Let's Go To Court! - 221: We're Terribly Sorry for this Terrible Episode

Episode Date: August 3, 2022

If you’re looking for a light-hearted episode that’ll leave you feeling warm and tingly, this ain’t it. Brandi starts us off with the story of a toddler whose body was discovered in the woods of Kansas City. For years, the unidentified girl was known as “Precious Doe.” Police said they were dedicated to the case, but it took outside intervention and relentless advocacy by the girl’s great grandfather for her to be identified. Then Kristin tells us about the infuriating fight for justice following the murder of Jennifer Laude. Jennifer was a trans Filipina woman who was killed by an American Marine named Joseph Scott Pemberton. Jennifer’s murder didn’t just outrage LGBT+ advocates – it outraged anyone who was sick of American servicepeople getting special treatment in the Philippines.  Kristin (the tattooed one who is engaged to David) ends this episode with a bang. And now for a note about our process. For each episode, Kristin reads a bunch of articles, then spits them back out in her very limited vocabulary. Brandi copies and pastes from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Kristin pulled from: The documentary “Call Her Ganda” “How the Killing of a Trans Filipina Woman Ignited an International Incident” by Meredith Talusan for Vice  “Philippines Events of 2018,” Human Rights Watch “9 of Rodrigo Duterte’s Most Controversial Quotes,” by Megan Trimble for US News and World Report “Revisiting the Jennifer Laude murder case,” by CNN Philippines Staff for CNN In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “‘Precious Doe’ — Toddler Erica Green Was Killed By Her Parents In 2001” by Erika Marie, ourblackgirls.com “Solved: The brutal murder of Erica Green” by Mary Hallberg, maryhallberg.com “Mystery child’s slaying still haunts, stirs resolve” by Christine Vendel, The Kansas City Star “Precious Doe Case: Lessons learned” by Christin Vendel, The Kansas City Star “Mother, stepfather charges in ‘Precious Doe’ killing” CNN “Precious Doe Born In Prison” CBS News “Missouri: Letters were sent by ‘Precious Doe’ killer to wife” The Joplin Globe “Mom at ‘Precious Doe’ trial says she waited for girl to die’ The Associated Press “Activist Continues Work for ‘Forgotten’ Missing Persons” by Bryan Robinson, ABC News “State of Missouri, Respondent, v. Harrell L. Johnson” findlaw.com “Murder of Erica Green” wikipedia.org

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts! I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Egan. Let's go to court! On this episode, I'll be talking about the murder of Jennifer Laud. And I'll be talking about Precious Dough.

Oh, so this is going to be a real bummer of an episode. A real bummer. I can barely move. Okay. Sorry. I had so much dairy. You did have a lot of dairy. I basically suckled on a cow's udder for like an hour and a half.

Why did you choose to go with udder and not teat? It's an udder. That's what you think of when you think of a cow. Okay. But when people say suckle, don't you think teat? Yeah, but I'm being specific. I'm saying I didn't just suckle on any teat. Any old teat.

It was a cow. Oh, okay. Which can be dangerous. Yeah. Ask me how I know. No, everyone, I had macaroni and cheese for lunch, and then those two bitches, Brandy and Norm, made me go get custard. I had what this establishment claimed was a double malt, meaning it had double malt powder in it. Yeah, we understand what the word double means.

It barely tasted single malted. So you didn't eat it? No, I ate it. Suckled the whole thing right down. Great. Have we reached the suckled quotient for this? What's quotient? Quota.

Quota. You know, here's the bad thing. I've got a terrible case today, like the worst. And it seems like, I mean, the fact that your lady doesn't even have a name. You don't automatically know what this case is when I said this? No. Oh, Kristen. What?

You're looking at me like I can't do basic math, which I can't. You'll know it. Okay. It's local and terrible. Oh, great. Yeah. Boy. Well, you know, we. Welcome It's local and terrible. Oh, great. Yeah. Boy. Well, you know, we...

Welcome to the worst episode ever! We start you out with a suckle talk, and then we graduate you to... To what? Maybe we should just go on and do an ad. Yeah. What do you think about that? Patty, we'll probably have to cut that. That was awkward.

Apologize. Okay, so Precious Doe didn't immediately give this case away to you? I was thinking about that. Patty, we'll probably have to cut that. That was awkward. Apologize. Okay. So Precious Doe didn't immediately give this case away to you? I mean, it sounds vaguely familiar. So this is a case that I was familiar with when it happened. And then I feel like I know nothing about it, like any kind of resolution to it or anything like that. And so it's local. And you still don't. No, I do now. This is a shit show. I'm going to do now and I'm going to tell you about it, like any kind of resolution to it or anything like that. And so it's local. And you still don't.

No, I do now. This is a shit show. I'm going to do now and I'm going to tell you about it. And it's there's no good in this case. I'm just kidding. You know what? Before we bum the people out, let's talk about our Patreon. Everyone, we've got a Patreon.

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Then you're going to want to hit that Bob Moss level. That's a $10 level. That's when you get all the stuff from the previous levels. I wasn't sure when I was going to stop. I mean, there's a lot of stuff. It's a lot of stuff. And you get. Ad-free episodes.

And you get them. A day early. Plus. 10% off merch. Woo, doggies. All right. Well, there we go. Okay.

Now to the depressing stuff. All right. So, to me, like, I have very strong memories of this case. And so I thought like, oh, surely like lots of places have covered that case. It's going to be easy one for me to research and whatever. Not so much. No, no. So two big shout outs.

First to Erica Marie, who started the website OurBlackGirls.com, which features stories of missing and murdered black women and girls. Amazing website. And she did a piece on this case. And then also to Mary Hallberg at MaryHallbergMedia.com. She is a YouTuber and a blogger, and she did a YouTube video and article about this case. Okay. And she did a YouTube video and article about this case. It was April 28th, 2001.

And a couple of police officers were canvassing a wooded area near Hibbs Park at 59th and Kensington in Kansas City, Missouri. So this is pretty close to the area of like the Kansas City Zoo. OK. Yeah. Less than a mile from the Kansas City Zoo. Okay, yeah. Less than a mile from the Kansas City Zoo. They were canvassing in response to a call from a man who said his elderly friend had wandered away from home. Not long into their search, though,

the officers received word that the missing person had been located safe and that they were good to call off their search. As the officers were making their way out of the wooded area, though, they stumbled upon something they were completely unprepared for. They found the nude, decapitated body of a black female toddler. Oh, shit.

Like, minutes later, police were all over the scene, including Sergeant Dave Bernard. He was the most seasoned of the more than two dozen detectives on the city's homicide unit. He said he remembered thinking at the time that nothing could surprise him anymore, but that this case proved to him that he was wrong about that. but that this case proved to him that he was wrong about that. He recalled standing over the body of this young girl and thinking that it would only be a matter of hours before they would be able to identify her. The detective said, surely someone would miss a child this young, and they would come forward and help identify her. But he was wrong.

And they would come forward and help identify her. But he was wrong. It would take years for them to identify this precious little girl. And in the meantime, she was dubbed Precious Doe. On May 1st, 2001, Precious Doe's head was found by a volunteer searcher approximately 200 yards to the southeast of where her body had been discovered. Oh, my God. It was wrapped in a black trash bag. An examination of Precious Doe's body revealed just extensive injuries.

It was evident that she had been beaten and kicked. An ashtray had been located near the body, and it was determined that it had been used as a weapon against the young girl. An ashtray? An ashtray. How about cigarette butts? Did they find any? No. How about cigarette butts?

Did they find any? No. They found no fingerprints on the trash bag, on the ashtray, nothing. No evidence of any kind, like, to identify anybody, to tie anybody to this discovery. They even, like, sent the trash bag off to this special lab that was, like, the leader in forensic stuff at the time to see if they could pull DNA or like do some kind of advanced fingerprint searching on this trash bag. It came up with nothing. They estimated that Precious Doe was somewhere between three and six years old. three and six years old. Because of her age and the brutality of this crime,

this gruesome discovery quickly gained national attention. But nobody came forward to claim the body of Precious Doe. And no children fitting her description had been reported missing in the area. Well, so then you know a lot. What do you mean? Well, it had to have been her caretaker who did this to her. Oh, absolutely. And I mean, that's the sad thing about this age group. If the child's young enough to not be in school, then how many other adults are actually looking for that child,. If the child's young enough to not be in school, then how many other adults are actually looking for that child, know about the child? Yeah. So detectives actually

started canvassing the neighborhoods surrounding this park and asking anybody who had seen anything around that time period, anybody driving into the park, anybody leaving the park, they knocked on every door within a certain radius to take stock of, you know, do you know where your children are? Are all of your children accounted for? Oh, my God. Yeah. Okay. But no one reported anybody missing. No one claimed to know anybody.

Nobody had seen anything in the days prior to this discovery. And so the public really stepped up to help in this search effort. Volunteers gathered and helped spread the word. They put out like notices on the radio and the newspaper. Volunteers took flyers and put them up all over the place. They knocked on doors. And they raised money to hold a funeral for Precious Doe. Her body was held in the Jackson County morgue for months. Oh, gosh.

And then finally they determined that it was time to do a proper burial. And so they, in December of 2001, like the public held a funeral for Precious Doe. And they also raised money and set up a memorial for her at Hibbs Park where her body had been found. There just wasn't a lot to go on. There was a tips hotline, obviously, and like a thousand tips came in over as the time went on and police, you know, tracked down every lead and everything led to a dead end. They worked to put together a composite sketch of what Precious Doe would have looked like before her death, and they released that. They also were able to narrow her age range down to between three and four years. But the investigation went cold pretty fast. Yeah.

And there was, they just weren't making any headway. Yeah. And there was. They just weren't making any headway in 2002. They actually exhumed Precious Doe's body to do another autopsy and see if they'd missed anything the first time around. And then they exhumed the body again in 2003 to put together like new technology had come along and they put together like a bust of what she had looked like, hoping that if they got that out there, somebody would recognize her. This story was covered multiple times on America's Most Wanted and Cold Case Files. And of those thousand, it was like eleven hundred tips came in over the course of like a three to four year period. And some of them came in from as far away as like Jamaica.

This story was getting out there, but the leads weren't taking them anywhere. One of the most vocal activists for Precious Dough was this man named Alonzo Washington. So he is actually still really active in Kansas City to this day. He's an anti-crime activist in Kansas City. I looked into him a little bit. So he, several years ago, like made a comic book with a black superhero. He actually had like a toy deal with Toys R Us, but then Toys R Us went under. And he just, he does a lot of, well,

I mean, to be honest, he ruffles a lot of feathers in Kansas City because he calls the press out constantly for being racist. Weird, and people don't like that. They do not like that. But he talks about, I mean, I was reading some of his more recent posts and like to this day, he calls out the press for how they report like on black victims versus white victims. Like even a black victim, the press will often say like previous convictions that they've had or, you know, they mentioned drug problems. They never do that with white victims. Well, it's not relevant. Right. Exactly.

Exactly. Yeah. So he's still super active. So at the time, he did a fundraiser to raise money to put up a reward for information leading to the identification of Precious Doe. He raised $33,000. And part of that, he put together a comic book about Precious Doe. And each year on the anniversary of the day where they found Precious Doe's body, he put out an ad in the local black newspaper, the Kansas City Call. And those ads basically said, anyone with information, please come forward. There's a reward. We're one phone call away from identifying this girl. He

said he just refused to let this child be a throwaway child. He said there wasn't a day that went by that he stopped thinking about her. And just how could a three-year-old, how could somebody not identify this precious little baby? Yeah. So he put out that ad in the black newspaper, The Call, or the Kansas City Call. It's called both. It's known by both names.

On April 28th, 2005. So four years after Precious Dough was discovered. And he got a tip on April 30th from a man named Thurman McIntosh. So Thurman McIntosh said that he was the grandfather of this man named Harrell Johnson. He said that Harrell lived in Muskogee, Oklahoma, but that he had been in Kansas City in the spring of 2001. And that during that time, he and his wife had his wife's three-year-old daughter with them. Oh, my God. Her name was Erica Green. He said that Michelle and Harrell eventually returned to Oklahoma,

but that Erica did not come with them. He said that a lot of friends and family had questioned the Johnsons about where Erica was when they returned without her, and that they had always said that Erica was living with some friends or family members. The story kind of changed. But Thurman McIntosh believed that Erica was Precious Doe. Yeah. And so Alonzo found this man's claims to be credible. And so he passed his information along to the lead detective on the Precious Doe case.

