Let's Go To Court! - 250: A New Neighbor & an Assplosion

Episode Date: April 12, 2023

Leith, North Dakota, is a very small place. So, when Craig Cobb moved to town, everyone tried to be friendly. He was a little odd, but he seemed harmless. He was just an older, lonely man who’d come out to work on a nearby oil field. But what the people of Leith didn’t know was that Craig Cobb was a white supremacist, and he had a plan to take over their town. Then Brandi tells us about Greg Mulhivill, who received a call late one night from a person who claimed to be a private investigator. The caller instructed Greg to meet him at a remote location. When Greg arrived at the spot, he sensed that something was off. He used his flashlight to survey the area and was stunned to spot a man crouching in the bushes. And now for a note about our process. For each episode, Kristin reads a bunch of articles, then spits them back out in her very limited vocabulary. Brandi copies and pastes from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Kristin pulled from: The documentary, “Welcome to Leith” “Craig Cobb” entry on the Southern Poverty Law Center “Village of the Damned,” by Ryan Lenz for the Southern Poverty Law Center In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “Diana Lovejoy” episode Snapped “The Night of the New Moon” episode Dateline “Diana Lovejoy” chillingcrimes.com “Gun Instructor Who Tried to Kill Lover's Husband: I Regret Cheating on My Wife More Than Shooting” by Christine Pelisek, People “Couple Guilty in Bizarre Attempted Murder Speak Before Sentencing” by Liberty Zabala and R. Stickney, NBC San Diego 7 News “Wife and her gun instructor get long terms in shooting of husband during divorce” by Teri Figueroa, The San Diego Union-Tribune “California v. McDavid” justia.com  YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 45+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts. I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Pond. Let's go to court. On this episode, I'll be talking about a new neighbor. And I'll be talking about a murder-for-hire plot. Oh my god. You sound like the lady who has a surprise. You sound like the lady who has a surprise. Okay, okay. Murder for hire plot. Do they contact someone who's, oopsies, a police informant? No.

Undercover cop? No. Do they meet in a parking lot of Chili's? Ooh, no. No, but you are going to love this case. Okay, very good. Very good. I think you will dislike mine very strongly.

I know I disliked it. Oh, great. Everyone, welcome to the program. Do you know what episode this is? Number 250! It feels like a big milestone. This is number 250. It feels like a big milestone. Yeah. Why didn't we get a fucking cookie cake?

I don't know. I saw cookie cakes the other day at the grocery store. The problem is they're huge. It wouldn't have made it till Wednesday. Well, yeah. That's true. But also, it was huge. It's too big. You know.

Oh. Oh, my God. I was too big. You know. Oh, oh my God. I almost said something really fucking stupid. What? What if they made like little miniature cookie cakes? Oh, like fucking cookies, Kristen? What if they made cookies? The important thing is that I stopped myself before that came out of my mouth. You know what would be awesome is if they had like cookie cakes, but like miniature single version.

Like for an individual. Like what if you just wanted to have one cookie cake to yourself or maybe even two? Why hasn't anyone invented that? Huh? Why am I the only genius? Million dollar idea right here. Personal cookie cakes. You know, I've got to say,

this is the second week in a row when I have thought something exceptionally stupid. And last week's didn't make it on the podcast, but I will say it right now. Yeah, I'm not remembering last week's. Oh, I guess

it was two weeks ago. internet went down oh yeah and our internet went down and you know i'm i'm a very modern woman okay when when the internet goes down i feel like in my head like you are living in the dark ages. Yes. And I walked upstairs and I thought I should probably do some dishes. And I thought, but I probably can't even run the dishwasher right now. Because yes, your dishwasher is internet powered. I got Firefox on that. I got Firefox on that thing. Anyway, the important thing is I didn't say that thought aloud.

It's just a thought that occurred to me. It's in there. And I thought, oh, boy. I'm an intelligent woman and I'm here to tell a story. But first, yes, we must tell you about our Patreon. You know, I'm clearly a very stupid woman who needs your financial support. You are not. You're a very intelligent woman. Brandy, I just came up with an idea for a cookie cake for one.

You know, on our Patreon, you get a lot of bonus episodes. 45. So many bonus episodes. Big old meaty boy. That's right. Badonkadonk. What is a badonkadonk? That's a butt. That's a butt.

Yeah. I was going for dongs. But, you know, the truth is we have neither on our Patreon. We just have bonus episodes. There's just bonus episodes. Also, you can get on a monthly Zoom call with us. We send you a sticker. We send you both our autographs most of the time.

Rude. If you sign up at the $10 level, you know what happens? What? Your skin around your butthole automatically lightens. Oh, so you don't have to get your anus bleached anymore. Right. That is nice. Or at all. It just happens naturally.

Also, you get ad-free episodes and you get them a day early. You also get 10% off merch. But again, the important thing is that complimentary anal bleaching that happens as soon as you sign up at the $10 level on our Patreon. Alright? You ever gotten your anus bleached?

No. No, me either. No, I... I can't actually see my own anus, so... Well, sure you can. You just spread your cheeks and, you know, turn around to a mirror. Do a human pretzel? Oh, you have to involve a mirror.

Well, yeah. I mean... Did you just say that to make me feel better about my cookie cakes? That's right. No, for real. You've never looked at your own butt in the mirror? I've looked at my own butt. I don't know that I've ever looked at my own butt hole. You've never stared into the abyss.

Abyss, yeah. No. Okay. Well, you're not very adventurous. I can see that for sure. No, I have never been tempted. Yeah, no, neither have I. It's enough for me to, like,

maintain the areas of my body that everyone can see on a daily basis. So I'm not venturing into unknown caves. Brandy, this is a disgusting thing to talk about. How dare you. And it could very well be someone's first episode. Their mom could have recommended this podcast to them. It is better than the one we started the conversation about the butthole with in contest.

That was when someone was guest hosting. I obviously wasn't here for that. You started it. No. I'm a very classy woman. The Grace Kelly of podcasting, as they say. Absolutely. That's what everyone says about me.

And I do appreciate that very much. Okay, great. Anyway, do you want to tell us a story now? Also, please sign up for our Patreon. much okay great anyway do you want to tell us a story now also please not really our patreon uh this brandy next zoom call we're gonna bleach kristen's anus we're gonna get a bunch of fucking creeps signing up it's like that guy who signed up and immediately canceled because our tits weren't there yeah well sarcasm goes over some folks heads yeah brandy i've got

you have to add one for us today um you know what as far as okay you know what no? No, I'm not going to play this game with you. Yeah, okay. Because last time you were like, yeah, it's super light. And then you told us a whole story about Nazis. Yeah, and Nazis do come up in this, so... Great! People are constantly saying there's not enough Nazi content on this podcast. So, woo boy!

Oh boy, are they going to love this. Okay. Shout outs to Excellent Reporting from the Southern Poverty Law Center. And a big thank you to the documentary, Welcome to Leith. Is that a place? It sure is. Okay. What? I don't know. I don't even understand the question. Is Leith a place? That's the question. Well, yeah. Welcome to Leith. Obviously, Leith is a place.

It could be a state of being. Why don't you Leith that attitude at the door? Huzzah! That's stupid. All right. Did you just say huzzah? Nope, I didn't. Let's move on.

Did you just say a song? Nope, I didn't. Let's move on. Brandy, Leaf, North Dakota is an incredibly small town. How small is it? It is three square miles. Oh, that is very small. And it is home to a whopping 24 people.

Oh, my goodness, yes. That's very small. It is home to one business what's the business what do you think it is i don't know a gas station it's a bar oh yeah and of course it has a pool table and yes it does have sassy handwritten signs on the walls what do they say i'm not totally sure i tried to like pause the documentary i saw I'm pretty sure I saw the F word. Oh, shit. Also saw something about, you know, personal checks and stuff. Yeah.

You get the vibe. Yeah. No bar takes personal checks. I don't think they need to put a sign up about that. OK, I don't know that I found the bar on Facebook, but I think I did. And I am pretty sure and I don't know how this is happening in this Facebook, but I think I did. And I am pretty sure, and I don't know how this is happening in this economy, but I'm pretty sure they were selling $3 liquor drinks the other day. Oh, yeah. $3? Yeah, $3 wells. Sure. All right. Anyway, one guy described driving through Leith

as like you're looking at B-roll from The Walking Dead. Oh, gosh. Kind of just an abandoned town. I mean, that's a rude thing to say about a place, but I mean. Okay. It does paint a picture. Yeah, it sure does. Yeah. The residents of Leith are, you know, kind of exactly who you'd expect to live there. They like peace and quiet. They appreciate the natural beauty of their surroundings. What? What are you making that face for? I'm just listening. You're suspiciously listening. I am very suspicious. As a general rule, they kind of keep to themselves. It's not often that people move to Leith. So when that happens, it's a pretty big deal. So in 2011, when a man named Craig Cobb moved to town, you know, the people of Leith tried to be friendly toward him.

Craig was a little different. He was tall and wiry and he had glasses and he had a very receding hairline. I mean, it was way back. You're way far back. Was it that far back? It's very far back. Okay. Okay. So you have like a hair island on top? No island.

Okay. I will describe this to you beautifully. Okay. I've come up with the perfect description. All right. So picture way receding hairline, but the hair that did remain on his head was quite thick, and it went down to his shoulders. So he looked like an aging drag queen who had been lip syncing for her life and forgot to apply her wig glue. That is exactly what it looked like. It looks like it's just slipping. Does RuPaul approve? No, there's no excuses.

You need to apply the wig glue. Craig. But I'm not one to judge. By the way, Craig is a terrible name for a drag queen. I agree. So people were happy to have Craig in town. A Leith resident named Michelle Shook went over and, you know, introduced herself. Although, you know, I bet there's a drag queen named Jenny Craig.

Oh, that's a great. Yeah. Yeah. That's a great drag name. Yeah. Oh, OK. OK. All right. She didn't really want to be buddy buddy with Craig because she thought he was a little weird. And, wow, she hates to admit this now. But at the time, she did think to herself, hmm, my mom is single, you know, and this guy seems lonely. Maybe the two of them could get together. Get Chuck Woolrey in here. Who's Chuck Woolrey? He's an old game show host.

How old are you? He hosted Love Connection. How old are you, ma'am? I'm younger than you, Kristen! So you say! So yeah, Craig Cobb appeared to be just kind of a quiet guy. He'd apparently bought his house in Leith for five grand in cash, sight unseen. He told people that he'd found work in an oil field, and that made sense.

There are some surrounding businesses in the business. Okay, boy. Boy. Lost track there. All right. You want to hit it again? No, I want to give up. Okay.

I want to go eat again? No, I want to give up. Okay. I want to go eat a personal cookie cake. There are some businesses in the surrounding area, and they support the oil industry. And it's not uncommon for people to come out to the area and get a job in the oil industry. Sometimes the people who show up for these jobs turn out to be great folks. Other times, as the local sheriff put it, you get the kind of people who come here because they can't get work anywhere else. So you have to be a little careful, I guess, but this Craig dude seemed fine. Just a little odd.

Okay. I'm guessing that's just like the tip of the iceberg on Craig. You are guessing correctly, ma'am. At one point, Craig stopped and talked to his new neighbor, Buddy Harper, and asked if Buddy had any property for sale. And Buddy was like, no. So, you know, again, okay, whatever. Craig was very interested in buying property in Leith. And luckily for him, that was really easy to do. Craig was able to buy multiple lots for like a couple hundred dollars a piece. Wow. Yep. Yep.

What's he going to do with it? That's none of your business, Brandy. Is it so wrong for a man to come to town and want to buy up some properties? Hmm? I mean, it seems kind of odd. Yeah, just a little odd. Okay. Is that against the rules to be a little odd?

No. All right. He bought up lot after lot after lot. At one point, he owned like 12, maybe 13 properties. No one thought too much of it. live and let live type of place. But what the people of Leith didn't know was that Craig Cobb wasn't just some quiet, harmless oddball. In reality, he played a very big role in the white supremacy movement. Great. And he had a secret plan to take over their town. Wow.

Have you heard of this story at all? No. This, yeah, I'd never heard of this either. It is shocking. Craig Cobb moved to Leith because he wanted to create a community for white nationalists. Oh, my gosh. He'd chosen Leith because it's a very small town. You could buy a lot of property pretty cheaply.

And it wouldn't take very many white supremacists to gain control of the local government. To outnumber everybody else. Yeah. Brandi's smiling because she likes the idea. No. No. No. Craig kept his plan a secret for as long as he could. But in June of 2012, he was ready to make his vision a reality. That day, Craig logged on to one of his favorite websites. What is it? Vanguard News Network.

I've never even heard of that. Right, and it doesn't sound bad, right? No. It's run out of Missouri, by the way. Of course it is. Exciting. The tagline for Vanguard News Network is, No Jews, Just Right. Okay.

Yeah. So Craig got on to one of their terrifying message boards and he wrote about his vision for North Dakota. He talked about white supremacists coming to this tiny town and quickly gaining political control. They'd vote. They'd get on city council. He wrote, I am ready now. This is an open invitation to all white nationalists to come and settle in this town. Holy shit. Yeah. Craig envisioned a town where white men could get jobs in the oil industry and white women would have tons of white babies, which is a sign of confidence, Brandy. Sign of confidence, Brandy. It is?

What? Sorry. That's just a little gem he threw out there that pregnancies are a sign of confidence. And I thought, you know, when Brandy got pregnant, I did notice a little pep in her step. Craig really knew how to sell his vision. Are you ready for this? Oh, boy. Tell me if you want to move to this town. Okay.

He wrote, there is water, electricity, satellite internet via Hughes at $50 per month, satellite TV from at least three companies, trailers, fifth wheels, campers, legal, car insurance, as little as $141 for six months, and most importantly, a surfeit of very good paying jobs in two different cities. It really humbled me that I had to Google a word that was used by a white supremacist. Yeah, what word was that? S-U-R-F-E-I-T. It it just means a lot he could have said a lot but no i yeah i i didn't know the word fun fact none of craig's properties actually had running water or like sewer hookup yeah of course they didn't because you know who wants to flush a toilet? Am I right? No, I very much go to a toilet. That didn't matter, though. This white supremacist community needed to happen because in Craig's words, white people are, quote, being genocided in our own country.

