Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 2269: The Best Workout & Diet for a Granite Hard Look, Ways to Address Low Back Pain When Squatting, How to Build Muscle After Gastric Sleeve Surgery & More (Listener Live Coaching)

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Starting point is 00:00:27 If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind pump with your hosts, Sal DeStefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. You just found the most downloaded fitness, health, and entertainment podcast. This is my pump. Right in today's episode, we answered live callers questions. People called in and we helped them out with their fitness and health. But this was after a 55 minute intro portion. Let's probably talk about current events and family life studies and much more.

Starting point is 00:00:57 By the way, you could check the show notes for timestamps and that allows you to skip around your favorite parts. Also, if you want to be on an episode like this one, where we can help you on air, email us your question at live at mindpumpmedia.com. Now this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Caldera Lab. They make skincare products that are natural, that actually work. They're phenomenal. In fact, I'm a huge fan of their serum. It's incredible. Put it on once and whether your skin's oily or dry,

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Starting point is 00:02:10 Also, we have a sale going on this month. Maps performance is half off. So that's an athlete, trainer, functional workout program. If you like to move good and look good, that's the program for you, it's half off. We also have a bundle of programs called the extreme fitness bundle that includes maps, hit high intensity, interval training, maps, performance,

Starting point is 00:02:30 maps, prime, and the intuitive nutrition guide, all bundled together and discounted. And then you can take an additional 50% off. All you have to do is go to maps, fitness products.com and use the code F EB 50 for that discount. All right. Back to the show. Most people stop wanting to tell people their age right around the age of 40, but here's an observation. People who work out and are fit, they love to brag about their age once they turn 40.

Starting point is 00:02:56 All right, what's the fit tip? Start working out. You wanna be proud of your age? Start lifting weights. One of the best ways to do that. That is an interesting point. Isn't that funny? You ever noticed? No, very much weights. One of the best ways to do that. That is an interesting point. Isn't that funny? You ever noticed?

Starting point is 00:03:07 No, very much so. It's brand-in-right. If you're in really good shape, you're so quick to tell people, like, yeah, I'm 65. Yeah, you love it. Right. You love it. But if you're not, like, if you ask someone their age,

Starting point is 00:03:18 they're like, how dare you ask my age? Because it's like, never mind. They don't want to tell you. I just always notice this, you know, working in gyms, like really fit older people. It's like they try to get an don't want to tell you. I just always noticed this, you know, working in gyms like really fit older people. It's like they try to get a opportunity to tell you how old they are. They want you to know.

Starting point is 00:03:30 That's so true. I'm 48, right? That's so funny, I haven't really thought about that, but that's so true. It's the reason why I stood out. Obviously I had a birthday this weekend, so I was thinking about this and it's just the thought or the memories of all these times just stood out to me, not because people want to say

Starting point is 00:03:47 their age, because it's so opposite of the average person. Like the average person, they don't want it, not only do they not want to bring up their age, they're in fact quite embarrassed or shy or whatever, especially women tend to be more than men, but even men, they don't want to talk about it. But then you get like fitness fanatics and trainers and people who work all the time.

Starting point is 00:04:05 And it's like, they try to find a reason to tell you how old they are, you know? Yeah. You know, can you believe I'm whatever? And it's like, oh man, but you know, it's, it's so true. And it's really because you, God, the, again, I was at the gym working out this weekend. And I was talking to this gentleman who was in his 60s

Starting point is 00:04:23 and he was just so happy to tell me his age. And I was looking at this guy and he's not like this crazy rip, whatever, but he's been working out for years on his own. So he's very fit. And you look at this guy move and work out and then I think about the average. I forgot how old he was, 64 or something like that. The average 64 year old, he's like a different species. It's not even close. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:04:43 Like he's just moving. He's exercising. He's not even close. You know what I mean? Like he's just moving, he's exercising, he's got great mobility, he was squatting and doing leg curls and he's just standing with tall postural energy and vitality make you feel it. And then I think of the other 60 year olds in my family that I know or neighbors and it's not even close. Yeah and it's probably like he probably gets a lot of people commented on that as well. You know, it gets reinforced because it's like you it's rare to see people that like able bodied and active and not complaining about whatever is going wrong with their body.

Starting point is 00:05:15 So it's almost like you feel compelled to sort of like share the gospel a bit of what they're doing. Yeah, no, it's a big one. And those were always my favorite members too. As a gym manager, I loved people like over the age of 40 that were consistent. Um, they always had a lot of wisdom around exercise. They were always the most consistent and they were not fanatical the way that my 20 or 30 year old members were, where sometimes they were still motivated by insecurities.

Starting point is 00:05:43 Once you get past a certain age, they have this kind of calm consistency that they would show up with and they'd work out and I would just love to see it. I'll, the first time that I encountered that I was 18, I had just become a trainer. I was working the front desk trying to set up a goal assessments, which is a common way to introduce yourself to new members. They come in, you scan them and you see if they want to train with you. So I was doing that, and this guy walks in, and I'd seen him already three or four different times.

Starting point is 00:06:10 And he was kind of tall, maybe six one, he had this really good posture. I remember he had silver hair, right? He would always wear a tank top. And I scanned his card, and I used to catch people. Do you guys remember catching people who would use other people's membership cards at the front desk?

Starting point is 00:06:23 So, and it was a great way to to like take the membership away and be like, do you want to buy one or whatever? So I scanned it and I thought he was using someone else's card because it was 74 years old on the birthday. And I looked at this guy's like 50, I thought it was like 50 something. Excuse me, sir. And he turns around and said, when's your birthday? Quick, you know, quiz, right? And he gives me the whole day. And I said, what? I said, you're 74 years old. He goes, yeah. I said, let me see your driver's license. He showed me and we became friends I said, what? I said, you're 74 years old. He goes, yeah.

Starting point is 00:06:45 I said, let me see your driver's license. He showed me and we became friends. And I'm like, dude, what is like, what's the deal? Like what's your secrets? I've been lifting weights. He goes, since I was in my twenties, he's all never stop. I feel amazed. And I, I was so shocked as an 18 year old kid to see the 74 year old man that I thought

Starting point is 00:07:00 was like 50 something years old. That was like the beginning of my infatuation. This is why I think there's a lot of parallels in lifting weights, strength training as there is in investing. It really is like, I mean, compounding. Yeah, it's very compounding and you, and just like investing, starting off, you know, saving 500 bucks, you know, a month way back when you're like, well, I'm not going to get rich this way.

Starting point is 00:07:22 But over time, you start stringing some decades together of consistently doing that. Before you know it, you have millions of dollars that you've actually saved and put away because of compounding interest, right? I think the same thing is when you get in, first getting to working out, you think like, oh my God, like I can't see any change or it's, oh my, I've been working so hard in this last six months and all I've moved the needle is this and or I'm only this strong, but it's like, man, you string together some decades of consistently doing that. And the beauty just like investing the less of it you have to do is you get older.

Starting point is 00:07:54 Like you, once you've built a really good nest egg and, and you were smart with the way you, you invested your money, the, the effort going forward, it gets easier with time. And I don't think that's expressed enough about weight training. And for me, getting into my forties now and looking back at like my journey of lifting weights, that's the thing that I, which is probably why I bring it up so much, why I'm, what I'm most surprised about that I didn't feel like a lot of people communicate to me is just like, Hey, you're going to get to a point where

Starting point is 00:08:23 you've been doing this for so long that actually you've got to do very little to just maintain it and keep it and keep it going because you've invested for so long in hours and days and weeks and months and years of lifting weights. Now you just get in there and touch some weights here and there and believe it or not, make some good food choices and you'd be surprised how much you will actually stay that way. And I really, this couple of weeks ago, I talked about how I went to, up to the truckie house with my Hampton group. I don't know if I told you guys, I tell you guys it's on the oldest. Yeah. Oh, you told me. So I didn't know I was the oldest. I just, I just, without insulting anybody that I was with,

Starting point is 00:08:59 like I just assumed there was a handful of them that I thought were. Well, their success level makes you think that they're especially older too. Yeah. And, and, you know, and right now I don't feel, uh, I w I would say I would be, if I was like grading myself on my fitness right now, I would be in the lower, like if one to 10, I would give myself like a two or three, as far as like my level of fitness and consistency training and diet and stuff. And so, you know, I, I don't, I don't feel like super great about it right now,

Starting point is 00:09:26 but then I'm in a situation like that with a bunch of other smart, successful people. And I thought that they were older than me, but they were all younger than I was. And I thought, oh man, that's great. And then all of them are making comments about how buff and strong. And I'm just like, wow, that's, that's weird because in my head, like, that's distorted because of what, how I perceive myself and how I've been training. But it's like, when you get around your peers and, and use, and the ones that haven't been training like you have been doing for decades,

Starting point is 00:09:53 you really see that gap, you know? Yeah, it makes you wonder a lot in terms of how much aging affects the body versus the things that we attribute to aging that are really just a result of our lifestyle and activity. You know, if you, it's crazy, right? If you look at the data on longevity, if you make it to the, what's the current life expectancy, 77 or something like that? 75. 75. That's what it is. So if you make it to 75 without heart disease, diabetes, like all the major ones, the odds that you'll make it into their 15 years are extremely high. Yeah. So it's like, if you're fit and healthy, um, and you, and you make it to 75,

Starting point is 00:10:37 like you're going to make another 15, 20 years, almost a hundred percent. It's almost positive. It's funny you mentioned, cause I was actually having this conversation with Everett and we were kind of plotting out because he's getting really cocky about getting strong right now. They got six pack and they're like, you know, feeling themselves right now. I'm like, you know, really like he's, he's wrapping out pullups and stuff. And he's like speculating. He's like, dad, I think he's like, I'm trying to think when I'm going to take you out. He's like already planning.

Starting point is 00:11:09 He thinks it's 70. He thinks when I turn 70, he's going to overpower me and like be strong and so I'm like, you know, that gave me extra a bit of like gasoline to keep up and like make sure like I'm still fit and like. Well, that's good that he still thinks you got 30 more years before he can catch you. Yeah, why would he wait that long?

Starting point is 00:11:28 I don't know. That was just when he's like, I think you're gonna be a strong old man but I'm gonna be able to take you out I think when you're sick. You know what, that's kind of a compliment. It is a compliment. He thinks you're so, so strong. Yeah, you're gonna be, because I think.

Starting point is 00:11:39 Yeah, I took that, I was like, okay. He'll be at his peak in about 10 years. Yeah, not that long, dude. In 10 years will actually be his best shot. When he's 18, I'm screwed. Yeah, yeah. That's when he's going to have his best shot at you is around, you know, 10, 15 years from now.

Starting point is 00:11:52 Yeah, sure. So the fact that he's giving you 30 damn near, that's a lot of respect. Yeah, yeah, for sure. That's so awesome. We'll see how this plays out, bro. Dude, you know, I'm going to be trained still. Yeah, I'm not going to stop.

Starting point is 00:12:04 No, it's like I find myself even even now people asking my age and I, I almost am like, oh yeah, let me tell you how old I just turned or whatever. You know, you get those comments and stuff. It's kind of, yeah, yeah, it's kind of cool, but, uh, it, it does make me think like how much of our life stuff, how much of the, that we, the, the aches and pains and ills and problems that we associate with aging have nothing to do with aging at all. Not saying that you don't get older and change. Of course happens, but when you look at the difference between a fit and healthy person who's, you know,

Starting point is 00:12:36 what some of might consider old versus their counterpart who's not fit and healthy, the difference is so vast that you'd realize aging doesn't play it's the role that we think there's way more of a correlation than a causation connected to it. And that's why we've really done society a disservice by doing all these studies and attaching it to age. It's such bullshit. It really is. Because yes, there's some correlation there, but it has more to do with the habits that they've had for so many years,

Starting point is 00:13:05 and that the average person doesn't do this, doesn't do that, makes these choices. And therefore, we can say, oh, when people get this age, these things happen. It's like, man, that's so not true, because for every study that shows that, I can give you an example of a client that I know, that I trained that was the opposite of that.

Starting point is 00:13:23 And so it really gives people this perception of like, Oh, well, you know, who cares anyways, I'm going to get old eventually. Everybody gets old. And what do you, I mean, I remember when family used to say that to me when I told them that I was doing fitness for a career, what do you do to get older? You can't do that when you get older. Like this, they used to say that was like, it's being like, Oh, that's cool for your twenties and and 30s, but what are you

Starting point is 00:13:45 going to do when you get old? You know what I'm saying? You can't be a fitness trainer. Dude, I had trainers say that. Like, I can't be the old guy trainer. I'm like, why not? Yeah. Like, what the fuck is up with that?

