Judge John Hodgman - Dog Duty

Episode Date: November 14, 2012

Zoe brings the case against her mom, Rochelle. They brought home a new puppy last summer and Zoe took the lead in training and caring for the dog until she left for college. Now Zoe is thousands of miles away, but wants to retain her say in the puppy's day-to-day life. Her mom says Zoe needs to stop meddling from afar.

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm guest bailiff Scott Adsit. This week, dog duty. Zoe brings the case against her mom, Rochelle. They brought home a new puppy last summer and Zoe took the lead in training and caring for the dog until she left for college. Now Zoe is thousands of miles away but wants to retain her say in the puppy's day-to-day life. Her mom says Zoe needs to stop meddling from afar. Who is wrong and who is right? Only one man can decide. Please rise as the Honorable Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom. Judge John Hodgman took no interest in guest bailiff Scott Adsit's introductions. He said that the education of the young was more important than

anything that could be done for those who are already grown up and introduced. It happened that Jesse and Bluebell had both whelped soon after the hay harvest, giving birth to them nine sturdy puppies. As soon as they were weaned, Judge John Hodgman took the puppies away from their mothers, saying that he would make himself responsible for their education. He took them up to a loft, which could only be reached by a ladder from his chambers, and there kept them in such seclusion that the rest of the court soon forgot their existence. Guest bailiff Scott Adsit was left with nothing to do

but to swear them in. Rochelle and Zoe, please rise and raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God or whatever? I do. I do. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling with the understanding that Judge Hodgman's only magisterial inspiration and influence is the great God Zardoz? I do. I do. I do.

Thank you. Judge Hodgman, you may proceed. You may be seated. Thank you very much for that sweet Zardoz reference there. Guest bailiff Scott Adsit, so nice to have you and your Rod Serling-like voice on the podcast. I stand rigid waiting.

Thank you very much. For an immediate summary judgment, can either you, Zoe, or you, Rochelle, name the particular piece of popular culture that I was referencing? Yeah, I can. I can, too. We can both, I think. You both can? You picked one of our favorite books. Can you say it in, well, don't say it in unison because it'll mess up our connection.

Why don't we let mom go first, Rochelle? Animal Farm by George Orwell. I also said don't say it at the same time. Easy there, Zoe. I trusted that you also knew it. Rochelle, would you stipulate that Zoe also knew the answer to that one? Absolutely. No doubt in my mind.

Animal Farm was the correct answer. One of the rare situations in which the answer was guessed, and luckily for this court, you both guessed the answer correctly. So it is a summary judgment neutral wipeout, and no one gains a summary judgment. So since none of you will enjoy summary judgment in your favor, let's try the case. Who brings this case? The complainant is Zoe. You are the daughter of Rochelle. Yes, I am the one with the complaint for my mother. And what's so wrong about your mom? I think my mom is, I think she's neglecting some of the things that she needs to do with my dog. I think she doesn't take me seriously on some of the things that I really

think we should do with Anna. Of course not. Like agility training. Um, and, uh, you know, other sorts of training. Uh, I think she needs to change the way she feeds her. It's really inaccurate, things like that. Let me interrupt you for one moment, Zoe, and we'll get into whatever weird ninja training you want for your dog in a moment. The bare bones of this case is that you adopted a dog before going to college. Now you're at college, your mom is taking care of the dog and you think she's doing a terrible job. Is that correct? I wouldn't say terrible.

Okay. Do you just have some very specific complaints? Yes, I have some specific complaints about, you know, a few things that I think are not being done that should. All right. Now, mom, Rochelle, your daughter just said you are terrible.

You're a terrible mother and a terrible person and a terrible dog caregiver. How do you respond? I think I take care of the dog very well. I would disagree with the characterization of the dog as her dog. It's our dog. And I might not be caring for her exactly the way that Zoe would, but I've cared for multiple dogs in my life, four dogs, including Anna, which is four more than Zoe's ever cared for. So I would say that I am a good judge of what is good for the dog and what is not. And while it might not be exactly what Zoe would do, I think that she's physically with me and I should get to decide. All right. Quick former dog roll call.

The current dog is Anna. Anna is a seven-month-old chocolate lab. What are the other three dogs that you've cared for, Rochelle? Penelope. She was a mutt rat terrier. Sadie Hawkins. She was a golden retriever. And Genevieve, a Lab, German Shepherd mix.

All right. Zoe, your mom remembers the names of dogs. It does seem that she does seem that she is a pretty good caregiver for dogs. Did you know any of these dogs as you were growing up or are these dogs that she had when, when she was a child? Penelope and Sadie were both dogs that she cared for when she was younger. And I think I met Penny when I was maybe a year old. So Penny had a really great life. And so you are 18. How old are you now? I'm almost 19.