That's for sure not happening, sir. No, and like, my dude, what are you seeing in the world that backs up that view do you know what genocide actually is obviously not i don't also think it's a verb being being genocided yeah i mean maybe when you're totally making it up yeah soon craig began selling off his lots for a dollar apiece to leaders in the alt-right movement. He sold a parcel to a man named Tom Metzger, who is the head of the White Aryan Resistance. He sold a parcel to Alex Linder, who runs the Vanguard News Network and who proudly advocates for the genocide of Jewish people. He sold a plot to Jeff Shope, who is the head of the National Socialist Movement, which is a very large neo-Nazi group.

I believe that dude is now in prison for some stuff in Charlottesville. Anyhow. for some stuff in Charlottesville. Anyhow. So Craig was slowly making his awful plans a reality. But the residents of Leith had no idea what he was up to because why would they? They're not on these weirdo sites. No.

But the people at the Southern Poverty Law Center did. The Southern Poverty Law Center is a legal advocacy group and they're very well known for their research into hate groups. And they've been keeping an eye on Craig for quite a while. Because by their estimation, he is one of the top 10 white supremacists in the United States. But also one of the worst drag queens. States. But also one of the worst drag queens. Yeah, there's footage of him in this documentary yelling at someone that he's one of the most famous racists in the United States. So that's exciting. Yeah. Now, Brandy, you may be asking yourself, but how does one become one of the most famous racists in all of these United States? Yeah. I do wonder.

Okay, I'll tell you. Craig Cobb was born and raised in St. Joseph, Missouri, about an hour north of here. Yep. You know, my family on my dad's side comes from that area. Yeah. You know, my family on my dad's side comes from that area. Yeah. His mom was a teacher, and his dad was a land developer.

And after high school, his dad forced him to join the military. After a few years in the military, now, according to Craig, he went to Kansas City City and he took an IQ test with 400 people. And you know what, Brandi? He came in second. Did he? Mm-hmm. And everyone was so impressed by that. They were like, oh, my gosh, you should join the NSA. You should get into whatever special forces you want.

You're so smart. Yeah, I bet everybody was saying that. You use words like a surfeit. But, you know, in order to do that, he would have to re-up with the military for another six years, and he didn't want to do that. So he just said, no, thank you, and took his big boing elsewhere. From there, Craig moved to Canada. And in the 1970s, he moved to Hawaii. What the fuck's he moved to Hawaii.

What the fuck's he doing in Hawaii? I'll tell you, Brandy. He was having a transformative experience because it was in Hawaii that he joined a church called the Church of the Creator. That sounds scary. The Church of the Creator? See, I think it sounds like a normal church. Oh, I don't. You don't think the church of the creator? No. Oh, come on. No, I think it... If you just saw like a random brick building... Yeah, I would think it sounds like a cult. Oh, okay. Well, you've got better cult radar than I do. I do. That is correct. Okay. Well,

here's the thing about this. Did it turn out to be a cult? Depends on how we're defining cult. I wouldn't say that. Okay. Here's the thing. That church was super exciting because unlike other lame-ass religions where you worship a higher power, at the Church of the Creator, you are God, assuming you're an Aryan dude. All other people need not apply. Cool. At this church, the congregants learn that all other religions suck.

Duh. All other races suck. Duh. LGBT, mm, duh, suck. White women are all right as long as they know their place and they're making babies. Also, violence is totally cool and necessary because

if we want to make any progress as a society, the only way to do it is with white dudes dominating everyone else. Yeah, wipe that look off your face, Brandi. I'm just telling you the truth. Oh my gosh! Brandi, I'm just telling you the truth. Oh my gosh. Brandi, I can see that you're very interested in this religion. I'm not. And you're wondering,

gee, what's their logo, you know? I'm so glad you asked, because you definitely did. It is a capital W, and on top of that, there's a crown, and on top of that, there's a halo. And on top of that, there's a halo. What's the W stand for?

What do you think it stands for? White? Yeah. Holy shit! I would like to read you their explanation of their logo. Okay, great. Lay it on me. And, you know, some words are in all caps, so I will be putting...

Shout them. Oh, great. Lay it on me. And, you know, some words are in all caps, so I will be putting... Shout them. Oh, yeah. The W of our emblem stands, of course, for the white race, which we regard as the most precious treasure on the face of the earth. Oh, Lord. The crown signifies our aristocratic position in nature's scheme of things, indicating that we are elite. The halo indicates that we regard our race as being unique and sacred above all other values. Okay. Mm-hmm.

The founder of the religion believed that white people should go to war against all other races, which he referred to as mud races. Oh, boy. As you can imagine, these stakes were very high. Here's how he put it. OK, buckle up. This is rough. We are today engulfed in a major worldwide revolution that constitutes a major turning point in the

history of the human race, and the outcome will either be a catastrophe of gigantic proportions, or it will usher in a new age of greatness and well-being for the human race. If the evil forces led by the Jews are victorious, future humanity is doomed to tens of thousands of years of slavery, misery, and bestiality. A situation from which there is no reversal and from which it can never recover. If, on the other hand, the white race wins, a bright and beautiful new world will emerge. You think this isn't a cult? I would classify it just simply as a hate group. I think a hate group that's masquerading as a church is absolutely a cult.

All right. That's fair. What are you thinking? I'm not the least bit interested in joining but you know thanks for the info i i really love that the stakes are this high that if the white people don't do this then it's going to be thousands of years of fucking dogs. Yeah. Beastiality, bestiality, bestiality. Bestiality will reign.

There's no turning back. You'll be going down on a turtle. You'll wish you'd joined the church. What's a going down on a turtle, Kristen? You'll be finger banging gophers. Stop it.

Brady, I'm just trying to tell you what's in store. So that was Craig's church. Okay. Yeah. Also, fun fact, when Craig lived in Hawaii, he drove a cab for a living. And you're not going to believe this. But one day while he was driving around, he picked up a young Barack Obama. Oh.

And get a load of this. That day in the cab, Barack Obama confessed to him that he was not born in Hawaii. Okay. It's like a Forrest Gump situation. Craig is certainly involved in a ton of historical moments and he knows the truth. Yeah. Yeah. Something that for sure happened.

Definitely happened. He's totally not making that up at all. Okay. Sure thing, Craig. Anyway, living in Hawaii was actually kind of awful for Craig because it was such a terribly diverse place. So in 2000... Yeah, you mean like with all the Hawaiians? Yeah.

Yeah. Yep. Okay. Can you imagine no i can't fucking imagine what the fuck is wrong with these people holy shit so in 2003 craig moved to frost west virginia which was real close to the headquarters of his favorite neo-nazi crew i'm was going to say, it sounds very white. Frost.

It's right there in the name. Maybe White Haven would be better. Maybe. Yeah, is that part of Craig's plan? Is he planning to change the name of Leith once he takes it over? Cobbsville. I realize I said that and it sounded like a joke. It is not a joke.

That was his real plan. That's the plan. Okay, great. Once there, he opened a grocery store. He called it Gray's Store, Aryan Autographs and 14 Words, LLC. What? Yes, once again, for the people in the back who are looking for a local grocery store, it's called Gray's Store, Aryan Autographs, and 14 Words LLC.

What are the 14 words? I don't know what that means. I'm so glad you asked. The 14 words are, we must secure the existence of our people and a future for white children. Oh, for fuck's sake. Yeah. Yeah. It may shock you to learn that Gray's store, Aryan Autographs and 14 Words LLC, didn't stay in business for very long.

Yeah, imagine that. Was it because the grocery store was only open for a few hours a day? Was it because Craig painted the web addresses of all of his favorite hate groups on the side of the building? The world may never know. Oh, my gosh. And really, it didn't matter because, as we've already established, Craig Cobb was an Aryan man and therefore a god. And god is too busy to run a grocery store in West Virginia. Obviously.

Aryan autographs. Yeah, what does that even mean? Oh, my gosh. I just came up with a great business idea, even better than my personal pan cookie cakes. Okay, your personal cookie cakes. What's your next business idea even better than my personal pan okay your personal cookie cakes what's your next business idea um i just write adolf hitler on a bunch of pieces of paper and i sell it to idiots okay great

and i use that money to buy cookie cakes for people of color. Sure. And then people are like, hey, this is too much. This is too much. I say, boy, have I got an idea for you. So, you know, grocery store business, it's a rough business. And there were problems with his church, which was definitely not a hate group or a cult. Right. By this point, the church was going by a new name,

the World Church of the Creator. Definitely a fucking cult, Kristen. All right. All right. I am not defending this. All right. I am not defending this. Although I am interested in avoiding thousands of years of bestiality.

Unless the tiger is really hot. Okay. How many bestiality jokes is too many? You know what's funny? Is I included that quote, obviously, because of the bestiality comment. And I thought, oh, Brandi and I are going to have a good time with that. And I'm the only one having a good time with it. So, I wish I didn't have to pick up all your slack.

Do you think in that future, zoos would just be full of humans and the animals come to gangbang us? Anyway. Brandy, sometimes you say the most outrageous things. What's horrible is they still have a gift shop. They still have cotton candy. They still have all that shit. Stop it. Because it's fun for them, you know.

Oh, the animals are going into the gift shop? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. You think you've got time to go to the gift shop? No. No. Stop it.

You're getting plowed from behind by a penguin. And it's all because you didn't join this cult when there was still time. All right, I'll stop. Brandy is looking away from me. She is horrified. She is thinking that I need to stop it with these jokes. Anyway, so they had a new name, World Church of the Creator, which is weird because I would have thought a bunch of white dudes would have gotten the name right the first time.

But, oh well. As it turned out, there was this other group that was also called the World Church of the Creator, and they were like, holy shit, you guys suck. We do not want to be affiliated with you. We are totally suing your asses. So the church sued the hate group for trademark infringement. Ooh.

You'll be devastated to know that the hate group lost that legal battle. So they had to change their name? Yeah, but you're kind of jumping ahead. Oh, I'm so sorry. So how about you slow down? Okay. U.S. District Court Judge Joan Humphrey Lefkoe ruled against them. And the hate group did not take it well.

This guy, Matthew Hale, who was the head of the organization, got really mad. And he decided to have the judge murdered. What? Yeah. Except for oopsies, Matt didn't realize that he'd talked about the hit with an undercover FBI informant. So Matt was arrested and he was convicted and sentenced to 40 years in prison. Okay. But Craig Cobb was devastated by that. The leader of his religion was in prison. And it was all the judge's fault. And she needed to pay for that.

Okay. So he doxed her. Great. He put doxed her. Great. He put her home address online. He went to the world's largest white supremacist website and posted photos of the judge's husband and children. Two years later, the judge's husband and her mother were shot to death in her Chicago home. Oh, my gosh. Yeah. So it turned out that the murderer was actually not connected to the white supremacist movement. But it's definitely worth noting that this is how Craig handles a

problem. He doxes people, he scares them, he puts their lives and the lives of their loved ones at risk. You okay over there? Yeah, I'm just seeing some parallels to some current events that are happening in our. Like what? Like maybe Donald Trump was indicted yesterday and then maybe he posted a picture of the judge's child on his social media. You should know Craig Cobb is a huge Donald Trump fan. It's not the least bit surprising. You know what is surprising? That so-called normal everyday folks are fans of Donald Trump and they don't see how that could be a problem.

Yeah. Yeah. I welcome your reviews. and they don't see how that could be a problem. Yeah. Yeah. I welcome your reviews. Over the years, Craig became more involved in white supremacist organizations. He volunteered for Project Schoolyard, which is a thing where white supremacists hand out CDs to elementary, middle and high school kids. And the music is like kids bop, but for racists.

Oh, great. That exists? Kids bop for racists? No, not actual kids bop. Well, I know it's not produced by kids bop, but like they're making children's racist music? Yeah, to get them while they're young.'s racist music. Yeah. To get them while they're young. Holy shit. Uh huh. That is fucking alarming.

Yeah. It's terrifying. Yeah. A couple of years later in 2005, Craig inherited some money and moved to Estonia because it's full of white people. And he told everyone that he wanted to start the International Office of White Diaspora. But that ended up being about as successful as his grocery store. Yeah. But then in 2007, he came up with an idea that actually took off. OK, first off, you know how YouTube is like super liberal and censors everyone and oh my gosh they're

just so progressive and out there is it no no it's not they've cleaned up a little bit but no in like oh seven for sure no no yeah craig referred to youtube as jew tube oh yeah so that's that's where we're headed with that so he started his own um right-wing alternative to youtube called pod blank pod blank was a great place to watch horrific videos of people of color being beaten and in some cases killed it was also your go-to place for learning about how to make your own explosives. Holy shit. It also mentioned... Is this like on the dark web or is this out there for just like anybody to stumble upon? You know, I actually don't know, but

if this was started in 07, I'm willing to bet that it was fairly easy to stumble upon. I guess I don't know. I mean, it'll shock you. I've never been to pod blank. It also mentioned all of the security measures in place at three specific synagogues in California. Oh, my gosh. Yeah, just setting people up to do horrible things. That site turned out to be very inspiring to a guy named Keith Luke,

who, after Barack Obama was inaugurated, murdered two people, attacked two others, and planned to attack people at a synagogue later that night, but was stopped by police. Wow. He said he'd been inspired to do so after reading about the demise of the white race on Podblank. This sucks. Yeah. I feel like we're not we're just barely in here all right yeah very sorry okay you want to hear some more bestiality jokes no so craig had built a platform for hate but what he maybe didn't realize that while he was

surrounded by a bunch of white folks in estonia he was not surrounded by a ton of free speech laws but bam brandy please stop making those ridiculous noises so he was arrested and found guilty of endangering public safety public order blah blah blah great you'd love to see it estonia kicked him the fuck out of the country for 10 years okay so he yeah america got him back well first he fucked off to canada oh okay and he promptly went to a library in vancouver and got on a computer and i don't know probably jerked his little ding dong to white supremacist porn or something um yada yada yada he got arrested for promoting hatred which is a thing you can be arrested

for in Canada. Wow. I kind of like that. Yeah. Why is that not a thing in America? Because we love free speech. This is a complicated-ass case. That is very complicated. I am starting to have new opinions.

Anyway. Oh, boy. It's all terrible. Okay. As soon as he got out of custody, Craig fled to the United States and the Canadians were like, hey, get back here. And Craig was like, you can find me in the easy chair near the elevator in the Flatland County Library. Sorry I left your handcuffs too loose. Is that what they said?

Yeah, that's exactly what they said. Thank you. Anyway, he did say he was in an orange easy chair in the library in Montana. Yeah. Oh, my God. But I guess the Canadians didn't care too much about finding him. Yeah, they were like, yeah, he's not a problem anymore. Oh, you want to go to the United States?

