Judge John Hodgman - Court-o-Potty

Episode Date: May 29, 2013

Meg and Tony share a one-bathroom house in Portland. Should Meg be allowed a chamber pot for emergency situations? Only Judge John Hodgman can decide.

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. This week, court-a-potty. Meg and her boyfriend Tony share a one-bathroom house in Portland. Meg suggests using a chamber pot when the bathroom is occupied, but Tony is appalled by the idea. Should Meg be allowed her plan B? Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Honchman enters the courtroom. Bailiff Jesse, Bailiff Jesse, standing by the sea, have you a crabfish that you can sell to me? Yes, sir. Yes, sir. That indeed I do. I've got a crabfish that I can sell to you. Well, I took him on home and I thought he'd like a swim. So I filled up the thunder jug and I threw the crabfish in. Late that night, I thought I'd have a fit when my old lady got up to use the thunder jug.

Husband, husband, she cried out to me, the devil's in the thunder jug and he's got a hold of me. Children, children, bring the looking glass. Come and see the crabfish that bit your mother's nose. Children, children, did you hear the grunt? I think I'll just leave it there. Bailiff Jesse, swear them in. Please rise and raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God or whatever? I do.

I do as well. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that as a perfectly efficient system, he has no need to evacuate? Yeah. Yes, I do. Judge Hodgman? Meg and Tony, you may be seated.

Thank you. For an immediate summary judgment in your favor, can you name the piece of culture that I referenced in suggestive rhyme as I walked into the courtroom? Um, is it Alice in Wonderland? Absolutely wrong.

Absolutely wrong. Tony, I'm afraid I don't even have a guess. Your honor. That is the old Irish, uh, song, the crab fish.

Oh, you could have taken a guess. You probably would have just guessed froggy went to Corton. Yeah, it's a little, it's a little froggy went in court and except that it's a, it's rather dirty. And is about a arguably dirty topic which is

a lobster or crabfish that is taken home by a man for his wife and to keep it alive he puts it in the thunder jug which is another name for a what Meg? Oh, pardon me. Oh, hello Meg.

It is another name for a chamber pot. That is correct, tony but you've already lost your summary judgment so don't try to step in and then his wife goes to use it in the middle of the night and terrible things happen and i identified it as an irish an old irish song but it's actually a an english i apologize an english folk song uh and it has been for reasons completely unknown to me, cleaned up and peddled to children as a song about not sitting down on a toilet full of lobsters. It seems as though that is entirely unnecessary. There are plenty of dumb kids' songs

that you don't need to clean up the old 1620 era English dirty folk songs. But there you go. It's one of those things. It's a lesson that children have to learn. That's true. But you know what? It's a lesson that children don't have to learn because there are no chamber pots in use in North America for the most part. But Meg wants to change all that,'t you oh yes what is what's going on why do you want to go backwards in time and start peeing in a pot because that's what we're talking about here right um well we we have one bathroom as was stated and the main thing is that I have an exceptionally small bladder. By whose authority? Have you had it examined?

I have had it examined. Have you had it calipered? I haven't had any lobsters in there, but I have had a doctor remark on my small bladder before. Oh, what a small bladder you have. Yeah, yeah. Well, let's cut to the chase here. Right.

Because I don't want to hear you say the word small bladder anymore. I'm starting to get nervous. You have to urinate frequently? Yeah. to urinate frequently? Yeah, I mean a quick look at the internet tells me that a normal person needs to use the bathroom about six times a day and I've been keeping tabs on myself and I would say I usually have to go about 15 to 20 times a day. I see you've been consulting the same urination tables on the internet that I have been consulting. Yes. That is a part of normal everyday life. 15 to 20 times you have

to urinate. Is that what you're saying to me? Yes. And does your doctor, I mean, because I would be alarmed. Does your doctor say that you should be alarmed no i'm not alarmed and the doctor is not alarmed um it's somewhat hereditary you and your doctor are wrong okay go on you were saying it's hereditary uh my mother also has a small bladder, and I had been lamenting the fact that we only had one toilet in our home. And she said, oh, yeah, you really need to have another option because she feels my pain. And as a big antiquer, she found this chamber pot in a shop and said, Oh, your prayers have been answered and mailed it to me. And we opened the box and I showed Tony what I received in the mail. And he was less than pleased with it.