You're almost 19. So there's been a gap, is what you're saying, in your mother's dog-caring career. She had three dogs up until uh no no Genevieve was um Genevieve lived from when I was six to sixteen oh so okay excuse me my misunderstanding then may I presume that Genevieve uh died of starvation in a basement tied to a pipe uh no she uh actually um she actually passed away of cancer. Oh, really? Did, did your mom seek veterinary care or did she just put her in a burlap sack and throw her off a bridge? Um, no, we actually went through a lot of treatments for her. Um, actually the day I got her, I dedicated my, uh, personal savings account from, you know,

I dedicated my personal savings account from little mad money that I got here and there and birthday money and stuff. I dedicated it to Genevieve because I knew that puppies turned into dogs and dogs got old and they got medical troubles. And she had hip dysplasia, so I kind of anticipated her needing care. And I actually spent the lion's share of her treatment was my money. Zoe, you're the one who's speaking now. Yes. The lion's share of Genevieve's treatment was your money? Yes. Of her cancer treatment was from my savings. Oh, so otherwise your mom would have tossed her down a well? That's what I assume. I mean, something like that. Rochelle, is that true? I think Zoe is exaggerating. I certainly

would not have tossed her down a well. I will say that Zoe did save her money from the time that she was little, knowing that Jen may need medical treatment. And I don't know if her money was the majority of the money spent on Genevieve, but she spent the vast majority of her savings on Genevieve, if that makes sense. Zoe insisted that we do everything and anything possible to save Genevieve or prolong her life. And that was definitely a big factor in the decisions that we made in terms of how long we kept trying to, to make her better until we couldn't anymore. And you may not, you may not have chosen to, uh, have Genevieve undergo as much treatment as she did. Were it left to you? I think that's a fair statement. Right. Because, because, because you're a monster. No, because

these are horrible. These are horrible decisions that every pet owner has to make. And it is very hard to care for an animal, especially when you know that their condition will never improve. But I do admire the choice that you made as a young person, Zoe, to keep your mother from throwing Genevieve down a well or strapping Genevieve to the top of a car. So that's very good. Thank you. So when did you get this dog, this new dog, this doggy come lately? Anna? Yes. We got Anna at the very beginning of summer this year. We had been looking at adopting a puppy, but in our area it was really difficult.

We really tried to do a rescue, but it wasn't working out. So we looked for a breeder and we found one in Southern California. And we found one in Southern California and I went and got her and drove her all the way up from from about Bakersfield up to San Francisco. OK. And then we I cared for her all through summer. OK. You live in San Francisco or Rochelle, you live in San Francisco and that's where Anna lives now. I live in Silicon Valley in the Bay Area. And yeah, she lives with me now. Right. Okay. And where do you go to college, Zoe? NYU.

Good school. Good school on the other side of the country. So let me ask you this. Why did you get a dog three months before you moved to the other side of the country? You know, it was really strategic timing because I thought that. It's the best time to get a dog because then you just have a puppy for three months and then you never have to see it again. It's perfect. I actually, I've been home twice since I've gone away. I've actually come home a lot and I'm going to go home in, I think, 10 days and see her. But we got her then because, you know, when a puppy is young, you have to spend a lot of time with her, see her. But we got her then because, um, you know, when, when a puppy is young, you,

you have to spend a lot of time with her training or, uh, training her, um, you know, house training. And I did all that kind of stuff that would be really hard for my mom while she's working. So I kind of, I kind of got all that stuff out of the way for my mom. And I wanted to get to know our dog before I left. I wanted to have enough time with her that like I knew the dog and she knew me. But it was important to me that my mom have someone to go home to while I'm gone because my mom is one of those people that only really can take care of themselves if it's through taking care of someone else. What do you think about that, Rochelle? Is that true? I think that might be a compliment.

I'm not sure um i think it is true that if i didn't have anna here i would probably work much longer hours i might you know sleep in a little later so she you know does get me out of bed in the morning sounds like your daughter just robbed you of a of a great life exactly so it's nice to have someone to come home to my daughter hadn't bought me a dog right before she left for college, after I raised her for 18 years, I might have been able to sleep in once for the first time in two decades. And I might have gone to happy hour a couple of times,

but now I've got a dog that I got to feed. Do you have anyone else at home with you, Rochelle? No. Do you have any other children? I do not. Oh, Zoe, you're an only child yes my mom would not be at happy hour however welcome um welcome to the club by the way zoe yes i am also an only child welcome to the welcome to the uh to the uh super smart narcissism club it's great i love it it is

never had to share a thing in your life didn't you nope no exactly except for this one thing this one thing for this dog yeah didn't see that coming did you you like every only child in the world you think well I'll save that for my judgment I really do think though that my mom would overwork herself I mean did you ask you ask even when, okay. Even when I was around, I, you know, it would be 10 at night and I would tell her, you should got to come home, man. I know you have work and I know you have to do it, but you have to go home and, you know, eat a good dinner, you know, not just grab fast food. Um, you know, working too much and putting everyone else before her is like,

is a big issue for my mom. Which one of you is the 19 year old? Which one of you is the mom? Are you the mom? I'm not. No, you're not. But you're being motherly towards your mother. Are you concerned that if you didn't get her a dog, that she would waste away in the basement chain to a pipe? That's honestly, that's an exaggeration of my fear, but it's not too far off.

