Let's Go To Court! - 280: The Pandemic Defense

Episode Date: December 13, 2023

Michelle Boat was livid. Her husband of more than 20 years, Nicholas Boat, wanted a divorce. Nicholas told Michelle that he’d found someone new – a woman named Tracy Mondabough. Michelle began stalking Tracy. She stalked Nicholas, too. She left Nicholas terrifying voicemails in which she threatened to kill Tracy. So, when Tracy was brutally murdered, investigators immediately had a top suspect. And now for a note about our process. For this episode, Brandi copy and pasted from the best sources on the web. And sometimes Wikipedia. (No shade, Wikipedia. We love you.) We owe a huge debt of gratitude to the real experts who covered these cases. In this episode, Brandi pulled from: “Michelle Boat” episode Sleeping With A Killer “Tracy Mondabough” chillingcrimes.com “IA v. Boat (2021)” courttv.com “Trial to begin for murder of Ottumwa woman” by Kyle Ocker, Ottumwa Courier “Woman charged in Pella homicide the estranged wife of victim's boyfriend” by KCCI 8 News, kcci.com “Defense attorney says Boat guilty of manslaughter, not murder” by Kyle Ocker, The Oskaloosa Herald “Jury convicts Michelle Boat of first-degree murder after 45-minute deliberation” by Laura Terrell, KCCI 8 News YOU’RE STILL READING? My, my, my, you skeezy scunch! You must be hungry for more! We’d offer you some sausage brunch, but that gets messy. So how about you head over to our Patreon instead? (patreon.com/lgtcpodcast). At the $5 level, you’ll get 53+ full length bonus episodes, plus access to our 90’s style chat room!  

One semester of law school. One semester of criminal justice. Two experts. I'm Kristen Caruso. I'm Brandi Pond. Let's go to court. On this episode, I'll be talking about the pandemic defense. Oh, really?

I will. I had to murder someone. The pandemic made me do it. Hmm, kind of. Really? Okay. All right. I suppose I'll stick of. Really? Okay. All right. I suppose I'll stick around to hear this story.

All right. And I suggest you do the same. Absolutely. Kristen, how are you doing today? I am not doing great. Not feeling great. No. Yeah.

I don't know if you can hear it in my voice. Is it obvious in my voice? I mean, your voice is a little lower than usual. Yeah. I can tell you got a little funk happening. Because I'm hot. Either you're super sexy today or you've got some funk. Which one is it?

Can it not be both? Can we not hold two truths at the same damn time? I believe we can and we shall. Okay, great. Great. Anyhow, how are you doing? I'm doing great. I'm doing well, but I would like to start off the show with a PSA for the listeners.

Oh, okay. Okay. First, it starts with me sharing the story that I told you on our way to lunch today. Okay. So, two nights ago, I was happily slumbering in my bed. It was about 3 a.m. I was having a dream.

What was the dream? I cannot remember the dream at all. That's cool because no one wants to hear about anyone's dreams. It's true. It's true. The only thing I can remember is that, hold on, sorry. I'm worried that these are like clicking against. Your nipple tassels are fine.

Don't call them nipple tassels. That's better. Like the beads are like scratching against the table. Anyway. Okay. So I was having a dream. Everyone, she's wearing a sweatshirt that has some beads on it. There's beading on the hoodie strings.

It's actually, it's a sweatshirt dress. Uh-huh. Anyway. Is she going to a ball? Is she going to lounge around? We don't know. Okay. So in my dream, all I remember is that there was this bird and it kept going chirp, chirp, chirp.

And then I woke up and I was like, was that noise real or was it in my dream? Yes. And then my smoke detector went chirp at approximately 3.15 in the morning. Uh-huh. And so I woke David up and I was like, the fucking smoke detector is chirping. So he gets out of bed. Our bedroom, just for reference, has vaulted ceilings. Rich.

No. Rich. We live in a townhouse, so. We've got three hot tubs. We have zero hot tubs. Uh-huh. Hot tubs. We have zero hot tubs.

Okay, so David has to go downstairs to the garage to get a ladder, come back up, climb up, take down the smoke detector to discover that it's hardwired. So you can't just take the battery out of it and make it happy for the night. You have to immediately replace the battery. So it's now 3.30 when we've discovered that. And there was not a single nine-volt battery to be found in our house. So then I Googled what was open at 3.30 in the morning. And because I live in the suburbs, nothing. Walmart isn't 24 hours anymore.

Walgreens isn't 24 hours anymore. Walgreens isn't 24 hours anymore. This used to be a beautiful country. Yeah. So the only thing we could find that was open was Quick Trip. I mean, my beloved gas station. So we called at 3.30 in the morning. Never before have I called a Quick Trip in my life. We call.

This young kid answers the phone. And David goes, yeah, I'm just calling to see if you carry 9-volt batteries. And the kid goes, let me go check. And so he comes back on the phone, and he's like, we have Energizer batteries. And David goes, yeah, that's great. I don't care about the brand. Do you have nine-volt batteries? I would love it if, in fact, David did care about the brand at this moment.

He's like, fuck Energizer. Fuck that, Bonnie. We are a Duracell family. And so the kid on the phone goes, I think so. Are those the little rectangular ones? And David's like, yes, those are the rectangular ones. And so the kid's like, yeah, we have two of them in stock. And so David at 3.30 in the morning drove to Quick Trip and bought out all of their

nine volt batteries and then returned to our home and replaced the battery in the smoke detector. So my PSA for everybody is just have just have a couple of nine volt batteries on hand just in case. You know, some shows really value the first five minutes of their programming. It's the top. It's where people decide, am I going to listen to the whole thing? Am I not? Anyhow, so yeah. Are you saying this is not top quality content to leave with? It couldn't wait. It couldn't wait, could it?

People needed to know. That's right. Now, let me ask you a question. When this happens, and we all know you and David sleep in the nude, does he climb the ladder in the nude? And do you hold the ladder steady in the nude? First of all, I was fully clothed. David had only shorts on. And he did climb the ladder in his shorts alone.

Interesting. Yeah, he did put on actual clothing. Let's pause. Let's pause so that all the listeners can picture it. Okay, good, good. Yes, yes. All right. Yeah, absolutely.

Well, I think we've all learned a lot from this story. Absolutely. Anyway, I think someone is going to appreciate this message. They're going to go buy 9-volt batteries, and this will save them in some situation down the road. Excellent. Excellent. Very good. Now that we've gotten that out of the way.

Yes, the important content out of the way. It had to be there. Let's plug our own stuff. How about that? Yeah, tell us about Patreon, Kristen. Everyone, we've got a Patreon, and you're going to love what you find there. You're going to find 53 bonus episodes. You can binge them right away at the $5 level or higher.

And you know what else you can do? What else? You can give us a little more money. And you know what you get for a little more money? I'll tell you. Yeah, tell us. Sticker with our autograph. You get Zoom calls with us

where we chitty chat the day away. Yeah. You know what else you can get? You get 10% off merch. Yeah. You can also get ad-free episodes and you can get them a day early. Imagine how your life would have changed

if you heard that battery story a day earlier. That's right. My God. The possibility. You know, someone is going to appreciate that battery story. Yeah, of course. Someone will. Many people won't.

How rude. Anyway, check out our Patreon, and now let's do a real ad. All right. Do-do-do. And we're back from the ad. Do-do-do. All right, you ready to talk about the pandemic defense? Yes.

Yes, I'm getting ready to say, no, uh-uh, mister, that's bullshit. All right. Shout-outs to two main sources on this. First is a new show that I had never even heard of before. Sleeping with a Killer. Ew. It's a Lifetime show. Naturally.

I didn't know Lifetime did shows. Did you know that? It's not a Lifetime movie. I understand. Okay, great. Why did you look at me like I just said something stupid when I just said it? You didn't say anything. Looking geniusly at you. No, I didn? You didn't say anything. Looking geniusly at you.

No, I didn't say you said anything stupid. Looking geniusly. Looking geniusly. So Lifetime came out with a program, Sleeping with a Killer. Killer. Sleeping with a Killer. It gives a lot away. I watched this one episode.

