Miss Me? - All Trump, No Dump?

Episode Date: June 6, 2024

Lily Allen and Miquita Oliver discuss the power of online activism, Donald Trump, ancestry, and CruftsCredits: Producer: Flossie Barratt Technical Producer: Will Gibson Smith Production Coordinator: Hannah Bennett Executive Producers: Dino Sofos and Ellie Clifford Assistant Commissioner for BBC: Lorraine Okuefuna Commissioning Editor for BBC: Dylan HaskinsMiss Me? is a Persephonica production for BBC Sounds

This is the BBC. This podcast is supported by advertising outside the UK. on Rogers Internet. Visit rogers.com for details. We got you. Rogers. BBC Sounds. Music, radio, podcasts. This episode of Miss Me contains adult themes and very strong language, as always. welcome to the meaty drop welcome wherever you pop welcome don't hurt yourself today babe uh the meat drop coming to you from the same location. First time ever. We actually are best friends.

So if Lily's in London, I do actually want to see her. And we're extremely busy, both of us, which is great. And so this is the time we could see each other. And it happens to be a day that we're doing this as well.

So just, I'm in the other room. Let's be frank. We've been working together today. And so we had to record our podcast as well. So we've figured out how to kill two birds with one stone. And we're recording in the same location, but at different ends of the room. No, come on. There is a door.

There is a door. That's stupid. It's a big glass door. I can see you. Hi. Can you actually see me? Not weird. Not weird at all. Kills the illusion. it's a big glass door I can see you look hi can you actually see me yeah not weird not weird at all

kills the illusion but we are at your godmother's beautiful house yes I love it here so much it's quite handy that we're in such a posh house

because I did my first binge of AD house tours that's architectural digest house tours for anyone that hasn't

clocked on to this incredible land of content i was like all i want to do is look at houses and i was like wait i know there's a way to do that and then found that and had a really good time at alicia keys and swiss beats this house they invited me around oh yeah that's a good one. That's a really good one. I watched Diplo's ranch farm in Jamaica the other day. Very nice house. Sort of like Brazilian architecture, very like brutalist poured concrete kind of situation. It's very nice.

Very nice. I would like it. I need to like the person that's taking me around, I realised. Yeah, you might like Emma Chamberlain's house. No, I don't think so. Oh, Dakota Johnson's got a lovely AD. No, really didn't enjoy that one.

Really? That one felt like a set. I didn't believe she lived there. That surprises me. I didn't believe any house could be so boring and characterless. Makita.

I'm sorry. I don't not like Dakota Johnson, but I remember thinking, actually, I watched that one ages ago and that's why I stopped watching. So I was like, they're not real. But Alicia Keys and Swiss Beats with their, I think it's the greatest collection

of African-American modern art in their home. Wow. One of the biggest collections. So I was inspired culturally and socially and also architecturally and interior designery. It was ticking all those boxes for you. It was. I was like, this is great.

I don't like watching YouTube on TV, but it was, it was nice to just delve into other people's homes. I wish I could do that for a job. Maybe I could do a new series of Through the Keyhole. That's not a bad shout. I'd do that with you. We could do that for a job. Maybe I could do a new series of Through the Keyhole. No, it's not a bad shout. I'd do that with you. We could do that together. No.

Oh, right. Okay, this is it. This is as far as it goes. Okay, fine. This is enough. This is enough. Good luck, bitch. Interiors is my vibe anyway.

I think I'll do that one. That's true. That's true. Have you ever thought of doing like an interiors show? Yes, I have. I'm in talks with several production companies actually. Oh! I might throw my little

bringing back Lloyd Grossman through the keyhole idea away. Someone's done it. I think Abby Clancy does one, doesn't she? Yes. Be nice. I haven't watched it. No, I know Abby, thanks. I call her Abby. Abs. I call her Abs. It's Absy. No, Grimmy knows thanks. I call her Abby. Abs. I call her Abs. It's Absy.

No, Grimmy knows her and I met her a few times in the noughties. I really liked her. She's so pretty and so lovely and sweet. I think she's good on TV.