Starting point is 00:13:55 That I can't have this as a career. That's the whole point of this career is that I'm trying to slow down that process or improve getting older. You know what I'm saying? Like, so I just think it's, but it's that perception that we have and, and these studies that we do that, you know, correlate all these things to old age. I think we just, we're doing people a disservice because I think a lot, the average person who doesn't understand a lot about what you're communicating,

Starting point is 00:14:19 they just go, Oh, well, you know, I'm going to get old anyways. So I might as well enjoy my youth and not give a fuck and eat whatever and not train and not do those things. It's like, oh man, there's a total misconception around that. Yeah, I was working out at the UFC gym over here by Oak Ridge Mall in the morning. And it's a different crowd, right? It's a totally different crowd than when I go to the

Starting point is 00:14:41 country club that I typically work at. So the country club place, and by the way, I always work out early, it's like six AM. It's an older crowd at the country club that I typically work so the country couple place and by the way I always work out early it's like six a. It's an older crowd at the country club place and at the ufc gym it's a younger crowd but still that morning crowd tends to be very serious or whatever couple observations one. This made me sad the ufc gym because it's a younger crowd I saw probably three or four like workout partner groups, dudes working out. All of them had phone stands and were recording. And we're filming bits of their workout to post on social media. Yeah, and it made me kind of sad because the atmosphere of the gym has changed so much in that sense. I remember when I first started, I mean, people had headphones and Walkmans, you know,

Starting point is 00:15:25 when I first started, but not everybody wore them. Most people listened to the music in the gym, which kind of made you a part of the gym while you worked out. Then everybody started wearing headphones. So they kind of isolated themselves. Now everybody's got a phone, the recording and you're kind of like on your own island type of deal. And it made me a little sad to see these kids do that cause none of them look

Starting point is 00:15:41 like, I mean, like no disrespect, you know, if that's your business, fine, but I don't think this was their business. I think they're just posting their, you know, their workouts and- Did you hear Vicky and I talking about this this morning? No. Oh yeah. So we have a, I didn't even know we had this like mutual friend

Starting point is 00:15:54 that we, that we both know she actually lived with this person for a little bit without rolling this person on the bus, but she, we knew, I knew the husband that she, and she knew the wife and they were, uh, fitness professionals, right? So, and they're in there on Instagram and they have the one, one of them competes and stuff like that, or they both compete. Sorry.

Starting point is 00:16:13 And, uh, she told me that I was like, Oh, wouldn't you stop hanging out? She's like, honestly, she likes, I just, I was so tired of like everywhere. We, we couldn't even have dinner or do things like that. They were on their, they were recording everything that they did. And I remember when we were first hanging out with Craig and he was doing the same thing, and I was like, dude, why do you, it's like crazy how many people get sucked

Starting point is 00:16:34 into the social media space. And then I think one of the worst things that ever could happen to them is they actually make a little bit of a business out of it. Cause then you can easily justify it. I mean, if you have no following, nobody gives a shit, like, and you're trying to do it and stuff like that. And then after a while it doesn't take and you're like, Oh, whatever,

Starting point is 00:16:50 this isn't for me or, and maybe you don't fall, you don't just follow through. But I think one of the worst things that happens is, is get, get a little bit of confirmation. Like, Oh, I grew my following. People expect me to do this. They want to see my food. Yes. See this.

Starting point is 00:17:02 Yes. And then it turns into, and then maybe you make a little bit of money online. And so now you've like, you justify it to the people around you, like, uh, you know, or maybe even worse, you think it's cool and you're bragging about it that you have this thing. And so it's become more and more common. It's just weird to see these kids do it. Um, and I was, I felt sad for them because they're not experiencing what I

Starting point is 00:17:23 experienced at their age, which was you're there, which was a guy coming and smashing your phone. And you like, get that out of here. Well, you know, Hey, we got thrown the trash. Let's play play. Try this.

Starting point is 00:17:36 If you work out and you have your phone and you tend to look at it in between sets, which I can be guilty of as well, try a practice where you don't pull out your phone at all and you just start in the workout. It actually changes the effectiveness and the feel and the benefits of this and all this stuff is coming. So we've been talking about this for nauseam for I don't know how many years. I mean, when was when was the Adam Altler book where you guys teach me forever, right? This is we've been talking about on

Starting point is 00:18:01 this show for fucking five years, right? That's the first one I heard you pronounce it. The Altler. Yeah. Altler. Yeah. I used to say, yeah, it's Alt is the L's first, right? So anyways, we've been saying it forever. The pendulum is swinging back and it's going to become a trend and a thing now to, to not do that stuff. I guarantee you the generation coming up. You know what I was thinking? Yes. but also have you guys seen the Apple goggles? It's all my notes to talk about today. Okay, yeah.

Starting point is 00:18:30 Bro, yeah, you see the driving and stuff. I went, because. Have you seen anybody in person, like wearing a hat? No, I haven't seen it in person. I just saw videos and was like, okay, well I know Apple released that. And I'm like, well, you know, what's the response? Like, what are the tech people saying about all that?

Starting point is 00:18:45 So I actually watched a few of the videos of people kind of like doing their reviews and whatnot. And I was like, oh, okay, this is going to take over phones. It's going to take it's because it's like, walk around these things. They're just, you don't need a phone. People drive. It's, it's, it's, it's's it's air so it's basically like augmented yeah you have cameras that are recording outside and then it portrays it in so

Starting point is 00:19:12 you basically you can see the outside world the real world while it's augmented with virtual reality people are interacting and they're doing all these weird things we're not gonna look at each other anymore guys yeah well these will allow us to right so that's the interesting no not going to look at each other anymore, guys. Yeah. So these will allow us to, right? So that's the interesting. No, you're going to look at people like that. No, I know, I know. I mean, but you, we see each other.

Starting point is 00:19:31 So if you had them on, I had them on. We see each other. I know that, but I mean, there's so dorky, but like, it's enough. But, but think about this. How many dorky people are just going to sit there at dinner and like stare at their phone and not even interact with you already?

Starting point is 00:19:44 It, what's, what's the difference between that and like wearing dumb goggles? This is weird, man. You know? Yeah, we're like, you know what it is, dude? Is that people, I mean, we don't fully appreciate just how much, how important human connection is, like real human connection. That we're substituting it with false human connection and we're suffering the consequences. But we're so distracted, it's so addicting, we continue moving that direction.

Starting point is 00:20:08 Dude, this is going to take off again. I T it because, dude, it's like you can watch whatever you want. Like it's so if I'm just in a commute, I watch TV, like people are driving like doing work. Yeah. You know, it's like, this is so bad. There's videos already of people and they're Tesla's while they're the Tesla's driving and they're doing it. Because now, so it'll be interesting to see the laws around this, right?

Starting point is 00:20:29 Because you're looking outside. So you still are. It's not like you're not viewing outside. It's just it's it's augmented reality. So it just adds to, I mean, is this not the beginning of the plugged in and unplugged call? I mean, this is it. This is like the hybrid of it. Because at least you're like, you know, you still can walk and like go outside and do

Starting point is 00:20:47 things, but it's like, you're basically just fully immersed at the same time. You know what I was thinking this whole time and you just, this really even strengthens what I was thinking. So I was just fantasizing, right? See these, this jam, I'm in there, I'm thinking about, you know, what it was like working out when I was younger and all that stuff. And I thought, man, if we ever open to Jim, because we've talked about this before, you can't have phones in the, we've already talked about this at one

Starting point is 00:21:10 day, maybe we'll open a gym. We don't care about making money or not. It would just be for us. And I love this idea. I thought, you know what, we would make it to where you're not allowed to bring your, if you bring your phone out in the workout floor, you're out. No, you have a place to check it in when you come in. Check in. That's it. It's fucking workout. We have like, yeah, definitely just workout. I think we'd have like one camera where it has your PR station, right? And then so you can get like the footage after you're done, but you know,

Starting point is 00:21:38 because people are going to want that. Maybe or not. Like, I like imagine, imagine right now us walking into a gym, well, you have to check your phone. At first you might be able to answer the reason why it's a brilliant ideas. Because again, it's, there's going to be, it's going to be like, it's going to be like, no, it's going to be like left and right. Right. It's just going to be like politics.

Starting point is 00:21:55 There is going to be a divide. There's going to be people that go the other direction, right? You see like the Bradley Martins gym where like encouraged, take your shirt off, bringing video cameras. Everybody's like, that's encouraged. Right. Well, I mean, and he's got a full gym. So there's obviously a, a part of the population that want that

Starting point is 00:22:12 direction, then there's going to be a part of the population that, that values and appreciates exactly your point you're making. And so there'll be, there'll be a divide. There'll be this, there'll be enough people that will want that. And there'll be enough people that want the other thing. This is where we're going to start to see people go one way or the other with being plugged in or unplugged. And I think that these types of things that you're, you're alluding to,

Starting point is 00:22:35 I think are going to become more and more popular. I think as, as the research continues to come out, we see what we're doing to children that are getting plugged into these iPads and iPhones so early and we're starting to see the repercussions of that I think there'll be a portion of the population that wise up like we always do it's typically what we do when we Progress is we jump headfirst into it. We realize that's dangerous and not a good idea We we reassess we come back and we go okay Well, how can we still utilize these tools integrated into our life?

Starting point is 00:23:03 But they're not also be consumed by them? And so the future looks like that. Yeah, and you know, if you look at fitness trends that explode, because trends come and go, but there's always an element of like truth in each one of them, like, okay, that's why that one took off. And that, you know, like curves in the late 90s or 2000s,

Starting point is 00:23:18 it's because there was a lot of women that were intimidated by gyms. They were able to track these women to work out type of. CrossFit was the last big massive shift in the fitness space. And it's definitely died off, but it has some lasting impact. And what it did very well, is it tapped into that it tapped into the community. It tapped into community grit. Yeah, you're not on your phone or whatever you're freaking we're doing this together.

Starting point is 00:23:40 You know, it's like, and that people went in there and just became, um, like, they just loved it. They became zealots because of that feeling. You know, old school gyms, they didn't even play music. You would just hear them, the weights. I mean, I could see this happen. I mean, even, um, I know stand up, they've taken phones and it's been like, they've had amazing results because that, cause people are just like engaged in their, you know, they're

Starting point is 00:24:06 present and they're involved in and I could see like the gym definitely like taking a piece of that because it's like, dude, every, like you said, every gym now that you go to, it's like somebody bow guarding some station just to set themselves up for it. At the same time, you have the, like I said, the Bradley Martins and you're seeing more gyms that are accepting people coming in with their camera crew and no shirts and all that stuff like that. So there's gonna be both.

Starting point is 00:24:34 There's opportunity for both because there's gonna be something that will. I don't know if it's a huge market demand for what I'm saying. It's not yet, but I think- But if we did what we wanted, which is literally just for the audience, we said one day we'll open a gym. It's the counter to it. We ain't care if it did what we wanted, which is literally just for the audience, we said one day

Starting point is 00:24:45 we'll open a gym. We didn't care if it makes money or not. It'll be just an awesome gym. That's the way to do it. That's the way to do it. Cause that's what I'm going to want to walk in. I'm not going to want to walk in and see a bunch of people terrible, terrible business strategies.

Starting point is 00:24:57 Micro-scooters. That's right. Nobody ever shared. Nobody ever shared it. Nobody didn't like talk about it. You never know. It could be one of those. It's like fight club, dude. It's like, you know, you have to have the special handshake to get talk about it. You never know. It could be one of those. It's like fight club.

Starting point is 00:25:05 Dude, it's like, you know, you have to have the special handshake to get in or something. Yeah, exactly. I mean, I, that's, I see, I think things like that will come. I mean, that used to be what was cool, right? Things that were cool when I was younger was like that the stuff that you, yeah, when you were onto something that not everybody knew about, like that was what made something cool.

Starting point is 00:25:20 Yeah. And if it was like underground like that. So I do think that there's, there's possibility for that. Yeah. I think you're onto something. Oh man. Anyway, how'd you guys do with the storm? It was pretty crazy. Oh, it was gnarly. Did you guys lose power or anybody lose power? I didn't lose power. You always lose power though when stuff like that happens. There's always this one transformer too. It just like blows every time. Like I don't know if there's this like tree that just drops these huge branches on or what. But yeah, I mean we have a generac and so it kind of makes it a lot less painful, but dude, I swear there's something, there's like one service person for like generators in like a

Starting point is 00:25:58 hundred mile radius, like there's like nobody to service these things. I'm like, what a business opportunity for somebody to come in and like, have like a fleet of like, you know, service people and like, dude, it, there's so much need for that, especially with all the people that live in the woods and everything else because it powers always an issue. Like just like shutting off. No, we went, we went to my parents house. My mom wanted us over there for my birthday and it was just windy and storming. And then that day, the two little ones were just, they were a handful.

Starting point is 00:26:31 And right now my daughter, my youngest has transitioned into like just, she's a rascal. All of a sudden you can't take your eyes off her. She'll climb anything and it's dangerous. So now it's like exhausting to be with her and my three-year-old So all day, you know, we were doing that managing that or whatever and we're just all tired Then we go to my mom's house and it's raining and windy and whatever and we get there and the kids are nuts And you know, it can be stressful in my parents house, too Because you got my siblings there their kids the whole deal. It's loud So then we're getting ready to leave. I'm like, let's go

Starting point is 00:27:03 We get a text from our neighbor that our power went out back at our house. The problem was that we locked all the inside doors with a top lock that there's no way to open from the outside. And I just realized, oh shit, we can't open the garage. So I'm like, are we gonna have to sleep at my mom's house with the kids? No.