I will say, I would not, if I hear that title, I would not pit this case in that title. That's why I think these shows really suck up when they make these very specific titles, like Homicide for the Holidays. Yeah. Well, I think they only cover cases that happen on holidays. Yes, I understand that. But how many people are murdering their whole family on Easter? I mean, obviously, you've covered that extensively.

But is there enough to make multiple seasons of a TV show? Anyway, I've only seen this one episode of the show, but I actually thought it was pretty good. Okay. There's no reenactments. It's actually done a lot with body cam footage. Okay. But I will give a caveat. Caveat?

A caveat. Caveat. Which do you say? Caveat? Caveat. That's the only way to say it, right? Okay. I don't know.

Okay. Okay. Anyway, my one warning is that because it is body cam footage, they include some pretty graphic stuff. They blur it, but it's still very graphic. So a warning. Okay. Yeah. And then on my other source is chilling very graphic. Yeah. So a warning. Okay. Yeah.

And then on my other source is chillingcrimes.com. Of course. Naturally. You ready? I am. It was 8.20 p.m. on May 18th, 2020 in Pella, Iowa, when a call came in to 911. when a call came in to 911. On the line was a woman who believed she had witnessed some kind of domestic dispute situation

in the parking lot of her apartment complex. This is the call. Call her. Yeah, I live over at 21 Glenwood and I just went outside to smoke a cigarette and I saw what looked like a scuffle between a couple. When I saw her get out of the truck, her face is just all bloody. Oh, my.

911. Do you have any idea of what apartment she might have went in? Call her. No, she looked like she just got in the car and left. It looked like a Cadillac almost, like cream or off-white. When police arrived at the apartment complex, they found a truck that the caller had mentioned parked in front of apartment four with the door open. And it was clear that there had been a violent altercation there. There was a purse laying on the ground as well as a pair of dentures that were later determined to belong

to the victim. And there was a considerable amount of blood visible. When police approached the truck, they found a woman slumped inside. Her seatbelt was still buckled. She was bleeding heavily, and she was unresponsive. The first officer on the scene called for backup and paramedics, Mm-hmm. Oh, my God. I'm sorry. Okay. So the caller. Yes. Was she just confused? Did she think this couple had driven away? Did I miss something? No. So someone did drive away. Oh, okay. The murderer. Yes. But there's someone left here at the scene. Yes. So one of her defensive wounds was so severe that it had resulted in her thumb nearly being severed from her hand.

Wow. A search of the scene led to the discovery of a driver's license, which allowed police to quickly identify the victim. She was 47-year-old Tracy Mondabaugh. She was a mother of four who had recently moved to Pella from Ottumwa to live with her boyfriend, 42-year-old Nick Boat. When police found Tracy inside her car, it was parked at her apartment complex, and it looked like she just, like, pulled in. The footage of this that I saw, it is like she pulled around to an alleyway behind the apartment buildings. Because these apartments are set up like they have what I'm guessing is like a deck off of the kitchen area.

Okay. And then that is over a garage. So she's pulled in front of a garage in front of her apartment. Okay. And so the car is found right there. Like she had just pulled up to her house. Yeah. And before she could even get her seat belt off, she was murdered in her house. Yeah. And before she could even get her seat bailed off, she was murdered in her car.

Yeah. She's in the driver's seat? She's in the driver's seat, yes. Okay. And so police are like, what even happened here? Yes. There were a couple of witnesses. So there was the woman who had called 911 and said she had, you know, seen what looked like some kind of domestic disturbance. Yeah. And there were another,

there was a couple that had been like out on their deck area as well. And they had overheard some stuff. They said that there had been a struggle between two women. There was a woman, like Tracy had been in her truck and another woman had come up to her and was standing outside of the vehicle. And that is the person who had left the scene. And this couple said the same thing, that they saw what they believed to be a four-door Cadillac and it was a light color. They couldn't tell if it was white or gray or silver, just light in color. What? It's just funny to me because I, in any of these situations where a witness has to describe a car, I'm always, it shoots panic through me because I can never describe any car at any time.

Oh, right. Yes. But a light colored Cadillac. Yeah. I feel like most. People would recognize it. Yeah. Yeah.

So. Not the best car to drive to do the murder. That's exactly what you're saying. That's what's getting caught in my mouth because I know that's a fucked up weird thing to say. I don't want to give tips here. Right. Absolutely. If I am giving a tip, you know.

Yeah. There you go. So these witnesses said that they had overheard something. They heard the woman standing outside the truck yell, he don't belong to you. Is Nick Boat super hot? Like, what's his deal? It's not Nick Yacht. Oh, you come here for the comedy.

Okay, I will tell you. But you stay for the battery stories. I will tell you that David watched this episode of the show with me, and when they show Nick Boat. Instant boner? No, he said, he looks like every guy ever. That's what he said. Oh, gosh. Yeah.

Isn't that the way it always is? Yeah. Yeah, he's a 42-year-old guy with dark hair. He's a white man with dark hair. Oh. Yeah. That's it. Where are you going to find another man?

So when they get this information from the eyewitnesses, though, police are like, we actually know someone who drives a Cadillac. Yeah, because it's a very noticeable car. This is what I'm trying to tell every murderer. So the police were actually familiar with Tracy because she had recently reported an incident that had frightened her. In March of 2020, so just a couple months before this, she reported to the police that she was dating a man named Nick Boat and that Nick had recently separated from his wife, Michelle Boat. And on this particular day, this incident that had scared her, Michelle had followed her from Pella, where she shared the apartment with Nick, all the way to where she used to live in Ottumwa, which is a 40-mile drive.

Yeah. So once Tracy noticed that Michelle was following her, she called the police. She asked if they would meet her at a gas station. And they did just that. And, like, that particular incident, nothing came of because the police intervened. Right. But you can't have the police with you all the time. Correct. And there were several incidents like this in the following months.

Yeah, that's horrible. So police learned that Nick and Tracy had met when Tracy accidentally friend requested him on Facebook in February of 2020. So this is the story. This is told at trial. Like this is this is the story. OK. This is told from Nick. Told at trial, like, this is the story, okay?

Mm-hmm. This is told from Nick. Okay. That Tracy fat-fingered his profile trying to friend request someone else. And he sent a message back saying, like, do I know you? Like, do we know each other? And that resulted in them sending some messages back and forth, which then resulted in them sending some text messages back and forth, which then resulted in them meeting and starting dating. While he was still married. While he was still married to Michelle Boat. Yes. Love it.

Yeah, it's great. Tracy and Nick went on their first date on March 8th of 2020. And things moved very quickly after that. Well, yeah, I guess so. Yes. Like within a week, Nick left his wife. How long had he been married? More than 20 years. Oh, my God. Yeah. So yeah, like within a week, Nick had left his wife, got an apartment, and within like a couple of weeks, Tracy was living with him. My head would spin off my body. Yeah. Yeah. Nick says that they had been in a loveless marriage for years and... He was just waiting for someone to fat finger him.

He met. That sounds horrible. And yet, it's exactly what happened. And that once he met Tracy, he knew what real love was. Okay. You got more you want to say there, Kristen? You're making this complicated for me. Okay. Okay. Yeah, more you want to say there, Kristen? You're making this complicated for me, okay? Okay.

First of all, no one has ever accidentally friended anyone. I agree. Yeah. And that's fine. You're flirting on Facebook. That's right. It's the middle-aged way. Yep. But let's not.

No one's accidentally sending sexy texts. My guess is that they met on Facebook dating. Yeah, that's probably exactly what happened. And he doesn't want to admit that he had a profile on Facebook dating. I would also bet that, like, she just friended him and, you know, then it's just, yeah, it just happens. Yeah, who knows? Okay, okay. Glad we discussed that.

So within a few weeks, Nick went from married to Michelle Boat for more than 20 years. They have two children together. Oh, my God. To I'm moving out. I'm seeing someone else. Oh, I was cheating on you. We're moving in together. Also, she's like 10 years younger than you because Nick was considerably younger than his wife, Michelle.

Okay. Michelle was like 55 at this time. And he's 42? Yeah. All right. Yikes-a-roo all around. Okay. Mm-hmm.

And Michelle did not handle it well. No, it sounds like she murdered Tracy. Mm-hmm. Uh-huh. Yeah. But even just the leaving part, she did. Well, sure. Yeah.

