Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2109: What to Do When You’ve Plateaued, Why Bulking Can Help You Look Better, Splitting up Maps Programs Into Shorter Workouts & More (Listener Live Coaching)

Episode Date: July 1, 2023

In this episode of Quah (Q & A), Sal, Adam & Justin coach four Pump Heads via Zoom. Mind Pump Fit Tip: Fitness fanatics! If you want to boost your gains and progress, cut the volume of your training down by a third! (2:03) Sal reviews the peptide tesofensine. (18:31) How red-light therapy works and affects sunburns. (27:13) Why the market repurposes drugs. (30:08) Preparing for Max’s 4th birthday party. (34:45) How fast reps can also build muscle. (44:57) Have cravings? Try increasing your sodium intake. (47:48) Shout out to the Founders Podcast. (51:07) #ListenerLive question #1 – How can I start to gain weight again? I’m currently eight months into a three-year bulk and have plateaued. (52:49) #ListenerLive question #2 – I need help and do not know where to go from here. I have lost a substantial amount of weight and now have a flat look. I do not know what to do now to look more muscular and better. (1:15:54) #ListenerLive question #3 – How much should I adjust my caloric intake on days when I lift versus swim (if I am prioritizing building muscle and strength)? (1:29:04) #ListenerLive question #4 – I’d love to do something different, and I am wondering if I can take MAPS Anabolic and make it a 25-minute workout/5-6 days a week? (1:39:25) Related Links/Products Mentioned Ask a question to Mind Pump, live! Email: [e-mail] Visit Joovv for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! For a limited time only, Mind Pump listeners get a free LMNT Sample Pack with any purchase: Visit DrinkLMNT.com/MindPump June Promotion: MAPS Cardio | Summer Shredded Bundle | Bikini Bundle 50% off! **Code JUNE50 at checkout** MAPS 15 Minutes Mind Pump #2010: Seven Reasons Your Workout Isn’t Working How to Become a Successful Personal Trainer TRANSCEND your health goals! Telehealth Provider • Physician Directed GET YOUR PERSONALIZED TREATMENT PLAN!  Hormone Replacement Therapy, Cognitive Function, Sleep & Fatigue, Athletic Performance and MORE. Their online process and medical experts make it simple to find out what’s right for you. Mind Pump #2097: Peptides That Improve Your Memory & Mental Sharpness With Jay Campbell ‎Founders on Apple Podcasts Visit Butcher Box for this month’s exclusive Mind Pump offer! Mind Pump #1485: Ten Life Lessons From Lifting Weights MAPS Symmetry Mind Pump #1830: Five Steps To Determine Your Ideal Caloric Intake Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources People Mentioned David Senra (@FoundersPodcast) Twitter Dr. John Delony (@johndelony) Instagram  

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind, pop, mind, pop with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded Fitness Health and Entertainment podcast. This is Mind Pup. Right in today's episode, we actually helped live callers with their fitness and health. But this was after the intro portion of this episode that was 50 minutes long. This is where we talk about current events. Fitness studies are lives and much more. By the way, you could check the show notes for timestamps if you just want to

skip around to your favorite parts. Also, if you want to be on an episode like this one, have us help you live on air. Email your question to live at minepumpmedia.com. This episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Juve. This is real red light therapy for your home. So all the studies on red light therapy and how it improves the appearance of your skin, re-grows hair, speeds up recovery.

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Get $50 off your purchase. This episode is also brought to you by Elemente or Element. This is an electrolyte powder that helps fuel your workouts, gives you better pumps, better muscle contractions. It's, there's no sugar. It's not artificially flavored, tastes amazing, and it has the right amount of sodium for fitness-minded people. It's legit, it's backed by science, and it's inexpensive, tastes great. Go check them out, go to drink

elementy.com-flour-slash-mine-pump and get yourself a free sample pack with any order. This is also the final hours of our June special. So, Maps is half off the shredded summer bundle of workout programs is half off and The bikini bundle of programs is half off. So all of those are half off if you're listening to this episode when it drops You have a few hours to take advantage if you're interested go to maps fitness products calm and then use the code June 50 for that discount. All right, here comes a show Fitness fanatics those of you that almost never miss a workout, I have a fitness tip that's gonna boost your gains.

That's right, what I'm about to tell you, for those of you that go to the gym all the time, never miss a workout or super consistent, the following is going to progress you. The following is gonna get you a lot further. You ready? Cut the volume of your training down by a third. Seriously, all of you, almost all of you

are probably overdoing it. Try it out, it won't hurt you. For the next two weeks, take your total volume, cut it down by a third, and you'll probably get stronger, you'll probably get more fit, you'll probably build more muscle and burn more body fat. Give it a shot, watch what happens. Sum it up, relax.

A little bit. Yeah, what did you say, like if you, watch what happens. Sum it up, relax. A little bit. Yeah, what did you say, like if you, like somebody who like never misses workouts, like if you could do the one, it tell them the one thing, that would probably get their body to progress, it's probably that. Yeah. I mean, I think this is actually even common with the, and we would never tell this to our client who struggles

with getting the gym and being consistent, but even the average person who is not a fitness fanatic tends to swing one way or the other. Like you're either off and you do nothing, right? So you're not a fitness fanatic. So you're not loving it. You have this kind of love hate relationship with fitness, but then you have these moments where you decide to get on your kick or you have some competitive thing at work or you have something that you're getting ready for.

Vegas trip coming up two months. And so now I said, and you become a fitness person, and you tend to go all in, and you're like way over doing it. And there's a way better approach for you. And then most certainly, if you're already a fitness fanatic, and you love going to the gym,

it's here and you've deemed it your church or your place of, you know, where your mind relax, where you get all this value, you've made an excuse of why you push so hard at the gym all the time. Not to mention, this is like the messaging is in our space. It's been that way for as long as social media

has been around, this idea of motivation and no days off. And it's your whole identity at that point. You really wrap a lot of yourself into this routine and all the benefits and you've associated all these things with that whole process. So to step away from that a bit to better your body is a really tough conversation. Yeah, if you're like, if you've been doing this for a long time and you've been consistent, like really, I'm not talking to the guy or girl right now watching, he's like, yeah, I've been consistent for two months, like, okay, don't worry about that. I've talked about the person's like, I don't miss workouts.

I've been doing this for years. I go on vacation, I work out. Like, I do not skip workouts. Yeah. What the tendency, the consistent tendency with someone like that is the following. You work out for a long time, and the consistent tendency is to increase the volume slowly over time to reach a point of what you can tolerate. And I've said this before on the show many times, what is optimal is not the same as the maximum you can tolerate. The optimal is down here, what you can maximally tolerate is up here. So you might not be overtraining, but you're a beyond optimal, meaning you're not going to get the same gains. You're not going to get the same results because your body is more concerned with recovery

than it is with adaptation. So if that's you, and this isn't gonna hurt anybody, so you gotta have a little bit of bravery, I know how it can be when you work out so consistently and it's like what you love, like oh, what's gonna happen if I cut my volume now? Literally, just cut it down by a third. So if you do 12 sets per body part in your workout, do nine.

That's it. Just do that. Just cut three sets out or one third of your volume. And then you're gonna get stronger. You're probably gonna progress. At the worst, at the absolute worst, nothing's gonna happen. At the absolute worst, you do less

and get the same results. In which case, you know, that's also revealing, which is you can do less, get the same results. Now you've got more time on your hands, you know, type of deal. But I experienced this some time. To add to that, most of the fitness fanatics push until they hit go beyond that threshold, and then when they scale back,

they still don't scale back to optimal. They just scale back to just below what they can tolerate. So they push, push, push, find that line. And it's like, oh, oh yeah, I know what he's talking about. I've definitely been there before. My joints are hurting or I actually get weaker and I'm actually training six, seven, eight, eight, eight. And they go like, yeah, so I need to go scale back to five days

and I need to pull back a little bit of the volume and they pull back. And so now they don't have these negative signs anymore, but what they don't even realize is they're still not in the sweet spot. So my challenge would be, I challenge you to maps 15. Like that to me is like two ways that I would say this to a client. How you know if this is something that you would benefit one, if it scares you to death

to reduce to maps. Well, there's something there. You're probably that person, right? And then if you actually do it and realize that you not only don't lose any gains, but you actually see some gains from that program, that's a clear indication that you were way on the other side of optimal and that's 15 is closer to your optimal. Even if you could handle potentially a little bit more, it's closer than what you were doing.

Would you say, I mean, in terms of like the actual fear of it for somebody like that is because of the fact that maybe too much of it is wrapped into motivation. It's too wrapped into like, I have to be able to hit all these strides, all these things have to keep working out in such a way to where if they don't, all of a sudden, they can completely fall off the deep end. Instead of it just being like,

you know, what's balance was best from a buyer? Where's that sweet spot lie? Like how can I constantly be in a flux of like listening to my body and finding that hum? Yeah, I, you know, as somebody who, you know, I definitely have a tendency to go in this direction. And I never know what I'm missing until I get there. So you could tell this to me when I'm doing

my normal consistent, read whatever workouts. And it's exactly what you said, Adam, I'd be like, well, I'm not over-trained with that, feels like. I feel fine, everything's good. I, you know, I look good, I feel good. And then what ends up happening is I'm typically forced for some reason to scale back on the volume, or I have this like epiphany where I'm like,

what would happen if I just cut things down? Let's just see what would happen because I've done this for so long that I've had that experience a few times. And every time, every single time I scale back, oh my God, I'm stronger. Wow, look at this, my body's progressing again. Like, you know, why didn't I do this before?

And then what happens is I stay there, and then I start to scale up again. Part of it, I think, is fitness fanatics have learned to love the process so much that you just like working out. So it's almost like, if you tell, like, okay, here's how you know, if you're a fitness fanatic and you're listening, here's how you know, if I told you you could get the same results doing less and you still don't want to do it, because you love doing more, you know that there's something going on there, right? Like, you tell somebody, hey, what if you get the same results working on half the time, the person like, but I love yeah, working out for an hour, you know, type of deal. Now you know that you're you're you're pushing your body, because here's what the and be very honest with yourself if you're listening, do you

find yourself constantly balancing between, you know, doing as much as you can and overtraining? Does it feel like you're walking that tight rope? Like, oh, I'm almost overtraining. This is the balance, almost overtraining. I'm on this line. That line right there is, there is a line between overtraining and what you can tolerate, but what is beyond that line is optimal.

It's way over here. There's a lot of space between optimal and what you can tolerate. So you can get away with a lot more than what is gonna get you the best results. So overtraining is a very clear sign you're doing too much. Not overtraining, it's harder to notice. Because you're still doing too much in terms of results.

You're just not doing too much to where it makes you overtrain. This is why I'm saying to people, worst case scenario, doing too much in terms of results, you're just not doing too much to where it makes you over trying. This is why I'm saying to people, worst case scenario, if you scale back a third of the volume, again, if you're this like super consistent person, you just, nothing's gonna happen. You're just gonna notice the same results. You're not gonna get any worse shape.

That's for sure. We know that for a fact, that's what the data shows. But what's probably gonna happen to nine and a 10 people watching this who are in this category, literally 90% is you'll notice within the first week or two, okay. So you don't have to do this very long. So I get to do it for six months to test it out. Within the first seven to 14 days, you'll see progress.

Then you know, holy crap. They were right. They were right. I also think that it's a way for us to avoid, and speaking to fitness fanatics, including myself in this conversation, I was thinking it's a way to avoid your insecurities. I think it's really easy when you've got a lot of issues either going on in your life or you were an addict of something else. It's really easy to justify these behaviors because working out falls in the category of

good and helping yourself and healthy. And so it's very easy to overdo that in really the pursuit of avoiding what's really going on inside of you. Making it, developing a dysfunctional relationship with something that's healthy is very, can be very insidious and sneaky. Very much so. And it's a good thing. Yeah, and it's really hard for no one,

no one's gonna see you working out seven days a week. You're amazing physique and you look so healthy and stuff like that and go like, oh, you're so unhealthy because you work out all the time. That's a matter. Yeah, right. Nobody is, nobody's gonna say that to you. And to be clear, it is better than me addicted

like something bad. That's right, that's right. But it's, it's, it's an easy way for us to shield ourselves from these other issues that are going on in our life and justify those addictive behaviors because they have they have these positive you know outcomes from it. So I think a lot of that and let's be honest, we've talked about it on the show many times that you know what drove each of us into fitness wasn't insecurity. I didn't turn to the gym and working out because I was like, you know what?