And on May 4th, 2005, Thurman McIntosh was brought in to sit down with detectives for questioning. Fun fact. Is it fun? No, it's so it's beyond frustrating. The police had actually talked to Thurman McIntosh before. This is so frustrating. No, it's beyond frustrating. Okay. The police had actually talked to Thurman McIntosh before. In fact, Thurman McIntosh had called police 40 to 50 times over the previous four years to tell them that he not only believed that he knew the identity of Precious Doe, but that he believed his grandson had murdered her. Right.

But they had written him off as not credible. Why? He was like an elderly guy. He was like in his 80s. And the details, the first time he spoke to them, got – it's hard to know if he had the details wrong or if they just misunderstood him. They say that he said that Erica was a year old. But he says that he told them that Erica was a year old the last time he saw her. And that she would be, had she died in the spring of 2001, she would have been about three years old.

Yeah. And so they actually only recorded, the police only recorded about two to three of his calls and the rest they just totally brushed off as some crazy old man calling us again. Wow.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. Thurman said that his call to Alonzo Washington was his last effort to get the police to listen to him. Yeah. I mean, how many times are you going to call about this? He said that, you know, at this point he was elderly. He was well into his 80s. And he said he wanted to make sure the truth was told before he died and left the earth. and left the earth.

He was able to give the detectives photographs of a girl he believed to be Erica, precious doe. He also provided them with a hair sample from Michelle Johnson. Wow. And so the police took this information and they looked into it, and the photos actually did not turn out to be of Erica. They actually turned out to be of Erica's cousin. But the DNA from Michelle's hair was a match to Precious Doe. How did he have her DNA?

So, OK. So I read in one article that like he had been asking his grandson about this over and over and over again. And his grandson was in and out of jail at this time. And like right before this, his grandson had gotten out of jail and he picked him up and he grilled. He was the one who picked him up when he was released. He just grilled and grilled and grilled him and got all the information he could. And then this was his like last ditch effort to get someone to listen to him.

Wow. And so he was just collecting anything he could to try and prove. Yes. OK. Wow. That this precious doe was Michelle's daughter, Erica Green. And the DNA proved that he was right. I saw a quote from the lead detective on this case about how they'd written off Thurman McIntosh. Yeah. What's their excuse for that? I believe the article was titled something like, Lessons to be Learned from the Precious Dough Case.

Yeah. No shit. So the lead detective said something to the effect of, you know what? We did drop the ball here. But you know what else? You dropped it so many times. Then we recovered it and we ran it in for a touchdown.

No. No. No. He kept calling. Yes. He gathered all the evidence. Yes. When you didn't listen, he called someone who would listen.

You didn't do shit. Yes. Ran it in for a touchdown. We did drop the ball, but you know what? We recovered it and we ran it in for a touchdown. We did drop the ball, but you know what? We recovered it and we ran it in for a touchdown. Okay, well, that's extraordinarily alarming. Yeah. Because that just shows no lessons were learned.

Yeah. Yep. Yep. So the police get this information. They test the DNA. It's a match. And so, Michelle and Harrell Johnson had actually – this was a little bit unclear to me. I can't tell if they had already been arrested on other warrants in Oklahoma or if they specifically were arrested on unrelated warrants because this information came to light.

Either way, Michelle Johnson and Harrell Johnson were in custody in Oklahoma. And so detectives from Kansas City went down there and sat down with them. And it took almost no time for detectives to sit down with Michelle Johnson before she told them everything that had happened. She confirmed that Precious Doe was her daughter, Erica. She said that at the time, so in the spring of 2001, Michelle and Harrell were not yet married, but they were living together and that they had come up to Kansas City and were staying with a family member of Harrell were not yet married, but they were living together and that they had come up to Kansas City

and were staying with a family member of Harrell's, like his cousin at that time. So it was like April 27th and they had gotten home for the night, like somewhere between eight and nine o'clock. They were at that cousin's house and that Michelle had put Erica to bed and that she just kept getting up. She kept getting up. And each time she'd get up, Harrell would get more and more angry that she kept getting out of bed. She's a three-year-old girl. Just fun reminder there. And so at one point, Michelle was like, OK, go to bed. And she put her in bed. And she's like, you stay in bed now. And then Michelle went and took a bath. And she said when she got out of the bath, she came out and she found that Erica was standing out of bed again.

She was standing in her room. And Harrell at this point was drunk and high on PCP. Oh, God. And he was furious that Erica had gotten out of bed again. And so Michelle said that she sat down on Erica's bed and Erica was standing in front of her. And Harrell came into the room furious that Erica had gotten up again and kicked her in the side of the head. And that she immediately fell to the ground unresponsive. Michelle said she jumped up and said, what the fuck did you do?

And she said the shock of the moment like of Erica falling to the ground like brought Harrell out of his high and that they both just started freaking out. Michelle said she grabbed Erica and took her to the bathroom and she said that Erica was just limp in her arms. She said she put her in a cold bathtub to try and revive her. bathtub to try and revive her. Yeah. And that she sat with her and she sang Barney to her, but that like she was completely unresponsive. Her eyes were like rolled back in her head. And that for 15 minutes she just sat with her like that.

that for 15 minutes she just sat with her like that. And then they let Erica just lay there for hours while they decided what to do. They didn't want to get her medical attention because both Michelle and Harrell had warrants out on them and they knew that if they sought medical attention that the police would get involved and that they would go both go to jail oh my god and so they let erica lay unresponsive all night michelle tried to feed her the next morning and it was clear that she was dead Oh, my God. And so together they made the decision to get rid of her body. And so they took her to the woods, took her clothes off of her, removed her head with hedge clippers. Why? Why? So she couldn't be identified.

But they left her head out there, too. So initially, initially they left the body in the woods and then they disposed of Erica's head in a church trash can. Oh, my God. were leaving, they became worried that someone would smell something in the trash, go looking to see what the smell was, discover the head and call the police. And so then they went and dumped it in a different part of that same wooded area. Oh, my God. When Michelle was giving this statement, they were showing Michelle pictures of Erica. And Michelle identified her.

I believe it was pictures of Erica when she was discovered in the woods. Sure. And she identified it. And she wrote – she turned the picture over and she wrote on the back of it, Mama is so sorry. You're always in my heart and soul. Love you always, little E. Oh, my God.

So they recorded this whole statement. She gave the full confession. And then they went and sat down with Harrell Johnson, and he did the same thing. He gave a full confession. And he also, like, they showed him the same pictures, and he, you and he told them essentially the same story Michelle had. And he also wrote a note on the back of the picture. He said, I'm so sorry that this happened and I hope that you forgive me for what I've done. And I will always love you with my heart and soul.

Harrell Johnson. I will always miss you. Harrell Johnson. The police asked them to do that. Really? 100%. Why though? It's another way to show guilt.

Okay. And it's an emotional play. It is an emotional play for sure. That's your baby girl. Why don't you write a note? Yeah. And then they've got – Yeah.

I mean I don't – I'm not mad about it. No. Yeah. That's for sure just a tactic. Yeah. They didn't independently decide to write notes. Well, I thought – I didn't think they independently did that, but I thought – I've never heard of that. I thought it was super weird.

But no, that makes so much sense. I watch TV shows. On May 5th, 2005, it was announced to the public that Precious Doe had been identified as Erica Michelle Marie Green. Erica was born on May 15th, 1997, in McLeod, Oklahoma. Her mother, who was Michelle Pierce at the time because she had not yet married Harrell Johnson, had been in prison for just over a month on a larceny conviction. Some sources say forgery. I'm not really sure. But when she gave birth to Erica, Erica was the youngest of five children that Michelle

had with Larry Green. She also has three other children, but I don't believe by Larry Green. I think she has eight children total. Gotcha. I think she has eight children total. Gotcha. So the corrections, like the corrections facility that Michelle was at didn't allow inmates' children to live with them. And so Michelle had to find a guardian for Erica.

And so after she gave birth, she chose this woman, Betty Brown, who was a friend of the family. She was like her grandmother's friend or something. So this was an elderly woman, a woman like I believe in her 70s. Okay. Who she asked to take custody of Erica. And she did. So she had to come to the prison and she had to fill out a form and show her driver's license. And then they were like, here's the baby. Wow. And then they were like, here's the baby. And so Erica was raised in Oklahoma for like the first three years of her life by Betty Brown.

Almost the first four years of her life. She had her until April 4th, 2001. Oh, my God. And then one day Michelle showed up at Betty's house and was like, I want to take Erica to a family reunion. And so she said, oh, my God. Yeah. She said, I'm going to take Erica with me. This is my boyfriend, Harrell.

We're going to go to Kansas City. We're going to go to this family reunion because Harrell had a child who lived in Kansas City. And she said, you know, I'll bring her back to you at some point. And then Betty Brown never saw Erica again. So did Betty Brown call around about the baby? Betty Brown asked some questions. Yeah. But she was just given kind of the runaround.

Like, oh, she's living with a cousin in Kansas City. Oh, she's living with family here. So I did see another source that said when the police had received that tip from Thurman McIntosh that they wrote off, when they tried to confirm the details that they'd given, they did look into Erica Green. But they found some record that Michelle Johnson was claiming like welfare benefits for Erica like in Illinois. And so they just like assumed she was living in Illinois. Oh, wow. And that was it. They didn't think that there could possibly be any fraud going on?

Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And so that was one of the reasons they'd written off Thurman McIntosh as being just, like, some old nut. Oh, God. Yeah. So, yeah.

So Michelle and Harrell got really good about telling people, oh, she's here, she's there, she's wherever. Right. And Michelle didn't have custody of any of her eight children. And so it was pretty easy for people to believe that. You know, there was a public identification of Precious Doe and it was announced that both Michelle Johnson and Harrell Johnson had been arrested and were charged with her murder. They were initially charged with second degree murder. Those charges would eventually be up to first degree murder. While they were both in jail awaiting trial, Harrell wrote several letters to Michelle and some of those letters were urging her to change her story and try and pin Erica's murder on someone else.

Well, a little late for that. Yeah. Yeah. His tone in these letters really changed. It started out, of course, I love you. 100%. That's exactly how it started. Yeah.

It was clear that there was some manipulation going on in their relationship. Yeah. In one letter, he said, Michelle, we got to do what we got to do together as one. We can beat this case. And that's real talk. You just got to do everything I ask you to do and listen to me. He said, boo, let's be faithful to each other. You have the man of your dreams.

Sir. Yeah. Sir. Can you imagine? First of all, never refer to yourself that way. Also, you killed a child. Yeah. And so at some point he got wind of the fact that Michelle was talking about taking a plea deal.

She was considering taking a plea deal where she would plead guilty to a lesser charge and in exchange she would testify against her. Absolutely. Absolutely. And so he wrote her a letter and said, please don't do it, my love. Boo, if they don't have the evidence and they can't get a conviction at all. He said, that's why they keep coming at you with all those pleas, because they know if this goes to trial, you'll beat the case. They know it. You have to put two and two together.

And then he came up with this other scenario, this like new story that he wanted her to tell and they were going to tell it together. So this new version, it brought in this whole new guy, this friend named Mike Mike. So he was like, OK, so this is the story. Let's get it straight. Right. OK, so we're going to tell them that Mike Mike agreed to take Erica to a family friend. Is Mike Mike inspired by a real person?

I don't know the answer to that. So from the headlines? Right, right, right. So they made these arrangements when they were in Kansas City. Mike Mike was going to take Erica to a friend of the family in Muskogee. Does this dude not know that they read your letter? Exactly. Exactly.

So they even paid, paid according to this letter, Mike Mike $35. They put Erica in the car and then they never saw her again oh they don't know what mike mike did and you know what i'm starting to think mike mike's not his real name yeah i'm thinking i'm thinking mike mike might not even exist hold up and then he's went on in this in one of these letters and said, don't answer any questions you don't know. Send them to me. Look, that's something you need to keep in mind because this is our way out of town. I'm going to write it out for you, the whole thing.

