Judge John Hodgman - Great Balls of Ire

Episode Date: June 18, 2015

Aron and Molly's yard is littered with balls kicked over from the park next door. They can't agree on how best to return the balls and appease the kids.

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. This week, great balls of ire. Aaron brings the case against his wife Molly. They recently moved into a new home located next door to a public park. The kids playing in the park continually kick or throw balls over the fence and the couple's yard is strewn with those balls. fence, and the couple's yard is strewn with those balls. Aaron and Molly can't agree on how best to return the balls and appease the kids. Who's right and who's wrong? Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents the obscure cultural reference. When I was 10 years old, I had a kite. Awesome kite. I could fly it so high you couldn't see it. One day it crashed down. I followed the string, and it landed right over there across the street, right on the lawn of that internet court. Oh, did he take your kite? Yeah, he takes everything that lands on his fake internet court lawn. But that's not the point. The point is, I saw him talking to his court

and kissing it. Besides, everyone knows what he did to his bailiff. Dun, dun, dun. Jesse Thorne, swear them in. Please rise and raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God or whatever? I do. I do. I do. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that he is constitutionally opposed to balls? I do.

I do. Very well. Judge Hodgman? Aaron and Molly, you may be seated. For an immediate summary judgment in your favor, can either of you name the obscure cultural reference that I delivered as I entered the courtroom? Aaron, you bring this case to this court. You get first crack at it. Which is it? Do you recognize the quote? No, you know, I don't, but I feel I shouldn't at least take a stab at it. Sure, take a stab at it. Why not? Why not start with metaphors of violence? Sure.

Let's go with. What do you think? God, I don't know. Maybe it's Mark Twain. They have kites back then. Truly a wild slashing stab. I don't know. Dickens.

I don't know. Dickens? I don't know. Shakespeare's popular. The ancient Roman Seneca? Is that one of those platonic dialogues? Wait, Socratic? Yeah. Who had the dialogues? You went to Yale.

Is it Plato's The Republic? Or is it his parable of the cave? No, you're wrong. The point is you're wrong. Okay. Molly, do you have a guess? Oh, Oprah. All guesses are wrong.

I really like that they're going for big fish, though. Yeah, that's right. You know, cast your net wide. Yeah. That's right. You know, cast your net wide. Yeah. The correct answer is the movie for young people called Monster House, which came out in 2006, was written by friend of the show Dan Harmon and Rob Schrab, friends of the show, I should say. The creators of Community, the TV show Community that we all love and is now on Yahoo streaming.

I get nothing for that, but I'm a supporter of the show. So Monster House is a movie for kids, an animated movie that Rob and Dan wrote that was nominated for an Academy Award, but pretty much every animated film is nominated for an Academy Award. Frankly, I feel that it is unfairly overlooked because it is a really fun movie about a neighbor with a creepy house who takes whatever toys touch his lawn and throws them into a fire.

Of sorts. This guy sounds like a real monster. We missed that one. I don't want to give anything away, but it's not called Monster Guy. Yeah, it's true. It's called Monster House. Fair point. The guy, the mean neighbor, is voiced by Steve Buscemi, who is one of the nicest dudes in the world.

He is actually, I don't know if he still lives in the Park Slope region of Brooklyn. And where do you guys live, Molly and Aaron? You live in Brooklyn as well, right? Yeah, we're in Kensington, which is kind of on the border of Windsor Terrace. Finally, someone from Brooklyn listening to this show. Right. So in any case, you're in Brooklyn as well. So he is also, Steve Buscemi is also our mutual neighbor.

And I have a feeling that if he had a lawn and your ball went into his lawn, he would not yell at you. He would not yell at you and throw it into his furnace. Although that would be really something if he did. So you're both wrong. Neither of you get an immediate summary judgment in your favor. So we're going to have to hear this case about kids annoying you in your home in Kensington, Brooklyn, Arad. You brought the case to this court. How would you nutshell it for me?

Take a wild stab. Yeah, I'll just stab out there. So, you know, we moved in. We loved the house, everything about it. And, you know, it pretty much started immediately. These balls, I would say maybe like three, four a day come over. Now, at first we were thinking, oh, okay, well, a couple balls flew over the fence, no big deal. But it's just, you know, after the 12th or 13th, 30th time

that you're throwing these balls over and they're ringing the doorbell, it's just we quickly realized that we were, this is going to be the rest of our lives. We're talking about, let me just clarify, we're talking about sports balls. Yes, primarily soccer balls. All right. So you live in the soccer district of Brooklyn?