At 17 years old, I was like, I want to take care of myself. And this is how I'm going to love myself. I'm going to go to the gym and exercise. And none of us did it that way. It was like, I'm too skinny. That's right. The motivation was from a place of an insecure place. And most of us don't solve that. We just build a bigger shell and a stronger

shell around that insecurity. And so it's real. And this is most people that I have met in the space that are the best physiques that we all admire is that they actually have this deeper thing inside of them that this is just shielding that and keeping people from even digging into that or themselves digging into it. Yeah, here's another way. This isn't, by the way, what we're talking about, you know, you gotta kind of pay attention to yourself

because sometimes like we're saying, it might not be so obvious or you don't want it to be obvious to yourself. So it's easy to lie to yourself. Here's another sign. Do you find yourself working out more and becoming more obsessive about your, let's say your workouts, your diet, your supplements when you're under a lot of stress? Or do you find yourself kind of backing off when you're under a lot of stress?

Now fitness fanatics who have this type of addictive personality to fitness tend to do more of it. When they're really stressed out, ooh, I'm working out more. I'm working out longer. I'm working out harder. I'm more structured with my diet. I'm more structured with my supplements. This is me. The more stress I'm under, the more the more consistent I am, the more hardcore I get with my training, the more I become obsessed with these types of things, just like any abusive relationship so it tends to happen when we get more stressed. Now, the average person gets more stressed,

like, well, I don't have as much energy to work out and I take some time off or do the things that leave that stress. So, and yes, exercise can be a stress reliever until it becomes a stress producer. So, just something to be wary of. And I know we're going off into that segment, know, into that, that, you know, that segment. But really literally this, and this is again, I have to sell this. So, and I know, because again, I'm talking myself, the only way you could sell this to me when I'm not in a state of awareness is to tell

me that I'll get better results if I cut the volume down. Then I might even take a chance. Now if you come to me and say, Hey, sell, you're a little too addictive to exercise. I'm like, whatever bro, I'm gonna keep working out. But if I do, you could add 50 pounds to your lift. If you took a third of the volume off, I might try it out. And that's indeed what tends to motivate me. So, even if what we're saying, you're like, whatever, I don't care, that's not me, whatever.

If you want to get better results, if you haven't missed a workout in like six months or a year or longer for sure Cut you're falling down a third by a third watch what happens. Yeah, and a third is a good number to start with This is the same process for me selling mobility to athletes or selling mobility to any of my clients because no We want to do it but if you want to look at it as a way of a performance enhancement and and and you're gonna get stronger and your lifts are gonna Go up and everything if you discipline yourself to do this

because you don't like it. You know, it's gonna transform you. And so you need to hear a different angle to a lot of these things that are good for you sometimes. Well, and to address the people that I know that are shaking their head right now, I'd be like, that's a stupid idea. I would never do that.

I know that if I were to stop doing that or reduce that, that I would, it would make me less consistent. And I know how important the consistency is. So that there's a way to reduce the volume dramatically, but still keep your consistent behaviors of going to the gym and working on yourself and taking care of yourself. And now instead of it being an hour and a half, high intensity workout seven days a week, you go to the gym still for an hour and a half, but now at half hour, 45 minutes of that,

is you doing mobility and stretching work, or you walking on a treadmill, or you stay busy, just doing things, reading, or you doing a lot of other things that serve you and take care of you and make you a better version of yourself, but cutting back dramatically on the punishing yourself in the lifting weights, arena, and doing other things that will support you.

So keep the habit up, keep the consistency up of going to the gym or carving that time out for yourself, but learn to shift it away from not always beating yourself up in order to quote unquote feel good, and actually do things that are more recuperative or growing you in different ways. So that's kind of what I do. So you know what I do?

So let's say I'm going to do a workout with, let's say, 20 sets in the workout and it takes me an hour. Well now I'll cut it down to let's say 12 sets. It still takes me an hour. I just take way longer between sets. So now I know, I see the clock, I got way more time. I'm doing less volume. So we different intensity. I'm still in there. I'm just taking longer in between sets. So now I know I see the clock, I got way more time, I'm doing less volume. Totally different intent. I'm still in there. I'm just taking longer in between sets and

thinking about things or what I'm going to do with the workout or maybe foam rolling or something like that in between, a little bit of stretching, and then I'll go into the exercise. So a lot of different ways to do it, but look, I'll say this again, I mean, we're selling it, but we're not lying, you will get better results, you will. You're going to get better results if you try what we say and give it a shot, give it a shot for a week or two, watch what happens. By the way, this is why I've made this case before

talking to other entrepreneurs of other businesses and other people that some of the best sales people in the world started in gyms. It's because if you want people to, this is for the coaches and trainers listening right now, if you want to be really effective to get people to adopt certain behaviors, you have to learn how to sell them very well.

So I'm trying to sell a fitness fanatic on why they need to do less. Well, I could tell them it's bad for you, you got a bad relationship with exercise. Fitness fanaticism give a shit, don't care. But if I say, hey, you're gonna get better gains, you might build more muscle, get leaner, now I might get your attention a little bit.

Not lying, in tone of the truth, I've just sold it to you a little bit better. So coaches and trainers listening, when you're talking to your clients, like Justin said, with mobility, most people don't care about mobility because they care about fat loss, they care about muscle, but let's say I've pain, nobody cares about mobility.

How can I sell mobility to a client? I can tell them about how mobility contributes to fat loss and muscle gain. Now they're interested and guess what now? They're getting the mobility that I wanted to get in the first place. Speaking of the coaches and trainers, Doug, what is the name of, so long ago,

it's been like what, four years, maybe more when Sal wrote that incredible guide for coaches and trainers, it's absolutely free. We haven't talked about it in forever. Yeah, we haven't talked about it. And I remember when we first did it, like all the great feedback that we have from it, it's on our MindPumpFree.com,

but what was the name of the, do you remember the name of the title of the? It's at MindPumpFree.com. Yeah, so, how do you know? How to become a successful person, yeah, that's it. How to become a successful person, yeah, it's at MindPumpFree.com, and it's a great free white paper that he wrote

a long time ago. And we never talked about it. I've been meaning to bring it up the next time he brought up coaches. You just reminded me so take advantage of that. I'm sure. All right. So I want to tell you guys about, again, talking about fitness, fanatics, bad relationship with stuff.

And you know, this is a tricky, this relationship we have with MP hormones.com for me is a little tricky because you guys know my relationship with supplements and shit like that. So now I have accessed all these peptides and all this stuff. So I have a lot of fun, also a little careful. Don't wanna do too many things at once. So I'm trying to try one thing, see how it works, try another thing.

So I tried a peptide called Tessofenson, okay? I did this about, I wanna say three months ago. Took it and what it is, it's a, people use it for fat loss because it's got some fat loss effects plus, it's got some appetite suppressing effects and some energy boosting effects. And people are talking about it, let me give this a shot. I took it, made me feel crazy.

I went off of it. Anyway, contacted our people and I said, all right, what's the deal? Like I felt like literally like it was, like something's wrong. They said, oh, it's the dose is way too high. You gotta go much lower. So I took the dose down a quarter. So I seem to be very sensitive to it.

Amazing. This is an amazing peptide. So Tessel-Fenson is known as a dopamine, noraponephrine, serotonin, reuptake inhibitor. Okay, so what is it? Neutropic. So what it does is it increases circulating levels in the brain of dopamine, norepinephrine, and serotonin. Now we know that serotonin does.

So SRI select this serotonin reuptake inhibitors are antidepressants. So serotonin will make you kind of feel better a little bit more relaxed. Norepinephrine is a stimulant kind of fat burning type of a of a cataclysmine or chemical. So if you have high to at norepinephrine is a stimulant kind of fat burning type of a catacolomene or chemical. So if you have high Norepinephrine, almost feels like caffeine. Dopamine is a motivator, a driver, it makes you want to do things. So all those go up at the same time and what typically people experience is better mood, more energy, kind of clear focus. So promotes more activity throughout your day.

Yeah, you just have more energy. That's what you're supposed to do, right? You're supposed to feel more energy, sharper, better verbal fluency, some fat loss. A lot of people report fat loss. In fact, it got researched as a Parkinson's Alzheimer's drug initially to help with cognitive performance. They noticed people lost weight on it. as a Parkinson's Alzheimer's drug initially to help with cognitive performance,

they noticed people lost weight on it. So of course, what do you think they're gonna be? Yeah, weight loss, weight bigger market, right? So they start marketing that way. So anyway, I took the dose way down, started taking it. I'm now on day, I don't know, 10. Mm-hmm.

Now I love it. The high dose, I did not- So right away, my- I thought crazy on the high dose. Right away, my concern would be, is that one of those ones that you would recommend cycling on and off because I don't want, and does this happen?

Like is it going to reduce what the body naturally produces of all those things? Like those are all really important to feeling good, not feeling depressed and so on. So of course it has positive effects when you're taking it. But then if you come off of it, is your body still going to produce the same amount or will it down-regulate? No.

So, with anything that is a re-uptake inhibitor, you work with the people that, you know, the professionals and what you do is you go on it, see how you feel. And if you ever want to go off, there's a scaling down process. So you don't just stop. So you do need to do that, because then you will feel that. Well, you might. Some people don't, but you might. So you want to, oh, so some peptides are like that, where you go on and you go off, most of them are like that. Some of them, some of them you kind of scale down, like dihexa is the other one. Utropic, Cmax is another one, Utropic, you don't just stop it. You kind of see, I had no problems

starting and stopping those. I noticed Cmax when I went off cold turkey. I was, I was cloudy for like four days. So you know it's interesting is maybe that's the unfortunate part for me is maybe I feel less of the positive effects, but then I also don't get as much of the negative effects. Could be.

So I can feel at Cmax for sure, I think of the positive effects, but then I also don't get as much of the negative effects. Could be. So I can feel, at CMax for sure, I think of the new tropic world of peptides has been my favorite of all the ones. The hex sound is kind of like about that. But none of them have made me feel really bad on. I don't, yeah, I don't feel dramatic. I do, CMax, I do feel sharper. I do like it. But I also stopped it for quite some time and didn't feel like, oh man, there was a huge drop off.

Yeah, that's interesting too. I wonder what the drop off is for people that don't get that dose right, right? Or work with their physician to really maximize that and they just abandon it. When it's, and sometimes it is, it's, Oh well, so I'll tell you, because that's what I experienced. So I was taking, I don't wanna see what the doses are

because I don't want people to copy me. You want to work with somebody. Yes, this is all working with your physician. Well, you know, keep in mind too, that the relationship we have with our partners at mphormones.com is, we work with the doctors there. They also know what our goals are. They also know that we talk about these products.

So we kind of can try different things so that we can communicate them. I don't want to communicate something. I don't wanna communicate something that I haven't necessarily experienced myself because you never know, right? And they also know, and I've communicated to them, like, hey, I love this stuff. Give me, make sure I feel it or whatever.

So I think what they do with me is they just give me the highest dose, they know, Sal loves this shit or whatever. So that's what happened, I took the highest dose, and I think it was too much dopamine. I really do, I had symptoms of too much dopamine. I felt it shit or whatever. So that's what happened. I took the high ass dose and I think it was too much dopamine. I really do. I had symptoms of too much dopamine. I felt it was too much.

I felt too much of that drive. My sleep was off. I felt like I was like, like this, I crazy is how I phone too much. Edgy, right? It's got a long half life. So when I stopped, it naturally weaned itself down because the half life is like six days.

So you take one today. It takes like six to 10 days for it to be out of your system. So is that all you're taking is just once a week? No, I took the dose down from what they were giving me to a quarter. So it's a quarter of what they would actually take. So once a month? No, no, no, no, I take a quarter. It was supposed to be one capsule a day.

I know, but if the half, Oh, no, it's a quarter of a capsule. Yeah, but I like, okay, so if the half life is six days, though, why, why take it every single day still? Because it's amazing. Because if you were consistent, well, if you do that, it would also, that's not necessarily the half-zone. No, I know, it does, but you keep it at a consistent level

if you take it on a daily basis versus taking one, waiting till it drops down and take another one. Huh, okay. But anyway, at this dose, it's pretty amazing. It's got a very, it definitely got anti-depressant kind of productivity producing effect. Just and I think you would absolutely love it.

Yes, I think you would love it. I think you would love it. I think you would love it. I know I've been experimenting with the Mont-C and really liking it. You know, initially, and here's the other thing why I said that too, because there was like a little bit of a period

where when I would go to inject and I'd have a little bit of a skin rash and like, but the effects of it afterwards were just like, I could feel it, like it was substantial and so I was like, I may have been able to give it a few more. And it took a couple times and then I don't get that same response, so it was interesting. So it's a couple times and then I don't get that same response. So it was interesting.

