Modern Wisdom - #296 - Kalle Sauerland - The Life Of A Global Boxing Promoter

Episode Date: March 18, 2021

Kalle Sauerland is one of the most successful promoters in world boxing, Co-Founder of Sauerland Events and Co-Founder of the World Boxing Super Series. Boxing is a legendary sport which captures global attention, but the entire industry is held together by the promoters who make the matches and create the events we love to watch, how does it all work? Expect to learn Kalle's thoughts on Jake & Logan Paul's YouTube boxing careers, his wildest stories from press conferences, how terrifying Derek Chisora really is, when he's been most nervous before an event, what he thinks about Dana White and much more... Sponsors: Get 19% discount, 5 Free Travel Packs, Free Liquid Vitamin D and Free Shipping from Athletic Greens at https://athleticgreens.com/modernwisdom (discount automatically applied) Extra Stuff: Follow Kalle on Twitter - https://twitter.com/SauerlandBros Follow Kalle on Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/sauerlandbros  Check out the WBSS - https://worldboxingsuperseries.com/  Get my free Ultimate Life Hacks List to 10x your daily productivity → https://chriswillx.com/lifehacks/ To support me on Patreon (thank you): https://www.patreon.com/modernwisdom - Get in touch. Join the discussion with me and other like minded listeners in the episode comments on the MW YouTube Channel or message me... Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chriswillx Twitter: https://www.twitter.com/chriswillx YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/ModernWisdomPodcast Email: https://www.chriswillx.com/contact Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Oh, hello friends, welcome back. My guest today is Caller Sourland, and we're talking about what life is really like as a global boxing promoter. Caller is one of the most powerful men in all of world boxing. He's the co-founder of Sourland events. He's been behind some of the world's biggest ever fights, and he's the founder of the World Boxing Super Series. Boxing is a legendary sport, which captures global attention,

but the entire industry is held together by men like Caller, the promoters who make the matches and create the events that we all watch. I wanted to find out how it works. So today, expect to learn Caller's thoughts on Jake and Logan Paul's YouTube boxing careers, his wildest stories from press conferences, just how terrifying Derek Chazora really is, when he's been the most nervous before an event, what he thinks about Dana White and much more. This is so fun. Call us such a character.

And it's just cool. It's cool to see how an industry that we see the front of the front of house. We were very familiar with how boxes go on in the ring, but all of the stuff behind the scenes I thought was fascinating. Yeah, you're going to enjoy this one. But now it's time for the wild and wonderful, Calla Salland. for the people that aren't already familiar with you and what you do, can you give us a rundown of your history? Well, I'm first and foremost a boxing promoter,

born into a crazy boxing family. People say, how long you've been in boxing? And I say, well, I'm 43 years old now. And I believe that my first babysitter when I was two was, it was was it was actually a world champion at the time. So I had babysitters as boxes as a teenager I worked in gyms in the summer or when I bumped off school my adopted godfather was the late and great Denny Manseany who ran Lonsdale started Lonsdale and a little shop down before Londstale became big and a little shop down near Khanovies Street, Big Street in the Soho in London. And used to skygove school, just hang around a little shop and watch the characters coming

and out of the shop. It was everything from your East End gangsters to your world champions to your to your bin men We've got to the weekend and we're picking up some reps. So you know, it's it's it you know boxing is often Seniors a very glamorous sport a very murky sport a very califull sport and you know this you know, I've got to say in my 2.5 decades in the sport of actually working in it and actually my early days I worked a lot in football as well. It's just the characters that make it, you know, it's just the characters.

We are on paper, we're an unregulated sport, you know, anyone can become a boxing promoter tomorrow, you've got to be in the, you've got to get your British sport of boxing control license, but the questions aren't tough as to answer. Actually, I don't even analyze my brothers the license promoter. So I've only done the test. So I don't know how easy the questions are. Maybe I've failed. But no, we certainly, we know we've promoted all over the world from last year in Japan. Actually, I'm getting all these lockdowns. I wasn't even last year. It was the end of the year, but just before pandemic hit, feels like last year.

2020 is a right off. Yeah, we did 22,000 people in Tokyo, 18 million viewers in front of the television. We've done Moscow. We've been, you know, all over the world. We've promoted, we've promoted in more countries than any other promotion on the planet. And it's a rollercoaster ride and it's great fun. It's great fun. Different job of promotion, we've never specialised in, or I've never specialised in one market I've believed in promoting all over the world.

And it's great. When you travel with boxing, you see the different cultures around it in the different places you visit. But it's a world that has many stories and many stories we can touch on when we have this hour. What makes a good boxing promoter, if you're going to design one in a lab, what are those sort of personality traits and the characteristics that you give them? The first thing is you have to be totally and utterly mad.

That's the first part. You have to be prepared to devote your life. And when I say your life, I've had situations where I've flown to wonderful parts and the planet, the wonderful week in the sunshine, a little, you know, one of those ocean villas, you know, said it all up nice week. The second I've stepped in after a 16 hour flight, I've had a call off my lawyer and said, it's all going off in America. Different times, oh, so you never know when it's going to hit you, you're basically a firefighter. So these great shows, these big shows, you see,

there's such a timeline and I can't think of any big show that there's not, you know, there's not murders around it. And there's not going to be murders in the obvious sense. I mean, murders in terms of work and the, you know, the arguments you have with, you know, someone's as fight as you sign for something up, you know, for certain amount of money, then they argue about the money afterwards or it's the other promoters taking a liberty or it's the trainer who wants to change the date because, you know, trainers trainers are trainers they want to know they're already interested in the sporting side of it but ultimately you're putting on a massive event that is seen all over the world you know boxing is something that

transcends any demographic you know there's kids who love boxing there there's grandpiles and great grandpiles who love boxing and great grandmothers who love boxing actually So it's it's something that you need to dedicate your life to you can't say I'm gonna do it You know sort of as a bit of a laugh and can be a manager advisor and do that. Yeah, that's cool but if you are a promoter and you're promoting shows, especially at the highest level, you need to dedicate yourself 100% and you have to accept that. Yet family first, of course, but boxing is a close second for me,

and it always will be, if not on par, and it's a huge commitment. And it's not something that you can just think you're walking and making a quick back out of, because that ain't gonna happen. There's enough people who fall and flat on their faces, clever people, very, very clever people in other businesses who fall boxing so all those millions of dollars we hear about. But I tell you, you've got to take them all as they come and unfortunately, you know, sometimes you need to get knocked down to the floor

and stand up and shake yourself off and go and have a round, even as a promoter. He always sounds so easy and so brilliant on paper, but there's some very, very tough times on that road as well. Other than fighting fires and trying to sort of the people shit out, what's your job supposed to be? What are you actually supposed to do? Because I hear about this, Boxing's an iconic supposed to be? What are you actually supposed to do? Because I hear about this, boxing's an iconic sport, right?

And everyone hears it. Even on the TV, we get to see behind a curtain a tiny bit as the audience that the fight's been made. You know, that's like a sentence that you hear. And you're like, well, what do you mean? Like what's your job? What do you do? What do you do?

