Knowledge Fight - #591: June 11, 2003

Episode Date: August 30, 2021

Today, Dan and Jordan dip deep into the past. In this installment, Alex Jones warns of the dangers of Monkeypox, and talks to a friend of his who died and went to heaven. Citations

I'm sick of them posing as if they're the good guys saying we are the bad guys knowledge fight. Dan and George, knowledge fight. I need money. Andy and Kansas. Andy and Kansas. Andy and Kansas. It's time to pray. Andy and Kansas. You're on the air. Thanks for holding. Hello Alex and Mr. Tim Cullen. I'm a huge fan. I love your work. Knowledge fight. We're going to sit around worship the altar of Celine and talk a little bit about Alex Jones. We are Dan Jordan question for you. What's your bright spot today? My bright spot today. I think we talked about this on a fairly recent episode. Survivor. No, collector itch. Oh, yes. Yeah. And like, you know, I think that that got into my head a little bit. And I

started to think about like, yeah, I do want fucking card collections. I do. I don't want stamps. Maybe I do, but I don't actually. Yep. So I was trying to think of like a way that I could productively and not like a bully self destructively explore some of these tendencies. Sure. Sure. And so I was I got a game that's like a deck building game. Okay. Okay. I get a game called a grift lands grift lands. Yes. Okay. All right. It's a lot of fun. And I think I think the bright spot, I guess, is like exploring these genres of games that I never really played all that much. And I dig it. Yeah. There's a lot of there's a lot of fun, different play styles of games out there that can can bring a lot to your life. And I don't know. I'm really worried

that I'm going to end up finding some really in depth deck building game. And then I'm done. Then you're then it's over. Then it's over for you. Yep. You're just going to get way too into online Gwent. And then it's over. It's possible. I mean, that was one of the first like thoughts you had. No, no, like one of the first instances of like, Oh, I could just do this for a while. Like when I was playing the Witcher, yeah, that was like, Oh, I wish there was more of this in this game. Totally. Totally. This is a sub game in the game that I kind of like more. I've gotten too good at this. There aren't players in the game that I can actually it's not satisfying. No, no, I've only lost like four Gwent matches total over like 200 hours. Like, yeah, it's not good.

That was that was the sort of the root of it. And now it's now it's grown to something that could be a problem blossoming into an addiction. We'll find out. I hope so. What's your bright spot? I'm going to keep with the theme. You've got your card collecting game. I have something similar. We got a new board game called wingspan. Okay. And it's, it's kind of like a, you know, it's like a resource game like settlers of Catan and all that stuff. But it is just gorgeous. Like it is hand painted, not hand painted, but, you know, it's like beautiful artwork of birds. And, and it's just about collecting and bird watching. And it's, it's gorgeous. It's just a beautiful game. Yeah. It's really, really cool. It's better than what

I thought it was going to be. And it was going to wingspan is just like, Hey, hold your arms out long, jump out the window. Get out of there. It's a fun game. Get out of there. I'm going to set a fire just to make sure that you mean it when you jump out that window. So Jordan today, what we're doing is we are going back to the past because we had to record this episode in advance. This is, we were recording this a couple of days before we would normally have. And so if anything happened in the very recent past, we don't know about it because it hasn't happened yet when we record. Right. In some ways, you are hearing us in the past talk about the past and thus we are even less capable of responding to the usual. Yes. Yeah. So what we're doing, we're going back to

June 11th, 2003, continuing on our path through 2003. Right. Right. Right. Right. Does he believe in the devil? I have to say that this is a groundbreaking episode. Okay. I am very excited about this episode. It is unlike anything I've heard it listening to past Alex and I am pumped. All right. To discuss it. Let's do it. But before we do, let's take a little moment to say, hello to some new wonks. Oh, that's a great idea. So first Dan, the stick man. Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk. I'm a policy wonk. Thanks, Dan. Great name. Next. Is it gauche to refer to sharks as chum slots? Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk. I'm a policy wonk. Thank you. It might be. I mean, is gauche the word? Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's one of the words.

It's a word. It's not the only word to describe that. But yeah. Next, Keldy, Cakes and Jose. Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk. I'm a policy wonk. Thank you very much. Thank you. Next, Merja from the happiest country in the world, Finland. Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk. I'm a policy wonk. Thank you very much for rubbing it in. Next, Jason B. Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk. I'm a policy wonk. Thanks, Jason. Thank you. And we got a technocrat in the mix. We got a little bit of a halo. What's up going out to Mr. Patience of the Flood. Thank you so much. You are now a technocrat. I'm a policy wonk. Crikey, mate. That's fantastic. Have yourself a brew. How's your 401k doing, bro? We got to go full tilt buggy on this

Watson. All right. Let's just get down to business. We ain't making that money off that heroin. Why are you pimp so good? My neck is freakishly large. I declare info war on you. Thank you. I know that's a biblical reference. But what's that? What's what? I thought it was the name of the Jars of Clay album. But I don't think it is. I think it was like Grace Flood or something like that. Okay. I was not a Jars of Clay head. No. No, no, no, no. My jars were made of porcelain. What other materials do you make jars out of? No, jars of clay. Their single was just called Flood. Just cause it was rain, rain on my face. Was that what it sounded like? Hasn't stopped raining for days. Oh, if I can't sing after 40 days and my mind is crushed by the crashing waves lift

me up so that I cannot fall with me. Oh, lift me up. I can't believe I wasn't in the jars of clay. Lift me up. It's hard to imagine that not tickling my fancy. I didn't even realize it. But as I tried to remember the lyrics and sing, it's like there's a bunch of different sounds in that song. At least three different vibes. All right. Okay. I thought it was Grace Flood, but that's not it. I wonder if that's something that I'm another. It sounds like a hardboiled detective. Hi, I'm Detective Grace Flood. I'm here to solve your goddamn mysteries. Also, I'm going to give a shout out to Jack, who adopted a sea otter. Yay. So now we've got a sea otter hanging around with the cutest of otters. Yep. Absolutely. We have a pretty cute crew. We do. We do. I mean,

I think my biggest problem so far now is that we don't get to hang out with all of these animals at the same time. We do when I sleep. I dream of the cool family. I won't disagree with you. So Jordan's dreams will factor heavily into this conversation. Man, I'd say I listened to a couple episodes from 2003 that we're not covering because they just kind of got bored. Right. One of them, Alex was just mad about a recent interview he did on a radio station and I was like, I really want to find this actual interview and like compare it to his version of it. Yeah. Yeah. But it's impossible. I can't find this local radio interview from 2003. So that was a real frustrating thing. And it was boring. Otherwise, it's just him kind

of being like, oh, people disagreed with me. Why? What was it like in 2003 when everything was an instantly archived forever? Yeah. So weird. Yeah. Things, some things were lost. Ephemeral? What does that even mean? So I turned on the 11th, June 11th, 2003, and I immediately got fucking pumped. We'll also get into the war in Iraq and how the globalists say they want America to get behind it and tack on Syria, Iran, North Korea. And then a private story that Colonel Roberts hasn't talked much about on the air. When he was diagnosed with a giant tumor, died on the operating table multiple times and his experience going to heaven. Holy shit. Can you die multiple times and go to heaven? Do you go to heaven each time?

Hey, what are you doing back here? Is that possible? Can you die multiple times and then each time you go to heaven? Paul's in the pearly gates just being like, God damn it. We told you to go back. There are no pearly gates according to this story. Okay. But I turned this on. I was like, this does not sound like any episode that I've heard from this time period in particular, where Alex is very calmly and patiently saying we're going to talk to a guest about how he went to heaven. I do like that. I do like that. This is this is absolutely a huge sign pointing towards believing in the devil. You bet. Yeah, you bet. We might make considerable progress in that investigation. Okay. Oh man. Okay, so great. But I love the juxtaposition of this. I used to

like, oh, we're going to get into the Iraq war and how the globalists want to attack all these other countries. Also, my weird friend Craig Roberts went to heaven. He's going to chat about it. Fucking sweet. That is two of the most important stories happening today. Yes. So Alex is not unfamiliar with this kind of thing. Sure. Sure. Sure. Of course he's done it before. No, maybe not himself. Okay. Now I don't normally get into the paranormal and into the type of shadowy issues, but I have 20 years and family who have died and who have seen similar things. And in fact, people that have other religious backgrounds have seen the same thing. And the supernatural is real. God is real. I've had experiences and not to not to death experiences,

but I've had other experiences and I'll share some of those on the air today as well because it's so important as a society. We've forgotten God. We don't believe. Many people don't believe in the afterlife. And look, the evidence of God is in the stars. It's in the trees. So I got really excited when he said that he's going to get into some of his experiences because based on what we know from listening to the present day stuff, he's got to have a lot of stuff that should have already happened for this point. Yeah. He should have already been a Satanist for a few years when he was younger. They tried to induct him into this high cult of Satanism when he was younger. He had God give him a panoramic 360 view of everything that was going to happen that would

guide him through his future. Yeah. I'm excited to hear him say exactly what he says now. You should hear that right. I'm really excited because this is some world changing shit and I would remember it forever if God literally came to me. Yeah. And you could either. You could either make the argument that if he if he doesn't get into a lot of the stuff that he talks about in the present, then either he doesn't want to talk about it on air because he's uncomfortable with it. He signed an NDA with God. Right. Or he's come up with all that stuff since this point entirely since 2003. He's added it to his back story. I said I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt and I'm going to say that he's going to tell us five years exactly five years into this