Great. I'm sure you'll find friends. And so Craig eventually moved to North Dakota and he'd hatched the plan to take over the little town of Leith. But the Southern Poverty Law Center had been keeping an eye on him. And the Bismarck Tribune had found out about his plans for Leith. So they came to town to investigate. And a writer for the Southern Poverty Law Center went and talked to Leith's mayor.

They got a mayor? They got 24 people that live there and they've got a mayor? They sure do. Okay. Mm-hmm. His name is Ryan Shook. He's been on city council since he was 16. And he is the mayor because the two previous mayors died.

And so, you know, he just it was his turn. Of course. Ryan loves his town. Every morning he gets up, drives a school bus. He comes home, works on the farm. He just feels like Leith is the kind of place where people have each other's backs. So when Ryan found out from these reporters what Craig was actually doing in Leith, he was shook. Okay.

Yeah. Well done. It's true. So in his interview for the documentary, he was like, you know, I don't really get out much. I don't leave the area. I haven't seen much of the world. And when this issue was first brought up to me, I honestly didn't even know what a white supremacist was. Yeah.

So this was just wild. The whole concept, first of all, the concept of someone coming to town and trying to take it over, it was so alarming. By the way, there is one black person in Leith. It's this guy, Bobby Harper. He's married to a white woman named Cheryl, and they live right behind Craig Cobb. Oh, my gosh. They were obviously very troubled by Craig's plans for their town. Yeah. Bobby was interviewed by multiple news outlets, and he basically said, I'm not going to leave. This is basically said, I'm not going to leave. This is my home.

I'm not going to be intimidated out of here. But, boy, did Craig try. Craig put up Nazi flags all over his property. He put up Confederate flags. He put up some other flags that I didn't recognize. But, you know, I get context clues. They were scary as fuck. I didn't recognize, but, you know, I get context clues.

Yeah. They were scary as fuck. Well, some of them were just like, I think it was like a Sweden's flag, you know, anyway. Because white people? Yeah, because white people. Oh, boy. Okay. He decorated his windows with weird little posters that read Credo 64.

I didn't Google it, but I, again, context clues. Yep, I'm not interested. He had photos of blonde white women taped to his windows. Stop it! And some of these weirdo white supremacist folks started moving into town. For example, Kynan. K-Y-N-A-N. Wait.

K-Y-N-A-N. Yeah, Kynan. Sure. Why not? Yeah, okay. Who cares? Kynan and Deborah Dutton moved into a trailer on Craig's property with their five children. Yeah. Again, no five children. Yeah. Again, no running water.

Yeah. Sounds fun. Kenan. Kenan. Could be Kenan. Who fucking cares? Kenan. What did I call him the first time?

Kynan. Kynan. All right. Kynan is 28. He's a skinhead. He's an Iraq War veteran. And, okay, his facial hair does not come in very thick, all right. Kynan is 28. He's a skinhead. He's an Iraq War veteran. And, okay, his facial hair does not come in very thick. All right.

So you have to get up pretty close to see that he has the Hitler mustache attempt. You know, it's there. Yeah. I got to say, it's a little, it's not as intimidating. Yeah. When the Hitler stash is so thin and wispy. Again, I'm not one to judge. So anyway, they moved to town. Cunningham was very inspired by Craig's vision. He figured that he could start Leith as a white community and then they'd start other

white communities and oh boy it'd be great. But you know what? The people of Leith were not very welcoming to Mr. and Mrs. Skinhead. Oh my gosh you hate to see it. They flipped them off and yelled at them to go home and without even the slightest man they're probably not used to that oh it let me tell you it was so funny because these two idiots they don't see the irony in it yeah so they're complaining on camera about like people are being rude to us because of what we believe. People are being mean. That's not fair. All right. So the people of Leith and the surrounding areas were horrified by what Craig was trying to do.

So, the residents there and a bunch of anti-racist people from nearby areas gathered together to protest the neo-Nazi takeover of this town. About 400 people showed up, roughly half of whom were Native Americans, and they all came to protest. But Craig wouldn't budge, and neither would his pasty little friends who showed up in town to back him up. The leader of the National Socialist Movement actually wrote a letter to the mayor, and it read, Craig Cobb will not be ousted from the community. Craig is not breaking any laws or ordinances and has a right to reside in Leith. If anything, you should see this for what it is. A chance at revitalizing a community and a chance to be neighborly to your new neighbors and vice versa. No, fuck right off. Get the fuck out of here.

Yeah. Absolutely fuck right off. Yeah. But this is the shit that scares me. Am I breaking any laws? Right. Hmm. Am I breaking any laws?

Right. Craig got on Vanguard News Network and posted about his plans to change the city ordinances to allow discrimination against people of color and journalists he didn't agree with. He also shared his plans to turn one of his vacant lots into a park in honor of Hitler. Holy shit. Yeah. Craig posted online that, quote, the streets will run deep in the blood of our enemies, some whites among them. Oh, my gosh.

Mm-hmm. What fucking year is this? We're talking about 2012, 2013. Oh my gosh. Yeah. This is fucking nuts. The people of Leith weren't sure what they could do to stop this. Yeah, what can they do?

Well, technically, Craig was not breaking any laws. But they couldn't just let their community be taken over by fucking neo-Nazis. No! So they had to act carefully. And this whole time, Craig kept threatening them with lawsuits. If they drove him out of town, he'd sue for religious discrimination. Craig and his little buddy Kynan made life miserable. Do you think it's pronounced Keenan?

I don't think it is because I feel like I would have remembered that. All right. Is it Kyan Pepper? Definitely not. Would have remembered that too. I think it's Kynan. All right. Kynan showed up one day at what appeared to be a city council meeting.

Are you okay over there? Yeah. David texted me. I was making sure it wasn't anything important. It's not. He picked up London. I'm glad someone did yes you know it shows confidence to get pregnant but the thing is you have to actually monitor your child okay so kind of showed up one day at what appeared to be a city council meeting. And, okay, this is just an aside, but the building where they hold their city council meetings, it's basically just a giant room.

And in it, there is what appears to be a hand-drawn portrait of Johnny Depp as Captain Jack Sparrow. Okay. Why? I don't know. We don't know. No. But, boy, are we intrigued. Are we?

Yes! Are you not intrigued? Like, why is that up there? I don't know. Exactly. So Kynan showed up looking unhinged as fuck, yelling about how everyone in town had been rude to his family. Jesus.

Nobody likes me. I honestly think, I think they were very unpleasantly surprised by the pushback they were getting from other white people. White people. Yeah. Yeah. I think it shocked the shit out of them. Yeah. Yeah.

I think they thought there's only one black person in this town. It's going to be a piece of cake. Yeah. Mm hmm. Oh, my gosh. Turns out Leith is full of peace-loving weirdos. Yeah. Hmm.

Fucking liberals. That's what's so funny to me is, like, obviously they're not. I mean, like, I guess I don't know. Right. But, I mean, you know, the mayor has never heard of white supremacy before. Right, yeah. So, you know, you know that this is not, like, a big issue that they're talking about. Right, yes.

But, yeah, no no they're not gonna let fucking neo-nazis come to town yeah so okay picture this kynan's there looking unhinged and he goes you guys think we're some fucking game we're gonna we're going to And a woman who's off camera goes, you need some soap. Your mouth is filthy. And Kynan goes, we're going. And she goes, you need to eat some soap. So he didn't know what to say to that. So then he just goes, white power.

No. And then he does the Sieg Heil thing and did the salute. And he was wearing Crocs. No. Yes. You made that up. I, no. No, ma'am. No, ma'am.

Crocs, the official footwear of neo-Nazis. No, don't say that! official footwear of neo-nazis don't say that no obviously no crocs are not supporting the neo-nazis in any way that I'm aware of it's gonna be like when those tiki torch folks had to be like

we actually don't know we're not affiliated with white supremacists crocs are gonna have to be like hey we make an ugly shoe but we don't support ugly values thank you very much. Yeah. So there you go. What color were the cracks?

They were like either a navy or a black. I would guess black. Yeah. You don't think he's getting navy? I noticed that a lot of these neo-Nazi folks, they love to wear black. Very intimidating. Okay. That's why I wear black.

I'm intimidated right now. That's right. But you know what you're not going to intimidate is an elephant that's coming to give you a rim job. Stop. Wear all the black you want, Brandy. Brandy, you look like you want to jump out the window. So at another city council meeting, Bobby Harper harper again the one black guy in town he's standing outside the building waiting for the meeting to start and craig cobb comes up to him

with a macbook and it's like open and it's facing bobby so it's like, OK, are you recording? Right. What? Probably Craig doesn't have a phone. I don't know. And a police officer stood between them and Craig was getting aggressive. And Bobby said, the meeting has not started yet. So why are you in my face? And Craig goes, this is a public space. You're in a public arena.

That's what I have a right to do. And Bobby goes, you can present your agenda when the meeting starts. Otherwise, leave me alone. And so the officer opens the door to the building and kind of pats Bobby so he can go inside. And Craig says, well, he says to get in there. Do what the man tell you to, boy. Oh. Oh. Yeah. So everyone goes inside, and Craig keeps antagonizing everybody.

He's still got his laptop up, and he says to one of the other white guys in Leith, What's your boy's name? And the guy responds, I'm warning you motherfucker you better get that out of my face oh okay now was it the mayor who said that hard to say there were a bunch of really angry north dakota dudes who were not intimidated by craig and his little laptop i'm i'm telling you i'm shocked as shit this guy didn't get shot in the face yeah things got more and more intense and one of the Leith guys said, he's not my boy, he's a man.

And you shove me, I will hit you. And Craig was kind of loving this, I think. He's like, I'm staying right here, I'm right here. You know, acting all innocent. Yeah. While being the world's biggest asshole. So people were kind of starting to lose their cool. Heather and Lee Cook had moved to Leith

after Lee's 17-year-old daughter was murdered in Washington. They'd wanted to start over. They'd wanted peace. And here they were dealing with this shit. And they didn't feel safe. And they were vocal, vocally opposed to what Craig was doing. And soon Craig began posting their information online. He posted their names, birthdates, siblings' names, Lee's ex-wife's name. Explain your face. I mean, it's just ridiculous.

Yeah. I mean, anything to torture somebody. Lee and Heather began sleeping with guns nearby. Yeah. Lee wouldn't even go out in his front yard without a gun on him. Mm-mm. He said, people really take it for granted that somebody like Cobb isn't going to do something to their children. And I wasn't willing to take that chance.

Yeah. Yeah, he'd been through too much. Yeah. At another city council meeting, the city council was, again, trying to conduct their business. But Craig was there and he wouldn't shut up. He kept interrupting, saying that their last meeting was illegal because they hadn't provided notice, which you are supposed to provide public notice, but, you know, I don't know. Do you really need to notify your local neo-Nazi about what you're doing? I'd say bend the rules.

Yeah. People tried to get him to pipe down, and then Craig goes, your daughter was murdered, right, Lee Cook? Was your daughter murdered? Did you have anything to do with it? So at this point, someone gets up, and I believe it's the county attorney. And he says, this is a public meeting.

You'll have time to talk through the public session. And Craig goes, yeah, I wondered if any of his actions aggravated the murder. You see? Oh, my gosh. Yeah. Yeah, that's really cool. Yeah. Just antagonize a man whose child was murdered. Yeah. The town was in a really bad situation. The mayor called the governor's office and was like, look, what do we do? This is really, really bad.

And the governor was like, look, you know, just keep your people calm. And Ryan was like, I can't keep them calm much longer. Later, he talked about it with some people at the bar. And he's like, look, Lee cook is the nicest guy on earth but if he's pushed too far he's not just gonna go over and slap the dude the i mean that's what amazing is amazing to me is like i feel like this is an area of the country where a lot of people have guns like yeah you really want to antagonize a bunch of people with guns, right? The police weren't a ton of help, but in their defense, you know, this is a really small town. They only had three deputies, one sheriff.

The county was huge. So if something went down, they really didn't have back. Yeah. The city council had to look at their options, and they didn't have many. One of their options was to dissolve the town. If the town no longer existed, then there would be no government to take over. That sucks. Oh, oh, it absolutely sucks.

Another option was the regional health authority. So none of Craig's properties had running water or sewer or anything. So the city council passed some new ordinances requiring that everyone have running water. And, you know, they gave him 30 days to comply. And, of course, that pissed him off because that ordinance had been targeted at him, maybe. Sure. See, this is when I think it gets complicated. Because on the one hand, I don't want for anyone to be targeted.

Yeah. But I will make an exception for neo-Nazis. Yeah. Yeah. Typically, that would seem like an abuse of power. Mm-hmm. In this situation, I don't know that they had any other choices. Yeah. Of course, Kynan was devastated. Kynan said, because I'm a white nationalist and a national socialist, they're levying these laws specifically to drive us out because of what we

believe, which is against the law. It's against our civil liberties. It's against our First Amendment rights. And it's sad because that's white Americans hating on us, who are also white Americans. Wait, are hate groups protected? I mean, here's the thing. We do have... Our freedom of speech laws are pretty robust. Yeah.

Oh, God, is he right? Is this one of those things where the worst person you've ever known has just made? I mean, I'm not going to call it a decent point because I think honestly. I think this has this case is changing my views on the First Amendment. Yeah, I've I've kind of always thought that like. You have to protect all speech. Especially if it's unpopular, because you never know what's going to be unpopular from one day to the next. But I don't know.

Other countries have figured out a way to limit hate speech. Yeah. And yeah, I feel like there should be a way to stop something like this from happening. Yeah. Because, you know, the Nazis got elected into power. Yep. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

So that was happening. You know, that was bad for Craig and his vision. But the good news was that all this drama was putting a spotlight on Craig's unwavering commitment to white supremacy. And Craig couldn't resist the spotlight. So when someone challenged him to take a DNA test and prove that he was 100% white, he accepted. Oh, great. How'd that go? Craig was invited on the Trisha Goddard show. Have you heard of that? No. Me neither. Okay. You know, it was one of these deals, daytime television, and he's going to have his DNA results revealed on live television. Okay. Craig was happy to comply. The clip is beautiful, and I will describe it to you now.

Yes, please. Okay, so, you know, picture it. Can I picture? I need to look up Trisha Goddard. Okay. Just so I can have an image here. Picture, like, beautiful black woman, British accent. Okay. Oh yeah, she's beautiful. Well yeah, she's on TV.

