Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 837: Larry Hagner of the Dad Edge Podcast

Starting point is 00:00:00 If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, MIND, with your hosts. Salda Stefano, Adam Schaefer, and Justin Andrews. So, in this episode of Mind Pump, we had Larry Hagnaron from the Dad Edge podcast. He actually came and visited us. We were on his show, and then he was on ours, and he's got a podcast about how to be a good father, how to be a good man, a good father. I really like this trend that seems to be coming out,

Starting point is 00:00:32 right, with these podcasts. Well, there's a big need for it. You can see that there's a need for this that, I feel like, and he kind of touches on this in the podcast that men just have a really hard time asking for help, you know, admitting they need help. Dude, we know this as trainers, like, you know, how hard it would be for, like, you to get

Starting point is 00:00:50 male clients sometimes because they want to come ask you. And it's even hard for men to just have open conversations with other men other than, you know, extreme situations like you're in war or like, you know, like you're, you're in battle. You're in like, you know, like a sports or drunk or drunk. That really comes out. I love you, man. Yeah, for people to now openly talk about,

Starting point is 00:01:09 I think it's very therapeutic. Well, he does a good job of humanizing himself. By no means is he claimed to be an expert, had been an expert father or have all the answers, but he provides some really solid guess and he kind of rattles off some of the people that he's had on the show. We've got some really good guests.

Starting point is 00:01:25 Yeah, he's had some great authors and great guys and friends of ours. We have a lot of mutual friends. It is interesting, a lot of people who are doing this, these kind of things, these movements, these podcasts about being a better father. A lot of it comes from the fact that they didn't have that role model and he goes into that in his life. And one of the reasons why he started this was to help himself out, help himself grow. He had become a new father.

Starting point is 00:01:45 And, you know, for, it's scary, first of all, it's scary being a parent first time for anybody, male and female. But if you're a man and then you're having kids and you didn't have that strong, you know, positive father role model, I can only imagine how much more terrifying it would be. The part of the, you know, Adam and him actually connected quite a bit over some of that.

Starting point is 00:02:08 Yeah, I think he was surprised by, I think he was, uh, wasn't sure what to ask me because I don't have any kids. That was on his show, yeah. Right, right. And then he led with the, the dogs and stuff like that. But then, you know, there's a reason why I'm not. And those of you as it are, you know, been listening to Mind Pump for a really long time and maybe have not heard that, that, that, I think I

Starting point is 00:02:26 got a little bit deeper on his show. I think you got even more personal, which was great to hear. And I think people would appreciate that to listen to that episode too on his podcast. Yeah, but he's a, he's a good guy, really good guy. He's doing a good thing. He's got great guests on the show. So go make sure, make sure you check out his podcast, the dad edge

Starting point is 00:02:43 podcast. You can also find his website, which is gooddadproject.com, forward slash alliance, that's the Dad Edge alliance. And then on Instagram, it's the Dad Edge, or at the Dad Edge, Facebook, the Dad Edge Group. And that's pretty much it. I also do wanna mention this month, Maps Performance is 50% off.

Starting point is 00:03:06 So this is the Maps program that we originally designed Maps Performance for the functional training CrossFit type crowd. Back in those days, when we first started the show, we would criticize some of the exercise workout programming of CrossFit boxes. People said, hey, if you guys are criticizing it, what would you guys do?

Starting point is 00:03:25 How would you do it differently? And so we had to really collectively put our efforts in that direction of what that looked like. So maps performance is like, you have a solid string component, you have a solid mobility component, you have a stamina component, an explosive power and speed and a jelly component,

Starting point is 00:03:44 it's literally trying to turn you into the ultimate all around athlete. It's a must program for all dads. A lot of rotational stuff going on when you get to pick up kids up off the floor and run around with them kids still and you're a 35, 40 year old drink, right? That's right. You want to be a bad ass. It's a mandatory program. But it's 50% off.

Starting point is 00:04:01 You have to use the code green 50 that's green, the word green, and the number 50, no space, at mindpumpmedia.com. On that side, you can also find a lot of our other programs and bundles. Bundles are where we take multiple math programs and put them together and then discount them, like our super bundle, which is a year of exercise program. So all of that, including math performance at 50% off with the code green 50 can be found at mine pump media dot com and without any further ado here we are interviewing larry hagnor the host of the dad edge podcast ah

Starting point is 00:04:37 oh dude larry can't beat you do this is first day here second Second Again Justin, oh, whatever dude you guys just get used to last place, bro Get used to last place. I'm gonna give you guys as many wins as I can so you feel good about I saw what you did on your Insta story. I mean yesterday with the men's physique pose like the subtle Like a little side like didn Did he really? I was just, just, just, just, you had your shirt on. Did you have your shirt on? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, natural. You guys will show us how awesome I am. Yeah, tell us a story. Okay, so my wife who's in studio with us today, she was like, where are we going? I was like, oh, we're gonna, we're gonna go on mine pump podcast. It's like literally one of the biggest podcasts on iTunes. She's like,

Starting point is 00:05:33 well, have you met these guys? Do you know what they're? I was like, no, I haven't met them yet, but I was like, hold on. So I went, I googled and a picture of Sal came up. I was like, this is one of them. She's like, oh, she's like, I'll sit in for this podcast. That's a lot of blue steel. That's a lot of Photoshop. A lot of Photoshop in that picture. No, don't lie, it's that Photoshop. Although, you know, it's funny.

Starting point is 00:05:56 Sounds a master of lighting. Yeah, in angles. He's like Mr. Angles in lighting. I remember the one of the first critiques that we got after the show had been going for a while. And we talk about, and South shares a lot about being all natural and dieting and eating and overall health, and one of the critiques we got was someone saying that who's the guy with all the animal steroids in the picture because they think he's on steroids.

Starting point is 00:06:18 That's going to be such a rad compliment. No, no, it's just Ravioli's and that is, those are not Ravioli or Ravioli. But so Larry, tell us a little bit about yourself and your podcast. You have an interest in it. There seems to be this growing market for, podcasts and media dedicated to helping men navigate,

Starting point is 00:06:43 what it means to be a man and be a father. Helping men be men. Yeah, and how to be fathers. How's it character? Tell us about how that all started and then I want to ask you, why do you think that market seems to be growing?

Starting point is 00:06:54 Yeah, so I started, I founded the Good Dead project back in 2012 and literally it came out of struggle, like struggle because I struggled just like all of us guys do with fatherhood and you live this quiet life of desperation as we always call it. So 2012 I started that. It was a Facebook page and then 2013 I started the blog gooddebtproject.com.

Starting point is 00:07:20 And then in 2015 I launched my first book, which is called The Dad's Edge, and I also launched the Good Dad Project podcast at the time. And then, I mean, the podcast has been around now for three and a half years in January. I changed it from Good Dad Project to The Dad Edge. It just seemed, you know, from, if we're talking marketing and business

Starting point is 00:07:43 and men who really want to dive into certain content, what I've noticed about men in general is whatever they're listening to, and I'm sure you guys know this, especially men, especially dads, they have to feel cool doing it. It has to be a part of them. If you look at the logo, it's a Spartan shield, you know, and that's what the data edge is. And really that's what we talk about. We help men become better men. And a byproduct is as they become a better father, the byproduct of that is become they become a better husband, they become a better business owner. But that's my

Starting point is 00:08:19 podcast really started because to be honest, I'm just as much of a moron father as the next guy. And I just decided I was like, I'm going to be a student of this. I just want to learn. And the podcast allows me to talk to men who are and guests who are just way smarter than me. So the podcast has really become just a platform of me learning and then sharing what is I'm learning. So when you first started, was it a business strategy to do it or did you look at it more

Starting point is 00:08:51 like scratching your own itch? Like this is something that I, this for that exact reason I can get to touch people that probably wouldn't be in contact. Yeah, like a hobby or yeah, what were you doing previous to me? Well, so I've medical device sales. So I was doing that and it was B. It was really just scratch my own itch because I was just like,

Starting point is 00:09:08 I just wanna figure this out. There was no intention whatsoever of making a business out of it. And I'm proud to say it's thriving now. It's doing really, really well, but it all came out of struggle. You know, a lot of times, like would draw, for example,

Starting point is 00:09:23 what drives a lot of people in fitness, especially people who are in fitness for a long lot of times, like, what drove, for example, what drives a lot of people in fitness, especially people who are in fitness for a long period of time, is because they're dealing with their own either health issues or insecurities. I know motivated me when I first started working out. I was a very skinny. I felt inadequate. So I want to learn how to build muscle. I want to learn how to train and drive those things. Why would drove you to do this for dads and for men? Did you have good role models growing up that were fathers or did you feel like you lacked that and this was something that you wanted to create

Starting point is 00:09:54 for people like who were in situations like your own? Yeah, so I'll share my background because I think it definitely gives a lot of context to what and why. So my mom and biological father were married in 1971. They had me in 1975, nine months after I was born. My mom and dad broke up. They split up and he was gone. When I was four, my mom married my stepdad. I didn't know my father had no recollection of him, whatsoever. And this will be a funny story for you guys. When I was four, I'll never forget this.

Starting point is 00:10:25 So I was in preschool, and I always remember like these guys coming in to pick up their kids, and I knew what a dad was, however, I knew that I didn't have one. So I'll never forget the first time my mom brought a guy home to have dinner with us, and she'd been working with this guy. So this guy walks in, he's got the 1970s, three-piece suit on, the mustache, the briefcase, because

Starting point is 00:10:46 there was no iPads back then or anything like that. Trunch coat comes in and my mom's like, hey, this is Joe. And I shook his hand four years old. I still remember this to this day. I said, are you going to be my dad? No, like, awkward moment for your mom real quick. I just remember like, it just went quiet in the room after that. So, you know, they laughed about it, but a year later, they did get married.