No. Actually, it's a very small park, and there's just a small piece of turf. I mean, this is kind of what's sad about it, but these kids, you know, they clamor on it because it's really the only piece of grass-like material in any, you know, maybe eight blocks in any direction. And so that's, yeah, they play on this thing, which is probably why it goes over so much because there's really not a lot of field. Right. Okay. And so the balls come into your yard and then, Aaron, you want to return them, but Molly,

you want to throw them in a furnace. That is a mischaracterization of my position i i just don't want to return them on the uh children's timeline i do want to return them but just not as soon as they come over the fence because i'm otherwise occupied so what timeline then mo, would you propose to return these stray soccer balls? I would like to do it at my leisure, which would most likely be the following day, which is why I propose the ball bin where we could place balls, you know, maybe hours, maybe a day after the fact, and I don't have to go scurrying around the yard, leaving my little children in harm's way, possibly, in order to respond to these requests, which are very frequent. But you are not a person of leisure? You are home with a child? Do you have a job currently as well

or is your job i'm parent i own a business run a business and take care of two little kids how old are your children one and three and we'll call them soccer target one and soccer target two yes i live in terror that they're going to get hit by a ball coming over the fence, which is another issue. You have a backyard in Kensington, Brooklyn. For people who picture Brooklyn, they think of hipster parties in Williamsburg where everyone's artisanally drying homemade beef jerky and drinking beer out of cans. drinking beer out of cans. But Kensington, people have to understand, is a somewhat different landscape, just architecturally. Aaron, how would you describe it?

Yeah, I mean, there's not as many hipsters, although they are slowly moving in. I see that at the supermarket, the craft beer selection has grown exponentially since we've arrived. You're crossing that land bridge from Williamsburg. It is. It is us. Getting priced out of Bushwick. You've got to come out this way. I was making reference to the prehistoric land bridge between Asia and North America, by which ancient peoples migrated to this continent of North America and then prospered until Europeans came back over the waters and killed them all with pox.

Ah. Just a little history lesson there for soccer target one and soccer target two. Soccer target. Soccer target. Shaka Khan. Soccer target. Soccer to me, Shaka Khan. That was a song about soccer right yeah soccer con

okay so anyway Aaron let's not talk about hipsters because I've heard enough of them but you are a small detached home in a neighborhood of small detached homes or are you in a row home or what we're in a row home we're the last one on the end so it's uh uh the yard is you know it's not a big yard but it's for

new york brooklyn standards it's you know it's huge it might as well be a city park and how long have you been living there we moved in here in what october or september that would be last year so so about half a year a little more than half a year. Congratulations. Yeah. Well, thank you. Thanks. Where did you move from? We moved from Carroll Gardens, which is, I don't know if you know where that is, right? I do know where it is, another neighborhood of Brooklyn.

Yeah. But very, I mean, that's a place where you can get some pretty fancy Italian food for a lot of money. Oh, yes. Used to be a place where you could get some pretty hearty Italian food for not a lot of money. That's true. It is a traditional Italian-American neighborhood, and you moved out of it. Yes, it is. To Kensington to raise your children. And Molly, you own a business, and Aaron, you do what?

You just chase soccer balls all day or what? Nowadays, but yeah, I also own a couple bars in the city. Oh, okay. I'll tell you what, why don't you tell me the names of the bars, and if I like them, we'll keep them in the podcast, and if I hate them, we'll bleep them out, and you'll never know. Okay. Fair. Well, one of them in the Lower East Side is called Hill and Dale, and then there's one in Soho called The Folly that just opened in October. And then we have one in the West Village, which is the first bar called The Brooklyneer.

And it was a Brooklyn-themed bar in Manhattan, which caused a little bit of controversy when we opened it. I don't know if you've heard of that one. No, I haven't caught wind of the Brooklyn-themed bar in Manhattan. I'm working very hard to quickly figure out whether I find that to be brilliant or contemptible. Yeah. A little bit of both. I think a lot of people have mixed feelings on that one. I kind of feel like it is brilliantly and purposefully contemptible.

Slightly. Well, since I gave your husband a chance to buzz market his bars, Molly, what's your business? Beef jerky? Backyard beef jerky at Kensington? You know what? It's not too far away from that. I have a little workshop where I make holistic skin care products. It's called Brooklyn Herborium.

