Lateral with Tom Scott - 128: The cow's jaw

Episode Date: March 21, 2025

Mary Spender, Jarvis Johnson and Jordan Adika face questions about golfing guile, charismatic comics and masterful mnemonics. LATERAL is a comedy panel game podcast about weird questions with wonderful answers, hosted by Tom Scott. For business enquiries, contestant appearances or question submissions, visit https://lateralcast.com. HOST: Tom Scott. QUESTION PRODUCER: David Bodycombe. EDITED BY: Julie Hassett at The Podcast Studios, Dublin. MUSIC: Karl-Ola Kjellholm ('Private Detective'/'Agrumes', courtesy of epidemicsound.com). ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS: Daniel Edgardo, Simon B., Nate, Em Andress, Sami. FORMAT: Pad 26 Limited/Labyrinth Games Ltd. EXECUTIVE PRODUCERS: David Bodycombe and Tom Scott. © Pad 26 Limited (https://www.pad26.com) / Labyrinth Games Ltd. 2025. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Los Angeles is sometimes called LA, while Orlando begins with the letters ORL. What does this help you remember? The answer to that at the end of the show. My name's Tom Scott, and this is LATTRAL. The Netflix series Stranger Things features this magical, evil world called the Upside Down. Well, I'm happy to announce that Lateral is set in a similarly magical land, but slightly less evil, called the Sideways. It's not quite as bad, except when you're trying to get a coffee out of the machine, which can get kind of messy.

Speaking of Stranger Things, let's meet the players. We start with singer-songwriter and music YouTuber Mary Spender. Welcome back to the show. Hello, thanks for having me again. Hello, everyone. Well, thank you for coming back. It has been a while. The new studio looks wonderful.

Thank you very, very much. I'm very proud. What are you working on at the minute? Because I know you've just been going through a bit of a change in what you're putting out. I'm working away on YouTube videos this year. I put out an album last year, so I now have to write the next one. And you know how it is, you have your whole life to write your debut, and then you have five minutes to write the next one.

So YouTube is a happy balance where I can work away on ideas and music history and music business, and then write some songs in the spare time. Well, very best of luck on the show today, Mary. You are joined by one half of the podcast, Sad Boys. Jarvis Johnson. Hello, thanks for having us. I didn't know, as I read that off my script, whether I should call it Sad Boys or Sad Boys.

Where's the emphasis? Oh, that's interesting. I don't think that's a puzzle we've cracked. Ha ha ha! But we can come to a decision by the end of the show. But I like the way you said it. Oh, that's interesting. I don't think that's a puzzle we've cracked. But we can come to a decision by the end of the show. But I like the way you said it. What's the podcast about? It's a podcast about feelings and other things also, but more or less it's us kind of ranting and raving about our daily lives, talking about mental health and also just pop culture, goofing and gaffing with friends. It's a very formless podcast that's very long.

And we are joined by... I'm not sure that's technically the best pitch for it, but it's what you went with. And I did notice you slipped the tagline in there. And our third player, new to the show, the other half of the Sad Boys podcast, Jordan Attica, kind of made finger guns at the screen at the tagline drop there. Sorry, yeah, not loaded.

It was purely for fun. He's in America now, he's exercising open carry. Yes, I can help. The emphasis is very, very, very, very quiet sad. And a really loud voice. Sad boys! Oh, don't, don't, because now I've got to do that, and our audio mixer's going to have a nightmare if I say that every time.

I'm going to, don't get me wrong, I'm just going to give them an advance warning of it. It feels a strange question to ask for a podcast like that, but what have your topics been lately? Well, I think a lot of the time what tends to happen with Sad Boys is we go in and we have a certain intention of something we might talk about and then we get very, very excited about some Dragon Ball Z lore or we get really invested in Magic the Gatherer. Recent topics include coping strategies around ADHD and the fact that Elon Musk has been pretending to play his Path of Exile 2 account. So like those are the,, that's kind of... those are the two extremes that we bounce.

Allegedly. Just to be clear, allegedly. Allegedly. Allegedly. Those are the two extremes that we bounce between. No, it's like, you know, if someone's listening and they really like Elon Musk, me too. And if someone's listening and they're not insane, yes, he is bad. Hopefully you will still be sane by the end of this podcast. Welcome to the Sideways. Good luck to all three of you. And there is only one mind flayer on this podcast, and that is the question editor.