Before I get further into this, let me get to some of the specifics. What is the problem? What are the specific things now that you would like your mom, Rochelle, to do vis-a-vis Anastasia? You want her to train Anastasia to be a spy. What is it? Agility training? Yeah. Basic agility training.

Um, you know, and she still needs to go through her physical therapy, um, for her broken leg. She had a broken leg over the summer. Um, which was really hard to take care of.

Um, that was really difficult for me who had a broken leg anna oh your dog had a broken leg yes anna broke her leg so she needs to get cleared by a physical therapist before she can do the training how did she break her leg were you teaching her how to skydive uh she was being a very energetic puppy and she tried to jump on something that was too tall for her. And instead of putting her front leg onto the object, she hit it against the object. Oh, I see. And did you get this on YouTube and then get a million hits? Absolutely not. Okay. Rochelle, are you taking the dog to physical therapy?

I am. I have taken her to many sessions of physical therapy and, and she's got a few more to go, but yes, I am. Is the physical therapist, is the, is the dog physical therapist, a handsome dude that you're falling in love with?

So we can turn this into a romantic comedy. If only, unfortunately, no. Oh, give me, give me the, give me the number off,

off the air. Give me the number of the physical therapy place and I'll, and I'll see if they can hire a handsome person. How old? Will do. What are your preferences? Maybe we could do that off the air as well. Okay, that's fine.

You know, it's very personal. Very personal, I realize. But it's just I have a lot of pull with the veterinary physical therapists of Northern California. It's just a weird thing. Good to know. I'll see what i can i'll see what i can do and what do you think about this agility training what can you tell me what this is for because zoe keeps talking about it as though it is something every dog gets

but i have never heard about it and it seems like a northern california weird mandatory dog school it is i had never heard of it either although although I had seen things on TV with dogs running down a field and jumping over little hurdles and hitting a target and makes a ball come out. And they get the ball and they run the other way. You know, first of all, may I just say something? I'm sorry, go ahead. What you're describing, that TV show you're describing is only for dogs. You should not be watching that. Okay, good to know.

That's television for dogs. I must have caught it when Anna was watching. What do you think of it? Is it worth it? I think it seems fun. I certainly don't have anything against the people who do it. My issue is, one, she already broke her leg. And she broke her leg trying to jump onto a chair. God only knows what she's going to do to herself if we make her jump over hurdles and off docks and into water and that kind of stuff.

It may be that there is no agility training for this dog. You may just have a clumsy dog. What do you think about that, Zoe? Maybe. And secondly, it's time consuming. I suspect that there are a lot of hours of training. I did look at it a little bit. There's classes you go to to get trained and then you have to do training at home and you have to buy some hurdles and a tunnel for them to run through.

And so, it's actually a significant amount of my time that she's asking me for. And, um, I don't know that I think it's worth it for the couple of videos that I would send Zoe. Look how cute your dog is jumping over these hurdles. How much does it cost? Uh, I don't know the answer to that. Why is agility training so important for, for Anna to have Zoe? Um, well, I think it would give my, uh, her and my mom a really good activity to do. Um, Anna is a really smart and active dog. She, she jumps on stuff and we're shocked. Like it's a,

the things you can jump onto, um, are so high. And we did take her to a demonstration of dog agility and she, we couldn't control her. She was so excited just watching the other dogs do it. Like the dogs would run over to the right and she would try and run over with them. She would try and then they'd go left and she tried to go left. She was super excited to do it. And I think it would be good for my mom to have something to do outside of work because all she, she doesn't do that much outside of work and she doesn't really do any much, um, outside of work and just being at home. What else is your mom doing wrong vis-a-vis the dog specifically?

Well, just about the agility training, she gives her toys and she rips apart toys. I mean, she just guts them. And I think I submitted a few pieces of evidence on just the destruction of chew toys that Anna is capable of. Um, and not only does it leave, you know, bits of junk all over our house and get it dirty. Um, but Anna gets sick sometimes from swallowing parts of dog toys. She, she's gotten sick four times while I was there and I've cleaned it up all those four times. I was just there last week and she got sick and I had to clean it up. So that's a problem.

And I think that if she was more active, she would, you know, have more, she would expend her energy and then she would be less antsy and not have to chew up so much stuff and not get sick. antsy and not have to chew up so much stuff and not get sick. Because sometimes when we take her out to the beach and stuff, she is super happy and runs around and then she comes home and she sleeps like a baby. Oh, so you feel that the dog is not getting enough beach time and therefore is getting neurotic and chewing up dog toys and getting sick as some sort of weird dog sort of neurotic eating disorder?