show. You certainly should still be giving him the benefit of the doubt. I'm a fair man, Dad. Fair enough. So Craig Roberts is one of Alex's weirdo friends. He's the guy who died and came back. Yeah. He's a guy who I don't ever hear Alex talk about anymore. Yeah. I never knew who this guy was until I started going back to 2003 and he's everywhere. This show is lousy with Craig Roberts in the past. Oh boy. But he is not somebody who you'd even be really familiar with. Yeah. He wasn't in our 2015 investigation. No. I don't know if he's dead. I tried to sort that out. He may be. Could be. Yeah. I don't know. Why not. Certainly died according to his own story. So wouldn't be surprised if it happened again. Yeah. Yeah. I wonder how many times you can come back

before you have to stay. You know what I'm saying? How many times. Okay. That's number four. You're here for good. Yeah. It down there. It's a three strikes. You're out policy. This is better. It's heaven. When I when I worked at a movie theater, you know, like if you want left the theater to go to the bathroom, you get back in with your stub, you know. But if somebody's going in and out of the theater like 10 times, yeah, it's not letting them back in. It's got to stop. You're fucking around later. I feel like heaven's probably the same way. You're probably right. So Craig Roberts died. I went to heaven. Okay. Alex's uncle also had a little bit of an experience and if you thought these numbers were weird. Okay. Coming up with Colonel Craig Roberts,

his death experience, not near death experiences, death experience. My uncle, when he was 16, was in a motorcycle accident, died six times on the way to the hospital and at the hospital. And he was then in a coma for six weeks. And he had an almost identical experience to Craig Roberts. So I'll tell you about that as well. So yeah, six times, man. Six times. Six times. He died six times. That must have been a long ambulance ride. Yeah. Yeah. And there's no way that you do not walk away with permanent brain damage from that. Alex does say that he has some problems with like is a low vocabulary. Yeah, something along those lines, which I guess would kind of lend credibility to dying six times. But I don't know. You're not dying six times

or coming back in an ambulance ride. That's ridiculous. You're not dying six times or coming back. Period. You're not dying and coming back. I want to know what counts as dying in this story. They definitely don't get into that. I want to know. I need specifics on when you know you're dead. Is there brain activity or is it just heart? Is it? What are we talking about? That is an important distinction. There is no scientific specifics given to any of this, which kind of does make it a little bit more difficult to deal with. I do believe, however, that the proof is in the stars and it is in the leaves around us that obviously this was full brain death. Alex's uncle is in the ambulance and he's like, I have died.

I'm back. I'm back. I'm back. I died again. That happened six times. Every 15 seconds. I return to the living. My work is not done. So before we get into this interview, Alex does have to talk about some... I'm sorry. I can't get them. Now that I think about it, somebody's in the ambulance. There's an EMT in the ambulance and I just imagine that being like at the beginning, just come back. I will bring you back to this earth. And then at number six, they're like, Jesus Christ. I don't even know if we need to do this anymore. Or conversely, the EMTs in there and they're like, I am magic. Every time I touch this man. How disappointing would it be to get your next

person you're picking up who doesn't come back? You just got a broken finger. So there's some... Sorry for that introduction. Oh no, quite all right. There's some real world issues though that we need to get to before we get to heaven. Of course. And one of them has to do with taxation of cars. Start out with a toll road chip. Turns out you got to have it to drive. Satellite tracker software and hardware already in all new cars. Now the $25 interface is plugged in. They start taxing you. We're about a year away from that in Oregon. Two years away from that in the rest of the country unless we stop it. And the average talk show host, he won't talk about this. You read USA Today, Washington Post. I'll be on radio interviews. They'll call me a liar and say it

doesn't exist as it's happening. So Alex is making a prediction that within a couple years, the entire United States will have tracking things in cars. So there will be a system that taxes you by the mile. Sure. That... So by 2006? I don't think that happened. No. Yeah. Maybe Alex managed to save the world from this one because it did not happen. So according to a 2021 article in the Washington Post, two states currently are trying out this sort of a policy as an alternative to taxing gasoline. He was just a decade behind on his plan. It's 18 years since then. I get it. So the question is why would a state want to explore the possibility of shifting how taxes are levied and measured? Climate change? It's because of emerging technologies and things like

the idea of hydrogen powered cars that hypothetically don't need gas. If these become larger and larger parts of the market space, what ends up happening is that states face huge financial problems. Cars are still using the roads, the upkeep of which is funded by tax revenues, but the drivers are no longer paying gas taxes, which made up a large part of the pot. There are a number of solutions that have been floated in terms of how to deal with this inevitable issue, but the mileage based taxation is one of the ideas that gets talked about the most partially because it covers a lot of the relevant variables and the plan seems like it could be implemented in a way that would cost the average driver approximately the same amount as gas taxes ended up incurring

on them. Now granted, the gas taxes are levied against the like wholesalers and then it trickles down to the customers which pass along, but the amount of expense would be fairly similar to most average drivers. People who would be hit hardest by it are people who drive completely fuel-efficient cars because they wouldn't be paying that much gas tax as a whole anyway. Utah and Oregon have already put programs in place to shift things in this direction and there are folks working on it in various places around the country, but it's nothing at all like Alex is describing. The Oregon program was launched in 2015 and it was voluntary to participate. According to the Washington Post, quote, legislators in Salem are considering a bill that would make the program

mandatory for new vehicles with a fuel economy rating of 30 miles per gallon or higher starting in 2026. So that's still even in the future. So it's almost even like a progressive gas tax, if you will. Yeah, I think you could look at it that way. Yeah. So here's how this article explains the system as it works in Oregon. Quote, participants in the state have three ways to sign up, two privately run systems and one administered by the State Department of Transportation. The private companies send drivers a device that logs where and how much they drive or pull the data directly from vehicles. Then they send bills and turn over the revenue to the state. Drivers get reimbursed for gas taxes that they pay at the pump. Sure. Okay. So that's the way that the system

right they're trying to they're trying to see if it equals out or if there's a loss still or if there's yeah, yeah, I get it. And then there are like concerns, you know, about privacy, obviously, of course, of course, that people can opt out of having their information right kept at all. Right, right, right. There's a reality that technology is advancing and non gas consuming cars or more fuel efficient cars are becoming more and more prevalent. Simultaneously, the system we've built in order to keep our roads safe and drivable relies on tax revenues that come from gas sales. The discussion about alternative modes of taxation are just a discussion about how we can adapt to new better cars while simultaneously continuing to publicly fund the thing cards need to drive on.

Right. Even so, even proponents of this kind of plan, except that there are real challenges in terms of putting it in place. For instance, like I said, the gas tax itself is collected from wholesalers, and then it's passed down to consumers indirectly. Whereas this new plan would require many more employees to be in like collection type positions. Yeah, it would add a lot of complexity to the the way that this was collected. Yeah. And I don't think that anybody, even proponents of the plan, don't recognize like that's tough. The infrastructure on this is going to be difficult to figure out because we're creating it as we go. It's a brand new system that nobody's ever even tried before. It's going to be a challenge. Yeah, doesn't mean it's impossible. There will probably

be some hiccups. Yeah, I guess if Alex would prefer maybe there's a conversation to have about making up the tax somewhere else like in property or sales taxes. But I don't think he'd go for those plans either. I think he's against taxes. Yeah, he doesn't have a plan and that's fine on his show because if you're listening to the show, you actually haven't heard Alex explain what the problem is, why people are discussing the ideas he's ranting about. It's fine to be opposed to this proposed system, but it's not really okay to just pretend that there's no reason that anyone would want to try it other than to track and trace everyone. That's not the relevant part of the conversation. You're missing out on the the entire reason the conversation is happening. Right. Yeah,

I mean, my plan would be to probably forcibly dissolve most oil companies and then reallocate those resources that I've taken to employ the employees that used to work for them as well as rebuild infrastructure. See, I don't know if that necessarily is a self perpetuating. It's a one-time thing. Yeah, I don't know if that's going to be a renewable pot. It'll buy us some time to figure out the renewable pot. It's all about buying time right now. All right. That's what I'm about. All right. Yeah. So there's other big news in the world and this actually made me think of how Alex was talking. It talks about the bubonic plague in the present day. He has a bit of another health scare that he wants people to be aware of. Okay. All right. Jumping into news and then I promise

into your calls. Monkey pox investigator seat exotic hatch. And it says investigators trying to stop the first outbreak of monkey pox in the western hemisphere scoured seven states Tuesday for dozens of prairie dogs and other exotic pets sold by an Illinois distributor. Hope officials announced a total of five confirmed human cases of the disease. Four in Wisconsin and one Illinois. No people have died of the outbreak in addition to 48 possible cases have been reported. To give you some context, the SARS outbreak is still currently active at this point in June. The World Health Organization didn't announce it was contained until July. So it seems like the monkey pox. Yeah. Yeah. Look over here. It's weird. So this outbreak in 2003

of monkey pox was interesting only because it was the first time an outbreak had ever been reported outside of Africa. Investigators believe that the outbreak traced back to a Gambian giant rat who infected a shipment of prairie dogs who had then gone on to get some people sick. God damn those Gambian rats. There was no human to human transmission and no deaths. The CDC did their job and traced down the animal shipments and put out guidance for people who may have come in contact with sick prairie dogs recently to keep an eye out for symptoms. Since this outbreak, there has been one case of confirmed monkey pox in the United States. And it was a person who traveled to the US from Nigeria this year where they had gotten sick initially and then come here.