Oh my god, okay. The smile. So he's on what looks to be a very typical daytime TV set. He's in a suit and he's sitting next to a black woman. Across from him is Tricia, who is also a black woman. And Tricia has her reading glasses on and she's about to reveal the results of his DNA test. So she's reading and she says, 86% European. And Craig just looks like a statue. Yeah.

He was completely still. He's stunned. And the black woman next to him just bursts out into the most joyful giggles. And Craig just looks like a statue. He goes completely still. He's stunned. And the black woman next to him just bursts out into the most joyful giggles. And she keeps giggling. And Trisha has to talk over her giggles as Craig's whole white supremacist life flashes before his eyes. And the audience is cheering. And Trisha says, 14% sub-Saharan African.

Shut up. And Craig goes, wait a minute, wait a minute. And at this point, the woman next to him is literally slapping her knees. She's laughing so hard. And Craig says, wait a minute, hold on. Just wait a minute. This is called statistical noise. And Trisha says, sweetheart, you have a little black in you.

And Greg goes, listen, listen, I'll tell you this. Oil and water don't mix. And Tricia gets up and she goes in to fist bump him. She goes, so, hey, bro. And she tries to fist bump him and his face goes red and he pulls his hand away and he goes, no, no, no. And the audience cheers. cheers oh my gosh from there the documentary cuts to bobby harper and he's just cracking up he's going he's black it's a real bright spot in a really horrible document. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Are you okay over there?

Are you still looking at pictures of Trisha? I'm looking at Trisha Goddard. I was wondering how I've never heard of her show. Where did it air? When did it air? I watched a lot of daytime doc shows. I was kind of surprised I hadn't heard of her either. I think it only lasted for two seasons, but even then I thought we would know.

Oh, it's a British show. Oh, is it British? Yeah, I believe so. Well, she's British. Oh no, she hosted a U.S. version of her own talk show. Yeah, sometimes they let British people come over here. No, it was originally a British show. That's what I was reading. It was originally a British show, and then she did

two seasons of it in the United States. Did you know that they let John Oliver come over here? Stop it. Anyway. Moving on. The look on your face is like when Craig realized he was 14%. No it is not!

What? Oh, Craig was humiliated. Absolutely humiliated. Suddenly all of his little Aryan friends didn't think he was cool anymore. Wait, what are you looking at now? I gotta close this Wikipedia page. I'm looking at a list of Tricia Connors' spouses, and her current partner is just listed as Mr. Boo. Her spouse is, and her current partner is just listed as Mr. Boo.

That's okay. She's keeping it private. Unless his name is on his birth certificate. Mr. Boo. Mr. Boo. Okay, I'm closing the Wikipedia. Ma'am, are you ready to focus on the story? Yeah. Boy, I love it when this happens.

Hey, I'm just going to do a quick Sudoku while you tell me this story. I fucking wish I could do Sudoku while you're telling the story. I like to multitask. I would be engaged as well. No, you wouldn't. But if I could just be over here crushing best fiends levels. No, you wouldn't. Yeah, I would.

You would not be engaged. I would. I would. Brandy, the reason I always stop is because... Well, because that's when I'm reading something. Yeah. Yeah, I don't have to read Best Fiends. I don't think you're as good at multitasking as you think you are.

I'm excellent at multitasking. No, you're not. I am. No, you're terrible at it. You're not engaged in conversation when you're looking at a screen. That's your boomer news right there. Okay, so Craig's humiliated. Just devastated.

To make matters worse, when he got back home to Leith, he discovered that people had written a bunch of anti-racist stuff on the outside of his house. Anti-racist stuff! Which I want to know what it is! Also, on Kynan and Debra's car, I don't know when somebody did this, but they wrote in spray paint, dick, on the side of their car, which I thought was kind of interesting, because normally you just see people spray paint a dick. Like an actual dick. Yeah, they don't write dick.

Do you think maybe that was lost in translation somewhere? No, I think they were calling him a dick. Yeah, but you could also just put a penis on it. Yeah, but I think that might require a leap for Kynan to see that they were calling him a dick. And they didn't want to leave anything up to mystery. Well, they also wrote go home on the other side of the code. Yeah, sure. Go home, dick.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. If you do a full walk around they also wrote go home on the other side of the code. Yeah, sure. Go home, dick. Yeah. Oh, yeah. If you do a full walk around, you get the full sentence. Okay, I got it. So a few days after he got home, he and his little friend,

Kynan, decided to patrol Leith. Oh, boy. Can you call it patrolling when you're not in charge or have any form of authority? Kenan's wife, Deborah, recorded the whole thing on her cell phone because they didn't see how this video could possibly look bad for them. Also, do you remember that time we went on that trip together to branson and norm took a

video of any mouth breathes to the entire time yeah deborah my god she was mouth breathing this whole time okay so in this video you see kynan and craig walking down a dirt road carrying guns and deborah goes this is video documentation that we're protecting our turf and not trying to be threatening to anyone yes they are carrying this is mr cobb and my lover kynan dutton patrolling with sexy ass guns yes it is stop the hate stop the hate. Stop the hate? Yeah, because... We're not threatening in any way? Hey, hey, hey, hey, they got their car spray painted. That's hateful.

Honestly. So when I watch... Wait, if hate is directed at a hate group, doesn't that just like cancel out? Like don't two negatives become positive? No, no, now they're really victims the funny thing is like so i i watched this documentary once through just to see if i wanted to do a case on it i was kind of like half watching it yeah and i was very are you playing best fiends while you're doing it no i believe i was shot i was online shot okay great so i was very confused by this video because they just kind of drop it into the documentary

without much context yeah and because she was like calling kind and her lover and saying they were patrolling with sexy ass guns i i couldn't register to me that that was a genuine thing. And I was like, so is this woman like sarcastically mocking these guys? And then when she said stop, I really thought I really thought like, oh, OK. So this is like one of the good ones. one of the good ones. So, you know, Craig, I don't think,

really appreciated Debra's commentary very much because he's more of a serious watcher so he goes, make sure that we're both in the camera. And Debra goes,

oh yeah, I haven't let you guys out of the screen the whole time. And then, you know, again, she's losing steam so she's like, okay, you guys are going quicker

than I am. So she's trying to keep up. At some point. Having flashbacks to us returning from lunch today. Oh my gosh. You and Norm ran up the hill and I was just trucking along

behind you. Almost got locked out of the house. You called us assholes. I did. Listen, sometimes Norm and I like to power walk. Norm's a very fast power walker. He is a very fast power walker. It's how I was first drawn to him.

I saw those swiveling hips. So at some point, Craig and Kynan come across this you know this woman she's an unarmed clearly a resident of Leith and Craig starts yelling at her and again they've got these fucking guns and Craig's not making a ton of sense I'm just gonna read read directly, but, you know, he... What? How would you react? You're just outside in your house. You're like, you're in your yard. You're in your side yard doing a little gardening. Two men come walking down your street with guns.

Oh, my God. I think it depends on a lot of things. One, have they spotted me already? Do they know me? And are they after me? Because, like, clearly everyone knows each other in this town. And I think part of me would be weighing, okay, am I going to make it fun for them if I run? Right.

I'm not totally sure what I would do. I don't know what I would do either. I feel like I would try to handle it the way this woman does. So Craig says, you know, the video kind of cuts out a little bit, but Craig says, tell your husband, too. And the woman goes, I forgive you. Oh. And Craig goes, you forgive me? You keep pushing.

I don't forgive you. You keep pushing and pushing, you fucking Christian shithead. What are they? Anti-Christian, too? Are they love the Lord? he that he is the lord all right all right sorry i'm trying to keep up with all the hate then craig stops and he says to someone off camera who i assume i assume by this point the woman has gone inside and her husband has come out and he goes and craig says

to him hey you son of a bitch christian i'll treat you the same way come on over here you think because she's a woman fuck you you little pussy boy come on over here we're going to property hey you fucking asshole you're running us out of this goddamn town controverting every goddamn to get with him and then you got the nerve to tell us we're the fucking demented ones fuck you yeah no there's no question who the demented ones are here sir then again he turns to deborah and goes make sure you got us on camera and deborah's like i got it at one point a man says i'm surprised though for a man that wants to have a community and craig goes hey fuck you with your double talk christian shit man you're not jewish but

you act like a man go up there and you tell the rest of them to act comport themselves with some goddamn dignity fuck you you fucking and then just a bunch of slurs great so by this point of course the i wrote here the calls to 9-1-1 are pouring in it's a trickle obviously there are like 20 people in town but yeah the people of leith were terrified of these two nut jobs who were clearly agitated starting fights with people, carrying guns. It's my personal opinion that they were hoping something would go down. Because on their own video, Kynan and Craig were talking shit about the mayor for not coming out of his house. Mm-hmm.

They wanted him to come out and confront them, I guess. And Craig said, wouldn't be surprised if they don't come out and attack us at some point. And Kynan said, good. I've been meaning to get some target practice. Holy shit. Yeah. So they have a good laugh over that. And then Craig reminded him to let them take the first shot. Mm hmm.

Craig reminded him to let them take the first shot. When the police showed up, Craig instructed Kynan and Deborah not to say anything. And he told the police, we're on our way home. We're just going home. And the police were like, OK, then go home. See, this is what scares me is the thing about wait for them to take the first shot yeah he knows he knows the law yeah he knows enough and then the police come and all of a sudden oh he's not he's not shouting slurs he's he's everybody be quiet we're just headed home yep the police officers try to ask him some questions. He's not talking.

Again, it's that scary thing. If you know the rules and if you have the self-control to stay in the box, you can do a ton of damage. Absolutely. Police did arrest Craig and Kynan. Prosecutors asked that they be held without bail, and the judge agreed. Both men were charged with seven felony counts of terrorizing. They were facing a maximum sentence of 30 years. Wow. But according to prosecutor Todd Schwartz, the case fell apart.

Evidently, after a pretrial conference, one of the people who Craig and Kynan had harassed that day said that he hadn't been afraid of them that day. He said, I'm really not afraid of Cobb and Dutton at all, period. But at the time, as a photographer, you know, photographers are weird. We just go after the story and the film and so on and we really don't think about any danger. What? That's such a weird take. Why is it weird? I don't...

I don't know. Why... I don't know. I don't really know what to make of it. Okay. So the prosecutor said that he talked to that guy and said, you know, if you weren't in fear for your life or serious bodily injury, then it doesn't count as terrorizing. And he claims that the man responded, well, you know, I'll just, you know, say whatever I need to on the stand. Mm hmm. responded well you know i'll just you know say whatever i need to on the stand and the prosecutor was like well i can't put you i can't put you on the stand yeah okay so my take on this because i feel like we've seen a couple cases where

something like this where a person has to say i was afraid yeah i was afraid for my life this man right here scared me yeah i have noticed that it tends to fall apart with men mm-hmm yeah being willing to say that yeah yeah and i'm sorry I don't fucking buy that you weren't afraid of two guys who had guns. I don't either. And were yelling slurs. It's extremely threatening. That's scary. That's scary.

That's okay to be afraid of that. That is normal to be afraid of it. Yeah. But I do think that there's like a fucking toxic masculinity thing. Yeah, trying to just be a man here and not be scared of anything i could be wrong but that's just my take on it yeah but i've never been wrong like when i made all those bestiality jokes that wasn't wrong okay All comedy gold. So the prosecutor dropped the charge of terrorizing that particular guy. He said, we now have a weakened case because of no other way to put it. Somebody has lied or misled law enforcement.

Thoughts? Gosh, I don't know i don't agree with this prosecutor yeah i don't either i i can see we're going to have to drop that. Yeah. Because, yeah, you fucked up, Greg. You're not supposed to, you know, say that. Right. Even though I really don't buy that he wasn't afraid. But whatever. But we have video of them.

Yeah. You have all these other witnesses who can testify. Mm-hmm. So Kynan got a plea deal. All of his charges were dropped to misdemeanors in exchange for him testifying against Craig at the upcoming trial. at the upcoming trial. But Craig never went to trial. On February 27, 2014, Craig pled guilty to one felony count of terrorizing and five counts of misdemeanor menacing. In court, he got a haircut, first of all. Okay.

So that looked a lot better. Yeah. Also, he wore a very tight, long-sleeved white shirt. How tight was it? Extremely tight. Oh. It kind of looked like one of those thermal shirts that you're supposed to put something on over. Yeah.

That's too tight. Too tight. In court, he apologized for his actions. He did? Yeah. Again, this is the shit that scares me. He put on a good face when he needed to. Absolutely.

I honestly, again, it's one of those things. If you didn't know the story, I don't know how likely you'd be to buy this. But I mean, he's saying the right things. He's saying, I accept responsibility. I apologize. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And like, how many cases have we seen where people can't even just do that?

Absolutely, yeah. He can do it. Yeah. He received four years of supervised probation. He'd been in jail for three months up to that point. And now he was free to go, sort of. He was allowed to live anywhere in North Dakota except for Leith. He couldn't own a gun again. He couldn't have contact with the victims again.

The people of Leith were outraged that Craig Cobb had gotten essentially a slap on the wrist. They were really upset with the prosecutor. Afterward, Lee Cook told the media, he terrorized our neighborhood. I was in fear of my own life. And he really disputed this idea that Craig was truly sorry. Lee said, if you watch the videos of him coming after me for my murdered daughter, you'll see that he isn't sorry for anything.

Yeah. Lee called it a failure of justice. And I agree. Yeah, absolutely. After Craig was let out, the documentary showed him in a hotel and he was back on his hate sites talking about how the way to stop Jewish people is to, quote, physically take apart their molecules and atoms. So kill them? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, is that, that's what he's saying, right? That's how I take it.

Yeah. How else do you? How else do you take that? And about a month later, a white supremacist named Glenn Miller murdered three people at the Overland Park Jewish Community Center. Yep. And the day before, he'd been talking with his good friend, Craig Cobb. Shut up.

Mm-mm. So, everybody, that's the Jewish Community Center that's in Johnson County, Kansas. Yeah. Yeah. And that guy was talking to Craig. Craig evidently wanted to serve his probation in Missouri. He petitioned the court for that, saying that he wanted to care for his elderly mother. But the court was like, no, you haven't talked to your mom in like 40 years, so fuck off.