It's just, they didn't do many houses that I wanted to see. Okay. That was the problem. So I'm a little bit scared of talking about what I'm going to talk about next because I think it is quite contentious. But I get a lot of messages from people on social media telling me that I'm not using my platform

correctly because I haven't commented publicly on the conflict in Israel and Palestine. And I wonder what your take on that is, if you think that it is essential for you one to use their platform to talk about their beliefs, you know, when something like this is happening in the world. Yeah. You know, I believe social media to be quite a sort of shallow and vacuous space and it's such a serious subject matter that I don't really feel like it is the place for me to talk about what I think. I'm actually not allowed to discuss what my opinions are

because we are impartial and we're on the BBC right now, but that's not really what I'm wanting to talk about. I'm talking about the demand that people have, the conversation around people boycotting celebrities or boycotting brands because they are not publicly giving a stance to one side or the other. Well, someone was saying to me the other day that actually a lot of, maybe because of this, a lot of new people have voiced their opinions,

unexpected people. I also hate Instagram for this, because I think everything gets wildly confused. And there is a lot of one side or the other. And what I've been doing in my life is having a lot of conversations about the war with my family and my friends and some of my family who feel directly affected by it. I think it's interesting because, you know, I think in lots of ways people think that social media, you know, mirrors real life in some ways. And I don't believe that.

I think that the two things are entirely separate. And I think that if you want to implement change in the world, you know, protest has always been, you know, really important and really integral in um in implementing change and i just personally think that if you are posting things on instagram or twitter or facebook and you are you know ticking that off as your box your activism box you might be less likely to turn up a process i think that like people power is essentially what is powerful and is what makes governments pay attention.

You know, if there are millions of people taking to the streets for, you know, a protest, the government have to think about, you know, increasing the police numbers on the streets. You know, there's lots of sort of things in terms of infrastructure that has to be changed that, you know, means that the governments have to take notice. in terms of infrastructure that has to be changed that you know means that the governments have to take notice mark zuckerberg doesn't have to do anything if we're all just sitting shouting at each other on instagram in fact he's making money off of it because he's shooting advertising at you you know you're putting a flag as you know what your beliefs are and what products you're likely to buy into as a result so i i just find it really difficult you know of course of course, of course I have my opinions.

I'm not going to share them here because they're my opinions and I want to keep them in my head and I'll share them with the people that I want to share them with in my time. That doesn't mean that I'm not writing letters to MPs. It doesn't mean that I'm not donating to charities. I'm just not doing it publicly right now. And to be honest, the amount of shit that I'm getting for not speaking up, imagine the amount of shit that I would be getting if I did. And I have children,

I've got children and I really do worry about my safety and their safety, quite frankly. I really don't appreciate, it feels really, really intimidating the amount of threatening language that's used in conjunction with this particular issue. Of course, I'm aware that people are suffering. Of course, I'm aware that people are dying. Of course, I'm aware of what's going on. The fact that I'm not talking about it on Instagram doesn't mean that I don't care. No, I completely understand that. I also think that it is important to see for me to see some of the imagery that I saw last week. And if people weren't posting so vigorously and continuously, I might not have seen some of the stuff I've seen, but it did just make

me feel more helpless. But that's kind of how war can make you feel. I think that social media is great for awareness. I don't think it's great for implementing change. Yes, exactly. Exactly that. That's why also I just worry that social media takes away discussion or sort of like people in rooms trying to actually implement change. I feel like we have to be together to do that. Like touching each other, looking each other in the eyes, rather than, as you said, okay, done.

All done. Yeah. All done with that one. I've done my bit. I've posted three times today. That's what happened with Black Lives Matter. I'm sorry, but Jesus fucking Christ, that black square got so misused.