So it's interesting because some peptide, the way that some peptides work is they kick certain processes in the gear responses. They kick certain processes into motion. They get your body to work the way it's quote unquote, supposed to and then you can go off. And then those things maintain. So what you'll notice when you,

like I don't know about you when I I did not see, I was like, oh my God, I feel so good. And then gradually over time, it just kind of just felt normal. And then I went off and now I feel like normal. It's not like I went off and I noticed nothing. Right. It's unlike a C-max where I went off completely

and I could tell, that would be something I want to wean down. Yeah. Tessel Fenson would be like that as well. You're gonna take it and then go to, but then, like I said, the Neutropic kind of like uplifting effects from it, like way different. So I'm glad I tried it again at a lower dose.

It's interesting how that has a fat loss effect to the whole thing. It's a norepinephrine. Norepinephrine is a fat burner. What was it? What was it when you were talking to Dr. Seeds about that had a camera mirror? It did something with the mitochondria.

I don't know if it like repaired it faster or it enhanced it. There was one that did that. I don't remember what it was something with the mitochondria. I don't know if it like, like repaired it faster or it enhanced it. There was one that did that. I don't remember what it was though. I heard you guys talking at lunch. Do you remember? I think it was Motsi. Oh, was it Motsi? I think it was Motsi.

Motsi's, yeah. So what it used to be? It was a good mitochondrial, yeah. Is that what it does? Motsi was identified because it's released in muscles post-exercise. Okay. It increases insulin sensitivity. And it improves mitochondrial function.

So what you'll notice, if this is something that you need, because some people would take it, I would imagine, and not notice anything. But if this is something that you need, you'll take it, and it's not a stimulant, it doesn't feel like I took a stimulant, it just, I just feel good. That's all, I just felt good energy. I wonder, I wonder then if you paired,

because you guys are both on MOTC right now? I stopped that. Oh, you did. I turned it to Ben. You know what I'd love for you to do right now? If you have the discipline to do this, is consistently use your Juve with it. And see if that actually-

Because they both affect mitochondria. That's why I asked that. Yeah. I don't, I don't, I think, so the way that, the way that red light works, it would work with anything. Red light is totally different. So red light's not a peptide, you're not taking a substance.

Yeah, I mean, I know. It signals your cells. Just the next turn signal. Yeah, it signals your cells to do more of what they do, to basically turbo charge themselves. So you can take whatever you want and combine red light therapy with it, and it's gonna be better, no matter what. Yeah, okay. But I mean, if you have something that's directly, like Motsie affecting the mitochondria,

and then you have something like Jew, which makes it all, it makes it run better. I would have think that the results that you feel from that would be enhanced more than anything else. Although everything else would positively affect everything. We've talked about creatines doing your creatine when you do it everything I know yeah, so essentially read this particular wavelight of light signals the cell

To basically do more of what it does and to Basically to to act production to act like a younger version of itself Okay, that's that that would be a good way to put it By the way, it's the research on red light therapy goes back decades. This isn't like some weird, you know what I just read? By the way, you know what their red light therapy is good for? Sunburns. Sunburns reduces inflammation and means appealing.

Well, I mean, so if you have a sunburn back to your point about yourself, the efficiency of the cell, if they're doing, because that's what it's having to do is repair from, it's done damage, right? The sun, sunburn is damaged to the skin, which is an unsealable skin. Part of me would have not put it on a sunburn skin. Part of me would be like afraid.

Oh yeah, yeah, I get, yeah, no you're right. I would have not done that, because heat doesn't sound like a good idea, and it feels like it emits a little bit of heat, so you know. Yes, because I looked it up, because we're going to be on vacation soon, and I'm going to be in the sun. I'm like, I wonder, and I just thought to myself, I'm like, I wonder how red light therapy

would affect a sunburn. Sure enough, there's studies showing reduces inflammation speeds up. It's a paleing interest thing of sunburn. So, what's the one peptide that also increases melanin? Like it? Oh, it's like a lanyotan. It was all the other ones. Yeah, well, I just wonder if, like, with that if it cuz you know, it's a protective

For you V. I just can't help about my picture him coming in one day like so brown Just deep chocolate brown color Slips are all out You're all out to do that, too. Like, what? You didn't take a pen tie, it looks great, right? Just the likes, it ain't so. Wait a minute, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

It's not appropriate. No, what you're talking about is the ones that, like Melano 10 is one, PT-141 was the other one, but so that, they researched to help people tan, side effect being like high libido. So what do you think they, they ever think that? Oh my God, yeah, of course. Yeah, that's it, that's it. being like high libido. So what do you think they put in? Oh my God, yeah, of course. Yeah, that's it.

That's a libido boost. Dude, what do you think the percentage of supplements, hormones, drugs were created for something completely different and then marketing to sell a lot? A lot, right? A lot, right? Yeah, there's a lot of stuff that people don't even realize that I mean, even like insulin, things like these,

a lot of these things that we use on a regular basis. We'll just make more money. That's what it is. It was research for. Monoxidil was to lower blood pressure. Oh, look, these guys are growing hair. Boom, hair growth. Viagra, these are called PDE5 inhibitors,

were for blood pressure. But then the side of, because people report, right, when they do test subjects. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, somebody was like, I got a heart on like crazy. But like, well, you know, then we had a very modest, you know, reduction in blood pressure and he's like, yeah,

you know, what did you notice? Well, I got like boners all the time. What? Yeah. You're the fifth guy that said that. That was rock. There's a big, yeah, there's a big market there for that. So that's another drug that does, I'm trying to.

There's quite a few that like, I know that it started like something completely different and then we ended up marketing for something else. Yeah, yeah. Testing to see it. Like I said, Tess O'Fensen, it was Parkinson's and Alzheimer's and they pulled the trials because too many subjects were losing weight. So then you know, they stopped the trial. This isn't good for Alzheimer's, they're losing weight.

They're like, wait a minute, they're losing weight. They lost drug. Boom. What's the origin of creatine? What was the reason why we originally studied it? Oh, they didn't know what creatine did. They they they isolated it and meet they knew and they knew that it increased ATP. Um, so really it was it was it was Was it a muscle building though out the gates? Was it right away thought to be that energy? Just energy. Yeah, just energy. Okay, so we knew that one. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Try to think what else I've ever that's a good question though. I wonder maybe I'm gonna list of all ball. There's a lot. I know we're not thinking of all of them right now, but I know there's been so many where I'm like, damn, that wasn't even for that either, that's crazy. Yeah, well, I mean, they don't know how some drugs even work. Like they'll have a drug for one thing and it helps for something else.

And then they'll prescribe it for that. Not really knowing what it's gonna be. There's been some like HIV drugs that they've changed. Yeah, like I'm pretty sure that they've made it and the market is a different thing. Did you guys know that antidepressants, oftentimes relieve people's back pain sometimes?

Oh, wow. Yeah, they'll notice like, oh, my back pain's gone. And so they'll give people low dose antidepressants for their kids. What do you think that is? I have a theory. Oh, well, come on, dude, pain. Pain, yeah, you could like attribute,

like, I don't know what the percentage lies, but definitely it starts in the mind, right? There's a physiological, like I could, we could add some pie. I mean, I mean, perfect example of what you were saying right now is everyone's had this happen in their life one time where you cut your finger or you do something stubby toe,

you do something like, you don't look at it for a minute or two, and then you look at it and then you see the blood or you see something that looks really bad. And then instantly the pain comes on afterwards, but up into that point, you don't feel it the same way. It's an example of how you perceive things. Well, look, I could see the kids all the time. We could look at, like if I hit your quad,

like we could look at the quad and see what's happening there, and see the pain, you know, chemicals and inflammation, and the nocy receptor is not shit getting activated and it goes to the brain, right? And then there's your perception of the pain. Right. There's a big difference between how some people perceive pain and how other people perceive pain.

Yeah. In fact, there's your knee surgeries where people don't even get the surgery. Here, here's your extreme, here's your extreme example. There's a lot of people out there, there's a lot of people out there who get turned on by pain.

You think to yourself, and let me tell you, I could get crazy. Well, it's a whole category. Yeah, where people beat the shit out of each other, literally whip each other. And I mean, you see marks and bruises and they're like, oh my God, that's so hot, right? Whereas I look at that, like what?

That hurts. What do you think? I also think that a posture, we know about what depression does to people, they slouch, their head comes forward, they roll forward. That is only going to make low back pain. So if you have any sort of like an anterior pelvic tilt or any sort of issue with your low

back and you're also rounded and forward, that's going to cause that. So just simply getting more upright posture, even a better mood in your positive, you're more likely to be standing taller, walking better, which I also would probably compound that. I'm probably a multitude of factors. Yeah, yeah. So, I know, I wonder, there's a lot of drugs out there.

I can't think of it up the top of my head, but I know that there's quite a few out there that are off label use because they see that it works, you know, for something else. Like, like, you know, birth control, you're not often they pers, I don't know if they do this as much anymore. Do you know how often they prescribe that to girls for shit like acne?

Oh yeah. And I mean, what the hell are you doing? And they have like really heavy bleeding, they'll do it. Oh here, we'll fix it. Yeah, awesome hormones. Or even if it's just your regular, you're not on your regular 25 day cycle or what I thought they'll do it. I mean, there's a lot of reasons why they prescribe it.

That's, I know. It's kind of crazy. I got a funny story for you guys. So what you got? So we have we have um Max's birthday's coming up right? It's fourth birthday's around the corner. I can't believe he's in for I can't believe it's crazy. I don't know how quick that you know he's gonna be he's gonna be 10 I just can happen so fast. I'll say that Jesus for slow down. We're fours here. Okay. So fours here. So uh so Katrina. So Katrina and I are talking about, and he's like really into, like the thing now is Mario Brothers, all right?

And he, my son, this is kind of funny too, I didn't tell you guys this. He likes villains, like so Bowser is his favorite character, right? So he, and I, there's something else that he likes, like he likes to do things. He likes horror too, it's scary. Yeah, yeah, and he likes villains, you know? So he tends to like gravitate to,

which is so weird, because he sits like sweet little boy, and everything, but he, Katrina points it out, he, oh, zombies, things like that. But he always, he doesn't want them to be evil or bad. He doesn't like that.

He, he always says, it's a good zombie. It's a good, you know, it's a good skeleton. Yeah, it's a good bow, it's a happy, Bowser's happy. Like, he always makes these villains happy. So, yeah, it's really interesting bout. It's a happy Bowser's happy like he always makes these villains happy

So yeah, it's really interesting right so anyways We're planning this this big Mario brothers thing and Katrina's like I want to I want to do a pinata this year I'm like really I said our sons are really not like aggressive like that where I don't see him breaking it like that Like well, he's getting into swinging the baseball bat. Maybe we do. I said okay. I'm fine with that And she goes so I'm trying to figure out how I want to fill it I want to and you guys obviously we you know don't give him a lot of sugar candy things like that so it's like you know having a penny out of full of candies probably not a great idea. So she's like I'm going to fill it like what

we do with his last birthday where you know a lot of parents give kids little you know bags on their way out to a birthday party or not and they fill it with candy and goodies and stuff so we did that but we did all toys. Oh, I really favor it from you. Yeah, Easter, we did the same thing too, is Easter Bassy was full of toys and coloring books and things like that. So we're always trying to think of alternatives

than just a whole bunch of sugar and candy. And so she shows me all these cool little toys and things like that. Well, she's sharing this with her, her one of her best friends, Christina, who's also fan of the show, she's super health conscious. Her kids are like, she's been like on them

since day one eating whole foods and a strict diet. And she goes, oh, we did that the last birthday. And she goes, I filled it with like beef jerky snacks, all these things like that. And she goes, oh, really? How did it go? She goes, well, there was eight kids, and when it broke open, they all rushed in,

and then they saw what it was, and they all ate kids literally walked away and left all the shit on the ground. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, god. I don't want to be that bad. I'm like, maybe throw some job breakers and there are something like a few things so they don't say, I'm like,

it's someone's birthday. Yo, no, no, no. She said literally, it broke and it all got out. The kids rushed in, they looked at, she said, they kind of looked at all the And they all just walked away boxes of raisins. They all just walked away and just left it all there No, I'm like I don't want to be that I'm like you got to throw some some things in there toys is perfect

Well, you know, it's little kids love toys. So and here's a thing Max is obviously had sugar cookies Can he's had he's had a lot of things now, right? So we haven't, like, he's not, I was getting asked this the other day on my DMs because I did that video of him taking the bite of cotton candy with me and like, of course, like everyone freaked out. Like, what?