Well, I don't blame her for that part. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's the murder, the murdering part. Yes. So, I don't blame her for that part. It's the murder. The murdering part. Yes. So, I mean, she started following Tracy around a lot. It rose to the level of stalking. Yes. To the point that Tracy and Nick got a protective order against Michelle, which pissed her off even more.

And this is what scares the shit out of me about anything you try to do regarding stalking. Yeah. It's like, what's the shit out of me about anything you try to do regarding stalking. Yeah. It's like, what's the right move? So she violated the protective order multiple times. She was arrested a couple of times. I believe she was charged with a domestic violence charge when she got into a physical altercation with Nick Boat at one point. Good Lord. Walked right through that restraining order and put him in intensive care. Yeah. Yeah. It was bad. It was bad.

And so by this point, like police are aware of this situation. So when they identify their victim as Tracy Mondabaugh and they hear that a Cadillac was there, they're like, OK. Yeah, we know exactly what happened here. And so they decided to go to Michelle Boat's house. And they pull up there and her silver four-door Cadillac is parked in the driveway. Sure. There's blood spatter on it. Oh, my gosh.

Well, how quickly did they get to her? Okay. So she lives like a mile away. Okay. And so they put this together like super quick. It just happens that one of the responding officers had been one of the officers that had dealt with the protective order. Sure, sure. So they know immediately.

So they know immediately. So they get there quick. Okay. When they get there, the rotors on the car are still warm. Like they give it a feel and they're like, how long has she been back? And that's when they discover the blood spatter. And I know what a rotor is. It's part of the braking system.

Exactly. That's what I'm saying. So it was evident to police when they arrived at Michelle's house that she was home. Her car was in the driveway. There were lights on in the house. There was somebody clearly moving around. Taking a shower. Taking a shower.

But it took more than five minutes of them knocking. So they start by knocking on the door. She doesn't come. So they start walking around the side of the house and they're like knocking on the siding. And then they get around the back and they can see a bathroom with the light on and they can see the blinds are closed but somebody's walking around there.

So they start pounding on that window. Finally she comes to the door. She opens the door. She's got her a towel. She's got her hair wrapped in a towel. She's got a robe on. Sure. And she's like, goodness me.

Hello. I was just in the shower. What do you guys need? What can I help you with? So initially the police asked her if she would step out of the house and then the officer realized she was in a robe and he was like, actually, can we just, can we step in? And she said, yes. And then they told her that Tracy Mondabaugh had been violently attacked that evening. And Michelle was like, I haven't seen Tracy in probably weeks. Half an hour easily.

I don't know anything about that. She said, you know, I don't, I'm not, I have no idea. I mean, I'm happy to help in whatever way you might need, but no, I haven't seen Tracy in days. But witnesses had placed Michelle and her car at Tracy and Nick's apartment that evening. So police took her into custody for violating a protective order. Sure. Yeah.

Did they let her change out of the road? I believe so. Okay. As they took her to the station for questioning, though, they secured a search warrant for the house and they went to work preserving any evidence that they could. They're already behind it now because she's gotten a shower, which sucks. But I mean, this is so unless you've got some twist up your sleeve. I believe they call it tricks up your sleeve. But either one, I don't know what you got up there.

But I mean, this is about as quickly as you're going to solve a crime, right? Yes. It's really fast. Yeah. Yes. But they don't like that she's already gotten to shower. She's gotten physical evidence off of her body. Yeah, of course.

By being able to shower. So, Michelle's on her way to the station to give an official statement. She's formally under arrest for violating a protection order. Okay. But they want to sit her down and do an interrogation about this, obviously. And back at her house, an officer start executing a search warrant. So an officer goes down to the basement, which you can't find a light switch. So he's like shuffling around in the dark just with his flashlight.

And he hears a noise like from the back corner of the basement. And he stops and he says, you know, if someone's down here, show yourself. No one comes out. And so he keeps like going back and he's going back and he still hears the noise. And then he discovers that it's a laundry room. And there's a load of laundry going in the washing machine. Oh. So he opens it up.

He says, you're under arrest, you motherfucker. Yeah, exactly. He opens it up and it's a single outfit in the washing machine. Yeah. So they take that, bag that for evidence. Upstairs, an officer that was searching the bathroom for evidence notices that the toilet in that bathroom is running and running and running. Like it never stops running the whole time he's in this bathroom. So he takes the lid off the tank.

And inside there was like a balled up towel in the tank. So he pulls it out. He opens it up. And there was a pair of blue latex gloves balled up inside this towel. And they had blood on them. One of them was missing the tip of one of the fingers. Back at the crime scene,

investigators had located the fingertip only of a blue latex glove. So immediately they whisk those off to the crime lab and they talk about this on this episode of this Lifetime show. They're like, it didn't take science to, like, match this up.

And it was like, they show the picture of it. It is a clear, like, break. The tip of the glove belongs to the rest of the glove. I'm sorry, the fact that she's balled that up and put that in the toilet tank, like, that's amazing evidence. Absolutely. They also were able to get samples of that blood off of those gloves, and they were able to test that for DNA. And it came back as a positive match to Tracy Mondabaugh.

Brandy, dare I say, you have presented an open and shut case here today. Yeah. There's a lot of evidence in this case. Yeah, I cannot wait to get to this defense because, god damn. Yeah. So then there was Michelleelle's car which was parked in the driveway there was a significant amount of blood spatter located on the car and tests later identified that that blood belonged to tracy mondabaugh but that wasn't all. Okay. This is wild. When investigators were processing the car, they noticed something black stuck to one of Michelle's wiper blades.

Upon further investigation, it was a choker necklace, which Tracy was known to wear. She, like, always had a choker on. Oh my God. Within that choker necklace were strands of hair that had been like entwined in the clasp. Uh-huh.

They were Tracy Mondabaugh's hair. DNA testing determined they were Tracy's hair. Oh my God. What they believe happened was during this physical altercation, Michelle grabbed that choker from around Tracy's neck and ripped it off and threw it. And it had a magnetic clasp on it. And that magnet attached to the wiper blades of her car.

Good Lord. The evidence in this case is unreal. Unbelievable. They're like, by pure dumb luck, this attached to her car and survived the drive from the apartment to Michelle's house. And somehow had Tracy's hair entwined in the clasp. Yeah. And it's like a clump of hair. Like there's a lot of hair.

Yeah. Wow. Is that not wild? It's ridiculous. Yeah. And as I mentioned with the defensive ones, it was clear that Tracy had fought like hell when she was being attacked. Mm-hmm. When they processed her body, they found hairs clutched in her hand.

Mm. And DNA testing on those revealed that they belonged to Michelle Boat. Yeah, I mean, she fought really hard. So we've got a ton of DNA connecting Michelle to Tracy and Tracy to Michelle. Like, this is, like, the clearest case.

Yeah, we've got DNA, we've got witnesses. We've got literal blood all over her car. witnesses. Yeah. We've got literal blood all over her car. Yeah. Yeah. We don't need more, right? Plus the history, the documented history.

We'll get into the history in just a second. Okay. There's even more. Oh, great. Okay. So at this point, they've got Michelle in custody, but only on a protective order violation. And they need to be able to escalate that so that they can hold her. I think they've got enough.

So she gives a version of, like, what she'd done that day. She ran some errands. She went to go get dinner at Culver's, but the line was too long. Culver's sucks. Am I right? Culver's malts are delicious. I don't love their food. Well, I'm glad they do something right. Their food is disgusting. Their food's, oh Am I right? Culver's malts are delicious. I don't love their food. Well, I'm glad they do something right.

Their food is disgusting. Their food's, oh, I think it's just okay. Disgusting. Their malts are, like, nobody makes malts anymore. It's true. You're an old-fashioned gal. I am. I'm an old-fashioned gal. I love a malt. Yeah. I don't really like a milkshake. I like a malt. No, I know. You're all about that malt. I am.

About that malt. No sugar. Okay, I'll have to try a malt there, but I'm just warning the people. All right. All right. Don't waste your time at Culver's. That's right. So she tells them that she went to Culver's to get dinner. She ran these errands, went to Culver's to get dinner.