Starting point is 00:27:22 Oh bro, I was like, oh, I could feel like the stress and anxiety. I'm like, I don't got nothing ready for tomorrow. I got to work tomorrow. What am I going to do? My daughter won't go to sleep. I'm like, and then I'm like, wait a minute. I'm going to break the door down.

Starting point is 00:27:33 That's what I'm going to do. So we go home. We get in the car. We drive home. And then I remembered that I did have a key to a door that we could come. I was fully prepared. Oh, I was fully prepared.

Starting point is 00:27:43 Yeah. And then just pay for the door to get fixed. Oh, my God. And do all that. But it was, man, it was the wind was wild. It's been one of the nastiest. We, I can't tell you the last time, if ever, Katrina and I literally did nothing. I don't think we left, we left a couch like twice

Starting point is 00:27:57 to go and get up to get food. Like, I don't think we've had that lazy. Granted, she heard her back on Friday. So again? Yes, she tweaked it pretty bad. I mean, she's blaming it on the marathon sex that we had on Friday night, but I don't think it was that cause it was cause it was only two minutes. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:28:16 So although she was doing some really acrobatic crazy things, could have been the case. Could have been the case. So no, she got other jacuzzi with max on, on a weird subject. We're gonna be dude, bro. We're having a really want me to do that. That's kind of weird. Like, like, push down.

Starting point is 00:28:36 So, give me so mad. I said that on the podcast, but she really did. She heard her back and she tweaked something and she was like super in mobile and laid around and put her on a heat pad and just laid up and watched movies. But I can't remember the last time that we had a storm that bad, man. It was, I mean, every, all my shit was blown around all in the backyard and stuff like that. And, and the, I have that California room with all that, that nice furniture outside. And normally it's designed to where it overhangs

Starting point is 00:29:06 and so I've got a good, you know, three, four feet before there's any carpet or like nice furniture. But the wind was blowing so hard it was blowing. Rain came in. Yeah, yeah. So I had to go like set up stuff to protect all that furniture and shit. So it was a pain in the ass.

Starting point is 00:29:19 Yeah, I had to cut our trip short. We were up in Truckee and then it was like, we had a little bit of snow, but it wasn't anything crazy. But there was just signs everywhere. Like if you are here Sunday at all, like you will be here through Tuesday, like just plan on that. Like you were just going to get snowed in. So we're like, we got to go. Yeah. I had to, we brought up the one of Ethan's friends too. So I was like, I was responsible for another kid.

Starting point is 00:29:46 And so I was like, ah, we just gotta take off. Well, so I had this realization, well I had two realizations. The first one, the fast one was that my little ones sleep. We use a hatch light and a hatch light, it'll like there's different colors. So one means like we're getting ready for bed. One means you're sleeping.

Starting point is 00:30:04 The other one means you get up and you train your kid with them and it's different colors. So one means like we're getting ready for bed. One means you're sleeping. The other one means you get up and you train your kid with them and it's pretty good. It makes, you know, white noise or rain sound or whatever to help them sleep. Well, that's, you gotta plug those in. So you got a power outage. Your kid won't go to sleep because they're so used to it.

Starting point is 00:30:18 So I'm trying to make my three year old go to sleep. He's got no, there's no power. So I had to like sit in there with him until we got power like late at night. Cause he was scared he could even, he's used to this like sound machine. You're not just running it off your phone? Yeah, I run brain FM when that happens cause we use a hatch also. My phone was dying and I had nowhere to plug it in.

Starting point is 00:30:39 Because remember we were at my mom's house. Here's the second realization that I had. This was a big realization that my family. I always charge you my clothes. This was a big realization that my family, and maybe you could say it's about my culture, right? But my family in particular, boundaries don't exist. There are no boundaries. Jessica's always trying to tell me about this, right?

Starting point is 00:30:56 And I grew up in it, so it's hard for me to really see. But it's true, they simply do not exist. Like if you say something to someone in my family like hey You know my kid doesn't want to be kissed. Don't you go kiss? I'm like, oh, yeah, okay No problem and I'm gonna do it anyway or please and then they'll do it or whatever They just there's no boundaries like to this day if mail is delivered to my mom's house So my name on it and I go by she'll hand it to me. It'll be open. So read show Yeah go by, she'll hand it to me, it'll be open. So she'll open it. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:31:25 Till this day. So I'm like, I'm having these like realizations, like, God, I grew up without any freaking. So I was talking to Jessica about that. She's like, well, what do you mean? I'm like, well, I mean, I moved out when I was 20 or 21. I'm like, up until that age, like my mom would go and clean my room, go through my stuff. She's like, what?

Starting point is 00:31:41 I'm like, yeah, she would just go through and she's like, well, how did you have privacy? I'm like, you learned to hide things and lie. She's like, what? I'm like, yeah, she would just go through and she's like, well, how did you have privacy? I'm like, you learned to hide things in life. She's like, oh, that makes, you know, but none, no bound, like none. And that's just my, it's just how my family operates. It's like, they'll just, yeah. You know, they don't really hide stuff though. They're, they're, I mean, the re, I mean, they operate from, it's, what's

Starting point is 00:32:00 hard, I think, for people like you and her to, why to see it is because they, they operate from a place of love. Sure. Right? So it's not like they're being intrusive, like your mom's like, so nosy, she's got to do that. It's just like, she's, want to make sure you're okay. I want to make sure I checked your bills and make sure it wasn't something you had to miss.

Starting point is 00:32:16 And so it was an emergency. Like that's how like they operate too, is like the play, they're coming from a place of love. And so, which is also the part that I always have to try and be compassionate when, when I'm challenged with it is because I know they don't mean any harm. I know that it's that she's been conditioned that this is how things are and this is normal.

Starting point is 00:32:33 But it's like, that's the thing that we're always trying to, we're always trying to have that conversation, which is like, let's agree that I'm not normal and you're not normal. And then we're trying to land somewhere in the middle here. Like that is the hardest part. It always was like, I was so not normal and you're not normal. And then we're trying to land somewhere in the middle here. Like that is the hardest part. It always was like, I was so not normal. And that is normal.

Starting point is 00:32:49 It's like, no, it's not. No, that's not normal either. No, it's not. Exactly. That's not normal either because you were raised that way and you think it's healthy and it's good. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:32:57 But you know, you go to like the average person and you know, you say, hey, the other taking pictures. Oh, I don't want to be in the picture right now. They're like, okay, no problem. You think my family? No, no, no, no, don't worry about it. No, we'll take it. It's okay. You look fine. You look fine. You're like, no, I don't want to be in the picture right now. They're like, okay, no problem You think my family? No, no, no, no, no, we'll take it. It's okay. You look fine. You look fine Yeah, like no, I don't want to take it. No, no, you look good. Don't worry about it. They'll do it anyway It's like I can't I can't say I grew up with it

Starting point is 00:33:14 So I'm just like now how are you so because one of the things I know that like like Katrina's like working through That's really challenging for her is to like to tell her family or tell her that's the hardest thing That's the part that like like like we like, yeah, we just had this again. We're, it's hard, bro. It's hard because it's, I don't know how to explain it. She understands it, right? I don't know how to explain it because you grew up in a way so much that to even create those now feels like you're, um, you know, it's like

Starting point is 00:33:40 disrespectful almost. Yes. Yes. Um, that's how she, that's how she, that's how she, like, so this, Justin and I were talking off air before you came in here about Super Bowl. And, uh, you know, we had made plans. I've made plans for a couple of my, my best friends who are like hardcore football fanatics with me. And so at that, we're going to watch the Super Bowl. Well, come to find out, uh, Katrina's family, this was just a couple of nights ago. They text us on the group thread or like that, like, oh, one of our family members, Melissa, she got this big raise, right?

Starting point is 00:34:09 And so we celebrate that. And they're like, Hey, let's plan it on Super Bowl weekend. We'll watch Super Bowl, we'll do all this. Let's have everybody over. Let's do a big party and we'll do the Super Bowl. And Katrina goes, uh, do you care if I invite her by over? I said, yeah, no. I said, no.

Starting point is 00:34:23 And she's like, oh, okay. And I'm just like, because they don't watch football. And it's going to be about her racing. I want to watch football. That's how, and I plan that like that. And so she's like, well, what should I tell them? Yeah, yeah. And I'm like, I know what that's like.

Starting point is 00:34:37 Exactly. Tell them that. I don't want them over. Exactly. That's why I was just like, tell them we already have plans. You know what I'm saying? Or tell them no. You know what I'm saying? Or don't even tell them. You just say like, we won't be there. You know what I'm saying? Or tell them no. We don't say or don't even tell them. They just say like, we won't be there.

Starting point is 00:34:46 You know what I'm saying? Like to me, it's like that simple, but I see it's not, I'm watching her. Like I don't, she doesn't even know this, right? She's going to hear this on the podcast. Like I was watching her, like just stare at her phone for like fucking an hour trying to like formulate with the conjure. Yes. Like how do I fucking phrase this so I don't insult my like she's a

Starting point is 00:35:05 freight, she's an insult, insult them or be disrespectful to him. And I'm like, it's fucking easy. You know what I'm saying? Like we, we had already planned this like a month in advance. Like we're, it's like it is. They're not big football fans. They're more about the party for the conundrum with Superbowl's too. It's like, it turns into this like it's a party.

Starting point is 00:35:22 And like, no, I'm like invested in this game. I could care less about like, oh, who's bringing the dip and his, get out of here, dude. Like let me just like, like focus. It's just, it's just weird. It's very strange. But I mean, I get it because, and she has the same thing. And I can see that and very similar, you know, verbiage.

Starting point is 00:35:42 Like I don't want to disrespect them. I don't want to hurt their feelings. Yeah. So she's like wrestling. What happens too is because Jessica wants to, she wants to please people. So she has a tough time then drawing it herself because she doesn't want to disappoint anyone, but then what that does, it builds resentment or whatever. And then I'm on the other end and, you know, half the time I'm oblivious.

Starting point is 00:36:02 So something will happen. I'll be oblivious and she's like, why don't you back me up? I'm like, what are you talking about? That's the thing that happened with whatever. That's the same thing. I'm like, huh? What do you mean? Cause it's so like, you know, I'm literally coming to you.

Starting point is 00:36:11 You don't see it. Cause you're hoping it. From her perspective. And it's the same thing that I said, or I said, you know, what it makes me feel like is that you choose them over me all the time. And I'm your partner. I'm, it's you and I first than everybody else. And it's like, so, and, but like her oblivious to it too, like, I don't,

Starting point is 00:36:26 I don't feel like I'm choosing them. Like you are though in that situation. Like you're not asking me. It's a tough thing, bro. Yeah. I mean, it's definitely one of the, because you have a dynamic with your fam, especially if you're close with them. And it's, uh, first you have to become aware of it, which took me forever to

Starting point is 00:36:40 become aware. And then the second part is, Oh, what do I do about it now? Yeah. You know, and then, okay, I got it. And then, ooh, I'm going to hurt people's feeling whatever. So it's. And then also second part is, Oh, what do I do about it now? Yeah. You know, and then, okay, I got it. And then, ooh, I'm going to hurt people's feeling whatever. So, and then also you add in the other layer, how do you do it and not roll your wife under the bus? Right.

Starting point is 00:36:52 Like how do you do it? Not because the easy default is like, well, Jessica doesn't want to come over. Like that's the easy. Which I'm sure there's people in relationships that they that the partner just doesn't like, fucking, I'm not going to deal with my family. I'll just blame it on my husband. I'll just blame it on my husband. I'll just blame it on my wife. I don't need to do that.

Starting point is 00:37:07 Say it. Well, that's me too. I don't give a fuck that much. You just tell them, let them resent me. But that's not bad. That's actually a good thing. Cause that means that you can draw your own. And people eventually will start to respect you.

Starting point is 00:37:17 That's right. I'm okay with that. Like I'm not, that's why I'm like, you just tell them. That's why I say, Just tell them I said no. Yeah. Tell them Adam doesn't want to go. You know what I'm saying? He's got plans with that. I'm not afraid of that conversation. You know what I'm like, you just tell, that's why I say, just tell them I said no. Yeah. Tell them Adam doesn't want to go. You know what I'm saying? He's got plans. What I'm not, I'm not afraid of that conversation.

Starting point is 00:37:27 You know what I'm saying? I'm very comfortable with who I am, how I want to run my family, how I want to do things like that. But I understand the dynamic because you guys both have very similar challenges, but she's the same way too. And this literally just happened this weekend. So I'm like laughing. You hearing, you're talking about this because I was like,

Starting point is 00:37:42 had this moment where I'm like, watching her in the corner of my eye on her phone, just staring at it for like 30 minutes. What to say? I was telling Adam, I was like, I didn't have a chance to plan what I actually wanted to do. You know, so these plans were happening outside of like, and I'm like a big fan of like, my team's actually in the Super Bowl.