Yeah. Yeah. This is an interesting story and as much as it offers an opportunity to learn about public health responses that might go unnoticed generally, or it could even be a good chance to discuss how there needs to be better regulation in the exotic pet trade. But ultimately, this is a low priority story. I have no idea why Alex is spending so much time. He is like, he reads almost this entire article. I mean, it's I guess because he likes saying monkey pox. Honestly, that does sound reasonable to me. It's kind of fun to say. It's not. Yeah. Monkey pox. You have a decent theory. It's as good as anything from him. Yeah. So I was confused because he did seem to be spending a lot of time on this. And then as he discussed it more,

I realized that I had found a hole in the space time continuum. Okay. It's an interesting note. This has never popped up in our country. And the government says we will be hit by smallpox CFR member and front man. Gary Hart says on Hannity and Combs, Dallas Denver and Cleveland will be hit by smallpox. We will lock down the cities. We will forcibly inoculate you. We will go to Red Alert. You will be considered an enemy of you leave your house, an enemy of the government training us for martial law in the new societal shift to tyranny. And then suddenly 99,999 percent of the healthcare police and firemen refused to take the shot. They had to suspend the program. And then suddenly SARS pops up to scare us. And then suddenly we've got

we've got the monkey pox scaring everybody. And there's even an article saying people are running out. You're the only person with the box now accepting it, even though it doesn't protect you from monkey pox or the weaponized smallpox that they supposedly foreign enemy would use. So it does think the high heaven. I can't find the article or the interview with Gary Hart that Alex is talking about. I'm sure he didn't say that these cities weren't going to be hit with smallpox. Sure. But there was a risk of it. Like I can find interviews and speeches that he gave dating back to like 2001 where, you know, the idea of someone releasing smallpox is something that is a fear of his. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But larger picture. This is just the exact same story Alex

is telling in the present day, but with the details swapped out like it's a mad lib. Yeah. All this just overlaps with the present day in a way that doesn't bolster Alex's credibility, but actually should make anyone who thinks he knows what he's talking about think twice. Yeah. The claim that 99.999% of healthcare workers and cops and whatever, they all refuse the smallpox vaccine. That's the inciting incident in the 2003 version of this narrative. This isn't true. We talked about it in a recent 2003 episode. This was a Bush administration initiative post 9-11 where he wanted to vaccinate 500,000 frontline workers against smallpox, ultimately only vaccinating about 40,000 because people didn't see the need for it. Yeah.

People were like, I don't know. This doesn't make sense. Yeah. Although that number is low, Alex's figure is way off. The present day parallel of this is the 2019 vaccine safety summit where Alex claims that the globalist doctors were worried that the jig was up and the frontline doctors were getting suspicious and wobbly on vaccines. These two events are severely misrepresented by Alex and molded into the reason that the bad guys had to act now. They had to do this now because everyone was refusing the vaccine, smallpox vaccine in 2003. And in 2019, they were the doctors are getting wobbly. Right. This explains the events that Alex is now covering as news. The SARS and monkeypox popping up to scare people in 2003 is the equivalent of the

initial COVID outbreak in 2020. Yeah. The inciting incident happened, which required the globalists to put their plans in motion to scare the public. And in that clip, Alex even uses the same goals that he ascribed to the bad guys now. Yeah. Lockdown cities, forced vaccines, martial law. It's tempting to look at the consistency that exists here with his fears and convince yourself that he was onto something. But that's missing the bigger picture. This isn't a prediction that Alex made that he ended up being right about in 2021. It's a prediction he's making that involves his interpretation of the world in 2003. And he was wrong. Total bullshit. Yep. When you see him repeating the game of the present day, that's all he's doing. Except this time, the stakes

are way higher because COVID was a big deal. And it wasn't handled as responsibly as other outbreaks of the past that Alex has fearmongered about and profited off of. Yeah. In 2003, Alex knows that monkeypox and smallpox aren't real threats, mostly thanks to widespread vaccination campaigns. And that's what works best for him. That's the sweet spot. It needs to be not an actual problem. Business works best when there's no actual pandemic. There's just the insinuation of one and rising vaccine rates happening, which is what the globalists apparently wanted to begin with. The arc of 2003 is almost certainly what Alex always wants. Yeah. 2020 and the way this has gone is a mistake for him. This is no good. It's also really, really important to remember that

the reason he's describing the lockdowns and all of that stuff is because that's what you have to do when an outbreak gets out of control, as we've seen. It's the embellished, exaggerated version of what you have to do. Yeah, exactly. And that didn't happen because of anybody other than the people who listen to the people like Alex Jones. It's self-perpetuating in some ways. It's self-fulfilling. We're self-encouraging. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It would not have gone that way if they didn't act like the idiots they are. Do you see? So it's not that he's right about something. It's that his very worldview predicates this happening. Well, it's this really bizarre thing that I'm thinking about as I listen to this. And it's like the thing that works the best is

a functioning CDC, people following public health guidance and Alex yelling about how it's bullshit. It's evil and yada, yada, yada. And everybody treats Alex like a sideshow entertainment new nonsense man. Except for the folks who are, you know, they have their eyes wide open and they give him money for his dumb shit. But they live alone. Right. And the weird people who sponsor him who are extremists. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you have that. And I think that that is kind of a balance that can exist. And I think Alex probably would think that's a preferable state of affairs because this is easy to go back on easy right here in 2003 when smallpox and monkeypox don't end up becoming a big deal. They don't become something that is a massive outbreak. Yeah,

it's great because then, you know, people are getting vaccinated and you're like, yeah, they tried to scare you into it with SARS and smallpox. And then there's no loss that wasn't already lost. Like you're just going to, I don't know, convince anti-vax people to be anti-vax. It's stable in some ways. But now in 2021, how do you go back? You can't go back. No, it's too late. It's too late. And I mean, it's just, it's just that fucked up. Like everybody on the far right is so much better off whenever they're nowhere near making any decisions. I think we talked about that like in a very early episode. I know it's like you guys are so much happier when you're just bitching about shit that isn't a problem and you can

bother yourselves. Yeah, I think I think a big part of that is that over the last couple decades in particular, but also, you know, going back even further than that, I think the conservative and right wing sort of the media sphere especially has been characterized and just they've gotten the most traction out of being like agitating and opposition. It does not really work all that well when there's power involved. It has to be against something. Right. I mean, you can't untie the like late seventies rebirth of the conservative dumb dumb as thought leader from the beginnings of rich people going a hog wild and trying to exacerbate income inequality. And as you see the quality of life go down for these people,

they get more and more angry. Combine that with a media sphere that's feeding them terrible information and making them angry at the wrong people. And we see how billionaires have made Billy over the past summer years. You know, it's just it's they it's created. It's manufactured. Yeah. And then it's perpetuated by itself. You know, and and the other the other point that I wanted to make too was that like when I hear Alex doing this in 2003 and think about like the way he's behaved in 2020, like I see it as like a just a gamble that he does that's always paid off in the past. And this time did not. Yeah. This time there was an actual like real public health crisis that was mishandled. Right. People responded to it poorly.

And in the past, that has not been the case. Right. And it's worked out to maintain balance before. And this time it's just completely out of whack. Yep. Yep. The whole world's fucked. Well, hey, the good news is we're going to learn about heaven. Yes, it's about time. Yeah, it's about time. So well, we're not there yet. Oh, God, Alex has to take some calls before Craig Roberts shows up. Okay. And there's one caller. I wonder if you can answer this for Alex. This caller asks if Alex meditates. What do you think the answer is? I'm going to say that the answer is prayer is meditation, my friend. That's interesting. What do you think the most powerful thing a person can do is? And let me ask another question on top of that one. Do you meditate?

No, I don't meditate. The reason I listen to you, Alex, because I can hear when you speak, I can hear in your voice this will right this search for truth. And my whole life I was, you know, afraid of the man or whatever you want to call control. And in my opinion, the truth is that no matter how strong someone else's will is, they can never impose any type of real control on me unless they trick you with false political spectrums and paradigms like me. So the globalist are experts at controlling counterculture moments that they create, they use to steer and manipulate society. Let me translate that for you. Shut up, hippie. Yeah. Yeah, basically everything you believe. Listen, I think you're coming at this from a

good place, but everything you believe has been a lie meant to trick you. You dumb dumb, meditate all you fucking want. I believe in self empowerment, but only through guns. Great. Yeah, if I wanted to breathe in and breathe out, I would be doing it while I'm at the firing range. So here's, here's where we get to Craig Roberts, Colonel Craig Roberts. This is just, this is comical. And for the next hour and a half, we are joined by Colonel Craig Roberts, good friend of mine, Marine Corps sniper in Vietnam, Army Colonel and intelligence police officer who worked in Oklahoma City bombing case, wanted to get his take on Ashcroft admitting there's a Patriot Act too now after denying it, admitting it last Thursday before Congress, wanted to get his take

on the announcements to invade Iran, Syria, as well as North Korea. And I want to talk about how the government says brace for more terror, we're going to take all your rights away, the monkeypox, the West Nile, the SARS, just a lot of different issues. And then I want to talk about Colonel Rogers just kind of to share with me, with the story that he shared with me when I was in the car with him for five hours driving back from Kansas City into Oklahoma, where I got back in my truck and drove back to Texas. And we were up in Kansas City doing a presentation, the big crowd of 600, about how he died on the operating table and went to heaven. So this is just hilarious to me in many ways. But the big thing that I think is really funny