It just became this ticking box, black square, and there were certain people that were so proud of themselves for posting that. Within six weeks, back to normal. Who cares? I'd like to say that i didn't post about good i mean again it was about awareness but i just there were a hefty amount of people that i knew were posting it uh who didn't give a shit it's just i use social media for like you know self-promotion and like vacuous like rubbish like narcissistic stuff i'm i'm not on social media

crying about like my relationship troubles or do you know what i mean like anything that's like serious or has any death it's not happening on social media anything that's fucking real will not be over there yeah so you've had quite a lot of that have you oh my gosh so much so much people i'm unfollowing you because you haven't said anything about Palestine. It's like, okay, fine. Should we talk about Trump being guilty? Yes, on 34 counts. I think it's 34 counts. 34 counts.

How can you imagine an actual felon of a president? Is there a possibility that he could still be president? Absolutely. Yeah, really strong possibility. a possibility that he could still be president? Absolutely. Yeah. Really strong possibility. What's the tone in America like now? I mean, it's only just happened, but how does it feel over there knowing that he could still run? I mean, as somebody that has a podcast on the BBC, it feels like a fact. It feels like a fact.

It feels like a fact of life and something that, you know, is just reality. Oh, wait. Did you hear about Donald Trump farting in court? No. Oh, my God. Fantastic. Apparently, like the people that were working for the defense tried to like file emotion of it being like a toxic work environment because he was farting so much.

It was like they couldn't focus and they couldn't concentrate. So not just a, oh my God, how embarrassing. Just continuous farting. No, continuous farting. Trump was trumping. That's a sign of bad health. Okay? I don't think that's the first sign.

It is. It's a sign of having bad insides. Well, luckily he looks so good on the outside, you'd never know. He's really masking it well. I feel like Dino's about to have a nervous breakdown. Luckily, he's so bloody gorgeous that it doesn't matter,

even if he continuously farts. What a summer it's going to be. A summer of politics. We should get some whistles. Dishy Rishy and Grumpy Trumpy. Who said that? Danny Mill. No, that was just me.

I just came up with that. Quite like it. Dishy Rishy and Grumpy Trumpy. Now stop. Has anyone in the world. Dishy-rishy and grumpy-trumpy. Now stop. Has anyone in the world said dishy-rishy? Starmer drama. Dishy-rishy, grumpy-trumpy. Biden's riding.

Biden's riding. If you will, if you will ask us to be impartial, we will just rhyme. Oh, and Nigel Farage is standing for parliament now. Excuse me? No, not just Starmer Drama. It's a Barrage of Farage. Unstoppable. Yeah, you're right.

Fucking album. This is your new role. This is your new job. Barrage of Farage, Starmer Drama, Biden's riding grumpy trump dishy rishi dishy rishi we need two more for the seven dwarfs guess what we're gonna do we're gonna take a break i think we're in a great place we've just started rhyming politicians names with their new uh vibe no no one's doing that we've turned into daily mail daily mail headline writers join me after the break for more starmer drama No one's doing that. We've turned into Daily Mail headline writers.

Join me after the break for more Starmer Drama. Go back to school with Rogers and get Canada's fastest and most reliable internet. Perfect for streaming lectures all day or binging TV shows all night. Save up to $20 per month on Rogers Internet. Visit rogers.com for details. We got you, Rogers. Maybe it's because I'm 40 and you're not 40 yet, but there is something about now where you go,

if I was going to completely change what I want to do in the world it'd probably be now and I was thinking what what could I do like how how much could I change well I don't know if it is now I feel like because I did have this um you know thought when I was probably just turning 30 and I thought I'd quite like to maybe go into architecture or the legal profession or medicine. And then I thought by the time I graduate, I'll be 40. So, or maybe even later. And then it just seemed like a bit long. A bit long.

A bit long to learn the actual skills of being a lawyer. I would really enjoy it. I'd love to be a lawyer. That's what I mean. Like, I think I'm going to start some courses. I actually think I'd be quite a good policewoman. What? Yeah, I don't like want to be like, you know,

just like a Bobby. Like, I'd like to be like a detective, you know? Oh, well, of course. Yes. Yes. I think I'd be a good detective. A good detective. I'm very good detective. A good detective. I'm very suspicious of people and their intentions.