Starting point is 00:11:10 And what I can say about him was he was a very nice guy, probably one of the nicest guys you ever want to meet. However, he had just a dark side. He was a huge drinker, and it was a jekylline-hide situation when he drank. Man, you know, Adam, I know it. We talked before this, and you shared your story. It was six years of absolute hell. Like mental physical abuse, my mom and him beat on each other. He would beat on me.

Starting point is 00:11:36 I was choked and strangled and pushed. Well, we have a very similar story there. And even to the point of what you're sharing right now with how my stepfather, I was seven though, when he came walking the door, only he came in with a mustache in permed blonde hair and rolled up in his irocxy. Oh, and he was a carpenter. Yeah, right, so he was a good looking guy.

Starting point is 00:11:56 And everybody loved him. I mean, and I actually still have a relationship with him today too, so, but he definitely had, I mean, when you meet him, he just seems like an amazing, amazing guy. But him and my mom were just, and what I've grown, and I don't know if you're similar in this way, is, you know, I kind of blamed the both of them, right?

Starting point is 00:12:15 Like, I don't think that he was, as a kid, I was, you know, evil, bad stepfather, you know, and the abuse and stuff. As I got older, I saw that my mom was responsible for just as much of the ugliness and abuse too. And so I think they were just toxic together. They were just awful together, right? I can definitely say that probably about my mom and her relationships that she had because there was always a guy in the picture and it was whether she was married or not. She went on to be married three times total. Every

Starting point is 00:12:42 guy just had his bag of issues, you know, just toxic, alcoholic, you know, it was just, it was, it was pretty chaotic growing up. I always say that half my childhood was spent without a father figure and the other half was spent with with a toxic one. And I don't, I don't say that out of pity. In fact, I give gratitude to my background now just because it's, you know, it was, it was a great learning experience of what not to do. But I will say this, I did meet my biological father for the first time and just for the second time I won't go into how, but I did meet him when I was 12.

Starting point is 00:13:17 And I never had a relationship with him. I had an opportunity to meet him and we kind of hung out for a few months. And then we had a conversation a few months later. And, you know, hey, I'm married again. You know, I have a two year old son, I have another son on the way. My life is complicated. So we ended up going our separate ways.

Starting point is 00:13:37 And that was really tough because my mom had just gotten divorced. I ran into my biological father, lost him again. And then, you know, like I said, my mom married a couple more times, and it was always a disaster. The tail end of this story really started when I was 30. So when I was 30, I had my first son who's 12 now, and I met my biological father again.

Starting point is 00:13:58 It was crazy, crazy, crazy. Like right after you had your kid, or he was 12, you were 12, that's crazy. Yeah, actually. Yeah, well, had your kid or he was 12, you were 12, that's crazy. Yeah, actually. Yeah, well, so yeah, my son's 12 now, but I was 30 when I met my dad, which was 12 years ago, but it was right before, I met him before my son was born,

Starting point is 00:14:14 but I was sitting in a Starbucks with a friend of mine, a coworker of mine, and we were talking about business. And all of a sudden, this guy walks into Starbucks and he caught my eye and I just was like, oh, shit, it wasn't like a plan meeting? No. Oh, get the fuck outta here. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:14:28 Wow, that had to been crazy. It was great, it was nuts. Like, I mean, my hands kind of sweat even kind of talking about it. Wow. But he walked in, I was like, I was like, you're never gonna guess, you just walked in. And she's like, who?

Starting point is 00:14:39 And I was like, that's my father. She's like, your father is in the guy, like you've never known. I was like, it's like in the Starbucks line. Yeah. Yeah. And she's like, what are you gonna say? And I'm like, what is he drinking?

Starting point is 00:14:50 What's his order? Yeah. It's curious. Well, it's funny you say that because like, she's like, what are you gonna say? And I was like, nothing. I'm just gonna take the chicken shit right here and not say anything.

Starting point is 00:15:00 Just let him go on his way. She's like, that's your dad. You're not gonna go say anything to him. I was like, what am I gonna say? I was like, I'm gonna get a white mocha. What are you getting? You know, it's like, there's nothing go on his way. She's like, that's your dad, you're not gonna go say anything to him. I was like, what am I gonna say? I was like, I'm gonna get a white mocha. What are you getting? You know, it's like, there's nothing you really can say. She gets up, goes over to him,

Starting point is 00:15:12 and I'm like, what are you doing? And before I could stop her, I see them talking, and also, I see my dad, like, he's far away, and I see him, like I can read his lips, he goes, where is he? And he started looking around, and he comes over, and I'm like, holy shit, like I can read his lips, he goes where is he? And he started looking around and he comes over and I'm like, holy shit, like I'm like sweating at this point. I'm like, do I leave? Do I go to the bathroom?

Starting point is 00:15:31 Do I run away? Like what do I do? It comes up, he shakes my hand and we start talking. And anyway, long story short, he asked me if I wanted to go out to breakfast later that week and we did. And here we are, 12 years later. And we do have a relationship. And he's still married to the same woman. He was married to back then. He's been married for 40 years.

Starting point is 00:15:51 Now I think I have two half brothers that I get along with great. My kids know him as grandma and grandpa. I mean, I don't call him dad. It just wouldn't probably serve our relationship very well. But we do have a friendship. So, but I say that because when I became a dad for the first time, I was lost. Lost, terrified, zero confidence. No idea what to do. I can honestly tell you I struggled with it for probably nine years. I even struggled with our marriage. I just zero confidence and I did whatever the other guy did.

Starting point is 00:16:30 I sought validation in other things outside of the family. I dove into work because hey, that's where I was doing good. My career was going great. I dove into hobbies. I was in a martial arts big time back then. I'm good at that. I'll go do that. I just, my balance was you know, was completely off.

Starting point is 00:16:46 Now going through that, does that give you empathy for him? And what he went through probably trying to make that same decision around when you were younger, like 12, when you guys read, do you have any empathy towards him or do you still hold animosity towards him? Wow, that's a good question. So what I've done in my mind is there is that part of me, right? I mean, there's, maybe it's the animalistic part of me where I look at how he is with,

Starting point is 00:17:12 you know, my brothers and I'm just like, damn, like, why couldn't we have that growing up and why did you leave again when I was 12? There is that part of me. However, I purposely focus on not thinking that way because I feel like it ruins the present. My dad's 71 years old right now. You know, he's actually in perfect health. Still works, still a business owner. Very successful entrepreneur.

Starting point is 00:17:40 But I don't know how much time we have. So I just want to make the time that we have count, but I will say this, and I've told this to my wife who's here in studio, I don't understand what might have happened there because there's nothing that is that bad that would, I would break ties with my own kids. I think being a father for most men

Starting point is 00:18:04 is when you first become a dad is challenging, scary. You don't know what to do. And the default, at least for me, and I think for a lot of people, the default is when you're in that situation, is you look at the playbook that your dad created for you. Or I had a father that was present. He was very active in our lives. So I got to go back to that default and be like, okay, I'm scared, but I think I know what I'm doing here.

Starting point is 00:18:31 I think I'm gonna do what my dad did because, we had a good relationship, but you didn't have that. And so that must have been much more terrifying for you going into fatherhood. Yeah, we call that the blueprint. Your dad will blueprint either good or bad examples on you growing up and I didn't really have one. I will say this though, I had an amazing grandfather,

Starting point is 00:18:52 like amazing and I think and he was my mom's dad and I think what he was a man's man and he loved my grandmother. Like he was so affectionate, so complimentary, like literally to the day he died. And I got to see that. So that really helped me tremendously. Like my wife says all the time that I love her, like my grandfather loved my grandma.

Starting point is 00:19:15 And he was just very open about it. But yeah, I will say this, it messed with me quite a bit, you know, growing up because I was like, I know my grandpa did, but that was still my grandpa. Like I didn't, I wasn't with him 24, seven. So in certain situations, a lot of situations, I had no clue what to do. And that's what I think frustrated me the most. How important do you think it is for children

Starting point is 00:19:35 to have a male role model to have that father figure? I think it's critical. And if you look at the statistics, I know we were talking about statistics earlier, if you look at juvenile at the link with C, if you look at drug use, if you look at time in jail, if you look at all these different things, anxiety, depression, in the fatherless homes,

Starting point is 00:20:00 those statistics are skyrocketed without that father figure around. Yeah, it's funny when you were born, back in the mid-70s, the single parent household rate, well, they're already grown, it actually had grown quite a bit. I think since the 60s, you started to see that spike, 70s, 80s, it really started taking off. Today, some communities, you know,

Starting point is 00:20:25 as much as 70, over 70% of the households are single parent. Now, that large percentage of that, the majority percentage of that, is a absent father. There's definitely households where the mother is absent, but it's actually quite rare. I mean, I think when you hear about a mom, you know, leaving her kids,

Starting point is 00:20:46 people are almost shocked. Like, whoa, that's crazy and that's weird. When we talk about single parent household, we all automatically assume it's the mom that's hanging around because the majority of the time it is, what's going on? Like why are guys, because that wasn't like that. It wasn't like that, you know, five to six decades ago,

Starting point is 00:21:03 seven decades ago, like men stuck around. We didn't leave, we were there as much as the, you know, almost as much as the moms were. It seems like it's an epidemic that's happening. What do you think is going on with that? So I think if you look, I just had a podcast cast on the talk exactly about this and marriage and why. So if you look at the resources out there,

Starting point is 00:21:23 we have a society of marriage breaking, not marriage togetherness. So like, so for instance, there are gazillion resources out there if you want to end your marriage. That's easy. Right. There aren't that many resources outside of going to couples counseling to make that marriage and that situation work.

Starting point is 00:21:42 So it's just, I think a lot of it has to do with it's the norm now. It's easier. There's resources. It just seems to be what it doesn't work out. So we're on that note, you know, we share a lot on our show. Some of the things that we've implemented into our lives to strengthen our relationships with our partners, you know, and I love that you're open that you've been challenged and you went through this. Are there things that you have now implemented into your life or your routine that help strengthen your guys' dynamic and your relationship that has been a game changer for you that you share maybe on your podcast? So my wife and I? Yeah, yeah, so I try not to fart and then throw the covers over her. That's rule number one.