is just that side by side thing. Yeah, it's the we're going to talk about geopolitics and what it's like in heaven. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Pick a lane. It's a little bit difficult to take anybody seriously whenever they're due. That's like the religious local news version, you know, like that's that's like, and after this, we've got the kitten that can't be stopped. You know, like it's that kind of thing. But I want to be clear too, like, I think that a lot of people have sort of, well, maybe we could call it mystical experiences or something. Sure. Something that feels transcendent. Sure. That means a lot to them personally. Naturally. I never want to impugn anybody for whatever they take from whatever experiences they have. All right. I would not

take seriously bickering about like, like if I had an experience and you had an experience. Yeah. And we went to a place and I had a detail about the place and you had a detail and we argued about yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like, yeah, I think that that's dumb. Yeah. And I think getting into too many specifics or taking anything too literally is kind of dumb. Yeah. And I think that's what they're doing. Yeah. I mean, somebody sent me or some of that that clip of what's this dumb fuck saying that God can't hear prayers through a mask. Oh no. Yeah. Yeah. And it's like, if you if you are at the place where you have to say God can hear prayers through a mask, you've already lost. Yeah. You've already lost. I think that I brought this up in the show before, but twice my grandparents

gave me a book for Christmas. Yeah. That was a tourist guide to heaven. And it was outrageous this thing. It had like a question and answer like frequently asked questions like, are the streets really made of gold? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Great. Great. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Totally. I just think that's not my heaven, Dan. I don't know why, but to me, it always seems a little bit like a waste of time. Oh, yeah. To engage in like trying to put physical details on. Yeah. Something that's spiritual. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. It seems silly. And I enjoy it existing on Alex's show. Yeah. I mean, it's really hard to shake from a lot of people's minds the image of God as that old white guy with a beard, you know, and it's like, really? Are we there? And so rich that

streets are lined with gold. What are we talking about? Why are you gold? What is the, is there an economy? Yeah. What's the point in heaven? Is there scarcity? There's an economy in heaven. I'm going to be furious. Yeah. That is going to be the angriest day of my not life because honestly, I think streets lined with gold would look tacky. It would be annoying. I don't think it would be aesthetically the best choice. Functionally, I don't think it would be the best choice. What am I walking on? Yeah. And it's not a good metal to walk on. I don't think it is. You'd scuff it. There would have to be people who were cleaning the gold streets all the fucking time. Then you need gas taxes. Oh my God. Anyway, Alex and Craig Roberts get to talk and he's like, what do you want to

cover first? And I think Craig Roberts is totally right. Okay. Colonel Roberts, we're going to get into your experience dying on the operating table and what happened. And do you want to cover that first or do you want to get into your analysis of the geopolitical scene that I respect and that I think the listeners need to hear? What would you like to cover first? Well, since you introduced the after death experience, we'll just launch into that. I'm sure everybody's waiting for that part with giddy anticipation. No shit. Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. But it's surprising to learn that they do not really get into any geopolitical analysis. You don't think anybody's like, okay, I did die several times, went to heaven, saw it all. But first, I really need to talk about troop mobilization

as we go. Like the logistics, we need to get into the weeds here because people are listening. Okay. People need to know that we've got to get two clicks to the West. Yeah. So I think that, you know, we're very interested in knowing if Alex thinks he's fighting the literal biblical devil right in 2003. And I can say I'm much more confident saying I think he thinks he is. But I can definitely tell you that Craig Roberts thinks that there is the literal devil. The evil power in the world at the top level plans centuries in advance. But they convinced the people at work forum today that there is no future. There is nothing after death. You're just dead. So just do what we tell you to do. We'll make you rich. We'll give you power here and forget what happens.

You know, in Jesus said in the Bible that, you know, it matters not how rich you become here. You know, you're piling up treasures that are going to be rusty and cankered. You need to pile up your treasures in heaven. And that you do with your deeds and the way you conduct yourself and so on. So basically, you're sitting in the middle listening to two recruiters. One is the sight of God. One's the sight of Satan. And you got to make up your choice. And a lot of people make the choice with the limited amount of data they have to our public school system that there is no God. There is no hell and there is no future. There is no hell. You don't have to worry about anything. And when I was growing up, we were taught just the opposite. We were taught, you know, if you do

this, if you do that, you're going to go to hell and burn forever. You know, so I mean, it was scare tactics, I'm sure, but the problem is, I'm sure my entire life and it always put down in my head, mind that before I do something really bad or stupid, I better stop and regroup and think about it. That's self accountability. When we lose self accountability, all of a sudden we get people to get out here and it doesn't matter who they hurt, who they kill, who they step on. That's a fascinating clip because I think that Craig Roberts sounds like he almost kind of understands the teaching them as a child that if you did anything wrong, you'd go to hell. It was abusive and scare tactics. It really does seem like he almost gets it.

But you just can't make it all the way. You can't make the jump. No. There's a good chance that Craig is right, that his hellfire and brimstone upbringing did instill in him a bit of self accountability and that he may have considered his actions more than he would have otherwise because he was afraid of going to hell. But he's on info wars, so maybe not. If that led to him being a better person, I suppose that's good. But I would strongly dispute the position that fear of hell is the only way to create self accountability. Teaching kids that they're going to hell if they don't behave well might be a way to convince kids to behave well. But it's also a really good way to mess with

their heads and give them enough baggage that they may take years to unpack it all in therapy. And there's all kinds of detrimental effects. Come on. I was beaten as a child and I turned out great. See, I am a podcaster. There's certainly in my own life and the life of many other people I knew growing up in the church. This idea of if you do bad, you're going to hell is much more detrimental than it is helpful in terms of creating self accountability. Utterly destructive. I think one of the big things that it does is it creates intense feelings of shame and guilt because messing up is human. You're going to make mistakes. You're going to do things that are wrong inevitably. And then if you've convinced yourself

ahead of time that you're going to hell for it, all you're doing is guaranteeing that you'll have some kind of intense guilt that you'll need to deal with somehow that you don't need to have. I don't know. It just seems like a dumb fear thing. It is one of those things where, you know, when you're in school, we should spend more time on understanding idioms and metaphor in usage like pile up your treasures in heaven. You're like, oh, that's a metaphor that he's using to because material things are valueless. And then other people are like, no, he means that if you do good in heaven, you get a fucking bicycle. All right. It's a equal system. It makes sense. It was in that brochure about heaven that I got. Yeah, exactly. That's how it works. It's like,

no, I mean, you're not. So when you do go to heaven, you get a bike and you no longer have to worry about socialism. Oh, that's nice. This is just a very small part of eternity that we're living right now. And yes, that we are judged on how we conduct ourselves. Now we better do the right thing. And yes, we need to plan for the future for our generations and do everything we can so that they don't have to suffer through some type of prison camp system or persecution or global socialist government, whatever. Now's the time to do it. And if you lose your life in doing so, so what? Because I'm here to tell you this life really doesn't mean that much when you get through the doorway to the other side. In fact, you don't even think about it very much.

Well, my uncle. So at the end there, Alex brings up his uncle again. Yeah. And one of the things that I find really interesting is that as Craig keeps talking about all of these, his experience, Alex keeps going back to his uncle. Right. That's just the like, can we talk about my uncle? Yeah. Like, I know you have an experience as you're my guest. Yeah. But I want to talk about my uncle. It's almost like the radio version of somebody asking you a question because they only want to tell you the their answer to that question. Or like, would you fight a million ducks or a million billion ducks? And it's like, oh, my God, you're you've thought about this and I have not had a thought. Well, but also, Alex, I think he thinks it's one upping. You know, like this dude died

six times in the ambulance. How many times do you die? And he can't make the story about him personally. So it has to be about him at the very least in a one degree situation. Yeah. Yeah. So Alex goes on about his uncle who died a bunch of times. And then we get a revelation that I have been waiting for for a very long time. Okay. Something I already knew, but I had not heard Alex Jones actually lay out. He got broadsided by truck when flying 100 feet, died six times on the way to the hospital and at the hospital. And he and my uncle's a real serious guy. He's he has limited brain damage. And you can hardly tell he just has a few speech problems, not a gigantic vocabulary because of the brain damage. But he's sharp as a whip and smarter than I am on 100

other issues, you know, runs a successful business to this day. But he said that he'd never been very religious. I mean, they went to church as Baptist, but he didn't really buy into it. He was kind of the rebellious one. My dad was the older son, the, you know, the good boy, the, you know, the valedictorian, john birch society, anti communist speeches, the thousands of youth, you know, around the state, the wild guy. Finally. Oh, no, Alex, something that Alex has tried to pretend is not the case for a very long time. No, your dad's super into the john birch society, giving john birch society speeches. Okay, now we've gone from my dad was around john birch society who maybe had a few books. He had, he was there were books on our library. We had a lot

of books, you know, of course there's john birch there. No big deal. You know, and it's like it wasn't that big of a deal. His dad's a fucking bircher from way back two decades ago. My dad was a fucking monster. He was, he was, he was given speeches for the john birch society. Obviously would have to be deeply involved. Yeah. Alex tries to pretend that he wasn't because he knows they're fucking nuts. Yeah. At a certain point, the, the label of bircher is more baggage than he wants to unpack. Oh, totally. So Alex's uncle died a bunch of times. And then he went to a place where there are crystal cities. Oh, he has this wreck, it's thrown, and it goes to heaven. And the description you talked about the waiting room, the hand on the