Oh, all right. And I have a little spa over on Columbia Street near the water. When you were talking about, yeah, it's not that far from making beef jerky, I have a little workshop where I make things out of skin. That's all my brain could hear. It's just a category difference. So there you are. A couple of relatives. What are your ages again, if you

told me at all? 37. 34. 34. There you are, a couple of grown adult Brooklyn homesteaders out there in Kensington with a couple of young children. You keep relatively, I think you stay at home most of the day, right? Because you're, I don't know about you, Aaron, do you go into an office to manage these bars or do you go check out the bars at nighttime when it happens? Yeah, I primarily kind of go in at night. Right.

And so I'm home a lot during the day. We both are. Right, so you're there to watch the soccer balls come into the yard and then have a family conference to decide what you're going to do about this one. Yes, we just have words on a daily basis. Yeah, I mean, when I'm here, my position...

Okay. Thank you. Molly, you say that you live in fear that the soccer balls are going to hit one of your children. Are they aimed at your children? I think they might be. Okay. We'll talk about whether or not you're facing. I mean, it's been near misses.

We'll talk about whether or not you're facing, what's the word I'm looking for? Punitive measures from your neighbors in a moment. But what sort of damage and danger do the soccer balls pose to your house and home? Well, they have already destroyed plants that we've planted recently and smashed a lantern that was on our deck. And, you know know when they come in and they whiz right by the one-year-old's head and crash into the furniture on the deck i you know i have a heart attack and it's hard for me to restrain myself from screaming obscenities which i i try not to do thank you um thank you for keeping this a family podcast by not.

Is this a family podcast? By not previewing the obscenities you might scream. And does it truly happen, Molly, as Aaron suggests, multiple times a day? Yes or no? Yes. Okay. So when a soccer ball comes whizzing by your child's head and smashes into your recovered architectural lantern or whatever it is. What happens next, Molly, in your words? How did the demands start coming?

Well, if I'm by myself, I hide the ball. And by no means do I admit to even being on the deck, even though I have kids screaming at me over the fence, throw it back, throw it back. They can see me. And maybe I take my kids and I hide inside and I won't give them back the ball because I'm so mad. Uh-huh. And then what happens?

Do reprisals begin at that point? Reprisals? Well, I mean, there's not much I can do except withhold their ball. I'm not talking about your reprisals. No, not you. The door. What? How old are these kids? I would say, you know, it varies, but they're 7 to 12, some 15-year-olds, I guess, out there.

So it's anywhere between 7 and 15. So this is a weekend-only thing? No, it's an everyday thing. It's like after school. Oh, after school. So like 2.30 to dark. Well, let me clarify one thing, which is that we live next door to a school on one side. So there's a school and then there's the park and then there's us. And this park used to be primarily for the school only.

But kids, when school hours are over, which is 3 o'clock, the neighborhood kids just go in there and they use the park. Now, it used to be that they would lock the park because I guess the people who lived here before complained a lot to the city. And the city started locking the park because it is a school park. But the kids started chopping the locks and jumping the fence. So now it's open all the time. So these are kids who are going to bust open a lock in order to play their game. Exactly. So that's why they have to be trifled with.

Have there been, Aaron, reprisals when balls are not promptly returned? Well. I just want to get an overview of the toxic landscape of recrimination. Sure. That's taking root in Kensington, Brooklyn. Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, here's the thing.

I can't really draw a parallel between the reprisals and the balls, because, you know, withholding, I guess you could say. But because a couple times they've thrown plastic bottles over the fence into our yard. There was also, when we moved in, there was about a stack of plastic bottles between our house. Yeah, like Arizona iced tea bottles and water bottles. Like cold-pressed kale juice bottles? Is that what you mean? Exactly. No, what kind of bottles? Yeah, like Arizona iced tea bottles and water bottles. Cold-pressed kale juice bottles? Is that what you mean? Exactly. No, what kind of bottles? Mainly Arizona fruit punch, Arizona iced tea.

That's like the one, the go-to bottle I feel like they throw. throw based on bottle brand throwing of arizona fruit punch into a yard where otherwise artisanal skincare products are being made maybe out of human skin i don't know is there a gentrification uh friction issue going on here no i i don't think think so. I mean, the kids are all different ethnicities. I mean to say you're being chased out of Cobble Hill by wealth, and now you are homesteading in Kensington. And I don't know the socioeconomic landscape of Kensington, and I'm not asking about race, although that's often a factor in socioeconomic demographics, but whether you may be perceived by the local kids at the school as intruders upon the neighborhood. I don't know.

I don't think so. I mean, I wouldn't, I don't know. What do you think? I don't think it's that sophisticated. I just think that they're taking the ball as hard as they can and it goes over the fence and they want it back. They want to play their game. Right. Do these kids, when they are playing soccer together, do they primarily speak English or another language? English.