Starting point is 00:22:24 You old Dutch. It's old you sell it wasn throw the covers over her. That's rule number one. You old Dutch. It's old you salad. That brings us together. That brings us together. That brings us together. So I get teased. This is true. So Katrina and I, seven years together, we don't fart

Starting point is 00:22:34 in the same room. We don't shit in the same room. And it's not like we do. We also don't have kids. You just wait. You wait to have kids. They've been saying that forever. And she's actually, it's crazy, because I've always been

Starting point is 00:22:46 this way. And it's more just that of a respect thing for her. My boys, I love to have them smell my fart, but I think the woman that I sleep with every night, she probably doesn't enjoy this much. She doesn't know you fully at them. Right. She doesn't know you.

Starting point is 00:22:59 Your kids end up farting on her too. We'll see. We'll see. These guys go stand up forever. And her mom actually tells her all the time that, you know, honey, don't let the guys over at my pump tease you about how you and Adam, she's like, that's a very, your father and I were like that our whole life.

Starting point is 00:23:14 And it's kept the relationship sexy and this and that. When you guys have kids, are you gonna watch her give childbirth? Probably not. Oh, really? I'll tell you the thing, because if you do, all kinds of stuff's gonna happen. Things are there. Yeah, I really cousin to say because if you do all kinds of Probably Things are there. Yeah, I really don't have a desire to do it. Oh, wait, I'll see my kid come in like 30 seconds later

Starting point is 00:23:33 Anyways, continue on I just wanted to side note there for you. That's okay that you stop farting on your wife But you get a great strategy that another rule is never never take a shit with the door open just don't do that But okay all kidding aside, one thing that we we can definitely say is and this sometimes goes against what I think married people what they believe because I've put this question out to the community and I've gotten different responses. Are you a parent first or are you a couple first? And one thing that we pride ourselves on is we are a couple first, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

Starting point is 00:24:13 I'm a parent second. And for some people, it's the other way around. However, the way that Jessica and I look at our relationship is we are the foundation of the house. And if we're not taking care of, it's a lot like what you guys do. If your listener, if your client, if your audience isn't taking care of themself, usually it's the other things that go to absolute hell if they're not. And

Starting point is 00:24:32 that's the same way we look at our relationship. You can't you can't pour from an empty cup. Exactly. Good luck. You'll be pouring nothing. You know, exactly. Exactly. And no one wants nothing. Exactly. So that's that's rule number one. The other thing too is we respect each other. So anytime I've known Jess now for 22 years we've been married today, 15 years. Congratulations. Thank you. And we're in the Mind Pump Studio. How about that?

Starting point is 00:24:57 Yeah, it's a cool anniversary. You'll never forget this one. That's right. But we fight, we argue respectfully. So I can honestly tell you, our kids have never seen us raise our voices to each other. When we argue, it is at the tone that I'm using right now, it's the same tone that we use.

Starting point is 00:25:15 We never name call, we obviously never hit. The other night, we were actually sitting outside on the deck and we had a slight disagreement. And we were just talking like this, and my 12 year old goes, are you guys fighting? And I was like, we're disagreeing. I was like, but listen up.

Starting point is 00:25:29 I was like, this is a really good lesson for you. I was like, because it's okay to disagree. It's actually healthy to disagree. However, when you disagree, you don't have to raise your voice. You don't have to call anybody names. You don't have to do any of that stuff. This is the way to disagree. And he was like, oh, okay, cool.

Starting point is 00:25:45 You know, and that's not the way, and I'm sure you're the same way. That's not the way I grew up. I mean, there were pots and pans and crazy stuff thrown like when there was disagreements. I feel like guys, I guess, you either go that way or you go a complete opposite, right? You're exactly right.

Starting point is 00:25:58 Either you embrace that and you think that's normal, which is sad for me because this is what I see happening to my two youngest siblings is they're falling into similar patterns as my stepfather and my mother. The two oldest, I think that we were old enough and wise enough to know that this isn't right, this isn't healthy. And so we've chose, you can just tell by our partners even. And we have like our communication, both my sister with her husband and me with Katrina. I mean, that's like, that's rule number one. Like, you don't raise your voice, you don't speak down to me.

Starting point is 00:26:27 And the real thing behind all the besides all the rules and stuff is, and this is just across, forget partnerships and marriage. Like, this is in life, like communication. You'll never, and work and, and relation friendships and just talking to another person when people are calling names or yelling. You're not listening.

Starting point is 00:26:43 Nobody's fucking listening. So if you're desired outcome, you know, if you and I are having a conversation and my desired outcome is to get you to see my way, me yelling and calling you names will never accomplish that. So if that's my real desired outcome, that is the stupidest way I could go about it. And so I think I tell people that,

Starting point is 00:27:02 regardless if you're in a marriage or not, when communicating and if you're, if you want to be an effective communicator, you have to learn to talk like that. Otherwise, you'll never win. Exactly. In fact, it does the opposite. Right. The total opposite. Yeah. Yeah. So those are the two big things. Those are definitely the two big things. Yeah, we have to take care of our relationship and when we argue, we do it respectfully. The other thing too, this is a big one. We never ever disagree with the other person. So if Jessica is disciplining one of the boys, because I have four boys, because I'm crazy like that,

Starting point is 00:27:38 if she's disciplining one of the boys, and even if I'm like, wow, I really didn't agree with that move, I am not going in front of them. No way no way. And she doesn't do that to me. You know, because I mean, kids are smart, man. They'll play one against the other. So like, for instance, like if they come to me and be like, like mom did, I'm like, if that's what she said, that's what it is. And this, she does the same for me.

Starting point is 00:27:58 And then behind closed doors, you know, she or I will be like, hey, you know, I kind of didn't agree. Never show weakness. And what I mean by that is undermining. Yeah, you guys are a unit. Like, that's it. There's no weakness between us. There's no light between us. So, you got a problem.

Starting point is 00:28:11 You got a problem. You don't want you to disagree with one of us. You're disagree with both. And then you get some more things. Yeah, is there some common themes that create, you know, these sort of things you have to work through? Like, you guys have disagreements about. Like, I know for me and my wife, we tend to find certain themes that create conflict, but we

Starting point is 00:28:30 kind of know how to navigate now when it gets brought up. Is there anything like that that you guys go through? Yeah. I mean, I think there's a few. I have to think about it. We're going to sell her out at home. Yeah. Creating this right now. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:28:45 I know one, and this is why it's such a mind-fuck doing the dad-edge stuff, because like you always talk about how to be more present, how to be more intentional. And then there I am while she's talking to me, all my phone, checking Instagram, she's like, it's a big one. Yeah, even listening to me.

Starting point is 00:29:02 And so that's like a big one. So that's one I always have to kind of keep in check. Like, hey, be here with us. You know, don't be doing your business, don't be doing it. And it really screws in my head because like, that is my business. It's like helping other fathers doing what I am not doing.

Starting point is 00:29:17 Do talk about what a challenge that has to be now, is she on social media? Does she use social media at all? Like Instagram, Facebook and all that? Not Instagram, but she's on Facebook. Okay, so Katrina doesn't, is it on any platforms? Which I think is definitely helped our relationship. Easier that way.

Starting point is 00:29:34 Yeah, it's much easier that it's like, that's my business. Because before, you know, before this happened, before my pump happened, I was never into that stuff. I mean, I think our age group and above is just like, you know, my space was coming in as I was like getting older and, and, to be honest, and no offense to anybody, there's like my jam. When that stuff came out, I already had a bunch of friends.

Starting point is 00:29:54 So I didn't need any digital ones. So I didn't really pay much attention to all those things because I was out doing shit with all my friends in real life that I didn't need those types of tools until we got a business that kind of required that we dove into it. And now I find this struggle of learning to separate those times of, I'm in business and it looks like I'm scrolling on Instagram

Starting point is 00:30:15 and only looking at booty pics and I tell her all the time. It's like, yes, those come in my feet a lot and I do like those. But I am doing other productive things also in there. But so talk about that. Would a dynamic that's been for you guys' relationship because I know that can be very challenging

Starting point is 00:30:31 when somebody has a business is based on social media. It is. So yeah, having a podcast obviously and then having a social media platform, we have what's called the Datage Alliance, which is our mastermind community, which that we use Facebook as of right now to have a forum. So, it's a lot of, I mean, the business, business and social media never sleep because business

Starting point is 00:30:56 is social media, you know, in a space like this. So, it is hard to disconnect sometimes. That is one of the issues that we probably face that Jessica, like she'll tell me about, but at the same time, I don't take it as one thing that Jessica is not, she's not a nagger, like she's just not that way. So when she brings something to my attention, I know it's legit and I need to pay attention to it.

Starting point is 00:31:18 But that is one common theme. It's like, hey, you need to have us time, you know, like put the devices down. That's awesome. You sound a lot like Katrina, that you need to have us time. Like put the devices down. That's awesome. You sound a lot like Katrina, that's kind of how she is. She's not a nagger. So when she does say something, I'm like, oh fuck. Okay, I've probably been a little too consumed with this.

Starting point is 00:31:35 And she's brought it up to me. My girlfriend's business is on social media also. And one thing that we started doing, she started, I thought it was brilliant. So now we both do it. If you're talking to the other person and they start to go on, just stop talking. And then when they say,

Starting point is 00:31:48 well, I said, no, no, no, I'll let you finish and then we'll continue. And it's no anger, no nothing, just focus on one thing at a time, rather than dividing your attention. And it's effective. If she's talking to me while I'm doing that, she'll stop and she'll say, okay, you can finish what you're doing.