If it's true that your prayers have been answered what miserable small prayers they must be so you you received an antique chamber pot from your mom and she was encouraging you who will will not talk about her bladder size we'll just refer to her as a fellow 15 time a day or and she and this obviously changed her life and she wanted to share this with her daughter and you want to station a chamber pot in your home for you to use during the times that the bathroom is otherwise being used presumably only by tony right you don't have any other roommates right right um though this would be in use probably only once in a blue moon. I do prefer to use the actual facilities. Oh, really? That's your preference? It's your preference to use a toilet and an actual bathroom in the 21st century rather than sit on a ceramic pot encased in wood in the middle of your bedroom? Oh,

I don't want to put it in my bedroom. Well, where are you going to put it? Where are you going to station this? Oh, I want to put it in my, my studio upstairs in the house. In your studio.

What is he, what do you do in your studio? I paint and draw. I think we know what she does. You paint and draw. I think we know what she does. You paint and draw. Yeah. All right. And,

and it's upstairs. So let me ask you the question. Seriously, Meg, how often is it the case that you cannot use the bathroom when you need to use the bathroom? Well, the main need for the chamber pot is, especially during the holiday season when we have a bunch of family visiting.

That's when you would not use a chamber pot, of course. Well, I mean, that's when various members of the family might, you know, pick up a crossword puzzle and,word puzzle and saunter into the bathroom. And then I just feel... There are limits, Meg, to what we're going to discuss. There are limits. Thank you, Josh. You know that you're not the first couple to share a bathroom in your life, right?

Sure. Tony, how big a problem is this in your in your in your day-to-day life uh i would argue that it's not a problem at all your honor um if if if it is it hasn't been made clear to me um uh is this a time where I should state my objection to the arrangement that Meg is proposing? I suppose. Well, it's a fairly simple one. I mean, we are adult humans living in the 21st century. We're older than four years old. We are not lesser species like cats.

And yeah, it's the 21st century, so we shouldn't be urinating and defecating into boxes. Let me tell you something. The day I see a cat using a chamber pot is the day I make a million dollars selling the greatest YouTube video of all time. That's how YouTube works, right?

That is something that I would be all for using our chamber pot uh for that's a good purpose meg is not suggesting that she use a litter box no it's a slippery slope your honor oh it's getting grosser and grosser in here uh yeah no i understand that the chamber pot is not something that is commonly used and the only other people to urinate. And I'm presuming we're only talking about urination here, correct, Meg? Oh, yeah.

Right? Okay. It would have to be a dire, dire emergency. I don't want to. Don't even contemplate pooping into a jug in your house. Yeah, thank you. Okay, Meg? Seriously. I'm not. I'm not. No, you are.

I wasn't, and now I am because you put it in my head, Thunderjug. Meg, you want to position this chamber pot up in your studio, right? Yeah.

Have you tried using it already? No, I have not. But let me also say that I feel like our differences in opinion also come from upbringing. And I do think that people in North America occasionally use a chamber pot. I grew up in Montana, and I feel like having family that use chamber pots occasionally and outhouses and going camping has just made me look, look, that's a different, that's a different story. Outhouses. Of course I've used an outhouse in North America. I've used a chemical toilet in North America, in rural North America.

Don't hold your Montana flag, your big blue sky cred above me. Montana flag, your big blue sky cred above me. And of course I've also made use of the woods. Sometimes woods in very deep country. So sometimes, sometimes woods that are only visible from the deck of my home in Western Massachusetts, where I am using the bathroom. Let's just leave it at that. But that's out of doors.