But you only need to remember the parts that pertain to you, okay? You can't plot this in a letter that you're writing from jail, my dude. Yeah, he didn't even try to be subtle. Like, oh, dearest love. Yeah. I'll never forget how sad I was when we waved goodbye to Mike Mike. Right. We paid $35.

Yeah. Yeah. Sorry, I just think I'd paid $35. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. I just think I'd be good at this better than him. So he's writing her these letters. And finally, like, she decides that she's not going to do what he wants her to do. She's going to take the plea deal and she's going to testify against him. And he finds this out and he writes her this four-page rant letter about a month before his trial.

And he says, now I'm going to make sure you get ran over personally. I'm going to tell them how you used to beat and leave Erica in that room with no TV, no nothing for hours while you smoked crack. Your time on this earth is real short. You can believe that. Yeah. So the police told him, hey, she's taking a plea deal. And then they were so excited. They're like, here's a pen and paper.

Yeah, exactly. Why don't you write her a little note? What do you think? Yeah. So in September of 2007, Michelle pled guilty to second-degree murder and agreed to testify against Harrell. In exchange for that plea, she was sentenced to 25 years in prison, 15 for murder and 10 for endangering the welfare of a child, abandoning a corpse and tampering with evidence. Harrell's trial began in October of 2008. As I mentioned, his charges were upgraded

to first degree murder. The prosecution's case was very good. They had his own confession. Yeah. They had Michelle's testimony and they had Erica's autopsy, the forensic evidence. Worth noting, the forensic evidence doesn't match Michelle's account of the story. Erica wasn't kicked only one time and fell to her death. She was beat extensively. Her cause of death was listed as closed head injury. Basically, her brain bled until she died. The pathologist who did this autopsy, or perhaps a separate neurosurgeon, it's a little bit unclear, testified at trial that if Erica had received medical attention after she had gone unresponsive, that she likely would not have died.

Yeah. So the trial only lasted a couple days. There was a couple days of testimony. They presented all this information and the jury deliberated for three hours before finding Harrell Johnson guilty of first degree murder, endangering the welfare of a child and abusing a child. He was sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole. He was sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole. Harrell Johnson appealed his conviction. He said the state failed to prove premeditation. Specifically, the way the Missouri statute words it is deliberation.

They had to prove that he deliberated on the murder. And he says that didn't happen. But the fact that he inflicted the injury and then they chose not to get her medical attention and that directly resulted in her death, his appeal was denied. Yeah. In 2010, Erica's biological father, Larry Green, filed a lawsuit against the Oklahoma Department of Corrections. He said that they should have monitored Erica after she was born in their custody, essentially, that there should be better procedures in place for where the baby is placed and that at the very least the Department of Family Services should be alerted that a baby has been born in custody and then placed with someone other than the mother. I mean, yeah. Yeah.

I mean, I think that – Why wouldn't that at least be in a file somewhere? I read an article on this and it was like a little like quote from the spokesman of the Oklahoma Department of Corrections. And he legitimately said, we don't do shit. Like, we don't have time to do shit. Like, they can put the baby with whoever they want. It's not our job to alert DCF.

It's not our job to make sure anything. Wow. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. Cool. Yeah. The lawsuit was settled in 2013. The Department of Corrections, the Department of Human Services,

Family Services, whatever, and the University of Oklahoma Medical Center where Erica was born, all collectively agreed to, quote, adopt new procedures to ensure the babies born to mothers in prison will be referred to Department of Human Services to plan for safe placement of the newborn before the baby leaves the hospital. They also paid an undisclosed amount of monetary compensation to Larry Green, and the Department of Human Services said they would collectively refer to the new policies as Erica's rule.

Did they actually make those new policies? I have no idea. OK. I think that's probably just some PR stuff you say, right? I'm afraid so. Yeah. Hopefully not. Hopefully not.

And that's the story of Precious Doe. Oh, gosh. So I remember so clearly when this happened. I actually thought it happened earlier than 2001, so I guess I don't remember it that clear. I thought I was younger when she was discovered, but I don't remember anything about her being identified or any of that. It's just such a heartbreaking story. That poor little girl. Why do you think you don't remember much

about her being identified? I'm guessing probably didn't get that much news coverage. I don't know. My spidey senses are a tingling. What do you mean?

Well, I mean, I think under any normal circumstance, finally identifying a child that had been previously unidentified would be really a really big deal. But in this story, the only way to tell the story is to admit that the police fucked up big time.

Oh, yeah. So I'm kind of like. Oh, you're probably right. Yeah. Yeah. Is it any wonder that it wasn't massive news? Hmm. And maybe it was massive news and we're just not remembering it. And that's possible. It is possible.

You know what's also kind of funny about this case is like you said, okay, the area where her body was found. I thought, huh, like that seems like an odd place to leave a body. To me, just because that's a pretty – like obviously it's a very wooded area. Oh, yeah. But it's pretty heavily trafficked. Absolutely. There are all those soccer fields. Like there's – that's a heavily trafficked area.

But then to find out the people who did this were from out of town. Well, I mean, the body was discovered, like, less than 24 hours after it was dumped there. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. It makes sense that it's people from out of town who were like, yeah, nobody's ever going to find anything in these crazy woods here. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Well, that was horrible. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that was horrible. Yeah. It really was. It was a terrible case. Are you okay? It was really horrible research. I almost changed the case because I was, like, too far in.

Yeah. Yeah, it was a really tough one. Well, especially, like, London's two. Yeah. Yeah. This little girl was three. I just – I can't even imagine like that somebody could look at a three-year-old and do this to them. Yeah.

And then throw them away. Yeah. Ugh. Ugh. It's just heartbreaking to me. Yeah. Ugh. Ugh. It's just heartbreaking to me. Yeah. Yeah. It's really, I don't know, it's like,

yeah, there are going to be people, shitty people doing shitty things. Mm-hmm. But then for the powerful people to not do shit, I mean, they clearly didn't care too much. They will tell you that they cared a lot and that they did a lot of stuff. Well, of course they will. And that they followed up every lead.

Well, no, obviously they didn't. But they obviously didn't. If her grandfather called them 40 or 50 times, they obviously didn't. Yes. Yeah. I'm not saying that they didn't do shit but they didn't do everything in that same article where they're like oh he dropped the ball but you know what then we recovered it and ran in for a touchdown hee-haw um they also said you know we we were behind from the start of it

there were three murders in kansas city therecious Doe's body was found. And so we were just overwhelmed from the beginning. See, I get that. I do get that, too. You're making a face like you don't. I think it sounds like a bunch of excuses. Well, it is. Yeah.

It is. Gosh, I don't know. I don't know what to do with that. Yeah. Because I hear that and I'm like, okay, well, you got a bunch of murders. Yeah, you do. I mean, there's a lot to do there. I mean, the lead detective says there's not a day that this investigation went on that he didn't think about Precious Doe.

He thought of her like his grandchildren. That's all he thought of when he saw her is like, what if someone did this to my grandchildren? Which I completely get, too. But again, like not enough to follow up. Not enough to follow up on leads. What if Alonzo Washington hadn't taken Thurman seriously either? Well, no one would have identified her. And her parents would have gotten away with it.

And that'd be that. Yeah. Yeah, this would just be a much colder case. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What do you make of the lead detective, you know, talking about how much he cares? Do you think he really cares? I think he probably cares.

Yeah. I do. I think he probably cares. Yeah. I do. I think he probably cares. I think it would be impossible to take on, like, to be working this case and not care. Yeah. But I also think it's something you say when you've wrapped up a case and everybody's high-fiving all around that they finally identified this young girl. But it wasn't identified because of the work you did. Right.

She was identified in spite of the work you did. Right. It was that she was identified in spite of the work you did. Yeah. Fuck. Hmm. I don't know. I think sometimes you can have the passion, but just not be good at the job. I mean, that's very possible. Absolutely.

And I think there is something too, like, yes, if there's three homicides in a weekend and you've got, you know, the same amount of people, no matter how many homicides are, I guess I get being overwhelmed by the amount of work there is to do. Yeah. But damn, if identifying a three-year-old isn't at the top of that fucking list. Hmm. Oh, I hated this one. I know. Thanks a lot. You're welcome.

I've got a pretty bad one, too. Okay, great. Let's do an ad first. Let's do an ad. You want to tell us about another terrible case? Are you ready to be depressed? I'm already there. I'm like Lone Star.

Amazed by me? No. What? Already there. Oh. Take a look around. I'm the something on the something. I'm your imaginary friend. Imaginary friend? Yeah, I'm the whisper in the wind. I'm your imaginary friend. Imaginary friend?

Yeah, I'm the whisper in the wind. I'm your imaginary friend. Oh, okay. Great. Boy, it all makes sense now. Baby, I'm amazed by you. Alright, thank you to BenBenVeryBen and TheGraceKelly

of NotGivingAFuck for suggesting this case in the Discord. Excellent. They both did it. Wonderful. Full disclosure, been, been, very been. First. Oh.

First to the. Yeah. What are we saying here? First to the draw. Yeah, isn't that what you're saying? They didn't get in a duel, these two. Okay. To my knowledge.

Also, international case disclaimer. Oh. Shout outs to the documentary, Call Her Ganda. And also, Meredith Talson for her article, How the Killing of a Trans-Filipino Woman Ignited an International Incident for Vice. Oh, okay. Okay, so Meredith is featured very heavily in the documentary. She's done really important reporting on this story

and a big part of it is that she gets it. I mean, this is a story about a trans woman in the Philippines trying to make a life for herself

and Meredith is a trans woman who was born and raised in the Philippines. So, bada bing, bada boom. Also, she went to Harvard

which, as we all know, is the Simmons University of Cambridge. Of course. Good for her. We all know that. Also, I even wrote this in my notes. Also, this is a terribly sad story and I'm sorry. Should we have said that at the beginning of this whole fucking episode?

That should be the title for the episode. Yeah. Yeah. This is terribly sad and we're sorry. Yes! Yes! You know, we had fun with Dippin' Dots last week, didn't we? We did, and we're paying for it this week.

All right, picture it, Brandi. We're on Leyte, which is an island in the Philippines. And just like the story I told a few weeks ago about Nikki Kuhnhausen, Jennifer Laude never seemed to puzzle over her gender identity. She knew she was a girl from the jump. Okay, you're nodding. I guess I, like, had this idea about anyone who was trans that they had to go through this period of like, what? I'm so confused. But now both these stories I've covered, there's like no confusion. Maybe other people around them were confused, but they were not confused at all. Her mom, Julita, said that when Jennifer was little, she'd walk around going, I'm so pretty. I'm so pretty.

Oh my gosh. Isn't that so cute? That's so cute. Okay. I told you the thing I said to London the other day, right? Yeah. So I told London. I was like, you're so beautiful. And she said, yeah.

It honestly gets boring after a while. I just want to bottle that up and just save it for her for when the world is mean to her someday. Brandy, you're so beautiful. Thanks. No, you're supposed to say yeah. Yeah. Boy. Work on that, okay?

So when Jennifer grew up, Julita started calling her Ganda, which means beautiful. Oh, yeah. Jennifer's parents accepted her for who she was. Julita said, I knew she was a girl when I saw her with her sisters, and she didn't move like a boy, but I never scolded her. By the time she hit puberty, Jennifer started dressing like herself. She wore tight jeans. She wore blouses.

And in 2006, when she graduated high school, Jennifer moved to Olongapo, which is a city in the Philippines, like super far from her hometown and way more Americanized than other parts of the Philippines. So she went there to go to college, but she had a tough time finding a college that would let her take classes while simultaneously being herself. So most colleges wouldn't let her grow her hair long. They wouldn't let her dress like herself. I know. Brandy, the people can't see your face right now.

My face is like, ew. Yeah. I hate that. Yeah. What does it fucking matter? Exactly. Exactly. That's a stupid rule.

Are you listening, colleges? Yeah, colleges. So she found herself with limited options. But one thing Jennifer had going for her was that, much like myself, she was beauty pageant beautiful, Brandy. Obviously. Don't snort. She had that long, glossy hair. You know, the glossy hair.