Well, in a way, yes. I'm actually more sympathetic to your point of view than I sound, but I just want to. Yeah. Her trainer actually remarked at how smart of a dog she was. And he said that she's probably pretty bored because she's a really smart dog and she's young. So she, and she's a lab.

And so she's active. She's very smart and wants to be active. Right. And you, and you did send in some evidence here. Yes. Bailiff Scott adds it. Yes,

sir. Could you hand me the evidence, please? You didn't have to crumple it up and throw it at me, Scott. It's a small gallery, web gallery of photos. This, I presume, is Anna, who is luxuriating on a leather sofa with a nice cable-knit blue blanket in front of a fireplace. It's a hard life for Anna, clearly. Rochelle, you're really torturing her. Then I see Anna wearing goggles. Are these goggles for fun or

does Anna also have a rare eye sensitivity that also needs a special place? They protect her eyes from the sun and wind. Who just said that? I did, Zoe. Okay. Oh, so she does. She's a rare eye sensitivity. I understand. Okay. Very good. We have here a picture of Anna sitting on a bed. What is bad about the sitting on the bed? Anything? I mean, it's a very cute, it's a very cute photo, but is there something else I should be seeing here? Um, no, I don't, I don't think so. Um, okay. And I

see Anna here on the same couch looking at a, what looks to be a MacBook air, no buzz marketing, um, staring at a MacBook air is one of the problems that Rochelle is allowing, uh, Anna too much, uh, uh, unsupervised screen time. Is she cruising doggy porn sites or something? Picture of her looking at me video chatting. That's actually me on the screen, video chatting with Anna. Oh, really? Oh, and so she's huddled up with her little doll and she's video chatting with you.

Yep. Oh, that's nice. That's my evidence. And that was, I submitted that to show that I don't want to be characterized as I lock this dog away and she doesn't ever get to do anything or have any fun. I certainly take her for walks. I submitted some evidence of her at the beach when we took her to the beach.

And anytime Zoe wants to chat with her, video chat with her, I set up the computer and I follow Anna around the house with the computer so Zoe can watch her and see what she's doing and she can talk to her. And I feel that I am very indulgent and happy to do so. So that was my evidence. Bill, Scott, I would like to ask, yeah, I ask what is Anna's response to Zoe on screen? Does she get excited? Does she kowtow? Does she cower? She responds to Zoe's voice. So when Zoe talks to her, she, she looks and tries to figure out where it's coming from. She'll get excited based upon what Zoe is saying. I'm not convinced that visually she gets it. She looks at the computer,

but I'm not convinced that she actually sees it and sees the image as Zoe. But she does hear her and recognize her voice. And Zoe can get her pretty whipped up. How is Zoe? You can feel the love. Sometimes she almost licks the computer, actually. She tries to lick your phone or your computer.

And whose computer is this? My computer, Rochelle's. Okay, great. So you're allowing Zoe to cover your computer with saliva for your daughter. How is Anna's typing? She makes a know, she, she makes a lot of errors, but spell check, uh, uh, makes up for it. Uh, yeah, you might want to enroll her in a typing course. And then there's this, uh, there's this, uh, steel container,

the steel scoop container. What is this supposed to represent? Is this, is this, uh, Anna's favorite art object? I submitted a photo of a scoop that I bought. One of Zoe's complaints was that I don't measure Anna's food accurately enough. So I actually purchased a special two-cup scoop to scoop her food with in an effort to appease Zoe's concerns. And I also sent a photo of the feeding guidelines from the dog food bag that I actually have taped inside the container that I put the dog food in so that I am actively making an effort to feed her accurately.

But let me ask with regard to the feeding, was there a problem that, is this to correct an error that you made before or have you always been feeding the dog using a scoop and guidelines? Well, our dog Genevieve was overweight her whole life and that was probably a bad thing because she had hip dysplasia and being overweight puts more pressure, you know, on her bones and it makes her uncomfortable. She used to use just like a, like a, any drinking glass as a cup measure measurement. And while I do think it's good that my mom bought that two cup measurement for about two weeks, my mom thought it was one cup and was using two scoops. So she was feeding Anna twice as much as she should have been feeding her.