shoulder. He was still a good person, but you know, believed in God, except that Jesus Christ is personal savior, but you know, he was still kind of the rebellious guy. And he got admonished about that, went through, saw these crystal cities. These, he said it was indescribable total peace. And then he was back six weeks later in a out of the coma right before they were about to take life support off. My grandmother was there praying for him. Amazing. Wow. Wow. Crystal cities and getting scolded. Hey, if, if I've been to a boy crystal cities or what I think of heaven, I love it and wagging. Well, you know, you're in heaven. You got to get a wagging finger. So Alex has told this story about his, his uncle. And now it's Craig's turn to tell his,

his experience. And I got to say too much preamble. Oh no, way too much. He goes on and on about his tumor and stuff and going to the hospital and then like, have you missed the point, the interesting part of this story? It's heaven. It's the heaven part. Yes. It's not the lead up. We will take for granted that you had a bad time and then you died. I mean, of course your cancer was bad. Yeah, we got it. Yeah. It can't, it can't be like, well, I was in the hospital for a little while and then my wife came to me and we talked to the doctor and it goes on and on. And I think that even Alex is getting a little pissed. Everybody knows people who've died from cancer. Nobody knows people who've gone to heaven. Right. That's what I want to know. And I think you can tell that from Alex's tone

that's like, come on, man. As luck would have it, I did make it to the hospital. They wheeled me in, put me in most of the rooms on the gurney. And the one of the doctors who I knew came in. And he said, listen, he said, do you have a living will? And I said, no, I got a regular will. I didn't even know what a living will was. And he said, well, you're going to need a living will, I think. And I said, what's that? And he said, well, that's where we can plug life support if things go bad on you. He said, because you're hemorrhaging internally, you've got a negative blood that we don't have as a very short supply. We're going to have to switch over to Oh, we find that we're real short on blood. You've lost so much now that I don't think you're going to make it to

the night. We've already told your wife. And so I said, well, just do what you have to do. And I don't think it's my time. But let's do what we have to do. He said, we got five doctors here and I said, no, sir, you got six. You got God working with you. You listen to him and I'm putting him in charge and we'll see what happens when we come back from the break. We'll see what happens. All right, folks, I'm Alex Jones. We're talking to Colonel Carter Roberts. Come back and tell you where he went when he died. Oh boy. I think Alex is a little pissed that Craig threw it to break. You do not throw my show to break. How dare you? I know that you can hear the music. A break's coming. Yeah. A break's coming. That's not your job, Craig. I'm a

professional Craig. Oh, how about you go lead some more army people because I'm working right now. So we go back from break and we get back and Craig's like, hey, welcome back to Alex Jones's show. Here's the host Alex. That'd be great. That'd be great. He does not. But we finally get to hear about going to heaven. You had told me that and that you said, no, you know, there's a six doctor here. It's God. It's not just the five people that are here. What happened next? What did you experience? Well, I normally came in to prep me for whatever they were going to do. And maybe we should learn about that. I took down my nose and then instantaneously, that was it. I was so quickly transported to another place that it was, there's no way to

describe how quickly it happened. It's instantaneous. And I was sitting in a large room and it was dark. I couldn't really see. And the only reason I know it was a room is because when you get there, you just know, you know these things. It's not it's not something you have to see or perceive or have measurements or anything like that. It's just all of a sudden, you have this ability to know what's going on around. You see things and it's like an instant download of knowledge. And I'm sitting there and I'm very comfortable and it's cool. And I feel great. Feels great. Also, there's air conditioning. Yeah. Wow. It's nice. It's nice up in heaven. I do like that, too. Like they put the tube in my nose and instantaneously, I was somewhere else almost

like I was on a drug. Almost like they, I mean, they had me count backwards from 100 and I remember making it to 95 and then God took me. It was definitely God had nothing to do with man, man at all. No, no. So Craig is alone in this big waiting room type place and there are two doors like in Beetlejuice. There's no one else in there with me except somebody standing right behind me. I don't feel like this is a bad place. I feel like this is a good place, but it's not the ultimate place that I'm going. It's a waiting room, so to speak. It's probably the size of a medium sized school auditorium in size. That's how I felt. It wasn't, you know, like an eight foot ceiling or anything. It was just like a big place. And there was a door to my left or a portal or

some type of entry way or exit way that led to this life. That's the one I had come through. And to my right was one that I would leave if I was taken on beyond this point. I would be taken through that door to the next stage. That's pretty standard. I think you, this is kind of a picture that you, an image that a lot of people have. Yeah, you know, when I was kind of like the architect in the matrix, right? We've talked about this before when I was working at a God camp, everybody used to make each other pass out because we couldn't do drugs, you know, like that kind of thing. So you'd make something. I've heard this sort of story before. Yeah. Yeah. And then when people woke up, what they would say is something like, oh, I felt like I had lived an entire other life.

And I felt like my dream had been for 20 years long and all of that stuff. And you're like, oh, you were only out for five seconds or something like that. And it's like, yeah, man, the brain does that shit. That's how it works. What are we doing? What are we doing with a waiting room? Why does heaven have a waiting room? Yeah, that does seem a little... What's that? The bureaucracy in heaven is keeping people waiting? It does seem weird. It seems like a human thing. What are we doing? It's a very human thing. What kind of God is like, hey, listen, we got overflow. I can't handle it right now. It's a busy day. Yeah. What are you going to do? Yeah. I think, I think the other thing too, like, I mean, you know, dreams, you can have dreams that feel like they go on very long,

although in actual time, it's not very long. Just on a very basic level, thinking about that time experience, and that's not some divine thing. And if you've ever had sleep paralysis, you know, where your body is still chemically shut down and your brain works perfectly fine, you feel like you're hallucinating and going absolutely crazy. Yep. Yeah. So when you're, but when you're in heaven in the waiting room, there's that, there's someone behind you. Sure, sure. But it's cool. It's good. It's all good. It's a good place. And guess what? You're young again. Oh, if I sat there, I knew that this life was through the door that left. It's behind me, and it didn't really matter anymore. I didn't, I didn't have any feeling of loss. I didn't have any,

any feeling of missing my family or any of that sort of thing. I felt wonderful. And I felt like I was probably 21, 22 years old in peak condition. And this is important because everything that I was feeling was just exactly the opposite of how I felt one half of a second ago. When I was awake, I was sick. I was weak. And now I was young and I was strong. I felt good. Oh, weird. Now you understand heroin. You just figured it out. The whole fucking attraction of heroin is that. Yes. Yeah. It's almost like you were heavily burdened by your physical body collapsing. And then you were experiencing relief from all that sort of some sort of drip. If you will, boy. So yeah, there's, there's someone behind you though. Sure. There's someone behind you.

Okay. I didn't really notice that I was wearing anything in particular or that I even I didn't even look at my body or feel myself. I just knew I was there. And then right behind me was a beam. And the best way I can describe that this is really hard to describe because I can it's all those things until you get there. You just don't really absorb the whole scene and understand what's going on. Looking forward to it. It's like trying to describe a McDonald's restaurant to a cannibal in New Guinea. I mean, they just don't picture it. I'm hamburgers. Does he think they, you know, people like Indigenous people don't use the bathroom? No. Does he think they don't shit? Nope. No idea. Nope. No clue until you explain it to them.

They have no idea, Dan. It's a place where you you poo. It doesn't seem that hard to explain. No, no, no, not hard. It's like, it's like what you do now, but different. That's not hard. So this being, who do you think this is? Do you think it's God? No, it can't be God. Sure. What's God doing hanging out behind you? It's not God. God doesn't hang out behind you. It's not God. I'm going to go with a green dragon. Green dragon. Green dragon. I'm going to go Game of Thrones. God is a huge Game of Thrones fan. Okay. Green dragon. You missed the mark by a little. Okay. This being standing behind me, and I know right then that exactly who it is. It's somebody who'd been with me my entire

life ever since I could remember. And he was my childhood playmate that was invisible. I think we all had those guys. He had helped me to stand the Alamo, his baby Crockett when I was a kid growing up in the 50s on my backyard fence. He had been with me in Vietnam. I mean, this guy had been with me all my life. And I had nicknamed Joe for some reason or other back when I was a kid. And of course, as we get older, we forget about those things. Well, here was Joe and he was a great big guy, I think probably seven feet tall. And he was behind me. I didn't turn around and look at him, but I just knew he was there and he had his hand on my right shoulder, but he wasn't touching me. It was just kind of there. It was kind of just hovering over my right shoulder, but I could

feel the force of energy from it. Like a picture with a celebrity was everything's okay. I'm with you and I'll be with you as we go from here. Yeah. So it's your imaginary friend. I do like the idea that Alex is there. I hope he knew he had to have known that imaginary friends are real in heaven. Right? I mean, he has to. God has spoken to him. The presentation of like the pre interview is when Alex and Craig Roberts went down to Kansas City to do that radio. Five hours in a car. Right. So this I feel like is probably could have come up. Although I would also believe that Alex wasn't listening because he wanted to talk about how his uncle died. That's true. That's true. Alex was busy trying to speak, so he couldn't hear you. Maybe he hadn't internalized

this part of the story yet. Yeah. Oh boy. I can't imagine having somebody that I take so seriously tell me that imaginary friends are real in heaven. I was in the waiting room behind me. It was a seven foot tall version of my childhood. Imaginary friends are real in heaven guys waiting room imaginary friends. Socialism isn't there. Heaven is capitalist. We move on. Well also you should know this. Your childhood imaginary friend also your guardian angel. Oh and I also knew by the way and this is the part I want to really put out to everybody. I also knew by the way this is my guardian angel. This is the guy that took care of me a lot of times when I couldn't take care of myself, but he's also the guy that keeps track of everything you do in life. He's the guy who they don't have to

write it down. It's like this giant computer chip in them or something, but they remember and see everything. So it's like it's like a a massive CD-ROM disc that they can carry that's got all the information of everything you ever did in your life good and bad. I want to make one point very clear. If Alex is concerned about the surveillance state, he should be really concerned about this. If there are aliens or angels with chips in them that digitally record every good or bad thing you do, I can't imagine what the NSA like how it would even come close to comparing to that. That's how they got the technology. They have been secretly killing and reviving people in a flat liner situation this entire time. All modern technology is taken from that waiting room.