Starting point is 00:38:01 And I'm like, nobody even asked me what I wanted to do. You know what? It's just so, it's so weird because even at the, you know, 40, I'm 45, right? So I even have 45 years old. I, there are things that you, you start to become aware of that. And then you become aware that you were not before. Yeah. So it's like, I start to see all this, like I've been told this before, but

Starting point is 00:38:19 it's very different to be told things than to actually like see them and go, Oh, shit. hold on a second. That's true. Like if somebody says, don't do that, you just don't do it. Why wouldn't you do it? You know, whereas before I was like, well, it's a big deal type of deal. No, because I grew up that way. So you become aware and it's like, okay, how do I balance this now?

Starting point is 00:38:36 How do I do this? You know, the good part of the good part of that, I think about getting older, at least this is how I feel with Katrina and our relationship is like, we're aware of these things enough now. I'd say she's come like full circle on that too. And so there is at least this like, uh, acceptance of each other, like how you're going to handle it. Like, you know, like if I, if I were to be, if I staunch about it, I'm not doing

Starting point is 00:38:58 this and she's like, I really want to go do this, be like, okay, you know, you go do that, I'll go do this. And it's like, it's not a big fight. No, it took me, it took me forever. What took me forever, this I'm well aware of now, but what took me forever to even become aware of was the dysfunction around food that is so common in just, in like, like in my family, in my culture.

Starting point is 00:39:15 Like they take pride in who can make a kid eat the most food. Okay. And I grew up with it so much that I didn't even see it. I didn't even see it. Now it's like clear as hell. Like I'll see my nephews sitting over there and everybody keeps trying to feed them and they're trying to convince them and who can distract them so they can fit more food in his mouth. And I'm sitting there watching and I'm like,

Starting point is 00:39:34 this kid is well nourished. There is no reason. Like he's a thick, he's a strong, thick guy. Like there is no reason. Like that was a great mentality, right? After the great depression. That's why that's like, that's exactly that. Generational dysfunction. It's generational dysfunction. 100% that's true.

Starting point is 00:39:49 It's rooted in something probably healthy and good, which is ironic about that, right? It's just like, there's probably a time where like, hey, you need to make sure you're kidding. But it becomes generational because it's how you're raised. This feels normal that you apply it. But I mean, and I get it, like, you didn't know if you were gonna get another meal meal and so it's like, you better eat this.

Starting point is 00:40:06 And I got to figure out how to make you eat this. Otherwise you are going to become malnourished because that was quite common. Now it's like, if my kid sits and doesn't want to eat, I'm like, okay, you don't have to eat buddy. Not a big deal. And I can feel, I can feel the older people in my family abundance. Bro, you understand? Freaking out.

Starting point is 00:40:20 Oh, I can feel my mom in on the inside. She's like, she has to get up and move away. I'm not going to have time with that too. She's like vacuuming the living room. Oh, I can feel my mom in on the inside. She's like, she has to get up and move away. Time with that, too. She's like vacuuming the living room. Oh, bro. Staying busy. Because I told my kid he doesn't have. No, you don't have to eat that, buddy. It's not a big deal.

Starting point is 00:40:33 And she could steal. Your kids passed up on my waffles. You know, I had like a whole conversation with my mom about this. He's so mad, you know, that they would pass on waffles and they're passed on like desserts and this and that. And I'm just like, they don't need it. Oh, bro. It's just, I could see my siblings do it.

Starting point is 00:40:49 I used to do it, you know, now I'm like aware of it. So you just got to, that generational shit is so hard to break. I mean, shit, that's like, that's 90% of therapy, bro. That's 90% of everybody who's in therapy is breaking fucking generational shit. That's a hundred percent. A hundred. Do you even higher than that. Do you guys have things in your family that like, like certain things that are caught, like in my family, anxiety is like, this is like what we have.

Starting point is 00:41:12 Everybody has. Oh, bro, like anxiety is a thing and it's contagious and you learn it, right? From the people around it. Do you guys have anything like that in your family? Yeah. Oh, I have a really bad trait that I get from my family, which is like, we have this like criticism. You don't speak to each other where they could like an issue and then you just, okay.

Starting point is 00:41:29 Just disconnect. Yeah, just disconnect. So that's a really bad habit that I know that I have that is from that, you know, it's like that. We've normalized that so much, there's just like somebody upset you or piss you off, whatever, you just have that ability to just like cut it off. You know, and so, which can be very

Starting point is 00:41:45 unhealthy. And obviously I have now another side of a family that that's different for them to handle that. So I know that's an issue that I've always got to work on for sure. No, no, in my family, it's anxiety. And if they'll find something to be anxious about something news, world events, something's happening right now. What's happening there?

Starting point is 00:42:03 Oh my God, that's so you, bro. Oh, that's so you. Bro, I'm, I'll tell you something right now. What's happening there? Oh my God, that's so you, bro. Oh. That's so you. Bro, I'll tell you something right now. I'm the calmest person in my family. Okay? No, actually, that's not true. My brother probably is probably one of the most,

Starting point is 00:42:13 probably the calmest, but it's in there, dude. It's like, it's my family. You know what I'm saying? Go ahead, Justin, sorry. Oh, I was just gonna say, we just find, like I just grew up, like we find what's wrong with everybody else. I was like, okay, I'm just going to say, we just find like, I just grew up, like we find what's wrong with everybody else. Okay, I'm very aware of, you know, it's so much talking shit that it's really hard for

Starting point is 00:42:33 me to get people put ups. I've been really working on that. Like it's, cause I didn't like it, you know, it's just, but it, again, you build sort of like a callous and, and like a, you know, thick skin from it. So I definitely have thick skin when people try and like come at me or whatever, but it's like, dude, like that, that's a problem, dude. Like growing up like that and like always like, and it's always in like some kind of sarcastic, you know, snarky, but like that shit adds up and you're like, not everybody's

Starting point is 00:43:02 a piece of shit. Yeah. Okay. Like let's think better. You know, on the, on the positive note of family stuff, kids, family, all that stuff, dude, I am so blown away. So I, one of the last episodes we recorded, my shout out was the, um, uh, the number blocks.

Starting point is 00:43:20 Yeah. Did you guys see the video I posted it last night? Oh, oh yeah. Oh, my son's pre-k bro. That's four, four years old. Did you guys see the video I posted with him last night? No. Oh, oh yeah. Oh yeah. My son's pre-K, bro. That's four years old and I was able to do. That's great. Yeah, he was two plus two, four plus four.

Starting point is 00:43:31 Two plus two, three plus three, four plus four, five, all the way up to ten plus ten is 20. That is 100% that game. Like, that's, I can't take the credit for like dad being this great dad. I mean, of course I interact with him and of course I play it with him a little bit, but he's become so obsessed with these number blocks and then the cartoon that goes along with it. Is he a numbers kid? Does he like numbers a lot?

Starting point is 00:43:51 I mean, this is the first sign of that. Cause you, cause you get numbers. Yes. So that's like the first sign of like, oh wow, this, maybe he's going to have that same, same thing that I have. That's great. Cause that was what one of my few strengths in school was math. Like I loved, I love math.

Starting point is 00:44:04 I still love math and numbers, right? So to see him to do that was really, really cool, especially considering that we're going to hold him back, right? So we're holding him back this coming year. And also, and I'm sure any parent that's ever heard that from the teachers, you go, oh, in your stomach, you know, getting the news. I'm pre-k. I know what you mean though.

Starting point is 00:44:22 Yeah. I don't care. I don't say, and I know it's like, oh, whatever. If your kid's like a sophomore, I saw him like this. Then you go, oh, what's going on, buddy? Logically, I get it, but that was the still. A lot of people intentionally do that.

Starting point is 00:44:34 Yes. Because their age is on the cusp. And he's that way. And they're smaller for sports and the y'all. And he's all the above, right? So, but I, so, I mean, granted, that's not, like that's not how my brain operates, right? Like leadership, rule number one, everything is my fault. What could have I done

Starting point is 00:44:48 better as a parent? 100% the two things, the things that, because the teachers are like, he shows signs of leadership, he raises his hand, he communicates with everybody, everybody loves it, like all these positive things. The thing that he's held back on is his, his, his confidence around writing the letters and actually writing letters and numbers and cutting with the scissors, all dexterity stuff, all stuff connected to the feeding thing. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:45:11 So his development on a speech and that, that has a lot to do with him feeding himself. We deprived that of him early on thinking that, oh, whatever, you know, not a big deal. Didn't learn until we had the speech therapist that we handicapped him in that area a little bit. I shouldn't use that word because I know that's not necessarily true. What happened, but we slowed his progress down by doing that.

Starting point is 00:45:32 And so here's another way that it's showing up is that the other thing I didn't do as a dad, I wish I would have done more. I remember thinking this, like I was going to do this more with him. And I maybe one time did it where, and you did a video the other day, I think of this with, uh, I don't know if it was your daughter or your son you did it with, where you were hanging, hanging him or her from the bar and seeing how long she could grip onto it. I wish, and so parents listening, I wish I would have done that more, like, so we had good hand strength between feeding him longer than we should have, not doing more stuff like that, where we,

Starting point is 00:46:02 and we just, because he wasn't really into the gymnastics and climbing stuff. So I didn't find ways to push it. And so now here we are in what it's manifested in is that he doesn't have a lot of confidence with his hand, his hand strength and dexterity. And then his, his writing and all has, it's all interconnected to that. Everything else, like great on all other stuff. And obviously with numbers, like he's way ahead of where he should be stuff like that, but that is enough that they're like, we want him to be fully confident.

Starting point is 00:46:29 And so we're not telling you have to, it's a recommendation on our part. He's also young for his class already. So it's not like he's going to be, you know, way older than everybody. He'll be right in the same age because we started him so young. So it's like, but still that, again, the, the, the initial like you, oh, what did I miss? Would I not do? But those are the things that I wish would just wait to become teenagers and you really get hit with that shit. I hope I don't got a lot of it. I hope I do a good job. I think this is what

Starting point is 00:46:56 they talk about though, right? Everybody says it's an, it's impossible, right? As a parent, there's going to be things that you screw up on. There's going to be things that you didn't do. And so, you know, here's an area where, I mean, I take ownership on it. I don't, you know, I'm not gonna beat myself up over it, but I recognize that, you know, and if I was giving advice to somebody who's going to have kids, these are areas we shouldn't,

Starting point is 00:47:17 we should have let him feed himself from the jump, let it be a mess, let it do all those things instead of caring more about how messy he was going to get and the house was going to get. And then the other one was doing things where you were encouraging him to, even though he didn't like to climb, still encouraging things that were going to strengthen his hands. Yeah. Well, my 14 month old, she won't stand by herself. She doesn't walk yet. She does a cruising thing, but she'll climb anything. It's really weird. It's like she, she skipped like 15 steps. Like she'll climb anything to the point where you got to be careful. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:47:50 Yeah. She refuses to stand or walk on her own, but you'll see her climb things and you're like, Oh, how did she get up there? You got to go grab her, pull her down type of deal. And she'll fall sometimes. She also won't say papa. She refuses to say, she calls me mama. At first I thought she was like taunting me like I'd say I'd look at her go papa and she'd go mama and be like no no no it's me. Now I realize that she calls me mom. She says mama to me and him.

Starting point is 00:48:15 Maybe that's from the night feedings that's what that is. I put on the fake boobs. Have you guys seen that? They actually make this fake boobs that you put milk in so that the dad can nurse the baby. Have you guys seen that? Yes. They actually make the fake boobs that you feel, you put milk in so that the dad can nurse the baby. Have you seen that Doug? Talking about giving the kid a complex. Why? Why are you doing? Yeah, terrible. Talk about confusing the kids.

Starting point is 00:48:35 That's terrible. So stupid. Hey, another random chest tear. Another, I got another message from somebody who I haven't spoken to in 15 plus years who sent me a message is, Hey, is this the real deal of the caldera? Oh, cause of our commercials? Yes.

Starting point is 00:48:52 Yes. Do you know that I get recognized for our, what call white label ads, caldera ad being one of them more than I do for mine. I have people stop me and they go, Oh, I've seen you before. And then I'll be like, Oh, do you listen to mine? Pump like, no, no, it's a skincare thing. Like, Oh my God, of all the things too, of all the products that we work with, I did, that's one that I would not have guessed that would have made this like random connection to all these people that I, that I haven't talked to for forever.

Starting point is 00:49:18 They see that and it's not like, Oh, look, you're famous or eating like that. It's actually asking about the product. Like, Hey, is this, is this legit? I saw you advertising this. I had someone asking me if I was a fitness model. I thought it was, I thought it was a compliment. And it wasn't because they thought I looked like a fitness model because they saw me on ads. So they said, Oh, you must just what you do, right? You do, you do commercials for like, no, I have a podcast. That's what I do. But that product is, um, I mean, they,

Starting point is 00:49:47 I would love to see the growth of Caldera over the last five years. The base layer and the serum. I mean, that's what I have right here on the right here on my next. Exploded. I, that's, I use that. I almost single. I almost feel like they have created like really widen the market for male skincare because before that, can you guys recall like a very popular men's skincare product? That's why I didn't think it was going to do as well as it did.