So, you know, she's trying, but there are definitely errors that she makes. And even though she's currently feeding her that amount, she doesn't factor in treats or food she stuffs into toys. And she constantly wants to feed her more. She always says, Oh, look, she's hungry. But you know, she's a dog. She would never stop eating, right? Of course, she's hungry. It's she's a dog. But you have to be responsible and feed her how much is healthy. And I even asked her if you think, you know, if you think she needs more food, you should ask the vet. And my mom, you know, has literally said on several occasions, I don't need a vet to tell me how much to feed my

dog. Rochelle, how do you respond to these accusations? Do you have a problem distinguishing between a one cup and a two cup scoop? Do you have measuring cup dysmorphia of any kind? Well, it is a true statement that I bought this scoop and I thought I was buying a one cup scoop and it doesn't have a measurement number on it. So I thought it was one cup and then after a while I went, you know, it looks kind of big. And so I checked it and it was two. So I found my error and I fixed it. So for a couple of weeks, Anna was getting a lot of food, but I corrected it. week Santa was getting a lot of food, but I corrected it. And it's not that I don't care about how much I feed her, but I do, I think the crux of this case for me is I know how to take

care of her and I don't need the veterinarian to tell me feed her exactly this much and do exactly this with her. I've raised a lot of dogs and I'm just not, I'm much more relaxed about it than Zoe is. And that is the crux of the issue. Yeah. But you raised a lot of big fat cancerous dogs, right? And I will point out that all of our dogs, Penny and Sadie both lived to very old age. How old? 35? Penny was about 16 and Sadie was 15. Okay. And the final piece of evidence is a video that I have here of Anna pulling a dog toy apart.

Is that right? Yes. Yes, I submitted that. Oh, this is adorable. I like dog videos. She's pulling out all the stuffing and may I presume at the end of this video she vomits it it takes a couple hours

but you know I've had to take care of that it happened you know the living room on the sheets in the car I mean it's you know it's not pretty and she's sad. She's unhappy. Okay. And you're basing this on the fact that she's tearing apart a dog toy? Is there any other evidence that you want to present that she's an unhappy dog?

Well, because it gets her sick. I mean, you know, when it happens, it's very clear. Excuse me. Excuse me. I will have a word. You've already made the case, and it's a compelling one, Excuse me. Excuse me. I will have a word with you. You've already made the case, and it's a compelling one, that she is neurotically pulling apart these dog toys because she is unhappy. First of all, these dog toys, for those of you who don't have this precise, I'm going to put this video up on YouTube immediately so that I get a lot of hits for a cute animal thing. But if you haven't seen it, this is Anna, and she's like tearing into a dog toy of the kind that i've never seen before it looks like uh a giant purple mitten stuffed with fiberglass where is this dog

toy from um it's uh it's actually from a nice pet store it's it was marketed as a very tough dog toy because she's so hard on her toys it's um it is a purple octopus and it has little squeakers in the arms and it is stuffed with, it's stuffed really, really firmly with stuffing. So once she opens it up, it is phenomenal how much stuffing comes out of them, but it is absolutely intended for dogs. And how many of these has she destroyed? Of that brand, I'd say about five. Five. I mean, she has destroyed toys at over a dollar per minute rate.

She destroyed a $16 toy in 15 minutes. You know that buying the same dog toy over and over again and expecting a different result is the technical definition of insanity, right?

Honestly, we can't find anything that'll hold up. I mean, she has so much energy. Okay. And she's smart. So she figures out like how to get the stuffing out. It's really impressive. Okay. Zoe, do you feel that her aggressiveness with these stuffed animals is a reflection of her own rage? Her aggressiveness with these stuffed animals is a reflection of her own rage. No, I do not. I think she looks at them almost like puzzles because she's a really smart dog.

And I think she likes to figure out how to open them up. And she systematically gets all the stuffing out and then she gets all the squeakers out. And you are aware that it's the first indication of a serial killer that they will go for small animals first. It might be our fault for giving her this thing that looks like small animals. I think that's the first indication of a serial killer or a dog. Those are the two things. It may be that your child is going to be a serial killer or your child is actually a dog.

I think I have everything I need to know in order to make my decision. I am going to go take all of my chew toys into my chambers and I'll be back in a moment to make my decision. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. And as he goes, let me ask you, Zoe, what do you think? How will you enforce your rules if the judge rules in your favor? Well, I'd just like to see that Anna is going to some kind of active training, hopefully agility training. I think she'd really like it. You know, but I understand she needs to be a certain age. She needs to get cleared by her physical therapist.

I would just like to see, you know, some more expert involvement in her life. And Rochelle, what is the ideal situation for you and Anna together? I would like to have Anna's care left to my discretion, which doesn't mean I ignore Zoe. Clearly, it's quite the opposite of that. I think that I am actually very indulgent with what Zoe wants and having Zoe pick out Anna's collars and leashes and beds and stuff like that. But I would like to have the last say because she is in my care. Do you feel that sometimes your daughter is trying to control how Anna lives her life and also just how you live your life?

Is she trying to control both of you from 3,000 miles away? Well, there wouldn't be anything terribly new in that. But I think that she really, truly cares about Anna deeply. And I think she really, truly cares about me very deeply. But I think that part of youth is the illusion that you can control other people and dictate how they live their life. Zoe, is that an illusion or not? It doesn't seem like an illusion.