Do you understand? Out of doors. How many families, when you were growing up in Montana, used a chamber pot? And let me just make sure that the listeners understand here. A chamber pot is a pot. It is one of the most ancient technologies devised. It is a pot that you keep in your chambre, which is French for bedroom,

in order to relieve yourself when you need to. And then it is emptied in the morning. It is a very simple technology that absolutely has been used and indeed was used in the United States until the mid-20th century. It was not uncommon at all. You buy one in the Sears Roebuck catalog, man-sized, lady-sized, children-sized.

They were all over the place. And because of that, they're pretty common in antique stores where mothers can buy them for their daughters in order to torment their future sons-in-law. So that's what a chamber pot is. Now, how many families did you know growing up in Montana, Meg, that had and used a chamber pot?

I'd say three, including my own. So two other families outside of my family. You had one growing up? Yeah. A chamber pot? Yes. One or more in the household? My family certainly had one chamber pot,

and then extended family had, you know, chamber pots in other locations outside of Montana. Did you grow up in a religious order that eschewed all indoor plumbing because it is too proud? No. No, I think... How many letters do you think I'm going to get from the internet listeners around the world

saying we routinely use a chamber pot and we have a home that has indoor plumbing to boot? Probably none. Probably none. I was going to bet two. I was going to bet two. One would just be pure crankism, pure crank letter, and then one that was going to be real. You say none.

So you grew up. Wait a minute. Are you an immortal meg did you grow up in the 1850s before you were turned by the montana vampire clan judge hodgman she could also be a time traveler that's true that's true i don't i i i'm getting a little rough on you here but i just i really i'm actually very curious so i want you to answer me very i very carefully i want you to be very truthful. You grew up in a household that had a chamber pot.

Where was the chamber pot kept? It was kept under the bed. I had one under my, what? You all shared a bed? No, it was kept, I had one under my bed. I will concede that it is something that is really used for children that are having, you know, that are learning how to use the toilet and was not used as much, except for when relatives were visiting or there were a lot of people in the house.

And you just wanted to have another option so that people wouldn't have to be uncomfortable was that option only for children um i don't i don't in my mind no but i don't have there was there wasn't like a chamber pot scorecard that was kept i mean i think it's usually such well there was in a way. But wait a minute. Wait a minute. First of all, how do we know that this is a Montanan thing? We already

know that your own mother is a chamber pot enthusiast. She's a thunder jug freak. So maybe this was just her own, her own, but she, she accidentally convinced you that this was normal somehow. Well, the thing about the chamber pot is I think that a user must be discreet about it. So I, I feel that it is perhaps common.

Let me ask you this question. How could you be discreet? Because you are suggesting that it was brought out at Thanksgiving, Christmas, other major holidays, because lots of people were over. So the house was full. You would only use it, presumably, according to your guidelines, as a plan B, if the one, did you have more than one bathroom growing up?

Yes, there are two bathrooms. If both bathrooms were being occupied and there was an emergency situation. How many uncles did you have? Yeah, I know. Someone would have to go and find the chamber pot. They would have to go into a room that was not a bathroom

because the bathrooms are occupied in order to use it and then presumably wander through the house with this thing in order to quickly dispose of its contents. How did this really happen at Thanksgiving? Christmas. Usually Christmas. how did this really happen at thanksgiving uh christmas usually christmas um good christian people only use chamber pots to celebrate the baby jesus's birth um i mean my my most vivid

chamber pot memories come from staying at my grandmother's house where uh it was it was sort of like an A-frame house with a big loft. So the chamber pot was upstairs in the loft, mostly for people that would sleep up there. But you knew the chamber pot was there if you needed it. It was comforting. It was comforting to know that you had that option to go upstairs and use it if grandma was taking a four-hour long bath and reading romance novels. And did you use the chamber pot as an adult at your grandma's house?

She died by the time I was an adult. I'm sorry to hear that. Do you have an equally vivid chamber pot memory in your book of thunder jug memories of an adult human in your home in Montana describe set the scene for me in which an adult human would excuse himself or herself to go and use the chamber pot in company you know I do not have such a memory, but I feel that my memories from living in various locations in Portland, Oregon, such as an artist's warehouse where there was only one bathroom for 13 people that lived there. And there wasn't any good plan B. So terrible, terrible things happened. And I just want to be a planner and make sure that that sort of thing can never happen. What was the worst thing that happened?