Okay, well, I'll start with the actual, what does a promoter do? It's no different to a concert promoter. The difference is we booked two acts or two acts though, are gladiators. They are people who want to take each other's heads off. And we sign these two up. We book a venue. We sell the television, media rights.

These days, the online rights, the OTT rights, as you call them. There's a sponsorship, there's obviously the tickets and you hope that what you're paying the two gladiators is slightly less than what you're taking in, but it's not always the case, you know, fighters will tell you now it's always the case, but it certainly isn't always the case. So you've got a bus to go over that, but then there's moving obstacles along the way as well. But on paper, that's all we do. We book two acts, which is two gladiators in our case,

book of NU and sell the rights and sell the tickets. So it sounds very simple on paper, Chris. But at the end of the day, when you hear promoter say, oh, you know, these negotiation, if it's a fight, are very easy to make if both want to tango. So you've got two guys who want to get in a real old girls these days, they're increasingly popular and great, and becoming a great sport female boxing. But if you've got two fires who want to fight and they're realistic and reasonable about it,

you do it very quickly. I remember doing David Haye versus Nikolai Valorov. I remember if you remember, it was the beast from the east, a big rush and giant, the first ever rush and everyweight world champion, David Haye. And they've been talking for ages and we're supposed to fight the clinch goals, there were one clinch goal rubber, they were talking for months and months and months. I was in London, I was staying in the Doolchester, I called up the manager at the time of David

Haye, Adam Booth, very bad reputation for being the dark lord, the mega, mega fussy guy, and I'm thinking, right, I might as well meet him on the off chance, they haven't done a deal with it, which goes, yeah, we met for an espresso in the bar, wasn't even a gin and tonic, and at the end of the espresso, we had a deal, we had a deal on at least verbally. We had a deal. And I went off and I had one of them. It was a massive event. It was one of the biggest pay-per-views at the time. David vs. Goliath, and it launched the heavyweight career of David Haye. We went on to co-promote for many years afterwards. But it was, you know, it was, it was, but it shows the reason I use that example

when people talk about how difficult it is to make fights, of course, we're all difficult characters in boxing. We know that. That's why we're in boxing. But we all, if you all want something, you make it happen. So, you know, I think some of it is ego, you know, it's some of it's ego,

you've got some of step over your own ego. So luckily, I can see my shadow via my ego, but, you know, I'm not an enchant named, so there are some that they're tricky to nubbers, but at the end of the day, it's not rocket science, you know. We didn't go to university to become a boxing promoter, and you don't need to either. In fact, I'd like to see the statistic on how many promoters actually went to university. That would have a degree, yeah, that would be an interesting one. So what did deals get held up by? If you can do one in the space of an espresso, what are the most common reasons that you can't make a fight? Okay, on the top, top, top level, normally those fighters are contracted to different networks.

So, you know, one might be with ESPN in the States and the other one might be on Fox in the States, the other one might be on Sky in the UK or BT in the UK. So then you've got to work out. Those are obviously very important partners and that's the trickiest part to those fighters and their promoters. So to suddenly say, sorry, broadcast partner, on this fight, you can't have it because we're going to the competition.

It's of course a difficult discussion to have. But if you look at probably the biggest financial, the biggest commercial fight in history was Pacquiao Mayweather. And there at the time, the thing they got the fight done was it was HBO and Showtime, the two biggest networks. They've been arguing for years, massive, massive commercial enemies. And they said, come on, we both show it, we open it up and we, and it worked and guess what? It was known as the billion dollar fight, wasn't it? I mean, it was a terrible fight, but the buildup was good, wasn't it? So, you know, it's always a solution and, you know, I think broadcasters would rather

there be a solution or maybe share rights, be non-exclusive, but actually see the fight happen. And you know, in the last few years, I've been running the World Boxing Super Series as the Chief Boxing Officer, the main person on the sporting side of things. And we put on the greatest fights in the last few years, become known as the Champions League of Boxing, because we go out and take the boxes out of there

or borrow the boxes as such, out of their contracts and have managed to create some, you know, year before last, but they were still before the pandemic. We had, out of the five fights of the year globally, we had the number one and the number three, you know, but we only promote, was it, 10 shows that year, some promote, some promote 50 shows, you know, probably a thousand big shows that year, worldwide, but that we managed to do it with so few, but if you bring the best

against the best, it's always worth doing in any sport. And that was off philosophy. That is off philosophy at the World Box and Super Series. So you know, it depends a little bit on what your ambition is. And sometimes, you know, fights don't get made because it's easy to fight a lesser opponent, pay less for him. You know, we'll work out the mathematics. So you often see big

champions taking these your own sometimes and that's the shape of the sport but people still watch. It seems crazy how many different parties you have to juggle. It seems like you're the sort of keystone in the middle of a bridge with about a million other stones that are a part of it. So you've got the broadcaster, you've got the trainer, you've got the athlete, you've got where are they on their journey, what's their trajectory, who have they just fought, what's their record like, what's the person that they're about to fight. And this is all multiplied by two because you've got two different parties coming in. It must be very difficult to kind of blend all that together. Yeah, but Chris is, and the thing it's it's got a lot more complicated because

let's go back, let's rewind sort of you know people don't watch boxing too much think about Rocky the film Rocky you know Rocky as a trainer you know maybe as a cut man in the corner there's a broadcaster and the time and let's say the 70s 80ss in the US, it was other than NBC, ABC. It wasn't really much of much of a choice. You got signed out and the fight was done and everyone fought each other. It wasn't complicated. Now on both sides, so if I go to the boxer, the way that boxing is evolved as a sport, the training is completely different. So you don't have one trainer. You know, the top stars don't just have a trainer. You know, the training is now broken up between the boxing training, which might even be, by the way, separate fees. There might be technical side of things,

power side of things, strategy, but you also have a dedicated strength and conditioning coach. That might also be broken up into two things, by the way, that might be strength on the conditioning side. You don't have the nutritionist side of things, then you have the physiotherapist side. By the way, these are all voices at the table. They might not be directly the table, but I remember, for example, Michael Kessler, very famous boxer from the Scandinavian, one of the best super middle-weight, to recent history.

He had a physio, a great physio, by the way, but he had just as much impact on the boxer and his decisions as his manager. So, you know, let's say the people at the table with a voice is much bigger. You've got, you've now got managers, advisors, agents, you know, there's a new name every day for something. They've entered the market somehow, which is normal in any sport, football as well, you know, where there's money and professional sport, you're always going to get that element and some are good and some are not so good.