So let me invite you to step through the curiosity door towards question one. This question has been sent in by Nate. In 2004, the libertarian magazine Reason had 40,000 subscribers. Their June issue covered concerns about large data collection services and their effects on privacy. In what brilliant but chilling way did the cover image demonstrate this? I'll say that again. In 2004, the libertarian magazine Reason had 40,000 subscribers. Their June issue covered concerns about large data collection services

and their effects on privacy. In what brilliant but chilling way did the cover image demonstrate this? Was it something voyeuristic, like peering through a window? I don't know. Is it 2004? 2004, yes. Ooh, a spicy time for the paparazzi so I Think that the spook in my mind would have to be what is some information that reason has about its audience then

that it can Expose and so my first thought was like a map with like little Points on the map where all of their subscribers are located. Would that be chilling? Right. So is it chilling? It's chilling to the audience because the audience are there being like, oh my god, they know something about me.

I'm wondering is this, was this as much of a concern in 2004 but going on instinct, is it your web history will be leaked? Oh. instinct is it your web history will be leaked. Ooh. Ooh. Ha ha. Because I don't think people were being that prolifically creepy online compared to now at the time. But I also think if you were relatively proactive on what was kind of the internet,

and then somebody was like, oh, no, you know that thing you searched, and we don't know where the private browser is yet because it's the past. I definitely got caught by my parents looking at things I should not have been looking at age 14, I think 2004. To back up, it is a libertarian magazine. And this is like, in the like, Patriot Act America, 9 11. So there is like a lot of like the government is spying on you type stuff in the like Patriot Act America. Oh, yeah. Nine eleven. So there is like a lot of like the government is spying on you type stuff that could be out there.

Also Batman Begins. So it could not be like, yeah, true. Also lost lost the premiere in 2004. Is Batman Begins the one where he turns the entire cell phone network into a spy device or was that one of the way to. I believe that's a dark night. And the ethical debate they have is, should I have done that? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah, I should have actually because of the joke. What was everyone doing in 2004 on the internet? I was on MySpace thinking I was going to get signed. So I was already, I feel grateful for this now, I was kind of like trying to be professional

on my MySpace and Bebo pages as a singer-songwriter in the south of England, in a very small town. My crazy ass was on Bebo making a Matrix fan page. For the Matrix Reloaded, the only one I'd seen. You've actually hit most of the main points between you, but there's kind of a bit of this you haven't got. Jarvis, you were right with subscriber data, that's what they had. And Jordan, you're right that this is something that people would freak out about much less 20 years later.

Is it like money, finances, like sharing your credit card details on the internet somehow? Because people were scared of that, weren't they? And now we have every... Like, we buy everything online. I go further with Jarvis's maps idea. Oh, okay. Okay. So, ooh.

Ooh, I'm thinking, okay, what's... Chalk journalism, what's a topic that really catches people? It's something about family security, you, your kids' school will be leaked, or your office address. This is a cover image, and it used highly advanced printing technology for the era. Is it glow-in-the-dark? I'm pretty sure that's older than 2004, but... That would be chilling.

You just get the magazine magazine and it looks perfectly innocent and then you turn the light off and it just glows something creepy. A ghost! This is maybe off... Maybe this is off the direction that we're going, but when I was in middle school, we had a yearbook cover that was photos of all... It was like all of our class photos as a collage,

coloured such that it would like pixelate an image. You know, that it would create an image like when you're zoomed out. So I'm wondering, it's like obviously they don't have photographs of all of their subscribers. They don't, but they do have access to something. In 2004, that was a lot less well-known. Right now this would not freak anyone out. But then it was surprising. I'm playing on Java, I'm just speaking out loud.

It's a map, and what do we use now? We use maps as directions, which we're fine with, and we tell people where we are and when we're going. A map wouldn't quite be creepy enough. Oh yeah. A street view or something, like street view of your house? Yeah. Pretty much it's not street view.

That's a little too early, but... Okay, so it's not a map, but it's not street view. What is something in between? It's literally the thing in between. Like satellite view? Yeah. thing in between. Like satellite view?

Yeah. So is it the satellite view of the region that you're in because they have like the regional data? Creepier than that, Jarvis. Oh, so they wait. Wait. OK, so did they print out a satellite view of every individual's house? Yes. 40,000 houses. Yes.

I just didn't think that that's so custom for 40,000 individual prints. Highly advanced printing technology for the time. Yeah. Wow. They sent out 40,000 different covers of magazines. The front said the subscriber's name, they know where you are, and a custom photo of your house from above. Well, what they mean is, I know where you are, and a custom photo of your house from above. What they mean is, I know where you are.

Yes. But you've got to remember, in 2004, that wasn't well known. Right. Well, you raise a good point because I don't know what it's like in the UK, but we had phone books that were like distributed locally that was just like everyone in town. Here's their like, here's the name and address or whatever, their phone number. I was, I once complained to, I'm from Gloucestershire

and it felt like that was a small enough environment where the Yellow Pages should be able to summarize everything I need. And I remember calling into, because I was so near to the Stroud News and Journal, I think it was. You just wanted to find the nearest hill that you could cheese roll off. That's just transit. The West country has this weird expectation that everything is so local despite its scale

and despite the fact that people don't move. So I remember going into the Stroud News and Journal and saying, well, at the time I was like, you know, we've got a bit of an issue with the yellow pages. Um, my friend Callum's not in here. I wanted my child friend, my six year old friend to also just be in the yellow pages in case a stranger has to call him on his landline. Oh, my goodness.