The line was too long. She remembered this place sucks. Yeah. But based on her version of events, there's like an hour unaccounted for. version of events. There's like an hour unaccounted for. And so just on a hunch, one of the officers decides to

obtain surveillance footage of the Culvers. No. They do have I think they look at the Culvers and there's no sign of her. Well, I was thinking more like Culvers is never that busy because it's not that busy. I don't know why I'm going so hard. You know you hate Culver's so much?

You know what it is? Yeah. One time Norm and I were on a road trip and he wanted to stop at Culver's. Yeah. And I was just like, God damn it. Yeah. But I decided to be a good wife, which is not my nature. So I'm just struggling through.

We drove out of our way to go to Culver's. And guess what? It sucked. It sucked. And that's the end of the story. Okay. It sucked. And that's the end of the story. I should have told that at the top of the show. Anyhow, that was many years ago. And I'm still just barely getting over it.

Okay. So, no. They pull the surveillance footage from the Vermeer Corporation, which is where Nick works. Nick Boat works. And so they're like, they knew that Tracy had gone there that evening. Nick worked second shift. Okay. So she had taken him lunch, which is essentially dinner.

Yeah. And they'd eaten together in her truck. And then that's when she had left and come back to her apartment, which she was killed the moment she returned to her apartment. And so they're like, how did Michelle know? Like, how did Michelle time that perfectly? Stalking. Stalking. So they pull footage from the Vermeer Corporation.

And sure enough, Tracy pulls in to the parking lot. Nick gets in the car. Michelle pulls in right after them. She sits there and watches them. Oh, my God. As they eat in the car. And then Tracy and Nick share a kiss. Nick gets out of the car, goes back into work. Tracy pulls out of the parking lot and Michelle follows her. Do you think they had any idea they were being watched? I think they had no idea they were being watched. So the shot, they show this on the show.

It's very high up, and so it looks like it would be very visible, but there's lots of stuff in this parking area. Like, it's like an equipment company or something like that. So there's just, like, stuff everywhere. Gotcha. Yeah, so I think she was probably pretty well hidden where she was at. So Tracy pulls out. Michelle pulls out right behind her.

They're able to follow through different surveillance footage. They follow her a couple miles down the road. There's a church that picks them up, and she's following right behind her. So they know. She had been stalking her that day and had followed her home. And then before she could even get her seatbelt unbuckled, that's how fast she was out of her car and she was stabbing her to death.

The timing of it is pretty wild. So like they leave the Vermeer parking lot at 8.10. The call from the witness at the apartment complex comes in at 8.. The call from the witness at the apartment complex comes in at 820. Wow. Yeah. God, that's a lot of rage. Yeah.

So this is enough for them to escalate this to the point that she's arrested and charged with murder. Yeah. But they still are trying to build the background of this case. And so they talk to Nick. There's a couple of things. First of all, the first thing that they discovered was at Michelle's house. There was a calendar on the wall.

And there was a note each day counting how many days since Nick had left. Started with one day gone. Oh, my God. And went all the way up to 69 days gone. Like, each day it's written on this calendar. That's weird. Yeah. She had become obsessive about Nick leaving.

So they talk to Nick. And Nick's, like, obviously devastated about all of this. But he tells them that like he's not that surprised that this has happened because Michelle has been leaving him these completely unhinged voicemails. And he has them saved. Well, and also there's a restraining order. Yeah, exactly. So he has eight to ten messages from Michelle saved on his phone.

Some of them are just like 15 seconds of her screaming. Oh my god. A couple of them, she just like played him a song. What song? I don't know. Probably a song that has some kind of meaning. Obviously. An old-fashioned

Christmas. Daddy's Home. Old-fashioned Christmas. Daddy's home. That was the one. This could be us, but you left. Yeah. Wish you'd been on that bus. Oh, shit. And then there were a few where she talked.

What'd she say? Okay, this is one of them. You know, ignoring me is not going to do you any good. Because sooner or later, I'm going to find that bitch. Oh. And I'm going to kill her. And then you are going to feel that pain that I feel right now of being fucked over after 20 years of marriage? Well, a woman scorned.

Hee hee. Oh, God. Mm-hmm. This is another one. I don't think you have any idea what I'm capable of, and neither does she, because she's going to die. One way or another, I'll kill her. Oh, my God.

Might take me a little while, but I'll do it. And like this is how she is saying them, like the cadence and everything. So when he got these voicemails. I believe he was reporting it to, I don't know if he was reporting that he was getting threatening calls at that time because there is an active protection order or if he was just saving these. I don't know if he brought them to the police's attention before the murder. I'm guessing no. Although, okay, some of the most disturbing cases I've looked into have been stalking cases. Yeah.

Because you would not believe some of the stuff people report to police. And they're like, well, they haven't done anything. Right. Yeah. And it's like, well, okay, I'll call you when I'm dead. When I'm dead. I don't know. When I've been murdered in the cab of my truck.

Holy shit. Another one. She's laughing during it. Oh, good. She says, I can't wait till I find her. Oh, man. She's gonna pay. And then this is the last one that they played on the show. Oh, and tell that bitch, you know, the fucking bitch that you're sleeping with, she messed with the wrong mama.

Oh my god. Yeah. How old are their kids? I don't know. Okay. There's, I only found one mention of them having kids. It was during Nick's testimony, the footage of that that I watched, and he said they have two kids together. Yeah, okay. That they've been married for more than 20 years and they have two kids together.

All right. I don't have any idea what their ages are. So they discover all of these. And then also when they informed Michelle of Tracyacy's death she was in an interrogation room at that point like they had already taken her into custody i thought they told her they told her that she had been attacked oh okay okay and so then when they have her at the station she's sitting there in an interrogation room and they're like well tracy died she smirked. Michelle smirked and goes, I guess the Lord works in mysterious ways. Okay.

Mm-hmm. Pretty sure Jesus had nothing to do with this. Yeah, no kidding. So at this point, with all of this information, Michelle had been arrested already and she was officially charged with the first degree murder of Tracy Mondabaugh. And now it's time for an ad. And we're back from the ad. So Michelle has been arrested and charged with first degree murder, to which she pled not guilty. Right.

Because it was the Lurd who did it. So she admitted that she had eventually she admitted that she had. So she stuck to her story initially. And then once she was officially arrested, she was like, well, maybe I was involved, but only because I was provoked to do so because my husband had left me. And after I saw them kissing that day, I just snapped. Well, why did you see them kissing? because I was provoked to do so because my husband had left me. And after I saw them kissing that day, I just snapped. Well, why did you see them kissing? Because you were stalking them.

Okay. And also kissing is not a reason to murder someone. Is it? No, obviously not. Her trial began in May of 2021. Okay. So at trial, the prosecution said that Tracy's death was not the result of some spur of the moment action. And it instead was a planned premeditated attack.

Yeah, no shit. Yeah. The prosecutor told the jury that Michelle was scorned, seething and obsessed. After her husband left her, she, yeah, she became obsessed with getting him back. There's even a mention. Sorry, I forgot to mention this earlier. There's a mention on this Lifetime show that even after she was taken into custody, she's under arrest. She's in jail. into custody. She's under arrest. She's in jail. She keeps calling Nick, wondering why he hasn't come to see her. Like she truly believed that Tracy was out of the picture now. And now she's back. Yes. Oh, Lord. Yeah. Okay.

Yeah. So she just became so obsessed with getting her husband back that she was willing to do whatever. And she believed that killing Tracy would bring him back. There was another thing that they talk about on the show where she reached out to Tracy. She found Tracy's ex-boyfriend on Facebook and sent him a message. And she's like, your fucking ex stole my husband. Go back to her so he'll come back to me. And the dude was like, who are you? Who are you?

Yeah. Can you imagine getting a message like that? No. Like, lady, I am so sorry to hear that, but boy, that's none of my business. Yeah. The prosecution told the jury that the evidence in this case would make it clear that Michelle had acted with the necessary premeditation to be convicted of first degree murder. Yeah. And nothing short of it.