Starting point is 00:32:03 And then I'll realize what I'm doing, maybe it's not that important or as important as listening to her. Or maybe it is important, I'll tell her, okay, you can finish what you're doing. Then I'll realize what I'm doing. Maybe it's not that important, or as important as listening to her. Or maybe it is important. I'll tell her, okay, give me five minutes. And so now we don't, rather than dividing our attention, we're much more, I'm a lot more focused. I want to ask you about your transition from medical device sales,

Starting point is 00:32:16 because that's a very lucrative business to be in, and to podcasting, I know for sure, of the first year or two, isn't a very lucrative business. So what was that transition like for you and was that a difficult decision to give up something like that to do what you're doing now and how did that look? Yeah, so I haven't broken free of the full time job yet. Okay.

Starting point is 00:32:41 This will probably be my last year doing this. I could easily break free now, it would be fine. However, we want certain things set, you know, because I think, and this is a good lesson for any entrepreneur. Obviously, there's a lot of entrepreneurs that listen to your show. I believe passion is the fuel, but strategy is the map.

Starting point is 00:33:01 Like you have to have, like I have a ton of passion for what I do, however, you have to have a map and I know exactly what I need to do to get to that point because right now I have five other people that depend on me besides me. And if you have four boys, one of them is always in the pantry. Like our grocery bill alone is out of bounds.

Starting point is 00:33:19 It's crazy. So but I will say this, you know, going from, so it's been a tremendous lesson in business. So, yeah, when I was a podcaster, it's actually the other way. It was money out because I was paying production fees and all this other stuff. Then show sponsors came and then I wrote a book. And then in 2016, we started what's called the Datage Mastermind. And that we had over 200 men go through that 12-week program. Now, we have what's called the Datage Mastermind. And that we had over 200 men go through that 12 week program. Now we have what's called the Datage Alliance,

Starting point is 00:33:48 which is our Mastermind community. And that's just one of a couple of different streams of revenue, are several different streams of revenue we have now. But that's a thriving, thriving, thriving group of men. And I can tell you, trying to build that, navigate that. Yeah, it's been no easy task. I always say, you know, being an entrepreneur is not for the faint of heart, especially if you're a busy father who, you know, people are depending on you. So I haven't made the transition fully yet, but I, the next, I would say probably within

Starting point is 00:34:21 the next six months will be that for you. Scaling a business like this is really challenging. And I think a lot of people don't, I would say, probably within the next six months, we'll be there. Scaling a business like this is really challenging. And I think a lot of people don't, I know, realize it because I think there's a lot of people out there that fake it, that make it look like they take pictures, they rent fancy cars, and they take pictures in front of it, like they're ballin' at a control. And in reality, there's not a lot of money in this

Starting point is 00:34:41 until you do get really, really rolling. Are there some things that you thought would be easier that it'd be more challenging? And what are some of the hurdles that you've had with scaling the business to where it's at now? Yeah, there's definitely been some hurdles, and I will say this, for busy fathers, I feel that the past few years of working the nine to five

Starting point is 00:35:02 while building a business probably speaks to more men than just diving in headfirst or feet first because I do believe you have to be smarter about it, but scaling it, I mean, there's really been not much out there doing how we're doing it. So scaling the business, it's been, I've had to hire business coaches. I've had to put in processes, structure, automation, the whole nine yards to make sure that so like for instance, the majority of my businesses when a new member comes on, you know, a new guy comes on. And I can tell you, if that is not simple, if that's not a simple process for a man, he's not going to do it.

Starting point is 00:35:48 So making things not only very simple, very easy from the customer experience, also very effective for the customer experience, at the same time on my end where I am not working relentlessly because as an entrepreneur, you can work yourself into a low-paying job if you don't do it right. Explain that, was it like so when you first started, was it kind of clunky? If I wanted to join your group or what about that, and I had to jump through hoops, or it was just not a smooth process,

Starting point is 00:36:15 like explain what it was like, and then where you're at now. So in 2016, I ran into a couple of challenges with it. So it was a 12 week, what we called the dad edge mastermind. So what did that mean for me? Every 12 weeks, I had to go out and find new clients, right? And then for my client, that meant that that session was coming to an end and I had clients that were like,

Starting point is 00:36:36 well, what am I supposed to do now? I want to keep going. What do you have for me? And I didn't have anything for them. Not to mention, I don't think Stripe was available then, and if it wasn't, I didn't know about it. So I literally sent out manual invoices. Oh, via Square.

Starting point is 00:36:51 I just had to track everything on a spreadsheet to send out everything, make sure I had certain highlights and colors for guys who had paid and guys who had, it was a nightmare. So I really started, the quality of your life depends on the quality of your questions that you ask yourself, right? So I started asking myself, what can I build that will fulfill the need of a man doing something that we do ongoing? It just doesn't end. And how can I streamline that for him? And then also, how can I streamline all the back work for me? And that's when I thought,

Starting point is 00:37:23 you know, that's when we, we, uh, we can't put the dad edge alliance, which is it's ongoing. It never ends, you know, it's once he joins, he, it gets billed out automatically. It's deductive from his credit card, just simple things like that. The other thing too is there's a lot of things as you guys know, being entrepreneurs that happen, um, behind the scenes, you are the CEO, you're the CFO, you're the sales, you're the marketing, and you're the janitor. You're all those things.

Starting point is 00:37:50 I had a business coach mind, tell me, make a list of everything you hate doing, everything, and all the things you like to do. And then your next step is to hire out everything you hate doing and focus only on the things that you like and only the things that will create value number one for your for your current customers and number two grow it. And that's what I did. So it and it took a lot of like so podcast production right. That's one that's

Starting point is 00:38:18 one I don't even touch that anymore. I record my show. I have a girl who does all my show notes, all my SEO. I have another guy who does all the podcast editing, and it's literally hands off, and it frees up so much mental space, so much time to go out and do things that I really want and need to do. Of course. You know, maybe seven or eight years ago,

Starting point is 00:38:37 I didn't see or hear of podcasts that would focus on how to be a better father or how to be a better man. There seems to be this explosion in the market with, you know, you have people like Jordan Peterson coming out in his book, seems to attract lots of young men. We have friends in the podcast space, like Ryan Michelin from Order of Man, you know, your podcast was very successful.

Starting point is 00:38:57 And others, why do we, why do you think there's this explosion in the marketplace of men seeking out this kind of guidance and information? Men are hungry for it. I mean, without a doubt, but they're quietly hungry for it. If you look at most men, they're not gonna be very outspoken about like,

Starting point is 00:39:16 holy shit, being a father is way harder than I thought. You know, and- Man, don't seek help very often. They don't. They don't. The hardest thing for a man to do is say, I don't know, I don't know. And especially fatherhood is one thing to, you know, to. The hardest thing for a man to do is say, I don't want to, I don't want to, and especially fatherhood.

Starting point is 00:39:25 It's one thing to, you know, to do what you are, do what you do for a living and then seek out coaching for that. I want to make my business better. Help me to do that. Guys will do that all day long. What they won't do is like, I'm not being the best husband right now. I'm not being the best father. I'm not very confident with it.

Starting point is 00:39:41 I lose my temper. I lose my patience. I need to be better at it, but I'm sure as hell, I'm not gonna ask for help for that because then I'm gonna look like an inefficient father. I'm gonna look like an ineffective father. It's gonna be a mark on me as a guy. Do you think there also may be because a whole generation now of men

Starting point is 00:39:58 has grown up now without male role models and without father? Because this has always been a challenge, right? Man, I've always been wanted to be better men, better fathers, better leaders and providers. But do you think now, it's now today, maybe there's just more men now who've grown up without that and just they need that guidance.

Starting point is 00:40:16 It seems like there's a bit of a crisis of, the crisis of masculinity, if you will. Yeah, so the crisis of masculinity, it's a huge hot topic right now. I think more men are We see more engaged men in this particular generation than I think in the other generation You know, and yeah, I think that there's a lot of validity to do that because Guys, you the grew up without a father or they grew up with a father that maybe wasn't Emotionally there. He just kind of went went out and did the work came home very few

Starting point is 00:40:44 I mean very few guys that I talk to, you know, it's, I mean, the numbers are staggering, but there, very few guys are like, man, I had the best dad. You know, he was awesome, and I just want to be like him. It's usually the other two. So now we, we're seeing, I think, more that hungry man, who's like, this stops with me, like this pattern stops with me. I am going to be a better father, and it's going to start with me.

Starting point is 00:41:05 And I think that's what you're seeing now. How do you coach on that? What are the things that you talk like? What does it mean to be a great father? What are the things that you talk about with your podcast and your mastermind? Yeah. So we focus on five dimensions of basically what affects us is men. We have our financial dimension,

Starting point is 00:41:22 we have our health dimension, which includes physical, mental, emotional, spiritual health. We also have the relationship with our wife, whether we're together or not, relationship with our kids, and then what we do for a living. And what I have found is that those five dimensions affect a man in a very profound way.

Starting point is 00:41:43 So like for instance, and what I have found is most men are doing pretty well in one or two of those. And then a three of them, they're not doing so well. So like we'll take a guy who's ripped, he's fit, man, his health is in check, he's got confidence, but he's broke. And because he's broke, it's adding so much stress

Starting point is 00:42:00 and pressure to his marriage. Because there is something very real about financial intimacy, that's a real thing. And then we'll have guys who are like, man, they're just, as you were saying earlier, ballin', right? You know, they're making tons of money, they're traveling, they, you know,

Starting point is 00:42:14 they're just making a boatload of money, but they have zero relationship with their wife or kids. Like, they haven't had sex with their wives in six months, you know, their kids barely know them. You know, things like that. But financially, they're doing great. So what we see is, we have to figure out first, what dimension are you struggling in, and which one are you thriving in? Because that's what we want to give to men. It's like you want to give them the keys to the dimensions that they're not doing so well.

Starting point is 00:42:43 One of the most common dimensions that you're finding. Well, first of all, before you go that direction, I wanted you to explain financial intimacy. That sounds interesting. I've never heard anyone say that before. That means you have sex and a pile of money. That's going through my head, right? It's just like Scarface.