Dramatic eye makeup. You could find her in a red satin gown. High heels. Blingy chandelier earrings. What year are we talking? Oh, gosh. I don't know when these pictures were from, but I think we're talking like 07, 08,

09, 10, 11. Chandelier earrings are very popular. Bottom line, what I'm trying to tell you, casual wear? We don't know her. Coincidentally. Around this time, money did start coming in. Jennifer's sister, Mary Lou, later said,

She started spending all night on the Internet and wouldn't go to her classes. I don't know what she was doing, but foreign men started to send her money. Old-timey OnlyFans? That's my guess. Yeah, right? Absolutely. Good for her. That's how I feel, too. God, take the

lonely heart's money, right? That's right. That money was badly needed. Trans women everywhere have limited economic opportunities, and that's definitely the case in the Philippines. In the documentary, they talked about how trans women are really only welcome in a few industries.

And I'm like using the word welcome super generously. A lot of trans women work in beauty salons or do what's called survival sex work. And Jennifer was no exception. I hate the sound of that. Yeah. Yeah, it's awful. Yeah. She got a job cleaning a beauty salon.

Her mom said that she cleaned the salon in exchange for food. Jennifer also did sex work, and it sounds absolutely terrifying. She and her friends knew that if they disclosed they were trans, they'd lose customers. And if they lost customers, they wouldn't survive. So they'd give blowjobs in a dark area or whatever and hope they could get their money without being found out.

Because obviously being found out could be really dangerous. But Jennifer had all these rules designed to increase her safety. Jennifer wouldn't go anywhere alone with a client. She'd always make sure there was a phone nearby. One of her friends always knew where she was. So Jennifer did some sex work and she had a group of close-knit friends in the trans community. And she continued working in the salon. And after a while, she met a British guy.

He was a customer in the salon, and he thought Jennifer was smoking hot. Well, it sounds like she was smoking hot. Yeah. Yeah. Did I mention the chandelier earrings? You did. I wore a ton of chandelier earrings. Well, I mean, I'm not –

Yeah, what's up with you? I did, like, chandelier earrings. Well, I mean, I'm not dances. Yeah, what's up with you? I did like chandelier earrings to the dances, but I'm not like that. You didn't do like a casual chandelier? No, I'm not a dangly. For daytime? I'm not a dangly earring person. You don't like the feel of a dangle up against your jaw? I don't.

No. Here's the thing is because I don't like to, this will surprise no one. I like to sleep in my earrings. So I can't be bothered to be taken out every night and putting them fucking back in the next day. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. To recap for any new listeners, which if this is your first episode.

Wow. Welcome to a rough one. You sleep in your makeup. You sleep in your makeup. You sleep in your earrings. Do you wear pajamas? Yeah. So you change into pajamas. I don't sleep in my jeans. Well, I think it's nuts

that you sleep with... And I think it's well established I don't sleep naked. God forbid! God forbid! Why do you sleep with your – don't you jab yourself? No, I get flatbacks. Just for that very purpose? Yeah, I actually don't have flatbacks, and right now I'm just discovering.

And no wonder I've been sleeping that well. Wait, flatbacks? Yeah, they're little screw-on backs that are flat so that it doesn't jab you. Like what's on my helix here. So see how it's like uh-huh yeah it's nice yeah but i mean so you like special order these specific earrings yes i can sleep in them but it's like so easy to just take them out before you go to bed. Trust me, I do it every night. Sounds terrible.

I don't want a 37-step process for me to be able to get in bed. You know what I like to do? Get in bed. I like to, you know, remove one piece of clothing at a time, immediately replace it with another piece of clothing. Yes. And then slide on in the covers. Okay.

Like, yeah, you think I'm taking my pants off, my shirt off, and then putting my pajamas on? You're sorely mistaken. Pants off, pajama pants on. Shirt off, pajama shirt on. For real? That's not a joke? No, I think that's really how I do it. I would never get fully nude and then put my pajamas on.

Absolutely not. Okay. You know, in some respects, we are very different people. I shit you not. Probably. Well, because I wear one outfit to walk the dogs you know do a little workout do whatever so I'm naked like quite a bit and I don't

do this like one item at a time I just fully stripped down so about I'm going to say two or three times a day Norman walks by the bedroom and goes today's and David's really missing out on life Norman walks by the bedroom and goes, today's.

And David's really missing out on life. Tell him to come over. It's like a show in Branson. Yeah. You know, it's like four times a day. We got the 1115. Three o'clock. Catch the matinee.

Get a funnel cake while you wait. It's 3 o'clock. Catch the matinee. Get a funnel cake while you wait. It's fine. So as I said, Jennifer met this British guy who was, like, quite taken with her, so he pursued her. That all made Jennifer a little uneasy. At some point she was like, hey, I'm trans. But he said no big deal. He wanted to be with her, which sounded awesome. But as it turned out, he wanted to be with her, but he didn't want to be in public with her.

And after a while, Jennifer was just like, you know what? I'm not a fucking secret. Yeah. Yeah. So she moved on. Her life got better. In 2007, she saved up enough money to get breast implants, which is what Dave Ramsey calls investing in yourself. Dave Ramsey, huge fan of breast implants.

Huge fan of breast implants. He advocates for an emergency fund, paying off your house, and pumping up those puppies as big as they'll go. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Hate that guy. Don't you think he's so arrogant? He's very arrogant.

Absolutely. So smug. Yeah. And not half as smart as he thinks he is. Not half. Didn't he fire a pregnant woman from his company? Maybe I ought to do a little story on him. I don't have the facts on that in front of me, ma'am.

Are you not as annoyed by Dave Ramsey as I am? I'm not a Dave Ramsey fan. I don't spend a lot of time thinking about Dave Ramsey. That makes one of us. You know what if it he seems like

the type that's like you know the reason that uh gin zeers or whatever can't afford houses millennials can't afford houses because they're buying

all that avocado toast and starbucks yeah i mean you just am i talking to dave ramsey right now i'm gonna call it because they're buying all that avocado toast and Starbucks. Yeah, I mean, you just... Am I talking to Dave Ramsey right now? I'm going to call it... We might have to cut this. But if one day it comes out that he's fathered a child out of his marriage,

I am fully not surprised. Not surprised at all. All right. Maybe it was that pregnant lady he fired. For real. It's like, can't have people finding out about this. Anyway, I'll look into that. Those are unfounded claims.

So thanks to that surgery, Jennifer brought in more income, and she sent a lot of it back home to her mom. In fact, she sent enough for her mom to add rooms to their very modest home. And I mean, it was a very, very modest home. She gave money to people in her old neighborhood when they were in need. That was really important to her. She told her mom, Mom, when I come home, they will not make fun of me and call me queer. I will have accomplished something. As she got more life experience, Jennifer came to realize that foreign, that chairs make noises when you shift in them. And so maybe you should

just sit still when you're recording a podcast. Quit shifting in your chair, Kristen. Sorry. Can't help it. As she got more life experience, Jennifer came to realize that foreign men were more likely to accept her as a woman. Whereas in the Philippines, people were more likely to see her as not a real woman. In fact, like – so in a few of these articles, the writer described that a lot of trans women in the Philippines will refer to themselves as not a real woman. So in November of 2012, Jennifer met a guy online.

His name was Mark Sesselbeck. He was from Germany. Sorry. I just can't imagine having to feel that way about your own identity. Yeah. That's terrible. Yeah, I mean, it'd be like you're kind of in no man's land in a sense. Yeah.

And, like, you have to apologize to everyone for existing. Yes. Oh, I hate that for her. She and Mark didn't exchange pictures at first. They just talked. But Mark must have enjoyed their conversations because after about 12 seconds, he was like, that's it. I want to fly out to the Philippines to meet you. I'm sorry.

Did you tell us where Mark is from? Germany. Okay. Sesselbeck. Sesselbeck. I thought that was his last name. It is. Oh. I was just saying.

That's true. You know, Sesselbeck, Germany. Duh. They have the best schnitzels. Sorry, that was stupid. Jennifer said, I know it maybe will prevent you ever to talk with me again, but I am what people call a ladyboy or she-male. But I'm a girl for those who see. Accept me as the girl I am or don't.

It's your choice. accept me as the girl I am or don't. It's your choice. But I am me and will be proud of who and what I am if I just find the right guy who shares it with me at my side. And she sent a picture of herself. And Mark said, okay, that's not a big deal to me. I want to pursue a relationship with you. So that Christmas he flew out to visit Jennifer.

And because this was basically an episode of 90 Day Fiance, he proposed like, bing, bang, boom. He did so on a stage in a mall in front of a shit ton of people to prove to her that he was not ashamed that she was a trans woman. Was the stage specifically arranged for this or was the stage already there? Surely it was there, right? I'm just asking. These are the things I want to know. It had to already be there. He didn't arrange for a stage to be erected for this proposal.

He just took advantage of a stage that was already set up for, you know, like a music performance. Maybe a choir was going to sing on it. Rumor has it Hanson was just getting ready to perform. I'm thinking of like a children's choir because it's around Christmas time. And they're like, we're grown men right now. He said, don't get offended, okay? He said, mm-bop, you're way on out of here. Wow.

And then they got really pissed. They were like, that's not our only hit. That's not our only song. Okay. We had a really good Christmas album. That's what we're here to perform with this little boys choir.

So there was, I knew there was a children's choir. We're both right. These claims are also unfounding. And Dave Ramsey was there. Which is weird. With his side chick.

My goodness. This was a big deal. They were going to get married. But TLC, the learning channel. Oh, I thought you meant. Tender Love and Care. And I thought you meant the singing channel. Oh, I thought you meant... Tender Love and Care. No, I thought you meant the singing group. Oh, no.

T-Buzz, Chili, and Left Eye. Can you imagine? Hanson, TLC, and a children's choir all team up on this small stage? I would be there. Everyone's got Dippin' Dots because it's a mall, too. Yeah. Okay, so no, TLC because 90 Day Fiancé. I get it.

Yeah. I'm trying to tell you what I've learned from TLC. Okay, sorry. You refused to watch 90 Day Fiancé. Can't do it. Brandy, I almost died watching that clip where that guy kept calling that girl lazy and wouldn't kiss her in public. Well, that was for cultural reasons. Him calling her lazy was because he's a douchebag.

Oh, okay. 90 Day Fiance is a very special program. Brandy. It's a very cringy program. Oh, absolutely. Can't handle it. There's a man on there from Kansas City right now. I know.

I hate him with a fiery passion. Anyway, we have no time. So TLC has taught us that it's tough to get married when you're from different countries. Over the next two years, there was a ton of paperwork trying to get everything ready for Jennifer to move to Germany to live with Mark. In Susselbeck. He had the cutest little place in Susselbeck. Germany initially said nine to her visa. But Mark and Jennifer appealed the decision.

And on October 1, 2014, Jennifer's visa was approved. I don't know what the German word for yes is. You couldn't look up yes? Listen, when I wrote that joke, I was like, there's no way I'm going to actually. There are lots of jokes that I put in that I'm like, you know what? You just skip right over it. You know what? That was my idea at the time. I don't have the nuts now.

So they set a date to be married. Jennifer got her wedding dress. And 10 days later, everything changed. It was a Saturday night. Jennifer and her friends were at the Ambien's bar. A-M-B-Y-A-N-n-z no don't approve nine there's a lot of purple lighting in this place oh is it like the purple smoke no previous well i mean yes yes actually it's kind of just douchey and gross and kind of like oh oh, gosh, I would hate for anyone to really turn the lights on in this place.

Yeah. This bar was full of American servicemen. Side note, the Philippines is full of American troops. And the Filipinos, they don't love it. Can't imagine why. But join me, won't you, in my history corner? So the Philippines gained independence from the United States in 1946. But as part of that agreement, they had to agree that the U.S. could keep military bases in the Philippines, which, boy, doesn't that sound like independence?

Yeah. All right. So there are all these servicemen and women who are in the Philippines, and that's a sore spot for a lot of locals for a lot of reasons. And here's one of the reasons. Under the Visiting Forces Agreement, if a member of the American military breaks the law in the Philippines, the U.S. government basically gets to handle that. What the fuck? U.S. government basically gets to handle that. What the fuck? Yeah, the U.S. gets exclusive jurisdiction over U.S. personnel with respect to non-service related offenses. The Philippine government can technically bring charges against a U.S. service person. They can technically bring that person to trial. But according to the Visiting Forces Agreement, if those judicial proceedings are not completed within one year, then that service person is basically off the hook for whatever they did or did not do. Holy shit.