They said, it is important to remember just because you took an oath to be a juror doesn't mean you checked your common sense at the door. The facts will support it. The law will compel it, and justice will demand it. Yeah, this is the easiest job for everyone except for the poor defense. Yeah. The lead prosecutor was Marion County Attorney Ed Bull, and he told the court that Michelle had stalked Tracy the day that this had happened, the day that Tracy was murdered. He said she hunted, she gloved up, and she plunged the knife into Tracy Mondabaugh's heart, murdering her. So one thing that worked against the prosecution in this case is they were never able to find the murder weapon.

They took a bunch of knives from her house. Any of them could have possibly been the murder weapon. They were never able to definitively say which knife she had used. And it's possible she dumped it somewhere. Sure. It was never located. The prosecution then presented evidence

about Michelle following Tracy from the Burger Drive-Thru where she had picked up dinner for her and Nick. And then she'd driven to the workplace. What did she pick up? I don't know. I do know that Tracy used to work for Burger King. So she probably knew exactly what to get.

She probably knew exactly what to get. She knew the best things on the menu, I'm guessing. I got to say, if I'm going to offer a criticism of this episode as a whole, it's that you're only mentioning restaurants that I do not care for. You don't like Burger King? No. I don't like Burger King either. No. It makes me sick every time.

Really? Yes. I think there's something in their grease there that does not agree with me. I do not like it. I've taken it off the list. David eats it when I'm not around. Yeah, I've just never been a fan. I don't like it at all.

All right, all right. Sorry, BK. I do like the it at all. All right, all right. Sorry, BK. I do like the Burger King. I think he's quite cool. But you don't respect his work. I don't. And so how cool can he be, really? The prosecution also told the jury.

Is it because he's got such a big head? Is that why I like him? Yeah. Honestly, I found him very creepy at the beginning. Sure. When I first, you know. Then he grew on you? He did. He really grew on me. He's just kind of weird, and I like him? Yeah. Honestly, I found him very creepy at the beginning when I first, you know, when he first came on the scene. He did. He really grew on me.

He's just kind of weird and I like that. Yeah. Okay. All right, weirdo. All right. The prosecution took the jury through all of the physical evidence in this case. There's a ton of it. Yeah.

There's DNA evidence. We get it. It's very compelling. We get it. It's very compelling. You get it. Everybody gets it. Yeah. It's horrible. We get it. Yeah. We know exactly what happened here. Yeah. The prosecution really talked about the gloves. The gloves were a big thing for their case. They said this was the thing that really showed this was a premeditated act. Yeah, you don't put on gloves unless you're planning it. Correct. So she put on these gloves. They even argue that she had done this while she was at the Vermeer Corporation. So there's some footage that

shows her either getting out of the car or like reaching. I don't, they didn't show this on the show, so I'm not sure exactly. But some of this equipment, these, so she had what they called a kill kit in the car. There was a hammer. There was presumably a knife, a knife they never found. There were several tools and there were latex gloves in the car. So at some point, they believe while she was watching them at the Vermeer Corporation, she got these things, brought them forward, gloved up, followed Tracy to her apartment. And before Tracy could even unbuckle her seatbelt, she stabbed her to death. Yeah.

So that's what makes me think that she had those gloves on beforehand because that timeline is so fast. So fast. So fast. Yeah. They also found binoculars in her car. Of course they did. Nick testified for the prosecution. He talked about how he and Tracy had met on Facebook.

Fat fingered. Fat fingered. Fat fingered, yep. He also testified that Tracy was surprised when he responded to the friend request and that they had started messaging each other after that. And then eventually Tracy had given her phone number and they started texting and arranging a meetup and that they'd gone on their first date on March 8th of 2020. To what restaurant? That I don't know.

I was hoping it would be another place I hate. I did watch this testimony. And during cross-examination, the defense is like, OK, let's go back to that Facebook friend request. What date was it that you started your affair with Tracy Mondemar? Yeah. Yeah. But like, I get it. Yeah, that's shitty.

It's absolutely shitty. It's so shitty. Yeah. And yet it's not illegal. It's not illegal and it's not an excuse for murder. Yeah. Nope. He testified that they had a lot in common, that they both like to go outdoors,

and that on one of their first dates, they had spent time walking through the wilderness searching for deer antlers. Sounds like a terrible date to me. They both like to go outdoors. Or loved being outdoors might have been how he phrased it. Yeah. It sounds like you don't like to go outdoors by the way you phrased that. Well, I have no interest in searching for deer antler sheds around Roberts Creek. Sounds good.

Sounds good. He said, the more we got to talking on the phone, it was like we had been friends forever. And then when we finally went out like we had been friends forever. And then when we finally went out, we hit it off great. Nick testified that when he met Tracy, he was still living with his wife of 20 years and their two teenage children is what he testified to. Okay. And he testified that in April, he left the family home and moved in to an apartment with Tracy. Yeah, that's awful.

Yep. Absolutely. Yeah. When he was asked about— The only thing more horrible for those kids would be for their mom to go murder someone and then go to prison. Absolutely. Okay. Yep. It's to prison. Absolutely. Okay.

Yep. It's all terrible. Yep. Yeah. When he was asked about his marriage to Michelle, Nick testified that it was a complicated relationship. I bet so. So he's like 13 years younger than Michelle.

How did they meet? I have no idea, and I wish I knew. Okay. 13 years younger than Michelle. How did they meet? I have no idea and I wish I knew. Okay. He said that the relationship had been borderline abusive from the very beginning.

Mm-hmm. And that he believed that Michelle was actually still in love with her ex-husband because that's what she said to him all the time. It was one of the forms of abuse. Wow. Yeah. And so the relationship had become really complicated. He said there were a ton of arguments between them because they did not see eye to eye on how they were raising their children. He believed she was too tough on them. He testified that he ultimately got tired of fighting. Yeah. And that he told her that's when he started.

That's when he. However, he started meeting Tracy like that's he said he had met someone else and that he was leaving and that that separation happened three days after he first met Tracy. He testified that four days after he left the family home that Michelle told him she would not be giving him a divorce. She refused. And he testified at that point that she assaulted him. So this is the the police were involved in this. Nick had bruising on his back and a cut to his left eye after that incident. And that's when the no contact order and protection order was put in place. Also, I mean, that's not how divorce works. You can't just say, no, I'm not going to give you a divorce.

no, I'm not going to give you a divorce. After that no contact order was in place, Michelle violated it four times by showing up at Nick's place of work. And what was her punishment for that? Nothing. Yeah. She's told to leave. Uh-huh.

Wow. Yeah. Wonder why she escalated. Mm-hmm. He testified that he didn't understand why Michelle was so obsessed with him coming back home. He said he truly did not get it because their marriage was not good, had never been good. He said, I don't understand because she never loved me and she told me that. She wanted to control you.

Mm-hmm. Yep. Oh. The prosecution asked the jury to find Michelle guilty of first-degree murder. They said there was plenty of evidence to show that this was a planned attack. Yeah. She wanted Tracy out of the way so she could get Nick back. Jared Harmon, the assistant Marion County prosecutor, told the jury,

it was intentional. It was malicious. And it achieved what the defendant wanted to achieve, which is to put out of Michelle's way the one person and the one thing that she believed was standing in the way of her reunion with Nick Boat. I am feeling some regret about earlier in this case, you know, talking about how he's just a basic dude. Why fight over him? Now I realize that, oh, yeah, Michelle. Michelle's the problem. It's Michelle. Michelle is for sure the problem here.

Good God. Michelle is. I think, I really think, and this is, one of the investigators talks about this on the Lifetime show. And she says that it appears that she controlled Nick for their entire marriage. Yeah. And she could not believe that he stopped doing what she told him to do. Mm-hmm.

And that's what she could not handle. Absolutely. Yeah. That is absolutely right. Yes. Yeah. The prosecution summed up their case by saying,

Michelle Boat didn't act because of some sudden, irresistible provocation. She was the provocation. Now let's talk about the defense's case. I cannot wait because how the fuck do you defend this? So the defense said that Michelle did not plan to kill Tracy that day. She just happened to have a kill kit in her car because, oops, don't we all?

We'll get to it. Oh, okay. Good. Good. Yeah. They didn't dispute that she was the person who killed Tracy. They said, this isn't a movie. It's not TV.