Starting point is 00:42:57 Yeah, Adam's like, I do that all the time. Right, I knew I was on track. Yeah. We're at the $100 bill go, babe. Mind pump media TV, there's a on track. Yeah. We're at the $100 bill go, babe. Mind pump media TV. There's a private video. Yeah. So financial intimacy.

Starting point is 00:43:09 So 50% of all divorces are caused from financial distress. So there, and here's the other thing too. Were you guys taught personal finance growing up? Nope. Nope. It was not. I was taught to save.

Starting point is 00:43:21 I came from a very traditional old school, a time and family. So it was like three of the money in the bank. That's it. Right. Yeah. Three. Don't spend your money. Which is better than most people. Yeah. I got nothing. Yeah. But I don't know how to invest. I don't know what interest rates were, credit cards, how they work. Yeah. I got to buy, you know, investment. I got to set up with loans. Yeah. Yeah. That was great. Thanks, mom. Exactly. And that borrow everything. Right. Yeah, so none of us growing up were ever taught personal finance ever. You know, so if you think of being a father, being a mother, you're learning that on the

Starting point is 00:43:53 fly, right? They're like, oh, yeah, here's your kid. Best of luck. Same thing with finances. Now you have to navigate the world of finances. And if you're looking at the Joneses, you know, that everybody's buying their new cars, their big houses, their this, their that. You have no idea what's going on behind the curtain, but what you do know is like, oh,

Starting point is 00:44:08 it's the American Dream. We just take out a loan for everything. And people are floundering in debt. I just heard a statistic I had, Jesse Mekamon, who is the CEO of Wine App, which is you need a budget. And he's got an incredible business. But the majority of 50-year-olds, the statistical blow your mind, the majority of 50-year-olds, the statistical blow your mind, the majority of 50-year-olds have an average of $50,000 in retirement.

Starting point is 00:44:33 And it's not because they haven't been saving. It's because they slowly take out of it year after year after year to keep up with their spending. So financial intimacy is, if you think about it, creating a vision for what you want your life to really look like if money was not involved. And then understanding, well, what do we want our money to do for us? And then almost deploying every dollar as a soldier, as what do you want it to do for you and how do you want it to work for you?

Starting point is 00:45:02 Like so for instance, Jessica and I, we're on the same page financially, we're like, we don't give a shit what car we drive because we know it's gonna be filled with goldfish and furios and mud and all this like wrap. That's some real stuff right there. Oh, it's nasty. Four boys, I mean, there's so much dirt. Oh, I'm so surprised.

Starting point is 00:45:21 So cars aren't a big deal. However, life experiences are a big deal. So cars aren't a big deal. However, life experiences are a big deal. Christmas presents are not a big deal. A lot of people go nuts. They rack their credit cards during Christmas time on stuff. You know, one thing we're doing for our family, for our two older boys and us, is we just bought OAR tickets for St. Louis, OAR of the band

Starting point is 00:45:44 and we are actually going to be on stage with them. Oh, wow. That's right. And that's obviously, you know, there's a pretty penny involved with that. However, we're like, this is Christmas. Right. We want to give an experience, not stuff

Starting point is 00:45:55 that's going to be broken anyway. Right. So yeah, creating that vision, it gives you financial intimacy. So the question I was asking was, what dimension do you find is the one that's the most common that men are lacking in? It's all over the board.

Starting point is 00:46:09 Really? It's literally all over the board. Every guy has a different situation. Like I said, some guys are just so financially stable but their marriage is a wreck. It's literally all over the board. Yeah, I would think that would be like that. You're strong in one area,

Starting point is 00:46:23 but then you're almost always weak in another Is it ever do you ever find somebody who's got a super balance? Yeah, I know I would think that it's you're almost always Robin Peter to pay Paul and when you talk about five different dimensions It's got to be pretty tough to kind of crush all five of those do you ever come across guys that you think are killing it or Do you even feel like you're killing it in all five departments? It's definitely a challenge. You know, you always feel like you're fighting it to crush it. What we always say is don't try to necessarily crush it,

Starting point is 00:46:52 just be balanced in it. Because there's always gonna be teeter totters, no matter what, you're never gonna sit back and be like, oh, I did it. You know, you're never gonna be at that point. However, what I find the most successful men know kidding around. Number one, they take care of themselves first.

Starting point is 00:47:10 So they take care of their health. They have a morning routine usually. They meditate, they work out, they're methodical, they're strategic. You know, I mean, it's crazy as it sounds, right? They'll literally, they'll gamify and make goals around spending time with their kids. They'll literally, okay, my goal today

Starting point is 00:47:31 is to read my kid a bedtime story and to talk to my 12 year old today for 10 minutes of uninterrupted and I'm gonna schedule a date with my wife. Like literally when they put pen to paper, when they write things down, when they make goals around it, those are the guys I see thrive. So it's funny you bring that up because there was a lesson that I learned in leading people

Starting point is 00:47:52 and I share this on our podcast all the time from a book that I read back in my 20s and something that I started to do with my staff instead of being a manager who was always pointing out the things that you could do better in and that you did wrong and correcting it, I began to focus on all the things that they did well. And the way I had to do that was I actually had to write it back then we had Palm Pilots. See, this was before the iPhone existed. And in my Palm Pilot, I had all of my staff and at that time I think I was managing somewhere between 20 to 30 trainers in front desk and counselors at my place.

Starting point is 00:48:27 And I'd have a thing scheduled at like nine o'clock in the morning, the alarm would go off and say, you know, Larry, and I would know to go find Larry, walk over, put my hand on your shoulder and point out something that I thought that you were doing really well. I can see how that would translate into even parenting and fatherhood, right? Where that would be a really valuable tool is to do that as silly as it may sound, to give yourself an alarm or write down on a piece of paper or a reminder to do stuff. I think it would be, it's something that I know, even though not a father, I would apply that same strategy too. Those are the guys we see thrive.

Starting point is 00:49:01 You know that literally they're intentional. They're purposeful. They're methodical. They're strategic. You know, I mean, a lot of guys think that being on a father, it should come naturally to me. I should be able to do this well naturally. Nothing is further from the truth.

Starting point is 00:49:17 It is a tough fucking job. It's really, really hard. However, if you know how, if you can use those same strategies, leading people, I wouldn't even call that managing people, I would call that leading people because that's what you did, leading people, same thing with your business, if you can take those same skills and incorporate those into your family, yeah, tremendous things happen because what is our, what is our usual default? Our default is to find everything wrong our kids are doing, right? And we're all guilty of that.

Starting point is 00:49:45 However, if you can incorporate something like that, it's tremendous. It's the power, I mean think about what you did for that employee, right? I mean, you just made their whole day, their whole week probably. Imagine what you do to your kids or your family or co-workers that you have if you did just those things. Well, your kids will either, they're either going to act and behave in ways to avoid upsetting you or they're going to act and behave in ways to to press you to yeah, to continue you right. Being proud of them and happy with what they're doing. It's two very different, you know, mentality strategies. It's like it's like a boxer fighting to win versus just fighting to not lose. It's a very different different looking fight. When you watch somebody on the TV and you can tell,

Starting point is 00:50:27 they're just trying to maintain their lead and they don't want to lose versus somebody who's actually trying to go in there and win. So it's kind of similar, you know what that. I've talked about on our show quite a bit about how much growth I've had personally through podcasting, both through the conversation I have with my co-host, the sharing that I get to do on there.

Starting point is 00:50:44 And then the guests in particular, the guests that we get to meet and how I get to leverage my podcast to meet people who I never would have had the opportunity to meet everyone from, you know, Paul checked to Bishop Baron to, you know, you know, people who've started incredible businesses and been very successful, who have been some of the most impactful guests you've had on your show? Have you experienced growth like that? Yeah. So when I first started the podcast three and a half years ago, I always say that I was on God's good humor. For like 10 episodes, I kind of knew what I was going to do. After that, I was like, yeah.

Starting point is 00:51:19 And I'll never forget. So it was right around like episode 50, I'd been doing it a year. That's when I really started getting some amazing guests. And it blew my mind. So one of the first big guests I had was Carlos Condent, UFC fighter. But I've had Carlos Condent. I've had Jim Miller, Frankie Edgar. Frankie Edgar just came on for a second time.

Starting point is 00:51:39 I just had on, if you guys seen the movie 13 hours, I just had Chris Tonto, Peranto on. And I've had, Tonto piranto on. And I've had, gosh, let me think, the whole gamut of just amazing guests, Navy SEALs. And I mean, just, I've had New York Times with selling authors like John Eldridge, who wrote, you know, Wild at Heart and Gary John Bishop, who wrote, you know, on F yourself, unfuck yourself.

Starting point is 00:52:01 And I would say, when I first started podcasting, I was like, there's no way that someone, I could get somebody on the show that has any type of, you know, clout like that. And it's, it is shocked me because every single person I've ever reached out to to come on the show has said yes, except for one that I've always wanted to get in that Seth Rogen because I'm, yeah, I'm sorry. Seth Goodin. Seth Goodin, yeah. He doesn't like talking, he won't talk about his family publicly. But everybody else has just been fatherhood has been such an amazing part of a man's life

Starting point is 00:52:37 what I've noticed is men are very eager to talk about their experiences and things that have been a struggle for them and things that have been good for them But as far as incredible lessons one came from a guest Aaron Walker who's his best friend is Dave Ramsey They're really really tight. They've known each other for 25 years. Don't come home with a wallet full of money and a house full of strangers That's one thing that yeah Oh, that's a good one. Yeah, that was big. Frankie Edgar just came on, he talked about the importance of always dating your wife. You know, that's something that we talk about all the time. I would say another lesson is being the example,

Starting point is 00:53:26 because your kids are always watching you. I just had on Christopher Voss who wrote the book, Never Split the Difference. He was the FBI chief hostage and negotiator for years. And he talked about the importance of allowing your kids to make mistakes and pay for themselves. He's like your instinct is to always protect your kids

Starting point is 00:53:47 from failure or from heartache. He's like, the best thing you can do, the best lesson you can give them is to allow them to go through the pain of making a poor decision because life is gonna hand them just a variety of different challenges. And if you coddle them, if you protect them, you're not doing your job.