Then you look, then you look on the other side of what we handle, so that's the money out, right? That's the money I've got to get the act, as we said before, the gladiator. So that's my deal with him. But then I'm going to go recruit my money. Who's that? That's of course the tickets, but that's actually the easiest part of it. And but the the broadcasings side of things hold on. We used to just have, you know, the 80s, you just, you standard channels. Then we came to the 90s satellite television, the agent digital. But so you had, you know,

you started getting UK red sky sports suddenly, you know, sky sports then went digital. So suddenly it wasn't sky sports, one of the sky sports went to the pre-4. Then we got now, we've had BTN, so on the paid television side of things, we're using very much UK examples, but you could look also in the States, ESPN expanding, you could look in in in in other in in other markets, everyone will see it in their own countries, but on top of that now, we've got these huge streaming services, you know, which are by the way, fantastic value, and they're really carving the market up now and making it very tricky for the traditional broadcasters. You look at the zone, for example, massive impact in the US, to Germany, Spain, and Italy.

And now they've launched globally. So you've actually got a platform which is global and showing boxing all over the world on one platform. It's a fantastic tool when for boxing fans, it's the greatest thing since it's sliced bread. But yeah, I mean yesterday even even recently as yesterday that Triller, also a new social media platform pops up and and makes a huge impact in the sport, you know, promoted recently they had the whatever one thinks of it, but the, let's say, the old man boxing with Tyson versus Jones, which, you know, you might like it or not, but it did, I believe it did 1.6 million buys.

Yeah, so, you know, that's decent numbers for a couple of old fellas. It's Snoop Dogg, he dog said, what did he say in his commentary? He was like, what's my two uncles having a fight? And then, LAUGHTER So, you know, but it sells. And you've got these YouTubers now.

And, you know, I've been quite vocal about that. I think it's okay. I think it's good to see YouTubers who want to take up a sport like boxing. It's like, I'd let my kid box, you know, I would, you know, I think it's a great sport to keep fit. But if you want to take it further, it's a great sport to keep fit, but if you want to take it further, it's a great sport as well, to have confidence into the fields and to defend yourself.

But what they've done is, some of them are actually taking it quite seriously. I have a lot of respect for that. I don't like this boxer versus YouTuber, because I find it ridiculous, but the YouTube versus the YouTube, I don't know if I've got respect for that, if they had proper counts, why not? And it brings a total audience that is great for us is of course the younger fans. I was going to say that must be, you've got Jake Paul against Ben Askerin coming up, Ben's a wrestler, although he's an Olympian, he's a wrestler. You know what Chris, you know more about the me. Yeah, so that's the next one. You've got Logan Paul and Mayweather, which has just been pushback, and then you have his younger brother,

and you have an Olympic wrestler. Now Ben's criticized sometimes for his striking, and I think that's what makes that fight slightly interesting, but you totally correct. Ben's criticized sometimes for his striking. I think that's what makes that fight slightly interesting, but you totally correct. Has there been in the sort of purest boxing community, I imagine there must have been some pushback. It's seen as like this noble art, the sweet science. Where's your stance on this?

Do you think that these YouTube boxing events should be allowed? I think if they are YouTubers against YouTubers and they have a camp and they've got themselves a license, I, sorry, there's no, what's the difference between someone off the street who wants to start to become a boxer? I mean, it's always ever a reasonable wage to get license. Absolutely. Go for it. Go for it.

I mean, it's great. But then box people on an obvious level So a youtuber fighting another youtuber has only done the training and everything and I was I was fortunate or unfortunate enough to wake up with my son and watch the Was it KSI against um against Paul fight? I mean Listen as I said in my teens I hang around James. I've seen all sorts. Yeah, I thought myself. I mean, listen, as I said, in my teens, I hang around James, I've seen all sorts. I thought myself, I was a terror, I had two left hands,

and unfortunately I'm not a Southport. So, I've seen boxing at all levels, and it was entertaining. I thought I actually care, so I was quite athletic. I think that's below, but the pools are clearly But you know, it's obviously levels off Floyd me Well, you know, I mean, that's like me saying yeah, I had a bit played a bit of tennis back in the day I'm gonna probably better off and I do a three month camera of challenging you, you know Roger Federer and me You know, we'll do it down down down a region's part will book a call. That's it. You know, I mean, you know seriously

That that that part, he sent a team, although if they want to do it, then do it, but it's not boxing, you know. But listening makes probably makes a lot of number sense. But what's the difference between that, a YouTuber fighting a YouTuber, and a YouTuber fighting a boxer then, is your concern for the safety of the YouTuber,

or is it something more kind of sacred about the fact that Mayweather shouldn't be going down to the level of someone that's just a YouTuber? I think that, first of all, it's so unrealistic that unless that boxer, in this is moving the case, may whatever's case, unless he toys with him and I don't know, throws his panties at 30%. I think it's bloody dangerous. I think it's bloody dangerous. I think that it's not tennis. The example I use with federal was a bit of a laugh, but it's a thing that if you've ever stood in a ring and I've been in a ring with, as I mentioned before, as a terrible

gym fighter, that's how I would describe myself, I wouldn't call myself an amateur, as a terrible gym fighter, who liked a bit of a tear up as a kid. I remember being in a ring with my old coach actually. He was a pro, he was an army special, he was a decent, I don't say nothing special, it's still a great credit to him, it was a British level pro, and to retire with certain medical reasons early and became a trainer, Clare Sh'Shaif, great, great, trainer. And I remember him sparring with me. It wasn't even, he was toying with me. And would you go on and send it, is the sweet science?

If you can box properly, you won't come near me. You won't be able to even land lever in my area. Yeah. And I'm a tenant. Oh, in my right, I was, I was 19, 20 years old, lots of testosterone in me, and I was giving it a real go, and I was probing my right. I just remember him just moving and dropping me with a body shot, and the body shot for people who don't know, is aimed at at the liver which has the direct impact of

cutting your skin to the brain about two seconds later so you stand and then dumb you go to the floor and it was how it's out of wall okay that prospect of a pro contract is definitely gone probably didn't help that other turbo hang over from the night before, and for Liverpool certainly felt it. And it was my memory, you know, that, as always, they were me. So when you see these journey men in the ring and you think, oh, rubbish, yeah, that journey man, that if you stood with him, you wouldn't get near it, right? So to say, as, and once again, credit to the YouTube, I'll be very harsh on other interviews about them, but I do give them credit for the training they put in,

because I mean, the care side was in the condition of his life that Paul, like I said, seems to be, you know, into what he is. Oh, I think he's a bit of a knob when he goes and talks or really just respects fires, I think that's disgusting, and I think he deserves to be put in his place. But the realism of him and Floyd Mayweber, who is once again not my ex British level pro trainer

and you know, this is Floyd Mayweber. This is arguably, well, now definitely the greatest defensive boxer of all time. So what on earth are you doing in a ring with him in your, in your, what is he, his second profile, and by the way, just, just, just to put this on paper, he lost his first profile against KSI. So he's got, he's got a record of not one, and he's fighting the greatest defensive boxer of all time. Okay. Ricky happened by the way. Ricky happened a legend, a great fighter, got not the fuck out by Mayweber. Now you tell me Logan Paul and Ricky at now have been covering the boxery, nothing, apart from they both have two legs.