Holy shit. Right? So that's just a fun fact. Stick that in your back pocket and now get out of my history corner. Back to October 11, 2014. Jennifer was at the Ambiance Club with her friends. She'd already had three clients that night. She and her friends worked very hard when the American service people were given time off. It's like you in prom season.

I'm sorry. I meant because you do so much hair in prom season. I wasn't sure what you meant, and it sounded rude. You're definitely not giving handies to high schoolers. That's what it sounds like. I'm like out back of a prom giving out handies with both hands. Do the guys get a discount when they go two for one? No, because this doesn't happen. All right.

Well, you know, you run your business however you want to. Who am I to tell you? In walked private first class Joseph Scott Pemberton. Joseph was 19. He was a Marine. He was also a former professional boxer. Former? Right?

At 19? Yes! How are you a former professional anything at 19? Also, I call bullshit because he did not have cauliflower ear. Don't you think if you're a former pro, you got to have... I mean, okay, but at 19, you couldn't have been a pro for that long, so. How long does it take to get cauliflower ear? I think you've got to get hit a few times to get cauliflower ear. Well, sure, but I mean, come on. These are the things I expect you to know. I'm sorry I don't know this one.

Damn. All right. What I do know is that cauliflower ear makes the ear really rigid and immobile, and it's really hard to cut around. How does that affect your prom season? No. That was a really good one, Christian. he was from new bedford massachusetts so we got a mass hole on our hands sorry i'm sorry you know this story is so awful i'm getting my chuckles where i can yeah like it's fun to think of you jerking off high schoolers.

That's not fun. That's inappropriate. Yeah, you should stop. And would make me a sex offender. Well, Brandi, since you've done it, you should stop. Okay? And we won't talk about it anymore. Now, I have with me some photos of high schoolers.

I want you to write an apology on the back of these photos. Oh, Patty, we're probably going to have to cut that. He and three of his buddies, Bennett Dahl, Jaron Rose, and Daniel Pulido, were pumped because they were out on their first night of liberty. In other words, their ship had docked, they had a curfew, but they had several hours to go out and enjoy themselves. So they'd gone shopping, they'd gone to lunch, and at some point ended up at ambiance. Joseph wasn't there long when he noticed Jennifer. And Jennifer was a business cat, so pretty quickly she made arrangements. Surveillance cameras showed them leaving the club together.

They went across the street to the Cell Zone Lodge, which is like the grimmest motel I've ever seen. But, you know, it was close, and one has to assume cheap. Yeah. God. Anyway, Jennifer had her friend Barbie Galviero come along with her for safety. Again, she always wanted a friend to know where she was.

So Joseph and Jennifer rented a room, and Barbie went in with them to negotiate a rate. Jennifer asked for 5,000 pesos, but Joseph held firm at 1,000. What's the exchange? So that's about $25. Oh, fuck off. Yeah. At this point, I'd like to formally invite him to eat a dick. I await his reply.

Jennifer agreed to the price, and Barbie left the room. And about 30 minutes later, Joseph left the room, leaving the door ajar behind him. At this point, his three friends were looking for him. They couldn't find him anywhere. Finally, they took a cab back to the ship and missed curfew by about 10 minutes. So they got chewed out.

And in the middle of that lecture, Joseph showed up. so the dudes were all like ah we're only late because we were looking for each other leave no man behind semper fi semper fi tattoo on his left arm you know that song i do i do know that song. I kind of like that song, actually. So they were let back on the ship, and at some point that evening, Joseph went up to one of his buddies, Jaron Rose, and asked to speak to him privately. He told Jaron he'd met two women at the nightclub and gone to a motel with them. After one left, the other stayed behind. He said he saw it had a dick. He said he got so angry that he choked it from behind. And afterward,

he dragged it into the bathroom. Oh my God. Oh, my God. Jaron thought Joseph was joking, but he wasn't. Joseph said, I think I killed a he-she. Oh, my God. Meanwhile, back at the hotel, the receptionist was expecting Jennifer to come downstairs. And when she didn't, he entered the room and found her dead in the bathroom. She was wrapped in a blanket, and her head was face down in the toilet.

Oh, my gosh. She had been choked and drowned in the toilet. the receptionist called the police and they arrived followed very shortly by the ncis which is more than just a tv show apparently it's a real real thing the medical report showed that jennifer died of asphyxia due to strangulation and drowning her back was black and blue with bruises oh my gosh so this was horrible but it wasn't difficult to figure out who'd killed jennifer she and joseph were seen on surveillance footage leaving the club together the receptionist at the hotel had seen them both and jennifer's friend barbie picked jose Joseph out of a photo lineup. And also he confessed to his friend. Now, okay, calm down because I can tell you're worried about what's going to happen

to Joseph. I'm not at all. I'm actually more worried about that fun history corner you did for us. Don't worry. It'll protect him. That's my concern. Yeah. So he got a lot of protection thanks to the Visiting Forces Agreement. He also got a lot of protection thanks to sexism and transphobia and white privilege and the natural superiority of America. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

of Murca. The United States exercised their right to keep Joseph on the ship, away from any Filipino police who might want to ask him pesky questions about the woman he'd probably for sure just murdered. Not that Philippine officials were, like, trying super hard to get him. Philippine officials were, like, trying super hard to get him. A trans woman was dead, and she'd been murdered by a white American Marine. I think they kind of knew what they were up against. But Jennifer's family wasn't having it.

Her mom, Julita, rode a bus for 24 hours to get to the city. She was terrified that the person who murdered her daughter so brutally would walk free. So she went outside the military base where media crews had gathered to report on the story. Actually, I don't know that this was a base. There was a ship in the background. Tears ran down her face and she screamed, how could this happen? How dare you? My poor child.

She couldn't fight back. This story struck a chord with a lot of Filipinos. It was bullshit that these American servicemen could come over, commit terrible crimes and not be held accountable. Yes. Attorneys Virgie Suarez and Harry Roque saw what was going on and they were like, oh, hell no. So they offered their services to Jennifer's family pro bono. Both Virgie and Harry were very strongly opposed to the American military presence in the Philippines. Virgie said that the Visiting Forces Agreement is particularly egregious because it, quote, treats Filipinos as second-class citizens in our own country.

She told the media, this is not an isolated case. In fact, in Olongapo, there's never been a single case where an American soldier is punished for committing a crime. The stack is high. The pile of cases in Olongapo that go nowhere is high. Sixteen-year-olds, six-year-olds, six-month-olds, all were raped, killed, but not a single American soldier was ever punished. Attorney Harry Roach asked the media, what kind of a self-respecting country can we be if we cannot even implement our laws

when they are breached in our territory and when a victim is a Filipino? You okay? Yeah. I mean, yes. Yeah, it's awful. It's awful. Yeah, America would not put up with this shit.

No! This story really brought people together. People who wouldn't normally find themselves advocating for the rights of a trans person were suddenly marching the streets, holding up signs. Because Jennifer Laude's murder wasn't just a story of transphobia. It was a story about the power imbalance between American military members and Filipinos in their own country. So Jennifer's story was getting media coverage, which was important. But some of the descriptions of Jennifer and her identity were infuriating.

I can only imagine. Yeah. So it's very common for trans murder victims to be dead named in initial reports of their death. But she was dead named in initial coverage as well as later coverage. I also noticed some of them did a thing where, like, they used her dead name like a middle name. It's like, well, that's not really how that works. That's not how that works at all. Shortly after she was killed, one newscaster told the story this way. Witnesses said a white man with a marine haircut met, dead name, who was dressed as a woman at a nightclub. No.

Yeah, that really mischaracterizes. Absolutely. What happened. Jennifer's fiance, Mark, was devastated by her murder. He was surprised to hear that she'd been doing sex work, but he was very clear that he did not judge her. He said, whatever she did to end up there, it has nothing to do with what happened inside. Simply nothing. Yeah. He also told the reporter Meredith Telson that he suspected she'd engaged in sex work, even though at the time she didn't have to. I mean, he was sending her money.

He thought maybe it was because she was insecure about her womanhood. And he said he felt like maybe she couldn't believe that her life was really about to work out. That's probably exactly it. Yeah. Yeah. This all seemed too good to be true to her. Yeah. This all seemed too good to be true to her.

Yeah. Within about a week of Jennifer's murder, Mark arrived in the Philippines to help her family advocate for her. By that point, Jennifer's sister, Mary Lou, had already filed a murder complaint against Joseph Pemberton. That's a thing you have to do? Okay, yeah. So that I was like, what the hell? She did that because it was pretty clear that the Philippines government wasn't doing anything to build a case against Joseph. So it seemed that a civil case was their best bet. Okay. Which, I mean, look, I know this justice

system about as well as I do the American justice system. So we're all in good hands here. But it seemed like they then had their own attorneys who worked with the prosecution and kind of kept the prosecution honest. Also, they're working against a timer, essentially. And so basically coming at it from all angles is probably the best case scenario. Exactly. Yeah. So they fought for justice, and in the meantime, the defense played a little game called Stall Tactics. This is a super fun game, and it's really easy. You just do everything in your power to make sure a murderer doesn't get punished for his hate crime, and afterward, you see if you can sleep at night. Yeah, fun.

You like it, do you? No. I know how you like a good game. That's not that's not the game for me. So here's how that played out. The Department of Foreign Affairs delivered a subpoena to get Joseph's stupid ass in court. That's what it said on the document. OK, you don't make these things up. No. And on October 21st, there was a hearing about the case, and Joseph didn't show up. His lawyer did, though. And his lawyer was like, oh, oh my, what? No, the subpoena didn't mean he was supposed to show up to this, did it? What a crazy mix-up.

I guess I got a case of the Mondays. And you know what? I don't even know that it was a Monday. The family's legal team was like, yeah, cute story. Just so you know, we will sue the government for not compelling him to appear. They were incredibly frustrated. The next day, Jennifer's family caught wind that Joseph had been secretly transferred to the military base Camp Aguinaldo, where he was sitting in the air conditioning and being watched over by American guards. They were pissed. So her fiancé, Mark, and her sister, Mary Lou, went to Camp Aguinaldo, and they were like, look, if this motherfucker won't come to us, we'll come to him.

Again, verbatim. So, OK, if this motherfucker won't come to us, we'll come to him again verbatim. So, okay, this part is real. They scaled the fence of the military base and they were like, where is he? Where is he? And of course, these military officers were like, you can't be here. All right. Okay. So the next part, it's really bad. If you're sensitive, just skip ahead 30 seconds. Brandy, Mark shoved one of the officers. It was a terrible shove. Yeah.

Twas the shove heard round the world. Brandy, he shoved a man. Can you imagine? I can't. We're not sure if the man fell to his feet. Fell to his feet?

It could happen. What am I trying to say? Dropped to his knees? Maybe I was trying to say fell to his feet. What happened is he was levitating prior to the shove. Yeah. And it broke his concentration.

Yeah, which is rude when someone's levitating. Fell to his feet. Fell to his feet. He was steady on his feet. But still, he did fall because of the shove. Yeah. Can't shove people, Brandy. All right?

You just can't. It was truly unforgivable. Mark, I think you can agree, needed to be punished. So he was deported and put on a travel blacklist. He can't go back to the Philippines. Holy shit. Yeah, he had wanted to go back for their wedding day, but, yeah, he can't because of the high crime of shoving someone. Mark said, they're banning me from the Philippines for disrespect and gross arrogance. Yet they're

protecting the man who murdered my wife just because he's American. Yeah. In late October, there was another hearing and Joseph didn't show. Jennifer's family's legal team asked the Supreme Court to intervene and the court was like, no, thank you. Cool. Finally, in mid-December, Joseph Scott Pemberton was charged with the murder of Jennifer Laude. The documentary did educate me that in the Philippines, there's basically murder and homicide. They don't do degrees or manslaughter. It's just murder or homicide. And Joseph was charged with murder because of a few qualifying circumstances,

including abuse of superior strength and cruelty, which I'm sorry seems pretty easy to prove. Yeah. More on that later. The important thing is that when he was charged, we were given the gift of Joseph's mugshot. For his mugshot, Joseph wore what I would describe as an Easter suit. And he smirked in the photo. Easter suit, light colored linen suit? light colored linen suit?