Starting point is 00:54:03 Oh man, failure is a great teacher, are you kidding me? What do you think about this current generation of kids that get trophies for just entering into a competition or not keeping score? I couldn't believe my daughter was in a basketball league and she's eight years old, so it's a bunch of little kids and they're playing basketball. And there was no score.

Starting point is 00:54:23 Nobody kept score, they were just trying to make the best. I'm like, why, what do you guys, they need, the losers need to know that they lost so they can learn from it. Otherwise, what the hell is the purpose of playing this, you know, this game? What do you think about that? I hate it.

Starting point is 00:54:36 I absolutely hate it. Every pro athlete, we've had a variety of pro athletes come on the show. One thing that I can honestly say about, because I've asked that question to the pro athlete, we've had a variety of pro athletes come on the show. One thing that I can honestly say about, because I've asked that question to the pro athletes, you know, how do you get to this level? You know, what was your childhood like playing sports? And the work ethic that was instilled in these guys who are in the NFL or the UFC or whatever else they're doing, they were like participation trophies.

Starting point is 00:55:01 No, absolutely not. One guy actually told me that his dad through his participation trophy away. And he was like, you need to earn this, you can't. He's like, this doesn't happen in miles of in our house. Yeah. But yeah, so my two oldest boys, they wrestled for three years. My 10 year old was gifted wrestler, worked as a ass off. He was second in state with wrestling,

Starting point is 00:55:24 has medals galore, right? Now, my older one, you have to finish in the top three of every wrestling tournament to get a medal. And it would always crush my older one to come home without a medal, which was pretty often. And he was just like, well, don't I get a medal for being there? I'm like, no. You have got to earn. So like, let's train harder. You know, let, you know. And that was, but yeah, that's the mentality given everybody participation trophy. I don't agree with that. No, I think it's terrible because you want to raise

Starting point is 00:55:52 strong kids. At some point they're not going to be in your, under your roof. You're not going to be able to protect them. How the hell are they going to deal with the real world? That doesn't give a shit if you participated and sucked. Nobody cares if you participate. If you show up at work and you suck,

Starting point is 00:56:07 you're not gonna leave with an award. You're gonna get fired. Like, you know, what's that old sales movie, Glengarry Glen Ross? Who is the first place in Cadillac, El Dorado, second place at a steak knife, third place is your fire. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:56:19 That's life. You know what I'm saying? I think it's crazy that what people are doing with their kids and they're so afraid to tell them, you know, my kid is here today with us. He's not, obviously, summertime. And so he was in the back doing inventory and he was trying to vacuum up in the front. And he's working with us. And he's a very, very good student.

Starting point is 00:56:35 He tries very, very hard at school. Usually gets straight A's. Every once in a while, he'll bring home a test where, you know, it's like a B or something like that. And he'll bring here, show me the thing. and he'll wait to see what my response is and I'll say to him, well, are you satisfied with this grade? Do you think this is the grade that you earn? And, you know, his response is, well, I tried hard.

Starting point is 00:56:55 I said, but do you think you could have gotten a better grade? And you'll say, yes. And I'll say, okay, are you satisfied with what you got? How do you feel about the score that you got? And you can see his wheels turning, you know, because I also, I'm not trying to make the case that being the best is the only thing that matters because you'll never be the best. There's always somebody better than you.

Starting point is 00:57:11 But applying yourself is what matters. And caring about that is what matters. And just showing up, shit man, nobody owes you anything. I think that's absolutely insane how people, how people, at least society today tries to do that. Do you guys talk about this kind of stuff with the dads and your masterminds? Absolutely insane how people at least society today tries to do that. Do you guys talk about this kind of stuff with the dads in your masterminds?

Starting point is 00:57:28 Is this a common belief that you're finding or do you think, are there a lot of dads who are thinking, no, they need to get a trophy just for showing up? I think if you talk to most dads, they get pissed at that. They don't like that because it rewards, exactly what you said, showing up. No one's gonna give you a reward for going to work I don't I don't feel like a bunch of dads got together made that you know what?

Starting point is 00:57:48 I think you know what? That's funny. You say that I think that with you know what? That's a reflection of that's a reflection of a of societies that are growing up or generations that are growing up without Dad's I tell you that right now a hundred percent I think that's and this is no knock on moms because I think moms Moms are there when dads aren't most of the time. That's the bottom line. And moms are, I mean, they're your moms. I mean, they should be held up on a pedestal. But I do think that's a reflection on a lot of dads not being present.

Starting point is 00:58:14 A lot of moms, you know, saying, hey, we can't have kids winning and losing because that hurts everybody's feelings. I really think that may be a reflection of that. Yeah. Yeah. There's something that's called that is called life. Absolutely. Has any of your guests shocked or surprised you? Or you expect one thing and you get something totally different? Oh, let me think. So I had, like I said, I had Chris Tato-Parrato on the show. And one of the things that that he said, man, this one just blew me away.

Starting point is 00:58:51 Swallowing your ego, it's swallowing your pride and asking for help can be one of the most powerful things we can do. And this guy, you know, he survived Bengazi for 13 hours. You know, he's a, he's an army ranger. I mean, this guy is like one of the baddest dudes on the planet, right? And he was talking about how he was going through the 75th Ranger Battalion training and how hard it was. And he just crushed it, crushed training. And then there was one guy at the end.

Starting point is 00:59:18 And you look at somebody like Chris, like he's an elite warrior. Like this guy never has a bad day, right? He's in great shape. He's mentally tough. So when he was going through his training, the 75th Ranger Battalion, he was crushing it. Training was going awesome.

Starting point is 00:59:32 On the very last day, they had an 18 mile rock. This was their last thing. They were doing calisthenics. And he had all kinds of gear on. He had his gun on. He had his rucksack and he was dying. At eight miles in, he was his gun on, he had his rucksack, and he was dying. At like eight miles in, he was like, I don't know if I'm gonna make it.

Starting point is 00:59:49 Like he was just dying. So there was a guy who was really overweight, barely made it through anything, and Chris was just on this guy's ass, all through training. And at the very last day, this guy, this overweight guy, you know, who was training right next to him goes, give me your gun and Chris was like

Starting point is 01:00:06 I've been pushing your ass ever since day one. How am I gonna give you my gun? He's like you're not gonna make it. You're not gonna make it. You don't make it You don't graduate be really horrible if you didn't graduate in the last thing that we had to do So Chris reluctantly gave him his gun to carry and And this thing weighed like, I think, 40 pounds. And he was already carrying another 40, 50 pounds on his back, along with all his gear. He ended up making it, but he said that the biggest life lesson was to swallow your pride and ask for help when you need it.

Starting point is 01:00:37 Because most men don't do that. And that's such a lesson for guys, because the hardest thing that we do is raise our hand and ask for help. We would much rather live a quiet life of desperation and isolation and just being miserable before we're like, I just need some fucking help. Isn't that funny about us, man?

Starting point is 01:00:54 Yeah, it takes up a more strength in confidence, real confidence, to ask for help than it does to not. That's the truth, I think. It takes a bigger man to say, hey, I can't do this man, you wanna give me a hand? Then somebody who's just afraid to do that. So I think what happened, I think we tend to, we internalize it and we confuse ourselves and say,

Starting point is 01:01:17 well, asking for help is gonna make me weak. No, you're weak because you're afraid to ask for help. Once you show some strength and confidence, it admit that you can't do something alone. I think there's a big lesson in that. I learned that, you know, early in my personal training career, I learned when I first became a trainer,

Starting point is 01:01:34 I was afraid to ask for help because I don't want, or I tell my clients that I didn't know something because I had to know everything. And about a year in or so, I realized, I get more respect when I say, I don't know, but I'll find out. And then I grow and learn anyway, because there's a lot of people out there,

Starting point is 01:01:49 most people out there know more than you do. That's the thing. Well, on that note, is there, do you see other common themes with the struggles that men and fathers go through, like that obviously being one, right? Is there other common themes? And I know we said earlier that

Starting point is 01:02:02 with the five dimensions, there's a lot of individual variances and you've seen it all. But you've worked with so many guys now looking back, do you see a lot of common mistakes that we tend to make or traps we fall into? Oh my God, yeah. So I can almost, I've had, I've been blessed to have, I don't even know how many conversations at this point, one-on-one in a group or at a speaking event or whatever else. I can almost say things before the man does at this point. I'm like, what do you struggle with most? Patients. Patients is a big one.

Starting point is 01:02:32 Now patients, the reason that men are short on patients is because that we tend to internalize so much. We bear the weight of the world on our shoulders. We think we have to do it all. We're into this whole, I'm a lone wolf, going through the deserts of Las Vegas, cocaine, and huckers. What?

Starting point is 01:02:52 Little hangover reference there. Shout out to hangover. No, but I think most men are like, I need to be a lone wolf. I need to be a lone. And what happens, do you guys know what happens to the lone wolf when a wolf leaves the pack? What happens?

Starting point is 01:03:06 Dies. Dies. Dies. The wolf leaves the pack to go die, and if he's lost his pack, he's going to die. That's sooner or later what's going to happen, but men think lone wolf, they think of strength, that's actually the extreme opposite. The wolf is strong because of the pack, and the pack is strong because of the wolves that are in it.

Starting point is 01:03:23 So we have to remember that as men and men, we are community beings, we're tribal beings. If we are not surrounding ourselves with the right men in our life, that's gonna be detrimental. And so we talk about patience. We talk about temper. Guys have a problem usually with temper.

