of someone who had a plan for everything and still does, Elizabeth Warren, 2% wealth tax annually. That's what you get, Maureen, 2% wealth tax. That sounds fair. 840,000 bells I order you to transfer annually, or, you know, 2% of your total wealth transfer annually to your wife, know, 2% of your total wealth transfer annually to your wife because you moved that money around, but you didn't build that iridescent sand dollar table. You benefit from her as well.

So I order a transfer immediately of 840,000 bells from Maureen to Kelly for the fiscal year 2019 into 2020. We will reevaluate next year if we're still playing this game. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge Sean Hodgman rules. That is all. Please rise as Judge Sean Hodgman exits the courtroom. Kelly, how do you feel?

I feel like it was a very fair verdict. I liked his plan, and this is why I brought this to Judge John Hodgman. Yeah, well, Judge John Hodgman, he has a plan for that. Maureen, how do you feel about the verdict? My fear is that it will apply to Animal Crossing years, and since I time travel, I will be transferring this amount of money about weekly, but otherwise I feel very good about it. I'm talking about Judge John Hodgman years. Regular years.

Do you remember that Saturday Night Live sketch where Steve Forbes was trying to convince them that he wasn't pitching the flat tax because he was Steve Forbes, but rather because he was Teve Torbs, who just happened to support the flat tax? It's just a little tax plan thing I was thinking about and just smiling to myself. Kelly, Maureen, thanks for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

Thank you. Thank you so much. I echo my bailiff's thanks. Before we let you go, I rarely do this, but I'm going to go ahead. You sent in as evidence, quote unquote, your Animal Crossing Instagram account. So I'm going to say Instagram dot com slash Queens underscore crossing Queens underscore crossing. Check it out. And good luck in real life and on this plane of existence. Thanks very much to both of you. Thank you. Thank you. You too.

plane of existence. Thanks very much to both of you. Thank you. Thank you. You too. Another Judge John Hodgman case is in the books. Our thanks to everyone who listens to our show, our thanks to everyone who's listened through the Max Fund Drive and through all of our pitches, and our thanks to everyone who's done something for our community, recommending the show, sharing it with someone, reviewing it in a podcast app. And especially, particularly thanks to everybody who has become a member. We're so grateful for you. We know it's tough times and we're glad to have this wonderful job where we get to hang out with our friend. Yeah. I mean, that's the hard thing about this time is that you feel overwhelmed. You feel powerless at times. You feel disconsolate.

And yet, for all of those hard feelings, you have to get up and keep going and do your day-to-day stuff. And it's really meaningful to me that Judge John Hodgman, along with I'm sure all your other podcasts, that you, like me, use podcasts as a way to get up and go and do your day-to-day stuff. So thank you for helping us and tolerating us and being patient during these weeks of MaxFunDrive while we got up and did our day-to-day stuff, the stuff that needed to get done to keep MaxFun going,

to keep MaxFun independent, to keep MaxFun producing the content that you enjoy, that I enjoy. I'm a member, obviously. Just letting us know that you're out there has been so great. And thank you so much for all of your support, both emotional and otherwise. Maximumfund.org slash join. I look forward to mispronouncing your name on the internet. Thanks, everybody. In a moment, we'll have swift justice. First, our thanks to Brianna O'Sullivan and Emily Joanne Holosek for naming this week's episode, Animal Crossing Examination.

If you'd like to name a future episode, like Judge John Hodgman on Facebook. We regularly put out our calls for submissions there. You can follow us on Twitter at Jesse Thorne and at Hodgman. Hashtag your Judge John Hodgman tweets, hashtag JJHO. And check out the maximum fun sub reddit to discuss this episode we're on instagram at judge john hodgman make sure to follow us there for evidence and other fun stuff and this week's episode was edited by hannah smith our producer is jennifer marmer now swift justice where we answer your small disputes with a quick judgment.

Eva says, my colleagues and I are both Spanish teachers, but neither of our first languages is Spanish. They pronounce the Panera part of Panera Bread Company with a Spanish accent. I think it's really pretentious. What say you, Judge Hodgman? So they're saying Panera? Panera? Panera so interestingly kelly morena in st louis panera bread i'm gonna say panera bread was founded in 1993 as the st louis bread company guess what joel they wanted to go national and literally the creator said i want something that we can take to portland oregon or Portland, Maine. Good idea. Right?

Yeah. That is a national strategy to reach white people. Okay. So they renamed it Panera, which means bread basket in Spanish. Bread basket bread. That's a little history lesson. But basically, I'm going to say, just say Panera. I agree.

Panera, no es bueno. Too pretentious. It is what it is. It's a fast food company. Panera. I agree. Panera? No es bueno. Too pretentious. It is what it is. It's a fast food company. Panera bread. That's it for this week's episode. Submit your cases at MaximumFun.org slash JJHO or email Hodgman at MaximumFun.org. No case is too small. We'll see you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.