I understand you're trying to bait me by making this all about Portland, Oregon, but I'm not taking that bait. People pee into jugs all around the world. Don't think that Portland has the artisanal grip on that particular trend. Well, it's funny that cats were brought up earlier because the worst thing I ever saw was a party where many people were at this warehouse and there was a long line for a bathroom and a young woman decided to just go ahead and use the kitty litter instead of going to the bathroom. Tony's shaking his head. He's upset that I'm sharing this on the internet.

You don't know what you're asking for, Judge. Well, go ahead and tell me. No, I'm just saying the horrors. The horrors. But that's what I would like to avoid. I would like to avoid the potty PTSD that I have. So how is it really different for a young artist in Portland, Oregon to discreetly use the kitty litter than for another young artist in Portland, Oregon to pee into a ceramic bowl. Well, have you looked at the evidence that I supplied with pictures of this chamber pot? Sure. And you know what? I'll tell you something else. I grew up with a chamber pot because my mom had antiques too, but none of us ever peed in it.

I know what an antique chamber pot looks like. This one you've given me here. This is beautiful, carved, wooden stand with a leather top to it. You lift that up and inside there's a bowl. And then there's a picture here of the cat staring at the chamber pot, saying, even I am too dignified to do this, and I'm a cat, and I poop in a box. And then there is a picture of the actual chamber pot,

which actually looks like a lobster pot. It's a white enameled, it looks like something that Andrew Wyeth would have painted. And then there's a beautiful there's a picture of your beautiful studio with a beanbag chair and the optical illusion poster on the wall and a skylight and some spray bottles and some books right and there's the chamber pot in the corner right okay so i've seen the evidence it's still a pot in a stool and i would uh even say that our cat is too

dignified to use a cat box. You don't need to say it, Tony, because I already said it, just as I've made your entire case for you. Even a litter box, I'm saying. But yes, thank you. I will just sit back and be quiet. Oh, your cat is too dignified to even use a litter box? That's right.

But here's the thing. Tony. Yes, yeah. First of all, why are you taking so long in the bathroom? No, I am certainly not the type to go in there, you know, and stretch out, you know, with my racing form or anything. I do my business and get out. Do you not like to take baths?

Yes, but taking a bath, you often come in and use the facilities while taking a bath. That's not a problem. It's not fun. But you know what? Maybe we both misunderstand Meg. Maybe the problem isn't that she has to use the bathroom quite a bit. It's that her

standards for urination fun are a lot higher than other people's. Maybe I'll be triggering on her. That she, that it requires a little antique pomp and circumstance. Maybe she inherited that from her uncles and other family members up there in Montana who used a chamber pot at Christmas because they seem to have forgotten that their house was surrounded by Montana. A pretty sparsely populated state where anyone could go

and probably happily use the bathroom within reason out of doors. Is that not true do i paint montana the wrong way no you had some country you had some country outside your house where you could probably find some privacy right um not necessarily my my home was was in this in the city oh okay right you're in chamber pot town i understand i made a mistake i apologize yeah i don't uh you're only going to use this chamber pot for urine is that correct yes have and you have not tried using it yet no i'm glad to hear that your honor we had sort of a don't ask don't tell policy or at least I had self-imposed one. That actually surprises

me about both of you because you're using the bathroom in front of each other all the time and you love talking about taking a crossword puzzle into the bathroom. That makes me feel sick. You seem to have a don't ask, but only tell policy. Perhaps that is so. I'm sorry, Your Honor. If you were to use

this chamber pot, how often do you think that you would use it? Realistically? Oh, I only imagine it being christened maybe once or twice a year. Once or twice a year. Is that realistic? I thought you were a 20 time a day or. Well, it's mostly, it's mostly an issue of peace of mind