Yeah. So it was like a light gray with kind of a nice tie kind of purples in it. You know me. I want to hate everything about this guy. I didn't hate the suit. I hate to admit it. I didn't hate the suit. Also, you should know I rarely make a comment about a person's looks. It just simply never happens.

Never. Uh-uh. But you should know that Joseph has... Blue head. Thumb guy. Thumb guy. Yeah, the guy's head looked like a thumb. You can't expect me not to say that. It's funny.

Is it all about the head shapes? Because I'm about to say some things about this guy's head shape. You're very focused on head shape. I'm like a racist doctor from the 1920s. No, no. First of all, slow down. We're not even we're not there yet. Sorry. He has a hide and seek chin. It looks like it's there from the front. But you turn that boy and she's gone. Also, he has this super oddly shaped head. And, okay, I'm going to have you look at the picture in a minute. I submit that whoever gave him his fade had no idea what to do with his head shape. I'll be the judge of that.

Okay. It's flat on top, bulbous in the back. Okay. The dude really only has one good side and it's facing you straight on. You catch him from the side. You think you're looking at a chinless alien. Are you going to show me the picture? Am I Googling something? Well, yeah.

You're going to have to Google it. Oh, I'm sorry. Okay. Excuse me. Joseph Scott Pemberton. And don't read any. I won't. Oh, they're not showing the side ones. Scott Pemberton. And don't read any... I won't!

Oh, they're not showing the side ones. Yeah, where's the side one? Oh, here. I got a... He does... He... I mean... Hang on. Hang on. You're not seeing the... Okay. Alright. Look at this.

Look at that here. Yeah. So, it's not a great fade. Look at this. Look at that hair. Yeah. So it's not a great fade. It's not. Also, he does have an interesting shaped head, but you know what? What? David and London both have that exact same head shape. No, they do not.

Yes, they do. No, they don't. Yeah, just look at it here with a different haircut. Here. Here he has, this is like his boot camp photo. Oh, well, it looks totally normal. Exactly. I'm telling you, it's the fade.

It's the fade. It's the fade. All right. Yeah, this is exactly how David and London set it. Okay, well, if you're ever mad at David. I can fuck him up with one bad fade. That's right. It's over for him.

That's right. It's over for him. Yeah, David and I got Casper tattoos because London's head looks exactly like Casper's head. Oh, that's cute. On her sonogram. So they took his little Sears portraits. But don't worry, he was not headed to a jail in the Philippines. The U.S. military retained custody of their precious baby boy. And they did everything in their power to retain custody.

I think I already said that. They took custody. They retained custody. They wanted to continue retaining custody. Yes, absolutely. They built a retaining wall. They retained custody. They retained custody. They wanted to continue retaining custody. Yes, absolutely. They built a retaining wall. They retained custody. This next part is just a series of postponements and semi-boring legal motions without a single motion of the ocean joke.

Is it? Yeah, it's motion of the ocean. I thought it was motion in the ocean. I'm not real confident in my words today. It's motion of the ocean i thought it was motion in the ocean i'm not real confident in my words today motion of the ocean yeah yeah it makes sense not the size of the boat that matters kristin it's the motion of the ocean thank you i've learned a lot today so an example at one one point, the prosecution— If it was motion in the ocean, that'd be like your vagina was the ocean.

No. Yeah. Motion in the ocean would mean that your vagina is the ocean. No. That doesn't make any sense. You know what whales say to each other? You're a— Motion in the ocean.

No. Yeah, because they're in the ocean. I thought the whales were going to say you're a vagina or something. Why would they say that to me? Oh, wait. Now they're talking to each other. Excuse me. So confused. It's such a complex story. So many characters.

So much going on. Anyway. Are you making whale sounds now? Yeah, that's whale for Eurovagina. That's just a fact, Brandi. Okay. Okay. All right.

So the prosecution tried to get the judge to recuse herself from the case. They were like, ah, you went to law school with one of the defense attorneys. You two are best friends. We can see your BFF necklaces from here. But the defense was like, so what? The judge's husband was a classmate of the lead prosecutor. So it's a small world after all. So it's a small world after all. Did you not like my singing or the whale? All of it. The whole thing.

The whole enchilada. Hated it all. So the judge stayed on. I mention this mostly because in this case, and I assume in all cases, it's not a jury trial. Yeah. It's the judge. So this thing started and stopped, started and stopped. At one point, the defense asked to suspend the proceedings for 60 days and the judge granted the motion because, you know, what's the rush? Am I right? Okay, great. Granted the motion of the ocean.

So where are we at on our one year timeline here? You know, everyone's so busy these days. It's rush, rush, rush, go, go, go. I say, why don't you just kick back? No, because we have a one-year time limit here, or this guy is off scot-free. So, like, let's get it going. You know, as a wise whale once said, you are a vagina. And let's talk about that for a while, shall we? No!

It got to a point that Jennifer's mom, Julita, stood outside the court with her lawyers. Rain pouring down, one of the lawyers held up a megaphone, and Julita cried and screamed at the court building. I want to know, why are the hearings always postponed? We don't get answers. How long do we have to wait? Nothing will change if this goes on. Do we not deserve help just because we're not white or American? What about poor people?

It's okay to kill us? Jennifer won't be the last one killed. Another Jennifer is waiting to happen. I will not allow this to happen. Please listen to me. Oh my gosh. Jennifer's family didn't have power or money on their side, but they had people on their side. People marched the streets carrying signs that read, justice for Jennifer, Justice for the Filipino People. They protested the U.S. presence in the Philippines with signs like,

Obama, not welcome. Which seems kind of polite. Very polite. Like the politest way to say that. You know what? You are not welcome. They had chants. U.S. imperialist. Number one terrorist.

That's pretty good. Pretty good? Brandi, we had a whole war on terror, so they've obviously got it wrong. Don't they know we won the war on terror? Oh, okay. Also, they burned a big paper Michelle Obama, which I think was just anti-American and not racist, but I cannot be sure. Yeah. Seemed racist to me.

They held signs with Joseph's stupid mugshot on them with bars over the top. Signs read, Jail Pemberton, and this guy has a hide-and-seek chin. They didn't say that. They did. Mm-mm. Yeah. No. Yeah.

Now, granted, it didn't all fit on one sign. By this point, Jennifer's family was becoming well-known and loved. But one way to get people not so well-loved is to imply that they don't really care about what they're fighting for. Joseph's defense team told the media that Jennifer's family was considering dropping the case in exchange for six U.S. visas and 38 million pesos. It wasn't true, but it definitely cast doubts on her family's intentions. And it embarrassed them and angered them. Which I always get fired up about this.

I really don't think there's anything wrong with victims or victims' families taking money when they've been wronged. No. What's so wrong about that? Yeah. I get that you want justice. But money can be a form of justice. Absolutely. Now, also, you want him locked up. Of course. Anyway, here we go. By this point, parts of the trial had already begun, but the public wasn't

allowed to attend it and neither was the media. So everything that we know about what happened in court comes from what the prosecution and defense told the media afterward. Everything that we know about what happened in court comes from what the prosecution and defense told the media afterward. So take that for what it's worth. Jennifer's friend Barbie was one of the first prosecution witnesses. She identified Joseph and said that he was the one she'd left Jennifer with in the motel room. The doctor who performed the autopsy on Jennifer talked about her manner of death.

Joseph's former buddy, Jaron Rose, testified that Joseph had confessed to him about choking Jennifer. Three other Marines also testified against Joseph. Two American forensic experts testified that Joseph's fingerprints were on one of the three condoms and a condom wrapper in the motel room. When it was time for the defense to present their case, they kicked things off with Joseph's mom. In court, she basically said, He's a darling boy. He'd never do anything like this.

Yeah. I mean, that's exactly. I mean, what do you expect someone's mom to say? She also did an interview with the media, which was really interesting to watch. It was very clear she was super sad, not super concerned with like what her son did. She said that her son has no animosity toward LGBT people. And that's because his sister is gay. OK. Bing, bang, boom. people and that's because his sister is gay okay bing bang boom takes the is like this what that's like saying i'm not racist some of my best friends are black

yeah like after you've done something see i think it's more like because usually when people say that i'm like you don't have a black friend what i think about is like you know when a man is like saying he can't be sexist because his mom's a woman. It's like, well, then there would probably be no sex as a buddy. Anyway. Okay. But yeah, at the time of this interview, Joseph's sister Destiny was getting married in a month

and he was supposed to be the best man. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, so he couldn't possibly have committed a hate crime. I mean, he drowned a trans woman in a toilet, but he was going to be the best man in his sister's wedding, so. Okay. About Jennifer's family, Lisa said, I feel very sorry for their loss and what they've had to go through.

Mm-hmm. They didn't have to go through anything. No. Like your son chose to do what he did. Yeah. And that's why they're going through what they're going through. Yes. Your son took their daughter from them. Yeah.

In a horrible way. Yeah. Thank you for bumping the table. My water bottle is very riled up about this case. I don't blame you. It's terrible. That was me talking to your water bottle. I know.

I got it. Joseph took the stand in his own defense. He said that thinking they were cisgender women, I mean, these are obviously my words, not his. He agreed to pay for sex and they went to a motel. He said Barbie performed oral sex on him and left the room. And a few minutes later, Jennifer performed oral sex on him. When he wanted more, he learned that Jennifer was trans. That revelation made him feel like

he was being raped. He acted in defense of his life and his honor when he choked Jennifer. Are you fucking kidding me? Fucking wish. Twas trans panic, which is evidently an international epidemic. Okay. An expert for the defense testified that the water found in Jennifer's lungs might not have been from being drowned in the toilet. She could have had a medical condition. No. Are you kidding me?

Also, someone else could have come into that room and murdered Jennifer after Joseph choked her. You went back on your ship and told someone you had done this. Yeah. Also, how stupid do we have to be to believe you admitted you choked her. You admitted you left her in the bathroom. Now you're saying you left the door ajar and someone, some murderer who was just so happy to find someone happened to go in there and find her and kill her. And this all happened in a very short time span. Wow. Yeah, super believable.

Ultimately, on December 1st, 2015, the judge found Joseph guilty of homicide, not murder. The judge decided that the fact that Jennifer didn't reveal she was trans was a mitigating circumstance. Joseph had acted out of passion. She sentenced him to 6 to 12 years. She sentenced him to six to 12 years. It wasn't a full victory, but it was something. Julita said, our efforts did not go to waste. He's going to jail.

My child's life did not go to waste. He's not getting away with it. So he was sentenced, but Joseph didn't leave the courtroom. An hour passed. It was a standoff. He was supposed to be taken to a prison in the Philippines, but the U.S. wouldn't allow it. They stayed there like this for three hours. He was literally standing in the center of two circles. The inner circle was American officers. The outer circle was Filipino officers. Oh, my gosh.

The defense threw a fit. They were like, we can't just let him go to prison, not here. And so the judge ruled to delay Joseph's imprisonment until further notice. Joseph's imprisonment until further notice. Later, the DOJ announced that he'd be taken back to Camp Aguinaldo, the military base, and he'd wait there until his appeal was decided. The Lotte family lawyer, Fergie, said, The fact that they are still refusing to surrender Pemberton to our Filipino police is total disrespect to the entire Filipino nation and our judiciary and legal system. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. It's a giant fuck you. Yeah.

By the time of the appeal, things were really tense. Locals were getting mad at Jennifer's family. And that's because because of this crime and the reaction to it, U.S. troops had their liberty privileges suspended, which meant that the money they would have spent in the Philippines wasn't being spent. So local people were suffering economically. Joseph ended up losing his appeal, but he got his sentence reduced. His maximum sentence would now be 10 years, not 12. But this case remained a big issue between the U.S. and the Philippines. And around this time, the Philippines got a new president. He was really refreshing because he said whatever the fuck and he did whatever the fuck. His name was Rodrigo Duterte. and he said ridiculous things on the campaign trail.