All right, Aaron. Okay, good. And so you could reason with them. Right. You could say, look, guys, you need to be more careful with your soccer ball. And please don't throw Arizona iced tea into my yard. You have to understand I own a Brooklyn themed bar in Manhattan. So I'm cool. How do you think they would respond? I think I'd go, we're pretty good. You know, kids like bars. Yeah, right.

That would do a thing. Yeah. What if every time they threw an Arizona iced tea bottle into your yard, you threw them a full can of pork slap beer? Then they might be like, this guy is cool. Thanks for the beer. Yeah, that's actually not a, listen, if that's the judgment,

then, you know, so be it. I mean, that's a good idea. What's the,. Yeah, that's actually not a – listen, if that's the judgment, then, you know, so be it. I mean, that's a good idea. So, Aaron, what's the – I mean, Molly – if I understand Molly's argument correctly, and Molly, you can correct me if I'm wrong, but Molly wants to collect balls as they come in. Partly for her convenience and partly for vengeance, she would like to ignore the children yelling over the fence and put them out all together. What would you say, Molly? Once a day? Once a week? All the balls that were collected? Once a day.

Maybe the day after the morning. I could do that. And how would you explain this policy to the kids? Ah, well, that's another point of contention. Because I would like to have a little sign on our door that says, lost your ball? Check the ball bin. Do not ring this bell. Yeah, please don't ring the bell. Do they come around and ring the bell? Is this the backyard or the side yard?

Yeah, they ring the bell. Please don't ring the bell. Do they come around and ring the bell? Is this the backyard or the side yard? Yeah, they ring the bell. They can't really get in the backyard unless they climb the fence, which is another major liability issue because it's a fence. They hop over it. They could hurt themselves. So, Molly, ball comes in, almost kills one of your children.

Next thing that happens is yelling and you ignore it yes or no walk me through walk me through the whole home invasion the strangers style scenario stranger danger um okay well because you're you're throwing out all kinds of stuff. Let me explain what I'm looking for here, okay? I have. You're throwing out all kinds of stuff about people jumping into your yard, throwing bottles, ringing the bell. And I really just want to know how quickly and how often it intensifies to actual trespassing by these kids. On a regular basis.

on a regular basis. If, if for example, I don't answer the bell and they think the ball's in my yard, then they'll travel alongside the fence along our house and the school fence, I mean, and they'll climb over the fence that we have erected and they'll go into our backyard and they'll find it. And then sometimes they're stuck in our backyard and they'll knock on our back door, like, let me out through your house. Or they won't find their ball in our yard and they'll climb over our neighbor's fence. And our neighbors are two elderly people who have been dealing with this problem for like 30 years. And who's just screamed things like, I'm calling the cops. You kids get out of my yard. And then they're desperately trying to hop back over into our yard and then hop over this

taller fence and I'm just, you know, maybe I'm in a towel looking at this through the window going, oh my god, don't die in my yard. Well, yeah. It's a bit of an exaggeration. I'm not exaggerating. It's happened. It's all happened multiple times. How many times has the scenario, and I'm not accusing you of exaggerating, I'm how many times how many times is the scenario and i'm not accusing you of exaggerating i'm just asking how many times has this scenario occurred if you were to ballpark count it like the worst case scenario is a handful of times but kids in our yard so a handful meaning five or less five or fewer times yes and kids in your yard overall dozens of times dozens of times kids in our yard.

I'd say it's fair. In the in the eight plus eight or so months that you've lived there. Yes. All right. Aaron, so this is a real problem. So what is your solution? Your specific solution? Because Molly's presented hers. Yeah. My specific solution, you know, is really, you know, if I'm here and the balls come over, my policy is that I'll throw it back and I'll give a warning. I'll say, hey guys, keep it on the ground. I'm not always going to be here. I can't return every ball. And that generally doesn't work. Sometimes balls will come over the same ones multiple times. So my policy is I'll return a ball if it's a ball I haven't seen before or maybe one or two times.

But if it's this, you know, you get to know the balls. I mean, it's almost like, you know, I don't know how to explain it. Are they volleyballs with faces drawn on them? Yeah. I mean, they all have distinguishing characteristics. Do you think that all balls look the same until you see one like 20 times a day? So I surely hope no one will ever take that piece of tape out of context. Yes.

Yeah. Well, just make me look good. So the balls that I come over multiple times, I actually started to keep those and not return them. And never return them? Yeah. Do you stab them with a knife? Yeah. Do you stab them with a knife while the kids are watching?