As of right now, Craig doesn't own any property in Leith. And I kind of love this. So the people of Leith decided, okay, if you're dealing with a snake, you got to cut the snake's head off. So since the Board of Health had condemned all of Craig's properties, they took the liberty of lighting his buildings on fire. So three of Craig's old properties are still owned by white supremacists. But if they want to come to town, they'll have to build a structure from the ground up. But Craig's still trying to do his thing. He tried to start white supremacist communities in a few other states, and none of them really took off. And in 2017, he bought a church in Nome,

North Dakota. He had big plans for it. He wanted to make it into a creativity movement chapel, which is the new name of his religion. Would you like to know what he planned to name the church? Boy, would I. The President Donald J. Trump Creativity Church of Rome. Oh, my gosh. Mm-hmm.

He told the media, that's the name because it's beautiful. President Trump is like a god emperor, can do no wrong. A god emperor? Mm-hmm. A god emperor. Apparently, that's high praise in white supremacist circles. I don't know. But weirdly, on the day that broke about, you know, Craig's plans for his racist church, you know, word got out and oopsies.

Oh, my gosh. The building caught fire and it burned to the ground. Oh, you hate to see that happen. People are pretty sure it was arson, but nobody's sure who did it. Yeah. And that is the story of when a white supremacist came to town. Holy shit. Honestly, I'm like, I don't know what the fuck you do in this situation.

I don't either. It makes me think of that story out of Missouri. Is it Skidmore, Missouri? Oh, Skidmore, where you have the town bully was murdered in broad daylight. No one saw anything. Yeah, so this guy was a total terrible shithead. My mom

has been on me to do this case for a long time. He was an awful man, made life miserable for everybody, and somebody killed him in like the town square, wasn't it? in the middle of the afternoon and oh my goodness no one no one saw it boy that was a long story i'm i'm sorry that took so long no it was very interesting i

fucking hated it but it was very interesting it is terrifying to me. The most terrifying part is someone who is that evil but is able to kind of stay within certain bounds and, oh, God. Yeah. Like, dude, what the fuck happened to you? Yeah. And how cool is it that he drove Barack Obama around in Hawaii and Barack Obama felt like he could. Just confiding in him. Yeah, amazing. Unbelievable, I say.

Yeah, so cool. Oh, you know what, Brandy? I'd like to do an ad. Doodaloo. Oh, I am excited to lean back and hear a story because I'm boy, I hated I hated learning about white supremacy. Oh, we're back from the ad. OK, you want to hear about a murder for hire plot? I do.

You're going to like it. Is it a lot lighter than what I just did? Considerably lighter. Great. You're going to like it. Is it a lot lighter than what I just did? Considerably lighter, yes. Great. All right. Bring it on. Yeah. Shout outs to an episode of Dateline that I listened to and did not watch.

An episode of Snapped that I did. I watched the whole thing. I watched it with my peepers. And then an entry for ChillingCrimes.com. my peepers and then an entry for chilling crimes.com it was after 11 p.m on september 1st 2016 happens to be david's birthday when he was born in 2016 which makes their relationship disgusting no the other night i was like what'd you do for your 27th birthday? And he was like, I don't know. Why? I was like, what'd you do?

And he's like, did you see a picture or something? Like, what? Where is this coming from? And I was like, oh, my case I'm doing happened on your 27th birthday. Oh. He didn't remember what he did. Yeah. Who would?

Yeah. I probably would. I don't know. What'd you do on your 27th birthday? I don't fucking know. It'd take me a minute. I'd have to figure out what year that was and then I'd be a whole thing. Yeah. Anyway, it doesn't matter. Anyway. So it's September 1st, 2016. It's after 11 p.m. when Jason Kovach called 911. He told the operator that his friend, 47-year-old Greg Mulvihill, had been shot. Jason told the call taker he's bleeding pretty badly.

According to Jason, he was with his friend at a trail off. What is wrong with you today? Did you call the dispatcher a call taker because you didn't want to mess up the word dispatcher? Okay, I've recently read somewhere that using the term dispatcher interchangeably with operator is incorrect. Because typically it's one person who takes the call and then somebody else who dispatches the actual. Blow it out your ass. Anyway. Really? Yeah.

Anyway. Anyway, he said. Actually. Yeah. Anyway. Anyway, he said he was with his friend at a trail off of Avenida Soledad near Rancho Santa Fe Road in Carlsbad, California. So they'd come to this little trail and they were attacked by a sniper. What? Greg had been shot. He was taken to the hospital for an emergency surgery. The bullet had hit Greg and it had entered like his side near his armpit and it had exited through his back near his shoulder blade. The damage was extensive and doctors quickly went to work to try and save his life. While he was in emergency surgery, police spoke to Jason to try and figure out like what the hell were they doing at that trail at 11 o'clock at night? Well, and what was a sniper doing? Right. And so Jason told them that on that night, Greg got a call from a man who claimed to be a private investigator.

The caller, this mystery caller, had told Greg that he had uncovered some information that may be important to him in his divorce proceedings. And that it would have an impact on the custody of his son, and that he would give Greg this one chance to come see whatever documents he had. He had to come that night. He had to come to the trail, and this mystery caller, this mystery private investigator, would place a packet with all of this information in it at the base of a power pole on this trail that's so ridiculous yeah so jason told the police that greg was in the middle of this like very bitter divorce and this very tough custody battle with his wife, Diana Lovejoy. Diana was like a technical writer for, I think, Nokia at the time.

Super successful, six-figure income. Greg was like a computer programmer, also very successful. They'd met on a dating site in 2005. And initially, they seemed like a really good match. They both liked the outdoors. They loved California. They were both kind of in the tech field, like really good match. They both liked the outdoors. They loved California. They were both kind of in the tech field, like really good match. They married two years into their relationship. And then for years, they tried to have a child, but they struggled. But finally, in 2012,

they welcomed a son. And after that, their relationship began to deteriorate a bit. And after that, their relationship began to deteriorate a bit. Greg was like laid off from his job. So Diana became the sole provider. They had bought like a very, well, I say very expensive, probably not that expensive for the area. An $800,000 like oceanfront condo. But for Carl's dad, that's probably, yeah, it sounds amazing. That's probably like entry level home. I'm guessing. Here that would buy a lot of house. That's probably. Yeah, it sounds amazing. That's probably like entry level home.

Here that would buy a lot of house. And so, yeah, so things were, you know, a little bit tough with Greg getting laid off and whatever. And Diana started to complain that she was suffering from chronic fatigue. And she told, you know, her friends, her loved ones that she believed that, you know, she was having some major health issues. Diana believed that she had fibromyalgia. And she also believed that her son and her husband both had some kind of pretty serious illness. More on that later. So this took a major toll on the marriage. And in 2014, they decided to divorce. Jason told the police that he actually thought the divorce was kind of like all wrapped up by this point. They'd come to an agreement. Everything was supposed to be finalized soon. But when Greg got that call that day, he was like, what the fuck is this?

Yeah. And it turns out that someone at the Carlsbad Police Department had actually spoken to Greg that night, the night of the shooting. When he got that call from the person claiming to be a private investigator, Greg had called the Carlsbad Police like non-emergency line. And he was like, hey, I got this call. Like, this is what they said. This feels really sketched to me. Yeah. You know, can I get your take on it?

Yeah. And they'd been like, yeah, I mean, it sounds kind of odd, but, you know, they didn't seem to think it was that alarming. What? It sounds like it's out of a stupid movie. I agree. Yeah. No, someone's clearly trying to lure you somewhere.

Yeah. I totally agree. And I feel like Greg did the right you somewhere yeah i totally agree and i feel like greg did the right thing he called the police and was like hey is this weird and they were like kind of weird but doesn't really seem like anything to worry about and so greg decided that he needed to go he needed to find out like what this person knew what information this person had and but he didn't want to go alone. And so he called Jason, who happened to be his boss because he's now reemployed and whatever. And so he calls his boss, Jason, and he's like, hey, a super weird thing happened.

Will you come with me? They live very close to each other. And this place was like a mile from where they both lived. And so Jason's like, absolutely no problem. So the caller had given directions to Greg and told him where to go. Come to this trail. Walk to the power pole. The packet of documents will be taped to the power pole. Would you do this?

No. I don't think I would either. No, I don't think I would. Or would my curiosity get the best of me? I know. I'm like sitting here hesitating for a minute because I'm like, I'm really fucking curious. Yeah. Yeah, my curiosity might get the best of me? I know. I'm like sitting here hesitating for a minute because I'm like, I'm really fucking curious. Yeah. Yeah, my curiosity might get the best of me.

And I think that like Greg, I could see like, okay, I'm not going to go by myself. I've called the police. You know, they seem to think that this is okay. I might go. All right. It's my job to stop you. Okay. Well, well I mean you're the fucking person I'm calling so yeah the night of September 1st 2016 was especially dark because it was a new moon so like Greg knew this trail area was a place that he'd been many times. And so he knew it was going to be very dark. He was, you know, concerned that this was maybe some kind of weird setup to begin with.

So he brought a flashlight. He actually brought the light off of his mountain bike, not like an actual flashlight. And then he had like this little like child sized baseball bat that he had Jason carry. OK. So they get to this area that the caller told them to go to. They walk about like 100 yards to this trail. They're walking up. They see the Power Pool.

Like I said, it's very dark. And they get there. They see something white at the base of the Power Pool and they look at it. And it's a towel with like an Angry Birds character on it. And so now Greg's like, OK, this is for sure a fucking setup. Like, what is this? And so he takes his mountain bike light and he starts like shining it around looking. And then they both hear rustling in the bushes near them.

And so they shine the light that direction. near them and so they shine the light that direction and there in the bushes is a man laying on his belly in a sniper position dressed in camouflage holy shit with a fucking ar-15 oh my god at one point one of the men either greg or jason yelled either either run or gun, and the two of them took off to where they had parked the car. As they took off, though, the sniper started shooting. Right. They heard six or seven shots. It all happened so fast that Greg didn't even realize he had been shot until they got in the car and he had driven away. Oh, my God.

He had to pull the car over on the side of the road and have Jason call 911. Holy shit. Yeah. He knew that he felt something. Right, right. And, like, even, like, it tripped him up a little bit. Yeah. But he just, yeah, he just kept running.

And it wasn't until they get to the car that they realized just, like, blood is pouring out of him. Oh, my God. Yeah. get to the car that they realize just like blood is pouring out of him oh my god yeah so paramedics come they get him they take him to the hospital to start get him into emergency surgery like he's in bad shape like this is a this is a through and through shot yep also the court record goes into how dangerous of a spot that is to get shot. Yeah, I'm convinced. There's all kinds of arteries. Sure. Absolutely.

But now there's this word of a sniper on the loose in the area. So police like descended on the area of this trail. Helicopters flew overhead. They did ground searches. They actually sent out a reverse 911 call to residents in the area. And you know, this was a thing. And they told them to secure their doors and windows. I love that.

I had no idea that was a thing. I didn't know that was a thing at all. Okay. But at the trail, there was no sign of the shooter. Well, yeah, he had fucked off at that point. Yeah, he was gone. Plus he was in camo. Sorry, but it's true.

You're right. You're right. There was a disgusting piece of evidence that they uncovered there at the scene, though. Piss jar. Worse than that. Poop? Yep. Yeah, he had to take a dookie and he didn't take it with him. In the bushes where Jason had described seeing this camouflaged man,

police found a towel covered in feces. Oh my god, that's how they're going to catch him. They're going to... Are you kidding me? The dump will undo him. So they talk about this on the Snapped episode and they're like, we found a towel

covered in feces. And then it cuts to this other woman and she's like, more specifically, it was diarrhea. It was fresh diarrhea. Come on, lady. And then it cuts to this other guy. He's like, you know, so rarely do you find, you know, fresh shit at a crime scene. It's very convenient.

It's like, you know, well, the joke is always like they wish that the dude would jizz everywhere in every crime scene. But, you know, a big diarrhea dump will do it. A big diarrhea dump will do it. Yeah. So they take this towel covered in fresh diarrhea and send it off to the lab for DNA analysis. Gross. Uh-huh.

You love it a little bit, don't you? I love everything about it. I love that this guy is clearly part of this elaborate plan. I love that he took the time to get his little camo outfit on. Uh-huh. I love that he's got an AR-15

for this. Yeah. He's big and bad. And and oopsies he shits himself shits himself my question did he have food poisoning was it just the nerves of the night did he think about it later like oh my gosh i left that shit rag oh no you know i mean that's yeah yeah you're right i do it. I love everything about it. I knew you would. That was like the little. So I was just like, I read like a couple of different things.

And I was like, that's the thing. Kristen's going to love that. The poop lures are in. That's right. Miraculously, Greg survived the surgery. He came through it with flying colors and he was able to speak. He was able to speak to detectives. I was not.

Fairly quickly. He told police that he was, in fact, like in the middle of a pretty nasty divorce and custody battle. And they're like, well, we found pretty nasty stuff. I'm sorry. I will get over it. I will get over it. I'm sorry. I will get over it.

I will get over it. I just loved on the Snap episode where they at first were like, a towel covered in feces. And like, it's like, oh, OK, that really, that's enough. Yeah, you get it. Yeah, we got it. No, they had to go further. This is diarrhea. Fresh diarrhea. Fresh diarrhea.

Well, it is relevant that it's fresh. It is relevant that it's fresh. It absolutely is relevant that it's fresh. It is relevant that it's fresh. It absolutely is relevant that it's fresh. It is a crusty diarrhea towel. We don't know who's this is. We don't know when it got left there. Exactly. Anyway.

You know what? Your case is just as disgusting as my bestiality jokes. No. And I wish you would stop. No, it's not. So Greg tells police that he and Diana had been having issues for years, and he confirmed to them that this divorce was not amicable. And they developed the belief that she and Greg and their son were all ill and that they needed to take massive doses of guafinicin. What's that?

It's the active ingredient in mucinics. Oh. Okay. So, okay, none of the stuff that I found went into this very much. But it seems that, like, Diana started going to maybe some kind of like alternative doctor. OK. And this alternative doctor was like, yes, I know exactly what's wrong with you. You need massive doses of this guafenicin.

So does your husband. So does your son. And so she comes home and she tells her family this. This is what's wrong with all of them. And Greg kind of goes along with it a little bit initially. Yeah. Kind of like, well, how how much harm can it do? Exactly. And then he stops taking it.