Starting point is 00:50:13 But obviously there was a need there. Obviously there's a need for a product like that. And I think the few people that don't invest in it is because it's not cheap. It's expensive product, but it goes for it lasts a long time. You put a drop. That's the part that I always think I explained to someone is like, you know, don't be fooled by the price on it because it is, it's not cheap. It's expensive product, but it goes for it lasts a long time. Oh yeah. We put a drop. That's the part that I always think I explained to someone is like, you know, don't be fooled by the price on it because it is, it's not cheap. It's an expensive product, but it'll last you a long time.

Starting point is 00:50:32 Like, I mean, I don't even know how long this has been sitting on here, how long I've been going through this, but I use it every single day and swear by it. For sure. That's awesome. Speaking of which, I got a DM from a gentleman who used one of our partners, Zebaotics. And so he was, he's actually a scientist. And, Oh, really? Yes. And he was, he's like, I was fascinated by the science. So if people don't know they Zebaotics, the probiotic,

Starting point is 00:50:57 and they genetically modify the bacteria in there to break down acetaldehyde in the gut. So when you drink alcohol, your, some acetaldehyde is produced and that gets processed by the liver, but some of it's released in the gut. And then it gets in your bloodstream and acetaldehyde makes you feel like garbage. So this essentially take it before you drink alcohol and you'll feel better the next day. So he's like, I was fascinated by this science and he goes and I tried it and he goes and I can't believe how amazing it works. And then he went into how this science is going to like revolutionize everything in terms of not necessarily for alcohol, but rather modifying bacteria,

Starting point is 00:51:32 to do all kinds of different things in the body, like produce more neural transmitters. So if you're depressed or anxious, you could take a probiotic that specifically will help produce more. Well, remember when we first partnered with them and we talked to them, he said like, this was like the low hanging fruit, right? This was easy. Yeah, this was like an easy product that everybody could connect to and understand

Starting point is 00:51:52 and they could show people dramatic results, but this was not like the big vision for the company. That's, I mean, we're investors, right? So that was one of the things that I thought was, we all thought was so fascinating was, oh wow, as amazing as this product is, this is like barely scratching the surface of the potential of these GMO type products that can alter like what you're saying.

Starting point is 00:52:11 Like, so it's going to be really fast. You know, speaking of that, when was their last quarterly update from them? Have you seen a while? Yeah, we're due for that. You should make a note, Doug, for me to follow up on them and reach out to them. Curious to see how, how the company is doing. Cause we haven't, I don't think I've seen a quarterly update. I also wanted to bring up, uh, so we have our trainer forum now. So the new forum for trainers and coaches who went through or have the

Starting point is 00:52:32 mine pump trainer course. So right now it's a small group, um, less than a thousand people in there. And people are sharing their stories of, you know, building their business. So like, so I, I wanted to share one because it's, you know, I take for granted, or I'd say we took for granted, just how the things that we did when we were trainers, how effective they were. And I think I, I don't know about you guys, but I assumed that they were like, people common knowledge, like people did these things.

Starting point is 00:53:00 They're still teaching it. Yeah. These principles. So one of the things that we taught in the course was how to get leads. And one way you get leads, very easy, is you set up a body fat testing booth. You can set it up in businesses, use calipers, because it gives you time to talk to people. And you have a chart that tells people different body fat percentage rate. And it's people want to test their body fat. And it's a great way to converse with people. And we talk all about in the course how to use it, how to, how to convert whatever. Anyway, um,

Starting point is 00:53:25 rich Gonzalez and our forum, um, posted about it. He did it. And, um, he's got seven appointments, seven appointments. Boom. Right away. Seven appointments for, uh, for sitting about a body fat testing booth. And he did this in a, I think it was a supplement store. Yeah. At vitamin shop, you know, and smart connect this to the talk that I did on the three free day training that we put out there of understanding how many people you need to connect and how many appointments you need to book to just decide like how much money you want to make, which is like one of the things

Starting point is 00:53:57 that I was always fascinated that no trainer knew. Like I go around talking to these trainers or back when I used to inherit staff. If you do a good job, I'll tell you right now with those numbers if I booked seven Assessments from a body fat test booth. I could pretty much guarantee that would turn into at least two clients That's it too right there boom two clients from what probably took them an hour There's probably an hour body fat test well, I think it's just trainers are kind of

Starting point is 00:54:22 There's probably an hour body fat test. Well, I think it's just trainers are kind of throwing spaghetti on the wall and they're not really focused on like, I can really make predictable income, especially if they're outside of like the corporate gym setting, they're getting a paycheck. It's really difficult to make predictable income unless you have systems like that that you're teaching like, here's as many appointments that you need to book, you know, because the average is going to be this amount. And then now you can, you know, accurately sort of like structure that for your month. So the income can keep coming in. You have to keep doing it because that dries up and then you're left with whatever you have client-wise.

Starting point is 00:55:01 I think the biggest problem is that we've lumped trainers into the health space because technically they are. And when you think about health professionals, doctors, nurses, physical therapists, people like that, you don't think about sales and the importance of that as much. It's more around education and experience. And so, since the beginning of time that trainers have existed as far as the market is concerned, the emphasis has always been put on education. It's always been put on how many certifications, do you understand biomechanics, do you understand

Starting point is 00:55:36 nutrition, and you know, you would tout your certs and your degrees and all that. It's been heavily weighted on that. Now the irony of that was all the hundreds of trainers that have worked for me in the decades that we worked as, you know, managers in the fitness space, the trainers that were the most successful were not the most educated. They weren't the ones with the most certifications. It was the ones that could effectively communicate or sell the best, sell themselves the best, were the most successful trainers yet no courses, no certifications. Nobody puts emphasis on that, that part when it was the most important thing.

Starting point is 00:56:14 And so I think that that's where we've missed for so long in the space. Obviously why we, we tried to fill this gap. Our goal was not, are we going to try and compete with NASM or NCSF or these other national certifications? No, it was, there's a need in the market for somebody to teach these trainers how to build and scale a business and nobody is really servicing that market. Not like what we thought needed to be done. And I think that was the vision here.

Starting point is 00:56:38 And to your point about the forum, this is also why too, in the four, this forum, I plan to share more of the behind the scenes of the business, the numbers, the mat, like what happens when we launch a program? How much does it sell and what did it cost us to build that? And oh, when we do this webinar, like how many leads do we get from that? Because that is the part that I felt like not a lot of people share that. And I want to be able to share that with that community. So they have insight to even how we're figuring how we figured things out to get here. Yeah, if you want to be able to share that with that community. So they have insight to even how we're figuring, how we figured things out to get here. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:57:06 If you want to learn, that's at mind pump fitness coaching.com. And by the way, we're, I want to mention this too, we're going to be at the Arnold, the Arnold classic, that whole festival there. And if you're a trainer or coach, please come and say hi to us and stop by. And I think we're going to try and schedule a talk, right? Yeah. They were trying to nail down a local gym that we can use, that I hope meet with trainers.

Starting point is 00:57:27 And I would love, yes, that's what I would love. Talk to trainers. We will, we will. So if you're, if you're planning on being that, I think March 1st through the 3rd or something like that. Second March 1st and 2nd. Okay. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:57:36 So you could, and for the Arnold classic, it's Arnold sports.com. If you want to find out more about that. And yeah, at the Arnold classic Classic and then between now and then we will drill down a day in time where we'll get access to a gym that we can use where we can meet and greet with people. Totally. Look, children's vitamins are typically just candy. Okay. They're gummy candies with a little bit of nutrients put in there. Anyway, there's a company called Haya that makes a multivitamin that doesn't have a bunch of sugar. It's not candy. And it has adequate doses of nutrients that your children need. It's the best multivitamin that doesn't have a bunch of sugar. It's not candy and it has adequate doses of nutrients that your children need. It's the best multivitamin for kids you'll find anywhere.

Starting point is 00:58:09 Go check them out. Go to hyahealth.com. That's H-I-Y-A health.com forward slash mine pump. And on that link you'll get 50% off your first order. All right, back to the show. Our first caller is JP from Canada. JP, what's up man? How can we help you? Hey, bonjour guys. How are you today?

Starting point is 00:58:28 We're good. Good. Yeah, thank you very much for taking my call. And everybody's always being very impressed seeing you guys. So I'm going to try to lie today and not act impressed. But I have no choice else. I'm going to lose all my English today. No worries. All right. So I'll go ahead with my question. I sent via email

Starting point is 00:58:50 My question today is about my week squat Why week? Well, if I can't squat it I can bench it and I'm totally not a strong bencher Every time I'm trying to go over a hundred pounds issues appear Every time I'm trying to go over 100 pounds issues appear, it usually manifests itself by like a short electric shock in the lower back, like the muscle close to the spine. After that, I'm going to be stiff like in the lower back for a couple of days when you try to get up from a seated position, it's always very stiff. So I can squat heavier even when no pen manifests. I try maps reds many times and usually the same story. It's no game. So I went on an hunt to find a problem.

Starting point is 00:59:32 Is it recruitment and balance, form, ankles, hips, wishcraft, I heard them all when asking around. I tried diagnosing the issue going back to maps prime that I bought years ago. I have a Nubius fail in zone three coming from the bot wing at the bottom of the squad, so I'm losing contact from the poll when doing the test. With that, I'm trying adding primer exercises to my routine like 1990s, but with not much improvement. Prime has a lot of options outside primers and plenty to select from. So

Starting point is 01:00:06 not being a professional, it's hard to pick the right stuff and there's like a certain limit to self-dienosing. Also from the buckwheat buttowing problem, I listened to the Glutes Mastercraft. One thing that struck home when listening to the Glutes Masterclass is about the Glutes engagement during the big lift. Thinking back to my squad, I usually feel most of it in my legs, not in my butt. So having a relatively flat butt, I thought maybe there was something there. And finally, I purchased symmetry thinking that maybe this was an issue from from to back that maybe symmetry could address. So that's the reason why I purchased this program. supersymmetry could address. That's the reason why I purchased this program.

Starting point is 01:00:44 What's changed is my question. I did purchase Maps Prime Pro to investigate a little bit more. There's great stuff in there, but I think I just added more variables into my investigation. Now everything looks wrong, so I don't know where to look at. I've just completed Maps Symmetry, and completed my Fade 4, the 5x5. I do feel a little bit stronger doing that program,

Starting point is 01:01:11 but also feel like I'm on a thin line that everything could fall apart from there, and maybe I'm not that strong. And finally, I know as you guys launched Maps 40 Plus not long ago, and I'm actually'm 43. So I think you guys have a different approach to squatting from this program maybe to learn from there and not doing the full movement. So with all that I'm kind of scared to put weight on the bar. I have some ideas of what's happening but there's a lot of variables, a lot of things that can happen. I think

Starting point is 01:01:43 that can go wrong. It's getting like pretty confusing from there. Okay. Okay, before we answer all this, are you hanging upside down right now? I just have to... It looks like the ground on the ceiling. You're ceiling. I'm very confused.

Starting point is 01:01:56 Oh yeah. I have some... Okay, yeah. Some things to improve the sound in my room, because there's a room just upstairs, and it was really noisy. Nice. It's a very small room here, so the sound is bouncing everywhere. So yeah, it looks weird, but I can flip. But yeah, it was like spinal traction. All right. So, okay, so it's a shooting pain that you feel in your low back. And does it? Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, the move the movement is fine. I can I can squat deep and go up But a certain moments gonna like like pinch and and really get that moment. That's a nerve

Starting point is 01:02:33 So you might have an impinged nerve. Have you ever had a back injury or have you ever been told you have a slip disk or Honeated disc I Had like a small very small area the lower back, like 10 years ago. And we were able to fix it, doing some physical therapy and some traction, to try to pull it back inside. So that went well during this process. Since then in the last 10 years,

Starting point is 01:02:58 I've been using a standing desk, I've been trying to avoid sitting position and give me all the chance to not use my back poorly. But in that movement, and even sometimes when doing good mornings, I could, it's like very risky that I get hurt doing those movements. Yeah, there's the excessive pelvic tilt.

Starting point is 01:03:17 I mean, it could, but there's an impinged nerve. So, okay, so when you feel a zing or electric or heat or like a shooting, shooting sudden shooting sharp pain, that's a nerve. So it's not muscular. There's a nerve that's being impinged. It could be the herniated disc. So the physical therapy, you want to do some physical therapy to help alleviate whatever is being impinged.

Starting point is 01:03:42 In the meantime, I don't think you should do any bilateral loaded exercises. I don't think you should do good mornings. I don't think you should do dead lifts. And I don't think you should do squats because the nerve is being impinged. And if you impinge the nerve hard enough, that's not, you don't want that, okay?