I thought about that. But so far, we haven't stabbed the balls. We've just been – we've been holding on to them. We have a quite – we have like five or six, I guess, at this point. Well, your policy has not changed anyone else's behavior. Your policy of, I'll return them if I see them the first couple of times, and then if not, I'll keep them spitefully, has not changed anyone's behavior. Has not changed anyone's behavior, no. Have you talked to anyone at the school or the park about this? Yeah, we have. I talked to—

I have. Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, we have. I've called the parks department, talked to the supervisor, talked to the principal at the school, even called the police precinct. Everyone tells me the same thing, which is, it's a your problem, not a my problem. You shouldn't have moved into a house next to the park. I mean, in so many words, no one's solving this problem for us. And so you went to those people asking them to solve the problem for you? Or at least asking if there was any suggestion, anything that could alleviate the problem. Go ahead. I was going to say that when we first moved in, there was a giant drip in the fence. There was a tear in the chain link on the school side that was maybe midway up. And a lot of balls used to go through that hole.

And so we complained about that, but the city didn't do anything. So I ended up going over there with wire and shutting that. And that actually made a difference. But maybe it took it from six balls a day down to three. But it's kind of do-it do it yourself out here, I guess. And, you know, your neighbors have been dealing with this problem for decades. That's what I got from Molly. Is that not right, Aaron?

That is correct. So given that there is no solution to the problem other than your suffering, Why is Molly's plan not good? Well, because I don't think that, you know, you're going to be able to teach these kids, which, you know, keep in mind, there's, I don't know, God knows how many, dozens, hundreds or whatever. You're not going to be able to educate them

and, you know, convert them into our ball policies. You know, we actually did try the ball bin once you put the ball bin out there, I put a ball, a couple of balls out there. And within minutes, some guy walking by was like, Hey, you're giving these balls away. And just took one. And I was like, actually, that's some kids ball came over the fence. We put it there for him and he just took it anyways. So I don't think that the ball bin is going to work mainly because you know how it is in Brooklyn. Everybody puts stuff on the street and you see something out there, it's free to take. And, you know, the kids know that, too.

So if we put the ball out there, it might as well just be given it away to someone else. Got it. So from your point of view, it's not effective justice because the balls will just be taken by other nefarious people. Yes. All right. I got it. Molly, have you said that you constructed a fence? You constructed it? I don't understand what the fencing situation is in your backyard.

Can you describe it for me? Well, there's a, sure. There's a city, you know, a city park fence, and that's like 25 feet high. That's a chain link fence. Chain link. 25 feet high. That's a chain link fence.

Chain link. Then we have a gap between that fence and our house. Our house doesn't go flush. There's a few feet that a skinny little body could run right down this corridor. Some urban no man's land. So you have your own fence in your backyard? Yes. So you have your own fence in your backyard? Yes.

We did put up a fence that blocks that corridor, but it is scalable. How tall is that fence? It's probably about six feet high, but you can jimmy up between our building and the school chain link fence and then get over it. That's called parkour, you guys. Parkour, yes, exactly. Why not construct a higher fence in your backyard? Well, you know, we just put this one up. It would be a shame to destroy the fence we just built out of Ipe. It's quite nice.

You built it out of what? Ipe? Ipe. What's Ipe? It's like a hard wood. It's a type of sword used for fencing. Oh, sorry. Well, I would have suggested sabers. When kids are kicking balls over your fence, they're kicking balls over this 25-foot fence?

Yes, which is why we're not so sympathetic. You've got to really be careless. You've got to really be careless, you know? You got to really be booting it without a care in the world to, you know, for it to go over the fence,

I think. What if you covered your entire house in netting like a batting cage? That, aesthetically speaking, I don't know

if that's what we're going for. You could grow ivy on the netting if you want. Yeah. Make it into a giant pergola. Yeah.

You know, I once went to Gay Talese's house, not to drop names. I once went to Gay Talese's house. He has this whole backyard patio that is completely glassed in. I mean, presumably it's plexiglass rather than glass glass. Sure. I mean, presumably it's plexiglass rather than glass glass. Where he can host a dinner party for – or dinner slash sex party for 40 or 50 people. And it is amazing.

That's what I suggest you do. You're going to have to write a few bestselling books. Does the party end with everybody throwing stones? All right. I can sense the desperation in your guys' voices because you have no clear solution to this problem. I'm not even sure at this point what your dispute is other than with yourselves for buying a house next to a schoolyard. Yeah, it's sort of like buying a house next to an airport and wanting to put up an airplane fence. Yeah, or airplane netting.