What's happening in here is a real life tragedy. I will tell you that Michelle Boat is responsible. Michelle Boat is the one who had the knife. Michelle Boat is the one who had the knife. Michelle Boat is the one who stabbed her. Okay. But they argued that Michelle hadn't planned this. She'd simply snapped when she saw her husband with another woman. So this is a TV show.

It's an episode of Snapped. Snapped, yeah. The defense told the jury that even though they had separated, they were still legally married and that they'd been married for 20 years. Yeah, we get it. And that this was all brought on by the pandemic. In what way? The defense told... Michelle didn't start being a douchebag abuser.

Right. Because of the pandemic. Yeah. The defense told the jury that Michelle's life fell apart in March of 2020. Okay. On the 11th of March, Nick left. And that was about the same time that the world descended into the coronavirus pandemic. Right.

Almost to the day. Yeah, it sucked. Yeah. So the defense asked the jury to consider Michelle's state of mind at the time. Oh, do we all get a free pass to murder? Each of you. Oh, do we all get a free pass to murder? Each of you.

Remember back to March of last year, how scary the world was, the fear, the chaos, the isolation that we all felt in the early days of the pandemic. That's where Michelle was 69 days before the 18th of May. So that's the backdrop. That's the context. That's the big picture. Right. It's super sucked. It sucked. Yeah. Yes. Mm hmm. But that's where it ends. It sucks. No, no, no. See, the pandemic happened. Lockdown happened.

It sucked the worst for Michelle out of everybody. And then on top of that, Nick left her in the middle of a pandemic. She was already isolated. And then her husband of 20 years that she's been bossing around and abusing for two decades leaves her. That's too bad when someone develops the backbone, self-esteem, I don't know what you want to call it. Courage, yes. Whatever you want to call it. That's too bad.

Then she lost her job because of the pandemic. What did she do? She worked in the laundry room of a hospital. Okay. She had no money without losing her job because of the pandemic and Nick leaving. She didn't have access to his income anymore. She lost a job at a hospital in the pandemic? That's what they say in court.

I would argue that probably she lost her job at the hospital because she's spending all of her time stocking Tracy. Yeah. That would be my guess. I would think that that would be one of the most secureing Tracy. Yeah. That would be my guess. I would think that that would be one of the most secure jobs in the pandemic. I sure would think so. All right. Yeah. The defense told the jury, I don't want you to sympathize with Mrs. Boat.

I don't want you to give her mercy. She doesn't deserve it. She killed someone, seat belted into her truck with no weapon, killed her and left her for dead, drove off. That is not asking for sympathy when I ask you to consider why. That's not the way this works. It sure fucking isn't. What do you mean consider why? Well, you see, she was dealing with the pandemic, Kristen.

Yeah. Which was. Agreed. It sucked. Yeah. And it sucks that her husband left her. Sure. Sucks.

Yeah. So she has to murder someone. No. That works. Yeah. This is the weirdest. They were asking the jury to find her guilty of manslaughter rather than murder. Did they have any psychologists testify about her state of mind?

Anything like that? Because, like, I didn't come across specific testimony about that. I don't know. Just a little pandemic made me do it. Michelle took the stand in her own defense. Oh, good grief. That's great. Let's hear it.

She talked about the isolation she felt during the pandemic She talked about the isolation she felt during the pandemic and then how that just continued to grow and grow and grow for those 69 days that Nick was gone. And how that just all that bubbled up until it resulted in her stabbing Tracy to death. She testified that her life had changed dramatically overnight. And as a result, she was left heartbroken, sad, despondent, devastated, and destroyed. She did not say that. Correct. She did. say that. Correct. She did.

She did say it. Oh, that's nice. She came up with some alliteration ahead of time. She said, like my whole life had just walked out the door. There weren't going to be any more Thanksgivings or Christmases without him. I just snapped and I grabbed the knife and I just stabbed her. No, you stopped her. And I grabbed the knife and I just stabbed her. No, you stopped her. And I dropped the knife. You made multiple voicemails.

No. You threatened to kill her multiple times. Yeah. You stalked her. Yeah, you didn't snap. No. No. I don't think that there's a better defense for this case.

I think they argued what they could. Do you think there's a better way to go? I mean, I don't know. Yeah, you have to admit that she killed her. Yeah, you have to admit that she killed her. I, oof. Someone who does all this, I would be wondering about their mental health, their mental state. Yeah. So I, I don't know.

I guess if I were her attorney, which, poor thing, I've only got one semester of law school. Yeah, that would be rough. Rough for both of us. But yeah, I would, I would want to hear what... Like an actual mental health professional. Yeah. I also think it's funny because, you know, the pandemic was obviously terrible for everybody. That's the thing.

It was terrible for everyone. But I think in a way, that's what makes that kind of a bad defense is that we all went through it. Yes, everybody went through that. And so I think it'd be different if it was like, I don't know why this is coming to mind, but like Hurricane Katrina. Yeah. Okay, so I didn't go through that. Right. But if I were to hear about someone who did, I think I'd weirdly have more sympathy versus you're talking to me about something that I also went through. Now, granted, not, you know.

Yeah. My husband didn't leave me during that, you know. But I watched some of Michelle's testimony and they talk about it some on the Lifetime show as well. And they said she came off pretty well during her testimony. Like, she came off pretty sympathetic. Like, she was extremely emotional. She was extremely emotional when she was on the stand, and she was extremely emotional when Nick was on the stand. The rest of the time, she just kind of sat there.

Yeah. Yeah. That would be pretty moving. I agree. I agree. Okay. Yeah. The defense asked the jury to find Michelle not guilty of first degree murder. They said the state will not have met its burden to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that what happened on the 18th of May 2020 was first-degree murder. It was not. We will stand in front of you and ask you to hold her accountable, but only for what the evidence supports.

And that is not first-degree murder. Instead, it is manslaughter. No. No, no, no, no. So they said that the gloves were not a sign of premeditation. Oh, it's just pandemic stuff. She had the gloves in her car because of the pandemic. Shit.

Okay. Okay, but she got the fucking gloves on in no time. You think she's driving around stalking Tracy, wearing gloves because of the pandemic? Okay. Okay, this is super early in the pandemic, right the pandemic. Okay. Okay, this is super early in the pandemic, right? Yes. Okay. I remember and you and I talked about this

on the podcast. I have a very vivid memory of like, you know, it was one of those things. That was when first of all, we're all obviously wearing masks anytime we go someplace. But we were also all wearing gloves. And yes, sometimes you would see people in their cars driving alone with that whole get up on.

And I mean, that was just what people did sometimes. That's so funny. God damn. I didn't even think about that. Now, I don't think that's what happened here. No, I don't either. But that's an argument. That's an interesting point because I do remember.

She wasn't planning to murder her. She had the gloves because it was the pandemic. Okay, but why was she following her around? It was the pandemic, Kristen. No, that's not an excuse for following her. Sure it is. No, it's not. It's the pandemic.

We all stalked. Remember how isolated you felt. Yeah, so I just stalked people. Yeah, you're just following any old person around. Their life has to be more interesting than mine. That's just, you know, tools in case of an emergency. A hammer? Yeah.

What kind of emergencies is she getting into? I don't know. There was also like a shovel and a trowel. Which one's a trowel? I think it's like a little shovel, I think. I don't know. Okay. Yeah, that's a lot of tools to be carrying around.

Yeah. The defense continued. We ask you to follow the law, discuss it with each other, and not judge based upon a normal, everyday person, but a reasonable person. That's the same thing. Agreed. In this circumstance, the law allows manslaughter, and that's what we have here in this case. No.

And they deliberated. How long do you think they deliberated for, Kristen? I mean, it couldn't have been long. How long does it take to fill out the paperwork? Like half an hour, an hour? They deliberated for 45 minutes. Yes, that sounds exactly right. Yeah.

So we all think she's guilty of first-degree murder, right? Right, yeah. Okay, everybody good to sign the form? Yep. Yeah. So we all think she's guilty of first degree murder, right? Right, yeah. Right, yeah, okay. Everybody good to sign the form? Yep. Yeah. So within 45 minutes, they came back with a verdict. And Michelle was found guilty of first degree murder. Her sentencing was held like eight weeks later.