You gave him sugar now, I'm like, yeah, you know, I absolutely, he's had, he's had, we do make protein, like healthy cookies and that's the cookie versions that he's had and we do make our own homemade type of ice cream that's not like real like so he's had a lot of that stuff you know. But I mean I and cotton candy is you know a serving of a whole thing cotton candy like 180 calories and he had a couple bites with me. But what's cool is that we were so consistent with that with introducing sweets so gradually

slowly even the sweets he did have are extremely mild or low that he doesn't like the cotton candy He took two bites. He was cool Like that little video idea of him. It was he was like ah I want more of it So what's nice is that we've been able to introduce these things when we feel the time is appropriate in the setting like oh We're at a big family argue. There's a cotton candy machine I'm not gonna let not let my son enjoy on the festivities. I'm gonna go do it with him. We're gonna have fun with it.

And he doesn't crave it, act all crazy. Does he like Hot Wheels cars and stuff? Yeah. So what if you put Hot Wheels cars in there, like little bouncy ball, like stuff that that she has already planned. Like she has Mario Kart things, wrist band things. Because my kid, but I mean,

my kid would lose his mind if a piñata opened and cars came out. Oh, so I know, so I know Max will too. Okay. Cause he's already been training that way. Like he's like, Well, I think all kids love that shit. Cars and stuff?

Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I mean, most kids, most normal kids, associate a piñata with candy. Yeah. So if you're, if you're old enough to associate what a piata is and you go to a party and just You just sprinkling a little right? That's what I'm gonna do

Literally, we're gonna put like like little smarties or something that's like a like in within there So they see that and that's in there, but it's not like those little crack fiends can get their face Yeah, and then yeah Yeah, and then my son will be right on the car So that's it that goes well everybody else's kids get the head Most happy that's in there But I just thought it was I thought it was funny because if we thought that would be a great idea I her girlfriend had already done it and I'm like all that would be so embarrassing

Oh the kids just want all the kids walk away You took him to see the movie, right? Yeah, okay, it's he like obsessed with the peaches song so Bro, you have no idea. Yeah, cause like my kids even are like, we'll sing it all the time. The Jack Black song is, yeah, it went crazy viral. That's all that is playing on our TV right now. So we moved away from the Afro Jack fucking terrible little bit of an upgrade, right?

It is an upgrade. I actually don't mind it, but he sings it. It's hilarious. So I'll have to, I'll, I love the hearings thing. Yeah, I'll make a video and you guys can see it. It's hilarious. So I'll have to... I love the hearings. Yeah, I'll make a video and you guys can see it. But that is this thing is to crank that up and he loves...

You know what song he's talking about? There's a song where Jack Black is Bowser. Oh, that song. And he's singing to Peaches because he was a Maryher. What do I say? So I actually was on the hunt. So for his birthday, I got that Bowser where he's in the white Tuxedo to Mary Peaches and didn't really like a collector like oh, I'm gonna do this thing. Okay, tell me if you guys think this is weird or not So Katrina thought was kind of weird

Toys like that that come from like a movie that was made, a very special, like, oh, it's in his white suit, like it's already like hard to find and expensive, I had to get it to like some other place. So I bought two, and one of them obviously I'm wrapping and giving to him for his birthday, and so with that, and I'm actually gonna put away the other one. And I'm gonna do this throughout his life

when I buy these kind of like one-off type of toys that are something he's really into for two reasons. One, I think when he's 18 years old, older, and I can show him like this is what you were into when you were four or three favorite toys. This is, yeah, like that I have it. That's cool idea. A little bit of nostalgia. And then also the fact that it could actually be worth some money because a lot of times

those one-offs like that and those toys and I'll keep it in the package. He probably won't be interested in these 18, I'll just tell you that much. It's gonna happen when he has his own kids. Yeah, maybe when he's 25 or 30. That's when he has his own kids. And you're like, hey, this is what you love and then he'll give it to his kid.

Right, and so I think it'd just be cool. I'm not ridiculously expensive right now. So buying two of them is like not a big deal. And I'll just kind of put it to the side. What happened, there was definitely a transition where hitting Pinyadas was no longer like you get too old. Like, why did we stop doing that? I love it, dude. I love it, dude.

We destroyed it. We did it for a long time. They should make an adult one. Yeah, we can do it. We can do it. They do make them like that, they don't know. And you just see a lot of fail videos where somebody's like trying to adjust something and they have lost it.

So do you guys remember as kids, when you were little, hitting a pignata was all about like how fun it was, and then there was a point where you get old enough to where this is a flex, where you're like, oh, I'm gonna hit it the hardest. Oh yeah, yeah. All the little girls are gonna see how I was. Yeah, and then when you do that, I'm like,

woo, yeah, yeah. Whoa. You see that though? That's you could hit it the hardest. It was all about like who's the fuck. Yeah, I don't remember the last age that you had a Pinyana for yourself I don't remember how old I was but we definitely were old enough to I think we were a sucker open with one swing

Oh, yeah, I think you guys we still be trick-or-treating on our own Right guys? Yeah, trick-or-treating is adults creepy bro. Hey, give me candy. I had a door. Ah, no the cops But but for Jello shots that's not a bad idea. Actually was I candy at a door. Ah! No, the cops. But for jealous shots. That's not a bad idea. Actually, I was at a place. Aren't there neighborhoods that do that? Yeah.

Where you bring your kids? Yeah, it's... Your kids get candy, and because of all the neighbors know each other, and then they give the adult like a glass of wine or something like that. Yeah, I'm trying to say it's not like YMCA. It's kind of like a YMCA camping thing. We went one year where everybody had their own kind of camp set up.

And so the kids did the whole thing and then the parents actually had like, some kind of like a small, like unique drink or something that you could take as you were walking around. Cause everybody was just staying there and sleeping. So it's cool. It was kind of a good idea.

But yeah, I like that. I like that with, you know what, trick or treating as a, and Halloween is the value in the back in the day was you knew your neighbors. People don't even stay in their neighborhoods anymore. They go travel to that neighborhood. Yeah, that's what we did. Yeah, you know, I kind of sucks. I mean, I, I mean, I lived on the other side of the tracks. I don't want to. I was fucking nothing but all my joy and mounds. You don't say that's how you rock. Yeah, bro. Or candy corn.

I'm a joy and mounds and candy corn. If you stay in our neighborhood, I was heading over to the golf course where they have, they get king size, king size recess, the king size, but raisins and pencils. You know, that's where I was at, dude. Which I hate these, dude.

It's just, it's your point of like getting pissed. I remember going to those houses and we'd, we'd agam later. Yeah, that's what I feel about this. Pretty important, I feel like there's a balance of how I could still, you know, like, like we have, there's gonna be sweets there, right? So we have a snow cone machine coming,

but also another thing I can control, right? I can give him ice, but just a little bit of that on there and my son won't know the difference. Like it'll be fine, feel like he's involved in it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Grandin. But I don't want the kids to be like, never wanted to come involved in it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, a little. A grandine. But I don't want the kids to be like, never wanted to come

to Mr. Schaefer's house because we're going to get a shitty pinata. So I got to listen. Oh, don't go there. They have been Anna Bread for the cake. Really played. I had a friend like that. Anyway, so I was reading some fitness studies on rep speed.

So I want to bring this up because it's an interesting observation. So the traditionally studies will say that time under tension is closely correlated related to muscle growth and progress. You want to have controlled reps when you're lifting weight. But then there's some studies that counter that that show

that faster reps. Also build muscles sometimes Sometimes maybe totally different response. Well, that, but it's also this. Here's, this is the speculation that I have. When you see people doing faster reps, I'm not talking about like Olympic lifting where you drop the weight, but I don't know like bodybuilding faster reps, right? Think of the torque intention on a muscle when you have to change directions, yeah, because of the faster descent.

So when you're descending with 100 pounds and you change directions, it becomes slightly heavier for a second. If it's a faster rep, it becomes much heavier and what it does that loads is the stretch, typically. Sometimes you produce more force too in your fast switch movements. Yeah, so people who understand

had to control fast reps, because bodybuilders have been talking about this for a long time. There's a lot of bodybuilders out there that say, no, I like to live faster and I get great results. I think it has more to do with that. It creates more tension because of the change of direction and the speed of the negative. I mean, I really thought that that was one of the biggest advantages

that I had. I did all that stuff. Like, when I looked around at my peers, like, there's so many people training, like, just the traditional bodybuilder, 90 degree angles, not doing deadlifting and squatting, not doing anything Olympic movements or explosive at all. It's like, it's crazy to me to think that if your sport is all about building muscles, sculpting your physique, that you would not use all the tools in your arsenal.

And those are all tools to building a better body, not just performance, but also for sculpting, because you're building muscle. So. They're also skills. So anything you practice, part of you getting better at it is that you develop a skill of it. So if you've been doing this for a long time,

and you want to be able to reap the benefits of just a wider variety and breadth of training, then it's good to practice and learn the different skills. Because if you always train slow, you're going to suck it fast in vice versa. In fact, one of my favorite things to see or watch is a bodybuilder trying to do a kettlebell swing. They can't. That's your favorite.

It's so funny. It's that upright row because they don't understand speed. It's a squat, right? Yeah, it's a squat front raise, upright row, type of deal, right? So, you know. Yeah, I wanted to piggyback on that. It's injury preventative, right? So like most of the times, if you are just training in the slow, like tension based rep

count, right? Like you experience something in life where you have to move quickly, you gotta adjust yourself, you gotta catch yourself. Boom, boom, done. Yeah, you can get a tear of something. Here's another thing that I was just reading about, is that, and I think we know this, right? There's different signolers of hunger. Obviously, you need more food.

You're lacking a nutrient. Emotions can trigger hunger. But here's one that's, that a lot of people don't know about because this typically only happens in the healthy population, or people who are a health oriented, or health minded, lack of sodium.

So, and this is common when you're, let's say you go from a heavily processed food diet. Yeah, then you make your meals. To a whole natural food diet. And then you're like, you know, mind pump said eat more protein, go whole natural foods. Why do I have these crazy cravings? You don't realize that you just went from

3,000 milligrams or 4,000 milligrams of sodium a day down to a thousand because whole natural food, even if you salt it, it's got way less sodium. It just does. And if your sodium intake goes too low, your body will make you hungry to seek it out. So it's very true if you don't need heavily processed foods.

So if you're like really regimented with your diet and you're noticing cravings, try increasing your sodium or supplement with like a electrolyte powder like element. Element is excellent for this. No calories, put in your water. Taste good. It's got the right amount of sodium.

Or here's the big one. If you go low carb, low carb sucks water and sodium out of your body. You need more sodium on a low carb diet than you do on the same calorie diet with higher carbs. So you should probably supplement, especially if it's low carb as keto. Do you think that you can have some of the adverse effects of low sodium, even with somebody who's hitting like the minimal RDA of what they need, right?

So because they came from such a high sodium diet, so like you gotta think that there's gotta be some sort of an adaptation process that's happened. Let's say someone has been like lived on fast food or eating out all the time for years, and they've decided to now chain and use your example, but make it even crazier. It's four, it's 4,9,000.

Yeah, just super high. Yes, super high day. And then they come down to what is, what will be normally a good dose of sodium, but because it was such a dramatic swing in a reduction in sodium, that they could feel some of the feelings that people with low sodium feel.

You think that's possible? Well, let me ask you this. One of, what's one strategy bodybuilders use feelings that people with low sodium feel. You think that's possible? Well, let me ask you this. What's one strategy bodybuilders use to show up on stage with less water under the skin? Besides bringing sodium down to zero, not drinking water, that stupid shit. It's increasing water, increasing sodium, and then bring it down to normal before you go on stage. Because your body does adapt, then you go back down to normal and it sucks. Your body has to adjust to it. So yes, that can definitely happen to the short term. But also, the RDA for sodium is based off of an unhealthy population. So unhealthy people who don't exercise,

don't sweat, right? They're crappy diet, whatever. That's their recommended amount of sodium. People who are active, exercise or healthy, need more sodium. The RDA for sodium is too low for athletes and fit people and healthy people. It's too low for most of us, fact. So fit healthy people who, you're probably gonna perform better and feel better

by eating more sodium than what is considered the recommended dose. And there's data, lots of data that supports this. I have a good shout out. I've been listening to this podcast. I'm really inconsistent with a lot of random. There's only a few podcasts that I consistently listened to. We've talked about the all-in guys before.