Starting point is 01:03:58 So we want to identify where the impingement's happening and then do physical therapy specifically to help with that. Now, did you work with a physical therapist 10 years ago? Yeah, we did. We did a couple of treatments, different treatments to make sure that everything was going fine. And I didn't have issues until then, but that being said, before doing maps read and everything, I used to do a lot of body weight stuff. So I think you can get away with stuff when you just only do body weight. But when I start putting some weights on, that's where it kills very, because you're loading, yeah, you're loading the spine. And if, so if the spay,

Starting point is 01:04:34 if your nerve is like almost impinged and you add a little bit of movement and it pushes on that nerve, um, then you're going to feel it. And it's going to feel like, like you just said. So, um, are you familiar with L doha? No, I'm done. Okay. We're going to send you a link to a YouTube video that I did a long time ago with L with a, uh, an L doha specialist. So this is traction through using the, the fascia of the body.

Starting point is 01:05:00 And it's quite effective. You do it on yourself. Yeah. You do it on yourself. It's very effective at spinal traction. In the meantime, I would only do unilateral exercises. And so symmetry is a great workout for you to continue to go through.

Starting point is 01:05:13 And I would not do the last phase. I would skip the last phase and continue to go through map symmetry. In the meantime, I would search for a specific diagnosis so you can address this issue. Otherwise it's, otherwise you're playing with it. Yeah, you're gonna be playing with fire. How good are you about being consistent

Starting point is 01:05:32 with training like your core and abs? I am, carefully doing symmetry. Symmetry was three days a week and I used the other two days during the week to do ab training and a little bit of lower back. Okay. Yeah, I would like you to do more like counter rotation and stability exercises for your core. Yeah, to prevent that impingement because lumbar flexion like you're going to get from ab exercises totally fine unless there's a herniated disc and you're moving it away, that might not be appropriate.

Starting point is 01:06:07 So like, I would go, I was thinking no BS six pack abs. So you have the hip flexor deactivator in there, you have exercises in there that you do, but because of the lumbar flexion. And if this is indeed what I think it is, I would want to stay away from any type of fatigue around lumbar flexion because yeah, just just a little off, you know, which would be fine for most people. And I say off, what I mean is a deviation, right? Slight deviation is going to call it could potentially cause you problems.

Starting point is 01:06:32 So I would seek somebody to do physical therapy, map symmetry, seems to be fine. Don't do the last phase and then watch the L doha video and practice that, that, that traction on yourself. So what traction essentially does is it opens up the space between the spinal column. Now, the reason why Aldo is what I prefer over like an inversion table or something like that is because you're using your body's own strength and support to create traction. You're not just using gravity. It's not passive. It's active. In other words,

Starting point is 01:07:04 two more questions that I have one. Um, did you ever play with elevating your heels when you squatted? No, no, I don't. I've been, I've been running before I was, I was a long distance runner runner. And I did the long of a lot of barefoot running and, uh, not, not elevated shoes. So I always have plain shoes. I don't have anything elevated. I know some people told me maybe you should elevate the ankle. So it might solve the butt wink a little bit, but I didn't experiment with it yet. Yeah, that's why I'm asking that. And which would,

Starting point is 01:07:40 by the way, that leads to that it could be ankle mobility that would be causing the wink, right? So and the wink is just making the issue. It doesn't solve if it's a nerve issue like Sal is alluding to. It doesn't solve that, but it definitely will make the squat safer. Yeah, safer and more comfortable. So that was, and then the other question I had, like, when you do like Bulgarian split squats, how does that feel like? Do you do those ever? Have you done those? Yeah. Well, I think there were a couple in symmetry. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:08:08 And, and, and those feel fine. Okay. Uh, I think since it's a new movement, maybe I'm a little bit more aware of what's happening and I'm trying to do it right. Whereas squat, I've been squatting a lot, but probably, probably not squatting perfectly. So I probably was getting away with things that I'm not now. But yeah, the other other movement are fine.

Starting point is 01:08:31 For deadlift, I bought myself a trap bar. So I'm doing deadlift with those and those are doing fine. But it's really the squat and good mornings that are more dangerous movement for them. Yeah, like I said, I would avoid bilateral loading of the spine for now until you can get an, an accurate diagnosis. And then in, in, in, in the meantime, stick to, to map symmetry phase one through three. J.

Starting point is 01:08:57 Oh, go ahead. Go ahead. Go. I just got 40 plus. Should I do that also? Or should I go back to the symmetry? Stick with symmetry for now. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:09:04 Yep. Yeah. For now. So you JP? Are you already in our forum? Yes, I am. Okay, good. Yeah, just keep us updated. So just give us an update on the feedback you're getting and what's going on. And then we can kind of say you have most all of our programs that we would recommend you to get. So we can just kind of as we go through the process, give you advice, you which direction to go from there. Okay. And I was wondering about old time string. Is there stuff in there that could help me

Starting point is 01:09:33 with those issue without loading the bar? Not yet. Eventually yes, but not yet. Yeah, we got to figure out, let's get an accurate diagnosis. And then when we're ready to load, you know, substantially, that would be the direction for sure. All right, makes sense. All right. Quick closing comment before I go.

Starting point is 01:09:50 I've been recommending your programs to my family, to my friends around here and everybody that talked to is enjoying it and they listen to the podcast and they really love it. But everybody around here and I know it sounds from my accent that we are all French speakers. Some people have English in second or third language. So if ever you guys want to go ahead and work to reach the market and translate your stuff and offer them to other people, just give me a call. It's wonderful programs. People are enjoying it, but I'm playing a lot of translation to help people going through it. So one day ever you want to reach the French market. Let me know.

Starting point is 01:10:31 We're actually having a meeting today. Yeah. Just so you know. We're trying to branch out of it. Yeah. Unfortunately, AI is doing it pretty well. Are you familiar with labs.hagen.com? So labs.hgene.com. Are you familiar with labs.hagen.com? So labs.hgian.com.

Starting point is 01:10:48 Are you familiar with that? Uh, I'm not sure. No. Yeah. Check it out. So we're okay. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:10:53 Thank you. All right. Thank you guys. All right. You got it, man. See you around. Take these guys. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:10:58 You know, it would be, it's, uh, so valuable for the average person to discern between muscle pain and nerve pain, because both of them, there's some very specific characteristics that come with nerve pain, and it would help. It's elusive if you don't know what those are.

Starting point is 01:11:15 Yeah, so if it's like numbness, tingling, burning, if it's a sharp zing, you know, if it's a pain that radiates and goes up and down your leg or up and down your back like that's nerve pain. And if, if you don't identify it as nerve pain, you know, what you'll do is address the muscle or address the, like, oh, it's my, it's, you know, this part of my body foam, roll it, smash, you know, massage or whatever. But the nerve itself is sending the signal and it's being impinged.

Starting point is 01:11:41 I would like to see the squat because it does seem like, and the good morning is obviously you have an excess, excessive anterior pelvic tilt kind of naturally for most people. And if you already have that issue, it sounds like that's the only thing that where he's feeling this. And so is it possible that it's so excessive that that's what's pinching the nerve? Well, I mean, it's, it's excessive enough to pinch the nerve.

Starting point is 01:12:01 Yeah. That's what I'm saying. But the fact that he said he had a herniated disc, it was like, that was a confirmation. Right, right, so that makes, obviously. His herniated disc doesn't go away. It should still herniated. You just, you end up strengthening support around it. But he should use this time too,

Starting point is 01:12:14 to address one of those things he brought up with his ankles and like the mobility practices. You gotta rebuild those better patterns so that way now, like once that gets addressed, you know, it, at the same time, you'll be able to kind of build better mechanics. Our next caller is Bryn from California. Hi Bryn.

Starting point is 01:12:33 Hi. How can we help you? So I sent over an email. I guess I could just read like kind of my question. I have lost almost 130 pounds in the last year. I had gastric sleeve surgery in May of 2023. And I've lost about 110 pounds or 100 pounds of that since then. I was working out consistently as soon as I got clearance, but just doing like the like, you know,

Starting point is 01:13:06 body pump group fitness kind of stuff. And I knew I wanted to get more confident, like in the weight room section. So I hired a coach and I've been working with them for the last like four months, but they only have me on like 1,100 calories a day. And I'm doing like an hour and 15 minutes of strength training five days a week with 30 minutes of cardio

Starting point is 01:13:28 So I figured that was a little much. So I went ahead and Bought the body transformation and started anabolic this week But I'm kind of like at a loss about like where to go with my macros because I feel like I'm kind of in a unique situation and not like at 1100 calories that's still more than I was eating six months ago. But like, I want to be able to have a little bit more like flexibility in my, you know, calories and stuff. So I just kind of like, where do I go right here? Where do I go from here? Like macro wise? Yeah, well, you got to eat, you're gonna have to eat more, especially if you're strength training.

Starting point is 01:14:07 Yeah. I know. Yeah. You want to build metabolism muscle. You could just slowly ramp it up. So you could go up. You're actually in a pretty good place, by the way. It's not, you're not in a bad spot.

Starting point is 01:14:15 I know it's low calorie, but yeah, I would go up. I would go up 150 calories, keep it there for a few weeks, see how you feel. And then do that again. Bump it in another 150 and then slowly bring it up to a point where you feel. And feel and then do that again, bump it in 150 and then slowly bring it up to a point where you feel and if you're doing good strength training, you're just going to get stronger and you'll build muscle and speed up. Yeah, your metabolism. Now you had gastric sleeve, so you can't eat a lot at one time, right? So you're eating a bunch of small meals. Yeah. And I am required, like I have no problem hitting my protein,

Starting point is 01:14:41 but I do use like, I do have to use like some protein powder or a bar, like I'm out and about a lot. So that helps me because they're small portions, but high protein. Yeah. Why do you use those throughout the day? Why do you want to eat more then if you're having trouble eating more? Like, I just didn't know if I can eat more, but I just didn't know if I I just didn't know if I can eat more, but I just didn't know if I will put on muscle. Like I would like to at the calories I'm at. Oh, yeah. You're going to probably need to eat more to put on some muscle. The challenge with gastric sleeves or bypass or those types of procedures are things like

Starting point is 01:15:19 nutrient deficiencies can sometimes become an issue. Right. And then it can be an issue to consume enough to go in a direction of building or whatnot. So you're probably gonna have to eat like a body builder, meaning like six or seven meals a day and meal prep. Okay. Yeah, I do meal prep now. And I just had all of my labs done, like a full vitamin panel, all that kind of stuff. And I take a shit ton of vitamins every day. So I'm pretty good.

Starting point is 01:15:47 Like all my levels were good with that. So like, I don't know, like, should I just, you know, right now I'm eating like egg whites, should I have more? Whole eggs, things like this. And I'm looking at your fat intake right now and you're barely eating enough fat. Yes, essential. Yeah, you're at 35 grams of fat.

Starting point is 01:16:04 In fact, fat soluble vitamins tend to be the deficiencies that people with gastric, you know, procedures tend to get. If you don't consume enough fat, your body will not thrive. Right. So 35 grams is, I would have you, I mean, no less than 50 grams. Yeah. I mean, you know, that's a result. That's the one drawback of getting your protein source from like, Super lean sources. Yeah, from like a whey or a powder is that a lot of those are really low and fat. And so this is a case where I'd really be encouraging you to do things like salmon, like chicken thighs, like steak, like I'd be pushing you in that direction. That'll naturally bring your fat up and hit your protein. So I'd be pushing you in the protein to obviously keeping you in there. It sounds like you're doing a good job of that.

Starting point is 01:16:49 But because you're having to get some of that from powders, those powders are so low and fat that you're not getting enough fat and that's going to be essential too. So I'm really trying to get you in the direction of, like I said, chicken thighs, salmon and steak would be great sources of protein for you. Yeah, whole eggs. Whole eggs, yes. Are you taking digestive enzymes?

Starting point is 01:17:09 How do you, are you digesting what you're eating? Okay. Yeah, yeah. I take digestive enzymes. Occasionally if I eat something like, sometimes if I eat like, like a dryer meat type situation, like or a lot of just like heavy meat, sometimes I'll take like digestive enzymes right afterwards. I have like some chewable ones that I could take, but I don't take those every day. I did start with seed probiotic after you talking about it. Um, and I take, um, like a bariatric multi vitamin.

Starting point is 01:17:36 I take D Zink, um, magnesium, okay. Fish oil. Yeah. I would. So as you bump up your fat intake, magnesium, official health, calcium. As you bump up your fat intake, I would also take a digestive enzyme with each meal. Yeah, because your absorption is a bit limited. And so breaking it down may pose an issue. And digestive enzymes are beneficial for most people that are inexpensive.

Starting point is 01:18:01 So with every meal, I would take some digestive enzymes as you start to bump the calories up. But I would bump, yeah, I would, I would, I mean, your protein's okay. I would just make your protein sources more fatty. And that should give you, that should give you the 150, 200 calories that we're looking for right now.