But he goes and sees this doctor that Diana has like all this faith in now. And the doctor's like, oh, my gosh, you're so much better. See, it's the medicine. Only he's stopped taking it. Right. And so then he's like, OK, this guy is, you know, full of shit. This isn't real at all. Yeah.

And so then he decides, like, he's putting his foot down. He's like, I don't think we should be taking this anymore. I don't think our son should be taking this. And he was like, I just don't think this is healthy. Mm hmm. And so Greg actually was like, OK, let's get him seen by some specialists. Let's see. Let's get some other opinions.

Let's take him to Children's Hospital. Was there actually something wrong with them? I don't believe so. OK. I don't believe so. I think Diana likely really was suffering from some kind of chronic fatigue syndrome or fibromyalgia perhaps. But no. It seems like Greg, probably fine.

Kid, probably fine. OK. Gotcha. Yes. And so he arranged like for some testing to be done at like children's hospital and diana was like nope nope absolutely not and then like i think at one point he was seen by a doctor and a doctor was like yeah no there's nothing there's nothing here he's totally healthy so you've got this belief that their son is ill. Diana's suffering from chronic fatigue, maybe fibromyalgia.

And like all of this stuff kind of came to a head in 2014 when Diana made a shocking accusation about her husband, Greg. So in 2014, that's when she really started to think that she was suffering from, you know, some kind of condition. She said she would wake up really sore in the morning and very groggy. And she told a friend that she believed that Greg was drugging her and raping her while she was unconscious. Oh, shit. Yeah. She also claimed that Greg was molesting their son.

Oh, no. Mm-hmm. that Greg was molesting their son. Oh, no. Mm-hmm. So Diana obtained a restraining order against Greg based on these accusations. What led her to believe that? Do you know?

No. Okay. I do not know. Oh, boy. From what these articles say, just that she was waking up very groggy and her body was sore when she was waking up. Okay.

And so she takes these accusations to the police. She secures a restraining order. Greg is basically forbidden to see his son while an investigation was conducted. Investigation was conducted. Yeah. Over the course of that investigation, Greg went through psychological and sexual evaluations. I don't know what a sexual evaluation is, but he went through a whole bunch of evaluations from court ordered doctors. And Diane and their young son were also put through various evaluations. And at the end, it was determined that there was

no evidence that any such abuse had ever taken place. Diana's claims were determined to be completely unfounded. And the court ordered psychiatrist actually determined that the child, their son, should be in Greg's care at least 50 percent of the time. Yeah. They felt like he was the safer parent for the child to be with. Yeah. Oh. Yeah, it's really.

This is grim. Really rough. Yes. From that point, divorce proceedings move forward. And in 2016, Diana and Greg entered into a settlement agreement. So the settlement agreement would allow Diana to stay in the family home. But in return, she had to pay Greg like his portion of the equity in the house. Sure. So this would mean she would have to pay him a payment of $120,000. That would be his portion of the equity in order for her to stay in the home.

And she had 90 days from the execution of the divorce to pay out this amount. Also, Greg was working again, but he was making less money than he was before and significantly less money than Diana was. So she was also ordered to pay some amount of child support, even though they were splitting care 50-50. And spousal support? I don't believe spousal support. Yeah, there was no mention of spousal support, just mention of child support. Gotcha. So this has been a very tumultuous time for Greg. He's been accused of horrible things. He's been kept from his son. Like it's really rough. But it seems like in June of 2016, they've come to an agreement that, you know, meets, you know, both of their needs and that they're both good moving forward with it. Throughout this whole time, though, Diana had told people she felt unsafe alone in her home. And so she had started taking firearms training at a local gun range. And it

was there that she met a man named poopy pants named maybe a man named Weldon McDavid. OK, I think this name is fantastic. I also think that it sounds like a made-up name a la mrs doubtfire it absolutely sounds made up yes and it sounds like the exact kind of guy who i want to shit his pants right so why weldon mcdavid shat his pants yeah i mean i swear it sounds like a name that a guy like has to come up with the name on the spot, and he's looking at news headlines, and he's like, yeah, Weldon McDavid. It also sounds almost like a name that Moe would read out across the bar on The Simpsons. Yeah, a little too close to Holden McGroin. Yeah.

Yeah. Okay, I like it. Tell us all about Weldon, please. Weldon McDavid was a gun instructor at this firearms range where Diana started taking these classes. Initially, Diana and Weldon's relationship was just professional. He was training her on how to use guns. But then Diana confided in him that she was having some problems at home. She was in the middle of a divorce and she was scared of her husband. Yeah.

And yeah, so through... She needed protection from Mr. Poopypants. Yep. She needed some protection and Weldon was there to offer it for her. He set up some security systems at her house, security cameras and such, I believe, and also started banging her. He was married as well. Oh, great. So that's cool. Did he wish that he'd been Weldon? What? Did he wish that he'd been well? What?

Did he? You think your joke is so hilarious that you can't even say it? Did he wish that he'd been welled in his butthole shut? Okay. You know, so the poop couldn't get out. Yeah, we get it. We get the joke. Yeah, so Weldon was...

Is it ever painful for you how funny I am? Sometimes. Sometimes, yes. So Weldon was married, but that didn't stop him from, you know, entering into an affair with Diana. And all of the time she is complaining about her ex-husband or soon to be ex-husband who she's scared of. And she's just building up how scary Greg is. He has all these guns. He you know, she repeats the accusations that she made about him to Weldon, of course. And Weldon is infuriated by this.

Weldon had a bit of a hero complex. This is actually the second time that he'd connected with a woman at the gun range who was in need of some saving. In that instance, the woman was actually being raped and abused by her husband and weldon helped her get that like recorded and it helped her secure a conviction against him that's great yeah he was actually weldon was actually featured on an episode of dateline in relation to that case shut up no okay yeah and so yeah so he's now you know same gun range same just different different damsel in distress and he yeah he wanted to do anything he could to save diana any idea whether diana actually believed the things that she was saying? That I don't know.

Okay. I'm struggling with how to feel because... I agree. I guess there's part of me that's like, gosh, if she really felt that this was happening, that's just horrible for her. Of course, if she's totally making it up, then my God, she's a mess. Yeah, absolutely. Messier than that towel that's right with the fresh diarrhea please stop bringing that up so weldon and diana got very close and so he was closely following you know these divorce proceedings and every time court didn't go

the way that diana wanted to, she would be upset. And Weldon would be equally furious. So the police kind of learn of all of this. And they're like, okay. So somebody lured Greg to a dark trail and then fired at him. And then fired out his butthole. Perhaps Weldon may be involved here. Yes.

Yes. Mm-hmm. You know, if I were an interrogator, I'd be making so many jokes that he would snap. Yeah. So they did actually bring Weldon in for questioning. Yeah, they did. And he was like, at first he was like, I don't even know where, like they asked him about the area where the trail was. And he was like, yeah, no, I don't know that area at all.

And then they're asking him, you know, if he knows Diana from the gun range. And, you know, maybe I remember her. It's possible. I see a lot of people. Yeah, and they're like, I bet you wish you welded your butt shut by this time i'm sorry by this time i believe like by the time they're actually interrogating him they have tested the dna from the doo-doo rag against weldon's dna i'm not sure how they secured that sample but it's a match. And so he's denying having any involvement with Diana, any involvement in an ambush at the trail.

And then they're like, what would you say if we told you that we have your shit? They didn't say it that way. Yeah, that's exactly how the detective said it. Oh, my God. And he said, where did you say this was again? Let me try to remember all the places I've shat recently. Yeah, and they tell him that it's this trail, and they tell him the location.

He's like, you know what? I did go jogging in that area not that long ago, and as I was jogging, I did have to take a shit, now that you mention it. Turns out that, like, there was a jogging, I did have to take a shit. Now that you mention it. Turns out that like there was a jogging trail like 20 yards from Weldon's house. And so like the police were like, yeah, no, you didn't go like an hour away from where you live to go take a jog on this like pretty secluded trail. Well, and he already said he hadn't been. Yeah, exactly.

And so at that point, yeah, at that point when they call him on that, Weldon asked for an attorney and they terminated the interrogation. After they were able to match the DNA from Weldon to the doo-doo towel, they secured a search warrant for Weldon's home and they found the AR-15 that was used to shoot greg i don't know any more any more than that i don't know if they did ballistics test on it i just know that they declared it was the gun that had been used to shoot greg okay but they still didn't know like did weldon do this on his own or did diana put him up to this and so they decided that the best way to figure out if there was any involvement was to trace that phone that had called Greg the night of this shooting. So they have the number because Greg survived. It's in his phone. And so they trace it back. And it turns out it's just a burner phone. Of course. It's a track phone. But they were able to tell that it was purchased from a local Best Buy.

So they went to that Best Buy, asked to see surveillance footage from, you know, X number of days. And sure enough, they were able to find the purchase. And there on the surveillance footage was Diana Lovejoy purchasing the burner phone. So they bring Diana in and they question her and she admits that she did purchase that burner phone. But this is all a big misunderstanding. How? So all Weldon was doing was assisting her in getting full custody of her son.

By murdering her ex-husband? No, no, no, no, no. Greg was never supposed to be hurt. He was just supposed to be like scared a little bit. Scared enough into confessing that he had actually like molested their son. So like a witch hunt. Uh huh. Will torture you till you admit it.

No torture. He was supposed to be hurt. Just scared. And Weldon was going to do do that the police were like yeah no that's bullshit um they so they believed that diana had hired weldon yeah to murder greg and they had asked weldon about this when they interrogated him and he was like she did pay me to scare her like i was supposed to scare her ex-husband. She paid me a thousand dollars up front and then it was supposed to be a thousand dollars after.

That's not how that works. No. You know, I get paid five hundred dollars to go on dates with guys. Yeah. That's for sure not for a handy. Right. That's for a date to the olive garden. Do you get the endless soup salad and breadsticks? Oh, for sure. Yeah. We're not talking about handies here. Right. No. Right. Right. He's just paid to scare the dude. Yeah. Yeah. Totally normal. They paid to scare the dude.

Yeah. Yeah. Totally normal. Yeah. So on September 12, 2016, Diana Lovejoy and Weldon McDavid were both charged with conspiracy to commit murder and premeditated attempted murder. Yep. In October of 2017, Weldon and Diana went on trial together. They both pled not guilty.

What do you think of them having a joint trial? I don't know. I mean. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know either. I think it sounds. I wouldn't want a joint trial. I would want. Right. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know either. I think it sounds I wouldn't want a joint trial. I would want.

Right. Yeah. But maybe that's not an option. Maybe it's not. I don't. Yeah, I don't know. Hmm. I guess I'm just really surprised that neither one of them flipped on the other. I am, too. Huh. I am, too. OK, let's get into the court stuff so the prosecution during their opening statement said that diana had manipulated weldon into shooting greg due to the lies that she told him about the abuse that she had suffered at the hands of greg abuse the prosecution said simply did not happen the jury heard about the divorce, the custody battle, and the accusations Diana made about Greg. So the prosecution talked a little bit about this on the Snapped episode. I believe it was the Snapped episode. I don't know. I watched two shows. I also heard the Dateline episodes. I could be wrong. But they said there was like kind of a

thing about like how they handled these accusations. Do you just go head on and tell the jury about them? Do you hope the defense doesn't bring them in? And so that's how they decided to handle it. They decided to go head on, say these accusations were made, but these court ordered evaluations were done and it was determined to be completely unfounded. Yeah, I think you have to do that. I think you have to do it that way, too. Because otherwise it looks like you're trying to hide something. Absolutely. Absolutely. The prosecution called Diana's aunt, Diana Clark, to the stand.

She testified that on Christmas Day in 2015 that she met Diana at a restaurant. Diana had asked her to meet. She came and met her. And Diana asked her at that lunch if she could find her someone that would kill Greg. Aunt Diana said that Diana at that meeting told her that she had it all figured out. And Aunt Diana said, sorry, no no i don't know anyone like that and she left the meeting that is wild yeah but and she just left it at that yeah boy I hate that. I know.

OK. Yeah. Where'd they go to lunch? That I don't know. And I apologize. The prosecution told the jury all about Diana and Weldon's relationship, how they met at the shooting range, how he gave her firearm training and self-defense lessons. And then they began an affair. The affair started somewhere like around November of 2015. They exchanged multiple calls and texts over the course of that affair, naturally. OK. And they said sometime prior so the prosecution said sometime prior to the 15th of august 2016 i don't know how they came up with this date but they said diana and weldon put together a plan to kill greg their plan was that they would lure him to that isolated spot where

weldon could shoot him. And Diana agreed to pay Weldon $2,000, $1,000 before the shooting, $1,000 after. They also produced search history from Diana's computer where she had searched for when the new moon would be. And when there is a new moon, what the darkest part of the night is. And that they had specifically made those plans and lured him there at that time, knowing that Weldon would have the best cover during that time. I wonder if that's how they came up with the date for when the plan was. Possibly. Yeah. Yeah. When she made that search on Ask Jeeves, no doubt. I'm sure. I'm sure.

on Ask Jeeves, no doubt. I'm sure. I'm sure. The prosecution explained to the jury that the plan obviously involved Weldon calling Greg to lure him to that spot. And so Diana had to buy that burner phone. They were shown the security footage from the Best Buy where Diana had purchased that phone. And the footage is great. Like, it's very clear that it's Diana. Like, there's no question that it's Diana Lovejoy on that surveillance footage. It is mentioned here in this that that footage from the Best Buy store was on the 15th of August. So that must be why they came up with that date. I don't know how I didn't put that together sooner. Oh, it's because you're very dumb. Oh, it's because you're very dumb.

The prosecution told the jury that on the 1st of September, Weldon used the burner phone to call Greg. And then Diana dropped Weldon off at that trail and then went into like a park and ride lot nearby and waited for Weldon to call her once the deed was done. She gave, Diana gave Weldon two towels. These were meant to, I don't know, convince Greg that the person who had called him there actually did have some connection to his son because she thought that he would recognize this Angry Birds towel as their son's towel. Okay. But it hadn't really had that effect on Greg. Yeah. And Weldon had used the other towel to clean up his diarrhea.

Mm-hmm. How many times do I have to hear it for it to not be funny? I don't know. Do I have to hear it for it to not be funny? I don't know. Then the prosecution walked the jury through what had happened that night, how Weldon had called, how Greg had come to the scene, how they'd walked up there and then they'd heard the rustling in the bushes and they'd turned the bike light and they'd seen someone in the bushes. And as they ran away, you know, gunfire all around him. Right. And Greg had been shot.