I've found a new one that I've been really consistent with. And it's, I think David Senra is the host, but it's called Founders. And like each episode, like he does. He told me about this. Yeah, I think I have mentioned to you before that. You guys would love it. I literally does a, you know, he'll read these autobiographies of these, you know, incredible leaders and, and founders and CEOs and stuff.

And then he basically does like a 30 minute or 40 minute synopsis of their life or their accomplishments or their principles that made them so great. Just a great way to get a real high level of people that we've all heard about in history is these great business leaders and war here, everything that you can think of,

he covers really, really good podcasts. So if you guys haven't checked that out, check that I've already like purchased several books because of listening to his podcast. Hey, butcher box is a company that delivers grass fed meats, wild cop fish, heritage pork, to your door. So it's sustainably raised, it's healthy, it's better for you than the conventional stuff. It's better for the environment, better for the animals or treated well. And it's also priced very, very well because there's a lot of middlemen that are eliminated. What they do, they deliver a box to your door on a monthly basis, you get your meat, when you're ready to cook it, you defrost it, taste amazing, and it's good for you.

Go check them out. Go to butcherbox.com forward slash mind pump. By the way, they'll be an offer for you on that link All right back to the show Our first color is Andrew from Missouri Andrew. What's happening man? How come I'm Yeah, you guys doing we're doing great. Hey, man. How you doing? Awesome awesome. I'm really yeah, I feel really blessed to be on you show today It's I'm really excited. So thanks for taking my question and giving me an opportunity to ask it.

I basically, I can get right into it if that's good with you guys. Do it. Sure. Real quick, thanks for all the content you guys put out there. There obviously is a lot of misinformation out there, which I stumbled into early on in my journey, but I found you guys. And I've been able to stick with a lot of what you guys tell us as far as just the plans. I've got the RGB bundle. I love it. It's been going good. I just appreciate your down-to-earth content and the way

you communicated. It's awesome. Appreciate it. Thank you. Yeah, so essentially I'm eight months into a three-year bulk. I'm wanting to really put on some size over the next three years, two and a half years now. I kind of started this journey. I'm 42 years old. I'm 64. I'm currently 206. I used to be 300 pounds and 48% body fat.

I got that down in the beginning by just, I bought a bike. When I got it to 297, by just, I bought a bike. When I got it to 297, I just was like, I'm not going over 300 pounds. I got to fix this. I was wildly out of shape, drinking a lot, just eating whatever I wanted. And so I bought a bike and just started biking to work

and trying to just be more fit. I lost about 60 pounds, got down to 240. Felt okay, but I wanted to make a change. And so I decided to add some weight training. I bought V-Stread, they've shredded a 90, you know, on Facebook, that guy. I won't forgive you. So I'll get to try.

I ran the 90 day program back to back. I got down to 208, but everybody thought I had cancer. Like they thought I was sick or something. I didn't look healthy. And so that was mainly because I wasn't really putting on a lot of muscle. I was just losing the spatts out in my skin, hanging off me, and I just didn't look right. So I talked to a neighbor, a mine who is a trainer, and he does physical therapy and stuff. He gave me a great plan to try out, help me with my macros, help me understand all of that. I got up to 233 with a bulk from

208, felt great in about seven months, how long that took, I felt awesome. Decided at that point to get a scan, see where I was at. And I liked where I was at, but I decided to one of the cut down again and try to see, cut the fat off, got a see where I've gone, got down to 193. I was sub 10% body fat. I was like 97. And I really liked the way I felt at 97. But I just, I wasn't big.

Like I didn't have a lot of muscle. I'm 6'5 or 6'4". And so, 193, I looked kind of thin. So that's when I said, okay, I want to put on muscle. I'm comfortable now. I know I'm not gonna balloon up. I'm comfortable now. I know I'm not going to balloon up. I'm in control of my diet and exercise. So I spent a month finding maintenance.

Last August through September, the entire month of August was just finding maintenance. Got it at 29.50, began the bulk, went hard, all fall into winter, got up to about 208 because feeling great and decided to have surgery like right in the middle of it. And so I had lost 110 pounds of body fat and I had all this loose skin on my stomach. I was getting really discouraged because I could make gains, I could change things, but that was never going anywhere. And I was getting really depressed about it because I'd worked so hard to get my body

where I wanted it to be. So I made a kind of a quick decision and decided to like have it all removed. And so I thought this was going to be like an easy surgery like, well, just go in, they'll take it out and I'll be back in the gym. I didn't really work out that way. I was back a week later, but there was a lot of stuff I couldn't do for about six to eight weeks. And so anyway, I've been to a weight basically since March 1st, you know, I did have that surgery. I ate in maintenance during the recovery process. Some days I might go about 100 or 200 under a day in calories just to try to get the fluid out. When you have that surgery, you have to get a lot of all that extra fluid and let the helium

take place. Well, now I'm back bulking and this is where my problem is. I'm currently eating 3,700 to 3,800 calories a day, upwards of 4,000 if I want to push it. And I'm still I'm 206.6. Like I am not moving off the 206 to 208 range right now. I'm doing maps performance. I'm in phase one. My wife and I are working out together doing it together. They're three days a week. I go in one or two days and do some accessory work to compliment that. And that's kind of where we're at right now.

When was the last time you told yourself you're the fucking man? All right, so I tried it. I tried it, you know, you do react and perspective. Yeah, it's gonna say you do realize what you have accomplished and you're, you're challenged that you're having right now, right? That's your super lean and you're eating 3700 calories and you're having a hard time putting some weight in mass. Now, we're gonna answer this and help this, but I just want to put that into perspective for you that you're fucking kicking ass

and what a great place to be for somebody who was almost pushing 300 pounds to now be able to eat 37, 300, 300, 300 calories and not put weight on. I mean, that's a good problem that we're trying to solve right now. So, are you tracking your steps in movement? Do you know what kind of, I mean, do you have a lot of, are you biking like your steps and movement? Do you know what kind of like your,

I mean, do you have like a lot of, are you biking a lot still? Like what's your activity level look like? No, I actually sold my bike. I got up to bike in almost four to five hours a day. I bike like 50 miles, you know, on a ride. And obviously I'm after listening to you guys. I'm not gonna put on muscle doing this.

So I actually sold my bike. I hit the gym and just dedicated myself to weight training. I would walk a mile every day after I weight training. I've cut that out. I have an office job. So I have a sedentary lifestyle for the most part. Now I'm an active busy person. So to speak, I can't sit still very long. So I do go to auctions and I have to walk around the auction quite a bit or I'll go on an appointment. So I'm not sitting all day. I do get up and move, but I don't, I thought about tracking my steps, but it can't be much.

Like I'm not walking. It would just help with solving this because it's kind of a math problem that we have now. Right. It's just getting to the point of like, okay, whether you're doing two thousand steps or sixteen thousand steps, it wouldn't change necessarily where my advice is going. It's just getting to the point of like, okay, whether you're doing 2,000 steps or 16,000 steps wouldn't change necessarily where my advice is going. It's more so becoming aware of, okay, this is how much you're moving,

this is how much your calorie maintenance is now. We just need to know that, oh wow, on a day, let's say you go to one of these auctions, there could be a difference of like one day, let's say you're relatively sedentary, 4,000 steps in a day, and then also, you have another day that's like 16,000 steps and you were not adjusting the diet because of that.

And so that might be causing your kind of plateau is you're relatively active, you're training, you're eating around your maintenance or above at 3,700 calories, but then also, you have a day or two where you're really active and you don't realize that you're actually burning, you know, 4,500 calories on that day.

And that's just enough to burn those extra calories and kind of keep you with that plateau. So that insight would help, but I mean, we just, we gotta eat more is the first step is to bump calories even further. If you're at 3,700 and you're not putting weight on, that means, and by the way, as you continue to slow, let's say you only put on like three pounds of muscle,

which will feel like you don't see it, right? Which is probably how you feel. But if you added three or four pounds of muscle, your body now needs even more calories. So your maintenance is now going up. And so it's kind of this game of, you're gonna be constantly increasing week over week or every two weeks per say. And then the routine you're doing right now, you're following math performance. Is that what I'm reading correctly or where

you at right now? Yeah, I went, I just came out in a ball like I spent a long time in anabolic primarily because the surgery was right in between like phase two and three. And so I kind of had to just, you know, make some adjustments and all of that I've spent six weeks in phase one because my wife just joined me. She's never worked out before She's been a runner and she wanted some change and she saw the change in me and was like man Let's let's all join you and give it a try. She's like you know in fact my oh my my whole family Oh my god three kids my 17 year old son's left-wing, my 12-year-old

daughter came in, she did some dead lifts and some bench press, my nine-year-old came with this, too. This was just yesterday and did some bench press and stuff. It's kind of fun. We're getting all family involved and I like it. But I got to be honest. I don't think performance may be necessarily for me. I enjoy it. I enjoy the compound. I don't think performance may be necessarily for me. I enjoy it.

I enjoy the compound. I like phase one. I got into phase two and I've started practicing these matrix lunges and Some of the other movements. I'm like, man, this is not cool 42 I don't have I'm not an athlete never really have been and so like trying to be athletic at this age and when I've only been And so like trying to be athletic at this age and when I've only been working in one plane, basically, you know what I mean? Just doing the lifts and anabolic and not really doing a lot. Just a lot. Yeah, I get it.

And I'm gonna go a different direction here. So first, let me ask you a couple questions. How's your energy? How's your libido? How's your sleep? And that's what's weird. Everything's fantastic. I can't tell if I'm just like really

in an inabolic state right now, or if something else might be wrong, but like, there's nothing weird. You're in a really good place. There's nothing weird. So let me ask you another question. Fantastic. Let me ask you a question.

What's the problem? Yeah. What's the issue here? So I am trying to get to 230 pounds, 10% body fat. That's the goal. I'm currently at 60%. Real quick, Andrew. I'm gonna ask you what your goal is. What's the problem? With what I've been doing or kind of what why I've called no, you obviously had what's your issue because you're you're in a an

Incredible state. I mean you're doing so well. You're eating 3730 800 calories. You calories. You've made a transformation that people can only dream about. You got great energy, great libido, the whole family's working out. What's the challenge? I guess I've tried to apply the challenge's patience, I guess more than anything. I am putting on muscle at a rate according to my in-body scans, which I use more as a trend. Sal, like you've said, don't go 100% off what the data is,

but at least look at the trends. I'm very much into data. I'm a salesman. I have an insurance agency, so metrics are really important to me. So I've been paying attention to that, and the muscle development's about, I put on about three and a half to four pounds of muscle

in the last like seven to eight months, and I'm trying to see if I can't get to like seven to ten pounds of muscle a year for the next three years. I'm just kind of concerned that I'm kind of stuck at 206 to 208. These last like three and a half months, you know what? I'm like guys, I meet my ice cream. I'm eating my hostess cakes on top of everything else. Like I'm getting my 30.

Everybody's talking to me right now. And listen, listen. Okay, look, how long were you, were you, you know, before you lost all this weight, right? You were in a really bad state, real bad health. Lifestyle completely different. How long was that? How long were you in that state for? Oh, God, I was an alcoholic and addict for, you know,

15 years where I just, that's all I did. I mean, I just ate, party, drank, didn't care about anything. And now I before and half of your sober and it's great. This last five years has been awesome. It's just I feel like I was kind of stalled out. I'm just trying to I want to push. We're getting closer to the problem here, okay. Don't pathologize fitness. You're at the next level of your

relationship with exercise and nutrition and fitness and a healthy lifestyle. The next phase is self-acceptance which you still have not gotten to. You still have not gotten to. You've gotten fit, you're healthy, then healthier than you've probably been a long time. You stopped those addictive behaviors, you're not drinking, parting, doing that stuff, you've got your family working out with you, you're still searching for something. There's nothing wrong with goals, by the way, there's nothing wrong with goals at all.

There's everything wrong with the obsession of goals and you can make exercise a drug. Lots of people do this. Now, I don't think you're over-training. I think you're doing it intelligently, but I think you're obsessing over the data, you're obsessing over the goal. And I'm telling you this because if you don't start to focus on this, this is gonna become an issue for you. You're, for all intents and purposes,

you're kicking ass and taking names. It's like, literally. It's a reason why I started the conversation the way I did. Yeah, you need to kind of, you need to wake up a little bit and celebrate where the fuck you are right now, bro. You're in a very, very good place right now. There is nothing you're doing wrong except for the mindset you have around what you're doing.