And it was like a 15-minute hearing because it's a mandatory sentence in Iowa for first-degree murder. It carries a mandatory life in prison without the possibility of parole. All right. And so Michelle was sentenced and sent off to prison where she remains today. What do you think? You think the pandemic made her do it? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

She sounds totally cool and reasonable. It's just the pandemic that made her do it. It's the pandemic. That is so stupid. Yeah. Especially when you have threatening voicemails that she's made. Well, see, and that's the part about this case that makes me mad. Because I feel like a defense, like, they're going to throw whatever they can at the wall especially in a case like this where it's so clear this is obviously

first degree murder you know I'm more concerned about this woman who's been stalking another person leaving these voicemails and there's nothing we can do. What do they do? I mean, this is where I feel like I want to learn more about stalking laws and stuff because, gosh, they do the right thing. I say right thing. Like, that's what you're supposed to do is get the protective order. Yeah. But then she walks right through it four times. Yeah.

Minimum of four times. Yeah, shouldn't you be in jail? That's just the time she showed up at Nick's work. Right. That doesn't include the time she was following Tracy around. I just wonder about what kind of message that sends to someone when you're told,

no way, you're not allowed to do this. They do it anyway. Yep. And they suffer no consequences. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Good grief. Yep.

And that's the story of the murder of Tracy Mondabaugh. That's awful. Mm-hmm. She left behind four children, a bunch of grandkids. Good grief. They were all so happy for her when she met Nick. Like, they really thought this was a great relationship for her. She seemed so happy.

Ugh. Mm-hmm. So had she just gotten out of a relationship, or what was her deal? I didn't find a lot about her past relationships. I mean, other than the thing about Michelle messaging her ex-boyfriend on Facebook. That's fucking weird. So weird. What did Tracy do for work?

She worked at a bunch of, I found a bunch of different fast food restaurants that she'd worked at. I don't know what she was doing for work at the time of. Yeah. I know she worked at Taco Bell and Burger King previously. Yeah. I would have stayed at Taco Bell. Although actually, you know what? Probably if I worked at Taco Bell, I wouldn't be able to eat Taco Bell. Probably not. So I'd probably have to separate my business and my pleasure. Sure. I'd have to work for the king and then eat at the bell. Yeah. Yeah. That's the way to do it, I think. I agree. Sure. I'd have to work for the king and then eat at the bell. Yeah. Yeah, that's the way to do it, I think.

I agree. Yeah. All right. Well, that was really sad and... I just think that defense is wild. They had nothing? Yeah, I think that's exactly it. They tried it.

They tried what they could. Because, yeah, how do you defend a case that has this much evidence? Yeah, I don't know. So the prosecutor talks about it a little bit because he's like, you know, he's like, they want to say she snapped. I don't think she snapped. I think she did exactly what she intended to do.

Absolutely. Yeah. She made up her mind. She knew what she was going to do. And she told Nick and Tracy what she was going to do. Yeah. Yeah. She made up her mind. She knew what she was going to do. And she told Nick and Tracy what she was going to do. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think she was very fucking clear.

Mm-hmm. Huh. Yeah. Well, should we do an ad? Yes. Doodaloo! Doodaloo Doodaloo And we're back from the ad Oh my goodness

And you know what we should do right now? Take some questions from the Discord That is right Everyone, if you're wanting to get into our Discord Who could blame you? All you have to do is sign up at the $5 level on Patreon That's patreon.com slash lgtcpodcast.

And you get in there, you chitty chat the day away, and when we're recording, we ask for questions. And sometimes you ask some questions, and sometimes we answer some questions. And I can't be any more clear than that. Oh. My in Wonderland asks, are you cool with your food touching?

I'm less cool with it than you are, but I'm okay with it. You're not okay. Yes, I am. I'll eat it if it touches. You should see my sister. She like put, Kim, she has to put them, like we have separate compartment plates for her. Oh, she's like elementary school cafeteria.

I don't want it to touch, but I'm still going to eat it. You would mix the whole plate together and still eat it. No, here's what you do. It's all about the perfect bite, ma'am. Okay, so you get a little bit of this on the fork, a little bit of that, a little bit of this, a little bit of that, and then magic happens. Yep, delish. That's the way to do it.

Ooh, Brandy's Zoom anxiety asks, in school, what was the most memorable project you did? Ooh, Brandy's Zoom anxiety asks, in school, what was the most memorable project you did? I'm a middle school history teacher, and today my students are travel agents and have to convince their classmates to move to their colony, one of the original 13 colonies. Oh, wow. It was so much fun. My most memorable is the models we made for our country project in sixth grade. Yeah. Yeah.

I loved that. Me too. I made a Norwegian Steve Church, I think is what it was called, out of popsicle sticks. It was beautiful. It was. I found God that day. No, we, yeah, in sixth grade, we were each assigned a country. Yeah, and you, like, worked on this project the whole year around your country. It was wonderful.

You did a research project on it, and then we did these models. Then we had like a cultural day where you dressed as if you were from your- Which, looking back, is like, oh. It was a questionable project there. We also made food from our countries. I made some kind of apple strudel thing. Uh-huh. Yeah.

Yeah, it was all very authentic. And, man, if you wanted to see a bunch of white kids dressed up as other cultures, well, 1999 had it down. It wasn't 1999. Anyway. Who knows what year it was. Not important. My dress, I remember for the day, looked a lot like Anna's dress from Frozen. Bitch stole your look. She did. Or I stole Norway's look. Don't worry about that. You're not the bad guy here. Not at all. Is that your most

memorable project too? Yeah, I would say so. The other one that I remembered is we did a book report project and we had to make a poster. Like there had to be to accompany your book report. And I did my report on Lewis Braille. And so I did my poster in Braille. Oh. Yeah. I have no memory of what I did for that. Yeah, that was also in sixth grade in Mrs. Dupree's class.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I must have really fucked up that project because I don't remember what I did for that. Oh, well. I just remember. So I had to I laid out the Braille and then like in bubbles and like colored them in with pencil. And then I poked a thumbtack through so it would raise the areas that needed to be raised and so my poster on the wall all the colored pencil was smeared all over it because

everybody felt the braille when they were walking by the pride that is coming off of you right now is pretty wild. Calling in Horny wants to know, what are y'all's icks? What is something people do that you immediately go, ick, no thank you. One of mine is when I'm having a conversation with customers at work and they are talking whilst actively chewing gum. That's for you too, right? Oh, yeah. You hate a gum chewer. I think it's gross.

I think it's really gross. Absolutely. What's your ick? Gosh, I don't know. I'm sure I have a bunch of them. I have a bunch of them. Norm and I were talking about this last night as we were like falling asleep. Yeah.

And I think my biggest ick, and it's been this way for like a year, is when people will say something and it's just their opinion on something. But it's clear, you know, they feel strongly. Yeah. And after they finish saying their opinion, it's clear they feel uncomfortable. And so they go, thank you for coming to my TED talk. I hate it. I hate it. It's so cringy to me. And imagine if they were chewing gum while they said, thank you for coming to my TED Talk. It would be so much worse. That would be my pandemic defense. They said, welcome to my, thank you for coming to my TED Talk. I had no choice but to murder them. Yeah, obviously. Yeah. What were you supposed to do? And I was wearing gloves because I'm just always wearing gloves. Constantly.

God damn. I can't think of a specific one that I have. I know I have them. Yeah. Yeah. Nothing's coming to mind. All right. Snowfeather asks, my husband and I went to Target and I showed him a cardigan I wanted and they only had one left in my size.

So I bought it for him to gift to me on Christmas. Is this tacky? I showed him a couple of other things I would like that they had more of my size in stock as well and told him that he would have to ship the rest for me. I don't think that's tacky. I think if you want it, I think it's fine. I don't think it's tacky either, but I think you just buy it for yourself. He doesn't get credit for that. Oh, sure.

Yeah. Okay. I sent David two things yesterday that I wanted for Christmas, and so I sent him the link. Yeah. And then last night while we were in bed, I was like, can you order those things soon so they don't sell out my size? Okay. So this is my problem with this stuff is like in the past I've given Norm like a list of things. Here are some things I'd like.

Yeah. And I've always been more of like kind of surprise me. Yeah. But then the problem is what if I really want all those things? Right. And then I'm like, okay, which one should I just buy myself? Right. You know?