Starting point is 01:03:40 And it's usually a manifestation of, we try to take on so much and we have zero outlet. We don't have that board of advisors. We don't have those men in our life to talk about these things. And I'm not talking about being fru-fru and mushy and all this stuff. I want to talk about my feelings. I'm like, hey, look, I'm a perfect example of finances. This is where a guy would be like, hey, I'm not having the best situation right now in my marriage and financially we're a bit of a mess.

Starting point is 01:04:07 How are you guys doing it? How are you making it? Having that open discussion, because if you think about what men talk about, we talk about the same four things over and over and over. We talk about what we do for a living, what are kids doing on the weekend, the current events, what Trump's doing, all this, all this stuff. It's very, very surface stuff. But, I mean, if men had that outlet,

Starting point is 01:04:28 if they had that group of guys that they could really dive into, if they had that board of advisors, that's where you see a man really start to take more control over his temper, take more control over his patience level, things like that, because that's what they struggle with a ton is patients, internal dialogue, negative talk, all kinds of things. There seems to be a growth too, actually that seems, this is statistic now,

Starting point is 01:04:53 of more and more men not wanting to get married and not wanting to start a family. So more and more men saying, I don't want kids and I don't want to get married. Do you think that's a good or a bad thing? I don't think it's a good thing. But I think it's an individual decision. But if you look at...

Starting point is 01:05:14 So I just had Garrett White on the podcast, you guys know who he is. Wake up warrior. Okay. So he talks about millennials and not wanting to be married and not wanting to have kids. And he always talks about like, well, a be married and not wanting to have kids. And he always talks about like, well, a lot of millennials, if you look at it, they haven't really been taught work ethic. They haven't really been taught relationships.

Starting point is 01:05:33 Like their education has been on a social platform, on a device platform. You know, they're in front of screens all the time. You know, their definition of a relationship is, I could swipe right if I'm interested or swipe left if I'm not. And I can go hook up. It's almost like, where's the motivation to have a deep meaningful relationship when you can just go on a, on a whatever and on a, on an app and swipe and go hook up. So like, yeah, there isn't a whole lot of motivation for, for millennials or younger people. Now, I'm going to play devil's advocate with that because a great book, Igin, that I read, not just too long ago, talks about part of the reason for that statistic sales,

Starting point is 01:06:11 because we are more informed at this younger generation is more informed they were before, and they're wiser, because they actually would have followed up with those kids and asked a lot of them, why are you not? And they'd say, well, statistically, I could, you know, at 50, 50 shots. And to fail.

Starting point is 01:06:26 Yeah, it's destined to fail. Or, and so because they're more aware of that. So it's a side effect of what's happened. Right. So some of them are, and that's, again, that's an overgeneralization, but I do think there's another side of the coin that could be a positive thing

Starting point is 01:06:40 that this generation coming up now has access to information like that. They can get in a podcast and listen to experience older dads talk about all the challenges of parenting and fatherhood and being in a marriage. And so they're more informed. And so maybe a little bit wiser to, hey, maybe I should wait a little longer before I decided.

Starting point is 01:07:00 Well, it's a trend that's happening in all modern Western societies and it seems to be the more prosperous and wealthy and successful the less Children people want to have and the marriage percentage tends to drop. I know America's birthroid rate is at the absolute Minimum that is required to sustain a a functioning society many European countries are below to the point where they can never recover. Japan is below to the point where I think it's like in 10 or 20 years, they're gonna have more people over the age of 60 than they will, younger than that,

Starting point is 01:07:35 which it's scary, who's gonna take care of, who's gonna take care of things. So it's a very interesting trajectory, and it may pose some kind of new problems. Funny though, the percentage of women that don't want to have families get married is also growing, but not nearly at the rate of men. The male percentage is what's growing the fastest.

Starting point is 01:07:58 I mean, I guess we could all speculate as to why that may be. One of my speculations is this, there's no more rights of passages. So, and here's the thing, what I mean by that is, women have a natural right of passage which is their biological clock, right? So they know like, okay, if I don't, if I want to have kids and I don't have them in this,

Starting point is 01:08:17 before this period of time, the odds I'm gonna be able to have on are much, much smaller, it's the point where it won't be able to happen. A guy's, you know's clock is much longer. You can wait to your 45, 50 if you want 60, and you can still have kids. And so I think this is my own personal opinion.

Starting point is 01:08:34 It's kind of Peter Pan syndrome, where guys are like, I'll just have sex with a bunch of girls and just go out and make money. And I have all kinds of time in the world. And it feels like that. And there's no other rights of passage. You know what I mean? Whereas before we had other rights of...

Starting point is 01:08:48 Do you create anything like that for your boys, by the way? Do you have any rights of passage for them that were you okay? Now you're this age and this is what happens or... Or no, it's funny you mention that because right now, so like growing up without a father or like the craziness that I grew up with, I didn't have that right of passage. So I have a son right now who's 12, and he is becoming a man. You know what I'm sitting here scratching my head,

Starting point is 01:09:09 I'm like, I really need to have something for him. I need to do something for him, to give him that experience of, hey, you're no longer like you are a boy, but you are turning into a man. The answer to that question right now is no, but I am searching for that because I think it's important, and I got three other, you know, right behind him,

Starting point is 01:09:29 that I wanna do something to allow him to enter that next part of his life in a profound way. And I also, I think it's important, I think there's something that mentally clicks, especially with young boys, you know, like, I'm becoming a man now. And I think they start to make different decisions. They start to look at life a little bit differently.

Starting point is 01:09:49 So yeah, I'm in the process. What a Ryan of order, I know he talked about his with his boy, but what was his process? He did some pretty fascinating ones. I think I forgot what the age is for, but he'd take his son camping. And certain age, they got the first, 22, at rifle, or they got to hunt. Or, you know, it, you know, at rifle, or they got to hunt,

Starting point is 01:10:05 or you know, it thinks that he picked that work kind of like, hey, and I don't think it matters really what it is. I think if you just, you can pick traditional things or not, but I think sitting down and having that conversation and telling them, you know, because like, again, like it's the lesson behind it. That goes matter. You know, boys and girls grow up and both go through puberty,

Starting point is 01:10:23 but a girl gets her period. So she gets that conversation. She gets that conversation like, what's happening to my, like really this is like a kind of a ride a passage and then again that biological clock, you know what does a guy get, you know we get pubes and what, like you know there's really nothing that we sit down and say hey, this is what it means. A comfortable boner.

Starting point is 01:10:39 Yeah exactly. You know what I'm saying, like what does this mean? And you know what it means to be a man type of deal. And then again the fact that a lot of kids boys are growing up without dads. So they kind of don't, you know, they kind of don't have that. How do you, how do you police like a social media right now? Cause they're coming to that age too,

Starting point is 01:10:54 where they probably have. That's a good question. And pornography is a big, that's a big worry of mine. With my son's 13 years old, he's on the internet. Like do you, do you have any strategies to deal with that? Right now, this is, I wouldn't say it's the right answer, but it's the answer we have right now. So they, they don't know, like, do you have any strategies to deal with that? Right now, I wouldn't say it's the right answer, but it's the answer we have right now. So they don't have phone jet.

Starting point is 01:11:09 They're 12 and 10, they're course they want to. Which is totally okay, because I didn't get my fucking first phone. So I was like 20. Yeah. It's only to have to survive. I don't even have cell phones with me. No, we have the Nokia snake phone when I was in high school.

Starting point is 01:11:22 I had a pager, you know what I'm saying? That's right. Get them a pager. Pager a major, you know what I'm saying? That's right. Get him a major. A major, why are you not home? Yeah, yeah. No, so they don't have, but they do have, they have iPads, right? So I just had a Cameron Adir on the show. And he is the world's expert on devices, screens, video games, internet, YouTube, and what

Starting point is 01:11:44 it does to a kid's brain at these certain ages. And it was like holy shit. Like parents, if you guys are listening right now and you have a kid, we have no idea we're up against. It's a huge experiment. Yeah, we have no idea we're up against. It is a freaking monster, right? And when I had cam on, I was like, holy shit.

Starting point is 01:12:05 This show is actually, my show with him is coming out in September, but I was like, this blew my mind. So, to answer your question, right now, we, anything that they go view on YouTube, so it's connected to my account, so I can see it. They are only allowed to be on 30 minutes of screen time per day, and that's it.

Starting point is 01:12:25 As far as like the sex conversation, so like write a passage like I mean yeah, you know, so I took my boys shooting that kind of thing We also we had the sex conversation So I did bring them up to speed on all that, but as far as like pornography I just had an expert on how to explain porn to your kids on the show And she wrote a book called Good Pictures, Bad Pictures. And to be honest, I've been at this point, a little too chicken shit to actually sit down and read them that book because I'm like,

Starting point is 01:12:56 what am I gonna open up here? Cause eventually what's gonna happen. They're gonna get curious and write. I think Sal's going through the same thing right now, right? Like how much of it do you wanna share? Cause you feel like your boys got some innocence to him still. Yeah, it's an interesting problem. Because when I, well, we were kids.

Starting point is 01:13:11 Yeah, okay. Do you remember how valuable one dirty magazine was? Oh, it's crazy. I could, I could not making this up. I know, I know kids that traded their bikes for dirty magazines. Okay. You, you porn is so You porn is so accessible now. It's like, it's all free.

Starting point is 01:13:26 You don't have nobody pays for it and it's all out there. And you can literally go through endless pictures whenever you want. And it literally changes the way your brain is wired. It's the point now. A rectile dysfunction is growing. The fastest age group that erectile dysfunction is growing is in the 20 year old age group.