It must have been very expensive for them to do that kind of printing back then, individualized. It absolutely was. 40,000 individualized covers of magazines are sent out. Do they mean big government in those ways? Is that the... Well, because what they've... I think that might be what they're trying to communicate,

but what they've illustrated is that our magazine knows where you are. Big libertarian. Yeah, which is a kind of requirement for the service. So yes, Reason Magazine combined their subscriber database and a set of satellite images to try and prove to their audience that they know where you are. Each of our guests has brought a question with them. I don't know the question, I definitely don't know the answers. We're going to start with Jarvis.

This question has been sent in by Simon B. In 2024, online retailers experienced a huge sales boost of a massage gun that people applied to their index finger. How was this caused by a cartoon hamster? Reading that again, in 2024, online retailers experienced a huge sales boost of a massage gun that people aimed at their index finger. How was this caused by a cartoon hamster?

This is a trick, right? This is a trick. What could, what? Not a trick. What could, what? Not a trick. I mean, they're all tricks on this show, to be honest. True. Index finger caused by cartoon hamster. The hamster has your location.

Oh! Oh! Mary, are you familiar with any cartoon hamsters? I'm struggling to think of a contemporary cartoon hamster. I will say that this is not a cartoon hamster that you'll know. No, I was just thinking of, who was the aardvark we used to watch? Otis. Otis the aardvark.

Otis the aardvark. That's the only animal... That's a reference that was lost on Jarvis. Yeah, no, I was like, I know an anteater named Arthur, and that's about it. Oh, they were probably cousins. Yeah. Let's talk Blue Peter.

I'll run the topic. I'm just making hand gestures, like, how do you apply a massage gun to one finger? The things are big. Unless it's some kind of special T-MU slash AliExpress, like tiny little individual massage gun. With one of those really long titles with every tag in it. Massage gun, index finger, party solo, groups. Yep. Hamster, hamster, gerbil. What would you... What is the equivalent of carpal tunnel?

Is that maybe what it's... What can an... All I'm thinking is like musical instrument, like that's what you'd... Like it would... I could kind of do with one, you know, after you played guitar for a while. Yeah, and your index gets kind of twisted. But how does that do—how does that have anything to do with a hamster? Or even the advertising crew being like, we need—what we need right now is a hamster.

Is that possibly what it is, cartoon mascot hamster? That's maybe the further ad. Like the Geico lizard. Or Juan sheet for plenty. Maybe the cartoon hamster somehow encouraged people to injure their fingers? Oh, because it nibbled their fingers or something? Tom, I would say that in a lateral way that is... Okay.

That is... could be true. You don't actually want to use a massage gun on your finger, I think. I know there's a workplace injury called vibration white finger. Like the folks who work with jackhammers, pneumatic drills, things like that, for long periods of time, you can start having all sorts of circulation troubles. So I'm not entirely certain this is an actually healthy thing to do. That was so immediately, when you mentioned that, I'm like, wow, I've never heard of it. And then you said manual labour.

And I'm like, okay, I've never heard of it. Yeah, of course. I thought it might be a typing base. Jordan's like, I have princely fairfingers. These haven't touched a... Simply for the ivories. Princely fairfingers, incidentally, plays for the... no, sorry. I can never be bothered to finish that joke. I start off with the it's a name joke, then I just peter out.

It's not worth it. Too many options. Peter out also plays for the... No. He's a baseball, he's an American baseball player, yeah. Can I ask for a hint? Is that allowed? Well, I'll get...

I'm going to give you a small bit of direction. Where are people using their index fingers these days in 2024? So this is a, we're in 2025 now, but this was just last year. Scrolling. On the phones. This has to be scrolling.

Or tablets. Scrolling. Because I'm so thumb oriented on my phone, I'm wondering, oh, well supporting the phone, actually. I get a little bit of cramping from just holding the phone in place with my index finger. Interacting with a device. Okay.

So it's some sort of thing where you have to just tap tap tap tap tap tap tap tap tap tap a lot, and it's starting to... A mouse? Wasn't there that app where you had to hold your finger down for like five days to win? Wasn't it a Mr. Beast app? Oh, yes there was. Interesting. Beastly finger. It's not Oh! Yes, there was. Interesting. Beastly finger.