Okay. Everything you're doing is right on paper. If I wrote this all down on paper, your journey, what you've gone, you know, what you came from where you're at now, you're literally the perfect, everything's perfect. The thing that the issue is that you're obsessing over these goals, you're searching and chasing these goals. And I'm gonna tell you something right now, you're not gonna keep hitting goals forever,

just doesn't work that way. It just doesn't work that way. So what you're gonna need to do, here's the next phase, okay, you ready for this? Okay. I want you to start to enjoy the process for the sake of the process, not the goal. That's the only thing. That is where you're at right now, because I'm telling you right now, the path that you're

on, although you're in a great place right now, and you feel amazing, although you're probably not stopping to smell the roses very often, where you're at is very amazing. If you don't get off this track right now, you're going to be going down a dark path. That's the direction that you're going right now. And I can hear it. What am I doing wrong? I'm eating 37-hundred calories. I feel great. I got a great libido.

This is weird. What? What do you mean this is weird? This is not weird. This is fucking amazing. Yeah. So what you need to start doing is this is what I want you to do. I want you to start, and I'm gonna give you the direction

that you can go that's gonna help you get there, because it's not, you're not gonna go from where you're at now to all of a sudden loving it for the sake of it and just developing this great, it's a process, okay? So step one is gonna be moving your focus away from weight gain, muscle gain, aesthetics to performance. So I want you to focus on strength, mobility, functionality.

Don't worry at all. Stop worrying completely about how much muscle you're gaining. Stop worrying about body fat. It says, in fact, stop paying attention to all of that. By the unlock your goal that you have set out for you. A lot of times it's just stepping away from that. And doing the uncomfortable things that you already mentioned, like this is just not what I do. I don't go another planes. I don't lean into that at all. It's amazing what that's going to do to your body if you give it a chance. That's it, which is exactly why actually performance is the perfect program for you. You just need to shift your mindset. So the fact that you're struggling, okay, the longer you stay in this fitness journey, the more you'll start to learn that when you suck at a program, you don't like it, it's

probably one of the best things for you. And so what you, I thought about that. So what you need to do is embrace the suck, embrace that you're not good at the matrix loans. And instead of being so focused on, I need to add 10 pounds of muscle over the next year, go, I want to get good at these movements. I'm going to get, as a guess what's going to happen is a byproduct, which is what's sour, so looting to. It, once you shift your mind away from not worrying about that, eating to feed your body

and feel your body, enjoying the fact that you can have ice cream every now and then, and you don't feel like a fat ass from body, enjoying the fact that you can have ice cream every now and then and you don't feel like a fat ass from it, enjoying the fact that you've made this huge transformation and get good at these movements and what you're going to find is a byproduct, the muscle is going to come on, it's going to happen, it will, but you do got to shift the mindset, you're in a hell of a place, bro. Here's the key though, it's going to happen when you stop caring so much about it happening. That's the key here. The irony of the whole thing.

Look, look, look. We've talked about this before on the show many times. If you listen to the podcast, I know you've heard me say this. Fitness in its truest sense is a vehicle for personal growth. It's one of the most amazing ones. So, and it's always, you're never gonna reach,

there's no goal. There is no destination. You're gonna get older. You're gonna have to accept certain things anyway. You're not gonna be able to hit reach, there's no goal. There is no destination. You're gonna get older. You're gonna have to accept certain things anyway. You're not gonna be able to hit PRs for the rest of your life. Gaining muscle at some point's gonna stop. It just is, otherwise you have, you know, I'd be 500 pounds of lean body mass by now,

if that wasn't the case. So right now your focus is this. You are now at the point, you're at a fork in the road. You've gone down the path of, I need to do this the right way and solve some of these issues that I've come from. Guess what, congratulations, you did it. You've gone down the path of, I need to do this the right way and solve some of these issues that I've come from. Guess what? Congratulations, you did it.

You did it. Now you're at a fork in the road, become obsessed with goals, pathologized fitness, or learn to love the process and develop a different relationship with myself, nutrition, and exercise, so that it becomes a practice. This is now, you're at that stage now, the beginning of making this a practice. You've tackled the first part, which is actually extremely challenging. Most people learning to get to where you're at,

you've gotten there, but now you're at the next level. And the next level literally is, can I start to learn fitness for the sake of it? Can I learn to love just moving better? Can I learn to function out to love learning new skills? Can I love just the fact that I'm moving? Can I love doing this with my family? And the byproduct of that is you're gonna be

fit and healthy for the rest of your life. If you don't make this transition, you're gonna run into some roadblocks that are gonna be even more challenging than the ones you came from. There's so many new skills to pursue. That's why I love about fitness. There's so many new skills to pursue. That's why I love about fitness. There's so many different avenues that you can approach

and all of them benefit the whole. So you come back and you do what you originally loved and what you were doing and kicking ass in, and now you just reinforced all that by stepping away from it. Yeah, and I'm speaking from personal experience because here's what's gonna happen. Here's the next step.

Okay, well, we know what the formula is to build more muscle, okay? Get stronger, eat more calories. Uh-oh, let here's what's gonna happen. Here's the next step. Okay, well, we know what the formula is to build more muscle, okay? Get stronger, eat more calories. Uh-oh, let me throw some hormones out this. Uh-oh, let's try some more supplements and peptides. Oops, I hurt myself. What else can I do now? By the way, this is me, Rick, I'm talking about.

So, and you're gonna struggle with this because it's gonna be the struggle. But the way out of it is what I'm talking about. And I promise you, the way that it's going to, what's going to happen is if you do this the right way, is you're going to relax into it. You're not relaxed into it right now. Right now, it's like, I'm on it.

You're going to relax into it, and it's going to become this amazing part of your life. And so I'm glad you called us because this is a great place to be. It's also a very challenging one. So stick to mass performance. It's the perfect program for you. Start to obsess over the quality of your movement.

That's the next step. The next step is, can I move better? Can I improve my mobility? I want you to take your focus off of body composition, take your focus off of how much muscle I'm gaining. Continue with your nutrition. Continue down that path. I don't think it's time yet for you to take your mind off that

because I think it's too close, you're too close to where you were to where it could go in the opposite direction. So go ahead and do what you're doing with your diet for now. But at some point, you're gonna take your gaze off that as well. But for now, stop focusing on how much muscle you're gaining, stop focusing on your aesthetics, stop focusing on body fat percentage,

focus on quality of movement, focus on strength, focus on enjoying it for the sake of enjoying it. And then that's going to take you the next phase and you're going to love it. You're going to love it when you get there. Andrew, are you on Facebook? I am. I only use it for marketplace though. For the most part. That's probably you just need to have an account. I'm going to have I'm going to have Doug add you into the form so we can keep an eye on you. Yeah, and keep us. Awesome. Let us walk through the, as you get to every challenge, tag us, tell us what's happening.

I'm gonna have to give you a pep talk like this every month. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This won't be the last time we have to remind you this. Couple slaps and give us some updates every other month or so, okay? Okay, that sounds good, guys. Thank you. All right, man. Thanks for calling in, brother.

I tell you, uh, the, I mean, it's the reason why I started the very first in a system, bro, when was the last time you, you just hear yourself and then you add it and then after he, then he went on another tangent to about his wife now, his kids now. I'm like, bro, you were really asked them about his sleep, libido and everything. No, no, they're just in case and he's like, no, everything's great.

That's weird. Why is it, it's so weird. What do you mean it's weird? You know, by the way, I wanna say this too for everybody watching a listening, cause we're obviously here helping people. We oftentimes talk to ourselves on the show. We've been through this ourselves.

It's a never ending journey. Trainers train other people, but on the train themselves. So when I'm hearing him, what I'm hearing out of his mouth, I hear myself tell myself in my own mind. So in other words, this is not easy. This is very challenging. That it's, it's very alluring to go down that dark path with fitness and turning

into something that it should have been. It's easy, especially if you have great results and, you know, you can easily turn it into something that's a negative, which, I'm glad you pointed that out. Well, especially, let me add to this, that type of an avatar, meaning, they're very, he's a small percentage of people that actually have this kind of success, right? They have this tremendous of a transformation,

that's a very small percentage. And many times those people that had other addictive behaviors, part of the reason why they had all this crazy transformation is they learned to shift. 100% crazy addictive behaviors. Hyper- the reason why they had all this crazy transformation is they learned to shift. 100% crazy addictive behaviors. Hyper focus on the one thing. And they took that same energy and mindset and they put it towards something healthy

better for it, which by the way, is a great, the better of the options there. But to Sal's point, you're now you got to move from now you're right and you got to get away from that and now you're going to move because you're at another fork right now. Otherwise, even if we gave you the perfect mathematical formula to hit his 230 pounds, sub 10% goal, he would still be in the situation and what a great point to go. This is where it leads to, oh, what peptide can I take or what steroid can I take or what? Because you're just, you're so focused now on that goal and you're willing to do anything to overcome that obstacle. Yeah. It's like, you can totally, I mean, some people can totally relate to the fact that when you

focus that much, like it's really hard to stop, step back and realize what you've accomplished. And I think that that's just something I always, even myself, had to remind myself to, to focus on that. Yeah, fitness should not cause anxiety and stress and clutter, but it will, if you pathologize it, now if you treat it right and you develop a, but it will, if you pathologize it. Now, if you treat it right and you develop a good relationship with it, it is enzialidic, it is anti-stress. It doesn't, it declutters your life, but this is a constant back and forth, especially

for those of us who work in the fitness space, who, in the reason why you work in the fitness space is probably solve some bigger problems for you. But now there's other problems in front of you. So no, I'm glad he called. I'm glad he called because I know there's people watching and listening who heard him and are waiting for us to give him the answer to gain that extra, you know, five pounds of muscle, you know. Our next color is Ahmed from Georgia. Ahmed, what's happening, man? How can we help you? He I'm doing pretty good. How are you guys? Wow. Very good. Very good. I'm going to start by saying I'm a big good. How are you guys? Wow, very good. Very good. I'm gonna start by saying I'm a big fan of the show. Everyone on

style, Adam just, I'm huge fan. Thank you. Thank you, man. I, I'll let's start with a bit of background info. So growing up, I, I was a very tanky kid. Very tanky. Love to eat and as soon as my teenager rolls up, I think I'm flusing a bit of weight because I was very overweight. I go to the gym, don't know much,

workout, cut my calories drastically, lost a lot of weight, doing a lot of fat stuff shown on the internet. I had no idea. 2019 I come to the United States and there was a bit off on my gym workout and diet, so I gained all the weight back and a bit more. 2021 when I started going back to the gym, I was 324 pounds, needed to lose a lot of weight and then I can food. So I started doing again, I started working out this time, I knew a bit about calories and everything because of all the research and all, so slowly I'm weight, so I mean,

I started my journey, I got to 245 pounds and then I had to stop for a while because of a short injury during lift. So I was up for the gym for at least four to five months from January to June. And that's when I found out you guys and on life changed. I got maps on a volic in maps prime. I got Maps on a Volic and Maps Prime. I started following them and that was the first time when I started seeing a bit of definition in my body because I was losing

weight. I was just going down on waist but I'd have any definition. That's when I started seeing a bit of definition using Maps on a Volic and from then I kept running MAPSANABOLIC and currently I'm 195 pounds. I took two to three maintenance breaks in between that time and so the weight loss was low but I felt good as I have gotten from the podcast to like focus on muscle building and resistance training. So that's when I started off my loading and everything. And now I was back on the journey again. No injuries this time, no nothing. But the problem is I'm losing weight,

but I'm not seeing any more definition or any change in the mirror. I get first time when I ran maps on a bucket. My delts for some reason has shrunk. The definitions that I had while I was 230 or 218, they're not there anymore. I'm losing a lot of weight, but it feels like that I'm shrinking.

The definitions are not showing up. I don't know what's happening anymore. And I had loose skin because I lost a lot of weight. It's not a lot of loose skin. I still have them. The problem is, what should I do from here? Should I, I don't know what to do anymore because there's no definition. Whenever I lost weight now, I just feel like that I'm shrinking.

It's the body fat is still there. That's what I think of when I look around the mirror and everything. Okay. I'm mad. Uh, the pictures that you sent us, is that a before and after? Um, the before was when I was two and 24 and the after is one 95. Okay. Okay.