That's it. There's no other similar. They don't even have the same hands. They don't even have the same hands. So Logan Paul, give it a go. Don't mow off about fighters when you are a YouTuber. Let's get that straight, you are a YouTuber. But you're very good at YouTube being, but maybe be another YouTuber first and then cool out, I don't know, cool

out the local area champion, maybe, you know, greatest of all time, and then talk crap about him as well. So it's, but once again, I get it. It's for business and it's fine. I just hope that Floyd has one hand take behind his back at the time and Floyd has the other hand take behind his head at the time. He'll still win.

Then it might be a fair fight. He's still win because the other way, if he wanted to, wouldn't they one glove on him, even without hands? So, you know, so, and do I see it? I think it's, I think it's great that these guys are, they are making an effort to train. It's not like they go in there, you know, they do put their, they put, do put the time in the gym and, you know, that's all good, but they should be fighting at levels which is entertaining for us, you know, I'm not saying I was super

entertained, I was a purist by watching KSI loan call, but I respected it. I respected it. And I let my son watch it. I let him pay his five euro in pocket money for it. You know. Yeah, but if it brings that younger audience in, I imagine that for you guys down the line, where are they going to be if they watch Mayweather Logan Paul and they love it. And then they think, well, actually, this boxing stuff's all right. And then in, they go to their local gym and then maybe they start paying for your pay per views

because they get into the more pure side of stuff. I think what you've identified there is, it's kind of what everyone has in the back of their mind, which is that the golf in ability between anyone that hasn't been a boxer since they were a kid and dedicated their entire life to it. And even the worst pro is probably absolutely massive. And we don't really realize that because obviously when you see Mayweather Pacquiao, they both make it look so effortless. But we might see probably for the first time, I think, someone

who's like a proper noob, you know, like a, a, a normie stepping into the ring with, as you say, someone who's essentially a ghost. Yeah. And, but, let's see, I mean, even, even Conor McGregor, may whatever, was, was a fast. Yeah. I mean, it was a fast that sold a shitload of pay-per-views. It sold and it was a spitting, I watched it, but I mean Conner's a great fighter in terms of fighting, he's a mixed martial arts expert. Oh, I'm not much lost. Sorry, Connor.

Mixed, mixed martial arts expert. And any, any, let's face it, he's, he's been the face of the UFC for the last five years, you know, we're not losing, you know, don't matter, you know, it's Connor McGregor, you know, he's the most recognizable face in the history that UFC have to see by a mile, by a mile. And the only probably actually, probably the only fighter, I would say that has transgressed beyond the brand of those three letters. He's the only one if he walked down Oxford Street, if everyone would pick out. George Sampire, you could argue back it back a few years, but when he walked down on his Australia I don't think he would get stopped by a mob. McGregor certainly would alone by the way he walks. But now I'm digressive from the question. So how do I

see it? Once again I've referred to that fight because that is a fight between a great fighter and a great boxer and it was in a way of interesting spectacle. Did maywever let him have a few rounds to make it more interesting? I'm pretty sure he did. You think so? I'm pretty sure he did. Maywever is a genius.

He is an absolute genius in a ring. There's not been no fight or life ever. Not in terms of being exciting going forward, but he, I mean, he developed the shoulder roll. I don't, he developed the shoulder roll, which if anyone doesn't know what a shoulder roll is, it's when you lift your shoulder up, almost as a third hand to protect your chin. You know, he would ride punches and shoulders. I mean, you know, he did things in the defensive, so, but specifically in opposition like Oscar de la Hoia, like did things in the defensive, so, but this was against opposition like Oscar De La Jolla, like Ricky Hatner, I just mentioned, like, there was Canelo Alvarez.

I mean, he scored Canelo Alvarez, yeah, and Canelo Alvarez wasn't a baby then by the way. He was an up and come, but he wasn't a baby. This is the greatest fight on the planet at the moment. Canelo Alvarez and Maywever scored him, but now Mayweather knows how we get old, it's a 50-50 against Logan Paul. You said that Mayweather's the best defensive fighter of all time, who's the best offensive fighter of all time in your opinion? I think the mainstream would always go with Mike Tyson.

You know, I mean, it's difficult to not, I mean, once I talked about the shoulder roll, Mike Tyson, developed the peak of a star, which was famously built by customarter from the Greatest Train of All Time, where he was very famously put across the ring of wire between the two corners and would duck up and down between this, underneath this wire, and that was the star he developed, behind the two hands and these ferocious hooks that came out of it. I mean, Mike Tyson really threw a jab. So you'd probably have to go with Tyson. Yeah, I think Mike Tyson is the equivalent in the offensive

style here. Talking about the UFC, what's your opinions on Dana White and what he's doing. Have you ever met him? I think I've had nothing to do with UFC. In my life, I looked at it from the outside. I think that it's a great organization, the way they've built the sport. I mean, mustn't forget the story of real life with the petiteer brothers and Dana and what a fantastic job. I mean, I just look at it as a let's say a sports entrepreneur and forget the boxing promote out on for a second.

And it's fantastic isn't it? I mean, they took a sport that was unregulated, in debt and didn't exist and was partly illegal and turned it into a $4.2 billion brand. I mean, what more is there to, for me, to say, whether Dana White's an idiot or whether he's a great guy, I just pulled my hat to him for that. So I couldn't comment on what I think Dana White too much. I think he's great value at a press conference.

I like his style. And I think when you see him with the athletes, you can tell that he lives it, he breathes it. I'm sure he could have taken an easy exit off of the sale, he didn't, which I think has kept the brand where it is, because it was very things of the seller for a sport that hasn't got that history to sunny off and disappear. And Dana's definitely done a great job post sale, pre-sell those 50 to brothers, though for me modern day geniuses in sport.

I mean, what they did with the brand, you have to look at it, they had a, they had a, you can think and say, oh, well, they can do this, they could have done that. Well, if they picked a sport where they had cart blotch, I mean, the ratings are created by themselves. The whole environment is self-controlled. And I don't think it's a coincidence

that there was no major brand as a fighter that came out. It was always about the three letters and boxing is very different to that. As promoters, world boxing super series or team Sourlin, Eddie Hearn with Matt Room or Bob Aaron, you know, let's face it, who gives a shit about us, yeah? So let's not take ourselves too seriously with our brands. No one cares, people want the gladiators, they want the fighters, you know, it's not about the promote, the promote, yeah, we can sometimes we can be quite funny, we can make, you know, arguments, we can, can you know it's a bit of pants and all that stuff but at the end of the day Fox is about the two gladiators it's about the

greatest fights the best versus the best you know and in UFC it's always been about it's a UFC fight you know it's not the mainstream sitting at bar. I've been out often by being in the bar in the state sat the bar all of the beer you have see on the tele and I have no idea who's fighting. I don't have a club and I don't know much about you. I see anyways But you sit in your watch and it's you and it and it and it You can get into it. Yeah, it's For me, it's as a sport. It's so technical, and I mean, this is a compliment,

but it's too technical. If I don't understand, like the holes, I find it very difficult. My brother does Fujitsu, for example. Roger Gracie, there's not my brother, but he does Roger Gracie a crazy school of jiu-jitsu. So, but in S U doing, you don't know what hold is going on. And for me, they're just rolling around in a pair of Spandex boxers shorts,

and my cup of tea. And that for me is very complex to watch. I like boxing because I can be after sleep on the couch with one eye open, watch the street and I still understand it's man against man stand up tear up. Do you know? Do you think that this is? You go down and there's a couch. I think you have seen fascinating though.