But it was all in good fun. He for sure didn't mean any of it. Brandy, would you like to hear a hilarious rape joke that he made on the campaign trail? What? Oh, calm down. It's just locker room talk. Okay, get this. It's a really cute story. You're going to laugh. One time when he was mayor, a woman was famously raped and killed.

And when he was asked about that on the campaign trail, he said, I was angry because she was raped. That's one thing. But she was so beautiful. The mayor should have been first. What a waste. Oh my gosh! Yeah. He's also super anti-drug, not a fan of drugs,

and you know the best way to stop a drug problem? What do you think it is? I don't know. Kill the drug addicts. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, that takes care of it.

Here's a real quote. You ready? Hitler massacred three million Jews. There's three million drug addicts. There are. I'd be happy to slaughter them.

Holy shit. Some people probably thought he was just kidding. He wasn't. I will now read to you from an article in Human Rights Watch. According to the Philippine Drug Enforcement Agency, 4,948 suspected drug users and dealers died during police operations from July 1, 2016 to September 30, 2018. But this does not include the thousands of others killed by unidentified gunmen. According to the Philippine National Police, 22,983 such deaths since the war on drugs began are classified as homicides under investigation. Oh my gosh. Yeah.

This new president was also anti-media, probably on account of all the fake news. He said to one reporter, just because you're a journalist, you are not exempted from assassination if you're a son of a bitch. Oh, my gosh. Rodrigo made some bold declarations and promises. He told America to prepare to leave the Philippines.

He told Jennifer's family that he was on their side. But he wasn't super loyal. He met Donald Trump and appeared to be quite taken by the Donald. I was going to say there's a lot of similarities. Grabbing people by the pussy. Hey, locker room talk. This is horrifying. Duterte sang a song to Trump.

Like, so Trump... I'm sorry. They showed part of it in the documentary and then I was like, I've got to see the full clip. I couldn't watch the full clip. It was too much. It was a duet that he sang.

This man is not a good singer. And again, it's a love song. It contained the lyrics, you are the light in my world, a half of this heart of mine. He sang that to Trump? Yes. Okay. Human Rights Watch called it an atrocity. Later, when asked about it, Rodrigo claimed that he'd sung the song, quote, on the orders of Donald Trump.

I mean, that's so wacky, it might be true. I know. It's like, just when you think it can't get weirder. Yeah. Like, I mean, that's the thing is I would believe either way. Yeah, so would I. I believe that he got up there. He did that. He was horribly embarrassed because it was terrible.

And then he tried to pin it on someone else. But I'd also believe that Donald Trump would be like, why don't you sing me a song? Sing me a little tune. Oh, my God. What? Okay. So we've said some bad stuff about Rodrigo Duterte, but he has a lot of supporters, including the Lotte family's former attorney, Harry Roque. Harry took a job as the president's spokesman.

Could you hear that? Yeah, what was that? That was my butt. You're just farting while you're talking now? No, no. I don't think it escaped. I think it's just backed up. It's like an internal bubble.

Yeah. Like, she's coming around the bend. That was at a very key part of this story. Let's see. Where should I back up to? Probably a toilet. I mean,

you're not wrong. You know, we'd save time if we podcasted from toilets turn the fan on if you're hot can you tell that i'm hot yeah you keep doing this are you not hot i'm not at all please turn the fan on maybe it's because i'm about to shit my pants Are you not hot? I'm not at all. Please turn the fan off. Maybe it's because I'm about to shit my pants. Oh, my God.

Oh, hell, it's broken. Oh, my God. Okay, we've got the fan on. I'm not backed up to a toilet. Seriously, I'm sitting here thinking, I've got to wash this bra after this. You're really not sweating? Not at all. Oh, my God.

Well, there's no saving this. You know what's the worst? Is when, like, something embarrassing happens and I'm like, well, we'll cut that, obviously. But then all this extra stuff happens and it's like, well, it won't really make sense if we cut it. Anyway. I'm the tattooed one, just in case anyone ever meets us in person. That's how you'll know me. The tattooed one who's full of farts.

Okay, so anyway. Anyway. Harry had been the family's attorney. Correct. Oh, thank you. But now he was the spokesman for the president. Oh, jeez. So on September 7th, 2020, when the president granted Joseph Scott Pemberton an absolute pardon. Holy shit.

The announcement was made by Harry Roque. So Joseph Pemberton went back to the United States, presumably to live a normal life. Jennifer's family and friends were devastated. Virgie Suarez stayed on as the family's attorney. And she called the pardon, quote, a travesty of Philippine sovereignty and democracy and another hallmark of Philippine's subservience to the U.S. And that's the story of the murder of Jennifer Lade. My gosh. Yeah. That is devastating. Yeah, it's horrible. It's also horrible that my body rebelled at the end of that story. Really apologize.

Basically, like, I farted a party. It's like we're all in this together and then all of a sudden... Anyway, again, tattooed one. Stop it! Let's do an ad, shall we? Why are you laughing? If you were a good friend,

you would hang your head in shame and pretend it never happened. Oh, man. You know, some podcasts are classy operations. Not this one. Should we take some questions from our Discord? Oh, I suppose we should. How do you get in the Discord?

Well, it's not by farting in the middle of an important story, I'll tell you that much. You do it by joining our Patreon at the $5 level or higher. Ooh. Lisa Loves LGTC wants to know, Would I rather read a book by Brandy or get my hair cut by Kristen? Oh, Lord. I don't think you'd want your hair cut by me. I don't think you want to read a book by me.

Either way, we predict you'd be very unhappy. Yes. Poopcorn Salad says, just went buck wild and dyed my natural hair for the first time. And she shared a picture. It's a lovely red color. Oh, that looks nice. Very good. Brandy, how long should I wait to wash my hair for the first time since dying?

Any tips for red hair? Figured I'd ask an expert. Well, if you don't hear this until next week, it's going to be too late to tell you, but you don't have to wait the whole week to wash your hair. How long would you wait? Okay, you can wash it immediately. Your color will stay better if you don't wash your hair that often, though. There's no reason you can't immediately wash your hair. It's not going to have an adverse effect on the color.

It's just the more you wash your hair, the more the color fades. And so I don't, in general, don't recommend washing your hair every more than every two or three days. Okay. Patty, please cut where that gross throat

thing she did because I don't want to hear someone's bodily functions. I think I speak for all of us. Also, if you rinse it with cooler water, that'll help your color stay longer, too. But then you'll have a miserable time in the shower. It sounds terrible. I don't do that. No.

That's one of those tips you used to always read in a magazine. It's like, well, there are certain tips I'm just not going to do. I'm just never going to do that. Okay, this is kind of along the same lines. Towers Go Pong says, as a person who has set the washing machine moments before getting in the shower multiple times this week, what are the pros and cons to a cold shower? It's miserable. Don't do it.

The pros are that your hair color will last longer and that's about it okay you know what i think it is you know how sometimes like people will assign like virtue oh yeah things yes yeah i've i've seen that in regard to taking a cold shower yeah it's one of the hard 75 things isn't it gross i bet it is I bet it is. I think it is. Oh, fuck. No, thank you. I don't want to take a fucking cold shower. I take, like, the hottest hot shower. Yeah. I like it. That's why

you are the way you are. I like it all steamed up. I want it to be so... I just like to be, ugh, scalded. Yes! Ugh. No. No, thank you. Doppenditz wants to know, in the case about the disappearance of Taylor Bell, there was a friend named Glenys. Is that name better or worse than Robertina?

Better. Yeah, I think it's better, too. Yeah. Robertina is just terrible. It's not a good name. Glenys isn't a good name. And also – Glennis isn't a great name. No.

No. But here's the thing. You can shorten Glennis. You can just be Glenn. Yeah. What are you going to go by? Robert. Rob.

Bobby. Tina. Can you do it with the last part of your name? Bertie. Bertie. That's what I'd go by if my name was robertina i'd go by birdie how how do you make the middle of it bird tina oh no just start over with a whole new name

oh that's a good question comrade krist. Did I say it? Is that right? Yeah, you finally said it right. Comrade Kristen says, what's the snack you pound while making dinner and then are two-fold eat? If my dinner has cheese in it, you better believe I'm taking little pinchies of shredded cheese the whole time I'm making dinner. Yeah. Yeah. Honestly, it's one of the reasons why I kind of tend to do more meal preppy stuff. Because I just, I can't like cook.

Yeah. And not eat as I'm cooking. Also, I made spaghetti for dinner the other night. And like, oh, is the sauce ready? Let me taste it. That tasted pretty good. Let me check it again in two minutes. Oh.

Mmm. That sauce tastes pretty good probably needs another two minutes we all know your game skydiving dipshit asks brandy okay maybe tough or too personal but i'm trying to have a family with my husband and i'm terrified of passing on my negative body image onto my kids how are you handling you handling teaching London to love herself when you might not always feel great about yourself? This is something that I absolutely struggle with. And I struggle with finding a balance with it.

Because I want London to be super comfortable with her body and whatever shape her body might take on. Also, I think London is the most beautiful creature I have ever seen in my life. And so I constantly tell her that she is beautiful. And I don't think that is probably the right way to go either. And so I want to figure out the balance because I don't want her to ever think that that is the only thing that matters about her. I don't want her to ever think that that is the only thing that matters about her. I want her to know that she is a complete person and all aspects of her are amazing.

And so it's something that I actively work on now and I will actively work on the rest of her life. And I know I won't always get it right, but I will do my best to make sure that she loves herself and know that she is loved for who she is. Yeah. I feel like my sister and I are always really careful about what we say about our bodies in front of Allie, my niece. You know, and I've always thought, oh, we do we do a good job with this. But I remember one time when she was like, oh, gosh, she was really young, like four or something. We were like we were shopping together. We were trying stuff on.

And like, you know, there were some things that we didn't like. But, you know, Kyle and I are always really careful not to be like, oh, I look terrible. Right. But like at the end of the trip, Allie looked down at her shirt and she kind of pulled at it. And she goes, this isn't very flattering on me. And it just, like, it broke my heart. Yeah. Like, oh, no.

Yeah. And that's not even some terrible thing to say. Right. Like, you hate. Oh. Yeah. It's like you see where – you hate. Oh. Yeah. It's like you see where it's going. Oh, absolutely.

Absolutely. I don't know. Maybe the next generation will have stuff more figured out magically. In short, I don't know the answer to that. In short, I don't know the answer to that, but it is something I'm super mindful of and I just – I want – in a perfect world, I would want London to never think anything about her body other than like this is my body that I have. Yeah. And it's my body. Yeah.

Yeah. A gal can dream. That's right. Oh, OK. a gal can dream that's right oh okay shauna asked brandy i just re-listened to the first ever patreon episode and i have to note do you still have a beef jerky subscription okay so i got out of the habit i got out of the habit of eating my beef jerky and so I canceled my subscription because it was like stacked up. And then literally like two weeks ago, I was like, I miss having my beef jerky in my lunch every day. And so I went to restart my subscription and they've discontinued my favorite beef jerky. Really? Yes.

Terribly. Sorry to hear this. Yeah. So it's because you stopped supporting us. It probably is. So as of now, no beef jerky subscription. I'm looking into it though. Sharna says, Brandy, girl, help.

I'm getting married on 8-13 and I'm doing a braid updo, but I'm having my ex-brother-in-law do it because he's awesome. But what hairspray would you recommend for an outside wedding in August? Okay, get a Mika Headstrong. It is like a super strong hairspray, but it goes on almost completely dry. So it's really good about fighting humidity and it won't wilt your style at all, which is like my least favorite thing about hairsprays. They go on wet and then they like wilt your style at all, which is like my least favorite thing about hairsprays. They go on wet and then they like wilt your style. This comes out in a super fine dry mist,

so it won't affect your style at all, but it will give you really great humidity resistant hold. Oh, man. Okay. You thinking about getting some? Yeah, absolutely. You know, like half the tips you give out, like I take them.

Who might have passed on these free tips? Hi, Priestess of Costco wants to know, do you return fruit to the grocery store? I don't have the nuts. No. I would just throw it away before I try and return it. I have returned one thing to a grocery store ever. The salad dressing, right? Yes.