So first of all, yeah, incredible. Yeah. Great job. Transformation. Not only did you lose a lot of body fat you built a tremendous amount of muscle Now what you what you're saying is that at 208 you felt like you had more definition than at 190 whatever you're at now Yes, I'm 213 to it. That's when I had most definitions. I had big dealt

It was lower biceps, but I felt like I was more defined on two or 13 to 13 to eight. Are you weaker than you were at two third? Like, did you lose strength? I feel like it. I am more tired now than I was before. Well, objectively speaking, I'm head objectively speaking, because so we got I want to know what the numbers are. Are you lifting less weight on your main lifts or or

you just because you're commenting on your energy, but there's your actual weight in the jam, what you're working out with the that go down bench squat deadlift your major lifts. My squats didn't go down my bench went down by 10 pounds and um dead lifts are quite the same.

I'll tell you what's going on. You're good, dude. Yeah, I'll tell you what's going on right now. So, what's really interesting about what you're feeling and what you're going through is it's more mental than actually physical. You're doing a great job. You're actually probably just fine. When I was cutting for my first show,

I remember how one of the most challenging parts was the mental fuck of feeling like I was losing muscle, I was getting smaller because you're in a calorie deficit. You gotta understand that your muscles fill up of glycogen and water mostly. And if we're in a deficit and you're trying to cut, that it pulls all that out. And in the bodybuilding world, we call this a flat look. And what what happens is you look like you lose muscle because the muscle bellies are not filled

out like they were when you were eating in a surplus or you're at a higher weight. And so even though you're doing the right things because you're maintaining strength, which is a huge indicator that you're not losing a bunch of muscle, you're in a calorie restriction for a period of time, you're gonna be depleted and you look depleted. And it's not uncommon to actually get a little weaker too. So the fact that you've been able to hold

your bench and your squat relatively close to what you were before, you're probably not losing muscle, you're just kind of depleted right now. One of the things I like to do to kind of reassure myself this is go on a little mini bulk. So reverse, go the other direction for a little bit. Put yourself on a week or two weeks

of eating in a calorie surplus, and pay attention to how you feel in your workouts and how you look. And many times what you'll realize is like, oh, wow, like instantly you'll see the shift of like I already feel like I look way better. And that's because you just fill the muscle bellies up. You just fill them all up.

And then now, and that will make you look like you have more definition. If a, if a, if think of it like a balloon, right? If you have like a water balloon, if it has no water in it, it's gonna look all kind of flat looking, that's what your muscle belly's look like. You load it up with a bunch of carbohydrates and water, it stretches out.

Now, son, you have definition, and it wasn't like you got leaner, it's just that you filled the muscle belly's out. So this happens for a lot of people when they're in a, a, extended period of time where they're cutting, is they get to this point now where it's like, oh, wow, I don't feel like I look as good as I did when I had 10 pounds more on them.

Yeah, I mean, the fact that you went down and weighed in your strength, related and suffer is actually a pretty damn good sign. Are you low carbohydrate with your diet? I was low carbohydrate. I try to cut out carbs a lot sometimes because every time I take carb, I get a bit bloated. Currently, my carb intake is like 160 grams, something. I'm 60.

Yeah, I mean, carbs will make your muscles look flat, for sure. I bet if you did a little mini bulk within a week, you'd be like, wow, there's a definition. There's the muscle fullness that I had before. I mean, you could do that. I would recommend doing like a short bulk for like three or four weeks, maybe 300 calories, 400 calories above maintenance,

just to give you that assurance of, okay, I feel good. You'll watch a strength go up and then you go back on the cut. But you're literally crushing. Yeah, yeah, you're doing that. Like kicking ass. Your before and after is phenomenal. Like I could sell things with that.

That's all remarkable that looks. Yeah. Have you been still with the whole foods in your diet as well? Like for the most part? Oh wow, so my breakfast, it's 150 grams of fruits, peanut butter, white protein, toast and egg, boiled chicken and rice. I have a very bad habit with foods.

So I got into the boiled chicken rice thing very young and I try to eat as much as old food possible. I don't really do for junk foods. Everything else, high protein. I'm just wondering about the sodium intake. Do you like to taste the boiled chicken? I got used to it. Yeah, so no, that's a no. You know, if you just switched to chicken thighs and some red meat, that would give you the calorie bump that we're talking about. Do that for

like three, four weeks and you'll see your strength and muscle fullness go up. So, literally, you could take your boiled chicken whatever it is probably breast Based off what you're saying and I would go to like like steak So you have some extra calories from the fat Or like thighs you have some extra calories from the fat and that'll give you that'll do what we're kind of talking are you are you using creatine right now? Yes, I am okay. Yeah, good. Yeah, helped with them. I mean that's I'd say good Go on a little mini bulk for like four weeks You know, and I think it'd be very happy with what's going on

But otherwise like you're you're like kicking ass dude You like literally like phenomenal doing a great job When you when you start to get down to where you're at which is in really good shape And now you're kind of looking for the next level of shape, right? That's what you're you're searching for There's this really there's it's it's more than anything, at least in my opinion. It's a mind-fuck. Totally. It's a trip what goes on with the mind when you're cutting like that.

And you're just, you're heading the right direction, but what you see in the reflection sometimes it distorts what's really going on. You're probably doing a phenomenal job and you're just fine. You're just at this kind of awkward phase If you're not quite as shredded as you want to be But then you're also having to deplete and cut and so your muscle muscle belly is on as full So you don't look as impressive as what you did when you were ten pounds heavier

But one of the best ways to to check that is like we're saying go on a bulk for two or three weeks And and see how you look and I bet you probably up. Now that doesn't mean stay on the bulk forever because you feel better because that, it just, it's gonna show you. It's just showing you what we're talking about. Like, oh, this is what the guys met. Like now I'm all filled out. Now I feel good.

You look like you have more definition. Yeah, so stay in there for a little bit and then go back down again. Yeah, how long have you been doing in a mall, in a mall, in a mall, now? I have been running in a mall, in a mall, since 2022. now. I have been running Maps on of all extends 20 22. Let's go map symmetry. I'm sending map symmetry. So go

and finish out whatever phasier in and then do map symmetry. I think that's it's time that you do unilateral stuff because and a lot of people agree bilateral. It's two week three. Thank you. Thank you very much and every information that you guys give are And every information that you guys give are phenomenal on. And for you guys, I have, I didn't really focus on cardio at all

for fat loss. And I got huge results because cardio, for me, I think it's overrated to focus on fat loss. And I went there whenever I, like cardio, I did for a week. I lost a lot of weight and as soon as I stopped doing a bit of cardio, I jumped way back. So yeah, cardio was not a thing. Then I got the information from you guys and it's sent me a lot of time. Because that's my back to thank you. We know we're talking about man. I appreciate you calling and we'll send you a map symmetry symmetry, okay? Thanks, O'Bad. Thanks for listening, dude. What a crazy before and after. Yeah, he looks crazy. I mean, that is a remarkable.

Totally a mind thing though, right? 100%. I mean, that is 100%. To this day, so I used to like intentionally hoodie up and not look at myself because it would mess with you much that much. And a lot of people don't understand what a difference all that water and carbohydrates can make in the look.

And the leaner and the more in shape you get, the more that makes a difference. So when he was 220 something pounds and still probably, you know, 20% body fat or more, you know, that doesn't make that big of a difference. And him just getting smaller is gonna make you look more defined and leaner. But then you start to get to where he's at

where he's in good shape and now he's looking for elite shape, and that transition of staying in a depleted state for an extended period of time. Yeah, flattened you out, and then you think, oh my God, I'm doing this all, I mean, that for as a young kid, I wish I understood this because this is what always kept me from getting in premium shape.

Totally. Because I would start doing this, and I would freak out that I was just losing muscle, and I was looking worse, and then I would shaking. Totally. Because I would start doing this and I would freak out that I was just losing muscle and I was looking worse and then I would go back again. 100%. In fact, it isn't until I get shredded that I start like really paying attention. Yep. Because then when you're really shredded, then you know, then you, that's what motivates you. But when I'm around like 12, 13% body fat and I go and cut, it's just, it's an awkward, it's totally mind, mind-screw, 100%. Our next caller is Sean from Washington, DC. Sean, what's happening? How can we help you?

Hey guys, thanks for having me on. You got it. Just good start with my question here and then give a little bit of background. So I'm transitioning to a new job after graduating from my MBA program and I want to shift to more balanced routines that prioritizes persistent training and lifting instead of swimming, which is what I've been doing. And with my goal, continuing to build muscle strength. So how much should I adjust my caloric intake if at all on days where I lift versus where

I swim, to just be kept consistent across all days, or only higher on days where I swim, or I could just be overthinking this entirely. You are a little bit. So yeah. or I could just be overthinking this entirely. You are only thinking a little bit. Yeah, and so now for background, I mean, you wrote that you were super high level water polo. I mean, including Olympic development. So you're like, your work capacity is insane. For people who don't know, training for water polo,

you're like, you're in the pool for hours and hours and hours and hours. How many calories do you think you burn? Right now we're back then Geez well back then you probably couldn't you probably couldn't couldn't keep weight on right? Yeah, yeah tremendous amounts Yeah, I mean right now So actually I started like a lean bolts in September going to about April this year went from About 140 pounds to what on now about 150 to 155 with strength

gains through then. So that was on about 3,200 to 3,500 calories per day. So wanting to realize just my latest regiment hasn't been the most balanced and realistic. Now that I'm going to be working full time instead of as a student. So I was just wondering on the clerk intake side of things as I shift my workout routine. Oh, what the best path would be? It's really, it's, it's going to be really hard for us to tell you like a number without you kind of going through it and then paying attention, right? So obviously if we, let's just say we just, okay, let's keep you at 3,700 calories and on average a day for the weekend. It doesn't matter up or down, you can, you can go higher days, lower days, whatever.

And then the real truth is we want to look at over the course of two or three weeks, did you dramatically lose weight, did you increase weight, did you maintain. And then from there, I'm going to make my adjustments as a coach, like trying to guess what you need to do calorie wise, up or down until you start, because here's the other thing too about, even though that's super high level, your body was probably very adapted to it because you've been probably doing it

for years of your life. And so even though you're dramatically cutting out all this activity, it may not be as big of a color of differences as we think until we start this process. And so really, I would just tell you to kind of track and be mindful for about three to four weeks, why we kind of figure this out, whether we need to adjust dramatically up or down, but really hard for us to try and guess like, okay, this is what I'd have. Yeah, like you could probably tread water, eat a sandwich, or read a book at the same time.

It's not okay. So here's, so look, for the listeners, I'm looking at what you have been doing and where you want to go. So what you've been doing, correct listeners, I'm looking at what you were, have been doing or where you want to go. So what you've been doing, correct me if I'm wrong, is swimming seven days a week for 75 minutes a session. Okay, so every day on top of that, three to four days a week of lifting, on top of that 12 to 15,000 steps, and then you average six and a half hours of sleep every night. Correct? Okay.

That's all right. Now, the goal is you want to gain muscle. So you're going to move to four to five days a week of lifting and then swimming on your off days. So you're not going to swim and lift on the same day. So you'll lift four days a week and then swim three days a week or something like that, right? Yeah. More often than not because I realize what I hope it's doing. Wasn't that necessarily most sustainable or conducive for that goal. And the goal is to gain muscle, that's your goal.

Yeah, so just realize I've been underweight for way too long and just need to fix that. Okay, I'm going to tell you to do two things and you're going to pack on muscle like crazy. For two reasons, one, at that level of athlete, when you compete at that level, you just have really good genetics. So, I mean, I can't even take a super high level endurance athlete, and then take them off their training, put them on lifting weights, and they just build muscle. Maybe not like a body builder, but better than the average person. So, you've got really good genetics working for you. So, if we just reduce your crazy amount of training, keep your calories the same. Okay, I wouldn't lower your calories at all. You're not going to gain body fat.

You're going to build a shit ton of muscle. Yeah. And then, here's the second thing I want you to do. I want you to get more sleep. Six and a half hours a night, you can get away with, but it is far from optimal. So what I would do is I would aim for, just try and go to bed an hour earlier or wake up an hour later, if possible, and on a consistent bait, by the way, just doing that.

So what do you think about him doing maps 15? Well, well, here's what I would, I mean, he could go this way. He's so fit, he's so fit and so active. You know, here's what I would do. I would have you not lift five days a week. I'd have you do three full body workouts, swim two days a week, take two days a week off. Okay, now that doesn't mean you can't go out and hike and do shit like that, but I wouldn't work swim two days a week, take two days a week off.

Okay, now that doesn't mean you can't go out and hike and do shit like that, but I wouldn't work out two days a week. Take two days a week off, five days a week you're working out, three of them are lifting, two days are swimming. So three full body workouts a day, two days a week of swimming, keep your calories the same, get seven and a half hours of sleep every night, set a six and a half, and you'll probably get a gain, 15, I'd say probably 15 pounds of muscle in like three to six months. That's probably what's going to happen.