I mean, I think that, you know, my mom has controlled me on a lot of things. And it's been a burden on me. Like, you know, I went to a high school that was four minutes away. That's a lot of hours spent on just meaningless driving. And, you know, I did it because my mom, you know, made me do that so that it would benefit me. And it definitely did. But I feel like, especially since we've always lived, we've lived as kind of a payer for so long that we, you know, we ask certain things of each other. And I think that my mom should respect that I'm asking this of her. And you also feel, I get the impression that you know what's best for your

mother's happiness and that is to raise a dog for you. Um, you know, she's raising the dog for both of us. I mean, Anna loves my mom so, so, so much. Um, yeah. And yeah, I think that my mom needs intervention to, you know, go home before 11 o'clock and not work all night, eat a good meal. You know, I hate it when she comes home from work at night and she's like I she tells me she hasn't eaten anything all day or that she never knew it was raining because she doesn't go outside. And, you know, you hate that. It bothers me. It bothers me to see her not taking care of herself. And so you need to manage that. I personally think I need to try as hard as I can to fix it because she doesn't. Understood.

Well, I think the judge has finished his self-consultation as I see the door opening. And please rise as Judge John Hodgman reenters the courtroom. Excuse me one moment while I puke up some cotton batting. Things got a little out of hand as I tore apart my dog toys. Okay. All animals are equal. Some animals are more equal than others.

George Orwell, right, ladies? Your favorite book that you read together, the two of you, mother and only child, reading your weird political allegory books together as you grew up together. And what was George Orwell referring to when he said some animals are more equal than others? Pigs. No, only children. Only children are the animals that are more equal than all other children, all other animals. Only children are the best, the best creatures of all time.

They are raised every moment of the day knowing that that is so. They never have to know. They never have to confront any reality in which they are not the utter center of, of the world's attention, including their own. And it is fantastic. I'm not saying this to put you down. So I am an only child. Scott, are you an only child?

I have an older sister, your honor. Oh, right. So, and that's, and that's why you hate only children, right?

Cause we had, we had, we had it easy. Didn't we? I hate anyone older than me. We, uh, uh,

only children never had to share anything never had to share any toys or had to share any uh uh bedrooms i had not only did i have my own bedroom when i was growing up in one house i had a whole wing to myself well then you and zoe would have something in common because she has the same thing she had the same thing growing up in your house? She has two rooms in our house. We call them Z1 and Z2 in her own bathroom. And we call the area the Z-wing. Yes.

And did you decorate it yourself, Zoe, the way I did? Did you go out and buy posters for it? And did you buy a smoking jacket and sit next to your fern and watch a black and white television as though you were a 35-year-old bachelor when you were actually a 12-year-old boy in Brookline, Massachusetts? You know what? Not quite, but ish. It is. It's a perfect life. And you know what makes it really perfect? Is the bond between an only child and his or her parent or parents. It is very tight, is it not? Yes.

It is something like a sibling slash, there's a parental aspect, but there's also a sibling slash like weird roommate aspect, isn't there? Yep. Yes, there is. And then something strange happens, which is, it turns out you're not siblings and roommates with your parents. You grow up and then you have to go someplace else in the world where there are normal people. People who are not the center of attention all the time and you have to separate from your parent. And it's very hard. I happen to know this myself. And what's interesting is that

the bond between an only child and a parent or parents is really tight. And there's a lot of interchanging over who is the parent and who is really tight and there's a lot of interchanging over who is the parent and who is the child because there's nothing else to distract you and there's no competition of siblings and there's and there's all kinds of communication that goes on between only children and parents it doesn't go on in regular households because people are too distracted right scott i was distracted oh i say, he was too distracted. See? And so I completely understand what, you know, where you're coming from, in terms of leaving for college, and not only feeling the disorientation of freshman year orientation, as it were, but also feeling a motherly impulse to make sure that your mom is okay and taken care of a weird reverse motherly impulse. And you know, it's interesting because anytime someone it's a it's a rule of thumb here in New York City, and in all of my observed

experience, that when a young couple gets a dog, that's a rehearsal baby, you know what I mean? experience, that when a young couple gets a dog, that's a rehearsal baby. You know what I mean? That's a rehearsal child for them before they get married or before they are married and have kids, they'll get a dog. And usually what happens is they'll get a dog and they'll enjoy the dog for like one year and bring it around with them to all their friends' houses and put it to bed and sing it to sleep and so on. And then once they realize they can do this, they can take care of this child, they immediately get pregnant, have a baby, and never pay attention to the dog again, and it wastes away in the basement. Or, you know, just leads a sad life of chewing up chew toys and everything else.