Yeah. So I don't know that it works. Yeah. See, my thing is that I buy David a gift and then I want to give it to him immediately. Same. Yeah. For David specifically. No, same.

Yeah. So I bought David this really nice KU sweatshirt. Yeah. As a Christmas present. It came, but it came with a bunch of- I am so sorry. I just slurped my drink. You're totally fine.

It came, but it came with a bunch of other stuff. And so we were just like opening the packages together, making like piles of where stuff, you know, needs to be wrapped and whatever. And he opened it before I knew it. And he was like, what is this? And I was like, that's a present for you. And he's like, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

I didn't even really look. I didn't look. Yeah. And I was like, can you just try it on now that you opened it? That way I know if I got the right size. And we all know that he did, in fact, look. He could have described it to a sketch artist. For sure he could have.

For sure. And so then he tried it on. It looked really nice. And I was like, you can just wear it. Yeah, just have it. And he's like, no. And so he put it back in the pile of things to be wrapped. See, that kills me.

Yeah, I want them to have everything right away. I know, yeah. And then we'll all have a terrible Christmas. I want him to be wearing that sweatshirt right now. Yes. Yes. And only that sweatshirt. And then you'll draw him like one of your Johnson County boys.

By the way, when I'm picturing this, you're drawing him on a dry erase board. Oh, sure. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And I'm really bad at drawing, so it's all stick figures. That's fine. Yeah. That's fine.

But that KU sweatshirt looks great. Looks great. And his stick peen looks pretty good, too. My goodness. Could we have a fig leaf, please? Would that be too much to ask? A palm frond, maybe? Okay.

I think this is hilarious that this person would even ask this okay elderly bigfoot asked brandy have you ever had an accident at work i once trusted a fart more than i should have i had to testify in court that day too long story short don't go to olive garden before your court point court appearance if you're lactose intolerant oh my, my. No, I would not fart at work. Like, I just never would. So, no, that's never happened. Well, that's not the only way to have an accident at work. Oh, sure.

Yeah. No, I've never had an accident. Get creative with your poops. No. Well, there was that one time that you had too many Fiber One bars. Yeah, my stomach all bloated up. That did not. I didn't have to shit.

I just, like, my stomach bloated up. Like, there was nothing was finding an exit was the problem there. Yeah. My butthole's too tight. How do you feel about that answer, Kristen? Well, that was on your Tinder profile. So I just, you know, I don't feel like it's necessary to share here. Someone in the fan group the other day

just did post something about like Brandy, Titus Butthole and podcasting. I was like, my claim to fame! How are they testing for that is what I want to know. Don't you worry about it. Okay. Hmm. I've never considered this, but yes, you are correct.

This is a family podcast says, did you know that if David married Norm, his name would be David Caruso? Like the guy from CSI Miami, the guy who takes his glasses off all the time. I know exactly who you mean. Okay. Yeah. They have to get married now, obviously. How would you feel if David was like, look, I want to divorce you.

It's nothing personal at all. I've just got this opportunity right in front of me. To become David Caruso. And he's like, you get it, right? You get it. You get it. I don't think I would get it. Wow.

I guess you really do have the tightest butthole in podcasting. That's right. Frozen Like a Grape asks, I was listening to an old episode, 2018, Chandra Levy and the Wichita Horror. Since it's been so long since that episode, have your opinions on statute of limitations changed? In that episode, you seem strongly against them or at least the arbitrary years for them. No, I hate the statute of limitations. I don't understand why time passing would make a crime not count anymore. Especially when it comes to sexual assault and stuff.

Yes. I hate statute of limitations. I think it's ridiculous. I've said this before. I'll say it again. I want to know who came up with it. Right. Because they were for sure a murderer or something.

I do not understand it. Who floats that idea? And then who's like, yes, I also agree. Yes, they haven't caught me yet. After seven years of rape, no longer counts. Yeah. No, I hate it. Ridiculous.

Yes, I think it's so ridiculous. Brandy's Laugh Twin says, this is not a question, but I thought Brandy might like to hear that when I was young, I dented the driver's door of my parents' minivan in an automatic car wash. So I definitely understand car wash anxiety. Thankfully, my dad is a very forgiving guy. The huge dent was still there when he sold it many years later. Yeah, I have serious car wash anxiety. Well, and like I don't know that I necessarily have a specific event tied to it, but I'm always worried that I'm going to like miss the track or something like that. I had a client, now that I'm saying this out loud, I had a client years ago when I was a brand new baby stylist.

Yeah. Who owned a car wash. Okay. And he always talked about hoses getting ripped off and stuff because people did it wrong. People doing stupid stuff in the car wash. And you're like, I don't want to be the stupid person. I'm not going to be the stupid person. Yeah.

I also have ordering anxiety at a new place for the same reason. I don't want to be the stupid person who's holding up the line because I don't know how to order at a place I've never been to before. I didn't go to Starbucks for the longest time because I had no idea how to order there. I didn't go to Chipotle for the longest time because I had no idea how to order there. I didn't go to Chipotle for the longest time because I had no idea how to order there. My brother actually took me to Chipotle for the very first time because it was his favorite restaurant. And I was like, OK, you take me there. You teach me how to order and I will buy you lunch. How did you get introduced to Starbucks? I went with a group of women from work. I was on a work trip in Colorado.

So the people at Starbucks never had to see me again. Right. And I was with another, like, three other district managers. Right. And they were like, there was a Starbucks, like, two doors down from the salon that we were visiting. What year was this? I mean, this was in 2010. 2010.

Uh-huh. Yeah. And I just ordered what they ordered. Even to this day, if I want to try a new drink at Starbucks, I Google how to order it. Like what exactly I'm supposed to say. Brandy, how small is your comfort zone? It's smaller than your butthole. I'm pretty sure.

That's ridiculous. Yeah, I just, I don't have anxiety about that. Uh-huh. Yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah. I don't like a restaurant

that you have to go in and like read the menu and place an order at a counter. Yeah, I know. I've been places with you. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know how to order there.

Yeah, I've seen you in new places. It's never good. It's never good. Should we move on to some Supreme Court inductions? Absolutely. To get inducted on this podcast, all you have to do is sign up on our Patreon at the Supreme Court level or higher. And right now, we are reading your names and your first celebrity crushes. Lilia. Gwen Stefani in her Tragic Kingdom era. Missy. Joey from New Kids on the Block. Sarah

Brie. Christian Slater. T and Crumpets. Luke Perry. Andy. Brian Latrelle.ll Laura Michael J. Fox Jason McNamara Johnny Depp Too tired to come up with a clever nickname A.K.A. Becky Ralph Macchio K-Bear Captain Hook from Once Upon a Time That's very specific

Julia Benny From the Sandlot, not from the Jets Sure Just calm down Okay Kelly Johnny Depp Specifically from 21 Jump Street.

Easy beef. My name is Elizabeth, and it's how my two-year-old could say my name. That's amazing. Easy beef. Easy beef. And easy beef has an answer that we have seen many a time before. David Bowie in Labyrinth. That bulge.

Oh, my goodness. Mesmerized. Mesmerized a lot of us, evidently. A lot of people. Sabrina Gruber. Josh Hartnett. Kelly. Chris Kirkpatrick. Lily. Lydia Dietz. Max Dozo. Jennifer Love Hewitt. Nikki.

Nicholas Halt. Welcome to the Supreme Court! Thank you everyone for all of your support. We appreciate it so much. Welcome to the Supreme Court. Thank you, everyone, for all of your support. We appreciate it so much. If you're looking for other ways to support us, please find us on social media. We're on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Patreon.

Please remember to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen and then head on over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a five-star rating and review. Then be sure to join us next week. When I'll be an expert on a whole new topic. Podcast adjourned! And now for a note about our process. I copy and paste from the best sources on the web and sometimes Wikipedia. So we owe a huge thank you to the real experts. I got my info from an episode of Sleeping with a Killer,

ChillingCrimes.com, KCCI 8 News, Court TV, and the Oskaloosa Herald. For a full list of our sources, visit LGTCpodcast.com. Any errors are, of course, ours, but please don't take our word for it. Go read their stuff.