It's not anything to do with, like, fingerprint... identity? No. It was the... Ooh. Removing your finger... We're back on libertarian mindset, but removing your fingerprints first. I did once try to remove my fingerprints, and it didn't work. Oh, blimey! What happened? What were you running away from, blimey! What happened? What were you running away from, Tom?

What had you done? You know what? I am going to refuse to elaborate on that. That is not worth telling that story right now. Being familiar with Tom's content, I'm just not surprised. You know what I mean? Okay. An app? Doom scrolling? Identity? Okay. An app, doomscrolling, identity, fingerprints. A massage gun for my doomscrolling is a funny concept. And then a hamster. I'm almost kind of couching the hamster because I just don't... I do not know how I can integrate that.

Maybe it's the mascot of the app or something like that. Yeah. Maybe. Little Ham. So what is the hamster encouraging you to do? Tickle the hamster? Poke the hamster? Click on the hamster? Oh, we were all playing Tickle the Hamster. I almost forget it. Oh yeah, you remember that app.

Did you tickle me? Wow, a massage gun. Do you know what? The other day I did see a viral video where someone was— put their drum kit next to a metal door and then was using the massage gun on the metal door and making the most heavy sound ever. And I was like, I need a massage gun. I've never needed one before for massaging.

I just want it for sound effect. What if the massage gun isn't for healing? Like it's not to make the finger better. It is to make the finger vibrate. Or to make the finger, like, tap a lot on a thing. So I think you should combine that with... Kind of you guys have been on the right track. We've talked about mobile devices,

we've talked about tapping. And now you've talked about using the massage gun to... Make music. Make music, but also most recently, Tom, to make your finger vibrate. Is it people wanting to rapidly like every Tinder match? That is such a... It's like the wrong answer that fits in the constraints.

I'm just a dog. What can I say? Just one of the boys. Yeah, yeah. It does kind of fit. When you're out on the pool, what else could you need to tap really rapidly? So, actually, the thing that we're missing is... What did they gain from? They won a hamster. What is something in 2024 that has changed economically in terms of like the economic

options that exist for purchasing power? Is it NFT or crypto adjacent? Yes it is. Okay. Oh wow. Okay. Oh, wow. Is there a mechanism of crypto mining related to tap? That would be new to me, I guess. Well, you're right on the money because there's oftentimes many gamified ways to mine crypto. Oh no.

Every time you tapped the hamster, it gave you some cryptocurrency? Basically, yes. Oh, wow. Every time you tickled it. It's a hamster tickle coin. The hamster tickle coin? Hamster, it is called hamster combat. And it was a viral, allegedly, viral 2024 computer game that had in-game scoring backed by cryptocurrency. Players simply had

to jab at the screen repeatedly to collect coins. Applying the massager to one's index finger allowed players to tap their mobile screen much faster than they could normally. The online retailer Wildberries reported a 179% increase in sales for percussion massagers. Percussion, like the door. Some retailers even emblazoned the game's logo on adverts for the massagers. That's wild. Anything to sell, I guess.

In the end, and you could have guessed this, but in the end, even the top players who'd been racking up their scores for months only earned a few hundred dollars out of the game. Well, covers the cost of the massage gun. And the physical therapy afterwards. No, honey, it's for crypto currency. Thank you to M. Andrus for sending in this next question.

In August 2000, television viewers complained to CBS Sports that they weren't always being fed live audio from the PGA Championship in Kentucky. No major technical mistakes were made, so what gave away the TV producer's deception? I'll give you that one more time. In August 2000, television viewers complained to CBS Sports that they weren't always being fed live audio from the PGA Championship in Kentucky. No major technical mistakes were made, so what gave away the TV producers' deception? Was the commentary wrong? It's a hole in one that they dismissed completely.

Were the players boycotting it somehow, like trying to hide what they were saying? Was there some sort of natural disaster or event that interfered that people would know obviously should be affecting the sport. Of those three initial guesses, Jarvis' closest, in the right, vague, vague ballpark. They were playing baseball. This is... I don't think this is live. The video was fine.

The audio was fine. Was Tiger Woods not playing, but he was, was he in trouble and... Oh! ...but was in the game? What year was it? 2000. That was a Tiger Woods, I don't know if that was the Tiger Woods controversy year, but... I think that was a bit too early, wasn't it? Or...

Could be too early. So the audio was incorrect. Natural disaster, wind, weather... Natural disaster's not right, but of the things. Jarvis is closer. Right, like there's something happening in the world. So, I think maybe the Tiger Woods angle doesn't feel that different, where something is incongruous.

Like, our state of the world, like, the state of the world that the public has, has updated. And the audio has not. And that's my imagination of, like, why we're seeing, like, a dissonance between these two things. I was like, there's someone on commentary who had some sort of issue and couldn't possibly be there. Earthquake?