According to Alex's own entire career, what's being described is the starkest tyranny. Oh yeah, but it's God, so it's cool. Right. Oh boy. I really want to go back to how many jobs that Craig Roberts has had where he has been in control of people living or dying. Do you understand that I don't like this? I don't like this at all. You know, and it's that kind of thing like if you have this belief system and that helps you get through the day, fine, but I don't want you with a gun. I don't want you with a gun. Well, I haven't done enough looking into Colonel Craig Roberts. So I don't know what positions he's had or not. That's a fair point. That is a fair point. That is a fair point. I take everything with a little bit of a grain of salt. Was he a super

soldier as well? I don't know. I don't think he's ever been on Camelot. But you know, you childhood best friend who is imaginary is your guardian angel and they have a chip in them that records all the good things you do. Stop believing in religion. So this actually answers a really deep philosophical theological question and that is there's so many humans. How does God know all the good and bad things you do? Because at the end of your life, you've got to be judged whether or not you can go to heaven or heaven. God can't keep up with all that. You know what? I remember thinking when I heard that it was ineffable. God's will, you know, remember in the Bible, we see through a glass darkly. Sure. You know, that kind of thing,

ineffable, impossible to F. Turns out don't F that S just some fucking computer chips. No, very effable. No, it turns out thoroughly effable. No, it turns out that your imaginary friend from when you're a kid is a fucking snitch. The old question comes up. Yeah, you read the Bible, you go to church and you say, okay, in the end, we got it to bow down our knee and we're held accountable for everything we do. Well, that's impossible. How's God going to know what everybody does? There's billions of people out here and there's millions that came before and there's no way that he's going to know everything that everybody did. Well, let me tell you what, he didn't have to. The other guy does and he reports he's standing there right next to you.

So I'm just the witness. That's just the witness. God does obviously know everything. Stay there. We'll come back and tell folks what happened next. Alex cannot abide by this. No, no, again, we're arguing about what God can or cannot do. What's the point? What are we doing? And we're arguing about whether or not your imaginary friend is a snitch or a witness. Totally, totally. This is, if you replace God with Santa Claus, it's the same conversation. It's very similar. Yeah. Now, look, I, I, being a little disrespectful, and some people may think that that's not appropriate, but I would like to present to you an argument. Okay. And that is that Alex could not be more disrespectful to his own belief system

and his own ideas. Listen to this shit when they come back from break. All right. But before we go back to a Colonel Roberts here in just a few minutes, I, I, I drug Jim Shepard back onto the airwaves because last week we had a special and they were 180 and now there's only about 30 left of the big murky, murky light with a super black thing out there folks. You know, I wouldn't stare you wrong. He interrupts the story of going to heaven to do a water filter ad to bring in his water filter sponsor to talk about like this special that they have. Oh man. This story of going to heaven is not finished by any stretch. Like they went to break and it was a cliffhanger. If we're going to get back to your experience in heaven, we do not. We get into a

water filter commercial. Hey, what are you going to do? What are you going to do whenever the, whenever your holy book very clearly states that marrying commerce and religion is a great idea. Whenever the person you've named your belief system after has explicitly said to you that rich people will make it to heaven every time when you know it's a good idea. When this twist happened, I literally, and I say this sincerely, had to stand up, walk around the room. I put my hands on my hips. I just sort of breathed a little bit. I can't, I can't do it. I can't, I can't make a joke out of this. Like this is so disrespectful to the idea that you're having an interview with somebody about like you went to the afterlife and you're trying to present this

as a real thing. And what you do in the middle of it is slip in an interview with somebody else who you're selling their shit. Listen, as we all know, crazy, Jesus said, build up thy treasure in heaven. And if you are in heaven, the number one treasure you want to have is this water filter, big burkies burky burky. Well, you know, there was that time that Jesus, you know, he went and volunteered at the money changing tables. Yeah, he's like, listen, I would love to do this for money. I'm a big money guy. I want a part time job. So anyway, there's a scratch scratch and dent sale on these water filters. A whole palette of these fell over and they just have small scratches on them.

Some of them, they can't even find a scratch on, but they're damaging all of them, you know, saying they're damaged and selling them for $149 instead of $200. Now $200 is already a great deal. And if you want one that doesn't have a scratch, pay $200. Wow. I watched kind of like that. She wants something that's perfect. You know, nothing wrong with it. But this is a great deal. I would take advantage of it. Only a few of these left and we won't be doing this deal again. This is it on this scratch and dent sale. Last time we had one of these was about a year ago on this ship. They got a bunch of other filters at their top of the line. Jim, what do you have to offer for folks today other than that deal as well? I believe you've got several other package

deals and the sports bottles, the portable filter bottles, the potassium iodate to protect against a nuclear attack that you take. Sure. Thyroid doesn't absorb the radiation. A lot of different key items that are supposed to get a great price on because you're a big national distributor, the national distributor of Berkey products. Tell us all about it. Okay. Well, first of all, with respect to the stainless steel units, we had a little bit more scratch and dent from time to time on those. If I were this guy, I would probably be mad at Alex because I'm now being presented as someone who's interrupting the story of heaven to sell scratch and dent sale water filters. Just remember that this is your last chance to get these. We're not going to run

this sale again. Just like this life is your last chance for salvation in the next. Ladies and gentlemen, we need you to get these water filters stored up in heaven. It's like a sketch show. It really is. It's like a parody of what Alex is doing. Yeah. It's insane. It is insane. It is so insane. I love it. It's amazing. It's just that that like if you see this, this is almost another part of that weakest link in the chain of right wing propaganda. This is the weakest link in the chain of Christian propaganda of just like once you see how glaring this shit is, there's no way you're not going to find smaller versions of that fucking everywhere. It's just remarkable how little care Alex takes to separate these kinds of aspects of his show. Totally. Like I think that

there's a way that you could sell water filters and interview a guy about going to heaven on the same show. Sure. You probably shouldn't do that in the middle of the story of going to heaven. Unreal. Unreal. It's a little tacky. I mean, it's careless. This is twice we've teased the story coming back from break. This is twice we're teasing a heaven story through commercials. Well, true. But that's just a reality of a broadcast. Yeah. Well, that's fair. His stories are very boring. And we have gotten to some of the details like how your imaginary friend from childhood is behind you and snitches. I'm not going to be able to get over if you if that's part of your belief system. Good luck to you. You know what? If I were Alex, I might have gone to an ad

too. That's also a good point. Yeah. If when the guy says your imaginary friend is your guardian angel and he tells God all the bad and good things that you've done, maybe I would bail too. But I wouldn't go back. Yeah. That's the difference. Yeah. Santa's elves tell you all the tell Santa whether you've been bad or good. And Alex is like, no, no, no, no, no. Santa checks his list. Here's where we break off because Alex, instead of being done with this clearly bizarre interview at this point, bananas, he decides to go back after the water filter ad. I have no problem promoting high quality water filters, folks. It's something you need, just like guns, horrible foods. But but with a water filter, you'll use it day one. You'll use it every day.

And just stop drinking what they put in the water. All right, Colonel Roberts, thanks for holding. All I had Jim on continuing recapping you. You're hemorrhaging to death. You've been weakened by chemotherapy. You are transported to this place. You've got your guardian angel with his hand on your shoulder. So that's set in the table pretty well. Yeah, we're all caught up. You're in heaven. I would have preferred you said imaginary friend instead of guardian angel, but we got to keep this respectable. I accept that. So when Craig was in heaven, he got some info downloads, which is interesting. This is what I'm saying about the NSA. We've always talked about aliens being where we get our modern technology. Nobody has thought about

death experiences. Sure. Alex has. The one thing that that was beginning to happen was I was receiving information. And this information was the first thing that was acknowledgement that I was there and that a decision was being made. And the decision would be to take me on or to send me back. And I thought later, you know, when I want to reflect it back on that, I thought, you know, well, isn't this ingenious because isn't it sometimes that we may be running into people on the street who've already been there and been sent back because they've had information to bring back. So we really need to listen to people. Maybe there's somebody out there who has some information that we need to hear. So anyway, I'm sitting there and I feel fine. I don't have a

problem with anything. I'm not even thinking about this life because it's like leaving one into your house and going to the other end. You don't think about the part you just left. It isn't relevant because now you're someplace else. So if I'm sitting there, I feel like I'm getting all kinds of different information. A lot of it, I don't understand what it is. I don't know what it means other than the fact that later on it could be valuable and I may have to draw upon this information for people that I run into on down the road. The decision was made to send me back. And what happened was very, very interesting in the fact that I felt like I had been gone maybe three minutes, but at the same time, I have to say that there was no feeling of time. Time didn't mean anything

there. Time was not a factor in anything. But in the human clock, I thought maybe this entire process of me sitting there while the decision was made, while it was given information, was maybe three minutes. Now, this is interesting because all of a sudden I had changed positions again. I changed places and I opened my eyes and I'm on a bed in the intensive care unit. And I signaled for the nurse and she comes running in there, you know, and then of course she calls for the doctor and the same doctor happened to be on duty and came in and what's interesting was 18 hours later. I felt I was gone maybe three minutes and there was 18 hours at past. Long winded. Wow. So he goes on to say that he was dead for like that three minutes later. Sure.