Yeah. Or glassing in your no airplanes area. Yeah. Why don't you point a lot of laser pointers at these kids? Get in trouble with the federal government. So in a moment, I'm going to go into my chambers and come to some decision, but I don't know what kind of decision I'm going to make because now I'm not clear where your dispute even lies. Aaron, tell me what decision you would like me to make. I would like the ability to throw the balls back

as they come over if I'm home. I don't mind doing it. Molly is asking that we adhere to this policy together. So even if I'm in the backyard, we hold all balls, put them in the bin the next day. And that's just our policy. Because if I throw the ball over, then I'm setting a precedent for the kids that they think they can just get it. So she's trying to get us to conform to this policy. But my suggestion or my fear is that if we do that, you know, the kids are going to just, they're going to want their balls anyways. They're going to keep coming at us for them. You know, one time they threw a whole cup of soda at our front door. So, you know, the kids are going to just, they're going to want their balls anyways. They're going to keep coming at us for them. One time they threw a whole cup of soda at our front door. So, you know, who knows?

Yeah, these kids hate you. Yes, they, well, they hate us when we, you know, we don't give them their balls back, that's for sure. Do they love you when you give them the balls back? No, I think they're fairly indifferent and then they kick it over again. Right. Yeah, maybe we should start lobbing beers over the fence. It's probably a good idea. Right. And Molly, what do you want me to decide? Um, well, Aaron will only submit to the authority of an outside figure. So I want you to tell him that the ball bin is the way to go. So I, uh, don't have to do, I'm not expected to do the same thing that he's willing to do.

You want to set a policy, specifically your policy, of the ball bin plus sign. Yes. And then you want him to abide by it and not go against the policy. Yes. Until such time as you both realize that policy doesn't work either and you've got to come up with a new one. Sure. Right. Do you have any pets?

No. Okay. I think I heard everything that I need to hear. I'm going to go into my chambers and sit down against the wall and throw a pinky ball against the wall for 100 hours like Steve McQueen in The Great Escape until I come to a decision. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Aaron, I wonder if this was a problem not with children, but with drunk people and you were neighbors to a bar and not a playground, how do you think you might solve a situation like this? Yeah, that's a good one. I don't know.

If you're saying if drunks were flying into my yard, how would I handle it? Maybe steins. Oh, ste's, yeah. I mean, I guess my best guess is a Stein or a pint glass or a Dura. That would definitely be worse than balls. Excuse me, but you run a Brooklyn-themed bar, a bocce ball. Yes, sorry. Yeah, I think that if Stein's or bocce balls or anything that was dense was coming over,

it would be a much more difficult problem for us. The balls, when you compare them, it's not so bad. But I guess I would, yeah, I don't know what I would do. We'd probably have to move. Molly, have you ever thought about, you mentioned not having any pets. Have you ever thought about getting some kind of deadly, terrifying pet? You know, when you have two small children. Like a junkyard dog or a cougar or something? Like having a chained up

panther on the deck? Yeah. Having two little kids, you can't really have like, you know. Yeah, no pets. Two kids, no pets. How do you feel about your chances in the case, Molly? I feel like it's strong. What about you? I think, yeah, I feel good about my chances, to be honest. I think that's really the only policy, I think.

Sorry. I don't know. What do I know? I don't know. I would say I feel good to extremely bad about my chances. So you're saying that your chances aren't a binary, they're a spectrum. Yeah. I'm saying I feel about as good about my chances as I did about getting the cultural reference right. Well, we'll see what Judge John Hodgman has to say about all this when we come back in just a minute.

Right. Well, we'll see what Judge John Hodgman has to say about all this when we come back in just a minute. who's gone to MaximumFun.org slash join, and you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by the folks over there at Babbel. Did you know that learning, the experience of learning causes a sound to happen? Let's hear the sound. Yep, that's the sound of you learning a new language with Babbel. We're talking about quick 10-minute lessons crafted by over 200 language experts that can help you start speaking a new language in as little as one, two, three

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please rise as judge john hodgman reenters the courtroom i can't help but have overheard your conversation about pets with jesse thorne and uh and and so i had to adjust my decision because obviously the perfect solution

is simply to fill your yard up with deadly asps. That'll be particularly effective if any of the kids are Antony or Cleopatra. Yeah, exactly. So given that you're not willing to fill up your yard with something terrifying to children. Why not just fill it up with public television? Yeah, exactly. Primetime. Fill it up with episodes of Frontline.