I think it's fascinating, but I find it a wonder and once again, credit to the to the to the to others and then teachers and then white for creating a Spectacle out of sport that is so technical that actually for the mainstream it's impossible to follow You know, yeah, when they you know when they finished a fight and they jump on each other and all that They think that you get but to get to that point and you speak to the professionals About the holds about what's going on on the inside. It's impossible to fight. I mean, everyone's way over the lines. I've never done jujitsu, I've never done a lot of wrestling

on the pavement, but I wouldn't, I'm living tall wrestling, so I wouldn't know the holds. You know, you wouldn't know, it's not a street fight. This is a technical, every move when they're on top of each other, it's like chess, it's fascinated, but it's chess don't sell because it's too complicated. So, you know, and people say, this thing might say, I'm working in blood sport, be so complicated. Well, I tell you something, it's the chess and fight sports, huge similarities, huge similarities,

massive. And I've worked with a lot of Russian fighters and he's the block fighters and big test players, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big

test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not saying a big test player, I'm not to a very old Russian trainer about 10 years ago, we were on a camp in somewhere near Siberia. And I mean, even in the sauna, and then we got out and have a watch and play chess. And he would explain to me,

there's not much difference with a fight in chess. You got your pawn, the jab, you know, you got the, when to, when to, when you, when you make your move, when you're faint, so there's lots of different things that, and I don't know if this is gonna sound ridiculous for some people listening, but it's the most intellectual school boxing, you know?

I'm not saying all of us fans of boxing are the most intellectual people of all time, but we appear to all sorts, you know, but as a sport, as a component sport, when it comes to fitness, strength, mental, ability, strategy, there's no other sport that covers that amount of components. There's no other sport where if you take your eye of what you're doing for one second, I love, I like, I like, I like a random golf, I like a love golf, I'm terrible at it and I hate it when I'm on the course, but I love it when I'm on the course. But when you hit that ball, you know, if anyone plays golf, they will understand that to take straight the ball is takes so many different things that you

are thinking about once. But if you screw it up, okay, worst case you have to pull out or more to and then drop to and whatever. So okay, but you can save the round. You can go up and birdie and eagle the next hole. You take your eye off the bicycle one second in boxing. The very good chance you end up in hospital. So that's the issue. You know, that's the thing. And imagine taking that focus required and at the same time, physically drained,

mentally drained, heaps get into you. You're being punched the whole time, you're blocking. You know, it's, it's hell. And I'm going to make a sit, the only sport for me that comes close to it is downhill skiing. The similarities of boxing and downhill skiing is phenomenal. You have to fight the mountain, you're getting bumped the whole time, you're getting, you've got a ice comes, your ski goes, but you're going at 120, you're going down, you're not going down a piece, you're going down, I get down, I'm pretty much down a cliff, where which by the way in the morning before the sun comes up, they've layered with water so you're actually on ice,

sheet ice. I mean, it's from it's a phenomenal sport downhill skiing, phenomenal sport and that is the that's the closest similarity in sports I can see with boxing now. Formula 1 you can argue, you can argue Formula 1 you get but my argument there would be, first of all, the Formula One these days is a lot different to the Formula One 70s and the 80s. It in a good way as well because it was probably two dangers at a time. But at the same time, you've got a huge team guiding you through that. When you're a fighter or a downhill skier, you are out there alone. You can have the best

promo in the world. You have the best coaches I've been discussed before. You can have the best media campaign for Kispop and everyone gets out of that ring and everyone. It's just you and the other guy or the other girl. That moment is something that I think why boxing is the only pay-per-view sport, the only fight sport or any sport actually, there's no other sport that works on pay-per-view. They're tried football, they tried to primarily actually turn lockdown. The biggest moment of the country was that they charge us for individual matches, pay-per-view matches. They go flat on its face.

Boxes is the only sport that we buy as an individual event. People say, oh, what can that be? Why is the mosaic? I think it's quite simple. Your pain, and it sounds horrible, but your pain for the suffering of this guy will go going through hell, not only in that fight, but you need to see what happens in a fight camp. They do weeks and weeks, they've got months and months of sparring,

all different types. They go on, they're creating, people talking my Iron Man and full respect to it, to get it, to get it, to get it, to get it. Going to a boxing fight camp and see what a fighter goes through. Making weight, making weight while trying to still gain muscle, bodybuilders listening, the hardest thing in the world, lose weight, gain muscle, as that work, you know, it pretty much impossible, but that's the, you know, bodybuilding you actually, it's absolutely never aint, but, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, unfortunately, being an increased level of, of, of dopeing your boxing, but that's the pressure of the sport, and you know, I think it's unfortunately being an increased level of doping and boxing, but that's the pressure of the sport. And, you know, I think it's a problem that you're going to see that's because a strict testing

is stricter and strict, and it's also the reason why, you know, certain people are getting found out. And it will put people off. We need to come up with lifetime bands, you know, 100%. We need to, we need to, in Germany, for example, the boxing is actually, it's a sport where where, which I think if you enter this, there's certain substances which are, you know, increasing your ability to take a punch, yeah. I mean, that's pretty much like suicide. What's the stuff? So, so so you can take those stuff.

I remember actually Mario's back. He took it again. So I don't know what I don't know what the name. I'm not an expert on coping, but but he took it again. He's clueless and was pounded into a hospital. It basically keeps your senses going. Shit. But if you think about what it's for like it chaos your body's protection, right? I was just about to say, a KO, it sounds terrible now, but a KO is actually almost healthy.

I mean, doctors, this one was saying it's stupid boxing from out of here. It's healthy in the sense that it's the body shutting down. It's game over, right? I know it's not healthy, so don't come at me and tell me I'm talking shit. I'm not talking shit. The way the body says, it's not healthy, so don't come at me and tell me I'm talking shit, I'm not talking shit. The way the body says, it's game over. And imagine taking something that says, you can pound me and I'm not going to go, okay, I mean, it's super dangerous for yourself, but there's people doing that.