I remember this. Yeah. And obviously I'm not talking like Costco. Yes. Like I've returned stuff there. But like – and I was so nervous. Yeah. I got this dressing.

I opened it up, realized someone had used half of it. Yeah. And I was so grossed out. And yeah, I did get my money back. But the whole time I was like, what if I go up there and she accuses me of lying about it, which is like kind of irrational. Yeah. But the lady was just kind of like, yeah, right. Yeah.

I – one time – I think we probably talked about this. We probably have. So I bought some cheese, some fancy cheese. And I got home and realized that the package was not sealed. Yeah. So I saved the receipt and I was like, okay, I'm going to take this. Because who knows? Somebody finger that cheese?

You don't know. And then I never got up the nuts to go return it because I was like, they're just going to say I opened it. Yeah. They're going to say it's your finger. Yes. You finger the cheese. They're going to fingerprint it's your finger. Yes, you finger. They're going to fingerprint you and it's a whole thing. Yeah.

Okay. Nat Likes Cat says, summer themed question. It's LGTC summer camp. Which of you is on the top bunk and who's on bottom? I'm on top. You're for sure on the top bunk. Yeah. Absolutely.

Who's doing canoeing and who's doing arts and crafts? I'd go canoeing. I'd go canoeing too. Yeah. I'd pick that over arts and crafts. I's doing arts and crafts? I'd go canoeing. I'd go canoeing too. Yeah, I'd pick that over arts and crafts. I would prefer arts and crafts. I'm actually terrible at canoeing. I don't mind canoeing. I can never get things going in the right direction.

Who's eating s'mores and who's giving a very specific description of how to eat your s'mores? Oh, I'm doing both. Yeah. I'm both of those. I am eating the s'more, but I'm also telling you how to cook it. And then also, okay, you've got to have your graham cracker ready with your chocolate on it. And then when your marshmallow is perfectly roasted, you put it on there and then you remove it with the top graham. And then squish it. Eat the mallow that squishes out the sides.

Oh, okay. Yeah. You know, you're going to squish some mallow out the sides. You call it mallow and not mallow? It's a, I don't know. Yes, I call it mallow. Anyway, you know, you go around the edge, you get the Mallow that's coming out the sides, and then big bite. Mallow sounds kind of like a sexy man.

Jujubee78 says, hey, Brandy, going to Oak Park Mall. Going to see if Dippin' Dots is open. Also, by the way, my daughter works at Lego. If you need a Harry Potter hookup, let me tell you that I went to the Lego store at Oak Park Mall at Christmas and got the very last

McAllister House Lego set. They were sold out online. Only available in store. Got the last one. Plucked it right out of a 12-year-old's hands. She said, fuck you, kids. There was some guy at the counter fingering another one, but the box was dented.

What is with you fingering? I don't know. I can't stop saying it now. But the box was dented. He was trying to get them to work a deal with him. And they were like. Was it my dad? No, dude.

Like three other people over here are going to buy that if you don't. It's tough. Tough. Poor man just wanted 10% off. 5%? I feel like there's a good chance we've already answered this question, but Hot Myrtle wants to know, do you fold or scrunch your toilet paper? I don't do either. I do like a wrap situation.

Like a mummy? Yeah, like just, yeah. On the hand? I do a scrunch. You scrunch? You're losing surface area. I think you're losing surface area because you got a whole back of your hand you're not using. No, I'm using it.

What? Yeah, this has gotten too graphic. So do you dab, dab, then flip the hand? No. So you do a wipe. Uh-huh. And then you do a slide and a fold. Okay.

Yeah. Okay, so it's not a real tight wrap you're doing the first time. All right. That's correct. You know what? That seems like a good method. This has turned into a surprisingly gross episode. This is disgusting.

Oh my gosh. What? Somebody else responded to that question. Ginger Rail Jones says, I don't know why, but I believe I remember them saying that Brandy, David and Norm are committed committed folders and Kristen is a noncommittal scruncher. What's weirder? The fact that we told you already or the fact that you remember?

Yeah! Yeah, you're the weirdo! Certainly not us! Oh, my God. Oh, no. Bernadette says, not a question, more of a plea for help. I recently came into contact with poison ivy, started on my ankles, and it's slowly been working its way up my legs. Please pray for my butthole.

Okay, yes. Prayers for Bernadette's butthole. Absolutely. Okay, Bernadette, here's what you gotta do. This is not a drill. She had poison ivy all over her butthole. No, I was just like Bernadette. I was just praying that it would not,

because that shit moves on you. It spreads. Okay, so you gotta go to your doctor. You got to get medicine right away. Do not hesitate. Do not pass. Do not collect $200. Get the fuck there.

Also, I just, I always have Blue Dawn in my shower. Really? Yes. Wash it with dish soap? So what you do is like when you've been out, possibly in contact with it, Blue Dawn will take it off. But also, Tecnu, that's the better stuff. Why are you calling it Blue Dawn? It has to be the Blue Dawn.

What? It has to be the blue one. Okay. What? This is a serious subject. Okay, I'm sorry. Someone's buttholes at risk. You're right, you're right. I'm sorry, Bernadette.

I'm basically a doctor right now. And you're like, oh, Blue Dawn, why don't you call it Blue Dawn? Because it's important. So Paul Molliff's not going to get the job done. Don't even say it. No. Ajax, no. No. Blue Dawn. Put the Heisman up to Ajax and get yourself

the Blue Dawn. Okay, I didn't understand any of that. I suspect there was football stuff going on. But also you gotta get the Tecnu stuff. What's Tecnu? It's like an exfoliating thing. Once you've been exposed, you gotta

What about Ivy Dry? You ever use that? I've not. Okay, IV dry is a spray. A spray you put on your existing rash, and it sucks the oil out of it, and that's what causes it to spread. Oh. Well, Bernadette, you're going to want to spray your butthole with that, I think. Doctor's orders. Best of luck to you

oh here's a tough question for you brandy you walgreens apologist okay this is from five star patron not sure if someone already asked this but brand, there was a recent story of a Walgreens employee refusing to sell condoms to a married couple and cited his faith as the reason. Walgreens stood with the employee as an avid Walgreens lover. How do you feel about all this? Yeah, that's fucking bananas to me. Yeah. Yeah. Fuck Walgreens.

Yeah. I read that story and I was like, what are you doing? Yeah. Yeah. I read that story and I was like, what are you doing? Yeah. So it seems that Walgreens employees, from what I read, they can kind of do whatever they want and say it's their faith. Yeah.

Yeah. I don't know, dude. In theory, they're supposed to be able to have another employee help. Someone else come forward and make the sale for them so they're not the one actively. Yes. But give me a fucking break they're not the one actively. Yes. But give me a fucking break. It's ridiculous. Yeah. Yeah.

How do you feel about Walgreens now, Brandi? I mean, it's super disappointing. Yeah. Would you care if someone stole a cheese stick from them? Well, grazing is stealing. I do still feel strongly about that. But that's not Walgreens specific. That's any store.

Okay. I don't want you to do that from Hy-Vee. I don't want you to do it from Sunfresh. I don't want you to do that from, what is that creepy little convenience store we drive by sometimes? I don't want you to do it there. You're about to make fun of a small business. Now that place

is creepy as hell. It's very creepy and I don't want you to grace from there. I'm supporting their small, creepy business. The guy who works there

is very nice. Twat Pocket. Twat Pocket. Twat Pocket. pocket wants to know which one of you would do better in prison neither of us

you would do better no okay hear me out I think I think emotionally I am a sensitive bitch

I cry a lot no I know I'm thinking that emotionally I would do better. But not by like a lot. Just saying like I think I'd do a little better. But you do hair. Oh yeah, that's true.

So that's a skill. I would have an N. Yeah. Alright, fine. I'd do better than Kristen. Alright, well let's send you to prison. I don't want to. Shall we move on to Supreme Court inductions, Brandi? Absolutely. But how do you get inducted in the Supreme Court?

What's wrong? Stupid computer reloaded the page because it was using a significant amount of energy. Now I have to scroll all the way to the bottom. Did you see this text we got from Kyla? Yeah. Asking her to move Ashton to the top of the list. I know. What does she think?

Who do you think you are, Kyla? Who do you think you are? Just because you wear all those sexy clothes. Okay, this week, just as we have for the past three million years, we will be reading your name and your favorite cookie. Destiny. Bird's Oatmeal Cookies. Andrew B. Chocolate Chip Cookies with a Square of Salted Caramel Chocolate Melted in the Middle.

Oh, well, all right. Sounds good. Lacey. Monster Cookies from the Farmer's, well, all right. Sounds good. Lacey. Monster cookies from the farmer's market. Mandy Jenno. My homemade chocolate chip pudding cookies.

Okay. Oh. Ashley Pagan. Fried Oreo at the carnival. I don't know. Sex by the ocean. Sex by the ocean. It's caked on the ocean.

Ryan Freger. Russian tea cakes. Maggie Germano. Chocolate oatmeal no-bake cookies. Lauren Jolly. Fig Newtons. I think that counts. It doesn't. It's a cookie.

A Fig Newton? It's sold on the cookie aisle. Yeah. You classify it as. It goes all. It's a cookie. A Fig Newton. It's sold on the cookie aisle. Yeah. You classify it as. It goes all the way to the top. I don't know. Okay, that's Big Cookie. Big Fig's infiltrated the cookie industry. Listen, if I said to you,

hey, I'm going to bring cookies when we record. And then you showed up with Fig Newtons, I'd be pissed. Yeah, you wouldn't be like, oh yeah, that's a cookie. You're right. Janice Flannery. Soft Batch Mint Chocolate Chip. Lucita Basto.

Tim Tams. Tammy Ricketts. Gooey Butter Cookies. Audie George. Anything dipped in leftover icing. So a Fig Nune. I'm singing like a finger. You know, you ever

fingered some icing? Good God! Just the cheese and then I left that behind in the grocery store for some sap to pay for. Smee J. The Jurassic Park Keebler Fudge Stripes with the dinosaur feet in the middle. What the

fuck is that? Why haven't I had that? Is that around now? Are they out now? Because there was just a new Jurassic Park movie. It was bad. This sounds fake. Is this made up? Smeejay, are you making this shit up?

Anyway, Sonnet. Chocolate chip with walnuts. Nicole. Oatmeal chocolate chip. Lindsay. Chocolate chip with walnuts. Nicole. Oatmeal chocolate chip. Lindsay. Oatmeal raisin. Jenna P. Soft frosted sugar cookies.

Katie D. Chocolate chip cookie lava cake by Kennedy. That's a cake. That's not a cookie. Yeah, this is bullshit, Katie. Oh, wait. Beep, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep. This just in.

This just in. Someone's cutting the line. Okay, everyone, my sister Kyla is using her connections to the podcast to get her friend Ashton inducted. Yeah. Ashton's lovely. Ashton is a pageant beauty queen. Oh, shit. Well, so it makes sense. We've got beauty queens listening to this? We've got beauty queens. Fuck. Okay, so Ashton. Wait, you say her name. Okay, Ashton. So then I texted Kyla, I was like, what's her favorite cookie? And Kyla said, she said all of them when I ask. Welcome to the Supreme

Court! Thank you, everyone. Do you think Ashton includes Fig Newtons when she says all of them? No. Definitely not. Definitely not. What about a lava cake? No, that's also not a cookie, Katie D. Anyway, thank you for your support.

If you're looking for other ways to support us, please find us on social media. We're on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Patreon. Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen and then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review. And then be sure to join us next week when we'll be experts on two whole new topics. Podcast adjourned. And now for a note about our process. I read a bunch of stuff, then regurgitate it all back up in my very limited vocabulary. And I copy and paste from the best sources on the web and sometimes Wikipedia.

So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from the documentary Call Her Ganda, Meredith Tolson's article, How the Killing of a Trans-Filipino Woman Ignited an International Incident for Vice, as well as reporting from CNN, Human Rights Watch, and U.S. News & World Report. I got my info from OurBlackGirls.com, MaryHallbergMedia.com, The Kansas City Star, Fox 4 News, CBS News, the Joplin Globe, and the Court Record. For a full list of our sources, visit lgtcpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it. Go read their stuff.