Which is interesting because that leads me to believe that there is a concept of time because he said within the human clock, it was like three minutes. Yeah. So there is. Yeah. His own telling of it is like, well, I guess time is still real. Yeah. I don't, I don't, I don't know. This info download thing is, is fascinating to me though. Yeah. You know, I think it's, it's kind of fairly obvious and I feel like more people telling these stories should get it. But it's like, it seems like heaven is limited by your imagination and not the other way around. Right. You know what I'm saying? Like boy, it seems like maybe your creativity or lack thereof is the limits of heaven. Yeah. And we're going to get into that as it relates to this info download thing in a second.

But first we have one specific from this, this vision. I want some specifics. One is some of the information I got. One of them, it said Robert to get off of that poison, get off of chemotherapy. Quit. I will heal you. And so I quit going to chemotherapy after that. And yeah, I started getting stronger. I started getting better. And I had to go in and see the chemo doctor, the oncologist who was an old retired army colonel himself. And he said, you know, he said, you're going to be dead a year from now. If you don't keep up with the chemo. I said, no, I said a year from now, you're just not going to have as much money because I'm not coming back. Wow. So don't listen to doctors apparently is a good medical advice from the vision.

You know, you were, you were dead. And before medical science, you would have stayed that way. Also, you probably weren't actually. You were most likely just drugged out. You were put into an induced coma and you were fucking fine. So we get this, this, this message here, get a little bit more information about the message that he gets. And he got, he gets sent back. He got sent back. I was sent back because I had done a lot of work and received a lot of information over the years in my research work, plus what I was told when I was, I was gone to continue on doing what you and I are doing now. And that's getting information out to people and telling them, look, you have a life. You have to live right now. You better live it correctly,

because later on you're going to have to answer for it anyway. So don't be a coward. Fight the new world order, fight evil, fight Satan. That's what you're here for. You know, it's a, it's almost like I look at it kind of like it's a recruiting ground. We're recruiting for the good army and the bad guy for the bad army and you got to make a choice. There is a part of me that as I was listening to this, I think Alex stole this story. Yeah. From Craig Roberts. Yeah. The info download, the, the getting a message that you have to fight the evil. Yeah. Like I, it reminds me of stories that he tells now about getting visions from God when he was at this time period or younger. Yeah. Yep. No, definitely younger. Yeah. No, you're right. The God giving him his mission and such,

like telling him in a big packet download that like seeing a panoramic view of the world and everything. Like I would expect that if I were Alex and I were having this conversation with this guy, it seems like, oh yeah, I would interject with my story. Very similar to yours. If it is, if it is that similar and you're willing to discuss anything, it seems like that would be what you bring up. I get a real very, very strong sense that maybe one of the reasons that Craig Roberts isn't around is because Alex is just taking the story. That's it. Yeah. The details of this are astoundingly similar to stories that Alex tells now about himself, about himself specific. But I do keep this one piece of sort of resistance to my own suspicions and that is based on like, well,

maybe you just wouldn't want to talk about things publicly. You know, like maybe you want to have some discretion about your own experiences. Sure. Sure. Sure. But Alex does bring up how he has psychic dreams. There we go. So it doesn't mean like in for a penny in for a pound. I mean, if you're, you've got a guy on who's literally talked to, I guess, his imaginary friend. Right. And I believe, did I mishear that correctly or did his imaginary friend say to him, if you keep on the chemo, I'll kill you. No, no, no. I don't get all that stuff is going to kill you. Get off it and I'll heal you. Oh, okay. I heard it as like, Hey, man, if you don't stop doing this, I'll take you out. No, which I was like, interesting guardian angel. That's not the way I heard it. I don't think that's

what I said. But so yeah, sometimes the ears hear what they want to hear, Dan, when you have a guy who's presenting himself as having like this divinely originating packet download of information that was super important. And Alex on the present day says that this happened to him at the beginning of his career. You'd think that he would they'd commiserate about this if Alex is willing to talk about anything. Sure. And he is willing to talk about stuff. Like I said, he's a prophet and strings from the time I was a child and only happens once every few years will have a dream. I will tell people about the dream vividly image it and it will happen at a later date a month, six months, a year later. And a lot of people ask how did I know about 911? How did I get on the

air and never done this before? I said, call the White House call Congress, tell them not to use bin Laden to attack New York as their proxy. And I had the evidence, I had the information, but frankly, folks, whenever I said this on the air, I had a dream where I saw the towers hit. So I think that all the 911 truthers and the we are change folks and everybody who's like Alex Jones is always right. You know, what you're what you're really reinforcing is his prophetic dreams. Yeah. He's a he's if you say Alex is right, then you are taking on that he is a psychic. Yeah, who can see the future, right? Not someone who is understanding the future. No, and you're not you're not defending somebody who's done a lot of research and knows things and and understands

came to him in a dream. Yep. Like that's why he can still stand behind things like loose change when things get disproven totally because no, this isn't based on any kind of actual report. This isn't based on my belief that 911 was an inside job is not based on proof or evidence. It's based on the fact that I had a prophetic dream ahead of time. Right. I knew this. Right. Well, I mean, look, Doc Brown didn't worry too much about all those facts and stuff. He had a dream when he hit his head in the bathroom and the flux capacitor came to be. This is very simple. This is interesting. Let me differentiate this a tiny bit. Doc Brown isn't real. That's a fake story. The next thing you say you're going to tell me King Arthur isn't real. I have some bad

Well, I hope Don de Grand Prix is okay. It's even worse. No, Don de Grand Prix son of I think he has come to legend. That is true. Yeah. So I find this all very dicey and sketchy and Alex should too, because you want some specific information about this information that Craig got. Well, if it's from God, I would want specifics too. Yeah. But unfortunately, that's not the way this works. You know, you're there in heaven or in the waiting room and the angel was God was transmitting more, more information, more knowledge. You want to share any areas of that with the listeners? Well, there's there's one of the things was that I would receive a lot of information that I would bring back, but I wouldn't know when to use it

until something happened or I made it up to somebody that I needed to tell or talk to about something or ask me a question and it was like opening a filing cabinet. I would have a file on that and I could pull it out and I could I could share, you know, what I brought back with me. Oh, that's super convenient. That really is super convenient. That's so convenient. I love that. Yeah, because now you don't have to give any specific information that people could judge, whether it's accurate or not or anything, you can just give yourself built in credibility whenever you tell anybody anything. This particular thing I am telling you, yes, is from God. Now, I didn't know this like 20 minutes ago, didn't, but it was in that filing

cabinet that God gave me and I can't confirm this or, you know, like I didn't know it before, so no, no, but you have to listen to me. Obviously. Yeah, I mean, it's from God, of course, and now is the time for me to tell it to you, because God said it. This is almost like a scam artist body armor. Yeah, yeah, you know, it's been the same fucking playbook for 200 years in America. You know, it's remarkable what this exact conception of the information that I don't have access to until I need it. Right. That's what Steve Quayle says also about this like vision that he had. The two of them both have the exact same explanation for why they don't have information until they need it. And then it's divinely inspired. Yeah, yeah. And you know why?

Because cop outs are fun. Yes. And this is a really ironclad way to never have to show your ass, basically. No, and that's why, I mean, you know, I imagine that the very first reason that we invented a divine anything was just because somebody got asked a question that they really didn't want to answer. And they were like, yeah, because God said it. No, I mean, moving on. This is like the equivalent of you don't have to do voices when you channel totally. It's an explanation 100 built into the story. Yep. It's it's I find it I find it suspicious. You can't be preemptively defensive about why you don't know things, you know, like if you're preemptively defensive, that suggests to me that you already know you're wrong. Yeah. Yeah.

So I think that you can have interviews like this. And I even think you can have interviews like this that are not disrespectful to the person you're interviewing. Like I think that sharing experiences of like things that, you know, you have subjective experience of. I think that there's a way to discuss those things and and not necessarily pass them off as this is the truth of the universe. Sure. But at the same time, not be like, you're dumb because you think you went to a waiting room. Right. I think there's a way that you can recognize the subjectivity of it and recognize what it means to the person you're talking to. Sure. Sure. Without universalizing it. Right. Right. Alex does not do that. Well, that sounds about right.