The jury heard about all of Greg's injuries, how he sustained, you know, a very serious injury. I threw and threw shot. I mean, it was absolutely life threatening. Yeah. He very easily could have died from this. very easily could have died from this. And then the jury heard that after this had happened, after Greg and his boss, Jason, ran away and drove off, that Weldon then called Diana and said, you know, come pick me up. And he told Diana at that time, I messed up. So does that mean I didn't kill him?

Yeah. So Weldon's going to take the stand here in a little bit and he's going to say it means something else. Yeah. And then finally, the jury heard that while executing a search warrant, they found the gun that was used in this shooting in Weldon's home. They also found the camouflage jacket that it was believed that Weldon had worn and some black pants. And they both had like dirt and like leaves and stuff on them. No diarrhea, though, unfortunately. My God. What made you think I wanted to know that? You wanted to know. Then it was the defense's turn. And it was the defense's position that this wasn't a murder-for-hire plot at all. Weldon had only been there that night to scare Greg it was never this is the dumbest thing well

I mean what else are you gonna say honestly yeah okay it was never an attempt on Greg's life it was just an attempt to scare him right so that Diana could get full custody of their son so Weldon took the stand in his own defense and he admitted on the stand that he was at the trail that night, but he was not there to kill Greg. He didn't even intend to shoot Greg. Well, how did you fire the gun? All right, we'll get there. So he testified that he met Diana in 2015 when he was her shooting instructor and that they worked closely together. And then, you know, Diana started, you know, telling him stuff about how she was so scared of her husband. He used drugs. He owned guns. I don't think Greg actually owned any guns. I

believe that came out in the investigation here as well. Like that was not true. Right. OK. And she told him that he was molesting their son and raping her. Weldon testified that in or around June or July of 2016, they began to plan a way to get evidence so that Diana could get full custody. So according to Weldon, they came up with this plan of them luring Greg here under this false pretense of these documents. So Weldon, when he was on the phone pretending to be this private investigator, he told Greg that these were incriminating documents, documents that proved he was abusing his son and that they would be instrumental in his custody battle and that this was his one chance to see them so that he could, you know,

figure out his strategy on how to work against whatever proof this was. And Weldon said on the stand that he knew that if Greg showed up there that night, it meant that he was molesting his son. Because, this is a quote from Weldon, anybody who's not guilty of child abuse, in my mind, would not come out at night to meet someone or pick up any evidence that they didn't know where it came from. What are your thoughts on that? I think it's kind of ridiculous. I think you don't know how somebody is going to act in a situation.

And if somebody says they have incriminating evidence against me, I might want to see what it is, even if I know there's no way that it's proof of what they say it's proof of. See, I actually don't think it's that weird of a take. Uh-huh. Okay. Okay, what I'm thinking of is I remember way back in the day before Louis C.K. was exposed for being a big creep and masturbating in front of a bunch of women who didn't want him to. Okay, so there was this story on like Gawker or one of those sites where some random anonymous person said, like this was obviously way before the story. Said, oh, you know, Louis C.K. did this to a friend of mine. And, you know, it was like this this totally wild story that, you know, hadn't really been out there at all.

And God, I hope this is all true and the story is that louis ck contacted that anonymous person yeah to talk about it uh-huh and i remember at the time thinking that is so fucking weird right because if there was no truth to it and it's some anonymous person, why would you get in contact with them? Right. Yeah, I mean, I can see that. And honestly, yeah, if you've just been through this whole thing and you're getting some weird-ass phone call to go meet up at night somewhere for documents of something that didn't happen right so to me

thinking of it from greg's perspective he has if if the accusations were completely unfounded right if if yeah which i think they were i believe they were too and if this is truly just completely false claims by diana he has been put through hell for them yep he's gone through all of these evaluations finally he's through it all he gets back visitation with his son he's been granted 50 50 custody it's all buttoned up and almost finished they're days away from signing the final papers in this being done and that that period of his life is fucking over. And then he gets this phone call from somebody claiming to have some proof that could potentially make that all crumble. I can see that being like curiosity being enough.

Sure. Yeah. Paranoia even being enough to be like, all right, well, at least have to fucking see what they have. Yeah, I get that. I'm just saying. Yeah, I get that. I'm just saying. No, I totally understand. I get the flip side of it, too, of Walden. Walden, yeah.

Walden. That's right, because Walden is butthole shit. It doesn't make sense. It doesn't, but Walden is butthole shit, does. And it's hilarious. Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Also, I think that for Walden, who believes everything that Diana has been telling him. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Also, I think that for Weldon, who believes everything that Diana has been telling him. Yeah. Yeah. It's easy to be like, well, if he shows up. Yeah, he fucking did it. Mm hmm. So Weldon tells the court that, you know, he believed that if that phone call that night was enough to lure Greg out to this secluded spot that he knew he must be

guilty of something. Yeah. So, yeah, Weldon testified that he never intended to kill Greg. He only had the AR-15 with him, he testified, because Diana told him that Greg owned guns and that he had it just in case Greg showed up there that night with a gun. Yeah. That doesn't really explain being in sniper mode. Yeah. And being in camo. Yeah.

Mm hmm. No, dude. So Weldon testified that the shooting happened because Greg had what he called a tactical advantage over him when he showed up with a flashlight. So you had an AR-15. Yep. He said that when he shined the light on Weldon, it put Greg at an advantage. And so. So Diana mentioned that he owned guns, but she didn't mention he owned a flashlight. Wow. So Weldon said that at some point, you know, he thought that Greg said he had a gun. This could be the point where Jason or Greg yelled gun or run because it's all kind of everything happened very fast.

Yeah. But Weldon said he believed that Greg said he had a gun and that he thought that Greg was at a tactical advantage because he was holding a flashlight. Sure. And so he fired to shoot the flashlight out of Greg's hand. No. He didn't mean to shoot him. He simply mis-aimed in the moment. Right.

And he's not an expert or anything. Had he wanted to kill Greg, Greg would have been dead. in the moment and that right and he's not an expert or anything had he won well there you go had he wanted to kill greg greg would have been dead um well it only seems like by the grace of god he didn't die because i agree because of where that bullet hit him. So this seems kind of to me like real Uncle Rico behavior. OK. So Uncle Rico and Napoleon Dynamite where he's like, how about I throw a football over those mountains. Right. OK.

So Weldon's like, I could hit a man from 100 yards away. I was in the Marines. I'm a trained sharpshooter. I was simply trying to shoot the flashlight out of his hand. And oopsies missed. So which is it? Yeah, which is it? Yeah.

Because you're saying if I wanted him dead, he would be dead. Yeah, I can hit my mark. I can hit my mark from 100 yards away. But you missed the flashlight. But you missed the flashlight. So which is it? Yeah, so they talk about this a little bit on the Snapped episode. And like this makes a lot of sense to me.

A couple of the investigators in the case were like, yeah. I mean, yes, technically speaking, he was a trained marksman. But he's never murdered anyone before. The man shit his pants. The other thing I'm wondering about is he wasn't expecting two guys that's exactly it he was outnumbered and he mentions that like that kind of threw stuff off he didn't expect greg to show up with someone else yeah his whole thing was that he was gonna greg was gonna show up and see the towel and somehow he was gonna record him making some

confession about his son that was the whole plan that weldon testifies to on the stand that is so stupid it's so stupid it makes no fucking sense no you were gonna kill him yeah yeah you tried to kill him you nearly killed him You tried to kill him. You nearly killed him. Instead, you shit your pants. Yeah. Weldon was the main defense witness. A few people testified about Weldon's proficiency with guns and testified to, yes, if Weldon had wanted to kill Greg, he would have killed Greg.

He could shoot a target from 100 yards away. Well, he did hit the target. Yeah, I totally agree. He did. Mm hmm. And I agree with what you're saying about like there has to be a difference between hitting a target in a controlled environment and murdering a person. Yeah. Yeah.

There's so much that's out of your control in that situation, including whatever's happening in your hometown. Yeah, absolutely. You had a diarrhea. Diarrhea. Are you about to burst into a song? Yeah, you know, when you're sliding into third and you feel a little turd. Diarrhea. Diarrhea.

That is a classic, classic song. That's the tune, right? Yeah yeah so that was weldon's defense diana did not present a defense at all oh her attorney was just like i'll stay they believed that the jury would conclude that the prosecution had not met the burden of proof. I never like that. I don't either. I don't think that's the way to go. The jury deliberated for like less than half a day. Well, yeah, I bet they did.

And they found both Weldon and Diana guilty on both charges, conspiracy to commit murder and premeditated attempted murder okay so their verdicts were read separately diana's was read first hers is read she's guilty on both counts they go to start reading weldon's verdict and there's this like huge thud in the courtroom mm-hmm diana face planted into the table and then onto the floor. There was like, like passed out. Like passed out. Whoa. Yes.

They had to like clear the room. They had to bring in a stretcher. They took her to the hospital. She was fine. She fully recovered. And like, but there was like a 30 minute recess where Weldon is just waiting to hear his fate as well. And then he hears that he has also been found guilty on both counts. And he cried upon

hearing his verdict. Then it was time for sentencing at sentencing hearing, you know, a couple months later or whatever. Diana cried and she told the judge that she would never do this. She would never take her son's father from him. She said, Bullshit. I know. She said, I could never be able to do that and it's so painful that some people in the world think I would have it in me to do this.

Again, you kind of can't have it both ways. Yeah. Do you really think he was raping you and molesting your son and all that? Yeah. I would never take my son's father away from him. I would accuse him of raping me and molesting our son.

Which would take him away. Which would mean that you don't want him to have exposure to his father. Yeah. So which is it? Exposure to his father. Yeah. So which is it? Diana went on to say that she hopes the, quote, higher reality of what we intended to do comes out and said, I believe it will someday.

But she did not elaborate on what that higher reality was. Just scare him into telling the truth. Mm hmm. Yes. Rid's ridiculous. Diana also said that she felt that her voice was not heard during the trial. Well, yeah, it wasn't. Yeah, and the judge said, that was your choice. Yeah. Yeah.

Also at sentencing, the prosecution described Diana as manipulative, narcissistic and completely self-absorbed. Prosecutor said she has shown that she will stop at nothing. And the prosecutor reminded the judge at this point that none into it. And it had been determined that these were lies in order to gain sole custody of their son. Weldon said before he was sentenced, I have seen so many things go wrong with this system. This system is broken. The jury got it wrong. I do believe that the system is broken and there are things wrong with the system. One hundred percent. Don't think they got it wrong here. The judge said in response that there was sufficient evidence to support the verdict

in this case. Yeah. Yeah. He took a dump at the crime scene, dude. Yeah. I get that that's embarrassing, but it's not a problem with the system. Yeah. It's a problem with your system. The judge then sentenced Diana to 26 years to life. And Weldon received a sentence of 50 years to life. Yeah. Because he fired the shot. Yeah. Okay. They've actually both appealed. Weldon's sentence was actually overturned on appeal.

Really? Yes. It was remanded back down to the original court. But at resentencing, the judge upheld the 50-year sentence. He reduced a fine that Weldon was ordered to pay. Initially, he'd been ordered to pay a $10,000 fine, and Weldon had said in his appeal that he couldn't afford that fine.

And so the judge had lowered it to $1,800. But he'd kept the sentence the same. Upon resentencing, Weldon again appealed his sentence. And in April of 2022, Weldon's sentence was again overturned on appeal. So it seems that I read through this appeal stuff. It seems that there was some judgment that came down in between the original appeal and the resentencing that made it to where the judge can overlook certain enhancements on the charges and not factor them into sentencing. So originally the judge had said, you know, I'm bound by the law to sentence you to 25 years to life on each of these charges that

you are convicted of. And I am making them run consecutively. So you are sentenced to 50 years to life. Right. Well, so when when Weldon appealed again, the appellate court said, yes, actually a ruling has come down that allows the judge to basically use his discretion and not include those enhancements in the sentencing. And so they have remanded this back down for resentencing in the lower court again. But it looks like that has not yet happened. OK. Yeah. Whole lot of nothing. Exactly.

I think likely he'll be sentenced to the same thing again. Probably. Yeah. Yeah. Weldon was interviewed following the culmination of all of this. And he says that if he could take back one thing he did in this case it would be cheating on his wife this is one regret he doesn't regret shooting nope okay yeah he says he regrets that he hurt his wife. And I believe... That would be horrible.

I mean, it would be horrible. And I believe they're still married. Oh, my God. As of the episode of Snapped and Dateline, they still refer... I believe those are in 2018, so it's been a few years. But they still referred to her as his wife. And she was interviewed on them. Oh, shit.

And they asked her about her take on people saying that Weldon has this like misguided hero complex that resulted in him now coming to the aid of two women that he met at the firing range

and she said that no, she doesn't believe that. He just really likes to help people. No, he likes to bang a damsel in distress.

And that is the story of a botched murder for hire plot. Wow. Oof. Yeah. That was troubling. I know. Yeah. There's a lot of layers to this one.

Oh, I just kicked the table, the microphone, the whole damn thing. I bet it sounded awesome. Yeah, I'm sure it did. Well, you didn't kick the microphone. You didn't do like a roundhouse kick. Well, but it shook the boom on, if you must know. Yes, it did. My God.

Is my hair... Yeah, it looks great. Fluffy enough? Yeah. I went into the bathroom, and I kind of look at myself, and it was very flat to my head, which I don't like. You got to have a little volume, Brandy. Yes, you do. Brandy, tell them what we're doing right now.

We are now going to take some questions from the Discord. In order to get in the Discord, all you have to do is join our Patreon at the $5 level or higher. We've got all kinds of questions in here today. People are so curious. Ooh, I Don't Light Up a Room wants to know, Kristen and Brandy, do you all consider listening to a book the same as reading it? My husband said I'm cheating. I listen while at work and consider myself to be reading. And he says no.

Settle the debate, please. Yeah, you get the content of the book. Tell your husband he's a snob. He says, no, settle the debate, please. Yeah, you get the content of the book. Tell your husband he's a snob. Yes, I don't do much actual reading anymore. I almost exclusively listen to audiobooks because I can do it while I do other things. But I like to read. I like the stories.

Yeah. Do you do both? I know you read a lot. You read all the time. Yeah, because I'm an intellectual, clearly. Yeah. Personal cookie cakes. Yeah, I do both. Yeah.