Yeah, exactly. That would be another way to dissuade them from coming into your yard. We have to find a more nuanced solution. I mean, I feel you guys, because this is perhaps something you should have been able to foresee, Because this is perhaps something you should have been able to foresee, such as moving next to an airport would mean airplane noise for you. Or moving into a brand new apartment above a Brooklyn-themed bar, you might get angry at the kinds of conversations you would have to overhear while kids were outside smoking their healthy American spirit cigarettes after putting down a lot of pork slaps in the Brooklyn-themed bar. This was a foreseeable problem that you failed to foresee. And so I can appreciate how your contempt and hatred for these children is essentially a projection of your hatred for yourselves. is essentially a projection of your hatred for yourselves.

And you are also at an interesting time in your life because you are in your mid-30s. OK, so you no longer have the pure sociopathy of childhood, which is what these kids are enjoying. You are not humans to them. You are faceless talking mannequins that take their things until they get them back. And nor are you prepared to enter the endless pool of rage in which swim your neighbors, your elderly neighbors who have been putting up with this futilely for 30 years, the anger and the empty threats of calling the cops that obviously obviously if the cops are ever called, nothing is ever done. That would really – you would really need to feel – you would really need to become a little bit older and a little less concerned about what other people think of you in order to truly combat this problem by becoming a Steve Buscemi-like monster. Think of you in order to truly combat this problem by becoming a Steve Buscemi-like monster.

And simply those balls go over the fence. You stab them with a knife and you throw them in a pile. And you stick. You know what you do? This is what you do. This is what you do, you guys. Those balls come over the fence. Here's what you do.

You add to your fence. You don't tear it down, right? You add to your fence a series of spikes. to your fence. You don't tear it down, right? You add to your fence a series of spikes. And every time a ball comes over that fence, one of you guys takes that ball and puts it on the spike.

And they see the decapitated heads of their dead every time they play soccer. Yeah, some Game of Thrones stuff. That's what I'm talking about. That would be something that would be Yeah, some Game of Thrones stuff. level would cause generations of children to learn over time, to even unconsciously hold their kicks down, lest their ball be spiked in your backyard. Okay? That is cold stuff. And you guys making your skincare products and your novelty bars and in your 30s with young kids, you're not ready to become human monsters yet.

That's why you're not able to settle upon a consistent policy with these balls. You're not ready to become monsters. And you know what? Good for you. with these balls. You're not ready to become monsters. And you know what? Good for you. Because the truth is, in a city, we are all living together densely packed, and we all need to try to recognize each other's humanity as much as possible. Or else we become terrible monsters. And in a dense living situation like this, particularly one where there's a lot of neighborhood change going on, whether you want to call it gentrification, whether that is appropriate to the specific case or not, there's clearly – there's a lot of churn in Brooklyn right now. A lot of things are changing.

There's a lot of unspoken anxieties and tensions. I'm not sure that spiking the heads of your enemies is the kind of escalation that is going to do you well in the long run. Because your yard is unsecure, kids can parkour their way into it anytime they want, clearly. And what you call the worst case scenario, where a kid is trapped in your backyard like a moose in a department store in Vermont one winter? Like that's not the worst case scenario at all. Vengeful children who have access to your backyard? That's a horror movie.

So even though I think that that would be the baddest of the badass responses, I think that you need to find a more nuanced response that acknowledges that these kids are human beings, just like you are human beings. Now, what is the appropriate response? I do not agree with you, Aaron, that these kids will never learn. I think over time, if you spiked those balls, they would learn. You know, kids learn all the time. That's why they're arguably going to that school. And in issues of behavior like this, I can tell you that what kids learn the most from is consistent policies that make sense.

And so you're saying, sometimes I want to throw them back, sometimes I want to keep them out of spite. That's not a consistent policy that's going to help you in the long run. and then putting it out on the street for others to steal from it, even if that policy were affected consistently, I'm not sure it would get the result that you want. But between these two approaches, I believe that there is a consistent policy that can be reached. I would also say that in this case or in this sense, I am going to side with Molly that you guys cannot have different policies between you in the house. You have to sit down and figure out what that policy is. And you have to figure out that policy such that you can explain it to a child, right? can explain it to a child, right? Because this problem is not just, you know, annoyance, nor is it just meager danger to your young children, but a potentially legal nightmare, as you point out,

Molly, should a child enter your backyard and become injured in some way. You know, it's a real, real, real problem. So, I think that you need to investigate, first of all, securing your backyard from intrusion. Because it is an ongoing problem. And I think that you need to investigate the idea of putting up signs on the exterior of your fence saying, for your own safety, do not enter this backyard. And I think that when the balls come over, you guys need to have a policy in place as to when to return them. Because I think we all know that keeping children's balls and throwing them into the fire is not who you are or who you want to be.