Oh, no, that would definitely be a decision. The vast majority of people wouldn't possibly be there. Earthquake? That would definitely be a desertion. The vast majority of people wouldn't have noticed this. Mmm. But they're pedantic enough to write into CBS, be evolving. Absolutely. And it's 2000, so they would probably have written it. Seasonal? Anything to do with the outdoors? Is there something just incongruous with the season? Yeah. Not with the season, but something's incongruous.

Have a think about the TV coverage on golf. What happens between the different shots of the golfers? Some aerial footage of the golf course? Yeah, there'll be establishing shots. So audio while they're on an aerial shot is... But most people wouldn't notice it, so it can't be too controversial. The competitors aren't mic'd, right? No, but there are a lot of mics around the course.

I was going to say, is this audio of the environment or audio of the on-mic talent? Audio of the environment. That's a key point there, Jarvis. A tiger. The sound of a tiger. Some wildlife problem. So something, yeah, there's got to be something that doesn't sync up, right? Something in the aerial shot that's not present in the audio, or vice versa. Not necessarily.

I'd stick with wildlife. Like, it's not a tiger. There's not suddenly a tiger appearing in the audio. But if you're a keen viewer, and you know certain things, you might spot that the TV producers are lying to you. Oh, wow. Was it birds or something? What else would be in a golf course? Birds?

Keep going, Mary. Um, they were sucked into the rotor of the helicopter. Oh no! Oh no! I think it was a Sully-style situation. You don't hear the helicopter during the big aerial shots. You don't hear from the mics that are way up on the towers. Wait, so if you don't have... So you've got the mics on the ground somewhere, you're hearing the environment, the birds,

wildlife of the said location, but you've got the aerial shots from the helicopter. Are you? Is it the wrong... Is it the wrong sounds for the birds locally? It's the wrong birds. You're absolutely right, Jordan. It's the wrong birds. Damn, I was going down. Well, that truly is...

I think if I received that feedback from an audience member, I would be like, that's okay, don't watch. Yep. Go away forever. I wonder, like, has birdwatching, was it more popular? We had less things to do in 2000. Social media had brought in our brains. We didn't have any hamsters to tickle.

I suppose I'll get to avian watching. Yep. CBS filled the gaps in the commentary and the action with ambient sounds and footage of the area, but sometimes the ambient sounds and footage of the area. But sometimes the ambience was pre-taped, and a few people complained that the call of a white-throated sparrow was audible, which is not native to Kentucky. You're supposed to be birdie-watching, not bird-watching. Hey!

Wait, but their complaint was that they thought it wasn't live, the whole broadcast as a result, or just they were like, this is inauthentic? This is inaccurate. What else are you lying to us about? If this is faked, what else is? It's not that they want to smooth out the broadcast because there's going to be lots of dead air otherwise. The vice president of CBS Sports said they try to use

local birdsong where possible. They did have a tactic for trying to get that. Lav mics on the birds. CBS put a microphone down and put something next to it. Oh, like some bread? Yeah, birdseed. They just put some birdseed down next to a microphone to try and get some local bird song when they couldn't get that.

They were paid for their work. They were too busy eating. They wouldn't be singing right there. Yeah, the bird sounds are just chomping. Nom nom nom. That's the chomping of the white-bellied plug feather. Yes, the producers of that year's PGA Championship footage had used taped bird calls for the wrong bird. Mary, it is your question. Over to you.

Okay, this question is based on an idea sent in by Daniel Edgardo. What has lateral got in common with a cow's jaw and an army of ants? What has lateral got in common with a cow's jaw and an army of ants? This is our very first meta question. I was gonna say, this is meta. Does the formatting of the text confirm that the, is it like in italics to confirm it's the show or? Is it possibly? It must be, it must be.

This is indeed referring to lateral this podcast. A cow's jaw. Well, cows chew like chud or whatever. Cud, cud I think. Cud, cud, I think. Cud, cud. And they chew with four stomachs. Well, they don't chew with four stomachs, but they have four stomachs. Four guests? Is that... Is there any possibility of...

Well, it's three guests. Yeah, but an army of ants. I can't see four making an army of ants. This is very silly, but it's like an army, as in, like, the audience is working together as a hive mind, and we're supposed to chew on the Riddles that they give us like a cow does Lateral has four players a cow has four stomachs an army of ants has many ants

Oh and and they have a queen right or every podcast Has well not every podcast but most podcasts have something that sort of unites them as a... I'm hoping I'm not giving too much away here. You're absolutely not. And I guess it's sort of, I am into sound and the podcast is audio. I'm just saying which part of the podcast to focus on. Is it tied to microphones? What has Lateral got in common with a cow's jaw

and an army of ants? So maybe a combination of those two things? We all chew on things. But that's not specifically a cow's jaw. But lateral chews on and digests questions metaphorically. A cow's jaw will chew on something, and an army of ants will... I mean, if they're particularly vicious ants, they will chew at things,

but I'm not convinced about that. I started so well on that, and then the metaphor got away from me. I had the chewing idea as well, but they worked toward a common goal. I'll give you the clues I'm definitely allowed to give. The cow's jaw still has the teeth in it. Does it have the rest of the cow attached? No. What happened? So, a jaw, and then what happens to the jaw if you introduce a load of ants?