Starting point is 01:18:16 And then slowly over time, you can, you can start to bump that up. I mean, there's no reason why you, you can't be at some point around 2000 calories and just feeling strong. Yeah. That's, I mean, that's what I want. Like the bypass was, or the sleeve surgery I had, like I've tried everything

Starting point is 01:18:32 over, you know, so many years to yo-yo and what it did for me, even though, like, yes, it helped my, like, I mean, just physically not be able to eat so much for a while, but like it changed my mindset to where like, okay, this is just how I live now. Right. Like, post to being like on a diet or on a new training program or on a new, like this is just how I live now. Now I have another question. I've have gotten into a good habit about being at the gym five days a week and I

Starting point is 01:18:59 kind of love it. I know with anabolic, I can't, I, you know, I'm not doing, I'm just trigger working, doing my trigger workouts on some of those days. Is it okay to still, because I'm an esthetician. And so at our office, like there's a lot of times I'm sitting down doing facials all day. Can I still on those days do like 20 minutes of like light walking on, like, you know, easy walking. Oh yeah. Walking is great.

Starting point is 01:19:22 Walking is great. Mobility with work would be good. Yoga would be good. Like just, just, yeah. Stuff that's think of, think of things you can do that are recuperative or regenerative. I don't even mind if you walk for like an hour, if you want to. Yeah. You, oh, you can, walking is okay. Getting those steps in like that. Good move, especially if you know, you have a kind of a sedentary job. I'm super pro that just avoid the getting after it.

Starting point is 01:19:44 Stairmaster pushing on on the elliptical, like, yeah. Don't try low level hard. Kind of like where I was at with my last coach, which I'm no longer doing, but like it was like an hour and 15 minutes of glutes and hamstrings. And then 25 minutes of stair master intervals. No. And I would just, God, no. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:20:03 God, no, God, no. Yeah. No, no, no, no, no, no. Yeah. We don't, in your case, we don't have a lot of calories that need to be burning. So, I mean, so the burning calorie approach is a terrible approach for you. We're trying to build muscle. Yeah. All building right now. Okay. Yep. Okay. Yep.

Starting point is 01:20:19 Thank you. Oh, fair way to ask one other question. So I just started doing spots with the barbell like I did my first Preface workout and I missed in the mirror if I like if I really really think about it I could fix it But if I'm just like doing my reps I like my hips kind of shift a little bit on the way down I was able to pass all the compass stuff on the prime But like what is it's a strength. This is asymmetry.

Starting point is 01:20:46 Yeah. It's a strength issue. And I'll say this on all strength training exercises, do not just go through the movement. So it is not cardio. So you need to be every time you do a rep, you need to be thinking very consciously of the rep. Otherwise your body will do what it wants. Lighten the light in the load a tiny bit and go really slow because like you said, you know already, like if I'm aware of it, I won't do it. So stay aware of it and slow it down

Starting point is 01:21:11 even more. And then you'll train it to do it. You'll train yourself to be able to do it right. Yeah. If you do it enough. Your body is just looking for stability wherever it can find it. So it'll go back to the sort of like patterns you've established. So you got to read, readjust your patterns and really focus on dialing that, that in. Brent, are you, are you in the forum? I just, um, just got like, I just did it over the weekend with the discount. So I should be in it today. I just haven't. Okay. Good. So that's the best thing you could do is as you go through this

Starting point is 01:21:38 process is, is just to update us. You can even give it like a lot of people do videos of their squats and movements. So if you have another question like that, um, we've got movement specialists in there like Dr. Brink. And of course we're in there. So definitely a share, share with the community in there. It's been, it's, it's incredible in there. Awesome. Thank you guys so much.

Starting point is 01:21:57 I'm so excited. I found you guys. I was listening like it like really changed my mindset around strength training. So thank you. Awesome. Awesome. Thanks, man. Awesome. Thank you. You got it. Um, boy, I hate fitness coaches.

Starting point is 01:22:08 I hate a lot of them. I don't hate fitness coaches. I love some 1100 calories and they're like, yeah, let's do stair master. Let's burn. And gas. You had gas or sleep. I like you need to burn. I want to listen, listen from now, I'm telling people listening right now.

Starting point is 01:22:22 If you hire yourself a fitness coach and you want to know if they're good or not, ask them if they have our coaching course. That's one way to know because there's a lot of terrible ones out there. We got to standardize this somehow. They're not just bad. That's not just like kind of wrong. It's just the opposite. That's the opposite of what you need to do. It's so frustrating to hear shit like that from people in our field.

Starting point is 01:22:42 I tell you what though, the audience that is on YouTube, we'll get a chance to see because she sent over her pictures. Like she looks great. She's in a great place right now too. I mean, a couple of tweaks like that. Sit simply getting her to eat whole foods and the three main, the salmon, the thighs and fat. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:23:00 That'll bump her fat naturally. That'll increase the calories naturally that, that tip alone and falling anabolic watch what happens. Yeah. That'll bump her fat naturally. That'll increase the calories naturally. That tip alone and fall in anabolic. Watch what happens. Our next caller is Casey from Texas. What's up Casey? Welcome back man. What up guy? Hey guys, thanks for doing this. How you doing man? You got it. What's happened? How can we help you? Not much. So let's see. I'm just going to first give you background. I've been lifting for like 15 years and I just did it thinking that I can't reach any sort of goals because of my genetics.

Starting point is 01:23:35 And then I found Mike Matthews like four years ago and learned about calories and versus calories without the whole thing. And so for the first time, I started to actually read some goals. And so what I ended up doing was hiring a coach to do one-on-one stuff for a year. And this guy had me bulk from 145 to 175.

Starting point is 01:24:02 And I sent you a photo of what that looks like. Yeah, we're looking at it right now All right, cool. So after a year of that I figured I'm just gonna take a break because a lot of it conflicted with mine pump stuff, right? So I'm like, all right, I'm not gonna, you know, keep going with that guy. So from there I've been cutting and You can see where I'm at now. My plan, so the whole reason I'm calling you is this. I'm going to tell you my plan, and then you tell me if my plan sucks,

Starting point is 01:24:30 but whatever you tell me is exactly what I'm going to do for the next five years, whatever. Imagine I'm someone who walks into your gym, I'm a client you know is going to follow what you say to the letter. So here's my plan is to cut down to 10% and then do a bulk to 15 cut to 10 bulk to 15 cut to 10 over and over and over. Adam Finaito. Is that a good plan or no? I mean, generally, let me tell you what I think went wrong with your 54 week bulk. Do you know what your body fat percentage was at the 175?

Starting point is 01:25:06 Honestly, no. I think, yeah. I mean, I think you, I can tell without him even telling us that you, you put way more body fat on than you needed because right now you're, you're, I'm looking, you're at nine pounds different than where you were before the starting point, right? Right. So you put on way more body fat just to add a little bit of muscle and at the end of it, it's going to be like you had to put 30 pounds on just to gain a six, five or six pounds of muscle, which that wasn't necessary. It wasn't necessary to bulk that aggressively. And your your thought process of doing this, go go 15 pounds and come

Starting point is 01:25:43 down 10 feet and doing that strategy where you're doing like, uh, mini cuts, mini bulks, like we like, is going to be a better strategy for the longterm and you'll, and you'll end up building more muscle in my opinion. Yeah. So, so the, the second thing I'll add is I think you should track and it sounds like you're going to track body fat percentage because if the scale goes up, you want to look at the trends and say, okay, you know, uh, I gained 10 pounds on the scale.

Starting point is 01:26:07 Oh, it looks like eight pounds of that or nine pounds of that was body fat. So this isn't really too successful. And typically that means it's your programming. Typically it's a workout programming and the calories might be a little too high. Here's what I think you should, I think, I don't know if a 5% swing back and forth from bulk to cut is going to be the best approach. That's a pretty big swing. What I would probably do is have you bulk up to 13% and then bring it down to maybe 11% or something like that. And you could do mini bulk, mini cut just by measuring body fat percentage.

Starting point is 01:26:42 just by measuring body fat percentage, or you could do a relatively consistent bulk where it's like three week bulk, one week mini cut, three week bulk, one week mini cut. That's another approach that you can do while tracking body fat percentage. How do you know on the mini cut? Cause I've heard you guys talk about the four, one, three, one. How do you know in such a short amount of time

Starting point is 01:27:01 that you've added the correct amount of calories? Cause sometimes, you know, I could add what I think is a bulk, but then after three weeks, I'm like, oh my God, that's more like maintenance. Right? And so it took me and then I'm like, okay, now I'll correct. Now I'm really on a bulk. You know what I mean? That's what I'm concerned about with the three on one off type thing.

Starting point is 01:27:22 That's what I'm concerned about. No, 100%. You go by feel. So if you, let's say you bump your calories up to an amount that you feel as a bulk, here's what you're looking for. You're looking for strength gains. You're looking for better pumps. And maybe the scale moves up a little bit. Remember lean body mass comes on slow.

Starting point is 01:27:38 Okay, so if in three weeks, the scale starts to trend up a pound, then you're probably in a bulk. If you got stronger, then you're probably in a bulk. If you got stronger than you're probably in a bulk. And then I'd cut down from there, maybe 500 calories for a week and then go back to where you were before and then slowly trend it upwards. But you're going to have to go by feel what you don't want to do is look for these huge swings on the scale.

Starting point is 01:27:58 You're not going to gain, you know, crazy amounts of mass on your body in a three week period. It may be like more like it's trending in an upward direction, but you might not see too much on the scale. We've been doing training wise like through all this. So I've done in the last 24 weeks, I've done anabolic advanced twice through. I started to do three times through,

Starting point is 01:28:21 and then I bought aesthetic. And so now I'm on phase two of that. Which of the programs that you've done so far has put on the most strength? I don't know. I mean, honestly, I just go every day and the fact is I've been in a cut throughout every single maps program. So for me, gaining strength isn't what's happening. Is your strength. That's going to be a big difference. Are you somewhat stagnant in your big lifts?

Starting point is 01:28:47 Well, yeah, because again, I've been in a cut like throughout every single week of any match program, I had been cutting a bulk and power lift. Yeah, let's have you. I would measure your strength. That's actually not a bad idea with Justin. Yeah, a map power lift might be a good program for you. It'll get outside.

Starting point is 01:29:02 Yeah, you just need to shake it up. Yeah, I want to see stimulus. You want to see strength gains. If you're trying to gain muscle, you want to see strength. I actually, okay. But shouldn't I cut down to something first? No, no, no, no, you're fine, bro. You're lean enough that you'll, so you know how you said, like, it feels like

Starting point is 01:29:16 sometimes you're going to make it. You are, that's part of like, when you do a good job of just being in a nice light bulk, the reality is we know that there's going to be some of these days where you actually might be a little bit in a deficit. That's how people actually lean out sometimes in a bulk. Is there a building muscle? And as they build muscle, their metabolism speeds up, and that naturally kind of leans them out in that process.

Starting point is 01:29:36 So it's not as cut and dry as, oh, I'm at this many calories. Therefore, I'm always in a bulk versus I'm not. It's this kind of ebb and flow, especially when you're right where you need to be of this natural. Oh, sometimes I'm going to be cutting a little bit of calories without moving my calories, just naturally with my metabolism. Other times I'm going to surplus and I'm going to build and gain muscle. So with your how lean you already are, even though you're not at your most shredded, but you're lean enough that I don't have to worry about body fat or that much. I would I would love to see you run the power lift program primarily in

Starting point is 01:30:08 a bulk. So find a calorie somewhere in your calories that you're not losing weight, right? So whatever that number is, you know where you're at right now? calories. 1900. Oh yeah, we need to be way higher. Well, you're at 3,100 for that big bulk, right? Yeah, we don't even go that high though. No, I would go 25.

Starting point is 01:30:23 Yeah. I'd go 2,500 do maps, power lift and, and, and get strong. And this is what we're going to do. Okay. Cause you, you have myself so you can, you can text me as we go through this process. Okay. So I want you to follow the 2500, go through power lift and I, and I, I would, if I wasn't talking to you, I would say every third or fourth week, we would interrupt it with

Starting point is 01:30:42 like a small mini cut, but since you can talk to me, every like couple weeks, give me an update on what's going on with the scale, weight, and your strength. And then based off of that, I will tell you like, okay, let's run a week cut. So for now, stay in the 2,500 calories. We may not even have to necessarily do a actual cut with you because you're lean enough already and we're not going to boost your calories all the way to 3000. You're doing a new stimulus to Justin's point with power lift and focusing on that. We might just slowly increase your calories and you, what you might see is I get you to 2500, then we go to 26, then we go to 27 to 20 and you get lean

Starting point is 01:31:17 while we go through the process. You know, are you at 10% right now? I mean, if, if they sent you the most recent picture, cause I actually sent one yesterday. Oh, Doug, you got that? No, I didn't. I didn't have the red arrows. We got the one, we have the three. We had the, the, the start, we had the big bulk and then we have the initial like cutting.