for me. Because of the signals that my body sends me, I find that I'm always thinking about where and when I'm going to use the bathroom. When I'm traveling, I make mental maps of the city, so I know, oh, that's where the public library is. That's where a bookstore is. That's where the ubiquitous coffee shop is that I can sneak in the back door and use. So it's mostly just feeling prepared and taken care of. Have you considered carrying around with you a female portable urinal i have i was attempting to curse you out but you know exactly what i'm talking about

i do i was also hoping that maybe someday someone would invent a stadium gal pal, not just for guys, but for anyone that has to stand somewhere for many hours. I'm sorry, I don't know what that is. I believe the stadium pal is... Uh-oh. Oh, no buzz marketing. I don't know if it actually exists anymore. Is that a brand name? Like aspirin or

heroin? I think it's basically like a portable catheter and urine bag that you strap to your calf and you attach to your undergarments.

You can just go to a football game and not have to worry about ever getting human being. Tony, what would you have me order if I were to find in your favor? Well, I would have you order that the port of, I'm sorry, the,

the thunder jug in question remain decorative exclusively. It's a lovely object, as you remarked, but I don't think that anyone should be using it for its original purpose inside of our house. Any other reason other than it grosses you out? No, not really. I think that's enough of a reason. And I don't think it's, I don't think it grosses, I don't think it's my particular, um, hang

up. I think it's, it's shared. It's pretty much, you know, the, the contract that we've entered into as a society at this point. And, um, I would just like to see Meg uphold her end of that contract. I'm not sure I follow. I mean, even though I think that it's very unusual that people would use a chamber pot in North America,

they are in use throughout the world. And there are certainly outhouses throughout the world. And there are certainly other alternative non-indoor plumbing evacuation techniques in use throughout the world. And there's certainly other alternative non-indoor plumbing evacuation techniques in use throughout the world. So I don't know that it is as hard and fast a societal contract as you would have me believe. Do you have a sanitary or hygienic argument to make that is backed up by any evidence? Because that would be something that I would like to hear. Sure. I mean, I guess, theoretically, if said chamber pot was used only very rarely, and if it were emptied nearly immediately, there would be

very little issue. My concern is that those things wouldn't happen, or they might start out that way. But as things often do, entropy sort of sets in. And, you know, people get a little bit more lax about taking care of that on an expeditious way. You're saying that you're saying that you suspect your girlfriend is going to leave a bowl of her pee

up in her studio for months on end? That's what you think about her? I don't want to impugn her name before, you know, dozens of listeners, but... There's not really any need. She's impugned it pretty well herself. Okay. Well, then, in that case, that is my fear.

It may not be warranted, but that is my fear, yes. I want you to know that I have a game plan for ways to dispose of any urine. I'd like to hear it. It goes down the toilet, right? I have a game plan, too. You're going to give it to Tony to take to the football game so he can get into a stadium, pal?

Yeah. Well, there's three different ways. I mean, it is upstairs, and if you don't want to toss it, you know, take it downstairs, you could just open a window, throw it in the street, and yell, medieval! No, no, no.

I'm joking. That's not a real thing. I can tell you're joking. Also, worms really like the nitrogen in pee, and we have a vermicompost, so i could pour it onto the worms and it would expedite the composting process i know that tony would not like that um but really you have you've you've you've introduced i think two other huge subjects into this one which is

composting two which is vermicomposting. So what is a vermicompost really quickly? It's a compost bin that you put food scraps into and red worms eat the compost and turn it into worm castings. OK, and this is for fertilizing a garden? Yes. And you'd like to add your own castings yep do you have scholarship to back up your claim that if you pee all over these worms it's going to make the compost great yeah i've read various pieces of literature that encourage the practice

and were these handed to you on the street by people in Portland, Oregon? No, it's from the library and from gardening stores. I have some pamphlets. Okay. And those are two interesting options, one of which is clearly comedic, one of which is actually interesting and intriguing to me. The third obvious one, just flushing it down the toilet, why is that off the table or is that on the table? Oh, that's the third one that's on the table. And I propose then, you know,