Oh. Do they, uh, do they create a hive inside the... It's kind of a horrific image. It is quite gruesome what the ants do to the jaw. Oh. I feel like ants don't have a lot of hobbies. Their main thing is picking up a thing they found and taking it home. Or nesting inside it.

Do ants, like, hollow out cow bones and nest inside them? Like the podcast. Mmm, yeah. Get away from me a little. Well, there is a process that happens when ants... Maybe they're not very nice ants, they're not very nice ants. Well, they're hungry ants, they're hungry ants, basically. Did they eat enamel? Like are they eating teeth? Flesh? Gums?

Did they make the jaw move? The jaw doesn't move by itself. Right, but did something the ants do cause the jaw to, like— Do they comedically puppet it? Yeah. The ants have a job of eating the flesh. Right. And then there's something sonic about this.

Sonic? But not necessarily done by the ants. I mean, it sounds like there's an instrument made out of a cow's jaw, but I don't know what that instrument could be. You are very much along the right lines, and it has something to do with lateral. Is it a wind instrument? No, it's not a wind instrument. I guess you could say it is like a percussive.

Does our theme tune have that instrument in it, or something like that? Yes. Really? Wow. Yes. In the theme tune for Lateral, you can hear a distinctive rattle sound. I thought that was one of those vibra-slap things that... It's a vibra-slap, but I think I can reveal this right now.

So the jawbone is a rattle that you can hear in laterals theme and then the vibras that was developed from a traditional Latin American instrument called the quiada and this was made by taking the jaw of a donkey, horse or cow and putting it into a bowl of ants. The ants remove all the flesh, leaving only the teeth and jawbone. And when the bone is struck, the teeth make a distinctive rattling sound.

Oh my God. And quiada literally means jaw in Spanish. Kudos to the creator of that instrument because everyone thought they were crazy. So if you don't know what a vibra slap sounds like, this is how it sounds. Tom, does that change your relationship to the theme song of the show at all? I'm assuming it's a synthetic one.

I'm assuming that whoever put that song together just hit a vibra slap or grabbed a sample, rather than an artisanal, original, cow bone eaten by rats. They could use a VST, but they chose to get the real one. A lot of musical instruments had kind of gruesome beginnings, like I play the viola, but obviously the baroque viola had gut strings. And it was genuine gut. And then you go along those lines and there are other, you know, snare, oh, well not drums with, obviously...

Like sinew and stuff is used as like, yeah, hides and... A lot of animals have contributed to music. Not willingly! This question's been sent in by Sammy. In 2017, a user of the operating system, Unix, found that if you used the command from manual page at 030 hours, the system would reply with three identical words. What were they? Say that again. In 2017, a user of the operating system, Unix, found that if you used the command for a manual page at 030 hours, the system would reply with three identical words. What

were they? Deferring to Jarvis on this one. Oh yeah, Jarvis, you, I remember meeting you at the point where you just kind of transitioned out of doing computer stuff. I know, but I don't know, I mean, I can provide a little bit of context here. This is 2017. Mm-hmm. And then what was the time?

030 hours. So that's midnight 30, is that right? In normal time? In foreign. And then the other thing I can provide is that a manual page in Unix, the command is man. So you'd be typing in man space, and then you'd be looking up the manual page for a program.

And a lot of times times developers will put Easter eggs and fun little things into man pages or whatever. And I'm wondering what sort of program would say the same thing three times. And my guess would be it's a pun that like it completes a word. So if it was like man that, like, it completes a word. So if it was, like, man something, like, man a war, man, you know, like, I don't know. That would cause it a triple.

That's a good instinct. My default was that it would be, you know, and this is assumptions only, but also based on tech time, would be it's a pop culture reference. That was the other thing that jumped into my head. You've got most of it. And Jarvis, just for context, when you say, like, type in, what are you seeing on your screen? Oh, yeah, so, okay, so you're opening up a terminal. So imagine, like, a black box with a blinking cursor

that's waiting for you to type in a command. And then you can type in things like, you know, list the directories in the folder that you're looking at and things like that. You can also type in to start a program. If I type in like Chrome on my, more or less, if I type in Chrome on my thing, it'll open up my Google Chrome, because certain programs have a command line. Yep.