Starting point is 01:31:39 Do you know where you're at now? What body fat percentage? You have an idea? I would say 14% maybe. You look lean or not. Yeah, there's no way. Yeah, you're at now, what body fat percentage? You have an idea? I would say 14% maybe. You look leaner. No. Yeah, there's no way. Yeah, you're leaner. No. Oh, that's right. Okay. Honestly, I don't know. I'm going to do the, uh, the whole bioelectric impedance just to,

Starting point is 01:31:56 you look hungover in the last picture. Good. Well, it's, you know, first thing in the morning, dude, just to track, just to track the, just to track the, um, the ups and downs. What do you call it? Where the numbers not accurate, the trend, the trend out of my just sent you what I look like today. Yeah. Yeah. That was the comment about looking hung over. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're good. You're good.

Starting point is 01:32:19 Anyway, so if you think I'm leaning up to start a book now, that's great news. I can in this call and go eat another meal cause I'm dying for it anyway. We're gonna get you, you gotta get strong. You gotta get strong. A bulk without strength game is fat game. And strength is one of the best, best, best, best.

Starting point is 01:32:34 It's not perfect, but it's one of the best metrics of whether or not you have good workout programming. What you don't want to do is get caught up in the like, I go to the gym and just do the exercises while I manipulate my diet type of that. That's like a pre contest bodybuilding approach, which is terrible long term. Mike, my goal for you in power lift is to, is to get strong as fuck and not put any fat on.

Starting point is 01:32:55 I don't care if the scale goes up a little bit because then maybe we built some muscle and I don't care if it stays the same per se. So long as we're building strength. So I may just keep increasing calories all the way through powerlifts. So start at the 25. We're going to send over the power lift program to you. So you have that. And then just keep me updated.

Starting point is 01:33:12 Like say every two weeks, check in with me. Just let me know. Let's do a follow up after at the end of powerlifts. And then we'll follow up at the very end. So we'll do a public one where everybody can hear your story as we go through, but check in with me about every two weeks, give me an update on calories, how your strength is feeling, and then if you have access to test the body fat, that would be really good for me.

Starting point is 01:33:31 Okay, so access as in like go do a DEXA or just the trend. So go do a DEXA. Yeah, I would love for you to do that. That's fine. Okay, if that's easy for you to do that, then the more data I have, the better it's gonna be for me to be able to tell you. Yeah, yeah, so just every two weeks, check in with me on the DEXA and

Starting point is 01:33:49 then let me know how strength is going. Let me know where your calories are. And then from there, I'll tell you what to do with the calories, but we may keep just slowly increasing your calories through that whole program. If all, if all goes well, that sounds great. All right. You got it. Do Adam. Would you would you? Trade coming at this point. Oh hell no, bro. What are you kidding me right now? I know you're watching him right now You have to train good for good. Oh, no way Last six games averaging over 20 points the last 20 something games after over 10 points He's now driving to the lane putting his shoulder down. All right So Sal here's the deal these warrior food. They want a good player, right?

Starting point is 01:34:29 Soon as one of their good young players is good. They're like, well, we can't trade him It's like how are you gonna get someone good if you don't trade someone good? You're all delusional I'm not letting go of them. I'm not letting go of them. Get out of here. I'll give up clay first. All right, man All right, okay, so I'll talk to you later. Okay. Okay. See you guys. Thank you. You got it. Yeah. Podcast. Yeah, bro. He's a killer. He's a huge YouTube. Oh, I see. Yeah. Yeah. He's so he used to be a, uh, uh, like a sports announcer on TV. Oh, all right. And then he's, and then he did his own thing. And so he's got it. What's it? It's AM hoops. Is this YouTube channel? I don't know. Oh at Andrew's pulling it up right now.

Starting point is 01:35:05 I tell you though, if you're bulking and your strength isn't going up, like you're gaining body fat. That's a strength has got to be tied to the bull. Well, you see what? It looks like that from this picture. Oh yeah. You see what the guy put them on way too many calories. The guy needs to build a base, like a real solid muscular base.

Starting point is 01:35:21 Yeah. And so to just focus on that for a while is going to do them way better. Cause then it's not to do them way better. Cause then it's not like this yo-yoing back of like the calorie game. My prediction, if we do it right, is he'll be able to run through maps power lift, which was a great suggestion, Justin. And he just is actually increasing the whole time. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:35:37 You can see his lifts go up a lot. Yeah. And hopefully he like slowly leans out while getting stronger. And at the end of it, he'll be, he'll be be leaner eating more calories and stronger than he's ever been and even though he might not be as shredded As he's been before that'll be okay. He'll be at such a great base. We'll be at 30 can manipulate. Yeah We'll be at 3,000 calories. We can come down to 2,500 like we had the beginning and then he'll get super shredded so Our next caller is Marco from New York. Marco. What's happening? How can we help you? Hey guys. Hey guys, how are you?

Starting point is 01:36:06 What's up? Thanks for having me on. I've been listening to you guys for many, many years. I'm a huge fan because I love that you talk about fitness, but you bring in different topics like science peptide therapy and recently stem cell research. So it's cool to get a holistic approach to everything. So thank you for that. You got it. I appreciate it

Starting point is 01:36:26 So in short about me, I'm a New York City firefighter 59 and about about 180 pounds. I've been training for roughly Three years and I've ran the RGB bundle as well as maps power lift so, you know recently I've been just in an effort to scale and You know appropriate my training recently I've been just in an effort to scale and, you know, appropriate my training. What I've been doing is undilating my periodization. So I've been running, like, for example, 10, 8, 6, then I'll run a D load and then 8, 6, 4, I'll run a D load and progress until I hit a new one rep max. So just in short, my one RMs are 385 for back squat, about 445, maybe a little bit

Starting point is 01:37:08 more on the deadlift, 225 bench and 155 overhead press. That being said, I made majority of this progress while progressively cutting. Oh, wow. Yeah. So my biggest question, the concern that I have is I've developed a decent level of strength But I've never it's been over the course of the years I haven't developed that net level of muscularity that I'm searching for it's like that dent not I know It's not gonna call density, but like that thickness or that solid look So I'm just trying to get a better idea of how I can continue to approach that bro We need a bulk. Yeah bulk time to bulk. Yeah, well how what's your body fat percentage all that strength do you know so I was

Starting point is 01:37:48 it I was about 160 pounds roughly 10 11% body fat and this off season I did bulk slowly for about six seven months so like I said I'm about 180 pounds now I think I'm somewhere in the neighborhood of 18 to 20% okay you need to 20%. Okay. You need to cut that. Yeah, you need to cut the number. So when you get lean, that's what gives you that hard kind of dense look. By the way, you said you put up here that you do 60 body weight pull ups? In a row? No, I could do my body weight plus 60 pounds.

Starting point is 01:38:18 Oh, okay. Holy shit. That's a lot of pull ups. Yeah, I wish. Yeah, no, you got to just go back on a cut. I mean, you know, it's interesting when you get lean, how much bigger you tend to look and the density and the definition really starts to show up.

Starting point is 01:38:30 So I would go back on a cut and kind of aim back down towards that 10, 11% and make it a nice, nice slow, even cut while trying to maintain a lot of the strength gains. Cause you're really strong. You're doing great with your lifts. Yeah. Where's your consistent core can take right now? Right now I've been tracking a lot less loot. I mean a lot more loosely, but it's definitely over 3000 calories Yeah, yeah when I was cutting I started at roughly 2400 and then you know towards the end when I was weighing 157 To 160 was about 2000 to 1800

Starting point is 01:39:00 I got a little bit more aggressive trying to get into that single digit, but my body was kind of starting to push back So I knew it was time to you know take a break I would do a cut I just wouldn't do a really aggressive one Maybe somewhere around 26 or 2700 to start. Yeah, and just see how your body responds to that before you drop any lower Let's see what happens there and then programming. What are we doing right now? Workout? So I typically I really like low reps, heavy weight. That's just what my body, you know, always gravitate towards that gravitate towards rather. So typically I run anabolic,

Starting point is 01:39:33 but right now what I'm doing is it's a bigger lean or stronger by Mike Matthews. But I just wanted to try something new. But typically, like I said, I always run anabolic or I'll always go back to that or power lift. That's what I like the most. Yeah, I like either map strong for you or if you want to try something different, old time strength only because of your job. I know you're a firefighter and old time strength is going to give you really crazy funials, really transferable strength. But map strong will do the same

Starting point is 01:40:01 thing. So I like those bigger leaner, stronger is great program. Mike Matthews has, he's got decent programming as well. So, but we'll send you MAP Strong if you don't have that. And I would do the cut. And once you start to feel like your body's resisting again, I would go on a bulk, but I wouldn't go bulk forever. I would bulk until you started to feel good again and then go back on the cut. That's how you get down.

Starting point is 01:40:21 So for people listening and for you, when you start to cut and you start to get to a body fat percentage, where you start to feel that resistance and typically it's anywhere before a man, if they're healthy, you know, once you get to like 10, 9%, you start to feel this kind of like my body's fighting it. Then what you do is you do a little bulk, get up to like 11%, 12%, build some strength and then do the cut again. And that's usually enough to get you passed through that, that, that plateau. Otherwise you got to keep cutting calories to the point where you're just

Starting point is 01:40:49 fighting your body and start losing muscle. I got you. Thank you very much. And then, you know, in terms of doing that slow cut, is there like a certain percentage, like just to get an idea of like what I should be aiming to lose per week? Is it like a pound roughly, or maybe like 1% of my, like overall body weight that you guys run? Honestly, I don't want to see major weight come off the scale. Initially, there's always going to be a little bit of a, like a bigger bump because of the water and the carbohydrates, things like that, right? So after the first week, I don't want to see major drops. I mean,

Starting point is 01:41:19 like a pound would be plenty. I don't, because if we do a good job and we're not cutting that hard, you may actually build some strength in the process. And so, yeah, don't, we're looking at, when we're gonna cut, I'm looking for too drastic of drops. And you don't want to do that. Just keep it to where it's a nice slow gradual. If you have access to body fat testing, I used to aim for one and a half to two percent body fat loss a month. That's what I would aim for. That was a nice consistent, not too aggressive body fat percentage loss on a monthly basis, but it was nice and consistent.

Starting point is 01:41:53 So I'd get tested every two weeks or every 30 days. And if it went down every 30 days, one and a half or so percent or 2%, I was happy. If it went over 2%, I would bump my calories. Okay, understood. All right. And then just if you don't mind, I have one follow up question that relates to my, but so my squat and my deadlift have always been the lifts that I've been able to push and get stronger and a lot quicker. My bench press has been lagging and it's been a lot more difficult to scale it. So I was just wondering if you guys had any tips and it's been a lot more difficult to scale it. So I was just wondering if you guys had any tips

Starting point is 01:42:25 to help progress and I guess 225 is currently my plateaus or the push past that plateau. You've already followed mass power lift, right? Yeah. Yeah. You know what's interesting, we told you to do map strong. So map strong has a very heavy emphasis on overhead type pressing. And that in my experience with people who tend to plateau

Starting point is 01:42:47 with a bench press, who've done powerlifting routines before, that tends to push them over the limit. So I'd be very interested to see where your bench press is post-map strong. So let's see what happens. Yeah. All right, awesome. Thank you guys very much.

Starting point is 01:42:59 I appreciate it. You got it, man. Thanks. Keep saving lives, huh? Yeah. Thank you. You got it. My bench press went up. I got stout, I Thanks. Keep saving lives, huh? Yeah. Thank you. You got it. My bench press went up. I got stottum or what number it was, but I got stuck.

Starting point is 01:43:11 And then my overhead press is what made it go. I'm glad you asked him body fat percentage because I was like, you need a bulk and then he was already out. He doesn't look hard because he's at 18%. No, no, totally. I just, I assumed he was lower because I thought he put in their lower weight. Well, and he was getting strong on a cut and I'm like, wait a minute, like, have you got strong in a bolt? Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:43:27 Yeah. No, that density look that people are looking for is a combination of leanness and muscle fullness. Cause you could also be lean and not look so dense because your muscles are flat. But if you're like lean for men, typically between nine to 11% body fat and you have nice full muscle bellies, you'll, you'll look down. I'm glad you said that cause I'll tell you what, Marco, when you listen to this, the biggest challenge as you go through this process, because you're going to be

Starting point is 01:43:54 in a cut and because you want that full look, you're going to be the, you're going to have the flat look. So you trust the process, right? And that was one of the hardest things for me, you know, cutting for a show was the psychological part of being depleted all the time and training really hard and knowing that I want this big, full, hard look, but you have this, what we call in the bodybuilding with this flat look because the muscle bellies aren't filled up. Just stay the course, trust the process, trust that we know what we're doing. And I promise at the end of all this, you'll be happy with the way you look. That's right.

Starting point is 01:44:27 Look, if you love the show, head over to mind pump free.com and check out our free fitness guides. You can find a lot out there to help you with your fitness goals and it's free. You can also find us on Instagram. Justin is at mind pump. Justin, I'm at mind pump. Just Stefano, Adam is at mind pump. Adam.

Starting point is 01:44:41 Thank you for listening to mind pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbundle at mindpumpmedia.com. The RGB Superbundle includes MAPS Anabolic, MAPS Performance, and MAPS Aesthetic.

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