Yeah, I mean, that could be tough. I know that to late for me to take rest days is been difficult. So, I mean, based on what you guys are saying, trust what you guys are saying. He's right. But the hardest thing normally is for athletes is to adhere to that. That's the hard, because you want to do more. It's the athlete and you gotta be patient. You can't expect it to be overnight and you gotta trust the process.

So the most difficult part for you will not be, can you do those workouts? You can do those probably in your sleep. It's going to be, can you discipline yourself to not try and do more, thinking that more is better. Yeah. I would have you do MAPS and a BOLIC. Do those routines, do the three day a week option. Follow it as it's laid out. On the off days, go ahead and do your swimming

like you've been doing, your 75 minutes, that's fine. Don't change your calories, so whatever you're eating, keep eating, and get more sleep. And you're gonna get strong as hell. Like way stronger, you're gonna see your strength go way up, and you're gonna gain muscle very, very rapidly. I would bet money that you would gain anywhere between 12 to 15 pounds of lean body mass

with that period of time. Are you good about just out of curiosity, what, you know, your personality type, when you lift, can you sit still for the three minute rest period and stuff like that, or are you the type of person that starts doing abs and starts doing a bunch of other shit and you've got your rest periods. Who do you get about progressive overload

and taking your time through that? Then yeah, tell me who you are. Yeah, that means in the past I would have been me, but just I've run my metabolic a lot now. Okay. At least three a few times. Okay, and so I've really grown to value the rest periods, especially during phase one.

During phase two, phase three, I'd actually go a little bit longer just because I want to be able to get the volume. So yeah, I'll just continue with maps and a ball. Can I do a map performance? So I can alternate that. What do you want about powerlifts? Yeah, powerlifts. I've seen a powerlift.

If I think you already ran in a ball, because you're inexperienced with in a ball, I would go powerlifts. Maps powerlifts would be good. Maps strong would be good. All of those will work. If you did, it's strong. If you did, it's very ridiculous. I would cut that one on this slow down. Yeah, powerl left to be good map strong would be good all of those work I want to slow down. Yeah power left will be good. Let's send you power. That's a good call Look just just a hammer this home, okay? If you change nothing right now and just took two days off you gain five pounds of muscle

Literally, that's it if you didn't leave and if you didn't relax if you change nothing and just took two days off, you gain five pounds of muscle. Literally, that's it. If you didn't sleep and relax. If you changed nothing and just took two days off a week, you would gain probably five pounds of lean body mass within a month. All right, yeah, I mean, I got used to waking up at 4.15 and for like a previous job and for school. So my body just doesn't naturally at this point,

but yeah, I'll do my best to get some more sleep. Good, that'll make a big to get some more sleep. Good. That'll make a big difference, for sure. And you're just, look, you're one of those people at high functioning, high performance. You said you're doing what? MBA? Yeah, just graduated, so I'm starting a new job now.

Yeah, so you just, you know, you get away with a lot more than other people, and you function at a pretty high level. And that's what that's done is that's created the illusion of this is what's optimal. But you're actually far from optimal. You're closer to what you can tolerate. You move down towards what's optimal and you're going to unlock some serious gains and potential. You'll actually notice your cognitive performance improve and everything else will improve as

well. And probably the sleep will naturally come up. That's right. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I guess I'd never really known, known better based on my past experience, but I trust you guys.

So I'll put that in my routine now. Hey, let us know how it goes. Yeah, yeah. Circle back with us in a couple of months because I'd love to hear about the show. If you follow what we say, it's going to be pretty fun. I bet you. Yeah. You'll be, you're mind will be blown.

All right. Yeah. Appreciate you guys taking time with me today and through those questions You got it, man. All right, Sean. I haven't go on guys you do you know what here's so here's what's interesting about Certain sports, okay, cuz people will say oh if you do water polo or if you wrestle or whatever it gets you so crazy fit Yes, but here's the other part of it. It's there there's a self-selection bias where Genetically speaking some people could just tolerate more of a beat down And those are the people that end up sticking around because everybody has gone off. Yeah, that's the two Even those two sports you mentioned probably the highest calorie burn

Initially, right and then they made the point that you're adapted to that and so now it's like you're in a whole different category. They train twice, typically they practice, this is high school pool. We're not even talking college, it's boring. It's twice a day they're in the pool. And normally guys that are that high level, that too, they wear the suffering thing

as a badge of honor. Sure. So like that's kind of like, they have a different relationship with them. They do. It's like, I can fucking take it. This feels good. And so getting that person,

but I mean, I love that he's, I mean, he's already listened to the show long enough that he's been running on. I knew that's why like he has the personality of rest periods or ab crunches and jumping jacks and pushups and other shit like that because he could just, he could just handle that shit, but he's already been listening and starting to like cut back on that.

So I he'll be all right. I'd be cool to see what this kid does because he could pack on some serious muscle if he just cuts. Oh, our next caller is Hannah from Tennessee. Hannah, how's it going? How can we help you? But he'll be all right. I'll be cool to see what this kid does because he could pack on some serious muscle if he just cuts it. Our next caller is Hannah from Tennessee. Hannah, how's it going? How can we help you? Hey, guys, first, I just want to say,

y'all have truly changed my life, my relationship with diet and exercise. I heard about you guys via the Dr. John Deloni show. So it hasn't even been like I think a year. And I mean y'all know, Sal, you were on that show and it was like a light switch went off for me. And I realized for over 20 years, I've been dieting and exercising to punish myself. And I mean, it truly flipped a switch where I have been able to go, okay, I'm not doing that anymore. I'm going to take care of myself by how I eat.

I'm gonna take care of myself by how I exercise. Anyway, so that was just like the intro to me, to mind pump for me, and I just started binging mind pump content. And I like to tell people my husband and I both have drank the kool-aid, we're like, all in. He asked for a PRX. Oh, you know, home gym for Christmas. Like we're in. We're new and we're in.

So anyway, my question for y'all, I began with starter and then I did not 15 and then that time is a week out our home gym. So my husband was like, you got to do a match 20, that way you can start, you know, using the barbell. And so I did my 20, I loved it. I'm on my second round now of maps 20. And basically I just want to know, like what do I do next? My issue is that I am a mom, I work part time, I'm in school part time.

So I love to work out Monday through Friday and Saturdays, I'll do, it's not my favorite. I don't want to work out Sundays. So like five, six days a week for under 30 minutes, 30 minutes or under, but like that's the time I have. I really want to do anabolic, but I didn't know if I can even, like can I manipulate that to be 30 minutes a day

for about six days? You could split it. Yeah, you can easily do that. I actually do that a lot. I love doing anabolic look like a split. So it's a three day a week program, and then literally cut the workout in half and then do it on the next day like that.

Yeah, I would do the first half, one day, second half the next day. And so now you have six days a week basically. No problem. And then just not do the trigger sessions? Yeah, no, you don't have to do them. I mean, if you could follow it as laid out, that's great. But, I mean, look, at the end of the day,

or one later on in the day, maybe. You could, but at the end of the day, the routine that you could do consistently that works with you is gonna be the best workout. So this is gonna be the best option for you. So, MAP Santa Ballac, half Monday, half Tuesday, half Wednesday, and just go till Saturday, and you're totally set.

But this is wonderful. I love hearing this. You wrote your question, too, that your husband and you both work for the Ramsey team? And my husband works for the Ramsey team. Oh, wonderful. Do we see you guys at the event we were over there up in Tennessee? I was upstairs with Cody Bennett, and he was like,

he and I, they're the mind-funk guys. He was a big fan. 30-pointed on me, but no, I didn't get to meet you all there. Oh, fun, awesome. You love Cody, too. Yeah, next time. But yeah, no, that's it.

That's 100% it. You can do that. And from there, you can go to Maths Performance and you can do the same thing with Maths Performance. You can take the foundational workouts and break them in half. And then if you have extra time through in those mobility sessions, and there you go,

Maths Performance, Maths right after Maths and a ball, and then from there we have all kinds of different programs you can kind of play with. But that's great. Awesome. Yeah. How's your results been so far following our program? How's your body been responding? How do you feel?

Honestly, I feel really great. Yeah, like I've lost inches, I've lost weight. I've plateaued a little bit, like weight scale wise, but I know that some of that is just body fat still going down muscle mass, you know, going up. Yeah, I mean, honestly, like I'm thrilled. I've worked out truly for 20 years. I've done everything.

And but not lifting, not heavy weights, I was doing like super low weight, super high reps, types of, and this is, I've never loved working out more. Isn't that funny? You love your hair. Isn't that funny? You switch from caring for yourself instead of hitting,

and all of a sudden you get the results you were trying to get when you were doing the other way. Stop fighting your body, right? Working with your body. Yeah, yeah, exactly. And so the baking for me, like I am in a, I want to burn fat, that's kind of my immediate goal, but long term goal, I want to gain strength.

And so I think that even too, is such a huge tick for me instead of like, oh, I just want to be thin. I want to, I'm in trying to have three babies in three and a half years. Like I'm trying to get what that did to me off of my body. And just a thought of like no I just want to be a 55 year old who can do pull-ups like that's what I want to do.

Are you hitting your protein targets? Are you hitting like the optimal amount of protein because that's the biggest thing I think on the other end? Yeah I'm I shoot for like one 30 to one 40. I was for a while counting the collagen in my coffee, and then I realized that that like shouldn't count towards my protein goal. So anyway, so it's probably more like 130, but.

No, you're on fire. You are on fire. I appreciate this call. Do you have maps in a ball, or can we send that to you? Yeah, yeah, yeah, we do. My husband bought the, I don't remember what it's called, maps bundles, like, anabolic performance. Or something else, I don't know.

Okay. Can I give you something, Hannah? I wanna give, performance. Nothing else, I don't know. Okay. I ain't. Can I give you something, Hannah? I want to give you something. I like it. You want something? Yes, please. All right.

Any pro, I'm a true. Do you have maps of the tree? Yeah. Uh, I don't think so. Without coming the in that bundle. No, no, no. Great one in anybody's toolbox. Yeah, we don't have a symmetry.

Yeah, yeah. We'll send that over to you. Thank you. That's awesome. Yeah, thanks for calling in, Anna. Yeah, really appreciate you guys. Appreciate it. Thank you. Yeah, bye, y'all.

That's great. Did we like filter like people who are kicking ass for today's episode? Every single project. Like everybody's just crushing. Every single person's home. I know. It was just about your high five today.

Oh, yeah. All we need to do is just give him a little back robe, send him on their way. I know. You know, I love hearing that because is just get a little back robe and send them on their way. I know. You know, I love hearing that because for people listening, well, people listening, like here's somebody, she didn't go from beginner, like she didn't go from not working out to working out.

That's why I love hearing these. She went from working out from 20 years and then changing it to what we say. And then boom, everything happens. So this works. That's more impressive than somebody who hasn't done anything and then you get them going in what we're telling you. Yeah, you expect to change.

Exactly. Like by default, your seed change in results because if you were sitting on the couch eating potato chips, not doing anything and also you start doing anything, even you could do a damn beach body program, you'll start to see some results. So I'm, you know, that's not, it's less impressive. But when you got somebody who's been trying and grinding for 20 years, it lived in weights and done everything under the sun. And then also makes that one switch and then also boom, like feeling the best

she's ever felt. That's amazing. Ladies and gentlemen, it works. Look, if you like mine pump, but you hate the fitness industry, you know, because Elijah, here's what you got to do. Go to ask mine pump.com, ask any fitness question. That is an AI model that only answers questions based on our episodes. So the information is correct and accurate. You wanna sift through all the garbage,

askBindPump.com. You can also find all of us on social media, Justin is on Instagram at MindPump. Justin, I'm on Instagram at MindPump to Stefano, and Adam is on Instagram at MindPump.com. They're taking our job! Thank you for listening to MindPump. If your goal is to build and shape your body,

dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbundle at Mind Pump Media.com. The RGB Superbundle includes MAPs and a Ballet, MAPs Performance, and MAPs Esthetic. Nine months of phased, expert exercise programming, designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs.

With detailed workout blueprints in over 200 videos, the RGB Superbundle is like having Sal Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a full 30-day money bag guarantee, and you can get it now plus other valuable free resources at MindPumpMedia.com. If you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five-star rating and review on iTunes and by introducing MindPump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support, and until next time, this is MindPump. introducing Mind Pump to your friends and family. We thank you for your support,

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