You're just suspicious enough. But also, you like the hunt of like, you're always trying to solve things and find out like the background of why something's happened and how it's happened, I think. I mean, I do watch quite a lot of detective series and I've always liked me and David because, you know, David is like my husband is an actor. So he reads a lot of scripts and he understands like plot and writing in that sense. But he's not very good at guessing why like bits of information have been planted somewhere, whereas I sister did it. He's like, no, that's too obvious. I'm like, okay, watch, watch, babe. And I'm always fucking right. I'm always right. Is that detective brain in you? I don't think I could be a very good detective.

You know, obviously I'm trying to write this thing about a detective. And I started doing all the research and I was like, I don't think I can write this because it's too gory. My cousin Sasha was like, you have to get dark and you have to go into crime and think about, you know, why

people commit crimes. And I was like, I can't do that. It scares the shit out of me. Well, not only that, you have to really understand the legal process, which is very complicated in the terms of how, you know, police and detectives divulge

information to victims of crimes because when victims stand up in court and have to give their evidence and evidence isn't allowed to be like compromised in any way so it's yeah the way in which like information is shared is very very important and um it's not a straightforward when did you learn all that like i don't know when i was stalked when i had my stalking case right yeah because there were things that they knew they weren't allowed to tell me because i had to be a witness so when i came off of this off of the witness stand and i went into a room they said oh now that you've given evidence and it can't be contaminated we can tell you that he said that

he wanted to put a knife through your face right and i was like wow so you had that information when you decided that you didn't think that it should be stalking and that it should be a robbery interesting um so yes so you sort of sort of saw what you're told and what else there is to know yeah exactly you'd be great because you've had so much darkness. I think you wouldn't be scared of a little bit more. No, bring it on. Bring on the dark. Bring on the fucking darkness.

You know that my great-grandfather was a detective in Antigua. Shut up. Yeah. He was a really brilliant detective.

I mean, I should really see this. I should write him. Yeah, write a story about him. He was like revered and he was a black man obviously he was from um dominica and then uh no they brought him over to antigua because he was so good my uncle

john is a brilliant storyteller and he's 92 and he's still here to tell us all these stories so and i listen and my great-grandfather was always very celebrated for the way he could solve anything he had this like genius mind. I don't think that's trickled down to me, but I was thinking a lot about... Yes, it has. Oh, stop it. She's a genius. You think I could crack that case?

You think I could crack that case? I don't know. If I really needed a case solving, I don't know if I'd be coming to DI Keats. But maybe. Who would you call who are you gonna call phoebe do not say phoebe she's got a detective mind it's funny you talk about um ancestral vocations i guess is what we're talking about my granddad on well both sides of my family

my mom's dad worked in dockyards in Portsmouth and my dad's dad was a submariner um but there's a lot of naval shit going on in my family submariner can you imagine what in what period of time are we talking the 30s long periods of time I guess like late 60s I mean that is my idea of absolute hell like months not only at sea which i hate the sea another little little known fact about me hates the sea interesting considering so many family ancestral paths were naval yeah and would spend months and months like underwater in a submarine so what's trickled down to you to us from the people before us well i think maybe from like naval like always like being on the go and i mean the thing is i really do love my home but

i'm also like quite happy to lay my head anywhere you know like i can pretty much sleep anywhere um i love to travel i don't really like being in one place for too long like on my toes nomadic even yes you can be quite nomadic and then on the other side because also the reason i've been thinking about this obviously is because i'm i i have my scottish family in my life basically my sister got in touch with me probably about nine years ago and uh on instagram and said i'm your sister do you want to meet up and i was like yeah absolutely and then we got very close and then that led to me and my dad getting in touch again and that sort of went on for a few years but then i decided to go meet everyone in scotland and now

i have this big scottish family and now all this ancestry that i'm really interested about because the way they talk about it we were kings we were kings and i got given a book the other day which was like the history of the bailey tartan and it was like this is these are your people i haven't read it yet i opened the first page and i was like whoa like it's so deep and i'm i was just thinking like what what does it do for a life to know more and more like can you go back even more do you know what was going on in like the 18th century in your family no oh you do you want to know no don't really care in who you are and where you're from I just feel like I've been on my own I'm trying to forge my own path into the future and I don't really need to like look back yeah but hello you only know