And, you know, like wise, if I take a strength performance enhancing, well, driving it, which is ultimately performance enhancing, whatever you want to call it, it's a drag. And you're taking these strength drugs, you're basically going in there with a loaded gun, aren't you? You know, like me, you say, come on, let's have a water pistol fight and you turn up with a magnet, right? Fully cocky load, we would be dumbed on bullets, you know? So, that's what it is. So for me, when it comes to bat type and you have to differentiate, there's a big difference between a dogbo who's using it to cut weight. Yeah. Not, not, that's,

of course, it should be bad, but the bad must be different for someone who is using it for actually going into a ring it's the same but we'll put the whole show in my glove, there's a difference if I'm taking something and there's proven scientific reports which show the strength difference and the boxing isn't a sport by the way of muscle. So if you see a guy with muscles done necessarily, worry, his power, I can show you boxes that look like rakes, which are definitely not beach bodies who would smash holes in the guy with muscles. It's totally relevant, but there are strength enhancing drugs. Actually, there was a boxer, Erkann Tepfer, name him Shanein,

a Turkish German fighter, he fought against David Price, I'll fight him. And he hit him, knocked him out of him two rounds. And I was speaking off of, I might make this guy. He looked like someone who would have been, who spent his life working in a cabab shop. I mean, his body looked like it was terrible. But you see, having weights like that and their feet

is a fiddle, you know? But this guy, he was on a bar, I remember sitting there waiting in the doping control with David and him, David was devastated. I'm just looking at these guys and he's too cocky for his own good. They found a steroid factory in his flat. So he got his depositive for strength. And that for me is a case of what's the difference between that and taking off horseroom, putting

him in my old school, like you see in the films, you don't have the cartoons to put an old show in my hand. And mate, you see, if you punch someone on the street, what can you get done for, A, B, A, to get three years? Yeah. You go someone on the street with a knuckle dust there, your punch, you're going to go down for up to seven years. What's the difference? In boxing should be exactly the same thing. If it's a strength enhancing drug, put them away. Put them away. Simple as that.

But you need to, we're in a day and age of where you need to quantify the punishments according to the drug. And it's not about, well, doping this. Doping is not welcome at all in boxing. And in fact, we've invested, as a company, we've invested hundreds and hundreds of thousands a year in doing these tests.

We were the first promoters in the 90s who started vada testing. We did in training tests. We were the first promoters on Planet Earth to do it. And I remember the time we had, I said we were going to do it. We were lovely, good people, we were actually the time we were made to do it by our broadcast partner. It was when all the cycling kicked off, all the EBO staff.

And we did it, it cost us an arm and a leg, but we had a clean conscience. And actually, to be fair, in 10 years, I think we caught two people. One of them, we're fucking weed. I'm like, mate, balding for stupidity. I mean, our stupid, I mean, listen, I get these some drivers wanna take before a fight. Weed is not one of them.

Yeah, that's for sure, man, that's for sure. So, I mean, what are you saying? You're supposed to join in constant brewing, I mean, what are you doing? Smokes are joining us to the ring, I mean, so you do get some lunatics, but on the whole, as boxing got a doping problem, no. Are they doping us in boxing? Absolutely, any professional sport, will they get caught eventually?

Well, yeah. And they need to get the front book thrown in. Going back to your side of the gig, is there a particular event that you've been most nervous before, a particular performance that you've had ready to go? I mean, that's some crazy ones over the years. I mean, let me think of some nervous ones. I mean, I had, I remember one,

wasn't nervous before the event, it was only during the event. We did the first heavyweight championship of the world in Switzerland. So it was the first ever World Heavyweight Championship to take place in Switzerland, not place with sociable boxing, although Muhammad Ali did actually boxing, Zerik.

So we did it together with my partner at the time Don King, who most people know, the guy with the tallest hair on the planet, and what a character I can give you a whole list of stories about Don King. But this one's one that stood out because we've done this event it was the first ever event that didn't know much about boxing and you know Switzerland's not a cheap place so the tickets were very expensive and there were about three four thousand for the VIP tickets we still get you a glenite a glass champagne and a bit of fog off but you know it's still about the show so we had a big pop act on. I think it was rolling, Keating, and we were singing it at the fight. We heard the lasers going off. Anyway, so the fight starts, and it was, it was, it was Baluat, who we talked about earlier, the bit is huge.

It was, it's seven foot three heavyweight champion, the biggest heavyweight champion of all time. And he's fighting the American rule drumming my clients. So the Swiss are sitting there watching, you know, they've been money that watched this fight. Second round, my clients thrown a punch, totally missed, totally missed, slipped on the canvas on our sponsor logo. So I'm thinking, oh my God, right. And I've seen him go. I've been a bit of training myself, so I'd recognize straight away what he done. He'd done his meniscos, he was, he was going over, it was no way, he was getting back up, there was no fight on. It was, it was over, you know, it was, it was, he was gone, you know, he couldn't continue.

So I'm still thinking, oh my god, no, whoa. So Don has jumped up and anyone who doesn't see Don, he always carries his flags and Don will sweep in the flags and shout and scream and and say, an amazing, amazing, and I'm thinking, oh my God, how are we gonna explain this? Like this can happen in box, I mean, can happen in any spot, I guess, but you know, better it can slip and he swisses and he,

so you know, break his ankle in the women and final, God forbid, but it can slip on these switches, isn't it? So you can, you know, break his ankle in the women and final. It's gone for a bit, but it can all happen. But I'm standing there in the press of Rust over and luckily, Don has stood up and taken the lead. Frickle, I don't know what to say. And he's like, did you see that, guys? Did you see that? And I'm thinking, did you see what, I'm thinking,

did I just slip on the canvas. He punched him. It was a delayed effect. I mean, he hadn't eaten about 20 seconds before the incident. It was a delayed effect. It was the punch, the sucker punch from Russia with love. And he's waving the flags and they're going, but the thing was he couldn't sell ice to the

Eskimos all day long. They lacked it up. The people were, so he turned this this feeling to this fable punch from Russia with love. And I'm thinking now this is just too much. And I've got so many stories we've done over the years. That was one of the most nervous moments that I can get jumps out on me, but plenty, plenty, plenty. I also remember the first time I was in my late 20s, I flew to Russia. And, you know, my first time in Russia, I was trying to sign the Olympic champion at the time, heavyweight champion Alexander Pavekhin. And in the process of doing it, I had to make big eyes. And, you know, let's put this way. They were, they were, they were one exactly businessman.

Let's put it that way. And I was taken out to this remote village back an hour outside Moscow. My phone suddenly went like no more certain signal. I suddenly saw a red eyes, they're using scrambs so you couldn't even get, get service in the area. It was all, you know, it was proper movie stuff. And I'm thinking, where were they, where am I? I ended up staying there for about a week, applied with vodka at the greatest time, became home with the contract. But it was stepping into the unknown.