swirling some bleach solution in the bowl before replacing it. I think I have everything I need to make my decision. I am going to take this crossword puzzle into my Roman baths and I shall return in about 47 hours to render my verdict. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Okay, Tony. Yes. Shouldn't your girlfriend just be allowed to do what she, what I'll just say she needs to do? Ultimately, you're probably right, Jesse, Bailiff Jesse. But I just, I guess when the idea first came up, I was so aghast at the thought of it. It's just not something that was part of my upbringing and it's hard for me to stomach. And so ultimately, if that's how the judge finds, I can live with it,

but I wanted my objection to be on the record. Meg, it seems to me like you're arguing that when you have company over, you would rather pee in a jug than hold it. Is that actually true? I just want the option to be there. It puts my mind at ease and my bladder at ease. I don't know if I will even exercise the use of the chamber pot if it was given to me, but it gives me peace of mind to know that I'm not trapped without a place to relieve myself.

I don't know. I mean, I just pee a lot too. I just, this has never come up. This peeing in a jug business do you think you got a shot at this one Meg? I hope so and I hope that if I win everyone will call me thunder jugs are you going to acquire more than one thunder jug? is that what you're threatening?

we'll see. We'll wait and see. Slippery slope. Slippery slope. Tony, you seem like a real so-and-so. How do you feel about your chances in this case? I do feel like the judge mostly made my case for me. But if history is any guide,

the judge likes to make a surprise twist in the end. So I could be in for it. We'll see. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman reenters the courtroom. Well, first of all, I find it to be extremely strange and intrusive that any one of us should be telling this young woman how often she really should have to urinate and how pressing a need it is for her. The reality is, like all of our bodily functions, they are personal to us and only we can know for sure. This is a matter ultimately that redounds to issues of privacy. I don't want to hear about people doing the crossword puzzle in the bathroom, not because I don't understand that that goes on in there,

not that I don't enjoy a crossword puzzle myself from time to time in a room that might have special plumbing in it. The point is, this is one of the most personal and private experiences that we have, short of birth, and then another that I won't mention. Close encounters with our body that deserve solitude. And I say that especially as a human being who is not only married, but also has children, which means that privacy has completely disintegrated in my household. And I am as guilty of disintegrating that privacy as possible. So I am speaking here of the ideal that a young couple together should be able to at least continue to have their individual privacy and also respect that certain portions of their lives are off limits. The evidence that I have that is more compelling than any beautiful photograph of a cat looking

at a chamber pot is that Meg, A, knew what a female portable urinal is and B, openly admitted that she thought about getting one. That, to me, suggests that whether out of physical or psychological need, this is someone who really does need to have some assurance that she can use the bathroom if she needs to. And I think it is reasonable for her to want to plan into her life some, shall we call it plan B. As long as we're not talking about a plan BM, if you know what I'm talking about. Now, I think I've made it perfectly clear that I find this whole prospect disturbing and gross. I find this whole prospect disturbing and gross,

but I don't really find it so very gross as in this, in the sense that I don't really find it so very gross as the idea that special chamber pots are being brought out for Christmas time. Yes. That's where this court truly gets skeeved out. Because when we are talking about something that goes on in the privacy of one's own art studio and an antique that may have been sent to her by her mother that no one need ever see nor hear about, that is a one thing. As far as I'm concerned, if you are at need, nothing is off limits. A two liter empty bottle of Mountain Dew, the woods near your uncle's house in Maine, no comment, or even at

absolute need, a litter box if you're an artist at a party and the door is closed. Who cares? and the door is closed. Who cares? Things happen. Emergencies arrive. Chamber pot, as much as it dismays me to say it, is a part of Meg's Montanan heritage. It is part of her growing up, her connection to her grandmother and mother. And you guys may know, I am an advocate of urine hoarding, precisely for the reason that it can be used to augment composts, I find myself finding in favor of Meg. With the stipulation that this thing be used in your studio only, that it be discreetly emptied and cleaned with bleach, as you say. emptied and cleaned with bleach, as you say. And by discreetly, I mean that Tony never has to deal with it, that it has kept a total mystery from him for all time, and that when your family comes to visit, you do not say, by the way, everybody,