where you're going if you look at where you've come from well how do you write that out someone said it yeah probably oprah cool i've been asked to do a couple of those like tv shows like who do you think you are and that stuff and i don't know what i just um i don't know i think i'm a bit scared of it yeah and there it is it's okay yeah just a little bit scared it's all right bye i'll do it on my own do you want to talk about crafts instead when will you let me talk about crafts what is happening with crafts is it on okay first let me show you what i found out about the relationship between man and animal. Okay, caveman, right? Cavemen opened up discarded animal heads

to gobble up the fatty, nutritious, energy-rich brains. In addition, animals' bone marrow, also fatty and energy-rich, was likely an important food source for scavengers. Researchers theorized that these additions to the diet fueled the evolution of modern humans. Without animals, we wouldn't be who we are. Wow. Researchers theorize that these additions to the diet fueled the evolution of modern humans. Without animals, we wouldn't be who we are. Wow.

So like, we are animals. They are in us, in the evolution of us. Because when you have a dog, people are constantly talking about like, oh, but they've been domesticated. Yeah, but they've been domesticated to do that. And I was like, so what we're saying is these were wild, crazy animals and we made them, we continue to breed them to be lap dogs

and cute and love us. I'm actually asking. You know, in the 70s, people used to walk up and down the King's Road with like leopards. No, they fucking did. Yeah, they did. Cheetahs and leopards. I promise you, they did.

On leads. Yeah, they did. Cheetahs and leopards. I promise you they did. On leads. Yeah. Stop it. I'm not fucking joking. I didn't make that up. Maybe only in Chelsea. Maybe in Chelsea. My cat does not want to go outside. She's like, you open the door and she's like, not for me. I'm happy I'm just staying here. Really?

Because my friend's cat turned up at her kid's school the other day. What? They were like, do you have a ginger tomcat? She's like, yeah. And they were like, yeah, he's in class nine. They were like, what? Does he answer to Garfield?

He followed. The cat had followed the kid to school. But why did you get a cat? Because obviously that doesn't, she ain't going outside. So that doesn't take you out into the world. What do you get from her inside? You little cozy up, you have a little cozy up. I can get, I've tried to talk about this in public before and I've got in trouble.

I got a cat because my daughter really wanted a cat. But the benefits of having a cat is that she makes sure that there are no vermin in my house, which is a big problem in New York. Yeah, that's not a bad thing. Did you get in trouble for saying that? Yes, people don't like the idea that you get a cat to serve a purpose rather than to provide it with stability and love. See, I feel like in the 80s, so 70s everyone's going around with cheetahs and leopards, and then I feel like in the 80s maybe people 70s everyone's going around with cheetahs and leopards and then I feel like in the

80s maybe people had cats for a use. You know, a lot of poverty, a lot of vermin and then in the 90s is when it became this thing about look at my lovely accessory and also love me, love me, love me, right? I'm asking.

I don't have the fucking answers Makita. I'm the same age as you, actually. I'm a year younger. But I wasn't around in the 80s studying the relationship between human and animals, domesticated animals. That wasn't me. Was that not you?

No, that wasn't me. Is that Lily carrying out a survey of the UK, aged five? Why do you have a catch? But no, but I just mean like, I didn't have dogs when I was a kid. We got Scout when I was 30. So I'm quite new to the idea of having like a dog in the family and now a dog of my own.

And it's just wonderful. I wish I did it earlier. Anyway, Crufts. So how do I get in to Crufts crafts because it's on every year right well you're going to try and enter zeddy into crafts she's ready wait a second no but i don't think you can because she's not purebred is she what's her certificates looking like dare you how dare you she's two cockers in one yeah but have you got Huh? No, then she can't be in crafts. Well, I'll get the paperwork. They were very lovely.