But I can't do novels as audiobooks. Really? I cannot follow it at all. Oh, that's interesting. Yeah. Fiction can't do it. I do tons of fiction in audiobooks. I am a big nonfiction audiobook fan.

I'm listening to Good Morning Monster right now. What's that? So this psychologist wrote stories about some of her basically most resilient patients. Oh. It's really good. Yeah, that sounds amazing. Quite powerful. Yeah, that sounds amazing. Quite powerful. Yeah, I bet.

Ooh, Rice-a-Goni Colon, the KC Treat, wants to know, now that we know for sure you're coming to ObsessFest, will Kristen be able to do dick jokes in front of an audience this time? I doubt it. Yeah, I doubt it too. It's funny. I mean, in front of a crowd, I become a real lady. How are you able to do that? I don't know. I did it in front of my dad.

I know. Multiple times. Yeah. I don't care. Oh, my gosh. I don't know what this is. Have you heard about this? Invisible Wizard asks, have you heard of Most Popular Girls in School?

It's a YouTube series set in your area. Specific references to the Overland Park Mall. I think y'all would like it. I've never heard of it. I've never heard of it. I'm going to look into this. All right. Weird. Ooh, Little Taste of Peter wants to know, what is a food from childhood that you miss the most or wish would come back? I loved shock tarts, but you can't find them anywhere anymore.

You used to eat the shit out of shock tarts. I loved shock tarts. Oh, my God, I forgot all about those. Oh, the red ones were the best. Oh, yeah. I loved Butterfinger BBs, the little round butter finger pieces i wish those would come back i'm trying to think you know there are things from childhood that i hated that i hate have come back gushers i get the fucking love Gushers. Get the fuck out of here.

No. We have a giant box of Gushers from Sam's in our pantry right now. That's disgusting. And I'm sorry. So fucking good. I saw the other day Dunkaroos are back. They are back. I enjoyed a Dunkaroo.

Yeah, Dunkaroos are good. Yeah, I can't really think of anything. I mean, shock tarts, my God. Do you still like sour stuff? You always liked sour candy when you were kids. Yeah. God, now my mouth's watering. You remember, like, you would eat

so many shock tarts, and then you'd get, like, that sore tongue from it? I remember that. Yeah, like, I would lose a layer. It's very cleansing for the tongue. Some people do tongue scrapers. I did shock tarts. So many shock tarts. I remember my tongue would bleed. Yeah. Maybe that's why they're no longer on the market.

Oh, I think they're still on the market though. Warheads. We see those too. Yeah. I don't miss those. I don't miss those either. That's kind of the corn nuts of their day. Oh, Thanks I Hate It wants to know, I am horrendously late to the show, but I'm obsessed with Ink Master. Brandy, would you ever go on the show? Absolutely, I would. You would? Yeah, I'd get tattooed on the show. Absolutely.

What if it's artist's choice? You get no say. I'd do it. Brandy. Have a really cool ass tattoo. Did you see, though, there's some finale episode oh my god i've never oh you know what i'm about to say don't you i think i know okay you know the final three artists were doing back pieces uh-huh oh that's not what i'm thinking of okay and the deal was you know it's a free tattoo by a very talented artist you don't get any say

yeah in what this person tattoos yeah on you and so this woman shows up and she's like oh i like you know feminine stuff well the artist you know he's and you know whatever he's yeah here to compete for whatever the grand prize is and he's like, I don't care what you want. I, this is what my specialty is. Horror. Oh, and so, Oh my God. Well,

I would hate it. And he did like this horrible monster thing on her back. And you could tell the woman was just devastated. He's like, what are you going to do? It's a, it's your whole back. Yeah.

That would be rough. Something delicate, maybe floral. Yeah, that would be rough. And you wanted something delicate, maybe floral. Yeah. And you've got like some monster ass dude ripping this shit out of your back, jumping out at you. Oh, it's like ripping through the skin? I don't really remember. I just remember like, here's the thing I remember.

I remember the next year that the canvas had to have some say in the tattoo. Yeah, because it's on this person for the rest of their life yeah i think they should get some say i hate that they're called the canvas yeah it's real no i saw this one i actually don't i didn't watch the show i saw this on tiktok this woman got this big thigh piece and it was beautiful but after like the show aired the guy plagiarized it another artist completely drew it and he like totally ripped it off so she has a giant like plagiarized tattoo like it doesn't mean anything to her exactly but yeah yeah yeah it's not like she's got some man ripping through her back skin oh marius wants to know, Kristen, would you consider writing a children's book entitled I Burped in My Pants?

I absolutely would. Yeah, do it. Write it up. Oh, no. Doppenditz wants to know, what are some tips I can share with my daughter who is starting middle school next year? Oh, my gosh. God bless that child. Fuck.

I don't know. I don't know either. My niece is in middle school right now. And like the drama she is enduring at 12 years old. I'm like, this is fucking terrible. Like girls will just decide not to like one girl, you know, for like the week or whatever. And it's like that. And then like the next week is just somebody else, like arbitrarily somebody else.

And like the girl who wasn't liked from the week before is back in the group. It just fucking sucks. None of this is advice don't tell her any of that no you know what honestly like okay and this is not the question that was asked i'm just thinking like if i were a parent of a middle school kid i would just really keep an eye out for them. And I think people are so much more into therapy these days. I'd be, you know, like if the kid ever needs therapy, because that's one thing I wish I'd had at that age. So I was actually just talking to my sister about this.

I think middle school is a harder age than high school is. Absolutely. I think that in high school you've gained some confidence in you are, and it's easier to stay true to yourself. I think that you don't know what's up, down, left, or right when you're in middle school, and you're just trying to like, I think a lot of kids are just trying to like fit in and go with the flow, and I think it's easy to lose yourself during that time. Also for us, it was just a two-year period, which I know some school districts do differently, but there's something weird about you're just in a place for two years. We didn't really have a lot of sports programs, so you couldn't really find your, I almost

said specialty, but like you couldn't really find your people as easily, so you were just thrown in with a bunch of angry weirdos. again no this is this is not helpful boy helpful in any way just look out for your kid okay yeah yeah oh third law bra wants to know kristin well said brandy and kristin probably mostly kristin have you started getting your garden ready? You been doing any gardening yet? No, Brandy. Because as you know there is There's ridiculous construction on your street

so the last place you want to be is outside listening to the trucks all fucking day long. Which like, okay the construction needs to happen. I'm not complaining about that. Yes. It is just so much noise. And it's gone on forever.

And it's going to keep going on. Yeah. And we just got an email that they need to bring out new, louder equipment. Right. And they're like, so you guys don't, like, work from home, do you? And it's like no actually we do but like at this point it's like whatever it takes to just get this done faster so no i spend as little time outside as possible yeah it's a sad sad existence for me

dotty and kit are horrified. I know. Well, Dottie's already a nervous dog, so then she's outside and there's like all these noises. She's having a really tough time, I bet. She is having a tough time. Yeah. Ooh,

DPIsMySpiritAnimal asked if you had to either cook or clean for the rest of your life which would you choose this is super easy for me cook i love to cook i would absolutely pick cook clean really yeah you've tasted my cooking good yeah i just i i find, I find them both pretty satisfying. Yeah. I don't really love to clean, but. You don't like to make a bed? Just boom, instant? No.

Well, okay, you're acting like I said, do you like to fuck a whale? No, I love to have a made bed. I don't like to make a bed. I love to have a made bed. I don't like to make a bed. I love getting into bed at night in a bed that has been nicely made. And so my husband likes to make a bed. And so David makes the bed and I sleep in it. Don't brag to us here.

It's very rude of you to mention that. Yeah, that's kind of how we do it in our house. I do the cooking and then David cleans up the kitchen after I'm done. Yeah. It's a good tradeoff. Absolutely. Yeah. In my house, we yell at each other. No, you don't.

Oh, okay. Queen Nikki wants to know, have you ever grabbed something that someone had put out on the curb for garbage? If so, what was it? Oh yeah you have absolutely okay i have not but it's because i'm terrified of bugs yeah i found this cool ass organizer now i have i'm not talking about like going through someone's garbage no no yeah people put out you know a large something by the curb yeah i got like it's in pretty good a little metal organizer one time. Yeah, I guess that's it. But no, I leave stuff out all the time.

Oh, they were the sweetest bugs. What if you got it to your house and it was just infested with bugs? That'd be real bad. I'd be like, it's worth it because of this free free metal organizer. No, thank you.

Do you leave stuff out for people to? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What's the coolest thing you've ever left out? When we moved out of our house, like, we happened, like, our last house, we happened to move, like, right at big trash pickup. Mm-hmm. So that was really nice.

So anything that we weren't taking to the new house we just put out on the curb. We had like some fairly nice like chairs that sat on our front porch but we didn't have that space at our new house. So we put those out. Somebody came and got those. We had like a little couple little pieces of like furniture like you know little tables

and stuff. People took all of that. No dildos. Kept those. Those were sculptures. Mimosa 21 wants to know, y'all are taking a vacation together to a deserted island and are packing the other person's bag. What are the best and worst things you secretly pack for each other? Ooh. Hmm. What are the best and worst things you secretly pack for each other? What are you packing for me? Well, the fact that it's a deserted island is really the thing that's throwing me.

Yeah, we need practical stuff. Yeah, so let's say it's a true vacation. Okay, true vacation, but we're packing for each other. Okay, I can tell you right now where you'd get pissed at me would be the clothing. Oh, yeah, you'd pack me fucking colorful shit. Yeah. And I'd be like, where's my fucking black? Now, I would pack you some black.

Okay. But then you'd wear only the black thing the whole time i didn't though i in when i went on my honeymoon i wore a coral dress i wore a blue dress i wore a floral dress yeah and i'm convinced that that's all lies i you have seen a picture of me in the coral dress have i yeah but did you do it in that weird way you do sometimes where you're like, okay, here's the picture. No, no. I just showed you. Do you know what?

How dare you? Where is it? I can't find it. Anyway, I showed you the dress. It was cute. Okay, what would you pack for me? I would pack for you. What would I pack for you um what would i pack for you just just adorable outfits matching sets i picture

vacation kristin wears matching sets oh yeah yeah i want every day kristin to wear matching yeah absolutely that's like easy and um you know chic isn't quite the word because they sell matching sets at Sam's Club. Yeah. But I'm what? You know what else I would pack for you? This is the thing that you wouldn't like, but I would want to be exposing you to. What? Flippies.

You need flippies on vacation. Oh, God. Uh-huh. Yeah. Okay. Tell you right now, I don't appreciate that. I'm telling you right now, I don't appreciate that. Like people need to see these veiny feet. Stop it.

You wear sandals. I know, but I kind of like something with a little coverage. And the whole time I'm like, just don't look at the feet. There's nothing wrong with your feet. Flip flops are like the real slutty shoe. Do I have slutty feet? Yeah. I'm always in a flip.

I was in flip flops yesterday. It was just a tid too cold today for me. A tid too cold? Yeah, just a tid too cold today for me to be able to wear flip flops. I was pretty upset about it, too. Let me tell you what I did. I did one of those foot exfoliating things. Yeah, you did the fucking peel your whole foot off thing.

Right. But the thing is, those things, like, they take a while to really peel your whole foot off. So I've been, we've had some warm weather. I've had to. You've been molting. Yeah, I've had to, like, cover these feet up. Oh, my gosh. Because I don't want to make people throw up.

Yeah. I don't want to leave behind coconut flakes everywhere I walk. Oh my God, we have to move on. Okay. Let's do some Supreme Court induction. Coconut flakes about pushed me over the edge. I am sorry, that was too much. Once again, I have done too much.

We are going to do Supreme Court inductions to get inducted on this podcast. All you have to do is join our Patreon at the $7 level or higher. We are continuing to read your names and your first celebrity crushes. Samantha Cheek. JTT. Sierra. Automatic, Supersonic, Rachel Weisz and the Mummy, also Brennan Fraser. Stephanie Kay.

Brad Pitt. Tabithia. Nick Carter. Kelly Folsom. Devin Sawa. April Grant. Mark Paul Gosselaar. Katie Johns.

Kevin Arnold from The Wonder Years. Elyse Jarmusch. Michael J. Fox. Alana Lux. Tyrese. Cassie Hulse. Claire Duvall. Rachel Mankowski.

Egon from the Ghostbusters animated series. Oh my God. This like unlocked a core memory for me. I remember watching the shit out of that when I was a kid. I loved that show. Holy cow. I haven't thought about that show in forever.

Did you think Egon was hot? I don't recall thinking Egon was hot. That's fine. Neither do I. Moving on. Shellafornia. James Marsters as Spike in Buffy the Vampire Slayer.

Ashley Kay. Gordon Ramsay. Samantha Jones. AJ from the Backstreet Boys. Christy Miller. Taylor Hansen. Jen Morgan. John Stamos.

Cassandra Cannon. Sean Hunter from Boy Meets World. Elspeth. Ash Ketchum. From Pokemon. What? From Pokemon. I thought those were all characters.

No, that's the person who's got to catch them all. Oh, I see. All right. Kristen Long. Orlando Bloom. Arielle. Prince Harry. Melissa.

C. Thomas Howell from the movie The Outsiders. My goodness. I feel like The Outsiders was like a sexual awakening for a lot of young women. Yeah. And men, I'm sure. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. It affected us all, didn't it?

Rihanna. Justin Timberlake. Derek Wint. Michelle Branch. Caitlin Beaucheson. Thorn from The Hex Girls in Scooby-Doo and the Witch's Ghost was my bi-awakening. All right. Lily Webster.

Never had a celebrity crush, but there are a few that aren't horrible to look at. Oh, Lily. Come on. Lauren Dimareth. Michael J. Fox. Kelsey New. Zach Hansen. Bridget McClure. David Bowie. Sarah New. Zach Hansen. Bridget McClure.

David Bowie. Sarah Brown. Andrew Keegan. Welcome to the Supreme Court! Thank you everyone for all of your support. If you're looking for other ways to support us, please find us on social media. We're on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Patreon. Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen.

And then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review. Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Patreon. Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen. And then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review. Then be sure to join us next week. When we'll be experts on two whole new topics. Podcast adjourned. And now for a note about our process. I read a bunch of stuff, then regurgitate it all back up in my very limited vocabulary. And I copy and paste from the best sources on the web and sometimes Wikipedia.

So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from the documentary Welcome to Leith and reporting from the Southern Poverty Law Center. I got my info from an episode of Dateline, an episode of Snapped, visit lgtcpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it. Go read their stuff.