there's a jug upstairs in case you need to relieve yourself. And as I say that it be used only as a plan B and never as a plan BM is that just as beyond the pale. In the spirit that what happens in the bathroom is your own business. Doing your business

is your own business. And if you absolutely at need and even desire need to extend the bathroom to your other private space in the house, it is not for me nor for Tony to stop you. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules. That is all. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Well, Meg, you sound very relieved all of a sudden.

Sorry about that. I'm going back into my chambers now. Meg, you've emerged with a victory of sorts. How do you feel? Please don't say emerged. I feel triumphant. I'm glad to have control over my body. Every woman should have that. It's great.

Tony, how are you feeling? Well, as a valid urine hoarder, I feel that the judge may have recused himself. But that said, I feel like it was actually a just and fair ruling and something I can live with. And I do want to see Meg have that peace of mind that she seems to be asking for and needing. Have you ever thought about taking your baths at the coffee shop?

I think they only have a little sink in there, but I'll see what I can do. You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast always brought to you by you, the members of MaximumFun.org. Thanks to everybody who's gone to MaximumFun.org slash join, and you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by the folks over there at Babbel. Did you know that learning, the experience of learning causes a sound to happen?

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have in common. They're made in Made In. Save up to 25% this Memorial Day from the 18th until the 27th. Visit madeincookware.com. That's M-A-D-E-I-N cookware.com. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience.

One you have no choice but to embrace because, yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-O-D-C-A-S-T-I. Hmm. Are you trying to put the name of the podcast there yeah i'm trying to spell it but it's tricky let me give it a try okay if you need a laugh and you're on the go call s-t-o-p-p-p-a-d-i it'll never fit no it will let me try if you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close.

Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh and you're on the go. Tony, Meg, thanks for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Oh, Judge John Hodgman, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to burst in upon your bath time. Sorry. Sorry. I was just settling into my brand new neck-high standing-up soaking tub. I assume that was a Victorian bathing house.

No, it's just an old iron lung that I got, and I put it on its side. Well, it looks good. Is that an appropriate place for you to clear the docket from? Yes, except I can't raise my hands out of the tub because they're pinned to my side, so I'll just use this page-turning stick with my teeth, or you'll have to hold the page in front of me. Okay, I'll do that. How about this? Why don't I

just... Eyes up here, eyes up here, Jesse. Why don't I just read them out loud? Okay. Here's something from TW. And just so you know, we have included pseudonyms in this letter for clarity. All right. My dispute involves two friends of mine. I'll call one the professor since he teaches at a local university. He's a European man in his seventies and he's only here for a few months each year. The other friend is a woman in her 50s who lives locally who I'll call Jane.

Whom you'll call Jane. Whom you'll call Jane. Whom I will call Jane. That's not on you, Bailiff Jesse. That's on the author. That's on TW. Go on. Today I received a phone call from a woman with a foreign accent telling me that Jane is sleeping with the professor and asking me to do something about it. I recognized the voice as the professor's wife, presumably calling from Europe, although she did not answer any of my questions. I gather that she wasn't prepared to say much in English. I've suspected that the professor had become close to Jane, but I didn't think they were having an affair. I can't be certain of the professor's wife's motives or even of her mental state.

Is this possible affair any of my business? Is the wife trying to use me? I'm tempted to confront Jane rather than the professor. I can see this damaging my relationships with both people. Should I keep quiet, confront my friend, or let the professor know of his wife's suspicion? Uh, yeah, stay out of it. Stay out of it, T. the professor know of his wife's suspicion. Yes, stay out of it. Stay out of it, T.W.