No, it doesn't work like that, babes. Do you mean? I'll find out if she's pure, pure breed, and if she is, off we go. If she was pure breed, you would know about it, and you would have been given those papers as soon as you got the dog. Like, it's a serious thing. It's not the kind of thing where

you just, like, go and find a birth certificate. So wait, only pure breeds are in crafts? Yes, that's the whole point of it. Oh, God. I don't know whether that's an institution I want to get behind. It's quite colonial of you. It's a bit colonial. Only pure breeds.

So my Zeddy not good enough, yeah? My Zeddy not good enough, yeah? My Zeddy not good enough. She's so obedient though. And because she's a Cocker Spaniel show, it's in her to be a bit like obedient and showy offy. Not showy offy, she's not precocious. She's just like obedient and can do a mean little trick. But anyway.

You'd probably put her into some other shows that aren't crafts. Alternative crafts. Yeah. I met her mum. She was a Cocker Spaniel called Penny. that aren't Crufts. Alternative Crufts. Yeah. I met her mum. She was a cocker spaniel called Penny. I didn't meet the dad, but the way that he looks, I don't think there's anything else going on in her.

Good luck to you bowling up to the Crufts lady and being like, her mum's called Penny. She comes from a lovely family. She's a cocker spaniel show. I promise. I met her mum. She's called Penny. As of 2016,'s a cocker spaniel show. I promise. I met her mum. She's called Penny. As of 2016, the English cocker spaniel has been the most successful breed of crafts. Boom.

Oh, my God. We're going to be champions. That's not even what yours is. Isn't yours a cocker spaniel show? Yeah. Isn't that different? English cocker spaniel. That's me.

Okay. Oh, my God. That's a good sign awarded best in show seven times Jesus Christ I said he'd get ready for glory okay

that's enough dog chat alright so Trump Crofts I think we're done here today on that note I'll see you guys on Monday for Listen Bitch oh no I'll see you on Monday I'll see you guys on Monday for Listen Bitch. Oh no, I'll see you on Monday.

I'll see you. Will you though? Not sure. You better bring it. You better bring it on Monday. Listen bitch, I always bring it. We are talking about ghosts on this week's Listen Bitch. We are talking about ghosts. Yes. Can I just say on the subject of Listen Bitch, I know

that I asked for voice notes and I'm very grateful for people responding and for sending in their well not always questions and that is the little bit of beef that i that i have and what my new demand is that please try and limit the length of your questions i'm not really interested in stories because I can't really respond to a story, but I can respond to a question. Oh, don't cut off stories. I like the stories. A little mix of both is a perfect little combination.

Okay. You can send Makita your stories and you can send me a question, okay? It's going to get really confusing. And we're having a cap of one minute, okay? So you can set your little stopwatches. In fact, you don't have to because it tells you when you're doing the voice note how many seconds you're on.

Can I just say, don't take this personally, world. She's like this with me. I feel scared to send more than usually 15 second voice notes and I always start with, I'm sorry. I'm sorry to send a voice note, but.

Exactly. And I'm actually going to cut you off there. We're going to end the show. Okay. You've got all the power. Love you. Yeah, I love you too. Can't wait till Monday. It's going to be a goodie.

Yeah, it is. Thanks for listening to Miss Me with Lily Allen and Makita Oliver. This is a Persephoneca production for BBC Sounds. Oliver. This is a Persephonica production for BBC Sounds. Let's take a journey back to 2003. Canadian teen sensation Avril Lavigne was topping the charts and turning the music industry upside down. But what if I told you that the Avril Lavigne we know and love might not be the same Avril? What? Did Avril die? Was she replaced by a doppelganger? I'm Joanne McNally, and I'm doing a deep dive into a notorious internet conspiracy. Who replaced Avril Lavigne? Listen on BBC Sounds. Go back to school with Rogers and get Canada's fastest and most reliable internet. Perfect for streaming lectures all day or binging TV shows all night.

Save up to $20 per month on Rogers Internet. Visit Rogers.com for details. We got you. Rogers.