And dogs are, in many ways, you know, child replacements. In fact, you know, that is, I think think maybe one of the number one reason people get dogs when they, when they face an empty nest, like your mom, uh, has is now facing in order to have someone to come home to have someone to take care of and have some companionship and company. Right. Okay. But I'm not sure that your mom asked for a child replacement. Did you Rochelle? I absolutely wanted to get a dog. Okay. All right. I, I thought it was a child replacement. Did you, Rochelle? I absolutely wanted to get a dog. Okay. All right. I thought it was a child replacement. Yes. But you understand you

speak with the utter solipsism of an only child. How can you live without me? It's impossible. My only dispute to that would be that, like I said, I've had three other dogs. I always thought of dogs as a great companion. I think they're great things for kids to have. So we had a dog when Zoe was a kid as well. I wanted to get a dog a little bit sooner than we got Hannah, but it took Zoe a while, understandably, to get over losing Genevieve. So I was actually pushing for a dog earlier than she was. Rochelle, Rochelle, listen, I'm rendering judgment here. I'm on your side.

You don't have to make an argument anymore. I'm with you. I'm with you. Here's the thing. You cannot get a dog and then abandon it after three months and move to the other side of the country and still consider it your dog. This is what it comes down to. A dog is, whether it is a child replacement or simply a dog, it is a fuzzy, leaping, hungry, meatbag of chores and love. It is having a perpetual infant in your house and you cannot own and care for that infant from 3000 miles away. I appreciate that very much. The, the, the sort of weird bequeathing that you wished to do to give your, to give your mom another child. But here's the thing. Only children don't know how to share. And now you have to share this dog with your mom. And that means letting your mom take care of the

dog. Now with your input, of course, so with your input, of course. And that means letting your mom take care of the dog. Now, with your input, of course, Zoe, with your input, of course. And I think probably your input is very wise. I mean, you obviously care a lot about this dog and you absolutely should be careful about overfeeding a dog and making sure a dog gets healthy and making sure the dog gets lots of exercise. But I'm looking at these pictures and I see no evidence whatsoever of this dog being mistreated in any way that would require intervention. And as far as this agility class goes, you know, I think that that's perfectly reasonable as an idea. Certainly, if you were owning a dog, that would be your absolute right to do. It is an expense and it is a use of your mom's time, which now for the first time in a long time is her own to choose what to do with. in a long time is her own to choose what to do with. So while I appreciate that you love this dog very much,

and I think it's adorable that you want to talk to it over iChat, and I think that, you know, the doggie will appreciate, little Anna will appreciate the fact that she has a deadbeat mom across the country who wants to see her from time to time and give her presents and show up at Christmas time and tell her caretaker everything she's doing wrong. I don't think that's the way you want to be in your life. So unfortunately for you, Zoe, I'm ruling in favor of your mom, Rochelle, granting her full discretion and full guardianship over this dog. I suspect and encourage her to continue to enjoy your input as to what the dog might enjoy. And certainly if you wish to provide a compromise position where you are going to pay for the agility classes

and arrange it so that your mom can take it to the agility classes when Anna is capable enough and at a time that is at your mom's convenience, I have no problem with that. I really do encourage you guys to stop giving, or specifically you, Rochelle, to stop giving Anna these stuffed octopuses because they're not good for her. Don't tell me that there aren't chew toys out there that she can't destroy. There's a thing in the world called a Kong. I don't mean to buzz market, but I know these things exist. I would be happy to send you a photo of a destroyed Kong, but your point is very well taken. Yeah. Well, you know, look, all I'm saying is keep searching for the better chew toy out there because you don't want her to be chewing things.

I don't see strong evidence beyond anecdotal evidence that she might be destroying toys out of neurosis. beyond anecdotal evidence that she might be destroying toys out of out of neurosis the the best of my understanding about about labs is they're basically the swiss army knife of dogs you can kind of do no wrong with them but and they're very well tempered and they're and they can be used you know they they adapt themselves to a lot of different situations i think that it's something to keep an eye on certainly and. And I think you should take Zoe's interest in Anna's well-being very seriously. And I don't think you can, unfortunately, dictate via iChat how either Anna nor your mom should live at this point. The separation has occurred. You are in college. You are beginning your life. You need to let Anna, who is growing up rapidly, go to college. You need to let your mom go to college and let them all eat junk food and experiment and have fun and have dorm parties without you. And eventually they'll calm down and be settled into a life on their own. You'll calm down and be settled into a life on your own. I'm sorry about this. Rochelle, you should have waited until your daughter left

for college to get another dog. Then you wouldn't have had this problem. But maybe this will be a way for you guys to continue to talk and have fun together and enjoy this creature that you brought into the world together in this weird only child, only parent family. I'm going to stop talking now. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules. That is all. Well, the judge has made his decision, and that leaves Zoe and Rochelle looking at each other blankly and wondering where we'll go from here.