It's none of your business. I'm sorry that Juliette Binoche called you, trying to involve you in her elaborate madman cosplay and get you involved in this thing, but it truly is none of your business. And you obviously don't understand how people do things in Europe. I think that if she were to call again, you should say, using an internet translator, if necessary, that you don't wish to be involved and that if she wishes to confront her husband, she needs to do so on her own. And I would give them the space and privacy

to work out whatever they're going through on their own. Of course, if you do use an internet translator, you'll probably be asking them for a hat made of cheese, but, you know. Do you disagree, Jesse? Do you think he should get involved? No, I mean, I think it... Yeah, I don't think...

I think that it was inappropriate for the wife to ask him, a person that she doesn't even know, to intervene. I think that she should address it with her husband if she feels that it needs to be addressed. I agree with you, Jesse. I mean, it's so inappropriate that it seems exceedingly weird that this woman would call this acquaintance of her husband's and ask him to do something about it. I almost wonder if he's not hallucinating a midnight call from a French woman in order to prompt him to do the meddling that he so clearly wants to do.

But he must not meddle. This is a European man in his 70s and a woman in her 50s. There is no more dictionary definition of grown-up. Let them be grown-ups and take care of themselves. Here's something from Matt. My partner and I disagree on how to describe the following situation. She does something or will not do something to make me feel bad. I then in turn do something or don't do something to make her feel bad, which she then repeats to me and so on and so forth. She calls this a catch-22, but I think that means the same as a deadlock. I call the situation a vicious cycle or a negative feedback loop. Ignoring the stupidity

of the particular situation, what's the correct casual term for this? Well, it's not a catch-22 because that's a specific thing from the book catch 22, which is when you can't take action because you are constrained by opposing rules or restrictions. So the, the, the, the definition is a guy, the guy wants to plead insanity to get out of combat flying duty, but he can't because the, the desire to get out of combat flying duty demonstrates that he's saying, can't because the desire to get out of combat flying duty demonstrates that he's sane. So that's not what's going on here.

So I have to find in favor of Matt, although I think Vicious Cycle is also, well, I guess it is more of a vicious cycle. It's definitely not a negative feedback loop because I no longer live in Brookline, Massachusetts in 1982 in the back of a head shop. Let's call it vicious cycle. And also, something you guys think you need to work through in therapy. How about that, too?

You're a wise man, Judge Hodgman. Well, you know, I'm getting all the terrible toxins out of my body Through this incredibly hot stand-up bath that I'm taking It doesn't seem safe electricity-wise to me Oh, why? Because I have three hair dryers in here, creating a jacuzzi? Well, I mean, that's only the beginning of the problems I wouldn't have plugged it in, for one thing thing if I was going to pour hot water into it. Oh, right. There's no water in here right now.

Wait, what's in there? Just the hair dryers? It's just a hot air bath and dust. Oh, so it is dust. So you're bathing like a hamster. I'm bathing like a hamster. I'm bathing like a hamster. I'm taking a hamster-style dust jacuzzi. A paralyzed hamster. A hamster paralyzed from the neck down. Exactly.

You know what? We should market this to veterinarians. Oh, believe me, Jesse. I'm putting in the veterinary issue of SkyMall tomorrow. We should market this to veterinarians. Oh, believe me, Jesse. I'm putting in the veterinary issue of SkyMall tomorrow. We'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Au revoir, mes amis et mes amantes. My lovers, my lovers.

That's what I'm trying to say. Goodbye. The Judge John Hodgman Podcast is a production of MaximumFun.org. Our special thanks to all of the folks who donate to support the show and all of our shows at MaximumFun.org slash donate. The show is produced by Julia Smith and me, Jesse Thorne, and edited by Mark McConville. You can check out his podcast, Super Ego, in iTunes or online at gosuperego.com. You can find John Hodgman online at areasofmyexpertise.com. If you have a case for Judge John Hodgman, go to maximumfund.org slash JJHO.

If you have thoughts about the show, join the conversation on our forum at forum dot maximum fun dot org and our facebook group at facebook.com slash judge john hodgman we'll see you online and next time right here on the judge john hodgman podcast maximum fun dot org comedy and culture artist owned listener supported