You've got all the important parts of this. Jarvis, you've identified the programme. Between you, you've figured out that there's something weird about how I'm saying the time. And Jordan, you've got that it's a pop culture reference. So I'm lacking right now. Is it 2017-era pop culture reference? Why do you think that, Jordan? No particular, just I'm wondering if the...

Well, why would the year be provided? I guess it can't be after 2017, but there's a bunch of culture from before 2017, there's like 10 years. There is, and I think this is the bit that Mary might be able to fill in. Oh dear. So something musical?

Man of Skin? I'm trying to think of, like, man reference. Is man one of the things? Can we confirm that, or is that still part? Yeah, man is the correct command, yes. Man is correct. So man music. What time was that again?

Zero thirty hours. Mm-hmm. Is there a song that just says the same word three, like ring ring ring or hello hello hello? I'm like imagining like what would be in a song. Yeah, you've got all the constant parts of this and you're going to kick yourself when it actually lands. Oh my goodness. No. Okay. So it's a popular song with a repeating... Jarvis, do you know?

You had like a cheeky look on your face. I don't know. No, no, no. I don't know. I don't know. Ring Ring is actually a song by the same band. Oh. Sleigh bells?

30 minutes after midnight. Something after midnight. Yep. At some point the penny is going to drop and I do not want to spoil that for you. Ugh. Why do I feel like it's like Linkin Park or something? Midnight. Minutes Midn-

Minutes After Midnight is a... isn't that a Linkin Park album? If you just say the commandant time a few times, it might land. Man Midnight. Man. Man on the Moon. Man. Midnight. Man. Man on the moon. Man after midnight. What was that Jarvis?

I said man after midnight, man on the moon, man. Man after midnight. Does that ring any bells for anyone? Oh, is it? It's not Elton John. It's not, but that scale of artist. They're Swedish. Oh, it's ABBA?

Wait, oh my god, Mary. It's not, but that scale of artist, they're Swedish. Oh, it's ABBA? Wait, oh my god, Mary. I'm letting myself down, I'm letting my whole everyone down. I need a man after midnight. Yeah, what's the bit just before there? You've got the song. Is it Gimme Gimme Gimme? Gimme Gimme Gimme a man after midnight. Yes!

Oh my god, Mary. Yes, if you type the command man into certain Unix systems at exactly half past midnight, it will send the reply it's meant to, and then it will tack on gimme gimme gimme. That's so funny. I was so locked into mama mia. Mama man after midnight. Gimme a man after midnight. It's an infuriating thing, because you. Mama man after midnight.

I could not give me a man after midnight. It's an infuriating thing because you've got man after midnight, but then you have to move your brain backwards in the song, and that's almost impossible to do. I, without knowing the song, I did the best I could. I was like, I understand the structure of a riddle. That was good, that's like an Ocean's Eleven where we need,

we need the safecracker, we need the acrobat. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's me, that's me. You guys have to make sense of this, I don't know. With the guy behind the chair. This Easter egg was found when someone's system started breaking because of it, because they ran a test at half past midnight, and it caused a problem,

and then they had to just kind of pair the Easter egg down a bit, so it only happens if you actually just type in man. Jordan, your question whenever you're ready. This question has been sent in by Nate. Eric Radomski was the co-creator and lead artist of 1992's Batman the Animated Series. In what way did he reverse the animation process to achieve the show's signature aesthetic? One more time. Eric Radomski was the co-creator and lead artist of 1992's Batman the animated series. In what way did he reverse the animation process to achieve

the show's signature aesthetic? Despite having never seen the series, this fact is tucked away in the back of my head. So, Mary and Jarvis, this one's on you. Oh no, we're already down one. I haven't seen the show. I think I've maybe seen the show as a child. Reversing the animation process. What does that mean? Can we unpack that for a second, Mary? I guess so. End result is the animation. Animation. And done the old fashioned way, I assume. So images.

Right. So 1992, the things I know about animation, it's drawn on cells sometimes for very advanced animation. I think in Snow White, they'll use rotoscoping and stuff, where they trace over, like, real actors and such. I don't know what it is about the... I don't know the style of Batman the Animated Series. I was more of a Batman Beyond guy.

Uh... So, it's not... So, maybe it's a bit more sophisticated than a flip book being reversed. I will say, Jarvis, to that point, Batman Beyond has the similarly iconic noir aesthetic as the animated series. So reversing the animation process, is it literally reversing, like playing something in reverse? Like, what if things

were animated backwards and played forward to create like a choppy effect? Or is there anything to do with the actual filling in of the art and it being finished, finished picture to then being like the sketch of the picture. I think what you've highlighted about the era and the way animation was done, methods that maybe would not apply now, is very appropriate. You could do it now, but the era made it... It makes a lot more sense. And just checking that I've got the right thing here, when Mary said that it's more about how the animation cells are made and drawn,

it's more about that than anything temporal. Yes, it's exactly that. It is more art design-driven than production process, or animation production. So 24 images per second. Or I think in animation there's like potentially less. But so my first thought was like thinking about modern animation thinking about like the Spiderverse movies and how they they to create the comic book aesthetic they like layered

additional they kind of drew on top of the existing cells. And so I'm wondering if there's something like that where they drew something in a traditional fashion and then sketched over it or made it or even took away frame. Oh, you said it was in the design and not necessarily the production.