I mean, it was Russia, yeah, I had a translator flew over with me. But it was one of those many situations of boxing throws you into. You know, in the late 20s, it was the first time I've been in Russia. It was, it wasn't like it was a trip around the Red Square and a bit of a mild wine. It was straight out to somewhere of remote, which no one knew, and it would like to disappear for three days. Talking about boxes and the way that you deal with them, you are present at most of the press conferences and there's always a couple of highlights. I know that you've worked with

some names in the past that have been pretty fiery. Have you had something that have been superbly hard to control or any press conferences that have really gone too bad for you? Loads, I mean, you know, there's the famous one, you know, can I swear on you? I probably have probably no. So yeah, I'm the famous one, Chris, you banked Jr. and the Turkish promoter, Ahmed Oner, the way he turned around and had a fight with the security guard and pulled his, you know, went over almost headbutted each other, then he went back, took his blazer off, and rolled up his sleeves, and then told him he was going to fuck his wife. If anyone hasn't seen it, it's sincerely rolling cameras live on German television. And if you haven't seen it, it is worth a watch on YouTube, so I'm going to find it. But the character without any question that I have promoted over the years, he was second,

he's human and there's no one else, you must get him, there's one and only Derek Chazura. The stuff that I have went through with Delboon and I love Delon. You know, he was I used to call him my awful Tereblor. You know, he absolutely crackers. One of the way outside the ring, one of the nicest family guys you'll ever meet. They're a real gen, living a similar area in London and we often bump into each other with the bunches. But, I mean, you know, what has he done to me at press conferences? I don't know, I remember once, did he, you know, he was all this heated argument between

him and did he and white big? If you're not from the UK, it was a big British heavyweight fight. And I remember we had the press conference in Manchester and Delb was come up and I said Delb come on let's have a quick chat before the press conference. When you before it was going to kick off it was live on TV, it was live on Sky News and so I said, Delb listen you know what today let's try it different. Let's you take let's take the moral high ground here. Let's take the take let's take the moral high ground here let's take the you know let Gideon's gonna come for you let him look like the the bag the you know the the bad guy take them like this try and win over some fans in it's come on we can

use it trust me it's like counter attack yeah yep I finished great idea sat down anyways the press conference started and you know, Didian sounds off, boom, boom, boom, boom, you know, you're this, you're that, I'm gonna do this, you know, I'm gonna do you on the street if I see you, you keep with going off, Derek's just sitting there, Derek always sits at a press conference, where his sunglasses on and he shows no reaction. So I'm sat next to Del and all of a sudden I felt like the table sort of, he's getting it, he said a few more questions, he's also quite sensitive, but I've got to be listening to me, well that's, that's, I'm, I'm pressed, right? And then I've just felt the

table start to shake. And it is legs are starting trembling and then I'm looking at him thinking, I'm looking behind those glasses, his eyes are still closed though. He's like he's sleeping and he's sort of like dreaming and his legs are going. And then, boom, boom, boom, boom, I'm a bad-ass man on the planet. And he's ripped the table up. It's me, no, still me, Eddie, Adam Smith from Sky, Julian White, Mark Tib, that was the top table.

And he's sniffing. He hasn't thrown like some finesse. He's picked the whole press conference table up. I launched it across the table. It gave me, I swear to God, I had a bit of stubble. I think it gave me a nice two millimeter rate shape. It was fantastic. The pictures, after what it's it, you can see it was across

all the back pages of the papers the next day, and it's me sort of trying to lift the toe down, protect oneself from the table and sort of half landed on Eddie and he sits next to me and put the funniest thing was I look back at the tape and I was so shocked. I didn't actually do anything. I just stood there, like frozen like, what the fuck has just gone on there? But that was Del, you know what I had to know? I mean, one more, one more for the road of Del, way in Germany.

And so this one he was probably even better, but not so famous in the UK, but this one, so in a way, again, he was quite cool about Pula, I booked the four seasons, but the four seasons in Hamburg is the poshest hotel I've ever been in, it's like posh in terms of old school posh, you know, they've still got the old T-boys with the T-sets, they're very relevant for the story in a minute. So we've had the thing, the way in and actually, the way in and actually Dell was going to, and he said, there is sometimes a bit of banter and you know, there is a show element to it, but Dell was going to basically, I knew that

he had bought a big black build-up, right, and he was going to hit the gun back in the sun, I don't know, he was going to hit him or give it to him because they were talking about penis sizes earlier in the week at the press conferences. And I think he was gonna give it to him or give him a cheeky slap with it. And he had it in his hand and they've gone to face to face. And I've seen it in his hand, I think, oh my God, what's he gonna do with it?

Before he can do anything with it, so the face to face, at the way in, both tops off Derek Scott is trademark union jack bandanna on, round his hitting with an every hand bottle, so he's jumped over top and hit down with an every hand bottle, I look to it like plastic every hand bottle, so I'm standing there I'm thinking oh my god and you can't even say security security in that moment there's nothing you can do to stop hell. Hell is like a buffalo. If he wants to run through it, he won't go through it. You'll go through walls, right? So, you know, and I just remember there was a room with cat, there's a ballroom and

he's forgot the map who lived, the Dildos dropped the floor, but I kicked it away quickly, so I thought that's the only thing I can do. To be fair, my brother actually tried to half-stop him. I mean, I've got to get my brother deserves a medal of honor for trying. Derek has chased out his guys, ran through the kitchen, so photographers run after, you know, with the cameras. And Derek has cornered the guy in the kitchen, and is in that moment, the guy with a T-set, like I said, old-school T-set, you know, one of those sort of the doorbell,

what is it, the dormant hats, and he's just looked at Derek, this guy storming through the kitchen after this Bulgarian, and Derek with a bandander on and has just dropped the tea set. And Derek just couldn't get older than the Bulgarian. As someone managed to leg it and he got away, but then I got a bill from the four seasons in Hamburg. I think it was at least 25 grams worth of damage in there.

It was insane. The whole kitchen went flying and... Brilliant, brilliant, it was insane. The whole kitchen went flying and brilliant brilliant brilliant brilliant brilliant. So that was that was Derek Chazora. But I've not long I've not more of Delva with Peter all night. Mate, my final question that I've had through my head throughout this entire thing and I heard Eddie her on the high performance podcast with Jake Humphrey, which is a really really good one if anyone wants to check out about Eddie, how do you deal with the pressure that you have on you? Because this pressure is incredibly intense. You are like the crooks

of everything that's going on. The book stops with you. How do you deal with all of this pressure? No, I mean, the pressure ultimately is your overall responsibility on the night, you know, then some pressure points coming up to it when, you know, you've got, you've announced a fight and someone tries to renegotiate afterwards had that before. I've had so many, I'm not going to use the words blackmail, but, you know, there's certain people, you know, they have a contract, you announce the fight, and then they see how big it is. And then they come back and say, oh, well, actually,

I want a bit more money. You say, no, you can't be work. But OK, how huge is now? I said, but that was my punt. That's the thing. So there's lots of different ways you can work with fines. You can work on percentages and take the risk and pay my flat fee. So you get those situations where, you know, you either call it all off and say, right, I'm going to sue you because we have a contract and

you're not following that contract, you call the bluff, you don't call the bluff, you're giving, you know, if you're giving months, you're giving for allways, so you don't really, you don't give in, you can't give in because it's the beginning of the end. So there's those sort of situations, but I think if you look at the pressure, I think I get nervous around fights. We mustn't forget what we do. We are the orchestrators of controlled violence. And that sounds really cool. That sounds like responsibility, pure, and like, wow, what you do, I put on fights. That's cool, isn't it? You know, that's a great one, use down the club. That's a great one, you know, as a pickup line.