Zoe, how do you feel about the verdict? You know, I'm happy that he told my mom to take my input seriously. told my mom to take my input seriously. And, uh, you know, I'm happy that he did say something about the toys because, um, I, you know, I think she's just spending too much time on them and the destruction is bad. Um, you know, and I would, uh, the thing I have to suggest to my mom is just more activity to make her, you know, expend her energy somewhere else. If I may make a suggestion, I would like to suggest that perhaps Zoe be reassigned to the role of grandma in this situation so that you can come home, visit with the child as it were, and lavish love and gifts and affection on the dog and provide unrequested advice of the mother being Rochelle,

and provide unrequested advice of the mother being Rochelle, which then can be ignored with contempt. I think that's very wise input, guest bailiff Scott Adsit, because it's much better that you be the grandmom in this situation, Zoe, than, as I say, the deadbeat Kramer versus Kramer mom who goes away and then suddenly comes back and wants to fix everything. I don't consider myself deadbeat and I still consider California my home. Yeah, but the thing is, you chose to go to school 3,000 miles away. So, you know, you still absolutely, I understand you still have a huge, huge connection to Northern California, which you always have. But you also have to give yourself the space to allow your new life to assert itself here on the East Coast.

There are a lot of boys out there in college that you can start bossing around very soon. I absolutely concur with Scott Adsit. And Zoe, good luck in New York. Have a good time here. Thank you. Don't get another dog. You're too young to be a mother. I think my RA wouldn't like my having a dog here. You should get your RA a dog. And tell him what to do with it. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Just say, I think you need this in your life.

What you should do is get your RA a 10-foot-long grown ball python. your life. What you should do is you get your RA a 10 foot long, uh, grown ball Python and leave it and leave it in his or her room. Just saying, I think, I think you would benefit by taking care of this Python. You'll be happier. Rochelle Zoe.

Thank you for joining us on the judge. John Hodgman podcast. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you guys very much. Judge, I hate to interrupt. Can we do some docket clearing? Yeah, sorry.

I was just trying to get this gin martini out of this Kong. What? Docket clearing? Yes. Okay, good. We have one here from Karen. It says, while my husband Mark traveled for a few weeks, I slept in our queen-size bed solo. I learned that my best sleep happens when I can spread out over more than half the bed.

Mark prefers to torture me in a love bundle rather than buy a larger mattress. His fear is that a king-size mattress is a gateway to sad old people sleeping in separate and sexless bedrooms. The reality of our situation is that I am already often driven to sleep in our guest room when Mark falls asleep before me. He takes up more than his share of the bed, radiates heat, and snores. We agree to follow your ruling regarding mattress size and the purposes of a bed. Your husband could not be more wrong. Mark, you're wrong. King-size bed is not a gateway to a marriage without intimacy, shall we say. It is the gatehood to awesome adulthood.

King-size bed is a signal to the world that you are a king. The king-size bed expresses the confidence you require to speak your needs plainly and get what you desire. Nothing could be sexier than that. And certainly, certainly not a love bundle. Love bundle is the grossest thing I've ever heard. It is not arousing or intimate at all. It is something that makes me think of naked mole rats. Karen herself describes it as torture. Yeah, it's torture. Queen-size beds are too small for grown-ups.

If you have the room for a king-size bed in your life, you will enjoy it, because otherwise you will be sleeping in that Lucy and Ricky double twins arrangement, which, you know, look, it actually can be pretty comfortable, too. I get a good night's sleep that way. King size beds are the best.

Moving on. Next up, Dave writes, I live in an apartment building with a shared coin operated washer and dryer. This morning, I found two washers full of clean, wet laundry. There were no other empty machines and the tenant had not removed her clothes. I took the clothes out of the machine, placed them delicately on top and loaded my own clothes. As I was leaving, a woman came into the room, saw that her clothes had been removed from the washer and started yelling at me in a foreign language. I apologized in English, but she kept yelling it as I left. I asked a friend who lives in a similar building about his thoughts on the incident. He said that he's had his clothes removed from the machines before and that it bothers

him. He believes that I should have erred on the side of patience as there is a quasi-expectation of privacy. I disagree. I think the laundry room is a shared space and if you're not there waiting as your clothes finish, you're not there waiting as your clothes finish you're being rude and the incoming patron is permitted to take your laundry out of the washer the onus is on the tenant to be there as soon as the load is finished is that true i could not agree more actually i i

think that i've ruled on a similar case in the page of the New York Times Magazine. When you are using a shared washing and drying machine room in an apartment building, there's a rule of thumb that I think everyone should self-enforce, which is you should not use more than two-thirds of the available machines at any given time. So in other words, if there are three washing machines, don't use them all at the same time. Use two, leave one to accommodate one of the tenants who might be coming in and starting their wash at a later time than you. If there are nine washing machines, do not use more than six. If there are five, leave 1.66666667 available for your fellow tenants. Because you don't want to be in a situation

where you are clogging up a machine that someone is waiting to use. And then once you