Starting point is 01:13:44 A rectile dysfunction. That never existed the 20 year old age group. You wrecked how dysfunction. That never existed in 20 year old man, or at least it was super rare, or it was connected to some health problem. Now you've got this growing percentage of kids that are like, are saturation. Yeah, it's just too, the only time ever in human history

Starting point is 01:14:00 where a man or a boy or whatever would be exposed to that level of variety would be in the extremely rare case that they were like a man or a boy or whatever would be exposed to that level of variety would be in the extremely rare case that they were like a king or something like that or some, you know, the leader of a massive trucking is con like you never had that kind of access before. Change is the way the brain is wired. So it's actually quite dangerous. It's actually not crazy. Yeah. It's not just being a period. It's like, oh, don't look at porn because it's dirty. It's like, this is a healthy thing that you got to, and when the brain changes at that age

Starting point is 01:14:28 because it's constantly molding, there could be potential for permanent, you know, more long lasting type changes in the brain. What were some of the takeaways from that guest? That sounds like a very interesting guest. Yeah, so here's the thing. I mean, you can police this all day long in your own house, right?

Starting point is 01:14:43 But eventually my kid's gonna go to his friends house, check this out, right? So, you know, I'm getting to that point now where I'm like, I really need to sit down. He knows all about sex. Funny thing is, he knows the we have sex, which is kind of funny. But that's a whole nother.

Starting point is 01:14:58 Do you guys know what he's like? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, cause you guys wanna hear it. That's our half point, yeah. Here's a really quick funny story. So it was like a month and a half ago, we were, you know, we were in yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, like, hey, dad, I'm scared. It's all right, you'll be fine. Pretty good. Scope stairs.

Starting point is 01:15:28 But dad, I'm really scared. Yeah, I'm really scared. It's all right. We'll talk about it in the morning. So that's when you're like, wow, I just totally, like, and then to add in Salt to injury, that was my 12 year old. My 10 year old comes down. He loves to draw.

Starting point is 01:15:39 Like, loves to draw. He's very proud of his drawing. Knock on the door. Dad, dad, I just drew this cool picture. Can we see it in the morning? Yeah, but I really want to show you now. And I'm like, no, not right now. We'll see you in the morning. So like, and then he's like, continues to do it. I'm like, just go upstairs. So slide it under the door. Right. So the next day, no kidding around this where you feel like total shit as a parent and the boys come to us and my son was like, I was really scared.

Starting point is 01:16:05 I cried last night to sleep and I'm like, and then my 10 year old, he's like, I cried too, you didn't want to see our drawing, am I drawing? And I'm like, so me and Jessica talked about, you're like, they know about sex. Like, it's probably just,

Starting point is 01:16:16 at this point it's probably healthy for them to know that they explain what mommy's daddy are doing. Right, but even from like a boundary standpoint, like, look, there is time when you are not invited, okay? And there needs to be an understanding there. So we sat him down, I think we scarred him for life. Because we told him, we're like, look, we're just gonna be honest with you guys.

Starting point is 01:16:36 When he came in the act, we didn't mean to hurt your feelings. All right, we know you guys both cried yourself to sleep. We're sorry, but mom and dad were having sex. And they were like, what? That's disgusting. You're still doing that. You're still eating. You're still eating.

Starting point is 01:16:49 Right. You have three brothers. You don't need to do that anymore. Yeah. They're next. They cried that night as well. Right. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:16:58 Well, their next question was, well, did you make a sister? Because we need a sister as four boys. So, you know, we told them, we told them, but there's boundaries and all that stuff. But with the whole porn thing, I think it's just, God, it's up to that point where like, I have no idea what I'm, as a father, what I'm up against here because I'm like, God bless, like there's an arsenal of just, as you were saying,

Starting point is 01:17:20 like just free shit out there, waiting for him to click on the wrong site. So I think what I'm gonna do with him is just be the one thing we've always been with the boys, obviously we tell him what happens, is just being very real with him. Like, hey, porn is not a good thing. I'm not gonna do it that way. I wanna make sure that he knows the real consequences of like, look, if you get into porn, here's what it does to your mind, okay?

Starting point is 01:17:43 Like it's one thing to look at porn, but over time, this is what, and if you wanna be with a girl sexually, guess what? You know, your penis may or may not work because you've looked at too much porn. Just scare the shadow. Yeah, I mean, time, yeah, you might fall off. Right, that's what I told myself.

Starting point is 01:17:58 Yeah. You'll go bald. Yeah, no, you know, when I think about it, I think to my, this was a big thing, I was like, okay, how do I talk? Cause I know what we were told, like your hands will, you'll grow hair, you know, when I think about it, I think to my, because this was a big thing, I was like, okay, how do I talk? Because I know what we were told, like, your hands will, you'll grow hair, you know, when you'll pull them in your hands, you'll go blind,

Starting point is 01:18:09 like, oh, that didn't stop me at all, right? Yeah, you're, you're like, I'm still good. I'm working out. I know that fucking, I don't give a shit if I grow hair on my palms, this is cool. So, one thing that I try to do with, with my boys, rather than, because I'll tell them that too, but I also try to be very honest,

Starting point is 01:18:24 because there's a reason why people look at it. We have the drug conversation, same thing. Why do people do drugs? I can scare the hell out of them, but I'm also going to tell them because they feel good and that's why people do them. Here's why people get addicted. One thing that I've done is I just, I really hammer home the difference between a relationship and how much more valuable it is and how it's

Starting point is 01:18:46 in a completely different universe than just sexual pleasure. Very, very different. So that way, at least, he can weigh the two understand, like, okay, when I'm with a girl and I build that relationship and have that connection, that's going to be way, way more valuable than just this momentary pleasure. Yeah, it's indul be way, way more valuable than just this momentary pleasure. Yeah, it's indulgences, right? And we talk about that too, even with food, and like having sweets and desserts

Starting point is 01:19:12 and all these types of things. Like, yeah, of course, you know, treat, like there's gonna be treats and there's gonna be times where, you know. But if you ate that every single day, and like, and you were just obsessed with this same treat, you're eating over and over, it's really gonna affect your body in a negative way.

Starting point is 01:19:27 It's so funny in our space and the health and fitness and wellness space we have, there's of course how you work out, how you eat and it's all around fitness and diets, all around sacrifice, sacrifice, if you don't eat the cake today, you're gonna be healthier and feel better tomorrow. And if you sacrifice some time with exercise, you'll make more time yourself and you'll feel better.

Starting point is 01:19:49 But then there's this movement with sex, which is crazy to me that the people don't see the parallels, we're like, yeah, just open, just be open, have sex with everybody. And they're required to just bang everybody. Yeah, and I'm like, you don't see the different, like you don't see it's the same thing. Like, yeah, sacrifice for this much more valuable thing

Starting point is 01:20:07 versus just indulging yourself all the time. It's no different than somebody coming to you and saying, you know, I'm a hundred pounds overweight, but it's because I enjoy my life and eat whatever I want. Are you really enjoying your life? Is that really bringing you value? So it's funny to me in our space how people can be so not consistent with self-advising.

Starting point is 01:20:23 I wanna ask you, if you could go back and give yourself advice so that the younger you who's about to get married, okay? So you've met Jessica, you're about to get married. What's the single bit advice would you give yourself about what you're about to head into? Wow, that is a really good question. I think the advice if I had to sit down with my 28 year old self, Batski and Married had no idea that I would have four boys. Like in my mind, I thought we'd have two.

Starting point is 01:20:55 We have four, which is a lot. That's crazy. That's twice as many as four. Yeah. Jim Gaffkin's got this. You doubled. Yeah. Jim Gaffkin's got this. You doubled. Yeah, Jim Gaffkin's got this hilarious joke

Starting point is 01:21:05 about having four kids. He's like, you know, having four kids is like, just imagine that you're drowning and then someone hand you a baby. That's what it's like. That's true. That's brilliant. Yeah, so maybe I would put that in there as the advice,

Starting point is 01:21:20 you know, to bring a life jacket into that situation. But, you know, the advice that I would give myself without a doubt is Do not Live a quiet life of desperation and solitude as a husband and as a father and as a man When you need help fucking ask for it because you will need help at every corner at every turn. You will need help and there will be every single part of you that won't want to ask for help

Starting point is 01:21:52 because you feel that you're going to look weak and vulnerable and that is so fucking untrue. It is the lie that we tell ourselves as men and fathers. If I ask for help, I am weak. If I ask for help, it's a stamp on me that I am not equipped, that I'm not up to the job. And that is absolutely not true. The other thing I would give myself advice on is to have quality friendships with other men

Starting point is 01:22:25 and the most important word here is like-minded men. We all have our guys that we hung out with in college, the good old boys, go out, kick back a few beers, you talk about the same five things that we always talk about, it is so important. It literally makes our break life as fathers and men that we do not live alone. That you expose yourself to men that have the same like-minded, the same goals, the same like-mindedness that you do, the same strategies to live a fulfilling life with purpose, with

Starting point is 01:23:03 your family, with your wife, with what you do for a living most importantly to Men that will challenge you that will challenge your thinking You know because a lot of times and you guys deal with this People have to get out of their own way. We are at times our biggest obstacle But if you could just for you guys on what you do, you know You you give people your clients, people who work with you, a tap on the shoulders, say, don't keep going straight, go that way, because it's gonna be much more effective,

Starting point is 01:23:31 much more efficient, you're gonna get the results that you want. It's the same thing with men. And that's the advice I'd give myself. Excellent, excellent. Well, yeah, I think you're doing a good thing with your podcast and your show. And looking ahead, anything in any goals for the future

Starting point is 01:23:45 for what you're doing. Yeah, so as I look ahead, I will be doing this full time and the podcast and the mission and our goal is to help as many men live these fulfilling purposeful lives as possible. Excellent, excellent, thanks for coming to the show, brother. Thank you for your meeting. Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and shape your body, dramatically improve your health and energy, and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB Superbumble at Mind Pump

Starting point is 01:24:19 Media dot com. The RGB Superbumble includes maps on the ballroom, maps performance and maps aesthetic. Nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs. With detailed workout nutrients in over 200 videos, the RGB Superbumble is like having Sal Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Superbundle has a 430-day money-back guarantee and you can get it now plus other

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Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth - 837: Larry Hagner of the Dad Edge Podcast

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