Wow, don't know that much. Probably run me all the way. But you know what, joking aside, I have been with fighters and their families in a hospital room after birth. So the ultimate pressure for me is actually on the night when I get that call, that everything from the doctor, the whole thing has gone successfully. And when I say successfully, the paper of yours is not, that's the stuff for the money. But the call on the night that we have had a clean bill of health, you know, and that,

and I've had horror stories, you know, and boxing, thankfully today in 2021, is one of the safest sports on the planet. But we mustn't forget what the purpose of boxing is. It's of course, even though we may have the first rule of boxing as defense. But let's face it, my tiresome said, everyone's got plenty of punch on the face. That's boxing, you know? I spoke to one of my fighters, Philip Hurgovitch, spoke to him in lock, he said, just dying a punch someone in the face, Kelly, you have to get me out.

That's what they do. And yeah, Chris, we can laugh about it, and I laugh about it, and that's what we want to see. You know, there's two things since the start of mankind, since we have heartbeats, there's two things that will happen on the street right now and we will both run to the windows and pick up our iPhones and start filming. Can you name them? I'll let you.

Okay, I'll tell you what, the first one is sex. You've got a couple outside fucking, you're gonna go to that window and you're gonna start filming. Yes or no? Yes. Yeah, how many videos have you seen viral? I caught them at the hotel room and they were leaving against the window. You see no half a fake, half a real. Okay, sex will always sell. Will always sell. The other violence. You see two guys fighting in the street, what's the first thing?

Oh, what's the problem? Charlie, those two instincts, yeah? Or something that are in our nature. We can't change that. What I do is not the sex part is not at least for business, is I my goal is to bottle that, put it on the big stage and get as many eyeballs as I can on that to give these gladiators the true platform. So I go back at the end now to the beginning question,

what do I do? Chris, that is what I do. I love it. I really enjoyed peering behind the camera. I love that myself, actually. Very arty, very profound. Yeah, yeah, don't you worry. But it's true, that's what we do. And we mustn't forget what fighters go through deserves that at every level. If it's a club fighter and he's got his big night, I've bought tickets for loads of

white collar events to support my mates, my brother had a few, you know, that's their moment, that wall count music, you know, that's that moment and we should, that is something that should be celebrated and, you know, it's not, I've got, I'm going to put down any other sports, yeah, but it's something very, very special and unique to give that for other people's viewing pleasure. The thing that really interested me was you talking about how unique boxing is with its pay-per-view, the fact that you can't get people to pay that money for football

when you've got 11 guys on the pitch who get paid in a week, what most people get paid in 10 years and all this sort of stuff. You are right, there's something ritualistic and sacred and symbolic about boxing. And yeah, it's fascinating. It's fascinating to see behind the curtain. There's a final thing. I know that you've recently signed Mr. U-bank, Jr.

What? What do you think? Obviously, you've got your World Boxing series and all this other stuff coming up. What should we be looking out for over the next 12 to 18 months in terms of people to keep our eyes on and events to look out for? Fighting in terms of your style Chris, Chris, Chris, you banged Jr. I mean, you know, he's been away for a while from the UK, especially. He had the big fight against James the Gail, but that's two years ago. It was a great victory and he went off to the States, had some success there and then unfortunately

the pandemic hit and he hit him hard. He's one of the greatest trainers on the planet in his dedication. He's got fantastic social media following and, you know, hangs out. We can't with Dan Bilzerian, you know, he's a real lifestyle guy. If you look to him on Instagram, you'd think, when the hell does this guy have a train? You know, it's, you know, in poker, it's him in this, you know, the guy doesn't drink a drop. He doesn't, he lives an absolute pure life, is in the gym every day. The way he cuts his Instagram is fantastic. I mean, I must have a film editor doing it because it's something stuff that you watch on Netflix. But you will see him back this year. You're

going to see him back probably late April in a tuna and you'll see him in a very big fight this summer. We've mentioned certain names there, Kelbrook, for example, we've talked about Geno Galovkin, Marata, there's very big fights in the wake last for him and this, he will fight three times this year so that's from a new Cape perspective, I think, something very much to look forward to. And on the World Boxing Super Series, we're going to be back with a new season soon. Obviously, we had a tough time in the pandemic.

We got finished, we actually managed to finish the second season during the pandemic, which is fantastic. And you know, we're working on now to see, you know, this great science for all sport, isn't it? You know, this vaccine, we're going to, whatever one thinks about it, you know, let's be fair, there is light at the end of the tunnel. And, you know, I think for boxing and all sports and all events, you know, I think it's going to be such a bounce back. So, anything you want listening to is in areas hit, go ahead and I'll tell you either the worst year last year, just mentally, you know, not getting out, not traveling, not going

to other events, that's what I've lived on for the last 25, 30 years, in my whole life, really. And, you know, I think that those industries, whether it's music, events, nightclubs, in living, life, tourism, you know, getting out there, traveling again, man, this is, you know, people who tell me, oh, well, the world's changed and we're all going to be seeing it home for the rest of our lives. I can't do one, mate. You know, I say, this will bounce back. We now will do this and realise how privileged are we are to be alive and enjoy and everything we do we will not. Maybe in a year of so many miserable, in a year of so many miserable, disgusting news of watching deathnakes like they were the football scores. Maybe what has come out of this is that we will all take life a

little bit more. I'm not saying more lightly, but you go and enjoy. You know, enjoy what you do. You know, and if you don't enjoy what you're doing, then change something. I know it's easy to say when I've been lucky enough to work into myself into this position, but at the same time, man, whatever is it you do, just live, go and live,. You know, when I drink a bottle of water now, and it's nice and cold, enjoy the whole enjoyment of life, and that's going to come back big time, big time people. So chin up, we'll get through it, you know, and that's not coming from someone who's just made billions

off the pandemic, you know, that's someone who's had a fucking shitiest year ever. But, hey, I look on the bright side, I spend more time with my kids than ever before. Um, I'm fucking home-schooling this one, and we're definitely one of fucking forget. Um, thank God for Google. You know, but so, but that's, you know, I'm always been a, like the glasses half full sort of fella, but, you know, head up, pull up, let's roll up our sleeves and crack on. I'm looking forward to this year mate. I really hope that everything comes back in line for you. If anyone wants to sort of keep in loop with what it is that

you guys are doing, where's best for them to sort of be updated with Team Sallond? I mean, Team Sallond, you follow us on Sallond, brothers. Sallond, bros, S-A-U-E-R, L-A-N-D, bros, brothers, S.A.U.E.R., L.A.D., Bross, and yeah, catch us on social media, on all forms. I like to rant on Twitter, my brother prefers his Instagram, but yeah, no, we're out there, we're looking forward to Big 2021. Man, thank you so much for coming on. Thank you very much Chris.