Yeah, I would say you've, you're nail on the head with reversing the method that they would create these individual cells. Less about the pairing of those cells, but the actual artistic process was there. So the things I know about the artistic process that I think I know about them in animation cells, right, is that you have background art,

and then you have the actors, like the actual figures that are moving on top of that so that you can change out those cells and not change the backgrounds, because it would be expensive to paint or redraw all these backgrounds. I think also about what the iconic color palette of Batman is and how he appears in the world. No, black and white. I'm thinking Sin City, but old school.

I think Sin City is a good reference point as far as it's high contrast and splashes a vibrant color. Is it red, black, white and red being the only colors? Or? No, it's a lot of vibrant colors, but the predominant theme of Batman is important to the way these cells were constructed. I want to go back to reversing because like, is it like normally you draw something and then you color? I already said this, but like one idea of reversing is like you draw something and then you color it in. And then another way is you color in first and then you draw afterward.

You're bang on with the how they changed the linear process of making the art. But the not quite that. It's more the background, as I remember, Jordan. It is indeed. This decision made animating daytime scenes more difficult. Oh, they like they like maybe, oh, I don't know. Did they use like black as the background instead of white as like a base?

It was drawn on black paper. Wow. Wow, okay. Which, and I see that the challenge of, even when I read it the first time, I'm like, it is animation, but it's not the animation. Right, right. That's the tricky part.

You can definitely tell it's very stark, high contrast. An interesting note also included here was that they issued the order that all artists should have it so that all backgrounds had to be drawn on black paper with bright colors applied on top of them. The opposite of the normal system, and it allows them to have that really gritty feel. The Batman in that universe is almost like the absence of the world design. Where in a lot of scenes, he has no detail,

he's just a silhouette with eyes. Because it would kind of like Batman Beyond, but without the red. I'm going to have to watch it later. It's fab. I mean, there's a very good Batman the Animated Series movie about Mr. Freeze. It's like he's like OLED screens, right? It's like the pixels are off. You know what I mean?

To get the true black. Yeah. For the process of creating Batman the Animated Series, the creative team, instead of drawing on a white background and creating the characters on top of that, they started with black paper and then added vibrant colours and basic whites to help bring that alive, created an issue with the daytime scenes because layering white art, brightening a dark background was more challenging than darkening a white background.

Which brings me to the question I asked the audience at the very start of the show. Los Angeles is sometimes called LA, while Orlando begins with the letters O-R-L. What does this help you remember? Does anyone want to have a quick shot at that before I clue the audience in? Javis is a... something of a Florida man. Yeah, so the airports in LA, you know, is LAX, and then Orlando is ORL, I think. No, Orlando is MCO.

Orlando's executive jet airport is ORL, but Orlando Airport is MCO. I never fly out of Orlando, so that makes sense. What connects Los Angeles and Orlando? Disney. Keep talking. There's Disneyland, Disney World. Disneyland in California, Disney World in Orlando.

Yep. Oh, LA for land and ORL for world. Yes. Brilliant. Like ORL, yeah, okay. Yep, Los Angeles is LA and that's in Disneyland. Orlando is ORL and that's in Disneyland. Orlando is ORL, and that is in Disney World. Yeah. I have to remember which Disney theme park is where.

Thank you very much to all our players. Let's find out what's going on in people's lives. Where can they find you? We will start with Jordan. YouTube.com slash Sad Boys. We put out an episode every Friday, and we also release a second episode on our Patreon, patreon.com. And that is Sad Boys with a Z.

And Jarvis. I just received word from Jordan's doctor that I am now 100% of the Sad Boys podcast, which you can find on youtube.com. Sad boys posting every week. That's so unprofessional. Hate that this is how you have to find out. And Mary. I'm also a YouTuber, so Mary Spender, just type that in.

And also I have a debut album on Spotify now, and well, anywhere you can listen to music. It's called Super Sexy Heartbreak. Woo! And if you want to know more about this show, you can do that at lateralcast.com, where you can also send in your own ideas for questions. We are at Lateralcast, basically everywhere, and there are regular video highlights at youtube.com slash lateralcast. Thank you very much to Mary Spender. Thank you.

Jarvis Johnson. I'm the only one. Jordan Addick. Ditto. I've been Tom Scott, and that's been Lateral.