Yeah, that's some Game of Thrones stuff. Yeah, right. We all want to be Game of Thrones until you think about how miserable it was to live in medieval times. Every piece of property that you own or even rent comes with unexpected headaches. And the headaches, when they are cockroaches, you smash them. But when they're humans, you either just learn to ignore it or you have to engage. And I think that what you need to do is return the balls to the kids. Don't hide them. Don't lecture them. Just send them back over. And I think that you need to do what it takes to secure your, and I mean, I don't want to say this, but you might

want to add some sort of, I mean, I don't know, burglar-proof your backyard so that it's a deterrent for the kids to come in. And I think that when you engage with the kids, just say over and over again, consistently, please keep the balls down and don't come in and get them. We'll get them back to you as soon as we can, but that's all we can do. And you can put a sign there that says the same thing. And I like to think that over time, this will ameliorate your problem. But I do feel very strongly that whatever systems you put in place, that you mutually agree upon it and it be consistent and that you both do it consistently over and over and over again. Because I think that's the only way to enforce rules, especially with kids who don't understand what rules are. And it's the only way that you guys are going to get along.

So even though I don't think the soccer ball bin is a particularly practical or just solution, given that a lot of those balls are just going to get stolen by weirdos on the street. Soccer ball collectors in Brooklyn, they're crazy. I do have to come down. Trying to catch them all. Technically, on the side of Molly and say, consistent policy going forward. Molly wins. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules that is all. Aaron, you just lost the case. How do you feel right now? I guess like up until the last couple seconds, I thought I won. But yeah, it was a zinger. It was a nail biter right to the end.

No, I mean, this is fine. I mean, we can, I can live with it. Molly, how about you? I'm just so happy to have a solution. Do we? Well, no, you don't have a solution. Do we? Well, no, you don't have a solution. There may be no solution, but you're going to create a policy that is consistent.

And you have to safeguard your yard from people getting into it, because that's a no-good situation. Right? Is that clear? Yeah. We'll go with the ASP pit. Just make sure the ASPs are conspicuous, because otherwise it's going to be a real liability issue. They're taking responsibility if they jump into a conspicuously asp-filled backyard.

Gotcha. If it's hidden asps, then the liability is yours. Here's a new T-shirt. Judge John Hodgman's – Judge John Hodgman brand security asp pit. Hard to pronounce but very effective. Well, thank you guys so much for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman brand security ass pit. Hard to pronounce, but very effective. Well, thank you guys so much for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney.

I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace because, yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls.

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If you need a laugh, and you're on the go. Hey, uh, Judge Hatchman. What? Judge Hatchman. Could you get my ball? Why are you throwing your meatballs around? Just sit there and eat your spaghetti like a normal. Hey, Judge Hodgman, are you still doing,

you still got that Festivall coming up, right? Yeah, the Festivall of Charleston, West Virginia. It's not Festiv-some. Nope. It's not Festiv-one. Nope. Come Festiv-one, come Festiv Festivall to see me in Charleston, the capital of West Virginia, for my West Virginia debut on June 22nd. You can get all the details at FestivallCharleston.com.

That's F-E-S-T-I-V-A-L-L, Charleston. Spell it like you think it sounds. Dot com or go to JohnHodgman.com and click on the tour button where you will also find details for buying tickets for me in Boston, Massachusetts on September 12th. And later in September, just announced, I am appearing for the first time at the Toronto Just for Laughs Comedy Festival, Just pour Rire. And I will be playing... Jacques Cousteau to you, my friend. I know. So all of those Canadian listeners

who are constantly saying, when are you coming to Canada? Now is the answer. You can get all the details on my tour at johnhodgman.com slash tour. J. Hodge and the T-Dot. That's what they say sometimes.

Thanks this week to Harish Krishnamoorthy. Sorry, Harish, if I've messed any of that up for naming this week's episode. You can name an episode of Judge John Hodgman. Like Judge John Hodgman in Facebook. Join the MaximumFun.org Facebook group and get up on Twitter. John is at Hodgman. I am at Jesse Thorne. Our producer is Julia Smith. Our editor is Mark McConville. Our show is paid for by your donations. You can support the show at MaximumFun.org slash donate.

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