Alex is universalizing. My uncle was in an automobile accident, but motorcycle accident died six times on the operating table. Went into a coma for weeks when he came out of it. He'd been to heaven. He'd seen the angels. He'd been back. Colonel Craig Roberts had the same thing happen to him five years ago. He died was dead for three minutes. He just told his experiences. It's real. It really does happen. And the problem is, is that a lot of people know this is true. So the enemy has a lot of quacks and the people out there putting out disinfo. Or people thinking for two seconds. Always has their counterfeits, basically. That's why I've always stayed away from it. But I have had experiences and I think now's

the time to talk about them at least a little bit. So yeah, this is this is him saying this is all real. This is all like, this is all truth. Oh boy. Oh God. Everybody knows it. That's why the devil created scientists to explain to you that drugs do things to your brain. Yep. Yep. So when Alex said, I think now is the time to talk about some of my experiences. I thought, well, obviously he's going to get into how he also had an information download course. He doesn't. He just talks about how he had prophetic dreams. Weird. I think now's the time to talk about him at least a little bit. Where I've had dreams, my friends that come through with the same images, the same color, the same detail. And that one of those dreams was about 911 months before. And I had

all my other evidence of my sources. But which did not on the air and said that call the White House call Congress tell them, don't use bin Laden as their patsy to attack New York to set up a police state. Because I had a dream where that happened. It was very upset when I got up from the dream. I know when I have these dreams, I rarely do that it's real, that it's going to happen. I learned this when I was young. And I've never talked about this, but I think it's important to disguise because there is another side that you're a psychic. Yeah, you have prophetic dreams. There is the other side. And I have been there. Right. I have seen it. Well, I mean, there's there's an interesting thing. I just I can't accept somebody who is is like I

make reporting based on prophecy that I had I had dreams and this is going to affect my coverage of the news. Right. I can't accept that living simultaneously in the same space as someone who's like everything I talk about is documented. Right. It's in the white papers. Right. Right. Right. Like, no, it's in your dreams. You can't both have because here's what happens if you both have all the evidence and you have a prophetic dream. Okay. Okay. So maybe you were dreaming about the evidence or why did you need the evidence? You had the prophetic dream. Right. Or who cares about either one of them? I think that I think it's an inability or an unwillingness to choose a lane. And I think it's because Alex realizes that like I don't

actually have prophetic dreams. If I tried to do that, I'd be wrong a lot. So I better edge everything with fake evidence. That's what it is. It's hedging. Yeah. If you're hedging, then I don't believe you. I mean, you know, in this kind of circumstance, this is an all or nothing situation. You've either been to heaven or not. So you've either proven that heaven is real or not. There's no other way around it. I don't think it's appropriate for like a magician, let's say, to do magic tricks, insist their magic, right, and then also explain how they did the trick. Yes, you know, there's the problem. There is the problem. I can't handle that kind of an act. It's just it. So we're getting a lot closer to Alex being against the literal devil. Well,

I mean, he's already said that that's how the enemy, that's why the enemy has all those quacks, right? So you'd have to say that has to be the enemy. I do feel like I'm very close to being able to say that Alex does believe he's fighting the devil in 2000. Totally. What we have to realize is that we are spiritual beings. We have a spirit inside of this thing, this container we call a body. And we are connected to that, that world. And a lot of people want to deny that they think, okay, you know, I'm chemicals, I'm electrical charges, when you're dead, you're dead. The thing about it is, there is a spiritual war and a physical war going on all around us right now. We may not be able to see the spiritual war, but I'm here to tell you it exists and it's happening.

And your imaginary friend is there. The physical war is what we're doing right here today, standing firm against the Satan and his New World Order globalist socialist crowd. And the thing about this, nobody out here who denies that all of this is happening, is going to be able to see it unless we open their eyes, we open their ears and we say, look, this stuff's happening. This is not the world we lived in 50 years ago. It's not the world we lived in 25 years ago. It's happening so fast right now. Women have rights. There's no time in heaven. Well, Colonel Roberts, the Bible says that some will be given the great delusion and that God won't allow some people's eyes to be opened. Well, and it says, don't cast your

pearls for the swine lest they turn and rend you. So we know that there are people out there that are hostile. You're right. It is a dumb book. So Craig Roberts is saying that, you know, there's the Satan's globalist socialist crowd. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And Alex is saying, well, you know, some people just won't listen. Some people are ostriches. They just have their head in the sand. And we are in a war, a physical war. Well, the physical war is information war. Sure. Why would that be the war if it's the war for heaven, buddy? Right? Exactly. I think that the way that Alex is responding to this, it leads one to suspect that he believes the same thing. Yeah. It's not him sort of explicitly laying out that I'm fighting the devil.

Right. But it's way closer. Right. It's swimming in the same pond and being like, I like this pond. This pond is where I feel comfortable. I suppose the only the only thing though is that I mean, yeah, the only question then is if you received message specifically from God, then the then does your Christianity include the devil? Because if it does, then you believe you're fighting the literal devil. The only way he's not fighting the literal devil is if he doesn't believe that the devil is real. Yeah. So yeah, he's fighting the literal Christian devil. I think so. I think his entire career has been predicated on trying to trick people into thinking he has political beliefs totally when in reality he's fighting. He's

fighting the devil, the devil. He's he's just a televangelist. I think so. Yeah. And you know what? If that's the case, like he's done a pretty good job of obscuring that. Yeah. Yeah, he really has. People do not think of him as nothing more than a televangelist. I think I think that he has made himself so weird and interesting on other levels and full of Byzantine mazes of bigotry. Right. Right. Right. Right. You kind of don't don't think of him primarily as somebody who is preoccupied with fighting the literal devil. But I think that's probably pretty fair to say. I'm still going to keep looking around to 2003. Sure. That this episode is kind of a watershed. Yeah. This this it convinces me beyond a reasonable doubt. I would I declare guilty

of fighting the literal Christian devil. All right. I think I tentatively agree with your your verdict. But I still want I still want more information. I want him to say it. You know, I want him to say I'm fighting the devil. Obviously. And also like the going back to 2003 and finding episodes like this. It's like there's gold in them. They're nails. You know, like Nana's. He's interviewing a guy about going to heaven. This is awesome. It's so much better. Yeah. So much better. Yep. This is the problem with what you believe. Nobody wants it to be real. And you can't go about making it real and getting Trump elected and all that shit. It's a bad move for the whole world. Yeah. As we've seen. Just learn your fucking lesson. Yep. So we have one

last clip here and it's Alex complaining about TV shows selling witchcraft. And then I think Craig Roberts might be not cool with people being gay. Okay. Turn on the nightly TV. It's all witchcraft shows. It's all the occult. It's all mysticism. They're selling us their religion. We have to stand up against them. And a lot of people see the phony Christians, the New World Order 501C3 Christians. I don't want any part of that. That's another counterfeit. In fact, would you like to speak to that, Colonel Roberts? Oh, yeah. Well, you know, we're seeing more than that. We're seeing they're getting into where it's okay if you're homosexual. We're getting into, you know, it's okay if you lie. So as long as you do it as a team. And it's not just the

television. It's in the public school systems. They've not only taken over the media, they've taken over the educational systems. Now that's where they get the youth. And that's the big problem we've got. They can't get you and me. We're too smart for that. And most of the listeners out there, they're not going to have a chance, but they know that and they don't care. They're going for the kids. The same thing Hitler said. Wow. Wild. Just got to get that Hitler in there sooner or later. Man, maybe education took over the education system. Yeah, that's the problem. That's a problem. Yeah. I think education is probably the thing that he hates most. Yeah. So this, this episode was so wild to listen to and so enjoyable on a number of levels. Yeah.

Compared to especially present day. But you know, you have a guy who went to heaven and Alex trying to interview him and trying to have some semblance of like, this isn't a ridiculous interview. Right. Right. Right. Meanwhile, the guy is talking about his imaginary friend from childhood being there behind him in the waiting room of heaven. Yeah. It's like, what are we doing? And then Alex goes to a fucking interview with his water filter sponsor. It's just the layers of the second onion of parody that, that him having the goal to be like, you know, like those fake Christians, those 501 C three Christians is like, are you just mad because they don't pay taxes? Because you're doing the same shit, man. You went to a fucking water filter

and interview in the middle of a story about heaven. Talking about these fake Christians. Yeah. All obsessed with their money. All of these questions obsessed with their money in dense. Hey, there's a scratch 149. It's a great price. It's a great price at MSRP, but this is 149. Yeah. Yeah. So I think we have more reason to believe that Alex thinks he's fighting the literal devil and has forever, but we will dig deeper and find whatever we can find at 2003 because it's quite enjoyable. Yeah. But we'll be back, Jordan. Indeed we will. We have a website. It's knowledgefight.com. We are also on Twitter. It's at knowledge underscore fight and I go to bed Jordan and at imaginary friend, guardian angel. You are my

guardian angel, Dan. And when we get to heaven, I'll find out you've been imaginary the whole time. This podcast would be weird if I wasn't here. It would be very laughing at nothing. It would be very weird. That Garfield without Garfield, just knowledge fight without Dan. Just random me laughing at my own fucking jokes. Yeah, that'd be brutal. Every now and again, we've guessed it on a show and we've had to record our end of the audio to send to them. And I've gone, you know, I don't listen to the whole thing or anything, but I will check to make sure the audio sounds okay. Sure. And it is bizarre to hear just one end of the conversation. Imagining your audio isolated. Oh God. Yeah. That was when we were, when I was editing the

D&D show together, I was, I was isolating everybody's individual tracks and you could just pick out weird sections where if I just wanted to clip that without context, beautiful. Everybody sounds insane. Yeah. Everybody sounds nuts. Yep. But we'll be back. Indeed, we will. Until then. I'm Neil. I'm Leo on DZX Clark. I'm Daryl Rundis. And now here comes the sex robots. Andy and Kansas, you're on the air. Thanks for holding. Hello, Alex. I'm a first time caller. I'm a huge fan. I love your work. I love you.